Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Can the Leafs Bounce Back Next Season?

Episode Date: March 3, 2026

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee continue to look ahead to the trade deadline after the Toronto Maple Leafs' loss to the Philadelphia Flyers, a fourth straight defeat. They discuss what can be learned from the play on the ice at this point in the season, whether the Leafs can realistically turn it around next year, and if Auston Matthews and William Nylander would have the patience for a longer turnaround. Later, former Leafs GM Gord Stellick stops by (33:37) to discuss how the team should approach Friday's deadline, what he expects from them down the stretch, and Easton Cowan's usage this season. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

All right, let's get her going. Clock's ticking. The Real Kipperman Borne show, Season 5. Nick Kipperyl's Justin Boren, Sammy McKee, Derek Brandeil. In? Is this true? Frank the Tank? Brasca?

Frank the Tank is in today? He is. He's 100% in. I could tell just by the camera work pre-show. Love. Love Frank the Tank. I was looking up how to spell his last name, and I saw it. He, uh, there we go.

He's in like multiple values. He plays drums. Cool guy. Sick flow. Long gray air. He's awesome. Big fan of the tech. He's original Dersackies guy.

Wherever you're watching, listening, Sports Net 360, 590 the fan in Toronto. It's streaming always on Sportsnet Plus. Glad you're aboard. If you do not catch us live, there's Spotify, Apple Podcasts. And YouTube, where we got our trusted chat going. where we always appreciate a thumbs up. The Toronto Maple Leafs came oh so close to ending a three-game losing streak

only to lose in a shootout last night against the Philadelphia Flyers. Got a chance to go. Oh, my God. Was it electric? The lamp chops were wonderful, wonderful. Yes. And the company was great. I don't know, better vibe than Saturday.

obviously. Yeah, they played good. Yeah, better effort, close game. I don't know. I mean, all right, I'm pulling a J.B here. I'm trying to find some positives. I got to tell you, I was just sitting down here looking at the lineup, and I saw we had a few audio clips, and I was like,

oh yeah, I played last night. You know, like I spent so much time. We are now, what, 48 hours until the trade deadline? No, 72 hours to the trade deadline. Like, we are, it's coming up. It is. All the conversation, all my thoughts, all the fan basis, thought, everything is about big pitcher.

I don't see anyone being like really like the push late in the third. No, no. I know. And I don't want 21 more games of nobody gives a crap. I know. I know. But I'm not going to allow it. I'm not going to allow it.

There's still. I was worried about you. I don't care. I don't care about standings now for the least. I don't care. Points. I care about pride and seeing. something of being pros.

Be pros out there. And I thought it was a much, a much better look last night. I get it. Flyers are struggling too. Two struggling teams last night play to a draw after 60 minutes. So I get that part. You can't quit. You can't mail it in and you can't have your coach for the next 21 days

pointing to his head and his heart. And it will come in every day And we'll have a board up between us And our game analysis will be Did they look like pros? Yes or no, we'll pick a box. And the show will be over. Listen, I understand I'm with you too.

There is more to be learned About where they're at, who's important, the direction they're going, how the players feel from the hockey. And yeah, they showed some pride last night. I thought a good bounce back effort. You know, I think nobody really knows how to handle what this next 21 games are going to look like. I mean, I see them in the post game and, you know, I see Willie being like, oh, it's a good game.

It's a good step towards people. And I see people online being like, oh, what's he talking about? He doesn't know. Nobody knows how to handle this. Nobody knows what to say. Nobody's like, or like, oh, we're trying to build. They don't know what to say or what to do after. a game. Like, Barube, I mean, if we can play his clips, like he's just, I think it's a very

unfamiliar position for everybody involved with this. Yeah, they haven't declared direction, clearly. It's just a very weird thing. All right, let's go to Craig Barubi on his overview of what he saw last night, clip one. Good battle by our group tonight. I thought really good second period had a lot of opportunities. We didn't capitalize on them, but I thought our game was good all around, you know, penalties in the first period kind of

guess set us back a little bit, but overall, you know, I thought the team competed hard, played good defense, did a lot of good things. We just didn't finish. What did you think of Austin and Willie together tonight? Thought they were good. You know, Austin had eight shots.

Willie four or five. I mean, they created it. They just didn't finish, you know. But I liked the line. Yeah. I thought Dakota Joshua was good. Like, there was bright spots where you're like, okay.

I think it's going to be really hard for the fan base to not measure, to not have like big sweeping takeaways for the rest of this season. Because you're still in like competitive window mode for a team. And like there's going to be some, there's going to be some bad hockey coming up here. And I don't necessarily think that it's going to reflect what the future is going to look like necessarily like the immediate future. I just think you're going to have.

to kind of take everything from here on out with a bit of a grain of salt. Yeah, I agree with that for sure. And I've been through it. Hartford, where you just know by February and March, you're just, what are you playing for? You're playing to take care of your numbers. Your next season. That I'm part of the solution. We've clearly heard from a number of guys, including Scott Lawton and Oliver Eckman-Larsen,

where I don't want to go or, you know, at least. that's the perception that they're giving is in front of the camera, is that they still like it here. And it's been going on for decades now that when the Leafs get into this mode, there's still guys going, God, it's still pretty good to be a Toronto. It's good to be a Leaf. It's good to be a Leaf. Yeah.

