Real Kyper & Bourne - Early-Season Goalie Questions with Steve Valiquette

Episode Date: October 15, 2024

MSG Rangers analyst Steve Valiquette joins Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne to share some early-season goalie takeaways (4:00). He dives into Linus Ullmark's surprise injury yesterday, Stuart Skinner's slow start, the Leafs' goaltending situation with Anthony Stolarz slotting in as the de facto number 1 and the Red Wings waiving Ville Husso. Nick & Justin regroup with Sam McKee to discuss Alex Ovechkin's move to right-wing, the Avalanche's concerning start and time running out on the Red Wings' rebuild.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's take it national on the real kipper and born show we are live on sports at 650 in vancouver sports at 960 in calgary this hour of real kipper and born is brought to you by bet 365 nick kipros justin born sammy mckee in a few minutes we'll welcome in steve aliquette analyst for the new york rangers on msg and and a great guest that we've always enjoyed having on the show because he just breaks it down a little differently on our program. And first and foremost, the view of the goaltender from his perspective is fascinating for me every time we have him on the show. Yeah, I always learn a lot.

And since it's a professed area of weakness for us, neither of us are goalies, fascinating for me every time we have him on the show yeah always learn uh learn a lot um and since it's a professed area of weakness for us neither of us are goalies good to have a true pro on the show to help us out uh you've got the oilers tonight right on sports yeah yeah i'm on with da and cosentino have a little pre-show talking oilers flyers oilers uh trying to stave off a fourth straight loss we got clearly it's like uh the cobwebs are gone now is it clear you tell me i don't know that that's clear um they started the season killing one of six uh penalties they took they gave up five goals on their first six penalty kills not sure if you remember last year in the postseason they killed 94.6 percent of penalties they lost cody cc uh

ryan mcleod fogel like a lot of their main killers so that is a genuine area of concern and then you know they they killed three off last game they're not going to be a 50% kill team, but it could be an area where they are worse than last year is the penalty kill. So something to keep an eye on tonight. Must win. No, it's not. It is a must win.

Are you kidding me? After three games? Are you being serious? It's a must win. Or what? How many times did we say that and look like idiots last year for them? Listen, I am an idiot. Must win. Must win. Or what? How many times did we say that and look like idiots last year for them? Listen, I am an idiot. Must win.

Must win. You go 0-4, everything is like knob blocks looking over his shoulder. Everyone's sour. Everyone's already sour. Must win. If you can't beat the Philadelphia Flyers tonight, you're in trouble. There is no less of a must win for an 0-3 team than this one. You guys are nuts.

You guys shouldn't do radio. The world is everything. They are clearly feeling it, though. Yes. Well, sure. It's not like they've lost 2-1 in overtime three times. But the goal differential at home. It's literally the worst.

Home games, minus 12. Is it the worst in the NHL?'s literally the worst. Home games, minus 12. Is it the worst in the NHL? By double. Second worst is minus six. Or that was the Avs until the Isles lit them up last night. Yeah. Must win. Avs and Oilers getting shellacked. Which I don't think anyone predicted.

Later on the show, do we have sound of Kale McCarr as well? We do. We do have that. I found, well, we'll save it, but I just found his comments absolutely fascinating last night after the game. Hard on himself, eh? Don't give it away. Okay. We'll get into

that with the news and notes. Maybe he wasn't. Stay tuned. Common theme amongst the abs and the Oilers is whether or not they're getting the saves also when they're supposed to. We'll have Steve Allocat join us in a few minutes. But as far as the Avs are concerned, like Gorgiev, patience may be running thin.

Think so? And then Justice Ananen. Justice. It's a great name. Did you see that goal last night? Like the diving poke check? What are you doing? Yeah, I don't know.

They're struggling. But I will say, you look at their back end, it's like the Oilers for me were the other. Yeah, hold on. We'll address that later. We have our guest. All right, Steve Allicat. What's going on, how are we i mentioned to these guys that we're going deep deep deep into the valley with steve aliquette

and they looked we're working on the segment in your valley they they cringed when they heard me say it uh thanks for joining us again uh as fascinating as anything that we've seen is the storylines around certain goaltenders and obviously here in toronto the joseph wall not feeling right to start the season and then we see all mark not play the other night in a crazy 8-7 final against the LA Kings and I think the term before the game was tightness which turned into maybe a strain afterwards but like what is your first thoughts when when either a goalie goes up to a team and says i'm not feeling right and then the team has really no choice do they not to go from there well you you can't say much when you're on the team side you have to take the player's opinion view position on that look guys i could

tell you i received at least six, seven, maybe even more starts because the other guy didn't want to play that particular game, whether the opponent was too difficult, a challenge that maybe the team felt was insurmountable, so throw me in. But there's reasons why certain nights guys aren't going. The Allmark thing, we touched on it the last time we spoke. it's fascinating because there are red flags everywhere but he's a Ferrari and you have to keep that in mind it's over the last two years he's the second highest performing goalie in expected goals he is a Ferrari but do you want a Ferrari if you've got a family of six you don't right it doesn? It doesn't always work. Here are the red flags. And I heard from

