Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Onto Ottawa for Game 3

Episode Date: April 24, 2025

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee get set for the Leafs' Game 3 matchup against the Senators in Ottawa as they look to stretch their series lead to 3-0. They react to Max Pacioretty subbing in for Nick Robertson and whether the team should have gone with David Kämpf instead. Later, former NHLer and Hockey Night in Canada analyst Kevin Bieksa (27:02) joins the guys in-studio to share his impressions of the Leafs' play so far, Craig Berube's trust in Mitch Marner and Auston Matthews in the defensive end, what Pacioretty can bring to the series, Simon Benoit's impact and much more.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Right back at you on a game day. The real Kipper and born show leaf. Our edition of our program. Nick Kiprios, Justin born Sammy McKee, Derek Brando and Jake, the snake shows with you for the next two hours. We'll get you to puck drop 7 p.m. If I'm not mistaken. Yeah, I think that's right. All right better than the 730. You like 730 I do buy an extra half an hour kind of get home get to eat. Yeah, exactly.

Anyway, I'm not complaining buddy. I'm I almost died. I'm happy to have a leave playoff hockey. We're live on sports at 590 the fans sports at 360 and sports net plus We are hot our show is hot. You know how hot it is. Tell me the good people at Starter Canada will not allow to be shown up from the likes of Craig Conroy or Don Waddell who sent us jerseys and they're like

Well, we'll get a we'll get something for you to hang up. Is that not just about the prettiest jacket you've ever seen? It got flipped. It got flipped. I think you gotta go logo forward. Yeah, I think you gotta go front logo, Sammy. That's fair.

The back says Toronto May Police on it too. It is beautiful. If the lease beat descends in this series, I will be wearing that the show after. And I think you say, Kip and I were saying, maybe at the end of the year we raffle it off, auction it, something, give away. Yeah, end of the year We raffle it off. Yeah Give a raffle it off to me. So our thanks to Norman Aaron over at Starter Canada

And you know Give them credit because it's a wonderful reminder of what a great time of the year. It is right now To suck up to us right So listen, we're at this thing for another two months. Go lots of time to send us stuff. Send us stuff. We'll put it up here. Yeah. We are good. We'll talk about it. We'll put it up. We are good to go. In the meantime, let's get you ready for a Toronto Maple Leaf Ottawa Senator game three in their series as it shifts over to the Canadian Tire Center

for the first time since what? Sammy, what did you have? Game six in 2017. Correct. Against the Pittsburgh Penguins. And if you remember, that was the conference finals. And then game seven in overtime, Chris Kunitz, double OT, shot it past Craig Anderson. Do remember that?

All I remember in that series was this pass by Eric Carlson that was the first time went 12 against the Bruins That was Hall of Fame still is The greatest saucer pass at high in the history of the game behind the net. Yeah 140 feet over center ice, flat. Flat as a pancake. How did it make Kirill Kaprizov look like? Not bad. Yeah, tape.

A walk in the park. And if you'll remember correctly, Mike Hoffman received that pass and then went one hander on it. A one-hander lander in the playoffs. How did I see that as much as I did? No, that should be like a top five highlight ever. We got a real fun show here.

In about half an hour, Kevin B. Exon is going to join us. Busy guy over at Hockey Night in Canada, but promised to stop by and hang out with us for a few minutes before he gets ready for a big night. On the national program, we'll have Rob Brown, a favorite of ours, to discuss the Edmonton Oilers and how bad is it? Right now in Edmonton. Oh, can you ever count that team out? And sometimes the answer yes, I don't know if now's one we'll talk we'll also say again Marty Turco. Oh

Yeah Dallas Dallas up two to one always fun with Marty's yeah in the meantime Dallas up two to one now. Always fun with Marty. Holy smokes. In the meantime, we do hear of a lineup change for the Toronto Maple Leafs. Out is Nick Robertson. In is Max Petruetti. Not overly surprised, are we, JB?

Yeah, I'm overly surprised. You are? Really, really surprised. Really? Yes, I am. I thought for sure David Camp would be the next man up. Mm-hmm I you know, he's been a part of it for years. He's a senator. He's makes him two and a half million dollars He played what is 75 games this year and he's not in so yeah

I thought he'd be next in but if you're just gonna change out one winger put one winger in Make some sense. What do you think totally agree with what he said? I know that's not scintillating radio, but I just thought with some of the matchup stuff that you're gonna have to deal with tonight, that it's gonna be tougher just in terms of some of the defensive zone matchups that you have, having an extra center man that's good defensively,

I thought would have made a lot of sense tonight and putting patches in for his first game in this environment, feels like a lot to ask, but we'll see we'll see I like a bigger heavier guy to go into game three in Ottawa and again I I don't think the Leafs have anyone in particular to match up against a Brady Kuchuk not many teams do to be honest with you. And that's not necessarily the thinking is that you need someone to match them,

but you need somebody in going in Ottawa who can hit back. And that's unfortunately not Nick. And if Nick's not showing signs of putting the puck in the net, which unfortunately hasn't happened for him yet, then you're better off taking the sure bet right now. And that is a Max Petriotti. And there's guys that hit, but the Leafs do not have many guys that can hit to hurt.

