Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Oil-Country Clash

Episode Date: January 16, 2024

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee start with a look at tonight's matchup for the Leafs against the Oilers - Matthews going head-to-head with McDavid after falling flat against MacKinnon, Keefe returning to a more familiar lineup and Martin Jones getting the nod. Then a conversation about Leafs & Oilers goaltending, whether Skinner can keep up his hot stretch or if Woll is truly a safe option when he returns from injury. Later, they key in on the Oilers - the evolution of Zach Hyman, how much he's been missed in Leafs Land and Kane's ice time decreasing under Knoblauch.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's get her going the real kipper and born show nick kiprios justin born sammy mckee derek brandeo jen roll nick with you all for the next two hours this is our leaf edition of the show but no matter where you are where you're listening and watching sports at 590 sports atnet 360, Sportsnet Plus, and now on our YouTube channel, for those of you that cannot catch us live, that is always an option worldwide.

And we have some loyal watchers. All over the globe? On YouTube. Thank you, Iceland. Yes. And South Africa. We appreciate the support. Alaska. We do have Alaskan support. That is true.

Sports beard, our guy. And wherever you get your podcast is also download us and give us a rating and review if you ever get a chance. So eight games around the National Hockey League. For the next hour, we'll focus on the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Edmonton Oilers. When we speak of Austin Matthews over the last few years,

it was always about how close is he to a Connor McDavid? And that is still debatable today. The eye of the beholder. It can range. But am I safe to say, guys, that tonight we can dub this game as the world's best shooter versus the world's best skater? Am I safe to go down that path?

Yeah, no one's going to yell at you. I know in Edmonton it's a big deal if you ever imply that there's any sort of competition between the two. So yes, we will give him the best shooter title and McDavid best skater. Oh, McKinnon might have something to say about that these days. Yeah. After watching a couple of McKinnon nights, I'm not sure McDavid's a better skater than

McKinnon. He does points. It's just, well, it's just visually they're two very different skaters. Yes. To me. And it's just the power that McKinnon has to me. Yeah. It's more effortless looking with McDavid.

But to me, it's McKinnon. Both. They're both. Here's the thing. Both pretty good. They get around. Can this be also deemed a little bit of a redemption night for austin because i'll just flat out say it uh he he did not stand up to the challenge versus nate mckinnon who's considered one of the best players in the

world he gets a second chance against connor tonight but nate ate him up saturday night yeah he was he dashed three in that game it was no good yeah this is a this is the chance for him and he always gets up for these games this is always a pretty good battle and i feel like i put in the lineup that i think mcdavid has 31 points in 21 games against uh toronto i think matthews has i'm just looking at here maybe 11 11 goals in 17 games against the oilers so they both kind of rise to the occasion for this one and And, you know, Edmonton versus Toronto matters. Big rivalry. That barn will be buzzing tonight.

Like, it's a big one. Well, we're going to get a thought out of Sheldon Keefe on our Kippers Clippers momentarily. But, JB, it was a tough weekend for the Toronto Maple Leafs. And no question about it. But if they come up with a good effort, if by chance they find a way to beat the edmonton order tonight and shut down a 10 game 10 oh no 10 game winning streak i mean based on what we've

seen out of these guys in the past the last few years would you be like, really surprised if they found a way? No. Because I wouldn't based on sometimes these guys' ability to rebound. Yeah, and not just rebound. Well, rebound is a big part of it, too. But, like, we have seen this team historically play to the level of their opponent when they know they're in for a good game. You tend to get a pretty good game out of them. I would say the pressure after their bad weekend going up against the oilers this is like the prime you get a good leafs game spot you know hate to be jinxy mcginxer pants here but that's a tough name to say easy for you

but yes this is uh this is a game you typically get a good at least are you feeling better going after what he just said there try to say mcginxer pants it's not an easy one This is a game you typically get a good Leafs performance. Are you feeling better going into it? After what he just said there? Try to say McJinkser pants. It's not an easy one. I'm good. Sammy, where's Leaf Nation feeling the challenge tonight coming off two losses on the weekend?

I'll say Leafs Nation, a.k.a. the Zig Zags dressing room last night, the morale is not high about the Leafs. No. It's low. It's low coming off that weekend. But here's what I'll say. Everything you laid out there is true. And they do bounce back in these kind of games.

