Real Kyper & Bourne - Hronek Hurt, Tocchet Tested

Episode Date: November 28, 2024

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne bring in Jason Brough (4:11) of Sportsnet 650's Halford & Brough to chat about the Vancouver Canucks' loss to the Pittsburgh Penguins, Filip Hronek's injury, the volatility of their roster, how Rick Tocchet has managed the rotating cast of players, and Erik Brännström's and Arturs Silovs' performances. Then, Nick, Justin and Sam McKee go through the news and notes around the NHL including Patrick Roy's post-game comments about his roster following the New York Islanders' loss to the Boston Bruins and Charlie Lindgren's own goal giving Brayden Point a hat trick.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's take this thing national coast to coast the real kipper and born show we are live on sportsnet 650 in vancouver and sportsnet 960 in calgary this hour of real kipper and born is brought to you by bet 365 nick kipriosiprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee. In a few minutes, we'll welcome in Jason Brough, co-host of Halford and Brough in Vancouver. Plenty to dissect after their loss to Pittsburgh. But more importantly, maybe, is the loss on the blue line, JB. Yeah, I guess we're going to lob that one up for Brough to pound down.

Can I ask you guys, both of you guys have experienced the American Thanksgiving. It's American Thanksgiving today. Happy American Thanksgiving. If you're watching us, listening to us on podcasts or watching on YouTube, thank you for listening and happy Thanksgiving. Yes. So is everything, it's all during the day there?

Yes. So like a full turkey banger ready to go at like noon? No. What time? Three. Oh, okay. So we're like in the nap pension zone right now. 501 ET.

This is like the nap zone when people have been together for too long. Around one o'clock, I'm still home. I'm watching the football game detroit in chicago but i had no interest in coming to work today i just envisioned everybody doing what i was doing i know sitting on the couch munching away waiting for the turkey couple glass of wine you know my wife is proper american and she usually takes off uh you know yankee thank you as we call it and she you know watches the macy's thanksgiving parade and that is like no joke i was downstairs at my desk and i could hear sniffles i was like are you crying she's crying she's what you know this is like a family tradition

this is have you uh gone to the Macy's? No. No, I can't say that. But it's like, it's a big thing. The Thanksgiving parade the whole day. It's a wonderful day. The best. Just one. One time.

Some, you know, Midwestern family. We would love to have you. I would love to do it. One time, baby. Let me just put it on right. One time. Do coaches get fired on American Thanksgiving? The Bears coach might. Oh, my God.

On a Thanksgiving day after a football game? Clock management. I hear he's defending himself by saying he thinks they handled it the right way. If he didn't catch the Lions-Bears game, pretty ugly mess at the end. And we have a monitor in the studio. And did I not say, like, they're in field goal range? They were just outside what was that what is that 52 53 yeah well no they put it around i think they usually put the line at 48 or

49 was the range usually so listen a makeable ring have you watched the guys kick lately yeah well it's been back and forth it's been up and down right yeah okay um so yeah american thanksgiving great stuff and they don't like eberflus, the guy that's the coach. No, it's not. His nickname's Dweeberflus. So, it tells you all I need to know. I also love that they have it on a Thursday, so everyone knows Friday's not a real day.

It's a write-off. Yeah. Do people work on Friday? In theory. No one works. Are you kidding me? No, it's not a real thing. Anyways.

Okay. Dissected that Toronto-Florida game pretty good in our first hour if we look you want a quick comment i was gonna say something cool from last night point something out but if you have a direction let me go coolest thing from last night cole caulfield changes his number to 13 for Johnny Goodrow. Goes into Columbus. Scores. Scores his 13th goal of the season in Columbus. Yeah. Wearing 13.

Love that. Yeah. Pretty cool. Yeah, I feel like there's always a lot of hockey. There's a lot of serendipity with that kind of stuff. Remember when the Sedins, or the next guest we have on here, they scored like an overtime winner, and it was like there was some 22 and 33 sort of significance of significance to it no that's not enough information for me jason brough

if he's on the line he would know he might know that all right all right let's welcome him in jason brough co-host of halford and brough in vancouver monday through friday 6 to 9 a.m on sports at 650 brough what's going on bud how are you uh just uh tryinguffer, what's going on, bud? How are you? Just trying to figure out what's going to happen to the Canucks. It's not looking good right now, guys. Hey, what the hell is Sam talking about, Ruff? I

don't know. I didn't hear it. Oh, okay. There's something with the, sorry, there's something with the Sedins when they the last game they played or there was like something with 22 and 20 33 like the the time into the overtime that a goal was scored am i crazy here did that happen that kind of rings a bell but i'm not exactly sure they did have their their final their final home game it wasn't their final uh game but there was their final home game they played florida and

they scored an incredible overtime goal together. And it was actually one of the best moments I've ever been in Rogers Arena. I don't remember what the 22-33 was. There wasn't 22-33 left on the clock, probably. Oh, stop. Yeah, I think that was it. Yeah, that was it.