people in Boston, it took a long time for the room to accept him. He's different. It didn't work for him in Buffalo. And keep in mind, when he left Buffalo, he left in free agency and they let him walk. And there was a lot of noise around that. Why would you let somebody like that go? Back at the time, I remember seeing his numbers being, you know, reflecting that he was a lot of noise around that. Why would you let somebody like that go? Back at the time, I remember seeing his numbers being, you know, reflecting that he was a top 10 goalie in the NHL before he popped. Now, here's red flag, you know, because if you've got a really strong room in Boston and they were able to align him with the team's goals,

does Ottawa have a strong room likeoston had to be able to control this guy because he's going to have a lot of one day offs a lot of one game offs and those are tough for guys to swallow in the room when they're playing banged up and you guys know the only time you're ever really healthy is day one of the season day one of training camp and then you're always dealing with something so i wonder i think two things are going to happen. I think it's going to drive Travis Green nuts, and I think the media is going to end up eating him alive. And that's going to be because there's going to be

too many ghostly disappearances. And you can even go to the postseason. They're up 3-1 against Florida a couple years ago after winning 65 games, and they can't trust him for Game 7, so that's one. You can go to the last 10 years that he's played professional hockey, including the Swedish Elite League. He's never had a safe percentage in the postseason over 90, but he's an elite, elite talent. And you can see the rub there, the pull. You want to have him in your lineup, you love him,, man, is he going to be there to get us through?

And we haven't seen any evidence of that yet. That's fascinating. I mean, it's great for Ottawa fans. I feel like if he's good, if he's this Ferrari, then they're going to put up with having to cram the luggage into the back seat a little bit for the family of six. As long as he's good, they're going to make it work. But that is the important part, if he's's good can the other two be good enough between Forsberg

and Sogard is there enough to help him out and get them wins if he's only gonna play whatever 40 some times you know I'm gonna say yes because I can go back as far as three years ago I received a lot of calls that summer when Forsberg was going into UFA. And he was a top guy three years ago, before he really landed and stuck his game in Ottawa. And the thing about backup goalies, just remind yourself of this. If you get 25 points from your group of backups, whether it's two, three, or four guys, you should get in the postseason with a decent starter. And he's an elite starter that doesn't always want to play.

That's what you have there. You've got an elite starter that doesn't always want to play unless he's 100%. And that can be frustrating. And, Kipper, you remember when Hasik used to have that reputation? You know, he didn't want to play unless he was 100%. That was what we always heard. And I feel like he's just that guy. And that's tough to deal with because if you want to be a starter, you're going to have to play unless he was 100%. That was what we always heard. And I feel like he's just that guy. And that's tough to deal with because if you want to be a starter,

you're going to have to play hurt at certain points. You don't have to play injured, but you've got to play hurt. We're joined by Steve Valliquette. I want to get into this. You described it as a ghostly disappearance because I find it absolutely fascinating. You had mentioned just moments ago about maybe five or seven extra starts because maybe it could have been the opponent

that the other goalie wasn't very comfortable with. I assume that... Want me to give you a story, Kip? Hold on, hold on, hold on. Okay, I just want to get my point across. That's an assumption and i'm just asking you if if you really feel strongly about that what did that do to your relationship with him and what did that do to the rest of the team because we had a conversation

last week about joseph wall and if the players and at my point of view is if the players stop trusting somebody, especially a goalie, man, that room's in big trouble. Well, that's why I'm referring to, you know, what does Ottawa have? Do they have within the walls of that room the same character that, don't forget, when Allmark goes to Boston, he's got his first year. He's got Krejci. He's got Bergeron. He's got Chara. I mean, that's the strongest room in the league at that point. And what do they have in Ottawa?

Ottawa is just going to have to know that you're dealing with a very sensitive individual that's high skill, high talent, elite goaltender that just wants to play the games when he's feeling the right way. And you're going to have to live with that if you want to get in. And you're going to have to get 25, probably more. You might have to get 35 points from your backups if he's going to have nights off that he wants to spot. You know, look, I'll tell you, one of my call-ups from Hartford to the Rangers, it was a call from Jim Schoenfeld.

He brings me in his office and he said, hey, Valley, I got good news and bad news. I'm like, all right, Schoenfeld, what do you got? He goes, well, you want the good news or bad news? I said, OK, just give me the good news. He's like, you got called up. I'm like, well, what's the bad news? He goes, you're playing against Philadelphia and the Rangers haven't won there in the last eight tries.

I'm like, OK, great. You know, so I'm getting into this game in Philadelphia. And by the time I arrive in New York, I find the two goalies that are there at the time, they could have played. They were just a little bit shy on this game, right? But, you know, whether you're a guy that's only playing 10 games a season or a call-up, any game's a good game, right? So you've got to give your you-know-what's a squeeze and find out what you're made of.

And I'll never forget getting on the train ride because we took the train from Penn Station to Philadelphia for this afternoon game. And I remember listening to Elton John, Philadelphia Friedman the whole time, just pumping myself up, you know. What am I going to do? Am I going to go in there and lay in anger? Am I going to get pumped up? And I remember the first shot of the game. Now, I walk in this locker room.

