Real Kyper & Bourne - Draft Day with Doug MacLean

Episode Date: June 28, 2024

It's the final Off-the-Rails Friday of the season! Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee discuss last night's NHL Awards, the Canucks abandoning efforts to re-sign Zadorov and his potential fit in Toronto. Former NHL president, GM & coach Doug MacLean (7:36) shares a front office's POV of draft night, the Lightning's impasse with Stamkos and why the Leafs should be careful on a potential Marner trade. Then, he weighs in on what to expect from the Leafs in free agency, the Flames' rebuild plan, Saros' extension and the Panthers' outlook with their myriad of expiring contracts. Later, they regroup with Sam McKee to discuss Kadri's future in Calgary and answer your questions on the text line!The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right here we go the very last off the rails friday on the real kipper and born show the 23 24 season good work team good work wow nick kiprios justin bourne sammy mckee derrick brandeo and jake the snake schultz in a few moments that will mean doug mclean will join us for one last kick at the can as well we have no money to pay him all season long but we did send him to vegas this weekend we did all we just found somebody else to pay for it. And he's there for other reasons. He is. So we can't wait to get to him.

But in the meantime, wherever you're watching, wherever you're listening, Sportsnet 590, The Fan, Sportsnet 650 in Vancouver, Sportsnet 960 in Calgary, and watching on 360 and Sportsnet Plus. Thanks for playing along. This hour of Real Kipper and Bourne is brought to you by Bet365. Friday means text as well. We will read your text. We promise. We're not

just saying it because it is off the rails Friday. In the meantime, before we wait on Doug, what'd you watch last night? I was going to ask you guys. Listen, we don't talk a lot before our show. I would just say I was going to ask you guys. Now, listen, we don't talk a lot before our show.

I will just say, I got the sense that none of us watched the NHL Awards last night. Listen, I love Sportsnet. Like I said, I love Rogers. Yes, big fans of Sportsnet. Did not consider turning it on. Didn't consider it. The thought never crossed

my mind. I came close and then I couldn't do it. It's just, I'm exhausted. From all the hockey. Yes. I just needed a break. Oh, so you watched the other really uplifting

event last night. I watched a little bit of that. The presidential debate. And that was just. Oh, that was just. More people that really, I'm not sure, wanted to be there. That's amazing. How did you do that?

So I didn't leave much. No. Maybe reruns last night. You guys text me and you saw that's a big hydrangea I got. It needs a lot of water. I had to water it all night. For the record, like, I used to vote on these awards. And then they, you know, when I left, they booted me out.

Sammy doesn't vote on them. You vote on them and you still didn't watch. That is really sad. It left my control. It's like after you hit the golf ball off the tee, you can't do anything once it's left. You just watch it go into the woods. Yeah, exactly. So I knew where it was headed. I actually voted for everyone who won, and I'm not just saying that.

Wow. Good job, Borny. I don't know if that's the goal, but I think we helped reach some consensus here, which is good. Well, all the guys you vote for get to be the winners. That feels like you did it right. Okay. You feel like you get to be validated, I think.

I think so. Did you catch a snippet on social media uh kucherov and uh how excited he was to be there boys i couldn't get through it i i got it sent to me by a bit i got it sent to me by at least no there's no way no way it's just him going like hey kucherov we're gonna do shtick this guy ruined the all-star thing by being a sour puss you think he's gonna be like i'll do shtick give me a break yeah you're right he was just like move it along and credit to the guy he tried but anyway i just couldn't even get through that clip great players deserving their awards good to see nathan mckinnon get one though i mean he's i thought deserved a couple by now so that's's wonderful. Quinn Hughes, 24 years old, gets a Norris.

Conor Bedard, preseason, was anointed the guy. He followed through. Not a ton of surprises. Barkov wins the Selkie. There's a big stunner as well. So, yeah. All right. And also, we got news of some names being brought out

in the Four Nations tournament as well. We did. Yes. You want to touch on those quickly? Let's Four Nations tournament as well. We did. Yes. You want to touch on those quickly? Let's leave that for the day. We'll leave that. We got, you know, we got Zdorov news. We got Stamkos news.

I mean, why didn't the NHL. So many players to talk about. Why didn't they just be like, it's July 28th. Let's put out these six players. Why do they do it in the middle of the busiest news week in the league? It's almost like they have everyone's attention right now. Is that right? If they put that out on July 28th,

I would literally debate that for a week. It's got to be Gary and Bill saying, get it out because I'm going on vacation on the 2nd. That's fair. But it is interesting hearing some of the GMs start to come out and talk about where they're at with their players. Zdorov, Vancouver basically said,

if you're not going to re-sign with us, you're not going to use us as leverage. They came out and said he's not coming back to Vancouver. Patrick Alvin on Nikita Zdorov. We did our best, but Nikita has decided to go elsewhere. What does Nikita want? He's an interesting cat. Five and a half, six.

