Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Recouping In Calgary

Episode Date: January 19, 2024

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne welcome in Daniele Franceschi (filling in for Sam McKee) and they start with the much-needed win for the Leafs over the Flames last night. They get into Matthews' goal-scoring dominance, a weight off of Keefe's shoulders, the clutch video review, Tavares' recent struggles and Nylander's drought since his extension. They are joined by former NHL goalie Carter Hutton (31:25), who shares his thoughts on his transition from the ice to the media, Martin Jones answering the call with Woll nursing an ankle sprain, potential lingering effects of ankle injuries for goalies and Samsonov's mental reset. Finally, he takes a look at unique goaltending situations and trends around the league.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

we are ready to rock and roll the real kipper and born show once again coming to you live and in color sports at 590 the fan i don't know what's next sports net plus from four to six see i'm we got new we got new 30 here third wheel i'm just skipping all the intros yeah right now great because as we alluded to the other day jb sammy mckee has bolted us for vegas baby vegas do you even think he's listening right now definitely not if he is he has failed at the idea of getting away all right let's welcome in that third wheel danielle franceschi disco dan gentlemen thanks for having me this is fun this is cool. Fun experience. We're really happy to have you here.

This is awesome. No, my pleasure. This is great. I got to admit, like, red light goes on, no nerves. No? No, zero, none. But earlier today, even yesterday, as I'm listening on the way home and you guys even said my name, I'm like, oh, geez, here we go.

But now I'm good. I am ready to rock. That's great, man. I love it. I love good. I am ready to rock. That's great, man. I love it. I love it. Let me just tell you from personal experience, when you think you're dead and buried in the minors, just like that, you're up and you're in the big leagues. Playing with the Flyers.

Right? You are our Pontus home run. Yes. No, I love that. You were in the minors hey can somebody notice me please can somebody know does anybody know i'm alive down here are we are we matthews and marner in this comparison i i i'm okay with that if you are yeah yeah 100 am i up for renegotiation i'm not gonna deny you guys that that's for sure. I love Pontus.

Yes. He's been great. Legend of the show, Pontus Holmgren. Well, welcome aboard. And you couldn't have timed it better because all we've had is doom and gloom Sammy, his beloved Leafs, in a tailspin. Yeah. And we've beaten it up all week. A very tough week for the hockey club.

A very tough week for Sheldon Keefe. Matthews with the hat trick. Yeah. A much better result last night in Calgary, and you're here to just reap the rewards of all that positivity. I'm thrilled. I'm a little cynical like Samuel. Are you?

I am. I'm very cynical. Oh, no. I am. I just built you up. No, no, but i will choose to stay positive i mean god we're talking about a guy here austin matthews goes out puts the team on his back cape on says get on we're going for a ride he's on pace for 71 goals love it come on

four hat tricks this season 11 in his career he's just it's electric there's your positivity that's it that's all we need austin matthew if outside of austin's performance last night with uh the goals yeah the one thing that stood out to me was when the camera panned to sheldon keith and there was just this sense of maybe a thousand pounds off his shoulders when they actually won there was a handshake there was was with Chenoweth or someone where he was really thrilled to be shaking that hand. And good on him, right? I mean, come on. Outside of what we have to do as a show

and try to be as objective as possible and say some things that don't actually bode well for a lot of Leaf fans, I was really happy for the guy. Yeah. I mean, it was a big night, and to get the performance from a guy that you hope you can count on

when you need a performance was nice, and then to get the, you know, the piece of luck you needed on the day you needed the luck with the overturned call, with the hair of the fabric of the glove, touching a puck that saves you a win you know everything went as it could have for him in the best possible way so there you go does that fix

all the problems uh no not even close okay i thought that was but that's okay yeah that's what we got uh to do on uh the rest of the hour on this Leaf edition of the Real Kipper and Bourne Show. But, Disco, we're glad you're aboard. Happy to be here. Just don't be too good because that will force JB and I to make a very tough decision on Monday. Oh, no. Come on. Sammy's the best.

Sammy's the best. For those listening, it is Daniele, and I will be calling him Yele henceforth. So if you're looking, if that makes sense to you, that's what we're doing. And I'm sticking with Disco. Sammy's the best. Sammy's the best. For those listening, it is Daniele, and I will be calling him Yele henceforth. So if you're looking, if that makes sense to you, that's what we're doing. And I'm sticking with Disco. Disco it is. Disco and Yele.

That's another thing I like about him. He could be great in any era, including the Disco era. Versatile guy. All right, let's go to Sheldon Keefer, our first Clippers of the hour, because we didn't go to him yesterday at all, did we? We got into some stuff. Yeah, we did. We went deep, deep.

But let's get his overview of closing out last night's win. I love, first of all, that through the third period, just played hockey. Guys didn't panic. Guys weren't tight. They were loose. The way it's supposed to be on a night like this tonight is that we're supposed to be hard. We're supposed to find a way through it. And I was as much as I would have loved to have some more goals and some breathing room.

