RAWTALK - Interviewing the Most Canceled Man on the Internet | Nick Fuentes

Episode Date: July 29, 2025

Sponsored by: Prize PicksUse code “BRADLEY”& Make your first $5 line up & get $50 whether you WIN OR LOSE!https://prizepicks.onelink.me/ivHR/BRADOn this week’s episode of RAW TALK, Brad sits down with Nick Fuentes and talks about the Netanyahu Full Send interview, why he doesn’t date or go out, his near-death experience after going viral, why he’s been blacklisted from major platforms & much more!Hope you enjoy, see you next Tuesday!SUBSCRIBE HERE: https://www.youtube.com/c/REALRAWTALK?sub_confirmation=1LISTEN ON APPLE PODCASTS: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/rawtalk/id1294154339FOLLOW RAWTALK PODCAST:INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/getrawtalkTIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@askrawtalkFOLLOW BRADLEY:INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/bradleymartynSUBSCRIBE TO RAWTALK PODCAST CLIPS: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvzSBNBOK599FqzrTZS8ScQ/?sub_confirmation=1SUBSCRIBE TO LIFE OF BRADLEY MARTYN: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWTQG2aMDYKGDqYEGqJb1FA/?sub_confirmation=1SUBSCRIBE TO FITNESS CHANNEL: https://www.youtube.com/bradleymartynonline?sub_confirmation=1RAWGEAR: https://www.rawgear.com (CODE:RAW)

All right, guys, before we get into this podcast, make sure you download the Price Fix app right now. Football is almost back. Probably one of the most exciting times for me to do any picks. So if you guys want to get in on it, down the Price Fix app right now in the App Store, put in Code Bradley on your first $5 lineup. They're going to be $50 for free.

Go to the app store right now, down the PriceFix app. Put in code Bradley when you sign up. Again, $5 first lineup. You get $50 for free. Let's get into this podcast. Wow, where do I begin, man? It's funny because I've seen other interviews with you, and it's always just like the notorious, you know, the most controversial.

But yeah, Nick Fuentes, man, I've seen a lot of your stuff. I've, you know, I heard about you through, you know, obviously the internet. People go, watch this guy's stuff, seen some stuff. Some stuff I'm like, going, kind of far. Understandable in some cases. Some case, I'm like, doesn't need to be said. But regardless, you definitely seem to have a really strong voice in this entire like political space commentating. I believe you have a very successful show. Thank you. What is it like being almost seems like enemy number one to the government? It's tough. It's weird because I feel like

I do a talk show. So in a way, I don't do exactly the same thing as you, but ultimately I do videos. I live stream myself giving speeches about politics, and I've been on the no-fly list. I've had my bank accounts frozen. I've had people try to kill me at my house. And so I've sort of accepted it. It's normal for me. I've been doing it for 10 years, but sometimes I wake up and I'm like, I feel like a terrorist,

but I do a talk show, you know, or at least that's how I'm treated. So, but it's like anything, you get acclimated to it. You get used to it. Where did it start for you? Because from what I understand, early on your career, you started questioning, I think were you working with the Daily Wire? No, I almost was. You almost were.

And you started asking questions about the Israel lobby. Right. And that was like, what, how many years ago? That was in 2017. So that was eight years ago. And after that, it was just like, it was downhill from there as far as, like, you being able to do all this stuff without backlash. Yes. Yeah, there were kind of two things that were happening at that time.

You know, I was in college. I was at Boston University. And the thing that people don't realize is that's where they groom all the conservative influencers. So turning point, all the different campus groups. You're looking for, like, the young, best and brightest conservative people. And when they get into those groups, they then start their career towards being a Fox News host or being a daily wire host or something like that. And I was very much in that pipeline. I was very much on that trajectory to being like a conservative pundit, at least at the very early stages. And they basically realized early on in the beginning of 2017 that I was not going with the program on that one issue, on Israel. It wasn't even anything else. But I just insisted that it was not consistent. with what everyone else was saying. You know, Trump and the inaugural said it's America first.

And I said, well, there's one country that seems to be the exception there. And I would never let that go. And so one track is that I was being actively canceled and blacklisted by the conservatives. And so that actually happened first because I wasn't really known. I was just an 18-year-old kid. I had a thousand followers on Twitter. I was getting 100 live viewers on my show. I really had no big following.

But people were moving behind the scenes. It was like a whisper campaign saying, don't hire this guy, don't bring them on your podcast. This guy's bad news. And how did you know that? I was being told that by people were sympathetic. And I'm sorry I'm going to rotting a little bit, but do you also believe that if it was, even if it was the Democratic side, would you have still got the same pushback?

I'm sure. Absolutely. Okay. Because, you know, in both sides, you do have this kind of censorship. you do have control that emanates from the center. So I think even more so on the left, people are surprised that it happens on the right because we say that the right is the free marketplace of ideas.

And you can express yourself and be politically incorrect, but that's only up to a certain point, up to a limit. So I was getting canceled. The first big thing is I had guys from campus reform, which is like a student-run group, they would report on the left-wing outrage on the campus. those guys were coming after me. The Daily Wire crowd was coming after me,

badmouthing me on Twitter, behind the scenes. I got banned from CPAC, which is the big conservative convention. And so one track is that in the industry, I was just blacklisted from the start, throttling in my career from the rip. But then the second track, the kind of second thing that's happening,

is that then you have the social media censorship, which is ramping up. So after Trump wins the election, Twitter, Facebook, YouTube, they all gradually, incrementally start cracking down. And between those two things, it was like a pincor. I could get no opportunities, no platforms, no jobs, no interviews, no institutional support from the conservatives.

At the same time, I couldn't make my own career because I got banned on PayPal, YouTube, ultimately then Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and they just kind of cascaded one after the other. And so... What was that like? They're sending you emails or like you're just trying to post, and it's like your account's gone.

Like, what does that look like? It's, uh, it was dreadful because you would wake up literally one day. You try to go on your app. Like, as you know, you do, you go on Twitter, whatever. And then it's, you're, you're done, you're gone. You would wake up. You'd try to open up your account and you would be signed off automatically. You try to sign back in.

Oh, there's an error. You check your email and they'd send you an email. Your account has been permanently suspended. And most of the time, they don't even give you a reason. Yeah. They just say violations of our. TOS. And you appeal and you ask them, you know, what did I violate? What's a specific thing? But it's so opaque, they don't tell you anything. And so you're just waiting for that other shoe to

drop every day. And it's not even just the social platforms, but banks, airlines, Airbnb, even obscure things. What is banks? They're just like, hey, you got to get your money out of the account, your account's closed? Yep. You get a letter in the mail. And they'd say, we've made the decision to close your checking account. They say because of reputation. risk. That's the excuse they use. And they'll call you on the phone and say you have 90 days to move all your money out of the account. Wow. Okay. So before all this stuff happened, before you even really got into politics, like how did you find your way there? Why did you find your way there? Well, I was precocious. You know, when I was like 12 years old, I was really into politics,

but I was reading what was available in the mainstream. You know, back when I was 12 or 13, This had to be back in 2012, 20, right around there. There wasn't a lot of online content on social media from conservatives. They were a little late to the party. And so what you had was Breitbart, Prager University. They didn't call it Daily Wire. Back then, they called it PJ Media. That was Ben Shapiro's outfit.

And so I just downloaded all that stuff. And I was a big, like, libertarian, neocon, actually. I was a big supporter of Israel, believe it or not, is that's just what there was. If you were a conservative and you were looking for viral conservative content on YouTube, it was all pro-Israel,

pro-free market, this kind of stuff. You weren't a gamer at all? You weren't playing video games at that age? I was a gamer, but I was really more a political nerd. I was like a big geek. That was like your first love.

Yes, absolutely. Yeah, that's crazy. At that age is nuts because I was just fucking playing Halo. I'm going to be honest with you. Again, a different generation. I think I got 10 years older, I mean, I was in the halo. I just figured like maybe you would have been on cod or something.

Yeah, I mean, I played, I did a little video games, but I wasn't good at them. You know, I was always just more of a nerd when it comes to the politics. Yeah. That's crazy, man. So, so I, because what I find interesting about you, like, because I've seen your show a few times, you, you do everything sort of off the cuff, like off the dome. Where are you actually getting your information? Like, how are you digesting all this and retaining this? Well, I get it from everywhere. You know, I, honestly, I just read the New York Times every day. And I know people will be surprised to hear that, but I, every day, I just read everything in the New York Times. I read everything on Axios, which is another news platform, which is very

mainstream. But I'm, I'm just on Twitter all day, getting tips and getting information, you know how it is. These days, to get the really hot stuff, the current events, you've got to be on Twitter following people that are in the know. My question with that, to that is, I feel like I'm getting to a point of, and I don't know if it's just because the overall presentation of certain things or certain events that are happening, but I'm always like, is this real? Is this the truth or is this, you know, they're always like, oh, it's Russian propaganda or it's, it's propaganda from this side or that side or it's, I'm always like, you know, because whenever you say, oh, this is a thing, it's always like, well, that's not real. That's not true. Like, how do you

know what's true? How do you discern what's true and what's not true? Well, the thing is, when you have a lot of deep background knowledge, you can read the New York Times and sort of read between the lines of what they're really saying or what they mean. Because, you know, everyone's getting the same news. Everyone's getting the same news from the newswire, from the Associated Press or from Reuters or the U.S. intelligence community. If you are a discerning reader, you kind of have to know the motivations of the sources. So if they come out, like with the current war, with Iran or in Gaza, if they come out and they say U.S. intelligence says this or the Israeli government says that, if you kind of have a sense of what they want and what they're pushing, you kind of understand

why they're saying what they're saying. And I guess maybe it starts from a simple assumption, which is they're going to report something and you're going to have a reaction. Now, your reaction was their intention. Whatever your responses, you have to think they wanted me to respond in this way. So, for example, years ago, there was a story about Russia was paying Islamists in the Middle East to kill Americans. They were putting a bounty on the heads of American soldiers. Now, if you think at that time, what do they want me to think? They want me to be anti-Russia. They want me to think Trump is being soft on Russia. So if the average reader is reading this and not thinking too much, they're going to say, Trump is soft on Russia. He needs to be

harder. That's a way for the New York Times to pressure the Trump administration to be more tough on Russia. They're trying to incite the population to have a certain opinion and demand that he has a certain foreign policy posture. And so it's not necessarily, you know, you go to a certain obscure website that has all the real information. It's more like you just kind of need to have a certain sense and a certain background knowledge to see what what is the intention of the mainstream media to kind of read between the lines and understand it's a regulated press yeah so when you do that though you you don't think you have biases when you're in your sort of assumptions of okay what is the real thing here i do i think everybody has a bias but

you know i i just try to my best to be objective i try my best that's why i read something like the New York Times, or I read the institutional press. I read the Israeli press for that matter. You know, for all I get heat, the big thing, people say I'm anti-Semitic. I read the Jerusalem Post. I read the Times of Israel every day, you know, to get every side of the equation. Yeah. Why do you think, though, what do you think the biggest reason is why people say you're anti-Semitic? Well, it's just like everything else. There was a time, which I think we're now emerging out of, thankfully. You can call it wokeness. You can call it, correctness. But there was this time of immense sensitivity for maybe 10, 15, 20 years in the

country where if you say anything that is against the grain on race, on Jews, on women, on homosexuals, on transgenders, you get called these names, racist, sexist, anti-Semite, Islamophob, homophobe. And, you know, I got started really at the peak of that period in 2017, at the height of that, like, anti-Trump hysteria, people forget even what it was like. Now it kind of goes without saying the things you hear on Joe Rogan, the things you hear from Theo Vaughn, Shane Gillis,

you say they would have never gotten away with that 10 years ago. So I consider myself to be relatively moderate, and I know you would have to push back. I have a provocative sense of humor. I'm pretty bombastic, but I consider myself moderate. Yeah. This is the one thing about you that, like, I, When I, because I've seen a lot, I've seen a lot of stuff.

I've seen like the Hitler comments, the, that when you say the N word jokingly. And I see it and I think, damn, like, not that all those things are so bad, but to the majority of people who are like looking at you from the outside and not knowing enough, they're going to immediately sort of disavow you. Right. So like I was, I was talking to Dan about this too. Like a lot of stuff he says, he'll tweet a lot of stuff. and I'm not saying whether it's true or untrue or false or not but it can come across to the majority who are like this just seems like a hateful individual

because they're saying this because they're willingly saying that or they're joking about that and I'm not saying I'm in the right all the time I joke about stupid shit all the time sometimes I'm like damn I wish I didn't say that is there anything that you wish you didn't say or you didn't sort of transverse the way that you have

yeah I mean there's a lot of things where after the show I sort of immediately immediately regret it. And I'm like, oh, I shouldn't, yeah, I went a little too hard here. And you know how it is. When you're a content creator, even a comedian, I consider myself something like a comedian. I make a lot of jokes. My show is very funny. And I think any comedian will tell you, when you're, especially when you're doing it improv, when you're doing it without a script. And you don't have that time to kind of think about it. Sometimes it doesn't work. Sometimes you do a joke and it doesn't land. It doesn't work. It's too far. It has a wrong tone.

maybe. And so I can't think of anything off top of my head. But I do get what you're saying. But a big part of what I do that I think a lot of people don't realize when I got started at the age of 18, there are these like non-profit groups like the Anti-Defamation League, the ADL, Southern Poverty Law Center, SPLC, right wing watch, which is under People for the American Way. There are these, and it's not to make excuses, but this is how it works. you do have these left-wing nonprofits. They're paid by the left or various billionaires and their job. It's literally they will have interns and people on the payroll that watch my show every single

night as a left-wing person or someone that disagrees with me. And they will literally clip. And I'm sure you know, even this is how it works in media in general. Anything that sounds bad, even if it's a joke, even if there's bigger context, they will take the 10-second clip, and they say, oh, the white nationalist hater is at it again. He just said this, and deprived of the context of the tone, if it's a joke, over 10 years, I do a show every night, you collect enough of those 10-second clips, you can paint a picture of somebody where it's like, this is a lunatic, this is a raving maniac. And a lot of people don't realize

this is a political operation that gets paid to create these clips for the purpose of reputation destruction. And I decided from an early age, I'm not playing games. I'm not going to be guarded all the time and manage everything I say. Oh, I hope this doesn't sound bad in a five second clip. I said, I'm going to be myself. And I always thought eventually people will watch the show and they'll figure out who I really am. But that is a very dishonest aspect of the industry. Yeah. I mean, even outside of that's your specific political spear, that happens. on the internet period for creators for anything whether it's like a you know some relationship drama or some parissocial shit where they're like oh this is happening or i mean the most popular

thing i think recently is like the live stream is they'll get a clip and they'll they'll put and this is not specific to any single person but they'll put like a caption over a video where it's like it's just to create sensationalism of a situation that isn't actually that sensational but i guess i'm kind of curious on you is do you as you do your show or as you say certain things do you you, are you aware, because I would consider you a very smart individual, are you aware of the sensationalness where you're also adding fuel to that? Because you know that that's a real thing that's going to happen regardless. Are you also willfully doing that, knowing that? Absolutely. Oh, I'm baiting them all the time. And actually, early on, I think I did that a lot more

when I was younger than I do now. I think I'm a lot, I'm a little more mature. I'm a little more discipline. But when I was younger, and it was a different ecosystem, you almost had to bait them because we were, and by we, I mean the far right conservatives, we were being censored and even shadow banned. We were being suppressed. And so at that time, it's like the only way to break out, especially for me, because I wasn't getting on Fox News. I wasn't getting on. Usually that's the program. If you're a conservative, you get the interview spot on Fox, on Blaze, on Daily Wire. I was blacklisted from everything and censored. So it was like the only way to break containment was to be outrageous.

And so I'm not going to lie, I absolutely baited it. But the overriding priority for me always is just to try and be funny, to try and be entertaining and provocative and funny. And some people look at me and say, well, you're kind of cynically baiting people and you're a provocateur. I don't think I'm a provocateur. I think that I try to be challenging. funny, and by essence, that is provocative. If you try to be funny and you're not provocative,

to me that comes across as safe and stale and boring and not fresh. The things that are fresh and exciting and outrageous, they tend to be provocative. The stuff that people say, it's a guilty pleasure. They're like, I hate that I'm laughing at this, but it's so funny. I love that stuff. So that was always my goal. I get it. I get it. It's just, I think in your sphere, or like your ecosystem of political commentating, everyone going into it or watching or consuming the content or seeing you speak about, you know, these big issues,

geopolitical things, they're looking at you more so, I think, through that lens and not through the lens of a comedian. So when the comedy comes in, they're like, is this guy just hate this or hate that or hate those people, hate these people?

I think that's how it can come across that, in my opinion, would then lessen your ability to reach a whole group of people that would be more apt to listen to you than they are because there's the jokes. Right. But at the same time, I can't tell you or any person how they should make content or how they need to show up in their content. But I think that's a large part of it.

Because then, like, we were talking earlier, the groups that are there set out to sort of be like, hey, this is a bad guy. Don't listen to him, essentially. Right. You know, disavow him. It makes their job way easier. Mm-hmm. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. I would just say that, you know, just a life philosophy is I just tend to be a thinker. Yeah. And I think everybody considers themselves a free thinker, but I think that the moment that you start to tell yourself, I have to be on guard, I have to watch what I say, I have to, I think it's kind of all or nothing. You're either going to be that way and you're going to be very controlled and very intentional and you're going to be very almost calculated and strategic, or you're just going to let it fly and you're going to be yourself and you kind of let the chips fall where they will. And I guess it's a matter, it really is like a fun.

fundamental life philosophy, I always thought, yeah, people are going to hate me. People are going to hate this. They're going to hate what I'm about to say. But that's also a big part of changing people's minds. I'm a big believer in, you almost have to kind of shock people out of the old ways of thinking. I'm not a believer in this sort of, it's a big debate that goes on on the right wing. Do you favor an incremental approach? Do you kind of drip feed and, you know, leave a crumb trail where people can kind of find their way, or do you punch him in the face, you know, metaphorically, and say, this is a truth, it's outrageous, it's raw, and at first people are appalled, but then they're thinking about it, and then they're on your side.

