Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Goalie Evolution with Lundqvist & Ralph

Episode Date: November 21, 2023

There are no NHL games tonight, so Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee start with tales from their rec-league games. They are joined by Leafs radio analyst Jim Ralph (6:01), who shares some takeaways from the team's trip in Sweden, the state of the goalie battle and where this year's team is different and similar to previous seasons. Later, Rangers legend and newly inducted Hall of Famer Henrik Lundqvist (28:02) shares his induction experience, thoughts on the Global Series and how the goalie position has changed since he started in the league. Finally, a conversation about dominant goalies in the league, who's at the top of the ladder and the Juuse Saros sweepstakes taking shape.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's welcome everybody into the real kipper and foreign show on the no nhl games tonight edition of our show no what is this it's november i don't know what this is this is like there there's's house leagues that play more than the Leafs in the last two weeks. Yeah. My son plays once a week. That is more than... The Zig Zags have played

the same amount this week as the Leafs have. How are the Zags doing? Shout out my boy, Matty. Took a bad spill last night. Yeah. Heal up, son. Yeah.

Okay, this is how slow of a week it is. You're sending me clips of your men's league game last night. We did watch the hit, and I think the league should review it. I didn't like the play. It was Marshawn Desk. Didn't like the response from the boys. Okay, who got hurt?

Shout out Matty Hughes. Matty Hughes. My good buddy, yeah. On a scale of one to ten, where do you have Maddie as a skater? On our team? Yeah. The best skater on our team, for sure. Oh, really?

Yeah, he's a good player. Not according to the clip I saw. Yeah. All the guys on the other team listen to the show, too. It's their Sammy. It was a bad scene at the end of the game. In all seriousness, he broke his leg? No.

He separated his shoulder. Oh, separated his shoulder. Okay, that's a little better than broken leg. At first, we thought it was collarbone. It was a bad scene. He handled it like a man. So, it was bad. But we got the win.

Good luck to you, pal. You do realize, all of you, that you have to get up the next day and go to work. Yeah, that's, the thing is. What is the point of Matty going that hard in for a puck? So, he's a Olympic athlete. He represented Canada in steeplechase for our country. I didn't see any horses last night on the ice. And he has the, he's got that competitiveness.

Yeah. Right? Like, he's just, he's got that competitiveness. Yeah. Right? Like he's just, he's a competitive, and I'm not like that. I don't play hard. I don't skate hard. It's just a reckless play by that D-man. Yeah. Going in after that puck in his feet.

Agreed. I skate with the guys every Thursday morning, you know, and Lindros, and you know, not to name a few. Drop him. Drop him. In that moment, it probably looks like you get it. Thomas Cameron. No, you get it.

Oh, listen, if you want the puck that badly. You can have it. You can have it. Just a matador. You know, whatever. All you, pal. Whatever. But I do not want to envision driving through traffic to go get therapy in the next four to six weeks.

That sounds like my style of hockey. How does everyone's games shape it up? Like, whose games age the best at that skate? Thomas Gabriela hasn't missed a beat. Okay, he's a few LBs ahead of where he was. Aren't we all? But the mind is as good as when he played. It's like playing with Lidstrom out there

where it's like can you just be out of position once yeah for me please so he's he's can you not make the best pass all the time when you've got two or three options is there one time when you can give it away like i'm really still impressed with thomas cabaret best old guys i've skated with um god rest his soul dale howuk, before he passed was still silky. And Brian Troche is still really, really good. But those guys are unbelievable NHL players. So imagine they'd still be decent at hockey.

The other goal that we have, at least I do every Thursday, is just to avoid accidentally making contact with the biggie. Oh, yeah. Well, he is a... He can accidentally crush you. Like, it's... Yeah, it's just not fun going for a loose puck with him. Yeah.

And he's actually in good shape. It's not like he's... Yeah, no, he's just a big man. He's just a big man. Yeah. And he's actually in good shape. It's not like he's, you know, he's just a big man. Yeah. No, it's, you know,

I'm with you there. If you would like to have the puck, I'll try to get it back in other ways, but not going to contest this puck battle. It was a clean game though, up to that point. It wasn't anything bad. It was a chicannery

and it just, it just was a freak injury. Get the shoulder better. Yep. We need a, we need you bad. We've got a great show. Oh, yeah.

Absolutely great show. In a few minutes, we're going to get Jimmy Ralph, friend of the show. And then in about 20 minutes, we're going to have Hall of Famer Henrik Lundqvist join us. Please tell me it's just a phone call. It's not a Zoom call. It's Zoom. You guys are dead. Done.

Done. Done. Done. Done. Done. Has he gotten better looking since he's retired? Absolutely. He's aging like a fine wine, that guy. It's crazy. It is nuts.

