Real Kyper & Bourne - Inside the Front Office with Gord Stellick and Brian Lawton

Episode Date: May 13, 2026

Former Leafs GM and fill-in host Gord Stellick joins Nick Kypreos and Sam McKee to kick off the second hour, and he shares his reaction to Craig Berube's dismissal in Toronto. Then, former NHL player, executive and agent Brian Lawton (8:30) gives his take on the Oilers' leaked request to interview Bruce Cassidy before making a public decision on Kris Knoblauch, which team Cassidy fits best with, and how much influence star players have on franchise decisions in today's NHL. Later, Nick, Gord and Sam discuss Buffalo's disallowed goal after a 12-minute review, whether their fluky goal off the stanchion can be a series-turning point, and the Sedin twins emerging as an option to be co-Presidents in Vancouver. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

The Real Kipprin-Born show. Justin Bourne. Gone. For Gord Stelich, straight up. I hope you like the deal. Nothing against Justin. I'm calling for Freddie Charles in the deal. You know who Freddie Charles is?

No. Future considerations. Oh, okay. Okay. We called it something else. It took me about two years in pro hockey to understand. Freddie Charles. Future could, yeah. I've heard that either.

Yeah, it's fine. It means nothing. We are live on Sportsnet. Sportsnet 650 in Vancouver, 960 in Calgary. And streaming always on Sportsnet. Plus, if you can't catch our show, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, where we always appreciate the chat. And I'm asking them for a big thumbs up for you, Gort Stelach, for joining us.

Well, I appreciate it. So I guess Justin's got, what, a hockey tryout or whatever it is? Or is he on assignment? We're saying he's on assignment. He's doing, he's doing it. He's really starting to get more into the hockey stuff with his boy. Yes. I can see in his eyes.

He's pretty excited about it. He's working on the left wing lock with him in the neutral zone. He's going to scout the next Evar Stenberg. You were a pretty sane hockey parent, right? I seemed to think, right? Yeah. I think you were. I wanted to sit at the top row with my coffee and just be kind of left alone a little bit.

And then the kids would start losing like for nothing. And they'd look at me and go, can you fix that? What are you doing? Go and help them. And I'm like, no, let me just have my coffee. Yeah. I would just say, look, the teams I manage were usually down for nothing. So you're asking the wrong guy. Go bug Kipper over there. This hour of Real Kippenborn brought to by Bet365. In a few minutes, we'll welcome in a former NHL agent, general manager, broadcaster, Brian Lawton.

You've had them on your show numerous times. Yeah. Well versed and well plugged in and everything. I think we'll have some great insight on the recent firing in Toronto and maybe one pending with the Edmonton Oilers. Nothing official yet, Sammy. Nothing official specs alluding to it on X that it could potentially happen by the end of the day today.

But we'll see what happens. In the meantime, Gordon, let's get your thoughts on surprised or not surprised because it, you know, I certainly started out thinking that there was a chance that Craig Barubi would be behind the bench come September October, but clearly after 10 days, John Chica and Matt Sondin felt differently.

Yeah. What do you think Matt's did or just Chika? I don't know. Anyway, however they're making it work. So I thought he was gone. I think he thought he was gone. And then that press conference, which was kind of convoluted in a lot of ways, it seemed like there was a real glimmer of hope if you're if you're Craig Barubi and you wanted to come

back. So I don't think that was the case. I don't know if you call it due diligence. I don't know if you call it just appearances that you talk to the coach, whether you went through the motions or whatever you want to call it, then he just wasn't his guy. And so no, no, not surprised. And very curious, like everyone's assuming Bruce Cassidy's the guy that Edmonton wants, that Toronto wants, that Los Angeles may want, like whatever. But all they kept talking about was database, database, database. And I don't know, I've been connecting more about with coaches.

Like, who are the coaches that are databaseed, right? Because you know the story in Chicago, Joel Quenville and company, they won three Stanley Cups. And when they got whatever data they were given, they threw out. You know, they were given data suggesting what lines to put together or whatever. I'm not saying that's the way you should go about it. So I'm curious, well, is that Bruce Cassidy or are we going to get a complete unknown? Would you like to see a Bruce Cassidy?

let's just speculate now because his name's been linked to the Edmonton Oilers. I'll get your thoughts on that separately. But for now, let's just finish off just a quick thought on the Leafs in terms of, are the Leafs ready for Bruce Cassidy, in your opinion? I don't know if he's the right, no, because that's kind of what Craig Barubi was in a lot of ways. And the other, you don't want to repeat of when Kyle Dubas got the job and Mike Babcock was the coach and all this stuff that Keith Pelley and John Chaker were talking about, whether it's the symmetry or the vertical horizontal connection,

whatever you, you know, whatever may be, I mean, he's got to be, let's them say, they got to be aligned with the general manager. So,

and the general, they made, they did not want a retread general manager. That's not a slight at other general managers. You know, Chega had been out of it for six years, so he was viewed a little bit differently. I think they found him more enlightened,

whatever. So, yeah, I'm curious to see what he's thinking. You got anything? for us, Sammy over there? I still think that the Leafs could be good with Cassidy.