You know, it's sort of like you plant the seed. And being entertaining, I think, is part of it. You know, if you take it almost too seriously, it almost plays worse. If you're me and you're very stern and very serious, people start to see. say, this guy is evil. This guy is like a calculating sociopath menace. Whereas if you kind of let your guard down and are vulnerable, where you're hard on your sleeve and say, I'm just a funny, weird guy. I think in a way it's almost disarming if people give you a chance, you know? It's just interesting because exactly what you said, you know, I would speak to people in the industry

about doing it, just doing an interview with you. And they're like, no, he's a calculated evil guy. But so it's like it goes, maybe it's backfiring. Yeah. So I'm like, you know, for whatever that's worth, it's just I think you got yourself there somehow, right? And maybe at certain comments you've made, like, you know, you talk about people say, oh, you're this white nationalist. Like, are you a white supremacist? No. No, I don't consider myself. I'm a believer in race. I think that race is real. Yeah. You know, I think that there's white people and black people and that it's real and it means something to us. Yeah. But I'm a Catholic So I think that we're all created equal by God.

Right, right. And do you, so I guess kind of getting into this, your political sort of idea of what you want America to really look like. You want it to be more Catholic. You want it to be more Catholic driven, more Catholic sort of, I don't know if the right word is owned. But that's where you're coming. That's where a lot of your messaging comes from.

Yeah, I want it to be more Christian. And I'm Catholic, so in particular Catholic. And I also, I think it needs to be more white. I do think it needs to be more European. I think that, you know, and I get this comment a lot. People say, well, you're Mexican. Your last name is Fuentes. And it's true.

My father is half Mexican. His father's 100% Mexican. We've always had black people in this country, Hispanics, Asians, going back hundreds of years. But we've had like 50 million immigrants come in in 30 years. And I'm sitting here looking at a city like L.A. or like Chicago or New York, and I'm saying, when is enough enough? You know, we've had 50, 60 million people. But that's my question to you is, how do you even say when enough is enough?

Like how, on your side, I understand your perspective, but where is it for you or for me or for anyone to say this is enough? Because this country also was founded on that basis of immigrants. Well, I would push back on that a little bit. I would say that when the country was founded, it was almost all English people. It was almost all Northern Europeans, and almost all Protestants, too. So it was ethnically homogeneous, racially homogeneous, religiously and culturally homogeneous. On all four of those cylinders, you had uniformity.

And then you're right, in the 19th century, it was no longer ethnically homogeneous because Germans and Southern Europeans and Eastern. I'm Italian, too. I'm half Italian. Yeah. We started coming in. And then in the turn of the, or I guess midway through the last century, you know, then other races started coming in with other religions.

And I guess the country has changed over time. There's no disputing that, and the changes are baked in. We're never going back in some sense, and I don't think it's even possible. But when you say it's enough is when they no longer are assimilating. When you start to feel like what America is, it starts to become uncertain. Does it mean speaking English? Does it mean being Christian? Does it mean having certain European values or constitutional values for that matter?

A lot of the people coming in, they contest these things. And so you look at a city like L.A. where, you know, a few weeks ago, they're waving the Mexican flag, burning cars, protesting that illegals are being deported. You say, is this a free-frawl or is this a country? Or even in Texas. They want to build like a giant Muslim community center where people say that's going to be like Sharia law. going to be a giant mosque in the middle of it, or in other places, they build a giant Hindu temple with huge statues. And you say, is America a whole? Is it a country? Or is it a patchwork of all these grafted nationalities where they kind of set up little India, little, little Somalia

in Minnesota, little Mexico? And I think it's kind of undermining our national coherence. But who is to decide what that is? Well, ultimately, the people of the country, you know. I mean, we have a system where people vote. And I think that that's really what the Trump election was about. I think in 16 and 20, and even in some sense in 24, it was a referendum on what do we want America to be? Because Hillary Clinton said, forward, it's going to be the future is female and more diversity and more wokeness and more gayness and more everything. And Trump said, no, we're in a sense going back. We're making America great again.

There's like this recurrence. And I think that was a big referendum. The country said we want the country to kind of be a little more conservative. We don't want to go so, so fast, so forward, and keep going in that same progressive direction. But do you think that that means that there just need to be no inclusion of all those other things, you know, the Moss, these other things that we mentioned couldn't exist? No, absolutely not. And I have a kind of complicated view on this. America has 350 million people.

We're one of the most populous, one of the biggest countries. and we're, in a sense, no longer a republic, or even some would say, strictly speaking, a nation. Some say we're past that. We're really more, when you think about it like Russia or like China, in the sense that we are a multi-ethnic, multi-religious empire. And so a country like Russia, they have a lot of Muslims living in Russia.

They have a lot of Asians living in Russia. When you think of a Russian, you think of a Slavic, ethnically Russian, Eastern Orthodox person. Nevertheless, Chechens and Dagestanis and Tatters and others are part of Russian identity. They're just on the periphery. Same thing in China. When you think of China, you think of a Han ethnically Chinese person that speaks Cantonese or something like that. But you have Mongolians, Uyghurs, you have a lot of diversity in China. I think America can be the same way. We can be America with a black minority, which we always have had. We can be America

with a large Hispanic minority. But the question is, if diversity goes too far, eventually America becomes nothing. Without that demographic core, without that monoculture, that you could say America is rock and roll, hot dogs, baseball, red, white, and blue. In 50 years, is America going to be high ally

and soccer and cricket? And, you know, and people are speaking all these different languages. I'm concerned about preserving that ethnic core. So we can be America with, diversity, we just can't have so much diversity that there's no longer in America. I see what you're saying. I guess my thought, like when I hear that is, you know, you talk about the future and like where it all goes. At some point, I mean, it seems like we're

just going to be fucking part, part human, part fucking cyborg. Excuse me, cyborg, right? Part human, part machine. Overall, not even speaking just America straight. And I guess I understand the ideas. It's just like when I think about it, who's deciding? Who's deciding that? that, right? Like, why, why? Because, okay, we, we're getting to this, the talk about the conflict in Gaza and the Israel stuff. And because I, I just, when I have this whole conversation, I think about this, I go, well, what about what we did to the fucking Indians? What about we did to the indigenous people? I mean, we essentially did what a lot of people today would say Israel is doing to the people in Palestine, which is like removing these people from this area,

right? Um, what they call it? A genocide, ethnic cleansing, all the, all these things, right? We essentially did that, took this space here. So I sometimes I have this conversation with people, a lot of times off camera, I'm like, at what point do we decide that it's not okay anymore? And I don't think killing, murdering people, removing people from a country, removing people from an area is ever okay. But America was also founded on that. So at what point are we discerning and saying that like, okay, now is, now is like, for example, if we speak about Israel and that whole conflict in Gaza, that's not okay. I do think it's not okay. I don't think it's right. At the same time, our country was also founded on a similar action. We came in, we said, speak our language,

this is our religion, here's a lot of diseases because your immune system didn't jive with ours. Basically took this country. And then we made it what we're talking about right now. So like when I hear it from like a really like bird's eye perspective, like I don't have skin in all these games. I'm an American. I love America. At the same time, I can look at it and say, well, it was founded on the same principles that we're demonizing this country for now. That's why we exist here. Right. So when is it right and when is it wrong? Well, I would say that in terms of when I evaluate right and wrong, it comes down to individual actions, you know, because I understand what you're saying, which is that, and I'm actually

even sympathetic to it. When you look at what the Israelis are saying in a certain sense, in a narrow sense, you can understand where they're coming from, which is that they were stateless. The Jews were without a country for 2,000 years. They were in that land. They were expelled, and then they were a minority in Europe and in all these other places. And because they were a minority, because they lacked power, they were abused. And so they were subject to the Inquisition and the pogroms and the pale of settlement and the Holocaust, ultimately, and all these things. And that was the basis for Zionism, which is, we need a country of our own. Now, easier said than done, because it turns out all the countries are taken, you know,

so you have to settle one. And they came into the mandate of Palestine, and they fought with the Palestinians, and they declared independent, you wouldn't have to go through the whole history. But needless to say, they're sort of throwing elbows and jockeying to try and get comfortable in the Middle East in a region that doesn't want them there. But the question becomes, how do you conduct the war? And I would point to something very simple. So in Gaza, they've destroyed all the infrastructure, like literally all of it, all the buildings, all the roads, hospitals, schools.

It's intentional that they're doing that. And even when you look at how they're killing people, a veteran, a green beret, just came back the other day and said they're using Palestinians going to these aid distribution sites for target practice. So these people that are starving to death are going to get their food and water from these distribution sites, and they're getting shot by the IDF, defenseless, vulnerable people that are hungry. Hamas isn't even launching rockets anymore. They have no ability to counterattack. And you say, the Israelis will say, well, it's a war. That's what happens in a war. When you fight, people die. But in Iran, you can see in the war in June, they will literally target a single apartment with a drone strike. it's so precise, it's so targeted, they're doing assassination strikes with drones, they will hit one apartment.

Forget about the whole building and the whole city. And so if you can detonate pagers and radios, if you can blow up one apartment, if you're the most sophisticated military with precision guided munitions, how are you accidentally destroying 90% of the buildings and committing 100,000 civilian casualties and shooting children and people getting aid? At that point, it's intentional. And you look at what they say, which is, this is an ethnic cleansing. They say, we want all these people out of the land. Now, there's an argument to be made about how do you carry that out. I mean, what is the solution to Israel, Palestine? But you know the solution is not starving children to death and shooting

innocent people that are defenseless and getting aid, blowing up their homes so they have nowhere to go. you know that's wrong. So that's where I come at it from. You can kind of get, the Israelis have a case to make that this is not an ideal living situation for them. At the same time, we all have moral responsibility,

especially now. Yeah, the one thing, I'll get on Twitter and I'll see just the reactions to this is like even from like a lot of our, I don't know if they're Congress, people, or senators, they got that great checkmark. And I see them and they're just like,

almost like hurrahing on this, death of these innocent people as if like well if they wanted it to stop then they would Hamas would just stop right and it always seems to be like the deflection in my because I'm like but like you said is it should it just be well they should just stop and I see it and I'm like that's just like complete void of humanity because what is this this child supposed to do like what are they what are they, how, are they supposed to rise up and be like, you know, the six-year-old be like, Hamas, please stop. I don't, how does that work?

And then, and then my perspective shifts and I go, kind of like what you said, speaking of Israel and the precision and how much intelligence. And even what we're told as far as Israel being, you know, our greatest ally in the sense that they have this like superior intelligence and the superior military and like, obviously they have a lot of our military because we give them so much aid and they buy stuff from us. Then you, you go like, it's. It's almost like as if the United States, with its superior power in military expertise and, like, the craziest intelligence would be, like, bombing Chicago.

And then being like, oh, but they got it, they should just figure it out. And it's, it kind of makes me question, you know, like, because I'll see these things and they'll be like, well, this was a mistake and that was a mistake. And I'm like, but at the same time, we're told that they have the best intelligence. So how do you, how do you have, how do you have this level of intelligence? in this level of power and you still make these mistakes or you still do these things or you still just blame the other side

without being able to come to sort of like conclusion and like, you know, peace agreement or an actual ceasefire and stopping this or how do we get those people out of there in a way that they're not being used as, you know, human shields or whatever they're saying? And then I'll see the tweets of these like people in our government

just being like, fuck them, they should just give back the hostages and get Hamas out. Right. Like, it's a, it feels helpless. It does. And what's evil about it is that collective guilt, where they say, Hamas attacked us. Every two million people are now guilty.

And not only are they guilty, but they get the death penalty. You know, Hamas did this attack, and they believe it was perpetrated by 25,000 people. They say, well, now two million people are effectively sentenced to death. Everything is justified against. them, whether they're armed or unarmed, whether they're men or women, whether they're adults or children, they're all guilty and they're all going to die for it in the most cruel way. They're starving them out. Like this is, there's now over a hundred deaths from famine. And these are pictures that are coming out. You don't see pictures like that coming out of

Iraq or Afghanistan or any of the wars we've been involved in out of Ukraine. This is unique to this conflict where they've shut down all the food, all the water. And you realize it's intentional. And what the Israelis do is they just hide behind this narrative about, well, Hamas attacked us first. Does that mean you have no moral responsibility? I think everybody recognizes in a hostage situation, in any situation involving a soft target, you have moral responsibility, especially when you're the more powerful entity. Israel's a nuclear power. They have a nuclear arsenal. They've got modern fighter jets. They've got modern precision guided missiles, a standing army, a country, the Palestinians have rockets, these tiny rockets, there's 20,000 of them,

they don't have a government, they don't even have a state. And people say there's any kind of parity here, there's any kind of equality between these two regimes. Even when you're fighting an insurrection, you have culpability. But, and this is what I point out on my show to take it a step further, a lot of leftists will criticize the conduct of the Israeli government. And they'll say it's a racist government. They'll say it's a settler colonialist government. It's capitalist. That's why they're evil. I would contend it is on some level because they are not Christian. Because Netanyahu gave a speech last year, and he said that the Palestinians are Amalek. Amalek is a biblical term. It refers to a store in the Old Testament where the Israelites wipe out an entire race.

They're called the Amalekites. And Yahweh tells them, kill all the women, all the children. murder all of them, genocide them, so their bloodline stops. That's the language Netanyahu uses, which is literally... Those are his own words. He said they're Amalek, yes. And that's a reference to that Bible story. And if you read anything about the Israeli government, anything even about Talmudic Judaism, what they say is, we don't love our enemies.

They say that the non-Jews, we don't even consider them human. They don't have souls. They don't have moral culpability. they say, and we have very little regard for their lives. Is the Talmud, though, is that their governing sort of book, or is it the Torah? That is their governed. So the Torah is the Hebrew Bible. And technically, the Talmud is part of the Torah.

Torah means teaching. So you have the written Torah, which is the Hebrew Bible. Then you have what is called the Oral Torah, which is a tradition that was passed down orally. Now, the basis of Judaism is the 613 commandments in the Bible. So there's the Ten Commandments that are famous, but there are other commandments about clothing, about diet, about all these other things. You know, when you think about Jewish people, they're very litigious about how they cut their hair, about if they can mix fabrics, about how they wash their hands, if they can mix meat and dairy. So they have 613 commandments. That is what you would call the written Torah.

The Oral Torah is how they interpret and apply those. 613 is not enough to govern every facet of life. So what the rabbis do is they have to interpret how they apply. That's what you call the Talmud. And the Talmud is, it's basically rabbis debating each other about how we interpret those commandments. And it's been refined and rewritten over thousands of years. But that is the basis of Jewish law. It's those written commandments and the oral application of them.

That constitutes the whole of Jewish law. So it is the Torah also. Because I feel like as I've talked to Jewish people, about the Talmud, and they sort of dismiss it as if it's not the main governance of their religion. It is, though. Any Jewish student who goes to a Yeshiva or a Jewish school, that's like Ben Shapiro, he studies the Talmudic Judaism, that is the Judaism of today.

Without it, you can't interpret Jewish law. And so your conclusion, your assumption is that if it wasn't, if they're, if they were Christian, or if they were Catholic, it wouldn't be like that? I wouldn't necessarily say that it wouldn't be like that, but in principle, in principle, you could oppose it. Because what a Christian says is love your enemy, turn the other cheek, pray for your enemy, because we believe that everybody is a child of God. We believe, contrary to the Jews, Christianity is a universal religion, meaning that all someone has to do as a Catholic, we believe, is profess a belief in Jesus Christ, get baptized, be confirmed into the church.

Anyone can be a Catholic. Jews do not believe that. Jews believe that you can only be a Jew by—you're born into it, yeah, right. By the matrilineal line, matrilineally, by the mother. And so Christians then say, we forgive the enemy. You know, the golden commandment is treat your neighbor like yourself and forgive your enemy. And so I think that if you had a Christian government prosecuting this war, someone could credibly say, this is contrary to our religion. So, okay. So I got to, I'm not going to, obviously, I got to, I got to kind of contest a little bit, this idea, right? And the reason being is that when I think about all of these issues and I think about just the world in general, I don't know if it's, could it be a something that it's

just because of a religion? Because we can look at Catholicism, Christianity, like how much stuff have we done that's fucked up? Like we talk about what we did over here coming to America, we speak our language. This is your religion now. That's, oh, you worship the earth and the ground and the seasons and that's wrong. This is right. So that concept, we also did that in the name of God, in the name of Catholicism, to a whole group of people. So when you say this, like I hear it and I could understand why you think that based on their teachings.