So we're looking forward to that. In the meantime, should we be giving, I know we tagged yesterday's show as the Willie Nylander edition of our show. We should also mention our other guest. Justin Williams is coming on in the second half. Oh, that's right. Big day. That's the national hour.

That's the national hour against Justin Williams. Yeah. So we're jam-packed for a quiet night in the NHL. Quiet week. There's no games Thursday night either. No. Yeah, well, it's Thanksgiving. Oh, it's Thanksgiving.

American Thanksgiving. This is weird, though, this Leafs schedule. Like, you know, you go away, I get that. But this isn't the time of year where you're usually, like, stretching for hockey games to talk about. It's November. And they play at 2 o'clock on Friday. Our show is 5 to 6 that day.

Yeah, so we're doing a post-game show for that. But, like, it's very weird to be sitting here in November talking about three games in 12 days. It's hard to remember anything. Imagine if they'd lost a few going into this. What if they had lost both? Like, we'd just be killing them. And we still are.

With absolutely nothing to talk about, this is a perfect time to bring in Jim Ralph. Ralphie, we're not even going to ask you questions. Should you just go into your appearance routine for us and entertain us for the next 45 minutes? Yeah, I'll start with the Kalamazoo game in 84. How are you? We lost 9-8, but I shut them out in the third. How are you?

We lost 9-8, but I shut them out in the third. It was a pretty good night. All good, thanks. How are you guys doing? We're doing well. Where do we start? Do we start with, you know, what you were able to see coming out of Sweden outside of the four points and Willie getting every Leaf player discounts at the IKEA. What did you see coming out of the two wins?

You know, it's funny. Every year you say the same thing. They start slow in October, and you're thinking one day it's going to burn them, and then it's almost like a switch goes off at the end of the month. And then you start saying, but boy, this guy's dominant and they're doing this better. I personally think the big story

as much as Nylander has been in Sweden and everything else is only seven goals against in the last three games because I think that was the number one concern that they had to get through and I think when you look over at Edmonton, they have similar to the Leafs except that they had to get through. And I think when you look over at Edmonton, you know,

they have similar to the Leafs, except that they haven't been able to outscore their problems early in the season. So I thought sort of the, you know, very subtly they've been much better defensively that, that that's to me going to be more of a lasting impression than, you know,

the great storyline of Willie Newlander going home. Ralphie, then, if you're talking about keeping pucks out of their net, we'd be fools not to ask you about their goaltending, your specialty. Joe Wall looked pretty good last game. What are your thoughts on where their crease is at? Like, these guys going to be good enough? Do you like one or the other? What are your thoughts on Leafs goaltending?

Well, you know what, Barney? I think it's, I always subscribe to the old adage that you've got to play well enough to give your goaltender a chance to be good. And, you know, they've cut down on the odd man rushes. I think what I found early on in the season, and whether it's just fluke or something they actually have to work on,

how many point shots through screens they've given up. And, you know, a certain amount of that is good fortune for the opposition, you know, to get it through. But it seems like everything is going, it's either five-hole or under the crossbar. You know, two of the three goals that Wall gave up Sunday were from the high slot, between the high slot or the top of the circles in the blue line. So, you know, that's one thing I think that

you want to see more from Wall of Late and Samsonoff as well as trying to battle to find those point shots. Sometimes they get redirected and there's nothing you can do. But I think the better the team plays around them, just give them an opportunity to be good. Take away the rebounds. Try to keep as much as you can to the outside and let them do their jobs and not get to the point where they're guessing

who might be open in the back door or, you know, that they've got to guess three plays ahead to do their job. We just focus on where the puck is. We're joined by Jim Ralph, Toronto Maple Leaf radio colour analyst. Ralphie, another day off for the Toronto Maple Leafs, which gets them ready for the weekend in Chicago,

2 p.m. on Friday. And then what is perceived as a bigger test against the likes of Crosby, Carlson, and Geno. Where would you lean first on the start Friday? Wall, and who gets the bigger test Saturday night? I think I'd go back to Samson on Friday. The one I know, Joseph Wall, I think his career number is he's 11-1 now on the road. So I don't think it matters from Wall's standpoint.

You know, he had some big games, you know, earlier this year on the road where he was the best player and the least win in Washington. He was great in Dallas, got the win in relief in Tampa. So I don't think you're concerned about having to test him. But I think I'd just go back to Samsonov to get him back in the rotation. And, you know, he's had back-to-back games where he's only given up two goals. So I would go back with him

and, you know, throw Joseph Wall to the wolves in Pittsburgh. One of the things I think we probably haven't discussed enough on our show recently is that Matthews and Marner have been kind of okay. They've been good as they're expected to be, but they haven't been maybe as electric as expectations. Am I crazy

in thinking that despite a pretty good start here, there's still more to be had out of their top unit? No, not at all. But I also think it's great that the Calgary or the game against Vancouver, the fourth line scores twice. Yeah. Because when Matthews and Marner are going well,

and Tavares and Nylander are scoring, we're saying they haven't had a secondary scoring. And that's what you need once you get to the playoffs. So you're right, because I think they both had a stretch where they had one point in four games, but they'd won three of them. So it was, you know, it wasn't a story or an issue. So, I mean, I don't think there's any concern about them or worry.

