Real Kyper & Bourne - Keefe Conundrum

Episode Date: June 5, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee kick off the week with the ongoing Sheldon Keefe discussion, the arguments for and against extending him and possible replacement candidates, including Patrick Roy who is coming off a Memorial Cup victory. They also get to the coaching hires around the league with the Ducks hiring Greg Cronin and the Blue Jackets hiring Mike Babcock, what to expect out of Babs’ old-school style and if he and Roy can return to the NHL with some new tricks. They are joined by Golden Knights’ TV analyst Daren Millard, who breaks down how Vegas countered Florida’s forecheck, Adin Hill’s meteoric ascension and the Golden Knights' fanbase rallying around the team. Finally, the guys close with some thoughts on Cole Caufield’s extension and make their predictions for Game 2 of the Cup Final.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.   

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. Hope it was a good weekend, everybody. Not bad for me. Yeah. Had a birthday yesterday. Happy birthday. I think we're getting some messages on our YouTube channel giving me a belated birthday. Getting close to 50 now.

Greg Soames. Who? You? Kipper. Kipper? giving me a belated birthday. Getting close to 50 now. Greg Soames. You? Kipper. Kipper? Happy belated birthday. 57 is a big number. That's what I just read. He just knew it, huh?

I guess you can Google your age. There's no... Hey, Greg. Whoop-a! Scram, beat it, Greg. You didn't mention it at all on Friday or at all. And then that was two times. You let them slip away.

That was two. That was Barney went through his 40th and didn't mention to us at all. We got through the whole day, didn't we? Yeah, I didn't have to run through the gauntlet. Do you ever do that when you're on your hockey teams? Like it's your birthday and the team make you skate through a gauntlet or anything on the ice no no but we didn't also had that that chain after a goal scored to the bench to hi-fi everybody and you just went and lined up again like soccer players hey that's great no other games were faster just

act like you've been there before yeah i don't know how i feel about that actually it's interesting like if you just went and lined up again would it be the worst thing i don't mind the flyby i don't either all right we got plenty to jam into the next hour in our summer edition i'm nick kiprios he's jb born or jb yeah whatever derrick brandeo jennifer rolnick sammy mcke. We got the NHL final that kicked off Saturday night. We've got some news and notes around the league, including a coaching conversation. Where do you want to start, JB? Do you want to start at the Stanley Cup final or the Memorial Cup?

Well, if we go to the Memorial Cup, you know where that's going to lead to. I do. Patrick Waugh. And then it's going to lead to the coaches. Right. So do we go to the memorial cup you know where that's going to lead to i do patrick waugh and then it's going to lead to the coaches right so do we want to just let's talk coaches let's juicy let's go coaches right away because we do have someone i've been familiar with a few years ago named darren millard yes he's in vegas now uh i i want to him, is it too early for him to size up his Stanley Cup ring? Would he get one, do you think?

I would imagine. Are you kidding me? He didn't move to Vegas to not get one. Right. Right, that's great. We'll talk to Darren Millard, get his thoughts on the Stanley Cup final. He is now host of the Vegas Golden Knights TV broadcast.

Has a terrific podcast called The Chirp as well. So we're looking forward to Darren Millard in about 18 minutes. But okay, so if we're going to have a conversation on coaches, let's go right to the Sheldon Keefe conversation. Last week I wrote about the thoughts of him coming back. Would not be without a contract extension. I think Elliot went on the other night and followed that up. The sense is, guys, everybody's on board with a contract extension.

You mean within the organization or within Leafs Nation? Sammy, share your little detail. Yeah, okay. A contract extension for Sheldon keith coming back for the toronto maple leafs let's get everyone's thoughts out uh to me you absolutely cannot extend them like i if if i'm on the board of mlsc and i'm talking with the new general manager brad for living and i'm saying hey like you know you're gonna extend keith okay you, but what if you don't like what he's doing halfway through this year? So we're going to pay him this amount of money.

And then halfway through this year, we're going to fire him and we're going to pay him anyway. Like, he doesn't, in my mind, he doesn't have enough, you know, clout and experience. Like, he's been in the league, I guess, what, three years now? Like, sorry, bud. This is going to be a lame duck season for you. If you want to come back, you're going into your last year. So get rid of him. Agreed year. So get rid of him. Agreed.

Sam says get rid of him. No, JB. Well, I know he put up a poll today of about 1,000 people voted in on Leafs Nation fans. Do you want him back? And I think no. We're at 68% of people say they do not want Sheldon Keefe. Here's my thing with Keefe.

I think he is a good coach, an NHL coach. I think he's, you know, I enjoyed working with him. I think he is very capable of coaching a team to a Stanley Cup championship. I also think that he is a Dubas guy. And if the Leafs are turning the page on the Dubas era and saying, okay, that just didn't work. We're getting away from that whole thing. I think it's really strange to yeah just move on have dubas leave and keep a guy who believes everything that dubas believed and you know and

kind of have one foot in the door and to your point extend them and sarah valley and that's it's not coming from nowhere that people that you know the extension rumor so to me it's just a strange fit and i can see it going where sam is talking about, where you go, oh, now we're paying for a guy not to coach here, if you don't like how it's going. Great points. Thank you. Pick one. Of my points?