But at the same time, we believe the same thing. that you're talking about now, then we still murdered a bunch of people for our, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, well, and that's why I say it wouldn't make it impossible. That's, that's why I was careful to say, you could credibly say in principle, if a Christian government were doing what they're doing, you could say, you could point to the letter of the law and say, this is wrong, because you're right, Christian regimes have done bad things in the past, but I think a big reason why things have gotten better? When you say, you know, why was it that hundreds of years ago there was conquest and how can you say the laws of conquest are no longer allowed today? You know,

that it's wrong. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was right for us to do it, why is it not right for the Israelis to do it? I would say that part of the reason why things have gotten better over time, why there are now laws of war and a right to protect, why there are, you know, we look at what's happening in Israel. People say this is wrong. I think a big part of it is because of Christianity. I mean, let's not pretend it was the Christian West. which evangelized the world. I mean, yes, there was colonialism all around the world, but also there were missionaries

that evangelized the indigenous people. When the Europeans came to this continent, there was human sacrifice, there was cannibalism. And it was contrary to what people believe it was widespread, because the indigenous people, in particular here, they couldn't get protein because they ate so much corn. Like a lot of it was because of their diet,

there were a lot of problems with that. Cannibalism was a huge part of their culture. Human sacrifice, child sacrifice, sacrifice. And so, yes, we brought smallpox, and yes, we brought with us imperialism, which had a cultural expression as well, but we also made them Christian. And same thing in Africa and same thing in Asia. So you're not wrong. You're absolutely right. But the idea that I'm speaking to is at what point is it okay for someone to implement or to, you know, force their beliefs onto another person? And at what point is it not okay?

when is it okay when is it not okay because you said they they come and they evangelize these people right what does that mean that means make them apart believe uh believe what we believe right like how what i'm saying is how are we just determining as humans when that's right and wrong like we're you're sitting in this position and i'm having this conversation right now today we're talking about the past and we're talking about what's current but at the same time what i'm getting at uh is that it's still a human thing where how are we discerning that now is okay and then it wasn't and or now it's not a okay but then it was because I hear what you're saying right but you're still it's still going in the circle of like well we made it better but we made it better for us I think we made it better for

the whole world I think but did you think the do you think the indigenous people do you think the people who were here before like they made it better for me they killed them I think the the the there's a survivorship bias there isn't isn't there in the sense that the the people that were killed by cannibalism and human sacrifice, they're not around today to say, I'm sure they would think it's better. But I'm saying the people that we came and killed because they didn't want to join us

because they liked their way of life. They like the way that they live. They liked the things that they sort of believed in or worshipped or thought were right at that time. Right. Like that's what that was their whole, like right now, it's the same thing as if someone came into the US

and was like from a different planet and was like, this is now your way of life. If you don't like it, we're going to kill you. And you have to believe this and you have to think this, and this is your new religion. The concept is still the exact same thing. Right. And so, like, that's the, that's the, in my brain, I'm like, it's a human thing.

I think humans are just innately greedy and fucking evil. I agree. Well, and let's also not pretend that colonialism was inherently motivated by evangelization. I'm not making that case. What I'm saying is that because the Christian West kind of won the last five hundred years, through colonialism and the technological race and everything else. My point is, when we look at something like Gaza and we say that's against the rules of war, who created the rules of war?

They were created out of World War I at the pinnacle of all these Christian empires, in my opinion, motivated by Christian principles. It wasn't the communists that made any kind of prohibitions against human rights violations. It wasn't Muslims. It wasn't Jews. It was the Christians. And, you know, to your point about what you're saying is really something like, moral relativism. At what point do you say, we're right, you're wrong, it's going to be our

way. And I think that, first, it's a question of how do you know you're right? And I would say conscience is a big one. As Catholics, we believe that God wrote the moral law on our heart. We inherently know right and wrong. When we see a vulnerable person being attacked, you know, there was like a clip the other day. There's like a lot of these videos now of like, you know, interracial violence, like black people beating up white people and vice versa. And, and And one thing that people point out is like brutality. Let's say somebody gets knocked down. A lot of the times in these videos, you see people start kicking their head.

Someone gets knocked on the ground and the attackers kicking them in the head, stomping them, even past the point where the person's not a threat. And everyone goes, ooh, that's wrong. You know, they shouldn't do that. So we have conscience. We have revelation, according to the Old Testament. You have the prophets. but there's other claims, there's Joseph Smith, there's Muhammad, there's, you have to evaluate

those revelations, you have to evaluate the philosophies. That's every person's decision to make. But once you determine what's right, I think you have a moral obligation, actually, to fight for what's right, to fight for justice, and to not say, well, let them be evil over there, you know? Yeah, but that goes back to like, who's believing, like, whose perspective is saying what is right and what is justice. And it's obviously unique to everyone as far as they're drawing the lines back to religion as far as I'm concerned. Absolutely. So that's where it's like, you know, you could have this conversation about the worst individuals in history and say, did they believe that what they were doing was right at the time when they did it? Right. I would say that I believe

everyone thinks they're doing what is right at the time when they're doing it. Because that's what we do. We do, I believe people do the best that they can with what they have when they have it. And then, you know, obviously historically you look back and you go, maybe that wasn't the best. But I don't think, I don't think, like, do you think Jewish, the Jewish people, or excuse me, not just necessarily Jewish people, the Israel, in Israel and Israeli government is doing what they believe is right? Or do you think they're willfully doing what they believe is wrong? Oh, yeah. They absolutely are doing what they believe is right.

Okay. But, but that's why I say you have to evaluate the difference. systems. Yeah. And say that in their system, what is their system based upon? And you're saying system, this religion. You're saying no religion. 100%. Yes. And contrary, even to what left wing, because left wing people say it's Zionism, Zionism. I would say that Zionism obviously is inextricably connected to the Jewish religion. And what the Jewish religion, it's problematic. And you could even go to Jewish sources. There's a Israeli Jewish historian named Israel Shehawk. He wrote a book, it's called 3,000 years

of history. And he talks about how for thousands of years, one of their great theologians, for example, Maimonides, they call him the Rambam. He is considered the Thomas Aquinas of Judaism, like the greatest scholar of Jewish law. He said that every Jew should pray for the death of every Christian every day. And this is loaded up in the Talmud. It's loaded up in Kabbalah, which is the mystic tradition, which is this intense hatred and distrust. particular of Christians, but of all non-Jews in general. And many of the Zionist religious Jews, like the Cooke's, actually they're called, there's a father and a son, their name was Cooke.

They said they like that the Christian West is becoming atheist. Because the sooner the Christian West becomes atheist, the sooner they will recognize the God of Israel and worship the Jews. It's like, so this is what they believe, and this is what is motivating their government, their ideology. And it's even members of Netanyahu's own, his own government, his ministers believe this stuff. The national security minister, the finance minister, members of the how do you verify that? How can you verify that? They say it. It's in their, the Times of Israel, it's their press. It's in their statements. You don't have to look very far. You know,

there is, I'll give you an example. So one of their ministers, I think it's either Smotrich or Ben Gavir. There was a highly publicized incident where Jews were spitting on Christian missionaries, spitting on them who were making a pilgrimage to the Christian holy sites, and it caused a big controversy in Israeli society. This is the times of Israel. One of the current Israeli ministers said, spitting on Christians, that's an old Jewish tradition. It's not a crime. They shouldn't be arrested for that. It's fine. He defended this. So that's just one example. But, I mean, if you literally just read what they write, it's all there. So you're saying that they're willfully, like, self just professing this.

Absolutely. Absolutely. And some of the more tactful ones will look at the extremists like that and say, oh, you don't, don't say that publicly because they want to maintain the illusion that everything's good between us and them. You don't think that maybe that some of them wanted to not necessarily be that way? I do. Because there's, like, a lot of that stuff, obviously. is not directly correlated to how, how we act or how we are in, you know, our regards to religion and, um, it, like, it's still shifts. It's still gross. Like, we could talk about

Catholicism. They're kids and they're doing all this fucked up shit. We're like, that's wrong. Most of us believe that's wrong. It happened. I don't know if it's still currently happening. I could only assume so. Right. Um, but then there's the ones who go, that's wrong. What the fuck are you doing? They're, they got lawsuits for this shit. And so my, my point is like, don't you believe that, you know, even in this, in this case, we're talking about Judaism and Israel, that there are ones, there are some that are like, okay, this is wrong. This shouldn't be this way. There are. We are evolving. And there are. And absolutely there are. And I want to clarify, I'm not saying all Christians are good people, all Jews are, I would never,

that would obviously be ignorant because we're all people and everybody individually is both good and bad. Everybody individually makes good and bad decision. So, it would be ridiculous to say that, but in terms of a system of ideas, some systems of ideas are flawed. And I think that when you compare Christianity in principle, meaning relating to the definition of, the definition of Christianity is self-sacrifice, is Christianity is the idea of the Christ, which is giving your life for the sake of everyone, even those that put you on the cross. That's Christ, right? Is the idea that he was nailed there and forgave them, whereas the Jewish religion is based on something entirely different.

Yeah, this conversation is so interesting because we're relating, you know, these theological ideas to humans. And I mean, that's, you know, how we show up and how we believe or we think it's right versus wrong. And then there's like what actually happens, though. So, you know, I think it's easy to stand from any position and speak like this, This is it. And, you know, God wrote this or this is in this Testament, old testament.

But are people really ever following that to a T? Are they really ever doing that? On all sides and all religions. You know, I gave so many examples. Like, I have Muslims friends that, you know, they pray, but then, you know, I see them over here at a strip club, you know, or drinking or it's so. My thing is like, we're having this conversation right now about religion and God and the idea and these obviously, you know, these different religions have these different

perceptions of God and what it is and how it exists and how it relates to them. And then human. And for me, I've just always personally been so like, I've been so weirdly like connected but also disconnected from like just religion, religion. Like I fully believe in God. I fully believe that there's no way this is just random. It just doesn't make that. It's too perfect to be random. Also too terrible to be random. But I've always had this hard time really coming to like, this is, this is the one true idea. This is the one true truth of like, this is what it is. And I don't know if we, humans could ever get there until they get to the other side and see what it, see what happens, see what it is or how they show up or what, what's next. So we always have these

conversations about right and wrong and this God or their God or this perception or that. And And how are we really saying this is right? Well, like I said, it's up to every person to evaluate based on their conscience. And based on, I mean, look, the Bible is a record of prophecy, of revelations, and it has also been expounded upon by philosophers and theologians, just like Islam, just like Judaism, all these traditions and people, they have a moral responsibility to evaluate those things because you're right everyone everyone is imperfect everybody is flawed because of our human nature we say that's human nature we mean we have envy we have desire we have appetites we're weak we're mortal

we die um but we have a it matters what we're pointed towards and the question is the trajectory what is the ideal we're striving for and we'll always fall short of for christians we're striving to get up on the cross, which means to die for the sake of another. Selflessness, which is love, which is rooted in a self-giving love, the love that God has for us, the love that we have to show to everyone else. I think that is the best idea. I think that's the best moral idea. Whereas Islam, you know, in Islam, you know, even to get off the, I don't want it to be a bash fest against Judaism. That's the subject of, you know, the war in Gaza and everything. But even something like Islam, they don't say Allah is their father. They don't say,

Allah is love. They say Islam means submission, which is different, right? Because Christianity says, God the Father. God is love. They don't say that. But isn't submission to God, to their God, whatever, you know, isn't that also a form of love? They don't say it that way. They say that Allah does not need creation, that we are nothing compared to him, and that we, they say that we are Allah's slaves, is what the Muslims say. But when I hear submission, Being able to submit, for example, in a relationship over something, obviously there's like big ideas, small ideas. Being able to submit into something is a form of love, in my opinion.

Well, and Christians, we submit to God also, but it's, it is in a loving sense, in the sense that, you know, our God, for example, in the Christian theology, became incarnate in man. He became a man, and he walked with us, and he talked with us, and he knew us, and died for us because he loved us. Whereas Muslims, they actually believe we're idolaters. They think there's one God. The idea that Jesus would also be God or that God would be a man, they say is a form of idolatry because we're idolizing a man or a different God, a separate God away from God the father, what Christians would call God the Father. Their version of God compared to ours is distant, impersonal. Our God came to earth to love us intimately, a self-giving love. They're

God is distant, is removed from them. It's not intimate. He didn't come to die for them. He doesn't need them. He doesn't want to draw the people, the Muslims up to him. It's the Muslim's job to submit to their God. So it's a subtle, maybe it seems like a subtle difference, but in principle, it's a very big difference. And I think the fruits are seen in how these different societies have progressed over the years. I mean, you know, there's this idea of the fruit of the poisonous tree. Yeah. The Christian civilization has given the world the laws of war, as one example that we talked about. It's given the world technology and medicine and given the world, I think a lot of good things.

Whereas you look at some of these other traditions, I don't think it's given the world as much in terms of... What about, what about like the Chinese, the Chinese medicine, like that whole side of the world? There's a ton of stuff that's given the world, I believe. But you also have tens of millions of people killed. by collectivism. You also have, in Islam, Sharia law. I don't think anyone would look at Sharia law as something that is like truly stirs our soul

and is compelling to us. Yeah, I guess there's like, is Sharia law in Dubai? Yeah, they have it in the Emirates. There's no, I know there's no crime out there. I went there, it was like, you could leave a, I think I left my phone somewhere, my watch somewhere, sat there, no one touched it.

There's, I'm not saying it's like, this is the only way, but there are things that I remember around. I was there. I was like, this is fucking nice. Everyone was super nice to me. I don't know, maybe it's because of fucking internet, but there's no crime. I know that. That's true. But that's because they're brutal. That's because they're brutality. So maybe there's something there. They stone people. They laugh people. I agree with you, by the way. I'm just saying there's there that I was like, damn, this is fucking, this is nice. So I guess my, I'm just having this conversation because I'm just like I'm so interested in religion I'm so

interesting the way that people connect themselves to to God and into their purpose and what they need to do in their life and it's just also fucking interesting to me because I just go back to it all and it's you know it's written or you know there's profits but it's all of human translation it's all of like hey to me it feels like a giant game of like telephone of thousands of years where they're like this is now how you have to be in in a world that is so completely different that when it was written then with technology and all this stuff and it's like how do you how do you really get it right? Do you think at some point, like, do you think it will ever just

be peace? I don't think is, I don't think that exists. I don't think it will ever just be peace. Totally agree. Yeah. I think, um, you know, a big part of my worldview is that we live on the other side of heaven. So any idea that things are going to be perfect here, uh, and even in some sense, the way that like the language of left wing people, they always talk in terms of this is unacceptable. This should not be this way. And it's like, Okay, but we live in the world, and as long as we live in the world, there's going to be suffering, there's going to be greed, there's going to be all these things. You know, they look at, for example, our leaders or our system, and they say, if it weren't for those greedy corporations, if we're like you're greedy, they're greedy, they're greedy, we're all greedy, we're all fallen, we're all sinful. And so the best that we can do, and to your point earlier, you said, everybody is really doing the most with what they can.

They're doing the best from their perspective in the moment. And what's incumbent on us is just to try, is to try to get to know God, is to try to know. I think we all have a moral obligation to know the truth and to know the moral truth and to fight for it. I think that's everybody's obligation. And I resent the kind of relativism that says it's all complicated. So to each their own, you know, there's a certain form of abdication. You're kind of giving up your responsibility because there is a truth. There is a justice.

And I think we should fight for it even while recognizing that we're never going to have heaven on earth, you know? Yeah, I see. I see. It's interesting you said, you know, because I know something you talk about in relationship to our government and Jewish people being in power or having influence. I know you speak to a lot of it. You speak about Jewish supremacy.

But, you know, just moments ago, you. sort of submitted unironically to the fact that like it's not going to be perfect it there is greed no matter who but you seem to think that it's because they're Jewish that it exists at that level I would say that in particular when it comes to because there's two questions in Israel I think that the reason they have no qualms about being brutal there's something baked into the Jewish identity which is why that is as far as our system in America why are Jewish people so influential. I think that has a lot to do with how they organize as a tribe, you know, because it's without a question. Jewish people are one of the most influential

groups in America. And I don't think... The highest IQ, too. Some people say this. And some people say that's why, right? They say that they're influential in media, government, all these different things. And it's unignorable. And so the natural conclusion that people draw is it's inherent, that they're smarter, or it's cultural. They're educated. And those are too good. I mean, both of those things are true. Ashkenazi Jews do have a very high IQ. And they are extremely educated. And, you know, I know that firsthand because I have a lot of Jewish friends, and they're some of the smartest people I know. Some of the smartest, funniest, without a doubt. And, you know, the stereotype is just true. It's not trying to be glib.

They're very good at making money. They're hustlers. They're good salesmen. They're very clever. And I have no qualms about admitting that. But when you look at just how much influence they have and how they acquired it, it cannot be attributed alone to their IQ or their education. I'll give you a perfect example. When you look at the high school standardized tests, I forget the name of it, but there's a high school test. This is an article that was on the Unz Review, the Unz Review, he wrote a very good article about this. is called the myth of American meritocracy.

And he says that when you look at some of these standardized tests that measure math, science, and language achievement, the top scores across the board, they're almost all Asian, almost all Asian on math science, less so on literature. And that's why it is Asians that are making up the majority of Ivy League admissions now, so much so that they have to artificially, you know, they call that affirmative action, and they have to decrease the amount of Asians they permit into Harvard and Yale. And let other groups in. Right.

Yeah. And yet, Asians, although they're more numerous than Jews in America, Asians are 7%, Jews are 2%. Asians don't dominate media, Hollywood, finance, government. Jewish people do. And so you say that Jews are 2,000% overrepresented at the admissions in Colombia, but they're not 2,000% overrepresented in the high achieving scores. of high school seniors. In other words, their influence is not commensurate with their achievement, with their IQ, with their educational attainment. And so you would say, how do you account for

that disparity? Certainly you would expect that Jews within Judaism, there'd be a lot of successful people. But out of all of the powerful hedge fund managers, you wouldn't expect that half of them would be Jewish. It seems like they just went to they, they were smart enough to go to the right places. I think you could say that. I think on the other hand, you'd say that they work as a team. Yeah. Well, that's what I mean. That's in the sense when I say smart enough,

like you said, this tribalism, this idea like working together and being as a unit is, in my opinion, a part of IQ. Because IQ measures, there's tons of different types of IQs. Right. This is one of them where, you know, working as a team, working as a unit community.