I think the huge bonus is you're not relying on the same two guys every night to win hockey games. And, you know, Willie's, you know, sort of putting himself in the conversation as being, you know, a top five player in the NHL, you know, if you can get four lines contributing, you know, at different times, you know, I think that's huge. And, you know, especially when you looked at, you know, the struggles of the fourth line at the start of the year,

I think you've got to be more thrilled with what you've seen in the last, you know, few games, you few games since McMahon has been called up and criticizing maybe not getting the production from the top guys. So I would look at that as a positive warning, where you're not talking about it simply because they're winning. Ralph, it's hard to talk Willie Nylander without linking him to his contract. It's just they're hand in hand. And how do you see this thing playing out?

Obviously, the price of poker has gone up since the Leafs last offer in the offseason. But would you see it as a scenario where if you're Leafs ownership management that you'd want to get this thing done sooner than later? Or do you let it run its course and worry about it after? I mean, I think obviously you'd like to get it done. You know, and there's always a risk on the player's side if there's, you know,

any kind of injury or whatever that, you know, you lose the security of having that guaranteed income. So, but I think, yeah, from a lease standpoint, I think you'd like to get it done sooner. What do they figure the cap's going to go up? Five, four and a half, five? I think we're looking at maybe an 88 million, which would put it around the four or five you're talking about. Yeah.

I'd just say, Willie, back the truck up. You know, once we get the go-ahead with the caps going up, and I mean, it's sad to say, but I mean, I think you've got to give him the difference of whatever the cap goes up. So I think that's sort of the positive side is that that money will be there. The negative side is you've still got guys

like Max Domi and Tyler Bertuzzi that are on one-year deals, and either you re-sign them or you do the same thing where you know you're gonna have to walk and find somebody affordable to replace them so how do you feel overall the leafs are positioned this november 21st um by the way happy birthday to my mother um let's just slide that in there um how do you think they're positioned right now compared to the previous seasons where it's it's another all there um how do you think they're positioned right now compared to

the previous seasons where it's it's another all-in season do you like this iteration of the leafs compared to previous ones uh well like i said bernie it's it's the same it's been the same script so i know uh all kinds of problems in october that you think my god you know they they could even be in a battle to even make the playoffs. They're going, well, boy, you know, you like this. And they, you know, then last year, you know, when they had the likes of Ryan O'Reilly and Luke Shen, you say, boy, they, you know,

they addressed some of the issues they were having. And, you know, so it's hard to say in November that, you know, you feel better or worse. I think what you feel better about is really the emergence of Willie Nylander, who was, I think, arguably the best player in the playoffs last year. I think he might be the one guy that you say, if you get everybody else going, Willie Nylander could still be the guy that leads you.

Ralphie, more of the same, you kind of mentioned it, including that I think the heaviness of a Ryan Reeves isn't their best hockey probably coming with him out of the lineup. Do you envision him finding any sweet spot to contribute this season consistently? I think it's tough. I mean, I feel for him because, you know, it seemed like, and then Sheldon keeps to bring it up.

I mean, what is he, minus 11? I think which is a team worse where it seemed like even when he's not directly involved in any mistake, he just seemed to be, you know, that circumstance was that he was on the ice. And then, of course, as soon as you make the change, the fourth line scores two goals against Vancouver of all teams. So it's, you know, the worst case scenario for him was, you know, not only the bad timing of being on the ice, but as soon as you sit in the press box, the fourth line takes off. That's like having a fifth goalie called up and getting a start ahead of you,

and he goes back-to-back shutouts. You're going, man, I know where I am on the depth chart now. So I can't... It still reminds me of the playoffs when Wayne Simmons and Kyle Clifford were both in the lineup for game one against Tampa. Clifford took a five-nup major. By game three, both of them were out of the lineup. So I think the game is just different enough now that it's great to say

that you've got the muscle and the grit and everything else. But if you can't contribute beyond that, I think it sort of throws things up in the air and try to find the combinations that work. It is typical of us to be talking about that part of the Leafs lineup because typically the top guys are pretty good. We're always trying to consider the fill-in guys and what they can add.

I'm working on a piece for tomorrow about the Leafs' decor this season. One of the guys who we almost never discuss who has been maybe not quite as good is TJ Brody for me. I don't know if you disagree there or not, but they're looking for solid D out of their, you know, Riley, their go-to guys, basically McCabe, Geo, and Brody.

