RAWTALK - 7 Time Mr Olympia Flex Lewis Shares The Truth About Steroids Usage In Bodybuilding

Episode Date: May 16, 2023

In this exhilarating episode of Rawtalk, we are thrilled to welcome a true force in the world of bodybuilding and fitness, the one and only Flex Lewis. Join us as we dive deep into the extraordinary journey of an athlete who has defied limitations and redefined what it means to be a champion.Sponsor: BETTERHELP https://www.betterhelp.com/rawtalkMANSCAPED: http://Manscaped.com Use Code Rawtalk at checkout for 20% off your order & Free Shipping.BABBEL: https://www.babbel.com/rawtalkSUBSCRIBE HERE: https://www.youtube.com/c/REALRAWTALK...LISTEN ON APPLE PODCASTS: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...FOLLOW RAWTALK PODCAST: INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/getrawtalkTIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@askrawtalkFOLLOW BRADLEY: INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/bradleymartynSUBSCRIBE TO RAWTALK PODCAST CLIPS: / @rawtalkclip SUBSCRIBE TO LIFE OF BRADLEY MARTYN: / @bradleymartyn SUBSCRIBE TO FITNESS CHANNEL: https://www.youtube.com/bradleymartyn...RAWGEAR:

How do I look? Do I look, do I look comfy or do I look uncomfy, guys? Good, dude. Oh, okay. I don't need, I don't need to look big. You got a little bit of an arm pump, though. I felt like, well, there was a rushed arm pump. Dude, it's like, it's also funny because you came here in a completely different outfit and you fully changed. I'm like, this guy's on it, dude.

Hey, listen, when Bradley Martin asked me to come on his fucking podcast? But it's interesting, man. It's like, it, right away, I was like, it's funny because you obviously have gone so far in the sport of bodybuilding and seven times. Yeah, sure. Which is insane to compete at that level that many year, year after year after year is insane. But it's funny now, you come in here and you come and like, you prepare, you like had all your stuff.

You're like, I'm going to do some of my beer. You're like, oh, yeah, yeah, you don't let the secrets out. No, no, no, no, but it's funny. It's an interesting thing because, like, that makes sense. Like, that's your personality because to succeed at that level for that long, you have to have that with probably everything in your life. Like, it's just like that's ingrained in your character. The saying is make a plan, a plan to fail, right?

So every Olympia I've ever done, there was a plan of, action from the off season all the way to 20 weeks out, all the way to 10 weeks out, all the way six weeks out. So now everything I do kind of segueing from that competitive mindset into life, all has a plan of action. And listen, not everything has goes to plan too. Yeah, of course. So you have to roll with the punches too, you know.

Sometimes tough. Yeah. So on that note, I guess as far as like this idea of planning and your progress and all of it, before you got into bodybuilding was that aspect of your life already there like were you already a planner were you already like an executor like or did bodybuilding kind of show you that well i picked up my nickname flex and i was six years old yeah nothing to do with bodybuilding and um my mother thinks it's kind of fate that i fell into this this world because there's no cousin or uncle or anybody that was a bodybuilder um how how i kind of fell into it i would say is i discovered a book

on Tom Platts when I was 12 years old that my auntie went in senior seminar brought back to Wales put it in her kind of a spare room that she used to stay with my grandparents at and me being the nosy little 12 year old kid I found this book and it blew my mind

so from there on in in terms of planning I was like man I wanted the biggest legs in rugby as a 12 year old you were thinking about that oh yeah I had no clue how the fuck I was going to get to there but I knew that in this book a squat bar on my back

was going to build my legs. So the first guy you saw was like Tom Plats you're like this is insane. Subconsciously WWF Arnold Rambor. Got it. And then something, I don't know what it was because I played rugby high level for all them years

and my grandfather played and it was kind of being Welsh that is our nation's rugby is own nation's main sport so to play for the country or represent the country in any degree. That's what I strive to do but I wanted these big legs and I just wanted everybody to you know when I run on the field I want to be a dominant force yeah I've never going to be the biggest guy height wise

yeah so I wanted to make up for it in strength and power and you know I had to speed it's interesting when did you start to really like realize you had what it took to be a great bodybuilder good question um you're like 18 because I remember and the reason I asked the question I remember not that I'm a great body but I'm great in things that I've done but I remember when I was first getting into competition, a lady came up to me and was like, there's this new competition coming out, which you'll laugh about this. I'm talking about competitions I did. She comes up to me, she's this new competition, this new competition category coming out. And I was like, oh, what is it? Because I've always known about bodybuilding because I wanted to be a bodybuilder. I wanted to be like

300 plus pounds. I wanted to diet down. That's why I was training. And then someone comes up to to me, this woman, she goes, oh, this new category came out. You'd be great for it. You'll get to wear board shorts men's physique in 2011 and I was like oh fuck it like and then all my buddy's like yeah you should do it just take your shirt off it's simple and I didn't I got smoked and then like but it says I just showed up and like sprayed on a tan didn't do anything I was just a gym bro that you know diet and nothing zero I literally just showed up on weekend was like oh I got abs but then I got smoked and I was like oh this is what they want and then the next show I like won and I won overall then I did really well and then

eventually I got out of the thing but enough about me the question to you is like where along the lines were you like because for me it was that moment where that one was like you should try this you have like a good build for this yeah where were you were you like 17 18 yeah I started training with guys that are all over me yeah they were like you know the cooler older crew and they were all into training they wanted to be big

but playing rugby so I joined the local powerlifting gym and I started power lifting to help with my rugby and there was a couple of bodybuilders in there but I was told like as a power lift you know when I was power lifting you can't do bit biceps you can't get into your squats suit if you do this and do that and then a couple of the guys in the gym they were like hey you should do your first show and i was like i ain't getting up in a pair of speeders can i swear by the way on this yeah oh okay okay listen that half my shit gets demonetized everything i swear so i'm

gonna tell you i'll give you a hack don't do it in the first two three minutes oh you're you're in this if you do in the first two three minutes you are off off camera i'm gonna pick up pick some of your brain yeah absolutely i'd love to help you um but this is i'm new to this world you're the fucking ogy in this world i've been doing it for i hope it past two minutes already are we Yeah, yeah, we're great. I've been doing it for a long time. I know, I know. I know.

My respect, Matt, in my respect. But in terms of what I was at a very young age, like 15, I was in the gym, I started getting told, hey, you should do a show. So I started looking good. All legs. Calfs. Wait, it's so crazy because how are you 12 years old and you're like, that's what I want. I want big legs.

And the next thing you knew, you had fucking massive legs. Was it just because you, was that just in? But because it's not just intention, right? it's genetic though like everyone knows this and i think it's enough to say and we should say this like bodybuilding yes you can be the hardest worker you could outwork someone else who's not working hard with their genetics but at the end of the day like if you don't have i'm not saying you can't pursue this thing that you love but if you don't have what it takes to like build muscle in that kind of like symmetrical pretty fashion it's it's going to be a very very difficult task

to compete at a high level so it's interesting that you you thought at 12 oh man i want legs it like this and then that's genetically just that was in you well hard work plus genetics that's fucking game over and that's the mentality I had from a young age like I grew up very blue collar um I don't know we're kind of going all over the place and I'll answer you a question about the powerlifting yeah yeah a little bit but um in terms of the blue collar aspect of things my dad and my mom you know very hard working people my dad used to be in a steel steel factory just retired after 40-something years I see my dad work doublers back to back 12-hour shifts you'd have a couple hours off he'd go back in

and then he still come and coach me and my brothers playing rugby every weekend coached it coached other teams too refereed hardest working guy in the room and the quietest guy in the room too until he gets a whistle in his hands and then he turns into a maniac

he's like a referee so my mom was a nurse and she was wrote off disabled so I've seen the struggles that she had and my dad had you know kid playing the computer games next thing all the electric goes off in the house, all that stuff. And I remember that feeling.

I know what it's like to feel broke, you know? Yeah. And that was a massive drive for me to become, you know, something. And before I talk about all the businesses and stuff, I knew that after somebody kind of told me, it's like, hey, you have the opportunity to do really well in this sport. I knew I had to take this chance. Who was that person?

So that person really was Neil Hill. Really? And Neil Hill is still my coach to this day. What the fuck? And listen, I, and for all the viewers that are watching this, you know, myself and Bradley are being two passing ships broke, let's be honest, maybe two decades, a decade and a half? It's been, yeah, at least a decade and a half. Like he would do, you know, exports, he'd have a line out the ass, I'd have a line out the ass, we can't leave booths, people saying, hey, you need to meet Bradley's in the green room, and vice versa. I remember that, I'm saying, I'm thinking myself, is this guy deliberately trying to.

big normie right now. It's been years. Like years. I know. But fucking off the point, but what was that? No, that I'm good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Back to the, back to the idea of like where you came from and, so who was the person? It was, it was.

