Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Matthews Perceptions + Measuring the Trade Market

Episode Date: February 26, 2026

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look back on the Toronto Maple Leafs' first game back from the Olympic break, a 4-2 loss to the Tampa Bay Lightning. They discuss the disappointing start to an important stretch, Tampa's punishing power play, and a tired-looking return for Auston Matthews. Then, they discuss what comes next for the Leafs as they approach the deadline, the markets for Bobby McMann, Oliver Ekman-Larsson, and Scott Laughton, and whether Brad Treliving is in the right position to make the decisions. Later, they dip into McKee's Midweek Mailbag to answer your questions! The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Back to back games on our Leaf edition, Hour of the Real Kipper and Born show. We are live on Sportsnet 360, 590, the fan in Toronto, streaming always on Sportsnet Plus. If you can't catch us live, give us a download on Spotify, Apple Podcast, also available on YouTube, where we have great chats to give us a thumbs up.

Do they? I don't know. Thanks, guys. I'm really hoping to do. I hope so, too. Caprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee, Derek Brandeo, and James Wilson. No, it's Jake. It's Jake the snake, not James, Wilson.

It's been James Wilson for the last two days. Every time I walk in there, it's somebody different. Wilson. I'm starting to think he doesn't create this lineup from scratch. Oh, what? We go from absolutely, you know, scratching our butts to back-to-back games. Yeah.

So like the anticipation was good last night, looking forward to the game, especially, you know, in our Leaf Edition hour of the Toronto Maple Leafs in Tampa Bay. That was the good part, the anticipation. The anticipation was good, he says. But disappointing is a reality check is what it was. It was snap back to reality.

That was a, oh boy, it's Domi and McMahon on the top line. You know, it was just, whoa. Was the opposite of whiplash, lash whip? And it was just like, whoa. I did Lee's talk last night with J.D. Bonkus. And he said after the game, I thought it was perfectly said. He said, I was, you know, I was excited, the anticipation. You know, I thought it would be good to get back in the.

the routine and the 10 minutes into it. He's like, I never want to do this again. I agree. Matthew's comments after the Olympics where he said, what was the line about went for one, stayed for two, all by three or something like that? And McKee tweeted last night. Same thing about the hockey game. Yeah. Checked in for one, stayed for two, was done by three.

I actually had never heard that line before. And I think it's a fantastic line. And I will be using it from here. We were expecting. something closer, better, more balanced. I know your reality is domi and McMahon compared to what you saw on Tampa Bay, but really disappointing

off of three weeks that they wouldn't find a way to keep this thing closer. Buddy, it wasn't... They got caved. Well, and they also took goals off the board so it looked way better than it was. But the reality was that game was four nothing, five, nothing at some point

until they shot a couple in at the end of the game once Tampa had punted on the match. But yeah, no, it wasn't particularly close, not a great effort, didn't look. They looked out of sorts. Tampa Bay looked like they had been practicing together the whole time, even though we know that's not true. Yeah.

I don't know. I don't know. It was bad, bad, bad. I mean, it's bad. It's really not. Rocket appliance is here to quote my friend, Ricky from Herbork, boys. One team good. One team sucks. It sucks.

That's what it looked like last night. It's not good. Let's get to Craig Brube's overall thoughts on last night. Clip one. Yeah, first period, I thought, you know, we played a good, solid period. We had three, two-on-ones in the first period. We don't get a shot off, so, you know, we've got to execute those plays better. Second period, I thought that we were flat early, and they got a couple goals,

and that's a difference in the game for me. Not to give away our chat secrets, but you liked their first period, too, didn't you? I did. I thought there was a competitive period until the bolts figured out how to play hockey. Yeah. I thought that the two-on-one acumen could use some work. I mean, he said they had two-two-on-ones. Have they ever seen a scoring chance before those two?

Yeah, Stephen Lawrence seemed shocked to be in those situations. He looked a little rusty in some of those offensive spots. Never usually, never his forte. So, yeah, it was a tough watch at times. You know, watching Tampa pass it, watching Kuturov and point, do their things. in that game was... Harlem Globetrotters? Yeah.

I mean, the Kutrov goal, the touch Gonzalez makes, instead of just ripping that, some pretty high-end skill over there in Tampa Bay. Who, by the way, has also been going for it for a lot of years and is still tippity-tong. Peak. Moser and Radish guys that you find along the way develop. Holmberg is part of a line that shuts down.

How many years now have they... They've gotten, like, all world... Are you kidding me? From Kutrov Point, though those two guys, to me, stand out. McDonagh and Headman still find a way to get things done. But like... Look at Pointe.

Could he used him? Italy. They locked them up early. What appeared to be a team-friendly contracts, right, with a state tax and whatever you want to say. And they're still riding them. Yeah. That's nice.

