Real Kyper & Bourne - A Goaltender's Trust in Defence + Canes' Consistency

Episode Date: May 8, 2025

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne are joined by Devan Dubnyk (6:15) – former NHL goalie & current NHL analyst to chat about Mikko Rantanen's rising production with the Dallas Stars, what it was like facing off against Mikko during his netminding days, how much trust you can put on your defense as a goaltender, how Calvin Pickard has given the Edmonton Oilers a boost, and if there's an art in selling calls in net. Then, Aaron Ward (31:16) – Stanley Cup Champion with the Carolina Hurricanes stops by to look at how the Canes can beat the Washington Capitals, their consistency in the playoffs, and who he thinks will clinch the East Final between the Maple Leafs and Florida Panthers. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Welcome to the national hour on the real Kipper and born show. We are live on sports that six 50 in Vancouver sports at 9 16. Calgary Sammy forgot to change over the Jersey across all sports that platforms and this hour of real Kipper and born brought to you by bet 365 and a kipper is Justin born and a very forgetful But very excited Sammy McKee because his leafs are up to nothing And there's no other team as far as he's concerned in the Stanley Cup playoffs It's tough to put an oilers Jersey up and the thing is half the size of an adult Jersey

But I was also got a DM from a guy named Garrick on Twitter Yeah, that said Sam that Pope fact is just way wrong Pope Paul the sixth was head of the Catholic Church from June 21st 1963 until his death on the 6th of August 1978 there was no Pope election in 1967. Sorry, bud. Just. He missed our Pope talk in the first hour. The Pope, I was misled. Please, I cannot cope with the Pope right now.

Cope with the Pope. Sorry, I was wrong with the Pope. Okay. American Pope. Next, an American Pope. Pope talk. Can we go from Pope talk to Pope talk to Pope talk? Okay, American Pope Here we go, can we go from Pope dog to Jets talk Well, Ranton's maybe gonna be the next Pope after his playoff performance so far. He's okay He's he's

He's got a cool off here eight goals in eight games 15 points one point eight eight points per game, 10 of them at even strength. A tip, a lucky redirection, a great one-handed rebound bat, all in the second period, natural hat trick. He is... Look at that play, look at that play. So what's the stat that he's been involved in the last 14 goals that they've scored? That was 12. is it 12? I thought 12 or 14 one or the other either way. It's ridiculous

The first NHL player with a hat trick in back-to-back playoff game since yari curry. I curry a fellow Finn Also playing well loose to Ryan and Lundell more fins pins are good at hockey The one thing I mentioned on yesterday's show is I think it was gonna be difficult for the Jets to kind of come off that double overtime win and then just focus and Put together a solid 60 minutes We saw a tremendous push on juror stood the challenge last night.

But is that what you got out of game one with Winnipeg? They did carry. They shot them 31-24. I thought, yeah, this is going to be a close series of close games and you're going to have to withstand those momentum swings. And when the other team has theirs, you just can't give up three. Blame Hellebuck for any of those ones. Kind of tough, maybe you want him to hang on

to the first one. Puck was sitting right in the blue paint. Chance to tie it in the last minute. Yeah. Oh my God, that's a, I mean listen, they got one of the greatest finishes in the history of the league, tipping it in with a minute and,

oh sorry, a second left. Maybe you're not gonna get that bounce, but when you see that puck sitting there, you're like, oh my god What could have been? Yeah, we're gonna welcome Devin Dubnik to the program as we let him Settle in I think I don't know. Do we have him yet or are we waiting on Devin? Usually they tell us we have okay. Sorry. All right, you saw in the meantime Can't help but think about Colorado fans that constantly got to watch ranting in from here on a score and we did hear from president and general manager

Joe Sackett In Colorado and yeah, that's it's in Colorado and yeah, that's it's It's hard to remember I think years down the road that they were they were really close to winning this series Like where's that fine line and it will ultimately was it just about the guy that you traded away that Kept you from potentially winning the Stanley Cup this year. Yeah, I mean, yes It's yes, three. That's as simple as that. It is. The answer is yes.

I'm curious what the knock-on effects of this decision are. Are the Avs, how are they going to spend their money this off-season? Do they now feel like they can go get Mitch Marner? Are they going to do something different with the money? Because otherwise, Kip, they're just a worse team than they were. On a decision they held in their hands and didn't follow through on. And traded their best prospect and a first round pick

for Brock Nelson who didn't score a goal in the playoffs, did he? No, he didn't. The one thing that Joe made pretty clear was he just wasn't ready to commit the money to Rantanen and the feeling was that it was too much upfront between I guess him, McKinnon and I don't know if he put- He's pricing McCarr in.

McCarr in there, but too top heavy. I'm not sure if he used that phrase or not, but there was a sense of of uh too much right and leaving him too thin or or not enough depth. But the cap is going to the moon. Well that's what I think everybody's been saying here and if if you're not gonna pay rent and then who are you gonna pay because I got news for him that nake hash. Mm-hmm. What do you think he's gonna ask for? I Don't know 10 11 11. Oh, you're right. No, you're right. And if I was him I'd ask for that too. Yeah, but okay, so What do you think you're saving by moving Rantanen? It's not good. Yep This is not good.

