Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Slog in Sunrise

Episode Date: November 28, 2024

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look back on the Leafs' 5-1 loss to the Florida Panthers on Wednesday. They dig into Bobby McMann joining the Leafs' already lengthy injury list, Fraser Minten earning a spot in the lineup, a long-term plan for Nikita Grebenkin and Nick Robertson's confidence crisis. Then, they discuss building interest around the league for the Leafs' AHL goalies and what they could fetch in a trade. Later, they are joined by Hockey Night in Canada's Craig Simpson (34:15) weighs in on the Leafs' effort last night, the period of opportunity for young players, Robertson's struggles and the state of the Panthers.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's get her going on the leaf hour edition of the real kipper and born show we are live on sports at 590 the fans sports at 360 sports net plus nick kiprios justin bourne sammy Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee, Derek Brandeo, Jake the Snake, Schultz, and U.S. Thanksgiving. Happy South of the Border to everybody, which can only mean one thing, NFL football. See, we've got a monitor in here with the football game, and then it went all kind of squirrely on us. It asked us if we're still awake and we

were very much awake we scrambled to unplug it plug it back in and like what is going on here just in time to see the bears pee down their leg there that was that was ugly um i have a very special kinship with other loser franchises where i really look upon them fondly and i really feel for them and i really root for them and i have a lot of good buddies that are bears fans and they they have a lot of pain like they really they really are in the they're playing the lions you follow the lions history for sure with the lions but the lions are legitimately the best team in the league in a super bowl favorite right now. The Bears have been wallowing in nothing for a very long time. Oh, that's the Lion fans, all these U.S. Thanksgivings. Just watching the team getting drubbed every Thursday,

every annual Thursday. Yeah, listen, it's good right now for the Lions. They're the Super Bowl favorites. I feel for my Bears fans. Okay, well, then if you feel that way about the Bears or the Lions, how are you feeling about your toronto maple leafs last night now listen it's not often we we remember what we say but i think a few people kind of reminded me that maybe i predicted a score uh derek did you find that is that our first unofficial kippers clipper Maybe not. He does have it. Okay.

Not now. Okay. Not now. Okay. Not now. You missed one game. If they lose 5-1 tonight, you're going to be mad at me tomorrow. I'm not mad at you, Kipper. I'm never mad at you.

Okay, so that's where it came from. I bet you I got 100 messages. Are you mad at me today because I said 5-1? I don't remember the context of that. Because I was saying that Austin Matthews should just play. Yes. And I think I said I'm not interested in Austin playing at 70% in November. I mean, it's not the most important thing.

And I said, then they could lose 5-1. And then, you know, will Sammy be mad at me because i didn't push harder for austin that was i'm not giving you credit for a prediction there listen you do not let the truth get in the way of a good prediction okay all right all right that was certainly not a prediction you actually thought that they were going to play well last night. I'm not sure they didn't. I'm with you. I'm kind of okay with, I didn't like the outcome like a lot of Leaf fans, but it was horrible. I mean, I just, you know, I was on the broadcast last night,

and I can't, there are very few games I remember being on a broadcast where there's just so little to say aside from they don't have their guys. They didn't have their hockey team. Florida played pretty well, got out to an early lead, and playing catch-up without your guys, really tough spot. Yeah. You know, when you play the defending Stanley Cup champions... Who are amped up. Who are the most horned up they could possibly be

after their coach bags gave them everything coming towards this game. They've lost four in a row. The Leafs have won four in a row. And they're going up against, like, basically the Marlies for half the night. It's probably going to end poorly. But I would say that the Leafs, to me, for the first time, like, you know, they've played well defensively and they've looked well coached.

I thought they looked well coached last night in terms of their effort level and trying to play the system and do what they were trying to do. They just didn't have a chance. They just didn't have enough bodies to do it. And maybe the first night Stolarz's play, he wasn't bad, but he wasn't good either. He didn't bail him out or anything. The first power play goal to me was like, I don't know,

he can make that safe. So Luke Fox asked Mitch Marner about the lack, I think, of five-on-five scoring. Do we have that as a first Kippers Clipper? Sure. What do you think you guys need to do to get more five-on-five scoring going? I mean, we're missing half our team up front, man. You know, it's tough. We've got a lot of guys coming in trying to

jump up in some roles. They've done a great job. I think we've done a great job keeping pucks out every night five-on-five. But tonight, like I said, we've got a lot of guys coming in trying to jump up in some roles. They've done a great job. I think we've done a great job keeping pucks out every night, five on five. But tonight, like I said, we've got to be up the ice more. We've got to be up in the four check more. We've got to get around the net more. Tips more pucks for our D. I thought they did a good job getting pucks through. We just weren't there enough.

