Real Kyper & Bourne - Coaching the Start of the Season with Bruce Cassidy

Episode Date: October 5, 2026

Former NHL head coach Bruce Cassidy (8:07) joins Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne to chat about the start of the 2026-27 season, what he would instill on a team during the first few games, the fans booing Dylan Larkin during the Detroit Red Wings' home opener, coaching top prospects, where he'd put Gavin McKenna on the lineup to start his NHL career, development vs. winning games, and the definition of an 'optional skate'. Then, Nick, Justin and Sam McKee wrap up the show discussing Simon Edvinsson's trade request, Leo Carlsson's offer sheet, Brad Marchand's early injury return to make his Florida Panthers' debut, and the Calgary Flames placing Connor Zary on waivers. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliate. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's the National Hour on The Real Kipper and Born show. We were live on SportsNet, Sportsnet 590, The Fan, streaming always on Sportsnet Plus and YouTube, where we always appreciate a thumbs up. I just look at your face and I go... It's been a tough record this year. Don't forget to change the dirt. Where's your mind?

I was... I got my computer exploded today. Yeah, you're just... I was talking to our boy Neil Houston about coming over to install a program. My computer I needed was in the break. Doing IT stuff. I was letting our YouTube change. Chat, know that Bruce Cassie's coming up for the break

because our host forgot to mention that. A good teammate could have handled that for you. I had a lot going on on to the break. I'll change it right now. Just add dog ate my homework. It's just, oh, my God. Worst, worst excuse guy.

It's kind of a nice ceremony to start the second hour. This hour of real Kipperman Bourne brought to by Bet365. Even Bet365 is taking bets on whether Sandy will change the jersey. That's a legitimate great thing to try some lots of. I can see that. As our Sammy said, in a few minutes, we'll welcome in Bruce Cassidy, former NHL coach, who's now doing some TV work. We'll get his thoughts on a lot of things around the National Hockey League,

including what a lot of people are weighing in now are these no trade, no move clauses. And I think it started with Gary Bettman. I think he was on the, Marquesie. Yeah, he was on the fan hockey. He's shown. Yep. And it really kind of started this conversation on what to do with it.

Well, the conversation was all the agents being like, how about this stuff. And the PA's weighed in now, too, as well. Haynes, he's pissed. Ron Haynes. Yeah, yeah. I got a quote here from him if I could read it. It's a player's right to negotiate salary, salary structure, as well as a no move or no trade with their club. They're able to do so in bargain in good faith.

It's pretty simple. If you've negotiated no trade, whether it's 10 teams, 15 or 32, the club isn't able to trade you to those teams without your consent. Our position is that the clauses are acting the way they were intended to work. Yeah, well said, man. I disagree with them, but well said. The only thing I could say is the waiver wire was never intended to use it as a loop to get a guy off their roster.

But have we seen that happen? I know Doug and Burkey cooked up something. back in the day. It was, yes. You know where we, where we heard about it was in Tampa Bay with Ryan McDonough. He was. Oh,

the threat was a way. There was a waiver threat there. There was a waiver threat there. I remember you brought that one up and Yarmah was pissed. You got, you brought that one up. Yeah. It got a little hot there.

Yeah, that's okay. Yeah, it's all right. That's okay. We get in trouble sometimes. Who? Who's to blame, really, on that? Who said it first? Yeah.

Okay. All right. But it's always the threat is out there if they could use it. And if they felt like it was a player that they could move off of, right? So it's like you have a no trade clause. Your contract's bad. We're going to put you on waivers and no one's going to claim you. No, no, no.

Somebody's going to claim you. But it won't be a team of your choice. You're going to go to one of the worst teams because that's the way the waiver wire works. Right. The worst team in the league gets to claim you first. Right. or you wave and will help you get somewhere a little better. So do you want to control, have somewhat control of your situation,

or you just want to take a chance that the worst team is going to claim you? Connor Zari on waivers today. Zeri, probably the Canadian way to say it. What's going on? Good Saskatoon boy right there. Like, I like Zari, man. I know. Okay.

Vancouver fights hard their first start to the season. I love that we're bringing up the NHL the Conor Azari before the guy who has the all-time goals record who announced this abuse last season at the end. Well, we're bringing things up in order of me being interested in the... I mean, it's own brand for us. We've never exactly been the biggest OV show, I don't think. But he did announce today.

People are mad that we're not an OV show. Yeah, I shouldn't say people. I don't care. I'm sorry, they're what? Well, you know, we don't give OV enough flowers. it's just very controversial. Very controversial. Yeah.

Right? And it's like, okay, like people are going to, it is that 50-50. 50% are going to hate you for bringing it up. Yeah. And then 50 are going to say that you don't talk enough about them. But it is,

I will say this, that if you knew, if you knew you're going to retire in just one year, couldn't you have left that Putin commercial just to wait a year? Yeah. And then knock your socks off. Go do as many commercials as you want with them. It's just going into your last year,

it would have been nice if you could just let that wait a year. Sure. Can I ask? It's always been the priority for him. Why did he announce his two games into this? Is he like, holy crap, this is fast? I'm good. Like, this is my last year?

Like, weird that it came on October 5th after they've played two. games. And he, like, announced it to the team, too. Like, he did, like, a speech to the team that he's going to be... He's like, I'm done. Too fast. Yeah.