They surprise you a lot of times when you're expecting them to get beat the worst. Like, I feel like they went out on that road trip and we were worried about them against the Kings and they had one of their best efforts of the year. And I think the questions about Keefe have been getting louder and louder. And, you know, we've talked about it

and everybody's talking about it. If you don't see a response from them tonight, that will be concerning. I'd say it'd be bad news bears for the coach for them to not get that typical pushback. Like if they don't come out there and look really good and their stars look good and they're really responding, I would be concerned. Well, Sheldon Keefe has looked at this this game and said i don't want to go into this with a bunch of brand spanking new lines uh matthews and marner are going to play together again tavarez and neilander are going to play together again domi and yarn crock all down the right side it's the same camp and gregor all the same a little bit of shuffling on the left side

but things are kind of shuffled there holmberg still stays up top nize is going to join tavarez and neilander for twosie domi yarn croft including another goaltending change for the Toronto Maple Leafs as Martin Jones will get back in that tonight uh we'll come off of uh our first Kippers clipper of of our show and then talk about those changes but let's go to Sheldon Keefe on prepping against world-class McDavid tonight. Just making sure where you need to be when it's time to defend and check, but also just how much harder the puck is to come by and how much you need to value it when you do get a chance to get it. That's really it.

I do think coming off that Colorado game, it helps us for this one here in terms of the preparation. Different teams and such, but there's certainly similarities there in terms of effectiveness on special teams and then, you know, elite caliber players. So, yeah, they've got lots of confidence. You know, they've put together a nice couple months here, and, you know, we're going to have to be at our best. And in these situations in the past, we have been.

So I look forward to competing tonight. There it is. He's banking on it. Yeah. First of all, you better load up here. Your two lines again. So it's right back to Matthews and Marner. But Holmberg.

Tavares and Nylander. your two lines again so it's right back to matthews and marner but holmberg tavaris and nylander and holmberg is the one exception where he stays on a line and hey listen he's been it's been great yeah just in terms of making things happen big body stripping pucks hard four checks that left side on that line isn't asked to be Gretzky. You know, you have a very specific niche role. It's get the puck back, be defensively responsible. But at some point, they're going to have to contribute. And Holmberg's getting points. Yeah.

You run shotgun with those guys. You can't have a 15-15 season. No, and neither Nyes or bertuzzi have been running away with top six point getting you know whatever this season so good to give someone else a little opportunity here i'm excited about that i do like the idea of holmberg going up there this is a big game i i i guess they've watched him play over the last little while and they think he's ready for this kind of test but this does feel like a different animal going against McDavid. And I know they did it a little bit against Colorado

and then they went for the full game against Detroit, right? All these games are so quick. But I don't know. This seems like a big bit of a desperation move to me. He, Holmberg, like like let me just say if I told you guys coming out of training camp that they would be going into January and I gave you the numbers that Nise and Bertuzzi had in that Holmberg would be on a number one line against McDavid in January you would have looked at me like I had three heads and nobody's injured you know it's not like oh we're desperately filling spots it's that's where we're

at so yeah i mean they probably need someone by trade deadline i think there's 50 days till the trade deadline yeah you know when you talk about all the needs of defense it's going to be hard to also fill that spot now i have not liked matthew nye's game for a while now and is this just part of the learning curve of being a pro i mean that's what i've basically come to that there's peaks and valleys and i i'm not sure if coming off the weekend, I would have put Matthew Knives back into a top six with Tavares and Nylander right away. I like Bertuzzi a lot more than Matthew Knives right now. Do you want to hear what Sheldon says about Bertuzzi? Or Knives?

Because we have a clip on both of those guys. What would you prefer? Knives, you mentioned Nyes. Let's go to his thoughts on Matthew Nyes. We're seeing a young player that's adjusting to the league. He's been playing a lot with Matthews on the top line, which comes with it.

The top matchups, the top D pairs. It's challenging. We've talked about this throughout the season. You're still adjusting to the pace of the league. I don't know where exactly he's at, and we've talked about this throughout the season. You're still adjusting to the pace of the league. I don't know where exactly he's at, but he's probably already here. At the midway point for us, he's probably already played as many or more games than you're going to play in a college season.

There's a lot of things that are happening for a young guy, so sometimes just taking a step back can help him. I look back to he was sick at one time not too long ago and came back from that and was probably ready to play, but I just felt giving him an extra day could help him. And then he came back. After just missing one game extra from being sick, was shot out of a cannon when we played.

I think it was Pittsburgh after that. It just shows at times the young guy if you take a step backwards it can it can help uh it can help him just manage everything that comes with being a first year nhl player first year pro but putting him back on is a step back up again right it's not taking a step back. Yeah. Nyes has the most games he played in university in his season was 40. Tonight? Yeah. 40. 40 games in half the length.