So 21 games. Heckman Larson committed here for four years. He got his money, you know, he wants to be here, thought they'd be in playoffs. And I don't think he intended to leave a year and a half later. So I have a question for you guys if I can commandeer the show entirely. Please. Please.

You are the co-host. Thinking about this today. It was like, you know, thinking about the teams in the division that are getting stronger. Buffalo rumored to be in on Robert Thomas today. Detroit rumored to be in on everyone, Montreal, talking about cadre, talking about big names. And thinking, can the Leafs realistically compete next season? Like, the whole premise of what we've talked about so far is, can this team retool?

Can they restock the cupboards and go back next year and be good? So is there any world to you, Kip, where they can be good again next year? Are these other teams leaving them too far behind? I think if, and we've done this already a lot, and others have done it as well, they look at the Boston Bruins

where we just thought that there was a period of two years ago when it was like it's going to fall off soon for the Bruins. I'm not sold the Bruins. It proved anything. But to answer your question, they are still in it a year later. In it? Okay. That's the best example I can give you of a rebound to get the Leafs back in it.

And that's depressing as hell. Okay. The Bruins bright spot to me is they drafted James Hagan's last year, fifth overall, because they dropped deep enough in the draft. They're going to get the sixth overall pick this year from the Leafs or the 7th or the 8th, whatever it may be. And they also dropped Minton in their lap. Right.

And so to me, that's part of a transition into, not this year. This year, they're no good. They're going to beat in the first round by whoever they play if I make it. And I think the Leafs fans next year would gladly think about making the playoffs and losing in the first round. Okay. So if that's what we're talking about. squeak into playoffs and if things go great.

But is it towards trending up? So you just explained to me that Boston is trending up. Okay. Because they have pieces to build off of now. So can the Leafs get themselves back in next year like Boston and find a way with flipping a few pieces or getting a couple of free agents or having a college kid drop in their lap,

get themselves back trending? up. That's the goal. Okay. So at that point, I'm talking about Austin Matthews contract is what I have in mind right now in the age of him and the age of Willie and the progression of you have to show them that you are trending up next year as contracts come up in a way that those guys are still looking like Matthews and Willie and you still want Matthews and Willie and want to be paying $25 million for the two of them.

or whatever it's going to cost. Yeah, that's a sales job, too. If you don't think you can do that, then you have to think about the rebuild, the bigger picture. The like, hey, we just need to do something much bigger than what we're talking about here. So in this scenario, I'm just saying,

if you're trying to make playoffs next year, Ekman Larson, you probably need them. I don't know how you replace them. I don't know how you get somewhere else. I know I've talked about selling a bunch of guys, but I think you have to have the real. realistic conversation of can they actually make playoffs next year? Detroit, Montreal, Buffalo, his teams are all better.

Tampa is still there. Florida's going to bounce back. It's really going to be tough. And next year the division looks so tough. So if you're not going to make playoffs next year, what are you marching to work? It's not sneaking up. We've been talking about Ottawa, Buffalo, and Detroit and Montreal, right? That we've mentioned, like, they're coming on, right?

They've been stockpiling for four or five years now. And they're already better than the Leafs. And they have a pile of assets. All these teams ahead of them do. So that's a big challenge next year for the Leafs. So are you to make, to get back into the race. Forget about making the playoffs just to get yourself back into the conversation. I think there's two ways to look at it.

Either teams are allowed to have a down year. in midst of competitive windows. That happens a lot. Teams missed the playoffs here and there. So you could look at this season as a down year for a lot of guys. Matthews was hurt for a long time. You know, the Tann.

Willie's missed a lot of games. We know all the story, all the stuff on that side of it. Yeah, there's a lot of those things. And different coach, different system, different set of eyes. Like, for me, there's a world where they are a decent team next year. I think that's a fair case. Okay. So that's the one side of it you look at.

The other side of it, it's over, baby. You look at the division. You look at the ages of your top stars. You look at what's happening. in the past. You look at the lack of playoff success. It's time to just pull the, the Band-Aid off and just like Bukula said yesterday, take it down to the screws and just kind of start over. I just think it's a tough decision which one of those roads you're going to go down. And I don't think you can just say, let's tear it down to the studs or whatever without finding

out, without seeing if Willie's healthy, Matthews is healthy, your goalies are good, Tannava is back. I think you go into this offseason and I'm not sure who's going to be in There's been some rumblings that maybe Brad's going to get another kick at the can here to fix this up. Like if you go through this off season and you make some seem like you improve the team seemingly and you go into next year and you get 30 games into the season and you still look like dog crap, then it's time to dynamite. Then it's time to do it. So then that means going into next year, you have to be taking the idea of being competitive next season seriously, which I think probably affects a little bit of what they do here. in the coming week, in the coming three days. And to your point for the past four years,

especially the last year and a half, two years, the stars have never had more power. So it may not be Keith Pelley's decision or Brad Tree Living's decision. It may come down to Austin's decision or Willie's decision on where they are, what they're thinking, and do they still want to be part of this? That to me depends, too, on the direction they declare. Like, you see the Rangers have clearly declared, you know, that they're going to be selling, the Canucks have declared, and all the sudden, you see guys like DeBrusk being like,

I don't think I meant to be a part of a rebuild. You see Adam Fox not really fighting the rumors that maybe he would not want to be a part of what's going on there. I think if the Leafs were clearly doing that, you'd have Willie and Matthews going, no, I'm not spending the next three years doing this. You would have to think. That they've talked. They're not going to show cards right now. You don't think they're, I mean, they've probably had to talk to those guys

but a direction at some point. No. No? No? Well, what? They just found out five, six days ago that they were making play out. If I'm Austin or Willie. Matthews was crowd surfing at 11 week and a half ago.