I mean, listen, Breezeball has done pretty much everything. thing right. It's really hard to not go away after you go for it for a lot of years. And boy, they really are humming. I'm trying to find points contract. I grew up around the Gratzky, Mario, Eisman, Pavellbury, all these top players. Kutrov is, for me, going to go down as one of the best and maybe arguably as good as anybody on a power plate I've ever seen. That's so funny you say that Because I said on Lee's talk last night

I was going to ask you guys about it Is he one of the best power play players of all time? Yeah Maybe the best Honestly I think there's a case to be made for sure I don't know what his actual stats are But I know when he has the puck

There's nothing he can't do Like you know And when you want to talk about great ones like Gretzky of course And Mario 97's pretty good On the power play Brett Hall can shoot a puck

Like we get all that But to have as many tools as he has the vision, the passing, maybe the best passer I've ever seen. But then he has this one-timer. Like, I mean, Mario didn't have a one-timer. Greske didn't have a one-timer. I mean, they were great and they were all-world.

But, like, this guy has everything. I couldn't agree more. Power play points over the last five years, he's one behind Drysidal for second. McDavid's ahead of them both by 20. So, you know, yeah. But I mean, yeah, 208 power play points over the past five years for him. And he's played the fewest games by 20 some.

So, yeah, he's among them. And it is just last night it felt like a bit of a talent divide, talent disparity between the two teams. Not sure what else, but it wasn't particularly close. Let's go to clip two on Craig Bruby on what he thinks Tampa does well. Is this like a 40-minute clip? Yeah, none of them are good. Well, they don't give you a lot of room out there, that's for sure.

And they only got a lot of skill they can make plays. But I thought that did a good job for a lot of the game defending it and making sure we had numbers and people back and doing a good job. But, you know, in the end, you give them a couple free ones and they capitalize on them. That was, you know, four penalties we took tonight. It's just tough. Like you're in your own end the whole time, it feels like. all the shots, all the rush stuff, it's all coming against you.

So, you know, I don't love the idea that you just gave them a couple. But, you know, this is, Tampa Bay is one of the few best teams in the NHL. You know, like to me, this is a, you know, you call it a measuring stick game. What are the Leafs trying to be? If they're trying to get in playoffs, you're more measuring yourself against Washington or whoever, but they're not at this level or anywhere close to it. I just look, for me, the biggest difference between those two teams is just, just the way the defense corps plays.

I mean, just that, you look at up and down that, that decor that they have, you know, they've made shrewd trades. They get that Mosier in the Utah, was that from Utah last year, 2024, I think they got it. Sergeathev? Yeah, I think it was the switch with Utah. Right?

So they let go of Surgachev. They end up with this guy who's playing on their top, their top pair. Great trade. They sign him long term. This das stew they were talking about was the ECHL defender of the year. Now he's moved up through their system. playing well. You know, McDonough is what he is.

Chernak's a guy they've developed. Headman was a top. Like, it's just their development of guys including, and just to cover off what they've had with the injuries or whatever, is just so much, it's so stark that that's like one of the big differences. Like, DeLief's, I mean,

who have, they've got one homegrown guy in their, in their D-Corps. And it's Morgan Riley. They tried to draft smaller skill D. They tried to get Sandin. They tried to do the Lilligran thing. but like the topies and the ronies whatever one of those was defense crazy that neither of us

neither of them ever made any of us figure it out no i just i i i mean you look at the least decor and it's you know it's morgan raleigh who they've drafted but it's mccabe who they had to spend a first round pick on it's carlo who they had to spend a first round pick on it's benwa who they signed off the scrap heap it's it's stetcher who they got from waivers it's just they're doing a great job and it kind of just illustrates how

badly the Leafs have developed the fenceman over the last little bit to me. And Sandin would be playing for them right now. Like he would be in their decor. Yeah. So, I don't know. You got a clip on, Barabee, talking about the break. About what he thought it did to the game? Yeah, let's play it.

Another thrilling one. Okay. Clip. Three. Well, it does probably affect it a bit, but, you know, two-on-one's, like, you know, we've got to get chances off of them. We didn't. We had We had our looks. We didn't score. Willie had a couple

breakaways and other opportunities, but we didn't do good enough job. I will say William Nealander had all the chances that they had, right? He had the one where he tried to go five-hole, couldn't get it through, he did the back end, tow drag, couldn't get it around the pad. He had lots of chances. He was skating well and involved offensively.

Set up DeVaris after cancel with the Patrick Steffon. He almost did the Patrick Steffon. No, he did. He went full step on. hell down right after he missed. Like it was the full step on. Obviously, we've had in-depth conversations about Austin and what kind of shape he would be in and what can we expect after the game was over. I think the most positive thing is he didn't hurt himself for me.

Yeah. Yeah. Did he end up with a point? Yes, he did. Was it on the, was it on the nyes? Yeah, the nyes. Yeah. The nigh.

What was that? It was weird. Yeah. That was strange. But like, no real surprise, right? Come on. Like, what were we expecting? And then if you watched the highlight of Jack Hughes there,

thinking that Tage Thompson was a teammate of his last night, did you see his giveaway? No, I didn't see the giveaway. There was a pizza. Oh, my gosh. To Thompson? Yeah, right to Thompson. I saw Thompson's goal.

That one had blowing over 0.8 written all over it. I mean, the confidence of that. guy to just take the microphone before the game and do like an aretta concert stand-up comedy session pull tall you know tage off his bench bench impromptu before the game i know i was talking to doing the the sutter book with darrell and he was saying the first time he played against his brothers he said we wouldn't look over at the other end we didn't want anyone on our team to think that we had a friend on the other side you know like for the fear before the game just skating around arm around a guy on the other team the sabers like sent him

out a tweet about it. Like with both of them standing there being like, hey, play free bird. It's like everybody, they're just like, they're just dunking on us. Every chance they get. Let's get Craig Bruby's thoughts. That's an unbelievable song.