Anyways. Anyways, I guess that's why we're... I mean, not going to disparage the man's hockey career by any stretch, but... We're talking about two different things. I might not be a fan. Right? Yeah. And, I don't know.

It's just... I've loved watching him shoot the puck. Everybody has... Shoots it like crazy. Still can. And people put together the highlight package of him when he was just a cannonball of a man out there. Like he was a hurricane on the ice.

The goal on his back? Yeah. Was that his rookie year, second year? I think so, where he rolled on his back. Yeah. That's not even, like, that's a great goal,

but I actually don't think it's his best goal. The goal he scored against the Habs where he came into the neutral zone. The back behind his back around Roman Hammerlick, if I do remember correctly. And then came in and as he was falling, chipped it over Carrey Price's pad is probably the best one he's ever scored. The one over is, it's all luck.

No. Yeah, it's all luck. No. The puck land a day. I will do it. That's ridiculous. I don't think it's his greatest goal. He knows the curve and angle of his stick.

I don't think it's the greatest school. I don't. Okay. Anyway, way to go, Ovi, last year. I'm sure he'll get a tremendous send-off in some places and booed another. I saw, oh, sorry, I just saw a wish Greg Wichinsky talking about it with his, with the ticket prices for the last game. And, like, they were already high. I think he said it was like five minutes after the mountain.

Is the last game of the year against the penguins? Yes. Oh, that's nuts. Last game of his career, I'll be against the Panigmas. But then like 15 minutes after the announcement had gone up, like a nosebleed was over a grand. Like it's going to be a huge event. So there you go.

Vancouver Canucks. They were supposed to be in Calgary's position of just getting their lunches fed to start the season. That hasn't happened. No, they've been very competitive. You know, I think what teams who want to tank miss is that you only need to be a few players light and you're in trouble. You're going to lose a lot of hockey games in a very good league.

like Calgary may have overdone it here. They are bare bones, baby, and they are minus 13 in gold differential to start. It's not going to be this bad. But, yeah, Vancouver still has Petterson and Horanick and Besser and some guys who can make a difference in the league. So good to see them come out of the gates and play and be competitive. But, you know, two and two is, it's going to be hard for Calgary's my point.

Okay, let's go to Bruce Cassidy, former NHL coach, who is now doing a lot of things, including desk work for TNT. I don't know. Bruce, in five or ten years, could you regret that going on the panel with a guy like biz? I have a good time.

Those guys are funny. They're good guys. Get to talk a little hockey, have a few laughs. Just your overall thoughts, what you've seen in the first week, Bruce, and how maybe training camp, a short one that we've,

never seen before. I always mentioned in our day what a training camp looked like and it was like God Almighty, will this ever end? Yeah, well this one, I mean they've negotiated down to, you know, not much left in terms of days

to work, right? So I think the teams with new coaches will probably struggle a little in the end, you know, trying to get their systems down. You only probably had a few days to teach. Power plays have looked a little bit you know, unorganized at times. The five-on-five scoring seems to be up a lot,

so it tells me checking habits aren't where they need to be right now. So, you know, those are fairly normal things early in the year. I think everyone's healthy, got lots of jump, you know, the legs are there. So, you know, goalies are going to have to be ready to go. Bruce, how much stock, you know, usually coaches are more mature than players in media about the importance of wins and losses in the early season. Oh, we're one and two or we're three and oh, How do you feel about the early season and how crucial it is right now?

Like I'm looking at the Red Wing start. It feels like a pretty uphill climb and they're only 0 and 2. You know, is it crucial to get off to that good start? Or is it just another couple of games in the season? I think for most teams it is. We always pride ourselves in that, get going out of camp. I just think, you know, if it's the opposite, right, it's just such an uphill climb all year if you're battling, you know, from behind.

I think if you're a veteran team, you'll probably find your way eventually. but the teams that are kind of bubble teams, as you put in Detroit, I mean, I think it's early. You know, Larkin hasn't played. Evanston's not there. So I don't know how that's all going to play out, but those are two good players for them. But then, yes, those bubble teams have to be careful.

And then you get the negative noise around your team too, right? If you start slow, that's the other thing. And, you know, an older team again can handle that, you know, they don't panic. I like the Rangers start. You know, last year they couldn't score at home when they started. And this year they seem to have got a little bit of that behind them. So there's an example of a team that's, we weren't sure what they'd have. They're doing well.

So, you know, good on them. It's a little easier to go to the rink every day earlier in the year when, you know, you're stacking some wins. You covered that game, Rangers and the Red Wings. How surprised were you at the reaction, you know, from everything from chanting, we sell the team to the booze for Dillon Larkin being in. introduced. Yeah, I mean, they're the fan base there is restless for obvious reasons. I think it's 10 years now without the playoffs, an original 16th team that had a lot of success. So I get that. Yeah, you know, we were talking about on the panel. I didn't like sort of the booing and I didn't know why Larkin necessarily had to be in that position. He's going to play soon enough. So fans can, you know, sort of, you know, voice her opinion that way. But then you find out after he wanted to be out there. So I felt bad for him. You hate to see that happen. He's a captain of their team. He's a 30 goals. score. He's a good player. Now I know he has to deal with the consequences of asking out,

but it's still, you know, I just don't like to see players treated that way, but again, the fans, I guess they pay their money, right? They can do what they can. The team did look especially sharp that night. They had some jump after late in the first period, early second, because it was their first game, but, you know, they weren't on top of their game yet. And, you know, That's one again, like a team that has expectations to get in, and then they're going to have to get their game in order in a hurry, especially in that Atlantic division. That's a bit of a beast there,

so you don't want to fall too far behind there. Yeah, Bruce, how has it been watching this for you? You've been behind a bench for so many years, behind great teams almost exclusively this whole time. Are you enjoying a little time off or does it feel strange? Well, it's the first training camp I haven't gone to in 45 years, you know, as a player or coach. So it's kind of strange.

