Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Putting the Goalie Debate to Bed

Episode Date: April 4, 2024

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee start with a rare day in Toronto sports as the Leafs, Raptors and Jays all lost on the same night yesterday. They get into the Leafs' 4-1 loss to the Bolts, Tampa heating up at the right time, Toronto's special teams inconsistencies and if the goalie battle can finally be put to bed after an unremarkable outing from Joseph Woll. They are joined by Leafs' radio analyst Jim Ralph (32:27) who shares his thoughts on where the team stands after a pair of games against the Florida teams, Samsonov claiming the starting job, a more confident bottom 6 and what questions still need to be answered before playoffs.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Giddy up for the next two hours The Kipper Homes, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee Derek Brandeo and David Siss Boom bah This is the Leaf edition of the Kipper and Bourne show We are live on Sportsnet 590 Sportsnet 360, Sportsnet Plus

From 4 to 6. Download us if you don't catch us live on any of your favorite pods. And text us at 590-590 as we shorten the week because we are off the air for a Blue Jay game tomorrow. You can't miss the Blue Jays. I'm not sure people will be real happy to hear that, especially with their cold bats. In fact,

yesterday was only the 11th time in history that the Blue Jays, the Leafs, and the Raptors all lost at the same time. Do you know that every single player on the Leafs had a hit last night, and you can't say the same for the Blue Jays?

I believe one person had a hit. The Toronto Raptors lost by 48 points last night. 40? 1-33 to 85 was the final score of that match. The Blue Jays are the first team in the modern MLB history since 1901 to be victimized by a no-hitter and a one-hitter in the first seven games of the season. So hot start.

Is it really being victimized when you do it to yourself? Yeah, I guess you're right. Also a programming note. So we're off Friday and then Monday. If you listen to us on Sportsnet 590, the fan or listen to us out in Calgary or in Vancouver, we're two to four on Monday because of the home opener. So two to four on Monday. Yeah.

Lots of moving parts due to the Toronto Blue Jays. So we are two to four on Monday because of the home opener. Two to four on Monday. Yeah. Lots of moving parts due to the Toronto Blue Jays. So we are two to four Monday. I had a veteran news reporter tell me to tell you that it's Calgary. What'd I say? You say Calgary. Calgary. Calgary. I'm not from there.

I say like people from Calgary. You don't Calgary say, probably say Toronto. Toronto. Toronto. Right? Toronto. So I'm supposed to say Calgary? Calgary. Calgary. Okay. Sorry, Calgary probably say Toronto. Toronto. Toronto, right? So I'm supposed to say Calgary? Calgary. Calgary. Okay.

Detroit, Calgary. Did you really expect him to say, okay, thanks for letting me know? No chance. No chance. That's why I did it on air and not off air. Very good point. I was at the game last night. I've always mixed feelings about going because how...

There's no rewind button in person, is there? A little bit of a sideshow. I love our alumni box. How was the salmon? No, roasted chicken last night. Oh, nice. Yes. Fantastic.

Yeah. Fantastic. But good energy. A lot of people feeling like there's some some real life out of the toronto maple leafs i know they were disappointed with the 4-1 loss last night but you also got a team full of future hall of famers on the other side that uh looked like they're not ready to give up on uh an incredible run so far don't want to draw that team in playoffs hey trust tree time boys oh here we go we're in the tree that might be the best team in the east in the east okay what happened here what happened we spent 85 of the season talking about the florida panthers being the team to beat

and now sammy comes in with Ditch the Panthers. First off, Carolina is the best team in the league. And let's go with the Tampa Bay Lightning. What? No way. I will say, if Tampa Bay were to play Boston, which right now that would be the matchup in round one, I don't know who the favorite would be.

Truly don't even know. According to books it would probably be Boston just because they have the better record they've had a better year they've been garbage yeah for sure so they'd probably be like you know minus 110 favorites for that series like it wouldn't be a big thing it's a real coin toss and I think you'd be

a fool to bet the Bruins there if you're taking if I'm looking at the way the two teams that I just watched I watched Florida on Monday who looked tired, dis organized, bad defensively, you know, let in six did not look great.

And then I watched two days later, watch that Tampa team with, you know, they gave up a few shots and they were, they, but then weren't really in the middle of the ice, the way Vasilevsky looks, the way their top guys look,

there's no question in my mind who's a better team. No question. Tampa Bay Lightning. You think I'm crazy? No, no, we'll get into that. We'll get into it a little bit more as we describe what we saw last night out of the lease in Tampa Bay. We've got close to an hour here, so spread it out a little bit.

Sprinkle the infield or the outfield on. Just sprinkle it everywhere. Sprinkle. Did Toronto give him a fair fight last night other than the obvious physicalities? You know, I thought that, yeah ryan reeves made some statements right with some physical play the fight but also the hits he was all over him um i did think that the leafs just struggled to get inside they've been so good offensively um you know i think they're

the number one they scored the most goals in february in the nhl the most goals in march in the nhl and last night i i didn't feel like they were getting... They got shots, but they didn't get to the dangerous areas quite as much. Tampa, we know, has some finishers. Joseph Wohl was an awesome, otherwise a fairly even game for me. I thought they played really well in the first period. I thought it was... It was disappointing.