We needed this here tonight. I thought the guys handled it very well. You know, it's one of the best third periods we've played, maybe all season, with a lead. So, yeah, really proud of the guys tonight. How nervous were you? When we left yesterday's show, I said, yeah, tongue-in-'s show, I said,

tongue in cheek, of course, but the best thing that could happen is them going down early in the hockey game. Do you remember that? Yeah, yeah. I'm like, don't go. The worst thing that could happen is a 2-0 lead. Yeah. They chased it, albeit kind of an ugly first period, to be honest with you. Yeah.

But it was a different vibe. But how nervous were you guys on holding the lead in the third? Well, you know, the goal to make it 4-3, being as strange as it was, it started to feel a little bit, you know, you didn't know that you were going to get the luck later in the game. So it kind of felt like, is just the the point where everything goes wrong for keith and this team and and it all comes unglued but so yeah kip i i don't think i was super comfortable with where they were at at that point in the game but the second period they played so well

and to see them after they gave up the goal to not fall all over themselves and start finding it again i think a really positive sign for them so you know i yeah a little bit of nerves there for them but starting to feel okay about things it was very nerve-wracking yeah i will say very nerve-wracking to me there were two kind of critical inflection points in that entire hockey game one is the matthews goal in the first period undoubtedly because they they had been hemmed in you know we see some of the same issues we've been seeing for weeks with that club and then they get that moment of magic right flips that turns the tide they go into the break okay reset the one goal game you're right there the other one is the hand pass like that that right there a team that has

struggled to protect leads right that's been the narrative for the last week and that nearly makes it 4-4 and we're sitting there saying okay well how does this group respond now so the fact that they didn't have to face that adversity of it being back to square one back to 4-4 we're all even i think it's a bonus but man to your point kipper just keith looks so relieved like just immensely and the stoicism that he had on his face when they panned him on the challenge too like he was just uh you could sense it underneath like their weight coming off his shoulders all together just to get a win even listening to him him after the game like it's just a little too happy for after winning a 4-3 game in January. You know what I mean? It's a job saver. Job saver.

You told me his name eludes me. Who's the video guy? Jordan Bean. Jordan Bean. Sam Kim as well. Did you not text our group chat last night saying, like, if this guy wanted a million dollars a year, he might be worth it if it's an it's funny, if it's a, an extra home game.

Well, think about it. I mean, you know, if they are, I think they're 18 for 19 on, on video challenges this year, which I think the league average is probably around 60, 70% getting them right. So if you're four or five goals better than average, is that what it is? Only 70. It's, it's around there. You know, I don't have the exact 70 it's it's around there you know i don't have the exact number but it's around there and so if you're a few goals better that's another winner to a year that can be the difference between home ice and not home ice playoffs and not i i was incredibly

impressed with the video call for only one reason because the majority of times when you, when you see the coaches contemplating it, you know, it's goaltender interference, you know, it could be offside, but there, that one had everybody scratching their heads on what it could possibly be.

And when you found it on the replay, as subtle as it was, that's a hell of a pickup on video. It truly is. And, you know, Keith calling the time out to buy time to continue to get different angles of it before making that decision, a crucial moment.

And let's be honest, sucks. Like that's a goal, right? Like, no, it's not impactful on the play. It's, it's a tough break for Calgary, but hey, we'll take it.

All right, let's go to our second Kippers Clipper on Sheldon's real MVP last night. Wow, they're vital. I mean, you guys get to see it when we have these challenges and these key moments. They're so dialed in, but I see it every day just because they allow this whole thing to run. You know, there's so much that goes on with the coaching staff and how we communicate to the players and prepare the team. And those guys, for me like i said you get

to see it on display with the challenges but those those guys are mvps of our staff every day give them the belt give them the belt honestly that's where it should have gone instead it would have been great the one thing that goal that call did last night and i i give like this is not me dumping on martin jones here because he had a hell of a game he did okay but what that challenge did was take away the fact that he gave up a bad goal yeah you're right we don't have to have that conversation, but we are. But we are. But we are, right? Yes. And if by chance they tie it up and somehow lose the game in overtime or shootout, which has been a little common lately, we might be starting this show on.

What are we doing, Nat? Martin Jones. You can't win if you give up a bad goal. He did give up a bad goal last night it was just happened to be disallowed yeah but usually bad goals come back and haunt you but outside of that yeah he is a major reason why besides Austin's hat trick they ended up with two points in regulation what do you what do you think about the way the Leafs came out in the game? So I think that's a good point and a complete thought.

I have nothing to add to that if you're good on Jones. Yeah. What do you think about their first period last night, given the stakes and where they're at in the season? Do you put anything to it? That's a couple of games where in the first shift, they're giving up a really cool. I remember Colorado. I believe Edmonton too, if I'm not mistaken.

No, they scored first shift in Edmonton. Oh, yeah, yeah. Not Edmonton. I can't remember about Detroit, but Jones has to make a really big save in the first 13, 14 seconds. Yeah. Yeah, no, they didn't exactly come out like a house on fire. And it was about first period.