Oh, I kind of meant in life. I do feel like He's an interesting cat. Five and a half, six. Oh, I kind of meant in life. I feel like, I do feel like he's an interesting. That is his life right now. Is that how much cash he gets? Yes. Five and a half, six. I would think that, yes. I'd give it to him.

I would. What would have been before the trade at four? His playoffs was really convincing, right? And he's got character and he's got some identity. Not afraid to call out the best player in the league. I do think of all the players in the league in all the markets, he and Toronto would be either a disaster or a match made in heaven. Like it would go terribly or wonderfully.

He can't keep his mouth shut and people ask questions here. Can I just quickly before we get to Doug, heading into this free agent Monday on Canada Day, I am a little bit concerned about the money that's going to be flying around here and some of Toronto's needs because they don't have a lot of players under contract they have a lot of cap space they have a guy who's willing and looking to spend little concerned about what's going to happen on monday i have to be honest if there's one thing dubas was good at boys it wasn't losing his mind on july 1st yeah and i'm a little concerned about tree if i'm being totally honest is that fair 100 fair kippy the shopping list is long he's got a

lot of money it's like letting your kid loose in bulk barn or something with a 20 sampling there's a sense that whatever money they have they're they're gonna use it towards the blue line so maybe that has a lot to do with bertuzzi and domi depending on who they get can they afford those guys here's the problem guys is that if you think you'll wait and you'll wait and you'll wait and you'll lose out, you may lose out and be held with not much at all. So it's a dangerous game for all general managers to say,

okay, I'm going to replace you with someone else for less, but maybe someone else for less went somewhere else and you're caught holding the bag i don't think fortuzzi earned any extra money right like in terms of his aav oh i'd go the opposite uh his season cost himself probably a half a million to a million dollars a year so like is if he's available at four and a half or something like that times five i mean i would be happy there maybe it's is that a reason is that's maybe a reason why they keep you keep hearing of that he's interested in staying here because it didn't go so well he wants to bump it up again i don't

know just keep hearing that okay we're gonna get into that a little bit of more as we welcome in doug mclean from las vegas on assignment for the real Kipper and born show, but paid by somebody else. How are you, man? Like you wrote a book, you wrote a book now, and now you're like going on speaking engagements all over the world.

What, what, what did we, what did we create for you from the real Kipper and born show? The book's been a killer. It's created way too many opportunities that I don't want, you know, because most of the opportunities don't involve getting paid. I find that relatable.

So the juice is you're a general manager, a president. You've coached. You've had all of that. You go to Vegas. All of this is going on right now. Your juice is flowing right now. It's like memory lane of the pressure. I did a presentation this morning in front of like 125 young people

that are paying to go to this conference uh hockey you know through sports management worldwide and they're keeners and and and my title was a day in the life of an nhl gm and how and of course the only question they ever want to know is how do you get to be an nhl gm and i try to tell them that I was coaching Junior B in Summerside and three years later I'm in the NHL. I don't know how you get there. You got to be lucky. Not helpful, Doug.

They're keeners and I got to say I really enjoyed it. There was a reception last night for all the participants and Darren Millard actually came with me to the function to the uh function because he wants to be a gm still and plus it was free it was free so you know so but but he doesn't drink so you know he's got a lot of free cokes but anyway we you know what these and and

you talk to kid after kid or adult after adult that want to get in the hockey business and it it's kind of fun it's kind of fun i know but if you were really if you were really truthful for them mac you'd tell them to run that's your best advice run you know it's funny i i talked to a couple of gms in the last few days and you know one that's leaving a job. And it's it's unbelievable, really. And you talk to I flew out here and I was with a couple of major junior coaches on the flight and talking about getting to the NHL. And, you know, most people want out there. They'd love to do something else.

This is bizarre. Have you talked to Ken Holland? Is ken one in or one out where's where's the truth on ken holland i actually i sent ken ken a note last night uh just congratulating him and he got back to me with a great you know what he said he got back to me he said hey mac i really appreciate the note you and i i he said i don't know if i've ever had more fun than the five years we worked together in detroit uh helping build the red wings to become a legitimate contender and uh you know he said i'm not sure what's what's going to take place he said it was time to move on and anyway we had a great chat and i I really appreciated hearing from him. And we've always been great friends, and we did.