And I do think this has the potential to be really bad. Really bad. How mad is their superstar? How mad is the fan base? How much if they lose again next year do people say, all right, well, we got to do something different. All right. Let's welcome him in.

Devin Dubnek, former NHL goalie, Coyotes. You know, the first time I met Devin, was he was, I think the third goalie with the Montreal Canadiens, and we were in the same lineup for hot dogs at the Bell Center. Is that right? Yes. You're giving me too much credit there. I think I was the fifth goalie for that.

I think I'd sent my gear back home already. I was just there for formality. And then from that moment that we met, then you became a star in the league, a number one legit goalie. I think me and the hot dogs deserve a little credit for that. Yeah, I had to do some extra work when I got home to work those hot dogs. Yeah. Because they had a few at the ball center there.

Thanks for joining us. Just a lot of talk, not only on our show, but throughout the league on Miko Rantinen and what he's been able to do single-handedly for the Dallas Stars and how this is playing out for Colorado. But what are your initial thoughts when you've been watching him like the rest of the hockey world?

You know what I caught a little bit of what you guys were saying before and it is it's it's truly baffling You know the more you go over you try to make sense of it you try to like you were just doing the numbers there and it just For a team that has made so many good moves and seems to consistently make good moves There's just nothing about this that makes sense the trade in general, you have a top five player in the league. I'm sorry, he's top five player just about every season. He's big, he's strong, he skates, he stick handles, he shoots. I mean, what are you, you can't replace what Mikko Ranthinen is.

And it's not just that, it's combined with the timing of it. Like, it wasn't a rushed at the deadline, we tried to sign him, oh my gosh, we can't, we have to get something for him. On a team that is considered a cup contender, so sometimes you even just have to sit on that, eat it, and take your chance, that you might still win a Stanley Cup with him,

potentially lose him, but still have the time to try to sign him if you go win. A guy that seemingly wanted to be there has continued to say he wants to be there. He's loved in the room. But then they do it, and it was like a week or two before they come out with the cap projections. So they did it before this, and then it was, I don't know if

it was exactly a week, but it seemed like a short period after they come out with these cap projections that are going through the roof, and all of a sudden it's like 12, 12.5, that's like nothing. So there's so much of it that doesn't make sense to move on from a player who is beloved in the room, in the city, and really an irreplaceable player,

and unfortunately for Colorado and their fans he just shoved it down their throats oh my gosh some salt in the wound last game like when you read these numbers are you serious 14 points in four games two back-to-back natural hat tricks like this is this isn't real Devin you you competed against him you played against him, you know those Minnesota wild years Seeing him constantly What is it about him? What what's it like facing a guy like that? Well, he's moose right? He's the guy's massive. He's six five. I don't know 235

Whatever he is is like solid muscle the guy's in incredible shape and he's not it's funny because you when you watch he's not like flashy. He doesn't look super fast You know you got McKinnon out there is going 100 miles an hour. It looks it looks amazing But when you really watch him like he's got incredible hands. He is fast He's huge. So he's gonna go to the hard areas He kind of just does everything and then don't know if quietly is the right word, but his points totals and everything, like he's got an incredible one-timer knack for the net. I mean, again, it's just the more you talk about it,

this is essentially an irreplaceable player who happens to be 6'5", 240 by the way, like have fun moving that guy in front of the net. And so so you know I had to deal with him I could have a peek over his shoulder sometimes if I was lucky but he was he was a menace around the net. So his job this series is to make life hard on Connor Hellebuck. Hellebuck had an unbelievably strange year in that he had one of the best goaltending performances we've seen in

regular season in a long time and a really tough first round. So what did you, a fellow goaltender, make of what's happened with him in the playoffs? Yeah, you know what, it's a tough one and it continues to kind of be like it's, you can't call it a fluke anymore when it just is continued to happen and I don't know, I mean I can see it. I don't know if it's pre-scout, because you're gonna, it's different than playing in Winnipeg in the middle of February. You're not gonna get that same focus on that specific game. Going into a playoff series,

there's a ton of pre-scouting involved, you know, all the advanced analytics and whatnot now. And a lot of it, you know, with Helly, it's a lot of high east to west puck movement, and then you're seeing these point shots go through, and combined with that, so Connor Hellebuck is one of the best goalies there is at reading the game. That's what he's great at, he's right there,

he's on top of it, he plays deep in his net, but it feels like he's always right there, because his reads are that good. In order to do that, in order to be able to do that, you have to fully trust what's going on in front of you, deep in his net but it feels like he's always right there because his reads are that good. In order to do that, in order to be able to do that, you have to fully trust what's going on in front of you. And throughout the year, obviously, Winnipeg played extremely well in front of him, very structured.