You want him to coach the Leafs to stand like a final, or you want to get rid of him because he's a dubious guy? Give me one or the other, but don't give me both sides. I will tell you if it were me, and so it's just really hard for me to say because i like him he's a friend i don't care i would i don't care i would be moving on you you wouldn't extend him i would not extend okay so that's two non-extension if you wanted to go into the year with him to evaluate maybe you can extend him in december if you like no no no what what do you mean no they're in first place and playing great and it's all working, yes, yes, yes.

Guess what? We've seen them play great and be in first place for three years. If there's nothing you can do to keep people happy, you're in trouble as a coach. I just think that it is not that black and white when it comes to keeping them or getting I'd just like to clarify the Leafs have never won their division under these guys. Carry on. And if you do get rid of them for all the great points that you made, who's coming in?

Like if I cannot feel 100% on the guy moving forward and I'm just doing it for the sake of Sammy, it's not the right decision. Okay, if there's still Gallant and vigneault out there i think both are good coaches how about laviolette uh is that yeah that's sorry that's actually the name i meant i wanted yeah galant or laviolette those to me are two established guys who can dig in a little harder than sheldon has in the past that could be a bit of a cultural reset who can handle toronto media experienced guys you know they want an experience in the gm i don't see it being a bad thing for a coach either but yeah you're gonna have to pay one of those guys whatever 4.5 a year or who cares the other point that I made last week when I wrote my article was,

Sammy, now listen carefully, okay? If you send Sheldon Keefe into a Maple Leaf dressing room without a contract, the players will look at you like you got three heads. Are you following me here? There is a lack of respect. I 100% get that perspective. If you are not good enough in the eyes of our management, then they're going to look at you like you're not good enough for us. You're right, Kip.

That's a great point. And I can't disagree with it. So then I guess the number one thing is there's two choices, like we've been talking about, and it's extend or bye-bye. And to me, extension feels like we don't have the time to make the right decision here or we don't have the time to make the decision we want so we're just going to extend like to me that's i understand the idea that there's no one else out there but there are other people out there and hey maybe maybe tree living is a guy who's like i don't particularly care for galant or for um i've also seen i know uh

chris for steve went on bunk show this morning and said patrick waugh is an interesting name you know you know for me memorial cup win led by patrick waugh last night and i don't know if you guys guarantee you didn't watch any of it but that was a s kicking that was not close outclassed big time the ramparts in the seattle thunderbirds well they weren't on the same ice service anyways continue yeah here's my thing with wah he is too much do you know what i mean he is a big personality and an ego he is mike babcock 2.0 here in toronto where it just, this is not a place where you need your head coach making stories. And to me, he's a guy who cannot avoid that. He can't tell a lie.

He is the truth teller and that's dangerous in this media environment. Why is it so dangerous? Maybe that would be refreshing. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I think it's a lot. Maybe a little truth serum would be the best thing for the Toronto Maple Leafs.

That would be fascinating. By a guy. Listen, for this show's sake, oh my God, bring us Patrick Waugh. Kippers Clippers featuring Patrick Waugh would be the most electrifying thing, Hunter. By a guy who knows how to win. He's a winner. he is a winner yeah it's i i understand all those things and you shouldn't disqualify a guy i really like the idea of a big personality in a small market someone who's won like babcock to columbus love that for columbus you can sit there at the you know

i hop with the fan base and be like, I've won a Stanley Cup. I've been there. That's dangerous too. You know that, right? Why is that? Because you're not supposed to be the biggest star on the team.

No, but it's a place that- The players are. No, but you need stars there. Some stars. Yeah, they had John Tortorella. He was the biggest star there. How'd that turn out? Well, yeah, he's a different type of star isn't he really he's pretty no no when you're when your egos are that big you you are yeah okay you can put those you can put those guys in the same group for sure law is in that group is that what columbus is trying to do with

babcock right now is turn him into the face. They had no juice with a first-time coach. I actually just, you know, Cronin just signed with Anaheim, and I was like, I just feel like in those small markets, you can just inject some life with a big name and a big personality and all that.

I like that for Columbus. Here, I don't know. Someone who... I'm surprised. At me? No, no, no. Someone who. I'm surprised. At me? No, no, no. Oh, then. Yeah, you surprise me a lot sometimes.

I have to bite my lip a few times. That Babs is back? Yeah. No, not back. Okay. Back to Columbus. Because this guy was all about original six. And we know how he kind of played and manipulated

Buffalo just to get to Toronto. That's when you had some serious juice. Yeah. Didn't we if I can recall Sammy, maybe you can help me out here, but wasn't there like live shots of MLSC's plane

maybe going to get Babcock? No, it wasn't live shots. It was people tracking the plane. Oh, they were tracking the plane. Yes. Okay. Yeah. They did the same with Kawhi Leonard.