Yeah, and I thought they were pretty good in the second too. Loved the special team stuff, right? I thought their power play got one, right? Matthewews goal is a power play it did yeah wasn't a it wasn't a set up and we yeah it wasn't like uh there's a goal on the power play not a power play goal yeah it's yeah it's a it's a set play off of a winning draw right it's not a hey the power play looks good they're snapping it around everybody's getting involved, hey, the power play looks good. They're snapping it around. Everybody's getting involved. Good touches. It's PK.

17 straight now since I said they'd get better. All right, let's go to Sheldon Keefe. We'll get Sheldon. You didn't say they'd get better. You said it doesn't matter. No, no, I did write that there's reason to believe it's going to get better. Sheldon Keefe with our first Kippers Clipper on the overview of what he saw last night like lots about our first period defensively was outstanding didn't give up a shot for the first 10 minutes of the game so that was really good uh penalty

kill was outstanding tonight you know against the toughest challenge in the league you know you win a special teams battle tonight against the, you know, from looking at power play, penalty kill perspective, it's, you know, right at the top of the league in terms of the challenge on special teams. And we win the special teams battle tonight. When you do that against this team, you're putting yourself in a pretty good spot to win the game, which ultimately I think we were in a pretty good spot to win the game. But we made a few more mistakes than they did. You know, they played a really good, smart, defensive game.

Didn't give us a lot. When we did get to their net, the goalie was outstanding, but we didn't get there enough, and then, you know, we made some mistakes that they capitalized on. Ray, we leave point open alone at the net. We give Samkos a two-on-one. That ultimately really is the difference in the game. I've got a take.

And my take is that, is it Guy Boucher who's running the power play? Yep. Pretty crummy job since Mitch Marner's been out. You know, like, I think most of us could have handled a power play unit with Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Morgan, Riley, thrown it over the boards, told them where to stand, and had a 20- handled a power play unit with Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Morgan, Riley, thrown it over the boards, told them where to stand and had a 20 plus percent power play. It's a challenge.

Once you lose one of those guys and you have to adapt and fill guys in and sort of find new ways to utilize these guys. And, you know, yeah, they shoot one in last night, but that's not really a power play goal. But for weeks now,

it's like he hasn't come up with any plan any sort of hasn't looked threatening at all am i way off and thinking there's some coaching involved here yes and to be quite honest with you and i know the percentage overall has always looked very healthy yeah but there's times when i've watched it with mitch marner on it and i still think it looks terrible and i don't know whether or not it's just yeah whoever's sending the message is it gui boucher ultimately it has to fall on sheldon keith he's the head coach yeah so something's not right there to me it's still a bunch of very talented guys that are looking untalented on it well when you watch tampas it's just every guy they're good too like they're like but don't get me wrong the least have amazing talent on theirs but when you watch

tampas every guy knows exactly what their role is on it. The rotation on it, and again, the first goal wasn't a power play goal, but they managed to pull the goalie, get the extra attacker out there, and make it look like a fabulous power play. It was essentially a power play goal. But that Hedman shot, who has that for the Leafs? I guess Riley could conceivably snap one top corner from the point, but I haven't seen it this year. It was not the shot.

It was the rotation and then the traffic enough that it wasn't a blistering shot. It wasn't a typical like hammered from the blue line. It was a good shot that was timed perfectly to get some traffic in front of Joseph Wall. But the amount of time that the puck spends on a maple leaf stick compared to the time it spends on a Tampa Bay is night and day. One's a split second, and the other one's you need an egg timer. I tell you what, there's nothing more scary if you're rooting for the Leafs than when Kucherov does the fake shot pass into the bumper

and your goalie is fully squared up for the one-timer, like, I mean, we've talked about it a hundred times, but it's just such a dangerous play. Well, the thing, you're talking about the roles, is that they have point in the bumper, but then you can go... His handedness works. But you could also have Kucherov,

where he's opening up to a little, it looks like he's going to go to the bumper, and you've got one of the best one-timer guys of all time on the half boards where you can fire it out wide and he can hammer it to stamkos it's like there's just two yeah they're made in the lab options for them neilander's shown to heaven not stamkos though but it's not star it's not stamkos it's not the few. It's not a trademark one-time slap shot that we've seen over and over again like we have with Stamkos or Ovechkin. But that guy can fire pucks off that pass.

He can. But how many looks does he get with a good rotation, right, compared to the other guys. Yeah, I mean, Kucherov is one of the game's best passers. I don't see Willie set up that way. I can't remember Matthews ever going seam to him. No. Flank to flank.