That gives him the confidence to make these reads that he's so good at so he can play deeper because he has to because he's not the best skater in the world. And then be comfortable with knowing exactly what's going on in front of him. So he makes these reads and he's there all the time. Well, as soon as, for whatever reason, Winnipeg doesn't seem to be, whether it's being late in shot lanes, not boxing out, being late trying to box out

and cutting across, there seems to be a lot of cross screens and tips and now he's playing deep in his net. So that's getting exposed. As soon as he starts to feel like, when he's relying on those game reads as much as he does, as soon as he starts to feel like he doesn't trust what's going on in front of him, then those reads start to become anticipation,

start to become borderline guessing on plays, rather than sitting on guys, letting that play happen, and then moving into it with the extra speed being your read The facts of goal is kind of a perfect example. So it's not a it's not a great shot Let's be honest like it's not OV coming down and ripping it under the bar Like it was a shot high glove on a straight line I mean, yes, those are gonna go in sometimes but not at that time in the playoffs but if you watch the play he's got a the play, he's got a guy driving,

he's got a St. Louis player driving the back post. And maybe when he's on and he's feeling it, he's gonna either know that guy's taken by his D-men or he's gonna feel comfortable that he can get there if that play happens. He can sit on the shot, wait for it, knowing that if that play happens, okay, now I'll go. But what you can see is he obviously doesn't trust,

he feels it off of his back shoulder. He doesn't trust that that puck's not going there or he feels like he can't get there if it does. Now he starts to sink back a little bit. You see his skates just start to drift. His shoulders then flatten out, which is that kind of guessing game a little bit where he's getting ready to go before the play happens.

Those shoulders flatten out, it opens up the glove side, and the shot goes in that really wasn't a great shot. And that's kind of what you started to see with Hellebuck and White Pucks are getting past him. So if he needs to get that confidence and trust back on what's happening in front of him so that he gets his reads back and those goals don't continue to go in.

So team structure is, not to say the whole thing here between what's happened to him from the MVP regular season to the playoffs, but can you talk about, a little bit about that transition for a goaltender and the pressures or like to your point, as soon as they straighten out what's going on in front of them, you're going to see the old Connor Hellebuyck back. Yeah, I think so. But it's, it's, it's, you

know, it's a fine line, because it's like, it takes a little bit to get to the point of not trusting, you know, like, like, crazy plays can happen, poor defense can happen in front of them. It's not like all of a sudden, the trust is going to go out the is gonna go out the window, but it chips away at it, chips away, it chips away. And after back to back games in St. Louis that were blowouts, that then starts to creep in. It's the same thing.

It's not this magic potion, irreversible boom. You have to build back that trust and that feeling. And it works both ways. He has to build back that comfortable feeling with the guys in front of him. Of course they trust him and they know

he's one of the best goalies in the world and they're gonna see it but he's gotta find a way to get back to showing them that. They've gotta find a way to get back to him trusting, this is a great save by the way, what's going on in front of him and then you slowly start to build that back up. But it is, it's really you know a goaltender is as good as the group in front of him and then his job is to make

that group in front of him comfortable with what's going on behind them. They have to all work together and it is you know overtime was a great step in game seven there. I thought he played well and you know last night was that last night it was last night I watched so much hockey I can't believe it's that much. We're right there with you, Val. Yeah you know he was okay but it's got to like there's there's got to be a game in here somewhere right where he's just that guy that that's a whether it's a one goal or a shutout and it's like wow that was that was a game and then it'll

come back hopefully for them. But he's not far off, he's still the same goalie. So Devin, we'll keep it in Canada. I've got some questions about the goal-tenning in Edmonton. They start the playoffs with Stu Skinner, they move on to Calvin Pickard. I don't know what your thoughts are on the difference in quality of those two guys, or their ability to win with Pickard and Skinner is a tandem

What are your thoughts and what's going on in the Oilers crease? It's changed a lot You know pre I've been covering that the Edmonton games a little bit and you know pre playoffs I was saying like it's it's got to take a lot For them to make a change in that and in Pickard had a had a great season You know he did his job, he played well, he played more than he ever had. Nothing knocking against Pickard,

but I just said, if Edmonton's gonna go all the way, they need Stuart Skinner. It's just, I didn't, that's how I felt. I felt like there was just, something drastic was gonna have to happen. It wasn't like a who's gonna start here. And then all of a sudden after game two, like it just looks so dire for Edmonton.

You know, it wasn't just Skinner. It was just that every goal that went in, like, you know, the whole fan base, everything was just ready to jump all over him. And the team just had no jump in front of him. And it was just something needed to change. And so I got asked after game two and I was like, yeah, you got to put Pickard in there

because this is a guy who's battled, he's not your most, sorry, I'm blanking here, like structured, he plays a little street hockey. And so, but the guys play comfortable in front of him, they battle for him, they know he's gonna battle for them. And they kinda just needed like an exciting save or something. Like, I don't know, it was just, there was no Skinner just hadn't come up with, with a big save.

The way he plays is very structured as well. So there's just, I don't know, they needed some sort of boost and Pickard comes in here and he does that because get, you know what, some saves that maybe Normally wouldn't be that exciting can be a little exciting with Pickard and now that he's gone on He's done everything that's asked of him more and the way the Oilers are playing right now There's really not that much that's being asked out of him other than to make these saves make the saves that he should and then he just seems to come up with the right one at the right time right now and make the saves that he should and then he just seems to come up with the right one at the right time right now and You know you can you can look down the road and say is that good enough to to get them all the way

I would have questioned that at the start, but with how well edmonton is playing right now and how aggressive they are being uh going the other way and like I think they're playing extremely well offensively and Defensively turning the pucks over, transitioning the other way. If they can keep that up and keep it to the point where, hey, we just need you to make two or three tough saves tonight and stop the ones that you should, and we'll spend most of the game in the other end, who knows, we could see it.

