Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Marchenko's Columbus Return

Episode Date: October 20, 2026

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look back on the Toronto Maple Leafs' 3-1 win over the San Jose Sharks. They discuss Sergei Bobrovsky's first home win in the blue and white, Gavin McKenna once again getting his ice time cut late in the game, Auston Matthews' leadership, and Nick Paul taking on a larger role in John Tavares' absence. Then, they get set for the Leafs' matchup against the Blue Jackets and discuss Kirill Marchenko's return to Columbus, Adam Fantilli's comments about him, and Darren Raddysh's usage. Then, the Athletic's Aaron Portzline (39:26) stops by to help tee up Leafs/Blue Jackets, dive deeper into how Marchenko will be received in his return and discuss Matthew Knies' play since being traded to Columbus.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Is there anything better than back-to-back game days on the Real Kipper Endborn show? We are live on Sportsnet 360, 590 the fan in Toronto, and streaming always on Sportsnet Plus. Can't catch us live, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, where we just love our loyal followers. We do. With a thumbs up, too. They give us a thumbs up every once in a while. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee, Frank the Tank, Braska, and Doug. and Derek Brandeo with you for the next two hours.

Leap's coming off a much-needed win. Slow down that losing streak. They take, I think, a good portion of their momentum from last night right into Columbus. Yeah, Sammy, you called it a must win, pal. I did. They listened. They won the must win.

They've had two must wins so far this year. No, not Columbus. would they play? Oh, Nashville. Nashville was a must win. And San Jose, two juggernauts of the league that they had to get must wins against, and they did. You in the chat were kind of worried about the first, what, 30 minutes, 35 minutes.

It didn't feel great to you? I was on the ice for the first 30 minutes of the game, so it probably wasn't me. I was worried. Let me see what I said. I don't think I said anything too incendiary. No, no. I didn't see the season was over by any stretch of the imagination.

Did it feel like there's portions of it early that felt to you, Like it was Saturday night where they weren't just getting much done. Yeah. Yeah, the one thought I had and I may have sent to the group could have been me was that they may never score again. You know? They didn't say that. I watched a game Saturday.

We felt like they had no chance of scoring. And, you know, we were getting late in the second period. It's like, this team may never score again. Yeah. Found a way through big power play goal at the end of the night. I wasn't, I wasn't sure where the go attending was going to go last night. And I thought those two guys were probably close to the best players on the ice. Yeah.

They both gave their teams a chance. Did anyone on the least know that Ascarov was goofy handed, though? Did anyone know? They shot it into his glove trying to shoot the locker. It looked like, I don't know, 11 times. It was crazy. Yeah. On the side boys.

I mean, he also went into that game with horrendous numbers. Like, he had been really... He got real lucky last night. He went through him, posed. Yeah, I mean, the one that... It was Gavin passed to Sizzins in the slot. It was like basically a tap in. And again, shot it right into his weird left-handed glove.

Buddy, Matthews at Rossovick, who shot it onto the moon. Yeah, it was honestly maybe harder to miss. Yeah. Like, if you put them in that spot, maybe harder to miss. Yeah. You can try it a hundred times. I don't think you'll get the puck up any higher than that. It was direct vertical.

I'm surprised he didn't land in the crease. It was insane. Whop shot. Where do you want to start in terms of some of our clips? Austin coming off a very sleep. Saturday night with huge three points. Yeah, bounce back. To me, Bobrovsky was the biggest story and when we'll get into McKenna and his set of

mitts. But I think it was a really, really important night for Brobowski, who obviously will not make the trip to Columbus as he gets to regroup a little bit. But I'm sure it's a lot more comfortable day and a half, two days now, knowing that you gave the team a solid 60. Yeah, I'd be curious behind the scenes how it all worked out, too, in terms of conversations about what games do you want, what should the schedule look like?

Because he went game, game, game, and I believe a day off between the games, right? Like, he, it's a, we don't, we haven't seen that over the years here with wool or solar. Sabres, Isles, sharks. Right. Was three games and five days for a starting goalie, which we haven't really seen much at all.

So good for him to kind of feel like a starting goalie, get in a routine, have a good game, and they needed it. What do we start with just the biggest reasons for the win from Jim Hiller, clip one? I thought we stuck with it. I thought we had some really good chances through 40 minutes at even strength. And Ascarob made some really big saves. And I think the difference was in the third period, you know, we made some mistakes.

And Bob made some big saves. But I thought still we pushed, if you go back to the Buffalo game where we were a little more tentative. I thought we did a really good job just staying and going forward today. I think it was especially when they were down and then they were up to one, that it didn't look like they were hanging on. And I think for Jim Hiller, that was a really good sign. And I think it takes a little pressure off of Hiller last night. Sneaky detail, though, McKenna didn't play the last 11 minutes of the game again,

which I'm fine with. I just... Is there anyone more pumped that it's with the third? period than Teddy Bluger and Reddit do it. They're like, yes, it's our period. We get to play half the period now. It's crazy. Yeah.