He's been okay. Like, do you feel like this Leafs team, when they're fully healthy, has a decor they can win with, or do they still need to make some changes there? I mean, you've still got that element that, you know, is the reason you brought in Luke Shen last year, where you want the guy that is, for lack of a better term, to be the slug in your own end.

He's going to be physical. You know, he's going to try to get away with as many slashes and cross-checks in front of the net as possible. And strike a little bit of fear in the opposition if they're coming through the middle of the ice with their head down. I think it's safe to say right now they don't have that. But I also think, Borey, what gets lost in the conversation, especially with how bad defensively as a team they were in October,

I think Morgan Riley's been fantastic. He has, yeah. It's one of those where you notice him, whether it's jumping up into the play, and I think he got caught, it was a game against Minnesota Sunday. He turned the puck over at center, and then he was the first guy back to break the play up in his own end. I think when he's got the Jets going like that, he's a force.

But like I said, because they were so bad as a team defensively, a lot of his plays sort of got ignored. But I think he's been good. And it's funny, I was talking to my son about this. Everybody's saying, well, Klingberg, he's going to be the next Justin Hall and the next Larry Murphy. And I think Dierke Loomey went through it, Todd Gill. And we were saying, one of the reasons that a fan base will pick on a certain player is because they're educated.

With all due respect to fans in Florida, they may not know who the five six defensemen are let alone what mistake they made in the seattle game you know yeah so i think that's just uh you know it's probably more a part of the uh the problem at times playing the big market is that you've got these rabid fans that notice everything and uh you know and i think that's why certain guys do want to shy away from it. Last night, Ralphie, we saw the Lightning take two points while the Bruins took one in a 5-4 overtime win for the Lightning.

We saw the Panthers take two points off of the Oilers. Is this now the time where these four teams separate themselves in the Atlantic from the likes of a Detroit, a Buffalo, an Ottawa. Is this just a matter of where the Leafs fit in from one to four here? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I still think, you know, I think Ottawa is going to get better. I still think Detroit is going to cause all kinds of problems for teams. But yeah, I will admit I'm a little surprised

that Florida is getting traction again. You thought maybe a team you can talk about going to the Santa Cat finals, but it's also a team that made the playoffs because Pittsburgh couldn't beat Chicago in the last week. I thought just maybe

you'd see a bigger split by Florida, but they've continued. I actually watched the Edmonton-Florida game last night. And I guess thank God they're not Edmonton. Because I'd probably be on a lot more regularly. Yes. You would. You would.

Hey, listen, in about, what, 10 minutes or so, we're going to have Henrik Lundqvist on a Zoom call. So he's coming on camera on our show. If the reason why you didn't choose to come on a Zoom call because you're following up Henrik, I just want to tell you I totally get it. I totally get it. I'm not trying to brag brag but you had me on first

that's right i'll let him know too the first i was the first overall pick today yeah kipper so yeah and uh and i'm i'm a little familiar with his work but uh you can ask him about me if you want i will for sure ralphie thanks ralphie thanks for doing this pal mizzou game thanks ralphie appreciate it pal all right thanks boys jim ralph as always as entertaining as he is informative on uh toronto maple leaf broadcast yeah um i love the thing you said about the whipping boy yeah because the fans know what's going on here yeah it's just like yeah they're the fifth or sixth worst guy on a team and that means they're gonna make the more mistakes

and uh educated fan base that watches every game super closely is going to notice those things more which makes them more of a whipping boy so i I was digging through some numbers today, and I'm going to write about Leafs D tomorrow. But one of the Klingberg stuff is, man, it's unfortunate. He is out of 149 defensemen who have played 200 minutes this year, he was 148th at D zone denials. So basically anyone coming down on him just gets in the zone. And he was near the bottom, like the bottom few, in gap distance between people coming

at him like he's just sagged way in can't deny the line just every stat it was ugly he's had an ugly start here in toronto dare i ask who was 149 oh i don't remember who it was off the top of my head but i i will say that the story is going to be about the Leafs gaps and how the four defensemen who play the most for them are in the bottom 30 D in the league in gap distance. They're all backed way off. And Brody is part of, you know, why I brought him up today is his numbers are just different than last year. He's not defending the line as well. He's backing in further. He's not breaking pucks out as well.

Interesting. Yeah. I think it's a good, really good barometer of where a defenseman's at with the distance of the gaps that they have. Yeah, and I didn't know they kept this stat. I found it just playing around on Sportlogic's site, and I was like, that seems cool.

That's very interesting. Do you remember who the best was? God. I know that some good skaters were up there it was like eric carlson and john marino and you know like some fleet of foot guys who are comfortable yeah in that group of players watching uh the florida panthers play last night against the edmonton oilers uh and we'll get into the more edmonton side of it in our national hour. But that team looks kind of like where they picked up. That Florida team looked like the one we watched beat the Leafs.

