Real Kyper & Bourne - Hockey Hall of Fame Weekend with Doug MacLean

Episode Date: November 8, 2024

Nick Kypreos and Sam McKee are joined by former NHL President and GM Doug MacLean (5:30) to chat about the upcoming Hockey Hall of Fame induction ceremony, why Colin Campbell deserves this honour in the builder category, Vladislav Namestnikov's impact on the Winnipeg Jets' second-line, whether Jim Montgomery benching David Pastrnak helps him or hurts him in the long run behind Boston Bruins' bench, how much pressure is weighing on Steve Yzerman, and how teams have found ways to attack Connor Bedard. Then, Nick and Sam read and answer listeners' texts. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

come on sammy the national show for goodness sakes get yourself ready we are bornless today listen i know justin bourne like i said i do a lot around here and i had to do a quick wardrobe change in the back of the studio we are are the Real Kipper and Bourne Show. We are live on Sportsnet 650 in Vancouver and Sportsnet 960 in Calgary. This hour of Real Kipper and Bourne is brought to you by Bet365. In a few minutes, we'll welcome back into the program Doug McClain as he is now firmly settled in Delray Beach, Florida. Must be nice.

It feels like chilly out. I would like to be in Florida today. I don't get the sense it's chilly down there either because he put out a text a few minutes ago from, I think, a bar. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, so he might be going way up there. I hope not.

I really am hoping that's not the case. But we'll have to wait and see. Hey, what happened to Shusterkin last night? Five on 12? Yeah. He's human? Yeah. Did the price drop last night on him?

I was going to say, the timing on that is peculiar, where Weeks puts out that tweet with the eyeballs and the 11 and a half, and everyone's all excited about it, and then they get starched by the Buffalo Sabres. 5-1. He lets in a bunch. That's not pretty for him. So I didn't see that one coming.

Could still work for him in saying, you know, when I stink, we're not even on a playoff team. It's true. Against one of the worst teams. It's true. Right? We lost to the Sabres. Not a bad point.

Not a bad point. Holiday or holiday. Hall of Fame weekend coming up uh toronto and detroit we had jeremy roenick on last uh night which was uh awesome really good awesome really good so we'll get doug mclean's thoughts on on competing on a guy like that because that uh that was right in his wheelhouse. And for me, the guy going in that sticks out the most, well, Weber obviously had an unbelievable career, but Pavel Datsyuk to me was one of the more brilliant hockey players in my life that I've ever watched just in terms of, you know,

I'm in the era of the highlight era watching like a top 10 of his goals. His highlight reel is amongst anyone that's ever played. Like his stuff is unbelievable. Plus his defensive work. He's a selkie guy. What round was he drafted in? Yeah, that was that mid. What?

He's a mid pick. I feel like it was later than mid. But anyway. Seventh? I'm just looking it up right now. I don't know. Was there 14 rounds back then? Yeah, that's true.

There was more rounds. But man, I loved watching looking it up right now. I don't know. Is there 14 rounds back then? Yeah, that's true. There was more rounds. But, man, I loved watching him play. He was unbelievable. He was a sixth-round pick, 171st overall in the 1998 entry draft. I wonder how many sixth-rounders made the Hall of Fame. That's pretty unbelievable. So, yeah, big fan of this class going in. Shea Weber, unbelievable for Canada, too.

So, great, great class. And you're going to go on Monday? I am going to go on Monday, yeah. I do like to go down there for no other reason than there's very few times, this and the draft, where everybody kind of comes under one roof a little bit. Not every team shows up, but most teams are represented at the Hockey Hall of Fame.

Either general manager or president. Some coaches will come by for sure. Coley Campbell, of course. I was a part of the Stanley Cup team, which he was an associate coach, along with Mike Keenan and Dick Todd. Those were the three main guys behind our bench every night. So it's nice to see his efforts as a player, a Stanley Cup champion,

and now as an executive in the National Hockey League be honored as well. Did you get that message too in your ear about Doug? No, I did not. All right. Just having a couple of technical difficulties with Doug. That's always the case with him, right? And it's like, it's usually just like, press the mute button, Doug.

Okay? Listen, I'm not saying anything about it. The last time I did, I said a senior moment about Gord Stelic, and you aired me out to him. So I'm not going to say anything about this one. But I do get the feeling from yesterday, and I'll get your thoughts on this that Jeremy Roenick going in and the way he feels and his relationship with the game of hockey and what all the stuff he had to say to us yesterday and if you missed it go back and listen to the pod it's an excellent

interview from yesterday I think it's got a pretty big chance to be a must-see tv situation with him doing his speech yeah i gotta be honest with you after i went home last night and i thought about our interview with uh jr i'm like i'm kind of nervous for him a little bit because really well i'm just i just i just don't know how much he wants to get into like he said there's's some stuff I want to get into. And he only has six and a half minutes, I guess, was the number. And I think he's smart enough to maybe just give enough of a story without taking it to a point of no return.

But I don't know. It's JR. You only go in the Hall of Fame once, Kippy. I know. You only get this chance once. I know. All right. Uh-oh.