Okay, guys, it's Mark Reckie, John LeClair. It is Jeremy Roenick. It is EA Sports, like, 94. And I'm like, yeah, I'm crapping my pants. I'm like, oh, my God, this is an enormous game for me, and I just got to keep it as close as I can for as long as I can. Now, first shot of the game, I'll never forget it. And, Kipper, you might remember John LeClaire's stick.

His stick was weird curved. Yes. I remember looking crazy. You've seen it, Borny? Yeah, you know, it was at Daryl Sutter's ranch this summer, and I got to see, he has one of them, and you got to see this thing. You can't tell which hand it is.

It goes both ways. So how about this one? The first shot of the game is coming from the point, and I'm looking to my right to see where the possible deflection might be coming from, and it's LeClaire's stick, and I took, like, a longer look than I should have at it I'm like what is that I got back to the point it's the post I could have got scored on the first shot of the game because I'm distracted on a guy's blade yeah uh it's funny story short is we end up winning that game and I get on the train on the way back and I'm looking

at myself the reflection in the glass they're like how the f did you do that you know like it was that kind of emotion. But I think that's why you just got to play the game because on the other side of that fear is freedom. And in that case, it's Philadelphia freedom. Love that. I like that on the other side of the fear is freedom. I think that relates to a lot of guys getting their opportunities in the NHL.

I do want to ask about one other guy, but I want to go to one other guy but i want to go to stew skinner in edmonton and and get your thoughts on him as a goaltender generally i thought this is going to be a huge year for him had that playoff run big guy felt like he would be full of confidence and this is going to be his season what do you see from him what do you expect from him yeah this is a really good conversation to have borny because we had four data scientists looking at all of our data this year i really wanted to get to understand hockey better yeah and over the past decade we've identified now three predictors that lead to stanley cup success

you have to have strong special teams you have to have settled offense at five on five and you've got to have a strong odd man rush and that's for and against okay now edmonton very good at denying odd man rushes they don't give up a lot they had a really good season last year at not allowing odd man rushes but the goalie in the nhl that allowed the most odd man rushes last year 46 goals was stewart skinner the goalie that gave up the most rush goals period on the entire season, even including even man rushes was Skinner. And I've got the numbers right here. It was 59 goals, total rush. All right. So when you're trying to break down your game and now you're looking at

settled offensive zone, five on five play, you're looking at dots down offense and defense, net front, offensive defense, east to west offense and defense, and then the odd man rushes. So those would be the four key cogs to being able to have success for and against. The area that Stuart Skinner really struggles with is the east to west game, whether it's at five on five in zone or off the rush. His movement side to side is, to be fair, and it's tough to say, right, because you're talking about the top 64 guys in the league,

but he's the worst of those 64. The nicest way to put it is he lacks confidence, and he doesn't get east to west well. And I wonder if he doesn't get east to west well enough to play all the way through and get them all the way through. Now, here's the caveat to that. The Florida Panthers last year, they were 32nd in the league in odd man rushes.

They never went for it, odd mans. There's many clips of them where they could have had three on twos and they choose to get it in deep, have possession, lug it down low, play it up and down the wall, go from low to high. And that just happened to be their opponent

in the Stanley Cup final. And I wonder, can you get through? What if you're playing Colorado with full cylinders? And what if you're playing against a really good team off the rush? That might be a mismatch for the Oilers if Skinner's your goalie going through. So I look at this blue line right now with the Oilers and it reminds me I was a bigger Cody Ceci fan than I thought when I look

at just the overall feel and I'm wondering if Skinner may feel the same way in terms of did my blue line get a little worse here in a short period of time and where

does that play in for a goaltender, Valley, when you feel like, you know, it may not be what I thought it was. And, you know, I'll even throw in Broberg, because he didn't play a ton at the end, but he played in every game, if I'm not mistaken, against the Florida Panthers an averaged 16 or 17 minutes. And I'm watching today going, Broberg would actually look pretty good right now on that hockey club.

You know what it is, Kipper? It's at the beginning of the season in the first three weeks, you establish a lot of trust between the way team defense is working with its goalie it can unravel if the goalie's getting beat on clear shots from distance because now your defense is running out of position in week four and five to try and take away that shot and kill the play away from your net when it should be your goalie's puck and now you give up the big east west right so we had a game saturday night against utah utah by the way looks really legit this year um they are a team they have a team concept they are in zone and they're buzzing

five guys connected connected connected and they had uh four of their five goals were east to west on shisterkin but out of their seven high danger chances total in the game, six were with time and space. Time and space is the accelerator on every scoring chance. So you've heard me talk about the east to west that goes below the hash. That's the play that ends up in the net more than any other scoring chance in the NHL every season. One every three times, one every three times. But the accelerator is when the receiver has time and space. There isn't anybody within a stick length. And if you go and watch those Utah goals, guys had time and space. Now, goal number three on Shusterkin is a clear sighted shot. And he gets beat because he's backing up in his crease now to protect himself against another