It was Neil. It was Neil. So I done my first bodybuilding show, the gym owner told me, if you do your first bodybuilding show, you're going to have a free gym membership. No, at that age, I was in college or playing rugby, that was a lot of money for me. So I said, sign me up. How hard can this be? I love bodybuilding at the point in time

I was buying flex magazines and if you remember take yourself back to the 90s there was very little people talking about diets I don't know why you're so secretive nobody would talk about diets post about diets you remember that?

You know what I feel like I feel like because I would have been the end of this I would have caught the end of this like where it was like where my mind was thinking about this it was honestly it felt like because they were so much so invested in selling like bullshit products

that they didn't give a fuck about actually giving a diet. It was like, you know, muscle techs, 500% increase. You said the near mummy. Yeah, it's just bullshit. Just fucking a scam. It was such a, it was such a crazy scam that I feel like they also had the hold on those magazines because they would pay the money to have the spots.

It's like this thick. So it's like you couldn't, why would they want real information when they could be like, all you got to do is take this and get 500% gains. Yeah, there was a lot of, a different time, man. A lot of graphs. A lot of before and afters. And like crazy like the way they, I mean, you know. This because you've done so many shots, but like, you know, obviously you look incredible and you looked incredible.

And when you compete, you fucking top of the line, but, you know, the crazy shots to make you look crazy drastic. It was just so much like over-hyping and overselling of like this shit that it's interesting now because there's so much more information. And there's so much more out there that you can like really benefit from. Yeah, it's true. And there's a lot of, again, with this piece of plastic that you and I have in our hands every single day that we use for social media, people will get caught off. Back then, you know, that was our Bible. You read that every single month. You go through it back to front, front to back.

And there was a first time somebody posted a diet in the Flex magazine. I was like, there's my diet for the show. Do you know who, do you know who's diet it was? Who? Gunter Shurcamps, 300 pounds. It's like, so. Maybe that helped you though. Oh, I'd know.

I looked at this. I was like, okay, this guy's eating all this carbs. He also had like firehouse, all this stuff. I was living in Wales. What the hell's the firehouse? Yeah, there's one in Venice? Yeah, the firehouse. this. And I was like, okay, I'm going to take all these out. I'll change this, this. I mean,

I've done a budget diet. I ended up winning my first ever show on that. I didn't really know what the hell I was depleted for 12 weeks. I was living hell. I'd be honest, hardest show I've done because the lack of knowledge. And everybody in the gym is a process. This is your very first show. My very first show. I had no clear worth doing. What was your body weight? Oh, my God. What's the math in this? Roderick. Can you pull out your phone? Kilo guy. 12.

14 pounds in a storm. I was 12 stone 8. Yeah, I know. Cavemon style. I don't know shit about that. Coveman style. But yeah,

14 pounds in a storm. I think I was 12 stone 10 maybe on stage. What the fuck is he even saying? No what does he say. What am I saying? No one knows what you're talking about. Welcome to my life. 14 pounds in the fucking stone.

You got it? That's my Jamie. His guy kidding. Yeah. Yeah. So he's like, kid. So,

damn, I ended up doing that show. I won the juniors, which is under 21, and it was a stark class. Bodyball is really big, really big. And then in, I'd done the novice class. Backstage, all these guys were talking about who's going to, am I going to do the British?

They didn't look at me. I was in the mix. I had Mr's legs from here down. Up here, I had a body of a 19-year-old. And Jeremy 19-year-old, and I'll send you the footage on my first show. And I ended up doing that show, winning that show. I walk out to the parking lot

all my friends from college came and there's an open bar in bodybuilding too so everybody's, they're all yelling got air horns, everybody's happy I won every's kind of waiting for me to be back to flex too you know where it's like dieting you start getting quieter and quieter and quieter

so I was jacked a lad I was like the shortest and the loudest in the class you know and me trying to diet whilst in college and girlfriends and all these other things it was no chance so I was looking for to be and myself again and then I had this gentleman following

me to the car with my parents and he was like, hey, you need to do the British Nationals. I was like, listen, all respects. I know who you are, big fun, and I really appreciate it. But let me think about it. He's like, no, I need to give me this fucking brave heart speech. You know, take it on the English.

Because that's Welsh for a small country compared to England. Take it on the English, Scottish, Ireland, mainly England. And I was like, yeah, okay. And I looked at my parents. I was like, what do you think? They're like represent Wales. Fuck them all. My parents. And that guy is still my coach to this day, Neil Hill.

That's insane. He helped me. He gave me my first diet. He said to me, if you do the show, I will help you. And literally that Tuesday after the show, I rebounded about fit. Nobody told me about the fucking rebound. Yeah. You know, forever he was watching this, don't understand.

But when you deplete yourself and diet down so hard, and then you just eat everything and anything. Bro, that was. How about you, one of the craziest experiences of my life. Oh, I couldn't tie my shoes. I remember my heart. I'm like, in bed. Am I going to die, dude?

And you still eating, right? Yeah, I'm like, so, and I couldn't stop. And it felt like I couldn't stop for like, for like two months. I was just insatiable. I just had to eat food no matter what. I was eating everything. But you know what's funny about that? My whole experience in bodybuilding and dieting, there's actually food to this day that I

completely avoid because I had so much of them or like had so much while I was like in contest prep, like tilapia. Oh. I'll never eat that again. Soilment. I'll never eat it again. I don't know why I ate so much of it. Because it gets you lean.

Yeah. That's the problem. And it was just, I remember, like, were there anything like that for you that you're like, you're like, oh, I never want to do this again. Well, man, I mean, to be on top, there's things that I had to do that nobody that I stood against would even would think about. Literally, when in my Olympia is one of my biggest, it was an ally and a detriment was my appetite. I had zero appetite. This is the first time in my life in the last year that I've had an appetite where I can actually eat food because I eat two, three meals a day right now. Yeah.

then I actually enjoy food, taste food. But when I was dieting and I was 15 years into this, and you don't, there's no day off and eat there when your body believe. Yeah, no, it's definitely not at that level. I was blending chicken breast and rice, blend in, string, and rice. Just to get it down. Just to get it down. Making it into soup and everybody's like, oh, my God.

But listen, I wanted to create the legacy. Is that what you struggle with the most in your career is the food? No question. Food was one of the reasons why I retired. The lack of appetite. I also developed a lot of gut issues over time, Because you had to stuff yourself? Traveling around the world, you know, different environments.

I hired three GI doctors. When I tell you this, Matt, I spent six figures in trying to heal myself while still in prep just to keep myself in the game. Yeah. And I was so determined to leave a mark in bodybuilding that I was able to get away with some of the stuff in the 212 class. But when I went from literally starving myself to flip in the coin and then, then force feeding myself to go up into the open class horrible yeah i don't think there i think there's a lot more people and i don't think people realize this that in bodybuilding there's a lot more of stuff like this like gut issues and things that happen because of like the force feeding

did did you have anything that like stuck with you because i had a buddy of mine who like he he did like bodybuilding and i think he was like he started realizing like orals and all the shit would flare up like his crone's disease and they have like pissing like blood out of his ass type stuff. Yeah, that's what Crohn's disease. Oh my God. You're like ulcers that are bleeding and your gut and they're like, you're like shitting blood. It's like diarrhea or shit. Anyways, I'm not going to get crazy to that, but I think it's not going to get crazy. Yeah, but yeah, no, but he fixed it. He fixed it. But it's like he kind of, part of it was having to stop certain things and like kind of like pretty much removed him from the lifestyle entirely. Um, do you talk about gear usage,

anything like that? I don't talk about it much, but I mean, it's not because I, it's like for me and my brand, and you look at my whole sort of media of everything, it's just I've never been kind of asked the questions. When I've done seminars and stuff, you know, you're going to have guys who want to hear what they want to hear. Of course. And the truth of the matter is, you know, I went through a sport when I had a weight cut. I had to make a class. So, you know, I never had the ability to have an incredible offseason. And if I was to do more, to get in shape, then I wouldn't make weight. And I was able to retire very healthy, you know,

obviously injuries and stuff like that, that's aside the point. But, you know, I've had two kids who also been prepping. I retired with all my fucking hair. I mean, this means nothing or something, right to somebody. But, you know, take it from me, and I have nothing to hide by saying this. Legitimately, I've done,

