Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Nylander Hour

Episode Date: November 20, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee start with the Leafs' overtime win over the Wild in Sweden yesterday, the 8 AM puck drop, the success of the Global Series, Woll's stand-out start and Nylander delivering in OT again. How much of Willy's electric start has been motivated by his looming free agency? Later, more reflections from the Global Series - Mats Sundin getting friendly again with the Leafs organization, whether Klingberg might be sent to LTIR and how that would affect the team's cap space.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

let's welcome everybody in the real kipper and born show on this monday november 20th nick kiprios justin born semi mckee derrick brandeo general nick all together here and let's not forget we are live on Sportsnet 590, Sportsnet 360, and Sportsnet Plus from 4 to 6 p.m. This is the Willie Nylander, our edition of Real Kipper and Born.

The Global Series is done and over with. The Toronto Maple Leafs back home with all four points. Willie Nylander back with five points in two games. And JB, we are talking next level stuff here out of Wee Willie. Yes. Oh, Willie, with all the pressure, you know, the line was two blocks long, I guess, waiting just to shake his hand, get an autograph.

Graham is in the stands for the first time in his NHL career. Goal and two assists the first night, and then the OT winner. When he's gone, he's gone, right? And I don't even know if he was going the whole time, but he was clutch, clutch, clutch for the Leafs. So fairytale stuff. Austin's going to have to change that clip to he's going all the time. He's just going.

What time did you guys have to get here yesterday for your TV call? I was in here around 6.30. Really? Yeah. You know, I was there around 6.15, but the people who worked on the show were there like 4.30. I don't know what they do, and that sounds terrible, but there's equipment. People who do the real work or they're very very early and i do have a phobia of sleeping in on like a five alarms guy i am you know that seinfeld episode when you know he's got

that marathon and he's got like the triple backup to wake him up and he still sleeps in yeah yeah that's that's my fear always trade deadline, all those years that I worked at Sportsnet doing that hockey stuff there, it was always the fear that you're not going to be there. You made it. I am a person who is terrified of being late, so I know that feeling. I also hate being late. I woke up yesterday.

I didn't see a minute of your pregame because I woke up at like the crack of 8 a.m. Which is shocking to me. I was shocked by that too. How were you not? I didn't set an alarm. It's Sunday morning. I opened my eyes. I'm like, oh, it's a.m. Which is shocking to me. Well, I just was like. I was shocked by that, too. Like, how were you not. I just, I didn't set an alarm. It's Sunday morning. I opened my eyes. I'm like, oh, there's a hockey game on.

I got to get down to that. Is that what not having kids is like? Yes. You just wait until your body wakes up? Yes. Sometimes old Lou Dog kicks me in the leg a little bit, and I wake up. I'm like, oh, I better get up a bit. That was a first, though.

Like, to puck drop at 8 a.m. Yeah. Very weird. I've played in an 11 a.m. game in Philadelphia. I played in the minors, dude. We played all sorts of games. I can't eat pancakes. I'm sorry, but for a pregame meal.

Love that as a pregame meal. Do you? Oh, yeah. So tired of the pasta. I also, I can't nap. So I loved an afternoon game because everyone was on my level. No one got to have an extra sleep on me. I will say it was awesome to have a leaf game at 8.m right you know football well yeah i just i got up i made

a wonderful pot of coffee a little bit of breakfast got the feet up watching hockey it's game time and then let's get hungry and then straight straight into football i was on the couch from legitimately 8 a.m to 8 p.m yesterday oh wow yeah i watched football until i watched the great cop i was all in everything well i think it gives you some idea of uh at least the commitment they have to say what i am that's a given i don't have to i don't have to make note of that you know but i i think uh you know we'll get into the Leafs, of course, momentarily here. But it gives you some idea of the importance that the league has now to go find new revenue. Because this is what Sweden's all about. And they're like, well, why are we going there?

And it's already popular there. But there's broadcast rights. There's streaming rights. There's potential. You say you want to sell those things to Sweden. Continually. And then grow it. And 20 years ago in my era, the owners would never have agreed to this.

They would have said, what are we, nuts? Why are we giving up a gate? Why are we making people get up at 8 a.m. to watch our product? I'm not giving up a night of selling beers, which essentially Detroitroit and i guess minnesota those might have been the home teams yeah they needed to give up their gates so but this is at least we're giving up a gate underrated story from this whole thing is like you know i know the hockey operations guy for the least is brad lynn i don't know if it was him who did the

negotiating but they were the ultimate victors out of this whole scheduling thing. Like they had two teams that were both on back-to-backs, which they drew. And then they come back and they don't play again until Friday. Detroit plays in two days. They play on Wednesday night. New Jersey's coming to town. So Detroit went there, had to play on the wrong end of a back-to-back,

comes home and has to play one of the best teams in the NHL. The Leafs just like, we're not doing it unless everything's in our favor. I'm sure Darren McCarty's radio show is a little different about the Swedish trip. Why wouldn't the Leafs play that hand, right? It's like, oh, hold on, you want us there? Okay, here's our list. Here's our list. No back-to-back games.

We get a night off, and we don't have to play until the end of the week. And to their credit, they took advantage of those teams and those spots and got their points. So they flew home right after the game. I imagine they're all pulling a Sammy now and sleeping in still. Yeah. They may not see the rink for a few days.