Yeah, yeah. So that's the type of attention it garnered, and that's the type of attention that Babcock loved. Yeah. And that stroked the ego. Sure. I'm not sure if there's any late recordings or notifications coming out of Columbus.

You know, it's also one of the 32 teams in the league, and the University of Saskatchewan Huskies are not. So I have a feeling for Babs, there was some appeal to getting back into the league before it's irrelevant. His contract's up, right? He was about to start making $0 and no cents. I am, I mean, can we talk about this?

Like, I am incredibly fascinated to see what Mike Babcock we're going to get here. I got two things to say on Babs. One of them is that... Like, can you teach an old dog new tricks? Do you need to teach him new tricks? Is he smart enough to realize that he needs new tricks? Does he need new tricks?

I think he does need new tricks i think he does two things i am sensitive to the you know the way that babcock's reputation was damaged here as someone who was hard on players or hurt their egos you know johan franz and let's not forget yeah franz and uh really poured gasoline on the fire on that story franz and had a hard time with them and then there was like you, one or two stories here, the Mitch thing, whatever. But like the other part of that is that Babs has been validated by

basically everything. He said that the team should do here, everything structurally, whether it's starting on time, how they should play North, South playing fast, all the things. Keefin Dubas came in and changed and eventually went back to everything babs wanted

so i think he was he's kind of been validated as a coach that's separate from how you feel about him as a person people vary on that but as a coach i feel like he's been validated so what you're saying is leaf should have rehired babs i am not saying similar situations in terms of the reputation for being hard asses or or tough on players or holding them accountable is uh babcock and patrick wah they come back well we don't know if patrick's gonna end up back in the national Hockey League. If he does, both have had ample time away to come back and revisit all of the things that made them successful. In this instance for Patrick Waugh, it was a short stint in Colorado, which garnered him Coach of the Year, if I'm not mistaken.

Yeah, they were successful. And then egos buried both of them yes for sure they they're that's you know hubris pride goes before the fall whatever you want to call it it's they both wanted more and too much and fell because of it but so interesting to see what a second looks like the babcock would go would go to Columbus and feel like that I can help and make a difference in that market. As we know, like there's a big difference between winning a cup with an original six team than it would be Columbus or Carolina.

But the mere fact that he'd be willing now to go to Columbus, which he would never have entertained five, six years ago. Yeah. Never. No. Columbus. five, six years ago. Yeah. Never. No. Columbus. Are they in the league? Yeah.

Is the type of answer maybe Babcock would have come up with five or six years ago. So I think it's a good sign for Babcock that he would want to go to a place like Columbus. True. Yeah. And the other good sign for even Patrick Wa waugh is the fact that he he had great success in colorado it it ended poorly for whatever reason personal conflict didn't have

enough uh say and player personnel he clashed with mcfarlane who was this young, you know, next wave type of guy, much like Kyle Dubas. And then he goes back to junior for the next five years. That says a lot to me, that he was willing to not feel like he needed a huge spotlight on him at the pro level, willing to go back, spend time with kids, and then to watch him celebrate last night on the ice with his players and uh i i think it it speaks to maybe just a better place that patrick wise and right now for sure than what we've seen in the past and what an education that would be you know watching young players in the way they play, getting a better sense for how these kids are.

You really connect with as a junior player, you're around your coach every day. Like they're in the same room as you by and large, not too far away. Anyway, it's a lot of time together on buses, hotels, little different separation level at the NHL.

So I bet this has been good for wall. Are you saying that you could see him as a candidate in Toronto? Yes. Yes, I do. I see him. Yes, I do. I love it. I love it.

I do feel that if you could have flipped the scripts on when the Leafs hired a Babcock Wah type, they would have done it in reverse order with Keefe. Like where it's like now is the time to hire this guy. Yeah. Right? Is it not? Well, I don't know. Then the idea was to get those guys playing 200 feet.

You got Mitch and Austin, both Selkie Trophy nominees every year. I think this is the time for one of those short window, hard-ass coaches to try to push this team over the top i i think there's bigger fish to fry for the leafs and even if you are patrick war or lavia lad or anyone that's had success in the past yeah like hey get your crap in order first and then come talk to me. Right. Who's here? Who's not? Who are you trading? Who's not?

Who's your goalie? Who's not? There's bigger questions right now. I don't even think they'd be in a position right now to go shop for a coach until they had some answers for them on what the next two or three years might look like. Yeah. Yeah, if you're an elite coaching candidate,

someone who's done it for years, big name. But when you had the lack of success the leafs have had with all that talent like there's no there's no stone that you should like not turn over yeah and that includes everyone in anything moving forward to to make your team. They should talk to Patrick Waugh. Just have a conversation with him. Bring him in. Do you care that he's a Montreal guy here in Toronto? Come on. We wouldn't love Patrick Waugh going to Montreal on a Saturday night as a leaf.