I've done obviously more than the average gym goer, don't get me wrong, but I never used and abused my body. Thankfully, I had a coach, Neil Hill, who is known for being very conservative. And his sort of mindset was, if you can grow in ABC, why do you need X, Y, Z? Yeah. I want to talk about that, because I think it's really common. I think it's becoming less common now for people to, like, abuse it. I think it was, our era coming up, it was very rampant I think for people to abuse it because of like I said earlier like the amount of readily readily available information and I just think it's important just whenever we talk about topics like this just because it's so interesting every time I talk to people who who competed at a high

level I don't even know if I could reference Chris Bum said right now but I had a conversation with him off my guy I had a conversation with him off camera and every time I talk to people about this kind of stuff who are who at a very high level it's always the same thing like that the idea of less is more and it's interesting because back in the day it was just like more is more is more do more because there's a lot of guys that we know about who like have come and gone and you know rest in peace all these people and all these souls man like you it's it's not the most healthy sport no right um but i just think it's important for people to hear that like you know i'm not encouraging anyone to go do this or if it's if it's in your you know your your life path

than it is and there's no really way around it but um that's the thing i realize over time too is like people get so caught up in that idea of if this got me this then like this much will get me this much yeah and it's just not that way it just doesn't work that way and then you also like you have the compounding risk that comes with it as well there's just like are you willing to continue down that road like to go further so um yeah i just wanted to just talk about it a little because it's obviously a very relevant topic in it and it's not like we can just like it's like i feel like at this point we're doing a disservice to people to just completely avoid those conversations. Oh, yeah, yeah. Especially because on the internet now, like, it's so, like,

talked about. Also, too, like, there's, there seems to be, I don't know if you've seen it. I don't know how much social media you watch, but, um, all right, quick interruption. This podcast is sponsored by Manscape. Now, check this out. Manscaped have been protecting and preserving my balls for quite some time. Now, yes, this is true. I'm not a father, but father day is coming up. All right. So June 18th, this father's day. So be ready this father's day. This is amazing. Look, listen, I'm not even a father and I have it for myself, right? They got the weed whacker, okay? ears ear hair nose hair I know I'm notorious for nose hair people talk all the time and I'm on I'm like Snapchat or on Instagram like this nose hair get rid of the nose hair

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even even for time it just got popularized like the trend and steroids and all this the shit is so like it's like it's popular and like i think i just i hope there's kids who watch this who just understand it what a serious decision that is and how it will affect the rest of your life forever. I mean, you're talking about the no, not the future. You're going to look great, I'm sure. I mean, anybody young that makes the decision to go that route. First of all, whatever they do, they are going to respond. But I mean, you mentioned it, right? The trend aspect of things, I mean, holy shit, there's people joining the gym and talking about. about taking that stuff yeah i didn't i didn't i didn't use that until fucking four weeks out for

my show and that's the gau's honest truth i mean there was no reason for me to use it in the off season um for obvious reasons i had to make a weight cut um and that's kind of like the cherry on the kick but but somebody now just to look good in the gym there's so many detrimental side of the time unbelievable like you can forget fucking kids and be honest with if if you're running this for like day and day out for years and years and years but um again listen everybody's everybody's got to live their life of course

and unfortunately you know mistakes will be learned as the years are gone on you've got you know fucking you know mistakes that you've learned from that made you better

as of I I talk very openly about my mistakes on my podcast it's made me the person I am it's made me a better person every fall has made me you know

a better a better individual a better dad whatever fill in the gaps but in terms of of the supplementation that some of these guys are taking, you start off with that. That's not going to make you a better body better body builder. It's actually going to be a detriment to because you are going to destroy your receptors.

And then when you go, it's like, okay, well, no, I'm not growing. So now I have to take more. And that's the mentality. You're talking about, like, you know, more is better. It's not. The glass gets full. Then there's no one else to go, you know? And at the same time, at the same time, too, the side effects, right?

You don't know how, like, if you, if you made a. soup this is a good analogy made a soup and you just put a bunch of shit in it because someone so said this was a good idea and then you don't know which one is causing what that's true it's like so then it's like because like now you can't just go oh this is all causing it it's like if you were able to know okay this affected me this way this affected me that way then you'd be able to go take this out okay now this is this makes sense instead of just like what the fuck's going on well a lot of people find themselves like yeah absolutely meant and that's one the reasons when I would prep with my courts you know we knew exactly what we were doing

because you know unfortunately there is a lot of fake stuff out there so adding that into the mix and I have an end goal to compete to be the best in the world by adding things in periodically you knew what was working what wasn't working but then in the off season you're eating everything you're drinking everything and a lot of these guys train their fucking ass off Monday to Friday and then cheers pussy and at the clubs on the weekend insane and they're doing stacks that some guys are doing pre-contest which blows my mind obviously, you know, the trending word that I see everywhere is trend, trend, trend, trend. And it blows my mind.

It just blows my mind. And that's so now mainstream that guys are coming up to me, you know, no names mentioned. Because, you know, like you, you have a lot of celebrities in your gym. You have a lot of celebrities in my gym. And they're like, hey, what do you think about this trend? Yeah, it's like, dude, what the fuck? It's like, bro, stay with that shit. Trent is like the, is like the steroids on steroids.

It's like, if you had testosterone as like a one, trend's like a fucking. a hundred it's like what it what it's it's not like a joke it's much better right the fuck who told you this it's but that's what that's why this has to be discussed because like there's a lot of kids i don't think they just understand it at all they just see it and they go you know it's it's it's it's all i'm hearing it i'm hearing it i'm hearing it so it's like it's acceptable it becomes more accepted but i've you seen half these guys who are taking it bro but that's the thing it's it's not even that like that's that's the problem right but the problem is also people who just hearing it and they go i go i always ask people

to talk to me about that kind of stuff right okay And I'll say, well, how long you've been training for? They'll be like, six months, a year. And I'm like, dude, you don't, do you even drink enough water? Do you even get enough sleep? Do you even, like, do you even eat enough food? Like, you don't eat, I guarantee you, all those other things are fucked. And you're considering something that's changing the rest of your life.

And it's like, for what? You know, like, you have to go farther in it. But I just think it's an interesting, interesting thing. But I want to change the subject a little bit. You were talking about lessons and everything you've done and learning from those lessons um why do you think sometimes maybe it's coming from a personal place because i've you know some personal experiences in my life i want your opinion on this why do you think sometimes it's so hard for people to learn the lesson like when you try to learn it the

first time and you fuck it up and then you get you your same situation and you get it again i think with me and i came to this country i came here i only knew one person and then i was on my own so i had to learn as i went along also as in a strange country and everything was so different for me. I learned a lot of lessons and I truly had to I feel I've done it the hardest way possible. Even with my, I just got my citizenship, by the way,

after 15 years of, thank you, my man. And I've done the long route to that too. I learned a lot from that. But I think if I was to go back, I would surround myself with different people as well. You know, I and Sharp and Zayin, when you're in Rome different mentalities, you've seen people who have paved

their way and they've had their mistakes, they were able to kind of showcase and tell me, hey, don't go this, don't do this. I never had that. I think now in my position of being who I am and what I've done and what I've achieved, I love helping, and

passing forward, passing back, whatever, the term is now. It always changes. I love helping the future. I heard yourself too today. I heard you on several different podcasts talking about helping the new up-and-comers, the new YouTubers, the guys and girls and the him, helping them with their social media.

And that's truly, you know, the lessons that you've fallen on your face at, now we're able to make sure that these next generation don't suffer the same mistakes, able to capitalize, monetize, various different things. I think mistakes, again, have to happen. I have to happen. I mean, listen, how many, with me then, shall I say, I had to have a lot of shitty relationships. to find the one.

And for me, I wasn't looking for my girl who ended up becoming my wife. It was just organic, you know? I was chasing. I met this chick, she ticked every button and in typical sense, I was like, oh, let me look at further afield. And then I kept on being drawn back, drawn back,

and I was like, fuck, I've messed up a lot with different relationships, putting stock into different things, whether it was beauty, whether it was X, Y, Z, And kind of then everything came together and all the boxes were ticked when I met this girl. But I had to mess up and make a lot of mistakes to get to that. In terms of business, too, I've had to be in a lot of shitty business partners

to find good partners. Shit, I know about that. Yeah, I know that we've got a lot of relatable topics, I'm sure. But again, this is one of the reasons why you are where you are because we do have very relatable things that have gone on. And it's just the course of life. So when you see people making mistakes, you know, the only thing you can really do is encourage a person to get back up on your feet. And that's when you find out fast if they have it or not.