I don't think they'll see the rink tomorrow. And then it gets kind of like a little goofy. You're not going to practice tomorrow? Maybe. I don't think they'll see the rink tomorrow. And then it gets kind of like a little goofy. They're not going to practice tomorrow? Maybe. I don't know. Maybe you need two days off. Maybe come to the rink and at least, you know, talk about video. I'm not sure I would.

Go over a few things. I'd put a hard practice together tomorrow. Might be an optional. If you want to bring them in. They will, yeah. The only thing that's, you know, that 2 o'clock on the road friday which is a thanksgiving thing i would imagine black friday yep so yeah we had no leafs games last week there's no leaf game till friday again and there's no nhl games tuesday night or thursday night this week very strange

nhl schedule for the middle of descent or november any raptors takes or yeah what do you think boy that zach wilson didn't look very good for the jets yesterday oh let's not talk about that all right let's go to our first uh kippers clipper of the week with sheldon keith talking about uh the global series it's a fitting end to the week for sure for us for willie for the fans the the country, all that kind of stuff. I think it's a terrific close to the event. So terrific how it works out. I, of course, would prefer that we didn't get to the overtime. But if that's what we had to do to have a finish like that, we'll take it.

So I actually don't think if you gave Sheldon Keith the old truth serum, he would have thought they played very well in either game. But, you know, I don't think he wants to pour cold water on the trip or the experience for anyone. Listen, we did the game on Sunday, and we broke the game down pretty much the way we saw it. We saw some good things. We saw some things that we still didn't like.

There's a long way to go for this hockey club. The good news is that they're getting points right now, which is hard for some other clubs to do. And all I saw was a weekend that bought them some time until figuring out a few things. For sure. Yeah, the Joseph Wohl experience was unbelievable. I thought that was one of his better games.

He's now up to fifth in goals to expected goals, you know, like the SportLogic rating there. 909, say, percentage. He looked really good on, and that's a bright sign. And we talked on Friday before you left to do some TV. And Gord Stelic, by the way, did a fantastic job. He did a really good job. Really good job.

The conversation with Doug McClain was potentially the most off the rails. Oh, really? It was amazing. Well, he got jealous because they had a book off. They have books out now. So they had a book off on Friday. Real book off. Any James Patterson references? Yeah. Jeff Rimmer out now. So they had a book off on Friday. Real book off. Any James Patterson references?

Yeah. Yeah. Jeff Rimmer chirp. Yeah. It was the whole experience. Yeah. Yeah. Go download that pod on Friday if you missed Doug McClain's Off the Rails.

So just getting us back on the rails here, when it comes to the goaltending, we had a little bit of a, you know, different look at who should have started sunday and uh i said samsonov you wanted wall you want according to sheldon it when it wasn't that i thought he would be better than samson off at all that that you know is a good sign for the leafs but it is going to be interesting to see if they see it as a 50 50 split now you know based on the performance of the two guys, I think you wanted Samsonov to be the guy to play more, and Wohl is playing significantly better.

You balance that out, they're probably a 50-50 split at this point. Yeah. And to me, I'll stand by the fact that I think that, as I shut my phone off. Silent. Silent. You got to still kind of lean towards samsonov being the number one goalie what does that mean does that mean you still try to get him to 47 50 52 starts i don't know that's it's going too far

in the other direction there for me and you're not ready to do that just yet. It just hasn't been good. He's been good the last couple of weeks. So I think it was the Raymond goal on Friday where I didn't like that goal. But I can tell you that it wasn't followed up with another bad goal. It was not. If he can just kind of cut it off on on one bad goal and then just look like the guy that we saw a lot last year yeah then the

Leafs have one less thing to worry about well and I think it's impossible to look at Samson off and not recognize he was a big reason why you just got by the Tampa Bay Lightning the year before yeah I would say that I hate how much the goaltending has been a conversation so far this season you wouldn't say you do i know i hate it oh you do hate it yeah i do because it's just you know when you're you have a goalie yeah that's a starting goalie you just want him to be you just it's something that like i don't say what you will about frederick anderson when he was here but he was just the starting goalie and he was the goalie that started the games and you put him in there and he was good yeah he wasn't good he still played

yeah you'd come in some days and you'd be like oh yeah the other guy's one yeah surprised it'd be just the guy it just to me it's been so up and down already right like the samsonov experience it feels like it's been a full season of him being tumultuous with him yeah and it's november 20th wall has been the best goalie in the league and he's been back down it just feels being it's being tumultuous with him yeah and it's november 20th wall has been the best goalie in the league and he's been back down it just feels like it's been so up and down to me for sure and i hate that with goaltending that's the opposite of what you want to feel about your goaltending you want it to be consistent and quiet some things uh something's like they're gonna have to implode for brad tree living now to think outside the box here moving forward.

This is it. These are their guys. It has to be, don't you think? And the only thing that you can do now is focus on insulating them. That's your focus here. This is who they are. And you work with them like you just said. Sammy showed you he can win a round.

You know, and I do think that they're both paid so little compared to most goalie tandems around the NHL that you're right, you don't want to spend assets or cap space trying to improve a position that's probably about league average for them. And I think this is pretty much where the league is headed, that you try to win with Grubauer. Yeah. You try to win with a Hill. You try to win with a Grubauer. Yeah.