Yeah. I thought that last night too. Listen, it's regular season, and you're not going to, the intensity isn't there, but you can see signs last night of a Florida Panther team that just recently added Eckblad and Montour to that closing of the gap. And it was Gustav Forsling from Florida. Florida has,

he has the best gaps in the league. There you go. Yeah. Wow. Yes. And I watched it again last night. Yeah. And it's like I said,

between Boston, Florida now and, and, and and tampa bay i mean the leafs they're they're in it but you you don't necessarily know where they're going to end up when it's all said and done and you know what though uh you talk about that florida team kachuk said to sportsnet david amber those that crew last night they wanted to take it in the alley with edmonton and they were a little bit more emotional in that game. And you could see, I think that's why it looked like playoffs for them. You're like, oh, right.

When they turn it up, there's another gear there with that. Half a dozen scrums and getting Evander Kane to take maybe a penalty or two that he'd love to have back based on maybe his emotion. One was drawn on Matthew Kachuk, which played totally in his hand. Yeah, right after a goal too, right? Yeah. He had just scored and then took the penalty.

Yeah, they have 25 points through 18 games. The 12 and five. And they haven't had Montour Ekblad until last night. Montour looked good to me last night too. Yeah. It's a tough division. This Tampa Bay and Boston, of course, split three points last

night if you're a leafs fan you're going awesome of course that game goes to overtime if if you're brad tree living now and unfortunately uh you know you've you've lost a little bit on on that physicality of the the edge just alone because ryan reeves can't hold a regular spot on the fourth line do you now move forward thinking that yes boston's sitting at the top of the atlantic division but it's really i have to find a way to think that can i get through a florida panther team again in a best of seven i mean any of these teams that you would have to play, whether it's Boston, Tampa, Florida, whoever, you're going to need some of that element.

You know, like that is something they will look. Every year here, covering this Leafs team, it's, you know, how do they get in a gritty depth guy? Sam Lafferty would have helped. Ah, that hurts. You know what I saw the other day, though? And it doesn't kind of match. For me, it just doesn't match up.

But it's worth noted that I think the Leafs on hits are the second in the league. They're high. They're really high. But I just don't know if it transcends into this drag you into the alley kind of feel. I will say there are moments you're seeing Austin Matthews, like, body someone once in a while. But, yeah, it's a different type, right? McGregor's been consistent on taking the body.

They've got some guys with some high numbers that finish checks. They'll run into you. Yeah, which has got to help for sure. But to what degree, in terms of how you're personified around the league you know camp is not a big aggressive player but he'll bump into people and all that so it's a different type of thing that you're talking about physical play versus just being an agitator i guess take a break frank all right we're gonna take a break um we're all gonna go um grab a

quick shower and do our hair before we go to Henrik Lundqvist after the break. Can we ask him about how long he blow-dried his hair for? Please don't. All right, the very handsome Henrik Lundqvist, Hall of Famer, and he's on our show after the break.

Don't miss it. Fresh views on everything in the National Football League. It's the Fan Checkdown with Matt Marchese and Donovan Bennett. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Alright, as promised, before the break, let's welcome in Hall of

Famer and the only goalie in history to record 1130 wins in his first 12 seasons in the National Hockey League. Let's welcome in the most handsome, handsome, handsome. Handsomeness. There it is. Handsome man in NHL history, Henrik Lundqvist. See, I'm so nervous. And I didn't get a chance to shower up or comb my hair with you on a screen with us. I'm so nervous.

How are you? I'm doing great. How are you guys doing? Hey, thanks for joining us. Just take us back a week ago and just the whole experience of what you went through in a full circle moment of a Hall of Fame. And does it does it seem surreal? Were you able to absorb it all? Yeah.

You know, what an incredible weekend. I'm so grateful to, you know, in life, you don't get that many opportunities to just gather friends, family. You celebrate. Obviously, you celebrate the career a little bit, but most importantly, you just share an incredible weekend with people. That means so much to me. And, you know, the staff at the Hall of Fame was incredible setting everything up. And obviously, Monday was extremely special to have that ceremony that that for me was when it really hit home and and i have to say to have uh patrick raw hand the plaque

to me that was special uh growing up i was a you know huge fan it was a big inspiration to me uh so in a way it was really full circle in that in that moment for me well that was uh yeah really special and congrats on that from all of us that was pretty pretty awesome to watch uh i can imagine that you and a lot of the other big name swedish hockey players were paying attention to the games going on in stockholm over the past week willie nylander the very guy who took you out after a big swedish victory is the hero what were your thoughts did you hear anything about the response in sweden from having the the four nhl teams there well first off i'm just so happy for him i know how special it is to you know as a swede go back to sweden and play there and then you're obviously