It's a fucking mentality thing. You look at a pro who's being hyped up to the max, you know, maybe came right through the amateur ranks. It could be another sport, boxing, UFC. They take their first loss. That's when you see the champion mentality come in because that person is either going to go back to the locker room, cry his eyes out. I'd be like, fuck this. I should have won boo-hoo, kicking fucking rocks. Or he's going to

realize that he wasn't the best man on that day or he wasn't the best bodybuilder or he didn't put the hard work in. He didn't do the extra cadre or he cheated on his diet. And that's when you have that reality talk to yourself and be like, hey, this is going to be the best thing that happened. It's the worst thing right now, but it's going to be the best thing. You know many times

I've had that fucking conversation myself? Yeah. I've fallen so many times and I've taken a lot of else, but every time I've got back up, I'm fucking different. I just think it's so important to talk about shit like that because it is a really like undeniable thing that's going to happen.

Even when you think like you, I don't know if you know it all, but you figure it out or you feel like you learn the lessons, man. Like that's when it's the worst though. That's the worst when like, like I've, in my personal experience, like I don't want to get too deep in detail about it,

but like I've made a lot of the same mistakes more than once. And that's where like really starts to hurt until like you make a really big mistake and it fucking lays you the fuck out and then you look back and you're like you're able to look everything in hindsight and go damn well like I could have stopped this

I could have changed this and I didn't have like the site then and that's when it gets just sometimes it gets a little overwhelming right but like what you said is true I mean I do believe that no matter what like the idea is if you're because I think mistakes and shit happen and are made because of either you're so focused on the future or you're still caught up on the past, right? So mistakes I realize are the things that like make you more honed in on right now,

the present, which is truthfully, we know how you succeed at anything, right? If I'm so caught up on the future and where I'm going to go or if I'm so caught up on the past and where things were or where I was or what happened to me or how I was affected, then it's very easy for a person to make their decisions presently based on things in the past. And oftentimes, like I could say right now, literally looking, back oh damn i know a lot more now i would have made different decisions then but it had to happen that way for me to sit here to say this now i have it now now now i understand it now i just think because i know a lot of people deal with stuff like this and how important it is just to speak more

about it man so making the mistakes is like and the lessons those are the things that add value to your life ultimately and everyone knows that but it's like it's it's never when you want it's it's never how you want it but like you said the reason why i could even sit here and have this like conversation with you is because like it's that's really my life and then I'm able to have this platform because I really want to share to help people to understand like you know you can get through this faster you can get through this better because I didn't have a ton of that growing up like I grew up without a father I didn't deal with like I didn't have I was like trying to find father figures and so being able to be in this

position now like all the mistakes that I've even made in my adulthood it allows me an ability to communicate with people that maybe I could either get them to like slow down and think about their situation before they make that drastic mistake or to understand it like if they've made the mistake it was it was still necessary for their progress in life and I'm just I'm just happy to be able to be here and have these conversations and easy talking to you about it man because like it's clear that to be at the level that you're at and the things that you've accomplished like you will have had to make tons of mistakes so it's this it's nice it's a nice conversation yeah no question and I also believe there's a lot of characteristic elements that I've kept true

true to myself during this process, which I think has enabled me to rebound fast back with people around me. I've later discovered new circles. Regardless of what I've achieved and my accolades and stuff like that, that is flex Lewis, the body below. All right, boys, another interruption from the podcast. Check this out. Babble.com. One of the easiest ways of you guys are trying to learn another language. I've been working on my Spanish, still a little rusty, still need a little help. I'm actually really good at understanding it. But speaking it, you know, I'm a little bit, I'm a little bit self-conscious. So Babbel's been helping me out because I'm like, I kind of sound better instead of sounding like, yeah, I mean, for those of you who are like, you know, maybe, maybe you're in

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slash raw talk, get 55% off, learn some Spanish or any other language of your choice. Let's get back to this podcast. People will look at me and say I'm all, and they humble, but I'm incredibly driven. I'm incredibly confident. And you have to be. You know, if you ask me while I'm in prep six weeks out and you said flex you know how are you how are you feeling i was like great i'm going to win this show but i'm not going to jump in a podcast and say that in within my circle that's the belief system i had people that i'd literally fly in from different countries to be in camp with me i had the mentality like a ufc fighter or a boxer because you talk about giving back it's still relatable is what i'm getting at right um i would fly in these young guys these young

young up-and-coming guys Raphael Brando right now, right? He's one of the top and hottest up-and-coming kids, I want to call him a kid, but he's in his 20s, that is going to be a future. I would bring these guys in to be around me because when you are at the top

and you've been there for quite some time, it's quite easy to forget the drive. Regardless of how hungry you think you are, when you see somebody that wants it that hasn't achieved it yet, that was me that's who I need to be and you get them guys who are tenacious

they turn up on time they're the first ones there they're beating me I'm prompt on time when it comes to training I'm religiously there if you're there I used to have my Boker atone location no windows no doors and that's one of the reasons that's how the drag is opened up but it had like a security key card

if you were fucking late you stayed on sight it wasn't opening it you won't open it I'll give a fuck who you are how many times we train together and the lessons were learned and these guys came from all over the world and they texted me saying bro traffic was this my girl

wasn't getting I can give a shit should have left left that bitch in the fucking house no offense to my boy's girlfriends by the way but mentality of being a champion has to be a soldier-esque mentality like you don't go and join the military

and your sergeant or your captain or whatever would be is going to let you turn up late because you've done X amount of tours It doesn't matter. There's a fall in line. You're there on time. Be on time. And that's my mentality was, you and I then, once the door was locked, we'd have a 12 o'clock start every single day, 11.30 when we met up. We would talk about how your mum is. I'm sorry about the dog. Is it sick? Blah, blah, blah. Whatever life. On that 12 o'clock, we went in, that mentality would change. That would click. And that's one of the reasons why I was able to stay on top because of keeping that element and that sort of tenacious driver. me because them guys were on the chase, I was defending and I was all about a legacy at that point time. So you think, so you think, I mean, obviously this is a very common thing. I think hopefully

people understand this, but the company that you keep being one of the most important things. No question. Like the people that are going to push you, they're going to drive you, they're going to make you grow and be better. So who are some of the people, obviously your coach, but who are some of the other people that were like that in your circle? My coach, my wife, my family. And then I've had various different training partners throughout the year who kind of bring that element to the best out of me. But the ones who have been there, I mean, my coach has been there for 20 years. My wife has been with me now for 11. And in between, obviously, there's been people who have been, you know, incredibly part of my circle.

But the majority of people are still part of the circle. And when I tell you this, man, I came here with absolutely nothing. I slept on a sofa for a year and a half and full of 10 calories. Oh, whoa, whoa, this is getting really weird. I lived in Fullerton when I first moved down here. And I used to train in Coliseum gym. I trained there once before it closed. And then you see how big I was and then you left.

No, it just was closed. Like whatever. I don't know when they close it, but like, that's so funny because I live, I lived in like, bro, this is the suit. These are the stories that can fucking out of it up. I lived in like, oh my gosh. I lived in like the worst conditions possible for the longest time. I lived on my buddy's floor on a fucking mattress.

That's the same house, right? I don't think so. But it wasn't Fullerton And I did I did I was getting I was getting in the So in the body building

And I think I probably knew I'd heard you were there You've been there But I literally worked out there I think twice And then it got closed down It did So I don't know what year that was

Oh my God That was like 2011 Actually 2011 Yeah it was before that It was before that But it must have been 2010 then Because I swear I trained there Twice and then it was closed

I wasn't that anymore I don't know I think I was hearing About you being there Okay And you were like fuck that I wait for him to go that was a great gym though

it was a great gym like how long did you train there for off and on remember I came you on a three month visa um 90 day visa because the UK have that like you know traveling visa I abused that so much

that's crazy you can't do that anymore I can't believe you were in fucking I know I was there for a couple of years back and forth me back or forth and that remember that was the flex photo shoot chip and another thing for you too like these are all weird circumstances that are coming full circle but

Fullerton was my my place I used to train at and then I got signed by Weeder the publications at 21 years old you know where the HK was right here

right across the gym yeah I used to come up here to see Joe Joe Weida a couple of times it's just wild right yeah

I mean just recently sold that yeah it's sad man yeah that was iconic did you ever go on there never when it was that I knew I knew I went in I like I went up to it

before they like sold it and started remodeling it and I saw it but I never actually got to go inside you know what coming from the UK and you do so much

sacrifice and again sleeping on the sofa and I'm like you have them gays where it's like is this going to work even though it might be you will allow it to creep in and you're like shut the fuck

I still have fucking days like that man it's yeah but it's less probably right than it was yeah yeah but there's more things there's more things for to feel that you know maybe like the feelings can get like squandered

like it can get shut down a little easier but it's like I feel like I'm playing whackamol sometimes man if I'm being transparent And I mean, fuck me. I spoke about gear, which I don't do in anybody's podcast. Bradley's Man. Brally Man has got me talking about all kinds of shit to you.