Nice of him to go into all of that, but he should have just kept his mouth shut after he told Luke, we're missing half our team, man. And then just left it there. Love Luke. Give your head a shake, Luke. You're trying to stir it up on me. I'm not, I won't have it.

I don't think he's trying to stir it up. I think it's a good question. Legitimate question. I thought Mitch gave a great answer. Like, here's what we need to do. Great answer. We got the Marlies here. Yeah.

We don't have the Marlies. So in, or we do have the Marlies. So in the interim, he said all the things his coach went on to say later, which is like, actually, do we actually have that? I'm generating more 5-on-5 goals. Clip three from Berube, please. Well, I think it's, you know, a lot of times it's hard to score. But, you know, for me, it's, you know, I think that we can do a better job of getting to the net front and creating more opportunities around the net

and scoring some greasy goals around the net. I don't think that we're hard enough around the net. I don't think that we're working hard enough to get to the net. I said after the first period, our D had five or six shots in the first period. We're not making it difficult enough on a goalie and creating second third opportunities around the net you know that's you know you gotta that's a lot of times that's the way you gotta score goals 505 yeah i mean that's gonna be his answer every time they

don't score right work harder to get to the net low to high screens tips etc pretty much the only thing i uh I expected him to say out of that and the only thing he can say. Is that much different from the overview clip we've got, Sammy? Yeah, we can play the clip. Well, I think five on five. You know, we were talking before, you know, it was going to be a tight, you know, tight game, five on five.

Special teams are different. I mean, gave up two power play goals to them in a shorty. To me, that's the difference in the game. Outside of the results of five on five, it did look fairly balanced, right? It wasn't like the Panthers dominated them five on five no no i thought that they they didn't dominate and i think that's because of what you mentioned where you know they looked pretty pretty tight defensively it's five on five sport logic said that the leafs had 1.0 expected goals florida only had 1.5 you know like they were slightly better at five on five a couple of

great shooters right there stanley cup champions they got uh verhege shoots one in reinhardt shoots one in barkov shoots one in yeah you know that's kind of the story of the game offensively for them and for me a tough challenge and tavaris has been terrific but it's i think last night was a reminder is that you you can't have tavaris go up against barkov yeah i guess you just so i actually thought tavaris was good last yeah and i i looked at some of the results and they weren't good yeah and i guess that could be playing barkov or whatever but yeah the turnover was a little hard luck too he ran out of space and the power the short-handed yeah the reinhardt short-handed one where it was bad

luck well that play was that i hated that like yeah i hated it too but you know when you're trying to give them the benefit of the doubt to be honest with you well you know you're in a game where and listen it's hard to get really bent out of shape about it but you're in a game where you're like we've said a month of multiple times here you're playing with the marlies, and, you know, these guys are out there battling. Like, the last thing you can have happen is the opportunity to get on the power play and, like, actually have a chance and then have that shorty.

They go down on the other end, and, I mean, that is the definition. It's the game. Definition of a dog's breakfast in their own zone. Reinhardt down the chute and Goldspar down. But, yeah, I didn't love that. And then, outside. But, yeah, I didn't love that. And then outside of that, like, you pass Tavares going up against Barkov,

then what do you got left between Holmberg and Dewar and Minton? It's like it's over. Yeah. And it's just a – it's over. And it's just a reminder of, yeah, it's just a it's over and it's just a reminder of yeah it's been a good november but we're gonna have to shore that middle up and that is even after austin returns yeah i mean after austin returns like if you get austin and nize back you know once they get everyone back you're gonna have to be you're a lot more comfortable with you at that five on five question as soon as you get those guys back as early as tomorrow night saturday night yeah i think he's i think he's really close i expect nize to play saturday night as i do austin but i expected him last night would have been nice to

have him last night would have helped to think i have him last night. Would have helped, I think. I heard that he wanted to, and they wouldn't let him. You did? I did. Oh. Yeah. I don't know. The Leafs wouldn't let him.