No. You know, the way Kucherov wills to Stamkos. But then again, I can't remember anyone popping from the bumper and taking one from Matthews either, right? Like he's generally shooting it or holding it and passing it down low or back to the top yeah somebody's dusting it off and the rotation on the pk gets time to adjust and then there's lanes taken away and it's not one of three options it's my only option the thing that kills me though kip is they used to flip them on their flanks and

matthews would be on his other side to catch and shoot sometimes to just mix it up a little bit i haven't seen him anywhere outside of that you know ovi spot on the flip side for i mean i don't know this year so yeah i just think it's been stagnant that's all and that to me is a little bit of coaching point kucherov i actually think Point is the most underrated guy in the league. That's fine. Because everyone always talks about, like, your favorite guys are Yossi and Barkov, but everyone says they're underrated.

No one ever says Point's underrated, but when you have the conversation about the best guys in the league, no one ever brings up Point. If you're doing a who do you want in playoffs, he's way up there. Like, he would be shockingly high on my list of guys that would take he looks so good he looks healthy he looks healthy remember this time last year i think he was battered and bruised in and out and played a key part now of tampa not winning has drop off right they have real drop off where when they were winning cups the drop off was not as significant a key part of Tampa not winning. Now, that 10-team has drop-off, right?

They have real drop-off where when they were winning cups, the drop-off was not as significant. There's guys out there, you're like, okay, that guy's whatever. But, yeah, those guys are still those guys. Meanwhile, Florida, Ekblad's hurt, may come back for playoffs. Verhagen's hurt, may come back for playoffs. As good as Tampa looks, like, you know, there's a drop-off after Ha looks like you know there's a drop off after headman you know

chernak chernak looked good last night he did but is he the second horse on this blue line right now there is no sergachev and there is no ryan mcdonough yeah no that's there you should in theory be able to get to the net, and the Leafs struggled to do that last night. What did you guys make of the goaltending? I think we've pretty much put to bed the playoff. Is there any debate left? Could it be swung, or is it all Samsonov now?

I mean. He wasn't terrible, but he wasn't good. Joseph Wall. Yeah, last night. Sorry. I didn't like him. I don't like him. He's coming off two and a half months. I think Wall's shot's great, but he shouldn't good. Joseph Wall. Yeah, last night. Sorry. I didn't like him. I don't like him. He's coming off two and a half months.

The ball shot's great, but it shouldn't go in. No, it should not go in. Too deep. Great shot. Too deep. That's it. He's coming off two and a half months of a significant injury here, and it doesn't appear like he's fast-tracking to where he needs to be

or want to be right now for this to be a healthy two-man kind of 1A, 1B feel. It is now Samsonovs and a distant second Joseph Wall. And does he get two more starts, three more starts? If they look anything like they did last night, I'm even questioning whether or not he should back up. No, see, for me, that's a bridge too far. It's like I was talking to my guy, Stephen Zorba, a fellow Greek guy of yours,

and we were talking about how Wohl is just such a confident guy that even if he's coming into a game, game three, and he hasn't been playing well, he just has this belief and this confidence. I would be okay with him going in, what he'd be able to do. He did it last year in Florida when he went in for them. His numbers are actually pretty good from that series last year. He wasn't terrible.

So I'm fine with him being able to come off the bench, but there's no doubt at this point that it's going to be Samsonov in game one. Can I ask you guys how, because this is something I was thinking about watching that game can i ask you how they handled him coming back from injury where he starts his first starts against uh phoenix right his first one back and where he plays well but then it's like you sure doing double boston was the best way to handle a guy coming off of 85-day injury? Are we sure? Was it a baptism by fire, seeing if he can handle it?

Looking back, in hindsight, of course it's 2020. But is that the right way to do it? Do you not feel like the Boston-Boston was his chance to kind of grab it? Well, it felt like they saw him as the game one starter. They were dying for him to grab it. And it was like, hey. It didn't happen. But he wasn't ready for it, maybe.

Like we said, he came off of that. And sure, you're coming back. You've gone through all the tests. You're ready to go. You're healthy. You're in the lineup. You're eligible to play games. Yeah.

But, you know, that's a big ask. Meanwhile, at that time, Samsonov was getting Washington and winning and feeling good about himself. And, yeah, maybe that would have been the way to go. But as you said, hindsight is 20-20 at the time. I was like, do it. Put him in the games, you know. All right, let's get Sheldon Keefe's thoughts

on Joseph Wall, clip four. Derek. He doesn't get a shot for the first 10 minutes of the game, and then, you know, it's a laser from the top with traffic from Hedman, and then it's a Brayden Boyd left alone, and it's Stamkos in alone at 2-1. Like, those are some tough spots, but you probably need to save on one of those three, you know,

to keep us going, especially with the quality of goaltending at the other end. That's just the reality of the game, but he made a couple big saves once it was at three to keep it there and allow us to get a chance to stay in the game. So he did his job in that sense. But like I said, it's one of those games where one or two mistakes our way, one or two saves their way.