If I'm Austin or Willie right now, why would I have that conversation now? Why would Willie have it at all? You'll never have it until they decide their tank. I think. out of respect, you're going to go to those two guys this summer and just say, okay, first of all, you're going to do your

end of the year meetings. You're going to get their thoughts on what worked, what didn't. What did you see? What did you feel? You're going to assess everything. And then at some point, it's going to be asked of them of

how excited are you still to be here. It has to happen. Right? Mm-hmm. How do you like having Max Domi as your winger in the prime of your career here? It's like, only Matthews saw that for him.

Well, if you're Austin, at some point you get to ask them, I lost Mitch Marner. And to your point, I got how many different wingers over the course of the season and Marner was never replaced. So, like, how close are we to getting a player of that caliber?

you know, my season next year may depend on it again because it certainly was a factor in what I went through this past season. You look at the teams who have looked like, so they win a cup and then they start to bottom out and it's like, oh, here it comes. Washington looked like they were on the way out and they kind of got some help from some guys coming up. Alexi Protas became a guy, Connor McMichaels.

They scored 30 goals one year. You know, for the Leafs, the things that can save you from hitting the bottom don't they're not there they don't have the same guardrails so yeah for matthews i think you'd have those conversations hey like could we be in on robert thomas i know that's hard you know we don't have the assets like are if we're not able to get guys then why should i feel optimistic i don't know man it's jason robertson a lot of rumbles that dallas isn't sure that they want to pay him 1213 million dollars i think based on

what we know about the offer to mitch marner And then the thought of potentially trading for and offering 13 or 14 million to ranting in, that they would have no problem throwing Jason Robertson $13 or $14 million. See, now we're talking. Who are the Leafs? Yes. Oh, no, now you're talking. Uh-huh.

He's one of the top scores in the league, Sam. See, his numbers. His numbers are right up there. with five of the big boys. Okay. I know he's flawed. Whatever flaws you have, he shoots at it.

The man is a top National Hockey League goal score. Now he'd be... Get someone who passes? He's still one full season away from becoming eligible, but would Austin need to hang on another year before we can get to this guy?

What do you... I don't understand. Jason Robertson. is a restricted free agent. This year? Yes. Yeah. He's going to sign a one-year deal to play next season for Dallas.

Is he okay? If he doesn't, he stays home. Wouldn't they just trade him before, if they don't want them now? Trade them now. It is a distinct possibility. But whatever the case is, I'm just hoping he gets to UFA is my point. Oh, yeah. That's not happening.

I see, yeah. He's not just going to be there for the taking. So can I can I get a can I find a caliber guy of that magnitude? You're probably right. He won't be in a position. He'll, if Dallas forces him to sign an arbitrated deal, it still could look as much as 11 or 12 million bucks for him on a one year deal. Last few years, he's 109 points, 80 points, 80 points.

This year he'll get 9. I know there's the spit and chicklets guys throw out Brady Kuchuk for, They traded for Jason Robertson. Yandel had a chuck for Robertson today. I mean, I don't think it's going to happen, but Jason Robertson has no trade protection, is my understanding. And I don't know, does Ottawa take a crack at him

and offer him that type of money, July? I think Ottawa would. I think Ottawa is like a lot of Canadian teams where it's kind of tough to get guys to commit long term. And when you get a good guy, 26, who can score 100 points. I think you do that. So, yeah, but I don't know what the Leafs can give them.

That's that. Just to come full circle, these are the conversations. The one that we just had right now has to happen with a guy like Austin Matthews and his agent to go. Austin's first question is, what are you guys going to do to help me here? Okay? I'm dying. Well, yeah, and that's, I'm looking at next year. You could chew one in the net.

Yeah. You're playing, they stacked you in the top line against. This roster will never allow him to become a 50 goal score again. Okay. Okay. Just know that. Could you get one in eight games? I know.

He's the second highest paid player in the league, Kipper. I know, but four of them are coming off the most emotional experience of his life. How will he done the freaky Friday here where I'm now? I know. What's happening here? I know. Now that he's won something, Kippers defending Matt. He was like.

Listen, I'm just. I know Austin has his flaws. They all have their flaws. But I'm also the believer of, like, he just can't serve people a $300 ticket and then come and see a fourth line player. No one goes to like Jacobs and gets a steak and nothing else. Just a steak on a plate.