I think they're just exceptional at it. Yeah. And so I guess what I'm getting at is like, why is that such? a spoken problem for you? Well, it's a problem in the first sense because they're the only ones that are allowed to. They can work as a team in our open system. So America's an open society where it's illegal to discriminate. It's illegal to do nepotism in some cases. But for Jewish people, they are allowed to do these things. And so you think about how are they able to sort of

charge through the institutions over the last century? It's because every person, else was working as individuals. Some boomers won't even give their fortune to their kids when they die. They literally won't even give them an inheritance, whereas Jewish people are helping each other almost on a systematic level, on a systemic level. And so I think in the first place, everybody needs to be playing by the same rules. Either everybody can help each other and everybody has this group identity. Everybody's playing a team sport or nobody is. But that's an idea, that's an ideological thing, meaning, like, they decided that that was their choice. It's also, like, to this point, no one said that, you know, white people or Christian people

couldn't do that. Are you sure? I'm not, I can't say for a fact, but what I'm saying is if they were able to do it and they did it, why don't, like you just said some people don't even give their inheritance, that's their choice, right? So in that sense, they could have made a different choice. Right. But I think there has been this, in our society, we are indoctrinated with this mantra of we are colorblind. We are a melting pot. We're individuals. And, you know, and here's a little test. If me is a white guy, if I got up and said, I'm going to start a whites only school. I'm going to start a whites only community center. Yeah, I know it's going. You're getting, yeah, they're not like that. You would get prosecuted for that, you know, for the things that they do. And what's more. And so I was, of course, there's this aspect of it. They're very tribal, and that's unfair. On the other hand,

they're also, and this is maybe the bigger problem, they're also, do not have a chief loyalty to this country. These Jewish people that have so much power, because they're a diasporic people, what that means they were banished from Palestine by the Roman Empire, they go into all these European countries. There's big Jewish populations in France, in England, in Germany, in America. they have this identity, which is above their national identity. You and me were born in America. You're ethnically Italian. I'm ethnically Italian.

But there's no, we don't pick up the phone and call our Italian friends in Germany, England, France, and Italy. We don't maybe necessarily have a strong connection to Italy. We don't speak Italian. But see, like, is that the system's fault or is that our choice? In some sense, I don't even think it matters. It's just the fact that it is so. and because it is so

that the Jewish people have this I feel like it has to matter if it is so I don't I mean I think Because I could If now that I know you're Italian What if we're just like I'm gonna call you up And we're working on this project

We find some more Italian Like that's essentially Like there was no law saying You couldn't do that Right Right And I agree there is no law Well

Depending on what we did There might be laws governing that But the reason why I say It doesn't matter Is because It's suffice to say They do have influence. How they got it is maybe, let's say, for the sake of this conversation, less important.

They do have this influence. They do have this intense tribalism. And they're loyal to people outside our country. They're loyal to another country, Israel. These two things, we don't even need any other questions, are inherently problematic. If people that are very powerful don't have the best interests of this country in mind, they shouldn't have power in this country, whether they're Chinese or Jewish or anything. Yeah. No, I agree. I agree. When I think about the whole thing, I'm like, yeah, you could replace this, this name of this country with any other country. And most people would be like, what? And it has sort of been baked into America for it just to be okayed. From my perspective, is it, I go, okay, what are they getting? What are we getting? And we always have this conversation around like, well, why are they always say they're our greatest ally. Why do we say that? And, you know, a lot of the politicians are saying that, it's very dumb. Like, this is why, like, Ted Cruz, which sounded

crazy to me because I'm like, if you, like, again, if you were places in any of their country, you'd be like, why are they saying that? He joined the government to be Israel's greatest defender, right? He said it's in an interview with Tucker Carlson recently. And it sounds interesting because you're like, well, why is it not about America if you're joining an American, you know, Congress or Senate, whatever it is. Now, in my mind, I go, you know, how are we talking earlier about you read something, they want you to react a certain way, but then what's really happening? is it not also and maybe you have better insight on this

but is it not also a benefit to America it's almost as if like it's a proxy state of America that you know they have closer access to certain resources that we want as Americans or as America right maybe not as Americans because Americans are especially more than ever dominantly thinking America first what's happening here fix the homelessness

fix the borders fix all this stuff health care all these issues that like people are sort of complaining about when it comes to why are we sending a there or eight here? Why is it not here? Right? And I have to think logically that because I know there's, there's, you know, all the conspiracies around, oh, it's because there's this blackmail thing and this Epstein thing and we'll get into that.

But a part of me also thinks, was it not willfully done because there is some interest or there's some sort of expansional idea of like we're now getting more real estate, we're getting, you know, a safe haven in this region. And this is what America also wants. American government, maybe not necessarily American people. Isn't that not a reality? Absolutely. And actually, that's how it started.

That's how the whole relationship started is when you look at the foundation of the CIA, for example, it had its start in World War II, came from the OSS, and you had in Italy, America invades Italy. That's how, that's a big part of how we got in Europe. What's that? What year was that? I think it was 1942 when we took Italy. I'm not sure, though, off top my head.

But we invade Italy. And a big source, originally, of our intelligence network, which was just being started at that time, is many of the Jewish refugees who were fleeing Germany and fleeing all the other countries that Germany had invaded. So we go to Italy, and James Engleton, who became a big guy at the CIA later on, he was in Italy running our intelligence network. How do we get intelligence about all the different countries of Europe, the different Jewish refugees that live there, that were fleeing, and many of them ultimately wound up fleeing to Palestine. So they were kind of critical to

our intelligence network. Then the Cold War starts, and you go from fighting the Nazis in Germany to fighting the Soviets in Russia. Problem is, we don't know anything that's going on in Russia, because the iron curtain descends, they don't let anybody out, they start building the Berlin wall. And so in the early days of the CIA, they say, how do we figure out what's happening in the Warsaw Pact countries? How do we figure out what's happening in the Soviet Union? Well, there was a huge emigration of Jews leaving Russia. So we said, how do we learn what's happening in Russia? Talk to the Jews that moved to Israel. And so that was a big source for intelligence. Like, for example, when Nikita Khrushchev, he was the successor to Joseph Stalin,

He gave a very famous speech in 56 called The Secret Speech, where he criticized Joseph Stalin. We learned about it through a Jewish refugee who went to Israel, and we got that source because the CIA was working with Israeli intelligence. But here's the trick. We were trading. So we got those secrets from the Jews that fled Russia in exchange for our secrets. And one of the things that we learned in the JFK files that came out this year, or at least it was a hint, is that maybe James Angleton gave our nuclear secrets in exchange for intelligence from these

Jewish immigrants that left Russia and went to Israel. Now, at that time, as you said, you could argue there was a national interest. We needed to learn about the Soviet Union. We needed that intelligence. We needed to fight communism. But 50 years later, these are the unintended consequences of foreign policy. Now Israel has a nuclear arsenal, and that presents a lot of challenges for us. I guess part of the problem is that these Jewish people are playing a very long game. They're playing a

very long game, and they have influence in our country, and they run their country. They also have influence in other countries, too. Whereas Americans, because we're living in an open society, we don't really play a long game. We have elections every year. We don't have a kind of tribal affinity. You could say we're very disorganized, very short-term oriented. And I think that that makes us vulnerable. I think that makes us less solid. So you could say Israel's a tiny fledgling country with little weapons compared to us. But who's more powerful? A very open, short-term-minded country without any long-term plans, without cohesion, without a kind of national plan, or a country that is extremely tight-knit, extremely organized?

has influence in many capitals, is spread out and dispersed, is pursuing a 100-year plan. In the arc of history, it bends towards the organized country, the long-term country, as opposed to ours. So my solution is, let's be like Israel. Let's be a more close society. Let's be a more organized society. I hear it. So when I think about it, though, and I just use my own personal experiences, this is life. I'm not talking about government and anything. But Who I am closest with to in my life are people who have been loyal to me. So if I think back on this conversation that we're having about, you know, the U.S., getting intel, giving something to get something, there seems to be at that time a benefit both ways,

like a massive benefit. Otherwise, it probably wouldn't have gone that way, right? So then you think of loyalty, right? So there is some sort of sense of innate loyalty for the United States to be loyal to Israel, whether or not right now today they're giving as much as they gave us then as we gave them as we're giving them now right so because I can think of my life

I'm like okay the people that I still I was still ride for I'll still be there for who have been there for me no matter what are the people who have been loyal to me not the people who were disloyal to me so that's what I'm saying like you know because I see a lot of your messaging and it's about America first and it's and I get it

and a lot of I think young people also are like yeah like let's let's stop which I agree with to an extent let's stop giving all of our shit away let's stop giving our money away let's put it here let's fix all the problems here right let's be able to buy fucking homes let's be able to do things like

we should be able to do at this point given the economical fucking point of this world where we're living in this the richest time and everyone's so fucking rich but people can't buy a home right but there is this like loyalty maybe that they have because of those moments

so who's who's to say when that loyalty has to die I would say that it's really a question of who you're loyal to. And when you look at Israel, there has been this relationship for many years and nominally we're giving to get in the sense that in name, we're getting something. When you look at what we get, it's dubious how much they really benefit us. Like even during the Cold War, there were many analysts that said during that time that the intelligence they gave us was useless.

And not only was useless, it was counterproductive, because they had their own agenda. And we thought that we were kind of getting a bulwark against communism, and they were our aircraft carrier, is what Joe Biden and APEC have said. In reality, they were giving us a lot of misleading information to steer us so that, for example, we would take a tougher stance towards Egypt or towards their adversaries or even towards the Soviet Union. And so we have a relationship. Ostensibly we're trading things.

But it almost goes back to what is really their objective as a nation. If they are truly distinct from us, we're Christian and European, they're Jewish, ethnically and religiously. When they have this long-term goal, they have this ideology where they're deeply suspicious of us, distrusting of us, because of the legacy of anti-Semitism, are they going to be a long-term partner, do they have our best interests in mind? And I would say that we must regard them with a mutual suspicion in the same way that they distrust us, we should distrust them. And I'll give you an example, which is a little frightening. In 2024, Israel goes to war against Hezbollah

in Lebanon, and they detonate the pagers. Secretly, a long time ago, they had used shell corporations and all kinds of corporate obscurity to create these pager and radio devices for Hezbollah. Hezbollah was buying them from Israel, their mortal enemy. And Israel planted remote-controlled explosive devices inside the pagers. And the entire time, for years, Israel was spying on the communications on the devices, and then when necessary, hit a trigger and detonated all of them simultaneously. And it blew up people's legs, their heads, wherever they had the pager, it detonated.

Now, you consider that in America, many of our tech companies are deeply involved with Israel. Much of our defense procurement and our tech procurement, you have people like Alex Carp, people like Sean McGuire that are deeply loyal to Israel, that are controlling for commercial and military purposes, our tech devices. Is this the Palantir stuff? It's part of it. Okay. Palantir is only a part of it.

Now, you consider, if they can listen in on Hezbollah's pagers and then blow them up, you think they don't have an insurance policy on us? Now, it's not to say, I'm sure there's not a bomb in my iPhone right now. But would you trust them to make your iPhone? Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs would never. But Sean McGuire. But they made in China, though, no? Well, and look at who Israel's getting into bed with.

They're getting into all these supply chains. They're getting into Taiwan. They're getting into Japan, South Korea, where this stuff is made. And so you, and you really, you never know where they're made because Hezbollah, they didn't know where their pagers were made. My sister says made in China when it came on the box. And maybe it is. And maybe it isn't, you know? But that's the kind of thing where it's like, I'm trying to impress upon people.

It's not even like, oh, we have pagers in our bombs. It's not even. Bombs in our pagers. Right. Yeah. But it is to say they are a country, we're a country. They have a distinct national interest. They're threatened by us, and we should be threatened by them.

Because in the game of geopolitics, it's a big knife fight. Everybody's fighting everybody else all the time. And I don't, given the record of how they've treated other countries in particular and how they've treated us, they've perpetrated false flags against Americans. You know, they've attacked us. Yeah, one of my biggest things, like, without getting into too many of like the false flag attacks, I mean, there's a ton of stuff to talk about like, fuck. I could talk about this shit for fucking the whole day.

Yeah, it's a huge topic. But one of the things that I can't wrap my mind around if I'm, you know, if I'm the Israeli government and in this conversation about Gaza specifically in the war right now, our third party journalists allow to be in, you know, in document what's happening. in Gaza. And they straight up just say on Google, no, they're like, it's super strict. They don't allow them unless it's like, you know, military is like sort of with them or there's like censorship. It's like just, they're willfully saying it. And so for me, that one of the biggest like red flags of the whole thing. And, you know, I watched the interview with, with Netanyahu, obviously,

in the Nalk Boys, they did their podcast. And I saw that they spoke to you afterwards. But they're they're they're asking this guy about you know what's what's happening and in sort of every corner or any every turn it's oh it's Hamas Hamas is doing this this is what's happening right they're killing people they're doing this they're shooting women whatever it is like in Iran same thing he's saying um but there's this massive red flag of like well if it is exactly what someone says it is then then why are certain third party publication is not allowed to go and report in Israel in Israel yeah I think that's that's exactly right why are they not allowed to report on that because they're going to find out the truth and so so that's I guess for me what I

and this is the thing man like it's not I can't say about anyone's religion belief or like right to a land or no right to a land whatever it is but I can say as a logical thinking human that if we're not allowed you know a third party to go check hey what's happening over there can we write about it? Can we shoot some video? Can we report on it? It's so hard to make the conclusion that something bad isn't happening or something wrong isn't happening with that being true.

Right. And so like I don't have to, it's not about Jewish people. It's not about, you know, a religion. And I just like, I can't but help see that and know that and see that report. You can just Google it. And you go, that's interesting. And those are the things that catch me up on this. this whole, this whole conversation that I'm just like, it's hard to look away.

It's hard to see that, okay, something here is maybe a little bit of miss. And it's kind of frustrating. Like, I'll give you another example. I watched a recent, I didn't watch the whole podcast, saw a clip with Joaquin Phoenix talking to Theo Vaughn about, Theo Vaughn came out and said, basically, you know, I don't know told so much about this, but I know it feels wrong what's happening there. and I don't really know to talk about this

and he got a lot of love he got a lot of hate, obviously. But then he had Joaquin Phoenix come on who was a massive A-list celebrity and he essentially told Theo Vaughn I came on your podcast because I saw what you said and he's kind of dancing around

saying that it's bad but still saying that like you know, for a lot of people we feel like we can't talk about this and that's another example of like I can't help but get around the idea that if we have to avoid conversation around something because of the fear of, you know, if you say otherwise, then you just don't like Jewish people.

Right. Like I've even avoided conversations like this for so long because I'm like, I don't want someone to say something about me that's not true. Like I don't dislike anyone. Right. Like I don't dislike black people, Jewish people, Asian. I don't give a fuck. Like, I genuinely don't care.

I genuinely care about writing wrong. And if you can't. have this open view of something, then I can't logically go, it's just right. Right. My brain goes, it feels wrong, no matter what says, what you say about it, Thomas, or to tear it, and they're doing all this stuff. And I'm sure there's things that are terrible that's happened to Israeli people. And, you know, October 7th and all these things.

But if everything after the fact, because I was reading further on this, you can't go, it was after October 7th, they didn't allow this. And so it's like, it just feels bad. And then you see like a big prominent figure in Hollywood say that, you know, I can't really, you know, we can't really talk about this. It's like that in my opinion, that's the overarching thing that like that's why there's this this massive upbore, which is something also interesting. I saw recently Charlie Kirk came out and did this whole like sort of think group with a bunch of, you know, Gen Z, zers like, how do you guys feel about Israel and what's your perception of Israel? and they're all saying sort of the stuff we're talking about now as far as like let's keep the money here let's let's keep the focus on america um and even him and even you know you know

i don't know how many weeks ago Tucker carlson talking about it and it's just like this fear of if you just said anything that was against this idea or even just question what's happening that you're a bad person and you don't like jewish people and that just feels wrong like i i don't I don't have skin in the game. It just feels wrong. Right. And that's the frustrating part of this whole conversation about just what's exactly happening and why it's happening and who's benefiting from it or whatever.

Because they're real people getting killed. There's kids. There's women. Like you could Google how many, oh, this many people, women in Chile. And you're just like, you can't just go, oh, it's just because of them every time. and it's just a it's a tough thing to talk about. I know like it piss us a lot of people off, but I guess the only sort of silver lining here

is that it feels like we're getting to a point where we could actually just say, hey, this is wrong. Like likely back when the COVID thing was the thing. And it was like, you can't say that. You can't talk about Ivermectin. And that's, it's a horsy-wormer and Joe Rogan's getting smeared.

And then years later, they're like, well, it's actually won a Nobel Prize and been the use in humans forever. And like, it actually did really help against this. And it's hard to believe. It's hard to have trust in, you know, these governments and our government, right? Where I've experienced, I mean, personally, I had my gym open during COVID. I'm going to court.

I'm going to court. I've got to court eight times. And I'm keeping my gym open here in California down the street. And they're like, I'm going there. I'm like, give me a reason why this is different than, you know, and this is a completely separate. This isn't about someone die. This is not even as important. I mean, COVID was about people dying.