He usually has done that in junior hockey. The most he ever played in a year? 44. 44. So the kid has never played more than 44 hockey games in a season, and he's already about there, and it's January. So to Keith's point's it's like can you find him breaks in the schedule i don't know that you want to scratch him but you know just

back him off a little bit more here and there you're right top six maybe you think too soon for him to he didn't earn his way back necessarily again you're not dealing as you said out of strength right now on the left side so just a little bit uh probably the ask is is big right now for matthew knives to go back and be with tavaris and we'll get into that but i want to hear his ty Tyler Bertuzzi and then we'll kind of yeah frame the whole left side up sounds good no I would say inconsistent um I would say for me it's taken a while to get going in each game that we've played here of late um

you know I think in you know when the game gets going he's he in it. He's competitive at times. The game gets away from him a little bit early. But to me, Bert has played good hockey for us here for a good stretch of time now. And it seems the harder, more competitive, and more important the game is, the better we get from him. The game in Colorado is a bit of an exception there. But he has played very good for us. So, you know, he's an important guy. I liked him with Marner.

It's a nice note, by the way, that he has played good in big games. You liked him with Marner, eh? Listen, yeah, I did. I think I haven't seen Marner get too many tap in empty net goals I see I don't know just a little bit of chemistry right there it was enough for me to say

that it's a nice different look so that's the thing that's jumped out to me the most that I didn't really know about him is his passing he's nothing like what I thought he would be like I guess the games I watched him play with Troy troy and boss and he was just more pissed off those nights i'm not sure what it is but it's just yeah his passing has been one of the most pleasant surprise for me for his game it's funny i was going for a walk today and i was listening

to an article on pontus holmberg did it yeah that's kind of how i roll and he's talking about how holmberg is like he's so quiet and reserved and like you can't, he doesn't want to upset anyone ever. I was like, you do kind of see that on the ice, right? He's not like in anyone's face. God, can the Leafs just get someone who isn't that? And then I thought, wasn't that Tyler Bertucci? He's the only guy in the league who didn't want to get vaccinated.

He's not afraid to make waves. He doesn't care. He'll stand up. Oh no, without a doubt, he doesn't care. But he hasn't happened in a game. There hasn't been a game where i've been like whoa he's a jerk tonight there was early in the season he punched one red wing and one scrum and you've talked about it 10 times speared the goalie in the in the yeah okay i remember the game he made there was a moment in a game yeah 41 games have been played. This is not the guy I thought they were getting who is a good passer, in tight, makes great little small plays,

doesn't skate well, doesn't get in anyone's face. He's a nice player. But he's not what I thought they were getting. I was told something different. Grit. Producer, though, too. Like you thought you were going to find a way to get easy 60 points what do you have 10 points in the first round for boston last year you had 20 on the leafs all

year this year the one thing that in the top six the one thing that is concerning for me on this second line is all three of these guys are hitting their worst stretch of the season. All three of them are hitting their worst stretch. Nyes, Tavares, and Nylander. Nylander's window of the last three or four games is the worst stretch we've seen all year long. What happened before that? I don't know.

Did he find some money? Did they take away his motivation at the apex of his career year? And Tavares, his production has sunk like a stone the last dozen games, did you say? Yeah, in the last 10 games, just two goals. Just hasn't looked. Minus five. His usual kind of consistent look.

Like he hasn't been a threat at all yeah over the weekend so i don't know maybe maybe sheldon strikes lightning with all of these three guys maybe they find a way to put six points on the board tonight between all three of them they have that capability of course but it kind of feels like he's going big or going home tonight with this line i feel like with tavarez just specifically that watching him over his career there are these games these stretches where he's gone for a little bit where you don't notice him as much but it just feels as the years have gone on they just get a little deeper and a little longer every year the stretches you know it's like he's well he'll get his points but it's just like once you

know every year it gets a little bit longer the stretch of lack of production kip earlier this year was going tovar's will get his point per game tovar's yeah it's like what's he got now i don't know pal he's now dropped under 70 points i think he's on pace for high 60s which i think would put him back probably i don't know five seven eight years ten years since he's had a 60 yeah point season maybe you got to go back to the beginning of the islander 2017 2016 sorry 2016 2017 he had 66 points in 77 games okay and he's on pace for 24 goals and 68 points 68 points

now he could score three tonight sure right and bump that right back up to his point of game

kind of feel and hopefully that's the case on this extended western road trip is that he finds

a way to produce again the power play needs to get hot yeah power play that's an is that he finds a way to produce again. The power play needs to get hot. That's an issue. And he's a big component of that six feet radius around the net on the power play. But right now, I mean, you're not,

you're not going in with a lot of juice. Nope. But you know, like you said, the thing that makes the Leafs, the Leafs is that it's there, you know, like you said, the thing that makes the Leafs the Leafs is that it's there. You know, the ability to have these moments to create and to show up in these big games because you have the elite talent.