I just don't know if they're going to win the Cup. Win the Cup? Yeah, that's what I mean. I think he wants to win the Cup. Okay, you're closer to that. Cassidy was. Yeah, yeah. Even I've gotten off that hobby horseman.

No, no, no, no. I mean, the Cup is... You're trying to get respectable. I just mean the... Like, if Cassidy comes in here, I think the lease will be a better team under Cassidy with whatever moves they make in the off season. If they hired him, they would definitely

be in the conversation for a playoff team. I think that'd be fine. I don't think they're going to win the cup. But if he wanted to do it, he could go to Edmonton and maybe win the cup there, right? Like, I think that's the difference. That's probably why he wants to go there. I think he's got a better chance there. Yeah.

Yeah. Two of the best players in the world. Yeah, exactly. So that's kind of my thought on Cass. How much when you've won a cup, you want to win more, don't get me wrong. But when you've won a cup as a coach or a player, like that, you know, that gives you a different perspective when you're an unrestricted free agent as a coach or a player and looking. at a destination.

Yeah. Honestly, it's like having children, right? You got one. You want another one. You know, I'm telling you. It's like, and you love them differently, but the same. But you want more. Okay.

No, no. If you're, that's the way I look at it. Yeah. Right? And you're here for a short time. Not with your wife and kids. You're talking about life and everyone. This is philosophical here.

I'm just saying that... Am I not looking well? It's like having kids. It's like if you're in, you're in, right? Yeah. And if you're a family guy and you want, you go for it and no different for Stanley Cups. I thought we were going to get our second Stanley Cup in 94 when we beat Quebec, when they were ranked one and we were eighth in the conference. And when we beat them, I'm like, holy geez, back-to-back Stanley Cup champions, would that like be the coolest thing in the world?

and then poof, done, swept by the flyers. But I think if you're looking at both lineups in Toronto and Edmonton, clearly everybody believes Edmonton's a lot closer, and I think Cassidy would feel the same way. Yeah, just what an unusual 48 hours. I mean, you're talking about Edmonton, and then all of a sudden Toronto makes the change. Vancouver's still up in the air.

And we're going to have another general manager, former general manager, you are a general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs. How often are you shopping for a new head coach without firing your old NHL coach? How often does that leak if it does happen? How much do you run a risk of it happening? Is it common even back then when you were GM?

Yeah, yeah, because you always had a plan there. It wasn't like you woke up one morning and go, okay, got to fire Nick Kippre. who's, can give me the directory and I'll start phoning people. So, you know, you have people in mind and that's where asking permission, I mean, optically, I'm sure Emmington didn't want this to get out, but asking permission, maybe exploring the other options you have if you want to make a move. So I think at the end of the season, it's got a little bit more bite, right?

Because you're, you know, you're evaluating, your thinking and, you know, whatever's going in the bigger picture during the season. You got to kind of be on who may be available in a hurry. Okay. As promised, let's welcome in, former NHL player agent, general manager, Brian Lotton, been a regular on our program. Lotz, how are you, my friend? It's not that often I show up on your show and you don't know about it until the last minute.

Just talking about that process in Edmonton where the information leaked out. Were people actually surprised that you go after? somebody else before you fire a head coach? Did people have the assumption that you fire somebody and then hire somebody quickly after that? Give me your idea in your era of being a general manager. I think as far as the general public goes, they're not aware how many times, you know, these things happen. What's uncomfortable about it is when people find out. It's not great optics, but it does happen. from, you know, from Stan Bowman's perspective, you got to find out, you got to figure out what's out there. You know, not everybody has a coach in their back pocket.

You know, sometimes when you're managing, and Gordon knows this, you have people that you know would work well in your organization, but they may not be available. In this case here, you know, it's hard to ignore the noise from the season. If you're a general manager, you know, it's quite well documented that several times, and this is the world we're living in now, but several times those issues or issues about the coaching had kind of indirectly been raised. So I can't imagine if you're Stan Bowman, you also weren't aware of this. So then you have to figure out where do you go from here? not a ton of guys available out there right now that I think people would have as that A-plus coach. Bruce Cassidy would be one of those people.

But what really threw this off is that you always wonder how do people hear or find out about this? You know, as a general manager, Gord, you know, you call in this case Kelly McCrineman, maybe George McPhee. either one of those guys would be fine. And you ask for permission. And that's, you know, the start of it. You don't want to get it in writing. You're then going to have a conversation about does it make sense to, for the team that's letting this person go kind of predetermine what you would pay them.

There's just a lot more that goes into this than people think. But in this particular case, you know, it's been, it's never ideal. when other people find out about everything that a hockey operations department is doing. Yeah, because optically, Vegas isn't thrilled. Edmonton's not thrilled. And, you know, in Chris Nabloff's case, Brian, you look at it that, okay, Connor McDavid and Leon Drys Eiddle have articulated quite well and calmly many times over. It's not good enough.