It was. And so that does bring us to, you know, Matthews just making a play, making a superstar play where he pulls it through his feet and, you know, shoots one past the goalie. Phenomenal individual effort. And watching it, obviously, with Gregor still on the ice and McMahon, it's off a line change. But Gregor butchered that play.

Is he trying to get a deep? Any other team, and that's a giveaway, and it's going back the other way. And was that after, or I think it was after earlier in the game that Gregor didn't get one out along the wall and they cut to Keefe on the bench and you see him say to Gregor, soft, too soft. You know, so like that could have been the end of Gregor's, whatever, ends up being an assist, a plus.

He plays the whole game, you know, like really got the team going. It's a game of inches. I mean, it's funny how it works sometimes. Yeah. Can I ask a question to you guys here? Let me pose this. The fact they came out the way they did, did it surprise you at all?

I think I expected it was you're going to see one of two things, and it was going to be really good or really bad. And so I guess I wasn't surprised that it was one of two things. The cynical fan in me says we shouldn't be surprised by that. Yeah. Because that's been the mo of this group with that core for years the way they start games right like they're known for being flat and then post game what do we hear yeah we came out a little flat it's okay yeah you did yeah so fix it

right i i think the question is you know and i'll just say what i think people are thinking at that point is this is the coach that was on the hot seat and the team didn't seem to come out for him. Was? I was, did they? One, I don't know. Was? Still is?

Alleviated? The seat heater went from three to two in the car, I think. It did. It did. And before we get into the nuts and bolts of what possibly could happen on Saturday night, uh, let this one breathe for a little while longer on our show.

Yeah. So let's go to Keith on the amazing effort and the performance of Austin Matthews clip for, we're very fortunate to have him, uh, uh, as part of our group, but while he scored big goals tonight, he also defended extremely hard,

which, especially once we get the lead, now we need him to defend and we need him to compete and lead the way that way. I thought he was great in that regard. I thought Marner was great in that regard, Willie, JT. Those guys really led the way for us up front. I thought Yarncroft was unbelievable tonight in terms of how he played, how he managed the game. And, you know, we got good efforts from the rest of the group.

Like, Bert was really dialed in and competing today. Matthew Nyes seemed to be coming back for us and had a great play, shot the puck with authority to lead to Austin's, I believe that might have been the third goal. So, yeah, through the lineup, I was really pleased with a lot of guys. And score goal six on five on the late penalty. Score goal on the power play at a key time. Penalty kill was excellent.

When we had to defend with a goalie out, we were excellent. So, a lot of really positive things for us to take out of this game. I'll say this about the man. He's kept it positive. Oh, he's trying to juice it up. Juice it up. Hey, you know, give everyone a little bit of something here. He's giving everybody a little something.

Way to go, Nize. You shot it hard. Is that because the confidence is so fragile? Yeah, I think so. That you need to overcompensate those comments. I think so. I think you got a team that has talent that you're trying to get the best out of them.

And if they're beaten down, it's probably not the way to do it. I will agree with him on Tavares' effort. You can see the guy is trying. But you can also see there's a level of frustration in his game and a lack of confidence right now,

which I don't know if you want to go back to his early days in the GTHL with the Marlies. I don't know if he's ever probably felt this way at any point since he's ever probably felt this way at any point since he's first put on skates.

Because we know he's always been a dominant minor hockey league player, dominant with the Oshawa Generals, dominant when he's played world juniors. But to go what he's going through right now, I'm not sure he's had a lot of experience to fall back on. No. I mean, in our wonderful lineup here i would bet my left leg it hasn't happened that tavarez point drought has reached six games yeah been nearly 15 years according to yele since tavarez has been kept off the score sheet this long he had a six game drought since 20 he's also

been a dash two and four straight games that like that is why he has spent a tremendous amount of time in his own zone yeah no i again last night for sure you know bertuzzi nylander tavarez when they are not playing well it's a tough watch in the d zone you know circling around trying to find a. They can't snuff out a cycle. You know, we're talking about stops and starts where he's not. The feet get heavy. Yeah. I did think he worked.

Oh, no, no. It's never an issue. This guy's a pro. Yeah. Okay. Not an issue. He will give you everything he has. There it is. That's actually a clip about Tavares.

That clip. Me saying that. Who is that? That's me. Working his bag a clip about Tavares. That clip. Me saying that. Who is that? That's me. Working his bag off. Talking about JT. Actually, that was on television. And I think it's the only time in my sports ed career I got a note from the bosses.