And being open and honest. I mean, I have days where I'm so overwhelmed with all the stuff that I'm like, man. But I have that conversation with myself. And then I get, once you start moving and grooving, it's kind of like when I wake up in the morning and it's like, oh, my God. But going back to what I was saying about walking into the weed or offices and being so young and impressionable and going to goals gym. and having nobody there I'm not many names but some of these guys were strung out on all kinds of stuff and I'm like man this guy used to be in the magazines I used to look up to there was not a soul in gold gym venice that's why I moved to a full of time because everybody was doing going there for

the photo shoots so walking in the weeder offices in woodland hills 19 20 years old and just seeing the presence of all the the oil canvases lifestyle oil canvases and uh ben weeder had a collection of all these sculptures and stuff and then going up to the offices and you had fit and pregnant muscle and fitness flax all these different magazines which obviously was out with social media back then because it didn't exist and to see how these things were put together on a big wall and then you start seeing your face getting you know the spread is up the month three months before and then you see oh shit i got a little i got a little yeah fucking corner such a crazy thing compared to what it is now It's like we filmed this and could be up tomorrow.

Like, you know, it's all over the world. Three months, man. You said, these guys and girls have no clue, but to be told that, you know, you're going to be in the magazine, it's like, oh, great. And you, every month for me, being in Wales, you know, I was going back and forth. You go to the news agent and you wait for the Flex magazine US to pop on the shelves. You pick it up, oh, not this month. Yeah.

You wait a month. Oh, not this month. And then it comes out three, four, five months later. you know it's crazy but as you said you know we do something now we hit send and it's for all the world to see the internet's beautiful but i will say this i i still played like a little bit of half and half where um i never would post myself without a top on in the off season not even till four weeks out i never was that guy i don't know if you knew that or not but i was kind of like dorisnietz where you'd only see me in a shorts and a fucking long sleeve tea yeah it's it's funny

I don't obviously I wasn't competitive body moving but I relate to that I never really took many shots with my shirt off yeah yeah no never enough it was never enough unless it was for you is probably was that what it was that what it was like it wasn't enough until you were like on stage ready was it was it was it ego thing or was it like I don't want to show it was I don't want to show and then I was being told hey you need a show I know I look back and I think to myself you fucking I wish I took more trained more half naked but I to be honest I wouldn't have that That was kind of my brand. And I'd done a video the other day,

which was like a week and a half ago or something like that, an off-season photo, me all hairy. And I was curling in my house with my top off. And everybody was like, what the fuck is going on? Because you got your shirt off? I don't even do that. Damn, a little flex thirst trap. I got to remind them, bro.

I have to remind them, you know? How old are you now? 39. Damn. What are you, 33, 34? That'll be 34. Yeah. I was not going to lie.

I did Google that age before I got. I thought you were my age. That's fucking 34 next month, man. Oh, nice. Insane. Nice. Yeah, November 40, big four. But I still think I'm in my 20s.

I still think I can do everything. Is that how you feel? Certain things, yeah. Yeah. Body-wise, mentally, yes. That's why I see you too. You can kick it with any age. I feel I can relate to the guys who are Fortune 500 company owners that have been

invested in different various, different things, all the way to a young kid who's been in the gym for a month. Yeah, of course. You know, I feel I've been that kid, and I'm trying to be that guy. So there's a swing, but I truly believe that I can have a conversation with anybody, truly. Yeah, like, I do too. I just, as long as you. I love this shit.

Yeah, I love this shit too. I mean, I've got my podcast, which I know you said you're going to come on mine in the future where I will. The role. But I think, you know, I never was that guy in school to get up and talk. talk openly to a crowd. I somehow found out after I won the body village show. All right, boys, back again. This is very important interruption. Better Help. Sponsored this podcast. Thank you guys. Check this out. I know I've talked about this before. I've talked about this many times. I've done tons of Astrod Talk questions at the end of podcast talking to you guys

about the importance of mental health. And just in general, talking to a lot of guests about their mental health, what they do to learn, what they do to get better, what they do to grow through the issues that they're having that they've had. Better help can help you guys. It's a super easy platform for you guys to do it from like the comfort of your home you don't have to worry about you know lines you don't have to worry about setting up appointments you can just do it all from zoom basically and you can do it where you're it's just it's just easy so you don't really have an excuse you can't keep making those excuses and i've said this before and i'll say it again mental health trumps everything else right if we're not right here everything else will follow

okay so we can get right here everything else will follow then so go to betterhelp dot com slash roth talk to get 10% off your first month at better help again that is better help better help com slash raw talk do it now let's get back into this podcast that involves fucking getting on a mic and talking yeah then you're on stage so there's me half naked on stage as if that wasn't bad enough you win a show hey flex tell us how you went uh uh uh uh I had to kind I hate stuff and I work out yeah I kind of had to I hate this I hate this sort of mentality but I had to kind of fake it until I made it yeah and I you kind of rhythmic patterns of talking and then know like full circle for me um you know what was it a month ago i got my citizenship and there's

about 90 people in that room and because i was talking to everybody as soon as i get there you know every loves i guess i got that sign come and talk to me right all these officials are talking to me they were like hey you're going to do a speech yeah okay so i got up there and i done my speech about how much this meant to me the journey of getting that everybody is living the american dream in this room, look left, look like, broke behind you. Everybody's come from different countries. Yeah. And we're all here today and we've all gone through whatever we've gone through to achieve this moment. And I made the judge cry.

My fucking speech, I was like, what the hell is going on? Just the judge's crying. What did make me feel any better was the fact that, oh, I had a kid like three weeks ago, so hormones are all over the fucking place. But nonetheless, I still made the judge cry talking about my citizen speech. But my point is, I went from. being fearful of being on the mic more than getting up on stage half naked to then to know really enjoying it and do public speaking or do the podcast and I think that the method methodology and the sort of I would say the lesson that I've learned from being in these shoes is if you're scared

about doing something just fucking do it that's you're supposed to do it do it just hit it And also the thing you said about like, quote unquote, faking it till you make it is actually a really important concept to like train your mind to believe in yourself. Not that like you just like go fake shit like, oh, I'm the best bodybuilding in the world like and you're not doing anything. But like just the concept of, you know, when that thought jumps in and it's negative on you and you're like you're holding yourself down and you need to be able to catch it and go, okay, well, what's the good in this? You need to be able to kind of not fake it, but re kind of train. your thought so that you can go down the right path and you can create like those stronger the neural pathways that are like directing you towards the good instead of like the habit going towards the bad so it's a weird concept because it's like fake it till you make it but it's

it's very very necessary in success in like overcoming shit as well have you have you have you have you had to do anything like that is there anything that you were kind of scared of doing and then you done it i know i'm not trying i'm not trying to turn the flex lewis flex lewis podcast you are to get me started bro my everything in my life man like i mean i mean fucking like dude everything that I was like trying to accomplish and everything that I've done like even though like the whatever cool shit that people might have seen on social media like jumping out of the pool and all this like lifting girl shit all this shit I was like I would always have to like mentally this is a small scale right prepare myself and be like I'm gonna do this I can do this like I'm gonna do it right I'd have to convince myself to it but even to the large scale of like relationships and being able to allow love in my life and like I've I've fallen flat so many times on that and it's been one of the biggest detriments in my life but like I've also realized that it took all those things to be able to sit here and be like okay now like now I'm really ready I'm really ready to receive it because I wasn't for so long right you know so it's tough because

like it's very easy to get down on yourself and be like well I could have done this I could have done that I should have said this I should have said that but like it just it it it is what it is it happened now it's like okay what are you going to do moving forward because like I said earlier it's it's not about worrying about the past it's not about worrying about the future it's about being present right now to be able to actually create those things that you want the way that you know that you can have them and i and i struggled with that for so long specifically in like the relationship route because of my fears in relationship to like being worthy enough and feeling like i was good enough and and that's like been one of the biggest detriments in my life but i think also at

the same time it's been one of the biggest learning lessons in my life and it's like as much as i hate to say i've gone through this way many way more times than i wish i had it also has made me the human being I am today and it's like I had to go through it was it a time that you kind of recognize that like you dropped that ego and said man maybe it's a little bit of me too absolutely recently recently I've been I've been going through it recently so we won't talk about it I know if you start you start going I ain't crying on this bitch but with with you recognize it that's an incredible thing because you know we're in a world full of egos, right? You know, especially in our world, sports, you know, bodybuilding.

