Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Rounding Out the Road Trip in Raleigh

Episode Date: January 9, 2025

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look ahead to the Leafs' matchup against the Carolina Hurricanes tonight with a chance to extend their win streak to 6 games. They dig into the Leafs' newly mixed-up d-pairs, Max Pacioretty getting the night off, whether Craig Berube needs to send William Nylander a message to break his slump and much more. Later, former NHLer Aaron Ward (34:21) tees up the Carolina side of tonight's matchup and discusses the Hurricanes' championship window, their analytics-driven roster construction and their carousel of budget goaltending.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

the game. We're live on Sportsnet 590, the fans, Sportsnet 360, and Sportsnet Plus. The Toronto Maple Leafs go into Raleigh, pick on the Carolina Hurricanes. If we can extend that winning streak, JB to six games. Seems unlikely at the start of the season that they were going to be threatening for the conference lead here halfway through, didn't it?

But boy, good start. Feeling good about things right now. Yeah. I probably was a little wrong on feeling like it would take them maybe 41 games to be accustomed to this new straight line, at times maybe boring system for many from the Craig Breuvie and the Toronto Maple Leafs. But, and we have seen some small snippets of adjustments. They lost that three in a row and it was ugly. Was it ugly for three games?

For a minute there, yeah. Anything's ugly for three games here. Is that Columbus then to the Blues maybe on home ice? And then somebody? I don't know, you have a weird hockey memory. I'm learning this more about you recently. Yeah, I remember the things I care about. I don't remember my email password or anything like that,

but I remember the things I care about. But not enough to derail a legitimate shot and not only winning the Atlantic division, but possibly a President's trophy. That's the new goal. I will say too, if you remember earlier in the season, there was long stretches due to injury where you had Grebenkin, Steeves, Nylander, Holmberg. You had a really thin lineup for a while.

So fully healthy here. I know a lot of the underlying numbers, some of the analytical people are not as in love with the Leafs, but they haven't really had their team until the last couple games so here's to hoping. Well McCabe's out that's a significant one right so but not a multiple scenario here which is helpful and in itself. But if you were to rank the guys that they would be most hurt by not having. McCabe's up there pretty high. Yeah, he's- Matthew's Marner.

Really gone to another level in terms of the dependency of him and his game, and it's not on the score sheet, but it's a lot of the other stuff on and off the ice. I've really been impressed with his development as a significant base and leader of the team. Before we go any further, I just want to do some housekeeping here. Oh, okay. Okay.

Okay. Before we go any further, producing. This is something that Kipper has been pushing for for multiple years. He's always wanted to do this. Much like Blair and Barker with the back leg line. We have created the Leafs line Okay So if you will call in a number here and that if you're listening if you have a pen and paper or whatever You're driving just get the podcast after don't text this while you're driving or anything. The number is four one six four one three four one

four one four one four one six four one three four one four one If you call that number, you'll hear my horrible voice telling you to leave a message. And you can leave a message on the Leafline. And if it's any good, if it's you know, a compelling cake, whatever it is, you leave it, I'm going to be pouring through these and if we have enough, we are going to do the Leafline tomorrow on the Leaf Hour. I'm curious to know what percentage of them you'll find usable. I what listen if it's 10% I love the idea listen. I've been screening like I've that's at the core of my job I've been screening calls on this station for 10 years. Yeah, but I know what this yeah, like bad shows

I know I know what makes a good show. I know what makes the first time you've even involved in a good show the rest of them Sucked I don't know that's necessarily trees to do a great job on Saturday mornings with Rob Well, but nobody knew about it. Yeah, they didn't know the truckers did. Okay truckers did. All right all kidding aside I am trusting you Okay, I thought for sure like we'd all sit and go that one that one not but he doesn't want that He wants to pick it himself and then kind of surprise us like a brick over the head So well, I mean to be in full in fairness as well when we started doing this show

I would cut the clips of Sheldon Keefe and we would sit there together And I would try to keep your attention for five seconds to play the clips kipper We learned that that is not like a little feet I'm not gonna sit there and try to get you to listen to these callers I'm just good. Okay, pick them and we're gonna play kipper. Did you like that clip? What clip kipper? What's your name again, we already have like six or seven calls Oh, yeah, right from my Twitter that I put out today So maybe I'll do a little something on tick-tock to this. I'm just a tick-tock influencer all of a sudden and away we go

So there we go. It's the leaf line. Leave us a voicemail on the leaf line You may if you're not an idiot you might get played. So there you go Anyways, okay looking forward to it. Yes any other producing you need to do you have a new shirt? Oh, yeah And born shirt that yeah, thanks kippy. Yeah, you're welcome. I appreciate it. Yeah a little late on the Christmas present Yeah, you're welcome. I appreciate it. Yeah a little late on the Christmas present And I'll just validate that I am wearing hacks I was running around today, that's a new style Thanks for me. So one if we were doing this segment today with someone say what's with the the lines today? I think that would be a hairs be like, oh my god, you know, what have they done now? So the the new wrinkle is throwing OEL Myers Riley Tanev OEL Myers

Benoit Timmons got some fears about OEL Myers anyone else? Yeah, I mean, I don't think those guys have you know outside of an injury game with McCabe I bet those guys haven't played more than two minutes of hockey together. It's a long pair. Yeah range Oh when you look at these new pairs, who is the first one that they're doing this for? I know you're asking me because you think it's Riley. I think it's Riley. My first thought is got to get Riley going and why not put him with your best, most dependable, 200-foot defenseman in Chris Tanev. Yeah, and I don't disagree at all.