You know, you go away at 16 to make a junior team. But I'll tell you what, I've been doing some advisor work for Hockey Canada, the women's team. And so we've met as a staff, you know, five or six times over the phone in Montreal, and they're going to have a training camp this week in Quebec. So you're getting a taste of it. You're watching video. You're talking hockey. You're planning practices.

I mean, I'll be like an eye in the sky just helping the coaches. So, you know, you're not right in it. But you feel like you are because you're in and all the meetings and all the discussions. So I thought that was a good thing to keep. busy and it's a little different animal you know probably learn you know different styles of coaching when you're dealing with the women so i'm looking forward to that some great people on the staff so uh that part of it has sort of caught me up a little bit in terms of you know getting back to work this time of year um i did play golf today which is odd for me in october

in new england i know i'm still in cape cod we have our summer house here so that that part of it's always a head scratcher but um and all that you know might as well enjoy I've gotten to see my son play hockey 16 years old, and by this time of the year, I would have never got to see him. So he plays lots of weekends in the Massachusetts areas in a school in Connecticut. So that's good.

You get to be a little more of a hockey dad, and I missed a lot of that. You're watching and listening to Bruce Cassidy, former NHL coach, Washington, Boston, Vegas, 470 wins, perhaps awaiting a new job, maybe in 20 games, 30 games. What's the cutoff here?

team starts not thinking that they're going to win the Stanley Cup like they do in training camp, Bruce. Yeah, you know, it's kind of, it's a tough part of the business. Like every coach in the league, those are my colleagues, right? And a lot of them are good friends and you kind of sort of saying, well, is one of them going to fail? You know, that's how you usually get your chance to get back on the Ferris wheel, so to speak. But that's the way it goes. That's our business. So, you know, you keep an eye on certain teams.

You're a fan now, watching games. And eventually, right? Like, it happens every year. It's inevitable come, you know, December or Thanksgiving, around that time that the chatter starts. And so we'll see where it goes, you know. You know, hopefully there's an opportunity somewhere down the road. That's what I'm hoping for. But again, that's kind of wait-and-see kind of thing right now.

Odds are pretty good, Bruce. Well, I want to get your thoughts on young superstars in the league. So Gavin McKenna makes the Toronto Maple Leafs this year. He's 18-year-old. We've discussed he's a lighter player. But further to that, there's guys like, Lafrenier and Shane Wright that are slower to kind of find their footing in the league. How you handle those guys as the coach, what the best, is it better to give them great linemates

and sort of in those opportunities so they can thrive? Or is it better off to keep them lower down the lineup and make them earn their way up? How do you feel about it philosophically? Well, I think you always want to make them earn it, right? That's the message that should be around your locker room. You know, the guys, that's what, you know, they want. And some guys are ready, some aren't. Like Celebrini, he was ready, you know.

You never know. He just came in and I'll use hockey our Olympic team. Like, we didn't know if he'd play the first game. And all of a sudden, you know, you're a game or two in. He's playing with the top guys. So he just took the ball and ran with it. So I think it's situational for those guys. I think that maybe the Martones of the world that are bigger bodies

will probably have an easier time adjusting to the physicality, you know, the lighter guys. Although I watched that game pro the other night for the Rangers, he was excellent. He got inside, he attacked inside, he was strong on puck. So maybe the little taste he had at the end of the last year probably helped him. So McKenna doesn't have that luxury. I think you want to put him in if he's a skill guy with skill players,

I don't see the purpose of putting an 19-year-old with two kind of, you know, more forechecking, you know, sort of that type of game. I don't see how that is putting him in a, you know, in a position to have success. So it's certainly like a skill where. I don't know. Can he handle top pair D every night? You know, most young guys can't, so you've got to be careful with that. But, you know, that sort of shakes itself out.

I think it'll take 10, 15, 20 games, and then you'll have a better idea. If it's sustainable, the guys that are off to good starts, or is a guy slowly catching up and going to be able to handle it, the more reps he gets? Bruce, do you have any names or examples over your coaching career where you had someone like that, that everybody's telling you, this guy's going to be great and you find yourself

in a predicament where okay but it's just not today well Charlie McAvoy had his young guy he came in in the playoffs actually turned pro sign with Boston he's down in Providence for a couple days and we got all these injuries

and he came in and he just ran with it you could tell he could play but Charlie's a you know he's a bigger body guy Pasternak I had is 1819 you could see he spent half a year in the minors and he comes up and you can see he's going to see he's going to he's going to impact the game. He just wasn't quite ready then. Now he's, you know,

he's a man now. He's strong. But at the time, you had to sort of let him kind of learn a little bit. If you're willing to do that. And I think, you know, the league is more like that now. It used to be, you know, Kipper years ago, you know, if you weren't ready to play, you didn't play, right? It was pretty simple. Now with salary cap, some teams need those entry level deals. You have to, you know, sort of let the player develop on the fly. And I think that's newness to the league a little bit because of the cap. And maybe where teams are at. Some of the younger teams might say,

well, we're going to let this guy play because we don't care if we miss the playoffs. You know, we're not there yet. So there's a little bit of that involved now, you know, back when there's 16, 21 teams, you know, I think it was harder for those younger guys to find their way right away. And you just see more of it now for those reasons. Bruce, does it get challenging sometimes? And I don't know if it's more or less now than it was 10 years ago or 20 years ago, between maybe upper management,

having a bigger picture of development, and then a coach saying, that's great, I got to win tonight, okay? I'm only thinking about the two points right now. And he's not fitting in. So we got an issue. Right. It still exists.