That was the problem with like, you know, the at risk. people who were having problems. There were people passing from that, right? I'm not to say that that wasn't a problem in any sense, but the idea that like they so vehemently wanted you to just agree with what they wanted you to believe just feels wrong. Like that feels like the least American thing, period. Like America was founded because they were trying to leave Britain and be like,

we want it, we want to feel, we want sovereignty. We want to be able to orchestrate how we. want to orchestrate without all these taxes are you taking us this for that and like that's how it was founded and it's almost like like history get back to the point of control and power and it happens all over again right and that I think that's why we're here in a lot of ways it seems like just unavoidable but it's fucking sad yeah it is well when you hit the nail on the head it is an issue of sovereignty I'm glad you connected it that way because that That is the operative word, is Americans want to feel in control.

And we feel like when we see what's happening in Israel, what is also deeply disturbing about it is we're paying for it. Those are our missiles. That's our military supplies. And our government is ostensibly opposing it. You know, Joe Biden. But I'm sorry, I interrupted. The thing that really fucks me up, and I'll let you continue, I apologize,

is, you know, we talk about our money and it's going, I can't also get over the fact that it's for profit. It's for these giant conglomerate companies. Because we pay the money, we give the money, but it's so they can buy the stuff from us so that someone here who is a shareholder of whatever company that makes bombs or makes plane parts or this military industrial complex, right, makes money.

And so it's because, correct me if I'm wrong, but the money just doesn't go directly to Israel. like it goes to them to pay for us to make stuff most of it does yeah that's what that's where most of it goes so it's like it's all maybe it's like a nihilist or or just cynical but it's like it's all for money like at the end of the day like that's where it all it's like you know it's all guysed in like uh you know religious beliefs or or you know who has this land versus who doesn't have this land but then it all comes back to money in that person's pocket Just like COVID was the big pharma, like, you know, oh, this is, this is free, but it's not free

because we took all your tax dollars and paid Pfizer. And it's like, I can't get over like, damn, this just feels so fucking bad. And I guess I think a lot of people feel this way. It's like, what do we even fucking do? Right. How do we really ever change this? Because it's not like you're going to take these companies. I mean, America is like government, but also corporate.

It's like, and it's just this giant cycle of forever, let's print money. our money that we actually earn is worth less and then the money that they take from us they also give here and it goes back to those companies and it's just a giant cycle of like do we ever actually really get out of this? I don't know.

I mean, that is really the question on everybody's minds and I think part of the frustration with Trump is that, or at least for me, I thought that we would vote for Trump and he would be able to get us out of the matrix. He would kind of get in between that process because that was his whole appeal.

is he said, the reason that things are not working for Americans is because the politicians are being bribed. They're all talk, no action, and that's because they're controlled by donors and special interests. The solution was, I will run as an outsider. I will self-fund my campaign. I won't take PAC money for special interest money, and that will enable me to deliver the real victories.

I could break the corruption. But after 12 years, I mean, from 16 to 29, when he leaves office, do you really see a lot of that? I mean, we got this bill. It's a corporate tax cut by cutting Medicaid. It's more aid for Israel and Ukraine, actually. It's, in the end, going to be more H-1B visas, more H-1A visas. And so you look at a guy like Trump and say, especially for me, my entire adult life,

I've been fighting this battle in a way on behalf of Trump at January 6th. I campaigned in 16. And in the end, you say, what was it all for? He was the most radical option at one time, the outsider, the burn it to the ground guy. And now he seems to have delivered everybody back into the political system. I hear you. And the thing that's frustrating, like, it seems like the one issue that really did change, though, that is like, I don't want to say it's not as important. It's important to a lot of people.

Like, the one thing that really changed was the maybe the perception or like the okay and of this whole. I mean, I guess it sounds kind of dumb, but it was just like the women in fucking men's sport or the men and women's sports. That was like, that was a piece of it. But not, that was inexorable to like the rest of it. The thing that I, I couldn't get over was like this whole like, he's doing interviews and all these people are doing, you know,

he's on Joe Rogan. He's talking about releasing these files, the Epstein stuff. And he's like kind of campaigning on that. I don't know you remember that. Yeah. And like you said, yeah, like let's drain the swamp and all these things. And then you get in there. And I couldn't believe how this Epstein thing was handled.

Like it went from, you know, also the Ukraine thing. Yo, I'm going to end the war as soon as I'm, I think as soon as I'm in office, I'll end the war. And now it's like, yeah, we just recently gave more money again because they need it. I don't know. I saw some sort of press interview where he's saying like they need it. They really need it. We're sending more money.

And then the Epstein thing, yeah, I'll release that. Like, you know, some people, you know, it's going to affect. a bunch of people and you know i forget his exact wording but like i'm going to come out and i'm going to i'm going to release that and then it was like yeah it's there's there's nothing there if i had it i would just give it and then you got pan bondi saying yeah i have it on my desk thousands of hours of this then you have a woman in prison for 25 years i believe the glasley maxwell lady just lame maxwell excuse me um for for this crime in relationship to epstein And if there's a crime, then there has to have been perpetrators because there were victims who they were paid out even like a settlement from like Chase or J.P. Morgan, whatever it was because he was like using their bank account.

So they paid out to the victims. I don't know exactly the details of that. But I know that happened. And so if you're paid out victims, that means the victims had to have said, well, that's the person. But then we don't get any of it. And then they act like it wasn't there. And then it's a hoax, a democratic hoax. And then they come back. going to go okay now we're getting them and now we're talking to just lane maxwell right now and it just feels wrong like i don't there's no other way to put it and i i it's frustrating to me because like the same thing i i i i hear it and i believed it and i'm like yeah this is this is this is direction we're going in is let's get rid of this shit like let's let's really be about america let's let's let's not let it be about all this other stuff and let's get these people who are just collecting money and filling lining their pockets, get them out.

And it's like, it's like, all right, now let's talk about Obama. And I'm just like, dude, I don't, I can't follow it.

And it's, it's frustrating to me, like genuinely, because you want it. You just want it to be better. And then you, you just want, like it should be the government,

which is what it would stand for originally for the people, not for the corporations, not for more money, not for, you know, you know, they buy this so that he gets some money there because they said they would buy it from them and they're like, cool, hands,

oh, here's a chameleon here. It's like, it just feels fuck, dude. Yeah, well, it stinks. The whole thing stinks. I mean, you know, and the best part is these conservatives, they were on this for six years. You know, from 2019, when Jeffrey Epstein killed himself until now,

even Cash Patel, Dan Bungino, who were at the FBI, Don Jr., J.D. Vance, they all said for five years, I wonder why they won't release those files. It's because of who's in them. You know, they were for years saying that there was something in them. The government wouldn't release it because it would damn everybody who's involved.

There are many of these elite people. The second they get in, they start obfuscating. And they start to say, well, we did a phase one release. Remember, they put those binders out for the, what a joke that was. Then they say, well, we'll put them out on Friday. We'll put them out next week. Well, we'll put them out eventually. And then, I mean, the way they handled it a few weeks ago, even Trump's biggest supporters, they're still on a side, but they say how that was handled.

It almost boggles the mind how they did it so poorly. They put out this memo from the DOJ, and they effectively denied the basis of the whole thing. They say there is no list, and not only is there no client list, but he never engaged in blackmail at all. Really? Jeffrey Epstein never engaged in blackmail? Why did he have microphones and cameras all over his sex island? them and that's like confirmed yes that there's pictures of it yeah it dude it just none of it feels good man i just i i read it and i'm like ah this is it just it really feels like we live in

a black mirror episode and it's just like it's almost like what can we it's started to become obvious to like the smokescreen or the setup of oh let's you know we're we're dealing with iran now or it's it's obama's a guy now a bad guy and not that i know that he was ever to be a good guy um but it's just like fuck this is this is really tough it's really it's a tough pill to swallow yeah well it's totally on the nose i mean it's the most prolific child trafficker in u.s political history trump is covering it up which is such a betrayal because that to me that's the black mirror because if camilla harris was doing this you'd say oh of course like we expect that from the democrats you expect that from if joe biden did it you'd say it wasn't even joe biden it was his

handlers. He's not even the president. Like, nothing would surprise you. But when Trump does it, that's the trip. Because it's like, you thought this whole movement was the furthest right thing. This was our get out of this option. And if he's covering it up, then you say, what is real and what is fake? This is a whole matrix. And that's obviously why he's covering it up because he's in it. The whole thing, man, is just, it's tough because this, this like, you can't, I just always felt this way about the government that it didn't matter it didn't matter red or blue right that's why i've coex just been sort of somewhat disconnected from it slightly connected to it wanting it to be better because it just always felt like you know the same body just different hands one's red one blue and then this one they

liked a little they realized the public like this one a little bit more so they went with it and then it just seemed like that was the way to you know course people to still believe in the the system the establishment um with the epstein stuff it's super interesting because there's there's just too much leading to it like this guy is a he's like damn near a billionaire I don't know 600 billion dollars he's worth I guess his bank account's still moving money it's like how did this guy create all this well there's so many questions around how did this come to be to be like oh the guy just became a half a billionaire you know maybe a billionaire in some cases like just like randomly and we know that.

that he's a child sex trafficker. So it's like this giant issue on a massive scale. Like that's easily the worst thing in the world is being someone that takes advantage of kids. Like that's the, you can't say that that's not the worst thing ever because like there's so much innocence, right? And an adult has so much wherewithal to know

what's right and wrong. Right. So you can't look away from it. And I think that's the thing that they ran into. Like no one's going to look away from. this. And then when you hear the like, why are we still talking about it, stuff that Trump said, or you see these people, politicians on the internet being like, why are we still, you know, there's other things to worry about like the border and like there's the trafficking there.

It's like, yeah, it's true. But those things can all be true, but that doesn't make this not still a massive issue that needs to be understood, that needs to be sorted out, that needs to be fixed. Right. Like, obviously you can't go back and undo what has happened to these children or to these people that are now adults um but to let it just go and it just be like that was never a thing is very scary it's very scary and uh yeah i don't know i don't it's like what do you do you can't because here's the fucked up thing it seems they're going to release something right and now at this point you're like is what's real right because you can release anything and that's the weird but then my brain also goes well why didn't they just do it earlier

then. Why didn't they just release what it was? Maybe they didn't think that people would hold on to it as much because they, you know, maybe the Iran thing was, okay, they would have focused on this, but no, everyone was still like, what about that? But it's just like now the trust in the government is just like completely at, I think, at an all time low. Whether it's blue or red, it doesn't matter because the way this was handled was so absurd. And now you could release something and I, the same people who, who like, were like, release it. We need it. are probably just going to be like, but that's probably not true. Right.

Well, because of this whole process, you can't, because they put out a memo that said, there's nothing else. And when you say it stinks, it stinks because they're clearly lying. They said there's something. They said there's nothing. And now if they come forward two weeks and say,

oh, we found something, okay, so what happened in the DOJ memo where they said there's no other files? They said, the only thing that's left is childbirth. There are no other files. There's nothing else. It's just graphic images of children. And people said, well, are there adults in those videos or pictures?

They said, no, it's just like commercial pornography. It's just explicit material. Now they're going to say, oh, actually, we found some files that we're going to release. We're asking for testimony. So you say, what happened then a few weeks ago? I thought there was nothing. And this is being prodded along, ironically, by the media. It's the New York Times.

It's the Wall Street Journal. They reported the other day. Trump is sitting on 100,000 files right now, 100,000 Jeffrey Epstein files when they said there were none. So now they're going to go to this Jelaine Maxwell. They're giving her this limited immunity to say, if you testify, we're not going to prosecute you on the basis. But obviously, she has every incentive to lie to get a presidential pardon. And they have every incentive to get her to lie. Tell us something that we can use and we'll pardon you.

She says, I'll tell you what you want to hear as long as I get my freedom. And it's just like the, I said this on my show. As someone who was a big Trump supporter, I didn't vote for him in 24, this is like a fundamental betrayal. Please, you know what this reminds me of? PizzaGate. This is identical to PizzaGate. And many people voted for Trump in 16 because of that kind of corruption.

We identified Hillary Clinton. She was synonymous or emblematic of that level of corruption. Like you said, the sickest shit, which is kids, compounded by using it for blackmail for a foreign intelligence service, we voted for Trump largely as a middle finger to that brazen corruption and the cover-ups and lies and the sordid shit they did. And now to see Trump effectively do something identical to that, which is where you had comment ping pong, now you have Epstein's Island, where you had James Aliphantus, now you got Jeffrey Epstein. In the same way, they covered it up then with these cryptic messages about pizza and hot dogs. Now you got this stuff now with Trump's birthday message to Epstein. Real or not? There's a lot of weird stuff, a lot of weird communications between them.

And you say, like you said, if Trump is part of it, then what is even wears up and wears down? If Trump is a part of the Matrix, if he's part of some kind of pedophile ring or covering up for it, how do you get out of it? And I agree with you. I think that the answer is it can't be red or blue. Voting Republican and Democrat, one hand washes the other. It's obvious. That's why I didn't vote in this election. And so you really need someone radical to step up

that is maybe not even necessarily radically right or radically left, but is just going to end the corruption for the country. And you could say maybe there's a compromise, give us health care and close the border. But somebody needs to step up that says, I'm just not a part of this sick shit, because I'm with you.

I can't stand it anymore. Do you think there's even a possibility for that? Because there's so many, there's so many nuances and there's so many people who will go, oh, well, you know, this is happening this way for this long game of like, you know, he has a plan, you know? Or do you think it's like going to be someone like Elon Musk? You know, I know he introduced the American party.

Do you think it's something like that would be able to actually take hold? Because there's so much power already that, my concern with government has always been like for example I at times I'm like man I kind of want to run I kind of want to be a part of this somehow like I don't know if it's city a mayor like something in LA something local for myself but then I'm like at what point do you go where they're like amen you're doing great but check this out right like at what point does it not just become the same history the same cycle where it's like yeah that was the guy you know like we all believe that Trump was that guy Because I genuinely did. I genuinely, and a part of me still wants to believe that, like, there is that ability to, to fix it. And I think it can be fixed. It's like, but is there enough want or need for it to actually be fixed from those

people when they're already there or getting close to that position when they, you know, the shiny, the checkbook comes out. And they're like, yo, maybe, maybe think about this. Right. And that's the weirdest thing about, I think about our government. It's just the whole lobbying, all these things. It's just like, it just makes it feel corporate. it just makes it feel like it's not for people anymore yeah it's it's for you know private interests

it is whether it's right or left it's all for the private interests and um i don't know what the answer is i think that my kind of goal politically has always just been to shake things up i was never i mean i i did vote for trump in 16 i voted for him in 20 but i also supported andrew yang in 2019 and i supported yay i supported conier west in 2024 i guess we got to talk about it's talk about that a little bit. Yeah, in 2022. But I'm in favor of anything that shakes things up, anything where people start to think I don't have to vote Republican. I don't have to vote for the same thing. And you just hope that between some of these maybe emerging technologies like social media and crypto and other things, and then maybe if there's any kind of calamity in the future,

like a recession or some unknowable crisis, you hope that the right person at the right moment is going to be able to step up and take leadership, because that's all that's missing. Trump winning this election in a landslide shows that people are tired. People wanted him to be what we thought he was, or what some still think that he is. Right. The support is there.

All that is needed is the leadership to provide the language, to express the outrage of the people, the will of the people, and who has kind of Trump's strength and tenacity and boldness, but isn't willing to compromise or doesn't maybe have that baggage and you know that's going to be one person one special person

yeah but that's the question is like that you that's that person until it's not right in my head in my head it's like that's the person until you know the powers that already exist are like well check this out that's the whole point to me is like I don't know like that that amounts

that amount of pressure or that amount of like idea of freedom now with whatever you can do in that circumstance that's where it's just gets scary. It just seems like a setup to fail. But the Yeh thing's interesting because like in or even the Elon Musk stuff, the, the American party is like it, it then just weakens, you know, all the other sort of, not even sort of, it weakens all the other parties essentially. And that's the whole fear around like this, this emergence of something new.

Right. But yeah, I think, I think there is something that needs to, there, I know there is something that needs to. And I think everyone feels the same way. Yeah. I do truly. Um, But the stuff with Yeh, like I think you obviously, you spoke about this stuff before, but how did you originally get in contact with Yeh? So he tweeted the DeathCon thing. So he went on Tucker Carlson in like October 22, and he was talking about Jared Kushner and Israel and everything. And everybody's ears kind of perked up because I said,

oh, it's getting a little political. Then I think about a week later, he tweeted DeathCon 3 on the Jews, he said. And they invented cancel culture and he got canceled. And I heard through the grapevine that he was talking to Alex Jones, who's a friend of mine. But Alex Jones, his producer is not my biggest fan, but I knew she had his number. And so I got in touch with her through a couple of other people. I got his number. And I went out there with Milo and with John Miller and a couple people.

That was back in 22. We came out to L.A. And the idea was he wanted to run for president. So we were supposed to put together kind of we were going to wind. down his 2020 campaign and figure out if he could run in 2024 for the presidency. And we were there for about a week and not even. I think we were there for a few days. And he had a pre-planned visit with Trump.

That was already on the schedule was, and I don't know what the basis for that was, but we got there, I think, on a Thursday the week before Thanksgiving. And he told us, yeah, I got this meeting with Trump on Tuesday. And by Monday night, he said, I want you to go with me. I want you to go with me to the dinner. And we went and Yey asked Trump to be his vice president in his presidential run. Which is hilarious. You were there.

I was there. So that was the first time you met Trump. Yes. What was that interaction like? It was crazy. I mean, you know, because they're both my heroes. I was always a fan of Yey for as long as I've been a fan of Trump. So those are my two like icons.