Yeah, for sure. Okay. So, where are we with Hronik last night leaving the hockey game? And quite the distraction is his injury outside of you guys really lost to the Pittsburgh Penguins. Yeah. I mean, that was a bad one last night. But, you know, the Canucks, I don't want to say we could see it coming, but any time Arter Seelovs is in there this season,

it's a bit of a wild card, and they let the first shot in again against Pittsburgh, and then there were some pretty bad breakdowns, and, you know, it got out of hand pretty early. They made it interesting in the end, but when you finish the first period and you're down 4-1, I don't care who you're playing. It's going to be hard to win that game.

You mentioned Hronik there. There are four pretty big issues facing the Canucks. I think four. One is the goaltending, and Demko's still not back. I don't know when he's going to play. Maybe the first home game so they got three more games on the road and then they play columbus december 6th and some people are kind of targeting that but we don't know if he's going to be good we don't know what the impact of his

injury is i imagine it's going to be pretty tough to just start you know start a season without training camp and you're just thrown in there um especially with the blue line and that's kind of issue number two uh the blue line was in trouble before heronic went out and we didn't uh we didn't know until uh elliot reported it after our show that heronic was going to be out a while but it didn't look good at that end of that pittsburgh game and maybe we didn't talk about it much on our show because we just couldn't fathom the idea of a of a right side with you know like we're looking at a right side of Tyler Myers uh Noah Juleson and Dave and David Vinnie Darnay who hasn't even been able to get into the lineup um they just called up Mark Friedman who is an you know an AHL guy but the right side of their their blue line is is in big trouble so that's kind of side of their blue line is in big trouble.

So that's kind of issue number two. Number three is the big elephant in the room with JT Miller taking a leave of absence. And we don't know when he's going to be back. We don't know much of anything about that story. And I would say issue number four is Pedersen still, like he's producing, but he's not back back. Like he's not at the peak of his powers yet. He still looks off.

His skating doesn't look right um so you know it's gonna be tough it's survival mode for the canucks now so just just to just to stay on uh philip aronix injury here like who who's next man up it myers is that yeah well i mean look aronix has been with hughes as a pair ever since he came to vancouver they've they've never really experimented with anything else and it's kind of like uh if it's not broken don't you know don't bother fixing it but you know there has been thoughts here and there like maybe you spread the wealth out a little bit because the first pair has been good,

but this year the other two pairs have not been good. You know, Susie and Myers have not been good. So it could be that you put Hughes with Juleson and maybe Susie and Myers are together again. I mean, they broke them up for a bit because they were so bad, but, you know, it's in a lot of ways, it's rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic because you've got Hughes and five guys, basically.

That's the way it's looking right now. And, you know, there were lots of people saying, oh, they got to make a trade. They got to make a trade to get another defenseman in. And now you're in this situation. I'm just like my god it's even worse like heronic if it wasn't hughes if it wasn't hughes heronic might be the last guy they could lose after considering all they were going through yeah pretty serious stuff um just for

everyone's clarifying sam um our boy jovo did text in and said that uh in the final game daniel scored an assist by henrik to tie the game 33 seconds into the second period. Daniel scored again on an assist by Henrik at 233 of overtime. Okay, all right. There was a little something there. Yes. So, you know, interesting thing. Like a team in the NHL, the separating factors are the stars.

They only go as their stars go. You mentioned Pederson is having a tough time miller is the one that no one's really sure of um before the show today sammy was reading me a couple things that people said that like you know there's some miller and petterson don't always get along you know is is there anything to that we're grasping at straws here trying to make sense of what happened what's happening in vancouver yeah you know i don't want to i don't want to speculate too much about gtT. Miller's absence right now. But, yeah, I mean, those guys, they've admitted they're different people.

They've admitted that they've had to work on their relationship. I mean, I hear their interviews, and I'm like, are you guys in marriage counseling or what's going on here? Like, I've got to work on our relationship. But, yeah, I mean, that's always been, you know, that's always been known. Yeah. But, you know, we just assume, like, hey, you don't get along with everyone you work with, but you should respect each other and you should be able to work together. But I don't know, man.

Like, Pedersen's slump was, I mean, Bourne, you know. I texted you a few times. I'm like, I've seen slumps before, but this one is something pretty odd. And then JT Miller's absence, I mean, you know, I hope he's doing okay, but it's odd, right? You know, you don't see guys just being like, I'm going to take a leave. I mean, you see it if they go into the NHL, NHLPA program, but he hasn't. He's just kind of like, you know, like either him or the team has said, we need to cool off.