Right? You try to win with a Hill. You try to win with a Binnington. Did not see goalies becoming NFL running backs where it's like, yeah, ours is as good as the next one. And they are. And they are. And just worry about the blue line and worry about big guys protecting them

and just make the saves that you're supposed to. And don't stand on your head and steal every game that we need. I think there's something to be said about, it's not that those positions have been devalued, it's that the people got so good at that position that there just doesn't seem like there's that much better, you can't get much better than 93% save percentage. They became less predictable too.

It's just such a crapshoot. More predictable goalies. I think, no, to pay them high end. Oh, yeah. To pay them high end. To know that you're going to get that kind of performance. That you're going to get that level. Yes. They've become less predictable.

There's some that, you know, look how long it took Bobrovsky to show full value on 10 million. Who's got three years to wait? Yeah. No, you're right. And they would have got probably rid of that contract if they could have a lot earlier, but they didn't, and good on them. It finally paid off last season.

And any of these guys can get hot at any time, so Samsonov can get hot or Wolk can get hot just as easy as the next guy. And if you're going to be spending the, I mean, we had Bucala on last week and talking about the assets that the Leafs have to play with. If you're going to be spending those assets, is it goaltending that you want to address?

Well, that's it. If you go get John Gibson, are you sure he's better than Samson? Well, the guy that you would be talking about and that's been rumored already is Soros, right? Like Oilers, it's been rumored. And like, that's the guy that's kind of been talking. If you're going to do that, maybe.

But his numbers haven't been great this year. You're just not sure. I'm sure on him. I'm sure he's better than the Leafs goal. I'm sure about that. But I'm not sure how much better the performance is. Listen, we'll fix the Oilers in the next hour on our national show. Don't worry.

That's a very hot button topic. Every shot going in the net needs to our national show. Don't worry. That's a very hot-button topic. Every shot going in the net needs to stop? Every shot goes in. Fair enough. All right, I teed this hour up as the Willie Nylander hour, so let's go to Sheldon Keefe on Willie. I just think he's got such confidence and swagger here now that he's just feeling like he can turn the game at any point in time

um so i think that's just the biggest thing you know i don't think he would look at these two games and say that he played his best hockey but he he stepped up in big moments and uh you know uh was a huge part of why we got four points here. And with all that said, like, I mean, a great opportunity for Willie, you know, to come here and play, you know, in his home city and country. But he had a full plate when he was here. I mean, more so than probably anybody that was here from the entire of the four teams. The obligations that he had, that he filled. So to be able to do that, still spend time with his family,

and still put on a show on the ice, and make the impact that he did is tremendous. And thrilled for him. Hey, important Willie conversation. Did you see the clip of him on that Swedish talk show in just a undershirt? And the old Swedish lady, like, grabbing his shoulders and being like, you're a nicely developed boy. I believe she called him a groovy dude.

A groovy dude. It's like, you know, a groovy man, maybe. And he was like, you know. I just assumed it was like 90 degrees out there. I don't know. It looked like Willie was having a bit of a Me Too moment. Like, easy. The same shirt as the female host he was wearing.

Was he really? Exactly. What a vibe that show had. Listen, you're what? A couple of points from leading the league in scoring? Oh, he's a groovy dude. You can pull anything off like that. Oh, yeah.

And he seemed to embrace it. Like, he didn't seem uncomfortable. He didn't seem like he's just. The best part of that clip is them flashing to Yarncroft and Klingberg. Who are sitting in the front row. I've never seen two guys laughing so hard. Like, can you just imagine that? Like, you are two guys who play for the Leafs,

and, like, you're clearly stars there, like, Yaron Kroc and Klingberbu, well-known guys. But, like, William Nylander is Otani there right now. Like, he is on another level, and they're just sitting in the front row. But how does him dressing like that come to fruition? How does it happen? That, you know, Luke Fox asks a lot of great questions,

but my first question would have been how did you decide on that wardrobe for the talk show willy yeah just the first thing i grabbed out of the drawer just out of shirts i've been at too many events yes here's what we got left i didn't pack everything's in the dry cleaners this is it we flew across the world i didn't bring my whole wardrobe he is right now as close to as an untouchable as there is right now like there is not even a thought of trading willie not even trading envisioning the leafs without willie right now no one wants anything to do with it and i know you know you hate me because maybe a week ago 10 days ago i I brought up the money.

And you can't talk Willie right now without talking money. I got a newsflash for you. And you hate that. This is like my biggest hobby horse. And I know people probably get so sick of hearing me say this. No, no, no. You represent a portion of the audience. I loved those two games with him scoring the tying goal against Detroit,

him scoring the winning goal, like in front of his family, Michael and Neil are going nuts. Family's loving it. And it's just, I just know that the enjoyment level of it is not nearly as high as it should be because it's all surrounded by this conversation of him getting paid, what he's going to get paid, is he going to stay? It's just like there's no other sport that this would be a conversation.