That's really what the game comes down to. And then you just keep playing from behind against a team that, you know, plays smart and a textbook third period from their perspective. And, you know, it just shows that, you know, playing from behind is a bad recipe. So Samsonov goes in Saturday night, or does he try to give wall an easy an easier game here uh saturday is samson off one doesn't want to go montreal samson off doesn't want to go

full week without a game yeah and i think if you're in the mindset of getting this guy ready for game one feeling good is a good thing and going to montreal and play well that's uh i think you continue on with the tradesies for a bit here so last night or yesterday uh we listened to a clip from sheldon keith and he talked about how he was intentionally putting a line in a tough circumstance right i think it was the holmberg nice robertson line and saying you know and you had the the lines yesterday about like is now the time for this sort of thing but i think he's trying to figure some things out with this team last night cuthbert and simmer did a great job highlighting how keith was leaving out the fourth line which is reeves uh doerar, and Kampf. Dewar and Kampf, presumably,

are going to be a part of a shutdown line. And this, to me, felt like a test. D-Zone starts against the other team's first line. Back-to-back face-offs. Can you get it done? They get scored on.

And Simmer nails the call. He's like, well, I guess you got your answer. And I was like, oh, Simmer. But it was great.

He set the stage. He put the ball in the tee. Yeah. And then it got... The only thing missing was, like, that sound from the game show where it goes... Womp, womp, womp.

Womp, womp. Thanks for playing. But... That's even better. There you go. But it's still going to be Camp and Dewar on a fourth line and a defensive assignment. I don't know if it's going to be Reeves or not,

but Camp was the guy last night who, you know, left his guy a little bit. And he's right there with point down low. Yeah. Do you want to hear the clip about it? He started chasing the puck. Yeah. Yes, we do. Let's do it.

Clip two. Got to have some trust in some other guys. It's that time of the year that line to me in the first period was our best line. We want to put them in a position. They had a couple shifts against that line in the first period that went extremely well for us. And I thought that Matthews and Tavares, because I've been kind of chasing the matchups,

and we had just come out of a power play not long before that. They were a penalty kill, one of the two. It was a power play and needed another line. So, you know, to me, that's, you know, especially right now where we're at, that's my third option in a defensive situation. So you need to get through that. But, you know, like I said, we're fine there

if Kanford just holds at the net front. We would be okay there, but made a mistake. That's my third option in defensive situations talking about matthews then tavarez then camp that's interesting that he sees him as a third option yeah and listen i'm i applaud ryan reeves for the battle back to to where he is today yeah Yeah. But there's just no world that I ever envisioned him being on the ice defensively when Kucherov and Pointer are on the ice. No world. That's what makes getting him into the lineup so hard

in playoffs for me is that he's going to have to play on a fourth line. You would like that fourth line to be a defensive shutdown type group, and you just can't have him out there chasing kucherov and point around but you know we had otzi on the show on monday talking about the physicality in game ones and game threes and if you're going up against florida like to me has to be in the lineup game one you're sacrificing whatever it is you're sacrificing with him to have him in there to have a bit of a conscience no yeah we're having a different conversation though right we're talking about starting in the playoffs or being in a situation on the ice he's not gonna be but but

yeah so to your point though i think he can be in the game and say we're not gonna start him in the d zone against kucherov ever you know that's what's stupid about doing it last night because you're never doing that anytime ever well you wonder you wonder if he's seeing, can I do this? Is this possible? No, you can't. You clearly cannot. What hockey, like any hockey mind, you ask any hockey fan in the world, do you think that's a good idea?

Yeah. No. No. No. No. No. Will that ever work? I don't know.

I mean. No. Unless it hits a ship. There's something that some things that Sheldon has done. That's given Ryan Reeves some confidence here moving forward. I do feel like that's part of it, right? It may be, but does the whole team have to take one on the chin for that to happen? I mean, no, but they, you know, camp doesn't have to leave his guy and maybe they get through that shift.

You know, maybe that's a bad bounce for old Revo there who otherwise had a very good night okay speaking of that let's go to sheldon keef on ryan reeves well tonight i mean was by far and away the most physical he's been um in terms of just being able to get there on time make the contacts and have them be uh impactful contacts you know that really i thought set a tone in the game. And then not just that, but we also got pucks back. Danny's getting to the net front. That line's shooting pucks. Like, that line was a real highlight for us in that first period.

And Revo was leading the charge. So that's terrific to see. I thought it wasn't just that. I just thought after the whistles, too, he was a really strong presence in the game. And then, obviously, you know, handles himself extremely well in the fight so you know all those things he certainly did his job tonight man he punch sized that guy's face for free yeah that was that was a really good tactical fight he was like waiting for jeno to throw to get underneath and come over top yeah he's a professional like he's got that the move

that he does where he dips down with the overhand right yeah that really catches guys and it it caught you know pretty good in the next hour top of the hour we're going to welcome in mike rup nhl network analyst we're going to get obviously into the devils and the rangers last night with that opening shift why Why, what happened? 162 penalty minutes. Was anyone talking about it? Did it come up? But it did open up the debate again, wide open.

Even last night, there's a lot of social media talk on the Ryan Reeves fight up 3-1. It's in the third period. It's a little later. The only talk is Jeno shouldn't give him that fight. Did we? Yeah. Well, whatever the case is, was it a meaningful fight?