Okay, so let's go there then. Just in terms of, of course, it remains a hot button topic in terms of McKenna and how much does he play. And now we've had multiple looks in the last three games from six and a half minutes to 18 minutes.

minutes and now it's somewhere in between. Yeah. And can we just come to the conclusion that that's the way it's going to be here for the next little while? Sammy, I hope you're okay with it. I'm just confused. You just wish it was tied closer to his play. Yeah.

Like he gets benched the game where we thought he was okay in that game and like he obviously made a couple mistakes, but he gets benched in that game. Then he comes back on Saturday night where I think we can all agree was no good, didn't really have his game that night. Week on the boards kind of got bounced in. round than he goes into last night where I thought he was very noticeable setting guys up playing well, scores the go-ahead goal. And he doesn't get elevated at all and he plays 11-6.

It just feels inconsistent. Like I don't know what the plan is with him. It feels like it's a different thing every night, which I don't love. But the tendency is that it is a different look every night when you're talking about an 18-year-old rookie. So, okay. So then just, and we'll look back to Saturday night, that's purely in response to him getting barbecued by the Toronto media and fans for 48 hours.

That's why he did that. 18's a lot. It was too much. They're chasing the game. It's a different game script, I guess. So that's what it comes down to. That's probably what it goes. So I asked you guys,

I asked you Sammy to go get a clip of Mike Sullivan, the head coach of New York Rangers. Yeah. Because he benched Dorfeyev. who's this $11.5 million player and he's not a rookie, right? He's not McKenna. But he was asked about

Dorfayev, and I'd like to play this clip now. Oh, a non-leaf clip. No, but it has, but it has relevance to all of this. So please have a listen. Sullivan, head coach of the Rangers, on benching Dorfayev. You want to know the answer?

You can't handle it. true. Okay, so I've been asking the power play for a number of games now that the first unit, when they have to change smarter. And when the puck gets dumped down two or three times and they've got to go 200 feet to get it and then work back into the offensive zone, they should change. And Pab didn't. And so at some point, you know, there needs to be some accountability around it. And unfortunately for Pav, you know, he was, he was the guy. And so, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I told the power play guys that, you know, we have to, we have to be smart. We've got another unit that's pretty good also. We've got some good players on it. And,

and I know part of his, part of his well intentioned, you know, he's, he's trying to do the right thing out there. But we have to have a sense out there, all of us, when we're on the power play. And You know, when you extend your shifts, usually that's when bad things happen. You're tired. You don't think and execute the same way. A lot of times you can give up goals against in those circumstances because you don't have the juice to play the game the right way. You want answers?

So a couple of days ago we were talking about the benching, right? The original benching at six and a half minutes. And I sat here and I looked you guys in the eye. And I said, coach's decision, and you don't have to feed anybody else, any other, you know, that's just don't have to explain it. Just say it's a coach's decision and let it go. And then I'm listening to this comment by Sullivan, and I'm like, that was wrong. Your take was wrong.

My take was wrong. You like what Sullivan did. my take was wrong well you didn't expect a guy to explain it that eloquent my take my take was wrong is because I'm evolving I I think in my day right

we were all on a need to know basis you don't need to know right it doesn't work today with the kids doesn't work today that that that will not work with the kids today the kids need an explanation. They need whys right away. And

Sullivan gave the why. You want to know, I'll tell you why. And I think if, if Hiller went back and really spoke the truth like Sullivan just spoke it, it would have been real simple. Okay. He can't play defense yet in the National Hockey League. I don't trust him out there. You wouldn't want him to use that language though, would you? Listen, you can, you can, you can fluff it up, you can paint it, you can put lipstick on it, there's ways you can dress it, he's not ready yet. We have more capable guys to protect the lead,

and he's not ready for this part of the NHL, so I'm going to protect him, and I'm going to pick his spots. That's the truth, Sammy. That's why you... Okay, it's not a strength of his yet, and we're letting him watch the veterans. And that's why he played six and a half minutes. And that's why he played 11 minutes last night. Wasn't because he lost him on the bench? No, no, it wasn't. It was because he doesn't trust him yet.

That's fair. But I think when our explanation from the coach of the Leafs through the media to the fans is that he lost him. Bad mistake on his part. Bad PR, bad decision, not knowing your market, not understanding it yet. He's, Hiller's learning too. Okay, and the things that you may have been able to say in L.A. with one or two beat reporters,

ain't flying here, man. They're going to pile all over you if you, if you don't come across totally clean and sincere like Sullivan just did. Yeah, if you want to look at a through line for McKenna's ice time, it's games he had, they had the lead in the third period, not playing. Game they were chasing, didn't have the league played a lot. And let's be honest here, okay? when we see this kid with the puck

and he's got some room, fun, dangerous, elite, special. That goal last night is special. Sickening goal. But then there's times when you see him on the wall and it's like, you got no chance to win him that.

You got no chance, you got no chance. You're getting eaten up. He's not even, what he's not really trying with him? What did he say? He's 150 pounds. He said he's 150 pounds soaking wet. Soaking wet. Like, and you see him on the bench and he's still a kid.

