Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Breaking Down the Bs

Episode Date: April 19, 2024

It is the eve of the Stanley Cup playoffs, and Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee are locked in on the Leafs' first-round matchup against the Bruins. They get into storylines from the Leafs' skate today, whether Nylander's absence is an injury concern or just maintenance, Brodie missing the cut and Matthews and Marner staying split for now. Then, they compare the Leafs' and Bruins' positional groups and how they balance out. How good does Samsonov need to be to win the series? Will Woll enter the fray? Finally, Leafs legend Wendel Clark (32:47) shares his thoughts on the Round 1 matchup, the physical aspect and the keys to the series.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

we are the real kipper and born show on the eve of 2024 stanley cup playoffs for Stanley Cup playoffs. Wow. Where? There's a dress code in effect. Yes, there is. There is. On late notice. Good job, you guys. Glad everybody's aboard. Wherever you're watching, listening,

Sportsnet 590, Sportsnet 360, and Sportsnet Plus from 4 to 6 p.m. When you don't catch us live, download us wherever you get your pod in Texas at 590-590s. This is also Off the Rails Friday, which means Doug McClain's off strike. Oh, we got him back. I think we got him back. I cannot confirm.

You met his demands? Or deny. I love listening to you when I'm on. He's back. But there's a sense that Doug McClain will make an appearance today at the top of the hour. In the meantime, we've got Stanley Cup playoffs on the eve. We'll welcome in Wendell Clark. There's anybody that knows what this time of the year is all about.

It's Wendell Clark. In the meantime, how are you guys feeling? You know what? I'm going to go to Sammy first on that. First of all, I feel stupid in this jacket. Okay. What's going on? I mean, it's like a three-person hand-me-down to me because I left my house too early today.

You get here too early because I was too juiced up. But I'm wearing a jacket that's a little too small, but looking good. You do look good. Thanks. Yes. That guy in a little car. That guy in a little car. Very well done.

He's trying to look like he's bulky. Yeah. But I will be honest. I am feeling incredibly nervous today. And I felt nervous before the show, which is something I haven't felt since day one of this on TV. And today I walked in here and I was like, I am really nervous. And I'm feeling,

I got to, I got to play off pit in my stomach. It's go leaf, go season. It's car, it's car flag season, baby. It's time.

I'm nervous. Feels good. Feels like living a little bit. Are you feeling a little better than... Is giving up 11 goals in the state of Florida a couple of days ago a thing of the past for you? Have you moved off of that? At least they only gave up 11 goals in the two

prior to that as well. If you're watching on Sportsnet or YouTube or wherever you want to watch this after, this is me turning the page, boys. You are. I'm turning the page. It's playoff time, baby. Those two games never happened.

Sheldon was, all he was doing was watching tape in between periods of the Bruins. No one cares. Screwed up. Never happened. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go.

Let's go. Let's go to the news of the day, shall we? Should we talk about what's going on with the lineup, or do you want to tell me how you're feeling? No, I'm good. I'm good. You know, you still look good, though, Sam. I want to tell you that.

Thank you. I got a haircut today, too. Oh, sure. With your haircut and the jacket, if the Leafs go, if by Monday they're up 1-0. Wearing the exact same thing. Exact. I'm wearing this jacket every day if the Leafs go, if by Monday they're up 1-0. Wearing the exact same thing. Exact. I wear this jacket every day

until the Leafs lose. That guy is a little... Okay. That is now a thing. Fair enough. I'm not lying. I will wear this every day. Spring is in the air.

Stanley Cup fever is in the air. And JB, where do you want to start here in terms of this key matchup? If I'm not mistaken, this is the 17th time the Leafs and the Bruins will play in their history. But like maybe the fifth in the last 12 years, which is a pretty incredible short run here. Is everybody ready for another one of these? Yeah.

I mean, you got to love it, right? I mean, this is a great foe this is an original six opponent this is there's history there's you know there's just a lot to love in terms of getting excited about the matchup so i'm fired up there totally totally thrilled about that is this part of your nerves yes that you have to go into a place where there's not easy access for like 5,000 Leaf fans to get to. Like there would have been in Florida. I think at this point with this, I am in a good place with the Bruins in terms of playing them.

Because, I mean, they're already 0-4 in the last series. Like 0-5, what a huge difference that is. To me, there's a mental part of this. It's like, well, for the fans, you're expecting them to lose. So if they beat you, beat them. What a pleasant surprise. Like, it's a very interesting spot for the Leaf fans to be. You're Cooper.

You're trying to frame it as we're the underdogs here. We're just happy to contend with these guys. Well, they're obviously the underdogs, yeah. But no, part of it is that I hate that building. I hate watching games there. We will get to a ton of kippers, clippers in the next little while or throughout the series but uh our our boy sammy here has already declared jim montgomery uh not in the same class as a paul maurice or john cooper i think if you went league wide those guys are one two for coach clips

i would say that i don't know how it's going to play out as the series goes on. I'd say that Sheldon was pretty close to the vest today, which is extremely unlike him, as we know. And Jim Montgomery was the same, pretty close to the vest. But, you know, as the series goes on, these guys tend to use the media a little bit more as a tool in terms of getting more calls potentially or however they want to call it a player or somebody on the other side. So we'll see how it progresses.