Cautious, baby. Interesting. Got to be cautious. So, yeah, you know, they're... Why don't we follow this up with Berube? Why don't we get Berube's thoughts, which is the un-missing these guys, hurting their goal scoring, which is clip four.

Maybe we don't have the finishers, and I get that side of it too, but I'm not going to focus on that. I'm focusing on what we have in the lineup and how we need to play to generate chances and score goals. Yeah. So they lose another guy last night, Bobby McMahon. man goes out hobbles off i thought it was a skate issue at first so did so did simmer who we have coming up he thought it was a skate issue but he doesn't come back for the third period so now that that's eight guys if you count reeves it's eight

okay oh so i guess we'll count seven kipper i'm not like you know i don't like to blow smoke up your rear end but i'm not sure you've ever been so violently right about people playing in a different system and getting hurt. This is uncanny. What team, like, I mean, they've lost Matthews. They haven't lost Marner, Tavares, and Nylander, and that's why they've been able

to keep their head above water here. It's clearly the reason why. But I can't remember any instance of the toronto maple east going through this type of injuries with their forwards i can remember with the defense they've had some issues but this is crazy now mcmahon's out like it's what is it again is this the second time he's had issues i think first this year isn't it first this year but he's always healthy healthy scratched okay and missed all of the playoffs last year with a mystery injury. Didn't play last year.

Yes. That's actually kind of an untold last year story. Like, we all talk about the Matthews and Nylander injury. What happened to McMahon? Tweaked his knee. Tweaked his knee. Yes. Well, what's concerning is that appeared to be a lower body injury yesterday.

He stopped skating on his right leg on the way to the bench and stopped solely on the left skate. So, I don't know which knee it was, but hope it's not a recurring injury. I have no idea. Like everybody else, just hearing that he's no longer available was a surprise to me

when nothing looked really out of the ordinary. Ruby said something, actually, I don't know if it's in clip two, where he basically said, like, apparently he couldn't come back and play. He said something that to me felt like if I was McMahon or something, I would have felt like he was talking to me,

like he thinks I should have come back to play or something like that. Why don't we hear clip two on losing another player? Well, it's frustrating, you know. But, you know, hopefully we get, you we get some guys coming back here next game. But, you know, for the game tonight, we've got to be sharper. And, you know, some of the penalties, we don't need to take them penalties. I think, you know, in the third period, we're trying to come back.

We take six minutes of penalties in the third. That's difficult. Makes it difficult. Yeah. All right. So is he talking to Willie? The penalties there? I guess.

Yeah, we haven't heard anything on that. Sam was concerned last night that Willie was going to get suspended. I thought the way the league goes sometimes, and Sammy, you're like adding that it's a leaf on the cherry on top of the Sunday, that it's a leaf. Can I be super honest with my Leaf fan brethren? I'm stunned there's no news about that. I thought for sure, like, you know, by the standard that we've seen.

The league passed. That'd be a game. I don't see that at all. That doesn't even sound like a fine. Really? Yeah. No, they passed. That'd be a game. Yeah, I don't see that at all. That doesn't even sound like a fine. Really? Yeah. No, they passed. Huh.

They passed unless they changed their minds during our show. But to me, it's like, you know, there's no force or malice going into it. It's a high stick, and he gets penalized with a double minor for it, which is significant at that point of the game. No history, no injury. You know, like the Meyer one, he's going at a guy, and there's some, I don't know, malice in there. I don't mind a guy going at it with somebody, but, like, you're still in the game to the point that Craig made.

Yeah. Right? You're still within reach here. So that's where you just got just gotta control it for me yeah well i think he was like uh it was schmidt right was kind of going up to kind of engage him and he kind of lowered the hands and willie kind of was going in to do the engagement and he just caught him quite across the clearly not what he was intending to do with that part of the game but yeah you know they keep it's funny with uh Nylander they've really just been kind of putting him out there with whoever and it's it's really he's done a great job I think he's

scoring a lot for them but last night to me was the first night where it felt like he's like he's serious we're playing against the Panthers, and I'm going out here with Holmberg and Robertson. But you've got to be understanding. For sure you do. We don't have anyone to put you with. I'm not saying that's right, but just for the first time I saw a couple shifts from him last night.