Oh, my God. Come on. If Patrick Waugh lifts the Stanley Cup above his head as the head coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs, there's nothing that would make me happier. He makes every game a lot more interesting. He's ours now. He stole Patrick Waugh lift the Stanley Cup above his head as the head coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs, there's nothing that would make me happier. He makes every game a lot more interesting. Well, he does. Hey, I love it from an entertainment standpoint. If you can have a conversation with him, you could speak to him for a minute and a half and go,

oh my God, I got to stay away from this guy. I can tell already he wants to come in and run the whole show yeah and then that's it you're done with it or you can sit there and hear him say i just want to coach i just want to coach that's all i love i love coaching i'm a coach i want to coach yeah you guys got some great players i got some ideas see what he says yeah i got some ideas. See what he says. Yeah. I got some ideas. I'm going to play Marner and Matthews 29 minutes a night. And Brad Tree Living. Hold on. You guys played Marner and Matthews together?

Have you tried this? Brad Tree Living strikes me as a guy that would be open to doing his homework and having an open mind on moving forward. Hey, how wild is it that Johnny Goudreau is like, get me out of Calgary and Daryl Sutter. I do not want a coach like this. And they're like, here's Babcock. Yeah, like you just signed Johnny Hockey to this mammoth contract.

How does he feel right now? Bad. Thinking about Babcock's reputation. And you don't have to go too far to pick up the phone and find someone that had him as a coach and hear stories. Oh, yeah. Because that happens all the time, as we know, in our world. Yeah.

He coached in a different era in terms of leaning on players, and maybe he's changed maybe some time with the university team, helped him in that regard. Maybe the way it ended here. Either way, can we get some Babs clips once in a while? Every time Columbus is in town, can we get them on our airwaves? That would be lovely. Good player.

Yeah, he's a good player. Good player. Start on time. Start on time. Good player. All right, we got Darren Millard coming momentarily as Sam tracks him down. Probably, would he be at, at Like walking the halls Of the casino And he just

Goes to the Blackjack table Between David Amber Is right now Or Elliot Is he Their card players

I sat At the craps table When we covered Vegas and Washington In the Stanley Cup final And I told you I had the dice For about an hour

I see that's That's elite But I am I wish I were there because I do play cards. I do like a little bit of. You do, eh? I like to sit at the tables a bit. I wish I was there.

Maybe not a great place temptation-wise for someone like myself. Are you really disciplined to say if I've lost this amount of money, then I'm done, I'm getting up? Kip, I don't have enough money to lose. Speaking of gambling, Darren Millard packs up and goes to Vegas. Cover the Vegas team, who is now in the second Stanley Cup final.

And Mallard, the gamble's paid off for you right now because you're three wins away from getting a Stanley cup ring. All in buddy. All in. How are you? I'm good. I'm good.

So you've been through it before. The player you've been through this, the situation I've never worked on the team side until I moved to Vegas and they've been close a couple of times, but I'm not in the heat of the battle like a player would be, and you guys are so familiar with that. But even just from arm's length as a broadcaster working for the team and being part of the organization, it's giddy.

It's totally – you live and die with wins, and then you get to this stage and you start thinking about it, different possibilities, and it's surreal. You know Jen, worked for the Toronto Maple Leafs, my wife, for 15 years. And I watched it from that point of view. But they never got close. Now this is three wins away from the ultimate glory. It's wild. That's pretty awesome.

There's a number of reasons that the team has done so well and why they are where they are. We've been talking about cons, my thoughts, a little bit on this show. Where do you have things right now? Is it a goaltending thing? You got a forward, a D-man. What are you thinking so far for if Vegas does get it done? Well, I had five guys.

And five guys deep is unusual going into a final from one team. But that just sums up the way that they approach things with their depth and rolling four lines and their three pairs on the blue line. But I went with Jack Eichel as my favorite because of the story. And he leads the team in points too, but the story is a big part of things when you get to this stage and what he's been through.

And I have William Carlson because of his impact on the game. Now, you've got to watch a little bit closer for William. He's produced goals, and he's been involved in the offense more so than he has in the last couple of years, and he's really resurrected that part of his game. But his overall ability to match up against the McDavis or Drysaddles or Rupe Hintz through these playoffs has been awesome. Then I went Marcia Soap, Stone, and Stevenson.

That's the five guys. And I went all forwards with my top five. As good as they are on the back end, they're so balanced. And I just have trouble putting a goaltender in there when you've only played, you missed a round. It's been impactful, but not a story for this team. So I went all forwards with Eichel leading the way. Yeah, there's no question that Hill would have to have

an incredible run. And they do value a final a lot more than they do the rest of the rounds. And that shouldn't be lost here. And there is a lot of hockey to be played still in this series with just one under both teams' belt. And there's no question with Florida, we only look at two guys kachuk and

bobrovsky but uh i'm surprised you didn't put petrangelo in there because he is a guy that just commands so much respect out there and i really thought and and we saw it we've covered petrangelo with his run with saint louis but there's something that happened in that Edmonton series that showed me this other side to Petrangelo that for me took him to another level. I'll go back a series against