But, yeah, he's not exactly cooper or maurice let's just say that yeah so let's start with who's going to play for the toronto maple leafs on the weekend we have some updates but it sounds like well they have updates we are being denied updates mostly is that the state of affairs of sheldon that That fair to say? Well, the big development today from practice is that William Nylander was absent from the skate. Yeah, that's a big deal. As well as Bobby McMahon, who was hurt in the game against Detroit,

and we kind of knew that he was on the fence to play, but Willie not being there is a big surprise to everybody, and the coach addressed that absence. If you want to hear that, I think it's clip number one. I just kept him off the ice today. Both he and Bobby McMahon both stayed off the ice today, but both are possibilities for tomorrow. And that's it.

I mean, the tree's made it pretty clear to me. There's not going to be any daily injury updates or anything like that. Our guys are available and uh that's it so it's an injury versus an illness like i said okay you guys are available that's all you're gonna get don't you dare ask one more question follow up with me okay oh oh no mouth shut okay uh yeah but that's i mean a little page out of John Cooper's book in past years. We're not going to say who's available. We don't know.

Could this just have been a mental break for Willie? Here's a guy that the storyline of 100 points got buried over Austin's chase for 70, but it hasn't been a good stretch for him. And could this have been nothing more than just a one-day mental break here? Because I got to be honest with you, I don't see Willie in game one. I'm wondering, like, what is going on here? How does a guy finish the game and there's no sense of anything and then game one he doesn't show up like what what is going on here no that's a really a good

point which really kipper just reinforces that he's gonna play you know like he finished the last game i it seems like a wild stretch to say that he's then not going to play in playoffs so i i think you can count on nylander mcmahon i'm less sure about you've been less sure about his availability i i don't expect mcmahon to play tomorrow yeah okay no no it's here's a guy that there was if you're gonna use what was the term they used uh probable use, what was the term they used? Probable or what was the term? Available. Available, right?

You would have used it in Florida. To not use available, possibly available during those two games and then throw him in in game one to me makes no sense. Whatever is ailing, whatever is bothering him enough where you definitively say he was no good to go Wednesday or Thursday makes me think, why are you going to push it or force it right into game one? Well, don't you think, though, that if he was close to coming back that it would make sense to say, okay, well, let's skip these two games and make sure he's good for game one my sense is if if if it was bothering him wednesday thursday then like give him saturday and possibly monday

or the following week like whatever was bothering him whatever kept him out this week doesn't go didn't go away for tomorrow night okay in my opinion yeah that i think it's it's much more significant than day to day and there might be a chance that he doesn't he doesn't play till later on in the series so with that with mcmahon out that does open a door a little bit so right now the way the lines were today and matthews is back with bertuzzi and domi um marner and tavarez played with matthew nize i believe robertson is a placeholder for willie so you're looking at willie holmberg and yarn crock yeah and then doer camp Reeves. That's your game one lineup. That's your game one lineup right there. Yeah.

And I'm happy that Reeves is in a position where he looks and he's earned that spot to start game one. Yeah. He's got a four check. He's got people looking over their shoulder. That's what this time of year is all about. And he's earned that spot. The other thing, too, is it's not like the Bruins are the fleetest of foot.

You know, whether Pat Maroon's on that team or Marchand isn't electric anymore, Zaka. Like, a lot of their guys are not the fastest guys. So I feel like Reeves is a pretty good fit in this matchup. The other one I like, too, is Jarnkrok with Willie on the third line. If we're going to spread the offense, right, with Matthews, Marner, and Willie, then you still have to give the freedom of Willie to go and do his thing, and Jarnkrok is, I think, a good guy to cover up,

to watch his back when he's cheating like a mother. You know what? All Swedes, eh? The Swedish line of Willie Holmberg and Jarnkrok. So that's a good line. I like that one. Then the big news on the back end, TJ Brody is the odd man out. I mean, he wouldn't confirm or deny when

asked about what's happening with with with the decor like he gave a short yeah you know to the point answer that's not even worth listening to it was just basically like yeah you know it's playoff time we'll yeah we're not decided on anything but according to line rushes and according to practice tj brody's gonna be on the outside looking in starting game one exact lineup we thought you don't you don't throw him in when you've practiced with other guys. Like, what do you want to piss off? Yeah. You're going to totally piss off guys now where you can't trust practicing

the day before a game together. You're right. You saw this coming a long time ago. I think it was maybe a month ago you're talking about Brody being a maybe in playoffs. There was just not enough signs for me that his game was in a good place. And this one's kind of tricky for me because this is a guy that you were kind of counting on here. Sure. Like he was supposed to be that guy that kind of was the buffer between your fourth, fifth, and sixth defenseman to Morgan.