Let's get Craig Ruby's thoughts. Derek Clip 5 on his captain last night. Yeah, you know, I thought he was fine. You know, we used them a lot at the end, obviously with the goalie out. And they did some real good things with the goalie out. But, yeah.

I didn't sense he was tired or anything like that. He was good. All right, let's say the quiet part. Kind of looked like he looks a lot. No, I thought, no, no, no. This one was even way worse than whatever you're insinuating to me. He did not want to handle the puck. He got off the ice fairly quickly.

There was no... Like 23 minutes last night. It doesn't matter to me. That's just how bad to Lisa. I'm just, I just thought Michelobaldra He just looked like he couldn't wait to get off the ice

and I don't blame him one bit. I mean, okay, I don't. And, you know, if we wake up today, you know,

if you search your phone or the internet, it's not getting any easier for, I think, him and the Leafs because this story, obviously, of going to the White House won't go away.

I don't know if you guys caught, Damien, article in the Toronto Star, but it, it, it, and listen, I'm not,

this isn't against Damien and it's not about Austin, but it goes to my earlier point of watching him last night. It's like, like, this guy has been completely set up. And it's, it's not his fault.

It's not. I mean, he couldn't, yeah, of course, you could sit there and say he could have gone, he could have not gone to the White House, whatever, I don't care about that. But we set him up to fail last night,

and I said it before the game, right? And just I hate what's going on right now with him. I don't, I hate it because there could have been ways to protect him or avoid him from this pitfall that he's in right now. and I don't know where it's spinning to. Is it going to alleviate or is it going to get worse? I don't know. I will say, you know,

watching how the Americans are watching us in Canada and Toronto specifically react to the aftermath of the gold medal game. You know, I kind of find a lot of the coverage today, it's a bit much for me, like the Matthew stuff. Like the Toronto Star today had the Cox article, which basically said that, he chose, that Matthews chose, um, country and politics over the Leafs, which I don't think that's fair.

I don't think he did that. But if he did it, but listen, he was there. But if he did it, we did it to him. Well, but fine. Every other American player also did that. A few, if you didn't go, but they all played the 20 guys or whatever that went to the White House. They all played.

But even last night, even last night. Yeah. Like, if he doesn't, like, people, I make calls today and they're like, you know, I give him full credit he played. And it's like, that's where we're at, that he just gets credit for putting his uniform on. Well, I don't see why you wouldn't give him some credit, considering the- No, no, no, no. I'm just saying, though, it's like, we're going to give him a ton of credit just for putting the uniform on, or we're going to rip him for not putting it on.

Like, it's, he's in a no-win situation because even a, if he puts the uniform on. He's not very good. We know he's not going to be very good. And we know his heart's not in it. So what are we really doing? No, we don't. We don't know his heart's not in it.

No, he played like his heart wasn't in it last night. I think that's your opinion. I don't think it's fair to say his heart's not in it. I think he came back. It's not like his heart's in it. And when I say his heart's not in it, he's not all in. He's not at his best. But Kip, how could you expect him to be?

Of course. And my whole point is, we did that to him. He didn't do it to himself. We is. The league, the Players Association, the pressure of the fans, the pressure of the media.

You're saying, we set them up to lose. But you're saying that it's a lose-lose, but the situation. But everyone else, aside from this conversation, you're talking about it saying, good for him, got back, he came back from this, didn't go to the State of the Union, came back,

showed up and played for the team. He didn't like his game. Again, I don't think anyone, expecting him to be very good. But I think that's all you ask of the guy. And then, you know, there's another article in the same paper, kind of doing the same thing about, you know, hobnobbing with a, you know, people have very extreme views and the stuff.

I'm tired of the political reaction to it all. I know I'm not trying to avoid it. We've talked about it for three days. But then you're the third article. If anyone accuses us of avoiding it, then please listen to our show. Don't listen to our other shows. You also wrote about Matthews in the paper. The Toronto Star had three articles today about him.

and, you know, he put on the jersey and he showed up and he came back and he played. Now, is it going to have some knock on effects that he was there and talking with American guys and wanting to play in America? I think the biggest thing is the Leaf's got to be good. The Leafs are good. I think he said he wants to stay. So they can focus here about fielding a good hockey team. And that's the same with all superstars in the league.

Field a good team and they'll want to be there. That's kind of where it ends for me. If they're bad, it's not because someone wrote an article in the paper or that would make them want to leave. And it's just a lot of discourse right now. I just, I don't expect them any better tonight. Well, no, of course not. But guess what?

They all stink. The whole team stinks. And it's like he can go out there and play okay and they're fine. But it's like when you can't get a breakout pass and you're playing alongside two guys that should be on an NHL third line, he's not in a very good position to success, even if he is sober camp. Like, I, I've made my point very clear about how I felt about him going to the White House.

but just the coverage today and the way it's talked about. Even if they would have like had them play Thursday or Friday, why Wednesday on a gold medal game where you almost were 100% guaranteed that at least one North American team was going to be in a final? 23 or 25 guys are going to be a tough. So then we know the championship team is going to party like crazy. We know, well, we didn't know the White House would be involved. But so what?

it is involved. It's like we're going to ask them now to go party for three days in a row, run the circuit, and then go play 22 minutes? What are we nuts? Yeah, I think that's the case we made the other day when I mentioned the Micahotto tweet about like, can we just shift the whole thing back, give them an extra day buffer? But I also don't think the NHL probably thought that the USA was going to party like it was the first time any of them had ever won anything.