I think he had his first shot late in the third period, or middle of the third period, and he's just kind of like, I've got no chance out here against these guys with Pontus Holmberg and Nick Robertson. Yeah. My one takeaway from last night, and actually i've got a few of them which you know we're going to get to here but the main ones are about the young guys and who looks good and i gotta tell you i'm believing in fraser minton more than i did uh going into this trial yeah i i know we've

had this conversation i it's not probable but it's not impossible for him to be one of the guys moving forward. I started believing in it, I think, when I heard that he was really good in camp again before he got hurt. That he was just going to kind of pick up where he left off i think uh starting of last season yeah it was a hard decision i think for them a little bit too but it it served them well i i for me the two guys that have a chance to be there towards the latter part of the regular season and maybe even the first round or at least be available to them in in the roster is minton and grebenkin yeah the grebenkin one's interesting because i think he's a guy who more than the other guys needs time in the american league to have the puck be the man be on the power play yeah i don't score some goals sorry i don't have

time for that i gotta win the cup right now and yeah and i know no and this is part of getting him yeah oh so you want to send him back for a month or so and get him back here in february march thing for him rather than say play in the fourth line finish your checks if you got the luxury to do it but he's also a waiver exempt right because i think you look at these other teams and you say you know look at montreal's got slavkovsky dying on a vine i know scored last night and hudson's playing 23 minutes a night and all the other d it's not good for these guys to be in you need to be the man in the league you're better than i think it's good for him for minton and grabenkin to get that taste last night like one or two games but if you keep

feeling like you're gonna lose you're not losing minutes. Like it's good to get a taste, but to keep stretching them out there, like you said, with the Habs, I don't think it's quite as good. I just, I just see him there above Steve's. I see him there.

Who, Kervankin? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I see him there above Alex Nylander. Yeah. I see him for sure above Nick Robertson.

And you know, I did not like Nick Robertson's game last night at all. Playoff start today, you got Kerbanken in ahead of Robertson. In a line of bad ones. Oh, 100%. In a line of bad games last night. And I agree. The problem with Nick now is he's panicking. So cookie hungry right now that it's just just he's separating himself from the rest of the

team but i've heard this has been the case even like when he played in the american league that it was just like he didn't care they won or lost he wanted to score he didn't care yeah if he had three assists he wanted one you want to shoot in the net he wants to shoot it in the net the one that kind of stood out for me last night was the two-on-one where you got one of the best opened like willie's opening up and he didn't even look at him and you know what i was okay with that if he had a stick in the middle of the ice between the hash marks if you're gonna shoot it then shoot it but then it goes to a weekend back uh weak ass backhand yeah marks if you're gonna shoot it then shoot it but then it goes to a weekend back uh weak ass backhand yeah like if you're gonna use willie great if you're gonna

shoot it great if you're so panicked by opportunity that it ends up being whatever that was but that's i mean there's not many plays where you can be like that guy has no confidence like it's just like you know you guys watch a hog your whole life that guy cannot no confidence. Like, it's just, you know, you guys have been watching hockey your whole life. That guy cannot think straight right now, and he's thinking about it. Normally, if he had, say, if he had six goals in the year, he's either making a good pass or he's wristing that one off the post and then, like, he's overthinking every play. I talked to him, and I told you before the show,

it's like some nerdy guy talking to a hot girl for the first time. He's just like, ah, oh, my God, it's a hockey puck. Bobble. Yeah, he can't handle it, man. The body language on Willie. After that? After that, he's behind the net, skated by him. It's not like.

It wasn't like good effort, son. It wasn't even a tap and nice effort, nice try. Hey, listen, if you think he got it, it's like, buddy. I'm making 11 and a half sheets. I'm fresh off 40 here. Not to watch you go in there and kill a play. Give me the puck. Give me the puck.

