REAL AF with Andy Frisella - How to Develop 7-Figure Social Skills, ft. Jordan Harbinger, with Andy Frisella - MFCEO237

Episode Date: May 22, 2018

In business & life, people who master the "soft skills" make an impact & make money. Jordan Harbinger is one of the pioneers of podcasting & is an expert in social dynamics. A guy who built a massively successful brand by providing high quality content & generating meaningful conversations on critical issues, Jordan joins me in the studio & we talk about the interpersonal dynamics that translate into big-time influence & income.  

I can stack them hundreds to the roof. I ain't stopping till they stack to the moon. Without me, my family wouldn't have food. Anybody go against me, gotta lose. What is up, guys? You're listening to the MFCEO Project. I'm Andy. I'm your host, and I am the motherfucking CEO. Guys, if this is your first time listening, welcome. This is an entrepreneurial, personal development, how to kick the shit out of every aspect in your life podcast. I don't think I've ever described it like that, but that's what it is. We're going to talk about a lot of concepts.

Some of them will be strictly business. Some of them will be strictly business. Some of them will be strictly personal development. Yes, we are in the business category, but you don't have to be an entrepreneur to get things out of this show, okay? We're going to talk about a lot of principles. We're going to talk about a lot of concepts that will help you in every area of your life, not just your financial area or your career area or your business area, but also your personal area, your fitness area. All of these things can apply, and that's the beauty of what we do here. So we don't run ads.

I'm not going to bore you with 20 minutes of fucking ads. I am going to get right to the point and we're going to keep it about you guys, about the listeners. The reason we started this podcast was because I deal with about 200 millennial people that work in my company and I recognized a need for them to learn the basics of what it takes to be successful. I won't say this is just for millennials, but I will say that the MFCEO project and the reason we call it a project was based out of that. We don't believe in the popular concepts of the everybody is special, that everybody deserves to feel good about themselves, that everybody wins. We deal with reality. Okay. So we're realists and we're going to talk about some shit that is probably going to make you uncomfortable sometimes, but if it makes you uncomfortable, you probably fucking need it.

My fee for this podcast and my deal with you guys is this. If you get value out of the podcast, if you get, uh, lessons that apply to your life for every episode that you feel like was value, I ask that you bring me one friend. You could do this a number of ways. You can talk about us. You could tell someone about us. You can make a post about us. You could tag somebody, but if you tag somebody in piece of my content, please let people know why you're tagging them. Um, this is a completely organic movement. We don't run ads for it. Uh, and we do this because we want to make a difference. So guys, if you could do me that favor and pay the fee, it's on the honor system. I appreciate

you guys. Love you guys. And I appreciate all the support that you give us. Uh, if you want to stay more connected, you could subscribe to my email list, which is, uh, andyfrasella.com forward slash subscribe. And you're going to get access to the Frisella Files which is a weekly free piece of content video content that we do that's sort of like a mini podcast it's the best way to describe it

but it's practical lessons on how to make some fucking money so which we all like as always I am joined by my co-host Vaughn the Impaler

Vanilla Ice the Pastor of Disaster. Jean-Claude Van Damme. Jean-Claude Van Damme. Vaughn Jovi. DJ DJ God. Right. He's known by all kinds of names because he's legendary. Right.

What's going on, my legendary friend? You know, whenever you post pictures of your transformation i actually feel like the before pictures that you post that you must have photoshopped them to make yourself look really bad because i don't remember you looking that bad but then when because it's because i was big sexy dude well that's true but it's also because i was with you every day you know how like when you're with somebody every day, you don't really see? But it's crazy. There has been quite a transformation. Why are we trying to call me fat, dude?

No, man. I'm just telling you. Tyler, I think he's calling me fat. Like a year from now, when I have 100- I think you are still fat. You're still that fat guy to me. Hey, bro. And you're always going to be that little gay boy. By the way, Tyler, where are your shorts today?

Yeah, he's got the ripped up jeans. This is the second fucking podcast. No, the third podcast in a row where there's been no salmon shorts. What happened last podcast? We had an awesome podcast. Actually, it was a good one. There you go. Yeah.

Are we breaking a trend? Yeah. The essence of the salmon shorts is still here. So I feel like maybe salmon's going out of style. Are you still on the salmon or are you feeling like something else? No, no. I'm way past the salmon. You were the one that still on the salmon or are you feeling like something else? No, no. I'm way past the salmon. You were the one that was on the salmon.

What's the new thing now? Just fashion. Are you going back to neon? No, no, no, no. What's the new thing, dude? Holes? Just fashion. Like all kinds of holes in your pants?

Oh, man. I don't really know how to describe it. Streetwear. Streetwear. All right. Anyway, all I was going to say is a year from now when I have 100 more pounds of lean muscle mass. 100? You're not even going to notice it because you're going to be with me every day, but everybody else will notice it.

That's when I'm going to get a sleeve. You're going to get a sleeve? Once I get arms, I'll get a tattoo. Do you have any tattoos? I don't know. No. First of all, I can promise you that you would do about five minutes of a fucking tattoo and you would quit. You're probably right, but every time I go to a tattoo artist, they can't do what I want them to do.

What, they don't want to tattoo your penis? No. Because it's so small? I always tell them I want a full body tattoo of myself. Those micro tattoos are in right now. What are? Those micro tattoos, they're hot right now. Oh, dude, that one dude who's doing those things, that motherfucker.

John Boy? Yeah, he's charging like fucking $10,000 for a fucking tattoo. It takes five seconds. He's pretty talented. Vaughn's going to get a little dick on the inside of his finger. No, Vaughn's going to get a little dick on his little dick.

No, I'm going to get a full body tattoo of myself, only taller. Damn, dude, you've been thinking about that for a long time. He's like, did you not hear me when I set that up the first time? Jordan picked up on it. I'm going to repeat the joke again.

I guess I just announced our guest today. Oh, yeah. I'm here, too. Let everybody know who we have here today, because I'm excited about this podcast. All right. Guys, we have, and I have to admit, I don't know if it's Harbinger or Harbinger. I knew that was coming. I was like, oh, he must have either not researched it or is going to in real time go, oh, wait

a minute. Wait, wait, wait. I can promise you he didn't research it. I did research it. Let's just fucking real. I did research it, but I have, you know, my brain, I'm a three-dimensional thinker. I've always got massive, deep, weighty concepts going on in my brain. Right.

So I just had a brain malfunction. Ain't nobody got time to figure out if it's a hard G or a soft G. You got it right, man. Yeah. The answer is both are totally fine. And even I switch it up sometimes if I'm trying to get somebody to spell it right. I'll say Harbinger. And if I say it normally, I say Harbinger.

But if we pronounce it Harbinger, it's almost like you're a Harbinger of doom. That's right. So for purposes of this show. That sounds badass. We're going with that one. Yeah. Okay. So anyway.

But let's be real. Let's be real. Let's be real. You didn't do your research. Hey, what do you call this? I know you did a little bit of research because you sent me some fucking thing in text message today that made no sense, but I'm sure this fuck wasn't good research. Well, I actually thought that you would need no introduction, but-

So far, so good. So far, so good. This intro is as good as not having one at all. That's right. Actually, my favorite accolade of yours is the Larry King of podcasters. You know what that used to say? What's that? The Charlie Rose of podcasting, and I had them change it. I had them change it.

I was like, oh, crap. We've got to find another. We've got to move away from that guy. So my friend goes, oh, look, I'm doing a Forbes article, and I'll go and throw that in there. Because it was like, it's kind of like, he's the Harvey Weinstein of supplements. Wait a minute. Maybe not. All the millennials over there going, who's Larry King?

But anyway, no, Jordan is actually, in all seriousness, if you listen to it, he's one of the, I would call you the OG, you know, because you're one of the first pioneers of the podcasting world. But Jordan is, man, you're an autodidact. I mean, you know a lot about a lot of stuff. But the way I would describe you, your expertise really does seem to be social influence, communication dynamics. And you know what? I just want you to tell your story about yourself. Tell us a little about yourself. Give us the five minute spiel about who you are and what you're all about. So like many of us, I went to college and I was like, oh crap, I can't get a job. This is back in 2003. And then I thought, well, the answer is clearly more

education, right? I got to go to school more. That's what they tell us. That's what they tell you. And at the time, you know, it sort of made sense. So I went to law school and then I worked my way through wall street. And the thing is when I was younger, I was, I was decent in school. I was all right. And then I got to college and I was like, Oh crap, everyone's smarter than me. So I had to outwork everyone, which actually was a better lesson than just like, Oh, I'm naturally smart. That's not a good, you don't want kids to actually learn that if it's true. And then I got to Wall Street and everyone was really smart and everyone was really hardworking. And I thought I'm going to get fired from this job as an attorney because they're going to figure out I don't belong here. Classic imposter syndrome. And what I ended up

which we all still have. Yeah. We also have to some, at least to some degree for sure. And I learned, I wanted to learn how to network and sell and close business because I thought that's the way that I'm going to get to the top of the law game is bringing in relationships, reaching out to people, making friends with people, getting new clients for the firm. And then I started working on that. And the problem back then especially was you could not learn this skill set from anyone you either were kind of naturally good at it which i was not or kind of like when you were knocking on doors in the original company like hey you learn it yeah you gotta learn just go get punched in the face over and over again