east to west. And he's concerned with what's happening now to protect himself against another east to west and he's concerned with what's happening in the environment in front of him because the goalie can only receive the play he can't have and dictate anything else other than his positioning based on what he believes his players are doing in front of him then he gives up the bad one he gives up the clear-sighted shot and it's from 35 feet it should be something that he has but it's from 35 feet. It should be something that he has. But it's in his head. And when we're looking at the accelerator on the time and space to an east to west play, it's like an extra 20% on your scoring chance. That's enormous. So instead of having like a 30% chance to score, you're getting into like the 47 to 53 range, depending on the seam. And those can feel like, and I'm sitting there with Henrik Lundqvist, who, you know, he's as great as any goalie

that's ever played in the NHL. And he's like, I want to fault him because of the number against, but, you know, let's be honest. You know, I don't know which one of those he should have had. And that's the way they look. They look like you don't even have a chance.

And I never like to say that because it's always full responsibility, have an opportunity to make a save, always find a way. But on the time and space chances that are east to west you can imagine if you play for the wrong team in the nhl you can be out of the league quick that you can really look bad because your entire game can unravel and the same thing goes for the d if your goalie's not stopping the clear-sighted shut excuse me then you're going to be taking away more opportunity to give up more east-west if you're overextended. Yeah, you know, it is interesting how different goalies look

behind different teams. I asked you about the backups in Ottawa, and you'd mentioned liking Forsberg. Let's go to Vancouver and ask you about those two guys, Shelovs and Lankanen. Lankanen's a guy I've kind of sneaky liked for a couple years. Of course, I don't know goalies all that well, but he's had a good save percentage for a couple years in Nashville.

Looked good in his first start with the Canucks. What are your thoughts on their two backup options? You guys are familiar with Kevin Woodley. You've had him on your program before. He's one of the guys that I give full access to our database so that he can always talk about it on his InGoal podcast. He does an excellent job. He and I were speaking this week, and he said Lankanen is finally proving your data right because it's been three years now.

He's been really positive, and he's the next guy to pop. And look, there was a time that Allmark was positioned the same way. I feel the same way about Lankanen. He's one of those guys in the weeds that really can pop, and he's got the right insulation with the goalie development group in Vancouver. I'm very positive on him. I think he can do a great job. Shelob, I think it's just a matter of too much too soon sometimes. I'm a big believer in 200 games in the minors, guys.

I really think he needed it as a goalie, and he hasn't't quite had that it's a combination of minor leagues and games in Europe any combination of that and I bring this back to Henrik again like Lundqvist played 236 games in Europe before he ever stepped foot on Madison Square Garden ice right you know it's not just a mystery to me why it was easy for him to segue into a career just one more for me and monta ball uh got off to a good start but then i'm watching the first three goals uh last night against pittsburgh and they're all under the bar and it just seems to me that at least last night it's either hit or miss with this guy he's either on his knees and they're going underneath the bar over his glove or he's he's finding a way to stop him but i mean it's all all shooters now for me it's right under the bar

on all of them it just seems like it's just a it's just destined that these guys are going to go down they're going to come out they're going to try to be as big as they are. But man, oh man, I'm just seeing so many go high glove. So you know what I think it is, Kipper? A lot of goalies don't know how to differentiate what save selection to use if the shot is dots down versus dots up. Dots up, it's distance to react. So reactionary glove save would look like this.

Just go north with it, right? Sometimes you'll see guys take this path and you're late because you get handcuffed right over your shoulder. And so if it's dots towards the blue line, you've got to go fingers up and just go north with your glove and it covers it. You can see it. I've done it old school where you take the ropes from the crossbar, bring it right down to the release. You can see it's really not the vertical angle. If you cut it in front front of you you have a very good chance to just take it away before it even gets on top of you now if it's dots down that's where you have to go into what what is a chicken wing so your elbow comes all the way up and you're able to

eliminate the part of the net that's right at your ear with your shoulder and your elbow and stolars makes that save well. By the way, Stolarz, I'm really impressed with. But back to Montembeau, I don't know. I don't know the answer to this, and I'm going to have to get to the bottom of it. But physically, I don't feel like he's able to go games in a row at a high level. I think he's elite as a goalie because when he's on, he's really, really good, but I don't know if he has the physical ability to carry himself for like seven games and without having dips like that. And I think it's hard for him on the recovery side,

but he just kind of looks like it. He kind of got the baby face, a little bit chubby, like chubby in the face. And yeah, it reminds me of me when I was in Sudbury, but Stolarz, I was in private, impressed with Stolarz, I've been impressed with him, guys. Yeah, I was just going to ask you about him.

You know what, Borny? If I go through Canada right now, as many question marks as you guys may have about your net, what net's better in Canada? And don't say Winnipeg with Hellebuck, too, because he thinks he played great in the playoffs last year. That scares me. You know? It is a strange comment, yeah. great in the playoffs last year. That scares me.

It is a strange comment. It's the strangest comment I've ever heard. I'm like, what? And he was the worst performing goalie in the playoffs last year. And I think he's a great goalie, but I don't like that. That feel gives me an uneasy feeling going into the playoffs this year. But Stolarz, man, is he big. So he expands his size in the net. He looks maximum size and still with posture that he can move on save.