extremely proud to represent your team in the NHL. But to get an opportunity to play those games overseas means a lot. I did it with the Rangers and it was an incredible experience. And for him to have that weekend, a week, I mean, I've been paying attention to his game here the last couple of years. And it's just taking it to the next level right now he's so fun to watch he's so powerful and skilled uh you know i remember the first time i i ran into him when i was playing with his dad michael back in 0506 he was a tiny little kid but you can see his talent

but still it's a long way to go from being a talented little kid to, you know, to be where he's at right now. I'm just so impressed. Henrik, as far as Willie's concerned with his situation in Toronto, you had a similar situation where you were looking at unrestricted free agency. And the thought process is your heart was first and foremost in New York. You ended up managing to sign a seven-year deal, if I'm not mistaken. Can you run parallels to what maybe Willie might be going through and describe the process that you went through to come to the conclusion

that New York was the city that you wanted to be in for the next seven years? Yeah, I think for me, year one, year two in the league, you're kind of fighting for your life a little bit. You just want to establish yourself. It doesn't matter what you accomplished overseas, national team or winning championships. You're kind of starting over. So you establish yourself the first couple of years.

And then, you know know for me i started create all these uh relationships and and and how much i cared and and really enjoyed playing for the rangers just grew for each year so it was never really a question going elsewhere when you know it was time to talk about that big deal and a long-term commitment um so for him obviously it's very personal for everyone, wherever they're playing and different reasons why you want to stay. But I can only speak for myself. For me, it was not really a long thought process.

I knew early on New York was the place for me and it was my home. I just enjoyed so much being part of the organization and the city. But of course, it's an exciting time for him right now. The way he's playing and

obviously a lot of people are talking about him and his game and what's next. I think the most important thing is you worry about the game and the rest will take care of itself. Yeah, that certainly is the case for forwards. And I know for goaltenders as well, it's such a mental thing getting a good place to play well to be a goaltender, probably more so than any other position. And I wanted to get your thoughts on the state of

nhl goaltending today i just kind of want to get your thoughts on on why there aren't any sorry great i shouldn't say there aren't any there aren't as many guys where it's patrick waugh or it's henrik lundqvist or it's marty broder there seems to be a lot of tandems you don't see guys play in 60 games you know the sort of evolution of the position why is it that we don't have as many guys that stand out in the way that you guys did in your primes well a couple of things i think the game has changed a little bit you you can't have guys play 65 70 games which was the case when i entered the league with a bunch of us we we we were on the 70 mark all all the time uh i think now the game is

uh is more intense than and uh obviously they also start looking at numbers to have a long uh successful year you you want to cut down the number of games guys are playing but also you have to remember how many starters actually left the league between 2019 and 22 it was all i saw a list uh a few weeks there was a lot of guys that played a lot of minutes played a lot of games that that left the league so obviously there's a transition there a new generation of goaltenders uh so that in combination with guys playing less games i think uh that's just the new look of the league now we're talking looking at 50 55 games maybe we're talking to henrik lundqvist uh new york ranger great and hockey hall of famer currently

tnt hockey analyst just staying on this subject for a second hen Henrik, what about the way we're teaching the kids the position? And, you know, I'm watching most often than not this reverse VH that drives me nuts. Henrik, I got to be honest with you. Like, why did they always stand up for me and they didn't give me any of the top net and all of a sudden I see everybody going high over the shoulders.

But it just seems like everybody's taught a certain style now and there's less personality in the position than we had with the likes of the great ones including yourself yeah it's definitely a new look uh I think over the last 10 years, you've seen a lot of new movements. The way guys are moving from the post and out, but also on their knees, they use it a lot more. Personally, I was never a fan of the reverse VH. I was also, I think, a mix of old and new, so I never really got into it. But I agree with it. There's definitely an overusage of it at times. Some guys master it, and some guys, I think,

need to just understand when to use it and when to be on their feet. But, you know, if you look at goaltending, how much it's developed over the last 10, 15 years, I think you see guys start doing certain things and then they have to bring it back because you're adjusting to the shooters, the way the shooters are adjusting to goalies.

So this year we've seen a lot of goals going in in the reverse VH position. So maybe we'll see less of it. But I hear you. I really do. So how much did you pay attention to the evolution of the position while you were playing because it does feel like the position has changed as you got on in your career were you reading about what other people were doing talking to other goalie coaches or you just like I'm really good at this I'm not changing anything well Well, I was lucky. I had probably the best goaltending coach in the business with Benoit Allaire.