Like usually you get a couple of nice sides with it or something. A couple Brussels friends. It's not a steak. It's hamburger. Oh, see, now that's slandering. you're paying for top and no i'm saying if you get rid of austin it's hamburger with them it's hamburger with them it's

it sounds like defense lawyer i i just think that going into this deadline if you're dead serious about being competitive next year making the playoffs you have to be in on those names on real players you have to be an acquiring team with guys term that are young otherwise you're just doing the slow arch down until you have to sell until you delay a rebuild. So if you are in that mode, then it is important bringing it to this year's deadline

to pick up a few tradables, to pick up a couple assets that another team may want. Yes, yes, yes. Because right now you have not. That's what I said. Be oversell us. Sell everything. Go to the draft. And try to get some picks and maybe a prospect that might be interesting to somebody.

Now, would you guys be interested in Austin Matthews getting traded for four? pieces much like Quinn Hughes. You know what's funny is before you walked in the studio today, I've got a tweet from someone here. My boy, NL. King, awesome follower of the show. And he asked about Nyes. He said, wrote Nyes to the Islanders.

He said, would you do Atchison? They drafted him this year, 16th overall. Heimann, Eiserman, and a first. I was like, I would do Matthews for that. I would do Matthews for Acheson, Heinemann, Eiserman, and a first, I think. You know, like, yeah, there's a world where

at that point you're just committing to a full proper rebuild. It's Willie too. Which means missing the playoffs next year. Oh yeah. Oh, it's missing the year after. Probably. Maybe three, three or four years. You know.

That's not in the equation. Well, then. I know. So to me, it's like, do you want to be in a position where the teams in your division are where San Jose is about to be where Chicago's about to be? These are the teams who are going to win the next Cups, by the way. The teams who have been bad for a while, they got a ton of picks. assets, young players coming.

It's just the deadline stuff. I mean, I was yelling to Kipper about this before the show even started, but the tone around the Leafs right now from all of everyone who knows stuff, not loving it. Not loving it. Yeah, it's going to be like, we traded McMahon and, oh, and Carlo. There's people screaming that they have to get a first rounder. They have to get a first rounder.

But nobody's, but like the first year, the Leafs have sucked. everyone's like yeah none other guys have any value but every time the lease need to trade for somebody they're like that guy is two first round picks 100%

not any value people are driving down the value of every Leafs guy when it's reversed it's the Leafs tax Leifes are playing the least tax of trading for players I'll tell you what's happening right now

okay it's same thing every year a few days into the week everybody's sitting on the big boys Okay, everybody's got their wish list.

The Robert Thomas is out there. You know, Cadry, Patterson for sure, is being mentioned. So they're all focused on that. And the Leafs don't have that. So it's much like last year. So Brad Tree Living is going in this time last year, and his wish list was Rasmus Anderson

and Braden Shen. Okay. And, uh, rantan, too. Ranting. Yeah. Please, rant and please. No. That was never in the cards.

Ever. Ever. Okay. It wasn't real. The martyr for, it was never. It was never there. It was like,

it was like flipping coins in a fountain. Okay. It's not real. This was real. That they sat and tried for Shen and Rasmus Anderson. And then once you- One game seven with that. Once,

once you're once that gets cleared up or once that you understand that it's either going to work for you it's not going to work for you then you go to the other pieces right now so the leaves you have to sit you have to sit and wait patiently now on your guys because they're aren't on they're not on the top of the wish list right now for teams and everybody's sitting on the wish list it's funny i was saying you guys before that like for eight years the leaps have been buyers at the deadline and every year it's a seller's market this this year it's a buyer's market it sounds like it's a like the one year that the leifes are actually trying to sell some pieces that's backwards. I will say the one thing I go on our website.

I love our website. I love everybody that does all the work on the website. And it's like Adam Vignan, five bargain bin NHL trade candidates. Who's the picture? Scott Lawton. It's like, are we trying to make the Leafs guys worth nothing? Why do you think we? Because it's the Leafs.

Nobody wants to see bias to the Leafs so they drive their value. Why do you think that matters? Because I think. You think people are so worried about being pro Leafs. if they say, oh, this guy's worth nothing. This guy's worth nothing. But it's the other way around. They're like, they got to trade a first to get that guy.

That's how I feel. You think GMs are basing their decision on the deadline. I think the coverage is. They're going to the website and they're going, oh, my goodness. I'm talking about the, I'm not talking about the GMs. I'm talking about the coverage. I'm talking about the way that people are talking about the Leafs guys. That's how I feel.

Okay. Okay. I love Scott Lawton. I love a lot of things about him. For the bargain bin. But just get him for nothing. He's been on the fourth line most of the year. I got a coach that doesn't play him all that much.

It's like, what do you think teams are trading for? They're trading for a fourth line guy right now, Sam. I think people, he's got a long enough track record that they have an idea who the player is, though. I don't, I don't necessarily agree that people look at his stats this year and go, that's what he is now. I'm not, I'm, you can look at any way you want, and I can, it won't matter. Yeah.

It's what the person who thinks he's trading for is going to get. him on. So they're turning around and they're saying you think he's worth a first round pick. You haven't used him. Here are his stats. Here's his and it's like

okay. I have no interest in debating the value of Scott Lawton. I don't even know why we're doing because he's bringing it up because he's saying they're all bargain basement places. Can we end this one and carry on with the show? Last year you're like if you're going to get Lotton, got to give up a first. Like it's just it you said those things. It's just it's

that was the price then i'm noticing that was just that's all so is it a Toronto thing Sammy 100% oh my god that people don't want to seem like they're being favorable towards the leaps it's like all the different stuff and they're not being like you know Bobby McMahon I haven't seen one person be like they could fetch you first like the market is the market all right okay and there's nothing you can do okay and if there's someone out there that's willing to give a second rounder for Scott Lawton chances are they're going to have to do it in the last second second So Carlo was out there last year.