and it comes dude i hate people to have the natural ability it's annoying like people yeah i get i get credit and it drives me insane they like i used to have this guitar teacher and i would say to him i'd say fuck dude you're so talented he would get so pissed off because he's been playing for 30 years you know what i mean every day for 30 years and he would get pissed off when i say dude you're talented and i never understood what why he would get so mad but then i but then i started thinking about how i feel when people say oh dude you're so good with people that's such a great talent you have it's like motherfucker do you know how many times I had to get punched in the face to develop my people skills like a decade of getting my balls

kicked in every day you know what I mean like a salesman who's really good at closing business I was the worst dude it's just I just didn't have an option I had to go out and fucking get my face smashed it's a lot of knocking on doors were you like that or yeah I had to I had to learn this stuff the hard way because I was quiet I was always like bookish would be a kind way to put these this thing and that was great for showing up for a geometry test it was not good for closing business in New York yeah and I tried to classes. So I would take like a Dale Carnegie class. But what I learned really fast was some guy in a sweater vest at the YMCA

is not going to teach you how to be like a smooth operating business closer rainmaker because they work at the YMCA teaching Dale Carnegie classes, which is, look, those classes aren't useless. They're great if you're afraid to stand in a room with six guys and go,

so the sales data for this quarter, that's great. Bro, you know that's how I started, dude. Like, I started my speaking career. People are like, how the fuck do you, do you ever get nervous when you go up and speak in front of 10,000 people? I'm like, no, absolutely not. And you know, but the reason is, is dude, when I started, I started in front of six

guys in the back of one of our retail stores scared shit shaking with the papers in your hand dude exactly like that exactly like that and that's how it starts man yeah so like going to the ymca to speak in front of six people there's a tremendous amount of value because i feel i feel like most people can't get past that point no and most people won't so they that point. No, and most people won't. So they'll feel that and go, okay, fuck this. I'm not doing this anymore. Right. But the truth is when you have to get more nuanced with it,

that's when the rubber meets the road for a lot of us. And you can't really learn that as well in a classroom setting. So you'll learn how to remember some kids' names of people. They teach you that like you're walking through the memory palace or whatever. You know, those exercises. They teach you like, I don't know know here's what you do with your hands when you talk but the problem is if someone's not giving you guys a client contract if you get fucked over by a supplier or you get a good deal from a supplier it's not because the person's

like well he had a firm handshake and they looked me right in the eye for the it's that's not why people like or don't like you there's more nuanced stuff going on but you're not going to learn that from a public speaking class with three people or five people who are afraid to go up yeah you got to get past the hand it's just there it's there to set a very basic foundation yes and you've got to be able to run out in the real world with basic skills and learn how to sharpen and evolve those skills exactly yeah like if you take a sales class, they're going to be like, oh, research the prospect, which is valid. You should do that. Show up on time. Yes, you should do that. Make sure that you ask about their personal life, whatever, like those basic things. But what

they don't tell you is, hey, when you go and knock on the door, back away from the door three or four feet, especially if you're a guy and the bigger you are, the further away you should back from the door and turn sideways because it makes you look less confrontational and look down at your phone or your paperwork until they answer the door. But they don't teach you that stuff. You learn that because you're like, you have a couple of people answer the door and you're standing there and they back up and go, whoa, oh, I'm sorry. Hi, can I help you? And you go, huh, I got to fix that problem. That's why retail is so valuable, dude. Retail is a great place to hone your personal skills because I was fortunate to come up in that area of business because you get literally dozens of chances a day to connect with people. You know what I mean? And you know

when it goes right because they buy something and if it and they're excited when they leave their post on the internet like oh dude i just had this great experience at this store you know people ask me like kids are like what should i do uh to learn these skills i'm like go get a fucking job yeah yeah you know getting rejected and having people say like you don't know what you're doing or having your boss lay into you and the numbers never lie with sales too you can't be be like, I'm really good at this. Well, I haven't closed anybody, but I'm pretty good at this. You are not good at this.

And that's okay. And you will get plenty of chances to blow it and get better and better and better. Yes, anything that you can do to sell something, especially if you're selling somebody else's thing, because then you're not going to be like homeless if you can't do it right away. Yeah.

Then they'll teach you things that they've learned. That such a good job to have i worked at a movie theater selling popcorn and gummy bears but they come to you yeah less effective plus they want that shit right yeah and they want different it's different selling something that they want versus selling something that they need so like for example in my business, we've sold things that people need versus shit that they want. Nobody wants to fucking take protein powder. Nobody. Nobody wants to take supplements. They just know they probably should.

It's a good idea. So when they come in, our job is to educate them on what they need to use and how they need to use it. To get somebody excited in a situation for something that they're they're kind of telling themselves they need to buy versus something that they want like a fucking beer yeah or a pizza you're completely different ball game plus your results are offset well their results are offset by time time yeah a lot of time months years whatever like when they go to get fucking pizza they're like fuck that was good it tasted good don't trust me if i have people always ask me what my regret is and i don't really have any regrets but if i knew what i know today i probably would have picked a business that would have been

something that people wanted versus something that i had to educate them on and i love what we do because it the the the time payoff that we get of actually changing people's lives, dude, it's irreplaceable and I would do it for free, okay? So I'm not saying I would change it, but if I were a young entrepreneur, like I'm giving advice now, like if I were you and you're fucking young, I would think about selling something people want versus something that they need. What do you think you would have sold? Do you ever think about what it might be?

Dude, fuck yeah, man. I know exactly what I would have sold. Do you ever think about what it might be? Dude, fuck yeah, man. I know exactly what I would have sold. I would have sold fucking frozen custard. Frozen custard? Everybody fucking loves it. I would have been a billionaire by now. The frozen custard billionaire. Yeah, bro.

There's this fucking- You might be fatter, though, than you are now. I was fat, and I sold fucking vitamins. Right, yeah. If I sold fucking frozen custard, I would have been 700 fucking pounds. I would have been on the show where they have to cut the hole in the fucking side of the house and use a forklift to get me out of the bed. Big Andy the custard guy. That's right.

Well, dude, it's funny because the reason I always say this and people laugh, and I'm going to give a plug here, which I never do, but there is this fucking place in Springfield, Missouri. And now it's a lot of places. It's called Andy's Frozen Custard. All right. That's the name of it. All right. Missouri and now it's it's a lot of places it's called Andy's Frozen Custard all right that's the name of it all right and whenever I knew learned about this business they were they only had one or two stores now they have like dozens and dozens and dozens of stores and it's this really cool concept it's like they have like this standalone like retro looking um like drive-in movie 50s feel building it's really like good atmosphere good ambiance and

dude their fucking product is so good and dude i'm just telling you like everybody in st louis loves ted drews and it's like a it's like a legendary place i love ted drews as well but andy's frozen custard has the whole fucking thing locked down for a model and i always knew i'm like dude if i fucking if i ran their business i would be a fucking billionaire because it's, people come from all over 20, 12 months a year to buy this shit. And I'm out there like having to like go into people's offices and talk to them about shit, like going on a diet, you know, like nobody wants to fucking go on a diet. Nobody wants to hear that. Meanwhile, people waiting in the rain to eat frozen custard. So you obviously started working on this stuff to succeed as a Wall Street lawyer, but you're not a Wall Street lawyer.

So what happened? That didn't happen. Yeah. So what happened was I was securitizing subprime mortgages, which is a fancy way of saying, take mortgage pools, turn them into a product for a bank where they can sell securities against it. So like you can buy stock in these pools of loans. Well, the big short, I think we kind of know how that went. Cause I remember asking what happens if people default on their mortgage and they go, it's fine. There's so many in here. You'd have to have this critical mass of people defaulting at the same time. Well, guess what? That's totally possible. And in fact was likely and happened. And so the whole firm that I was working at cut back dramatically and they're like, look, we're probably going to end up cutting a lot of

you guys and it's your first year. So we don't want to fire or lay you off. So what we're going to do is pay you for the entire year, every month, just like you work here, but you don't have to show up anymore. And, but you should get another job. And if you get another job, let us know and we'll stop paying you. Right. Right. Cause no problem. I'm certainly going to do that. But then I just took all of that salary every month and I focused on, I used it as seed capital for my business. And that's what started the whole company in the first place. So I didn't end up continuing with Walt with law, but I continued with those skills. Cause every time I learned a little bit about sales, marketing and relationship development, networking, like this is really this is a huge competitive

advantage that nobody thinks about because people are thinking about how to outwork everyone which you should be able to do already uh you work ethic is something that you should have you have to have you have to be able to like die on the treadmill but making yourself smarter is a process that you should also do but is so much slower and then there's this third path, like the secret third path is what I call it, which is the relationships and the networking stuff. If you're building that, your colleagues, they're not thinking about this right now, especially if you're in your 20s. Because what you think about when you're in your 20s is, I'm going to work and I'm going to build something and then sooner or later I'll know everyone because I'll join a country club or something when I'm a millionaire.

And I'll just make friends. Right. The friends come first. They don't come as a result. They come as a part of what you're building. Yep. Dude, totally. And that's just, it's funny because one of our last podcasts, we just talked about this.