And what I've really liked with him is that his footwork, he plays deep because he's not fast. He's not explosive, but he takes a short path. And here's the important thing for me when I watch him. On all of the plays that are going downhill towards the net, he uses a double shuffle. So he's got his toe cap square the whole way through the pass. So that's really important because he's not opening up as a big guy and then having to close it back up. And east to west, he's also using a double shuffle.

And then from the low to high stuff, from below the goal line out to slot, he's more of a T push, which still gets him to advance to top of crease. But I think you're very solid in that if, of course, Wall can get healthy and stay healthy. But I made a few calls on that this week and a little disappointing. I guess he's just always been hurt. This goes back to when he was young, and I don't want to hear that. It's going to be really hard to keep this guy healthy. You ruined me last week when you started telling me about goalies' mindsets.

Now I can't watch a goalie without thinking, I wonder what he thinks of himself right now. Does he think he's a good backup goalie, or does he really believe he can be a starter? Hey, just remember this, Kipper. You can't fail if you don't play. There you go. A lot of guys don't want to play.

They want to keep the stats. By the way, let me cut you off for one more second. Kipper, when you go out and score 62 goals, I think as a junior, I heard Sammy get corrected the other day. So would you ever lose one of those if you had a bad game? Would you lose two goals if you were a minus two a specific night? No, you don't. of those if you had a bad game did you lose two goals if you got if you were a minus two a specific night no you don't but guess what you lose in the nhl you lose your save percent so sometimes you want to avoid a game here and there yeah i

don't like the way the guys are looking right now i think i've got a groin my groin's going so a guy like stole ours you know in the NHL for maybe six years now, but multiple teams, including Anaheim and Philly and Florida, of course. Now at age 30, is there a thought process that he could be ready to truly challenge? Or is he more comfortable saying, you brought me in to be a good support guy that's where I'm comfortable at and that's it or is there a real opportunity for him in in the later stages of development to say now's my time I'm saying yes I'm saying yes Kipper I think the last time we were on I mentioned that when I was working at Quinnipiac, he was Miami of Ohio before he went to London. So I've seen this guy for 10, 12 years now play.

He's a different guy in a good way. He's matured. He had some really good structure in Florida. They've got a great development team for goalies there. When you think of it, they've got Leo Luongo. They've got Roberto. They have Francois Allaire, Rob Tallis. That's as strong as it comes.

So imagine that he's had a lot of good information, a lot of good reps, a lot of good work. He looks legit to me. I'm all in on Stoelers. I really am after two games because you guys understand how I watch the game. I'm watching it frame by frame. I've got to rewind it. I want to be sure, and I'm really sure.

I love the way he – now, as long as he can keep it going with the pressure and the pressure cooker that is Toronto, I love the way he looks. Hey, before we finish up, Borny. Yeah. Remember when you were saying a few shows ago about John Tavares taking those long, clear-sighted shots and they really get you going? Yes. Yeah. I looked it up for you.

Okay. Am I right? Have I gone wrong? No, you're right there in the wheelhouse. You know what you're watching, right? You're watching the game and you're like, I've seen that before. I've seen that. I've seen it. I've seen it. So,

okay, Tavares, over the last two years, 149 of those shots that you don't like, how many do you think resulted in a goal? Four? One. Oh, God. They're just giveaways. R they're changed their change of possession it's a rally killer it's uh you're playing catch with your old man in the backyard

right yeah okay listen thank you for that that is very valid yeah that's why i'm here boys i'm listening and i'm gonna come in and yeah i'm squeezing everything i can because I love that. Vili Huso cleared waivers. What does that do to him? What does that do to the organization? Is that just clearly a miss of pulling him out of St. Louis by C.B. Iserman? You know what I heard before Vili joined Detroit was that you got to stay on this guy.

If you can ride him every day, he's just one of those guys you got to ride every day. You have to be hard on him. You got to stay on this guy. If you can ride him every day, you got, he's just one of those guys. You got to ride every day. You have to be hard on them. You got to push them. You've got to. And now at that time, Detroit was getting a new goalie coach, a rookie goalie coach. And I had heard that that might not be the best fit for the goalie because when you're a rookie goalie coach, I've been a rookie goalie coach. You want to be liked. You want to be respected and liked, but you really want to be liked. And you want the guys to know you care about them, but you don't want to push too hard because you don't want to lose somebody.

And there's a delicate balance because when you think about the game, fellas, you've got your head coach, your assistant coach, two, three of them for 23 guys, but you have one goalie coach for two guys. You spend a lot of time with him one-on-one. And I wonder if Detroit just wasn't able to push him enough. And he needed more. He needed the whip every day, not the carrot. And I just think that this guy was legit four years ago.

Legit, legit, legit. When he was in St. Louis, legit. And I think he just let his game get away from him because he settled into a big deal and took his foot off the gas and let his guard down. How do you think I got Justin and Sammy on this show going? All whips every day. Every day.