Was it a useless fight? Was it necessary? Like, I'm sitting there going, Tanner Jeno is a scary guy coming at you. And any time that you can get this guy out of the game it's a good thing yeah for the Toronto Maple Leafs they're gonna go play him next week game you're looking for a pop of momentum I don't hate that one maybe maybe not for sure but again like you took a piece off of Tanner Janot last night you You got to go and play next week. We don't even know if he's going to play.

You know, if Tanner Janot is not ready to go play now game one in the playoffs or you match up with him in the second round, like it's a meaningful fight that doesn't have to just be in that moment or in that specific game. Yeah, you're weeks from playoffs. Janot, he left the game concussion protocol and didn't come back. And they're a weaker club without him in the lineup.

Yeah. This is a competition. You're preaching to the quiet. It was like, you're going to get a yes from me. That was awesome. You see, I mean, my wife took an excellent video last night of the fight, put it out on Twitter. Tons of people told me her favorite player

on the team is Ryan Reeves, and she got home for the game. I'm like, oh my God. I knew I married the right woman. And it was just like, let's go. go i don't know like i loved it and you see the fans react jeno's asking them to fight they're down 3-1 if they come back in that game they get a goal everyone's like see it's meaningful like you he has to take that fight there's no way he does it of course yeah jeno giving it to him was surprising to me well actually didn't reese

say something post-game about Janot being like... He thought they were going to go earlier. Oh, okay. And then it happened later. We've got a Ryan Reeves-Kippers clipper, don't we? We do. All right, let's hear it. Oh, man.

You know, I think that month, month and a half that I was out, I used that as a mini training camp. I worked hard. I bagged. I worked on everything that I could. I was doing two, three a day sometimes and just trying to get confidence back. Confidence is a real thing, and that's the first time I've probably gone through something like that in my career where I just felt like nothing was going right, and I just felt like I had no confidence.

I just used that opportunity to try and build it back. Coming off of the break, I felt like my game started getting a little bit better, and then just been building on it ever since. Reeves has been north of 10 minutes in four of his last eight games, which maybe doesn't sound consequential to people, but it's a lot for him.

He was playing six minutes. I was going to say, I thought he was playing three some nights. Yeah. I don't know if I said it on this show or one of our Leaf telecasts, but the Leafs need Ryan Reeves like that last night more than they need Nick Robertson with a potential shot on goal.

Like there's just, this week, he hammers Mikola. He hammers Hedman. He carries significant weight. Dust Hedman. That was great. With the emotional aspect of a game, he keeps everybody on their toes. Like, that's what it's for for that's why you have a guy like that you know i don't know if it were game six and seven series on the line if he's in but

i think to start the series you certainly have him as a part of it yes no question and that's which means a good player is watching game one craiger holmberg if he can maintain that energy and and get in on a four check he's playing game six and game seven too. You just need seven minutes of that. He's definitely skating better. I remember a play earlier in the season where Nyes put one on his side and Reeves couldn't get to it. He just couldn't move.

And right now he is getting in. Keefe mentioned as much too that he's actually getting to the puck, to the plays, turning them over because he's there on time. And on time was something he wasn't earlier in the season. Anticipation of Mitch Marner playing Saturday night. Yeah. Where do you put him? If they decide to play him Saturday night.

If they've talked enough about it. They've talked to enough people about it and had enough conversations. Got enough permissions signed. What do you think? Well, what do you think? Is it back with Matthews? I think I'd probably like to see Max Domi, Matthews, and Marner together. Please.

Has it happened? It's happened one game, right? This year? For a bit. I don't even think it was for a full game. I think he sort of tinkered to that at one point. Let's just have a look-see here. Is there any concern on what maybe a second line can look like

i'm john tavaris has hit and missed some nights where he's on his game or the feet look a little heavy i i didn't like his game last night but are you okay you quietly haven't liked his last few are you okay with uh tavaris locked in with neil ander on the second line i think some of the best well first off the team has really been rolling you know since the trade deadline uh i think they're the best goal differential team them and tampa i think are one two in the league so you know they've been going okay in their current configuration but I thought they played really good hockey when he centered a third line. When you had that kind of spread out attack,

I still think it's like it hasn't worked where they've had the deep run and they've always been all in the top two lines. I still think I would like to see it spread out across three lines somehow between those four guys. However you want to do it, I don't know. So I don't necessarily want to break. I've liked McMahon a lot with Tavares and Nylander,

but I think it's just pretty natural that if you're going to do Domi, Matthews, and Marner, you're just going to move Bertuzzi down to the McMahon spot, right? Then you just move McMahon down one. So you're looking at Bertuzzi, Tavares, Nylander? Probably. That's a very good line. Is it too many good guys? You know, if you're looking at bertuzzi tavarez nylander probably it's a very good line just is it too many good guys you know you're trying to spread it out i have a mcmahon thought whenever

you're done what you're gonna yeah go ahead i don't know that we're gonna see i still think you can shoot one or two in in playoffs i just don't know that we're going to see the impactful version of mcmahon in a playoff series in you know there's been games this year where he drives it wide his speed is on display he gets a bunch of shots you know you see him against a good team like tampa last night and the pressure mounts and it gets hard right like there's a reason he has been a fringe guy till age 27 i think he can be a guy where if he gets a look, he'll shoot one in. How dare you? No, he's going to be good. Our sweet boy, Bobby. How dare you? I just don't know that he's going to be a four-goal first-round guy for them.