It looks like, it looks like a, it looks like a toothpick stuck in an orange, you know? What? Big head, little neck, right? He's just, he's just a little boy. I don't know. To be as skilled as he is and be up there with those meetings is incredible. No, no, the skills there, the leanness there,

the, you know, the skating, the edge work, the hands. Oh. He looks great. Way better through 10 than I was expecting. But 150 pounds to hold a guy up in the neutral zone or step in his way to battle on the walls. Five feet inside the blue line. Five feet outside the blue line is when games are one loss.

He's not there yet. You see an NFL kicker? He was like 150 pounds tried to hit someone returning a kick. How does knee end up after that one? Yeah. Tor it. Just got blown as veterans. Like when you're just.

physically standing in front of some of these Mack truck. Yes. It's not ideal. So that's his 11 and a half minutes. That's his six and a half minutes. And who knows what it looks like tonight. But as far as the big moment ability, we know it's there. And let's have

a listen to the head coach talk about that clip three. Yeah. I mean, yeah, we talked about that, right? Even his first goal, talked about Gavin a lot, but he's just not afraid of the moment. And he enjoys the moment. You know, he saw his celebration and, and you could say, yeah, well, shouldn't everybody do that?

It's, there's lots there. And you have to be want to be that big time player. And that's what he has in Spades. Derek, we're going to need that drop. Talked about Gavin a lot. Yeah, we're going to need that drop because he feels like he's getting asked about him a lot. So we're talking about him a lot. Talked about a little bit with Bunkus today.

I wanted to get your guys thoughts on it. Just about the Matthews sort of, if you, Because, you know, you've always asked for more of a leadery feel from him throughout his career. And I personally, through 10 games this year, and I've been hard on that part of it as well, but personally through this 10 games, he does feel like there's a different sort of feeling about him. Obviously, he's producing, so it's easier to say that now. But, like, do you feel that? Is there something there with that with you?

I see a big difference from what I saw a year and a half ago up until, the end of last season where he's he seems happier he seems more engaged he seems lighter he seems stronger quicker you name it down low yeah he can make plays down low he's he's threading needles down low he's making plays and they're they're not going anywhere without him it's clear yeah there was a a moment last night where he got stepped on or had his feet kicked out by Will Smith Smith. He actually went back at him. Who also kicked McCabe behind the net too for a tripping penalty.

He was kind of kicking the feet out. But yeah, continue. Matthews just kind of give him a drive by a skate and said, hey, you know, enough of that or something. And I see Matthew say something to someone. It's a start. Yeah. It's a start. In the playoffs, it needs to be intensified.

Yeah. Yeah. Playoffs. Well, I was just saying, down the stretch. a game against Florida, that stuff kind of, you got to make it more obvious, right? And you have to kind of look closely to see that. Yeah. But you're Austin Matthews, man.

Someone messes with stepping on your calf and you didn't like it. Make it more obvious. Bring more guys into the party. Make it more. Maybe that's a good stepping stone for him in the 10th game. I think it's nice, though, just to see him go out there in the morning skate, do his media availability and say, we got to play with more emotion. We got to have urgency, urgency, and to go out and have three points,

including a big goal at the end of the second, sets up McKenna's goal. That's good stuff. And I don't know if he would have done that a couple years ago. So, one of the things we also mutually liked in the group chat, Nick Paul played almost 19 minutes last night. You know, he's become very important. He feels like an adult on the ice And a game full of children last night

Makes the right read strong He's just a huge dude He looked like Nick Paul That beat up the Leafs with Tampa Yeah, he did But God, this guy has the puck all the time He's in the way In the way and heavy on the four checks

And finding a way to Knock a puck loose Kind of had a meltdown on whoever it was there Keeper Sherwood And on that last penalty kill When the Sharks got one towards the of the third and it was him and bluger out there. They had more chances than the sharks did.

Like they were, he was strong, man. I don't know, like, Tavares is not coming back anytime soon. Like, can this guy play 18, 20 minutes like that? You know, every night? I feel like they're going to need him. Feels like they're going to need it. I looked at his career, uh, like typical ice time. You know, two years ago, he played 17, 16 and had 24 goals and whatever.

Next year he had 16 and a half minutes a game, 22. goals. He plays every night. And last year he's down to 13 minutes a game. He was the only dressed 50 times. You know, this year he's right back to 16 plus minutes and, you know, on pace for a point to every other game, 40 point season. That's, they might have the guy that they, that Tampa used consistently, which would be really nice. Be handy. That would be real handy. Marchenko. Oh, yeah, go ahead. Marchengo. Do you want to talk about tonight? Yeah. I mean, how's he been for you? Ten games. games? 10 points? I think yeah. I go ahead. No, I want to be careful here because we see the talent.

We see the ability to stick handle in a phone booth. Like there's so much to love about this guy. Great plan. Matthew's goal. Right. But he's got to learn, he's got to learn how to play a better team game for me still. and hopefully that comes. But at the end of the day, I don't know whether or not Nyes for Marchenko is going to be enough to move the needle at the end of the day. But he's elite. There's no question, he's elite.