A man who is in our real Kipper and Bourne Hall of Fame. Let's welcome him in, Doug McClain, former NHL president. Dangerously deep V. What's going on? You got the big pink T-shirt on right now. Well, you know, I thought I'd show you a little Italy. You know, Jill dressed me up in Italy. She bought me a couple of cool T-shirts.

I thought I'd go pink tonight. You look good. You look good, Doug. Well, yeah, I'm just going to head up the Ave a little later and, you know, have some dinner and just try to relax. I've been preparing all day for this show. So most Fridays I build you up, I build you up, and then I get Derek in my ear going, we're having technical difficulties.

What is with you and technical difficulties these days? My internet's out here at the condo today, so I have to do it on the phone. And, I mean, they're saying, frame it up, frame it up. I'm thinking, frame it up? I'm on a damn phone. How can I frame it up, Jen? I've got it. You're on top.

I've got four draft day paperbacks underneath my phone trying to hold it up here. You're doing great. You look good. Don't move. Don't move. don't move don't move don't move so uh hall of fame weekend we had jeremy roenick on yesterday if we talk about certain players in your wheelhouse in in the height of your days behind the bench jeremy would stand out as much as anyone look he was a good player, a very, very good player in Chicago, especially. I mean, we played them a lot, whether, you know, I was in St. Louis and later on Detroit and in Columbus, he was always one of the best players. He played hard. He played the game the way it was. It was

supposed to be played. He was mouthy. He was cocky. And he produced. And he produced. And, you know, I liked him as a competitor. I really did. You know, I've been sort of waiting. I look. He and McGilney, I mean, he's been waiting to get in.

This was one of the proudest moments of his lifetime to get accepted. I remember watching the call when he got in and, you know, him and him and Tim, Tim, the referee talking about it. But it's great for him. And McGillney is the only guy that I'm sort of bothered about. I listen to everybody every year. McGillney's name comes up and I coached against him. I know how good he was and he's not in, I don't get that one. And you've got Larimer, you've got some guys that you, you think should be in there. Do you,

do you think that like really depends on, on the power of the club pushing you? Like there's an ownership push. There's always people campaigning for certain players and the, the committees get flooded right gotta take this guy like if you've got some power behind people does it make a difference look it's i'm trying to get a guy in the pei sports hall of fame you know how's that going working you know how much well i'm in so i'm not worried that's the most important thing in, right?

Yeah. So, you know, so I'm trying to get somebody in. I mean, it's a problem. Look, it's a big deal. It's a special thing. You know, the guy I'm excited about who I dealt with more than anybody in the NHL in my career was Coley Campbell. He was a guy that, you know, I talked to on a daily, if not weekly basis, sometimes late at night, sometimes early in the morning. And he was always there. And, you know, people say, Coley Campbell in the Hall of Fame? Well, he did a lot for the game. I was in Board

of Governors meetings. I was in General manager meeting when coley took control and and really did a fabulous job especially in the time when we changed the game when the game actually changed you know when the when the slashing and the stick work come out of the game and the and the free flow game come in. Coley Campbell was as responsible for that as anybody in the league. And he never gets mentioned. Well, he did on our show just now. Yeah. You mentioned him.

Yeah. Well, I'm trying to, I'm trying to get us a cheer for him when he goes in tomorrow. Okay. So you haven't been on in a while, like anything kind of crawling on every, on a,

just a minute. I've been on every Friday. What do you mean? I haven't been on in a while. Well, a week, a week, a week. A week. A week.

What's happening a week? We're talking about seven full days. Well, the Leafs won a game. That was exciting. But look, I want to talk about Winnipeg and their start they've had to the season. I mean, one loss, is it, in 14 games? Matched only by the 07 Ottawa Senators.

I got to believe that was Brian Murray coaching the Senators in 07, wasn't it? Yeah, I think you're right. Yeah, and you know what? You know what? They've got the big guys going pretty good. Their top defensemen are going pretty good. But I'll tell you what, Nameshnikov's line, that number two line, they made a decision to go by Monaghan and his contract

and put Nemeshnikov in his spot in the number two hole with Ehlers and with Profetti. And that has been a great line for them. We know they've got a great third line with Lowry, and we know they've got a big first line, but that second line was a hole. And Nemeshnikov has come in there and done a great job. Profetti's got a chance to be a star. And you know Ehlers. In his contract year, he's playing for a big contract. They couldn't come to terms. That line has been good.

And not only that, their top four defense you always love. You know, the Morses and the Mellows. And they're sort of pionk. They're smaller type guys. All of a sudden, you you got Stanley on the back end and Sandberg playing recklessly and banging people around. And then you got Hellebuck. So I think there's some subtle moves, new coaches with O'Neal,

and Chevy's done another great job. Another great job. Is the lineup good enough as is, as long as regular season Hellebuck shows up instead of playoff Hellebuck of the last few years? I don't know if you got a chance to see the game last night. It wasn't even close. I mean, Colorado dominated. I know, they dominated.