When we were together in Detroit, I was assistant GM, and Ken was director of amateur scouting. And we traveled a ton together and had a ball. You know what Ken's like. He's just one of the good guys. I was just talking to Ricky Curran this morning, and we were talking about Kenny, what a what a great guy he was and a deal maker and you know he's had a legendary career so i don't know what he's going to do you know i'm sure he'll have every opportunity if he wants it um you know so

we'll see what happens but he's always been just a fabulous guy a couple of people have suggested to me maybe there might be some opportunities someone mentioned chicago to me maybe just bring in some experience in to to davidson uh could you see that i i i think that the the job like look ken likes florida he loves golf um c Cindy, his wife, is a great person. You know, I can see him enjoying life. And maybe like an advisory position would be the perfect thing for him. And seriously, who couldn't use Ken Holland as an advisor in the NHL? Any GM. Maybe you could sell him your place as a timeshare at Del Boca McLean down there in Florida.

I think he's got a place. So, you know, all the rich GMs have their own places. So the, you know, it's funny talking about getting in and getting those jobs. The one thing we know about hockey culture is that if you play it safe and do the safe things and get fired you can get another job if you take a big swing and get aggressive and do something weird and get and you lose you're fired you might be an outcast you might not get back in it's a very safe culture so how what's the fear like heading into draft night when everyone wants to make a big trade?

You know, how much is there hesitation? Just be, I look at the NBA, they're trading for first round picks for a guy. Is there not hockey culture where guys just don't want to make the big mistake? Look,

I, I made a big mistake at the draft. You know, when I drafted Brule instead of Kopitar and it was, it was bizarre. I mean Brule instead of Kopitar. And it was bizarre. I mean, Kopitar went 11th. I had the sixth pick. And not one person would have taken him before he was taken.

Not one. And I've been ripped for 10 years over that pick. I mean, it was a devastating move by me. And I was the guy responsible for it and i wrote about it extensively how we came about making the pick brulee was the eiserman the next eiserman you know and and everybody loved him and as berkey said nobody in their right mind would have taken copetara had a brulee in that draft well i've paid a huge price for that. And it's bizarre, but it's haunted me for 15 years. How crazy is that?

And I guess it was a big swing, but it really wasn't a big swing. He was as highly considered as anybody. So, yeah, and Kippy and I have laughed about it, but it cost me dearly, and the guys in Columbus still write about it like seriously, you know? So big swings are great, but you, you, you also have to be a little careful, you know, you have to be a little careful and the draft, you go ahead. No, go ahead.

Here's just the draft. The draft isn't like the, the, the, you can't compare the NHL draft to any other drafts, I don't think, because it's like the NBA are drafting guys to play tomorrow. The NFL are drafting guys to play tomorrow. The NHL is you're drafting guys with the hope that, you know, they're going to play in a year, two, three, four years, you know. So it's a different – it is a different setup.

And you know what the one thing I found out, if you took 10 teams and you compared their top 100, their own team list, the $3 million, the $2 to $3 million list that you pay to do that 100 men. If you took it and you compared 10 teams after the draft, how close the lists were, you'd be shocked how close the lists are. And we used to do that study. We'd look at how the draft went and compare it to our list. And it blew me away how close the lists were team to team to team. It's bizarre really mac what about the the the gm today compared to maybe uh in your era just in terms of going from being emotional when it comes to certain players and practical now and no better example than the tampa bay

lightning where to your point, you draft a guy, you hope he ends up with three, four, 15 years, Stanley cups, face of the franchise. Like I can't think of anybody more than Stephen Stamkos in Tampa. And yet it,

it appears that they're, they're trying to not pay market value. I'm not sure for a 40 year old or a 40 goal score, although he's probably, you know, in the back half of a great career. But at the same time, like if there was no salary cap, you know, he'd just be retiring as a Tampa Bay Lightning. But now we make it a whole Stamco situation?

No doubt, it's strictly money. It's strictly about the salary cap, and it's strictly about if we sign Stephen to a contract that he, you know, based on

history and based on loyalty and those sort of things, then we can't build a team. We can't build a team because they've overpaid other guys. They've overpaid some other guys. I've watched it all year and I was very nervous that if I would ever see him back in a Tampa Bay Lightning jersey. I was. I will not be surprised if something happens and he gets signed. But I've been skeptical about it all year. And loyalty, there used to be a time when you would do things like that

for veterans to let them end their career. It's hard now with the cap, especially when you're a contender. It really is tough. So loyalty is not where loyalty was. And I spent some time this morning talking to Ricky Kern, a longtime agent, who I did a lot of deals with. And we were talking about the way it is today and the way it was. I did Adam Foote as a free agent with Ricky.