I think it significantly moves the needle, but I do feel like both teams traded a guy who, you don't know on a given night if you're going to get there all. Like some nights there are very noticeable, whatever. I thought the last couple games, Marchenko had his hat trick game and the next night I thought was his worst game as a leaf.

Real quiet against the Islanders. And that way he's a little similar to Willie, where they could be the best player on the ice or they could get lost. Yeah. And so, you know, you get enough of those guys. You hope that you have enough nights where one of them's going

and carrying the mail for you, Offensively, you know, if he's get a point per game guy, that's more than they've got from Nyes. But will it move the needle, though, outside of, you know, everything else? Because at the end of the day, you just, you just, you traded for winger for winger. Yeah. And if Nyes was a 50 point guy or 55 point guy, and this guy gets to 80, is that 25 points, is that 25 points the difference maker for you to say they're going to make the playoffs or not make the playoffs? To me, the difference is that points aside, one guy consistently throughout his career drives a line into the offensive zone, and that's not Nyes. And I think that Matthews is off to a good start.

It's not a coincidence. He played with them for eight games. I think he ended up in the O zone a lot more, and I think that helps. I don't think Nyes would have helped him get there. So I think there's other elements to what he does. And I like, and to that point, you can, if he's not playing on the top line, I think he elevates a second line, too. like if you put nyes on a line without Matthews, I don't think you're going to get the same

play driving that you're going to get obviously from from Mark. Yeah, I can't disagree with that. But there's parts of his game that are going to drive everybody nuts and I think it's similar to the Willie thing. There's just certain things. And Tilly talked trash about him today. Oh my. Do you want to play this clip? Do we have an? Yeah. We have the...

Obviously, Marchenko goes back for the first time since the big trade. A little bit of the Hella Buck, Dylan Larkin scenario where he didn't really want to be there and he made it clear he didn't want to be there and he got his trade and the other two are still waiting it out but it's it's left a ripple effect in that room yeah they're pissed they are very unhappy and he did he wanted to leave so they can go ahead and be mad let's let's play the fantilly clip on on marchanko yeah uh it's it sucks um like i said mart like it's a business right

and Marchy not wanting to be here, like it's tough not to take it personally because I would have been playing with him all year and he didn't want to be a part of that. But it is what it is. For whatever reasons, whether it was who he was going to play with, whether it was management, coaches, who knows, right?

I haven't gone in depth with him on that. He has his reasons. And like I said, I'm happy we've got guys that want to be here. It would have been a nightmare having a guy that didn't want to be here all year. So I'm happy we, got that trade done when we did and then we got guys that want to be here.

Well, you know how I feel about regurgitating this whole woe is me thing in Columbus. Yeah, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong. But wasn't Adam Fintilly holding out until like two weeks before the season started and that got paid the fifth highest thing in the league to come back? It's like, oh, you really wanted to be there. Oh, wow. Yeah.

You're holding out. You can't even. No, I'm sorry. No, no, no, no. I'm okay with you. cropping all over him, that has, that is a poor example. And that a guy wants to get paid what he thinks he's worth and you're comparing that to a guy that doesn't want to be there no matter what.

Yeah, I mean, he didn't want to be there. Whatever. I'm sure if they gave him, if they offered Marchenko some money, he might have been willing to. No, no. You don't think so? No. No. Anyways. And I don't know if you remember or not, but the guy that is their best player on

their team, I'm not sure if he had a high profile thing where he wanted to leave and talked about leaving and then maybe was going to be traded somewhere else. and then had to put out a statement with the general manager being like, oh, we love each other. Like, I don't, I'm just, I don't, come on. You don't like it. Like, watch your own bobber, buddy. Like, yeah, I'm sure he wanted to leave.

I get that. I like that he comes out and says that. But like, he was holding out until literally. Fantilly quote here, he said, I really enjoyed Marchy, but he's on the other team now, right? I have to play him as hard as I can. Try not to give him anything. He's a guy who doesn't want to defend.

So if I can keep him in the defensive zone, that's a win for us. He's like coming at him pretty good. Great. Fantilly, by the way. Awesome play. And by the way, Van Tilly owns the Leafs. He will score tonight 100%.

Like he's Mike Bossy. I don't know. Honestly, boys, look like he is. I think he has eight goals against the Leafs in like six or seven games. Like he's out of this world. Yeah. But I just probably too much information from Fantilli for me. Yeah?

Yeah. He doesn't like to play in the D's. I mean, it's okay to think that way. Maybe amongst your teammates. in the back of the bus. I'm not sure you need to go public with it. It's crazy to be like, yeah, he was going to play with me, and I kind of take it as he didn't want to play with me.

So, you know, if Fantilly ends up... Maybe you should go talk to the guy that didn't name captain for some reason. If he doesn't have the night that you think he might have Sammy and he ends up minus four, I mean, those kind of... Those can come back and bite you in the ass, those comments. Well, why isn't... Why isn't Warenski the captain? Because he didn't want to be there.