And I've seen this guy in the first quarter of the season, he hits to hurt. Look at these. Okay. And I've seen this guy in the first quarter of the season, he hits to hurt. Look at these. Okay, and this will be an element that they'll need. And I'm okay with Max Patcheretti coming in tonight. You know, the thing is too, is it's not like you're taking out Nick Robertson for a guy who if the puck hits a stick,

he's gonna chip it in the corner. Patcheretti canauretti can shoot it in the damn net. Yeah. Make no bones about it and he's got a pretty good track record in the postseason to score on goals too. So I think for them this is not a massive step down offensively and it's a big step up physically. You go through this Leafs lineup and now Ottawa has the last change. Austin Matthews, big guy. Knives is big. You know, Patcheretti is big. You know, they, McMahon, Lorenz, like it's a big group there now. And I feel like it makes a lot of sense when you sit back and look at it.

It feels like this is, I mean, we laid out this exact scenario with Max Patcheretti early in the year that we talked about how, you know, you hope to get 35 regular season games out of him and he comes into a playoff game and he, in a 2-1 game, he has one of the goals and he hammers somebody. This is actually the exact dream scenario for his season with Elites. I did not see him on a PTO coming in and having that physical element that he showed us and I think we all knew that like there's no sustainability over 82 games But if you could get this guy in a small window this time of year healthy enough and how long has he been off like?

February 8th, I think Luke Fox tweeted out is he hasn't played a hockey game in 75 days there. Yeah, I mean so well rested No excuse to turn away from burying somebody tonight. And he's coming off a tweak, you know? Like not like it happened in a game, like he just kind of tweaked something. Okay, let's go to Max on his thoughts of jumping into this series, clip one

on our Kippers Clippers. Done it before, I was a little bit younger though, but I feel confident I'm ready to go. I've put in a lot of hard work. A lot of really good resources here that we've spoken about time and time again to help you get up to speed without playing a game. And I feel like I'm ready to go. I believe him.

I mean, this guy's notorious for taking care of himself working hard putting in the work after injuries You know, what kind of run could you get from him? If you only give him 12 13 minutes a night or something This is I like this the you're up a couple of games you got a chance to get let him get his feet under him and down money What was the part that you didn't like just the mere fact that that they're rolling right now on the winds What people will say?

I mean don't mess with the winning lineup and that Robertson has been a dog on the puck pretty darn good And it does feel like a guy who if the puck comes soon can shoot it in but I think a lot of people just don't Think you should change a winning lineup and I am the opposite of that I think you play whoever you think gives you the best chance to win every night I don't think you that. I think you play whoever you think gives you the best chance to win every night. I don't think, you know, I think they it was nice to give Nick Robertson the first two and he deserved that down the stretch. Like he played a ton because they were injured or whatever. He took advantage of his situation.

He played well and I think he deserved the first couple of games, but he had one shot in two games. Like I know he had an assist in the first game, but I don't know. Like I just I didn't see enough to keep him in there. So I love that old-school hockey man Craig Borubey didn't stick with the you can't change a winning lineup and actually made a significant change the lineup and how fast I mean Patrick had a good skater Domi's fast McMahon's fast a couple guys really big couple a lot of guys and shoot it in I actually really like the look of that line. Okay, let's uh, let's get Craig Ruby's thoughts on on why he's bringing in

Patches, you know veteran guy Coming into a game here. It's gonna be you know It's gonna be tough here, you know, it's the crowd and Just wanted to make that change to get a veteran guy in there bigger guy heavier There you go. There's this breakdown. It's breakdown it's not complicated for Ruby ever no that's just fine um we might as well just finish off the Ruby on patches stuff and get clip to on how patches handled the layout I mean

it's tough for sure you know but you know he's handled it fairly well happen, you know he can't control a lot of things that happen. I think he, you know, for sure he wanted to be in there and playing but he's got the opportunity now. And you know to me he's worked hard, kept a good attitude for the most part. It's not easy, especially for a guy, you know he's been been around a long time veteran guy. It's it's always harder for those guys Can I tell you I take away from that that patcher eddie is a little bit perturbed and not being in sooner You guys hear that at all? How can you not right? Yeah, uh how uh, good to have you for the most part and I think I didn't get that the first time I listened to it,

but now that you mentioned it in that context, it does change the way I listen to that a little bit. For sure. Salary cap probably kept him out of the lineup from playing a couple of games too. And you know, that's just that fine line where until we see him play tonight, whether or not if a two month layoff,

two and a half months, will play into tonight, or can he just have that veteran savvy that he can come in and still find a way to contribute or make it, make one big play, one big hit that can alter tonight's, or just sit there and go, big play one big hit that can alter tonight's or Just sit there and go Yeah, that stupid salary cap kept him from getting a couple of games in and maybe that would have made a bigger difference on him

We'll have to wait and see in our plays out and you wonder individually like he doesn't seem like he wants to retire from the NHL Like he was very effective in the games He was in I'm sure he would have liked the chance to play more to show he could do more. I do agree that the cap probably kept him out towards the end of the year and maybe he was frustrated by that. And so perhaps a little pushing from behind the scenes is part of the reason he's getting the nod over camp that he's wanted to get it work his way back in. In which case I say great, love a guy who wants to be in. No problem with that. Alright, so towels tonight in Ottawa, Heart Over Hype. That's the Rally towel. What does that mean something? Hype? Who's hype?

Are the Leafs the hype? Are people hyping them? I do kind of feel like that's a perfect description of the series so far. Heart over hype. The Sens were a super elite super high Hype team coming into this people thought they were gonna upset them and the Leafs have played with a ton of heart and won two Games against them. It's all hard team. That hasn't happened in a while. I mean, it's crazy to say but they have been yeah, I Did not get that sense that a lot of people were picking Ottawa did you? Yes, well Sammy you're a little different. I mean, go to a go.