He's worth a fourth in a bag of pox this year. Long was out there last year. They were out there for quite a while. And you just hope and pray that someone's going to come and meet your price. Brad Tree Living did last year, albeit at the last second. You can hope for that on Lotton. But right now, if there was a second to be had right now and a team was willing to pay for it, it would have been done by now, Sam.

If you can't get a second for Scott Lotton, just extend. them. You're trying to win next year. You need guys. It may happen. Yeah. It may happen. Just extend Lotton. I don't need a third rounder for Scott Lotton. I think at this point, I'd be surprised if both McMahon and Lotton are traded

both of them. One, I can see one. Yeah. Oh yeah, you don't think both. But I don't think both. Yeah. Are going to be gone by Friday. I could be wrong. Maybe they get a team ready to pull the trigger. You know, but the chances are it'll be maybe one of them. not two.

Yeah. The athletic had an article today on, you know, like a bold prediction for every team, you know, and what they're going to do with the deadline. The one thing that stood out to me is there were five or six teams that I counted where the bold prediction was acquire a right shot D man. That's what they're going to get, a right shot D. And you look at the right shot D market out there. There's Ristolin and Tyler Myers, like Murphy's gone.

Yep. And so I wonder if team. Risto Ristelan and Justin Falk. Yeah, okay. So there's a few guys. I think Brandon Carlo, though, if five or six teams are looking for a right shot D, might have more value than we think. What are they paying for him?

Because Boston's still eating, right? 325, I think they're paying them? It's nothing. It's a really good price. You can't double retain anymore, though, can you? No, you can't? No. So he's 325, and if I'm not mistaken, they have him for next year, too.

Yes. And he's, you know, coming off a year where things didn't go great, right? But he looks way better today than he did the first few months. His last 10 games, his numbers have been as good as they've been all year. All of a sudden you got a cheap Carlo right shot D, a bunch of teams want to write. To me, he's better than Tyler Myers, if you're looking for based on age and, you know,

the big games he's played in, I don't know. Part of my thinking on this is like, Ekman Lars and everyone's talking about him, you can do this with him next year. And who's to say he's not any good next year? He's not 38, 33. I don't think he plays a style where I don't think he's going to hold up? No, I, I,

He plays a style where I don't think it's going to fall off that much. He skates so well, you know, and these guys who are elite talent, is he... The only part that worries about me about Oliver Eckerman Larson is wearing tear. Sure. Right? But I just think if you are trying to make playoffs next year. So what we've come up with here is we're keeping everybody.

No, I think Carlo has more value, I think. And I like Carlo, but I think he might have more value than overall. I think Tannov is expected to have surgery. So whatever's ailing him, I think they'll have plenty of time. to now get ready for the fall. Wish he had done that. What a wah. People talking about what.

Let me ask you something, guys. I mean, we haven't really discussed this, but Matthew Nyes. Like, just simply, like, are we going to just hand him over the, I wasn't healthy card here? Yeah. He's regressed.

Yeah. I mean, I don't think if you don't like his year, the solution is to put him on the trade block. Unless you, like, get that deal from the island. I'm not remotely thinking about that. Okay. Well, I don't know. Maybe people on hold his feet to the fire.

Have we given him a pass this year too much? It's been pretty uninspired. Well, I mean, you're certainly not going to trade him right now because his value will never be worse than it is at this very moment. Right. I think if you're thinking about it, I just think he's part of the team. You know, maybe a couple years down the road, but I think you have to figure out, like he was so good last year.

And he's had a down year, some injuries. I haven't loved a lot of the year, but I don't think you're just giving up on him now unless it's four. No, nobody's saying giving up. I'm just like, part of a Robert Thomas package, sure. Did we, uh, overvalue him? Is he still projected for you to be one of the best power players in the game? He's probably worth a fifth.

I think he's unique. I think he is 23 big already had, you know, a 29 goal season. He can play on the top line. No, I don't think he's, uh, he's overvalued. I sent it to tweet today to ask for fake trades and I was totally overwhelmed by the response I don't even know where I was going to retweet the tweet to help make sure we had enough content for the show

you'd put it out five minutes earlier there were 53 comments I was like I think he's good there's 230 replies to it I don't even know where to stop I'm overwhelmed so we got gourd coming up I have a couple of good ones fake trades me Benoit for McDavid how about this one how about this one

Feasible. How about this one? To Edmonton. Bobby McMahon, Nick Waugh, a 2027 fifth round pick. Okay, I had to add that in there.

This is from Cake McJabe on Twitter, which is hard to say. To Toronto, Andrew Majiopani, Isaac Howard, 2027 first, 226,

third. You know, I always struggle with the pick math. You're sending him McMahon and Nick Waugh. And a fifth round pick. And you're getting back Mangiopani,

Howard, a first, and a third. So you're getting back, Howard first. Who are you giving up a first for? What's that? Well, you're giving up a first to get Wai and you're getting off the Mijipani money. There's spare parts. Nick Waz's a spare part.