Oh, yeah. Like, maybe you should look across the locker room. Why don't we listen... the Jim Hiller clip for, talks about on playing hard in Columbus for Margie. Yeah, I'm sure that, you know, the Hattrick game probably really you know, pumps them up and yeah, we'll see. We're going to have to go in there, you know,

on a back-to-back and play really hard with him on our mind, right? Because we're super glad to have them. And we've got to go in there and play for him tomorrow night. It's going to be interesting. They're going to be pissed and I don't know, like will it be... And Columbus needs this. You talk about

a must win. Columbus is must win. mode. Their bottom of their division. I mean, they've only played seven games somehow, but are they going to... Five points per cent of third worst. Is it going to be like Tavares on the island here? Like, are they going to be booing them? They said no tribute video. He's getting booed every time.

Well, at least, I don't know if they have that passion to do it the whole game. Yeah. I mean, the Islanders fans are unbelievable. Like, they're still all these years later. But like, I don't know. Pajama boy. You think... God, it's just no video

tribute at all. No. It's just been a top minute I don't know how I feel about that. Is it screw you or is it take the high road? I don't know. I think when you're a smaller market team, I think it's okay to play the scrappy screw you team. I think that's cool.

I think the Leaf's got to be the professional, dignified, big organization who's above it all. I don't think Columbus has to be. Let me just say. I wish that there were some comments like that's around the Leafs when Marner left. I'll just say that. I like this from them.

I like that they're paying. If you were running the Leafs, you wouldn't give Marner a video tribute? I'm not saying that. I'm just saying what they're saying. That's classless. And so is this. He played there for however many years.

Yeah, that's why I'd have to really think long and hard about the real message I want to send here about this is not what we do. No matter what the circumstances are, we take the high road and I get what you're saying too. Like I'm not, I'm not

I'm not pushing it right off the side of the road here. I get that part too and I got that part in me where it's like, you know, screw you too. Yeah. I know you do. I just like a tweet or two in your time. I just like the Scram beat it. Like every single guy like, and we don't need to, I shouldn't even have brought it up.

But like everybody was like, we love him, we love him. Like, I like a guy being like, as much as I made fun of Fantilli, it's nice to him to be like, yeah, I'm pissed at him. like he left. You know, be some hate. Sports hate is good. Yeah.

And Matthew Niles will get nothing but love from both sides. He's disappeared a little bit too. Yeah. Five games, no points. Those last five games, I believe. Quiet. But he's playing 20 minutes a night, the last couple games.

So they're using them. He's a big part of what they're doing anyway. He's, yeah. Leif's penalty kill, best in the NHL. Specialty teams won the game last night. Yeah, best, best PK in the NFL. Elbin scored on once all season. Power play fifth best in the NHL right now.

Buzzin. Just a thought, because we're going to go soon here, because we've got to talk to the other side of it here with Aaron Porcelain from Columbus for an article today about Markchenko coming back. I can't believe how much Radish is playing. 25, 26 last night? More.

27? Yes. More. Was it more? No, we didn't go 28. I think it was 27 and change. Let me find it. I thought they were siding a guy. to be a power play specialist or whatever.

They sign Pronger here. Like, he's their everything. He plays every situation. He's playing 27. In a game that didn't go to overtime, he paid 27 minutes. That you guys are right. What can he do on a back-to-back now? I just hope that-

Game 23, Blankenberg, 10 minutes. I don't think Blankenberg's playing tonight. How about Troy's boys? Troy might be the best D-Man on the team. No, that's like 20. Dude, outside radish, Troy Stetcher might be the best defenseman on the movie. He skated the podcast.

out of trouble five separate times last night. He blocked shots. He's got a goal the other night. Why I said 10 by Sizzins. I know we're not supposed to say this, but I thought Riley was better last night too. And he hit a slapper. Why can't you say that?

Why can't you say that? Because every Lee fan gets, the mind is made up. But I thought he was good last night. And he hit a slap shot, which I don't think I've ever seen him do. It went straight into the... It was a chest-seeking missile.

But he's down too. 16 last night? I think he played more last night than that, didn't he? Yeah, 21 last night. Oh, 21. Okay. He felt like he played a lot more last night. All right.

Yeah. Back involved. But Radish five shots last night. He's up to five assists now. Like to see him when plus one. Shoot one in the net, though. Yeah, I'm sure he wants that too. He, you know, the one that hit Paul in the skate lace or something, he bombed pretty hard.

But yeah, it's, uh, it's coming for him. It's a big ask. It's a big lift. They put him on the ice constantly. So take what you can get at this point. Um, I just, yeah, like, we talked about how much that contracts it was and was it an overpay and Tampa letting them go or whatever. But like for what they're using them for and like the amount he's playing.

Like it's not it's not the thing like he's playing like. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he's. No, he is. He's crazy. He's the Leaf's number one defenseman. For sure.