If this guy played for the Boston Celtics, it's just max contract. If this guy was playing for the Buffalo Bills, here's $400 million. If he's on the Blue Jays, well, maybe not the Blue Jays. Per Strings is a little tighter there. Maybe if he's on the Dodgers,

here's $300 million. If it's a Leaf fan for you, it's the fear that he might leave no no it's that every time he has success it's it's correlated to a negative for the league yes so he has success and you're supposed to feel as a leafs fan that's a bad thing that he's succeeding i'm almost cringing every time he has an amazing play because i'm like oh oh, God, there's another 250K. And that's the opposite of the fan experience where you're like, our guy did great, now it's like, oh, but that sucks for us. Like, that's a bad spot. Yeah, I believe that he's going to sign and they're just going to figure it out.

I think that's probably the way to do it. And there's just a, even if the window is between 10 and 12, there's a a, even if the window is between 10 and 12, there's a number there. And, yeah, it might, some might argue that he's not worth 11 or 11.25 now, but I think he's firmly entrenched in being a top 10 player in the league. Yeah. I think there's, well, there's a lot of good players. When you start listing them, it gets hard.

Let's do top 10 forwards. Sure. Yes. Same thing. I think there's, well, there's a lot of good players when you start listing them. Let's do top 10 forwards. Sure. Yes. Same thing. I think there's enough really good players. So the same thing. Top 10 players in the league

versus top 10 forwards are two very good conversations. Sure. When you look at the top 10 paid, he fits in there. How's that? Yes. That's fair.

Okay. We can have that conversation. Yes. Yep. Right? We can all judge, oh, no, no, he's no good. He's better. He's okay we can have that conversation yes yep right we can all judge oh no no he's no good he's better he's more consistent he's not but when it comes to top 10 paid guys

there is an argument today that he fits somewhere between austin matthews and um and mitch marner who would be at the bottom end at 10.9. Yeah, and I think that's fair. But I do think there's enough elite players in the NHL who have recently signed deals. Like Matthew Kachuk last year signed 9.5. Yeah. Eight times 9.5. Sebastian Aho in Carolina.

Nine. Is he a nine even? Very good player. You know, there's enough really good players that I agree that he's probably in that 11 range or whatever. But you can point to these other guys and go, we'll give you the extra year. I'm not asking you to be in the nine. But let's say you're 10.7 or whatever it is.

Anyway. Yeah, but it's not going away. My whole point is that it doesn't go away. And the owners wanted a salary cap. I think that it took maybe the fans 10 or 15 years to truly understand how it can work against you, against your team, and nobody should like it. Other than the owners, it completely sucks for everybody else, including the Leafs.

As an ownership group, you don't want to see them go out the door. You'd gladly, in an open market, give 14 15 million bucks compare yeah as as a as a drawing card well i look at the nba and it's like you know it's a hard thing to compare because they just you know tv deals there's so much more money involved there's 12 guys on the bench and you're making the same revenue but like let's just say i don't know who the equivalent equivalent of a William Nylander is in the NBA, but there's a lot of really great players in the NBA that make obscene amounts of money. Yeah. And it's not really talked about.

Like, it's not like a conversation. People are like, Oh, I want to play by LeBron, but God, he's making a lot versus the cap. It's like,

I know. I know. It's not a conversation. It doesn't, nobody cares as long as it doesn't affect your team. Yes. As long as it doesn't hurt my chances, I think of winning.

You're on the same page. At the end of the day, if the owner overspent and that's your problem. Right. Not my problem. But when it means you have to start sending our guys away because you overspent, now it's a story for the fans.

Correct. Which is why we talk about it, which is why it sucks, which is why you're both right. But I would argue that the Leafs haven't really overspent. They've just had the bad fortune of having great players that are worth a lot of money. And you can't do it. No, they overspent.

On Tavares? But let's say you want to shave a million and a half off all these guys. Overspent on who? Yeah, they overspent. I think the Tavares, they could have probably had Matthews and Marner tied up around the tens and didn't have to catapult over Tavares.

Sure. But even if you shave off, you give all these guys a haircut and you have three million extra dollars, you don't suddenly have Willie Nylander here. They're tight because they have good players. Your product, it's like this cap situation. Hold on for a second.

Maybe $3 or $4 million could be a really good defenseman. Yeah. So it does matter. It does matter. Well, I know, and that's why my defense of them, that the cap should have gone up this $3 or $4 million, and then they'd have a really good defenseman, wouldn't have to trade one of these guys, I think holds water.

It does matter a bit in terms of making your overall team better, for sure. But it just, it does suck to say, I wish we had less good players. That's the only way to fit under the cap. Yeah. And next year, we're really just talking about next year, because this is the last one off of Tavares' $11 million. And then it should open up. Which is why they can't trade Marner or Nylander. Next year.

Next year's... We don't know what's going to happen. They could go on a run and they could end up in a conference final or a Stanley Cup final. They can get knocked out in the first round again. Right. And then you've got to come back next year to what? A new Nylander $11.5 million contract,

plus Tavares at 11, plus Mitch Marner in his last year, 10-9, and Matthews kicking in in his new contract at 13-5. You have to figure out this next season, Kip, though, because after that, you're talking about two cap raises. Maybe you're up about two cap raises maybe you're up to 90 or something by then tavarez is off the books 88 next year 88 next year yes and then the year after that you're looking at 92 or whatever the number may be maybe tavarez is off the books if you still have matthews marner and nylander you're still in a really you're suddenly

in a very good spot but if you move one of them and all of a sudden tavarez is is off the books and you just got two stars, you're every other team in the league. I think my point is them overspending. Maybe they overspend a little bit on their stars, but they don't have any of these anchor contracts that some of these other teams have. You know what I mean? There's no Josh Anderson contract or these other contracts around the league that are hampering their teams.