And I think everyone's comfortable with Riley and McCabe, but then it gets a little dicey for the Leafs. Brody was supposed to be that kind of anchor. He's a $5 million guy. You're starting the stanley cup playoffs with your five million dollar defenseman in the stands i do have moments so i have been fine with this lineup but i do have moments where i'm like is it super overthinking it to have like labushkin over tj brody is that overthinking it is it lilligren over brody are we overthinking this but

um i just think you have to put the contracts aside Kip yeah can't it doesn't matter it's it's not about it's it's just what the idea it's the idea of the money yeah the money that you you wanted invested in the person you've invested in the person all along yeah the money is now it's just imbalances the feel of of what you should have had going into game one. That's all. The idea of a $5 million defenseman is that he's a good player and a good contributor will be in your game one lineup heading into the playoffs, and he's not.

I think that's a pretty big shock. But I do think back to an older generation where we didn't know what players earned. There was a pure meritocracy. You say, who's playing the best? Who makes the most sense? In that case, I don't know that Brody does. But the other thing I kind of think that just, like, peeks in my head a little bit is in the past at the trade deadline

when they've added new players, it's been like it's the new players team. Like, you're talking about how do we get Ryan O'Reilly going and where do you put in, you know, Achari and where, you know, Shen is going to be a big part of this. Rather than saying the core is the core here, and if you can fit in, great. But everyone's like, well, you've got to play Edmonton because you traded for him.

No, you don't. He has to play his way into this lineup. I don't know why it's necessarily handed to guys. Well, they want Edmonton to butcher Pasternak. Basically, he cross-checked Dreisaitl and got himself a playoff. But you need, as a management team, though, like, I get what you're saying, but if it doesn't end well,

that stuff's coming back to the management side. You gave up draft picks for guys that didn't even play. Yeah. Like, that's, you want to cover yourself here, right? Well, but you know what else comes back to the management? You took out one of our guys who'd been there all year for a guy who stunk. You know? If you put in Edmondson, he's no good.

It's going to come back, too. So there's risks all around. Yeah, but you might as well go down with the guy that you added. Yeah, yeah. That's the whole thing is if you don't, then you look like you're second-guessing yourself before you've even had the outcome decide for you. And that's not a good thing.

That's not a good look. As long as they're quick to go away from it if it doesn't work. As long as if at game two, Leafs lose 5-1, they go, okay, that didn't work. We got to do this better, different. All right, speaking of the Lions, you want to go to keep on Matthews and Marner? Yeah, he got asked, like, that didn't work. We got to do this better, different. Alright, speaking of the lines, you want to go to keep on Matthews and Marner? Yeah, he got

asked, like, how hard is it to keep those guys apart? Basically was the question, and this was the answer. Very easy. That decision was made weeks ago, and I've liked what we've seen from that, and liked the options that it gives our guys,

and I guess the rest of our lineup. So, yeah, it was quite easy. You know, he offers stuff up that's so good for our show, but he just shouldn't. Like, you know, like why tell us it was made weeks ago? I love it. But that's great. Well, and this really comes, for me, off the back of the work that max domi has put in to kind of change the perception that first half perception into a guy that uh can can be looked upon as a guy that can hold his own with

austin matthews this is this is the real key here is that if if max domi can get off to a good start with Austin and have that depth spread out, it is for sure making the Toronto Maple Leafs a stronger hockey club. It is. And what it does to me, so McAvoy and Lindholm have been paired up on the Boston side, and those two guys are far and away

their best two defensemen. They play the most minutes, the toughest competition. They often anchor their own pairs. They've got them together, I assume, to shut down the guy who scored 69 goals this season. So that should free up Marner to drive a line, to beat Carlo and Gryzlik,

and have Tavares there with him, and hopefully Matthew Nyes too. So, yeah, hoping it spreads the wealth and gives the Leafs a chance to get the depth scoring they haven't got in past years down the lineup. Oh, go ahead. I was just going to say then, you know that pair is going to go right at 34. Yeah.

So what does that leave? Zaka, Coyle to go up against Austin? Yeah, good question. I got to believe Coyle because you get Marchand and DeBrusque with Coyle, which to me that's pesky, got some skill in D. Would that make sense to you? Yeah, I think it does. And I think we have seen that matchup during the regular season,

which really sets up for me a pretty good battle between Marchand and Domi. Like if Marchand's doing Marchand things out there, it's Max that will be in his face. Yeah, that's a good point. I have a prediction. Marchand will in fact do Marchand things. That is my bold prediction for this first down. Domi, Domi's like, he's fine with playing like that, you know?

It is. And as long as Max is smart to pick and choose his spots and he cannot end up in the penalty box with an extra two. He can't be Cadbury either you know with the. You gotta be able to be really smart here.

Yeah. In terms of when to get into his face when not to if you can pull him off take that trade all day long, Max and Brad in the penalty box together. That's a win for the Leafs. But you can't go by yourself. Yeah, I think that's a really, really salient point.