The process of continuing to level up your your groups of yes friends you know what i mean um so many people try to fight that process when it's counterproductive to the yeah what they're trying to do you know what i mean um but it is what it is well or they're doing this thing where they're like well right the first one is i don't want to ditch my old friends and it's like okay i get that you don't have to not talk to your high school buddies but if you have a bunch of friends that you're going, hey, let's go get a workout in and then go see a show. And they're like, no, let's smoke pot and play video games.

That's cool if you do that once or twice. But if that's all they ever want to do, you got to figure out if that's what you want. Yep, because that's what you're going to get. That's what you're going to get. You're going to end up like that. And I interviewed this guy on the Jordan Harbinger show named Ben Hardy, Benjamin Hardy. And he wrote a book about how your environment influences what you do. And one of the

examples he gave is he had a buddy who was happily married, he had kids, and he stayed friends with this guy from high school, which is, again, not the end of the world, not a big deal. But then he started spending more time with that guy and more time. And then that guy went through a hard time and got divorced. And he's like, well, I'm his only buddy. So he spent more spending more time with that guy and more time and then that guy went through a hard time and got divorced and he's like well I'm his only buddy so he spent more and more time with him and that guy was talking negatively about his ex-wife and he encouraged this guy to talk negatively about his current wife and then his current wife started getting sick of his crap and his eating Cheetos and playing video games with this guy all the time well you can guess what happened fast forward a couple years later this guy ends up getting divorced. His wife takes his kid

and now he hangs out with this guy 24 seven. I think they live together and play video games every fucking day. Yeah. And that's because this guy's mindset and his environment were set up to just sap away his energy, sap away his, his good choices, sap away. He didn't make new friends. He didn't level up his friends. And networking and relationship development is a great way to make sure that you're around successful people all the time, not just the people that you were friends with in college because they live next to you. I think it's important too to say, you know, the other thing is that networking is fucking huge, right? And you have to be conscious and and and uh intentional about who

you're going to try to meet but what i see on social media and i don't know if you observe the same thing but fuck i do is like all these kids who think that just by networking that they're going to somehow become these wealthy oh yeah like right they're not they're they're they're disproportionately going in on networking as opposed to like building a quality product or become these wealthy oh yeah like right they're not they're they're they're disproportionately going in on networking as opposed to like building a quality product or having a business plan or all the other shit that you actually got to have too because like you're having you know like gary v pushes this hard and gary's my boy but i don't agree with everything he said and one of the things that he go in somebody's dms and dm him and dm him dm him until they fucking

respond dude you know that's how you get blocked on my fucking page you know what i mean like you i had this question uh i went to kansas city for an event last weekend or two weekends ago and um i had a kid come up to me who was just like i don't know he's like three or four years into his business and he was like how he asked me for my my personal cell phone number and and like dude I admire your ambition like I get that and I'm not trying to be disrespectful but I'm not giving you my fucking number like I don't know you yeah I'll give him your number don't worry about it but like I I get it like he was displaying that he had like courage yeah that's right and I appreciate that but and he's like courage to ask. Right. And I appreciate that.

But, and he's like, well, how, cause after I told him no, you know, politely, um, he said,

well, how do I, how do I get to be friends with people like you? Like, how do we get in the same circle? And I'm like, bro, you got to go out and do something.

Yes. You got to go out and fucking build something. Like you've got to go out and build something that's so fucking noticeably successful that you cannot be ignored to where people like me or you or whoever else and he's who have already done things look and say dude yes we gotta get this dude's doing it we gotta get in with him it makes sense yeah because people miss that point because they're they're so they're young and they're ambitious and they want it now and they don't realize like dude you can't just talk your way into people's circles i see you're an entrepreneur let's connect yeah but like if i had elon musk's phone number right now for example i wouldn't be like hey look i have all these great ideas for

spacex you gotta hear or no hey can i i don't have i'd be sending them fucking funny memes right yeah until we're fucking boys. Exactly. I would find some way to make it entertaining, but that's a whole, that's a whole side topic probably. But that's what we're talking about. Interpersonal relations.

Like you're, you're, you work your way in like over years. Yeah. You know what I mean? And, and you have to bring value to them because you know, if, if this kid and I don't want to pick on somebody, I don't even know, but he probably wasn't like, Hey, I have to get in touch with you directly because I have all these things that are going to benefit you. He was like, I'm going to text you every week to run ideas by you for my own benefit. Oh, that's a whole other thing. This kid was very nice.

And he's going to listen and he's going to know what I'm talking about. He did everything right. But if you don't have the thing, whatever your business is, to back up your... It takes that part too, not just the networking. You know what I mean? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I do. Another thing is you get people in DMs all the time and they'll say this, Hey, can I pick your brain?

Oh, yeah, that's not... Don't ever do that. You can't pick my brain. I've got lots of shit going on in my real. No motherfucker, you can't pick my brain. I've got lots of shit going on in my real life. Like, no, you can't pick my brain. Or we've got 236 podcasts that you can listen to. Dude, it just shows me you're fucking lazy. Like, I cannot stand, like it's a pet peeve of mine.

Like if those words go together into a fucking DM, I literally get like irritated. I want to like tell them off, but I don't, but I try, I just ignore it. It's, it's tough. I will say if somebody's friends with me, like if you called and you were like, Hey, look, I want to pick your brain about podcasting. So that's totally different. That's different.

Yeah. But if I don't know you, you're picking my pocket instead of my brain because I got to make money on this time. No shit, dude. Like, that's a great way to clarify that. It's totally different if you've got a relationship and I, and I call you and say, Hey bro, I got a question about this. What do you think?

Yeah. As opposed to some dude I've never met before. And, and dude, what they always do too, like they always try to leverage. They're like, Oh dude, I've bought all your products. I've done this. I've done that. Can I pick your brain? And I'm like, no, you still can't. Still can't. Yeah.

Like I just don't have the time to do that. And I'm doing what I do so you can learn this shit. All you have to do is go listen. Yeah. It's not scalable for you to do that. Yeah. No, man. One thing that I started doing that has helped with this is, uh, do you know what clarity is? It's like this service where you can charge up I think, $600 or $1,000 an hour, and then they can set up a call with you, and it's like, at that rate, it's about $17 a minute. And I will donate that money to charity, or I will, it depends on what the cause is, of course. But then, if people are willing to pay for that, then I know that they're going to probably apply what they're telling me, because it's going to cost them $400 to talk to me for $15. That's right, and that matters yeah that's

something i've had i've had to learn over the last few years is like because we're getting ready to launch a bunch of academy courses nice and um uh i'm excited about that because i'm i'm excited to have people who have something in it you know what i mean whereas dude because that's what i like man i like people taking the information and then coming back a year later and being like fuck dude i double my income or i grew my business this much or i did this right but it doesn't happen really for because a lot of people don't have skin in the game they don't have skin in the game the guy who wanted to pick your brain not not the one again don't want to pick on somebody i don't know but a a lot of times you'll give somebody, I remember when I first started, I would spend like an hour

with somebody outlining a strategy or something like this. And they would never, a year later, I'd be like, oh, did you ever launch that? They never would launch anything. They would never do anything. And that's why if somebody's like, hey, I want you to be the first guest on my new show. I'm like, no, I'll do it when you're on episode 50. I never hear from those people again because they don't get there. They never get there. Right. Yeah, dude. That's a good point. So backing up just for a little bit. So clearly you built this awesome brand on social dynamics, interpersonal communication, a lot of the things that are connected to that. Let's formalize this, all right? And let's make let's state this in in really stark terms give us your step

by step you know path or or or formula for how to get somebody to do something you know what sure basic principles of persuasion persuasion we're already talking about it organically but let's normalize it yeah persuasion is is commonly misunderstood because people are like all right what's this like hypnotic set of words that you can use to get somebody they have they have a negative connotation of it yeah it's either manipulative right yeah or they're they're thinking like oh i got to use uh power words or like uh some kind of there's some terms i'm drawing a blank because i don't use i don't worry about linguistic programming yeah i don't really i don't really focus on this kind of thing.

The way that, honestly, the way that I get people to do things that I think are going to be beneficial to them, which is the easiest way to persuade somebody to do something, is to, first of all, align their goals with yours. I know that sounds very cliche or trite, but what this means really is, look, I don't tell someone, or you don't tell someone, hey, you should buy this product. It's the best one out there. And if you do this, all this great

stuff's going to happen for me. You would never sell anything like that. You'd say, look, you're going to go out there and spend 50 bucks on supplements. If you spend 60 bucks, you're going to get stuff that we've tested. It's going to work. It's going to give you better results. You have to speak in terms of what's going to be good for them, but you also have to show them, you have to handle their objections in a way that's not like you're selling it. So a lot of the ways that I would sell an online course or an in-person training, and when we teach, when I teach people, usually I teach military, a lot of special forces, of course, a ton of civilians and things like that come to our training as well. And they're always, these are guys that know that hard work is part of it.