Morgan Riley's on a pretty good deal now. That that contract looks pretty smart to 15 points in 17 games yeah like that number looks pretty great at the moment you know you don't have any your goalies aren't locked in long term for a huge bad number like they're in a pretty good spot they are as long as they have too many good players they can't keep them as long as you can replace what you have with someone else that's pretty good like that's just it's it's great to sit here sam and say hey you know what we haven't committed to a lot of things but go out and and replace those guys now and are you going to be better or worse for it yeah that's the trick yep no you're 100 right but i just mean anyways you look you look down at their cap picture,

and some teams are like, oh, my God, that's a nightmare. And I look at the Leafs, and I'm like, wow, they got some good players under contract and Kampf and Jaren Kroc, and that's pretty much it. So you got to replace them. But, hey, I get this tweet a lot, and I've been getting this text already. Get your opinion on this. Like, how much of this is the contract here?

For Willie? I think it's a legitimate question. Because I get that tweet, and I got this text four or five times already on the text line. I think what's important to note about Willie is that it's never been a doubt when he's motivated, he's an elite player. And so, yeah, there is a vibe that maybe some percentage of it is timing,

that he's hit his career prime at the same time as his motivations peak he's just in sweden it would not shock me to see him tail off a little bit now home from sweden where's the envision him signing an 11 million dollar contract and then where's the tail off moving forward, I think, is the bigger question, JB. Yeah. When he originally sat out for three months to get his 6.9, he came back in and there were a lot of people upset. He was awful when he came back. Overpaid.

And he stunk for a year and a half. He was not good. And there was a lot of pressure because of that contract. What had happened when Matthews and Marner jumped over him, it was just a foregone conclusion that Willie's Willie and the pressure's on Matthews and Marner. And Willie can kind of find his way as the third guy or even the fourth guy if you have Tavares in there.

Pretty chill. his way as the third guy or even the fourth guy if you have Tavares in there pretty chill and it was there was less pressure on him when there when he when he played one out of four games really well and if he had lulls that for two or three games there wasn't a ton of heat on him now after everything he's experienced about the taste of consistency out of the Leaf fans now to match an 11, he doesn't have that same luxury moving forward to have nights off. And that's the question. Are you going to get the Willie that you have Willie now or the Willie that we've seen hot and cold the last four or five years?

The other part of this is, you know, remembering Willie in playoffs, do you even care if you get mediocre Willie at times, if you believe he can do it when he's motivated and he's motivated in playoffs? If it seems important to him to win in playoffs, do you just go, if we can get the motivated version when it counts, we'll take it? Listen, I...

At 11 mil, though, that's a tougher... He has been better than actually the perception was willie's been better the last few years than even matthews and marner in the playoffs yeah but i mean matthew's not exactly justin williams here either you know for for one round uh win in six tries yeah these are more unbelievable in the first round last year they were people and disappeared in a second 100 no question and Marner were unbelievable in the first round last year. They were. People overlooked that. Disappeared in a second.

100%. No question. They were really good in the first round. So basically it's just, will you get this type of willing moving forward for the next eight years on a commitment of close to $90 million? That's a legitimate question. It's scary.

There's no question it's scary. Because I think if last year didn't happen, that's that's a legitimate question scary there's no question it's scary because i i think if last year didn't happen it would be scarier but to me he was really really good last year too and i think and i think he's just taking a step i think he's gotten better every single year he's been in the nhl yeah you know what though an eight-year contract takes you to 2032 what's the salary cap in 2030 you know is it 110 do you care if he's a 10 million or 10 and a half there like i i know it always matters in the nhl but i as much as i worry about his motivation his performance towards the end of it if the cap's high enough you can

live with a guy and i would think i would think willie is smart enough to understand that a new contract of that magnitude would, he should have a really good idea of the expectations from him moving forward. Any chance he would take or sign a Matthews-type contract where he would sign for three or four years or something? That'd be ideal for me. Yeah? Are you sure?

Yeah. At least you'd get motivatedie again in a few years i think he says my one big shot show me the money give me that whole spiel i'm looking at 88 and 90 plus million i want it now yeah yeah how many times is he gonna be fifth in league he he does have he does have a personality where where ryan o'reilly can come here look around and go it ain't for me and then there's willie writing the ttc and it's like it seems to be a fit here well there's a certain clip about that number five keith talking about william neilander in that in that fashion would you like to hear it i'd like to okay i just think he's unflappable that's really it you know whether it's you know the the spotlight and playing in toronto and the media and all the different

things that come with being a maple leaf i don't think that phases him in fact i think he loves it and enjoys it uh likes it that way um you know, he lives here in Sweden's biggest city, and you can see he's a bit of a rock star here. We learned that. You know, he just enjoys that, and he's not bothered by it. I think he also, he's a guy that's really pretty much spent his life in the NHL, right, as the son of an NHLer. So I think he knows exactly what it means to be an NHLer,

to give back to the game and to be in a locker room and be around a team and to be with fans and all these kind of things. He's been around it his entire life. So I think all that sort of stuff he was built for. See, that's why he leads the Kippers-Clippers-Sheldon because every once in a while we're on the same page. That's a really thoughtful answer to what makes Willie Willie. I love the top 10 in league scoring right now.