It's can you fill in all the holes? Just like every team, every team has holes. The Leafs high end is just so high. You know, can they find it against the Oilers? Can they match that? Power play could use a little work. The one thing that also stood out to me while doing my data mining that I usually do,

and I've said this to you guys before, is just how much this team is the team that people thought the old Leafs were. That they just aren't very good defensively, and they score like hell. Their third best team in expected goals, and like 25th in expected goals against.

They just, they're a pretty one-dimensional team right now. And that's scary against the Oilers. And you look at those stats and it's like, you know, we've been talking about making additions. Is one or two guys going to change the whole outlook of the team? That's the question. I don't know, like, who are you bumping out? Right?

So it's like Tanev comes in for example yeah like are you immediately 15th and expected goals against like how much does that change things it's a great question I don't know well I just you know how I felt for this team for the last couple of years they're not one defenseman away yeah they're two yeah defenseman away you know the question of does one or two make it or one guy make a difference i just don't think any team is good enough in the nhl right now for the leafs to say this is no year we're not going for it i still think they have to do these things i still think they're one of the teams that have a chance so i'd like to see them if it is two

i'd like to see it happen i can tell you that in about 10 minutes we're going to welcome in brad may former nhl or stanley cup champion friend of the show first time this year where's he been i don't feel bad i don't we haven't had on yet we're gonna have him on so maybe it's been a while fight his mother to be on two of our favorite clips uh well it's not good it's not good i'd fight my mom to win another Stanley Cup. Those two lines could really just be our whole show. That's all. It's not good.

They get played plenty, which is good. So we're excited to have Mayday coming up in about 10 minutes, like I said. I think it's official now. I haven't got a clue what Sheldon does with his goalies. And I'm not doing it anymore.

What do you mean? He's going back to Martin Jones. I said yesterday that based on the pump up he gave Samsonov coming off the Detroit win, take it. Go put him in against Edmonton tonight. We told you you were huffing paint. A little too nervous, I think, to maybe go all in on Samsonov against the hottest team in hockey right now.

Handing Samsonov to Connor McDavid right now? Bigger picture, I think I kind of get it now that you're on an extended road trip if in fact that you put samson on it in tonight and he gets shelled then you're basically screwed the rest of the way in this we samson off will play against calgary calgary yeah right that's the start that uh yeah that he'll get he'll play calgary and seattle yeah it makes sense because they got the back-to-back yeah well let's see what happens in calgary before you give them seattle they're going on the trip they're not gonna fly i don't know maybe they're gonna

fly him across the country to play in a game against no it's gonna be sam snuff regardless of what happens yeah well maybe it's joe wall. Joe Wall's on the trip. You know that? No, it's not Joe Wall. Joe Wall is on the trip. Let's hear from Sheldon Keefe on his schedule. That just means he's one step further. He's not going to be playing on this trip. I don't even expect to see him in practices

on this trip. He's just here just to continue to work with Curtis and be around the guys. There you go. Injury Island is lonely. Good to be around the guys. There you go. Injury Island is lonely. Good to be around the guys a little bit. Pretty chill. I think he's still on schedule to be in that February after the All-Star game, All-Star weekend.

I think he'd be be could they rush him depending on results on this trip don't do that don't do that i think i think beginning of february pretty much has him around that eight week mark if i'm not mistaken yeah which right on schedule. And this was in my mind that I had something about Edmonton Oilers and Martin Jones. It's not gone well for Martin against the Oilers. Well, he's been in Seattle, so they've played a lot.

21 games. He's got a winning record somehow, but 8-8-2 save percentage. 3-0-1 goals against. Going against some good players a lot, but it has not fared well for him against this team at least he knows what to expect he knows he's played them 21 times he knows what's coming but man it's a big ask for him it's a fastball's coming it's a big ask for him

like i you know i continue to be really happy for what they've given them but at some point and then we could be at the point this is going to start to go the other way like it happened on like you guys are looking at me like i'm mean here i don't i i know what you're saying about martin jones he didn't get a job in the league this year watch that avalanche game on saturday it's like you can't you need wall to get back here you can't keep stretching this out it's gonna get worse that's all I'm saying. The Oilers, how quickly from our earlier Oilers conversations do you think of them as among the best few teams in the West? Like Vancouver, Winnipeg, Colorado, Edmonton?

Oh, yeah. Like they're in that group of teams solidly now for me. 10-0-0. Yeah, it's crazy how far we how far yeah we had some dumb conversations about them in retrospect kind of take us off the toronto maple leaf uh train here but in in our conversation but like everybody has flaws everybody and we went to from writing off the Edmonton Oilers to now going Stanley Cup champions.

Now, is the truth on the Edmonton Oilers maybe just somewhere in between? Very likely. Yeah. I mean, the depth scoring for the Oilers is much like the Leafs. There's none of it. They need a top winger to play with Dreisaitl.