Yeah. That was tough. So the guys are going to start getting healthy and you know again in theory in theory we've been through this a little bit you know jb where i feel for him a little bit too because he is an nhl player in a 32 team. Now he's going to watch guys get healthy. We'll see what happens with McMahon, but we're going to watch guys come back, and we're watching Grbenkin and Minton impress,

and he's going to get pushed down, and he knows it. He knows it's coming, and that's why you probably saw him shooting everything that he could last night, no matter what. I think once they start getting healthy here, they got to seriously think about moving him out. They cannot let a guy like that come to the rink feeling the way he's feeling and thinking that it won't affect the rest of the hockey club. And what are his priorities, as you said?

He's not like, God, we lost last night. He's like, I didn't. Did he know what the score of the game club. And what are his priorities, as you said? He's not like, God, we lost last night. He's like, I didn't. I still didn't score. Did he know what the score of the game was last night? It just feels like he's playing by himself out there. Yeah, that's not healthy. No. You know, a few guys I liked last night, I really liked Lorenz. I think they got their cup rings for the game. You guys saw the rings?

Yeah. Nicer than the Rangers ring? Bigger? Different? Bigger, gaudier. Yeah. That's wearable. That's fine. Hey, listen, that ring's a ring. Come on, everybody wants one.

But, like, when these moments get big, I forget what game earlier in the year Lorenz scored a late goal for them. You know, he's, as we said, won the cup, I thought, last night. Like, amidst all the frenzy, he's a guy who seems really composed to me. Like, I just think he's going to be a rock for them in playoffs. I liked what you pointed out there during the intermission where he's like directing traffic.

He's trying to slow stuff down. It's like we're on or off wing. Just stay over there. He's a leader-y type guy. He's been in big games. So we mentioned Stolarz close to the start here first non-spectacular one for him last night sucks it has to come against his former team nothing to be worried about or concerned about like he's showing a little bit more he's a little bit more human

last night but i thought he's still going into the third, gave them a chance. Yeah, he made enough saves for sure. The last one was jarring, the Verhege one that went up top on him. Yeah, I didn't like that one. I think that got redirected, I think. I'm not sure. It's just surprising to see him. Real quick.

I just can't think of, I mean, Verhege can absolutely fire it. It just feels like he doesn't get, if he's staring down a guy like that, it felt like he hasn't been beat clean like that all year. It happened too with, I mean, Reinhardt down the chute. You got no chance he goes bar down or whatever. It just feels like first time I've seen him just get beat clean a few times. It doesn't shake your confidence, but you'd be lying in the back of your head. You're like, oh, this journeyman, like it's all, you know,

it's coming unglued. Like those thoughts are in the back of your head. You're like, oh, this journey, man. It's coming unglued. Those thoughts are in the back of your head, but I got confidence in him. And it sets up going right back to Joseph Wall Saturday night. Yeah, I mean, hopefully just a much – you get a couple of guys back and it changes things. Do we have any idea on Domi what that – he can't come back this December? He's not on the trip. Yeah, he's not.

I don't think he's LTIR. I think he's not on the trip yeah he's not i don't think he's ltir i think he just ir just ir yeah so and that's is that 10 days no that 10 that 10 days is ltir isn't it no no it's like yeah anyways month yeah 10 games yeah 10 games right i know i have not looked at it maybe you can run it for me i'm not getting it up but like after saturday it gets real busy again right 15 games in 31 days yes monday chicago wednesday nashville yeah friday caps saturday penguins i think is this going next week i gotta think get a few eight and seven nine and six for one goalie would be, I'd be surprised if one of those two guys gets nine out of 15. I'm not understanding. What do you mean?

Next 15 games. We said next 15 games in 31 days? Yeah, yeah. I see a split of eight, seven, or I'd be surprised if it's nine, six. You're heavily injured and you're playing a ton of games back to back to back to back to back where you're asking a lot of a thin lineup. You're right. It's unlikely

that they're going to cruise through this dominating. As long as nobody shows signs of a couple of consecutive stinkers, right? You mean goalie-wise or just player-wise? Goalie-wise, right? Yeah.

Or player-wise. I mean, they're all intertwined. So you're mentioning goalies here, and I saw from your piece in the Toronto Star today, good piece on the Leafs needing to win the Atlantic, but about the interest in the Leafs' goalie depth. Yeah. So do you think that's something that they're

going to use to acquire forward help at the deadline? I think that's as long as those guys continue to show upside, he'll be and they got a rush in there. You got it. Act him off. There you go. Act him off.