We've kind of been waiting for him to find it with someone and get his game going. I know he's scored a goal the other day, an OT winner, and he's commented that he thinks he's found his game a little bit. He's jumping a lot more. He is. And you think a lot more. Yes. And you think that's. Yeah, I don't mind it. And I, I can live with the odd mistake every once in a while, especially if Tanaf is there to kind of back you up, but he still needs to be a lot more

assertive for me, but this is why they got Tana. Yes. They literally went out and got this guy for this spot. He, when we heard that Chris Tanaf was coming he it was like the first thought was okay now Morgan's got a Defenseman and what's funny is I think a lot of us were like Benoit McCabe are also set They're an awesome shut down pair for them And then it was you know OEL Timmons or whatever you ended up doing on the third pair was gonna be alright

So hasn't quite played out that way, but maybe these two of the few more games will find it a little bit. We do have some coach comment on that. So just as a warning on these clips, as you know, I love background noise on clips. They decided to have the coaches media availability in the lobby of a Broadway play. So there's a lot of there's a lot of people around. So if you can make out these... It's fine. Isn't it better than, I think it was New Jersey where there was a construction site they were doing in the middle of a... It held it in an airplane hanger.

It's more of a consistent hum as opposed to when the Leafs do it right below a rickety old fan at the at the Scotiabank Arena. So anyways, let's get the clip from Brubé on the D pairs changing up. I think a lot of that is their lineup. They're pretty spread out in three lines, you know, so I think we need some balance with our D pairs tonight going against them. They've got some good skill in each line, you know, with size. in each line, you know, with sides. So, Neckis, Shvetchikov, is that how you say it? Shvetchikov? Shvetchikov, yeah.

Close. Close. Stahl, Bajo, you know, like so. They got to spread out pretty good. Is that you, Kipper? You coaching the team? Shvetchikov. We're in full grapes.

If he was on his team, he'd know his name, that's for sure. Is that how you say it? Old Bieska. Yeah. We're in full grapes. If he if he was on his team, he'd know his name. That's for sure Yeah, the best the best one with grapes was when he called upon a Kuroski pocahontas Anyways, yeah hillbilly hillbilly I'm not gonna live that one down but still I'm not gonna live that one down. But still, yeah, it is, you know, it's a tough lineup you're facing. That Carolina Hurricanes team is pretty loaded, so whatever adjustments you gotta make, you gotta make. We also have another one from him.

Do you wanna weigh in on that before we go back to broobs? No, go. All right, we got clip three as well on the lineup changes. So let's do that one. Just a little more speed tonight. You know, it's gonna be a fast game. And I want, you know, like we talked about it before, guys sit out, wanna get them back in.

Womers been out for a bit, you know, he was sick. And then, you know, he's back now, but, and I saw one to make that switch. There you go. Humberg in, Robertson in, Reeves out, Patcheretti out. Patcheretti. What are your thoughts on that? My thoughts are that it's not so much

about his performance as we've had multiple quotes from Patcheretti this year where he's like, I didn't get out of bed on Sunday. The one time he said talking about the physical wear and another one where he talked about how much of a grind it is to play like this. and they're playing every other night right now. He is a veteran guy who's been injured So I think it's just like it's a night for him to give someone a rest Yeah, I look at that lineup and I'm looking up and down there their lineup there

And it's just a lot of speed and not a ton of guys that you necessarily need The patch readies physicality or Reeves physicality. You can kind of try to turn this into a track meet. They're not the most physical team, and I think that's been sort of a detriment to them over the years. So I think you can go with a more speedy lineup as opposed to the one against the Flyers, which is supposed to be more physical.

That's what I would look at it. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not surprised. To everyone's conclusion on Pacioretty. I thought he was just awful against Philly. Did you? Yeah, well just slow and tired and worn down for all the reasons that you spoke of. It's just not effective.

So you know, kind of lends to make me a little concerned on if you're really truly gonna depend on him in April and May to maybe get to a conference final or a Stanley Cup final if this guy's going to be able to kind of do the things that we've seen out of the gate early here in the season on getting up and down the ice and using his body and what's going to be left of him in April if he's kind of running out of gas right now going into January. But you know a few games ago you'd have said he's playing pretty well right and so I wonder if you can do this even in playoffs say he's a guy who's not above coming out you know for a Holmberg here. coming out for a Holmberg here. Yeah, for sure.