What's going on with that? So, Hyman and Kane? I don't know. They need a top winger to play with Dreisaitl. What's going on with that? So Hyman and Kane? I don't know. Dreisaitl and Kane probably not have the best chemistry, I guess, over the course of the year. A couple of shooters. I mean, Leon's the best passer on earth probably, but days don't work, eh?

That just doesn't kind of click. I mean, I could give you a pretty good explanation of why this is turned around. Stuart Skinner's last games. I'm going back to December 30. I'll go back to December 28th when he got a shutout against the Sharks. Same percentage of 1,000.

929, 946, 967, 962, 958. Yeah. Get saved. It's a pretty good explanation. Oh, come on. No matter what he does between now and the end of the regular season, you're still going to question him, and you're going to question the goaltending,

especially if it's Pickard backing him up. You go into a series and it's Skinner and Pickard. It's like uncomfortable. They need a backup goalie. And depending where you are on putting all your eggs in the Joseph Wall basket, even if he comes back and plays well, the Leafs aren't out of that, at least having a conversation on, do we need somebody else? Or is it Joseph Wall and Martin Jones?

Joe and Jones, baby, let's go. Going into the playoffs. Yes. You know, we should not, and I don't want, I hope Leaf Nation hasn't gone, yeah, Joe Wall's the guy. He's 100% our starting goalie, like going into the playoffs. He's got weak ankles okay it's this this last issue that he's had isn't the first time it's just a funny thing to hear about someone i've never you know and nhl hockey player weak ankles there's an issue going on there he has and you know what's worse is the way he left

it wasn't someone landing on it crashing into it watching us see him twist it it was just something that jammed on him it was a flutter puck from the half boards that he adjusted it was so weird he was also in the midst of one of the finest goaltending performances i can remember yeah against ottawa massive glove save you can watch him on the injury a thousand times on video and it will never equate to eight weeks off for two months yeah injury like you're like okay where yeah where you know for the toronto maple leafs going back to 21 22 he's played 22 games for them you know like and everyone's like he's the guy he'll get healthy he's the guy and it's like he probably is the guy i really like him but gosh

again watching we've been yelling from the rooftops for how many shows to get a goalie watching that injury again are you like likely to believe that this guy can play every other night for two months and win you a stanley cup you know what also gives me some pause about this is when asked about this summer in his training like did you try to bulk up like you're 23 did you try to get bigger what'd you work on yeah you know he worked on his ankles he had had an ankle issue in the past and he actively tried to strengthen his ankles to avoid an issue this summer okay so my weak ankles comment isn't farfetched i didn't mean to laugh at the idea that you were suggesting it it's just a strange thing to hear have you ever heard or said

that about a player before there's a lot of weak ankles. He needs an ankylectomy? Like, that hasn't come up. A lot of weak ankles during ACHL, but I'll tell you that much. Go to watch Beer League. You can be sponsored by Renfrew. Get some tape for these boys. But it's not quite the NHL's thing. So, the point of all of this is

everybody's got some question marks that you could pick apart to suggest they're not quite ready for winning a cup. But now you're starting to equate winning cups to... On this show, we've said they needed a goalie, a D-man, and a left winger. I've been saying they needed a goalie for... My voice cracked. I'm getting emotional.

We've been saying they needed a goalie for three seasons of this show. We should break get to mayday okay we're gonna take a break you know we're gonna also have later on the show we'll have a conversation on uh elvis leakings brought that monster out of him is he an answer in toronto or edmonton but uh we'll save that for uh the hour. Okay, let's take a quick break. When we come back, Brad May will tell us how critical this Western road trip is for the Toronto Maple Leafs. You're watching

and listening to Real Kipper and Born. Teeing up the biggest games of the night. It's the fan pregame with Ailish Forfar and Justin Cuthbert. Weekdays at 6 p.m. on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590 The Fan and wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the Real Kipper and Bourne Show.

Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee. Soon to be joining us, Brad Mayday. Mayday. Dirk Brandeo, does he have the Mayday call? Can he find that for us while we get Brad May set up for the phone call? I'm going to ask Brad May uh the leafs right now and you know did we see have they where is their identity when it's all said and done here in terms of halfway point now they searching for one can they grab one on this road trip let's start with you jb well i'm gonna

give you some some quick stats. Goals four per game, they're fifth. Goals against per game, they're 21st. Their power play is sixth. Their penalty kill is 23rd. Their shots four per game is sixth. Their shots against is 21st. Their identity, to me, is they're a one-way team, right?