Dominated the game. And Hellebuck was different. He was. Hellebuck was best goalie. Hellebuck was. He was. Best goalie. Hellebuck, does he? Yeah, he's got to make it happen this year. I feel for him because that's a lot of pressure being a, you know, not getting it done in playoff time.

I picked him against Colorado last year. And because Colorado's goaltending was so bad. And all of a sudden, they were out goaltended last year by Colorado. That's hard to believe. So, yeah, he's got to get it done he's that good but i like what chevy's done and full marks to them they've had a heck of a start and i i didn't think they would i really didn't this caught me off guard yeah but they're a very similar conversation to the leafs to me that they have they've always had great regular seasons but they have a lot of problems in the playoffs, and I think it's Hellebuck. Hellebuck.

But look, I got to be careful what I say on this show because last week I brought up Nashville, loss or identity, and it went worldwide. That's all anybody talked about all week was Nashville. So, you know what? I don't want to set the tone for the league every time I come on here. Okay.

So is Nashville, their latest loss, they're going to rebuild now, Doug? Is that what's going to happen? They did too much rebuilding this summer. Oh, okay. Okay, that's good. All right, so let's go right into your wheelhouse of coaching here because this week between Boston's Montgomery and then Tortorella benching his Russian phenom Mishkov,

like those are some bold decisions. Let's start with Boston first with Montgomery and my good buddy here who's not here today, Justin Bourne, says, listen, star players are no star players. You got to just march to the same drum of, you know, we're treating everybody the same. And I've told them that some of the stars that I've played with don't feel that same way.

And I'm just wondering with Montgomery, the benching of Pasternak, like, does he flirt with his job security when you start going at those top stars? First of all, there's no sense talking about Tortorella because Torch is Torch. He's going to do what he wants. He's going to, you know, if it's not Frost, it's the kid.

You know, it's always somebody. And, you know, so there's no sense even talking about him. He's not going to, you know, it's not Frost. It's the kid. You know, it's always somebody. And, you know, so there's no sense even talking about him. He's not going to change. It's a waste of time. They got a win last night, which was great. They beat Tampa, which I can't figure out how. But anyway, there's no sense talking about him. But Montgomery, like somebody give Jimmy Montgomery a shake and wake him up.

I agree, man. Jimbo, Jimbo, Pasternak is your best player. And who in their right mind puts their best player out there to the hockey world sitting on the bench for a full period? Like, come on. We used to get mad at Iserman in Detroit because, you know, some games he wasn't a superstar like he always was. But listen, this guy, I used to say to Brian Murray,

Brian, if you sit Stevie Wye out one power play, that's like sitting him out for a game. If you tell him he's not going out on a power play, that's the same as sitting a third liner for a game if you tell him he's not going out on a power play that's the same as sitting a third liner for a whole period he would snap he would lose it but i'll tell you what what he did to pasternak when his job's on the line and i know last week people were chirping me because i said kneelander should talk to the coach instead of the media i love when they chirp me by the way you know i never get chirped anymore i kind of like it so so but jimbo your job's on the line he's your best player he's a quality guy the players on the team love him and you think you're sending a message

no i'm sorry you're not you're not sending a message past your neck send him out a couple of shifts it's the same as sitting him out a period. And you don't have all the hoopla. We know where that bar has been set for Boston all these years. They're, like, not even close right now. So what would you do if you're Montgomery to get these guys going? Because they sunk a lot of money this summer. They might not be very good.

With Zdorov and at home. Like, somebody said to me they thought zadoroff could be chair like no scout said that did they hope no no nobody ever said that did they that zadoroff could be chair he's really struggled he has struggled big time look took another penalty last night took another penalty penalty last night. I thought he had a hell of a Halloween costume. I thought that was his best move of the season. The Halloween costume was fantastic. What was his Halloween costume? I missed

it too. I don't know what it was, but he really looked good. Anyway, they all do such a great job. But anyway, look. He's spending a lot of time on the internet, isn't he? Jimbo should go in and talk to Don Sweeney and talk about their personnel because they're not good enough right now. They're not a good enough team.

And that's their number one problem. It's not Pasternak. It's not Marchand. You know, Doyle's got to be better. I get all that. They lost to Brusk. They, they lost to brusque. They didn't like to brush for four years and now they miss them. Although he's only got one goal so far,

I think in Vancouver, but look, uh, they're not good enough right now. Forget about blaming pastor. And I can, Jimbo should be worried about keeping his job. Uh,

just, and I like him. I hope he does. Just to confirm Nikita Zdorov was part of the Adams family for his Halloween costume. I know everybody was waiting with bated breath for that. That's exactly right. There you go.

You mentioned Iserman in one of your answers there. Red Wings are in Toronto tonight for the Hall of Fame game. Where are we at at the state of the Iser plan, Doug? The Iser plan is pretty close right now to the Dougie plan in Columbus. It ain't working. Come on. It ain't working. It's not working.