the Winnipeg Jets. He took a penalty in game two, but it sent a message to the Winnipeg Jets. They were able to kill that penalty off in game two, and they turned that game around after a not very effective first period. And they could have been on 2-0 in that series. And Bersuah was great in the first period of game two,

and Petrangelo didn't snap but stood up to Winnipeg and sent a message to everybody in the building and then did the same thing after being targeted, certainly the focus of the Edmonton Oilers, and sent a message with that slash along with his play. And he's been really effective. But nobody really stands out on that blue line. Alec Martinez is one of the greatest players that you're going to see

from a consistency basis. Love Braden McNabb. And their third pairing, you guys, Nick Haag and Zach Whitecloud, is as good a third pairing as you're going to find in the National Hockey League. So I don't disagree with you on Petrangelo. It's just that they're so balanced back there, and it's just such a unique group that it's hard to put one guy over the other because I feel like I'm almost slighting somebody else.

And now Shea Theodore looks like he's finding his game. So the Florida, I want to say bread and butter so far, has just been four-check hard, play physical, and get unbelievable goaltending. Vegas seems pretty well equipped to handle some of the four-check with D-man that break the puck out really well what are your thoughts on getting to bobrovsky and you know his performance in game one this could be kind of an opening that maybe some other teams didn't see yeah i wasn't surprised at it to be to be honest uh given the the extensive delay and jumping right back into a final i thought they they were really going to be challenged,

whether it's Bobrovsky trying to continue that strong play out of his rhythm and jumping into a Stanley Cup final or the team game, trying to resurrect their flow. That game one was a real uphill battle for the Florida Panthers, and that's why I also put it as a major important factor for Vegas to be able to take advantage of that and win that game. I think tonight is going to be drastically different from both sides. Let's see if Florida continues the after-the-whistle stuff.

They love it. I enjoy it. But it dragged that game on for certainly a while the other night and if the referees are going to start taking guys out from that you you can't afford to uh to put yourself not that vegas is is lights out on the on the power play but it just costs you attack time uh in a game so we'll we'll see if the if the power plays end up as lopsided as they were the other night because Vegas doesn't take a lot of penalties themselves.

And if they continue to call it like that, then Florida may have to adjust their after the whistle kerfuffle and shenanigans. Just want to revisit a little bit of this kind of goaltending carousel the last few years.

And there's no question that Marc-Andre Fleury was the face of this franchise to get them out of the gate. Then they make this bold move to go get Robin Leonard, which, again, people were like scratching their heads. Now you're in deep for like millions of dollars. And let me get this straight. They're three wins away from having like nobodies in net. That there's no money on the cap left on all of them.

Bersuad was the guy that we thought we'd kind of maybe, maybe not get them there. And then Aiden Hill comes out of nowhere and does. Does any of this make sense to you? Well, not in a traditional approach. You went through it. When you won your cup, you had a stud and it's followed through. I was talking to somebody the other day. That's an old doesn't claim line.

I was talking to a guy the other day, that's an old dozen plane line. I was talking to a guy the other day. Is this the most unexpected goaltending performance by a team in recent memory? Like Matt Murray seemed to come out of nowhere with Pittsburgh. We've seen goaltenders shop for that Cam Ward back in the day,

but he was a top prospect. But this is bizarre. And Aiden Hill, the reason why they went out and got Aiden Hill was because Leonard uh came uh down with the double hip surgery in the summer after everything it kind of free agency had passed and there wasn't a lot left and Sean Burke had a relationship with with Aiden Hill and liked him that Aiden was the backup for most of the season uh and now people call him the fourth string goaltender because he wasn't the starter in the playoffs and revolved with the backup role with Jonathan Quick. And now he's the guy. And you're right, there's no cash in there.

The highest payroll guy is Jonathan Quick, and he's your backup because you've gone four deep uh right now five deep if you consider uh Robin Leonard it's it's surreal at times I have trouble getting my head around it like who is really uh the the backup who's the fourth stringer where where does Aiden Hill uh fall into uh the the pecking order like what what do we call him uh but he's he's I tell you what the guy battles i think of him as a blocker always thought of him as a blocker but his athletic ability and then uh talent level to be able to adjust and make desperation saves we saw it in game number one

and he's been able to do that he's been really impressive and and the other part is they're all free agents uh except for logan thompson they signed for another two years everybody else is free agents and uh maybe that's a little signed for another two years. Everybody else is free agents, and maybe that's a little bit of motivation for everybody, too. I got one explanation that makes all of this make sense. Sean Burke. What? Sean Burke.

Yeah. So, Burke, I call him, and you basically grew up with Burke. You know him very well. Burke, I call him the goalie basically grew up with Berkey. You know him very well. Berkey, I call him the goalie whisperer. And he's like, stop. I've tried my whole life to shed that. Because he is the goalie whisperer.