I just went and checked our Sportsnet picks. Multiple people picked at least four people of all the people they did pick the center. I saw Sarah Valley did for sure. Yeah, like people were picking the center means to Valley. Like, yeah, it was a sexy upset pick. No question. It was.

Yeah. Okay. Is there anything better than beating the Leafs? All right. Hey, you know, I think in. And if you really put it in perspective, and we've talked about this, and we've had multiple experts, guests come in and say that there's maybe 8, 10, 11 legitimate teams to win a Stanley Cup. Ottawa wasn't one of them. Nope. I agree with that

No one I didn't have them in that pocket of teams with a legitimate cup chance now. They're thinking win this series You win tonight and all of a sudden it's two one everybody's closing out a sweep So what's what's your point here? My point is is like you're super fanish and not like, you're super fan-ish, and I don't think, I don't think, They had hype? I don't think that they upset hype, or the big sway of people believing that Ottawa was beat them. I think this is revisionist. I think this is very revisionist.

Yeah, I would say I'm on that. You are. And people picked Ottawa to win this. Yes, man. I would say 40% of people picked Ottawa that might too high is that unreasonable? I just I do think that in the ether that sends fans were confident because of the regular season record They lost five games in a row to the to the sand like all right I I gotta tell you like I think it's playing out the way

We probably would have expected it that I would have hoped that I didn't expect this. The better team, the deeper team is up to nothing now. Who knows? This is professional sports at its finest, right? And it's the Leafs. And it's the Leafs. Stolar's looking great today. Who knows what tomorrow brings? Who knows what a key injury brings?

Who knows if anybody steps up and becomes a hero for Ottawa? But like, Ottawa's, they gotta come out, brings who knows if anybody steps up and becomes a hero for Ottawa but like Ottawa's they got to come out they got to score a couple of goals early I think or get a lead for a change and play with the lead like a lot of other things have to go right for Ottawa here to get themselves back in the game you know one thing that's going to happen I talked a little bit with Anthony Petrilli he wrote some on like the line matchups. They'll probably try to get the Pinto line against Matthews to free up the Stutzla line against Tavares Nylander. Be my guest. So that's a bigger ask now for

Tavares Nylander and Holmberg is it? Playing a pretty darn good line. You know, that Kachak obviously we know what he can do and they control a lot of the play And then can the Matthews line? Oh, you know score on the Pinto line dominate the Pinto line and make them regret that matchup I mean, I like Michael Amadio the way he's Won his cup in Vegas and he's he's been a good become a good pro But like Marner Matthews nice should be able to handle that line and make them regret a little bit the Stutzla Against Tavares. So going on the road what you're saying is could potentially free up the The matchup a little bit for the Leafs instead of sort of chasing it at home and chasing the Matthews versus

A Stutzla line matchup that it kind of frees them up a little bit Yeah, I think so, but I also think that it's gonna be much bigger ask on the second line Which I think we've had concerns about in the past. Holmberg there probably the right answer if not McMahon at some point. Alright let's go to the head coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs on his big line Matthews Marner. Nice. Yeah they're closer I mean they're obviously things like everybody else that you're looking at that they can do better. I mean, they're tough matchups with the Stutzel line. You know, it's a good line.

So I think they're doing a good job defensively and checking and doing a lot of good things. You know, you just gotta keep going. You just gotta keep working. I mean, goals will go in, but you know, you want to score goals in a playoffs, it's about getting to the net more than anything. I mean, you're going to get opportunities for sure at times on broken plays and things like that, but get to the net.

That's where the goals go in most of the time in a playoffs, the greasy goals around the net. But overall, I'm pleased with that line, job they're doing I'm not too worried about Matthews I love that line that's encouraging I I would say that it's pretty awesome from a least perspective that you're up to zipping the series and Matthews and Marner have combined for one goal right on five like I just I I think it's... They've spent a lot of time not in the offensive zone though.

Right, no, it hasn't been awesome. But that's, I think, to Sam's point, they're not far worse than the lines they're playing, right? We think at some point that should sort of stabilize, they should look like the line that we know they are. Hopefully that comes around for them here a little bit. And a few offensive zone face-offs. I don't think they're going to get more.

I don't think that's going to change. Yeah, I mean, not... I think it has to. Wow, no David Camp. I mean, it's going to be the same situation. You don't want to put Tavares and Nylander there against Stutsela. But at the same time, these guys are some of the best offensive players in the

world. I mean, you gotta put them in. You can't, I get it. If you get another two, nothing lead or you're up three, one, four, one is game one, but you can't just hold on. You can't, you can't just coach to protect or sit back. You gotta play. You gotta put these guys in a position to think, win a face off, get to the net in a split second, not go 200 feet to get back to the net. The problem is you haven't felt like a Domi Robertson line. You can't start them in the D zone at all.

No. Although they did in overtime. And it's, they won. But it's a winning formula, Justin. But that is not something they wanna do, right Kip? I mean, that's not a trustworthy D-line. Tarras, Nylander typically hasn't been won, particularly when Domi was on their wing.