I was like, you can't say that. I've heard it a thousand times. I know. From everybody. And we've just clipped it and ran it right through. Whatever. I don't know. No one has followed up on it so

apparently we're okay you can't question his effort because like brian lawton you guys had him on yesterday and he made a good point i thought he said it pointed you know it was it was really really poignant where he talked about i had no questions that he would reach whatever the ceiling of his potential would be because that's how hard a worker he is he's got the maturity it's always been his mo so that part we can't question right i do uh you know the effectiveness of that line right now not great they had some magic earlier in the season he knee lander but we've seen they you know at times they've struggled to kind of mesh right like the chemistry is hit and miss with them and then willie himself yeah he has two assists last night but was he at his best you know like it's a great question how did you think willie played last night i saw him pushing a little harder okay yeah

i did uh but he made a couple plays obviously this is again his longest stretch where uh he's gone all season long without looking dominant. Mid. So, I would worry probably a lot more about where Tavares is for the rest of the year, or hopefully for Leaf fans going into the playoffs than I ever would Willie. Yeah. So, the only question is, will Tavares come back and be still a no-doubt second-line centerman

for the Toronto Maple Leafs, or is he now going to be in a position where Sheldon Keefe has to find ways to protect him, which could mean moving to the wing a little bit, could mean less defensive zone face-offs. Obviously, you're going to keep him on the power play, but... Yeah, he killed there last year. Where is he now in terms of where you think...

Is he just going through something temporarily? Is he going to get back to what you have known of him for the majority of his career? One thing I will say is the power play used to, under Spencer Carberry, ran pretty heavy through Marner and into Tavares, right? A lot of looks. Tavares had 38 power play points last year, which was, I think, sixth or seventh in the NHL

and was half his point total thereabout. And this year, it's a lot of flank stuff with Matthews and Nylander. Buddy, I've watched Marner on the power play this year. He doesn't touch the puck. No. And I'm touch the puck. No. And I'm like, this is crazy. This guy should be touching it the most.

100% he should on the power play. He's supposed to be your quarterback. He's supposed to set the table. He is supposed to be. He's supposed to be the distributor. When I see him in front of the net while everybody's trying to do something around him, I'm like, what's wrong with this picture? matthews to get it when it's time to hit it you want willie to get it when it's time to hit it you want you know those guys to

move it until it gets to your but i want i want it to go through marner yeah and and to far as is another trigger you have plenty of guys who pull the trigger but yeah it should be in his hands a lot last night was a four on three marner's goal, which looked great. Willie, what a play. Six on five goal. The late penalty. They do a good job there. Those guys, that's where they're lethal. We know that. It's when they have time and space and the ability to make decisions, right?

A couple of days ago, you told us, you know, you kind of had evidence from what I've been saying all years that they're not a good passing team. So the stat that you came across that announced them as the worst passing team in the offensive zone, is that strictly based on counting the number of touches?

Yeah, completed passes. Completed passes. As a percentage of attempted passes to completed passes. Does your site actually break it down even further with the toronto maple leafs to tell me which line touches the most or which touches the less the least don't think line but player like i i would believe that even matthews and marner this year and whoever's been on their line isn't even the top passing team on their, or the line on their team. Like I would like to see how it truly breaks down

on the number of touches. And I don't know if that site does it. I just think the second they get the puck, they want it to go into the middle for a shot. They want to get there right away, right? Well, you got a 70 goal score. Yeah. Like that's what happens. It happened with Brett Hall yeah and it happened with mcgillney and last time

i checked they they weren't top teams except for the year maybe brett hall had 86 the year he had 70 i think they were they weren't a top team i mean mcdavid's 65 last year were they tops in the west i think i think they were but it's it's not a guarantee if you got a 70 goal score you're gonna you're you're scoring on a top team for sure that's my point yeah no it's definitely not and you know spreading that around a little bit would be good but it's just tough to see on this team where you're spread it around to. They certainly need Nylander to get back to scoring. No goals since he signed his contract six games ago.

And he, you know, him as their sort of second shooting threat as a non-threat right now is, is hurting things significantly. All right. I'm Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne in for Sammy McKee. Just go Dan Franceschi.

Did I say that right? You got it. Kip. You know, if I got your whole family watching, Ico Dan, Franceschi. Did I say that right? You got it, Kipper. You nailed it. Have I got your whole family watching? I feel a lot of pressure right now. I don't know if they're all watching. Are you kidding me? I don't know.

You just got called up. Yeah, I know. I'm a Franceschi. I don't know what the situation is right now, but we'll see. They're aware. There's a party going on at the Franceschi household right now. You think Woodbridge is watching? I don't know about that.

Reppin' Woodbridge. I love it. One more thought on Austin Matthews because it's a sound which is kind of incredible that you hear on the road. MVP. Yeah. The chant of MVP. No. Okay.

That's what I was getting to. legit not legit no i mean like if he scores 70 goals he's gonna be on the ballot you know he's gonna be on everyone's ballot somewhere but i don't know how many points he is behind uh nathan mckinnon or connor mcdavid but the consistency in all around play hasn't been to the level he has been at in previous seasons. He's better than last year, all-around, for sure. But no, I think his hard trophy year, he was an elite defensive player. I voted, he was on my Selkie ballot. Yeah, 65, 70 goals, and if they trend in the spot that they're in if they sneak into the third spot in the atlantic or a wild card spot i i have him so on the outside looking in on an mvp i just try to

imagine the leafs without him last night yeah you know like it's it's impossible to think that this guy is not their most valuable guy by miles 11th and in scoring in the NHL right now, Austin Matthews. 54 points. Obviously, the 37 goals leading the league, but that puts him, what, 21 points behind Kucherov, for example? Yeah. He's 19 behind McKinnon. Yeah.