Everywhere he goes, he is unbelievable at goaltending. Now, Sean has aspirations and always has. He's run Olympic teams. He's been GM of world championship teams. He can do more beyond just goaltending and uh and we should recognize that but there's nobody i would put uh bill radford and and sean burke uh right up there at the top as being able to find goaltenders and not do overhauls with them not be overly technical but know exactly what to what to do with them and how to tweak them and

and make them into frontline goaltenders and and he's brilliant and and the dude's just a great guy he he is so positive and so much fun uh i just love the guy and uh we were talking earlier this year and this is going to be a story uh two seconds uh berkey was in an all-star game i think in 1989 uh and there's a picture of gretzky and mary lemieux and a face-off and all you see is berkey's hartford whaler pads uh uh and and you don't see the top part of him but he's like i'm in an all-star game picture with mary lemieux and wayne gretzky so we got him that picture off ebay and uh and as a commemorative thing and then this morning i'm at breakfast,

and I get told about this great story involving Mary Lemieux and Doug McClain and Jack Armstrong. I'm with some PEI guys who are down, and they tell me this great story. Have you heard that story about Mario joining Doug on the golf course? Yes, he's told that on our show. Yeah. Five times he's told us that.

I thought I'd heard all of Doug's stories. I'd never heard that story before. What a small world. Yes. He was so proud of it too. But didn't he not know it was Mario? And that Mario went up to him and went, Doug? Like it wasn't Doug going up to Mario saying Ace or Mario.

It had to be Mario going up to Doug. And I don't know whether that's true or not, but it's a pretty neat story. I think he's gotten more famous since he's been a regular on our Off the Rails Friday. That's what I think. We're helping him out. Off the Rails Friday. Yeah, that's our professionalism level right now. And it's named after him so darren what's the uh you know the energy there like in vegas is always at a fervor right like not

just for for hockey but there's always stuff going on can you sense any palpable difference with this going on you know with the potential would we see a parade down the strip if they win uh i'm i've been uh instructed that we don't talk about that i'm not going to uh go down that uh and i'm superstitious so uh i mean that would be it's a yes they can they can follow the formula one cars in uh in in november or october uh when they when they do that but uh no no no, there's tons of energy. This place is rocking. They've always loved this team from day number one, and you would never be able to recognize if this was a six-year-old franchise.

You look at the T-shirts, the license plates, all the ancillary things around town that come with a longstanding franchise. They haven't, and it's rocking. The place I'm at for breakfast this morning, they're all wearing BGK paraphernalia hats and shirts, and they're all excited. This town, the best part about the Vegas Golden Knights to Las Vegas,

or Vegas, as people, locals call them, is it's their team. It came in. It didn't exist before. They named it after the Golden Knights with the Vegas instead of Las Vegas because that's what locals call it. It's the one October tragedy bonded this team. But it is their team more than the Raiders, more than the baseball team will be, whatever they name that, more than the basketball team in a couple of years.

It is their own franchise. I got an idea for a Stanley Cup ring. A roulette wheel that you spin. Oh, my God. Is that a good idea? That is such a good idea. And then it's a puck. Contact a jeweler immediately.

I know you don't want to talk about it because you don't want to jinx anything. You know what I did think about when I first joined here and there was deep runs in the first couple of years and I allowed myself to think about that. One of my first thoughts was how pissed off is Kipper going to be if I ever wear a ring?

This was like two years ago. I got a problem with that. You and the team dentist. I have a problem with having stanley cup rings i actually was gonna after this interview was gonna ask you about that yeah where you said it because to be honest it does feel a little we had this conversation before and it was one of the first things i thought of this was two years ago in the bubble uh when when they had a really good team and they were on a roll and i thought kipper would like i i would have to reject it just to avoid first rap no don't do that i would have to i would have to reject it

and they would ask me why would you do that and say that kipper kipper i'll make an exception for you but not gary lawless no i'm i'm with you on that uh regard uh i'm with you on that one hey have a blast the rest of the way okay uh and uh i'm with you guys uh whenever you want to call uh give me a shout out with you guys all right pal darren millard host of the vegas golden knights tv broadcast and host of the chirp podcast doing a terrific job out there They're definitely waiting for him to hit his shot on the golf course. You hear someone swing in the background? Yeah. I don't think, like...

He's out for breakfast. Is that what he's doing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought for sure I heard contact. The members who live and breathe, like, building a Stanley Cup team should be the only ones with rings. So, you know, I say that with full respect to Darren, but, like, I don't really like it.

You know, like, Jack Edwards and Brick got Boston Bruins cup rings or whatever it's like. Well, at least Brick played. I don't mind them having. For the Bruins that won the cup? No, but he played on the Bruins at least. I'm fine with everyone who has a part in the success. Alumni don't get Stanley Cup rings.

If you're stretching the groin of the players for the game, you're impacting the game. If you're filling the groin of the players for the game, you're impacting the game. If you're filling the water bottles, you're impacting the game. If you're calling the game, I'm okay with you getting something else. Even if it's a ring, it could look it could be something different.