So you have to speak in the language that they have, which is not, this is going to be so easy for you guys. Half the time I will tell a client or student, this is going to be one of the hardest skills you've ever tried to learn and then the wrong audience will go wait all right i'm done let me stop you there sure why do you say that because i know i know why but why do you say yeah so the reason that this is important is if i tell if i tell a kid outside this is going to be one of the hardest skills you ever had to learn he's probably going to be like i don't want to fucking do that but if i tell you this is going to be one of the hardest skills you're ever going to learn you're going to be like well good I need a fucking challenge I know I can do this I've mastered

all kinds of other stuff not only that now I fucking trust you because I can believe that you can believe that I can believe like when somebody says this fucking lose weight in 30 days lose 100 pounds in 30 days easy cut your leg. Nobody fucking believes that shit. But when you tell the truth, people believe it. Yeah. And then you have credibility. So you might not sell as much today, but over the next 10 years, you're going to sell a lot more because the people who are buying are the people who are willing to go do what it is you're telling them to do.

Yes. And what are they going to do? They're going to say, hey, I went and bought Jordan's program or this or that or andy's supplements and you know what they fucking worked because i did my part and it's a long-term play you know what i mean yeah i do and i think telling the truth is first of all underrated everything and it's hard to do in the moment people always go oh well you know of course i'm going to tell the truth you know i always tell the truth this is what i do the when it comes down to the moment where you have to choose between getting easy results or getting money from somebody or telling the truth, that's when it

actually matters the most. Right. Discipline doesn't really matter when you don't need it. This sounds so dumb when I'm saying it out loud, but it's actually a great life truth. Discipline only counts when you need it. Like if you're already awake at 5am because your dog woke you up, that's not discipline. It's discipline when it's cold out, it's snowing, you're so warm, you wake up and you go, I could totally go back to bed for another half hour or I could get to the gym or I can get up and make a healthy breakfast, whatever it is. That's when the discipline counts. The same thing with truth. The truth only matters if it's like,

shit, I really want to sell Tyler on this, but you know what? This isn't going to be a good fit for what you're looking for, but I'm going to refer you to one of my competitors as much as it kills me right now. Then the person goes, wait a minute. You're not just trying to take my cash right now. You're not just trying to get this close to sale right now.

And that's tough because- But that's what does close the sale but that's what does close the sale that's what does close the sale yeah it does and and look the another way that that i think it takes like it takes like five to fifty times of real life experience experiencing what you're talking about yeah to understand it like because like dude i try to teach this to like guys who that we have in our program and they're like no man they're like no dude if i do that nobody like, no, dude, if I do that, nobody will buy. Nobody will buy. I'm like, motherfucker, this is how you close a sale. Yeah. This is how you close a sale. I recently, I, every Friday I answer listener questions on the Jordan Harbinger show. And one person was like, I got this really successful cleaning business, but I have all these clients and they're used to

paying me, I don't know, 150 bucks a day or whatever to clean the offices. And I want to raise my rates to 200, but I don't want to piss off all my old clients. And my advice was not spring a rate change on them. My advice was not tell them what's, you know, what's what my advice was, tell them you're raising your rates in 30 days. So they have time to plan. And if it's too much for them to pay, you will refer a competitor who will probably do just as good of a job. And she's like, I'm not referring my competitors. And I said, then don't raise your rates because you're never going to be able to do it. So of course, what she ended up doing was hopefully taking my advice, I would imagine. And when other people have asked me this problem or had this problem to solve,

if you say, look, I'm going to refer somebody else if you can't afford my new rate, most everyone will pay you the new rate because they trust you. And not only that, dude, let's say they don't. Let's say they don't pay you the new rate. Because really what you have to think about, like we talk about, like you said, telling the truth sometimes is hard. But it's really not if you think about it the right way. Because what you should be thinking about in today's society

is what the conversation is going to be Friday night at the bar when they talk about supplements or working out on Monday or what the conversation. So let's say they don't buy from you. Good things still going to happen because what's going to happen when the conversation comes up is, you know what? Jordan raised his rates from 150 to 200 bucks, but he offered to help me find someone else to do it for the same price. Like, dude, that's a good fucking dude. You know what I mean? So you end up still winning even if you lose. You know what I mean? Yeah. They go, he referred somebody else who does that. It creates the story. It creates the story. The conversation that you're trying to control that what the of mouth, doing things like

that are what creates that because it's so abnormal. It's like what Seth Godin talks about his purple cow, right? It's so abnormal that people remember it. So it's automatic branding and advertising for you forever. And it shows confidence in the way that you need to show confidence. It's not bluster. It's, look, my protein powder costs 60 bucks. Yes, it's twice as much as another one. It's more than twice as good. Well, you know, I'll give you 55. Sorry, man.

No. But here's another brand. You know what the best thing we ever did? The best mentality I ever adopted for not just business, for my life. And it says this on my Instagram profile. It says, not for everyone. People get themselves in trouble by trying to please everyone. Do not try to please everyone. Just figure out who it is that you're going to appeal to and go all in there. That is a very good point. What happens is people try to take brands like yours, mine, and they try to make us all vanilla, and then you get punished by the market for being vanilla.

Right. But the person in the moment, it's kind of like they want you to be this way, and then as soon as you change that way, in fact, this happens in relationships too. You've seen this with probably your friends, and they're married and stuff like that, and like that it's like why can't you do this why can't you be more like that and then all of a sudden the relationship falls apart and it's like what happened i did everything that she said or i did everything that he said it's like yeah but you've changed it's like you fucking changed me what are you talking about i'm gonna tell you this nobody's passionate about vanilla ice cream you know i'm saying nobody nobody's passionate about vanilla i like vanilla vanilla is good i fucking eat it yeah but i ain't fucking passionate about it it ain't no frozen custard no that's right with m&ms and fucking reeses and caramel in it right because that's

the shit i like and i'm gonna i'm that that gets me so passionate that i want to start a company around it all right so you have to think about your life and your brand and your company in that way right if you're vanilla dude you're you're you might be able to pay the bills but you're never going to thrive your commodity right exactly you're you're becoming a commodity by default and it really comes down the reason that your brand has become vanilla is either a you're running it by committee because when you run shit by committee the answer is going to always be vanilla because no one's going to agree or b you're purposely trying to please everybody's opinion and it bothers you so deeply that you can't please everybody that you take all the cool shit of your brand and throw it away you sand down your shit

until it's so smooth that nobody wants it anymore. Right. Okay, so Jordan, the first two points that I pulled out from Jordan Harbinger's rock star persuasion course in 48 hours or less,

sarcasm. Nailed it. Is align their goals to yours, tell the truth, even if it's not in your immediate best interest. Yeah, I like that. Well said.

Think about the long game. Well, long game, yeah, that's actually probably two separate points. Long game, I was talking with Gary Vee, speaking to him before, and I can't remember what I said, but he was like, you do think long term. And I hadn't really thought about this,

but it's true. I don't go, oh man, I gotta get Shaq on my show so then I blow up and everyone will be like, yeah, it's the guy that had Shaq. I waited two and a half years to get Shaq on my show. So then I blow up and everyone will be like, yeah, it's the guy that had Shaq. I waited two and a half years to get him on the show. And it was persistence. But it was like, I think you call it aggressive patience. Is that right?

Yeah. It's aggressive patience where I'm there. Like you turn around. It's like, oh, yeah, he's still behind me. But I'm not like I'm not poking you in the back the whole time. You're letting the value accumulate. Exactly. And I think that's important to play that long game.

I get why younger guys, especially younger guys and gals, but especially guys, they don't want to wait because especially in the internet age, it looks like you should have everything right now. Well, dude, and also what people don't realize is that if you have Shaq on your show as the first fucking guest. It's all downhill from there.

It's not going to make your show anyway. No, it doesn't do anything for you. Because it takes time. This goes back to the buying process or the process of becoming a loyal fan. It's the same. It takes people time to accept your idea, to accept your message. All right. And if you go in, like people have this false perception

and it's because what we're fed, right? Uh, Kim Kardashian posted for this company and now they're selling $4 million a month. Right. Yeah. But next month they're selling $0 or they were selling 3.8 and they paid Kim Kardashian and they went up 200 grand. They didn't make it overnight. But yeah, people have this perception because we're fed the idea of overnight success that by having this one person or that one person or this opportunity or getting your product in this store that it's going to make you. Nothing that you can do. Nothing.

No matter how much money you spend. Look at all the companies you see spend ads on Super Bowl and then you never hear from them again. Yeah, never. It doesn't matter. You cannot outspend you cannot outwork you cannot out strategize time time is always a factor you cannot turn a cake up to 900 degrees and cook it in five fucking minutes right it's going to take 40 minutes that it doesn't work right and take my word for it it's the same thing that these young these young dudes i the ambition, dude, but you're

thinking about it in a way that you don't understand doesn't work. Yeah. You know what I mean? I don't know. Have you guys had this experience where every, over the last 11 years I've been running the show, every time I thought, this is going to be this one big turning point, it has never once happened. Like when I got Shaq on,

I thought I'm going to have so many new fans from this. It was like, bink. It was like this tiny little like blip. And then it's like, oh man, we hit the New York Times. All right, cool. We got a little boost. Or like Tony Robbins mentioned us on a bunch of stuff. And I was like, oh good.