Just to add that, remind yourself, too, that this guy's never played a playoff game in his life. Right. It's all. It's a big ask. It's a big ask. And it's going to be fast hockey and intense and tight D. I just think he's a good player. In on the forecheck, he can kill penalties.

He's useful even if he doesn't shoot one in. But we had a run of games here where he looked like one of the best offensive players on the Leafs. And I don't know that we can anticipate that happening in playoffs round one. One thought on the blue line for me is if i don't see significant growth in tj brody's game all things being equal everybody's healthy going into game one he is my seventh defenseman wow how'd we end up here I think it's a completely fair thought. Is that Lilligren in?

Lilligren would be in if he's healthy. Yeah. Edmondson, Lilligren, third pair, Benoit, McCabe, Riley, LeBush. Benoit is in all day long. It's not even a contest for me between Benoit and TJ Brody. You can't have Benoit out. No. He had 11 hits last night.

He was all over it, again. I love the way he plays and it's crazy that we're having this conversation and i wish i could push back on you but you're just you're right brody's been over 20 minutes he was over 20 minutes again last night he's looking better than before the healthy scratches i know but if he's not the reliable guy he once was, what's his role? Even last night, right? They played him third pair by and large, but they still trust him out there 20-some minutes.

He played 23-42 against Florida. I wonder if Lilligren's not out, if his injury didn't hurt him here. Because they tried after the trade deadline to be like, nope, Lilligren's in. Right D, he's a right shot. He's going to stay in. They gave him every look.

They put him on the power play. He got hurt again. I just don't know that this injury is not going to cost him a spot. Okay, let's take a quick break. When we return, Jim Ralph. Ralphie. Ralphie. No Zoom call with Ralphie.

Never. We just need to talk to Jimmy. He doesn't want to see us. He doesn't want to show everybody he's lit up a dart, I guess. He can smoke and talk to us on camera. I don't want to lose Ralphie, and I just don't want to fight with him anymore about the Zoom, so I want to have him on.

I want to see his face. Okay, well, we'll have him in studio one day. We will. All right, Jim Rowe, Toronto Maple Leaf radio colour analyst, will join us when we return to Real Kipper Unborn. Get smarter when you listen to Hockey Talk, the Hockey PDO cast with Dmitry Filipovich. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. as promised before the break let's welcome in jim ralph toronto maple leaf radio color analyst

good friend of the show ralphie what's going on oh not a lot yep we're borny how How are you guys doing? We're good. Yeah. You know, just like you, grinding. Getting to the end here, pal. Right to the end. Ralphie, right to the end, pal. What do you make of the week between the Florida Panthers

and the Tampa Bay Lightning last night? Good results against one team. Not so great last night, good results against one team, not so great last night, but overall, the feel of what the Leafs got out of these last two games. Yeah, you know, I even go back, you know, to the Edmonton Carolina back-to-back skipper. I think the, you know, and they have that emotional win over Edmonton on a Saturday night,

and then you've got to follow it up with Carolina. And I sort of looked at it with so many thought that the Leafs can't handle Florida, that they're not tough enough, and then you get to win over Florida, then whether there should have been or not, there seemed to be a letdown again the next night.

I think overall, it's been positive. I think there's obviously some question marks still there. I don't think Joseph Wall is back anywhere near he was before the injury. And, you know, talking to the guys from the broadcasters from Tampa, they said, you know, it took Vasilevsky a good, you know, two, two and a half months to get back to where he is right now. So I think that's expected.

But, you know, it's going to be interesting to see what mixes and matches, you know, line combinations, defense pairings, you know, they're going to come up with for game one. Yeah, that seems like all that's left on the table is basically who's going to play with who when you head into that matchup. Seems like, go ahead there. I was just going to follow up with the Joseph Wall comment because we just talked, you know, a little while ago, Ralphie.

If it takes Joseph Wall the time that you're suggesting that Vasilevsky took, there's not enough time here. Would you consider if there isn't a vast improvement in his game in the next half a dozen starts that you would think about Martin Jones backing up? No. No, I don't think I'd go there. Just because what we've seen of Joseph Wall and what he's capable of doing, I think right now that's enough for me as he kind of works his way back.

By the way, the game in Carolina was probably his best game coming back, and that was a 2-1 loss. But I think now he's, what, 2-5 since the injury. But in fairness to him, in four of the five losses, they only scored a single goal. So that's, you know, if they win 4-3 last night, we're not

talking about the five-hole goal or the long shot on the screen. You know, you're just talking about how Austin Matthews saves you again. So I think when you look at the record and everything else, that's got to factor in, that he's just been getting starts when they haven't had any offense, even the back-to-back 4-1 losses to Boston. So it's easy to kind of critique every goal and every mistake

because they were obviously costly, but you're not getting the offense on the other side either. Ralphie, I think this Leafs team is the biggest mystery to me of the recent teams that have headed into playoffs. Like I had stretches earlier in the season where I thought they were definitely worse

than previous years. I've had recent stretches where I think that maybe there's more there. Like the support crew seems a little bit stronger. Where do you stand on what this team is compared to the teams they've taken into playoffs the past few years? Oh, I'm right with you, Barney. Yeah. As soon as you're ready to quit and say that's it,

they're worse than they were before. And I know that a defining moment for me was I remember when Riley took the penalty and got suspended after the game in Ottawa, another loss in Ottawa. And you started looking at the schedule ahead and you said, in the next two weeks, they can come back from Colorado out of a playoff spot. Then they lose to Morris and Marner the very next game against St. Louis to illness. And you're going, man, this is a disaster.