There's no doubt coaches or having those discussions with their GMs because you're right. That's what we're paid for. We're paid to win, right? That's what, you know, if we don't, you know, we're probably out the door at some point. So, but being aligned with your GM, I think, matters.

So you have to respect their opinion. And now you got not only a GM, you haven't, you know, three assistant GMs. You have a player personnel. You have a director of, you know, whatever. So there's a lot more voices. Yeah, this guy. Owners have voices now more than ever. Well, you have to listen to those ones.

Yeah, for sure. I think you're an idiot if you don't. Anyway, that's my opinion. But, like, you know, you got development guys that have seen them. And, you know, I think he's read. and, you know, they're not in the fire, you know. So as a coach, you got to balance that. That's just the way it is.

And Jim and Toronto's going to have to do that with McKenna. You know, he probably at some point we'll have those conversations. Maybe they already have a plan. I mean, sometimes you have a plan going in, hey, he's going to stay unless he really can't help it. We're going to, you know, grade him on 10 game increments. And we're going to, you know, manage, like what they did with the kid in Anaheim, Carlson, a couple years ago. I kind of like what they did. They managed his game load so that he could still get stronger as the season went on in the gym.

And I think they knew where they were as a team. And I thought it really helped them. I think the kids, if he's not already stud, he's going to be. And so I kind of like their, I think they had him on a 50 game, whatever it was. I know that he wasn't playing every night. I don't think that's a bad way to go depending on where you're, you know, kind of where your team is. You know, this is actually perfect for me to get the chance to ask an NHL coach. What is an optional practice?

Is it optional for everybody? It is on my team. I tell the young guys, I don't care if you're, you've played, you know, whatever, your first season or your 20th, optional means optional. So make a decision, you know, just, you know, be mindful if you don't go out that the guys that tend to take their option or prepared at 7 o'clock at night at puck drop. So, you know, that would be my message to the younger guys. If you feel like your body needs a rest

and make sure you're prepared to go tonight because you haven't, you know, got your touches in the morning or touch the ice. And some other times, they're told. Like I will tell guys, hey, you played eight minutes and 37 seconds last night. It's not enough. It's not optional. I'm not picking on it.

You just need, you can't lose your conditioning. And when you play, you know, you didn't play much because of penalties or whatever the case last night. So, you know, you got to go out. and get your work. And I think they respect that. So it's not really optional. Well, unless you're told it isn't. Unless you're told.

You hardly practice anymore anyway. It's so with all the games and the travel, I mean, it's really limited. It's tough to, I tell you what, it's tough to fix your game in the middle of the year through practice. It's just, it's just hard. Did you like it? Did you like morning skates? And as a coach, is it more just another opportunity? to sort out a few things with specialty teams,

power play, penalty killing or line rushes? Like, what did you like or didn't like about it? Powerplay, for sure. We did a power play every morning. And if we went out for a morning. Did you go out, Bruce? Were you on the ice? Oh, he's a quarterback, power play quarterback specials.

I didn't run it. Like John Stevens and Joe Sacko in Boston. but I was out there pretty much 95% of the time. So I did like to, you know, I coach the power play. So I had some input at the end of practice. You know, six or eight minutes on the power play. What are we going to see tonight? These are options.

We still want to do what we do. But this is what they're going to try to take away from, you know, watching the pre-scout. So let's, you know, let's try to run these plays. So I think it was important for that. Otherwise, I didn't even pay attention, like the first 10 minutes, you know. The only time I'd notice anything, it was a goal that was getting completely lit up. And, I mean, guys are, she and. it up from the hash mark so I don't know how they don't get completely lit up but I'd say wow he didn't

stop anything I'm like what's going on I actually I actually asked you as a player if you like them during your career there weren't a lot of optionals you know with Mike Keenan you were out there you were working and Darrell Sutter I had a little bit in Chicago I didn't mind them I was young I didn't play a ton so I was at least getting out on the ice in the morning get some you know and I think a couple of years we went in track suits. Remember those days you're in track suits? Imagine now the players in track suits with the puck's zipping around. Like, you know, so I, you know, I could take them or leave them.

If the coach said, you got to go out. Okay, we go out. All right. Well, you know, if not, you know, I don't need to go out. So I was kind of indifferent, I guess. How much patience did you have in the early going with line combinations? Like, I know you go into a year with a plan, but, you know, it's like, all right, we want to give this five games.

Do you ever get away from that plan? How do you deal with patience in the early going? I was a mixer anyway, so I knew that I'd try to look at, you know, let's say Mitch Marner comes in, right? He's a new player. We're going to look at him with Jack. We're going to look at him with Hurtle. We're going to look at him with, you know, you had a plan.