So you kind of run out of options at some point of who you feel comfortable doing it with. Yeah, and that's why you'd. Does pass already change that a bit, yeah, well. And the other thing is I know, you're comfortable now with Scott Lawton. So where's the room for camp? Well, I think Lawton can play wing, right? Like I think you took yarn croc out, made camp the centerman. You go Lawton Lawrence

on wings with, with camp. I think if they, if they have any issues tonight, I'm with you in game four. Yeah. That they would make that. But I think that to me, like, patcher ready for Nick Robertson doesn't upset the apple cart as much as positional one in one out. And camp, that is a major,

that changes the rhythm up a lot more than just one guy in, one guy out for some size. Yeah, it does. It's hard to find Domi's perfect spot. People hate to hear that because he scored the OT winner and he's whatever, but it's like if you put him on the Tavarez line, now you don't think you can start that line in the D zone. You can't put him on the fourth lineres line, now you don't think you can start that line in the D zone. You can't put him on the fourth line

because he's wasted there. It's tough. You know, so you gotta find, how do you maximize everyone? It is, it is kind of funny, not funny, but I don't know what the word is, but like, this is a team that won the division. Yeah.

Right? Yeah. And we've never really felt like the lines were ever. They're up to nothing in a series. We still have no idea. They're up to nothing in the series and you're like, we're still looking for like that perfect feel of 12 forwards. Yeah. No, it's, you're right. It's fascinating. Maybe it's a good thing though that they have some flexibility. You know, like there are guys, Domi can play wing and center, and Lawton can play wing and center, Lorenz can actually play wing and center. You know, you have some options with some guys,

and I think maybe that's why it's kind of challenging. Also an unwillingness to try things in the regular season, which I yelled about a lot. Yeah. Do you guys have anything more on that? Because the Battle of Ontario, Sammy, is is about to come out I had to ask you guys a question all right let's have it so when I was younger as a kid I clearly had no like exposure exposure to six months ago when you know like when I

was like in high school and I the first battle was a few years ago yeah like you know five years ago or so but I didn't have the exposure to takes about stuff. Oh, it was a better time. What a better time. And I'm way too chronically online, so maybe people that are just like, live their lives just listening to us on the radio, watching us on YouTube, whatever,

down on our podcast, aren't exposed to this. The pearl clutching about Anthony Stollers and Ridley Greig has been out of control boys Oh my have you ever watched like do you even like hockey like yo? Are you talking to Mark Lazarus? Every I saw a hundred bad tweets about it. I saw a hundred like give me a break cover another sport Like there's plenty other sports that don't allow that.

I saw the last tweet and I like Laz a lot, but that's. It's like, oh my God. Do I need to call you a whambulance? Oh, basically, you know, and I just. I'm excluded from this. The Sens fans. The Sens fans. I can't comprehend those comments.

The Sens like way too much exposure to what these sends fan. I'm like, oh my god You don't actually believe that you can't be a fan of this game and believe what you're reading and writing Hold on if all mark had done that to Pick a guy. Don't me you you'd be flipping out right? Yeah, I'd be like, oh, yeah, it's a penalty I'm upset that it wasn't Quentin double-miners. You'd want three or five games and they get nothing because it's the Leafs. That's that's you think that's we think so Four years I've done. I absolutely I will tell you there's definitely some truth what you say But you're not gonna I'm not calling for a suspension I don't want that out of the game, right?

When a guy who crashes into your knees the game before is in your blue paint, you're eligible to hack them. They can call a penalty on it. That's what makes hockey great. Right. What did I tell you in game one when Ridley cross-checked Tavares? Like you want that? You don't, you don't. In the game. If that's the way it is, then you just want that benefit to come back to you. And it did with Stolarz there. He got some licks in but you know what so did Ridley Gregg on Tavares even up let's move on that's the game. Yes you are a hockey man. You like hockey too. I love hockey. Tell everybody that that wants to change whatever they want to change about the game. I'm too, I'm way too online.

I just read stuff. I open my phone and I read things that make me exceedingly mad all day long. It's good for your brain. Oh, really good. Yeah, for sure. There's nothing. Constantly stimulate your fight or flight. Holy crap.

All right. Let's get head coach Travis Green's thoughts on returning home. They're going gonna be excited You're always excited in the playoffs when you play at home You know much like Toronto you could tell there's a lot of juice in their game to start the game and the crowd is loud it's You know you grow up watching playoff hockey It's fun too, it's exciting and that can't be forgotten It's fun too, it's exciting and that can't be forgotten. So I'm not worried about our guys embracing it.

I think one thing is we've got to make sure that we keep our emotional control, things that we've talked about since the start of the series. I thought we did a much better job in game two with our discipline. And it's been well documented, they've got a good power play, and we've got to make sure that we don't take a lot of penalties ruler Someone saying the least have a good power play Nice to hear No control our emotions. Yes, as well LA Kings, but it's good

We should go see we should go see because we have hold on hold on hold on I'm so excited. You had a Craig Ruby comment on Mark Savard. I've not heard it. Oh, it's very fun. Yeah, I assume it's fun. It's funny Okay, let's have a listen. Yeah, well we asked the players to be composed and we talk about it all the time So that goes for us, too Sometimes it's difficult. Hey Spike, how about we chase cars, huh? Does that sound like fun? Does that sound like fun? Let's chase cars.