But can he go from being out of the lineup for game two into a top six in game three and be effective? It would be a unique, I can't recall too many players doing that in and out in playoffs, still effective when they're back in. I'm sure people have some examples for course they can give us but I can't call to mind any if you're sticking with Nylander and and Tavares as you're pairing on your second line I thought that there's been many moments of brilliance over this season with Tavares Nylander and Patcher ready so if that's a look that you want to go to in a game two or a game three

You know that that does work Maybe with a fresher patch ready, but I don't think there's a lot of examples of a guy coming into the top six Okay, you're gonna think once you're getting in the first and second round you're gonna be facing some fast teams, right? So It's like okay Tavares and patchty might look good on a November, December, January, but is it going to look fast enough for you in April? And is Nylander going to have to be like, you know, like, come on guys, like I'm two zones ahead already of most people, let alone you two, that is going to be unique.

One thing I want to note about this Carolina Hurricanes team. So if you check natural statric, uh, Corsicy percentage, corcy for percentage, which is just shot attempts. Yeah. Um, I gotta get a new word so everybody stops hating. Cause it's such a normal, it's such a normal thing. It's like, who gets more shots. Yes. So the second best team in shot attempts percentage is the Florida Panthers. Third best is Edmonton. They're at 53 and 54%.

First best is Carolina at almost 60%. Like they're 5% better than the next best team So they control just a massive number of shots So even though you know, they're not first in the NHL and goals or anything They have the pocket ton and they shoot the pocket ton So it's something tonight where it's like I'm worried the Leafs are gonna be on their heels a bit I think patch ready not be in the lineup. Maybe it's a good night for him to not be in Then one thing that I think can hold a little bit of water for them tonight is even if that does happen like they've

They're used to very seldom out of position. So someone and it made the they win every game getting a shot May hit with a 17 It may the they win every game get no shot may hit with a 17 load Injury before it gets to wall and if it does get to wall, he'll stop it. So even if that trend continues I Think the Leafs have shown an ability to frustrate teams Yeah, when the plays a little lopsided for me, it's like is that a trend? A trend that will continue or will it finally catch up to the Leafs? You know, that's the only thing that you got to ask maybe in the back half of the season at some point.

It puts a lot of pressure on your goalie. Puts a lot of pressure on, you know, just no weak ones. I mean, he's a real stalwart. He never gets hurt. So he's a pressure. He's a proven commodity that he is. He's 70 a year for him. Makes you a little nervous. Okay, so You mentioned Willie. We haven't really talked about Willie Yesterday. Oh, we've talked about him just not on the air. We haven't we haven't talked about him. Well yesterday

Today before we did about today. We are yes. Okay, and What was your comment again on our broadcast? He takes some naps. 12 games. Just a dozen game naps. A dozen game naps. What are we at now, seven or eight? We're at eight. We're at eight.

Yeah. You got four to go here to hold, you know, true. Well, he starts getting talked about around now, right? Oh, Willie's been not great for a little bit. The coach will call him out around game 10 or so And then by 11 or 12 Willie gets two and one and he's like, oh, that's what it feels like again And you know I started with this business working at City News 680 and I'd worked there for two or three years as an audio editor as An editor did a bunch of stuff there like a 50 year old today and young man and that's the glass. It's the glasses

You know you start to feel the beats when it comes to like covering the news like oh, it's the glass. It's the glasses. Uh, you know, you start to feel the beats when it comes to like covering the news It's like oh, it's the st. Patrick's Day parade again. Oh, it's just back to school again. It's like that with the Leafs. It's like Morgan Riley's struggling. He's the big whippin boy. Oh, you know Marner needs a new contract Oh, you know, we're gonna give him the Landers gotta get his whack. Here we go Like it's very cyclical and we're at the point of the season now the dog days where Willie kind of needs it But I will say Willie has been it's been a unique year where out of the gates Barube was like I need better from you. I'm just playing them 17 18 minutes a night Yeah, Willie stood up to him in the media absolutely responded to the criticism

Yeah, but we also like had this Austin Powers like oh, it's a powers struggle. You know, like we had the moment and like it felt like Willie won and they were like do whatever you want and no one has said a negative word about him since and he's been a dog for two weeks. Do you want to go to Craig Borubi on Willie? Longer clip, Keith-esque clip here from Borubi. And we'll pick up the conversation out of it. Yeah, I talked to Willie today and it's just more about, you know, I think sometimes skilled players, scorers lose their confidence a little bit and that's what I see right now with Willie,

a little bit of lack of confidence. And for me, it's talking to him about just working his way out of the situation. You know, you can't just relate to, well, I need a break, you know, work your way out, get your breaks, work for your breaks, you know. You can't just relate to, well, I need a break. Work your way out, get your breaks, work for your breaks. That's the biggest thing for me is just getting him back to work a little bit more and being

more tenacious on pucks and puck battles and things like that. When he was scoring, and he was scoring a lot, his puck battles were extremely high. He's playing with more pace. He's just not playing with the same pace right now. He's responsive. Very responsive, yeah. And we always have good conversations and, you know, it's been really good that way. So, you know, I think, you know, I had to do a little bit better job with him too.