We did the deal in 15 minutes. Today it would be – I mean, Stamkos has been going on for six months. as a free agent with Ricky, we did the, we did the deal in 15 minutes, you know, today it'd be, I mean, STEM codes has been going on for six months or two years. I am curious though, Doug, if you think it'll go back a little bit to the way that it was before, in terms of not everyone's spending to the cap,

the cap has been flat for so long. Every team's a cap team. I think it was like 25 teams were within a couple million of the cap at one point this year like do you think your owner in columbus is going to spend 100 million when it's 100 million cap you know what i i know we talked about it when the cap was coming in and uh i i said that everybody will beat at the cap because of the media pressure in your market. They won't tolerate it. When you're asking somebody to pay $250 for a ticket, they don't care. They want you building a winner and they want you going to the cap. And I knew the minute the cap

came in that we would be all at the cap eventually. Columbus had been at the cap for the last five, seven years. Like my first year in Columbus, our payroll was $17 million. We played Detroit eight times with a $77 million payroll. When I left Columbus, we were a $39 million payroll. You know, today they're 85 or 84, whatever the cap was, 83. It draws everybody because of extreme pressure

because of what you force people to pay for tickets. I don't think it'll change. I really don't. I got to ask you, the Mitch Marner situation here, I get the fact that it's a very difficult decision for the Toronto Maple Leafs to truly understand whether or not this guy's in the plans or out of the plans

or if you're going to trade him now, trade him later, try to re-sign him. But we've heard a million different versions of what's going on with Mitch Marner. Ultimately, is it because the Leafs can't make a decision or shouldn't make a decision, Mac, or should wait to make a decision? Everything kind of stems, it has to stem from up top,

does it not, to set the narrative or the tone? Are all these different stories coming out because the Leafs have yet to tip their hand one way or the other? Yeah, it really is. And I think at the end of the day, what you've got to do as a manager is, do you know how hard it is to find good players? Like, it's unbelievably difficult to find stars and 100-point guys and guys that make your team better

like i i compared to eiserman and you and i you guys have i've talked about stevie why for years when i was in detroit stevie couldn't win in the playoffs couldn't win stevie was a 50 goal score and we go into the playoffs and stevie couldn't do it himself and he didn't become the greatest captain one of the greatest captains till he was surrounded by the right people that gave him a chance to win at playoff time and then he excelled and he was a great leader you know marner is being blamed for the Leafs playoff woes. Give me a break. Okay, give me a break that he's being blamed for the Leafs woes.

He's never, they've never had a third line at playoff time. This year was the closest. They never really had a playoff goaltender that had a chance to win. They've never had a playoff defense that's good enough to win at play never had a playoff defense that's good enough to win a playoff time and mitch myrner's being blamed are you guys are you serious i know he's going to get paid a lot you know we even heard criticism mcdavid when's he going to win

when's he going to win they win when they get a supporting cast to help them win and that's the general manager's job to figure out how to get a supporting cast. Now, if you're going to pay four guys too much money, that's the only deal with Mitch Mariner. That's the only problem. The four guys are making too much money. And Mitch is taking the heat for it right now. Yeah, you thought he played well in the playoffs?

Just team around him wasn't great? You know what? I go back to Stevie. Why? No, Stevie. Why didn't play great all the time in the playoffs. Mitch didn't play well all the time in the playoffs, but it's not a one man deal, you know, to Chuck, to Chuck had like one goal in 16 games in the playoffs. They're going to run them out of florida and all of a sudden what happens he's got support yeah he's got big time support makes it he's a hell of a player yeah makes an absolutely massive difference so heading into the i tweeted i tweeted a couple of weeks ago be careful what you wish for with mitch marner unbelievably challenging deal to make unbelievable challenge to get return

you better be careful yeah and what i meant by you better be careful is maybe you better not trade him right and so because you'll be looking tree living could be looking tree tree living could be looking the rest of his career to find a player as good as mitch marner all right are we good calgary i'm done calgary what do you want from calgary just give us your thoughts on calgary in terms of uh retooling rebuilding manjapani goes for a second rounder markov's long gone lots of talk about Kadri. Yeah, they're going strictly with a rebuild. And, you know, it's got a chance to be really ugly. And I was talking to some Calgary fans this morning, and they're excited.

They're very excited about a rebuild because they know that the way they're not set up, they haven't got enough good players to turn it around. They've got to rebuild somehow. They're not retoolable, is what I'm saying, in my opinion. They're not retoolable. So it's going to be ugly. And Craig, who I happen to like, I don't know him as a GM, but I knew him as a player.

And he's got a big job. He's got a tough job. And that's what I'm just talking about. When you get good players, guys, you better be damn careful. I'm totally on that page. And I am a little bit worried about, you know, what the Leafs do next in terms of the cap space they have here. You know, Todd, Codry could, you know know end up back here tanaf's looking for

four or five years at his age you know zador off the same thing you know those are they're good players but doug you can't commit the the farm to them no you you can't and like i had a toronto fan send me a note last night doug we got to get zador off and t Tanev. And I said, yeah, if you get Zdorov and Tanev, you've got a much better blue line. There's no doubt about that. But what's the cost? What's the price? And what happens?