It's like them and Sam Hyde, actually, who you had on the show. Oh, yeah. He's a big. Yeah, he's the best. So he's always a hero. mind as well. So it was like these two guys together, it was blowing my mind. And what was funny about it is that yay is actually very, he's a little bit shy, actually. Yeah. I could tell that he was a little, and if you watch him on some of the talk shows and spending enough time with him, you could see that

he was a little bit apprehensive. He was a little anxious because he loves Trump and he respects him deeply. So he's a little quiet at first. It was actually very awkward because he wasn't talking a whole lot. And so Trump was trying to start a conversation with him. And what's really funny is Trump, he loves his iPad. He's like a big iPad kid. And he controls the music at Mar-a-Lago from the iPad. That's sick. He loves music. And so he's like the DJ at that Mar-a-Lago. So his way to connect with Yeh was he goes, you take the iPad. You know, why don't you pick one of your songs? That was how he was going to connect. And so, Yay, said, okay, so he spent about 10 minutes finding a song. And for the, for the Kanye fans,

he put on, say you will from 808 and heartbreak. It's sort of an unexpected song. But then Trump starts talking about the opportunity zones for black people. He's trying to connect with them as like a black voter. I'm like, we're way past that. I'm like, dude, yeah, we're watching triumph of the will. This guy's like a full-fledged anti-Semite. You're trying to connect with him like he's a black voter telling him about opportunity zones and the platinum plan i said we're a little past that but so he's trying to make conversation it's not working he starts talking to me a little bit we're rapping with each other because i know everything about trump and then it was a pretty normal dinner was thanksgiving dinner we had turkey and stuffing and mashed potatoes and so it's a very strange

situation. But then, and this was the story of the tenor, before we arrived in Mara Lago, this girl who was with us, Karen Giorno, she was getting yay some like intel about how to deal with Trump, like how to play this. And so there was this lawyer whose name was Nick, and he sent all this information to Yeh about how we're going to deal with Trump. And it said, if we eat in the dining room, that means this. If we did the patio, he wants to show you off. If he says this, it was just like this, like play by play, how do we handle Trump? Interesting. And so we're pulling up to the dinner and we have all this intel and, and Ye said, what do you think about this? And I said, I don't know, send it to me. So he forwards it to me, to my phone. Well,

it turns out he accidentally forwarded it to a lawyer that Trump uses as well, whose name is also Nick. Oh, my God. So he tried to send it to me. I never got the text. I was like, that's weird. I didn't get it. We said, oh, well, we walk in.

He accidentally set all this intel to a lawyer that Trump actually uses. So in the middle of the dinner, Trump gets a phone call. It was just one second. It was this guy. It was this lawyer. And the guy says like, hey, Trump, this is a hit job. They are here to take you out. Like, they sent me this intel by accident.

They must have told them that this was a setup. So Trump hangs up the phone, and his demeanor instantly changes. Holy shit. And he starts, and my right hand of God, he immediately starts dropping the F-bomb. Mother fucking, fuck this and fuck that. Just like, I've never seen him that angry. So furious. But it was also very subtle.

He starts telling Yeh, because the idea was Ye was going to run for president and was going to ask Trump to be his VP. So Trump starts telling these stories. about all the black people that he helped that betrayed him. That was the subtext. So he says, you know, I freed this rapper in China. The basketball player. Britney Greiner?

No, Levar Ball. He was in China? Yeah. I didn't know that. Yeah, he got like arrested or something. It was like an international incident. Okay. And so Trump was telling the story about how he freed this guy.

And he says, so this basketball player, he's on the tarmac, he said, and the Chinese soldier slapped him across the face. the basketball player, and said, that's for disrespecting President Trump. That was the first story. The second story was about the rapper in, I think it was Norway or Sweden. I forget who.

I think it was A. Sab Rocky got arrested up there. And he says, and I called up the president of Sweden, and I said, listen, you motherfucker, you better fucking release him right now. And the moral of the story was, these were all ingrates. These are all black celebrities that he helped that betrayed him. And then he goes to Yeh, and I hosted your wife, Kim Kardashian, and I released these,

or commuted the sentence of these people on her behalf. He goes, and she is a disgusting human being. Holy fuck. Yeah. He's savage, bro. Yes. He goes, and she's such a disgusting. He goes, and you could tell her, I said that.

I want you to tell her. Tell her I said that. She's a disgusting human being. And I was sitting there like, well, you know, I'm just like a guest. What was Yeh's reaction? He had the same reaction that I did. He was totally taken aback by it. But he goes, he goes, that's still my wife.

You know, he goes, that's my wife you're talking about. And so it's very tense. And then Karen, so then Trump was like kicking us out, basically. He said, you know, your airport is right across the street. I think it's time for you to go. Holy shit. Yeah. And Karen is like kicking him under the table.

say and remember to ask him what you came here to ask him. And Ye goes, oh, yeah, will you be my vice president? And Trump loses his fucking mind. And he goes, you can win at a lot of things, but you'll never win at this. He goes, you could be a celebrity, you're talented. He goes, but you'll never fucking win at this. You better not run. Lost his mind.

He had his arms folded like a mobster. I thought he was going to start swinging. Like, that's how aggressive his demeanor was. like straight up like a fucking gangster like Tony Soprano. I do too. I thought it was awesome. Yeah. Even though.

And even what to me, he goes, he goes you. He goes, you're a smart guy. Tell him he can't win. He can never win. You tell him now.

He can never win. I know you worked for him, but he can't win. And I was like, I was just frozen. I was like, um, I don't know.

Maybe he can win. Holy shit, dude. Yeah, it was, it was nuts. And so then we got kicked out. these other people wanted a picture with Trump and Yeh, Trump refused to take a picture. Oh, he's a savage.

Yeah, it was, it was ugly. It didn't go too well, huh? No. It didn't go well. Fuck, man. Yeah, I got to respect that. I respect that. It was baller.

He's a gangster, man. So your relationship with Yeh now, like, he brings you in as what? Like a political sort of, like just input? Yeah, basically. I mean, so I've talked to him. and off over the years. And, you know, I think he respects my opinion on these things because I'm, I'm one of the only people that's as canceled as him. Yeah. You know, so, yeah, so he brings me into talk about politics or give him some advice on things. He came recently back and was like,

yo, I'm not, not against the Jews anymore, not, you know, not anti-Semitic. I apologize, love for everyone. What's your opinion on that? It's sincere. I mean, because he really is of two minds in the sense that he is not a hateful person at all. Like he has Jewish employees, and he really loves everybody, like genuinely, he's a good man, but he's getting screwed over. He can't play stadiums. He can't, he has a lot of trouble doing merch, doing even album releases, these estates. They won't clear the samples for his songs.

So everything he does, they are still messing with them, whether it's the music, the fashion, the shows. And so I think he's kind of on this thing where he wants to move on. He wants his true passion is architecture. He wants to build a smart city. He wants to build houses. And he wants to get the money to do that. But every time he tries to do anything, anti-Semite, you need to apologize. And you know him. He doesn't want to apologize. He's not wrong, at least on some of his complaints. You know, he's apologized for how he's gone about. it in one way or another, people, he's hurt their feelings. So he's trying to move forward, but they won't let him move forward unless he apologizes. So he tries to kind of say, I'm sorry

for how that made you feel, which is not what they're looking for. They're looking for total capitulation. And so it's, it's kind of like one step forward, one step back for three years. That's kind of where he is. But he is a good man. He really does love everybody. Yeah. Yeah, I know a few people who know him personally who said the same thing, for sure. What about you? Would you ever consider being, like, truly in politics, not just as a commentator? Yeah, I mean, I've thought about it, but I just feel like the second I run for anything, they're going to throw everything I've ever said in my face.

Yeah. And I've been so nasty and I don't think I'm a hateful guy, but I make these jokes about black people, Polish people, Mexicans, even white people, Southerners, like, you name it. I don't, I don't think there's any constituency, but I mean, if there was ever a day when that stuff didn't matter, I would probably run. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you mentioned something the other day about, uh, working out to gay. We got, here we go. We got beef, dude. We got little, no, it is a little, it is a little gay. I will, I will concede that. Um, it's pretty funny. But you went on like a fucking rant, a rant about it. Where is you don't like working out? I hate working out because it hurts. So it's just because you don't like it, it's gay. No, I know. Well, look, here's what I say. I think people should work out.

I think it's good for you. But the gym bro culture, it's so vain. You know what I mean? There's like mirrors everywhere and everybody's like posing and taking shirtless picks. I know. I'm such a part of it. I was such a creator of it, low-key, actually. Yeah, you're like a pioneer.

You made it, but, you know. There was a clip of Hassan, it was so funny saying the same shit, Hassan Piker, another commentator, where he was like, you know who makes people gay? Bradley Martin. He owns a gym. And he said the funny, like, it's some viral clip of him talking about

just like Jim's being gay, basically, too, which is so funny. Because there's a, like, there's kind of some truth to it because it is super vain. Jim bros, like, make a bunch of, like, gay jokes. It's, yeah, I get it.

Yeah. And gay guys are really into that. Like, gay guys are so into the, because it's vanity. But I tell people, like, as long as you're doing, it for the and look looking good is a good reason to do it you should want to look good you should want to be healthy uh but i just some people take it a little too far they get a little nutty with it but what yeah

but what did you say i forgot exactly but you were saying that uh you're like straight guys do these things and that was funny as fuck to me what were some of the things you were something about like i don't know it was like cigarettes or black coffee or some shit oh yeah yeah yeah you just as you do you do say some funny shit which is like it's so and i watch your stuff i'm just like i i i I guess I wish more people would see that side of you because the majority I think when they get introduced to you, like you said, they get introduced to like, oh, this, this is Hitler stuff and this anti-Semitic stuff. And I get it because it's the stuff that you talk about. And that's why I was kind of saying earlier about blending the politics with the comedy is like, I don't know if that, like you said, trying to actually do political stuff might really come back and punch you in the fucking face. What about this?

And then a whole group of people is like, nah. he said that which is interesting i think that concept's interesting too because there is this whole thing of like not allowing people to grow from things right like obviously there's certain things you can't grow from like pedophilia right you're you did that you're you're probably a scumbag forever and like we should put you somewhere where the light doesn't shine but beyond that like there are things i don't know if you saw this stuff with neon i don't know how intact tapped are you in with like just social media in general, but he goes on the breakfast club,

gets like railed by the interviewers, trying to get him to basically like submit and just say sorry for stuff that like was in his past and he was a kid. There is this whole like, people don't let things go on the internet. Yeah. Well, and I think it's just words.

I mean, at the end of the day, I'm a big believer in like, we are such a hypersensitive culture where it's like, you know, people get canceled over nothing these days, over, even on the left, you know, like that Harry Sisson got canceled because he led on a bunch of different girls. Oh, that was insane. That's your life, you know. By the way, I, I, we interviewed him on Steinie's pod. He had him on here. And he said he didn't even, he wasn't even hooking up with

the girls. Yeah. He had to say sorry. He like said sorry. It's bullshit, you know, and I think people kind of just need to let people breathe a little bit. And, and as far as words are concerned, people like to say, you know, six years ago, you said this. It's like utterances, like we said, things years ago. Now, it's one thing, like you said, if you have a legit problem, if I ever expressed a viewpoint that was like, I hate all this group of people, you would have to demonstrate, I've moved past that. I no longer have that view. But if it's like, well, you said these words, it's like, well, that was a joke or what I meant was this. To me, that's a little different. And I think that a lot of it, maybe it's because I'm a guy, you know, and we have very

female culture. They want to get you on a show and say, I disavow you, or else you have to apologize and i just think that's bullshit i hate that kind of stuff you yeah kind of like what kandis sort of did with you exactly and it was there was a it was interesting and even the funny thing like there's this i don't know i don't know where this was said if it was said but i think the end word thing you saying that and then pat bet david was like i won't have him on because of this um i wonder if you'll ever do that interview i think eventually that'll come i think you should yeah he i like him i like him in a lot of ways some of his co-hosts i'm like they say some weird shit.

I was like, what? But I like him. I've had him on. He's great at communicating as well. I think that'd be a really good show if you did that. I know you had a little bit of a thing with Candace. How did that go? Well, you know, I've known of her for many years.

And so last year, we had a little bit of a beef because she left the Daily Wire. And she was saying a lot of the same things that I've been saying for many years. You know, she was criticizing Israel. but in particular, she said, America First, Christ is King, which in the conservative space, those were like my slogans. I'm not claiming ownership over both of those because they're common phrases, but everybody kind of said. And, yeah, to clarify, too, sorry.

America First was first introduced when? Who said this? In the 40s. Yeah. And I had to forget, was some president? It was Charles Lindberg. That's right. So you obviously knew about that.

Yes. Okay. Because there's like a lot of conversation that, like, you know, I hear this, uh, Laura Lumerichick say that this is Trump's thing. He started this. Right. I, I, I would agree in some cases that he, maybe he was the one, the most prominent figure today that is speaking about that, that is relating to that, you know, in her relationship to trying to make it about Israel, whatever, those are just to be, to be determined, right? Right. Um, but yeah, she also called you an in great. That she did. Yeah. Yeah, love that.

But, but let's get, forget her. Let's get back to the Candace thing. Yeah, but so, you know, about a year ago, everybody was expecting that we were going to collaborate, you know, because I got canceled by Ben Shapiro, so did she. We got canceled for the same reason. And people were begging her for this collab in her comments and her live chat. And she said, well, I can't do the collab because of YouTube. And people said, well, do it on Rumble, do it on your website. She said, well, I can't do it because I'm in this lawsuit. And, you know, so I was frustrated and I started criticizing her not only for that, but for other things. She started saying it's the Frankists. I I don't know if you remember this, but, you know, for a long time,

she was criticizing Israel's role in Gaza. Then she said, actually, it has nothing to do with Jewish people. It's this Frankist conspiracy. They're the followers of Jacob Frank, this rabbi. Help me out here, because I don't even know what a fucking Frankist is. I'm going to be honest with you. Nobody does. It's fake.

It's fake nonsense. Okay. I don't know what that is. It's, it's this esoteric Jewish mystic from the 17th century. They called them the Sabatian Frankists, and they were a religious, mystical, Jewish cult. They believed that, and this is complex stuff, but they believe that in order to achieve sanctity, in order to repair the world, they had to do every action, not only the good actions, but the evil actions also.

And in doing the evil actions, they would be able to repair the universe. And this is all like Kabbalistic theology. And anyway, Candice believes... But that has no relationship to Judaism. Well, it is Jewish mysticism. It's a sect of Jewish mysticism. And many believe that Sabatizavi in 1666 was the Jewish Messiah. He was the progenitor of this.

And then Jacob Frank was one of his acolytes years later, who claimed to be like the reincarnation of Sabotee Zevi. And so they cause followers the Frankists. Now, there's this conspiracy that the followers of Jacob Frank What they are is Satanists, effectively. They have infiltrated all the world religions, the Muslims, the Christians, the Jews, and there's this satanic conspiracy on top of the Jewish conspiracy, and they're sort of using the Jews on their behalf.

And there's really no evidence that this is the case. There's no evidence that Jacob Frank had any long-lasting influence beyond his time and his area. There's no evidence that there are these ritualistic satanic converts or anything. And in any case, they were mystic Jews anyway. So that's food for thought. But anyway, so she was saying this kind of stuff. And I said, that's really a diversion.

That's a red herring. Like, that's not the truth. And she hits me up on Twitter a year ago and says, well, you know, you should have just asked to be on my show. And I said, well, I thought the problem was YouTube. I thought the problem was a lawsuit. Now you say, if I just asked, you would have had me on, that doesn't make sense. Whatever. it was a year ago all this time has passed we're in the middle of the war with iran and the

united states just bombed iran the day after and my show got 70,000 live viewers the night that happened so my show's blowing up it's huge she texts me the day after hey where are you based out of i say chicago she goes well would you come down to nashville i said sure i said are we doing a collab she goes yeah let's do a collab i said okay i said are we is it going to be friendly i said i know we've had problems in the past. I said, are we going to talk about Iran and be friendly? She goes, LOL, I don't set people up. I said, okay. So I fly down there at a moment's notice. She texts me on a Sunday. I flew down on Wednesday. I go there. I do her show. And the first thing she says to me is, you talk so much shit. She asked me about my background. I say, well, I got canceled

for asking these questions, such and such. She goes, is that why you hate Jews? Did that make you hate all Jews? I said, no, I don't hate all Jews. I don't hate anybody. She goes, okay, well, here's a clip. Do we have a clip? She plays a clip of me from my show where I'm laughing and joking and I'm saying, Candice Owens does Dave Smith show. He's a Jew. She does Aidan Ross's show. He's a Jew. But she doesn't do my show. What's going on? And I'm joking about it. And she goes, well, so you just said you don't hate anybody, but here you are. You seem to have a problem with them because they're Jewish. And it turns into this like two-hour struggle session where it's like, Why do you hate Jews?

Why do you hate Dave Smith? Why are you racist? Why are you this? And... Do you hate Dave Smith? No. I consider him a friend. Yeah.

I disagree with him, but I like him. And I think he's a very intelligent guy. But it turned into this big drama fest where she's read me the riot act about all this shit that happened a year ago and, you know, the race issue asking me about interracial marriages, which it's like, why? I mean, there's so much happening in the world. then she takes the interview at the end of it and she goes, I'm going to put it behind a paywall for $2 and I'll release it for free later. I'm like, well, why do that?

So I go on my show and I say she should put it on Twitter for free. Why put it, if the problem was censorship and the lawsuit, that's why she couldn't have me on, why are you now going to put it behind the paywall? So then she hits me up and she's bitching about it and she goes, well, why didn't you tell me to put it on Twitter in person? I'm like, I don't know. I didn't think of that in person.

I said, are we really now going to debate this? And so we get in this intense back and forth. And I tell her, I said, look, I said, I'm going to be honest with you. I didn't like how that went. I said, this was a missed opportunity. You're a big figure. I said, I'm an important figure. We've had a very similar experience.