That's an important point. That is going to be a lot of jawing, and I think you would make that decision before the series. My junior hockey coach, we used to write the other team's lineup on the board, and you would circle the guys you want to get in their ear and square the guys that were blockheads and you wanted to stay out of their ear i'm sure they've decided how to handle marchand ahead of time do we want to be in his ear or not don't you have to play it smart it's going to be a good matchup to watch you want to get an overall feel of uh where sheldon feels like the leafs are yes i do all

right clip two feeling's good you know uh guys are excited you know it's it's good to turn the page of the regular season that was kind of dragging on there for a bit but you know once once you knew who you're applying you're able to to hone in on it a little bit more and then the excitement builds up much more from a player's perspective coach's perspective you're you know you're digging in on the preparation and there's not a whole lot of time our schedule's been tight uh here but um yeah you know you want to just drop the puck and get going that's you know it's the most exciting time of the year i gotta ask you guys a question because you talked about the penalties that you can't have Domi taking when he's out there against Marchand. You can't goad him into stuff.

Where do you think the Bruins power play ranks in the league this year? I think it's decent, isn't it? Top? No? No idea. 14th in the league. It's unusual. So it's not the same unit that it's been.

Which, you know, it's clearly not like, oh, yeah, they're going to suck at it in the playoffs. It's going to be good. But, like, I don't think it's what it's clearly not like, oh, yeah, they're going to suck at it in the playoffs. It's going to be good. But I don't think it's what it was in years past, and that's something to me that's surprising when I looked at that, that it's down to 14th. Yep. Well, outside of Pasternak being a true superstar,

they had a lot of meat and potatoes on in in this lineup up front and that's not to take away from marchand and his ability to score but marchand as an offensive threat isn't pasternak he's not no he's not he's just he's marchand yeah he had 60 some points below a point per game. And according to the daily face-off stuff with the Lions, and they're usually pretty up-to-date here, that Marchand is not on the first power play unit. So they're maybe doing for the two separate units here.

They have Pat Maroon on the first power play unit, apparently. And to your point, they finished 14th in the NHL in just total goals as well. So they're not the threat that you would have seen. Which, if you're the Leafs and you're a deep goal tending, that helps. The great thing, watching that Florida team play

on, was that Tuesday night that they played them? Wednesday. No, it was Tuesday. Tuesday, Wednesday. Sorry. The Leafs did dodge that bullet because when they turned it up to 100 that doesn't look like many teams in the league that can do that no but the the the consolation prize here is no treat but the bruins are not the panthers so i think that's something that if you're a leaf fan you can kind of be like well at least we dodged that bullet because it felt like Daryl Sutter, you know,

quote, waste eight days with the Panthers. Yeah, the Florida Panthers were also the league's best team in terms of goals against. They let in under 200 goals on the season. You know, Boston top five as well. So still very good, but not quite Florida. So we all are on agreement that like the leafs this is a definitive advantage going into this series is the leaf forwards against the boston

broon forwards are we all are we all together on that yes the toronto Maple Leafs finished second in the NHL in goals this year. 298. They score a ton. Zach Akoyle, Morgan Geeky. Who's stopping Austin Matthews? We do this every year where it's like, yeah, the Leafs forwards are the advantage. And then it's game seven and Geeky's to win it's just you know you do this every year and that's been the great torture of this leafs team is that on paper their forward group is excellent but when it comes down to the big moments that's when things get dicey and that's

where other teams guys have risen to the occasion like a pass we're not there yet don't take us to game seven let's just take it into game one. You say it's an advantage. It is. It clearly is an advantage, but... Don't give me the but right now. I don't need the but right now. We're laying out the pros and cons of the teams.

This is a great offensive team. Are we talking about the Leafs here? You're talking about ghosts. You're not talking about reality. You are. It's not reality. It's not reality. No, it is reality.

They score more than anyone in the league outside Colorado. We're just going by the optics. We're going by what we've seen. What should happen. What should happen. Before the ghosts ruin things. Okay.

Yeah, on paper, they're way better at forwards. On paper, 100% agree. Agree. Yep. Advantage Leafs. Advantage Leafs. For sure. We got one green check.

Until the big. Oh, my God. Are you just like. What do you think? You're damaged goods. That's the only way Oh, my God. Are you just like. What do you think? You're damaged goods. That's the only way I can describe you. I was totally unjustified here, boys. They've given us so much.

We're going to invoice you for this therapy later. Continue. You just lose until you win. Right? That's what you're getting to. The Chicago Cubs won the championship 108 years later. It's just every once in a while. You got to grit it. You don't believe anything. It's just every once in a while. You got to agree.

You don't believe anything. Anyways, let's go. Next thing. Buddy, I believe the Leafs are better than the Boston Bruins up front. Sure. Okay? Yeah. That's a fact.

That's it. That's a fact. That's what I'm going for. Agree. Okay. Defense, we probably would give the advantage to the Boston Bruins, but if Morgan can look like Morgan in the first round against Tampa Bay, where we saw the best hockey of his career,

that would go a long way to balancing it a little bit. Agree or disagree? I mean, it has to happen. It has to happen. Without playoff Morgan, you look at the Leafs' decor, and it's just not. They're in huge trouble without playoff Morgan. Yeah, without playoff Morgan.