I thought, okay, maybe he lands with Carlson and Howden, but, you know, Carlson gets hurt. So now, you know, now he's playing center because, you know, two other guys are hurt. So, I mean, you have patience, but you have patience. you also, you know, play the hand you're dealt. So I mixed up lines a lot early on, unless I had a line, like the Bergeron, like I knew they'd end up together, Marshawn and pasta. They just, it worked. So eventually you land on those.

But I think, you know, I was a guy that tried to look at a lot of different combinations early, sort of see what you got and then kind of, you know, solidify stuff, I guess, as they went. And I worked in pairs. I always tried to find a center with a winger that mixed and then say, okay, try it. Maybe shuffle them that. maybe not a whole new combination, just a new winger, you know, move some wingers around. And that's how we found out Barbashev was a good fit with Ikel, you know, really good on the walls, got the puck to him, who's coming underneath with speed, went to the net well.

So, you know, sometimes shuffling around helps. Other times, I'm guessing players probably get annoyed at it, you know, a little bit if you do it too much. You know, so there's, you know, kind of pluses and minuses there. Bruce, great stuff, man. really appreciate your time. If you get sick of biz, you know where to find us. All right. Thanks, Bruce.

Appreciate it. All right. Thanks, fellas. Have a great day. Head coach, Bruce Cassidy. And probably if any team falters. Future coach of your. If any team falters, he'd be right at the top of the list.

I would think so. I was having to look through Twitter, like, searched his name as you do. I do before a lot of guests, see people are saying, just kind of like, and literally there must have been, I want to say, in the. the 100 to 200 replies of fans being like, well, Bruce Cassidy's out there. Bruce Cassidy's like, you know, the devil's, those are their first, well, Bruce Cassidy's.

Like, he's, I got to tell you, listen to him, boys, and I've seen that guy behind the bench for a lot of big games over the last, you know, however many years. Yeah, he knows how to do it. God, I don't wish he was in Toronto. Oh. I do. I do. I'm not against Hiller, but I think he's a really

good coach, boys. There's something to be said about, like, certain coaches and style and intensity. where you're not sure the longevity, but you're pretty sure that they're going to squeeze whatever they can out in the first few years. And I put Bruce in that category, that there's a trend or consistency with certain coaches

that like to challenge their players, that there is a shelf life. And so far, he kind of fits into that. There is, for sure. But like one thing you know about him coming is, you know what he is, right? Oh, yeah. And I look at the coaches who do have some longevity.

John Cooper, I don't know how long Maurice has been there, but Rod Brindamore. Bednar. Bednar. These are pretty demanding guys, too. And maybe they're different in whatever that gives them a bit more longevity. They all have Stanley Cups, too. But they all have demanding. They all hit it, though.

Yeah. They hit the cop. Right? Bruce hit it. Yeah. I know. That's what I'm telling you. Like, he was in Boston for seven years.

That's not like that's a short tenure. I do think. that like you have to, players have to know that you are inflexible in some ways. And that makes them not love you, but it also makes you effective because they know there's a standard. But once you win that cup, it's a recipe that has keen to improve. I think he's coached every team in the league by now. I know. So there's always that.

Yeah. But without it, it's a challenge to find your next job without the cup and try to be that type of guy. And to your point, the first year, lighten a fire under them, they win the cup in the first year with Vegas, right? His first year coaching there, like, that's when they're at their best. And where we go. Yeah. Game time? Game time.

All right, boys. Is our first one? No, we did last week? We did on Friday. Oh, we did. Yeah, we did on Friday. Good. It's game time.

Preserve by Bet 365. Home of the three goal, early payout, an official partner of the NHL must be 19 plus. Ontario and Alberta only. Please play responsibly. four games on the ice tonight and debut of Monday Night Hockey tonight on SportsSept Plus. Ottawa in Boston, taking on the Bruins. Ottawa looked pretty good in the third period against the Leafs on Saturday night.

They are minus 115 against the Bruins in Boston, and the Jets are in Pittsburgh to take on the Penguins, also on SportsSep Plus. Jets plus 150 in that game, minus 180 for the penguins. Big number. for me. Don't mind the Jets in that spot. Flyers in Tampa tonight to take on the Tampa Bay Lightning,

big underdogs, as you would imagine, plus 180. And later on, the San Jose Sharks are in Dallas, take on the stars. They had an early 0-2 start. Stars are 0-2, yeah. Bruce, you still there? Oh, geez. Listen, every team that has a bad start, that's going to be

the conversation. He's one of the better coaches in the league. Dallas doesn't have much time to mess around in that division either, do they? And they don't. They really don't. It's a very, very good division and uh pittsburgh like i said hosting the winnipeg jets give me a nick robertson anytime goal at plus 290 to continue the former leaf pain listen if you bet on him every game all year you probably win 40 times you see i just saw highlights i didn't see the game of wall standing on his head against somebody like highlight reel save after highlight real save i'm like oh my god

this is just going to be all year isn't it so give me a give me a nick robertson goal anytime tonight Plus 290 on Monday night hockey against the Jets. That was game time presented by Bet365, home of the three-goal, early payout, an official partner of the NHL must be 19 plus. Ontario and Alberta only. Please play responsibly. Alberta, what's up?

All right, quick break. Yeah. You're talking about Edmond after the break? Yeah, Elliot had a little bit of an update on Saturday night hockey. Barkoff conversation. Marchy. A little bit more Zari talk. It's not looking good.

for Barkoff. What do you mean? 10 to 12 weeks? That's what I saw. All right. Okay. We'll catch up on that and more when we return to Real Kippenborn. Hey, it's Ben Ennis.