And Patrick Alveen, I mean, the Canucks have been very tight-lipped about it, but Patrick Alveen and the few comments that he said, he's like, well, we're just happy JT is getting help. Right. And so it kind of lends, well, you know, everyone's curious. We're trying to respect it, but it's like help for what? You know, so, you know, that's the weird thing about, you know, these athletes, like we don't really have a right to know what's going on

with their lives, but we're sure curious. Yeah. But we do know that if the help is significant enough that it's going to pull you away from work where someone's paying you nine million dollars it's significant and the tendency on help is no one really gets it in two weeks or three weeks sure it takes time right yeah we're not sure what sort of length we're looking at predicament to be in so let me ask you brufford just in terms of rick talkett and all these dynamic storylines how's he managing it he can be an emotional guy i've seen it i've known him a long time just how's he handling it i think he's trying to keep his composure because i think he

knows that if he flies off the handle at least publicly then everyone's going to start to panic um you know i think that's pretty important for a coach to maintain composure but you know i think he he's frustrated um but it's like one of those problems when you go over the defense, there's no great solution. And with Hronik out now, you know, I don't know if Quinn Hughes can play the entire game, but he's going to be playing a lot of minutes. And then you run the risk of like,

are you going to overplay Hughes too much? You know, Tockett had great success last season and he brought respectability back to the Canucks. He really simplified their game defensively. He kind of did the things that I imagine a lot of Ottawa Senators, Sam, were hoping to happen this year with Travis Green, and we'll see if Travis Green can have some success there. But they were an immature team before Rick Tockett showed up.

They would make really dumb mistakes, especially defensively. They wouldn't handle the ups and downs very well. And then last season came and it kind of came out of the blue. And everything was going right for them, especially in the first half of the season. And then a few things started to go wrong petterson had his slump and oh hello awesome i think he just disappeared he disappeared dropped call sammy on an incredible record i think that might be like literally the first one of the year. Yeah. We didn't even, the thump. No, it was such a mild drop.

We didn't get the thump. Who was it that we had on that was three separate and one phone call? Oh, yeah, that was tough. Kevin Kurz. He kept insisting on calling him back. It was like 70% of our guests two years ago. It was the old studio. It was the old studio.

We're in the big professional studio now so it's it's really interesting and i thought jason did a great job it's not against the law to talk about jt miller who is a public professional athlete it people it's in poor taste to speculate i guess about what's happening we don't know it really is though uh to the public all that you need to know is he's gone because he's working on something yeah personally yeah that's enough yeah it's enough yeah but i guess where there's an information void it gets filled i think the problem is and again you know sammy has made this clear and i'm starting to kind of weigh in a little bit on expectations from the public.

And you brought this up with Matthews. He just disappears, and it's like day to day, and it's like, oh, no, no, this is three weeks here. So I don't think that Vancouver has done that with Miller, but this is not everybody's scenario at work, right? Nobody pays to go see Pat Flash at her desk, you know, upstairs. You know what I'm saying? We love Pat.

But, like, no one's paying $200 to go see her or there's an expectation. These guys get watched and people are making big commitments. Do you think they're comparable situations? To me, one is where the Leafs are being purposely quiet about something and very kind of, I don't want to go as far as to say deceiving, where they're just like, hey, it's day-to-day. Now he's on an intercontinental flight. With JT Miller, it's more like, hey, he needs some time. He's going to go.

We do have Jason Brough back with us. Brough, do you remember where you left off, or do you want a new question? Pocket trying to keep his composure. Respectability back to the team, and now we're wondering what he's going to do. Yeah. You know, we talked about all those D,

and we didn't even mention a guy who who i i read called branch eyes in someone's article the other day you guys big eric brandstrom fans or what he's not helping out and he is but i think it's one of those things where it was a nice he was a nice story not was he's a nice story but he's not the solution okay you know he he's he's he added some puck moving and the Canucks needed some puck moving and he's been good. But, you know, like we have a saying and we used to say this about Alex Biega. Remember him? We used to say you don't want to get drunk on Biega.

And, you know, we don't want to get drunk on Eric Branstrom. He's brought something good to the team, but he's probably a 6 or 7 guy. He's not going to solve it, but he's playing with enthusiasm and he's playing with speed and some confidence, so I'm sure he's going to be needed over the next little while.

Leaves Nation is funneling Grabenkin over here. Just absolutely beer funneling. Is it hard to gauge where Vancouver is with so many teams underneath them, either struggling or just battling, battling consistency? Yeah, it is.

It's tough right now. I think it's, for some reason, it seems hard to get a handle on the league right now, but I think the Canucks, especially they've had a pretty soft schedule, if we're being honest. You know, typically if you'd have a back-to-back in Boston and in Pittsburgh, you'd be worried about it.

But this season's a little bit different. You know, they beat boston but boston controlled play and lankanen who's been one of the good stories in vancouver this season played really well in that one and then the next night they didn't play so well but not altogether different but they just didn't get the saves from silas so silas is uh you know last year was a revelation it seemed like this is not uh gone as planned is there need to find a solution there just hope he plays his way through it i think the solution is just demko coming back yeah hopefully the solution is silas needs to go down to the ahl and there was an there was an element of getting drunk on silas last

season too like his overall numbers weren't spectacular. He was just put in a really tough position, and for a young guy, he performed well. But he wasn't perfect. And I still wonder how that series could have gone if for a few different things, like Demko being in there and Pedersen playing well, but it didn't happen for the Canucks, and the Oilers deserve to win that

series. But she loves is a super young guy. And for him to be put in this position, you know, those feelings, you know, those times you're watching a player and you feel badly for them. It's not just like,

it's not just like you're mad at them. You just feel badly for them. And, and I just, I felt badly for CLOBS last night. The Canucks needed him to be good. He wasn't. And I don't know if he's going to get another game with the Canucks

before Demko is back. And when Demko is back, they'll keep Demko, obviously, and Lankanen. That'll be their tandem, and Seelov will go down to the AHL. I am nervous. Whenever Demko does come back to play, this one's got me nervous. I don't know about how you feel, Ruffer, or just the rest of the market in particular, but this has been one of the stranger storylines, injury storylines, again, that I've probably seen in my broadcasting career that I'm like, okay, what's the problem?