He needs to be able to play 25 minutes, assuming it's a 60-minute game. And we've been in trouble before saying that he's not going to be able to flip the switch, so I believe he can, and I believe he will. But boy, that game on Tuesday shook me a little bit. But yeah, we turned the page on that. That didn't happen. But Hampus Lindholm, two years ago, was like Norris when he for he didn't have that no he did not absolutely not so

if if that trend continues can can mccabe kind of balance out lindholm a little bit you know i don't know there or is that a reach? Well, I just think they're different style guys. But, I mean, in my mind, I think Lindholm is like a good puck mover and a good skater. You know, in the end, I think McCabe ended up with five more goals than Lindholm and probably as many points. So, yeah, I think that's. But as far as minute muncher.

Yeah, he can do that. A guy that can shut down and protect. Yes. Can he come close? He can come close. Okay, so what does that leave you with? Gryzlik, Carlo. Gryzlik, Carlo, Shattenkirk, Peek.

And Peek. Shattenkirk is not good at this point. Has been a great career, but. Third pair guy that can play secondary power play maybe or power play in general can make some plays you can put them through the glass on the first power play unit first power play so and then grizzlik i like grizzlik i do too i don't think he's a top four no i also like carlo but i he doesn't have that kind of like, if he were a bit more physical, I'd like him even more. But yeah, like he's, they're fine.

But I don't look at them compared to the Leafs guys and go, you know, it's head and shoulders. The Bruins decor is better. Don't get me wrong. It's better. But I don't think it's head and shoulders better. I'm getting the sense that if you get Morgan last year, McCabe can hold his own, and then you just hope certain guys stay within their limits.

Yeah, but Mora's physical. Lilligren skates it out. It should be okay. Yeah. All right, I'm in agreement on that. Now. Now we get to a duo that's been lights out for the last, what, few years, three years?

Vezina last year for Allmark and Swayman will be on Vezina ballots this year. So this is where it's kind of important here on a Sammy start. What do you need, Ilyas? At what number does Ilyas Samsonov's save percentage have to be for them to win round one? Great question. Is 900 enough? No.

No. 9-10. He was an 899 in their win last year. Vasilevsky was a 740 last year, so that helped. That's a great point. Was he that bad? How many goals on the average here? It used to be a lot, is your point?

Four. Seems unlikely. Listen, I don't know if Samsonov has to stand on his head and do spins. Yeah, but he can't be bad. But he's got to be good Sammy. What button do you push to make that happen? I guess a week with Curtis Stanford is the... They back down to whatever gulag he was in with

that time in the season, and you hope. You hope. Let's go to Sheldon Keefe on Samsonov. He's had a good season for us. He's in a good place, and anytime he has slipped up, he's bounced back. I think he's in a good place there. He's got lots of experience.

You know, we've got lots of depth in goal, lots of good options for us, and we feel good about it. You know, Waller hasn't played as much here in the last couple of weeks, but had his run before that and got some time in the net. And like I said a few weeks ago, our plan was, you know, we didn't know how we'd end up there, but we thought it'd be sort of a split by the end not necessarily rotate like rotating each game but like we ended up in the last 11 games there

like we have a six for sammy and five for for joe so you got good work for both guys and then jonesy gets in as well and um you know we feel good about our group there. Oh, my God. Don't start talking about good options already. We haven't even started. I was concerned about the phrase lots of depth. Do you mean more than wool? To be fair, Montgomery said, like, the exact same thing. So if you want to play the second Montgomery clip, Derek, he said the exact same thing, basically.

We got two great goaltenders. Our entire group's very comfortable with either one. And, you know, performance is going to dictate a lot of how we move forward. All right, can we also hear clip one on who's starting tomorrow so we can talk about that guy? Sure. We have decided that we're not sharing it with you guys. Oh.

Uh-oh, he's going to give us clips of that length all series? He's got to be swimming. Yeah. Does, doesn't it yeah all right i mean they are both very good goaltenders right it's uh there's there's no doubt that that is the strength of the team you kind of hope that what happened in playoffs to them last year so they went all mark all the way through to game seven right and then we're like crap we're gonna have to pull hit the emergency button like are they gonna alternate these guys if things are going well one of them were to have a shutout or one of them were to give up six did they just keep switching all mark played the last two games of the season by the way he did uh swayman was a no sorry he

didn't i lied he played the last game of the season i I would say Swayman played 44 games, 9-16. Allmark, 40 games. That's incredible. 9-15. That is sick. So that adds up to 84, meaning there was some pull and someone went in, but almost a dead split and a 9-15 each.