Devin, you know that market pretty well in Edmonton starting out what five years there And and the demand in that town is there any way that you could feel maybe what Pickard's feeling right now or anybody in general who didn't necessarily envision being a number one guy You know in the in a final eight in the Stanley Cup playoffs Yeah, you know what? He a final eight in the Stanley Cup playoffs.

Yeah, you know what he's had he's had a great mindset when he got thrown in there and and you know the quotes that he had when he was talked to is just kind of like he said what's what's there to be nervous about I mean he's he's been grinding in this league to try to just to try to stay in the league I don't remember the exact amount of games that they said, but it was like, I don't know, 20-some games over like five years or I don't know if it was that low, but it was something crazy like that. And he's like, you know, this is, this is an incredible opportunity. What's there to be nervous about? This is, this is just, it's a chance for him. And if it doesn't go well, then what? I mean, it was like, nobody was really expecting it to be this,

this savior anyway. So I think his mindset was perfect nobody was really expecting it to be this saviour anyway, so I think his mindset was perfect for that. And he's kind of, you know, he's 5-0, so he's done an incredible job, but he's kind of taking that pressure off of the goaltending side because it was honestly, not even just in the playoffs, but all the way leading up just this relentless talk about the goalies over and over and over again. And as the conversation's gone on now, the talk, it's like, yeah, he did a good job. It's almost like better, like you don't even want to say, like Pickard stood on his head.

It was just like, it's just not a, not part of the conversation anymore. Nobody's talking about the goalies. It's great. Like that's what they, that's what they needed. And he's done that where it's just kind of like, and I think he's given himself a leash now, too You know, I think that for a while it was like yeah If he really slips up in a game then then that's when you go back to skinner because I Constantly said like I do think they would need skinner to go all the way I I might be eating my words on that one

But I think he's I think he's earned himself a leash here that if he does have a game That that isn't great and he doesn't look good I think he's earned the opportunity to to stay in there and and continue to battle. You know for the NHL hour we do a Leafs hour and so I can tell you Sam Bennett's little elbow to the head of Anthony Stolaris came up as a goaltender watching that did you what did you think is that on purpose goal guys trying to do that to you guys? So, alright, here's the thing. I'm gonna piss off everybody in Toronto. I don't think he's trying to hit him.

But he is trying to make contact. But that's what these guys do, right? Like the Corey Perry's, the Sam Bennett's, this is why they're great playoff players. They're trying to agitate. when they go through when the crease they're trying to get a little bump He's I don't think he's trying to to hurt him in the head. Like it didn't look like a really hard contact He didn't like swing his arm and hammer him and it's unfortunate that he got hurt But yes, he's trying to make contact, but that's what he that's his job That's why these guys are that's why you hate to play against him in the playoffs. And he'll do that and he'll bump you and he'll piss you off

and then he'll go put the puck in the net. This is why these guys are great. I think it's a combination. He's trying to make contact with them. But at the same time, it was a really weird play where Stollard's ended up. Most of the time, guys push their post and go to the RVH there on that play.

He ended up biting a little bit on the shot to begin with, so he actually was down early, and then the puck goes down to Bennett, and he's kind of stuck at the top of his crease at the angle where he then goes paddle down because Bennett's right there to tuck it. And so he's kind of in a spot that he wouldn't, the goalie wouldn't normally be.

He'd actually normally be back a foot and a half. And Bennett is, he takes the the puck he takes it to the net that's the other side of it is he's got the puck on a stick with a chance to score like are we giving him that much credit that not only is he gonna try to put the puck in the net but at the exact same time he's like I'm gonna elbow him in the head like I think that he initially was trying to score puck went off his stick, hey, I'm around the goalie,

I'm gonna give him a little shove. And unfortunately, it was a serious injury and that's too bad for anybody, but that's kind of what I took out of it. With all this talk of crease crashing, we watched Bobrowski, I thought, try to sell a few calls here. as long as they're coming in that area Are we gonna see more of this is?

It is it is there a bit of an art for gold tender to sell something without looking like he's selling something like I know You would never do anything like that. I got one email one time but From the league from From the league, yeah. I completely disagree with you. We had a nice back and forth conversation. But there's an art to selling it. I don't think guys are very good at it.

I know just from being in there, a lot of times the contact does feel like more than it that it ends up being like when you rewatch it but the thing is is you're you're down and you're in a you're in a vulnerable position all the time right you're down on your knees with your head forward looking around so and these guys are moving quick out there so a lot of times it's like when you get hit in the net it feels like more than it is but you know you got to be careful with the head back and the flailing the arms. And that's up to the league to make sure they're on top of that.