And I think a lot of us thought, okay, well, it can't be the coach because he was Connor McDavid's coach and junior. But obviously, obviously, it's got to include the coaches. And if you're Edmonton, you can't go Chris Knoblock one more time, that kind. It is time for a Bruce Cassidy. It's time for a Pete DeBore, but he's gone to the island. I don't know. Is that the way you look at it if they're going to move on the coach?

It's got to be a Bruce Cassidy type. I think it has to be somebody that has a lot of cachet. If I'm thinking about logically about, you know, how you're connecting the dots. And if my memory serves me correctly, Connor did not win. and junior with Chris as his coach. I don't know what that means. And you can correct me if I'm wrong, anybody on the show. No, you're correct.

Oshua General beat him. Yeah, I'm very certain that didn't happen. So I don't know what that means, though. I just mean that I heard a couple of times, you know, players being pretty vocal, which is not, you know, necessarily standard operating procedure. You know, you've never heard, you know,

certain players that have as much cachet, certainly as Conner or Leon, do ever talk about it. And I think, you know, in looking at it and looking at the season, I'd say they were frustrated. These guys have been knocking on the door. They're right there. Whenever you get in those scenarios, you feel like you're going to break through the next chance you get. And when it doesn't happen, it's disappointing. You are watching and listening to Brian Lotton, former NHLTHA player, agent, general manager in studio here with Gord Stelik and Sen.

are we all under the impression now that with this recent leakage of news, Frank Sarajevoire, reporting that Vegas, not using denied, I'm using, what's the word, Sammy? Withholding. Withholding. Permission. Semantics battle. Withholding permission.

Which is the same as denying. With that news coming out, are we all in agreement that it's, It's very difficult for Chris Knoblock to ever walk again into a dressing room as a head coach of the Edmonton Oilers. It certainly, you know, makes it more challenging. I would say this, though, I wasn't quite sure what really transpired. I know that permission wasn't given, but it's not uncommon for clubs when you ask and they're in the playoffs to say, hey, look, can you wait a hot second? We're still playing.

That's our main focus. we're not saying yes we're not saying no we're just asking you if you can wait so to me that seems like the most likely thing that may have happened but I don't know that it's only speculation so in terms of

Chris Now Block Kipper you've been a player it's not an ideal situation no no it's not it's not okay I'll throw this out to the both of you Cassidy's in a pretty good spot right now. L.A., Toronto,

and I'm going to say Edmonton right now. Where's the best fit for him? Gordon, I'll start you with you. Yeah, I think it's Edmonton. And also, when it goes to you, Brian, what I'm curious about, because I just, with Craig Barubi

getting fired today, that, you know, the sense is, okay, Leaf fans think, oh, they're going to jumping on because Bruce Cassidy's out there, the talk's out there. Peter DeVore's gone. We've got to get Bruce Cassidy. but that one press conference that, like I said, was a little all over the place,

but they kept on message that we're going to be a data-driven organization. And I've connected with a lot of coaches, ex-coach. I'm trying to think, who are the data coaches? And they're going, well, there's some young guys. Like, I don't, so I'm just saying, like, I mean, can they say all that? Can John Chaker come in and talk about that and set up whatever this connective, connectivity they want to have, this consistency with philosophy? and does Bruce Cassidy suit that, Brian?

I actually think Bruce doesn't having conversations with him, but really how I read that gourd is that they're looking for somebody younger, somebody who maybe is a little bit more controllable, which can be good, but it's not what I believe in. You've got to find somebody that, you know, these guys are your field general. They need to make tough decisions under pressure. As far as being data-driven,

Anybody can be data driven. It's just a matter whether or not you accept or believe in it. I can tell you guys from fact that when Dave Tippett was in Arizona, I was staying at his house during the season, and he wanted me to look at some data. Now, this was a while ago, so I have to be careful in how I frame this. The data was not nearly as good,

but what I saw for a coach was a very, low value. I'll be honest with you, but that was quite a while ago. So that's not fair to hang that on John Cheka. That may have been the best information he could come up with at that time, but I didn't find it particularly helpful. I would think in today's world, I know in today's world with the new Hock and player tracking system that, you know, the data that you can get is incredible. The ways that you use it are different for every organization. And clearly some organizations, are doing better than others with how they inject that, embed that into their decision-making process on player evaluations.

We're going to see more of an emphasis now on coaching. I don't think it'll translate as well as it does for player evaluations into coaching. Lots. It's been well documented. Two years from now, who becomes an unrestricted free agent? And we've got three of them in Canada. Connor McDavid, Austin Matthews, and Brady Kachuk.