Yeah, no good. Like 16 minutes for a Stanley Cup team two years ago. He sucks. You want to give away his $3 million next year. You're going to get like a fourth round pick. All right. Okay, stop it. If the Mange-a-Pani thing is like taking money on for them.

They're no. None of the guys were done in. 250 of those. If they're all like that, that's a lot. the last one you're reading. Let's hit the break. It's like the zigzags play for the least. They're trying to trade Cuddy for a second round pick.

Oh, my God. Come on. St. Cuddy. Cud's got sick game out there, but he's only worth of six. It's going to be a long 21 games. Four years you mean. It's going to be along like till Friday, 3 p.m.

All right, let's take a break. We got St electricity after the break. Sure. I think, I hope. Gordo, come and save our block. When we return, Real Kipper and Boren. Everything you need to know about the Blue Jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome back to the program. Nick Cabrero's Justin Bourne. Sammy McKee. A little electricity for us coming up. Is he ready? All right. Here he is. With all the answers, former Toronto Maple Leaf, general manager.

Cord Stelik. Does a great job on our show. Gordo, how are you, my friend? You know, something I got complimented about being on your show a couple of times last night. I sat in the seats at a game. A friend Dean Anderson invited me of the game. And for the first time ever, I was under the flag for the anthem

and then the leaf flag when they tried to get the crowd going, rather unsuccessfully. I felt like I was a one or two-year-old. Remember those parachute parties? So that's the kind of. kind of fun I'm having now rather than expecting the win games. So I'm good. I'm good.

Love hearing it. Now, if we went back to like, I don't know, 1988, 1988, 1989 when you were the general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs, am I in the ballpark? Glory years. Right? All 180 pounds of you back then. What would you do today with this roster closing in on a Friday deadline? Well, I face kind of a similar situation, but it was an expected situation.

So we were fortunate to get two first round picks as assets in the Ken Rega trade. Okay. So but you can't work miracles. Okay. So here's the thing. All of a sudden, the leaves are sellers. Okay, let's get assets. The cupboard is bare.

Okay. You're doing a rental on your house. There's no supplies. There's no carpenter. There's no electrician. There's no HVAC. All you can get is a guy to put a few more. shingles on the roof because it's leaking and you don't want it to fall in. Okay, so you can still

look at making good hockey deals, but not cosmetic deals to go, golly gee, wow, we got a late second round pick for Bobby McMahon. Take a look what a late second round pick has done historically. Now, one other tactic, Kippy and Justin, you may be better plugged in there. What about the nudge, nudge, wink, wink thing? Bobby McMahon, Scott Lotton, we're going to get assets for you, but we want you back. Do you want to be back July 1st? Here's what we'll pay you. So, I mean, that would be a little innovative. I think every Leaf fan thinks they can do the opposite of the Brendan Carlo trade. They can do that kind of trade, which unfortunately now has come to bite them in the ass a little bit, getting a top prospect like Fraser Minton and a first-round

pick. First-round pick still have value. I'm all for that. But let's not expect miracle. Oh, we're going to stock the cupboards and shelves in a couple of days. They're screwed when they're thinking about the future. Just as Chicago, Buffalo, Detroit. It does not happen overnight. And they had their draft picks. So do you feel like this team then has a path

to be competitive next season? Because that is kind of the story we're being sold, right? Like this is like, oops, we just kind of fell off, get back on the horse next year and we'll be the Leafs again top three in the division. Well, this team's lost the path. But can they find the path again?

Because, you know, Justin, F-1 race, you see an F-1 race start in the grid. And then all of a sudden the race goes, and there's one car that doesn't start, and they're out of the race. And oh, my goodness, Ferrari's pissed off or whatever, whoever they all are, whatever, Wadjit Khan, Dufford, Mazda,

whatever his car, probably, whatever. Anyway, they don't start. That's been the Leaf season, and it's made no sense. It's made most sense from the team that came first last year and the team that played playoffs nine years in a row. And that's not a distant memory.

That's a recent memory. Being a Stanley Cup contender, that's not a realistic, this is not a realistic present compared to it was a few years ago. But you're going to be back with Matthews. You're going to be back to Nylander. And sometimes in this world, a lot of things go wrong. I know the Chris Tad of injuries making him look like a heart trophy candidate. You had indifferent goaltending.

Your decourt that you brought back. And I don't think anyone could argue. It's not been the same. They don't get the pucks to the forwards. I have to say, like, why is everything broken down? So much so Craig Barubi touching his head, touching his heart that isn't that stuff they had? Isn't that stuff that was instilled in them? Can they instill it again?

So, Justin, you've got to go back at it, in my opinion, to some kind of degree. It's more of a salvage mission now rather than thinking, wow, we got a great chance to win the Stanley Cup. Gordon, these cars that you speak of, are you driving? Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm not driving the Ferrari, but I'm driving, yeah. Wajun Khan, Duffra, Mazda, Mazda, CX-90. I've had it forever.