Listen, it's anyone's guess based on Montgomery, but my gut says that they'll start Swayman first. I have heard that from people, that it feels like it's going to be Swayman. Any huge advantage or disadvantage, bench boss? It's a good question. What is Montgomery's experience? I know Sheldon Keefe now, I feel like, has been through a number of rounds with this core

and hopefully learned some lessons. And I, having worked with him, know he's a smart guy and not so stubborn. He wouldn't change things. So I'm confident in his ability. I don't know Montgomery's. He was in Dallas. I don't know if they went deep at all when he was there. I feel like I'm so much more familiar with Maurice and Cooper

with the playoff stuff as opposed to Montgomery because it's been so long since the Leafs played and he wasn't the coach last time the Leafs played himself. Is it Julianne? It would have been the guy. I'm having a tough time. Vegas coach. Oh, yeah. Cassidy. Cassidy. Thank you. So. Well, boys, what do we think?

Well, what's your predictions? Yeah. We got Wendell coming up. Or you want to save him towards the latter part of the hour? now? Well, we got Wendell coming up. Or you want to save him towards the latter part of the hour? Let's break, talk to Wendell, and then we'll do our pitch after. Let's just make sure to give him. All right. People want to hear what's the call on the Real Kipper and Bourne show.

But before that, we'll take a break, and we'll welcome in one of the most popular Toronto Maple Leafs in history. Wendell Clark will join us, the legend. We'll get into the Leafs' chances of slaying the Dragon once and for all. And this year's team, how tough are they compared to years past?

We'll get into that with Clarky when we return to The Real Kipper and Bourne Show. Covering the Blue Jays from an analytical perspective. Jays Talk Plus with Blake Murphy. Be sure to subscribe and download Jays Talk on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the end of the Real Kipper and Bourne Show.

As promised before the break, Toronto Maple Leaf legend Wendell Clark on the eve of the Stanley Cup playoffs. Let's welcome him in. Clarky, how's it going, pal? Hey, guys. How are you doing? We're good. How are you? We're all good here.

What, 24 hours until a little over 24 hours we get it going here. Does it matter how many years have gone by since retirement? Is there something that gets the juices flowing this time of year for you? Yeah, this is the one time we're always still excited, I think, as ex-players. We don't miss training camp or the grind of the season or getting hurt, but first playoff game, that's fun no matter what. This is when the home building is the most fun and the road building hates you wait how do you feel about the road building they're

going to be going into and the draw they got here boston bruins that's a good old rival it's a great rival and actually i don't mind it both teams kind of limped the last couple games look like they're waiting for the playoffs to start as it was and uh i i like i like the situation uh that we're going into actually well it's interesting now because the the last uh year uh there's been a sense for brad tree living you want it to get bigger tougher stronger i i think we can all be in agreement that that's happened here do you how physical of a series do you expect uh you know with the likes of brad marshall involved in all of this yeah well he's old now

he's almost as old as you and i kipper but the uh the the big thing i think it's going to be less physical than if it was the florida series and uh you know the first game of any first round is is nuts you know what it looks like anyway and that doesn't matter what series it is um and then from there i i think our key isn't i think we've added uh toughness we we can initiate it a little bit now we just don't have to react to it um but the big thing is for us to play patient um our our players that aren't the skill guys have to be placed i have to be patient and don't get out of position trying to force something to happen just let the game come to them and we'll have the skill to outscore

the other team by the end of every game well and this question is sort of related to that how tough is it when you go into a playoff series and you're all amped up to run guys over and the intensity and all that how tough is it to be composed within that i think back to kyle clifford taking a major in game one or even cadre you know taking a suspension is it tough to sort of manage the emotions and still stay all jacked up um well i think it's a you want to be there but it's it's it's everything within the rules and the rules have gotten a little lighter than it was in the old days obviously but uh you're just if he doesn't have the puck well you can't follow through four strides later.

An elbowing penalty, a high-sticking penalty, those are all still in the game, so you can't do that. Really, it's just forecheck hard, play hard, finish your checks when the puck is there. Just don't get overaggressive on pinches and third guy not being in position because you're trying to force something to happen. Because you know in the playoffs, that's when the other team eats you alive and you can't get that second and third goal because you can't donate goals in the playoffs.

Earlier in the show, we were talking about the thought that Max Domi may be going up against a Brad Marchand or a Bertuzzi and there's a lot more sandpaper in those guys than we've seen in years past, and that might come in handy against the Boston Bruins. But, you know, yeah, it's been a while, Clarkie, but it feels like that epic scrap that you had with Marty McSorley for a lot of Leaf fans feel like yesterday. Can you take us a little bit into your decision to go after him at that

time with so much on the line including maybe getting thrown out or getting an extra penalty like what what would max and and tyler batuzzi be thinking about if they had to make a decision like you made against the la kings in the playoffs uh well, I pretty much knew Marty was going to fight. I don't have to worry about him turning and skating away. When a guy's 5'10", skating up to 6'3", he's not skating away. But the big thing is just to play with great energy. And those guys can. If they can play the way they did,

the way Bertuzzi played in Boston last year in traffic and the way Domi was playing in Dallas, you're just playing with great energy and tenacity. That's more about the toughness in today's game is every shift you're playing with tenacity and puck battles and you're in there grinding. And we want to initiate the grind on their team on their defense force bad passes because uh forcing them to do things in a hurry not not do the flybys and stuff like that

when what would you say to toronto maple leafs fans who believe in ghosts who believe in curses in the jersey and you know because it's the leafs this they're going to get bad calls or bad luck or it's not going to go their way. What are your thoughts on those vibes that some fans believe to be true? Well, that's the fans to talk about and the media to talk about. It creates attention and fun and anxiety in the series. This series, it's going to go back and forth four times, I bet, no matter how long the series is. But it's something I think every player goes into it going, no, it's going to go back and forth four times, I bet, no matter how long the series is.