That's how we operate. Every day. Yeah. Valley, great stuff as always, man. Fascinating insight in what you've seen so far between the pipes. Yeah, thanks, Valley. Appreciate it, man. Great job, in, in what you've seen so far between the pipes. Yeah. Thanks Valley. Appreciate it,

man. Great job. Hey, Oh, before I go. All right. At Valley's view on Twitter, I'm going to post every single morning after game is played a game scoring

chances report from clear sight analytics. So fans can follow. And I put the first three up today just to get it started because i don't know if you guys announced but i'm looking to join you guys every tuesday all right that's at valley's view is that right on twitter view all right buddy appreciate we're looking forward to it thanks so much man all right anytime god he's good is he gone i don't want to say that in front of him this makes me feel unprepared about my own work. There's so much there, but I can't get over John LeClair's stick.

Have you looked it up? I just looked it up. I got a picture on my phone. It's insanity. I actually had to Google if he shoots left or right. I know. Because he could shoot either way. I can't tell which way he shoots, and he shoots left.

But it looks like it could be a right-handed stick or left-handed stick how do you have any idea what he's going to do it's how'd you play with that how'd you shoot top scoring left winger yeah he was unbelievable i mean honestly people google john leclaire curve this is not some weird thing to get you to some weird pace. Select images on that. Alright, while everybody Googles John LeCure's dick, are we going to break or are we... Yeah, let's hit the break.

Let's hit the break. Okay. When we come back, Sammy's game time and a few NHL news and notes, including what we thought of the fight in Buffalo's practice the other day. Let's follow that up a little bit. Let's follow that up a little bit.

That and more when we return. The Real Caper and Born. The best Blue Jays show out there, period. Blair and barker be sure to subscribe and download the show on apple spotify or wherever you get your podcasts final block this hour of real kipper and born brought to you by bet Final block. This hour of Real Kipper and Born brought to you by Bet365. Before we get into some news and notes, including a very humbling comment from Gail McCart after last night's Avs loss,

let's get a little game time, Sammy. It's game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app, Latest Odds, and find's game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app, latest odds, and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly.

Few things I got for tonight. New Jersey Devils in Carolina. I think the second half of back-to-back they played yesterday afternoon against the Utah Hockey Club. And I think they beat them, shut them out. So the Devils are pretty big underdogs in the second half of back-to-back jake allen went yesterday got the shutout i would imagine that they'd go

back with markstrom today plus 140 for the devils against carolina ever get them plus it's kind of tempting i don't love carolina's team this year and i feel like they're still a little bit overvalued by the books so give me the devils the plus 140 underdog in that game tonight. The big one. The must-win game, like I said. Or else what? Or else what? A couple texts on the text line offended by that. Well, what happens if they lose?

Throw it forward. Nothing's happening. Anyways, the Philadelphia Flyers are plus 175 versus the Edmonton Oilers at minus 210. Since it's a must-win, they're going to win by a lot. Oilers minus a goal and a half is plus 125 they gotta win by two i think there's a good chance that they do that tonight against the philadelphia flyers you just you just can't go two years in a row of digging yourself in a hole that's all that's why it's my but like or what stop it sammy no there is no or what yeah or you

just you suck you just do it again and then you take it out again. Then you bring a lot of agony to your head. Yeah. Then you play the Kings in the first round and you dust them in five and then you do your thing again. Or you miss the playoffs. No, you face Vegas in the first round. That's bad. Right?

Yeah. It's true. Or you face Vancouver. They weren't that far off from facing Vegas in the first round, if I'm not mistaken, last season. It was true. Or Vancouver. They weren't that far off from facing Vegas in the first round, if I'm not mistaken, last season. It was close. It was the last day of the year. It could change.

The Kings jumped up. I forget how it happened, but it did. That's the fine line of the regular season. No, I'd like to clarify. Losing's not good. It could have been losing to Vegas in the first round last year. Yeah. Instead of getting the LA Kings.

Yeah. So it's not just about missing the playoffs. It's about getting your path towards another chance of getting a Stanley Cup final. No, it's not good to lose a lot. It's not good. But it's not. So I like the Oilers by two tonight. Okay.

So it pays plus 125. And I have a superstar goal parlay tonight. Alex Ovechkin moving to the right wing tonight. I don't know if you saw that. I'm sorry? Yeah, he's moving to the right wing. Imagine the coach being like, well, this isn't working. It's the most goals in history.

He's moving to the right wing tonight. He's moving to the right wing. Moving to the right wing, he's going to score. My parlay is Ovechkin to score, Stamkos to score, and McDavid to score. The parlay is plus 11.45, so over 10 to 1. So there you go. Reminds me of John Travolta in the movie Grease, his gym teacher. Try track. Track's not for you. Try track.

Track's not for you. Try baseball. I got another sport for you. Try right wing. So there you go. Going to right wing tonight. Anyways, that was Game Time presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's ever ordinary.

Bet365 must be 19+. Terry only. Please play responsibly. All right. ordinary uh bet 365 must be 19 plus carry only please play responsibly all right did you want me to read you the alex ovechkin uh the the little preamble about it because i saw this and uh i may have lost it here but basically he had one of his biggest years on the right way oh is that right yeah yeah yeah so they're they're wanting to put it back over there who is that someone who knows this talking about this or looking it up because they have historically mislabeled his position.