The Islanders' wives every year got something for their contribution to it. A smaller ring, one year a pendant, one year a bracelet, like something nice. But to it. A smaller ring when you're a pendant, when you're a bracelet, like something nice, nice. But to me, to give the same thing again,

no disrespect. This is not about Millard specifically, but to give him a large, the same thing is you're going to give Chandler Stevenson. Yeah. Is wrong. It is. Yeah.

It cheapens his ring. It does. Nah. I can't wait for my Stanley cup ring when the least when it, well, when I was, when I was with the Marlies, I was the video coach of the AHL team

and was told that I was one of the people who would qualify under Lou Lamorello had the team won. And even then I was like, I can't do that. I can't show my dad. You know, had to at least win a cup, be like, AHL video coach, you know? After he's been to war with the Flyers in 78, he's on his way through to winning his.

No, you guys are kind of, you're right. Like, you know what even irked me the most, and correct me if I'm wrong, I could be wrong. You might be wrong. I mean, did the Raptor fans have a chance to buy the same ring as the players? No, but I have a Raptors replica ring. Okay, then I'm wrong. But sometimes you do hear rumblings.

I think you can get similar or whatever. Like, this is the one the players got. I mean, I think you could probably buy it. If you had 500K, you could probably buy it. I'm guessing that jeweler wouldn't mind. There's probably some infringement there. I doubt you could. No?

Some sort of patent or copyright. Just to kind of, I never saw a Stanley Cup ring until I got to see Keith Acton's at a Philadelphia Flyer training camp when I was like 18 years old. Yeah. I couldn't stop thinking about it all day. I just, it blew me away to see a Stanley Cup ring.

Now, do you think it's gotten too much? Listen, I wear mine at special events and i here's this peak era the first the first thing people want to say is they want to see it and i take it off i let them try it on actually wow and uh and it just like it's like the holy grail for them. They've never seen one before. So it hasn't changed over the years that the majority of people have never seen one up close before. And the first thing I want to do is, you know,

either try it on or take a picture with it. But, like, they're unwearable now, Kip. They're unwearable. You need to clean them at the car wash. I know. You know, there's a level where it's not a ring now. Now you've created something different. Can you bring it in for us to see?

But they are so special. They are so special. And it is what the players live and dream to have because you can never take that away from them. Yeah. A couple questions off of that interview well first a comment absolutely love that millard would not talk about a stanley cup parade that is superstitious brothers through and through that is just great work by him he is secondly he's a knight's nation like you are leaf nation 100 i would never even mention it even if

there are three wins away, or one win away. The second thing is, can you further explain your roulette puck idea? That's an amazing ring idea. Oh, the ring. The ring would have... The face of the ring would be a roulette wheel. Like a Sprewell's

on your finger. I think a slot machine would be too bulky. That is such a niche reference. That's very, like, 90s rap. What'd you say? Spring rolls, like, rims, the spinner rims

back in the day. Yeah, same thing. Yeah. So I thought, when you mentioned that, I thought you were talking about the parade, so I misheard you.

I was like, what the hell does a ring do that? Yeah, yeah. Okay. But it has to be, like, full cheese Vegas stuff. It does.

No question. If you're gonna wear gold-fledged jerseys and a gold helmet. An Elvis hairdo or something on it. If you're going to wear a gold flag, jerseys, and a gold helmet. An Elvis hairdo or something on it. If you're Vegas, this ring is, like, Bill Foley's got to put that money back into the ring. He's got to have zero profit after this. I will say, and I guess we'll get to it a little bit in playoff picks, but. Yeah, we got to go.

I think this could be somewhat short. Oh, you do, eh? Yeah, I just. We'll find out tonight. For sure. I also, just quickly before we go to break here, wanted to mention Cole Caulfield signing that contract. I thought we should have a quick discussion

on that. We got about three minutes here. Do we have three minutes? Are we no break today? No, we gotta take a break and then we'll come back for five minutes. $63 million deal. Eight years. Eight years. Which matches Nick Suzuki, correct? No, suzuki's was more wasn't it please look yeah because i know that they fought tooth and nail to have cole caulfield

not pass their captain and i just wonder suzuki's is exactly 7.875. I think that's exactly what Caulfield's was, right? We had said that a long time ago, that they wanted their captain to be the ceiling. And now their internal... Sorry? Here we go. Here we go. What do we mean? You know what he means.

It's a Leafs transition, and it's... Buddy, it works. It works. I'm telling you you they've got now an internal cap here are two best players this is what they make everybody back of the bus

yeah okay and that's where Kyle screwed it up and Lou wanted to do that with Marner and Matthews. Like Patrick Kane and Jonathan Taves. Same.

And look at the mess they're in right now. It's a dilly of a pickle. You got anything to say about that? With your here we go? Do I make sense or do I not make sense? I'm not even about you being critical of it because you're bang on.

It just sucks. It sucks for Leafs fans that that happened. It's also like it's tough to do this in like 90 seconds. You know, the history of the contract. You're right. They didn't set a hard. They did set a hard number and it was Tavares. And that was the one that everyone was wanting to be around.