It's cumulative. It was cumulative. Yes. It's a cumulative package. It's to where, so now when people look at your website or they look they hear your podcast or they they find out about you somehow what they're doing is they're going and they're saying fuck dude new york times bestseller number one rated podcast innovator

of this been in forbes been in this been in that and they're like fuck all right i like this guy i'm gonna see what he's about and that's how it happens it's a cumulative product and it's it's it's hard to explain that to young guys because like dude i don't think i would have understood it i wouldn't when i was 20 years old because you don't have enough to be cumulative you look at your your whole life is childhood you know how many times in my business career i like not just the podcast thing but in my business career where i'm like fuck dude we just get this one thing and get laying this one account, do this one thing, dude, we're going to be billion dollars next year. Like I've thought that for 20 fucking years, you know? So I'm guilty of the same thought process, but I think it's okay to think like

that because it keeps you wanting to do big things. But what you have to understand, like, dude, it keeps you swinging for the fences, but what you have to understand like dude it keeps you swinging for the fences right swing for the fence strike out swing for the fence strike out swing for the fence hit a home run all right because i've hit a lot of fucking home runs but i struggle way more but i think the problem the problem with thinking that way and i actually believe it's a good way to think but the problem with thinking that way is that when these kids go out and strike out the first three or four times, what do they do? They quit.

And so it's a double-edged sword, man. There's good things about it and there's bad things about it. So what I tell people when they ask me about this because they're like, oh, I'm going to get this big press. And I still agree with you. I'm the same philosophy. Get excited about it. Yeah, you're going to be in the New York Times. Get excited. You're going on it's huge co project get excited but then don't have an attachment to the outcome get excited and fly all the way to st louis and do this show yeah and when

you get a bunch of new fans from it be thankful but don't go what the fuck i flew out to st louis i only got 10 000 new fans i'm supposed to get 100 000 this guy's bullshit i don't want to talk to him anymore. Don't do that because then you're just loading the gun and then shooting yourself in the foot, reloading the gun, and aiming at your other foot. But you do have to, I agree with you, you should stay excited because otherwise you just go, you know, it's no point. I'm not even going to fly out there and do this because nothing ever happens.

Right, right. Like, dude, I had an article come out a couple, like, I don't know, like a month or 40 days ago or 45 days ago where Entrepreneur Inc. or Entrepreneur did an article about the top five entrepreneur podcasts

and they put us at number one. I saw that. Okay, which was fucking so cool because that's like, for me, that's like an iconic thing. Like, I grew up

reading that magazine, you know, so like, and I show it to my dad and I'm like, dad, check this shit out. You know, it's just cool but then yahoo picked it up and then fucking ink picked it up and ever and they and they ran the same fucking a version of the same article and uh dude it was awesome but like i didn't it didn't fucking it didn't make the show

show made the show right you know what i'm saying like yeah we're not any more popular than we were fucking a month ago or maybe, you know, maybe we have a hundred new listeners or a thousand new listeners, but I, I'd still enjoyed that. I still thought it was cool.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. You gotta, you let, you sort of soak it up, but then you don't go. But I'm not hung on it.

You're not hung on it. Yeah. And I think a lot of people, they'll get, they have that, like you said, the strikeout, the swing for the fences and the strikeout. So they'll get this big piece of media.

What is this called? It's called magical thinking. That's what I was looking for. And people do this in relationships. They do this in business. It's easy to spot in business because you go, oh, we have a Super Bowl ad that's going to be huge. Nothing happens. Right.

But when you do it in relationships, too, you have problems. Like, oh, as soon as I, you probably heard this in your inbox your inbox as soon as I get a girlfriend my life's going to be totally different I just need your advice on this you're going to have less money you're going to be more aggravated yeah you're going to be able to get less shit done and you're going to be fatter because you go out to eat all the time that's right that's what's going to fucking that's how different it's going to be yeah congratulations on achieving your dream yeah dude um but people do this in relationships with marriage they do it with marriage too they'll be like you know me and my wife are fighting all the time but uh you know as soon as i get this job in this different town and we move everything will be fine and then they

move and it's like no i'm still an asshole and she still hates me for all this shit i did in the past right you gotta solve the real problem stop with the magical thinking and 90 of the time in those situations 99 of the time where's the fucking problem it's oh it's in yeah it's you yeah i did want to say just as you were talking i was thinking about everything that andy has always said about success in sales and obviously there's so much interaction or interchange between success in sales or business and success in real life and i was thinking he has said on the podcast a number of times you'd be successful at sales you can't look at it as individual transactions. You got to look at it

as lifelong relationship. And that's what I was thinking as you guys were talking is, that's why you have to commit to the long-term because you don't form a really meaningful, rich, rewarding relationship in a single moment it takes time and it's about building trust and i think i can't remember which one of you mentioned trust earlier uh because you both look so much alike i can't remember which one right exactly but a lot of people best compliment you ever got yeah i think it is yeah but like the building of trust you you'd said uh what other persuasive things can you do i always oh there's always one dude it's always one i think that actually may be the first time that's ever happened in our podcast 235 fucking episodes

in and this motherfucker still got a cell phone on it's time to clarify we're talking about tyler yeah yeah um the the way that you build trust also is by doing the little things and most people will not do those little things. So they'll, they'll do this. They'll go, all right, well, I got to figure out, they'll go, all right, well, I got to figure out how to get this set up or I got to figure out how to persuade. I got to figure out the magical languaging or I got to figure out how to do this awesome presentation. And then they show up 20 minutes late and you're like, wait, your whole thing was to blow me away and you've wasted a bunch of my time already right

or they'll they'll go they'll cancel something and my wife will she goes bonkers when i'm like oh i'm tired or like oh we're not gonna make it she's like you know how shitty it looks to cancel something yeah like you better have a reason like oh my leg's caught in a meat grinder so i can't make it right you know not like oh, oh, I overslept. Like, that's not something where it just happens. You have done, there's a whole lot of non-discipline, a whole lot of disorganization, a whole lot of something not working out right for you to have a failure at that time. And that's what I'm looking at when I'm looking at business. I'm not, somebody's like, oh, this meeting ran long.

All right, that might happen sometimes. But if it's like, oh, we got stuck in traffic. Hey, you just didn't plan. You did not plan for this. How are you? It's like that sign you guys have on the door where it's like salesman. Am I allowed to say a salesman by appointment only? And it's like, if you show up and you don't have an appointment, we will not do business with you on principle because it shows that you can't follow directions. Did I get that right? You got it. And so that is, that's so important because every action that you do now, people don't think, oh, well, this is, this is unrelated to me closing this deal, or this is unrelated to me in a relationship scenario. No, it's not. How you do anything is how you do everything. And so if you're showing up without an appointment, or if you're showing up

later, if you're canceling stuff, you're rescheduling stuff, you're moving stuff around all the time. I'm looking at this from a business perspective. I'm looking at this as where did you fail in the line of planning of the logistics? Where did those go wrong? And what's this going to cost me in the future? What's it going to cost me in the future? Yeah. Right.

Oh, well, I have an employee and they failed. OK, so you don't hire properly. So this thing is happening consistently. I'm not like, oh, well, I have an employee and they failed. Okay, so you don't hire properly. So this thing is happening consistently. I'm not like, oh, well, yeah, employees, they're a bunch of screw ups. No, your employees are screw ups because you don't know how to manage or hire. So it seems like you're combining two concepts. You've got the attention to detail, obviously the small little things, but there's also something that Andy talks about all the time. And we've had a podcast on this specific subject. He always talks about all the time, and we've had a podcast on this specific subject, he always talks about how the inefficient is essential. And sometimes to do the things that really bond you to

somebody or help you to persuade them, you have to do those little things that are not easy. They take time and they take a lot of effort. And that's what I think he's always meaning. That's what you mean, Andy, when you talk about the inefficient is essential. If you you want to persuade people, if you want to really want to impact and influence them, it's not just that you have to do the small little details. You have to do the small little details that usually take a lot of time and effort. Yeah. It shows people that you actually care. You know, from a podcasting example, people will often go, wow, you know, your show's edited really well. And I go, yeah, you know, your show's edited really well. And I go, yeah, I have an engineer and a producer, producer Jason and engineer Jason,

because I don't have to remember multiple names. That's efficient. But they edit out coughs, sneezes, like the ringer on some phone that the guest has, or like I put the bottle up and I'm drinking it and it goes, you know, and they'll cut that out. And people always go, wow, you know, how do you get all that stuff out there? Or why bother another, another podcaster? Why do you bother doing that? The reason is because, well, there's other things like auditory fatigue and it keeps people paying attention. But the reason is because, well, look, if I want to convince somebody to send their whole team of bodyguards to my school for 5k ahead or whatever how am i gonna do that and then i sneezed and i was like eh fuck it i'm leaving it in right like how disciplined are you how much do you care

about the final product when you're like i could cut that out but i just don't feel like dealing with it right yeah dude it shows i think those things tell everything yeah yeah they do those little details. You know when you buy something and you're like, wow, all the edges, even on the inside, the part that you don't see, they're all sanded down. Dude, I've been having this fucking issue with a guy that I'm friends with who's helping us. And he's the same way, so I'm not picking on him.

We have been having this issue with a hat company who's sending us the same hats but they're fucking different like the they fit different but they're the same according to company that's annoying yeah and like dude so we've been him and i have been going back and forth with them and it's like dude like most people might not notice that shit but you better believe like i fucking notice it yeah Yeah. You know what I mean? Cause it drives me insane. One's loose and the other one's a little too tight.

Or the, the, the, the type, the, the rise on the crown is like one eighth of an inch different. You could see it. Yeah. Most people can't see that shit. I see it everywhere. Like I notice it everywhere, everywhere I go. Like I see symmetrical perfection.