And they create the list for the referees of guys to watch out for with the diving and whatnot. But there's definitely an art, if you can get bumped, lose balance. My favorite thing was to take the net off, being as big as I was. If I was anywhere around the post and they were buzzing around the zone, I got a little little push it was just

like I could just get the crossbar nicely tucked underneath my shoulders and just be like whoa If we've got penalties over the glass for two minutes I want a penalty for any goalie that knocks the net off I also want my goalie doing that so Yeah exactly I mean that would almost have to be a review call because you can't imagine the refs like staring at the goalie to try to, although sometimes this playoffs, it seems like they're looking at everything but the game. How big are you? Six, seven, six, six, six, six, six. Like you could breathe on one of those nets and knock it off. That's how big you are. You just need the tiny little lift. That's why I was like, yeah, just off the moor when I was on my knees. So just get one inch lift on that thing. And then that rubber,

the rubber pipe gets a little wobbly. It doesn't take much. Oh gosh. Giving away all the secrets. The, I don't need them anymore. You're, you're, you're, you're handing in your goalie union card right now. Hey, Devin, great stuff, man. Thanks for joining us. We'll do this again. Okay. Absolutely Absolutely thanks guys. Devin Duneck former National Hockey League goaltender doing a great job covering the NHL too as well. Aiden Hill did that last night no no it wasn't last night. Yes I know. There was a national

referendum when Matt Murray did it. I'm telling you. There was a national referendum. It happens a hundred times. It happens every night in the league and it. Well, he did it a bunch of times on purpose. Yeah, but that happens every night in the league. And it's like, Toronto guy did it. National referendum. I can't remember when they brought in the rule for shooting the puck over the glass. Yeah, yeah. People were appalled.

It's crazy. Yeah. And then it became just a part of it. It's normalized. Why can't we normalize that if the net comes off and you have no other person to blame but yourself, you're getting a two minute penalty? Yeah, no, I'm with you.

Totally, totally agree. Hey, there's black and white. Even if it's an accident, like, well, hey, buddy, if no one else touched you, you knocked it off. You've practiced in this thing since you're seven. Yeah. It hasn't moved. It's the same size.

It's the same size know it hasn't moved. It's the same size. It's the same size, it hasn't moved. You know the distance between two posts, you know where it is, you knock it off, you're gonna end up paddling. Totally good with it, honestly. I have no problem with that. By the way, I don't remember people shooting the puck over the glass to get a rest before they changed the rule,

but anyway. I did. I remember a few people. I mean, it happened, but not like with any regularity. And now it's the only way you can get a power plant over time. I know. As long as we're going on this pet peeve thing.

Okay, one more, one more, one more. Okay, why is it more important in your own zone and it's not in the neutral zone or in the offensive zone? If we're gonna keep, if we're asking you to keep the puck, no, you're a skilled player. offensive zone if we're gonna keep for asking and keep the puck I know the You're a skilled player. You shoot it over the glass. You're a moron Okay, they're trying to catch guys who do it on purpose, which no one does anymore Just take away guessing who does it on purpose or not and just say you shoot it over the glass into the crowd

You kill the play we don't like that. You're a pro. You're a pro. How do you shoot it in the neutral zone or in the offensive zone over the glass? Penalty. All the way around penalty. First draw was good, second one,

I don't think that's passing the game. All right, I tried. Okay, it's game time. Resulted by Bet365. Visit the app Flutistod to find out why it's ever ordinary. At Bet365, that's 15 plus, Ontario only. please play responsibly. So two great games on the ice tonight We're gonna talk about the first one tonight with Aaron Ward coming up after the break Carolina in Washington looking for a two nothing series lead on the road

huge faves again minus 170 tonight the Carolina Hurricanes Washington Capitals plus 145 second best team the league all year you have to think that if they're gonna get one on this like this is a Big one for them. So I don't hate the Washington Capitals tonight at plus 145 I like that bet to plus money on them for sure Oilers in Vegas Looking to take a big two-nothing lead on the road against the Golden Knights. They are underdogs as well tonight plus 110 I can see that imagine

they'd be underdogs tonight. Vegas looking for a big bounce back, minus 130. But the thing I really wanna talk about is tomorrow night. The Leafs again, Friday night. This to me is crazy. The Florida Panthers tomorrow night are minus 240 favorites on home ice snooker.

The Toronto Maple Leafs are plus 195 on as a road huge road underdog I like I understand that the the the Panthers will likely win that game Lorda push come but that I mean that is a Disrespectful number to the trauma police it is if I would never bet on the Leafs and that no never But it's a good number if you would so do your like What do you call those? Edge Happiness happiness edge. No, I want you to put a thousand dollars Would you pay a thousand dollars right now for the Leafs to go up three nothing? No

Cuz I'm it's it's okay. I don't need to pay that yet. We'll see what happens after we'll see what that thinks. They're okay We caught him he thinks they're gonna win us he does now. He thinks they're gonna win the series. We caught him. He thinks they're gonna win? Yes, he does now think they're gonna win. Oh no, this is gonna hurt. They're all in five in series where they go down to nothing, boys. I told you, training wheels. It's like eighth grade heartbreak coming. He's got the training wheels off.

Anyways. Put them back on. I just thought that's a crazy number. So I'm gonna try to text Chief and text him the picture of that line and see this is what they think of you, buddy. Yeah, Chief feel like that. We just keep playing. Chief be like, who is this? I of you buddy. Yeah, Chief, you feel like that, we just keep playing. He's like, Chief is like, who is this?

I don't care. Anyways, that was Game Time Presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the songs and find out when it's ever ordinary at Bet365, it's 19 plus, Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Okay, let's take a break here. And when we return, Aaron Ward, Stanley Cup champion with the Carolina Hurricanes, who the and when we return Aaron Ward,

Stanley Cup champion with the Carolina Hurricanes, who, by the way, had ranted and didn't keep them. No problem at all. No problem at all for Carolina. They keep rolling. Aaron Ward next to discuss when we return to real kipper and born. Hey,

it's a list for a fire and I'm just in comfort. Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. It's the Fan Pre Game, 6 p.m. weekdays on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590 The Fan, and wherever you get your podcasts. [♪ music playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M theme song playing. A&M Welcome back to the real Kipper and born show this hour of real Kipper and born brought to you by bet 365. Let's get him going. He's been on the show before I love having him on Aaron Ward Stanley Cup champion, Carolina Hurricanes, the team that once had ranting in but unlike Colorado doesn't really miss him right now. It's nice.