24-51 Duffron, north of Aglinton on the east side. You know that. I only ask, Gord, because I've been in a car with you, and I'm not saying that you're slow, but there was a dog pissing on our wheel. Well, I know. You know it's not a Ferrari.

I am, you'll be happy to know I got my first speeding ticket in 100 years last week. I said, like, Lisa's going to be ecstatic because she gives me crap all the time about being an old man. driver so there you go kipi i wish you were with me you're watching and listening to the electricity behind a Ferrari these days um when you watched uh the leif's last night gourd i know i know everybody's kind of off the playoffs and the standings and all of that but what's important for you now you know

past the trade deadline to see for the next 21 games so okay it's called garbage time and um i may be overuse it. I don't use it disrespectfully. But I use it first of all because we would have had it back in my day when you were sort of not mathematically, realistically out of the playoffs and all of a sudden, you know, Gort Stelle gets you eight goals in the first 60 games. And then he gets 10 in the final 20. I go like, I really couldn't, I couldn't give a bleep about that. We were out of it then. Ideally, is you like to see the young players play like Gabe Perrault did last night with the New New York Rangers got three points. At least don't really have young players. Easton Cowan took a early and really didn't play much after that.

You know, it's kind of sad. Like, you know, God rest of soul, I don't know how many times you played in a team like this. I love Dan Maloney. I love Dan Maloney, the player, the coach, consummate professional. But he was assistant coach when I was with the Leafs when we came dead last. And we got Wendell Clark first overall in the draft, which was great. But I remember there about 12 games left in the season.

Practice was about to start. And he's getting ready for it. He's putting his skates on. and he goes, Gordy, don't you wish the season could end yesterday? And he was a pro, but I'm telling you, that's how they feel right now. Don't you wish to say, so anyway, the minimum you can do, because you're not going to get your sister. You know, like, it's too late for all that. So whoopi-a-you-fine, you find whatever you were lacking the first 60 games.

You got to put on a great show at home, okay? You can't do what you did last Saturday. These are your die-hard fans. That's a minimum, okay? you got to go, you know, put on a great show for your hometown fans for a starter. You want to try to end the season on a positive note, of course. And then I don't like, unfortunately,

you don't have a ton of young players, but this is generally where you try to give them that opportunity to play in roles that they wouldn't get to play if you were a playoff team. Gordon, how much value is there in the idea of getting guys who the fans want to see? I know Brian Burke talked about he wanted to get guys at times that put on a show.

And I've worked with Daryl Sutter. and when they took over the flames, he said that's one thing they wanted to do. They want to get some Western Canadian guys that played a way that the fans could connect with. I'm not saying for the Leafs in general, but is that a factor where guys are looking at players and going, that guy puts on a show

and that matters to our organization? Well, maybe to a degree, I don't know who that would be right now. I remember Nathan Dempsey, like he was a Marvel, right? When he was up, the fans like him. I think it's part of the Max Domi appeal. You know, he's got games where he can. You want a show, but you don't want a side-

show. Okay. Well, yeah, and I want him to approach the shoot out a bit different than last night. But anyway, so, okay, the thing is, Bradger Living said he wanted more snot in his team, and he got Joshua, Waugh, and Machelli, right? And that wasn't an unfair observation of the team. But you can't get snod at the expense of not scoring. You can't get snod at the expense of not playing D. So the player that is kind of a fan favorite, um, That's gone for this year. I mean, do either you guys know the only player who scored 20 goals the last time the Leifes didn't make the playoffs in that season? I'm going to say I'm on this one.

PA Parento. PA Parento, right? That's where, so, but the Leifes have Austin Matthews and William Neelander, John Tavares. But that's the kind of team and season they've had this year when they didn't have those guys. And PA Parento was kind of the fun player that got 20 goals. there's no fun player right now. This season ain't fun. This style they played has not been fun.

But your premise is a correct one. So last night, Gord, with your theory of getting some kids in there now or Easton Cowan certainly would be in that disappointing for you that he only played a little over eight minutes? I've been a little puzzled at times about his usage. And I took the penalty early in the offensive zone. and I guess that was it. I don't know.

You know, you've got hardly anybody else. So, yeah, so answer your question, yes, yes. Like, why not? Why not play them? What, you know, it's not like you scored a ton of goals. I know you put the big line back together and trying that thing, but I don't, there's hardly any other young players, but I'd play them. Yeah, 100%.

I mean, that's at least one thing we did when we didn't have very good teams. You know, you, hey, when you're out of it, play the guys. You know, that kipper, you know, you'd want to, I want to get a chance sometime, right? Just give me a chance, Gord. Just give me a chance. Gord, how fast were you speeding when you got your ticket? He was doing 61 and a 60.

I got 35 and a 30. Well, you got a 35 and a 30. No, you did not. No, no, I'm bad. Oh, him, yeah, yeah. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah, no. He knocked it down.

He was nice. I was on, what do you call, Glenn Care, and I visited my mom and the senior's residence. Whatever. Like, that's a great story. She's 96, whatever. It's the middle of day. And, you know, the sirens now, it sounds like a SWAT team.

One was a little siren. Like, I thought there was a mass murder time pull over, you know, and all the cars. It's me. You're a criminal, Gord, if you speed. Yeah, well, anyway, that was it. And they looked at two guys, looked over everything. Anyway, it was my brush with the law. So, Kipper, I can be a bad boy on the road, just so you know that.