Like I see the details and like I don't know like I feel like that's a skill that most people haven't developed but it's a great skill to have it's a great skill to have and think about this they say it doesn't matter tell them to get a tattoo that has one eighth of an inch different in a part that like imagine you have that skull on your right arm it's like oh one of the eyes is an eighth of an inch bigger, but it's basically fine. You're like, no, this shit is on my body. And people go, well, that's a tattoo. You're going to have that forever.

Yeah, but you got to treat all of your products in the same way. You got to treat every, and this goes for information products too. You don't release stuff that has a bunch of typos in it. Oh, well, it's beta. Okay, well, fix it. Make it look good. It goes back to, I said this when you're out of the room how you do anything is how you do everything i didn't make that up i think that's

one of those like t harv ecker quotes or dale carnegie from like 1938 i say that shit too and people people will like i'll see them make a meme and they put my name on it and i'm like all right i guess i said yeah but it's funny because that's I think that is one of the things that, I don't know who originally said it, but yeah, we all live by that. Yeah. Yeah. You have to because otherwise you end up with the company that makes hats that aren't quite fitted right.

Yeah. Or the, well, yeah, there's some protein in here, but we put in way too much sugar or we didn't put in this other ingredient, but it's fine. Or it tastes a little bit different. You got the guy who buys chocolate mint 47,000 000 times in a row and then he gets the one that is like off the motherfucker is going to notice he's noticing it yeah but like dude that's in our space luckily that's how most people do business so yeah so they go to beat them they just go all right i'm done with this shit right if one out of every seven of these buckets tastes like shit i'm not doing it yeah

okay so you're talking about these little things that if you want to influence people if you want shit. If one out of every seven of these buckets tastes like shit, I'm not doing it. Yeah. Okay. So you're talking about these little things that if you want to influence people, if you want to persuade them, these little things that you have to do. And by the way, what I love about the last like 20, 30 minutes is that I've literally observed you doing little things, like referring to things about us, making references to things that you know that we've talked about before, which is incredibly, it's incredibly, well, it's meaningful to us. It shows you did the research that somebody else didn't do. Yeah, I knew you were going to go there, but I chose to humble myself and bring this issue up

anyway. But no, but it's, you're actually showing that you're observing people, you're making references to them, you're making it about them're observing people. You're making, you're making references to them. You're making it about them. So I assume that that's one of the little things. Probably, but I've been doing it for so long that I don't notice it anymore. Yeah. Cause I'm like, oh dude, it's just who you become. Yeah. I agree. I'm the same way, dude. Like I know like when you, when you, especially in a sales situation, it's all about them. It's not about you. And so many people are terrible at sales because they make it about them.

It's not about them. Dude, if you're selling cars, it's not about the $1,000 commission you're going to get off selling the minivan. It's about how safe they're going to feel. It's about how comfortable they're going to be. It's about how cool they're going to feel because they got a cool minivan instead of a boring one. And you got to make it about them in every single way. And those guys who care about what they are getting are the ones that end up getting paid.

Cars are a good example for the long game concept that you guys brought up earlier as well. How many cars are you going to buy? Yeah. Ideally, a bunch right if you're if you're good at what you're doing you're gonna have a bunch of cars and you're gonna have to get a bigger one when you get a family and then you're gonna want a fun one for when you actually made enough money to get the car that you wanted instead of the cheap one so if you get those sales guys that are like oh he's 24 he'd fuck i'm not gonna spend any time talking to this guy i'm gonna go to the older. You might make the sale from that older guy or you might not. But if you treat that 24 year old

with respect and then he grows into a 30 year old who then has a different kind of job and he's a 35 year old with a family, then he's a 40 year old during a midlife crisis. What about all his fucking friends? Yeah. What about all his friends point what about the conversations he's going to have about the experience you could have provided about selling that 24 year old uh you know a 10 year old used car what if you make him feel like he's the most important person in the world what if you fucking congratulate him and get him excited about his car to the point where he goes out and tells his other 24 year old friends dude friends, dude, you got to go see my buddy Andy here because he's, dude, he hooked me up. He took care of me. He's a good dude.

He didn't treat me like I couldn't afford shit, okay? And you address all these issues. You're not just selling him. You're selling him and everybody fucking knows. And if you could think about that when you're talking to people, it makes it a lot easier to do the right thing. That's a good point. That network is farming, dude. Sales is fucking farming. You're planting fucking seeds that are going to harvest 10 years from now. So 10 years from now, when that 24 year old is a 34 year old and he's literally told a hundred different people about

you, how many cars are you going to be selling a fucking day off of that one great interaction that you took the time to make him feel more special than everybody else yeah that network effect is huge man that's why creating it's even in the content world right like stuff we're doing right now with this show when you create something that's really good people will then and this is not rocket science they'll refer it out but if you just create a bunch of stuff or if you create like one big splash like you have one big guest and you expect that that's only going to ripple so far you have to keep make every show has to be good enough well you you mentioned it too uh um you know audio fatigue yeah fucking dude there's content fatigue

you put out so much shit that people ignore what you put out. And we see kids doing that all the time. They're putting out, when you go to their fucking Instagram story, the line at the top looks like a fucking centipede, right? And you're like, fuck it, I'm not watching that shit. Or he's making nine posts a day and putting out two podcasts a day. And YouTube, dude, eventually people are like,

dude, you're fucking annoying. You have to be aware of that too. You know what I mean? Like overdoing things is just as bad as not doing anything. It's actually worse. If I think this was in, man, I wish I remembered which president this was, but he wrote a letter and he's like, sorry for the length of this letter. I didn't have time to write a shorter one. You know what I'm talking about? It was like, I don't know. I'm just going to get it wrong if I say Abraham Lincoln or something. No, it was somebody like that. Yeah.

And what he's basically saying is- No, it'll come to me. It's harder to create something that is tight and doesn't have a value delusion than to create something that's just long and rampant. Like, if we did a show that lasted the whole day, it's probably going to be tough to make it more valuable than what we're going to fit into an hour. Well, you know why people do that, right hour right i mean you know why people do that because one of the fucking ways that itunes ranks you is because of how long people listen to your fucking podcast so that you have

these motherfuckers out there doing four hour podcasts oh my god just so they can get a fucking higher ranking right i did not know that oh yeah dude that's why you listen that's why some of the biggest podcasts are fucking two and three hours long. Every time. I know that they rank based on, yeah, I guess I get it. Technically,

I guess I did know that because of the play count, the episode listing. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. I didn't think of it like that. I never thought,

Oh, I should do a longer show because it's like people already go, man, your show's an hour long hour and 15. I only got a 45-minute commute. If it's really good, they'll pick it up later. But half of the time, they're just going, I'm at work. I'm done.

That was Mark Twain. It was Mark Twain? I was going to say Mark Twain. But wait a minute. Get the fuck out of here. I swear it was going to be Mark Twain. Every unattributed quote, though, is now Mark Twain. Mark Twain, right. So it's like YOLO.

Oh, that was Abraham Lincoln who made that up. Actually, that was Mark Twain, too. Yeah, that was Mark Twain, too. Yeah, right. Yeah, I don't know. Now I don't believe anything that he said. I was going to say it. I was. You are that guy. Well, I was going to say it, but he's got my favorite quote

about the right word is the difference between a lightning bug and lightning. I never heard that one. Oh, that's a great one. I never heard that one either. What is the quote? The exact quote is something like having the perfect word versus having a good word is the difference between a lightning bug and lightning or something like that.

Why do you like that? Well, because he said it better. I'm actually misquoting it, but it's really good. I was going to say, it sounds kind of- It's really witty. Mark Twain's kind of witty. So is that why you misquote him and shit? His quote was so powerful that you fucking can't remember it?

No. Tyler, what's the quote? I think I need more coffee. Actually, it was Winston Churchill. Oh, is it Winston Churchill who said that? Yeah, but it goes back. He stole it from somebody else. It goes back way back. Yeah, I think everything comes back to Mark Green. So what's the exact quote? The quote is, if I had more time, I would have written you a

shorter letter. No, no, no. The lightning bug quote. Oh, the lightning bug. Did you get that one? No, I didn't hear that. would have written you a shorter letter. No, no, no. The lightning bug. Oh, the lightning bug. Did you get that one? No, I didn't hear that. Oh, you're not paying attention. No, I'm fucking looking up quotes.

Anyway, but Jordan, I know you have to hop on an airplane with your wife here pretty soon, but before we forget to do this, why don't you share your social contacts? Sure. At Jordan Harbinger on Instagram and Twitter, if people still use that aside from the president. Or just to read the presidential tweets. And I teach a lot of networking and relationship development stuff. Actually, if you guys have a minute, I would love to go over like two of those little drills because I think they're super freaking helpful.

Yeah, sure. Yeah. All right. You know what? Can you spell your name? Because people do that all the time. They say, well, I looked him up and I couldn't find him. Oh, really? Yeah. Jordan, like J-O-R-D-A-N. And then Harbinger, H-A-R-B-I-N-G-E-R. Harbinger.