And those teams are having, obviously, like in Colorado, obviously in particular, having a much better season. I mean, he's got, how many assists does he have? 17. uh 17 yeah and that's probably that might not be in the top 125 i don't know yeah if you look at i'm staring at this list right now top 15 nobody has fewer than 25 at least yeah and he's got 17 yeah so i think that's a part of it for sure. Factors in. All right. Blue line for you. Still very challenging. And good on them for finding two points.

But nothing happened last night that has changed your mind on the challenges they have on the blue line. And I'll start with you first with with brody i mean he has struggled for a long time right now yeah and the thing that i see is sheldon continually going to him like he's the guy he was, I don't think he's going to him because he thinks he's going to be the guy that he was. It's because he has no other choice. There are no options. There's no depth.

I mean, you're kind of hoping at some point Lilligren would emerge. Last night he tucks one on their own net and then takes a spinorama holding the puck penalty so it wasn't his highest focus night you know and and giordano gives you everything he's got but he's not there i mean i love mccabe but boy he makes some air so yeah kip is where else you gonna turn all right let's go to uh brody on his uh on where he thinks his game is. I think just sometimes you go through those phases, maybe lack of confidence, you're not getting the bounces,

and you grip the stick a little tight. Sometimes it's just taking a breath and things are okay and getting back on track. Is there anything in particular you do in those moments or anyone you lean on? No, I think you just mentally think about there's more to life than just hockey

and it's not the end of the world if you make a mistake. I know it feels like it at the time but just move on try to learn from it and forget about it. I can appreciate that last comment about more to life. He's 100% right.

Yeah, just move on. I just don't think I'd want to throw that one out there. I love that. I couldn't agree more. I am the most work-life balance guy you can find. I believe it's important for everyone. It's true that there's more to life, but

he didn't pay $5 million in Toronto to be a great defenseman. We're asking about hockey now. We're not asking how it's going with the kids. I'm not going to Scotiabank Arena and dropping six hun for two tickets in the lower bowl to hear there's more to life than hockey. Not asking about the well-roundedness of your situation. I'm asking specifically why you can't break a puck out.

That was tough. That was tough. I was like, oh, no. Can you imagine what we'd be saying if they lost the game last night? And he said that? He's like, ah, there's more life than hockey. Oh, my goodness. I want to hear that when I'm paying $8 for a beer

at Originals on Bayview. Not $20 at Scotiabank Arena. I have to be the softest audience for a comment like that. Like, I'm the guy who's like, totally. But it's just like, it's just not the time and place. It's just not. Also, I want to say that's the first ever TJ Brody clip ever. Really?

On Kippers Clippers. I heard that voice, and that could have been anywhere. Yeah, I had to look twice. Yeah. the first ever TJ Brody clip ever. Really? On Kippers Clippers. I heard that voice and that could have been anywhere. Yeah, I had to look twice. Yeah. Wow. Is that Brody? It was Brody.

Honestly, that was the most interesting thing from the entire post availability. Yeah. Just because. It's an interesting thing. They won the game. Everybody else, their spirits are high. You know, they're trying to be positive. He just sounded so down. Yeah.

He sounded defeated. You can tell. Got a win where he used to play. So, yeah, that stood out big time. All right. In a couple of minutes, we're going to welcome in Carter Hutton. One time Toronto Maple Leaf. Without playing games?

On paper? Yeah. So he's done a terrific job on dailyfaceoff.com. We're going to welcome him in after the break. All right, Disco. Easy 30 minutes right there for you, pal. Yeah, we just, we killed that. We killed that.

We did. Worked our way in. Okay, we'll be the judge of that. Fair enough. More of Disco, JB, and yours truly after the break. Teeing up the biggest games of the night, it's the Fan Pre Game with Ailish Forfar and Justin Cuthbert. Weekdays at 6 p.m. on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590, The Fan,

and wherever you get your podcasts. All right, wherever you're watching and listening sports at 590 the fan sports at 360 or our plus channel youtube we're glad you're aboard and remember it's friday please give us a text at 590 590 for some questions some thoughts some comments and we'll get our boy Disco Dan to read them. All right, let's welcome in Carter Hutton, former NHL goalie and, yes, technically, a Toronto Maple Leaf, right, Carter? It was short-lived, but I was a Maple Leaf,

traded from the desert up to Toronto. I kind of came in with Campbell and Mrazik were out and never got a chance to suit up, but I was there and got to live the lifestyle. I got the helmet behind me. So I made a lot more friends retiring at Maple Leaf. Buddy, come visit us in the alumni room then, right? Cash in.