Yeah, I do think it would have looked very different if McKinnon shoots that in the net And it's the Canadian team. I just, I really hope, and, you know, people bash me for being a Matthews hater, whatever. I can handle it. Like, I mean, you're not a, you were never a Matthews hater. Read my mentions and DMs. Just recently, though. Within the last year, when the results haven't been as good and he has been as good.

But here's the thing. I don't want him to leave. I don't want him to not play for the Toronto Maple Leaf. And I don't want to look back on this four-day stretch. I want to look back on this as a foot. A footnote, a footnote, footnote in a bunch of us being super sour that we lost. And we are a sour grapes country right now. 100%.

We are, could not be more pissed off. And I get it. I'm feeling it every day. I think about it four times a day. Every day. I get it. I don't want this to be a point where we look back on and we all say that was it. Yeah.

That was the end. That's when Austin Matthews saw what people are saying about him. A lot of people are talking like that. That's what I worry about. As a fan, it's like, Austin Matthews, flaws, hated him shaking hands with Trump, hate all that. But like, I'm a Dumbo hockey fan who likes hockey players on his hockey team. Shoot it in.

I want him to be on the team. Do you want to see me hit dingers? I just, dingers! I worry that these last three days are going to change his perception forever. Yes. That's it. I think that's a very real concern. And it's going to be fascinating on.

Saturday night. When they return home to play against the Ottawa senators, which will involve Brady Kachuk, which, boy, I mean, everybody's crapping on us for being tough. Did you see him in his morning skate today? He did deposition. Oh, is that right? Oh, my God. Ten questions about it.

Like, just back and forth to me. Well, apparently, someone said close the northern border, which by, and people thought it was him and he's having to answer the question. I'm sorry, who was talking about? Brady Kachuk. Apparently on the Trump calls. Okay, all right. Okay, now you got you now. Now let me clarify. If they did

and if a very funny joke, they just played Canada. It's a funny joke. They beat their rivals, whatever. But Brady is in it. They went on Fox News. They did the whole thing. I think, you know, were I ascends fan, I'd feel even worse. You know, your brother's. You know the family vibe there. I don't put Matthews and Brady in the same conversation. But I just, I think that there's a world where we look back on this week when we're like, yeah, he's playing for Utah now. What a surprise. Yeah. Utah. Yeah, there's no question.

People are going to maybe look back on it for sure. But there's also that other element, which has nothing to do with any of this and where the Leafs are and where he sees they are in two years and wanting to maybe go try to win somewhere else. Do you want to have the big conversation here? Sure. What else are we doing?

I'm watching that game last night. and I don't know how long ago it was that you said maybe they should consider blowing it up. You know, we saw Pronger on the rival radio station talking about taking it down to the screws. Watching that decor last night, I'm like, boy, maybe this isn't an overnight fix. Like who, like, I mean, that, there are an incredible amount of holes on this hockey team, an incredible amount of holes that just really are. I think there is too many what-ifs right now that they can talk themselves into before they do it. because as you guys know, when you rebuild,

when you tear it down to the studs, nothing's guaranteed. Two years, not guaranteed, three years, not guaranteed. You need to make sure you need to do that. And so I think there's a lot of, what if next year Matthews finds 100, his 100 point form

and Matthew Nyes is better than the goal. What if? 10F's healthy, what if, what if, what if? I think they have to make sure that there's not a chance that it can turn around before they can say that they need to do that because it's a big, you've said they can't do it.

even if they need to do it. I just know that it doesn't appear like it's an option now to even think about multiple years that you're out of the playoffs. Right. So that means you might have to suck it up this year. But two in a row, heads roll. So that means you're sitting here this year going, how do we get creative? And I'm watching OEL last night. He's the only one that showed up.

He was awesome. Ripped it off the inside of the post. Come on. And rushes up. beat a guy up for scoring. Like that guy scores and he's like, I don't, I'm going to beat you up for. Just love him.

But he's 35. You're right. If you're watching that game and considering trading for OEL, that was a real like, all right, there's still some life in that. There is, but he's 35. I'm not sure if he can bring a first rounder or not. I mean, he absolutely can't. So take the second.

Take the second. What does that have help? You'd rather just have two years of OEL at 3, 5. You know, if you're talking about being good, But it's to your point, like, do you keep them and still miss the playoffs in the next year or two? I'd rather have him and try to figure out the other holes than get rid of him, try to figure out how to replace him cheaper than 3.5. Who's better than him at 3.5 in the league?

Can't be many. I get it. I get it. So I'm saying I'm fine with the trade. You get a good return. You have him now and he's at the top of his game and you're still missing the playoffs. But there's no way he's not worth a first. I don't know if I don't know if he can play like that next year.