I get it that a guy can't play in the playoffs early, but to fight through it and then go into the season with question marks and just this waiting out period now, even in the last week, 10 days where you're like, you're thinking you're going to get them and you don't get them. And it's like, why is there, is there a setback? Is there more swelling? Is there something going on that they cannot get right?

Like, I think they're just waiting a long time. And Demko had some interesting comments actually. He said like, I want to put this knee through hell in practice because I don't want to have a setback. I don't want to come in and it's two weeks and I have to leave it. But to your point, it's going to be terrifying. It's going to be terrifying. And anytime he, he makes a acrobatic saver, anytime there's a gold mouth pile up, you know, and guys are jabbing away at the puck.

You know, it's hilarious, actually. And, like, his injury came out. And have you guys ever heard of the popliteus? Not until we literally had a doctor on to tell us about it. Yeah, I'd never heard of that. And it's very Canucks that their star goalie gets this pop Latias injury. And, you know, everyone's saying like, we've, we searched the world and no hockey player has ever had this injury before. So, yeah, I mean, you know, it's, it's a, it's a weird injury.

And I don't know how it's going to respond. I don't know how he's going to be. There's also the fact that his goalie coach isn't really with the organization anymore, certainly not on a day-to-day basis. So that's another factor in all this. What happened there? That's another good question.

I think there was a difference in philosophy between Ian Clark and management, but Ian Clark was also getting older and I think his body was wearing down a little bit so he didn't want to do the day-to-day of the goalie coaching but you know my whole point earlier on is like all this stuff has happened to the Canucks after last season was a real dream season and the vibes this year are just very, very different, and I think we're just going to find out what a lot of these guys are made of.

And for me, a lot of it starts with Pedersen because he's going to have to be a lot better. They're going to rely on him. Quinn Hughes has been really good. He scored an amazing goal against Pittsburgh. There's been times where he's put the team on his back. They need Pedersen to do that too. And when Miller's back, he needs to be good,. And when Miller's back, he needs to be good. And when Demko's back, he needs to be good.

They're in it right now. These next few weeks, it is survival mode for these guys. And it's fortunate for them that they haven't had a disastrous start to the season in terms of wins and losses. They've actually won seven or eight in a row on the road. And they had some dreadful performances at home. So it's been a pretty weird season here, boys. Jason, just one more for me.

And just to add to that pressure on Alvin and Rutherford here. And like, do they have the luxury to kind of wait out and see what the blue line looks like without Hronik? Or do just have to go out there and and find something in the next 48 72 hours if not sooner well not to bail on the question but it probably just depends on the deal you know uh they did bring in the door off early last season when carsonie got hurt. And I think there was a feeling like the vibe here is really good. Let's not let an injury derail things. But if we're being honest, things have kind of already derailed this season. So they've got a decision to make whether or not they just try and survive

and pick up wins here and there, maybe force a few games to overtime, get a point here and there. Because everyone knows it's not easy to pick up defensemen in the NHL. It's expensive. And the position the Canucks are in right now, there isn't going to be anyone just granting them a great defenseman. It's, you know, you guys in Toronto know

it's hard to find good defense. Everyone knows. Edmonton, Toronto, everyone knows. It's hard to find good defense. Everyone knows. Edmonton, Toronto, everyone knows it's hard to find good defense. Ten years. Yeah, right? Like, it's really, really difficult. It's why you've got to draft and develop these guys. The Canucks do have a bunch of younger players in the system,

but they're not ready to make an impact right now. So it's a tough situation for Jim Rutherford and Patrick Galvin. But, you know, based on their track record, they're not weight around guys. They like to do things, so if I were to bet, I would think there's going to be something coming

soon. The question is, how big is the deal? You're going to hear him Monday through Fridays on Sportsnet 650 in Vancouver, co-host of the Halford and Brough show. Jason, thanks for doing this, pal. Thanks, guys. Thanks, buddy.