Yeah, that was mentioned to me. I heard free tickets for life, so I'm going to see if I can knock that at some point. Well, we're glad you're joining us today. And certainly, is the first thing you do as a broadcaster is kind of broadcast from the net on out? We've seen so many goalies turn into broadcasters. Is that a natural feel when you watch games now for yourself? I think so, you know, maybe because I sat on the bench so much

and watched a lot of games. And they used to throw the headset on me when I played in Nashville. I was playing behind Pekka Rene. And at the 10-minute timeout, I'd kind of get interviewed. And, you know, from there, I just kind of fell into it. And now I'm just trying to find my way in it and enjoy it. And it's something I can do, you know, from home with a young family and something I don't have to be on the road.

So I've really enjoyed it so far. So what are your thoughts on the Toronto Maple Leafs goaltender situation? Are you a Martin Jones guy? Like, is it comfortable enough to wait for Joe Wohl and go ahead with him? Are you a Samsonov guy? A lot of avenues to choose from here for this Maple Leafs team on what they should do with their goaltending position. You know, right now I got to say that I love what Martin Jones is doing.

You know, especially a guy that was kind of counted out, signed as a number three, you know, wasn't really given a chance. And watching him play, he's been great. I think he's played above everybody's expectation with a 9-20 save percentage so far. But from Martin Jones, you know what you're going to get. And this team is legitimately, they want to be a cup contender. And being in this situation, it's tricky to watch. Joseph Wall has been great when he's played, but he has a high ankle sprain,

which for me is scary. I had two of them. I had one in college. I had another one in the NHL, which was kind of the end of my career. I rehabbed it, and as I came back, I had to get surgery. So I think that's a big question mark for me. Where is he at? And for Samsonov, this has been tough.

This has been, I feel for him. Even when he gets rolled out to the media and hearing his answers and his lack of confidence is something, for me, I used to always always internalize and now you see him out there it looks so weak and i think him getting sent down and martin jones just coming in and making a capable save just giving the team some confidence is is important at this case especially the way this leafs team has been up and down can we follow up on the ankle thing if you got one go away. What is rehab like? And how does it limit you and affect your game when you're trying to come back from an ankle injury? So the tricky thing as a goalie,

we use our ankle and our post for so much leverage, right? So the biggest thing I would find is after week two, week three, you're in the gym, you're jumping, you're squatting, you're doing all your normal lifts, but then all of a sudden you get in the net and the leverage you have when you're in the butterfly position or you're using your post, changes the whole game so i had six to eight weeks after my bad one in buffalo and i'd get on the ice and i had no power there was no pain

there was no immediate impact it was the fact that i had no power so from there i ended up seeing somebody in the with the buffalo bills because we were owned by both teams they sent me out to bob anderson who is in green bay works for theers, and is the big ankle and foot guy. One look at me right away put me under to do a scope, and I ended up having to get a tightrope installed and reconstructive surgery. And from there, my ankle's been great day to day, but for goaltending, man, did it fall off.

I had no movement. I had no ability. And I'm hoping for Joseph Wall that isn't the case, but this is something that is, we just think Joseph Wall's going to rehab and be back ready to go, but ankles as a goalie it's tricky and the way we play now you see more and more of these injuries and it's it's definitely hurts you know his potential coming back and it's something that even if he comes back from it there might be some you know delayed effects of it so i blew out my knee i don't know 30 years ago and I could tell you like it happened yesterday,

the great detail of it. So when you look at and think about your high ankle sprain and how it happened, and now I watch Joseph Wall's high ankle sprain that he had in Ottawa, and I've watched it 10 times, and I can't tell you where it was. There was no someone landing on it. Non-contact. There was no twist. There was nothing.

Just him going from post to post, I think, and then getting carried off the ice. Is that a bigger concern than just flat out seeing where exactly your high ankle sprain came from? You know, I think the way the circumstances are, I think that would be a better fact that there wasn't a heavy impact right because i had one in college literally i'm embarrassed to say this on air here scraping my crease and i just caught an edge tweaked it a

little bit and it was i played the rest of the period then all of a sudden as the period went on it got worse and worse wow but then my second one in buffalo we were playing the rangers and rasmus bristolainen good friend of mine and had decided to put a guy right on top of me. Got caught, my knee underneath me, and the last thing to pop was my ankle, which was more of a contact, which was a heavier one. But same rehab, same thing, because it's just an injury. And they struggle with this in the NFL, I learned a lot. They invested a lot of money into ankles and the education because they lose a lot of man games because of ankles. And similar to goaltending, guys are landing on players in thefl just like goaltending when we're not playing we're not

prepared for it right we're in our stance guys are falling on us and there's a lot of pressure with walls i feel like it's on the better side of it i would assume because of the way it went down very looked very innocent but at the same time very concerning from my standpoint wow that's terrific stuff carter uh great great feedback on high ankle sprains uh at least fans right now are going uh oh i just want to i want to get your thoughts on on samsonov because we would have probably thought that he was going to squeeze another start here soon i there's no there's not a chance they go to samsonov in vancouver so kind of sets them up for for uh seattle on sunday but just this reset that they had in the last uh 14 15 days for him

which was clearing waivers on paper being sent to the Marlies, but not actually ever playing a game. And in your case, would you have ever wanted to start with the Marlies before coming back? Or can you see in today's game a goalie, any goalie, just going into a scenario where it's all in my head and I don't need to play another game until I'm back in the NHL.