Then get your first. So here's the next point that I have written down. You're right. Kipper, like, if this was any other team, if the Leafs were trying to trade for all of Recman-Larsen, you'd be like, that's guys, you got to give up a first to get that guy. No, you give up first for Carlo, who's 28, not 35. And a future Patrice Berger.

Well, we didn't, you didn't know that at the time, though. He knew he was in NHL. You didn't know. You knew he's good. I just, I think there's, if you're trading all of Reckman-Larsen, it's because you're getting a first-round pick back, in my opinion. If it's a second, you're disappointed?

I just wouldn't do it. I think it's a second in a player, like a second in some sort of a prospect or whatever, but you have to get some sort of first-round value back. So here's the next thing I have written down, which is if you're going to consider OEL, Carlo, Lotton, all those other names, it starts today.

Like maybe you make a move today or tomorrow. You're not going to trade four guys. on March 6th. It's hard to say that though, J.B., because they're out there and they set prices and they're shaking off the prices. They're not paying. If you watched McMahon last night,

would you give up a first rounder for him? Was he stinky last night? I didn't notice him in any direction. You just answered my question. Yeah. Right? So. I'm not making my decision on, like,

a game out of a three-week break. He's a 20 goal score already this year. Yeah. Right. Score 20 goals. He's 28 and he makes a million bucks. He is. He is a third line player on a contending team, Sammy.

Yeah. He's a 20 goal score. What Scott Lott? On one of the worst teams in the league right now. Why are you trying to make the case that these guys are not valuable assets? No, no, you're telling me that's 29. You're telling me to make trades right now, and I'm telling you there's no first rounder out there from McMahon. That's all.

That's all I'm saying. Yeah. Hey. Right? And you're asking me why. Yeah. And I'm telling you why. So by the deadline, you think that that comes up?

I think it probably comes down. I don't, I don't see. There's no first and you think the offers are getting worse. I think generally when more teams get involved, when they know that they're out and they, they push more chips into the trade table, prices come down, right? Supplying demand. Well, that seems to be the final five hours of the deadline. hey, we got to get something for our guys sort of thing.

I've never got the impression that that happens in the five, six days leading up to the deadline. No, if you want to overpay, you can get them now. Yeah. Right? To your point, if you want to overpay, if you're desperate enough and you want to go for it, by all means, blow your brains out. And so this is the, you know.

But it's hard. No one's making trades right now of significance. They're waiting. Well, I mean. Tyler Myers is sitting out for, you know, right now. I think as today. Right now, but like Sunday, they'll start. Saturday.

Yeah, we're seven and a half days. After tonight. After tonight, some teams will make decisions. Right. Because you're here now. And so I guess my point is, last year with the Toronto Maple Leafs, they wanted to make two big moves. They wanted to add a centerman and a defenseman. That was a big thing.

We talked about it from November. And we talked about them trying to find it. And it didn't happen. It didn't happen. And then contrary to our conversation here, it got to be crunch time. And people said, if you want them, the price is going up, up, up. And at the last minute, they said, blah. Okay.

God, they blad hard. And all of a sudden, it was nightmare. Nightmare. Because you waited to the last minute. To me, it's like, listen, Bobby McMahon's getting traded. Edenton, if you're interested, I'm making a decision by Wednesday. Hey, if you're interested, we're making a decision by Wednesday. We have to have some idea.

You need to get out ahead of this stuff and not go, let's see what happens in the final. That's not the way Brad works, though. I acknowledge it. And this, this is the next. This is the scary part. And that's the pushes to the other conversation. This is the crux of the crossroads of the convoy, if you will. What are his motivations?

What is he allowed to do? Exactly. Do you think he has some limitations? Who's in charge? I don't know. I mean, if the mandate from your ownership group or your CEO is, you know, you can't strip this down where we're in 30th place next year. Say the scary numbers you think his contract might be for an extension.

McMahon? Yeah. Like I'm seeing way too much McMahon extension talk. I saw Dregor talking about. I see Pagnotta talking about it. Well, it's because they try to drive up the price. It's tough to, it's tough to replace them. It's not easy to replace a guy that can skate like that, Sam.

Well, you didn't notice him last night. So how big is it to? I think his career arc is going to be. I'm not saying he's crap, Sam. I'm just saying that if you're a team, first, I'm going to, first round picks for, forwards are legit top six players. And he is not a legit top six player.

He's a guy that can play anywhere from three to nine and be okay. And then sometimes he can fill in on a top line for a week, 10 days. But that is not a typical first round player you trade for. So then if you want to give him an extension, let's pay him like a third line. I think if you get to a number. Like if he says, I don't care, 20 million bucks. Yeah. You go, okay, well, let's do it.

Let's do it over six years. And he's like, I don't care. You're going to give me $10 million on a signing bonus or, right? I'll take it up front. I'll give you six years. If you hit my number, I'll retire on $20 million. I'm good to go. What does that work out?

To four, four one? That's a funny thing that you're kind of hearing people do. Like, I'm trying to get to a total contract value of, and I'm not particular about how we do it. Right. How old is he? 30. Does he envision itself playing until 35, 36?

Yeah, this summer he'll turn 30. Anything after that is a bonus. If I keep playing, I play. If not, I know I got 20 large. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, if you get 20, you're talking about five years times four million. You're okay with that?