And as soon as you say that, they win, what, seven in a row. You know, including in Vegas and in Colorado. And then you're going, boy, they've never looked better. And then, of course, the letdown against New Jersey, you know. I guess it was Vegas coming back from that trip. But the only thing I'll say is I think they're different. I think they're tougher. Whether that's going to translate into winning one, two, three,

or four playoff series remains to be seen. But I do like the fact that Joel Edmondson, I think, might be the greatest addition in the long run. If they get him back healthy, it looks like he's within a week of coming back. But we could talk about the transformation of Ilya Samsonov, but the transformation of Ryan Reeves is probably just as impressive at this point. Ralphie, just watching Tampa Bay last night, where do you put them right now pretty

impressive but yet we still look at that blue line and there's not the likes of a McDonough or Sergeyev anywhere near that blue line right now which puts a tremendous amount of pressure on headman now but should we be looking at Tampa Bay as one of those teams that can easily find themselves in a Stanley Cup final? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I think, you know, I think the D is part of it. The circumstance of injury is obviously devastating to them. And that would be a concern, even the bottom six. You know, because of their success,

they haven't been able to hold on to a lot of guys that were crucial to their Cup wins. But, man, any team that's got Kucherov and Point and Stamkos, between their power play and Vasilevsky, if he's back to form, they're going to scare a lot of teams. And let's not forget,

they do have, the core has the playoff experience and the playoff success. I mean, there are a lot of matchups that you look at and you're going, pick your poison. But I think Tampa going into any series as the underdog is pretty scary to open up, you know, game one and two on home ice against the Lightning.

Yeah. You know, before we went to break and got to you, we were talking about the bottom of the Leafs decor. Sheldon has said that he doesn't see them as having like a shutdown pair this year. It's interesting because both of us, Kip and I here, love Simone Benoit. Sammy does too. Trying to figure out who's out. And TJ Brody's name kind of comes up as a guy on the fringes.

Obviously, Lilligren's injured right now. But where do you stand on a guy like Brody and his importance? Or if he's even going to be in come game one? Yeah, I honestly think, Borny, it's going to be a bit of a revolving door. And still something clicks. And I mean, you might get lucky, right? You know, if you could ever steal the first couple of games on the road of a playoff series. And obviously, you're going to stick to it.

But, you know, even Benoit and McCabe, you like the physicality. Sometimes McCabe gets caught in some bad decisions, but you love to compete and how hard the guy works. But, yeah, I think so much of what's going to be in the personality of a series, if it's going to be a rough, tough, physical series, then maybe T.J. Brody does find himself the odd man out. I don't know if you keep

Labushkin and Riley together, but Labushkin's another guy that can be physical. I think they're well-suited in the sense that they've got the option for toughness or puck moving. And that might depend more on the series

and how the series starts to develop as much as anything. Ralphie, seven games to go here. Matthew scores another one last night. If he finds a way to put up a hat trick somewhere down the road here or a couple of back-to-back two-goal games. That number 70 gets real close here. Where are you on the pursuit of 70 and still prepping this team for game one of the Stanley Cup playoffs?

Well, you know what's funny, Kipper? The one thing I noticed and I like, and I'm sure you're more old school this way as well, that for the most part, he's not a big, selly guy. It's not, you know, unless it's a big goal or an important goal, a lot of times you see very little reaction from him. It's almost back to the Bobby Orr days where it's just sort of put your head down and go back to the bench.

But when he scored 60 in Buffalo, there was a huge response from him. And I was, and then you realize how much, you know, that milestone did mean to him. When you're thinking, boy, they never saw that the first 59, you know, so, you know, the 70 might mean a little more to him than I might've thought a month ago. And they hit that milestone. But like I said, I think I go back to the business-like approach after scoring a goal. I don't know if it's necessarily number one on this list. And I could see if he gets to 67 or 68, and Sheldon Keefe, I'm sure, would have the conversation with him.

We'd like you to take the day off and get rested up and not risk injury, or do you want to play? I think that's probably the conversation that would happen. But I don't think, you know, Austin Matthews knows that 60-goal seasons or not, you're ultimately going to be judged by your playoff success. And then, you know, like it or not, that whole group has been so far so I think it's it's

kind of a nice storyline I think it's probably means more to the teammates than it does to us and Matthews but I think everybody realizes what's at stake and it's you know he's won his league awards and everything else already and there's something a little more important around the corner so I I tend to think that 70 would be nice, but I don't think it's the, the plan or the be all end all for, for Sheldon people. Awesome.