They want to go that way. And so that, to me, is the challenge from games 42 to 82 is can you become a 200 foot team right now they're not to me i don't think if you ask them what's your identity they'd say what i just said but from a viewer's perspective that is their identity and i imagine they would say that they're an offensively dynamic team who can play both ends of the rink, but they currently don't. The lack of identity is an identity to me. Yeah. Just how they just don't really have a defining thing outside of the core four.

And that is the defining thing, yeah. Yeah. All right, let's welcome him in. Let's welcome him in. Oh, no, we have the clip ready. We don't have the actual. Oh, okay, I thought Brad was ready. We're trying to track down Brad here. Are we? Yeah. Oh, no. Let's have the clip ready. We don't have the actual. Oh, okay. I thought Brad was ready. We're trying to track down Brad here.

Are we? Yeah. Oh, no. Let's have the clip. Let's have the clip. Gets it to May and over the line. He's May going in on goal. He shoots.

He scores! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday!

Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! Mayday! God, I love that. What's the thing when you send it out looking for somebody? No, the... Oh, SOS? Yeah, maybe send it out, SOS, trying to find her. You know, I think if that call, I don't know, like in the great annals of great American sports calls, like that's got to be one of them.

It doesn't get enough respect national oh gosh i think it's played out amazingly well i think and it was it was a first round was it yeah i think they beat boston in the first round off off of mayday's goal so yeah imagine if it was like a conference final or stanley cup final that might be one where you just let the crowd do the talking those are good calls too hey where there's a big moment you just sort of let the the ambiance i mean the anti tony romo well i don't know jim yeah oh jim i don't know jim jim jim jim jim jim as uh as derek just pointed out i mean he undressed ray bork was it ray bork oh yeah oh my god yeah the one-handed kind of threw ray bork and then he kind of hopped around him

and then the fake slap shot i think we might i have we might not have brad i can't get touched brad all right well listen for brad, we have lots more Leafs content. If he joins us, he joins us. But talk about a former Leaf that went on to Edmonton who's having some success in Zach Hyman. We can critique a lot of things for the Toronto Maple Leafs. And we do. Over the last six years.

Letting Zach hyman go uh everything's great for the number bertuzzi earns does not does there's nothing else that can top that cadre trade the decision to give up draft picks for felino the decision to give draft picks up for ryan o'reilly but letting this guy go because you would not go five million dollars for him what happened is i can't need the context of what happened in that summer because i can't remember disaster i don't remember all the context but the current context i can give you is that his high his goal total the highest goal total with the leafs is 21 he currently is on pace for 55 he had 36 two years ago for the oilers he's on pace for 55 goals, 26 goals in 38 games. And I should say the 21 with the Leafs was in 51 games.

So he was on a pretty nice clip too. But yeah, he is a massive goal scoring threat in the National Hockey League on a team, you know, where he's crucial for them. But to the Leafs defense, like there's just no way you could see this coming. There's just no way based on where he had come out of college from and his rights were first with the Florida Panthers. It was a nothing trade by Kyle Dubas to get his rights to come to Toronto.

He works his ass off. He grinds. Babcock sees something. There's people going, okay, why is he playing with Matthews? Why is he playing with Marner? And he fought through that. And then it was to the point where some of the Sammies in the world would gladly drive him to the airport because he's not worth $5 million.

Never say that to me. So I wish I had, I never said, I looked up this up to be right about something because I'm rarely right. All right. My apologies. But I looked it up on Twitter. I never sent any tweets, but when I was very early in doing my shows on the radio,

I was like, why don't you just pay him? Yeah. Just pay him. And here's what they did in that summer. Did you look it up on Twitter. I never sent any tweets, but when I was very early in doing my shows on the radio, I was like, why don't you just pay them? Yeah. Just pay them. And here's what they did in that summer. Did you look it up? No. They signed Peter Mrazik, Nick Ritchie,

Andre Kasha, Camp. Camp. Yep. Rich was great. Michael Bunting. That track? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That track. Totally tracks. You know. So. uh camp yep rich was great uh michael bunting that track yeah yeah that checks totally tracks you know so yeah they just probably allocated a little of that to spread hyman's money out

amongst a lot of people but you know you talk about they couldn't have seen where this was going in 20 1920 he's on pace for 32 goals and you know the next season he's on pace for 30 goals. Like, he didn't leave here a 10-goal score and become a 30-goal guy. So, I think you bet against the idea that he would be able to continue to do it away from your superstars. They basically said, we think he's as good as he is because of Hyman and Marner. Or, sorry, because of Matthews and Marner. Turns out he's just a great hockey player. Yeah. And how old is he now?