You know, honestly, I feel like it's a tough situation, right? So I only had one chance in my career when I was, I hadn't played in a while and I was in Nashville and Rene was on a run. I think that was the year he was up for the Vez and I didn't win it. But they came to me and they offered me a chance to go play in the American League on a conditioning stint. And Pekka, he had come back the year before from a staph infection and came a chance to go play in the American League on a conditioning stint and Pekka he had come back the year before from a staff infection and came back and went and played in the American League and he kind of came to me and advised me not to go play just because

the fact he just thought that there was just too much to lose if I didn't play well if it didn't go well and I stuck by my gun but I also wasn't in a situation when Samsonov was in where he's been playing so bad it's been a rough go and for me it's hard to play yourself out of this situation if you aren't getting games so for Samsonov he needs to get in the net at some point unless this plan is to just you know let him try to reset himself over time which I thought his last start he looked better but still not the guy we saw last year and for me there's obviously a reason why Washington let him walk and you look at this year Tree Living taking him to arbitration only giving them one year deal you, there's obviously a reason why Washington let him walk. And you look at this year, Tree Living taking him to arbitration, only giving him a one-year deal.

There's obviously something they see in this guy that is not up to par to give him that contract. But my only concern moving forward is with the Leafs and my experience, my short time with them and other teams is there's so many cooks in the kitchen when it comes to off-ice, when it comes to the team, when it comes to strength coach, sports psych coach, all these different elements this poor guy is living in a bubble where everyone's poking product i don't think that makes it any easier too without playing the game where you can just be by yourself yeah that's fascinating the idea that like all these people

who are there to help you like it might just be the best thing to just let me go be a hockey player like i've been my whole career that is a lot of pressure you know looking around the nhl you know what are your thoughts on like the lack of kind of true number one guys the way the workloads are kind of spread out i just think we have a tough time assessing who's good and who's not and who's the 20th best guy and the 40th best guy and the 60th best guy you know guys get in 33 games. And I just, we really struggle to assess it right now. Yeah, it's a tricky, tricky time.

And I feel like always it's, and it's, it's a contract that you give to a guy that isn't your, you know, there's a handful of guys you could say, you know, your Hellebox, your Veseleski. And this point now you, you know, guys starting to separate themselves, Ottinger, Allmark, Demko. These guys that have been pretty consistent now for a few years where these other middle guys it's pretty much like can you get hot for me can you get hot at the right time and you look at even what montreal's done this year holding on to three guys like jake allen's value has got to be through the roof even looking at detroit looking the way

alex lion has played where who is going to play well at the right time you almost need that platoon of guys to see who's going to play because if as an organization you look at edmonton they commit that money to jack campbell leaving the leafs and now it's like we're stuck with this deal he's been so bad stewart's gonna even last year i thought jack campbell's was a liability playing in that where you need to almost have that extra third depth guy where i think this signing by tree living having martin jones as a depth guy is coming looking like a genius right now so it's very tricky to find that element and i think that the difference between like number 20 to number 80 isn't a lot but the difference in that top 10 guy but it needs to be homegrown right it's hard to go find a franchise goalie in free agency because

nobody's giving them up just irkans a franchise type of goalie regarded as the second best behind Vasilevsky over the last few years. I think he gave up four and 16 or 17 to Vegas last night. That happens. It does, but does it go to show you that if you just have mediocre goaltending, you don't win no matter who you are anymore yeah i think so i think good goaltending solves a lot of problems right i always used to joke around about that like you play in a game or where you give up one extra goal and you lose

three two but you play great now all of a sudden it's the end of the world where maybe you make that one little extra save and then everything's good we win everybody's happy so it's a tricky situation especially being the goalie so is you know you talked about how hard it is to get a number one guy the only guy you hear out there right now is sorrows as kind of a guy who's been a number one vesna level guy who's available you know the rumors i think i read today were like two first rounders wouldn't get it done or you know big asks how comfortable would you feel trading for a guy like that kind of as you mentioned one to ten is really really good and tough to get into but you just you can't be sure

what you're getting i feel like it depends on where you're at in that situation right if it's one of those things where we have to win now and you know you need to get that guy or i look at a team like new jersey who's had struggles in that where you have younger goalies trying and there's no veteran presence where maybe if you're investing in a guy like Soros where you think over the next few years he gives you a chance to win or if a team like Calgary is going to move on Markstrom someone who has term but right now again you're committed to at least you know what you're getting with the Soros where sometimes it's almost having that you know the James Reimer, Martin Jones, Alex Lyon these guys that have come out to establish themselves in a better price range, you know, where do you find that fit

and who's going to get hot at the right time, which is always the, I guess, the good thing about goaltending, which I think I kind of fell into that category when I played. It was consistently I was never in that elite class, but when I got hot, I could keep games rolling and you just got to get going at the right time. We're seeing what we thought was a very good hockey club in the la kings and camp talbot if i'm not mistaken is the all-star uh one of the all-star goalies uh in what uh next few weeks in uh in toronto uh but

is that a team for you carter that needs maybe a Soros? You know, something to push them over the top. Like, I love Cam Talbot just because, you know, similar guy came up with them. But again, this team needs a little bit more. I think if they're going to make a serious run, especially in that Pacific Division, there is just too many heavyweights, and it's going to be an absolute dogfight, I feel like, in the West.