If Matthews is wearing the C, would it make you feel better about the situation? Cole Caulfield is awful. No, it has nothing to do with anything. Your best player making the most money? They got their best player making the most money. Caulfield is also not any of the least four players. He is clearly not as good as any. You called that a bad deal before we went on air.

Why? Well, I just think if he ends up being a 40-goal scorer or a 50-goal scorer, it's a great deal for the Montreal Canadiens. Great deal. You've got this guy for eight years when we think that the salary cap's going to blow off the roof in a few years. I think in four years, Caulfield's going to feel like Nate McKinnon and Brad Marchand

and be like, what am I playing for 7-8 for when he gets 13? But this is where Jeff I'm not convinced. This is where Jeff Gorton and Hughes have to, and any other... Okay, let's use a Kyle Dubas term. Progressive GM has to hedge. You have to take educated guesses now that Cole Caulfield's going to be a 40-goal score.

You don't think he's going to be a 40-goal score? I think he's going to be that at least. Where do you think he's overrated, Sammy? I think he scores 50 next year. He's tiny and horrible defensively. I think he's... And he's been hurt already a bunch of times. He leads score.

Just put the puck in the net. Yeah, if he plays 50 games a year because he's always hurt, perfect. He's tiny, boys. I truly do. Now you've got only upside to surround Cole Caulfield with the money in a salary cap era. The Montreal Canadiens sit second on the salary cap for any rate. Say what you will about Pierre Dorian.

Pierre Dorian did the same thing in Ottawa, right? Locking those guys in at decent numbers, and now Ottawa should be okay now for the next five, six, seven years. Pierre Dorian was very loyal. All right, let's go. Okay, let's go to break. Back after these words, real Kipper and Bourne. The best Blue Jays show out there, period.

Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. All right, it's time for our playoff picks with our Sammy McKee. All right, like you said, time for playoff picks presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds. So a couple relevant things now.

Game two tonight, correct? Florida Panthers to win this series from behind, which they are now behind. So decent number on that if you think Florida's going to get back into it. Plus 230. Not a great number, obviously, but I think before the series they were plus 115. So if you still think they're going to win, it's a pretty good number.

Not for me, Kip. Yeah. On the other side of this, you can bet on the score for the series after four games. And to me, Vegas, 4-0, pays plus 575. Ooh. And I got to be honest. After watching that game, I florida hung around in it but they're just vegas is so much deeper can i tell you the difference for me go ahead kip no you go

ahead first the difference for me is guys going back on the pucks are alex petrangelo and martinez and white cloud and hegg and these guys that make nice little plays they the the four check from florida doesn't have the same teeth that way a lot of these playoff picks have to do with goals. A lot of goals have to do with goaltending. I want to switch this to the conversation that we had a little bit with Darren Millard and Aiden Hill. And where is he going the rest of this series? Can he close out on a $10 million goalie? Yeah. If he does, this soon-to-be 27-year-old unrestricted free agent. I'm coming to you, Sammy.

You be ready on this one. What? Aiden Hill, a Toronto Maple Leaf over Samsonov. Yes or no? I don't know. If he wins his Stanley Cup? No. I guess, yeah.

Sure. I will say that the numbers guys liked? I don't know. I guess, yeah. Sure. I will say that the numbers guys liked Aiden Hill before this season. Yeah, sure. Why not? He'll come here and crap the bed in a big game. That's just what happens. He's a nice guy, eh? Oh, my God.

He's a Leafs guy. You are. And one last. No fun Sammy right now. No, no, listen. Sure, they could sign him. He'd be great. Short sample sizes here.

Yeah. But, like, what do you think if if you're a general manager of a hockey team and you need goaltending help yeah and and aiden hill closes this thing out where's he you know he's not that different than samsonov i will say i watched that at least 6 4 2 15 yeah i first game, though. He kind of does that same thing Samsonov, like pushing out of the net, and he's a little busy still. 27, he doesn't quite have the pedigree of Samsonov. I don't know.

The only thing is if he wins the Stanley Cup, then you go, okay, well, he's been there. But he did that with Matt Murray, so I don't know. I don't know. Do you know? Mid. I just don't know whether or not he jumps up to become a guy that teams want or are willing to pay. And last playoff pick, not hockey related, RBC Canadian Open this weekend.

Rory, an overwhelming favorite at plus 450. He's won two of them, right? In a row. Sammy, you're going to be there? I'm going to be there on Thursday. I will be out the show Thursday. I'm going to be there Thursday, Saturday, Sunday. If you see me, I love cold beer. So, you're going to be there? I'm going to be there on Thursday. I will be out the show Thursday. I'm going to be there Thursday, Saturday, Sunday. If you see me,

I love cold beer. So, bye, anyone. I'm going to take it in on Sunday as well. I'll be watching on the telly. Alright, listen, for all of you out there that have sent me belated birthday wishes, including you, Gary Soames, I told you to scram beat it. Thank you very much. It was a great birthday. We're back again

tomorrow on the Real Kipper and Bourne Show. Have a great night, everybody. Enjoy game two.