That's how close it is. So Stevie now is getting very close in the management ranks after the amazing job he did in Tampa. Coming into Detroit in, what, six, seven years now, not making the playoffs. They're getting restless. And Stevie now is moving into that realm as the same as all the other GMs in the league. He's got to get it done. He's got, there's a ton of pressure in Detroit. The fans are restless. The fans are restless. I, you know,

I watched them play in Chicago the other night. Played pretty well. But they've got to get it going. You think there's pressure in Ottawa and Buffalo and these teams? There's big-time pressure in Detroit. They are restless. They are 7-5 after a win tonight in Toronto. That's not bad for you?

It's okay. No, but six, seven years out of the playoffs is getting old. So they've got to make it. So who is your team right now? I know we mentioned Winnipeg, but outside of that, the Rangers, like if Shusterkin's giving up five on 12 shots, are they a playoff team? Yeah, they're a playoff team.

And here's my team today. And I think I said this at the first year that I thought they're going to be the surprise of the league. Washington Capitals. Oh, yeah. I mean, the goaltender, Logan Thompson, has come in and done a good job. The big guy from L.A., your buddy there, Dubois,

has done a good job. Ovi's reinvigoratedois, has done a good job. Ovi's reinvigorated. They look like a different team. The kid behind the bench has done a good job. He did a great job last year. I looked him up the other day. This guy played at some college I've never heard of, and I know colleges in the U.S.

I don't know what the name of it was, but I never heard of it. I think it's folded. Obviously, the college is folded. Didn't he play with Borny? And then he played in the East Coast League. No, no. Look it up. It's scary.

I've never heard of it. So he did play with Borny in Alaska, but he played at St. Norbert College. Is that the one you're thinking of? Yeah, Norbert College. What the hell is Norbert College? I had no idea. Spencer Carver. Yeah, Norbert College. What the hell is Norbert College? I didn't know that one either. Spencer Carver.

Then he goes to the East Coast League and played there for a bunch of years, assistant coach in South Carolina in the East Coast League. All of a sudden, he gets assistant job in the American League, head coach. Then he gets the job in Toronto, and then he comes back to Washington, and the guy's done a heck of a job. I've watched him with some conversations in the dressing room just on clips. I really like the way he handles himself. And he today is the coach of the year in the NHL. And this team is hard to play against.

They are playing really hard. So it'll be fun to watch. They've got some good young kids in the mix as well that they put on the team. So it's going to be fun to watch them. And tonight it's Sid and Ovi for I don't know what the number of times they've played against each other, but Sid's two goals away from 600 here now. Ovi's chasing Gretzky clearly. It's rare that athletes live up to the hype like these two guys have.

It's unbelievable, Doug. I missed Wayne the other night. He was down here. He was at the Trump gala event at Mar-a-Lago, but I missed him. So I wasn't invited. But anyway, I was disappointed. That's too bad.

Last time I met a superstar here, Lemieux, I didn't recognize him. But anyway, look, you know what? You know the kid I want to talk a little bit about is Bedard, and I feel for him in Chicago. Okay, I feel for him in Chicago okay I feel for him in Chicago he's got three goals he's an unbelievable talent but with the way coaches and coaching is today when you play the Chicago Blackhawks there's one thing in your mind we got to shut down this kid Bedard we got to shut him down and teams I watched him the other night teams are really

playing them different in the neutral zone they're they're backing off they they've got it in their heads that he cannot beat them with with because he's not that fast unbelievably talented unbelievably a great young player but they're backing off them they're not standing up and they're they're giving them a little more room and you know what they're shutting them down but but sid you know Connor Austin like you're the first pick overall on bad teams you got to find a way to get through it you can't be on a pace for 15 16 goals this year and on top of being number one he's been labeled like a generational player here I know and I'm I'm concerned about his speed. I'm concerned about his flat-out speed.

And I know Gretzky wasn't fast. Sid was a great skater, but he was a powerful skater and a powerful guy. This kid is powerful. But teams are going in and they're really working them. And they're physical on them. They're playing them hard. And they're not letting them beat them one-on-one by standing up in the neutral zone on this kid. So they're giving them more space and they're angling them out.

They're angling them out. So it'll be fun to watch how he adapts. Like the other superstars have adapted. It's never, it never feels like he's getting clean looks when you watch them play. Like, you know, like when he was in junior and juniors,

whatever, but that's what his strength was is that he just got clean looks and he had the one of the best shots you'd ever seen it went in but just never gets clean also but he also beat people one-on-one in junior down through the middle i mean this guy i remember talking to uh brent sutter about him for the book draft day because he was coming up for the draft. And I said, who does he remind you of? Who does he really remind you of? And Brent told me Braden Point. That's who he reminded him of. That is who he was going to be.