And I'm Brent Cunning. We got you covered on all things, Leifes, Raptors, and Blue Jays. Every weekday morning, 6 to 9. It's the fan morning show. Sportsnet 590 The Fan and wherever you get your podcast. Welcome back in studio. Nick Kippreos, Justin Boren, Samuel McKee. This hour of Real Kipperm, Boren, brought to you by Bet, Bet,

365. Can you think of an organization that has had a worse off-season and start than the Detroit Red Wings? No, think about it. No, I did. Wow, the way we talked. The way we talked in our first hour would be the least. I mean, absolutely not. Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong.

And what's sad is your 10 years removed from the play. playoffs, you're supposed to be doing the other direction thing right now. I love this tweet from Helene St. James. I sent it to his on the group channel Friday night. Red Wing season opener less than six minutes old. Already down 1-0 to the Rangers, outshot 6-0

on second penalty kill. Dylan Larkin booed during introductions, fans' chance sell the team during the break. But other than that. So, yeah, stepped on a reek, every time they turned around. Kyle Dubas voice, well, everything's great. If you happen to just be joining our show now, why?

Where have you been? Correct. And give a download to our Bruce Cassidy chat because he was really good. He was really good. One thing he did say is he didn't agree with actually putting Dylan Larkin in a position to be introduced there. And I'm with him. I disagree with you both. I am so with him.

People are going to do it. You have to give them the opportunity to or it's faster. It gets worse. in your opener at home. Don't soil it. Push it away. You want to boo? Boo in the third game, the fourth game, the fifth game.

Not my opener. Where everybody's feeling good. I got 22 other players. I got a coaching staff. I've got the pride. You only get one chance at opening your season at home. All you did is you took Dylan Larkin and you threw him in there and it ruined everything. It set a bad tone.

And by the way, he said, well, Dylan really wanted it. Oh, okay. Oh, okay. Yeah, let's get Dylan what he wants. When do you get to dictate that you want to be in the introductions? The argument here is that people have that lurking, looming over them anyway. No problem. Just not in my opener.

You make a compelling case. Oh, no. Like, you've kind of flipped me, I think, Kip. Like, I... Not my opener. Yeah. Openers are special. Yeah.

There was nothing special. special there right now. Fans are mad. Fans are, that was representative being mad. Hey, here's the beauty. But you're talking about being Russia and putting up some storefront that's not real. I mean, it's just. Here's the beauty is it's also a timing

thing, right? It's the only it's fresh. It's at the top of their list. Going to game three, game four and now, you know, Edvinson News and your power play stinks and it kind of gets lost and everything else.

It's in the crap sandwich It's in the complete Crap bowl A salad bowl It's a sesame seed on the crap sandwich I would say if there were a judge here right now Ding ding ding yeah you're right Yeah

You know that's there's short memories And they're like oh yeah Dylan Larkin let's boo them Yeah But not right off the top So you know what Yeah to start the season off Be like this is the kicker

I think the flip side argument is It's a bigger story if you don't put them out there. That's kind of how I feel. You let these things fester and build and they get worse and bigger, but I think you could do it a game in, two games in. I can see Kip's point on that. So then the lettuce on the craft sandwiches, Friege went on headline that said that Evanston wants out.

That's devastating. Just devastating. Okay, so you're not going to pay me what I think I deserve. I guess you want to get traded. Yeah. I'll go somewhere where they will pay me to be. Yeah. What I am?

I am so pro player for all of my career. Here we go. Kippy League office coming in hot here? I am just so sick and tired of some of these players feeling like, ooh, Carlson got this and this guy got this and this guy got this. I'm going to get this too. Oh, what? What? That's exactly what he should do?

That's exactly what his value is. You can do it. But if Detroit thinks they're going to suck anyways, they stay home all year. I mean, that is a big, what were they, one point out of playoffs last year? I'm just telling you. They don't think they're going to suck anyways.

I don't know what they're thinking of. But if you're not going to buy in to this big push because of Carlson and now all these contracts, so most siders, contract now. Sorry, but I'm sorry that I have to make five more million dollars than you're suggesting they lost five yards on first down so they should punt on second down. I'm saying it's only a matter of time before a team goes, screw that.

Yes, I agree. I'm not paying you. And I don't know. I don't know. I don't know if it's happening in Detroit, but I get a sense that it is. I mean, I totally could see that happening. and I agree that teams are within their rights. If someone doesn't want to sign for the number you're offering,

I see how that all works. But if you're Detroit and you're appointed out of playoffs last year and you're trying to sell fans, you're turning things around, and we've got a new GM coming at some point, you've got to just pay him what he's worth on market value. I think some teams are not going to be able to do that. We're going to start hearing about self internal caps. Yeah.

And I just think at some point we're going to see a team go, you know, I'm not buying that. And if you want to, Sammy, you want to go back to your Toronto Maple Leafs, where would the Leafs have been if they told Willie Nealander way back then? We're not going to pay that and you may sit out all season long. What would have been the domino effect of that? I mean, we don't know. We don't know. I agree that it would have been better in retrospect, for sure.

But we don't know. But teams are going to start going enough already. Look what Detroit's doing to the perception of their organization. If what you're saying is true, why would I ever want to play for the team that's too cheap to pay players? Why would I pay a ticket to go see that? Right. You guys aren't willing to invest in our product. I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong, but I'm just saying that I think that's what's going to start to happen here.