A better job on what? Like a bit better job coaching him, I guess. I had to do a bit better job with him too. A better job on what? Like a bit better job coaching him I guess. I had to do a bit better job with him too. Is what he said. Did you cut the? No that was it. I had to do a little bit better job with him too. Better job of him too. Like I said, they're doing it at the Met Gala.

He can do all of that or you can bench him. No. Go to jail if you do that. He can do all of that or you can bench him. No. Go to jail if you do that. Apparently. From the coaching staff here you go to jail. I know what I know. I know what will work for sure.

Give him the full two minutes of the power play. Try giving him three minutes of the two. Keep doing that. That's really working. Well, it wasn't lost in that maybe longest Craig Brubie Kippers clipper in history. I think number one for sure. Number one for sure. He mentioned like work and battle and work and work and work. And there's a lot of sense in what he said that he's not necessarily working hard enough to get out of this. Yeah. Just do your job.

Yeah. Yeah, it is, you know, it's, it is a Willie thing. There are, this is like the ultimate time where you would kind of expect it, right? Like no, not a contract year. He's been through that. He's back. He had a good start. You know, it's mid season.

Like this is a Willie time where you kind of got to give them the little cattle prod and I'm not a I'm not a big believer that you've got a Shut a guy down like These are stars and I know that there's a different You don't embarrass your guys. You don't embarrass your guy. It's different, but you can miss a shift or two I don't know if you have to do the whole kind of kucherov shut down for the third period or half a game or Pastornak I think got embarrassed a little bit by Montgomery earlier this year. Did he not?

For two shifts like but the pastor bet that the passion. Yeah, well, that's For sure, yeah, and I don't think Berube needs to go down there But you know even if he was to miss a shift or two It's after an obvious event right an obvious event. You can still get a message across It gets noticed by the other players on the team, which is never a bad thing. Oh my god He if he benches Willie, what's he gonna do to me? If I turn the puck over like that. So that's usually how it has that ripple effect

on your team. But he is nothing wrong with that. He's just not at that place yet. Borubi, and maybe that last comment where he just kind of left it hanging open, like I gotta do a better job. Maybe if this trend continues, that maybe that's an option for him.

The other question I have is, do you think that the pace of his line is having an effect on him? Like the fact that Patrick, Eddie and Tavares are older veteran, not fleet of foot guys. Now, when he was successful earlier in the year, was he with Matthews? Was that would that have been his center? He's played he played with a lot of kind of I just don't call Matthews being in there long enough for anything to yeah He played he's played a lot with Tavares, but then he played with like Holmberg and Robertson for a while when they had well

I know he went eight or nine games without having the same center for two straight games But like when Marner plays with Taveras for long periods of time, I don't think you think it's the best thing for Marner, right? Like that's not the ideal guy to help him. I don't know how many games we saw this year of Taveras and Marner. Do we see? We saw during the nine that he was out obviously early and they they put points up Yeah, no, they were great. That was Mitch's

Highlight as a leaf run. I would say he was really really good so I mean you mentioned that so with the lander about needing to poke and prod and it I am less Like, you know, we're really now. I'm less willing to do it now like I'm less willing to like deal with it Really yeah, I mean see I'm much more accepting of it. I understand it. Yeah, but when you get paid Like a top winger in the NHL You know all it's the dog days all this

So it's like that's what the eleven point six million dollars is for is to motivate you to like I understand it He was making six point nine. It's like I'm a little bit more willing to give him grace When you sign on the top dollar like he's been no good for quite a while here. I Think there's a sense and it may come back to even what we witnessed with I want more ice time and then getting the two minutes that there's There's a Don't know what an Agreement or just an overall kind of this is the way we're gonna handle Willie

It was almost as if it was pre-planned and that when he did go through stretches you weren't gonna bench him you weren't gonna call him out in the media you're just gonna kind of work your way through it to Justin's point an acceptance of we got to work around the edges with this guy I mean I wonder where Willie is talent wise in the NHL like top 10 talent like is he even go lower seven yeah six like he had his best his edges his skating he is the talent is scary it is he's he might be this generation's Kovalev where I mean you would know much better than I do and I he's he's got that he's got that it factor, you know, and Yeah, you Have some perfect example. Sometimes you're like, oh my god, like what are you doing?

Sometimes you're in your own little world and right, you know, are you playing left wing for us or right wing for them? My point was like if he played to his potential He's probably paid more like dry sidle or like Marner's gonna be or you know more money I think part of him getting 11 5 and not more is People are like driving in a ditch right now going 11 and a half Yeah driving in a ditch right now going, 11 and a half. Yeah. That's a deal for a guy that should be at. If he's a top seven skill guy and he's playing and getting paid like a top 40 guy,

it's cause sometimes he sleeps for a bit. I just, I think. By the way, my argument sucks. What? You shouldn't get to be like, oh, he gets to not try because. Yeah. I'm not trying to justify it.

I'm trying to explain it. I got a doctorate in William Neylander, buddy. I get it. I understand it, but I'm just less willing to accept it after the contract negotiations and paying the peak of his problems. What are you going to do? Well, I'm not going to do anything. What's Craig Berube going to do?