But it's something I think every player goes into it going, no, we're going to win this. That's our mindset. If you're not going in with that much confidence, then you're not going to win it anyway. The players have got it in their head that, no, we're a better team. We're going to play harder and smarter, and we're going to come out winning. I think I'm hoping that's what our dressing room is thinking when they're going into this.

Joining us is Wendell Clark, Toronto Maple Leaf legend on the Real Kipper and Bourne show. Excited to start the Stanley Cup playoffs. Wendell, in terms of coaching staff, how does that role change from a regular season to the playoffs? This is another shot for Sheldon Keefe

to take a talented lineup deep. What do you remember, basically, out of a guy like Pat Burns uh during your stretches here in terms of uh how they can truly make a difference uh during a playoff series um yeah no they're gonna have the game broken down every player is gonna have a a sheet of who they're playing against they'll have the whole team and then they'll have who they're going to have the game broken down. Every player is going to have a sheet of who they're playing against. They'll have the whole team, and then they'll have who they're playing against pretty much every shift until the coach starts juggling and rolling the dice

when something has to happen mid-game. But really, he'll have them all prepared. The assistant coaches will break it down, which defensively and penalty killing and power play, they're all going to be on the same page and getting everybody to buy in and understanding what their roles are. And then it's, you know, when you're coaching, you're reading, you're reading the game. No longer do all the numbers matter. OK, over time, if we play this way, odds are we win because analytics tell us that.

Well, come playoff time, you can throw a lot of analytics out the window because you're not going on an 80-game analytic. You're going on a four-game, seven-game, three-period. As a coach, you might say, this isn't working. I have to change it for one period. It's not that you change the whole system. You might just change it for one period just to see how the other team reacts. And that's where the coaching will come in with his gut call

and what he sees out of his team and what the other team is doing. When I look at your stats, you know, that 92-93 year, you're 39 points in 66 games. You go into playoffs, you're a point-per-game guy with 10 goals. What does it take for the best players to maintain or even increase their output in these situations where the other team is is keying on you and being even harder on you well the easiest thing in that year was come playoff time after the halfway through the

detroit series i got to start playing with gilmore oh is that the secret that gilmore thing has a little bit to do with getting more points. Okay. No, and points become harder to get. So you're playing in traffic. The players that want to – you don't have to be a tough guy running over guys if you don't play that way. But you have to want to go through traffic to get your goals,

even if you're not a big guy. You know, Nicky Borszewski scores in overtime because he's going through traffic to tip a shot in from Rouse. So it's about going through and hanging out in traffic because it's going to get tighter inside that, I call it the five of diamonds in front of the net. You have to want to play inside there, and defensively, you've got to keep everybody out of there. If we keep everybody out of the five of diamonds, nobody scores.

They score one goal a game. If we don't get inside it, we don't score more than one goal a game. And really, the game is that simple. It doesn't matter the era. And it doesn't matter all the video and analytics. You break it right down, the shape of the building has never changed. So with you joining Gilmore, is it inevitable that we'll see Marner back with Matthews ats at some point i think you're going to see a lot of it like a

little bit dougie come playoff time with us um he ended up playing centering uh davy andrew chuck and borchewski and then he come and centered the the third line with myself and either Foligno or Robbie Pearson or Glenn Anderson. So Dougie started double shifting to have offense on two lines. And then basically our one centerman didn't play that much. And I think with Marner, I think because of the injury and the timing of when it happened and how good Domi did when he went in there, I think he's got an element there as a coach that he can change things up a bit because the team has played that way now. So I think it's a bonus.

He can throw a couple different scenarios. You know, you're a harder team to check because now you can throw, you know, you've got Willie Nylander, who's been our best forward the last three playoffs. He can carry a line himself. Then you've got Tavares playing another line. You've got Matthews. And so you can throw more than one line out.

So they have to worry about checking more than one line. How do you feel about the additions they made, bringing in Labushkin and Edmondson, a couple of big bodies? Is that going to be the difference in protecting a guy like Samsonov, maybe, who numbers not great this year, but has shown stretches of being able to be a good nhl goalie yeah no i like it i think they're going to be harder on the forwards uh when they're doing cycling our end i'm hoping that's that's the one of the reasons why they're here that uh you know you hit and pin and check and hold down and uh be hard on the other forwards. And we just got to make sure we don't play high risk.