Hey, it's you know, everybody left them for dead. Randans gone, give up your hopes. And they get Stankhoven who walks in and completely fits in this mold. I mean, you got now guys under five foot seven and Blake and, and Jarvis and now Stankhoven who seemed to play like they're six foot two. And it's amazing that they, I think everybody overestimated Jersey as a team. And I think now, Fitzgerald coming out and talking about how disappointing it is for them to be where they are out of the playoffs. You're gonna have to refit and retool.

It's not gonna be the same team. But I think you gotta give credit to Carolina that they just stopped them. They just absolutely stopped them and they handled them well. And some things in light of the playoffs starting for them came to the roast of the playoffs starting for them came to the, that rose to the top and they are highly effective right now. It's funny, everyone kind of looks at Stankoven,

goes, such a Carolina Hurricanes player, he's whatever, but you look at the Canes, I mean, Martinook, Stahl, Jankowski, Carrier, like Slavenburne's big on the back and they've got their share of big guys too, Wardo. So yes, but they're all capable no matter the size to play the style that Roddy imposes on his team. And when I mean impose, they play that style. It's the most annoying style to play against.

It's the identity of this team and come playoff time, it runs you down. Absolutely takes you to the shed. And after a while, decor wise and what you saw, what happened with Washington the other night, actually, I came with some stats for you. My boss, who's actually a Toronto Maple Leaf fan, Curtis Harvey, at SMT, former UOT hockey player, passed these along to give you an indication of just how bad game one was for Washington and why I think Carolina's gonna win in five.

Ooh, so, well, yeah, yeah, let's hear it. Let them know. Carolina led the National Hockey League over the course of the year in regular season, average time in the offensive zone at 46.1%. Their best game all year was against Toronto recently in April at 52.7%.

In the game against Washington, 53.7%. Conversely, here's Washington for you, a team who's built on offense, always not going and doing a ton if he's not getting himself planted in the offensive zone. Washington, lowest regular season game offensive zone time was 30.6% against your Carolina Hurricanes in December. Last game, 27.9%.

So what that tells you is WASH is just aching to get out of their own end. So Carolina, the style they play, what they saw against Montreal, Montreal tried to play a Washington-style game in the first part of the series and realized that you're not going to transition through against Washington. They're gonna poke the puck off your stick. If you start to create chaos You start to get Shikran not thinking about going forward and has to stay in the cell in his own You're gonna have better results. So now Caroline and style they play we talked about that

Lob it out, right? the pucks never in the offensive zone for Washington very often because burns all these guys are just put in the offensive zone and as a defenseman if I'm looking up and I'm Having to try and locate this this pop fly I start to retreat I'm not winning all those pucks and they're so adept usually one or two in the National Hockey League in ozone battles one the way the playoff series is going for Carolina it's starting to play out right and the fear if you're Carolina and I said it for five six years now I hate the goaltending here it sucked for forever forever like you can't it's lipstick on a pig every year. You got a really good team

You got a ton of skill you got really young guys, but you keep looking behind you I was not shocked when Freddie pulled himself in New Jersey because that's kind of it's not a rip But it's kind of his MO But if he's sustainable in this series against the Logan Thompson, who I think if you see how Carolina played that game Halfway through the game wash already had 24 block shots. That was not part of their design to play the Carolina Hurricanes They're playing in their own end the whole time. So this could be an interesting and quick series So wardo basically where you're telling me this is where the analytics department really kicks in for Carolina and they're like We don't need a star goalie.

We don't need to pay a guy eight million bucks. We just need Freddie to. Don't put words in my mouth. They need a star goalie. Honestly, the thing I would love to change about this organization is please, God, go find someone to play. Well, not now.

It's too late now. I know. You can't do anything about it now. So they're so reliant on the decor being like concrete pair one to pair three. They play the same style. They're going to block the puck. But it's the soccer mantra. If the ball's not in your end of the half and it's all the way down there, likely here

you're going to get scored on is very unlikely. And that's how Carolina plays a hockey game. If you get in the offensive zone or you're always contesting the exit in the offensive zone or contesting in the neutral zone, they're never in your end. And I mean the new stat for Carolina which is amazing is they haven't been scored on the playoffs on power play. So couple that with that's where OB gets his meal ticket. It's looking decent. So the Carolina Hurricanes, I mean, we're talking about the Toronto Maple Leafs

in the first hour, this is the first time they've led in the second round of a playoff series, two nothing since 1987. The Canes do this every year. Does it feel like not a big deal for this team to be where they're at? I think that they have enough experience and a different makeup.