20 million over six years? I'm not. I'm not okay with them. You just don't want him. You want an asset. Yes. Hold on. There's a number you want.

I've won. Yeah, sure. 850K. No, no. He wants change. He does not. want the same people coming back. Well, I mean, I don't know if you've watched the local side this year, bud,

but it hasn't exactly been a palatable product. I like this slow infusion of European football talking. I get it. But it's just, I get it. You're going to sign Bobby McMahon for $5 million, or however much it's going to cost to sign them. Four. Sure.

And you're going to come back next year and be like, now it'll be different when we have all the same guys. This didn't. The whole idea is not to change guys around him. around him. And Matthews and Nealander. I'm just doing the math on what does Bobby McMahon at 35, 34, I guess, look like, you know?

He's really fast. Very fast. Very fast. Yeah, maybe he'll be fast. And if he wants to stay so badly, like, hey, Bobby, go enjoy your sabbatical and come back in the offseason. We'll get a pick for you and have fun in the playoffs with some other team. Good radio show.

Yeah? Go to break. Oh, okay. Can we take a break? Sure, bud. I'm exhausted. I want to talk about the White House some more? No.

No? No? No. Any other current affairs we want to get into? Moving on. Mexico is pretty crazy right now. Stop it. Will you?

Stop it. All right, we're done. Okay, what do we got? Mailbag? I got a few other things we want to talk about it too. But mailbag. We should talk about stole ours. Talk about some other stuff.

All right. And they're playing tonight. Still got some meat on the bone on our leaf hour edition. All right. Sammy's mailbag, mid-week Maple Leaf mailbag up next when we return. Real Kipperman Bourne. Hey, it's Aylish Forer. And I'm Justin Cuthbert.

Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. It's the fan pre-game. 6 p.m. weekdays on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590, the fan, and wherever you get your podcast. Welcome back to the Real Kippur and Born. Showna, Kimbrose, Justin Bourne. Sammy McKee. Hey, before we move on, I just wanted to remind everybody that it's Toronto Maple Leafs Game Day. score a Popeye's chicken sandwich for only six bucks in classic or spicy make it your new game day tradition get your six dollar chicken sandwich at a Popeyes near you can I just say yeah I just really enjoyed the phase of the show where we got to cheer for them to do well and I'd like to have that resume the Toronto Maple Leafs yes Popeyes yeah they don't have the cheer for Popeyes they're doing just fine yeah but you know like it's not fun when you have to do anything other than I hope

they have success. You know, you just want to see him win? It's over. This year. They're going to try to win. Listen, thank God we have you. I'm telling you right now. I agree. You can keep Sammy afloat. I can't.

You know what's funny is I was going to say this off the air and you guys shut me down aggressively for saying it. Well, I almost said something before the show about the show. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, right. I said, tonight actually matters in that. their internal perception of where they're at. We all agree that where they think they're at and where we think they're at are very different.

Internally, if they beat Florida tonight, I think they'll still be like, let's see how we do Saturday. We said two out of three. I said two out of three. And if they win tonight, I think they'll go, let's see how Saturday goes. We'll see.

I'm not saying I think this, Sam. I'm saying it matters for how they think of themselves. I can't even, I can't even entertain. I think maybe we should see how they, after Saturday, after they play, we should check out how they look at morning skate on Sunday, maybe how they eat lunch, and then after that, we'll make a decision on the future of the state.

Have the Florida Panthers said anything about their lineup tonight? Sammy? I haven't heard anything. There's strong indication that Brad Marcharden will not play again this season. Really? I mean, I thought that I had heard that maybe it was possibly a perhaps, thought that they were thinking of, you're thinking it's happening.

My understanding is if it wasn't for the Olympics, he probably would have had surgery three weeks ago. I hate hearing that. I hate hearing that. Like, if you're on the verge of going, having surgery, then why are you going? Well, okay, can you explain to me? Is that not fair?

Sid Crosby, Sid Crosby said he was maybe 70% with playing. And then he comes home and he shuts down for four weeks. How can you be that close to playing and then being told you can't play for a month? Well, I think there's a game that is of such huge importance that you're willing to risk further damage, the brace and needles and let's just try to get through one.

But it's not the right thing for your long-term knee. And then now it's like, okay, well, let's just let this thing heal. Okay. That's my guess. Don't you think? Well, I don't know. Is there something more nefarious than that? No, I'm saying that if Pittsburgh's now,

they go and lose three or four in a row, do you rush him back now instead of four weeks? Maybe, you bring him back for two and a half weeks? Maybe. Yeah, maybe. Because those games become awfully important. For sure. Have you seen their schedule too?

They've got a brutal schedule coming up this month. But now I will see. I mean, maybe Brad sucks it up some more and tries to play. I don't know. We'll see. And those rabid hockey fans down there buying up all the tickets for the two conquering heroes for their two-time Stanley Cup champions and their gold medalists get in the building for $40. No, $40 tickets. What a rabid fan base.

Can we just also keep in mind when we're talking about the Florida Panthers is that they've got this pick that's dangling as well, just not the Leafs in the Boston Bruins over Carlo pick. It's top five protected? No, top 10. Oh, that's smart. top 10 protected from the Spencer night right yes does Florida want that pick or do they happily give it away no they'll take a top 10 pick that'll work out just I think they would get yourself into that range where you could Islanders it up

well you can't bring Barkov back what's that can't bring Barkoff back then right you're trying to get down there right I mean where are they league wide here they're not too far off dig into your mail bag so we kind of we kind of we kind of alluded to this in the first block, but let's do it again, because it's all care, anybody cares about anyway right now is trades.