Well, sure. It's gotten out of hand. Like I know Tristan Lunoz off to an awesome start and he's going to be a great player. None of that is relevant here. He kind of had like a sick weekend. Yeah, yeah. I was like, oh, my God. He was awesome.

And you just killed him in your article. I did. Me too. I killed the contract because it's exactly what you're talking about doing. You didn't have to pay him that. But at the same token, you got Booiam, you got Byram. You just got to bet on the right horse. That's all.

You do. And so if you're Edvenson, it's real silly to not be like, how am I not that? I think they worry about it. His contract embarrassing Cider as the best defenseman or the best. Mm-hmm. I don't know. I don't know. Yesterday's price is not today's price.

Yesterday's price is not today's price. I understand that logic. Like most siders your best player, right? Is your best player on that team probably? He might be the best team man in the league. He's really good. He's really good. And he's signed for $8 million.

And what's Ebbott's going to get? More than that. 12, 11? He could say 15. I don't know. You're right. We don't know. But it is a weird sort of awkward thing

to have a guy that's the heart and soul of your team that makes $8 million signed until 2031 at that contract and bring in his... You got to give Siderson credit for recognizing that things have changed. Like, if you're Edmondson talking to Moe, it's just kind of like... I guess they're all rich or whatever, but I don't know how that doesn't create a little... Well, if I'm both side or I'm annoyed

or basically anyone who signed 18 months ago. He's probably more annoyed that he has to play with Ben Chirot and not Simon Everton. Right. But yeah, Detroit's in a dilly of a pay. pickle. Barkoff? Barkoff. So there's some stuff going around?

I don't know where 12 weeks came from, but... Saw it in the Miami Herald. I think Paul Maurice has gone on record saying, don't waste your money or don't bet your money on these reports. I think Paul Maurice is smart in that you just want to keep expectations low for a return. The longer we don't hear of anything, I think the news is. gets worse. Yeah.

Interesting. So you think he's saying that because it's worse than 10 to 12 weeks? I don't know. I don't know. I'm just saying my spider senses say, okay, you've had them for two days now, three days. You've done major tests. You got a pretty good idea of what you're dealing with. Yet the last official report that I've seen was we're still waiting on the doctors.

Knowing nothing, I would be willing to guess that this is, there's so much swelling, we're not sure if it needs surgery or not. We need this thing to calm down a little bit before we can decide if he needs to go under the knife or not. That's the best guess I have from seeing people with injuries. That's valid for sure. Since nobody else in the media does, it all raised the flag. A miracle of modern science that Brad Marshan recovers a month early, the second that Markov goes on LTIR?

What a miracle. It was all about load management. It wasn't that he wasn't ready. Paul Maurice said that he was going to be out through October into November. The second that he goes on LTIR. Oh, wow. He recovered. It's like.

They lied. Yeah. They lied. And they get away with it. If that happened here, every single guy. You want them suspended? Do you want them fined? I would love something like that.

How about an investigation into that greasy contract that they gave him? Or the one they gave Goudis that they're never going to pay the end. They get away with murder down there. just another thing where they're like, I'm sorry. It is. It's greasy. They get away with it. Nobody cares.

Nobody cares. Thank you, Paul. Thank you for telling Sammy. Nobody cares. I think people care. You know who cares? Hey, listen. Losers.

Listen, that's who cares. Okay. People who lose. Let me ask you a question, okay? Let's say in the Toronto Police Hour, okay, that the lease were, you know, John Tavares was going to be out to start the year. Jim Hiller comes out from, he's like, oh, you know what? I think he's going to be out until the start of November.

And then Austin Matthews hurts his knee and he's out for the year or whatever. And John Tavares comes back to next day and he's like, oh, he's better now. You're the first guy being like, wow, what's going on in Toronto? You can change your mind. Are you on? They could change their mind. LTIR. Are you on nothing?

Yeah, season ending is different than just LTIR. Gary's goons to be kicking down the door at 4. performance center, try to find out what's going on. Down in Florida, it's like, I go, just wear your flip-flops. Who cares? Do whatever you want? Different rules. They get to pay guys less because no tax. You need, like, a tinfoil hat to wear for these conversations. It just drives me nuts. They get away

with everything. And Marchand scored last night. Of course he did. With a 50 left to tie it up. That's a good point for Florida. Yeah. A couple good points. San Jose and Anaheim. Yeah. It's like a split. They're good. Scrapping. Do you think the Barkov thing?

I mean, obviously, I hope it's great news. You know, Sammy doesn't want to hear it, but I hope. Come on, did you see his reaction? That's all you need to see. You think I'm hoping that he got hurt? No. I'm saying that you're hoping that he's out as long as possible for your Leafs to make the playoffs. Barkov being hurt has no bearing, like, I don't think on that.

I think the Panthers will still be really good without him. They have enough good players. Yeah, they go over the cap, they do whatever they want. They've got enough good players. Sam killed me at the top of the show for suggesting. we discussed Conner's area being on waivers, but I would like to talk about it now if that would be deemed appropriate. Very.

25 years old. He's played parts of three seasons and been a 20-goal pace guy. You get a 14 or 15-goal season in 60 games as a first-round draft pick. Makes 3.75. Has fallen off in the perception of the team a little bit, and yeah, they flat-out waived him. What's up with that? Like they're rebuilding, he's younger, he's got, you know, he can play, he need players.