Like you talked about Karrion, you talked about some of the guys that are playing for this team that have come in and added pieces that they sorely lack. They always have a big back end, but upfront. If you think about some of the storylines of this series alone,

Svetlana Kov has to exercise some demons. The last time Lit played in this series, he got knocked out and was face down because he challenged his hero to a fight. Didn't bode well for him. And I would tell you that that's a deflating moment in that series for the entirety of the group. So Spech now always got a scoring record

and he now has the opportunity to change the storylines for the Carolina Hurricanes in their favor. Overall, Orloff was formerly in Wash and now he's in Carolina. He knows his team extremely well. I feel like this is an old Southeast division battle. Seeing each other so much, you can close your eyes and imagine exactly what each team is going to do next. So Carolina right now, I think, is comfortable in the idea that they're going to push the

pace so it looks like Washington's playing with the running shoes on and Carolina has the skates on. Sveshnikov can be an X factor here. Like I watch this guy Orto and I'm like, you should be not ranting in, but maybe a very lower, you know, poor man's version of a ranting in. He can do things others

can't do physically with speed and with some hands here. So what's keeping him ultimately from going to the next level? I think the style, but if you're happy with the style and you look at team success, then you'll fit you'll fit this this locker room. I think you have to place yourself in an area where you're putting your ego aside and realizing that eventually your ego will get fed when your team's success occurs. And that's the problem with playing the Roddy style and why Rantman's in Dallas. Rantman doesn't want to go bangin in the corners to win it. He wants to transition across, use his body, cut to the net, make it great to play and score score a goal He's willing to battle it out in that front

But to play that style for 60 minutes and be expected to if you're not the two guys below the goal line You gotta be reloading high because your defenseman's gonna paint me a pinching Those are things you have to get adjusted to and it takes time and it's not always fun playing that stuff Is that what happened to ranting in it was just not a Was it a style issue here because there were some nights I'm watching and he's playing 17 minutes. Oh yeah, well here's the other thing is you gotta wrap your brain around.

Carolina is either your town or it's not. You're either in that stage of your life where you're like a low key, you wanna kinda go under the radar sometimes, you're still really embraced by the fan base or you wanna be in a Dallas where it's a bigger city and the entertainment's better, the restaurants are different you know all these things it depends on where you are in life and what you want for yourself

and your family yeah it's it's funny how that shook out they ended up with Stankhoven and was it two firsts and there's not not Jankowski I mean that kid I mean that kid is a Roddy Brynner more dream right now he's He's playing lower level minutes in a role that sorely needed to be filled in this team. And he fits well with, I mean, whoever you put him with, Kerry and Martin, whatever, you can interchange all six pieces on the lower end and feel like you're still going to put up a competitive group on the back end that won't be dominated by someone's one-two. Just they won't.

They're highly responsible. For Cenkowski right now, he's that, like, someone's one-two. Just they won't. They're highly responsible. For Cenk Kelsky right now, he's that, he's a battle winner. He's got a little grit to his game, but all of a sudden he emerges and he's scoring goals in a way that he wasn't expecting because that wasn't his role in Dallas. Is he a game time decision?

I hate to tell you this, but Carolina basically excommunicated me from any information in my past job. I stuck my nose in places where it shouldn't be. And then it basically told me to take a hike. I'm not in the in crowd. You'd call it. Is he available? I mean, how big of trouble can I get you in with that question? They know if I'm calling now, it's not for information. I'm trying to snuggle for tickets. I'm retired I can't afford those ticket prices anymore I need

the loan. Don't come to Toronto. No I know I heard. So do you look at this Canes team and and kind of think of your own Canes team at all that maybe none of the or fewer of the top end elite guys in the league but play a team system, team structure, good defense sort of thing. Can it happen almost 20 years later? I hate to tell you, I'm going to go back to 2002. So we met Toronto and there's a juggernaut in Toronto. I mean, let's be honest, you guys were looking at, you guys were already deciding between it was at Colorado or it was at Detroit. And we snuck in there and we just played a consistent style of game that we found would counter what Toronto was able to do. And we just kept it close.

And we knew, here's the mentality, which I think is also the same mentality here. They're going to try and keep it close so that when it comes down to the trying times, they've already run down the defencemen in the last 10 minutes of the third period. You get to overtime, everybody's exhausted because this team is so well conditioned. I'd even say by comparison to probably 90% of other teams around the National Hockey League because that's what Roddy has made the identity of this team. They know the later they get into the game, the better off they are. And that was what we did in 2002. We just kept things close and hope for the best. And this is what that team reminds me of. Boy, I can't wait for that conference final between Toronto and Carolina,

where we're going to have them on every day. I can't wait for a state proclamation in North Carolina. If you're coming into our town in blue and white, you cannot buy a ticket. And the funny part is, so many people stay over from Nortel that live here in Raleigh, that they're already here. They have addresses. So here's your key. If you're in Toronto, you want tickets here, find your buddy who came here in like 1995 with Nortel still has an address, they'll sell you tickets.

Hey, you don't think Toronto can get through Florida for real, do you? I honestly do at this point. Oh, yeah. Listen, game one for me was an anomaly. I feel like Florida had nothing that you could build off of from that game that you would say, hey, listen, going into game two, we did this well. Nothing. So game three, truth, better.