Appreciate your time. Bye. Bye. Yeah. Spectacular radio show, by the way. That is a very good radio show. Yeah, they know the Canucks real well. I was just going to say say just he mentioned it like how many teams

need so much help on the blue line and vancouver and edmonton are two of the top we've watched toronto over the years everybody's saying like if not one two two three defensemen away from winning can i say something scary i don't feel like that with ronald this year you feel like they're all right they went out got two that's what i mean yeah capable guys that could play 20 minutes a night i know but at 23 i think last night uh eckman larson played the most at least like two minutes if you're gonna power rank the guys they could lose on that team for an extended period of time ronick is at the bottom of that list by the way is that not like the massive like black mark on eiserman in detroit what they gave up on this guy ronick is currently 27 and he's

played what two years now with vancouver yeah i mean he's been i don't want to pay him didn't want to pay him well he had other had to get him. Well, he had other. Had to get Sherrod in there. He had other guys he wanted to pay. Because you're paying Sherrod and Justin Hall so you can't do it? And Jeff Petrie. Holy smokes. Like, that's a bad look, Kip. Yeah, it's tough. These young kids that he knew they were going to get squeezed on real fast

with another contract that they've all jumped to $8 million, $8.5. Great. So is Hronik. Yeah. You know, he's worth it. He's getting value with that money. So that's a pretty big pickup for the Canucks.

But Shelob's being a, what did you say his save percentage was? 840 something? Yeah. Not pretty. 847, I think. You're giving it to S all day long then you are ironic yeah you can have both though right can you yeah oh i right-handed shot yeah well let's i don't want to get too into detroit here but they are paying yeah so cider makes eight and a

half but then it's ben charotte it makes five a year you know 4, 4.75. What's Petrie at? Petrie is at 2.4. Justin Hall is at 3.4. Eric Gustafson, who can barely play with the Leafs, is making two. Anyway, it's just not the best. It's the drilled suite of Odom spending $3,600 a month on candles. Someone help me. My family's dying. That's what the Red Wings have done with their decor.

Anything else before game time no all right it's game time presented my bet three six five so hold on for a second so there's something else right before we did game time yesterday oh i said do you want it you said do you want to go and i you say you want to do game time and i said yeah let her rip and then you made like a fart sound with your computer it was and everybody thought you let one go it was with the papers if you did that was a high pitch weaker on somehow and i pulled a paper out from under underneath this and it made a cartoon fart i don't know i don't know how it happened derrick it's on my twitter at least that's your story and you're sticking to it.

You never sneezed on air. I've never ripped on air. I can rip if you want me to. No, no, no, no. Let's just keep our streaks alive. Thanksgiving dinner? I was going to say bowl ice cream. We'll get it done.

All right. It's game time presented by Bet365. Visit the app, play the stocks, and find out why it's never ordinary. Bet365 must be 19+. Terry will only please play responsibly. So no NHL, obviously. Everybody gets out of the way for the NFL, the massive NFL. But tonight, there's actually a really good game,

the third game of the three traditional on Thanksgiving in the States is the Miami Dolphins, who are all of a sudden back in the playoff picture against the Green Bay Packers at Lambeau Field. The Packers are big favorites, minus 185, two a tug of Viola in cold weather games that are under 40 degrees. I think he's like 1-4 or 0-5, hates the cold weather. So give me the Packers, minus 3.5 tonight, to take down the Finns at Lambeau Field.

In a weird Black Friday game tomorrow, the Kansas City Chiefs are hosting the Las Vegas Raiders. They are minus 800 to win the game. That's insane. Minus 800 to win the game. They are 13-point favorites. If you want to, you know, waste some money, you could bet on the Vegas Raiders at plus 550.

And there's a bunch of afternoon action tomorrow in the NHL. There is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 afternoon games tomorrow afternoon. There'll be a ton of hockey on Weller's show. Is there night games as well?

There is a few night games as well. Lots of hockey tomorrow. I'm going to watch those games. You guys work tomorrow. We'll just watch them in here and never can watch them with us. I've seen some people have watch-alongs. We can do that. Who are we going to talk to tomorrow? Everybody's just watching hockey.

We're doing a hockey show and every team's playing. You're telling me that there are people dumb enough to watch people watching hockey live. No comment. And that was game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app, latest odds, and find out why it's never an ordinary. Bet365.

It's been 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Do you know, every year since I've lived in Toronto, so 12 years, I have bet my friend that the Jets will finish with a better record than the Dolphins. And you've never won. I have never won. You're like the Lions on Thanksgiving Day before today.

I just detest the Jets, and I cheer for them. Yeah, they're a tough unit. Listen, I'm wrong a lot. They're a tough unit to cheer for these days. They're really bad. Okay, we'll take a quick break, and when we return, we'll get into our news and notes, including... Patrick Watt.

Yeah, we'll talk a little Patrick Watt. Also, when we ended our Leaf Edition hour, I mentioned to you about penalty shots, and I got this radical idea, and I want to run it by you guys. We're going to hawk some merch, too. We're going to hawk some merch. What was that? Do I just hear something in my ear, like a voice?

Let her rip. All right. Let her rip. That little squeak sound. Can we hear it once more? Let her rip. All right. Let her rip. That little squeak sound. Can we hear it once more? Let her rip. All right. That is so gross.