They're raising eyebrows around the league. Really? Yep. And just looking for chips to use, eh? It's like, there's one. Found one. Matt Murray is one. That's interesting. Matt Murray is also out there for a team like Carolina right now.

Okay, Carolina's, they're looking right now. Now, do you think that Matt Murray is the be-all end-all but 914 and the a cheap better than the 914 too cheap cheap and above average boy right yeah so if you got still Stanley Cup pedigree and you're not 35 memory is just 30 years old and you're healthy for maybe the first time you're starting to convince people that hey i'm fixed here all my issues including the ones that i had in ottawa and toronto are no longer there then he's in play. I don't know if you have any sense of this, but where is his head at in terms of being a Marley?

Do you think he's like, I got to get out of here? Do you think he's satisfied with it? It's just a guy that's got a ton of pedigree, ton of pride. He wants to be back in the NHL. For sure. But he knows that he was this close to like... Being nodded, gone.L. For sure. But he knows that he was this close to like. Being not in. Gone. Gone. Yeah.

For good or retired. And he had hip surgery. At two. Yeah. Fixed them both, I heard. Yeah. So, he knows he needs to start somewhere. And you're still.

It's Joseph Wall. That guy could disappear at any moment. Yes. And he's right back in the mix yeah yeah so you think he'd be the first call now if one of those guys happened because was it who was it that came on our show and said that hildeby's the three it was josh cloak on monday yeah yeah i mean where are they on the let's get him some experience? I don't think Hildeby would be a guy that they want to thrust in there. If they came up with a perfect trade to get people out,

I think they wouldn't be thrilled about putting him in there to start his NHL career yet, like some more cooking in the American League. But I don't know. What's it going to look like in the new year in terms of what you really need to shore up your team and at what cost because there's there's only a few people that when brad tree living picks up the phone or makes calls he gets talked about or asked about and that's like there's only like two or three guys grabenkin would be grabenkin would be one of them now cowan cowan minton hill to be and the goalies yeah and then don't give me your scraps roni hervedon the topes and ronis yeah what are they five nine

five ten yeah yeah soaking wet i you know, I say those names not out of disrespect, but they were like in the embodiment of the Davis drafting. They represent something. They represent something. It's not about them as people. So I do believe that when it comes to February or March, and if there's one thing that I kind of got reminded of last night is that you're still going to have to get bigger and tougher.

Well, they're missing. They're playing a tough style, but I'm watching Nico. Nico Nicola or Nico Nicola? Nicola. Hammered Tavares. 6'6". Hammered Tavares. Hammered.

Like, he had Nick Robertson's trying to close off the boards with him coming down on a pinch on the uh on the second goal and i'm like that's like was that who robertson ran to try to hit in the corner that's like really really just contain them that's really warm butter trying to stop a knife yeah and here comes butter oh no oh the knife so yeah like you know that's funny you watch the panthers i meant to say this and you know i'm watching that game like i thought these guys sucked everyone told me these guys were playing bad i thought they sucked and it's like oh no yeah they're still all looking pretty good but you look through that lineup it's not the same lineup like the main guys are still the main guys.

But, you know, last night... Lusterian. Lusteranen, yeah. Lusteranen. And Lundell didn't even play last night. He's like another guy just really hard around the net to stop. I'm really looking forward to rooting for Sam Reinhardt in the Four Nations face-off.

I love Sam Reinhardt, man. He's turned into such a good... I never saw this coming oh you think the sabers did i guess not sabers i guess they're gonna watch eichel get 130 points oh my god reinhardt second overall yep yeah he was okay excuse me but as a pick is that who was first was it patrick in philadelphia no that was the same year that was the that was the nico he sure draft i'm quick it was okay he was number two in the 2014 draft ekblad went one my heart too so three of the top five play for florida who's the other ekblad reinhardt and sam benning are

all the top yeah yeah like williamlander went 8th that year. And he's so smart. He's just a smart player. Can shoot the 50, 60 goal score. When he was younger, he wasn't going to skate well enough to do this. I'm with you. He fooled me. I thought Buffalo

got a third liner on a championship team. Right. But, you know, look, where you're playing matters. And since he's gone to Florida, it's 33, 31, 57. Before that, he'd never scored 30. So it's like, yeah, playing with other good players in a good situation, that is pretty important.