I said five years ago that when Dubas signed Brody, I said, it's a bad deal. I said, it's going to come back. You're going to be sorry the last couple of years of that deal. But that's the way the NHL is. There's not a GM that makes a deal but that's the way the nhl is there's not a gm that makes a deal that he's really happy with you either give too much term or too much money and you're never really happy with the deal i you know i'd be i'd be excited signed the deal

and i'm thinking uh i gave him too much and i gave him too much term god i hope you know and i wasn't worried about the cap then because we were such a low payroll team. Today, you can't make those mistakes or it can bury you. It can bury you. Did the play of Bobrovsky help a guy like UC Soros get a very nice, attractive extension in Nashville? I think, I don't know that it did because he's got a reputation of,

of being such a gamer and they love him there. He's a good goaltender. What did he get seven years or eight years? Seven, seven and a half times eight. That's all right. Sounds right. That's, that's a lot. That's, it's a lot of money i mean they drafted

his they drafted his replacement and unfortunately he's still at milwaukee the russian goalie i mean when the hell is i've watched him in the minors when the hell is this guy gonna get a chance i thought he was gonna be the next coming of broski there's talk that they want to keep him in the american hockey league next year like how many years what's it to keep him in the American Hockey League next year. Like how many years? What's it? His third year in the minors? Like seriously. The goalies, Mac. They take time.

Yeah, I know they do. I know. Look, you got to have them. But if you get caught paying too much for them, it can bury your franchise. It can bury you. It can bury you if you pay them. You know, how lucky are Florida? They won the cup

with brobroski at 10 million dollars no it hasn't happened before the fact that they were able to able to build a team and they were able to build a team for one year and now it's gonna be a tough summer you know but you know what it is the luck of making a forzland deal well i talked about him halfway through the year to you guys, and I said, this guy's making Eckblad a player, boys. But Eckblad became a much better player. I thought Eckblad was a horse in the playoffs. I really did.

He was injured. He was banged up. But he played with unbelievable character for me. Good time to trade him. And Forslund. And Montour. Yeah. I mean, look, to me,

he took a lot of criticism, the kid, and I thought he showed unbelievable character and grit and toughness when it really mattered. There's talk about moving Ekblad. He's got one year left, and if that's if they want to take another crack at maybe signing Montour because Ekblad's at seven

and a half. That'd what they're up against. That'd be a heck of a decision. What's he going to get in his next deal? Billy Zito did a heck of a job. And now because he did such a great job, he's up against it big time. And it'll be fun to watch how, you know, it's unfortunate. But, you know, that's the way it is in the cap area. You build and you go for it and then you've got to pay a price. The Leafs have never really gone for it.

They've never really made the bold moves. I want to see them make some bold moves. Bertuzzi and Domi aren't bold moves for me. I want to see some boldness. Yes. That's what Tree Living got to lose. He can go to work for Boston Pizza. He just gave away work for Boston Pizza. He can only.

He just gave away 30,000 pizzas. I mean, like Brad, this is the greatest opportunity. And I like Brad Tree Living. I really like him a lot. And I would like to see him. Go big or go home. Big time. Big time.

We'll see. Big time. We'll see big time we'll see you know you mentioned um rick kern he was my first agent and then i think three or i don't know five seven years ago i think you referred to me as a puke on uh he did yeah because i mentioned one of his dear clients uh in chicago perhaps you had moved out you were with Oil Can, was your agent. I was Harry Francis. He may have had the greasiest hair of any person I've ever met. Yes, I don't think you're too far off. I was scared he was going to touch my sport coat when I was talking to him.

You can't wash that out. Hey, I got a guy for you, Kiprio. You're not serious. He was one of the best. One of the best. He was a great guy. So let me ask you something, talking about agents, how influential are they? Just one minute.

What was his part-time job, Harry? He was a part-time agent. What did he work? He was a top fireman in the city. Exactly right. I loved him because of that. He put out a lot of grease fires. That explained it.

It was like standing next to a French fryer. So, hey, how influential are those agents? And, you know, there's a few that are my friends, but, Mac, they are very powerful people this time of year. Tell me the truth as to how Kachuk ended up in florida i don't know you tell me you're there you're the expert you're the guest total total setup by the agent total you know kid wanted to go to florida they wanted him in florida they made it happen they made it happen and and florida get win a stanley cup one of the reasons they won a Stanley Cup was the Calgary trade for Kachuk.

Nobody can tell me that. And nobody can tell me that it wasn't orchestrated by the agents. And good on them. Is there anyone in the NHL doing what Rich Paul is doing? Rich Paul is doing what? Is there anyone in the NHL doing what Rich Paul is doing? He just told everyone, don't draft Bronny James or he'll go play in Australia. Like he basically dictated where a player ends up.