They weren't as abysmal, but Toronto looked like they put the boots to them. So now here's the big question. Is the mentality in Florida like, hey, this is the ebb and flow of a series and everybody should carry home ice. You're trying to get to game seven to just get that last chance to To work the to work the odds that you'll win one there, right? So Florida has to hold serve Let's be honest. I don't think Toronto plays particularly well in Florida. So that's one thing I also know that there's a storyline yesterday that our boy Maurice and sale Iran don't exactly get along historically

So that Rodriguez call might come Really? Oh Saint Laurent don't exactly get along historically so that Rodriguez call might come creeping up. Oh really? Oh you don't know about that. No I didn't know that was a thing. There's a storyline there that there wasn't Moe fines significantly for interaction with from Saint Laurent. All I know is Moe was asked after the game what he thought of the embellishment call or whatever. Yeah he said nothing or you know. Nothing because because historically coaches are cheap and they don't want to pay out money for fines.

All right. Love to get your quick thought on what Edmonton showed everybody going up against Vegas. That one's like puzzling to me. I thought Vegas, I thought Edmonton was going to be left for dead, that they were lucky to get through this. I felt like Vegas was going to come with something different and they were pedestrian in how they played. And it's like Edmonton played with them in a level of emotion in spite of whatever you're putting back there in net, they seem to overcome it. And so my constant criticism about Edmonton for the last three years is like,

got to get a goalie. Same story I say about Carolina. Then I look at their decor and like, you know, you get so many warts in the back end that come playoff time, they'll be exposed. I don't know how they're doing it. But I mean, you wake the slumbering Dry Cytl and McDavid and all the guys that who have had the past experience of getting to game seven. There's like an emotional investment understanding where we talk about the tangibility of having gone to the playoffs and experience. Montreal needed to learn it and Edmonton got it last year and they know that they're never quite out. So how they came back in this game is a testimony to having been on that

journey and you're never out of the playoffs. What happened with Winnipeg and St. Louis? Edmonton is another team that they're never going to just give up and lay down at any stage of the playoffs. They've been there, they understand it, and they've done that. Buddy, great stuff, man. Enjoy the game and we're going to catch up to you real soon, okay? Good luck getting in there. Just to be legit, I actually went out and bought a mic for the show, but... Buddy, you look and sound amazing. I work for an IT company. I'm gonna have to have someone come teach me how to set it up.

I want to talk about the camera. You have auto focus, it's zooming. Do you have a person who works in your house? What is happening? No, hey, Apple. Shout out to Apple if they want to sponsor me, I have an M2 and it's a pretty advanced system. No, I can, I can even, I can make like, if I do this, I think bubbles come across this time and balloons pop up all kinds of stuff. I can make it confetti. What a world. What a world, man. You just, you're going to have to start hanging jerseys like us. Hey, start begging for jerseys.

It's worked for us a little bit on our show. I love it. Okay. Wardo. Thanks again. Hey, listen, I can afford free if anybody can afford free. Stanley Cup champion Aaron Ward. Thanks, Wardo.

Thanks guys. All right. I went back and I did some digging on Maurice versus S, and he put him he buried him. So hold on I just want to say that the comment he actually said there asked did the ref talk to you to explain the initial Embellishment call and he said no he didn't this is from January 19th 2023 on scouting the refs comm which is a good good scouting a good ref web resource. Yeah

He said I'll just read the quote here. I'm proud of her guys here tonight They flew us out to the west coast flew us back flew us home flew us up here and back to back and they throw those And they threw those two guys at us. We hung in there pretty good. I'm proud of this group And he said yeah, basically there'll be penalties you like and It wasn't it wasn't Florida Panther friendly. He went on and won. He was he buried him. Yeah, he was very It was like vintage mad Paul Maurice going out to the refs. So There you go. Maybe there's something listen. It's got to be impossible To not have personal vendettas as a referee.

I don't know how you do it. Every coach at some point presumably has told you to stuff it. Speaking of that, when they brought out West McCauley to be a Lionsman last night, I almost fainted. It's like, we're really bringing him into this. He takes the mic over, offside. Red team.

Cupid for offside. Before we leave, Joel Quenville hired as head coach of Anaheim it's been almost what three and a half years? Long time. Long time here. Thoughts? You know the league made him eligible right? They I don't know how long ago they said he was eligible to be rehired to be a coach in the NHL. Once the league says okay you know we can quibble with a lot of that he was eligible to be rehired to be a coach in the NHL. Once the league says, okay, you know, we can quibble with a lot of different people in the league. Some people don't love that, you know, Bowman's a GM.

Some people don't love that, you know, Ovi or other Russian players who support Putin can play. It's a lot of league with a lot of people. They found an owner willing to do it. Well, when you look at a coach like tonight in Carberry, everybody's looking for the next Carberry. And there's others out there that have tried that have failed miserably. For Anaheim to go to Joel Quenville here. And not, you know, I think it

speaks more of all you more on more on some of these newer type of coaches that are coming in and not having very great success. I think just speaks volumes to having to go back to a guy like Joel who has won before and can judge character and do all of that. And, you know, some of these newer coaches and some some are good But there's a lot of guys that are Too busy trying to reinvent coach it's it's kind of like it's a long time off though, can't then they come in

They get their chance and they fail miserably That's why you go to Joel Crenville right now Yeah, I don't know long time to be out of a job and come back things change. We'll see we'll see Alright, just like that two hours fastest two hours in hockey and we've solved nothing We're back tomorrow. Hey, you Doug McLean on off the rails Friday. Excited with the OHL championships for us tonight? Thanks to Aaron Ward. Have a great night, everybody.