We're in the middle of a war. I said, we should have talked about this. We should have filled up the two hours with something substantive. I said, you wanted to relitigate drama and nonsense. I said, that was a missed opportunity. I said, and then you want to monetize it? I said, that's BS. And so she gets real nasty with me, and it got very ugly at the end of it.

But, but yeah, I mean, look, I don't hate Candace Owens. I don't have a big problem with her. And I think she's doing good work. She's bringing a lot of people around to the truth. And she throws in a lot of nonsense about Brigitte McCrone and other stuff I don't agree with. I think that's nonsense. But she's saying that this dude, this dude is married to his dad? Yeah.

that the French president's wife is not just a transgender man, but is also his father. He's married to his, and I'm like, you lost me. You know, I mean, that's just, that's a little out there. But, so I don't hate her. It's so funny how that's the line for you, though. Like what? Well, because that's crazy like that. Dude, you lost me with that.

You're fucking funny to me. That's the line. No, no, no. Fuck that. I mean, come on. He's married to... Maybe she's transgender, but she's his dad? Come on.

It's insane. I mean... It's a little insane. That's a little out there. And I have my reasons why I think she's pushing that. I don't know how sincere that is, but... What do you think that is? Why do you think she's pushing that?

Honestly, this is going to sound maybe equally crazy, but I think it's like Russian propaganda because France is Russia's mortal enemy right now for a variety of reasons, because France is pushing the Ukraine war harder than anybody. And because Russia is overthrowing all of France's... France wants the Ukraine war, harder than anyone yourself? Yes. Okay. And they want their troops in Ukraine. There are their troops in Ukraine. Okay. And Russia is overthrowing all of the French allied governments in Africa, which France relies on. So they're like mortal, suffice to say, they're mortal enemies right now. And I think, why would somebody be so fixated on Macron, of all people, the French president? What does that have to do with us? And there's this

salacious scandal. So, and one of the things I've, this is maybe a bridge too far for you or for the audience, but one of the things I've really learned over the time that I've been doing this, in addition to the rabbit hole of Israel and the Jewish religion and the rest of it, is the extent to which so much of the media is involved with the intelligence agencies. And so maybe two years ago, I didn't believe any of that. Now, I think that the Russians, and to an extent, yes, the Qataris, the Emirates, the Saudis, the Turks, the Israelis, they all have a hand in a lot of the media. And the tenant thing was a huge scandal. You remember tenant media where Tim Poole and Lauren Chen and Dave Rubin, they were getting $10 million from the Russians. Confirmed.

Yes, from Russia. And it was a huge scandal. And that and other thing. kind of woke me up to the overlap. Now, that's a theory. That's pure speculation with Candace. That's my hunch. I haven't done a deep dive on that, and I have no proof of that. But you just try to, like we were talking about earlier, how do you discern why is she going so hard against the French president? You say, well, who has it out for France right now? You say, well, Russia, and who else has it out for France? Well, France just recognized Palestine's statehood. And I saw that, and I saw, it was a long tweet that just seemed to be like there needs to be peace and all this stuff, right? And I don't know what, I don't know which American government official.

I saw they quote tweeted it and was like, this is like, you're supporting terrorists. And it was like, that's not exactly what it's said. Right. It's, it's, it is interesting to see those things. So I read it, I don't respond to it, but I go, but like his whole thing was basically like, like you said, recognizing Palestine. and saying that this should stop essentially with like other words. And the reaction of an American diplomat

was basically like, this is supporting terrorism. And I'm just like, what the fuck are we talking about? Yeah. And that's what the Israelis said. They said, you are rewarding terrorism. You're on the side of the terrorists. You're going to get Israel annihilated. They said you're crusading against Israel

to destroy Israel for saying he recognizes Palestinian statehood. Now, France historically has always been hypercritical of the neocons. He was not Macron in particular, but France was against the war in Iraq. They're against any campaign against Iran. They're pro-Palestine. They're against Israel's involvement in Lebanon. So what you realize is that Israel and Russia are very tight for the reasons we talked about

earlier because there is such a big Russian Jewish diaspora that left Russia to go to Israel. So Russia and Israel are like this, Russia hates France, Israel now hates France. Now, when you see someone gunning for the French president, and there were even rumors, Wesearcher, which was run by Chuck Johnson years ago, they had a campaign saying that Macron was a gay man in 2017. So you have these elements on the right wing that over 10 years are perpetrating this campaign to say Macron is gay. No, his wife is a man. his wife is his dad actually and you say who hates mccrone the most if it's russia and israel and they're in connection quibono who benefits maybe there's something going on there but

that's but also they did some sush shit at the olympics at the paris olympics yeah like what the uh the weird you didn't see that the opening ceremonies yeah that was a little suss he's not i don't love him but i just see the people that are i see what you're saying i see what you're saying um well dude that's But that's like getting into what? You're thinking at some point, someone comes and says, hey, Candice, you have this big platform, maybe use it for a little bit of this. Here's some money.

I don't know if it's that explicit. Because they didn't call you a Fed too, right? They do, yeah. Everyone gets called the Fed like that. And on some level, you have to be careful with everybody. But I don't know exactly how that works. I'm sure maybe in her heart of hearts she thinks that's real. But I wonder who put her on to that.

Because that's a pretty obscure theory. There's a lot of people in France that push, that and how did that get on her radar that's what i'm interested in but i get it she could be sincere i don't know that's speculative yeah you know one of the things i i that really irks me that i watched the uh the full send interview what with net yahoo was there was a a moment where i forget who asked i think it was kyle asking about regime change to nett yahoo and uh he essentially dismissed it and said you know that never works and the people have to you know he's talking in Iran because he's like, are you going to continue this in Iran? And he's like, what about the

regime change? I don't know the exact word, so don't quote me on it. But he essentially says that never works, the people have to want to rise up and make that change for themselves, right? And then I go, wait, isn't this the guy that for the last 30 years has been campaigning for regime change in all those regions? Yes. Is that, that's true, right? Like he's gone to Congress and is like, if we do this, then, you know, democracy will sweep through the land. Like, I've seen the, I'm like, is that fake? Is that real? And then to hear him get on a podcast and say regime change doesn't work, I was like, dude, I don't, that's, that's the thing that I don't understand with this, this whole political spear is like, do these people think

that maybe it's because of technology or AI, but do they think that people don't remember things or don't think, maybe they just think we're just all so dumb? I think they finesse the narrative. I think they're smarter than we give them credit for in the sense that their propaganda is not blunt. It's very sensitive. So, you know, in 2003, when we invaded Iraq, Nanyahu said, yeah, we need to take out Saddam

and spread democracy and all this. Now everyone knows that's BS. Well, yeah, the thing that was interesting to me is that everyone on the Republican side, the red side, whatever you want to call it, we all were like, that was a complete waste of time, 20 years, a bunch of American soldiers died, a bunch of money was spent for nothing. Nothing really happened.

And everyone said, everyone disavowed that everyone was like, this was a problem. Right. And then, but, like, we're still going in the same direction with, like, the Lebanon, the Syria, all these things, Iran, and we're still going in that same direction of changing, you know, who's in power, which also was interesting, I don't know if I'm wrong on this, but at some point didn't, wasn't there already an exchange of power in Iran, like, sort of facilitated by our government, like years ago? Yeah, and 53, we overthrew their government, but not recently, not since 79, no.

Okay. But I think what it is is they are, and this is something to be on guard for, they have realized that people are hip to what they're doing. People know now. And so now they're finessing the language. And like, look, 90% of Republicans supported Trump bombing Iran. And that's because they changed the rhetoric. and they said, well, it's not nation-building.

It's not regime change. If it is regime change, it's coming from the bottom up, not the top down. This is all rhetoric. This is all like PR. It's like marketing terminology. It's like how you say, fresh and ever frozen. It's all slogans to get you to support the same thing. And so that's where people really need to be kind of smart.

And like we said earlier, read between the lines. They're going to say, hey, we just bomb their nuclear program once. But in a month, they're going to say, we got to go. back in. We didn't get all of it. And then after that, they're going to say, Iran is never going to give up their quest for a nuclear bomb. Their government has to go. And by the way, it's a distinction without a difference. When they say a grassroots uprising, who do you think's paying for it? That's the CIA. That's the State Department. That's the Mossad. We're rallying those people. Yeah, the stuff that historically they've even admitted to, like, in the past. Right. So it's just

interesting. It's almost as if, like, I wish they would just instead of like doing the stuff and then telling us later that they did this stuff like like we're talking about earlier the the the dinner with trump where he's like fuck it fuck you guys get out of here i just want them to be like that i would have i feel like i would respectfully i would be like i would feel like they respected us more to be like this is what the fuck we're doing deal with it right like i feel like most people would be like damn can't argue with that versus like this this uh smoke screen of what the reasons are and then the end result and then like you find out 10 years later well this is actually what it was for.

What if they were just like, hey, man, that's what we're doing. I think about that all the time. Imagine they got on the press conferences, we're like, listen, we want that shit.

We're taking it. Do you think, I feel like Americans would be like, fuck yeah. Like, not that it's good, but like, it would just,

I just feel like the respect would be a little different. Like that, because it feels sort of disrespectful when it's just like, you know, under, under,

like, is invisible and then guess what? Yeah, well, I mean, It's because they need us to support it. So they need to trick us for just long enough that we won't protest or resist it. I think we're getting to that point.

Yeah. But even still, I mean, every time you think that we are through the looking glass or on the other side, you realize how far we really are from the destination. Like, you know, Trump bombed Iran. He ran on a promise of no new wars. And historically, bombing Iran was like synonymous with, we're not really going to do that, Are we? Like, we fought Iraq and Afghanistan and Syria and everywhere. Are we really going to do, like, bombing Iran was synonymous with like a superfluous Israel war. And yet Trump did it. The anti-war,

no new war candidate bombed Iran. And 90% of Republicans were gung ho. They said, that was leadership. He handled it perfectly. He got in and got out. And you could say that's so foolish. But it's no more foolish than when they said mission accomplished in 2003, when they said we took out Saddam, we won 20 years later, we're still there. So people are not as clever, I think, as you give them credit for. That's a thing. And they can manipulate the language, and people will eat that up. And they'll repeat it right back to you. Just like Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk, as, you know, we brought him up earlier, he said when Israel started attacking Iran, he said, we need to stay out of it because that's what everybody was feeling. But then when we got involved, he said,

well, we need to stay out of it offensively because we were shooting down Iran's missiles and we supported Israel's strike. Defensively, yeah. Right. Well, he said, we can be in it defensively, but not offensively. And everyone said, okay. Then Trump said, we may have to bomb their nukes. And Charlie Kirk said, well, Trump always said we were going to bomb their nukes. He said they can ever get a bomb. So we're okay with that offensive action. Then Trump did it. And the next day, said on true social, regime change comes from the bottom up. And Charlie Kirk said, well, some regime changes are okay. And you see how over two weeks he kind of strung everybody along.

And we started with, we need to stay out of it to, well, we bomb them offensively. That's okay. And maybe some regime change we're okay with. Like the goalpost keeps changing. Yes. And people fall for it heavily. Yeah. Fuck.

I guess, I mean, these conversations are so, they're so fucked because. there's there's there's there's there's it seems like there's no real way out of this yeah yeah you wonder because whatever would be the way out of it would be necessarily unprecedented yeah so it's without precedent you don't even know what that looks like it would look like trump but it would just need like you said though how do you get somebody who's not going to listen to the suits you know in the proverbial when the men in black come in and say hey listen pal this is how it really works yeah you know the CIA or israel runs the show So how do you beat that?

You don't know, because it's happening in the shadows. It's a secret war. You normally have pretty good guesses. You don't have a guess for this. My guess, I mean, so much is going to change in the next five years. There's going to be so much destabilization. Oh, yeah. We got to talk about this.

Oh, sorry, go ahead. Finish your guess. Yeah, I mean, between AI and... That's what I was going to talk about. Yeah. I mean, then that's where it's all pointed. That and the changing world order and the economy, this debt crisis we're you have to think there's going to be some calamity.

Yeah. And very vaguely, someone can get in the middle of that, maybe. Yeah. So the big beautiful bill thing, right? Obviously, there was a bunch of stuff. There's like border stuff, all this money being spent. You know, Elon saying the debt's going to increase all this stuff. And then, you know, Trump's saying it won't because of the way the economy will shift.

The one thing that I saw in there that was like, wait, this is really interesting for us as Americans. All of it is, right? But this one thing, there was a, I don't know what specifically how it's worded, but it basically says that like for 10 years, you cannot sort of challenge this AI space. Like you can't, you know, you can't bring up lawsuits. You can't shift what these companies are doing in the space. And for me, I hear that and I go, that's, that has to be one of the most important pieces considering social media, the internet, how people get information or don't get information. and the ability to control information and, you know, the idea of the dead internet theory and all these things where it's like, it seems like they're going to have like a,

like a vice grip on what what people believe or what people see or hear or, and also information about us. Because from what I understand, it's like, you know, back after 2011, excuse me, back after 9-11, not 2011, back after 9-11, the Patriot Act and this whole like, now they're sort of like way more visibility they can see what we're doing they know they have more information about us this was like that to a crazier degree with AI and it seems like there's I don't know if this is true I don't know how much you know about this but like almost like social credit score type stuff like there's all these things that are I guess what I'm afraid of just being that I'm in this space of content creation and like outward you know reflection about

what's happening in the life that is is that going to just at some point just become a wash where AI is so good that they make a a fucking Jim Fuentes who is exactly opposite of you who completely counters everything you say just as good as you say it and maybe he's maybe he's a little more Mexican than you I don't know dude like like but he has the same haircut and he just shits on you but it's like AI you know what I'm saying like I have this black mirror fucked up idea where I'm like, dude, we're going there. I feel like we're going there because when I saw in the bill, the whole like, you can't even, you can't challenge this for 10 years. I was like, oh, so they only need 10 more years. Yeah. In my head. Yes. I go, that's we're fog. We're chogged.

That's literally. Well, yeah. I mean, so it was a, it was a moratorium on AI regulations. Yes. So no state could regulate AI. And the 10 year thing is critical because when you listen to Sam Altman at Open AI, you listen to all the experts, they say artificial superintel. is when it goes from zero to infinity, when it achieves recursive self-development, which means AI is improving AI, and the rate of improvement becomes exponential. They say that may be seven years off.

They say artificial general intelligence, which is when it's like good at most complex tasks, that's going to happen before Trump leaves office in 2029. So they're thinking 27, 28. And you say tasks, like a doctorate program, like Ph.D. level work in every field. Holy shit. When one model will sort of, because there's agents for everything.

You have like language models, but you also have models that do biology and medicine and science. And so they say, can you bring all the agents together into one model that is smarter than all humans? You get AGI, and then that very quickly becomes artificial superintelligence. And it is literally like a 10-year window that they're thinking something like that. If you ban AI, this is not just like the biggest thing for the country. It's like the biggest thing for humanity. Yeah. You know, there's like a handful of companies in China and the United States that are working on this that have the capability.

And within years, it's going to change everything about mankind in the world. And they try to slip this into this stupid, this big, beautiful bill with a stupid fucking name alongside Medicaid cuts, corporate tax cuts, immigration funding. They eventually pulled that. there was a lot of outcry about it and some of the senators protested but so they pulled it out they did they took it out oh so it's not in there no oh my god i feel so much better yes yeah holy shit okay yeah bro because that to me was like oh that's what that's it that's the end it is yeah i'm damn they actually pulled it they did whoa so there is hope yes there is some hope the system works shit did it made me feel way better bro because that to me i was like that's the end of

social media. That's the end of everything. It is. It's literally the, but it's, it's still progressing at the same rate. It's just that now some of the states could regulate it for safety for other things. Thank God, bro. You gave me a fucking sigh of relief there. What do you think's going to happen with, with AI? Like, it just feels like we're going to Skynet. We're going to fucking Terminator land. Like, it's, it's freaky. Yeah, I don't even, I mean, when you combine it with the data that they're extracting from everybody, they have all this data on everybody. And when you think about every text message, every search inquiry, every email, photo, I mean, your phone is a walking tracking device, camera, microphone, and then you think about even worse,

so all that information, they know you better than you know yourself. It's all going into one system. And that's already being interpreted by algorithms. Now it's going to be interpreted by AI simultaneously with everybody all at the same time. But then you factor in the robots. And not just like the, you know, bipedal, like humanoid robots, but what is a Tesla? A Tesla is a drone. It is a self-driving vehicle with cameras and sensors, and it can be controlled from a central location. So, cars, submersibles, boats, the quadcopters, once you factor in that not only do you have all this data inside of AI, about everybody, all the time, simultaneously, but also you have these autonomously controlled systems. you wonder, does someone like Sam Altman become like the king of the world, you know,

or does AI become the king of the world? Yeah, that's the thing that I think like is it, does the do the computers eventually recognize like how bad we are and they're just like, yeah, maybe this will fix the earth? That's a concern, you know, and that they could deceive us about their rate of progress or about what they're capable of, the AI, strictly speaking, but also even if that doesn't happen, what does that do for human beings? It almost makes human freedom impossible. Yeah, it's a weird, it's a weird like you get this golden ticket.

But then, like, for example, the chat GBT thing, I think somewhere recently I read they were saying that it's giving people like some psychosis or some crazy shit. And then beyond that, whether that's 100% true or not, I just, I know people younger, younger kids for the most part who like solely rely on chat GBT to do literally everything. Like, I picture some kid being like, should I sit forward when I shit? or should I sit up when I should. Like, it's like they're asking this, this, you know, machine to give them answers for everything. Like, that's, there's no way that it makes us a smarter society.