Does anyone have that cachet as an agent in the NHL to dictate where players go? I would say no. I would say no. But I, but I, you know what? It's funny. I was talking to Rick Kern today and Ricky said, I told Scott Housen not to trade for carter i told him he wasn't going to report and they they gave up the eighth overall pick of the draft and a couple of things and they lost out on couturier because they they did the carter which rick was emphatic he is not reporting

not that he doesn't like compass but he's not reporting them he's not going to go there you know i never found they dictate it, but they used to like to give advice. I got more advice from Pat Morris and Donnie Meehan than

I got from Brian Murray. They were trying... Pat Morris' goal was to make me a great GM. So he told me. He made me a worse GM. You got your fired. That's what he did.

And I like them. They're all good people. So I take it you didn't take in the NHL awards last night, or were you in the front row? I thought you'd be handing one out. We didn't watch it the NHL awards last night or were you in the front row? I thought you'd be handing one out. We didn't watch it. Lady Bing. The last NHL award I went to when I was up for coach

of the year and I didn't get it. They gave it to Scotty Bowman ahead of me. Do you believe that? I'm sorry. I was runner up to Scotty Bowman and that's the last awards function I went to. You know why i went

because i was up for award and because my owner gave me his private jet to take to toronto to go other than that i wouldn't walk across the street to go to them okay one last one for me are we running out of time with mac yes listen i wrote a book on the draft and I don't even want to go to the draft today. I'm right across the street. You're going.

Oh yeah, of course. I'll be there. Okay, listen. See if anybody needs any consulting work. You know what? I got enough consulting just to try to survive. Okay, here's one last one for me. Somebody said to me today,

how lucky are you to be able to do that Born and Kiprio show every week? I said, Kip and Born, it's not Born and Kiprios. I said, you know what? I feel so fortunate to have this gig. It's one of the best jobs I've had in my career.

So if you weren't watching the NHL Awards and you were watching the presidential election, and one of the key parts last night was whether or not you could be. They're handicaps. Whether or not you could beat Biden. I couldn't beat, well, I couldn't beat either one of them because I've been in politics so long, it's a given they're going to cheat.

But I didn't watch the presidential debate because I was at the American Bar and Grill, downtown Vegas, just off the strip, enjoying talking to Darren Millard and 110 hockey fanatics. That's what I did last night instead of the debate. It sounds much better. It was so nice to relax and drink a dozen free beer.

And you're enjoying the heat? What is it, like 110? No, no, I was listening to the news this morning, and the weather girl was on, and before I did my presentation at 8 o'clock this morning, and I was listening to the girl. She said, it's going to be a high this afternoon of 108. Like 108?

It's manageable there. It's a dry heat. All right, stay cool. Stay cool as always. Hey, great. hey great thanks for having me on listen we haven't done um first and second team all-star awards on the real kipper and born show but you are a runaway favorite right now for uh second team he's whatever's ahead of first he's a zero you're right behindchek. Somebody said to me today after I finished my speech,

have you ever considered being a motivational speaker? A demotivational speaker? I said, I don't want a job. I don't want a job. Leave me alone. I'm trying to sell real estate, BEI, and I'm trying to enjoy life. But we do, as much as he's cynical, whatever, we do appreciate

how much time you gave us this year. You saved us on Fridays every week. We love having you on. Is this it? This is it. We're done. Are you serious? We're done with you. We're done Tuesday or Wednesday, I think. Our show is like like, over.

You know what? I just appreciate the opportunity that you guys have really gotten my name out there. I didn't grow your brand, Doug. Hey, let me tell you something. You really outgrow my brand. I'm dead serious right now. Just so you don't have to believe this. I got to tell you this.

Jill was in playing pickleball the other day. And Tillman Gallant from Summerside, who used to be a former school teacher, has a fish truck there. And he said to Jill, he said to Jill, no, he's not George's brother. He said to Jill, I can't. Is Doug coming in to watch you play pickleball? I never miss him on Real Kipper and Bourne. I just I just love it. So that's the that's that's what you guys are doing.

You're affecting people all across Canada and good on you guys. Well, listen, that explains the ratings bump on Friday. As I've said many times, I love your show. The only time I've watched your show is when I'm on. Well, that's when it's the best. You've caught the good parts. A bright future.

When I'm on. A bright future. That's what you have in this industry, Mac. Thanks for doing this, man. As always. Thanks all season.

Guys have a great summer. And really I'm on a serious note. I love coming on and having fun. I really, all right. Hey, keep that in mind. When I call you in September,

I'm retiring. Don't go south on us now all right not a bad way to end our uh no our off the rails friday with him there's some people that it's tough to hang the phone up on i tell you that was that was a seven minute goodbye that was at least long goodbye it was a long goodbye yeah he just pulls out another story there's nothing worse than the long goodbye when you're at a party or whatever. That's why I just... Coat, shoes.