Class. What was that one? Class, class, class. No, that was from, that was like during somebody's scrum. Wasn't that Vasilevsky? Someone ripped a huge fart during it. That was in our first couple of years. We laughed so hard at that.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I brought it up. It's Thanksgiving. It's everyone's house right now. Okay. When we return, more Real Kipper and Born. Hey, it's Ben Ennis.

And I'm Brent Cunning. We got you covered on all things Leafs, Raptors, and Blue Jays every weekday morning, six to nine. It's the Fan Morning Show. Sportsnet 590 The Fan and wherever you get your podcasts. Last block here on the Real Kipper and Born Show. Nick Kiprios, Justin

Bourne, Sammy McKee. Reminder, this hour of Real Kipper and Born brought to you by Bet365. As we get a little into what's going on around the league. I'm thankful for Bet365 because they've been a good sponsor for us. Thank you. But I'm also thankful for you guys. What else are you thankful for?

Rogers is happy. Yeah. Listen, if they're happy, I'm happy. I'm here. Every day. Just say happy. I'm here. Every day, the key card. Just say it. We're thankful we got jobs. Every day, the key card works, boys.

It's a great day for me. Yes, plenty to be thankful for. Yes, sir. So what's going on with your New York Islanders? Because they gave up, I think, six to the Boston Bruins, and nobody has given up five or six to the Boston Bruins, which made Patrick Waugh's comments rather interesting. You know, they don't have the horses.

They have one injured guy, and all of a sudden they can't create any offense. I think when you're a coach, frustrating when're like take the leafs last night when you don't have the bodies and you're chasing a game you're just like what am i supposed to do so uh why don't we play patrick was thoughts on yeah let's do that the new york islanders i mean i love these guys they work hard for me mean, every night, I mean, they're there, they're pushing. No, it's the team that Lou gave me, and I'm going to work extremely hard for these guys. And I owe this to the players and to our fans. Make sure that we compete every night.

It's the team that Lou gave me. Whoa. That's a what am I supposed to do with this? I mean, how would you have liked to have heard me say after our first year of our show together, yeah, they gave me Justin Bourne and Sammy McKee. No one's listening, but like. Look.

That's what they gave me. pure engvall for seven years okay so do you think that that was calculated by patrick watt because it's hard to think that a lot of things aren't or was that just a reaction to a frustrating lineup to coach. I think he's an emotional guy. I don't think that's premeditated. Do you? That would be a much bigger statement if it was. Well, what is the statement there that you put a lousy team together? I imagine if it were premeditated,

it would come on the backs of conversations where Waugh's going, you got to get me someone. I need a scorer. I need some speed. speed you gotta help us out and lou saying oh well we have time so use it and it's an orchestra and everyone's got to play a different instrument patrick was going jam your head into tuba and trade me trade a defenseman to our team like something's gonna have to give it's not a good lineup boys let's lose age at this point fellas 80 mo riello 182 he is 82 years of age like at some point not to be ageist

i'm just saying you know like it's getting up there. It's up there. I know he's a sharp guy, and he's been around the league and all that. Do you think there's any shot that they push Lou out and let Patrick go in there? Oh, both jobs. I think Lou wants to, like a monarchy, hand it off to Chris Lamorello. I don't know if he's around.

Is he not the AGM there? Is that acceptable for people to think that Lou is behind the scenes still, even if he's not there? No. Yeah, you're right. I think that would lead to some potential distrust. Now, the feeling after the last few years that Patrick was away, that he just wanted to coach. That's it.

I'm a coach. I feel a butt coming on. And I don't want to get involved in the other stuff. And there is, of course, those last years in Colorado where there was a sense that he was trying to make general manager decisions or at least tell them what he wanted and needed. I'm not saying that that never happens with any of them, but that's the but is could you see that i just don't think you can do

it today oh you like him be gm and coach pat quinnett going back in there i don't think it works like it's just it's a huge job does he even want that influence anymore it seemed to have not helped him at the end in colorado i listen i work my only experience is working with sheldon keith as a head coach and i that man grinded from 6 a.m he's watching video at night he's talking to players during the day he's drawing up practice plans talking to the development team you know like i can't imagine then being like let's also talk you know go to the gm meetings call around the league like i just can't i don't think there's time anymore the jobs are too big to your point he's coming from the queue where he is cup yeah and but like he literally not a decision gets made under the ramparts umbrella that doesn't get

like run through patrick waugh like he is the ultimate decision maker he builds the team he coaches the team he oh like everything is patrick waugh and i'm sure there's an element he gets hired by lou when it first comes they have a great run under him and he's like yeah this is fine but when adversity pops up you start to revert to back to like well you know i could probably do this better i could probably do this and i'm sure there's part of them that thinks like i could build a better team than old lou but but do you know successful athletes they might have ego yes i don't know about patrick waugh There's part of him that thinks like, yeah, I could build a better team than old Lou, but that might not be true. But do you know any former successful athletes? They might have egos.

Yes. I don't know about Patrick Waugh. He's very successful. He was very good at goalie-ing. So I don't know. It's an interesting one. It seems a little bit combustible to me. I mean, I watched this while I was looking for that clip.