Like Harbinger of doom slash sorrow slash destruction. Or something good. Or something good. But nobody ever uses that for anything. Harbinger of joy. Harbinger of rainbows. The reason I want to give these drills is because I think young guys, especially guys and girls, but guys, especially we deprioritize our relationships in our businesses, especially because we don't think that we have time. And so I think digging the well before you're thirsty,

you never think you're going to be thirsty in the moment. So you got to start those relationships off early. And one of the things that I do to maintain connections in the network is every day around 10, 9 a.m., I scroll all the way down to the bottom of my text messages and I start texting the people that are at the bottom there. And I'll be like, hey, man, been a long time. Haven't spoken with you in a minute. And then you sign like give me an update on what you're up to next. I'd love to hear from you. Sign your name so that they don't reply like new phone, who dis, or just ignore you because they're embarrassed. And then you say no rush on the reply. I know everyone's busy because when you're trying to sell something, as you guys all know, you build urgency. So then when I get a message from somebody from two years or whatever in my past, I'm like, is it Herbalife or Scientology? Like what's it going to be? So if I, if I say no rush on the reply, I destroy that urgency and it actually increases my response rate. And I do that with four or five people a day. Not every single person responds and you end up with a few minutes of conversation while you're waiting for coffee or whatever, or between phone calls.

I do a similar thing to that too, where I just, I just check, I just do what I do is I send people the emoji, the three fist emoji. Like I, this is something I always do. And then I said, just thinking about you, bro, or just thinking about you. And like, and then, so it's kind of the same thing. Like, Hey dude, I'm just thinking about you. It's not like, it's not like I need anything or whatever. I'm just trying to let them know, like, Hey dude, I haven't forgotten about you. Right. You know what I mean? And, uh, that works really well to help keep, just keep good things good. Because what happens is, and this is the fucking worst.

Like, and this used to happen to me all the time. It's like somebody would text me and it would get buried in my text. And I didn't reply. All right. But then a situation comes up where I need to get a hold of that person. So then I fucking go to like text them and I look and I'm like, fuck. Oh,

I didn't reply to this. I didn't reply. Now I got to ask this guy for something. And then you're the shit bag. Yeah. You know what I mean? So like now I do the same thing that you're talking about. But I just do it in a way of like, Hey man,

I'm just, and I do it in a genuine way. Like when something like when somebody pops in my head, I just fucking shoot him a text. But hey bro, thinking about you. I'll give you a sub drill for this then. This is called a opportunistic network maintenance. And so this, this is something

that will allow you to engage with people all the time without having to be reminded by something or with, by being reminded by something that you don't have to set up yourself. So when you log into Instagram or Facebook, you see the newsfeed and if someone has a baby or gets married, you click like, or you write a comment. All that stuff is what I would say is below the fold, right? Like it's, you're not, I'm not reading those comments or if I do, I'm not like, Oh, Oh, that's cool. The Vaughn commented on that. I just see a thousand comments and I'm like, Oh, all right, done the likes. I'm not reading that list of likes, but if somebody has a, is in your network, which is in your newsfeed and they're, they have big news in their life, they got a business thing, they've got an event going on, they had a kid, they get married, send them a text.

If you don't have their number, send them an email. If you do, maybe you could even give them a call on the phone. All that stuff is above the fold. It's higher on the... It means something. It means something. If you have their number or you reach out more, when I got married, I got thousands of likes, thousands of comments on the picture, the relationship change. But I, I probably got like 20, 30 phone calls and maybe like 40 texts.

But I remember those people because even if they weren't at the wedding. And you, even if it's exactly, that's exactly what I was going to say. Even if they aren't somebody who's like real close to you, it puts them closer to you because you're like, all right, this dude really cares. Or this girl really cares. Exactly. And all it did, you didn't have to do anything other.

You were going to click like, you were going to write a comment. Just pick up your phone and write a comment in the freaking text field to that person. Or an email if you don't have their number. It's better. It's higher on the engagement totem pole it brings your relationship it furthers the intimacy a little bit for sure and that kind of thing i i have uh so the reason i brought that up when you asked me for my contacts was because i have a bunch of stuff on my new website which is advancedhumandynamics.com where i have networking drills, body language drills, persuasion and influence stuff. If you click level one, it's free. It's not a thing that you

have to buy. You know what I love about, about you dude, is that you, I know that you struggled with this early on and that's why you've become a student of it. Oh yeah. I'm the same way. Like I started out fucking terrible and all the shit you're talking about, like the worst, like I knew you got it whenever you said, whenever he said, and when I said, I'm standing in front of my manager meeting, he said, standing there with the paper shaking in your hand. That's when I knew you fucking got it. And the reason you are where you are, dude, isn't because you have a gift. It's because you fucking made it your gift.

And I respect that, dude. I think it's awesome because like I wouldn't be anywhere in my life without going through all that same shit. You know what I mean? And I haven't made it my whole career, obviously. But it's something that fascinates me. But you're a case study in that it works. Yeah, but I'm saying what you do, the human dynamics and the interpersonal relationship dynamics, that shit fascinates me, man. And it's because I was so bad at it.

Are you the same way? Yeah, I was shy, quiet, nerdy, still nerdy. No shame. Yeah. But I was just like- Nerds run the world, bro. Yeah, we do run the world. Yeah, don't forget that.

Be nice to nerds because you're going to work for one if you don't already. So yeah, I was always quiet and introverted and shy. And eventually I was like, fuck this. Yeah. This fucking sucks. And I looked at all the habits that people who are not introverted, quiet or shy were doing. And I thought like, all right, these guys probably weren't born that way. And if you look back, if you zoom out far enough on the timeline of somebody who you think is well networked or persuasive or wealthy or interesting or funny, if you zoom out far enough on the

timeline, you find somebody in their environment or some influence in their environment that might make it look natural. And I'll give you this example right now. So if you find a kid that you think, well, no, my friend Matt, even when we were in elementary school, he was outgoing and fun. Okay, but he had an older brother and his older brother was on a team that was co-ed so he had girls over the house all the time so you weren't afraid of girls when you were six years old like i like me and every other guy were because you're around older kids so then they hung out with you and blah blah blah and then one of the time you got to middle school and high school you were used to having women around so it looked like you were naturally outgoing and comfortable around women

but you were not yes you. You learned it earlier. Yes. That's it. Dude, I love that, man, because people look at people who are charismatic or who are successful or who are personalities. And like, dude, they look at it and they're like, God, you have a gift. Like, dude, I get this shit all the time. They're like, dude, you have this gift about with your voice and this and your ability to speak and dude go listen to my first podcast oh yeah fucking terrible don't listen to my first podcast

please no i hope it's gone i leave it up for the for the specific reason of letting people understand that this is all a skill that you learn you know what i mean it's not a gift the tape doesn't lie right right you look at, if you had a picture or a video of that meeting you were holding with the paper shaking, and you, people would go,

that's not you. That's a guy that kind of looks like you, but is not you. Right. And in a way, they're right. Right.

You're not that guy anymore. Yeah. You know what's really funny is as much as you've said that, I still believe people don't believe it, and I'm telling you guys, literally,

go back and listen to episode like three or four no listen to one yeah hey guys uh i'm andy uh this is the this is a fucking podcast this is the mf it's not for pussies yeah it's terrible but the content was still good no the content was great i didn't know how to really do anything. Present it. Yeah. Yeah. And it's the same for every single skill

because people right now are going, yeah, but you've got that aggression thing that your dad taught you. And so of course you're good at business. I don't have that. Everything that people see about you or me or any of us here, this is by the time the plant,

what is it? You gave this example perfectly. I think it was Chinese bamboo, right? Yeah, the Chinese bamboo tree. By the time the plant what is it you gave this example perfectly i think it was chinese bamboo right by the time you water it for like for years or months or whatever then it pops up and you go oh man this thing grows really fast it looks like it grows really fast if you watered it and then a day later it popped up above the ground what you don't see is all of the fuck ups that everybody made everybody has the things i think the i think the reason that my content resonates with people is because they do have what the fuck i have yeah they're just afraid to let people see it sure you know what i mean like they're like oh dude if i go out it's like

it's like uh doing something anything new for the first time you know like like let's say you were gonna take a singing lesson and there was other people in the room and you're, you're afraid. Cause you're like, fuck dude, there's other people here. Like I'm good in the car. I'm good. But like, dude, this ain't the same. And you're fucking terrified. And like, dude, that's, that's what it's like. You know what I mean? You just have to get past that, that, um, I'm going to feel weird phase and just know that you're going to feel weird until, until you don't expect to not be where you want to be pretty much ever in your life. Like, I don't, I don't want to speak for you, but I would say right now where I'm at, I'm like, people go, man, you're, you're

just built this huge thing. And I'm, I'm not, I'm like, well, my windshield's bigger than my rear view mirror. You know, I'm looking at what's ahead. I say that all the time. I say, I'm just getting started. And people, people think I'm saying that to be humble or something. No, I'm saying it in a literal way, you know, and I don't feel, I don't feel successful at all. I just don't. I feel like I've, I feel like I figured out a little bit. I'm like, all right, I figured out a little bit. You got the foundation set up and you're just getting ready to build the building. Yeah. But like, dude, you know, I also believe that true entrepreneurs, like I can always tell if someone who's a real entrepreneur by the way they speak about what their life's going to be like, like if they say, Oh yeah, I'm going to fucking,

I'm building this business so I can sell it at 35 years old and retire. You don't have it, bro. That ain't, that ain't, you don't have it because to be successful, you've got to love the process and love the game of entrepreneurship because the guys who are winning big they all love it yeah and those guys are going to stop you and a real entrepreneur couldn't sit on a fucking beach could never sit on the beach exactly i was going to say people go what's your exit strategy and i'm like death yeah mine too like and because dude i've had some really big offers to buy our company um not we're not 10 figure but nine figure offers and uh like to where i would literally never have to fucking work do anything and we've turned them down because i'm i make enough money to live the life i want to live

right i love the guys here and the girls here in our office. I love coming to work every day. I love building shit. I love creating shit. Like, like I think about it, like how it would negatively affect my life having that money because it wouldn't change anything, how I would live. And what it would do is take away all the shit that I love. Exactly. You know? Yeah. And, and, uh, that's how real entrepreneurs think about shit. You know what I mean? I agree with you, man. I don't,

I don't know anybody that like, why would I take a lot of money and give away all the shit that I love about my life? It doesn't make any sense. It makes no sense. You'd end up trying to buy your way back into the feeling you get from running this and you couldn't, and you couldn't recreate it. You'd either be into some bad shit or you'd have a bunch of stuff that you don't like as much that takes up all your time and energy.