We have to, we have to uphold some sort of confidence, ego, whatever else. And, you know, I'll segue, you know, so we don't get too deep into other things. But one of the biggest things for me, most recently in the last year, six months more so and anything else was dropping the ego of the guerrilla suit that I had, I never recognized me for. The biggest I've ever been walking around lean Lean I never go fatt ever was 260 Yeah fuck at your height that's insane

Insane actually I think because they don't know how tall are you 6 2 Ha ha ha yo you're jokes this guy laughing out over here You're fucking jokes Fucking 6 1 there what the fuck Yo you're hilarious bro 5 6 oh yeah you're hilarious that's good 5 6

Because I'm 260 But I'm tall Yeah, well, right now I'm like 252. Yeah. What's the biggest you mean? 2.78, 280. And I didn't like it. How big you when you jumped out to the pool?

You were fucking big then. 260, yeah. Yeah. 260. I was kind of hovered around that weight. And at one point I like really kind of went up and I was like 275, 280 and I was like, I didn't feel comfortable. That extra 10 pounds is. Yeah.

That's when I was like, I was like, I don't know if I want to do this bodybuilding shit for real. That's truthfully when because I remember like basic shit was like, well, I'm just tired. Oh, like, I'm like. like walking upstairs and I'm like yeah I shouldn't feel like this you know so then I I just realized I was like okay I could shift my focus and also I always I always had a lot of health anxiety I always had a lot of worry like oh I'm gonna fucking die and I so like it always kind of like shied me away which also like probably was a better thing in the long run it is met and I will say to the viewers when when I came in here and I was talking about drinking energy

drinks one the first thing you said was like how many of them do you have a day you know we kind of went on the health yeah yeah yeah not to go and pop that fucking cherry but that to me just shows where your mind's at and where you're at in your life i don't know if you've always been that way but it just goes to show where you're at right now in your life and that stage of life um and i'm kind of there too you know where i've done the whole body bin and thing going kind of you know segueing back and forth into what we spoke about earlier but um i was very conscious about the exit strategy yeah you know a lot of guys will be for the no and they're like i don't give a fuck i want to be the big

this guy but then when you're sick what do most people want to do when they're sick oh not be sick not be sick yeah man when you feel fucking sick where you get the flu or cold whatever else every kind of says oh bro i feel like shit like oh man i just want to get back in the gym now imagine that is your day to day and because you as an unhealthy person through the the craft and the sport and everything else that you've pushed yourself into this position and unfortunately there's there's twofold right now. I'm finding out there's more knowledge that are coming in that people have kind of learned the lesson from guys of old because of other, you know, past things that

have happened, RIP, but also there's the new age element too where there's, oh, but this guy is taking this and this goes back to the conversation we said earlier too. There's no end cap to that yet. And we're not going to see, I feel, a lot of these guys talk about health issues because of that for another couple of years, you know, a number of years. evidence takes this toll you know but but um you know talking about um the health and everything else um what else are we talking about so i can say i remember there was something i kind of went on a little bit off the point but prior to the health stuff yeah what were you saying we were

talking about uh something you my fucking terrible life choices that led me here so great i hope you have it too right yeah i know terrible fucking life choices that fucking life choice i had to learn a bunch of lessons i remember so it was the the segue on being known as the body builder as the big body builder that's oh perfect we're talking about it in the gym yeah yeah yeah okay this is actually really interesting yeah um so i actually do really wanted to ask you this like you obviously had to be i mean you're still fucking huge though so it's kind of hard to give you this like not as big as not as big i'm so skinny right now competitor i want to be that's why that's why it's hilarious that's why this whole conversation is hilarious because i guess i've always really i've always

I actually wanted to ask Ronnie about this too and I never did. He was on my pot. I wish I asked him about this. But like to be at that level of like competition prep and be at that level of like year after year after year like up there because you're coming back every year to win this shit. And then and then having to forego that.

What does that do to your mentality? What did that do to yours? It was it was a process. It was a process. because of the gut issues I told my nearest and dearest and my closest of closest circles the ones that you know they are not going to break

any type of you know it's it's yeah that there's a possibility that I might not compete and I'm not going to lie to you my training partners both were crying they truly believed as did I I wouldn't have done this had I not

and persevered through the hell that I did I truly believe that I would have won the Olympia or had been the first ever champ champ but it's a word I could or should have right but if you look at the people who just came first and second I beat them both Hardy just won I beat Hardy in Korea and Derek Lansford came second

who took over the rain from me as a 212 champ incredible guy incredible champion will be a champion in the future but I've beaten him too So it would have been great mix for me to be up in that. Yeah, well, they shifted. You couldn't know that it was going to shift to that direction and bodybuilding. I felt it was going there.

Fuck. I felt it was going there. That's one of the reasons why, because originally when I had this mentality of shifting from the 212 to the open, people were telling me, no, they're always going to go for the biggest guy. But then shape and structure started coming through. Because of guys like Chris Bumstead and the classic physique getting such a great response, the open class kind of transcends into that.

You know, what do you want? Somebody that's winning shows that a fan, a person in a magazine can pick up and go, man, I would not want to be that big, but he's got a decent physique. And then they look at, then it goes down the line, right? Of course.

Chris, this is why the men's physique is so popular. Yes. So I wanted to have the best of both worlds bringing classic lines, symmetry and structure, no bare leaves. Well, you always held that. You always held that.

I prided myself on having that look, yeah. And I wanted to bring it to the open class That'd have been insane Like you would have done it So you gotta feel a little I don't know I'm trying to like deflect you How shitty I feel in my life right now

Back to you It's got to feel pretty shitty It It's you know No Okay good I'm okay I'm a great spot

And I tell you why I had to process it my way Right So when I told my closest Near India My circle of circles That I was doing this Everybody was like

Flax just think about it just think about it. So I sat in it for three months. Three months. I trained. I had my good days, had my bad days. I had my,

fuck, man, please, please, you know, I was appetite issues, stomach issues, throwing up every day.

It was horrible. Horrible. It was all food related. Yeah. Allergies and stomach, like I would eat something and literally my stomach would swell. And that's not me.

I don't have a belly. I never had one. It was just literally my stomach would swell from food. And again, when you've hired the best to the best in the United States I mean I hired three

I know I mentioned this earlier three gut specialists I could have bought the fucking house in Tennessee for the amount of money I spent trying to stay in the game but that's how much I believed I could have won this and I stayed in it to the very end

I knew I mean I can look you in the eyes and I can say I knew that I walked away knowing that I'd done absolutely absolutely everything so when I told the world or should I say I told the the IFBBB

you know Steve Weinberger, Jim Mannion and guys at the top of the tree that I respect highly that I've devoted my life to this craft on they were like just have just just push pause and I was like I've done this for three months I was already done yeah

I was already done and there was a lot of people trying to get me back out of that you know out of that mentality but I was okay I moved on I done a lot of different things I had to process it my own way and I also seeked you know helping in in in that process from you know you can remember and same for you too it's like Bradley Martin is a brand you've created this empire around everything you've got and there's all these kind of spider graphs that have come

off Bradley Martin you know zoo culture roguia etc etc yeah so then you start thinking it's like okay if I if that pops what happens to everything else around me you know I I have just under 200 employees in all my businesses underneath me so how would that affect them so that was really my anxiety there was true anxiety when I thought shit how is this going to affect them and I had to really think and then I was like this is for me am I happy in life and the answer was no and at the end of the day you have one life I have this and you'll see this when you come to my office I have this painting on my wall done by iconic and it's basically it's a ticket stub and it basically says one life

It's one life on that ride, and we're in their ride right now. Yeah. And you'd really have to live it on your terms, you know. There's so many guys that are in relationships that have kids and the shitty marriages and doing shit that they don't want to do because they've been taught by their generation before them, or it's been brain trained that they have to clock in at this time every single day and work and make money for the man, not for themselves, or they're in such a rut. I came to this country with knowing one person.