Okay. You got to Anna McCurler, and we take no crap, okay? Love it. So a lot's gone on the last two weeks in El Gordo's life. Enjoy the rest. to the trade week, my friend. Thanks for doing this. We'll do, guys.

Take care. Thanks, Gordon. Good one. Yeah. I don't know what show means when you say that because if it looks, if guys stand out with their play, with their physicality, I mean, it's just them being them, right? Who puts on a show in the NFL?

Brady Kuchuk is a show every single time. Florida's Lomburg, who's in Calgary. Is that a show to you? Yeah. That's not a show. to me. That's just him. To me, I think it's a willingness to get in someone's face, to stand up for teammates, to fight, to score, to have pace to your game, to finish checks, to make the glass rattle, to be like noticeable. As I said earlier, but you just don't want it to be on

someone's own agenda. Totally. Look at me. Look at me. Look at me. It's okay. We lost, you know. 3-1, but I'm no one that scored. Locked out a pain of glass of the body check. Anyways, you mentioned to me a former teammate of my friend. Brian Leach traded. Yes. I don't think my mic's running. I think every time we go to a guess. What is going on?

20, 26. His mic has to shut off? I guess. Yeah? Oh, maybe. I don't know. What was the trade? Do you remember the trade?

I can look it up. Okay, because they gave up a boat load. And the only thing I can remember is the, I don't think, like, any of the boatload that the Rangers got for Brian Leach turned into anything. And we're talking about first and second rounders. That's all, that's how this happened. Yeah.

This is why teams need to go for it sometimes. Yes. Well, that's, you know, it's such a prime example of this time of year where you're like, don't be so scared. Yes. It was on this day in 2004 that they traded him for a lot of, yeah, for her,

Maxim, oh, boy, top names here. Contran Ditov, okay. Yarko I'maman, and a round one pick that turned into Chris Chucco. The second round pick in the 2005 draft. Oh, my. You can't have a better example than that. Chris Chaco.

I remember Chaco. I played Junior Rockies. Yeah, yeah. Could Chicoe, Chucko, Chuck him? Yes. Chaco is an all-time handle. He was a good junior player. But I will say the Brian Leach experience as a young, young man,

training for the Toronto Maple Leafs, was incredible. Can I say something? He came over? It was just like, oh, my God, this exists? I don't think people realized that year, how good that team was. That Leafs team. That Leafs team. That Leaf team was unbelievable.

Yes. That was still the Tucker era and McCabe. Would you like me to... Would they run into Islanders? No, they lost to flyers, I think. Would you like to name some dudes? Names some dudes.

Everyone loves naming dudes. Matt Sundeen, Brian McCabe, Joe Newindy, Gary Roberts, Owen, Nolan, Darcy Tucker, Antropov, Cabberle, Reichel, McGilley, Ken Klee,

Ponoceroski, Stajon, and Renberg, Ty Domi, Carl Pellash, Tom Fitzgerald, Brian Leach, Ron Francis, Acky, Berg, Richard Jackson, Calli-O-Hanson. Did you say the goalie? The goalie at Belfor. Oh, my God. Trevor Kidd rockin the greasiest chin team you've ever seen.

You know, I killed that team, eh? No. Jeremy Roanick. No. I'm just talking about, like, the following year. They would lockout. The lockout. Yeah.

But. And it wiped out contracts. That is how the Leafs would go down, right? Some dramatic way. And then they had all these guys in poor John. Ferguson Jr. is like, get rid of, get under a cap. Yeah. For the leaves. Yeah.

And then that's a tough spot. Kind of was the beginning of the end. But yeah, I think that's when Jeremy Roanick down the right wing shot it in the neck. See, what needs to happen right now is you got to get rid of a few bodies. And then Cowan will play 15 minutes because you're just, there's nobody around. Yeah. That's what needs to happen. Quillan's going to play.

You'll see Bo Glew. Quillin's my fourth line center next year. Quillin is, yeah. Yeah. All day long. Nah, you got a non-tender him. Let him the Bruin sign him. Let him cut him.

It is fascinating to see how this is going to play out. But I do think that it will be interesting after the deadline, just to talk about some new guys, see some new guys. Yeah, that'll be fun for one show. New guys here? Yeah. Oh, they're all draft picks. They're picks.

New to us, pal. You think they're all 10th round picks? Do you think they're going to get some bodies in here? No, I do think that you'll see Quote, no, gulf rule. Oh, okay, yeah, from the Marley's. Yeah, yeah. From the Marley's, okay.

Maybe you see. Is there a chance that they could trade, make a hockey trade? No. You tell me. I don't have confidence. You're the board, man. I don't have confidence that that's what's going to happen. I just want to know.

50 people that replied to me and I read one of them and Kipper made fun of me for the last of my life for it. So no more trades. No, no, no. Tomorrow. I'm going to let you read it. No, no, save them. Save them. Save them.

Not. Not. Not. Save them. That's, no. Yeah, I don't like that. Okay. We need to respect our followers, Sammy.

Okay. Yeah, you sure respected cake the game. I just didn't agree with him. That's all. That's what the process is. Thanks, Gort Stelik.