I watched his press conference from the game. My man's agitated. Like, we're getting back to old Patrick Waugh here. And I know that for years, some people in ownership have had Lamarilla questions, so. We'll see. All right, we got a couple other big storylines here. Where do you want to go, JV?

Do you want to do the empty net thing? Do you have that in front of you? I do. No, no, no. Okay. Can we just... Okay. I want to get this in.

Okay. Because you were working last night. You must have seen the Charlie Lindgren goal. Oh, my God. Okay. I had to watch it again like twice, maybe three times. Yeah. He didn't even really heal it.

I don't think I've ever seen a worse goal. twice, maybe three times. He didn't even really heal it. I don't think I've ever seen a worse goal. That's the worst own goal of all time. In NHL history, yeah. Number one. Obviously, the stakes and all that, it's not the same. It's not Steve Smith. No, no, it's not Steve Smith.

It's not Chris Phillips. It's not any of those. It's tied with Patrick Steffen missing the empty net. The biggest gas. And then the Oilers coming back. But that's made worse because the empty net. The biggest gas. And then the Oilers coming back. But that's made worse because the other team does a great thing. This is just you doing it all yourself. If you haven't seen it, go find a clip of Charlie Lindgren has the puck in front of his net. Oh, the clip.

Oh, the clip. He's going to wrap it behind his net. He just shoots it in his net. You can go to any. Oh, he put it it behind his net. He just shoots it in his net. You can go to any. You can go to any learn to play hockey program around the world. And I don't think you're going to see a worse goal than that. No. You need a certain set of skills to even be able to pull that off.

And you want to know something? I got a chance to talk to Charlie Lindgren about a year and a half ago at Washington Capitals alumni. Yeah. Maybe one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. So engaging. So nice. I just felt so bad for him there. The boys picked him up. No, there's no but. They got the. But the boys picked him up.

No, there's no but. They got the W. The boys picked him up. They bailed him out. Yeah. That's team building. You think back to one of the other great goalie gaffes of all time was Vesa Toskalo.

Was it Sutton that scored on him from the other end of the night? Yeah, but that was a bounce, a bounce, a bounce. But they got the win that night, too. No one ever talks about that. So they still got the win. That wasn't that far off from what we saw with flurry mark andre flurry earlier this week no but that is the worst like you know not like i said no stakes no anything involved if you're just in the third period yeah but it's a regular season steve smith was in a you know yeah did you ever play goal for

your your team yeah in practice yeah okay the equipment's crazy it's impossible it's like sucks it can't even like can you imagine now spinning around and feeling like you've got your balance and your equilibrium and all of that like i could see that happening not to not to him but to me yeah right but just you usually err on the side of caution he's like i'm gonna what if that works from that angle it's a tight bank back out the other side in front of his net again i went in that like recently like within the last year our goalie blew it is growing and he's like someone's gonna go or the game's gonna end i was like all right i guess i'll go justin pogey in there what horrible why would

anybody choose to do that it's the worst thing and to be able to handle it. Do you know Andrew Brewer, who writes for Sportsnet.ca? He has three boys, and they're all goalies. Oh, my God. I can't think of anything worse. Ken Reed's a goalie dad, too. Yeah. He's got a group of one. Yeah, I know.

Three's crazy. Three's crazy. Crazy. Okay, so you've got a story on Sportsnet.ca about empty netters? No, it's actually on the Daily Faceoff. It's not by me. Paul Paduti wrote it, and it is on the trend of empty netters? No, it's actually on the Daily Faceoff. It's not by me. Paul Paduti wrote it, and it is on the trend of empty net goals

and its effect on scoring races around the NHL. So back in the 05-06 lockout, there was 0.14 empty net goals a game. Here's what you need to know. Every about 45th goal in the league was an empty netter. Now, every 14th goal in the league is an empty netter way way way up we're up to 0.42 goals per game as empty netters a couple things are the reason for that one is goal uh wah had something to do with this goalies are pulled earlier now because of

analytics they think it it helps the other is analytics have said that you can shoot from your own end and the value of ending the game with an empty netter is worth the risk of icing the pocket because your arrow you probably chipped it out right like you didn't shoot for the empty net from the your side of the red yeah it was um taboo it was really bad and it was like a selfish thing selfish greedy nobody wanted to face off off of an empty net goal right so now they're shooting for it what's really changed is it's not the guys going out there to protect the lead like let's say your team's up two they're not putting out your best defensive forwards your bottom line guys now it's

these top end guys the guy in the past three years going back to what is that, 21, 22? Jake Gensel has 30 empty net points. 30 empty net points? Last year, everyone's like, March or so had 42 goals. Seven were empty netters. You know what drives me nuts, too? 30 empty net points is great. Cooch had 14 last year, won him the Art Ross Trophy.

In my era, like, if you're 2-1 and you pull the goalie, and now they're doing it with four minutes to go, and then it goes up, and then you score the empty net goal, and it's 3-1. You put the goalie back in, and you quietly tip your hat. Thank you for the match. No, they keep the goalie out at 3-1, 4-1, and it's like. Ruby did it last night.