This, this. Yeah, whack away. Whack away. That's it. That's all you got. Yeah, I hope. Whack away. That's it. That's all you got. Yeah, just log them in. If it continues tonight or bleeds into the weekend, Craig can only go to the Wells so

many times with that before. You'll probably feel a little bit of the heat to say find another way to get really going. The beatings will continue until morale approves. But you remember Sidney Crosby. It's like a corny work slogan basically. But the like Sidney Crosby hadn't scored in eight or nine games and they asked him about it. This is like three weeks ago and they're like, yeah, you haven't scored.

He was like, well, the good news is every time it gets to a point where you guys bring it up to me, I start scoring again. And he scored that night. That's like, this is the Willie cycle. What's today? Today's Thursday the 9th. They play on Saturday the 11th as well. When we do our show on Monday, he'll have scored at least twice. I agree. Maybe two tonight. Yeah I had him pegged for two empty netters Billy the other night. Yeah, I'm like that's the way it works with this guy Yes, it does and no one will know the difference in April. Yes, and we're gonna go in here go. Oh, will he sure You know they were here. He's on track for

Wall again tonight. Looks like. Yeah, I think. They're doing it. They're giving the Ilya Sorokin treatment. Every night, son. He's doing everything he's supposed to be doing, including.

Passing a lot of tests here. Going through a nice stretch here where you need great goal-tending. You're waiting for Stolarz to get healthy. Speaking of, do we have anything? Speaking of passing tests is the Been removed from his knee no update. Yeah the pebble. Yep I might add to the text of the Fox ass, but we're next practice. Yeah, we need an update on that

I think we're do We have a couple more clips to get to oh just one more on the top line We play the Hurricanes one Yes, because he's wrong. No that was about that was about switching up the D pair We didn't actually play the one on on the yeah, let's get a little bit of input on the team. He's facing tonight Real good team for a while now You know they got some great players over there and they've got some great players over there. But it's the pressure they come with.

They're a hardworking team. They work as hard as any team in the league. There's just no room. They don't give you much room. You've got to win your battles. There's a few things that we've got to do to try to create some space out there tonight. And be patient. I think composure and patience and discipline will be key to tonight's game.

Yeah, so that's what you mentioned there, right? The composure, patience, because he's like, they're going to fill us in. Well, and it felt like being on the other side of a Leafs game where he talked about this is what teams used to say with Leafs. They've been a great team for a while now. You know, you got to win your battles against them. They're great. All these sort of like cliches and it's like, but we need to stay patient. It's like, God, that's how teams have been beaten the Leafs. So yeah, they're the anti Leafs this year.

I'm scared to say this because I said this about LA at the beginning of the season This team's not as good as I thought they'd be Carolina yeah I'm looking at them and they're like win one lose one win one lose one win one lose one I don't know if their their window is kind of closed They seem to be the last few years as a team that probably should have won Or gone to a final well They went and went a couple around or two every year for like I know swept them in the conference finals when

Sam Bennett nailed Slaven oh that was the other guy's hip swept yeah that was kind of there felt like it was gonna be their year and it just didn't work out they just I don't know they lost Pesci and they say has a second pair last year they're missing something here They just seem to be like the goalie. That's what they're missing. They're starting to be enough to me I'm not even sure if they got enough star power and I like Sebastian Ajo and Jarvis Special the cops got like 13 goals and 29 points in 41 games. That's not a superstar.

And same with Svetnikova. Those aren't superstar numbers. And Jarvis, he had 29 points. It's like, Natchez has 47 points in 41 games. But this is like a crazy career high. And I don't think he's been, he started on fire. I think he's cooled off significantly. So I think they recognize themselves as a team.

It's like, can you win by committee? Like thees of old like the 06 Canes because they're not going to get dragged the same way a McKinnon has or a, you know, McDavid drags team to a final. I do think that they'll try to do something more aggressive but the ah, did you guys see the Hageljo exchange? Yeah, what was it again? Where Hagel was yelling at him and he just did like the stupid face. Oh, did you see the Vern Fiddler on BX's face? He crossed his eyes and Hagel just immediately started laughing because he got him. The face is so funny.

I like that guy. I'm writing an article for tomorrow on players NA on players being friends and it not being as competitive at times. And did you see the kerfoot Kachuk clip? No, kerfoot Bennett. Yes. It's a kerfoot Bennett? Yes. Okay. Yeah, I did. So lining up for a face off, kerfoot comes in and says, love you bud. And not as much as before now.