Yeah. They got two years on their contracts, but can you explain why it kind of only feels like one year? Like my point is lots, is it, can they get to this point next summer with no decisions on their future? You know, it's very funny because you hear a lot of people comment on this, Kipper,

and you heard about, you know, there was people commenting, you know, when they were vying for the Toronto General Manager's job, which I was not. But I always pay attention to this stuff because I find it fascinating. And some people end up, you know, basically saying what they would do. And, you know, the consensus was that you must know, and the player must tell you this information. That's absolutely not true. You could ask the player, but it's up to him whether or not he wants to entertain that conversation.

or not. You'd think it's in your best interest. You know, Mitch Martner just went through this and I don't know. I didn't, I didn't see any, you know, a lot of people think you can go in there and just demand that the player tell you what they want to do or where they want to go. And as we're finding out right now with no move clauses, teams are handicapped in this area. And this is going to kind of be the precipice of it. As you see some of these elite players, that start to do maybe what players haven't done in the past, which players generally have tried to stay with their original team that may be changing in this new world.

I'll be fascinated to see how it plays out. But you definitely want to know to your point, Kipper, but you don't really have a mechanism to drive a definitive answer. So you mentioned the flip side of it, you know, because all these guys are American guys that re-opt to stay in Canada, okay? And so the Quinn Hughes model, though, is that the new model? And how much is very sensitive now in Canada, how much it is the greener pastures? Or is it?

I didn't sign up for this Vang version that Vancouver Canucks. I didn't sign up for the Edmonton order version if a year from now there. Or I didn't sign up Austin Matthews case where the Toronto Maple Police are right now. So sure, they can't be forced. But there's got to be, I think, Quinn Hughes signified a different way of thinking from I'm here for the long term. Yeah, I haven't asked Quinn this. I was at their game the other night. Quinn was pretty amazing, I must say, as was Brock favorite,

but they did not win. Colorado was more amazing. In terms of Quinn's, it was kind of my understanding that he had made it known how he felt. And I'm sure, you know, even though it's not the news you want, as a general manager, you know, just want to know what you're marching towards.

I always have kind of one rule with this type of stuff as a former agent. No answer is an answer. Because you have to figure out the path forward. In Quinn's case, I think he was clear that he wasn't going to resign. You'd have to ask Jimmy Rutherford to clarify that. I certainly took that to be by his quotes. And he made the best decision he could. Is that going to work out to be a decent deal for him?

well, you have to kind of measure it against the alternative. He stays and then he walks and then you get absolutely zero for him. So by that metric, he hit a grand slam. By another metric of, you know, you don't get time a lot of in the NHL. It's very rare that you have time in order to make some of these pressurized critical decisions. Whenever you do, I like to default to use it because it doesn't happen all the time. I thought that was, you know, kind of cutting things off at the past to your point, Kipper. Do you want to know earlier so you can make a decision?

Yes, you want to know earlier. You don't know if you're going to make the right decision. You want to try to – I look at like Cutter Goethe, you know, playing in Anaheim. Some things didn't work out there. And, you know, he got moved pretty quickly. I know they felt like they made a good deal in Philly. I just, that's one where it kind of shows my example. I would have been more patient personally or that would have been my thinking.

So, you know, these are really challenging issues for general managers, Gordon, you know this. Gort, I'll ask this to you as well because you were a general manager as Brian Lotton here. And you played both sides as an agent. A lot of speculation, especially on our show, especially by me in terms of the star players. the power that they have right now in terms of maybe having some influence on maybe a coach either being fired or hired, you know, trades. Like tell me about like when you guys were in that position, how much you leaned on the feedback.

John Chica said there was no feedback on players and he included Austin, particularly on this. But there's also this floating report out there that he's not committed. to returning next year and how does this all kind of play out when it comes to star players like Connor McDavid moving forward on the next head coach. I'll let you go first lots. Sure. You know, in my opinion, you always want to have in today's world, it's just different, Nick, you and I, nobody asked you and I what we thought ever. Especially me. Especially me. Yeah. Now, we weren't, you know, star players.

even the type of guys that would generally get that cloud. But even so, you could go pretty far up the lineup and very few players knew what was going on. It's just, it's not an indictment. It's just recognition of the changes in society. A lot of these players, you know, they're playing today. They're credible players. They're having great careers. They just grew up differently than we did.

We were more of the do-what-you-told generation. This generation now, and a lot of this dovetails into the coach. and all the things that are going on with organizations, it has to do with earning respect from the players because they'll ask you what's going on. And we're seeing some potentially extreme events in that regard. Connor McDavid, Austin Matthews, you know, the list is long.

Zach Wrenzky is going to be a free agent in a couple of years. These are the types of players that not only are going to ask, but they're going to get answers. And, you know, Sid has been a great ambassador for the game. And, oh, for that matter, as well, that's the kind of generation preceding this one. And you really never heard of those guys, you know, as a matter of fact, you know, having some players on that team when I was an agent and knowing lots of Sid's teammates, you know, Sid was, is like the perfect player to have on your team. He's going to work hard. He's going to support what the organization's doing.

But deep down, I never got the feeling that. he wanted to have any say and how it was run. I think that's changing a little bit in today's world. Yeah, I characterize it a slippery slope, Kippee, if you engage in that. You know, there's a lot that can go awry. And Brian, even in the different era, the role of the player agent is usually the guy that can piss and moan to the general manager. That generally was it, right?