And I said, no, Brent, he's going to be a lot better than now. Braden Point's been a superstar and a Stanley Cup winner, but not a generational player. And that's who Brent Lichen said, that's who he was, he said, that's my guy who he's the most like of anybody I've seen. Interesting. One more I want to get your thoughts on,

and that's the Seattle Kraken, because they came out of the gate fairly well, and now they think they've lost seven of eight. And Ron Francis went out and paid Chandler Stevenson a ton of money. He went out and gave Montour a ton of money and just the pressure he could be feeling right now with the Kraken. Really interesting. I was talking to somebody this summer about Chandler Stevenson

and they said he's going to be a bust in Seattle he he you know he's not as good a player as we saw in Vegas complimentary guys around him in Vegas were better were big strong guys and they said he's going to struggle and I I don't know him that well as a player but that's what I was told and and you know what he's he's not a six what is he six million dollars i mean he's not close to that i think it's more than i mean crazy kind of and and it was not a snowball's chance not a snowball's chance kelly mccrimmon was going there anywhere close to that money he couldn't and and no interest and kelly he's got the plug and play you know he loses somebody and he plugs somebody in.

It's like unbelievable. I'm still scratching my head on Dan Bilesma, that they brought him back. And, like, this wasn't a coach that a lot of teams were racing to interview. I mean, I just didn't understand that one when there's maybe other options out there. Yeah, I don't want to get into their coaching staff, but I think that Dan's a guy that had great success

with a great team in Pittsburgh. He went to Detroit as an assistant coach. It didn't go very well. He ended up going back to the minors, and good on him. He grinded it out, and they had good success in the minors. And Ronnie France is a loyal guy, and he felt loyalty to give him a chance. But I'm not sure. I think Danny is a real good assistant coach.

I'm not sold on him being a head coach. Last one for me, Doug. Last one for me, Doug. Last one for me. Keep an eye on the Sens clearly. Cause in the least division and one of the Canadian teams, did they trade Jonas Corpus Allo and then sign new Yorba, Jonas Corpus Allo?

Like this, this Omar thing is not good off to a good start. Oh, but like, so, so he loses five, one in Buffalo. He's going to gonna be your guy he is your guy if you make the playoffs he's the reason you're gonna make the playoffs okay okay okay why not

play him again last night why not come back with him again last night somebody explain that one to me yeah i don't get that i care can't. If he's your guy. Maybe it's him. I mean, we talked to Valley on this show about him playing half the games, and maybe it's him. Maybe he's just a high-maintenance guy. He's got to be perfect to play. Well, then, I don't buy that.

But I was caught off guard by that. Because I was excited to turn that game on. I wanted to watch them. I really like a lot of things Ottawa is doing right now. A lot of things. I like the way they're playing, but they can't blow that game last night. It's a bad loss. They cannot. That is a bad, bad loss last night.

A horrific loss. Now, Travis has been grumpy at the podium. I didn't stay up to watch him last night, but I'll tell you, hevis has been grumpy at the podium i didn't stay up to watch him last night but i'll tell you he should have been grumpy just big mistakes and but anyway i'm disappointed because i i really they've got to make the playoffs talk about stevie y and the red wings and buffalo ottawa's in the same boat they've got got to make it. And all marks your guy. Go with them. Is he tired? Like, what is it, game five? Is he tired?

Jeez, what a joke. I pull up the Atlantic Division standings, and I know it's early, and I know they're all bunched up, but second last there, sit the Ottawa Senators right ahead of the Habs. It's like, oh, boy, are we doing this again? Oh, don't bring the Habs up. I talked about the Habs a few weeks ago, and I had buddies phone me. They were depressed, so don't bring up the Habs.

No Habs, Doc. No Habs, Doc. Is there going to be one Hall of Fame weekend you and your T-shirt can maybe make a trip up? This is a holiday. You know what? I didn't even go to the Hall of Fame events when I was living in Toronto. I used it as a toronto i you know i used it i used

it as a night off you know so and you know it's not that i'm jealous because i'm i told you i'm in the brockville sports hall of fame brockville ontario yeah i'm in the pei sports hall of fame how many hall of fames can you have that's too many hall of fames you don't want to be in three hall of fames that's too many you can't get in the HEPA Hall of Fame. I know that. I know, but I've got a chance probably to get into the Canadian Broadcasters Hall of Fame. I don't. I don't know. All right, Mac.

Well, enjoy the rest of your weekend. I'll say hi to many people for you. How about that? Listen, it's really been a pleasure to get on. I had a busy day today, and I really was looking forward to this all day long. Where did you send your last text from? What bar? The Sandbar.

It's on the beach just down the street from me. A great little sandbar, sort of an outdoor bar. How's the weather there today? Mahi. I had a Mahi sandwich there. It was beautiful. And a cocktail. Is that your ritual before every Friday you're coming on the show that you have a sandwich and a stiff drink?

I had a mahi sandwich and the lightest beer I could get, a Belgian Blue Moon. Can you get a lighter beer than a Blue Moon? Like seriously. Blue Moon on the beach sounds pretty good to me right now. Yeah, well, you know, it takes a lot of, it takes the stress away. It takes the stress away, it really does.

Listen, no Justin Bourne today. How did my boy Sammy do with you today? Because we were a little nervous. I was nervous that you were going to look at him and, you know, make fun of him. You know, I didn't even notice Bourne wasn't there. I thought he was behind me.