When Bennett says, hold on says hold on hold on say that louder say it in the mic or something I did I did and so he wins a draw and he goes I don't love you as much as before something like that what happened of a game we should break where where where would that history of come from I don't know it's Bennett Bennett and kerfoot I am almost 100% positive that it is that I can really look at it but okay sure it is Yeah, anyways, they I was watching on my phone from beat from the drum Utah and Florida last night

Yeah, and what did you kind of conclude because you know how I feel obviously I Concluded this is based on my conclusion in the article Joel Fairby There we do her this exchange my conclusion is that this all raises the value of villains. It is neither Bennett or Kachak. It is Sam Reinhardt. Reinhardt. Yeah. So I don't know what the history is there. And Kerfoot. It raises the value of villains because when I was in college and I was chit chatting with guys on the ice and cutting deals, I remember trying to cut a deal with David Backus and he punched me in the face so hard and he did not Want to be buddies? Yeah, and it was not fun to be on the ice and I didn't want to play as much against David back

It's and I just say it's really valuable to have these guys like last night Miller and Tom Wilson going toe-to-toe. I love that game last night. They right at each other. Love. No deals cut. Everything about the Vancouver Canucks. Yeah. Good game. Last night in Washington was what you would love in a hockey game. No love you buds. Right? So Sam Reinhart. Debois goes right around and gets the best defenseman in the league. We got a national hour to talk. No, I know. I know. Okay. All right. Sam Reinhart and Alex Kerfoot, both North Vancouver guys. I'm sure maybe they played Minor hockey together or whatever. So but again like there you go

Like we want to mic them and they're thinking about ways to entertain us when Just the NHL is the players the players are chatting online because they know their mic Or they're they're chatting the. Online. Or they're chatting. On the World Wide Web. W doesn't mind. W's saying it. On their wires. On their chat groups.

On their microphones. Yes, yes. But they're doing it because they know it's out there and it could go viral. I don't know. I don't think. What is the purpose of that? I don't think anyone knows that at the time. I don't think he knows that. No, he says, I'm miked. Right knows that at the time I think I don't think he knows that oh, he says I'm miked

Well, the other guy says to him after he gives him the love you bud All right, but I my other thought was that the NHL needs the PGA's Player incentive money and we need these guys to try to entertain a little bit. Well, but that's a separate conversation We should go okay, but they played and just to finish off that conversation Alex kerfoot and Sam I played together on the 2010 2011 Vancouver Northwest Giants under 18 no see it's always connected dots in this world folks boom real you figure a lot out okay we're gonna take a quick break when we return Aaron Ward Stanley Cup champion

Stanley Cup champion with a Carolina Hurricanes. He'll give us the goods on whether or not The Hurricanes still have a window to be good or not Ward Oh when we return to real kipper and born Get smarter when you listen to hockey talk the hockey PDO cast with Dimitri Filipovich Subscribe and download the show on apple Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts Welcome back into the real kipper and born show. So sammy how many uh calls yet, uh, give people a reminder that we're doing a now we're doing a what is it called? I call it the Leafs Line. Yes, a voicemail. So we can get Joe from Scarborough. Yeah,

Joe from Etobicoke, Tony and Maple probably a couple of those. But I got to tell you, it's off the hook, but get to Eduardo. He doesn't have that much time. So all right, let's get to our next caller. Aaronordle! Aaron from Raleigh. You're on the Real Kipper and Bourne Show. Go ahead. Hey, careful, careful. I do have a burner account that exists that's out there and it's clearly like a parody,

but you might get me involved somewhere here. Buddy, how are you, man? We haven't had you on for a while. It's great hearing from you. For those of you that watch our show, great seeing you. How are you, man? We haven't had you on for a while. It's great hearing from you. For those of you that watch our show, great seeing you. How are things going? It's good. I think you guys are taking a bit of a risk though

because this is my virgin foray into using FaceTime. So I'll just warn you that the people and Roland Garros were doing a presentation with the statistics and I moved my hands the wrong way and they got balloons and hearts and fireworks coming across the picture. So I had to keep my hands down. This could get interesting.

I'm dealing with boomer over here. Awesome stuff. Well tonight we're going to tee up the Carolina Hurricanes and the Toronto Maple Leafs and just before going to commercial break, I talked about the the expectations of the Carolina Hurricanes and you know if the window's still open to maybe win a championship or be one of seven, eight, ten teams that can legitimately win. From your view on on the club overall and maybe not the last two or three weeks where they've won one, lost one, won one, lost one. What have you seen out of this hockey club? So full transparency being a former player here and living here, I actually held out no hope. I

thought the idea that they had lost so many guys, I thought, man, they're not going to be able to withstand the loss to Shea for what he brought to the table. I mean, Pesci clearly that component going out getting Gensoul because that's off on whatever level and then Tara Vynan for the kind of the chemistry that he has with Aho with making them feel comfortable and what they had going on. Yes, that there's no chance I gave them the benefit of the doubt prognosticating saying they would probably make wild card. So I will tell you that I'm surprised by what they've managed to do.

Truth be told, this is Carolina who's a heavily analytics built team. Their mentality is this, that they can replace a player maybe not as good, but like-minded and like-capable. So they have clearly brought some players in, and they've maintained a level of play that's exceeded what I thought, but when watching them and seeing how they played from the start of the season, I go back to what you just said a second ago, the consistency sometimes against given competition, it's like they sometimes play down to some teams and then compete up against the better ones.