I'm like, oh, I gotta run out to the car. You're at the door. See ya. Let's break. Plenty more still, including your text messages. And just one quick note, guys, before we go to break,

just our condolences to the loss of Sergey Berezin. When he turned pro, we were teammates with the Toronto Maple Leafs. We're all shocked and saddened to hear the loss, our condolences to his wife, his children. 10,000th goal in the Montreal Forum, if I'm not mistaken. The loss or condolences to his wife, his children. 10,000th goal in the Montreal Forum, if I'm not mistaken. Or no, as a Montreal Canadiens goal. He scored the 10,000th.

Really? Yeah. That's interesting. And there was one really good goal by Steve Thomas that is one of my favorite of all time. I heard that from multiple Leafs. Wasn't that great? He's coming down the left side. Stevie Thomas goes out to the right wing, fires it across, backhand tuck underneath the goalie.

ACC at that time goes wild. One of the first true loves of the Leafs for me was Bereson. I loved Bereson. I just know he was deadly in NHL 94. Oh, yeah. Very good. Another reason to love him. But I appreciate that.

Well said, Kip. Gone far too soon. More real Kipper and Bourne after the break. Diving deep into Leafs, Raptors, Jays, and NFL. The JD Bunk is podcast. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, Kipper, it's game time presented by bet 365 visit the app latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at bet 365 must be 19 plus ontario only

please play responsibly now i'm just uh looking through some of the non-game stuff here on Bet365. There's a bunch of draft stuff. So I am far from a Jason Bukala draft expert. I used to be really into this when the Leafs sucked. And it's like all that mattered was the draft and who you're going to get. But now the Leafs have been good for a while. I don't really pore over it a ton. But there's a lot of fun stuff here.

Like, you know, total Americans drafted in the first round, over four and a half. Total Canadians to be drafted in the first round, over 15 and a half. Defensemen drafted in the first round. Finish players in the first round. So if you're really into all this stuff, it's, you know, it's pretty cool. And it's a fun way to bet on it. It's a fun way to make the draft a little bit more electric than it's already going to be. Is it true that the USHL has kind of taken over the CHL

for producing or getting players drafted? I say this not to be snarky or anything, but we focus so intently on the NHL every day. I wouldn't know. Oh, I thought you would. I don't know why i would here's a guy that's like at a hole in one and then an eagle from 182 yards out why am i asking him that we call brooks and cosentino and those guys for real answers on the junior stuff

so and one of you sammy do you know what the number is of ushl players can i say something right now uh i'm a dyed-in-the-wool ohl man through and through chl guy for life they could never pass us so they can talk about it all they want but the greatest development league in the world is the ohl and they can say whatever they want about what they got going down there tribalistic statement about anything you're under-informed on. It makes sense. But hold on. They're having a tournament now.

There's been a little reporting that they're going to be doing it, that the top prospects, top American prospects from college hockey and the USHL are going to be playing against the top prospects from Canadian top prospects. That is my Super Bowl. I will say that's a big step for the USHL because when I played junior hockey, it was kind of a fledging league that wasn't on par and they've risen up. One day we're going to probably hear a team from the USHL

maybe playing for the Memorial Cup. I think so, yeah. That would be cool. I agree. I know the BCHL has incorporated some AJHL teams. Let's have a tier one North American championship. Kipper Cup. And the last thing I'll mention,

because this is still the only player they have on Bet365 for where he's going to sign, Stephen Stamkos, he was at minus 300, I think, yesterday, or minus 400. It's down to minus 120 to go back to the tampa bay lightning the predators have moved up to two to one detroit three to one and your toronto maple leaves that's seven to one so there was a real sense too that maybe stamp coast wasn't a steve Iserman guy in Tampa. And then Stamkos goes to another level, leads Stanley Cups to them.

And now you hear that Steve Iserman has interest in Stephen Stamkos to Detroit. It sounds like leverage to you? I just think that the player that Steve Eisman thought earlier in Tampa Bay ended up being not the player that Stamkos ended up being. And this is this warrior, this leader, this guy that could fight if he had to. To me, it's a huge sign of respect to Stephen Stamkos that Steve Eisman wants you potentially in Detroit.

His last three years are 40, 34, and 42 goals. Yep. And just 80 points. And a presence. Like a real alpha dog. Yeah. Let me just wrap up. That was Game Time presented by Bet365.

Visit the app for the latest odds to find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. So I got a quick, a few quick texts here. Do you want to do the Marner thing? No, no.