I thought he was behind me here on the screen. I love it. Sometimes you guys take yourselves just a touch too serious and you just got to chill out, you know, and then I'm going to come with a big, big because I was offered a new job today. A podcaster offered me a full time job today, and I'm really I'm weighing my options. And if I do get it, I'm going to contact Jeff Merrick and get him to show me how he did all that.

Breaking it up and the excitement of watching those little clips. I like, I was, I, I made, I'm going to try to, I don't know how the hell to do. I could hardly get the phone set up for the show.

Let alone do what Merrick did. I like the sound of McLean and Merrick. Oh yeah. No, no, I'm not. I listened to Jeff for three years when I was on with him. I'm not doing it again.

All right, Mac. Hey, thanks for doing this, pal. Thanks, bud. Thanks a lot for having me, guys. All right. He is the one, the only. It's our pleasure. It's our pleasure. Doug McClain, former NHL president, GM head coach. Oh, my God. And now we've got him.

I survived. We did survive. I survived talking to Doug. Good job, Sammy. Thank you. Thank you. Do you want to do a quick game time before we hit the break?

Yeah, let's do it. All right. It's game time presented by Bet365. Visit the app to find out why it's ever ordinary at Bet365.

Must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Like I mentioned with Doug, Ovechkin and Sid going head to head tonight. Sid's two goals away with Doug, Ovechkin and Sid going head-to-head tonight. Sid's two goals away from 600. Ovechkin is creeping ever closer to the great one's goal record,

which is hard to believe. Like I said to him, it's hard to remember anybody living up to the hype as much as those two guys have. It's crazy. I love both of these guys to score a goal tonight. Both in the game pays you plus 475. So give me an anytime goal from both Sid and Ovechkin. And I'm looking at the Leafs tonight.

They're a huge favorite. Minus 200. I wouldn't touch that one. But if you wanted to go with a total, I feel like there could be some goals tonight. Give me the over six goals at plus 100. And that was game time, Kipper. Presented by Bet365.

Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's ever ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Penguins and Capitals, one of four games tonight in the National Hockey League. And I got to think Sid's a little grumpier these days than Ovi. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's, you look at the way that the Penguins

have built around Sid's sort of twilight of his career versus what the Caps did this offseason. I'm sure there's probably a little bit of jealousy there from Sid, right? Like what Dubas has done there, and he tried to bring in Carlson and all the contracts they had already signed with the prior regime with Malkin and Letang. It's tough. Like you're looking at

Ovechkin is his main competition. That's the main guy he's been competing with his whole career. And he sees him having this twilight. I'm sure he's jealous. In our Leaf Edition hour, we had Nazem Kadri on. The book is Dreamer, My Life on the Edge. We talked about that being one of the worst trades for the Leafs. That's my least

favorite trade they've ever made. 20 years, 30 years since they won the Stanley Cup, arguably. They also traded the pick that became Scott Niedermeyer. That wasn't very good either. That was Kyle Dewis who did that. Then he goes to Pittsburgh and tries to make a splash with

Carlson. You know what I can't. And it's been a disaster. And you know what I can always think of, and I know it's the national hour and I hate to make it about the Leafs, but that was a big-time rumor when it was here, when he was here. Remember that? Yeah, it wasn't a rumor.

I said it. Kyle Dubas loves Carlson, and he's trying to find a way to fit him here in Toronto. Can you imagine that had happened here? Because it would have probably come at a cost of somebody else on the roster, right? You can't fit all that in. And anyways, we've got to go to break,

but if you're listening right now, text 590-590 and give us your takes, questions, whatever you want to do. We're going to read them in the next segment. 590-590, text them now. It'd be great if whosoever, I think it's jen up there can get the thing up on there so we can get the name uh the the numbers 590 590 text in now we'll read them after the break and we'll talk a little bit about uh about tanner jeno's hit oh boy on brock besser what was that yeah uh yeah all right that

and more when we return to Real Kipper and Bourne. Hey, it's Ailish Forfar. And I'm Justin Cuthbert. Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. It's the Fan Pre-Game. 6 p.m. weekdays on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590, The Fan, and wherever you get your podcasts.

All right. Down the stretch we come, Sammy, on this Friday. This hour of Real Kipper and Bourne brought to you by Bet365. Kings. Tanner Janot had a hearing for an illegal check to the head of Canuck Brock Besser. Here, let me get you this. That was a bad one. Let me get you this.

This is from our boy Ian in Ridgeville. Yeah. What is your guys' view on how many games Tanner Jeannot should be suspended? Yeah, well. A few. A few if Brock Besser's okay. But there's an injury here. How significant. And it's just not.

It's Brock Besser. It's one of their stars. It's a bigger deal. So what could have been a two-game suspension might have to be a four or a five. I got to say, I was rotten. Rotten, needless hit. And Brock Besser's a guy that's had injury issues and you know I don't know

what like it's just I guess it's a credit to the way they've changed the game or whatever but you just these kind of hits are so jarring now because these things used to happen a lot you know these borderline bad hits where guys would hit up high was all the time he didn't know where he was

didn't know where he was. Didn't know where he was. He just hammered him. So I would say anywhere in the four to five range would be an acceptable suspension for me. I was waking up to might be an in-person hearing. Yeah. That's, I mean, that's fair. It was a really bad hit. It was a bad hit.