So I don't know what that make is. They play the same style that you know Carolina has played for the same three years, three, four years of they make very few mistakes in their own end because they're up in the top two or three usually have lobbed the puck out of their own end. They don't give the puck away in that capacity. They generate their offense, so puck retrieval, chances off puck retrieval. And it's the same team in terms of style, but some of the players have changed.

And you can really see where Carolina is hurting right now The power play even though they're sitting at 12 There were two last year and that was one of the major help major aids in generating offense So I think that's where some of the questions come. Yeah, that sounds a lot like the Leafs But what I don't think it's a lot like the Leafs actually I gotta tell you I was talking to a friend of mine in Toronto and he's like, well, what's your analysis of Leafs? I'm like, almost something completely different than I've been accustomed to. Usually the Leafs have like this, this chaotic story that you've got like, oh, they got to address this. I almost feel like there's been small components that they've, we've talked about, but there's never really been a major overarching

problem. Like, okay, yeah, Matthew's injury, that could be a major one, but I feel like there's an even keelness, if that's such a word, to the Toronto Maple Leafs that's not normal for them. And it's kind of scary for the rest of the teams around. They've got some pieces in that I think, I'm a huge closet Matthew Nives fan. He's almost an old school throwback kind of player

that I feel like Scottie Bowman would have loved him, like that kind of guy. And I feel like they've solved some issues and bring in some presence. But you said, for me Carolina, it's still a question mark. Yeah. So where do you stand in general team building? As the Leafs are different in that they are run,

they are elite talent. And then they've been trying to fill in around that elite town for years. Carolina is kind of like the collective you have experience winning a Stanley Cup on a team that I think most would say was a collective and not a star-driven team. Can that still work today? So Roddy coaching and not being in a locker room I always heed to the idea that you never know the truth unless you're sitting in that locker room, hearing what's being said and feeling philosophically and psychologically where the team is at. How he coaches though, I think the team takes on that identity.

Right? So we had the story about Natchez looking at going elsewhere last year and that was a dominating storyline here in Carolina. But I think what Natchez was evaluating was, okay, if the system for me is not typically ideal for a skillset guy, I can probably operate within this system, but where do I fall in the pecking order?

I think that's where they've struggled. So the idea of how he disperses his team is almost like that playoff mentality of having equal parts. I'll give you an example. The LA Kings, two or three years ago, if you looked at them top to bottom, line one through four, they were highly successful during that run because they were able to disperse evenly the statistical output. I think this is the same philosophy

with Carolina when you have Jarvis up top with Ajo and Roslavik and then you look down and you're like okay, Nacius is sitting on the second line and then here's another panic like Spekshinikius is sitting on the second line and then here's another panic like Spekshinikov is sitting on the third line what are they doing? I think it applies to this to the style and the system that Roddy has these guys playing that that's effective and guys have bought in. So here we got an owner in Tom Dundon who took over I think sole possession of this hockey club maybe four or five years

ago and not that I know his history of and who took over, I think, sole possession of this hockey club maybe four or five years ago. And not that I know his history of his business history, but the perception is out there that he would find undervalued businesses and build them up. And you know, maybe he brought that philosophy into the hockey club a little bit. And I'm not saying it can't be done because you can moneyball maybe To a certain extent but then once those assets get a little bigger. It's hard to keep them I bread pesci. So where is he today? My understanding is Jake Gensel wanted to be in Carolina I wanted to be a hurricane. He wanted him there

He just did not offer him enough money when he needed to. You think he's learned a little bit here moving forward or are you shaking your head? No? I think they maintain a very static and consistent philosophy here in Carolina that you have. So I'll give you an example of this. We have an alumni game coming up here for the Eric Stahl jersey retirement and we joke amongst alumni that 2019 on the majority of the fan base here has changed. They identify with the Ahos, they identify with the Spechnikovs and so as long as you have those components there where there's like a fan-based loyalty to it. Knowing what I said earlier when we started this, they're a heavily data analytics driven team.

And that includes not just how you approach the game, but the players and the lineup you present, or how you deconstruct or construct your lineup. Tulski here, although he doesn't say much of anything ever to anybody or give an indication of how things work. By the process of him actually working for Dundon, he's very good at economizing players, evaluating what he thinks a guy is going to get. Can you hold on to him?

Are you better to get more picks for that guy for the long term? So I think they really take a long-term, 60,000-foot view approach rather than finding any loyalty to a given piece or component or player in this team. So yes, you're correct. Their philosophy is once you price yourself out of here, and this is an outsider's observer or part of the Tuesday Alumni Club conversation in the locker room as we evaluate this team, once you price yourself out of where we think you should land, then you're expendable. And that's just factual for 90% of this team. And that's the way they work this team. So he's smart about how he runs his money. They evaluate players top to bottom on how they can fit into a lineup, not just what they can bring to a lineup, but will they complement other players? Can they possibly play within the system that Roddy has set down?

And going back to the answering the question you said about how Tom runs his organization, the fact that how he started it here was offering the first coach $300,000 to prove themselves as a head coach in the national hockey league tells you that there's a standard set and it will be consistent going forward. So, uh, I know you have to go here shortly so just need to get a quick goaltending question in for Carolina. I'm good to go 550 sorry 455. Okay. Oh okay. Perfect. Yes so quick goaltending question then for Carolina.