Oh, right. What was the thing? Don't tell anyone. This is between us. But one year, the hockey writers voted him as an all-star. Best left winger? Left and right wing. I think he got voted in.

Twice. Yeah. They put in some stop, some measures to make sure that can't happen. There's a few dumb people. Whoa. Well, there is. That's just a statistical fact. At least half of us are below average.

Yeah, so Alex Ovechkin has played the left wing for most of his 20 seasons in the NHL and has had great success there. And the 39-year-old, but Ovechkin played right wing during the 2012 2013 and 2013 2014 seasons when adam oats moved him there to take advantage of him playing on his natural side as a red-handed shot so there you go this is uh this is nylander played center at the

marlies this that's what that is he scored 32 he scored 32 and 48 and 51 and 78 in the two years when he played on the right way guess what primal vegetable scored a lot probably could have put him on the he would have scored 51 anyways all right your new york islanders on the return of patrick watt in colorado came up with a big win yeah last night you know the i gotta think that the abs are very thankful for edmonton's slow start maybe it takes a little bit of attention away from the fact that colorado does not look good at all oh and i would love to make this about the islanders um you know they get their goals from brock nelson and kyle palmieri and everyone else who's older but uh this is about the Avs and their defense,

and they're giving up a whole ton. It's a legitimate concern at this point. And can we now discuss the Cale McCarr thing? Yeah, we can. So this is arguably one of the greatest starts for any defenseman in the history of the game. Like starts to a career. Starts to a career. Not to the season, but to the start of his career. Yes, to a career. Starts to a career.

Not to the season, but to the start of his career. Yes, yes. Right? Correct. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. On track to be one of the best of all time. All time.

Norris says his first year as like a rookie, he came in and like impacted the game in the playoff. Unbelievable. He's my favorite. Yeah. Maybe my favorite player. Which makes this quote that he had last night even more perplexing to have it

a lot of myself just not moving my feet not playing my game and just kind of where it's at right now so um i mean i'm hard on myself but at the end of the day i gotta be better for these guys so it's definitely a lot closer game if i don't play tonight so a lot closer of a game if i don't play like george bailey come on everyone'd be better off if i was never born you know it's like what is going on like you're you're important you're very good wow yeah that's that gives you a sense of how hard he is on himself that's incredible i can't ever imagine bobby or saying after a bruins game we would have a better chance if i didn't play tonight yeah yeah that it almost feels too strong you know like you hope it's tough to get through 82 games with expectations on yourself so high

that you can't have a bad night without giving yourself a beating like that. Jeez. But it is kind of refreshing that they're human too. Yeah, absolutely. I would say the Avs decor, looking at the third pair of Sam Molinski and John Ludwig, you know, all of this. Yep.

Shillington has not exactly been a defensive stalwart over his career. Sam Gerrard's not a defender, a pure defender. So if McCart isn't defending and Manson's not great, you can see how they're giving up some great chances. And you guys mentioned Gorgiev and Eustace and Ananon. Right, Taves out. So it doesn't help at all. But they're in a bit of a pickle here.

Tough division to go on a slide. And you can't fill in Landis Coggs' $7 million either because on the thought that he may return by November, December to try this knee out, you have to have that money open and ready to absorb his contract. And do we know, I'm just trying to find, when is Natchushkin's suspension, when it ends? Six months, so it could be, I mean, at some point here, in the next month or two, I imagine he'll be available to them.

But it's a crapshoot whether or not, you know, he's going to be fully there for you, that you again can trust that he's going to stay, he won't disappear again on you he won't fall off so like it's gonna be really hard yeah this avalanche team has some tough decisions to be made and has their hands tied a little bit and in a division where dallas is so good nashville's gotten stronger the jets are off to a good start like the oilers i'm like they're fine but mostly because it's like you know they're better than to play the sharks a bunch yeah you're better than the sharks you're better than anaheim you're better

than calgary like you just get handed x amount of wins in the pacific if you're halfway good so yeah more concerned about the abs i would say where's uh the concern on the detroit red wings also because uh derrick lelan had a he had a pretty good one there when he was asked about shisterkin's contract do we have that we do let's play it this one this wasn't a complete goalie i mean they cast you on the power play um there's more we would definitely have done. But obviously, he was a really, really big difference in it. He's special. I can see why he turned down the 88. He's a good agent.

I can see why he turned down 88 million. Yeah. Good agent. What are the Red Wings? The Red Wings are going, they're within 12 months of firing steve eiserman if it doesn't turn around right they wouldn't miss playoff six straight years not sure how many of those he's been there for four or five but you can sell a slow patient rebuild but there's not even really glimpses of them being better than the other teams who are turning around. I think there might be a chance that you could fire the guy that we just heard from before Steve feels that heat.