Yep. Anyways, I got a bunch of texts. Do you want to do texts? I do want to do texts. Okay. So we were talking about trades and the worst trades. William from the highway. On that theme, what are the worst trades you can recall in the league in the past 15 or 20 years?

What are you doing? Give me A, B, C, or D. Okay. Don't make me work on a Friday when I'm like, I don't know, 40 minutes from my first cold one. Yeah.

Okay. Give me some, like, okay. How about, here's one that doesn't get talked about. How about Marty Erat to the Washington Capitals for Phillip Forsberg?

Yes. As soon as you mentioned that name, right away, I knew Philip Forsberg. Yashin for Chara? Yashin from the Isles? At least Yashin. Okay. Here's one recently where I'm shaking my head again. It's like, whatever for Sam Reinhardt.

Yeah. Right? What was that trade? Was it not a trade? Yeah, yeah. I think so. Or maybe it was a, let me just pull it up. I can't quite remember.

The trade was, traded from the Buffalo Sabres to the Florida Panthers for Devin Levi and a first round pick in the 2022 draft that became Yuri Kulich who has played nine games and scored one goal. Like if Levi comes around Yeah, he's got to come around a lot. Right, but like you gave up a

50 goal score. Yeah, second overall pick that they had there. Second overall pick. Yep. You never thought in a million years that that guy would be a 40 or 50 goal score. I mean, just put him in the right place and he really has come into his own.

Like whatever, you know, at the end of the day, that's just a bad trade. Yeah. That's hindsight. We can all do it. We can all look here and say that guy's no good. That guy will never do this. And then, lo and behold, he does it. I actually do. I feel like shame. it we can all look here and say that guy's no good that guy'll never do this and then

lo and behold he does it i actually do i feel like shame i actually do think that the cadre one is on that list like for for kerfoot and barry yeah i think uh you know i think he was i think cadreri was doomed in Toronto the moment they signed Tavares. Yeah. Yep. Oh, what was the Thornton trade? To San Jose?

Yeah. What did they get for him? They got, they had like three or four pieces. It was from trade from Boston Bruins to San Jose Sharks for Wayne Primo, Brad Stewart, and Marco Sturm. Ugh. That's up there.

That is certainly up there. Yeah, yeah. All right. This is a question that we've got a lot about, actually, about Sid in trades. And it said, should Sid be pushing for a trade toado to have a chance to play with his buddy nate probably play for one last cup like he signed the contract the ship sailed it did so he signed that two-year extension after this year it's just he's never leaving he's gonna be on a 10 game under 500

team every year for the next three sports is crazy and I don't ever want to get in and never say never. That's from Keith in Winnipeg, by the way. Thank you for that text. The decision needed to be made earlier. It needed to be made this summer if there was any chance. Who outside of maybe Kyle Dubas and a few other in that organization thought that Pittsburgh still had a chance to take another run at anything? Yeah.

So please tell me that they're intelligent enough to say, Sid, we're going to sign you for two years. It's going to be tough, but help us. And I guess he did. Yeah. I guess he did. Yep. I guess he did. Yep. He's Mario.

In so many ways, he's Mario. I know. Where it's like, I'm built to win. I don't go on social media. And I'm going to end my career with one uniform. But you just look at him over his career. Has there been a more competitive guy? It's just hard to imagine him just wallowing away.

Like, they're not going to be better next year. I don't want to see Sid in another uniform. No. No. I don't. Even if it's in Colorado or somewhere else winning a cup? I'm conflicted here. I'm conflicted.

But I don't want to see sid like wayne his last few years where i'm like i can't even remember him in st louis to be honest with you and i played against him in a playoff series the saddest part about his memory in st louis is the most memorable thing is stevie y stripping him and then him going bar down in that double OT, 0-0, slap shot from the point. On a goalie that I put in that John Casey. What do you mean? Well, I fell on Grant Fuhrer.

Grant Fuhrer was out and then Iserman rips that shot over Casey. He just does the shoulder thing. And that's the one of them. And they had that great angle from behind the net. And every St. Louis Blue fan has never let me forget that i would imagine so uh this is from kevin in elmira ontario which canadian team will make it the furthest in the playoffs this year i'm watching quinn hughes last night once again control a game. He's unreal.

I got to watch Brian Leach do it in New York. And when I'm watching Hughes on that blue line dictate pace of play, I'm thinking there's a lot he can do with the hockey club to take it far. And the plus of the goalie, playing well, specialty teams, guy getting hot. But he's the first guy I think about right now. I look at Edmonton and I'm like, you're not going anywhere with that blue line.

You have Quinn Hughes. They have problems in that decor. Bouchard struggled the other night. Yeah. Mightily. Mightily. And I look at that. It's a conversation.