Yes, sir. I did write an article in the Toronto Star. You can find it on my at real Kipperx feed or Twitter, old Twitter. Like, where are you guys on the importance of the Leafs winning a division? I don't want to play that team in the first round. You with me a little bit? Oh, my God, yeah. Okay.

Yeah. So important. I mean i mean god the two teams you might play are you know teams that have won stanley cups in the past five years that have the pedigree and the confidence to play in those big games not that the leafs don't but it sure would be nice to and again it's not a gift when you get a wild card team but just be one percent easier gonna be one percent easier that would help yeah when you lose by a goal in round one you take one percent lisa win the division i'll get the rangers first round rangers are brutal yeah i've got some issues there i guess just reckon i could just i know how that goes and then i really feel like oh they have the goalie we could beat him

i know how it goes like i know florida looked a lot like a team that won the Stanley Cup last year on a few plays, but they aren't the same team they were last year. They weren't. They're missing some pieces. The D's not as good. Not sure they're top to bottom as good. They got Carolina twice, Pittsburgh, Philly, San Jose. They could lose two of them, you know?

That's just the way it is now in the NHL, but it's there. It's there for the leaf taking this week is important for the least. Like if that Saturday night game's huge, cause Tampa is not that far behind. And then you have, like I said, uh,

Chicago Monday, Nashville Wednesday, what Washington's a good team on Friday, but then you go to Pittsburgh. It's like, you need to get, start stacking up the points against these softer teams anyways we should go for simmer okay we got craig simpson former national hockey leaguer two-time stanley cup champion and one of the

best on hockey night in canada he'll join us next when we return to real kipper and born dive deep into toronto sports and the nfl the jd bunkus podcast subscribe and download the show on apple spotify or wherever you get your podcasts uh not quite sammy mckeee you want to share with the whole class good things mics aren't on boys justin bourne and a few minutes we'll welcome in uh craig simpson yes who called the game last night he doesn't miss a trick and you of course know, you couldn't get out of here fast enough. And you were screaming, finally, they've gone to the A team for a game. Wednesday night, you, Elliot, David Amber.

It's a good show. I enjoyed it. You know, we really were limited by the fact that all of a sudden it's 2-0. Leafs got no horses. And it's two nothing at least got no horses and it's just like okay they did their best they played played hard but never got got back in it okay let's welcome in craig simpson on this american thanksgiving which means craig you're having a turkey or you you're passing on a turkey because all those years of playing in the U.S., we got spoiled, right?

We had two Thanksgivings. I think I have literally been on the road in the U.S. for the last 20 Thanksgivings. So it's always trying to find a place that you can get something to eat, a restaurant that's open. And I think I'll pass on the turkey tonight. But no, always good to have a good football day

and sit and watch some of those festivities. So we were talking earlier in the show about a 5-1 score that may have looked maybe a little bit more lopsided than what it actually was. And we've seen the Leafs really rise in the absence of some key players, including now Matthew Nyes, let alone a top goal scorer like Austin Matthews. Was last night just one of those games

that kind of caught up to them a little bit? Well, I think you looked at that game. I heard you guys. As I was walking around here at camp, I was listening and talking about not playing Matthews. And I'm not trying to be controversial at all with this, but I do think that if I was the team, I'd look at that game and say,

you've got the defending champs who have lost six of their last seven, four in a row. Paul Maurice has taken a lot of the blame for his coaching in the last three weeks. Bag skated the team. They're on home ice. I go, that is a game. If you're looking at your schedule

as you've dealt with your injuries, you look at your lineup card and you say we've won seven out of eight with Austin gone. Let's go for another one because this is one of those games that could be a bit of a disaster. How would you be feeling or talking right now

if Austin Matthews had played last night and it was a 5-1 game and he didn't get anything i i know that's maybe being over protective uh but i do think that came into the equation i think you kind of you had a good thing going maybe the guys could come up with another big effort it didn't quite happen but now you kind of get the reset of your own and get into a game on Saturday with another practice on Friday and able to try to right the ship and get a little bit of consistency and continuity into your lineup. So is there anything from that game, Simmer, that we can learn about the Leafs? Do you reach a point where a team is just so injured that it's almost like