I think if your, if your name isn't Riley, you're not pinching past the hash marks on a regular basis. That's I need to make sure that our end is I don't care what our system is. Our end is looked after first because you can't allow come playoff time, you know, a one nothing hockey game with 30 seconds left in the first period and you allow a two-on-one because somebody pinched and now it's one one after one and you always want to lead if you can take it in so it's really situational and being that's why i

say for us to play hard and be patient our skill will sooner or later take over we're not going to score five six goals every game but with the lineup we, we are going to get two or three every game. Have you got your car flag ready? It gets ripped up. I got a two-hour drive before I get to the game. It'll be ripped up before I get there. Well, we can't wait for

it all to get started, Clarky, and we'll come back to you at some point. Hopefully it's a great, deep run for the Toronto Maple Leafs and uh we'll have you on a couple more times thanks for doing this pal all right thanks guys thanks for your time appreciate it yeah i love that that thought of either mitch or matthews jumping on a different line and doubling up. That's the one thing that I think he has not done that in the past. Steal a shifter, too. Go big or go home with these guys, right? I think he's double-shifted Nylander more than Matthews or Marner

than I can remember in the last few years. And I'm like, listen. You're right. The guy that should be double- to me is is marner above everybody else that's that's just my opinion no i i don't think it's a bad opinion can we sneak marner out there with the fourth line you know whatever just give him another couple of reps and especially with what wendell said he's been off for a month you know what really resonated with me was uh the five of diamonds stuff and just if they get inside they'll score if they don't they don't, they won't. It's not that hard, you know?

And that's why you have Edmondson, the long stick, and that's why you have Labushkin in his playoffs. Size of the rink hasn't changed. It's a good line. All right. You want to go first? Sure. So it's tough on a show like this

because I've never been the homer guy, but I am taking the Leafs, and I'm taking them in six. I took the Leafs in seven. Do it. It's okay. It's the Bruins in seven. If they go to Boston in that building in game seven, it's a fair bet. There's only one reason why. Because we've kind of noted

where we think the strength and weakness is. And I don't blame you, but going into game one, there's a distinct advantage for the Bostonoston bruins over the toronto maple leafs one word culture that's it that's it they've had a better culture and the toronto maple leafs haven't but this needs to be the spring where that changes for the toronto maple leafs yep and you know what the bruins have gotten away with some blown playoffs

along the way that people don't, you've probably noticed. Well, they would be talked about like the Leafs if they didn't get that one in 2010. They've had some of the most all-time meltdowns. I mean, they blew that series lead to the Flyers. They're down 3-0. They were literally the highest point total

in the history of the league last year who lost to an 8 seed. They lost in game 7 in their own building twice i believe in the stanley cup final they've had some horrific so my point is you can get in their ears you know they're not above the oh god not this again feeling either yeah it's just and you could you could play that card if you were literally any other franchise you're right you're right you can't it tough as it leaves and i think it's going to be an excellent series and i think it's going to be paper thin super tight but when it comes down I think it's going to be an excellent series, and I think it's going to be paper thin, super tight. But when it comes down to it, it's going to go seven games,

and the seventh game of the series is at the TD Garden, and I don't think the Leafs can win that game. I just don't. I saw somewhere, I think it might have been the Athletic, the percentage chance or whatever that the series goes seven is like 30 plus, like 32, 33% that it goes seven games, which is insanely high. Yeah, it is really high. I mean, their goal differential between the two teams is one on the year but you just you gotta you gotta

assume that like after all these disappointments that there this is the peak this is the the star players in their prime this is their time so you say leafs and seven yeah leafs and six i'm the guy that says bruins and seven yeah Which we really wouldn't have thought. Rude. Now I feel like an idiot and I feel mean. It's okay. You get to be right. You have the chance to be right on the show.

I'm not switching up my pick, but I feel bad. Like, I want them to win, but I just can't sit here on my platform. It's okay. I know. You're jaded. I am. And you're damaged goods. We get it. This jacket's going to be damaged goods. We get it.

This jacket's going to be damaged goods if I move too quickly. You have to live with yourself. And, you know, that's punishment enough sometimes. Boys, this is going to be fun. Buddy, let's go. I know. I can't believe it's not tonight. It's going to be really exciting.

And, you know, we come here on monday talking about game one teeing up game two on the way like it's just a it's we're right into it you know the playoffs are all still like this weekend fast this weekend is just a cornucopia of sports action word like just you got the overflowing nhl playoffs kicking up you got the nba playoffs kicking up you got the jays you got the golf you got everything and you got the Jays. You got the golf. You got everything. And you know what? Good coach weekend. Three Canadian teams. Our favorites.

My kids are going to have a lot of iPad time this weekend. Alright, and we're only getting started on Off the Rails Friday because we got seven more series that we got to touch on. Oh my god. Seven. And we got Doug McCl that we got to touch on. Oh, my God. Seven. And we got Doug McClain at the top of the hour.

He hasn't been on, like, forever. This is just like, hey, how are you? And he'll go on for 20 minutes. It's the best. Yeah, it'll be a nice break. Turn the mic on. All right. Doug McClain, when we return, the real Kipper and Bourne show.

Do not go away. We'll see you next time.