My goal was to be the best bodybuild in the world. I had all the fucking cards stacked against me. If I was a lottery, I won the lottery. But I truly believed in leaving my family, my friends, and everybody else in Wales that I was going to do this. And every time shit hit the fun, you know, my mom would be like, all right, babe, come home now, you know, I'm ready, mom's cooking and that was tempting. But I'd come so far that I did not want to let anybody down. And more than anything else, I was the one, I was the one that was going to change the generation. for everybody else around me and my goal was to you know be in this circumstance i'm in right now

to help my mom and dad to help my brother to help my family members and then pass back to other people too so um it's gone full circle now and going back to what i was saying when i made that decision i had to stand in my two feet and say no every wants me to come back i mean after olympia you know any judges yeah came up to my ear and basically said hey you got to win this you could do it next year good hype but you knew it wasn't it wasn't for you my heart was in this sport made since i was 19 i devoted my my life to this craft and right now thankfully i've set myself up to have that segue but that that transition was tough though i'm not going to yeah i have a question in regard to like obviously all the accomplishments

all the achievements what what would you say would be your most important attribute in like achieving that success like for you personally what would you say it was like the thing that you like this is one of the things that was probably if you put them all on like a a chart was like the most important thing for you having my kids damn you think that just pushed you over the other that made you just do everything met i found a six gear when i found when i found out my wife was pregnant that nobody could have fucking stopped me yeah he was like fucking bring it on and then when i had this little baby in my hand that was so vulnerable and like shit I'm the one now that that controls her future yeah and I just had you know my

second he's gonna be a year old coming up and it's a different mentality and that's one the other reasons why you're retired to because I wanted to be present you know how much times I've been I've given to other people promoters and stuff like that and I've been away from my my daughter and I've had to miss things I mean fuck me I missed the flight and I had a whole zoo at my house, I came home to pick up fucking giraffe shit and fucking elephant shit. That's what I was left with because I missed the flight. So with my son, now I said to myself, I want to be present and I wanted to have more of my businesses in an erupt around what I'm doing. So that would be my biggest accolade. In terms of

achievements and trophies and stuff, winning the first Olympia was an incredible feat. There was people missing that. What about personality? trait like what about like meaning what part of you would you say would be obviously it's as a whole but what about you do you think allowed you to really get to that point obviously like that the children are going to push you and elevate you to a different level but like what about you and your personality you think really allowed you to get to that level I just had a poor man's mentality I just thought you know people talk about this immigrant mentality of coming over to the United States I truly believe that I you know so many times you

fucking year now that the American dream is dead. I wanted to be that statistic of being the American dream. And I think I achieved that, you know, and I'm still in chapter fucking X, you know, I've got so many more chapters to do, but the personality aspect

of things, I think it was coming over here knowing that I've come from a very humble upbringing, steel work in mining town to then coming over to the United States and truly seeing the glass half full and chasing after my dreams so i don't know what that would be cliche does um but i had the the i say the poor

man's mentality to i still have it just drive yeah yeah that makes sense i mean it's just there's there's no other way it could have done all this no so okay so body building is obviously in the past now what are your focuses now business wise and life business wise um you know obviously the Olympia has most definitely allowed me to, I guess I say, have a platform, right? Yeah. The legacy that I left. I was able to retire from amateur. I have an unworthy with my amateur career, undefeated.

I went into the 212 class and I was able to retire undefeated in the 212 class. So I was two kind of thing. I think that's historic. I don't think anybody's gone into body building, into a weight class or open class, won everything in that weight class and been able to retire on top.

Yeah. So that, ending that chapter there, crossed off the, you know, my T's and dotting my eyes. The segue then was onto my businesses and it's very prideful for me to walk into Sue culture today

and just see Arsenal strength everywhere. Yeah. Which is obviously I'm parted in the business. business. Me and Andrew started up in 2015. I always kicked myself for this for not when I first opened the zoo culture of 2017 for not trying to become a partner. I always kicked myself for that. Was that you opening up? 2017. Bro. First of all, I never going to invite to come to a zoo culture in 2017. But I also think that you didn't know it was part of it. It was you as you as I had no idea. No, you did. When did you find out I was part of it?

Because I message you when you were like clueless, I think you were. Yeah, well, it must have been like years later like three or four years later maybe it was a couple years ago from nowhere yeah yeah I remember hitting you up and we were talking and uh I kind of think you faked it pretend pretending that you knew

yeah no no it was it took time I think like I said it was like after open the gym 17 18 19 20 it was probably like 20 yeah like it was a it was a few years like maybe 2020 when I realized it oh really yeah 2019

oh wow before COVID yeah it was just I didn't I didn't know because obviously I knew Andrew yeah Andrew is a stud net yeah he's crushed it today yeah great guy he loves you and we we all love you too fucking incredible guy man yeah we I kicked myself for that I'm like fuck I didn't know I didn't know you want the opportunity to I didn't I but I should have asked because of the position that I was in and what was time I know man I fucked up is I listen I love it because I like it's I mean we could talk about it more but like I I'm like I love the equipment

I love like even just the way you guys you know my experience with Andrew in the way that he operates the way that he helps the planning the way that he pushes the process forward everything I mean I'm like dude I love this brand and so it is definitely something

I mean I'm sitting here now be like I'd love to try to figure out a way to still be a part of it I mean I kind of am because of the relationship we have we definitely part of it but like I'd love to figure out like a like a real way to be a part of it because I still kick myself I still kick my thumb. I'm like, dude, why did I not bring this up?

Well, listen, we can talk off camera, I guess. But I guess with what we are involved with right now and how you push and promote and what you've done in the gym for us. I mean, me and my guy, Roderick, when we walked in there, I was like, where are any other pieces? You kind of got the same ratio to me. Yeah. And obviously, I'll talk about my gym now, but you have like a,

It looks like it's like a 90, 10 split between Arsenal and everything else. I mean, take away Card, you're, and everything else. Yeah. I was looking for pieces and you got pretty much evident. And, you know, red is red and black is my colors. And we're, we're working on the pullover. That's what I want. It's coming.

It's coming. If you're not getting it before me, my phone. Oh, no, no, no, no. I was going to take that shit from your fucking gym, bro. I need, I told him specifically. I was like, this is the one thing we need. I need this. Yeah.

Like, easily one of my favorite machines of all time. Oh, awesome. yeah it's it is definitely well needed for our line of pieces of equipment and you know there's there's certainly you know incredible brands out there but I'm very prideful of what we've created from honestly met concept and very short telling you story you know Andrew is an incredible partner incredible partner I would say I'm the crazy one or us both but what he'd done back in the day him and I were training together in Tennessee, in a gym in Tennessee. I used to live in Murphysboro, Tennessee. And we were

training in and I was, I think it was two or two, Mr. Olympia back then. We were training and doing something together. And he was telling me about an equipment company he was working with back then and some of the issues he was having. And I said, start your own. Start your own. You've got all these relationships. People are there for you, bro. He's like, yeah, I know, you're right. I said, fucking do it, bro. Seriously, I'll help you with this. So I went on the road with Gaspari. I went like a month tour I come back he's like flex I sold the house I'm doing it I was like oh my god what the

bro and I was like okay I'm in I've got to I've got to but I believed in him and I believed in the concept and then obviously 2015 is when we officially you know opened and now we're global and thanks to guys like yourself who are you know strategic partners that have been able to you know

showcase the pieces in a in a different audience because your audience is different to mine right yes there's crossovers but you have such a unique and it's very social media based as well you know you're the top of the tree in that world so everybody comes to you because you're the man in that world so it's it's great to see what you've done man I'm proud you know of what you've done throughout the years and and again obviously I know we're kind of newly meeting but everybody who kind of knows me knows I won't throw them words around easy because it's

earned you know not given and that's that's your story right this being earned. So what you've created, the empire you've created right now is truly, you know, very impressive and also, you know, very motivating too, Matt. I appreciate it, man, truly. It means a lot. No, truly, it does. Fuck. I don't even know where to go from there. The guy got me kind of emotional. It's, you know, it's interesting because this industry, it's rare for people to really, like, who are, you know, at the top of their game, who've been at the top of their game to actually show love. You know, another person who showed me a lot of love once on camera,

who's done incredible things in the sport was Kai Green. Another guy who told me, he, I remember at the, we're at like a Jim Shark meetup in Venice and he came to me and was like, you were one of the first people that showed me that I didn't need bodybuilding to like have success because of like what I did on social media, the timing in which I did it. That like no one else was really doing it to that degree. And he gave me, he gave me those flowers then and I couldn't be more grateful enough because like he went to the top and I think, you know,

he had his issues with the organization and why he, He didn't continue to compete. And he said, you were one of the guys who, like, really inspired me to see that I can, I can make a life outside of this. And then he pursued that. And, you know, so there's probably two people who've given me those who give me that love. And it's you and him. Oh, man.

And everyone else is like, I just, I feel like, I don't know, it's like a lot of motherfuckers are, they're they rather like. I mean, if you pull any of my guys aside, they'll tell you, I'm very big on. Also, there's, there's a, there's an element to that some people don't need to be put on a pedestal because they think they're already there, you know, there's, but I'll still give them the props and the love that is needed. But I also, in the flip of a coin,

in this generation and this day we're living in, and the success people have, not many people give flowers when they're still on this earth. Yeah. I was very blessed to have an incredible relationship with Dallas, McCarver. You know, he was my training partner

when he passed away. And that was a, you know, a horrible part of my life, you know, I had to rebound and get back in the, in the driving seat for the Olympia that same year. But I used to tell him all the time how proud I was of him. And that was a wake-up call for me because, you know, we've lost a lot of friends who you could have said something to them. And maybe that in some cases, not all cases, of course, may have been enough to live another day or something, right? So on the top of the tree, man, more people need to give respect when it's done and earned. And for me to you,

you know, you are one of them figurative people who know what I'm at in my career, I'm trying to be like Bradley Manning because I'm trying to be jacked and athletic, you know? I come from the rugby background and I'm now going back into that. I'm actually started a transformation now, which I'm showcasing on my YouTube.