Matthews. Yeah. It's impressive that he's kept up his scoring rate without Mitch Marner, but I guess the question, you know, for such a great player like Mitch Marner is do you put them back with Matthews here? Do you, do you put them back with Matthews here? Do you,

do you, have you seen enough with Domi and Matthews chemistry that you feel like you could load up another line with Mitch Marner, maybe help someone else along, or is it kind of inevitable? They go back to the Matthews Marner duo. Yeah. I mean,

I'm, I'm of the faith, Bonnie, that, you know, one of the best set up guys in the league and one of the best goal scorers in the league. They're like, to me, To me, it's that simple.

And they played together and had success. Obviously, with the power play struggling, that's really where, even on the penalty kill, where you miss Mitch Meyer. And I just think you've got that kind of special chemistry that you should keep it together. But please don't ask me, where does everybody else go swatting on the lines?

Because Joe and I tried to do that. I think before one of the games, we thought we had a pretty good lineup. We said, if you assume everybody's healthy, this is her lineup. And then we realized we didn't have Bobby McMahon in. And then we went, oh, no. Through the wrench in the whole thing, eh? Yeah, we thought, boy, we got all these in. And then we went, oh, no. Through the wrench in the whole thing, eh? Yeah, we thought, boy, we got all these great lines. And we go, oh, no.

Oh, no. We just omitted somebody. So I think if you're a Leaf fan and you're getting pumped and want the combination, sit down with the pen and paper and come up with the lines. And then, you know, and this is assuming that Kelly Yarncroft is back as well. But again, you talk about the decors, TJ Brody in or out, and based on your own preferences or, you know, defense pairings, the forwards are going to be just as difficult.

You know, once you get Marner back and if you get Yarncroft back as well, number one question is who comes out, and number two, personally, I would prefer to see Pontus Holmberg being the number three center, and Kemp four. I don't know if I like that 3-4 combination, or the

David Kemp centering the third line on a regular basis. I think, and again, that's where it gets difficult to say, okay, if you've got Dewar, Camp, and Reeves on the fourth line, where does everybody else slot in? But let's face it. I don't recall having this conundrum last year,

previous years going into the playoffs because you just knew who was playing with who and the options were really pretty limited. So if we are talking about maybe one of the last spots on the roster in game one, is it safe to say that you'd rather have a guy with a hard four check like Reeves than a guy like Robertson who could shoot a puck in the net? Yeah, well, we made the reference that,

you remember Lonnie Bohannes when the Leafs played? I was with Lonnie last night in the alumni box. Oh, really? Yeah. And I remember he had that one great series. I think he was playing with Mets for a while and then scored some big goals for the Leafs. So Nick Robertson could be one of those guys

that if he doesn't start in game one, maybe through injury or, you know, in different play, he gets in. But I'll tell you, to be in the building and watch Ryan Reeves, who somehow, I mean, it's great to say he's been more physical, but to me it's been the speed. You know, we've seen him get back on the back check and break up plays. And, you know, where it it seemed early on in the season, he seemed to get caught standing still a lot.

But boy, to see him wind up and get ready to go shoulder to shoulder with somebody against the boards is a lot of fun. I mean, it may not quite be an Austin Matthews rush, but the crowd, you could feel the crowd's energy build as Reeves is going in I think he's earned the right to be in the lineup and he's done everything you could ask for but it's gone far more

beyond the fights or anything else to me he's been a very valuable commodity for them as you have on our show Ralphie what's that? as you have on our show, Ralphie. Yes. What's that? As you have on our show.

Very, very hot commodity. Value. Yeah, that's where I was going with that, yeah. All right. What, seven games to go, Ralphie? We're going to be leaning on you the rest of the way here. No problem. And I should be through season six of Love is Blind by then, too. Thanks, Ralphie.

Jimmy Ralph, everybody. Toronto Maple Leaf radio color analyst for us here at Sportsnet. Likes Reeves quite a bit. Likes Holmberg. Yep. And I think I've probably said this a number of times.

They just have more guys who could score one, you know, in the past than in the past. Like, it could be Nyes. It could be McMahon. It could be Robertson. It could be Holmberg. None of those guys would go like. Domi, Bertuzzi.

Yeah. None of them would be like, oh, my God, they scored. Like, they're guys that can make plays. You just got to play a team tight, and you got enough guys that can find them a crack. And it's crazy, but, like, the more I've watched the last half a dozen games that the Leafs have played, it's really always coming down to the goalie. Yeah. Who's going to get goalied?

Yeah. Probably whoever plays Tampa. But I do feel like it's just less Team A, less Team B, which I like. Okay, we're just warming up here. We've got an hour to go. The national show kicks in. Mike Rupp, NHL network analyst, former NHLer, covering the Devils and the Rangers last last night combining for 162 penalty minutes we're getting into that three seconds into our show

that's all it took for a brawl last night three seconds good time yeah good times and uh i look forward to hearing ropper's take. He was watching close. Stick around, everybody. We're back after these words.