And actually, the general manager, generally in the older era, would stick it back down your throat, but would hang up the phone and go, okay, okay, he's making a good point. And then when another agent jumped, you start saying, okay, I'm understanding. I'm getting the vibe, okay, right, Brian? Like, I mean, that's what I got by and large. Did you piss and moan to Brian Burke a lot? Berkey and I had one disagreement on R.J.M. Burger, we both have laughed about it. You know, the world was different then.

Like, Kimber, I've told you before, like, when I sold my small representation firm, I did it with the intent of wanting to have more support. every week if I was going to continue to be an agent because it was literally the law of the jungle killer be killed I don't want to insult anybody in the military but it felt like that if you everybody was trying to give it to everyone and a lot of it came down to your overall leverage for me the answer for that was quite simply selling my firm but it came with a very funny caveat that I really have never talked about and that was that, yes, you have to buy my firm. And, you know, I eventually went from my own firm to

advantage, which is octagon hockey today. But you also must give me up to $10 million so I can grow this firm quickly. And that's exactly what we did, to be honest with you. For the very reason I'm citing is I wanted to have a little more cover so that we could handle negotiations a little smoother. So if someone really tried to give it to me, they knew they were going to see me. They might get me on Tuesday, but I'll be back on Thursday with somebody else. And it's really in everybody's best interest to keep this a little more civil. And it worked for the most part. You know, Berkey and I had a disagreement. That was more philosophical. Burkey was great. Dave Onus was great to deal with. I'd love dealing with those guys because they're straight shooters.

and you could yell and scream at Berkey, and he'd yell and scream back at you, and then it was over. It was like a hockey fight. You could go have a beer with the guy you just fought. It was just business. So there's a lot to unpack there. Players now are clearly, in my opinion, more involved.

If you're not understanding that, it could be problematic. It's hard for me to imagine that, you know, these star players aren't watching what organ is. organizations are doing, particularly in times of change, of coaches, GMs, presidents, you name it, whatever's going on. Players are paying attention more than ever. And a few guys that can drive things, I think they're going to exercise those rights. Beamer remiss to let you go without asking you about the Minnesota Wild and Colorado. You are in Minnesota. Certainly doing everything they can to beat the crap out of Colorado. I'm just not sure.

sure that they eventually can catch them enough to beat them. Yeah, there's been a lot of talk about, you know, you had these quality teams in Dallas, Minnesota, and Colorado, you know, playing themselves early in the playoffs, playing their opponents early. I don't really take any offense to that. That's more random. You know, the league had a goal when they started this program.

So I've always been okay with that. But as far as the quality of Minnesota and Colorado, they're both so elite. That could easily be a final. Being at that game the other night, I did something I don't do that often, and I went and I sat down below in the stands. And I used to do it once in a while in Tampa,

but not a lot, just to get a feel for how fast the game is and really how hard players are working. Minnesota came out and absolutely finished every check, pounded the Colorado Avalanche. They bent, but they're not. did not break. And they don't necessarily have some of the toughness. It's not even size. Minnesota is a very tough team. But Colorado took it all, responded, ended up winning a game where Walshdad was sensational. They just never quit. Their special or superpower to me in terms

of Colorado is obviously their elite skill, but it's really their quickness as a team. They are a very, very quick team. And although Minnesota was playing an intimidating physical style, Colorado countered with just taking away time and space from Minnesota. And at one point, you know, I'm sitting down below and I look up at the shot clock and it's 20 to 4. And yet I think Minnesota is effectively, you know, running out their game plan. So that had to be tough for them, but they've got a great team that series isn't over but going back to colorado for any athlete that's ever done that or played there spent time there it's just an advantage that we don't talk enough about it's really hard to go into colorado and play at that altitude and not feel a little different so we'll see how that

one is out but super impressed with both teams off the charts that was one of the best playoff games i've seen all year this year it all gets going at 8 pm eastern on sports Minnesota and Colorado. Lots. Thanks for doing this, pal. Really appreciate your time. Thanks, Kipper. Great to see you, Gord.

Likewise, Brian. Brian Lotton. NHLLLIN. Does a terrific job covering the game. Game time. Game time, baby. Game time. Presented by Bet365.

An official partner of the NHL, must be on team plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Just looking at the futures here for their remaining teams in the

Stanley Cup playoffs, who the favorites are to win the Cup, as you would imagine, Colorado is the favorite, even though they're not through to the next round yet. They're at plus 145. Carolina is at plus 150. The next closest team is the Vegas Golden Knights

at plus 650, Montreal and Buffalo both at 12 to 1 and the Minnesota Wilde 40 to 1 Anaheim Ducks all the way down at 50 to 1. Find that interesting that Minnesota's down 3-1 and they think that they have a better chance in the Anheim ducks rolling down 3-2. On the ice tonight, like you mentioned there, Colorado, huge favorites against the Minnesota

Wild, minus 225 on the money line. Minnesota plus 185, Bet 365 thinks this game. And this series is going to be over tonight. That was game time, presented by Bet365, an official partner of the NHL, blessed 19 plus. Ontario only, please play responsibly. And a reminder, this hour of Real Kipper and Born is brought to you by Bet365. All right, nice job, Sammy. Thanks, man.