30. He's 31. He's 31. But he's a freak of nature. He's one of those guys who's all green juice. Nobody goes from like being a 25 goal score to a 50 goal score at age 30. It is remarkable what he's done in such a short period of time with the edmonton oilers you know he had 22 goals in 37 ncaa games like he scored at the college level and i was with the marlies

when hyman was there and i saw the work this guy put in like he is the guy doing all the weird exercises and the correct diet and watching his game tape other people would come watch their game tape when they would score. Could I get my shifts? Could I watch my shifts back from last game? Hyman could play terrible, and he would still watch them. Like, he put in the work to be the player he is. He writes children's books.

That alone should have kept him here. I know. And maybe there's a world he didn't want to be here. No, no. There was a big world where he wanted to stay. He just was not going to get paid. Yeah, would they have given him comparable? No.

I don't think they ever got close. Is it five or five-five? It's five-five. Five-five. That was a lot of money back then, right? Now it's like a... He's already in year three giving him a 50-goal season. There's four years left in the deal. It's not like it's like a he's already in year three giving him a 50 goal season like there's four years left in the deal it's not like it yeah it's already one of the best contracts in the

league they've done very well by it for sure yeah i mean when you look through the rest of that lineup you know their fourth line is adam ernie james hamblin connor brown struggling to put it in the net derrick ryan ryan mcleod matmark, like they, they could use some depth help too. So obviously Hyman is crucial for them. Curious to see Kane's ice time has kind of scaled back since Knoblick has been the guy they, I think Knoblick recently had a quote about trying to find more opportunity for him.

Yeah. Yeah. Someone suggested to me, there's a little friction there for sure. With Kane. Well, he wants his ice time time I'm sure he does and now I think we've got Fogle and McLeod with Dreisaitl yeah and like I'm a I'm a big Fogle fan I liked him in Carolina and there are some times uh since he's been an Edmonton Oiler where it's been challenging for him a little bit, but now I think he's settled right in. He's a big, fast guy.

So Kane's ice time in the first... I was just looking at this. Yeah, in October, he plays 18 and a half minutes, plays a couple more seconds per game in December, 18 and a half minutes, but towards the end of December, I don't remember when Knobloch came on. I think late November, I want to say. say yeah so he still played quite a bit in december after that 16 30 in the month of january so far or sorry that was in december he was 16 30

this month he's 15 22 so it's really really scaled back i had the months wrong there. So 18-24 in October, 18-26 in November, 16-30 December, 15-22 in January. Yeah. Yeah. And one assist in the month of January so far on a team that's winning games. Quite a contrast tonight from maybe the ability to control your team, or have a feel of the temperature of your team between Knobloch and Sheldon Keefe. One can get a little hot under the collar.

In Knobloch, I'm not sure if his pulse ever gets higher than 50. Yeah, we witnessed it on our show. He was very thoughtful, said all the right things. We witnessed it firsthand. We do have Sheldon Keefe talking with Zach Hyman, just to stay on that theme before we change channels here. Yeah, good call. Let's listen to that.

I mean, Hyman, he's always had good touch around the net. He knows how to get to the right spots, and he's playing with the right guy to get the puck right where he needs it. So in that sense, I'm not surprised. But then he's a relentless player, so when he gets confident and all that, he's going to be dangerous. See, he should have just started the clip going,

I miss him so much. God, he did love him too. I mean, Dubas, that's the craziest part is that Dubas loved him. He brought him in. Was it McKaig? Greg McKaig. They traded Greg McKaig for him. Yeah.

And he loved him and he developed him and he came up and developed him into what, I mean, that's what sucks with the cap, not to go down this road again, but you spend all this time developing these guys and you they get to the peak of their powers and you got to let them go and that's what they never mind i'll leave willie out of this yeah uh and i i'm not suggesting that a guy like Matthews is the reason why he left. But typically, when your star players really want to keep a guy, it sways the management's decision. And I'm just not sure back then how much a guy like Matthews

would have thought the upside would have been to keep Hyman. So you think maybe. I just don't know if there was ever that true. Like I. I kicked down the door like Sid did this summer for Gino and all those guys. Like I'm not sure how much Matthews like loved playing with him back then. Or if he felt like he wanted, he needed someone with a better touch,

smoother, higher-end point producer. And I think the whole feeling in general from even some of the star players to management was that Hyman has a cap right and he's just and we're not paying 5.5 yeah for 60 points i don't know back then where we were 55 goals right now it's like yeah 55 goals but he has developed his game he's so smart so he's so intelligent yeah that he's he's figured it out between the body and the mind, how to go to another level.