I would be so self destructive. I would be, I'd be dead in fucking two years. Yeah. I would go fucking crazy. I know it sounds funny, but I think people don't believe you. It's true. You see wealthy or successful entertainers and they, they get on a down slump. You don't turn to cocaine cause you go to a party and you try it and you like it. You turn it because you you get the feeling from that stuff yeah that you were getting before this other shit i never fucked with any drugs you shouldn't like i used to smoke a lot of weed but and and dude uh but like i never i never did drugs you know why because you know you'll get hooked on drugs because the shit makes you feel bad right yeah you know you'll like it like dude i would fucking smoke some crack and i would be fucking i'd be making a documentary about me it'd be like look at this guy who used to be this and now here he is on the fucking sidewalk with a crack pipe.

Yeah, the rise and fall of Andy Frazella by Andy Frazella. It would take one fucking hit of crack. It would be over. Did you, have you, sorry, do you have any other points on your drill? Oh, there's so many drills. Advancedhumandynamics.com and then click level one or go to slash level one. That's cool. I'm going to go check that out. Do it. It's, look, it's so many drills. AdvancedHumanDynamics.com and then click level one or go to slash level one. That's cool. I'm going to go check that out.

Do it. Look, it's free. The reason it's free is because it's the highest leverage stuff that you can do is maintain, and you're going to see how I look on video, which is not going to be as polished as it is on the radio. But the highest leverage stuff you can do, especially when you're young, not even when you're young, in any business is always relationships relation i don't have to explain this to you you know this stuff but i want to hammer it home for everybody listening too and that's why i'm like i want

to get that's what in my opinion that's the people who are going to you want to know the difference between and i said this a million times on this podcast the difference between people who are you know 40 to 80 000 year people and the difference between people who are $40,000 to $80,000 a year people and the difference between people who are $250,000 to $1 million, the only thing it has to do with is their ability to sell and their ability to manage people. And guess what skills you need for that? Yeah. Yeah.

Soft skills. Right. Networking, relationship development. Yeah. And sales. So, dude, thank you so much for making the trip out here thanks for having me man this has been awesome i gotta tell you when i heard your show before i was like wow this guy is like a little high energy and abrasive and then i started talking to people i'm like what's up

with this andy frisella guy and they're like oh he's a good dude and then uh i was texting with you and then my wife was texting with you and i was like isn't he just so nice i did not expect this i did not i this. I did not. I really didn't. But it's a testament to your skill in relationship development that you can be an authentic version of yourself where you're like, you're, you're telling people what they need to hear. But then when you're talking with someone who's a friend, you, you don't have like a, an aggressive persona.

Yeah. I appreciate it. An abrasive persona. No dude. It's look, man, the reason it's branding, right? Like it's, it's my product. My product is, my product is different than everybody else's because it's an authentic, aggressive stance on the shit that people need to hear.

Yeah. And, you know, I'm passionate about it, and that's where that comes from. But, like, dude, I don't run around my house yelling at my wife. You know what I'm saying? Not every day, anyway. I'm a about it and that's where that comes from. But like, dude, I don't run around my house yelling at my wife. Like every day. I'm a pretty chill dude. Like, you know,

I'm a fun guy to hang out with. And if we're going to drink beers, we're gonna have a good fucking time. But like when I get to talking about like the shit people need to know, dude, like I get angry at the lies they're told. And really what you're seeing when I, when I post like clips or bites that are, you know,

of course over the top. Really what you're seeing is my anger for people lying to other people coming out. You know what I mean? And it's just, because dude, I was lied to and I was told the wrong way. And I spent decades of my life trying to figure it out. And so it's frustrating to me.

And I'm not frustrated at people. I'm frustrated at the people who taught those right the noise yes man so I don't know man like and I like this is just another example you know you know we don't monetize our podcast because I fucking love doing it you know I just love it and eventually we're gonna have products that are gonna monetize like we sell some children's book everything that we do is designed around. That was unexpected too. But my wife's like, he's got these children's books. And I was like, wait, who does?

I was talking about Andy Frizzella. He's got children's books. And fortunately, you know, people have really supported those and, and really done a great job helping other people learn about it. But I mean, dude, this is about impact, man. You know what I mean? Like I'm, I'm, I'm a fucking rich dude. Like, you know what I'm saying?'m i'm i'm a fucking rich dude like you know what i'm saying like yeah you don't have to do this i live a crazy fucking life like it it's like rock star shit but what i love to do is fucking help people i just fucking love it like

i love the business we're in um because we're able to send somebody away for six months and have them come back a completely different person uh emotionally physically you know confidence wise i love what we do here because i feel like i'm able to relay some of the lessons that i was taught um through life and also by my dad i was very fortunate to have a dad who by all accounts was not like the most loving dad like if you looked at him from the outside you guys would be like this dude's fucking crazy but the reality is is he loved us way more than what most dads love their kids because he was he had he had the understanding of what real love is which is telling you the fucking truth and preparing you for reality and i was very fortunate and and i

don't use the word luck very much but i was lucky lucky to have that. Um, and I try to share that, man. You know what I'm saying? Cause not everybody has it. Good on you, man. Cause I think a lot of people would take the opportunity to create a platform like this and just go, cool. I'm going to sell them some, some more shit. Yeah. And dude, we are going to sell some shit, but it's all going to be shit. It's healthy shit. Yes. It's all going to be stuff that will return on someone's life in a financial way a thousandfold. You know what I mean? And I can feel good about that. Yeah.

And that's got uncensored children's books coming out. Uncensored children's books, yeah. Dude, what's that one, the Go to Fuck to Sleep? That video of, who's reading that? Samuel L. Jackson, I think. Oh my God, dude. That's one of the funniest videos ever. Yeah, he's like, go the fuck to sleep.

And he's like, it's so calm, so chill. He's such a good voice guy. Him, what's his face? Lawrence Fishburne's voice. Oh yeah, of course. Morgan Freeman's voice. Those guys are so fucking good at what they do. I'm big fans of their voice work.

It's so hard to do voice work, too. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Dude, it's just, I don't know. The more I get into podcasting, the more I pay attention to people's voice work. Yes, yes. And I'm really becoming a fan of people that can have their fucking style.

It's tough, man. It's really no different than fucking rapping. Remember, Tyler and I just started working on some rap shit with our buddy Mark, and fuck, that shit's hard, dude. It's a totally different art. He sucked so bad at the beginning. He sucked so bad at the beginning, yeah.

I got fucking way better quick. Yeah, you got way better in those, only over the course of a couple days, and Mark's like, man, I never heard somebody pick it up this quick. Yeah, but it is a different thing, man, because man because it's like yeah like in podcasting you develop your style or radio you develop your style and then that was just a whole different thing but uh is the boys in the hood always hot yeah I'm bro I can drop it on you man I don't care drop it on

you the vanilla ice style I can drop it on you i will fucking next time mark comes in town we're bringing this motherfucker over because i would love to fucking see him weasel his way through a fucking rap verse easily i approach the microphone because i ain't no joke tell your mama i'm cringing could you be any more fucking white white uh no. Literally, I don't know that I could have any less pigment in my skin unless I was an actual albino. That's the fucking truth. But, you know. You got the hood blood in you?

Yeah, oh, I do, yeah. You got the hood blood? All right. Well, dude, thank you so much, man. Thank you, guys. Yeah, anything. Guys, if you're not following him, make sure you do. And make sure you check

out his website because, um, he's teaching you and has dedicated a big part of his life to teaching you guys, uh, a great foundation for the skills that you're going to need to earn more money. And, uh, we kind of went all over on this podcast, but, but Jordan is one of the best in the world at what he does. And, uh, make sure that you're, you're giving his content proper attention because it's going to benefit you a lot. And your podcast is actually just called The Jordan Harbinger Show. That's right.

The Jordan Harbinger Show. You can find it anywhere fine podcasts are sold. They're all free. I don't know. I don't know if people confuse that sometimes. We're in the fine podcast category. That's right. That's right.

Yeah, we're MFCEO adjacent. That's right. We're winging each other across the aisle. That's right. All right, guys. Thanks for listening. Make sure you pay the fee, and we'll see you next time. Outro Music