Right? There's no question. And he's playing a ton. So do you guys think that Colton Sizzins came to the team and thought that he would be like the third most important forward on the team, whatever you guys think he is. He's over 15 minutes a night. He played 12 minutes a night last year.

No, I think when I watch Colton Sizzins play and Nick Paul play, you can tell that those guys came from winning organizations. Like, especially Colton Sisons, who came off the cup run last year, won the cup with them before. Just the way he makes a lot of really good, smart plays. We're always going to judge him versus the money he got, unfortunately, but he's a nice player to have.

And Du Hames been pretty good on the penalty kill too, and he gets in there. He's noticeable out there. Yep. So they've gotten some good mileage out of the bottom six there. Okay, we'll take a quick break when we return. Aaron Portsline, who covers Columbus for the athletic. We'll join us and give us a little bit of a picture of Marchenko going back to Columbus for the first time since the big trade. And then deep in the valley.

Steve Aliquette, when we go national at the top of the hour. That, when we return to Real Kipper and Bourne. Everything you need to know about the Blue Jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back in studio, The Real Kipper and Born Show, Leaf Hour edition of our program as we get set for the Toronto Maple Leafs, Columbus Blue Jackets.

Tonight, back to back. Any thoughts on Sharkies last night, whether it be Celebrini or Stanberg? Yeah. I didn't think they were very good. Yeah, you didn't. Did Stenberg play? Ah, there it is. Stenberg played 14 minutes. That's just a valid question.

I thought he was in the third. He had one really good look. Okay, he played, but did he look like a $20 million player? No, he had, I'm with you, sorry. I didn't notice him much. I thought most of his shifts in the third were pretty dangerous, but maybe. not. Maybe I'm just scared of him. He had five shots. He was played 22 minutes.

Yeah. On ice time. You know where they kind of struggle for me is that blue line too. I know they added Truba. Darnell did, you know, Darnel, I got a lot of respect for it because that guy shows up and he plays. Yeah. But he does struggle at times. What was the score when he hit the post? Remember that redirect?

Two-one Leafs. Yeah, that one was close. to being a game changer. But outside of that, I'm not sure how overall that blue line's going to help them get in the playoffs. You know, one thing, one thought stuck out to me. Kesselring couldn't get in the Buffalo Sabres rotation last year. He played 22 minutes for San Jose last night as their second most used D man.

That's reasonable context, I think, for where the Sharks D is at. Do you think they want, like, do you think they did all these things to be in the playoffs? Oh, you don't sign Nurse and Truba and all these moves to not make playoffs. I mean, they were archment. I guess. Maybe you're right. But they traded Eklund. I don't know.

It just feels like they're kind of, I don't know if they're ready to, I don't know. Like, I don't look at that team like playoff team. Oh, I think almost everyone thought they were a playoff team. Yeah. I think so, too. I guess I had a different expectation. You know, that they had, you know, finally the rebuild had brought from this point that they could bring in vets to supplement and here you go. You're talking about Will Smith making 12, 14, 15 million bucks too?

You know, I know they're on the West Coast, and so I probably don't watch him enough, and so I feel unqualified here. But, like, I don't notice him much. And, you know, I probably watch him play seven times a year or something. But I've yet to have a game where I'm like, that guy looks unmanageable. Celebrini is one of my three favorite players in the league.

He's unbelievable. Looks so much like Young Sid. Celebrity does, yeah. Celebrity. Like the. Petitive. Low, center, good eye. It just feels like if this guy and Will, if they're not leading the charge with two or three points tonight, they're no good.

It's funny, you know, when you tear it all down and try to rebuild, people go, like to tear it down, you get all the applause, great move. Oh, they got another draft pick. They have all these assets. And then you go to turn the corner. It's hard. It's hard to get, you know, you can just on the talent you draft, get up to wherever. Yeah. But then there's more to it than that.

Yeah. But you can say the same thing for John Chika. He didn't do that. He actually went and got players right away. Yeah. Until you turn the corner, you're kind of in the same boat. It's hard to be good. It's hard.

Like the good teams have lots of good players. Yeah. There's no guarantee on any side. So many good players and they could definitely not make the playoffs. And like Ascarov was a bet that San Jose made that this is going to be their guy. I know he only gave up a couple last night. I thought he looked terrible. Hella buck.

He's going through him. He's swimming. He's an off angle. Yeah. What do you go there? Between him and even Utah or Melka, to me, those are two teams that I'm not sure. I didn't like him against the Leafs. I can tell you that.

Melchie didn't. No. Not even close. That was not exactly a goaltending battle back game between Utah. I don't know. I mean, we're going to maybe know something more about Hellebuck in the coming days. Do you think by Friday, this is, gets sorted, no? Well, what's sorted to you?