We'll take a quick break when we return. Plenty to get into as the Vancouver Connects found their next hockey operations slash general manager. Maybe we should mention the HABs too. Okay. Well, I mean, we've done an hour and a half. We haven't mentioned it. Wow, we'll get into the HABS. Sir, general manager in peril.

The one that got away last night in Montreal for the HABs. We've got a Calder Trophy winner. We've got a fine in the NHL. Plenty more, Gordo. Yep. on the real Kipper and Gordo show. Back after these words. Diving deep into Leaps, Raptors, Jays, and NFL.

The Jady Bunkin's podcast. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the program. The Kiprios, Gord Stelik in for Justin Bourne on assignment for this kid at a hockey tryout. And our very own. Sammy McKee. Time now for the Accura Performance

Matchup, the 2026 Accura MDX, precisely premium. Only one game on the ice tonight, and it is game five between the Colorado Avalanche in the Minnesota Wild Mini in Colorado trying to extend their season. A few stats heading into this

game tonight. Nathan McKinnon enters Wednesday two points shy of his fifth career, 10-point playoff series. He can become the second player in Avalanche, slash Nordique's history to record a double-digit total in five series following who? Who's the only only got to do it? Pretty easy answer.

Kay, listen to me. Joe Sackett? You were listening. No, I'm not listening. It's no me by now. Anyways. Did you listen? No, he didn't listen.

No. No, neither did it listen. Nobody listens to me around here. Quinn Hughes can become the second fastest American defenseman in NHL history to 15 points in a postseason behind. Brian Leach. Bingo! Yes. There we go.

Okay. Paying attention. The avalanche can join the hurricanes as the second team to advance the conference final in nine or fewer games. The 2026 playoff, they can be the second, oh, sorry, be the second in NHL history to feature multiple teams to achieve that feat after the Flyers and Red Wings in 1995. So these are two dominant teams that haven't done this in a long time. And the avalanche won an all-time record of 14 and 2 when leading a best of 7 series 3 to 1, including 10 and 2. including 10 and 2 when starting at home. Colorado has gone on to win the series

in each of the past seven scenarios. And that was the Accura performance matchup, the 2026 Accura MDX, precisely premium, also known as Kipper not listening to me. Yeah, I've been caught a few times this past week. I'm not listening, Gordon. No, well, we're focusing, getting ready for it.

We are. A lot to talk about. Before we get into maybe the Montreal Canadiens lost last night to Buffalo, Am I allowed to ask you about you had a sleepover? Yeah. Yeah, you had a sleepover. I should show you the gift.

Yeah. Was it like a play date? Well, it was, okay, a modern day play date in. With Brian Burke. Our good friend Brian Burke invited myself and Joe Bowen to the last Friday, the Buffalo Montreal game. Yeah. And then we met Dwayne Rollisson there.

Did he come over for sleepover too? No, Bowen was supposed to. And then he forgot that he had a dance recital, hopefully for his granddaughter, not for himself. But he had a dance recital. So anyway, I arrived at Berkies and Odie's place first in the afternoon, and Bowen was about five minutes behind. And I say it with love.

It's kind of like Green Acres. He's like all over Wendell Douglas. You know, like it's 50 acres, you know, whatever. So anyway, we were there. It's a neat little place. And then he drove us to the game. Yeah. He was pissed that.

I don't have Nexus, right? They kept bugging me. So we were in the longer line going through. Sorry. And then we went to the game. You know, people recognized to varying degrees. But I went to,

he's treated a lot of respect there, which is nice and that. We sat in the seats. I've not sat in the seats for a playoff game, I think, in my life. And then we drove back. Yeah. And I stayed up with Berkey and Odie

till about 2.30. It was like, no, we didn't. Did you guys, like, put pajamas on? We, yeah, we told ghost stories and, and some popcorn. I brought a guitar out and we started singing. Does Berkey have like John Tavares' pajamas? No, everything was on.

We were a little casual, though. I can't remember the fashion thing, but it was very, very relaxed. And so we chatted about everything in the world, and then got up Saturday. I bought him breakfast. It's the least I could do, and I drove back. It sounds like an annual thing now.

Well, it could be Burkey's world for 24 hours. I love it. I had a really good time, and I appreciate it as generosity. Awesome, buddy. All right, Sammy. Habitant? Yeah, should Montreal? be up 3-1 right now.

They only had how many power play opportunities, some of the dumbest penalties I've seen a team take. Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I thought that they, I thought there was some pretty brutal embellishment in the first period for the habs. I thought there was a few flops,

including the cross check on who was it that went into the boards. I mean, if you dove on that one, thought there's a few dyes. That was, um, Gouli on Thompson. Yeah, like there were some obvious high sticks, which are always a penalty.

But I thought a couple of them. Goolee's not going into the boards that hard on an embellishment. No. No, that was okay. How about the 10 minute, was it 10 minutes between? Ward that, with the two reviews. Two reviews. They got it right, though.