They were down 4-1. They were down 3-1. They had no chance i'd rather lose three one than five one but like logically it doesn't matter no it doesn't right it does no but it doesn't it doesn't actually but logic isn't always wow i was gonna say the dumbest i was gonna say logic isn't always correct but that's that's not that is my old school mentality is i think three one's a lot more respectable than 5-1. Maybe there is something to it,

like your team's mentally gets out of the game in a closer game. I don't know what it is. But, yeah, so last year, Kucherov had 14 empty net points, and that led, that took him to the Art Ross Trophy. Aren't the Leafs really low on this? Really low. Marner had the most with just three. Last year.

Which is way, way, way, way, way down. Yeah, Matthews had two. Wow. So they don't get a ton of empty net points. That's fascinating. Okay, early in the show, we were talking about penalty shots, right? Yeah. Oh, yeah, right.

Okay. What's the rule? My radical idea is that you draw a penalty, and you always have an option of taking a penalty shot or going to the two minutes. Yeah. Do you think people would of taking a penalty shot or going to the two minutes. Yeah. Do you think people would automatically take a penalty shot? I think depending on the player.

Yeah. Or the goalie. Yeah. So, like, regardless, so it's like two minutes for a hook in the corner, no bearing on the play. You either get a penalty shot. No, no, no. Are you saying every penalty goal?

Everyone. Oh, that's nonsense. So I'm just saying, what would you rather what would you rather have if you got a goalie that has an impeccable like shootout record shootout record you wouldn't lend towards just killing a two minute momentum kind of situation the uh it'd be interesting late in games when you like last, last night Nylander takes a four-minute penalty with five minutes left. Maybe you say, take the two shots. We want our goalie to save it and keep us in the game.

I think about 32% of penalty shots go in and 20% of power plays end up in goals. So you would take the shot is the point. But that's based on sending great shooters. So if it's like you got to send who's hauled down. I love the idea. I love the idea of getting to choose a penalty shot or a power play. At some point.

Like on a breakaway. Yeah. Like you get called. Like three minutes left in the game. You get hauled down. Your team's up. We'd rather have the power play. We'd rather rag the puck.

You know. Now we're spitballing. Like if someone said you could really do that, I'm like, are you nuts? Yeah. Are you crazy? He's a game alone. Are you crazy? Yeah.

All right. So listen, we got early gifts. Look at these things here. These are playing cards. Real Kipper and Bourne playing cards that you could get from the playingcardfactory.com The best part is our faces are legitimately on them. So look at this. This is just pretty cool.

So they're just playing cards. What's the gentleman's name? Thank you to the gentleman who did these. We really appreciate it. I'm on the king. I couldn't help but notice that you're on all the kings and I'm on all the queens. All the kings. Hold on.

Where's JB? I'm the queen of the cast. Queen of the cast. And the Jacks. The Jacks are Sammy. Oh, I love it. What is that? I don't know where they found any of the pictures. It's incredible.

This is where they really got us right. Three Jokers. Group of Jokers. Oh, I love it. Three Jokers. I love that. That was the playing card factory. There you go.

All right, thanks to them. Nice gifts. Really cool. God, now I hope my wife's not watching. She'll know her gift. I got to tell you, I was definitely going to give a pair to my parents. Not as their only gift, but they were going to get something, but now they know.

You know who won't know is my son. Oh, yeah, that's true. We may end up getting them. So all quiet tonight, no games tonight. So what are we going to do tomorrow? I think they should just go head-to-head against the NFL. Yeah, jump up and try to contest the dunk. Just start now.

Start. Who's the NFL to compare to the NHL? Oh, yeah. You don't want that answer. You don't want that answer. Yeah. You guys went heavy last night, even on the Team Canada stuff. Yeah.

I think people are starting to really get excited. David Amber is. Oh, he's so fired up. He loves it. Me and DA should do Team Canada. I actually don't disagree with that. You guys should be like the reaction pod you know we all we talk about is that i want haggle they were talking about what

was the this or that was it this or that what was it called yeah take your pick yeah and it was haggle and who was the other choice i can't remember tampa bay record for assists five assists in a period last game i think yeah he leads them in penalty kill and ice time he's like their play driver gonna be hard for me to cheer for him yeah yeah he's on my short he's ratty in a good he's on Last game, I think, yeah. He leads them in penalty kill and ice time. He's like their play driver. It's going to be hard for me to cheer for him. Yeah? Yeah, he's on my short list. He's ratty in a good way.

He's on my short list. Yeah. I think Wilson's the big one that I'm not sure about because I think Canadians want a big, strong, four-checking bass. Thought Bennett looked awesome last night. You know? Bennett looked awesome. But I just don't know if he's inside the line for me.

Listen, go back to like i think it was team canada 91 eric lindros six foot four to what 25 230 and he must have been not much than 21 or 22 years old ran everything in sight that's what they need he was also like you know offensively elite. Yeah, he was amazing. All right, thanks for watching. We're back tomorrow on Real Kip Rimborn. Have a great night, everybody.