Like, he's somewhere in a jersey for a team. Manitoba? I think that's the safest bet. The only time it hurts you that it's the same building, like people can still go boo this guy. Oh, let him go. I would love to see them sell massive tickets for a moose game to go boo him. That's not happening because apparently they're not selling massive tickets to go boo

Brady Kachuk in Ottawa. Yeah, that's disappointing. Sandy's fan. Well, maybe it's even better that they're just like, they think about them so little that they're just disinterested. They don't care enough. If their general attendance weren't last in the NHL by percentage, I would agree that that's the statement,

but it doesn't seem to be the statement from Ryan. We're just trying to connect with authority here. In terms of like extra guys for the Leafs, McEwan is kind of like a fringy sort of character. with him maybe getting in. Do you like Letary or Gru or McEwen? Do any of them matter to you? Letary is that filler guy.

New Quillen? He's a lot older than Quillen. Yeah, it's true. So I played with enough guys in Hershey in the American Hockey League where kind of know that's your place. You're a go-to guy. and you're a star in the American Hockey League,

but you're a tweener in the NHL, so you can come up with a game or two, and then you know you're going to go back, and I think that's what LaTerry is. I drew a penalty at his scoring chance. Like, you know, he limited look, and he was fine to good. You can grab some of these players for a shift or a period, or if you're lucky, maybe a week,

you can look okay. I just think about where Bo was last year, Bo grew. Yeah. And how he came in when the team kind of needed something. Oh, and he was ripping it. And he, there was a good fit for a while there,

but now reality sets in and it's like, you can't play in the NHL. That's what you're kind of left with now. He's like, he's not, he's not an regular NHLer. Yeah. Yeah, he's going to be on the fringes.

It's much more interesting on the back end. as they try to figure out. McEwen in and out. I think he's next level stuff because he can intimidate, he can hit, he can fight if he has to. That's just stuff that other American hockey league players cannot do. Yeah, he played six minutes last night. I thought Ross Levick is slowing down for me, you know,

like in terms of, are we sure this guy has to be taped to Matthews? Is there a chance? Are these lines updated for, today? Sorry, those are from the game last night. From the game last night. So, yeah. I don't think there'll be much difference.

Cowan, Matthews, Roscoeckiwick, Marchenko, Paul Nealander, and we're going to have Beckman Larson, a concern for you? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's a concern. He's really gone down a notch,

with overall quickness or intensity or... What's that? Trading him at the deadline last year was the move, eh? Like, people are talking about it could be a first for him. He was really a first for him. effective last year. Anyway, I don't know. Both him and McCabe have better,

but you just worry it's age and not just coincidence. How are we doing, Sammy? Oh, all right, let's welcome in, Aaron. We're trying. It took a while there, but it'll be worth it because Aaron's just going to tell us how tough it's going to be on Marchenko by the Columbus Blue Jackets. Aaron, how are you? Doing okay, guys. How are you? We're good. We're good.

What do you expect tonight when Marchenko takes his first shift? Honestly, I mean, on the ice, I, and he's going to get booed in the arena, of course. I honestly don't think it's, I mean, it's not like he used to be in this league, right? Where I don't think it's going to get too nasty. I think some checks will be finished. I think some guys might mess around with him, but I don't. It's certainly not going to be Patrick Line, part two coming back here when he, pretty much ripped the organization from top to bottom after the morning skate and then word quickly got into the dressing room.

That changed the whole feel of that game. To me, this feels like it's going to be a game that where all eyes are on Marchenko and some checks may be finished, but I certainly don't think he's going to be targeted for abuse. I'm curious, you know, how he handles that, like if there is some extra attention on him, were there any moments in his years in Columbus where he was physical or upset? that in him at all? You know what? It's interesting. There were times last year, late in the season, especially, when teams really made it a point to go after him, him and Werenski cut off the heads of

the steak, right? They got really, really physical with Marchenko, and he did not respond well. He did not produce at all down the stretch. Many guys did. It's not all on him. But there were a couple of moments where you could see his anger royal up and he would respond just briefly. But he is not really wired that way and he doesn't want the physical stuff. So I think he understands sort of what kind of player he is. And if he gives it, it's going to come back to him from guys that are built to play that way, where I just don't think he fancies himself that type of player. You're watching and listen to Aaron Portsline

as we discuss Columbus Blue Jackets in the Toronto Maple Leafs. He works for the athletic covering the hockey club. So, Aaron, can we put a bow on the reason why Marchenko is no longer Columbus Blue Jacket? Did it come down to money?

Did it come down to he didn't want to be there because they were going nowhere, the organizational decision? like what do we know for sure and to me to me if he if he left because they weren't willing to pay him then join the long list of athletes over the course of the last 20 years and sure that may not be a good enough reason to boo a guy if he thinks he he can get paid more but what else do we know well he wasn't a USA hockey member blah boom um fair yeah thank you thank you thank you

He's willing to go. Hooray. Yeah, I mean, he, look, he was asked nine different ways to answer that question, and he wouldn't do it. Now, my understanding is from some of the guys in the room who sort of cornered him and said, yo, what's up and tell me that what I'm reading this summer or read all summer isn't true. They have been given reasons that they won't share private conversations and all. So I hate to say this, but I really don't know what his reason is. I mean, listen, he's not the first guy to say, I think I'd like to play somewhere other than Columbus, right?