And again, another team for me that I get concerned about in that picture would be Colorado, right? Georgiev, they came out the other day at the GM just about managing his minutes, right, where they want to keep it down, but if we don't have a backup or a solid guy to go to, where is it going to be? So I think LA could be that team, but my thing is you just made that move last year to get Corpus Allo, right, as a rental, and now you're going to go out and get Soros. At least he has has some term but it definitely gives them a chance

but that west division is going to be tough to run through it is interesting to me that like corpus allo can't make a save and columbus goes to la and he's an awesome goalie talbot struggles the year before goes to la and he's a really good goalie like how much does structure help a goalie you know increase their save percentage well did you pull my numbers from when i went from st louis to buffalo no i have right i sometimes well i let i led the league in stats right goals against save percentage playing for st louis blues the next year they win the stanley cup and not to take anything away from jordan binnington but it was kind of a plug and play at that point. We had a veteran team. We had the big defensemen, very predictable hockey.

I go to Buffalo where my first year, I thought I played fairly well at the times, you know, it, we struggled. We had a lot of issues. It wasn't just me, but I felt like the game became less more predictable and I almost tried to do more with my game instead of letting the game come to me because of the unpredictableness of our play. So I think you always rely on structure,

and you look at the teams that are consistently good, and those are the teams that play from the back end out, that have the D-man. Even look at Vegas last year. I know Aiden Hill was unbelievable, but, like, Broussard was really good for them. Thompson was an all-star. You know, is that a product of the surroundings?

You look at their back end, and I believe that structure and good defense is what's going to get you over the hump. Yeah. Carter, terrific stuff, man. What's with you goalies? We got Valley with the Rangers and Mike McKenna. You guys were way more intelligent than I thought. I know, yeah.

We had you fooled, eh? I wasn't an athlete, so I became a goalie but I can talk really thought you guys were nothing but targets terrific stuff Carter thanks for joining us man and keep up the great work on dailyfaceoff.com thanks guys thanks for having me on

thanks Carter really good the ankle stuff really concerning really concerning well just the mere fact that he came back from one and then had to have some sort of procedure yeah to correct it eventually god i forget the word he used there's not anybody's line something it is something put in like if he if if joseph walt broke something he'd be he would have been back by now.

Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Well, you know, here you go, Martin Jones. Martin Jones, keep playing well. Do we have a clip from Elliott Freeman from 32 Thoughts on the goalie market or the Leafs looking for one maybe? So the teams that are looking for goalies are New Jersey, Carolina, L.A., Colorado, possibly Edmonton. Toronto-wise, I heard the problem for Toronto is they wanted to trade

like a sixth-round pick or something for a goalie that could help them while Samsonov was down. No chance. They couldn't get anything. They just they couldn't even get traction. And they didn't like anything that was out there. And people wanted more than that. And they were like, we're not doing it. A sixth rounder throwing a box of donuts or something with a sixth rounder.

It's like going into Harry Rosen with 10 bucks and be like, I can't get anything. What do you mean? This is ridiculous. You can't get cashmere with a six rounder. No Chris Marino wool sweater. Nothing. When somebody tells them that.

Yeah. Does Elliot laugh at them? You thought you could get what for what now? No, because he has to preserve that relation. Oh, yeah, okay. I'll throw that one out there for you. Yeah, we need Elliott to give us a read before we have to break here. Yes, we got some giveaways for All-Star Weekend.

You guys have obviously been doing it here on the show, but we got more. Yes. So make sure you're locked and loaded right now. Get ready to text in today's keyword. But from February 1st through the 3rd all the top stars around the nhl are coming to toronto for all-star weekend and we'll be giving away tickets to different events and episodes here on kipper and born from today through january the 26th today we have tickets for the nhl all-star skills competition featuring 12 all-stars competing in a series of challenges like the Rogers Hardest Shot for a chance to take home a million dollars.

To enter for your chance to win, text in today's code word HARDESTSHOT to 590590. And of course, we have another code word coming at you on Monday's edition of the show. Do we know who the 12 guys are yet that are in the event or in the skills? Connor and Austin. That's it, yeah. You'd assume they put Willie Nylander in there being a Toronto host or Marner.

You got to think it's kind of lean towards the hometown guys. You would think all those guys would be in it, all the Toronto guys. Drysaddle, Leon is in it. Vancouver boys, they got 32 guys in the game. I wonder, the only thing I wonder is, are we going to hear some guys with injuries bail it all? I hope that's not the case here. Anyways, hey, Disco, great job.

Thank you. We still got another hour to go on the real Franceschi and Bourne show. After the break, Ian McIntyre to talk about Rutherford.