So we were on the same page right away, talking about the position. And we didn't really change much over the 15 years. Of course, throughout my career, there were small adjustments here and there. But you definitely pay attention. But you also have to understand what's going to make me good just because it's working for other guys doesn't mean that's going to work for me you know i i remember watching dominic hasik i'm probably 15 years old it was first time i saw goalie dude go down paddle down so the next day i tried out in practice it's like

okay that makes sense. So, of course, you have moments like that where you try certain things, but then you have to think about, will this fit my style of play? I'm 6'1". I was never a big goalie. So certain moves, especially the reverse VH, I leave a lot of room open up top if I'm down on my knees too much. So from my era to where we are today,

we've seen the New York Rangers go from Mike Richter to you to Shusterkin. And I'm like, how lucky can one organization get here? And you watching the New York Rangers here, how close is this team? I'm really impressed. And we talked about this on air last night, actually, just how ready they looked already in game one and two. And to me, it was the positioning. It was the reads.

And a lot of times when you have a new head coach come in and change the system a little bit, you need a few weeks, sometimes a month to make it click. But for them, they were ready to go. And their top guys are performing extremely well. They're getting a lot of big efforts from the third and fourth line. So right now, they're very well balanced from goaltender and out. And special teams, obviously, their power play is clicking over 30%.

I think right now in this league, five on five is pretty tough. But if you have a killer power play, it's going to win you so many games. Henrik, last one for me, and we've got you on during our Leafs hour, so I have to ask you a Leafs-related question by law. The goalies here are Samsonov and Wall. I wanted to get your thoughts on,

if not Samsonov specifically, but the type of goaltender like him who he can be very busy, like he's athletic and there seems to be a lot of movement. You know, what are your thoughts? We often hear when a guy's playing well, he's quiet or, you know, in the net or whatever.

That doesn't seem to be Samsonov's style. Is quiet always a good thing or is that a varied thing from goalie to goalie? Again, I think goaltending is about playing to your strength. And you look around the league right now, there's so many different styles. There's different ways of doing it.

In the end, it comes down to stopping the puck. But there's different ways of doing it. But the one thing you can be sure of is any goaltender in this league benefits from good structure in their own end. It makes it so much easier to make decisions, even if it's a clear shot. If you as a goalie know that your D-man or

forwards are taking up their guys, you can really focus on the shooter. It makes your game so much easier. So sometimes you focus so much on the goaltender and less on the structure in their own end but listen playing playing in toronto you're under a microscope there's no question about it

and when you play in new york there's no question about it that there has to be some star quality and you know uh sometimes i it drives me nuts when people are really good at everything but you're the exception because I really like you and admire you. But, you know, when I think of New York, I do think of that star attraction, like a Jeter, a Manning. I saw Messier when I was there and you. And it just seems like everything comes naturally to you, whether it's in net or playing the guitar on the Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon? And like, were you always this way, even as a kid?

Did you ever sweat or get nervous at all? Why is it so natural for you? I don't know. I do sweat. I do get nervous. I make a lot of mistakes, but I just try to have fun, you know. And to me, we talked earlier about how well the city fit me and how much I enjoy being here. And part of it is just the opportunity of doing different things and meeting people. And the one word that keeps coming back to me is opportunity in this city.

So I really enjoy myself throughout my career. You know, now transitioning into my next chapter, I feel like New York is the perfect place. And I just love being part of the city. And MSG, where I work as an ambassador now. And yeah, you know, I'm just having fun with it. The actor strikes over. Can I help you with motion pictures? I could be your agent.

You know what? When I played, I was so focused on next game, next performance. Now I'm very open to live experiences to kind of see where it will take me. I don't know what I'm going to do in four or five years. I just know right now I really enjoy what I'm doing. Keep an eye out. know what I'm going to do in four or five years. I just know right now I really enjoy what I'm doing. The only thing he was missing was a cup. Can you envision being a president, a GM,

and getting a cup another way now? Right now I just love exploring. I want to be part of the game for sure. I love the game. I'm a big fan of the game. But the day-to-day, be part of hockey is not something I'm looking for right now. But again, I don't know what I'm looking for in 10 years or down the road.

I just love, you know, seeing other sides of the world right now, in the city and people and the hockey world, I know. But we'll see down the road what happens. Well, we look forward to whatever you do. We'll be following closely. We can't thank you enough for making time for us, man. I've tried on a couple occasions, but getting you today was worth the wait.

Thanks for doing this. Thank you. Good to see you guys. Thanks so much. We appreciate it. The great Henrik Lundqvist, Hall of Famer, Ranger great. I really like him. You couldn't even get a handstand. I'm so happy I wasn't on screen with that weapon. Oh, my God.

Hey, even the curtains look better with him in the shot. Do you think... And that sweater he was wearing... Do you think I could afford that sweater with my bi-weekly paycheck? No, not even close. No, okay. We would never look that good in that sweater.