Who are they going to play instead of him? That don't make no sense. It's a salary dump. Yeah. Just don't like his money, they don't believe he's going to get there. No. I think there's probably some internal headbutting of what he wants and what they want to give him. But he's getting claimed.

He is getting claimed. $4 million? $3.75. Do you think it's a lock? One year left on? Just this year next. Like I said, he's always been a 20-page guy, but he gets hurt. I can see him getting claims for sure.

There's a shortage of talent guys out there. Totally. And we're seeing it on a nightly basis. And people finally have cap space. So it just feels like it's going to happen. You look at the waiver wire, which is last year's standings flipped. It's like Vancouver, Leafs, Rangers, Jets. There's options out there.

Jets could use them. Speaking of... I think they have 50 contrast, right? They don't have a spot. I think they're 49 according to cap wages, but I did see someone on... I saw 50 and I saw so I don't know. So I'm not sure where it is. Speaking of a shortage of talent out there,

there's a lot of people cooled off on expansion and... Because of that. And owners. Because they're like, there's not enough good players. Right? Is that not part of it? Yes. And also there's a lot of injuries in this game.

The ones that have them right now, are going, I can't afford to lose one good player now to expansion. You're just weakening me. Yeah. I think, you know, the puck knowers, which I like to include ourselves in somewhat, when you watch a game, you can see the difference when it gets weaker. I think if you're the NHL trying to appeal to the average fan,

worst players means there's more mistakes, means there's more opportunities and action, and it's not a worse thing for the product. I think it would be bad for the product. I do agree that it's gotten really thin. You thought the flames were bad. Yeah. Let's add two more flames.

Totally. Like it's just going to be teams full of no-name guys that just they're going to stink forever and they're just not enough good players to go around. So you got owners that will go, no, take the 60 or 70 million. Yeah. Or they'll go, please, let's not do this. I think there's more that would like the 60 or 70 million. You're probably right.

But it sounds like it's on the back burner for a little bit here, hey? Alex Ovechkin, we did that already. How about Hot for Hockey we didn't get into? They've canceled that. I guess we got into it a little bit. Did we? Or do that off air? So can you tell me who wrote you an email?

We got a letter to the editor from a writer. I didn't. What writer? One of the writers? A romance novel writer, yeah. Oh. Yeah. About the NHL stuff.

I wasn't prepared to do this, so I didn't necessarily read it fully yet. But she's a diehard listener. Now I feel guilty. I expect to do this on there. Like, is romance another word? for like, like, yeah. Is it? Like, like,

hubba, hubba. Yeah, like really, like hardcore hubba, hubba? Or like, you know, he gazed into my eyes. You know. It was supposed to be a one-night thing. Not again. Yeah. Like, I'm talking like real, like.

They turfed it, though. Like, they, they. Smut? I don't know how smuddy were talking, but they took it clean off Spotify. Like, it was supposed to be a year-long initiative. Whatever happened between the NHB. PLPA in the NHL, there was some disagreement on what having the players, you know, being able to use their name, image likeness.

Full investigation on this. On what happened? Yeah, a documentary would be fun. I can tell you, it's really short. Everyone's like, heated rivalry. Good. They're like, ooh, sex and hockey. Do it again.

I don't know. I don't know what to tell you, Kipp. I'm sorry, but that has officially been stricken from the record. It's gone. Yeah. Oh. We got tremendous. Listen.

We got a lot of drops now from that thing, though. Yeah, I don't know. Not how often that's me. The whole thing makes me go with tomato face. I got a little shy. Don't get shy on me now, Sammy. I know this may surprise people, but I do have a little shame and I get a little shy about certain things.

Not about calling out the Panthers BS, but about sex and hockey, you get a little bit, you know, hotter to the collar and it's a big sweater. So bold strategy. Too much in once. NHL players of the month Shisterkin goal and an assist Player of the month or whatever player of the week

Sorry good points Not bad McDavid nine points in three games to start the season Done too shabby I don't even know that You're buying into the Rangers What's that? Are you buying into the Rangers?

They have my attention Gabe Perrault Off to a good start as well Adam Fox is still kind of that dude I think he's got four or five assists out of the gates Correct me of them wrong but Shisterkin still good Shasturkin's still good Oh, he's a good

The Rangers Tomorrow boys deep in the valley for the first time Valley gets back After a lengthy contract Dispute Negotiation We were going to leave him on the sidelines But we decided at the end

He's too essential to the We're going to trade them but you know We decided to give him a long-term contract So who won grill time You know who won You won by one point in the final day But it was rigged It was rigged

Wow I don't try to buy it for a second. I think it's, we go again into this. I think we cut it off a week before the end of the season because Kip was up a point. I can't wait to talk to Valley. We need Valley bad on this show. All right.

What did you say? Monday night hockey exclusively exclusive on SportsNet Plus, right, Sammy? Yeah, Winnipeg and Pitt. Sends a bee. All right. Sends and the B. You know what? I'm really impressed with Shabbat Saturday, boys.

What a show. He's a stud. Captain-like performance. First time that the Leafs and Sends captains both scored an opening night since Alfie and Thundee. That's kind of cool. Now both work for me. Much to my chagrin.

Very weird. Alfie watch. Our thanks to Luke Fox and Bruce Cassidy. See you tomorrow.