That wouldn't be no fun. I love Mark Subard. That's funny. Spike. Well, we asked the players to be composed. I know you don't care, but I just can't wait to see what the crowd's crowds gonna look like Tonight, that's my number one most excited thing about this game Lee fans No way. No, it's gotta be if they have any civic pride in Ottawa It's gotta be 80 20 them up to fail

If they like if you're a season ticket holder and you've sold the two Leafs for this game sold out you know You you don't get your season tickets for next year. Yeah Yeah, imagine you're like a season ticket holder and you sit in your section that you usually do and you're you get there and your Buddy Johnny, oh Johnny. Oh, no Conference yesterday Like the guy the media conference tickets Yesterday to recline to Ann Lauer. That'll be like the guy the media conference tickets Okay, we'll go we'll go with Kevin B X that joins us after the break we'll get into more thoughts on

Who he now considers the best? Sixth defenseman in the national hot. Oh, yeah, like that. Well, I'll tell you who he thought when we returned a real kipper and born Everything you need to know about the Raptors and the biggest stories around the NBA. Smith & Jones. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the program, busy night. Welcome back to the program. Busy night. The National Hockey League helping us get ready. We got him in Leafs hour.

Kevin B X. Oh no, no, this is, this is a nice hour. That's what we're talking about. You're in the leaf. Well, we couldn't squeeze you into the national hour because you, you're like deep in meetings with really important world secrets. A on the, it's like science stuff. They're optional for Elliot.

But everyone else has to be there. Is Elliot still crawl in like five minutes before the show starts? Yeah, Elliot's Elliot. He's not changing. So, you know, it's always a fight in the makeup chair. It's always a fight in the hair chair. And I just go in there, I just sit down with my coffee

and I just sit back and watch it. And I watch the arguing and the negotiations back and forth. Well, hey, thanks for dropping by. Regardless, Kevin Biaxa, former NHL or Hockey Night in Canada. How surprised are you in terms of the Leafs being up to nothing and perhaps maybe still not seeing like the best side of them so far?

I think you look at the style that Craig Brubia was brought in to implement and it's being shown in the first two games. It's not the sexiest. It's not the flashiest. It doesn't create the most chances and shots on net, but it's effective and it works. And if everybody buys in, they're a tough team to beat So I think Ottawa was playing some really good hockey coming into this series and they've kind of been stifled a bit You know you see five guys in the house you see all 60 defending very well pretty simple with their breakouts You know just advance it and you know, and then you need the big guns to score So so far for the Leafs, I think it's been exactly the recipe to success for them How do you like that having elite talents, you know

Like Matthews and Marner and Nylander and those guys and having them be a dump it in dump it out sort of team You know, is that utilizing them properly or is it really just the best thing for playoff hockey? Keep it safe Well, I don't think Marner and Matthews are playing that way. I still think they're playing their game I still think Nylander is doing his thing. I don't I don't see themardner and Matthews are playing that way. I still think they're playing their game I still think Nylander is doing his thing I don't I don't see them dumping the puck in any more than last resort like it would be in the regular season I think you give those guys a bit of a leash you have to you give Tavarez a little bit of a leash but the rest of your team has to be predictable and get pucks in deep and play that Zone game, but I still see the top guys making plays now

You look on the other side of that, the equation in Ottawa, and I see Stootsla running around, I see Stootsla dumping every puck in, and it's just not his game, right? It's not where he's the most effective. He needs to skate the puck in, he needs to make plays. So there has to be a communication by the coaching staff, like don't completely change your game

to a dump and chase guy in the playoffs, because that's not exactly who you are. Yeah, there's a time to get the red line and get a deep and get a change when you're hemmed into your zone, but you still need to make plays. And I think Ottawa has to make a few more plays in the neutral zone, certain guys. Kevin, we know what line matching does this time of year.

If you're Travis Green right now with Stutzla at home, last change, how important is it to maybe get away from Austin Matthews? Yeah, I think you want Pinto if you're Ottawa Pinto at Matthews Pinto is kind of taking that shutdown role. And he's done well with it this year. So you'll get that I think it's it's pretty important. I think you chase it a bit. And talking with with Newsy and coach Coach coach Lalonde is Luke likes to call

him such a suck up. Oh, he really is coach. He coach. So he just wants to be one of the boys. So Newsy what he says it's it's a constant balance of how much do you chase that line matchup versus throwing everybody out of a rhythm. So I think I think you early on for sure you chase it a bit if you're out of it, you make sure you get pintoed against him and you chase it a bit if you're Ottawa. You make sure you get pent up against him,

and you give Stootsla and Brady a favorable matchup. It's been interesting because I'm thinking back to when your teams were really good, and thinking of the intimidation factor. So Ridley Gregg, Anthony Stolar is going at each other, kind of one of the stories of the series. And I think back to the old like Marchand on the Sedines and like that Sort of moment that felt similar to me where how much do you want these guys?

To go back at the opposition when it's not there naturally should ridley greg Should he be going back at Anthony Stolar's when he's getting those chops or? teammates How do you handle the other team trying to you know? Rough you up like as long as you can do that stuff and not throw Yourself off some guys just play better that way, you know max lapierre played better that way burrows played better that way Some guys don't some guys get on tilt when they start doing that kind of stuff Ridley Greg He's got a little bit of rat in them

You know the way he's played in the past and some of the things he's done and I say that in a good way Right. There's another guy on their team that's got some rat in him in a bad way. I think Ridley Gregg has it in a good way. It's competitive and he's kind of a thorn in the side. Now I feel like Ottawa thinks that he's gotten a little bit of punishment that hasn't been called. So I know they think that, hey, he's going to the hard areas,

but Stoller shouldn't get three chops at him. He shouldn't get two cross-checks, one, two, that one. And but this one right here, certainly after two, Kevin, like that one hurts. Listen, I think Ridley missed an opportunity to just pop him at that point. Then it's like, And now I didn't see that one.