So weird. I was looking at it. It's really weird. The three Canucks are tied with 28 points, Miller, Pedersen, and Hughes. And after that, it's Kucherov, Nylander, Pasternak, Panarin. There's Kael McCarr and Rantanen. Like, it's a great list of people who are all

paid pretty well. Sam Reinhardt up there. I did skip over Sam Reinhardt because he didn't fit the bill. But still, I mean, that shows you how good a player... I would like... So, I have a Nylander clip here, guys, and I just cut it because it's hilarious. We're talking about, like, this huge spotlight. Scores a game-winning goal in his hometown in front of his whole family playing for the leafs and this is how excited he was uh dare could we get the can we get that clip of him

scoring the ot winner i mean it was uh pretty special for sure to get that uh ot winner there but um yeah i mean it was a great two or four points for us here and uh hopefully you bring that uh on the way back home. Unflappable? But you just had a lifetime. Maybe he's a sociopath. That's not even a normal response. His thought is, what's the shortest answer I can give you and get the heck out of here?

For sure. Which is great. He just had a movie moment. If they wrote that in a movie, you would be like, that's way too far-fetched. That's a corny ending. No way anyone would ever believe that in a movie you would be like that's way too far-fetched that's a corny ending no way anyone would ever believe that he's like yeah it's pretty special we got two or four points i don't know how many let's go if i were neilander i would have talked to so many people after that trip like i feel like i'd go sit under a blanket and hide

for like a week i would be emotionally exhausted he must just be so tired oh yeah of talking and hearing his own name and saying thanks you think this trip at all uh affects them like you're kind of mentioning a little bit or you think they're yeah i don't i can't see it won't be uh helping a blip i i just think it's really hard to like get back into the swing of things everyone else is playing steady games and normal rest and normal schedule. I think it's possible that, I don't think they're going to lose a bunch, but it'll be interesting to see how they come out. Do we have Sheldon on that too?

Did we have a clip about him? The effect of the season this trip? I think it's clip number three. We do that. In terms of how it affects the season, I mean, time will tell. We're going to do all that we can to manage it here when we get back home. Like I had sort of alluded to before we got here, I've talked to different coaches that have been through this experience before

and different people. Guy Boucher, his head coach, has been through something like this before. And teams haven't always responded well. It's taken time to dig out of it. So it's going to be on us to manage that here now. So, you know, in terms of the impact on our season and on our schedule, that remains to be seen, how we get back home and deal with it.

But in terms of the experience itself. They do, fortunately, come out of the gates. They get the Blackhawks so that's helpful i mean they lost them earlier this year but another weird start time 2 p.m which is very strange like we get us looking forward to a 7 p.m puck drop so it's just chicago and pittsburgh back to back yep friday saturday and then they return home yeah and they return home uh to play i believe the panthers on Tuesday. Next Tuesday night.

Florida, Seattle, Boston next week. There's a Saturday night Boston Bruins game. Oh, baby. Love that. That should be fun. Rivalry week. I wonder if they'll put Reeves in for that game to go chase Marshawn around. By the way, I think Reeves is going to play next game. Yeah, probably.

I just, you know, you can't sit him out forever. All right. We'll pick up on that. Plus, we'll talk a little bit of the Leaf Blue line. Klingberg. Oh, yeah. What will happen to John short-term and long-term? That and more when we return after the break.

You're watching and listening to Real Kipper and Bourne. Breaking down the top stories in hockey and Elliott Friedman every day. The Jeff Merrick Show. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. down the top stories in hockey and elliot friedman every day the jeff merrick show subscribe and download the show on apple spotify or wherever you get your podcasts nick caprios justin bourne Sammy McKee. Toronto Maple Leafs have ample time, as we do. We should take time off when the Leafs are off. Think so? Yeah.

I'll propose that to the bosses. See how that goes. There's no games. What do you want to listen to us for? You know, I can't answer that question, but I don't argue. I just show up. Sammy would show up anyways. What?

I would? Just be here talking about Matt Sundin. The jersey behind me, by the way, today is a beautiful Sundin kit. Thank you, yeah. Yes. Yeah, he looked like he really enjoyed the moments. The spelling of Matthews by like, I don't know, a dozen guys. Yeah.

And then they turned it to Matt. Turned it to Matt for a picture. That was really cool. Yeah. He had the turned it to Matz. Turned it to Matz for a picture. That was really cool. Yeah. He had the big thumbs up in the picture. He looked happy. Now, a little speculation about Matz, you think? Well, I saw some people talk about him.

You know, you see Alfredson going with the Sens. I mean, it's a pretty easy parallel to draw. No, it's not. Well, same era. Yeah. You know, for Matz, it's not an easy parallel. That's the only parallel you can draw. One guy lives in Ottawa.