I mean, the best players in the team. With all due respect, I know it was kind of funny, but your training camp and the start of your season isn't funny. I'm not sure I'd be cracking jokes about Shisterkin's contract or having a really good agent that's you think he's not in a position to be making jokes no i don't i don't he's auditioning for hockey in canada again he doesn't need to audition getting the jokes i just to me that this is a gm thing where it's like the top of that team is raymond and cider have not, they both signed eight-year deals and neither have really proved,

they're very good players and they're very young, but, you know, they're not, you know, Matthews, McDavid, McCarr, McKinnon, difference makers. And then it's what, Larkin and Debrinket. Like, they just don't have a lot to me for a long rebuild here. Hall and Kane, Sherratt and this old Petrie. It's just...

Yeah. That team to me is... It ain't good. Well, it ain't... Well, it's not good. It's not good. Yeah, that's... I don't know.

I have a couple buddies who are dying. I think if you look at the Atlantic division between Buffalo, Ottawa, and Detroit, there's some real... there was a real sense that somebody's stepping up here. But, I mean, I don't want to make too much of a crazy game yesterday by the Ottawa Senators. But they can score. They can. Yeah.

And, you know, Norris has been good. And Sanderson looks like he could become really, really good. But I don't know. Is there a sense that they're ready now? I don't know. Maybe that's why the Buffalo Sabres are punching each other's faces in that practice. Yeah.

They're like, you know, the time is now. They're pissed off, and, you know, it's a slow start. So, anyways. Just on that note, I know we had a back and forth there, but I don't know if you caught dalene's comments after where what'd he say he he apologized and he shouldn't have done he says he shouldn't have done it and that was bad by me and uh i think it was perfect yeah i think it it he had to say that he didn't say right thing to say stick enough for for myself. He shouldn't have, you know. No, no. Not as the leader of this group.

So I got to think that it's okay. Like once you're, you know, once a guy like that, at that status, with that salary and the C on his jersey, can admit a mistake, then it's got a better chance to put it behind you. Yeah, to me that's being the bigger man, where it's like we can continue to have this contest, you know, whatever. But it doesn't take the pressure off of Kevin Adams, I can tell you that.

No, they need to win. Yeah, they need to, yeah. That market needs the team to be competitive. These are all tough markets, you know, because Detroit's a good hockey market. Ottawa here has got a growing and serious base, so fascinating to keep an eye on. I did want to mention tonight Columbus has their home opener.

They're playing the Florida Panthers. The Panthers are all wearing good row jerseys, and tonight they're all entering with purple Gatorade and Skittles, which was led by Matthew Kachuk.uk sam bennett pointed that out as you know they had played with him in calgary and and knew that that was something that good row loved um seeing the images of florida's dressing room i you know i visibly shook you know just like had little shudders just like i can't watch a lot of the tributes to good row it's just having a young family myself i can't wrap my head around this tragedy and how awful awful sickening this is so uh just on behalf of our show that we're thinking you know of them um hopefully it's

a special night for columbus and their fans they deserve that um and good for florida for for doing their part goudreau's father taking uh the ice with the blue jackets uh which is like really nice to see yeah that connection he put out a statement because he's banged up so he's not going to be there tonight in columbus and i could read the statement here he said unfortunately i won't be there tonight in columbus johnny was a huge part of the hockey community to me he was much more than that a great friend a teammate a family man not a day goes by without me thinking about johnny and matthew this is the biggest thing i'm going to miss about tonight is not being able to see meredith noah little johnny guy and jane uh would be would love to give them all big hugs johnny will be my teammate forever so really classy touch by by chuck who's obviously not

there but with the statement the gatorade and Skittle thing, it's still hard to believe that. It's really hard to wrap your mind around. And for a team like Columbus, who their aspirations this year are not the playoffs, realistically, with the lineup they have, I think it's going to be a hard year because that's kind of going to be the focal point of their season um but how how can it not be how can something like that not be at the heart of

what the the team is dealing with and yeah just a terrible terrible situation nine games on top tonight including i think vancouver and tampa bay so they go back to florida yeah vancouver has a tough schedule what on what do you think about tampa bay here because we are the constant uh you know theme is what is this team like without stamp coasts and headman still looks like every bit of the stud that he's been well i'm gonna surrogate you have gone he's the guy on the power play again you know he's gonna be in the thick of it he's been the last 10, 15 years. Well, I'm going to Sturgachev gone. He's the guy on the power play again. You know, he's going to be in the thick of it. He's a special player. I think they're going to be the lightning.

Yeah. And I don't think they got worse. As craving a move as it was to let Stamkos go and turn their back on a franchise icon, they're not worse with Gensel. They made a decision. Yeah. And also, can we just mention that Kucherov last year had 100 assists?

Oh, yeah, he's quite good. Four goals and 100 assists last year. Quite good. How are you going to have a bad year? He's got four points in one game so far. That's his season to date. All right. Couldn't hate him more.

Sammy, you're not giving away anything from Rodgers? No, it's all good. We can go. If you're on the seat, check it out. All right Rogers? No, it's all good. We can go. Get on the seat. Check it out. We'll mention it tomorrow. Yeah, fine. We'll mention it periodically.

It's all good. Like I said, nine games on tap. Pick your favorite one and then join us again tomorrow on the Real Kipper Inborn Show. If you get a chance, download us. Give us a rating and review. We'd love to hear from you. Have a great night, everybody.