They got it right. But, Gord, we just can't, we just can't stop a game and just stare at a monitor for 10 minutes. But you want to get it right. So you say, okay, rush it up and get it wrong? Can we get it faster? Okay, that's always the question. And I can't speak for why it may not have been faster. We know there are two separate reviews, obviously, which took the time.

So, yeah, I, but use the technology. And ever since, you know, ever since that Schmisel and the San Jose Vegas game, the whole Joe Pavelski thing, now they can call the major review those kinds. I mean, we have it all at home now. So why should you not try to get it right when we all know we may have differing opinions, how we interpret it if we're fans? But I don't know, Sammy, you think? it was right. They made the calls right.

What did you not like the goaltender interference? I thought at first it was and then I kind of watched it a few times and listen to what Lindy Roth had to say. Let's go to Derek. Let's go to Lindy Roth, clip one and his sort of explanation on it. It can do a lot because there was a lot of elements that went the other way. You know, the review where we get the goal, the review where they take. it away, which I totally disagree with, just for the fact that Dobesh always is swinging his stick. He initiated the contact with Helens with his stick coming across the crease, and I thought

Helenis did a great job of trying to avoid the goaltender. Their guy ends up hitting the goaltender, so I really thought that that was going our way. And I know that's my opinion, but a great play by the kid and just a tough review on us. I think I didn't see it and then I kind of saw it at the end stick out and like I don't know like No I think I just can't be in that area Yeah stay out of it

They're kind of saying after the Malenstein thing You know whatever you know The whole emphasis has been protecting goalies the last few years Whether you agree with it or disagree with it Well then bring back the Brett Hall rule Because that's what it is But there isn't the Brett Hall we're running You go by the rules of 2026

For me it's less about protecting them And just They need space to make a save. That's their turf. Right. That's their area. Which is kind of the Brad Hall rule to your point. That's what I mean.

It's just if you can't, like he sticks and stick out and it makes contact with the guy. I get the heby-jeebies if I think about toe and a crease. Well, that's what we have. Yeah. If there's any contact at all, we have to sit there. No, you can still put, you can be your foot in the crease and shovel a puck in the net and it can't count. The only way that, like, if you want to get rid of these reviews that are, you know, there's tons of gray area and like is it or is it not?

Why do you want to get rid of them? Well, because that's what Kippa was just saying. It takes too long. Well, no, there's two different things. We have the technology for the reviews. Yeah, that's just been winding a little bit. But always about trying to, and they want to too. Obviously, that's their goal as well.

And it doesn't always work that way, but I still think it's more important to get it right. Buffalo got away with one, I think. There's not a real sense that they've got momentum now, is there? based on a win that feels like they were lucky to come out with? Well, I think two things. One is game number one, we forget. Buffalo was doing what Montreal did. They were coming hard.

Their D's got nine goals, right? Buffalo's D. They were jumping in the play real well. Then Montreal kind of took that game and did a better game's two and three. I think the one element that Buffalo can relax is good for them is very seldom does a goalie steal a series. And one more Jacob Dobish performance like that would be in the heads of Buffalo. So at least that part, it's not going to be Yashlav Halak like right now. So I don't know.

I really do. I really think it's toss up. A big, big win for Buffalo. Who knew the key to beating and was throwing it off the Zamboni door and into the net? That's right. I mean, that should be home ice advantage. It felt like the turning point of the game. It felt like, yeah.

It just, that goes in. You're like, oh, God. You win a game when that happens? A gift. A gift. Just a big ribbon. I got a lot of people text me. What's a stanchion?

Right. They're just watching the playoffs, right? They don't know what's going on. Now, when you were with the Leafs... Seamless glass. I know. When you were the Leafs, did you bounce the boards off the, like, off the Mr. Sub sign? Remember that?

Mr. Subsign? Yeah, behind there. It was the one you hit. It came out in front and Glenn Anderson or Dave Andrew Chuck or something. Oh, yeah. Really? There's some soft spots so you could find out. Detroit had the same thing.

And, you know, yeah. There's an area in the boards that were dead. So if you knew if you, if you dumped it in, you were going to just pace the defenseman. Oh, because the fucks just died there. Yeah. died there, right? That's good old days. There's no chance.

That's unreal. All right. Vancouver, imminent. Isn't it for Ryan Johnson? Yeah, well, Elliot Freeman at Sott, maybe as early as today. Now, he brought up a thing, like, the Sadiens have been doing different roles for 10 years. And I say that with all due respect, okay?

Like, whatever may be, it seems like an ever-changing. And one of the things Elliot brought up, not as fact, but one of the notions out there, like it seems like they'll, hired the general manager from within, but that Matt Sundeen's reporting to Keith Pelly, or excuse me, reporting to John Chica, barely, but he is reporting.

Chica has the final say that the Sadiens could be co-presidents. Okay? So I don't know. I sit back, wait to hear the organizational reconfiguration. The belief is they're going to get a more prominent role. I think you've heard that as well. And, man, like what, like, was it three years ago? Edmonton, Toronto,

Winnipeg, Vancouver relatively legitimate Stanley Cup chances, right? Relatively. And all of a sudden, and here's where we sit watching lottery balls to see which one could get

the award for finishing the worst. You had a tweet last night, didn't you? Yeah, I had heard that it was going to happen really soon, you know, within like 24 hours or midday of, next day sort of thing.