He's not alone in that, right? And, you know, frankly, Werensky's in a difficult position because some of the stuff that filtered out this summer with himself. Now, he certainly didn't request a trade. In fact, you know, denied a trade, shot it down and trade to the Dallas stars. Backpedaled. Yeah, for sure. But I mean, he did use his no move clause to block a trade to the stars. So, but he has not given an answer. And that's what's, I think, a source of frustration for so many people, fans here for sure. I think management should be doing everything they can to get to the bottom of this. Tell me true. What is the reason? What can the organization do better? Of course, winning is the one thing that's been missing here below these 26 years. But I don't know exactly what Marchenko's reasoning is for deciding that he needs to get out. Because he is the guy, of course, who they were closed on a two-year deal with him on this contract.

He's under right now the last year. And he said, may I please have three, which got them all excited. Okay, he does want to be here. And now two years later, it's changed. Yeah. So let's take the other side of this. Matthew Nyes, come back. Great start.

Slower since. How has the beginning of the Matthew Nyes era been for the Blue Jackets? Yeah, well, I mean, the team's struggling to score goals. I do think with Marchenko not there, they're going to have a hard time on some nights. They're just not going to score easy goals. They didn't score enough of them to begin with, but most of those came from Marchenko up front, Werenski on the back. So it's a different tack that needs to be taken now to score goals.

I think Nyes, as you mentioned, got up to a great start. I think he's played well. He's had chances. That line with, you know, Fantilli's centering it, Kent Johnson on the right. has been their best line. That's not saying a lot because they've played okay in the early going, but they haven't, they've had some games where they've been defensively sound, the last two for sure.

But they have not really clicked offensively yet. And I think Fantillion and I have both said that it's common. Johnson's been their most productive forward. But those two haven't really found it just yet. They've come close a few times, but it's not there yet. Aaron, just one more for me. last week it was head coach Rick Bonas and with the message that if

if you don't want to be here we don't want you here and then we heard Fantilli kind of say the same thing in regards to Marchenko I mean is there a chance that we could kind of stop hearing this and they can stop feeling like victims every week. Yeah, right. Well, I mean

it's one of the things right? players stop asking to be moved, the reputation will die. Until then, it's going to be a hard, it's going to be hard to shake. Like I say, it's Marchenko now, but it's been many players before him. I could go through a long list. I had to cut some guys out of the Monday Notes column talking about the return games for some of these guys. There's been so many of them. They haven't won here.

And I've never met anyone. I've never talked to any player who said, I can't stand to live in that city. A lot of people say, who wants to live in Columbus? I don't honestly think it's ever been that. Now, Panarin wanted to live in Miami. Sorry, Bobrovsky wanted to live in Miami. Panarin wanted to play for the New York Rangers.

That was it. End game. So they can't be those things to those players. But to me, it's the organization, and it's the lack of winning. Yes. that has to be highlighted. And until they get around to winning consistently and having a run, they've never had a run here in so many years,

they need to be a really special place to play for players. They need to do more behind the scenes than just about any other team, I think, to make it a special place to play. And I'm not sure that it always feels that way to players. Yeah, I would bet to say that that onus is on ownership. to do that. Yep. All right, Aaron.

Thank you so much, man. Thanks, 40. Okay, guys. All right. Thanks, horse line. Have a good night. From the athletic covering blue jackets. Mm-hmm.

That's ownership. But what way? Like, what way? You, you're the tone setter, man. You, everything starts at the top and comes down. So make it a place where guys want to play and try to win. I get what Aaron's saying. I don't think you have to win first.

You have to create the illusion that you are going to do whatever it takes to win. And we're going to do whatever it takes to make you feel like this is the place to be. You know, they went and got Johnny Goodrow, you know, which was obviously ended so tragically. But the idea that those sort of guys will come there needs to be something they hammer home. So like Jason Robertson right now. Like you got to, what does it take to make Jason Robertson possible for Columbus? What does it take to get stars there? They've had Rick Nash and Wrenski, I guess.

They had Jeff Carter for a month. Yeah, who didn't? You know, like, you got to get some guys there where it's like some of the electric guys in the league. Minnesota's done this. Minnesota was the Minnesota mild forever. Now it's Hughes and Capriza. Wild Minute. Yeah.

Wild Minute. But at least, you know, we joke about like I still don't watch him a ton. but like I respect what they're doing, man. They're trying their ass off, and Columbus needs that energy. Quickly before I go, Colton says it didn't win the cup. I gave him a cup he didn't get. You see him in the National Yellow. It might as well be Vegas Yellow.

We had a nickel every time. I was excited. I want to create some pedigree for the league. I mean, we love you. Thanks. No matter what. Thanks. Okay, we'll take a quick break.

Who's the most colorful goalie right now in the National Agingham County? Oh, Devin Cooley. Devin Cooley. Kevin Cooley Cooley Can you find some for us? Maybe in the next five minutes. Because we've got Steve Valacette

to tell us all about it. It's deep in the valley when we return to real Kippin'Born.