Are they just gonna go status quo and hope someone plays well? Honestly, I Again, I don't work for the organization. I watch so much time because I live here I watch Montreal all the time. I watch every other like 30 other teams equal parts My biggest head scratcher is at what point we're going back to Morazzic Like when are we gonna just come up with something that's gonna answer the question in that and that's ironic that I'm sitting here on a trauma radio station talking about this But when do we answer the question in net like you got guys that don't perform in the playoffs you guys guys are consistently injured like

This is a team that as we say your last question was you're economizing you're trying to bring the best out of players I don't think goaltending position is a, is a place you play with that. Like you got to find your horse and we've been dealing with ponies here for a little while. Like I, they want someone to step up, but they haven't graduated that level of owning the net and having it. Kachekov is entertaining and I think he's fully capable, but he's young. And like, as you see the process of what Montemboa did in Montreal, he's ascending in terms of maturity, skill and

composure and owning his net. I think that process still exists for him in his ceiling side, but he's not quite there yet. And again, as you talk about like the window, how long is your window open with this core composition of guys? How about Brent Burns? Get him to play Nat. He seems to be doing everything else for this. Unbelievable. So we have guys I think that play our alumni game that are younger than him. So how we get our information is there's usually the injury skate at the practice rink and the alumni go on after. We just show up early and I mean your cohort, Justin Williams sometimes out there working out Jarvis when he was injured.

We meet some of the guys, get some of the inside information. But Burns is a machine and he's yeah, I mean just when's it going to end? We were joking the other day about some guys coming out and and debuting again in their 40s in the Spanish League and Spanish But burn seems to be just you know, there's no downturn in this performance and what he means to this team I think is more invaluable to the team than anything. Like, how he deals with the young guys,

how he teaches guys to deal with adversarial situations. It doesn't only fall on Roddy to guide the team. He's an extension of Roddy. So the participating alumni at your game that you guys are gonna have, Ray Whitney, Rod Brindivore cam ward Justin Williams Mike Commodore Chad LaRose Tim Gleeson Eric Cole Sean Hill Patrick East Eric step in how are the boys? How's it going with your alum? Let me tell you something

So how this came about was we played the UNC University North Carolina Acha D1 team in August Steve Royce is the head coach of them and we did it for charity game Pack the barn kick the snot out of them did you really oh my god so you're the D1 team they talked crap too they were like all young legs we're gonna make him here's the thing if you're chasing the puck the entire time and you don't know how to play systems we will outsmart you we will hockey IQ to death so it was it was it was competitive for the first period, it was like, you know, three-one,

and then I think it ended up nine-two. And guys were like, yeah, we were like doing the old messy to, you know, whoever, like the triangle passing and then popping it. And we didn't have Justin Williams, we didn't have some of these guys, so now our group is pretty good. The NC State team is pretty good.

There is a, we are lodging a labor complaint for the D though if you look at that Five defensemen so cam words coming out and playing For the second and third period dude, you should see him. He's the Adam Oates of the alumni game Dude crushes it he's like always under control. Composers there, dishes off, but he always, he front loads his team though. He sits in like politics in the locker room for everybody wearing a dark Jersey. So the NHL guys all are on his team and some of the guys that played like college hockey or junior end up on ours. There's a Seinfeld episode where Kramer brings, he walks into Jerry's

apartment with his golf clubs and throws them down and goes, I stink. And that's, that's me now every Thursday morning. How's your game? Our game's good. We play, we actually started for mental health reasons. How are you, your game. Your game. Never changed. I didn't go faster. And guess what? There's still glass on every arena. Wardo, welcome back, man. It's good to have you back on the show. Thanks for doing this. No problem. Thank you. Thanks, Wardo. Aaron Ward, Stanley Cup champion, multiple Stanley Cup champion. That's great. He's awesome. He's really good.

I'm really not surprised that the former NHLers worked the D1 team. I am. Really? Yeah. I don't think most times, I don't think that would happen. I don't know what UNC is all about, but... For those of you that saw him on Zoom, the guy looks like he can still play. He looks very fit. But I mean, you saw that club team beat the defending champions in the preseason

like a UNLV's club team beat Denver in the preseason 7-6 and a shootout like I don't know they're NHLers like it's like Eric Stahls on the list like you know you could you could beat him well sure I think it depends on the age of the alumni group and this is obviously a younger one anyways that was great chat okay we're just getting started our thanks to Aaron Ward for joining us depends on the age of the alumni group. And this is obviously a younger one. Anyways, that was great chat. Okay, we're just getting started. Our thanks to Aaron Ward for joining us. Stick around, Ray Ferraro, AESPN hockey analyst,

former teammate of mine in New York, all briefly and all, but love having Ray on. You're not gonna wanna miss that. We're gonna pick up the very hot discussion on the Vancouver Canucks, plus much more. So do not go away on the Real Kipper and Boren Show.