So we'll see where the Sadiens lie in all of this. I think it's kind of a copycat league a little bit. They probably watched the Matt Sundeen senior advisor role and now feel like they got to announce something more for the Sadiens. But get it structured properly. Like, I mean, the Trevor Linden presidency, like there's different presidencies, right? And it seemed like he was sort of more a corporate president, right, versus guys like Luke Robatai or Cam Neely

that have more teeth in their respective roles. But it's funny because Jim Rutherford fired the general manager and then kind of publicly surprised everyone announcing he was stepping down. So I'm sure internally they were on this. He essentially fired two people then. Yes. Yes, he did. Patrick Alvin saying, could I not, anyway,

could I not have been a chance for it or let the other guy fire me like Barubi? Calder Cup trophy, no surprise. Yeah. Shafer. Yeah. Calder. Is it?

Calder a trophy? What did I say? Calder Cup? Yeah. That's what I won in 1988. Yeah, that's a tough trophy to win. It's like the Stanley Cup. And we were 12 in 0.

Yeah, I remember that. Really? Yeah, we went undefeated. But there was only three rounds. Yeah. But still pretty amazing that Carolina is like 8 and O, and I know. Yeah. It's kind of like a...

It's a journey. They played the Flyers, which, you know, was fairly easy. So you forget other guys, like, you know, Beckett Seneca's a hell of a player too. Like, there are other... Five goals. There are other young players besides Schaefer.

You don't know what I mean? Like, there's some other quality young players, but for a defenseman to enter the league like that, I mean, Rasmus Dahlene took some time as the number one overall pick. Owen Power is still taking time, you know, as a number one overall pick. And this guy to come and did what he did last year was something special. Speaking...

Did you see any of him? because he did it on Good Morning America. I did not. This kid is just like class person. Like he's just, like he is a real gift to the league. Just affable, classy. Awesome. Like, awesome on the ice.

Like, he's just, he's like one of the future faces in the league. So does the least build around a defenseman or a winger? Well, they, they, well, boy, this goes back to when Mark Hunter was, he wanted to build around defense way back when John Chike, I think. think acknowledged about we need some defensemen. That's what he said and it's understood. So, but I think, I think, I think the, the, the, the, the crowd is so hepped up about the number one overall pick.

Don't you dare move it down and, and get a defenseman. But they need a little bit everything right now. That's when you're picking that high. Same with Vancouver. Anybody else. Like, you need a few things. But I, you, yeah, your, number one need is defense. The top two players are wingers.

You think, Jake will be tempted to. Turn it into two or three pieces if he moves down one spot. Well, and then people talk about San Jose. So can you, will they give you that pick and Michael Mesa? For example, I don't know. Just throwing it out there. So all of a sudden you got for Austin Matthews. Again, we're talking.

And again, all of a sudden, by the way, Austin Matthews doesn't play for you. That's a huge loss, okay? It just seems everyone's being flipping. I mean, Mitch Martner was a huge loss. Yeah. You know, Nick Eilers was a huge loss. You know, it's not. But it's just, there's so many different ways he can go about it.

I have no idea of what kind of dance partners he has or doesn't. Let's take McKenna. Let's take McKenna. Yeah. But it's just not clear cut. You wish it was a, yeah. The Reyes Schaefer. Well, you hope it's not the friend year, that kind of draft, right?

Oh, we mentioned his name. Yeah. Yeah. It's so easy to do. You just be like, go back and look at it. Oh, I hope it's not. Natal Yakopov, what if it's, like, what if it's a good guy? Can we just do it both ways?

There's a lot of great first overall picks, but everyone is just saying, what if it's the worst possible outcome? Yeah, that would suck. But the other side of it's pretty good, too. It's just not the wow factor, okay? And that, and it very well could be the wow guy. And then you're looking where Vancouver is sitting or other teams, and you're reminded about Kail McCar and Quinn Hughes and where they were picked,

like, you know, 3, 4, 5, 6, certain players. So it's, when you don't have a good season and you, and you hang on your draft pick, it's the one positive bone you get. If I had a sleepover, would you come? I would, yes, it would be less driving. I don't know where you live right now, but your place is probably, honestly God,

Berkey, you got to make it right at the tractor, you know, and then Sam Drucker's a general store, you know, what's for? And then there were the three girls from Petty Co Junction, you know, in the water tower. And then you're flying this place. Dante's Fiesta. Oh, we could order in.

That would be nice. Hey, thanks for doing this today, pal. My pleasure, Kipper. All right, Sammy, where are you headed right now? The J's game, boys. Watch another fat L. Bring us a win, would you? They always lose.

Our thanks. It's Brian Lotton, joining us at the top of the hour. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening. And we'll see you tomorrow on the Real Kippering Born Show.