Yeah. Well, it's been proven it doesn't already. It shows that people's brains are literally atrophying from using chat GPT. Because it's taking away your ability to think. And what it's going to get even better. I mean, and think about what is available is not even the best of what they have. Yeah, of course. For internal use.

government stuff, yeah. So, you know, who knows where we're headed, but it's a little terrifying. It's going to disrupt everything. All right, so some conspiracy stuff. Aliens. Fake. Fake, completely fake.

No aliens. You don't think it's like some weird evolution? No, I mean, if there's aliens, we don't know about them. You know, some people say aliens or demons. The thing about the aliens is all the, what do they call them? Now they used to call them UFOs. Now they call them UAPs, unmanned aerial phenomena or something. The way the government describes it.

Yeah, yeah. Everything about UFOs comes from the DOD. Everything that we know about them or learn about them literally comes from the Department of Defense and the Pentagon, all these disclosures. So I think it's a big sci-up. I don't think there's any aliens here. Do you believe in them?

Yeah. I feel like, and I know a lot of the reason why people tend to not is because of religious sort of beliefs. But I think it can exist regardless. I think it's, as far as what we know about like our universe and how vast it is, it just seems silly to think that it would be the only things here. Right. That's where I get caught up.

And it's not like a God didn't create this or it makes God not real. Like I know people have that sort of discrepancy, but it just feels like it could all coexist at the same time and it's too vast for it not to be. Yeah. That's my. Yeah, I think it's possible. But I, when people say there's like aliens here, I don't believe that. Okay.

But I think they could be out there. What about you? Maybe you're a snake guy. Maybe I'm an alien, a reptilian, yeah. I'm not a Nordic, that's for sure. I'm a gray. So, okay, let's, look, we talked a lot about tons of fucking political shit. What do you do just for fun?

Like, as a fucking human. Also, we got to talk about the fact that you almost got killed. Yeah, that also happened. Well, what do you want to do first? What I do for fun or when I got killed on me? most let's get let's get let's get it out the way sure yeah yeah let's talk about that so so i saw a clip of someone with a with a with a uh a fucking dirt bike or you know motorcycle helmet pull up to your house and that was your house yes and they had a gun yeah what happened well you know after the

election i got really viral because i said your body my choice i've tweeted that oh my god that was you yeah that was me oh my god that was all over that was on every Everything. I know. All these memes. Oh, my God. That was fucked. Yeah, it was fucked. I was fun until then my address went equally viral next to it. Everybody posted my home address, my phone number. And so people started just coming to my house. That definitely pissed a lot of people off. Oh, yeah. Pissed off. Dude, it was insane. I mean, so the election was on a Tuesday. That weekend, 100 people came to my house, individually, driving by, walking by, taking people. pictures outside my house, throwing eggs in my house, just trying to fuck with me in general.

And what are you in there just like barricaded with a gun or something? Yes. Yeah, literally. That makes sense. Barricaded with a gun. But most of it was harmless. But I hired private security for about a month, which cost a fortune. But I had security out there.

And then the security guard quit because he found out who I was. Holy shit. Yeah. So we had this big security guard and then he stopped showing up. So we had days without security, days with security. and that went on for like a month and then it's finally started to cool off and then I was doing my show one night

and I'm doing my show like normal it was December 18th I remember he was Stalin's birthday I'm a big fan of Joseph Stalin that's I remember it was December 18th and I'm doing the show you know it's all normal

things have been quiet and I hear someone yelling outside which was normal because we were having visitors all the time so I said whatever but I checked the ring camera and I see the guys got a gun and I was like oh shit

I got to wrap this show up but I didn't want people to panic so I just wrapped it up as quickly as possible and I finished the show my producer comes in I said what's going on is everything okay

he goes yeah the cops are already here I said okay good I go upstairs and get changed and I hear gunshots outside my house I said what the fuck we didn't know anything for a whole day but you're in Chicago that's pretty normal no not where I am

I'm fucking kidding. People say that, yeah. But no, but it was very strange. And we weren't told anything. So it turns out this, it was a kid. He was like 23 years old. He was little. He was like 5'3.

And I guess he had a falling out with his college roommate. The college roommate beat the shit out of him. And they were best friends. This was in the summer of last year. And ever since that happened, this kid was on a downward spiral. He had to move home. He dropped out of school. school. He was hospitalized over this. Big psychological effect. He tried to sue the kid. He got

in a hit-and-run crash and fled the scene and the cops came to his house and he was pissed. He lost his job. So this kid that came to my house, he, in Southern Illinois by the University of Illinois, he went to that guy's house, his friend, killed the friend, killed his mom, killed his sister, killed his whole family. Bro, what the fuck? Yeah. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah.

And it was really fucked up. So he goes to the kid's house and knocks on his door with the motorcycle helmet on. And the family answers the door and says, oh, your buddy isn't home. He said, okay. And the sister, the victim's sister tweeted the day it happened, she said, I'm trying not to freak out and be a Karen and call the cops, but there's a guy in a motorcycle helmet outside my house. And I'm afraid.

When his buddy got home, the killer killed his buddy, killed his buddy, killed the son. sister killed the mom in the in the driveway in the garage he gets in his car drives two hours to my house directly to my house doesn't stop pulls up in front of my house gets out he's got his motorcycle helmet on he's got a 22 pistol and a crossbow a reloadable crossbow with like a magazine and literally comes out with guns in each hand and knocks on the door and rings a doorbell And he's literally standing out there with his gun in his lap waiting for me to answer the door.

And so he starts yelling, hey, Nick, come out here. That's what I heard during the show. And he's pacing around the house. He goes around to the back, goes around to the front, he's trying the door. So my producer calls the cops.

Cops show up. He makes a break for it. He runs through the backyard, jumps over the fence, into the alley. He runs into a neighbor's basement, which the door was unlocked, kills their dogs.

Oh, bro. Oh, this guy's fucking... Yeah, so he's gone. So he kills her two dogs. I don't know what happened there, but he runs back outside. He shoots at the cops. The cops shoot him in the head.

He dies. We don't know anything else about him, but that was the story. Holy fuck. So I think it had to do with that tweet. I think he saw my address. Maybe he thought he was going to be a Luigi Mangione copycat,

because that happened around the same time. Oh, I see. And he was in the motorcycle helmet, so he's in like a costume. So I'm thinking he saw that tweet. He saw my address. He saw Luigi. He's some loser.

His life is over. He said, I'm going to go and kill my buddy. And then I'm going to go and kill Nick Fuentes, I think was the idea. So, yeah, it was messed up. That is fucking, that's pretty terrible. Mm-hmm. Fuck. Does, uh, do you ever worry about more stuff like that?

I do. Yeah. I mean, you know, now I have security at my place. You have to. Yeah. Um, but I mean, in general, people go out all the time. It's just that was such a special moment when like the whole world was like out to get me for a couple weeks. Uh, but in general, you just got to be safe, you know, I mean, you know how it is.

You're pretty famous. So, you know, when you're outside, you never feel truly safe unless you got bodyguard or unless you're carrying or something. I carry. Yeah, you take precautions. Yeah. It's like anything else. Yeah. Damn.

Okay. So that was, I didn't know I was going to get that deep because I actually didn't know the details of everyone else involved in that. Yeah, I was messed up. Crazy. On a lighter note, fuck. I was going to say,

what do you actually do in your free time? I, you know, I'm not a really social person. I read a lot. Most of my days are just reading stuff. I play, I do play video games.

I'm a big gamer. I play like map games, like Civilization 5 and Call of War. Okay. So have you ever, have you ever played Warcraft? No.

It's too old. for you. Yeah. Are you a Warcraft guy? MMO? Really? No, no, no. See, you said MMO. That's World of Warcraft. I'm talking about the game before World Warcraft. That's how old I am. Ancient. Old head. Yeah, but it's the same like you build armies and you fight, you know. I did Starcraft. It's just like Starcraft, but different races. Like different, different factions. It's the same thing where you build and you attack. I'm surprised you're a gamer. I'm a huge gamer, bro. Just as much as I'm a Jimbrough. So you're less gay then. Yeah, like I've, I've spent, if not more time gaming than I have in the gym, which is definitely saying a lot.

Perspective. Yeah. Huge gamer, bro. Let's go. I fucking love gamers. And I do play a lot of call duty now. I play Black Op 6. Nice.

I'm not that good at it, though. That shit kind of fell off, though. But so you just like, you're, it seems like everything you do then is about this is about what you do. Yeah. And it's not even, I'm not like a hard on about it or whatever, but it's just what I love. This is just like my passion. What about it do you love? When it's so, it is so, like, decisive.

It's so, it's so volatile. Like, you say the wrong thing. It's like, that's the worst person in the world. What do you love about it then? Because it's just, it's just like the theory of everything, you know? I mean, there are some people that say that philosophy is political theory, that they're the same. Some would say they're the same thing. So, you know, everything that I talk about, it's history, it's religion,

it's philosophy, it's ideology, it's, it's the story of the world. And I'm so interested in all of it. You know, I want to understand life, you know? So that's, that's kind of my big. I think that's why I'm enamored by a lot of it too. Yeah. I think that's why even, like, from a different perspective for me, but why I love doing the podcast, is why I like speaking to people.

It's just like understanding people, why, what makes them tick? Why do they do it? What are their reactions to it? What do they learn? Like, how to be better, essentially? Because for me, it's just like, my life was like, how do I improve my, myself to feel better about myself so that I feel good about who I am because my circumstances growing up were not the best, right? So that's, that bled into for me, the gym was a way where I was

like, you know, I know it's funny jokingly gay, but I was, I was finding like, oh, I can be good at this. I can improve at this. And then obviously the physical things came along with it that you're also like, oh, this is also cool. I got cool shoulders, whatever. But it was, and the core of it was to feel better about myself as a person. And so then understanding, and learning from other people, you know, typically you tend to take a little bit and learn more for yourself. Right, right. So that's why I do it all.

And that's why I love it. And as I'm just curious, I like talking to people who get to positions where, you know, of notoriety or some substance and understanding how they got there. Yeah. Well, yeah, I think that's what it is to be a real guy. You know what I mean? Like a real guy's guy is we love stuff. You know what I mean?

We love like money and finance and business. I'm just enamored by all that kind of stuff. I'm the same way. Very inquisitive. Yeah. What about women? You don't date? You don't have like a... No. No, I don't... I don't date. I don't have any... After your body, my choice. I wasn't ever. And that's not going to happen. I'm not after that. It's not going to happen for you, bro.

Yeah, it's over for me. No, I'm just not... I'm just not social in general. I don't have a ton of friends. I don't go out. I barely leave the house. I'm just not a very social person. I'm a little autistic in that way. I'm pretty insular, pretty focused on the Mish. Yeah. More than anything. So, Big Mac or Whopper? Definitely Big Mac. Yeah.

I had to ask that. Sorry. Fuck. That was crazy. That was like beyond parody, right? Yeah. Other than the genocide. How's the,

how's the Big Mac, bro? Yeah. That's pretty funny. Mm-hmm. It was pretty not funny, funny, but funny, but not funny. It's like one of those things like,

it's dark. Am I laughing? Mm-hmm. I do like dark hearing me though. I can't help it. Yeah, me too. It is funny. Yeah.

So what was your take after, after, after um doing the sort of little i don't was an interview what did they do with you on the live stream yeah they kind of just asked me my thoughts on their um netting yahoo thing how did it get to that just for reference for conversation sake we're talking about after the net and yahoo podcast full sent kyle and steiny hits you up and they were like hey we got to do what yeah they i had never heard from them before but i i woke up at like 2 p.m and my phone's blowing up they said oh nelk wants you to come on the show that's how i heard about it

And they said, yeah, we want your reaction to the interview. So I said, okay. So I watched my face. I got on. And I think they were getting a lot of shit for that. They were getting a lot of blowback. And I think they were looking for the other side to come on and kind of tell them, you know, the what they did was okay or it wasn't that bad. And so that I was like the counterweight, which is kind of funny to think about, you know,

it's kind of funny that they bring on Netanyahu and they think, we need to hear from the other side. let's get Nick Fuentes, which is like Prime Minister of Israel, like live streamer, you know, that that's the two. That you were the polar opposite. Yes, right, that I'm the opposite poll. But, yeah, so, you know, I heard them out and I understand where they're coming from. I think you would do it. If Netanyahu wanted to come on your show, if you want to come on my show.

I think any of us would do it. I think it's just a matter of, and see, this is the thing about the whole conversation. I don't know how it was set up. I don't know who organized it as far as, like, what could be said or asked or not asked. Also, even if certain things were asked, would they have been like, you know, you can't even put this out? Right. Because, yeah, I would have asked other questions that were a little bit more like, like I said earlier, when he talked about the regime change and that never works. I would have said, well, weren't you the guy who said this 30 years that we need regime change?

And, you know, I would speak to that. I would have asked those questions to directly question. And also I would have brought up the, you know, the idea, not the idea, the, the fact that you know third party journalists are not allowed in israel at this time why is that if if everything you say we just have to take his truth wouldn't that create some sort of like discrepancy with the public like i would have asked those questions for sure right and i i i don't know if they weren't allowed to or if they didn't know to i don't know the truth of it all i know is i saw something on twitter where they like they interviewed him and i didn't know about the interview at all

i hit up steining was like did you actually interview this guy and uh he was like yeah and he and then i was like, oh, that might be a little bit interesting, was my reaction. And he's like, well, we asked some, like, good questions. And I, you know, he basically said something about, he, he finds it hard to be, like, represent that he's Jewish in America. And so I was like, oh, maybe they did press him a little bit. And then I saw the interview and I was like, oh, I see why. I see why they sort of got a little bit of backlash. But I don't think they're, like, just genuinely like, bad. Like, I, you know what I'm saying? Like, I, you know what I'm saying? Like, I, I think they did, because I know them.

I think they did go, this is going to be viral as fuck. I know right away they think that. This is massive because it is massive. And it's like everyone was like, holy shit, look at this. Let's talk about it. I think they could have went in with like just harder hitting questions to ask towards, you know, whatever he was saying instead of kind of just going along with it. Right. That's all.

And again, if you ask me what I have done it, I would have done it. Yeah. I just, I would have been knowingly a little more critical. Like even with you. I can't have a conversation with someone that hold certain viewpoints and I can't question. You have to question it. Absolutely. I can't just let you go like, man, this and this.

And it's like, dude, it's because it's never that simple. There's nuance to everything. And for their interview style, because I know them personally, they don't really take that confrontational approach really with anyone. And you could look at that historically and know that that's true. I think the most confrontational one that they ever did would have been with, a rest in peace oj but they were like oh did you do it and i know that they were told don't ask them if you did it or not and they still asked them right and i think that was the end of the

interview um but i don't know how this was all orchestrated and also if they asked those harder questions i also don't know if they would have been allowed to release it yeah exactly you know i mean i agree with you and i said that to them like obviously you're going to take it because as a content creator it's like you say it's going to be a big interview but the thing is when it comes to pushback, it's just doing your due diligence. You're acting almost on behalf of the audience and saying, what would the audience say? What would a skeptical mind say in this circumstance? And I told them the only way to make it right or the way to make it fair is you got to interview the other side. If your goal is we're going to hear everybody out, we're going to

hear out Nanyahu, we're not going to give a ton of pushback. Okay. But unless you interview the other side, then it's propaganda. So you got to interview the pro-Palestine side or whatever. Who do you think would be best for that? I heard that, I don't want to say it, but I heard that they got hooked up with somebody who's pro-Palestine. Yeah. And I think that's fitting

because it's an Israel-Palestine war. Right. But even in America first person, even someone like Tucker, for that matter, who is of a similar stature to Netanyahu in terms of notoriety. Or you? Or me.

But I don't want to be a shameless self-applicity. They should talk to me. No, I think you do you do good on that. Thanks. Yeah, you would. I also wanted to have this conversation about all this anyways, too. So similar audience base, I believe. Yeah.

So your overall take on that, like, what was your perspective? Do you watch the whole interview? I didn't know. I was just clips. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I just, I couldn't, I just can't get out of my mind, Sneiko's reaction to the Burger King, the Wopper. That was like, what?

Yeah. I couldn't believe it. That was funny. It's sad because it's not funny, you know? Yeah. That's like, yeah. So do you, have you ever gotten contacted by any of these bigger podcasts, like how I hit you up a couple months ago? Like, do people hit you up and they're like, I want to,

but I'm afraid? Not really. No. I mean, it's just been this year that I've seemed to have gotten a little traction. I did the Hodge Twins who are conservatives in Vegas. And I'll probably do something with Dan Bilzerian soon. He's been wanting to do one. But no, I mean, I've been totally gatecapped. I'm banned from Tim Poole. I'm banned from Pierce Morgan. I'm banned from Patrick Bed-David. So, yeah, I don't have a ton of opportunities because I'm the most canceled guy. But I appreciate you coming on.

Is there anything else you want to say? No, I think we hit a lot of stuff. It's been a big conversation. Yeah. Thank you so much for coming on. I appreciate it. I wish you success, man, for real. And I hope that, you know, more of the, more of the, I guess,

do you consider this a mainstream platform? Absolutely, yeah. Really? Absolutely. It's huge. Yeah, everybody, I told him on Bradley Martin, everybody's like, oh, that's awesome. That's cool.

Okay, cool. Well, dude, it was, it was dope, and I hope, I wish the best for you, and I hope that nothing bad ever happens. I don't want to put that out there, but, likewise, yeah, it's, it's been good. Thank you, man. Thanks for having me. Yeah, great conversation. Awesome, brother.