You know Matt Sundin. And the other guy lives in Stockholm. I know you know, but like for the outsider, you know, famous guy from that same era with his team. Yes. Famous guy from the same era with the Leafs. I would also say that I think it's well understood in all hockey circles that Jerome McGinley is

literally just waiting for his kids to grow up and then he's going to have whatever job he wants at the Flames. That's an understanding. His son is lighting up the dub right now. I think it would be great to see Matt involved more, but I don't think right now with his young kids and his family

it's not high on his priority list. Okay. But it'll eventually be high on his priority list. If you're Mats, you'd have to come back and move here. How else can you be involved? No, you can't. You're not going to be me.

Well, Cronwall does some stuff for the Red Wings. Yeah, he could be like a scout or something. He's like the European coordinator. They were talking about it on the broadcast that he does like some stuff over the Red Wings Yeah you could be like a scout or something He's like the European coordinator They were talking about it on the broadcast That he does like some stuff over there A lot of times these old guys are like Just give him a picker title We'll pay you

Be involved You think Mats wants to be a scout in Europe? No Go to buildings No chance Come on No way Stop it

You're right Draw a check and be involved in some way People like money Draw a check. You don't think people like money? This guy, he's made $100 million. He doesn't need any more. I know some $100 millionaires who like money. To become a scout?

No, not to make scout money, no. Good point there. Really good point. He'd have enough to buy khaki slacks and a black vest so he could look like a scout. No, you have to get a tucked-in golf shirt to your khakis. That's the mandatory scout outfit. I'm best over it. Before the two games in Sweden, there was some talk with Klingberg

that he may play, he may not play, but really coming out of Stockholm, there's a real sense that, you know, there's a bigger concern here moving forward. Now I think our Luke Fox may have had some quotes about him dealing with whatever he's dealing with. And it just, it didn't, it didn't sound like he sounded very optimistic. I believe it was Brad May who once said, well, it's not good. You know, like this is, you had a, you know,

you talked about Klingberg and the ltir the next day klingberg played for the leafs and then after that he just couldn't and this sweden thing let's not forget a big name in sweden right the klingberg has had a lot of nhl success and he didn't even have the chance to play in the game let alone alone practice over there. I think the quote you saw was from Sheldon Keefe. He was concerned that John Klingberg's injury could linger a little while, and he said, yeah, it's certainly getting to that place.

There's no quote from actually Klingberg in this piece that I'm reading right now. Listen, as long as long-term injury reserve is out there and teams continue to use it it has to be a viable option if he is not healthy it has to be the thing that stands out to me and i mentioned this to you before the show is like for the leafs to be able to then use that money for them to be able to go spend the 4.1 million that's going on LTIR he can't be coming back at any time you know you can't go replace Klingberg with that money and then in March he's ready to go and you

don't have room for him so it either for the Leafs yeah he may go LTIR but that really handcuffs them because they can't spend that money the only way you're absolutely right. The only way this can help the Leafs alleviate the cap spaces is if he's done for the year. Unless he wants to come back a la Kane, Kucharov, whatever. No, it has to be a Muzzin scenario. Right, but I'm saying maybe he's ready for playoffs and he's available at that point, but, you know. Maybe.

Yeah, but yes, he would have to be done for, and that would mean surgery again for that to be the case. So he's not just going to like rehab for six months. Yeah, it could happen. He could rehab. You think so? Well, would that be rehab? Well, listen, wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

I don't know. Just tell us when you feel like you can play. And if you can't play at 65 or 70 and guys with bad backs or, you know, he's had two hip surgeries, what's going on there? Whatever the case is, you can avoid surgery and go through a strict rehabilitation and maybe get to the point where you can be a lot more successful at 85 or 90% than the 60 you're at now.

So if I'm not mistaken, he's already missed and people, and this will drive fans from other teams, nuts and other teams nuts too. But we've seen this scenario already in the national hockey league. What, what the Leafs are any different. Other teams have used L long-term to their benefit.

Oh, yeah. Vegas, our Stanley Cup champions, Vegas. Vegas was actually... What do you think, the Lightning aren't? I think Vegas was maybe the most untold story of that. Didn't they end up having three guys, Shea, Theodore, Eichel, and someone else came back. Stone came back after the season, right?

Yeah. Yes. Which is insane. Those are three quite important players to their Stanley Cup win, I would say. Having those players not count towards your cap would be handy. So, sure. They are well within their rights to do so if you can convince him that this is not a short-term LTIR. This is really emphasizing that L in the TIR.

Do you think he's gonna play again ever for the least listen it's it's they don't know he doesn't know whatever's going on they need answers first that's a medical thing that's uh uh what course of action do we have to to to move forward. There's no way anybody would just be guessing right now on Klingberg's future, including John himself. Yeah. The sooner they can get those answers, the better, though. Yeah, I don't think they're coming.

Me, I don't believe that they could come, you know, in the next day or two. No. I think this is one of those, whatever we're doing now, we're probably going to have to wait maybe another week or two no i think this is one of those whatever we're doing now we're probably gonna have to wait maybe another week or two to see whatever is bothering settle down yeah and see if we can build it back up and in the interim trans transatlantic flight didn't help anything yeah that it is frustrating you know seeing an organization with all their resources. I guess you have to bring them to Sweden.