What's your most optimistic asset return in terms of pick value for this off season? I.E. OEL being a first and a B prospect, McMahon, two seconds, to a first. My sense is that, sorry, I got my chicken alarm going off here. My sense is that they sell properly hard. OEL, McMahon, Carlo,

Lotton. They can get four firsts of value total. Your thoughts? I've been talking with Nick Caprios and I don't think that's happening. second and thirds and if they can do conditionals to first then good on them if they can turn OEL into a

a second and maybe if they go to a conference final they get a first that's a big big return I can just tell you that you know following the islanders the way I do the decision on Dobson to move on from him and get two firsts

I know that they don't have Dobson to trade in Toronto but immediately the fan base was energized like I think a hard sell here of like the four or five guys we're talking about sell them all i think people would be pretty excited to suddenly have a first three seconds you know like all the sudden it's like okay there's some assets we'll pick once or twice we'll trade a couple of them god forbid a young fast player right a guy that's got some promise that'd be nice that would energize people how this is from Ethan. This is a hard hitter boys.

How big of a disconnect do you think there is behind closed doors in terms of tree and Brube? MLSC eliminated the president position so they could work closer together. And you see Cowan is rotting away for a month despite Tree saying they want him to be active. I don't think there's any disconnect between those two. Do you, Ken? I don't have any facts towards that. I don't, I've not necessarily heard definitively that they don't get along.

but I will say this that I had heard that the influence that Craig Bruby had towards roster, roster players, his overall perception of the team

was as strong as any coach in the league. So when you eliminate a Brendan Chanahan, you also put more power into Brad and chief. So if you also want to tell me that a team went from winning the Atlantic Division to where they are now and they haven't had a few disagreements, right? Think about that. Sure. Right? It's not going good. They must have

butt heads on a few things over the course of this year where where they are now. Yeah. You know who are not always good GMs or coaches? You know, like Barry Trots had a tough time making the transition when he went to Nashville. Players aren't great. You saw LeBron James over his career, try to play GM, doesn't always go great. I think it's a tough spot to be a coach and telling a GM what you think should happen. I think those things should stay very separate. What else you got for us in your little mail bag? I got to tell you a quick story.

I remember being with when I was with the Leafs coaching staff when I worked for the Marley's. Often we would be with their coaching staff in the same building. and one day Lamarillo walks by and I think it was DJ Smith someone Lamarillo's walking by Hey Lou Lou come in here come in here You gotta bring me Roman Polack Get me Roman Polack

He had been here the year before Something like that and they got rid of him He's like I gotta have someone who kills a penalty Bring me Roman Polack and say Oh yeah You know like when you're a coach And you have desires and you have wants Like that guy couldn't wait to get rid of him

Polack Yeah I know but that's what I'm saying Coaches don't really have the big pitcher in mind. What's good? You know, he was in charge of the PK. He won this guy who Pekayed. I like Polack. I mean, listen, he did too.

He ruthlessly broke his leg. Just for the record, you know, on your coaching, like you had a clip, a Kipper's Clipper on the video team. I'm not going to that. No? No. I think they're 22 and 0. If they're 20 straight.

If we're down to now giving credit to like video coach based on what we saw in the ice, we might as well, I'll just pack it in and go home. Jordan Beat and Sam, it's a great job. You guys are killing. Great job.

Hey, no one's doing a better job than them. They're hilarious. Nobody. They're hilarious. But you're doing your job. Perfectly. Lots of people doing their job imperfectly. So, like, yeah, okay, we're doing our jobs every day.

Anybody giving us, anybody doing a clip on us? No one's ever put me in perfect at the same sentence. No one's ever looked at me and said. You're 20 and, listen, it's not that hard. It's a hard. It's a hard. video you come on. No.

Come on, really. You're sitting there doing this. Two guys rewind, play, rewind, play, rewind, play, rewind, play. You got nine seconds to make it or Craig Barrube's mad at you. The thoughts of Nick Kippreyo. My God. Let's give the guys credit for doing their job. A good video coach should make a million dollars a year.

You're not blind. You get to see it 10 times. It's worth a million dollars. Of course you should get them all right. The reason the clip was so funny is because Rubei was like, well, I saw him too. He's going to give them credit to those guys. He's like, they do a good job.

He gets it. He said, I saw the kid. No, we're not playing it. I'm not playing it. Oh, God. This one's from Lee. This one's from Leafs. Oh, I'm sorry.

You were a video coach, too. I didn't do that, though. Okay, good. Could have been doing that one. I know you, this is from Lees Ried Along. I know you're gung-ho to Sell McMahon, OEL, and that you, Sammy, in parentheses, point to Boston as an example of a good pivot. But they didn't sell guys having a great ear.

Who is the equivalent of Marchand, Coil, Frederick, Carlo, on the lease? Riley, Domi, Wa, Lawton, Carlo, Joshua? Like, what's there the equivalent? Because they did trade Marchand, Coil, Frederick, Carlo. And those are guys that... Well, what they get from Marchand, like a second. Second? Yeah, but he...