Right? I'm like, That's a freebie for you. It's absolutely a freebie. This is the one guy that's probably in your heads more than anyone else in the first two games and You've got every excuse to pop them at that point Mmm, but you know Ridley like a lot of other guys little inexperienced this time of year we know we know guys like Ridley can make a

reputation and a career out of this time of year if if to your point, you know, you can kind of be in a space where you're not overextending yourself, but you're not shying away either. Like there's a fine line. There's no going back for Ridley. He's gotta go back to Stolleart at some point. We think Corey Burr is doing in that situation, right? Totally, he's falling on him.

Him and Jonathan Quick, like he's the reason why LA didn't win more cups because of him and Quick and him on top of Quick and pretending to fall on him. If Quick chopped him, he'd turn around and he'd push him like, you know, not very hard, but you know, like, you're right, I agree with you. Ridley can't back down now or else you look like that you're either scared or intimidated by him,

but like you're in it, Ridley, you're in it now. Now don't take that penalty. It's the fine line, but this is what guys like you gain reputations on. There's a time, like people understand the game within the game and the referees, like when something like that happens, when the guy gets a three chops on you

and it's not called, you get a freebie, and the worst case is it's gonna be evened up the worst case That's why I like as a D man I loved it when the goalie covers the puck and a guy chops the goalie And I know I get a free shot as long as I don't go Excessive and like hit him in the face with my stick I know I get a pretty good leg and the worst case is gonna be 50-50 and both can roll the box Someone that may have fallen on a goalie

50-50 and both can over the box As someone that may have fallen on a goalie my career It's just not then between you and stole arts. It's whoever else you suck in Right, and who knows what the reaction would be from a teammate or an opposition player now Someone gets another lick in there. They're they're penalized. You're not. There's a better chance of still a power play off of it, not based on you and the goalie, but everybody else around you. Like you wanna pull people,

this is what people talk about, drawing players in and your teammates into the fight. And I think that's where Ottawa may have to go in game three. And on home ice, maybe a little bit easier to do that. Yeah. I think, cause you know, like the referees react to the crowd and when the crowd's loud in certain situations, they're like,

oh my God, what happened? And you're going to get the right reactions at home versus in Toronto. So as they make their adjustments, how personally do you take it? Do you take a matchup? Like if they say, we want to get you out there every shift against so-and-so, how personally do you take it matchup? Like if they say we want to get you out there every shift against so and so, how

personally do you take it about being in that person's ear, making sure they get nothing? Is that something that would have mattered to you? Like it might to Ottawa now that they have home ice? So we were talking about this last night with Ovechkin, because I had a couple hard matchups against Ovechkin where, you know, the coach would say you're playing every single shift against him, I want you against him.

And I remember like, what do you think about Ovechkin? She let him sleep or should you go on him? Probably should let him sleep. Not really in my DNA. So I would go at him and I would like chop him after the whistle. I'd push him, I cross check him. He obviously wouldn't back down on five on five.

He'd still run me and everything. But the one time I knew I got to him, it was the third period, it was like 10 minutes left. And left and he went out I went out and just before the puck was dropped I saw him stand up and look around Just to see if I was there and I was there and I saw him and I started smiling because I saw what he was Doing and then he started smiling and I'm like, he knows that I'm coming for me knows I'm not so to answer your question I think you take a ton of pride in that if you get get a job, if Pinto gets a job and it's like, hey, if you shut down 34 and 16,

we got a good chance to win this. As long as we stay out of the box. Yeah, so I wanna elaborate on that a bit, because we talked a bit about the way that Borubi has used Marner and Matthews. Very defensive, they've actually had, what was it? Eight D-zone starts, only three in the O-zone. Well, Nylander and Tavara is the opposite. Do you like the idea of saying your best players, you're going to handle this defensive load, you're going to go against

Stootsla, you're our guys and you've got to figure out the offensive side of it as well. It's kind of a tough spot to put those guys in. I think it's trust though. I think as a coach, you probably trust two lines in your D-zone, like really trust two lines. And I think Matthews is one of the best three zone players in the world. So I think, you know, you look at Eichel, Eichel probably would be the same.

Like you, yeah, he's an unbelievable offensive player, a hundred points, but you probably want him taking a lot of the defensive zone just for that reason. So yeah, like, and then, you know, default, you have to put some other lines in the offensive face-off, you know, but you're still, you trust Matthews is so good in both ends. I think that's why you're seeing him more,

and you're seeing him on the PK as well. Pretty easy though, when you're up to nothing in the first five minutes of the game. If the Leafs chase at any point, and they gotta start pushing the pace of play in the offensive zone though, that's where Ruby's gotta push him a little harder here for sure yeah and he will I think he will you'll see like if they're down then you'll see Nylander or Marner or Matthews you'll

see one of them or all three out or Tavares because he wins every face-off that's important what do you expect out of Brady Kachuk coming down he's the captain they're at home they're down to nothing. How hard does he have to push the envelope? I think you see him physical early to get the crowd into it. I think you see him though, maybe you see a couple more scrums out of him. There hasn't been many scrums, but maybe he feels like he needs to get that out of the crowd

and out of his teammates. I think you see him around the net a lot obviously, and he's a pretty clutch guy. I think you see a lot of him tonight. I think you see him protecting Pucks down low That's the one thing for Ottawa like they've done a good job once they get in zone and get the puck back They've done a good job of protecting it and having some zone time I should ask you about that because that's the one thing watching the panel