I look at every mock Four Nations face-off thing, and they're all penciling him in there. I like Josh Morrissey in Winnipeg. I do like him for sure but he can't do what nobody can do what hughes can do in vancouver yeah i completely agree uh so then this is a perfect follow-up to that should quinn hughes be in the heart conversation yes yeah yes okay pretty easy one here's one for you. Very easy. This is random, but hey, Nick, what was your favorite cereal while playing for the Centennials from Justin? Do you have any idea what that means?

Oh, my gosh. Yeah, that could be a Justin that I lived with. Okay. I don't know. What was the? I don't know. What did I eat, Justin? I don't know what I had this morning for breakfast.

You're asking me something that happened 40 years ago. Yeah. With extra peppers. Not a Frosted Flake guy. Not a... I don't know. No, no idea? Maybe he's just pulling my leg a little bit on that one.

Boys, Gretzky played in the conference finals in New York in 97 versus Philadelphia. He was a big reason the Rangers got there. Have a nice weekend. Love the show. Steve from Dundas. So that's a response to us talking about him bouncing around. But when you close your eyes, I guess you still would say Oilers. But I was too young, right?

Oilers. For me, it's... Just Oilers. For me... I still think, if I close too young, right? Oilers. For me, it's... Just Oilers. For me... In the height, in the... I still think, if I close my eyes, the first thing I see, because I was a kid, I still think Rangers. You do, hey?

I do, yeah. Because I wasn't like... It's a generational thing. I remember how big of a deal his last game was, and it was a nationally broadcast event, and him using every different stick and the whole pomp and circumstance of it. And he got an assist in that game, I remember. Maybe he went to Otad.

Jager scored the overtime winner. Anyways, there you go. Final over-under for JR's speech. Love the interview, Jeremy from Weaver. Over-under on six and a half minutes? Yeah. Over. Oh, yeah. Over. I'll be disappointed half minutes? Yeah. Over. Oh, yeah.

Over. I'll be disappointed if it's not. Here's a good one. Will Ovi retire once he breaks Gretzky's record? I don't think so. No. I think he's, I think he, he's, what's a thousand? A thousand. Yes. No way. I think he wants 1,000. 1,000?

Yes. No way. I'm telling you, that's him. Oh, my God. That's him. So we had a little conversation with this today in the room. He wants to play. But you don't think there's any world where he wants to just get this over with?

That's why he's lighting it up? And then he can go back and play for SKA Moscow or whatever? We've watched over 800 goals we've watched the way he celebrated like it's his first one you're right you do not there's no faking that emotion after he scores a goal it's his drug yeah you're right so this guy if he's feeling good he's gonna go for a thousand a thousand is insane like that's what's the record 98 94 yeah and what's what is that for him he thinks he can do it in two more years which would take him to what 41 yeah at 42 just to me at some point this has to break down

at some point that this has to stop looking like At some point, this has to stop looking like this. We've been saying that for four years. No, but no. He hasn't been 39 for four years, Kippy. At some point. I'm past thinking there's logic to the way he's built or the way he looks or acts or scores goals. I'm beyond that.

So he can still fire a stinking puck. Yeah, he can shoot it. He can shoot it. He can shoot it in the net. Is there a more important cup for anyone than that one cup that he has in 17-18? It's a life changer. Think about how you'd be talked about without that. But it's a life changer for those guys, you know?

And outside of that, and we'll hear it this weekend with Jeremy Roenick, that he needs a Hall of Fame because it's the closest substitute to missing out on a Stanley Cup. Weber too, right? Weber too. I mean, he got the gold medals for Canada, which is obviously great, but not the Cup. No, not the Cup. Not the Cup. That's the right? Weber too. I mean, he got the gold medals for Canada, which is obviously great, but not the Cup. No, not the Cup.

Not the Cup. That's the hole that will never be filled in their life. And you got one. Stars align, baby, sometimes. Stars align. I love it. All right. All right.

So we're going to see you down there? Yeah, I'm heading down. If you see me, say hello. I'm going to be sitting in the lower bowl. If I happen to pass you and ignore you, is that okay too? Totally fine. Because I hang with big wheels down there. And listen, Kemper, we see each other for three hours a day, five days a week.

I'm perfectly fine with you big wheeling me, buddy. I'm almost scared that if we were beside each other, it'd be like, hey, Sammy, who's that guy beside you? Oh, shut up. It wouldn't be like that. No one's sound. Not here. I've created a monster in a very short period of time with you.

Four years. Created a monster, bud. Anyways. All right. That's great. So our thanks to Naz Kadri in the first hour, JD Bunkus. Seems like a while ago.

And Doug McClain. Got a lot of messages. Good Friday, buddy. Got a lot of messages about the Kadri interview already. If you didn't get it, go to our Leafs hour, listen to it. It was excellent stuff. Candid, great. Get his book, Dreamer.

And please subscribe to us on YouTube. We got a ton of viewers always there. We thank you for your support. And if you get a chance, give us a rating, a review on any of your podcasts. We'd love to hear from you. Have a great, safe weekend everybody. Enjoy the Hall of Fame night. And we're back on Monday.

The Real Kipper and Bourne Show. We'll see you next time.