He would only go to Florida. He picked... Yeah, I understand why. I'm just saying it's not like they got a huge... He would have been a first... ...asset hole. What did Edmonton get for... What did Eminton get for...

Sorry, what did they get for Frederick from Evanton? Can't remember. I don't know. I had to have been a first, right? Oh, my gosh. Don't tell me that. Trent Frederick trade. Three, it was a three-team deal.

Oh, boy. I'm not getting the answer as quick as you guys need them. Yeah. It says Peter Houser. I don't know. Peter Houser and Shane La Chances. This way of the hockey D.B. has this laid out. I don't know.

That signing was for Edmonton. A disaster. He has the type of stats that you can put together in a good game. He has 55 games played, but he's got two goals, one assist. Like, did Cooch have that last night? I don't know. I think he had one and two maybe. But I feel for Frederick because a lot of people at the time,

and I, myself included, really like Trent Frederick. I didn't like an eight-year deal, but I liked Frederick. Eight-year deal. Who else was offering him eight years? Who was offering him five? The Bruins ultimately got in that trade a second round pick and a fourth round pick and Max Wanner. So a prospect is second and a fourth. Yeah.

It's not nothing. It's okay. I take that for Bobby. It's okay. But he was considered a top nine guy. And then they got Minton and a first for Carlo. Sorry. Yeah, I don't know who else.

They did coil. They tried to coil to the line. Columbus? Columbus? Yeah, maybe you're right. So, Columbus, he's actually doing,

he's having a great year. But I, I just really hope that they do a huge sell. Like trade five guys. Like I said, I think it's the best way to get the fan base reinvigorated. And even to take your team and be like, look,

you know, we had to do something. Shake it up. Like, is there any way that, I mean, he mentioned domy in there. It doesn't feel like there's any way there.

I guess the next question is, who do you like out there? Who do you want for the Leaf? Who makes them better? Who might be available? I, I think there's a world where you, could trade for someone who has term if you're serious.

He'll trade him with hockey. I don't know. Well, like, Kyru. I don't know. What's he? Is he East and Cowan and then 2028 first? I don't know. I thought we were like no chance Cowan's going anywhere.

Well, I mean, it depends. There's a chance. Gretzky got traded. You know, there's, so you're more open up for moving Cowan this week? I'm not trying to trade Cowan. I'm saying it depends what you can get back. Okay.

Kyru for. Cowan in a first round pick in 28. Sure. No shot. No shot. No shot. No shot for me. No.

No. Okay, okay, okay. I'm just saying there might be guys. No. For middle staff. Okay. There you go. Yeah.

But I get what you're saying. You know, like there's a world where guys who have term might still be appealing to the Leafs. Cairo and Brubay isn't the best mix. No. Kyru's not. I understand. You guys are mad of me. No, we're not mad of you.

But I think that just really gives them. a chance to bury this team for a very long time. Totally. And I actually think there's a chance that very quickly Easton Cowan could be like a lot of these guys. Like is he going to be much worse than Cairo next year? I don't know. Put him in the top six for the rest of the year.

Just. Yeah. Can we just play him? Yeah. Play the hell out of it. Last 20 games. Call up all the Power Play unit. Call up Alex Nealander. Call up Bull Grohl. How about this new Hames? Who games had a had a had of the other night?

Call them all up. They had high hopes for this Hames. and I'm... Marley's bottom six, leaves top six. I'm looking for someone. Let's go. Get the race car driver, Villeneuve on the back end. The way we go.

Okay, Luke Hames, we got 22 years old, 6-1, 203 pounds. Got a dozen goals now for the Marley's. It's coming. Okay.

He's kicking down the door. Kicking down the door. Oh, leave for six. Give me a score tonight. Who cares? Come on, Sammy. Five.

Hopefully an L. Can the Leafs get five? Nothing leaves. Hopefully an L. Pitching a shell. Shut out. Okay, we didn't really talk about Stolars, but like, is it 10 or 12 nothing? He was actually awesome, I thought.

Very good. Yeah. And a sizable loss where he did get two taken off the board to help him out. He's really good goalie when he plays. Yeah. Yeah. When he plays is such a key part of that. But I thought for...

How many saves he made last night? I thought stretches that game last night reminded me the way he looked last season. Yeah. In the last game before the break, which everybody remembers so well, he was really good against the oil. But I thought he made a ton of great saves last night. He went back to his old helmet, which is fun, interesting. He changed at the start of the year, and then we went back to the old shiny bucket.

He looks a little better in there, but I don't know. Maybe they could trade him, too. Seven goals in the last eight games for Luke Hames, by the way. Just had that brought to my attention. He is kicking down the door. Hamer. Hamer. Hamsey.

Call up the Hamer. Bring in the Hamonator. All right, boys. Hamer in the door down. We're terrible. Sammy, what do we got going national? A little Ren LaVois action and some old friend Aaron Ward.

Aaron Ward. Oh, he's fun. He's a lot of fun. And Renault will give us all the scoop we need. As we get ever so closer to the trade deadline. Friday, next Friday. Yes, sir. 3 p.m. can't wait.

We will be here, presumably. All right. I think. Don't go away. Back after these words.