I know that Leafs fans were upset about is that oh, yeah one thing Leafs win the game and you know You guys talked about how Ottawa controlled the play. They're going to play at five on five numbers, which with numbers. And they absolutely did. You know, how much does a team sit back once you're ahead protecting the lead? How much do you attribute Ottawa's play in those moments to leave saying,

we're the team ahead who, you know, we don't want to push it. We don't want to. We're not trying to score anymore. Yeah, it's a combination. I think like it starts in the offensive zone so when you're up by a couple goals f3 is a little bit more passive your D when you know sometimes your dear making the walls hard they're probably not going and you're just living another day you're backing up in your in your three man wedge as opposed to maybe making that line hard and keeping it in so then

it trickles down so then they get the red line they dump it in and so and so and so so but I mean I still think like yeah They're up to nothing but I was still a good team like it's an even series, right? Yeah, Ottawa could still easily get back into the series with a couple wins So there has to be a little bit of respect there for the Leafs Like they're not just gonna dominate and walk all over Auto like be happy winning the two games be happy that your power plays on fire fire right? Like but if you want to dominate every facet of the game it's not there yet and it doesn't have to be you just have to win four games. I gotta ask you about Almark. A couple days ago we were talking about him and I said if

this guy was my goalie he'd drive me nuts you know because he's a he's a very talented guy and we've seen so many sides of him in this season alone. We've seen him really, really good. We've seen him at times not great and then at times disappear for an injury. And pressure now to come in on a game three, I think he got better, obviously played a lot better in game two, no question. But you played with Luongo and compare that intensity or if he had a bad night, giving up six

like Allmark did in game one, like the response of him or his demeanor. I just listened to him after game one, like it was a walk in the park, and you weren't very good. I mean, what's this guy got to do to prove to people that he's worthy of 8.25 million a year? I don't overthink goalies. I'm not a goalie expert. I just say stop the puck. You have one job, just stop the puck. I don't care how weird you are. I don't care what your

work ethic is or habits, obviously they matter, but you mentioned the long goal, I also played with Jacob Markstrom earlier in his career, I played with John Gibson and Freddie Anderson, so four of those goalies, all completely different personalities. Gibson was another guy that was kind of easy going and maybe didn't work the hardest in practice,

but then he'd have an unbelievable game. So I don't know what the correlation is, like goalies are just weird, man. Like at the end of the day, they are. So at the end of the day, like, yeah, like his demeanor's different and he's like, he's a really nice guy, Al Mark, right? And he's, you know, he's making light of it after the game.

Like Stuart Skinner was laughing after, you know, when it was six two last night, you know, like goalies are weird. Like they got a lot going on. So like, I don't try to understand them, right? I just say, hey, just stop the puck. Like give us a chance to win tonight. I don't try to understand them right I just say hey just stop the puck like give us a chance to win tonight I don't care how weird you are, but just stop more pucks tonight. Yeah, I mean that's all you can do I guess it's it is a confounding

I don't he's a little too casual in those interviews for for Kip's liking I'm trying to make sense of that though like goalies and doesn't mean anything the The big change the Leafs are making is bringing Max Petruetti, hasn't played since February 8th, Robertson coming out. How do you feel about that? I think they're just trying to get more guys involved because they think it's gonna be a longer run. Robertson hasn't played bad.

It's been fine. He's been okay, McMahon's been okay. There's a couple guys that you can kind of, if you wanna add guys in in but I think that's more Of we know we're gonna need more guys as we get deeper into this thing and you can't let patch already sit there too long Yeah, so I don't think it's as much of a slight on Robertson as it is We just got to get more guys like not sitting for two weeks at a time Are you surprised how physical he showed us he could get earlier in in this season?

Robertson? No, no Max. Yes. Petruredi. Like we know when guys are trying to check you to get the puck and then we also know when guys are trying to hurt you. Like this guy hurt a lot of people earlier on in the season which I didn't see coming at all. Well you're not in the league anymore. I'm not in the league anymore. There's a lot of guys that not in the league anymore. I'm not in the league anymore. There's a lot of guys that are in the league. I played against Patch already for the first 10 years. He wasn't even doing that.

Wouldn't even recognize that guy. I just don't know why you wouldn't do it today because there's usually no repercussions to doing that stuff. He's a big guy. He's strong. He skates pretty well still. Why wouldn't you run around today? Like you don't have to fight anyone in retaliation if you don't want to we know that and it's super effective

The way Brady pay it plays Tom Wilson. They obviously fight a little bit more, but it's super effective Like you're you're running as you're hurting guys, but but Some guys refuse to do it. I know it's amazing right refuse it It's like you can make a lot more money You can make a lot more money like what do you think of the evolution of some of these guys? So patcher eddie's won, but corey perry became a fourth line grinder after winning a heart trophy Spezza came here in toronto and played fourth line I mean thorton tried to do it a little bit a lot of he was always a prick but these elite guys betta