I just want to mention because obviously our show goes into Sportsnet 916 Calgary. That what I'm getting is that up until now, there has been no discussions on Naz Kadri asking for a trade or the Flames approaching Naz and saying, would you lift your no move? But you could see how Naz would be like, I'm coming to Calgary. You have players. We're going to compete. And all of a sudden, it's like, oh, this is not what I committed to. I think maybe down the road there might be some thought about where my intentions will be short and long term.

But as of now, there is no talk and no shopping of Naz Kadri this weekend. Okay. Okay. Good clarification. Quick one here. Andrew. Okay. Good clarification. A quick one here. Andrew Doucette, nine. With Bert willing, well, Bertuzzi willing to discuss terms,

he knows he can't ask for much. Would you lock him up now before free agency? What do you think Lee's position are? Are they waiting for first to see what the defense will cost them? So I guess are they waiting on Bertuzzi before, you know, they're going to sign defense first? What are they going to waiting on Bertuzzi before they're going to sign defense first? What are they going to do with Bertuzzi? You know, I think that makes some sense.

Kind of wait and see, you know, how much you got to spend, whether it be on Zdorov or Tanev. It feels like to me, Tanev is going to be a maple leaf until I'm told otherwise. So I do think it's a matter of they'd like to have him, but they just don't know how much they can offer him right now. But then if you're Burt, maybe you don't feel good being the second-class signing. I think they like Burt. I'm not sure they love him. Yeah.

I think I would agree with that. In saying that... I think there's potential for better with him. There's some talk that he really wants to stay, and that is probably music to brad tree living's ears that hey if you want to be a leaf then take less and it's his call on what he wants to do on that or how much i was more term he can get on on the open market yeah i was torn on this taking advantage of the toronto market thing you know, like the Panthers, they have Florida, right? People want to go to Florida.

They want to play there. They're going there in some cases for the weather or the taxes or whatever. Toronto has the fact a lot of guys are from here, and they should take advantage of it. But in the past, you've been a little, you haven't loved guys like Thornton and Marlowe and Giordano and guys coming here just because they want to be here. That's why they just want to be here.

They have good career contracts. Right. And so do you feel the same way about Tanev or Bertuzzi, guys who are kind of from around here and want to be here related to that? Well, listen, all the players that you just mentioned in the past. Or at the end. They were forwards. They were highly producing guys that couldn't do it anymore.

Yeah. And Tanev can still play the role that he plays, and that is being a true shutdown guy. So it's a different animal with Tanev. But I'm like everybody else. There's concerns about his age and his ability to stay healthy. That would be terrifying. Good player.

I mean, on a one-year deal, as my friend Petrilli mentioned, he's probably worth six and a half next year, but what is it after that? Who says no? Marner, Robertson, Yarncroft, third-round pick for fourth overall, Boakvist, Lane with 2.5 million, line A, 2.5 million retained,

live at the Sphere from Leafs Loyalist. I just can't do these trades. There's so many parts there. I know who says no. The Toronto Maple Leafs. Okay. No, Marner. How about no?

Marner says no. You think he's going to Columbus? Have you been watching that organization lately? That's a tough part. That's actually a good point. Marner is the one who says no. It's funny. It's not funny at all,

but when you're a bad team, it's tough to get players to go there. You need people to play with. Elliot threw something out today. I don't know if it was on 32 Thoughts or not, but that he expects a contract offer coming from the Leafs for Marner. I mean, we talked about it in the show. Feels like every day for the past 10 days.

It just seems to be, like I said earlier today in our show it's just everything seems to be all over the map what's the one thing you can't do is just let him leave you know which is probably the thing he wants to do the most so it's like if you can't trade him then this is like the next thing i just don't i don't see a world where he signs yeah i don't and especially now like these guys and i'll include dry sidle they they get to dictate more than just signing a contract they get to dictate like can i uh who's gonna be here great what uh what's the power play gonna look like what where you plan on using me like these guys great you should draft my son.

Squeeze every bit of leverage out of it. Oh, yeah. Get everything you want, and then you'll find happiness. I think this one's going to go a very long time. I know you do. You're going to walk them right to UFA. Great. You're going to say whatever.

Just for a heads up for everybody, Monday on July 1st, free agency's opening up. We're on for three full hours. Three! Borny's joining via remote the satellite hot stove from Kelowna for a bit of it. A cup of coffee on the desk.

Sometimes. I want a nice background. I want mountains. I want water. Yeah. I want to see the wind. I can provide these things. So tune in on Monday.

We're going to be here on the holiday 12 to 3. We're going to be here on the holiday, 12 to 3. We're going to be here talking about all the breaking news. Awesome. Awesome. Once again, our thanks to Doug McClain. And Kevin Barker. When are you going to come in on the Real Kimper and Boren show?

Never! Come on! Love it when you come in and teach me baseball. Have a great weekend everybody we're back on Monday three hours starting at noon eastern