All right, all right. Someone texted in and said, Hendrick Lungfist and Justin Bourne, who wins the battle of the salt and pepper beards? Gonna go to the limb here. Yeah, yeah. The guy who's on the Tonight Show playing guitar. Yeah, I'm gonna say even my wife would not be selecting me out of that duo.

Yeah, he's like, he just reeks of like star. Too sexy. You know what, though? I love his answer about like, would you like to, you know, be involved in the game? He's like, I'm Henrik Lundqvist. I have New York City at my beck and call. He's going to explore it. He might be in the opera one day. I have New York City at my beck and call. Like, he's going to explore it. He might be in the opera one day.

I don't know. He'll do whatever he wants. You're watching, like, half the general managers and presidents, like, can't even sleep at night. Yeah. No, exactly. Henrik sleeps. Let me tell you, boys. Henrik sleeps at night.

In our schlub we're here. In silk pajamas. Okay? That's how he sleeps. Silk pajamas. He's not even that comfy, but I just he sleeps. Silk pajamas. These aren't even that comfy, but I just wanted silk. Oh, my God. Kipper, you got a man crush on Hank.

Yeah, I do a little bit. Yeah, I get it. Me too. He's kind of got life figured out. I think that's a clean sweep. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, interesting to get his thoughts on, well, the position,

goaltending in general for me. It's just, it is different. Like he even says in 10 or 15 years, the position, goaltending in general for me, it's just, it is different. Like he even says in 10 or 15 years, you know, he said a bunch of starters retired from 19 to 22, and I didn't think of that. But I guess it is true. Like the big name starters. I'm just wondering if we screwed up the position.

Yeah? Yeah. Well, it is all by numbers now. By overanalyzing, by overstructuring. We've turned them into robots. I know. Play. Stop the hockey puck.

There's no personality. And he said it when he was describing Hasek. That guy was all about guts and instinct when he stopped the puck. Any way I can stop it, I'm going to stop it. And we teach the kids now, no, no, this is the only, this is the way you should do it. And they all look the same, and they're all interchangeable. A lot of the goaltending now is, if you can beat me on this shot,

like if I take away all this and you beat me, good for you. There's no, like, trying to take away that extra whatever. It's like, I'll leave that there. If you can hit it, that's, you know,'s you know way to go so yeah paint by numbers mostly i was i was just looking at the games played leaders from last season i was surprised that there were seven guys that played over 60 oh no it's spreading you're right it's spreading my cough sorry about that you're right seven guys over 60 games i'm trying to save sam i don't know what he's talking about but if i had to guess seven over 60 sorrows hellebuck uh i don't know

if i'm back am i back no i just think that that's more guys than i would have expected yes at that level over over 60 having seven guys like i thought it would be way less than that yeah i didn't want to put him on the spot of having to know who Joe Wohl was, so I didn't ask him about him. Do we still believe that Vasilevsky, the pecking order is Vasilevsky, and then Shosturkin. Sorokin has been so good. This year he's not been good.

He's been okay. Eh, it's generous. No, no, he's not even okay no not not where the islanders are he's been like minus two goals below expected or something we're gonna get into the edmonton oilers uh oh how's their goaltending yeah okay in the next uh hour of our show but uh you know is there a world you see where they go after Saros in Nashville? Yeah, Sammy and I were talking pre-show, like as soon as Nashville's ready to say we're not a playoff team,

the Saros thing almost certainly has to happen. And that is a large prize for a lot of teams. Yeah, it is. But not the Edmonton Oilers if they don't do something a lot sooner than maybe Nashville is ready. What good is Saros doing, Connor McDavid or Leon, if you don't make the trade now? The thing is, Saros makes so little.

It's not just, not so little, but, you know, it's a manageable thing with retention. I think he makes under six, so 50% retention. You're looking're looking at three could the leafs another team would be the kings for him yeah another team who has real aspirations yeah and they're i think they're cam talbot's playing a ton like that's that's team to me that if they got him there they go into the upper echelon of contenders if they get him yep even if the leafs goaltending doesn't really improve that much over what we see already there wouldn't be anything to suggest that the leafs would want to up that there's there's as long as it's just good enough they will attack maybe the blue line or a bottom six guy,

but not the net. Would you agree with that? I would. And so that'll be interesting for Nashville. If there's not a lot of suitors, they might want to make the move sooner than later while there are a lot of teams who think they're still in it. All right.

We'll pick up that conversation on the Edmonton Oilers after the break. Our thanks to king henrik lungquist hall of famer joined us on a zoom call if you're just joining us now make sure you download our show or pick it up on youtube or snap plus you can always find it uh fantastic 15 minutes with henrik lungquist we'll take a quick break here and we'll pick it up on the national hour with Justin Williams, former NHL forward, three times Stanley cup champion.

And of course the cons might winter in 2014 doesn't get any better than that on the real Kipper and Bourne show.