No, no, perry. Yeah, we've had thorn always had that as part of their game. Always had that. Always. Never. So you're not surprised. They just picked their spots a lot more when you were scoring 40 and 50 goals. You have it or you don't. Like if it has to be drawn out of you or pulled out of you or forced out of you,

it's not gonna last. I thought that was part of Thornton's reputation as a younger guy was that he didn't, he was too laid back, too casual. He was, but he also still fought, and he still, he had it in him, but it had to be dragged out of him. But it was, I think it was there

where some guys just don't have it, and some kids just don't have it in minor hockey. You're like, man, if you could just play a little stiffer, you'd be a hell of a player, and kids just don't get it. So one of the things that we saw in game two, it was well documented outside of Max shooting in the net, was Simone Benoit stepping up, not only intercepting the pass,

but making a brilliant play, which you called the best sixth defenseman in the history of the game. Ever. Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame. Can you get in the Hall of Fame as a 60? But like, that's a play that you would expect

from Morgan Riley, not Benoit. when you get in the Hall of Fame as a 16. But like, that's a play that you would expect from Morgan Riley, not Benoit. Like it was a big time play. I just have seen his evolution. He was in Anaheim at the end of my career. So I kind of overlap with him just a little bit, talk to him a little bit. I remember talking about the golf tournament

and he's like, I'm gonna do that Superman punch one day. And I'm like, okay. Oh really, that was actually part of like. That was probably five years ago. And he goes, I really liked that Superman punch. I'm gonna do that Superman punch one day. And I'm like, okay. That was actually part of like. That was probably five years ago. And he goes, I really like that Superman punch. I'm gonna do it one day. Then he steps up to the tee and just smashes a drive, 3.30. I'm like, geez, this guy's aggressive, right?

So I wasn't surprised when I saw him try it. But I think he's one of those guys, I'm gonna do a little thing on him tonight. Like he had to earn everything. Like try out at ID, rookie ID camp, try out at main camp, try out to get an HL spot, try out to get an NHL spot. So he's had to earn everything. And some guys just get better.

They just keep getting better. They keep figuring out the nuances of the position. They keep getting their skillset better, their reads. And some guys are up and down, up and down. Some guys are up and then way down. He just keeps chipping away. He just keeps getting better and better. And as hockey guys, we love that.

We love when a guy earns it and gets recognition for it. He wouldn't get that recognition in Anaheim. If he was still in Anaheim as a 6D, making those plays, like he went into the corner once against Brady, and it was like one little bump and got the puck off him. I'm like, wow, like that is invaluable that your 6D can go out against their number one power forward and take the puck off him. I'm like, wow, like that is invaluable. That your 6D can go out against their number one power forward and take the puck off him like that,

no zone time out of the zone. They didn't think he was tough in Anaheim at all. Benoit. He's tough, and I think he hits hard too. He's your perfect mold for a 6D. Like, is he gonna throw Pete's up the middle once in a while? Maybe, right? But he's physical, he wins more than 50% of his battles,

he's high percentage, like, I love the way he plays. So you've been, your son is playing now and you've been coaching a little bit, I think? A lot. A lot of it. A lot, yeah, I was all in, bud. Yeah, so you're all in coaching there. And so now it's funny. You're a crazy dad then too. Cause you're- No, I'm more,

I look at all the kids as my kids. You can ask my kids. I never coached my son. I coached, he was a player. Everyone was the same, but I'm done now. I retired. So do you want to be done with coaching? I think I had a group, I had a group for about five, six years, same core.

And now they're all moving on to junior. I have like eight of them that are already committed to AJ, BCHL, WHL. So I'm gonna just take a step back now. Cause I was so dedicated to this one group and I loved it. But now it's like, how do you just take all that love and work and just give it to a new set of kids that you don't know. So I'm gonna take a bit here.

If we have time, on the panel the other day, you guys talked about Laine and not putting him out in the final minute You know, yeah, I thought it was a really good conversation. You guys, you know surrounded the conversation Well about should he be out there? He had been a dog, but he can shoot it in the net You know, there's so many different elements to that coaching Do you like the X's and O's part or the personality management part both? Yeah, I love both. I love I love special teams I love face off plays first and foremost I love structure plays but then I love the the relationships and the communication because I feel like as

Like the good coaches I've had they can get through to me and the and some of the coaches I'm thinking of like this one guy right away. Like I didn't care what he said I wasn't listening this guy because I hated his delivery. I hated his body language So I think with the line a thing it doesn't have to be a big deal to line-A if it's handled the right way. If Marty goes and talks to him today and says, hey man, like you just weren't going, you know, like it's just one of those that you're still a big part of our team. You're still one of the best flank guy, like fluff them a bit.

Like you're still one of the best flank guys in the league. You know, you got a great shot. We're going to need you. You're a huge part, but you just weren't, you just weren't going. So you know, I went with a couple other guys guys but not like that's the way it should be handled And then line you'll be like, okay, like I'm still a stick player, you know It's just one game because you should be able to bench and news He was talking about benching Kuturov back after he won the heart

It shouldn't be a big deal to bench your top guy if he's just not going so nice. You just don't have it one period when top guy if he's just not going. Sometimes you just don't have it. God, I love it. One period, wham, wham. At least, the broovy didn't. No, I know. We argue about it all the time, though. I feel like... But it's got to get bad, though. Like, I think it has to be really bad to bench your star. And, Lainey, you can disagree with me, it was getting really bad. Where he couldn't make, he couldn't go a shift without a turnover. So quickly, we know how you feel about Benoit's ranking. Where would you rank Elliot on being the fourth best analyst on any panel?

Where would you rank him? Fourth best on any panel? Would he make your top four best on any panel? By a sliver. If there's four panelists, yeah, by a sliver. Can you just get him to do his nod up a little bit for me, please? I don't get involved in the wardrobe. There's enough people, Deb and Fabien.

Totally in control. There's, there's, we have three people that come in for wardrobe and it's not for me. He is Kevin Biaxa and you're going to get your fill of him tonight on Hockey Night in Canada. Thanks for doing this, pal. Thank you guys. All right. We're back national next on The Real Kipper and Bourne Show.