So where do you stand on players having any input onto personnel? Because I don't think there's any credence to what you're saying, you know, but like, do you think they went to a 23 or four year old and said, do we want this guy on our team? Should we keep them? And if so,

should that happen should these players have input because why are you asking a kid to be the gm if that's the case ask lebron james well lebron's 40 listen he's been doing it his whole career yeah fair enough and you know what ask people if lebron's a good gm he's the worst gem in the league terrible yeah you know i love you but i think you're nuts if you don't think this is going on all the time. Yeah. And yes, they go to 22 and 23-year-olds because they are the team now. Yeah. And it doesn't just stop with, it doesn't stop with line mates.

It doesn't stop with roster. Should it? Listen, you have no choice. Yes, it should. Yeah. You know why? Because these guys have the power mcmatthews has the power to go oh oh you want to keep babcock well maybe i'll look for another place to play maybe i won't sign for sure maybe i'll move on. And they're like, let's get rid of Babcock. Yeah. Which, you know, in retrospect, maybe was the right move.

Babcock had to go to Phoenix. I know. Okay, he had to get on a plane. Yeah. And go suck up to Matthews. I know. Think about that. Yeah.

I remember that well. You know what's craziest? You want to talk about power? Yeah. That's power you know it's crazy too about all the babcock stuff where people talked about his coaching or whatever he was right about pretty much when you i know he's not a great guy and we're all mad at him or whatever but if you look back at all the things he said the leafs needed to do to be successful pretty much every single box has been checked okay and then so you went the other way with sheldon who's pretty much given these guys everything they want yeah you know i think when he came in you know dubas still really wanted them to be progressive

right they wanted to play different than other teams. They wanted to hang on to the puck. Remember the curlbacks? You know, they, yeah, it was tough to watch for a while. And eventually they've said, this doesn't work. This doesn't work. And eventually it's like, we need to play fast, go forward, north, south. It's like, where did that, I didn't hear that before.

There's not the regroup. He got rid of the regroup, but there's a lot of that stuff that's still in there. Like I'm watching again how many times that that the leafs have two defensemen behind the net and i'm like there's no world in mind their own net or the opposing it no their own net yeah there's two lilligren and mccabe are caught behind the net uh Tavares on the weekend, I saw him like caught by himself in front of the net. Rantanen, his goal Saturday night, alone in front of the net. I'm like, how does that keep happening?

How does one guy understand that if the defenseman is behind the net battling, I better be in front of the net because nobody's there. That happened to Kopp on the game-winning goal. Two defensemen caught behind the net. How does that keep happening? You know, I highly doubt it's coached, right? That they're like, hey, we want to send two guys. Maybe they're just not listening to the coach, which would be coaching.

Okay, that's a problem then. Exactly. That's a problem. It is. And we you and i had a brief conversation earlier you know i don't think that sheldon keith is a bad coach or has done a bad job i think he's been a good coach who's done a good job or whatever i do think that it would be interesting to see if people would respond differently to someone else because i think their systems are very comparable to other teams i don't think they're doing anything out of the ordinary but a lot of it is just getting guys to adhere to the system which at times it feels like they're not okay so we had a bruce budro vancouverucks? And we have Rick Talkett. I would say those are two very extremes.

Pretty much. Yeah. Same group of guys. What's the difference? Well. Like they didn't listen to Bruce and they're listening to talk. Certainly that's part of it. Yeah.

You know. But they're. Quinn Hughes isn't playing center. From February 1st through the 3rd, all-stars are in Toronto for an NHL all-star weekend and we'll be giving away tickets to the different events in episodes today until January 26th today we have tickets

the NHL all-star Thursday draft which includes the PWHL three-on-three showcase the NHL all-star player draft plus a tribute to the 1967 Leafs for a chance to win text in today's code word which which is DRAFT to 59590

and we'll have another code word in tomorrow's episode so be sure to tune in. DRAFT is that code word. DRAFT. The person who picked 1967 Leafs. They never show themselves. Apparently Leafs suck was too long a password for today.

Were they relieved of their duties? Who picked 67 yesterday? Before we go, I got a lot of texts about Justin Hall. We did the return, and he got the tribute video. And I got a couple of texts being like, Justin Hall gets the tribute video, but Duvis doesn't. I'm like, that is... Says something.

I didn't see the tribute. Neither did I. The tribute was like, welcome is... Says something. I didn't see the tribute. Neither did I. The tribute was like, welcome back, Justin Hollen. I just hope it didn't include some bad pinches. What was the highlight package? Maybe they could include last year's penalty kill numbers versus this. You know what? Not a bad point.

Oh, yeah. Do you want to play it? No. Move this man! Do this tribute video sound. All right, listen, we're going to get an answer from Brad May. If we can find him today, we're going to find him tomorrow. We're going to track him down for you.

In the meantime, we continue on the Real Kipper and Bourne Show as we go national. Rob Brown, former National Hockey Leagueaker, 50-goal scorer and now an analyst for the Edmonton Oilers will join us next. Stick around.