I'm kind of a little cheeky plug there. Yeah, go for it. I don't care. But I think that's my mentality now is more getting back than athleticism. You know, I can still do a backflip and after a couple of drinks, but. Fuck that,

Listen, It's so funny because people have asked me for years Why I never did a backflip Because I know that I could Because I jump very high Yeah The reason why is because when I tried to do a backflip Yeah

I got traumatized So someone told me they were like Yo, I got you Like I'm gonna help you You know how they can help you through it You put yes yes This motherfucker has me do it I must have done it on like

The floor was not meant for backflips Or anything Well that's number one rule Number one I was just like But I'm trusting the person are like no i got you easy like this i was up at some gym in sacramento i'll never forget this um i think it was with your i favor oh jeez and some other guy some other ufc coming of you anyways

and uh yeah i was at your i favors gym and and yeah and so he goes i got you it promised it's so easy he's like all hyped up so i believe him oh shit this motherfucker goes to help me gives me zero help i destroy my knee like fucking destroyed my knee it hurt for like a year year and a half you landed on your knees landed directly on one knee not on both knees on one knee like all my weight went to one kind of like you went on a kneel position backflip so I backflip and I didn't complete it and I landed on like this knee like I didn't land on both so it wasn't even it was all trauma and so it hurt for literally like a year and a half and affected all my lefts everything else that I was doing like I bench and I'd be like fuck my knee again and it wasn't it was terrible

it affected everything and ever since then I was like you know fuck this shit yeah I got trauma I was like a kid I couldn't even like go to try to do it again I was like no this is gonna happen again well because I didn't like I didn't I didn't like tuck it I just like jumped and I just floated but I floated too slow and just hit the name ever had anybody had anybody show you before that or was it just initiative no that was literally the first time someone was like try this and I was like yeah I can jump high anybody but he convinced me he was so happy he's like yeah no I got you do I promise it's so easy like and I was like oh he's so convinced so I just did it fucked completely fucked my knee and it fucked my

training up so I was like nah I'm never doing it's that again and that's the reason why I haven't done a back look can you walk in your hands I think you can do that yeah yeah yeah I can do a back I'm gonna do a back that I'm gonna come I'm gonna use that motherfucking mentality and I'm gonna do a fucking backflip one mental I ain't given you own mentality no no I will promote that mentality on anything but I didn't do one for the backflip I didn't give you I didn't give you no you did I fuck up my knee it's you it's on you this oh my god this this guy what is on your hand I need this to be rowan so make sure I didn't give

any better forget it it was flex he ruined his knee If you're doing one, I'll do a one. But yeah, I walk in on my hands. My daughter found out I can do a handstand and then now me showing off because she's like, you can't do it again, you can't do one. And I'm like, I done one last week.

You can't do another one. Oh, my God, that destroyed my shoulder. Now you're a pro. Oh, my shoulders are so wracked. You know, I got two-tone fucking lay brems in the back there and they're always reminded me like this. But, yeah. Well, listen, man, it was an amazing conversation.

I would love to have you back on again. Thank you. I'm going to come on your show. Yes. Obviously, I'm going to come visit your gym in Vegas. I'm obviously talking about opening a gym in Vegas. Dude, we got, we have to talk about this off camera, but, um, because I'm, like, there's a location, but it's like, it's like way too close to your gym.

Oh, no. Come on, bro. Everyone's, everyone. Cause you text me, you're like, yo, people saying blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, it's not even like that. Yeah. Because I was, because like, I want to open a gym in Vegas. And, you know, I don't think people even, I don't even think people, I don't know how much

people know about you and your involvement. at least from my audience in Arsenal. So it's like, it helps either way. Yeah. You know, it's like, as long as it's not on the doorstep,

it helps either way. No, no, on the doorstep? In Vegas. No, yeah. No, it's like,

it's like, if I'm looking at the map, it's here, Dragon's Lair is here. And it's like, it's across the highway. That could be 20 minutes. So,

no. How, how, it's not 20 minutes? No, dude. You might have to find a different. Oh, my God. It's like five,

six minutes. Oh, bro, you can, No, but it'd be like a bunch of people. There's a bunch of people go to your gym, yeah. Nah, they go both, dude. I'd be like, yo, check out Dragon's Blair.

This guy. This guy. We could just turn your thing in like a protein house. What do you mean? You want to turn my gym into a protein house? No, turn your gym into a protein house. I'm fucking with you. I don't have it set in stone yet.

I don't have the exact location yet. That was a potential and I was like, that's probably, I don't want it. It's a little too close. I appreciate it. But I am really wanting to do that. And obviously, you know, you're a part of it, which is dope. And it's, so either way, I just kind of expel the whatever rumors, people like talk shit or this.

Oh, you know, it's Vegas. People want to kind of, you know, they'll run back and forth. So sometimes I kind of like throw a little sprinkle because I'm friends of the end caps. I'll be like, hey, listen, I said this. So if it comes back, you know. I said it. And I've done send the messenger a couple of different things. But what I, obviously, it's vague.

I guess people your gyms that are coming to Vegas all the time. I mean, we've had, since I've opened up, there's been five gyms that have opened, four or five gyms that have opened since in Vegas. Listen, what people don't understand from the outside in, you are very involved with the gym. You're very hands-on gym owner, and I'm sure you'll be spending quite some time in Vegas back and forth.

Oh, of course. Periodically, right? Yeah. And that's what gyms need. They need, like, a watering. They need a Bradley Man. People are coming into the gym to see you. They come to zoo culture.

in hopes they're going to see you. If they don't see you, there's an element of all these other celebrities there. Vegas is not a big place. You know, when these gyms have been set up from afar and, you know,

we've got guys that are coming in from Korea, there's guys that are coming in from Canada, there's guys that are coming in. But they throw money at this thing. And then they soon realize that the membership pool is so small that you and I, you work off tourism and we have the name.

Yes. You know, so that is our kind of forte. We've worked hard to making sure that tourism It's something that, you know, is a bucket list for us. It's part of the experience. And for them, you know, opening the gym and throwing equipment in and just thinking it's in. It doesn't work like that.

No way. There's an ambience to be created and something needs to be watered, just like every business. So, you know, you come into Vegas definitely will be an incredible element. I'm looking at a couple of locations here in, uh, I'm not joking out. Yeah. No, no, no, but it'd be cool because, again, listen, your, your demographic, traffic is not mine and there's a crossover so you know Vegas is an incredible place I love it there and obviously I moved there during it's coming up it's going crazy actually I'm I love recruiting

so I brought a lot of pros in from different parts of the world and know what they call themselves you know they call Vegas their home you know and obviously selfishly if I get to see you more than than this weekend you know it's great for me and I think synergistically too you and I will fall into so many different conversations off camera that as soon as we start talking more and more where we're closer than than we thought we were because we've got a lot of mutual friends a lot of different business ventures and I'm sure there's advice that can be spread on both sides again I want to see the best other people I think karma is being very good to me my mentality in life is you know just treat people or you want to be treated people

to yourself and now it's gone full circle for me and I've been able now to give back to the future and here I am, you know? And you just want to note that too that the reason why I'm here today is because I came out here, what, two weeks ago?

Yeah. And we tried to lock it in. I forgot because I used to live in San Antonio for a number of years. Traffic has gone fucking ballistic. More than worse than what it was. It's definitely got worse. For me to come and meet you two weeks ago wouldn't have been on the on the cards We tried it.

We wouldn't work it out. You were doing the Laity Wheels podcast, which I think dropped it today, right? Or something? Yeah, dropped it today. So, no, you know, I said to you, let's get back on and it was like, come out whenever. I was like, how about next week?

Yeah, easy. I told you, I'm a man of my word, bro. Yeah, you crushed it. And I appreciate you, you know, opening up your zoo culture gym for me. A lot of fans there. I took a lot of photos today. Great to see so many people working on the Arsenal Strength Pieces.

And you're right now in all your podcast. It's been a blessing, man. I'm really grateful to have you on. I appreciate you. And I'll come when I come to Vegas, I'll come on yours and show you some love too. I love that. We're doing the new studio too, so you can be one of the first guests. Hell yeah, I love it, man.

Thank you for your time. Thank you, my, thank you guys. Subscribe to the channel, subscribe to the YouTube, iTunes, Spotify, all that good stuff. Drop some good reviews. I love you guys. We're out of here.