So maybe I shouldn't critique that then. But that's disappointing to see a guy had something he's struggling with hurt by the travel. Also on Friday, I would expect they'd get Conor Timmons back. Yeah, I think they're excited about that too. Well, I mean, he had a good training camp. Yeah, he looked really good. well i mean he had a good training camp yeah he looked really good i know everybody has a good training right it's a different sort of environment but yeah i mean they have had benoit and lagasin eating plenty of minutes so if they can use

timmons for 18 or 16 or whatever that would be very nice. Okay, not 18. That was a lot. 18's high. 18's high. What'd you make of the ice times on Saturday? On Sunday morning. To note, yeah, Nick Robertson and who else? McMahon, both under eight minutes. And so, oh, Domi too. Domi under eight minutes as well. Yeah, I saw that.

Thoughts on that? Yeah, in a perfect world, you want to trend the other way sure and the one thing that's been constant is either one night it's the matthews and marner show and one night it's neil lander and tavara's show and it appears that it has to kind of continue until you find some real consistency on some balanced attack from everyone else. You guys know, I haven't loved that third line, even though they have contributed and helped them win some games.

I haven't loved that line. I think what was happening against Minnesota is Evason, you know, Dean Evason, his name is on the other side, was targeting that line. Like he was trying to get their best line out against that line because they would get hemmed in in the Leafs' zone

and they were on for a goal against, and Sheldon kind of just said no more and played the big dogs the rest of the way. And where did the big dogs leave on ice time on Sunday? Matthews was 21-18. Willie was 23-09. Wow. Marner, 20-51.

And Tavares was 19-07. For a game that goes to morgan was 2603 yeah morgan's average on the year is now 25 minutes and we were talking before see i just i just think it's just way too heavy all right look at their decor they they got injuries i'm not sure struggling i'm not sure awesome there are some like, just complete horses that can handle. I want horses back there. I do. I always want the horses back there. Well, he's been there.

They can handle. But Morgan, to me, doesn't have the body type or the makeup to consistently be a 26, 28 guy. Some guys are. If he kept doing this, it would affect him because he's been doing it. I do worry about, like, you worry about overtaxing Morgan. Get Morgan ready again. And I know last year there was a lot of question marks about Morgan's regular season. And then he became the player that everybody envisioned in the playoffs.

That blue line has already been taxed. Right? The injuries. Yes. Lilligren. Timmons not being there the depth uh uh geo we talked about geo sunday morning i tipped my hat off to that guy because 19 something on sunday again another 19 20 minutes here which is okay for now and i i get it sheldon i get it man what else are you gonna do you're trying to win a hockey game.

But you just don't need that in November piling on. It's just so hard. Go ahead, man. I was just going to say Morgan Riley is eighth in the league in average ice time behind Darlene Yossi, Miro Heiskanen, Seth Jones, Travis Sanheim, Drew Doughty, and John Carlson. The guys in front of him. You know, he's playing the tough matchups he's leading the team in plus minus him and brody are up there you know playing a lot of minutes 24 46

is his actual number but you look at that rest that core and it's like okay we can't do legas and benoit much you've questioned mccabe at times his ability to eat real minutes coming off and a little better now yeah and then you got Brody and Giordano, your other guys. You know, like someone has to play this minute. So I see that it's a decor criticism that they need some help for more. Depth. Yeah. You got to alleviate those minutes.

The other thing I really liked Sunday was Nye's goal. It started 200 feet. You had talked about McCabe starting that one. All five guys from one end to the other touched the puck. I said that on Leafs talk after the game that Kipper was going to love that goal because it was a great passing goal and the Leafs don't pass. I don't know if you saw the board that was up at intermission that Kip, you know, our producer David Azuma had a great board on the Leafs

passing the offensive zone. And he found that board based on listening to our show a couple of weeks ago. And so he did some digging into it. And in the offensive zone, the Leafs were like, hey, whatever. There's three different categories, and they were 28th, 29th, and 31st in Ozone passes. Yeah. You wouldn't really thought that.

No, but, you know, you would have because you observed you know they got a bunch of shooters and so it's interesting robertson is a guy who shoots and gregor likes to shoot it and obviously matthews and willie and tavarez like to shoot it a lot of shooters on the leaf so when you do move it around a bit more opens up some lanes for some of these great shooters and so yeah and geo getting on his horse to uh drive the lane yeah it was a nice uh that that's the type of goal you think with that type of talent we should see a few more of yeah maybe geo you know old guys do their best work at 8 a.m maybe he knew it was maybe his body his body

clock is like 100 what it is he's like oh i feel really good right now it's 8 a.m let's go take 40 more games what time's your old guy we'll give him his geritol and we'll put him to bed's 8 a.m. Let's go. Take 40 more games at 8 a.m. What time's your old guy skate at? We'll give him his Geritol and we'll put him to bed by 10 p.m. What time's your old guy skate at? Oh, 8.30. Oh, there you go. The boys are... There's a theory. There's a theory. I'm definitely going to be a you know, the kids miss the best part of the day

at a 10 a.m. guy. I feel it coming. It's quite the willy hour. And now we go national. Gary Galley's going gonna join us and we're gonna get into the edmonton oilers and who believes they can still make the playoffs and who doesn't we'll get those answers after the break more real kipper and born don't go away