you throw what you have at the wall and hope something sticks and if it doesn't you just kind of go well we didn't have our team well as you guys all know like injury is opportunity right there's been many a career that's been made because somebody went down and somebody came up and you went oh my gosh this guy's ready to play like he's gonna get his chance and his chance, and he opens the door, and he doesn't really allow you to send you back. So I think there's been elements of that in the last couple of games. I heard you talking about Fraser Minton,

and your view of him even changes a little bit. I thought last night was a great example of there were stretches of that game that he looked like, oh, calm, poised. He looks like he's ready. And there's other stretches, as you would expect, playing really your third game in the NHL where you go, oh, yeah, you're playing against Barkoff or you're playing against really good pros that you're not quite there yet. So I just think that sometimes the necessity of giving guys opportunity

and playing them in situations that maybe you'd be hesitant to normally do so as a coach actually helps your team and helps you as a coach. I often think that coaches sometimes are so darn resilient or hesitant to give a guy a chance just because you're worried about the big mistake. Well, if you were Craig Berube last night, Justin, you're looking down and you go, go well what other option do I have so I got to give this guy that time or that matchup and I think that's where guys learn and guys get better ultimately I think it helps the

team in the long run because whether guys go back down to the Marlies and start to hone their craft with the experience of going man I just played the Stanley Cup champs, and I played five shifts against Barkov, and I think I did pretty well, or I won a battle in a corner against Ekblad. You know, you start to grow as a player. You all know when you're trying to establish yourself, that's what you have to try to prove to yourself and then the coaching staff that I can play at that elite level

on a more consistent basis. And I think that's the challenge when you have a team like Toronto does right now. But I honestly think in the long run it's going to help them a lot. We're talking to Craig Simpson, former National Hockey League or two-time Stanley Cup champion, and one of the best voices you'll ever hear on a hockey broadcast. Simmer, in terms of the frustration of uh of of not only nick robertson but the rest of the team at five on five but specifically nick robertson's bread

and butter has to be putting the puck in the net you were of course a big goal scorer in the national hockey league i kind of felt it a little bit in junior hockey and the pressure that you put upon yourself to find a way to get it over the goal line here. And to me, I watched him last night and specifically I made it a point to talk about the two on one where he just went in there and he had those blinders on and he didn't even look off a Willie Nylander. But there's a sense of me that feels for the guy a little bit too here.

100%. You know, it's almost cringeworthy at time. And I mean that with, with admiration and respect to the person, uh, because you hate to see it. And we've all at some point lived it. I've, I've often said, you know, there's times where you get out in the ice, you go, I hope that puck doesn't come near me because I don't want it. Like I got nothing. I got no confidence in myself. That two on one, I was saying, yeah, you end up going to your backhand with no option and get nothing out of it. Well, like you guys were saying earlier, if you're a confident player, you're snapping around. I mentioned like, look at Mitch Marner's play in front of the net.

There was times a couple of years ago when he hadn't scored in eight or nine games that he didn't look all that calm in those areas. Last night, it was like in his sleep. You just react. You react to what the goalie does, and it's in the back of the net. Nick, to me, is like I'd almost be as an assistant coach. You've got to spend some time and really show some videos, show some positive videos, show some things that he's doing well

to try to eliminate the thought process of going into a game. And I heard you, Justin, saying going into a game and thinking, all I've got to do is score. Because it's like anything that you want badly, if you're only thinking of the end result and not the way that you have to act and react to get there. You're never going to get there. And that's where he's at now. And it is hard to watch. And I'm, I'm confident the coaches are doing everything they can to,

to help him along the way and video wise and talking wise, but it's one of those stretches where, man, you just feel for the kid. And that's what I think the process is saying, let's just play the game. Let the game come to you. Play with some energy. Play with some emotion. Play with your partners, not try to do it all yourself. And I think that'll serve them well.

And you hope that sometime you get a rebound or you get one off your leg and all of a sudden you feel a little bit better about yourself. Simmers, you know, thinking of guys who are young trying to make an impression what are the odds that gerbenkin is a guy who matters for the leafs this season i i think he's got a chance just and i i said last night watching a couple of shifts and i go to me like okay the guy doesn't communicate all that well. He's learning a new language. He's learning a new game. But he's also a young kid that's played in the KHL for a couple years. So he's played against men.

And that is a big distinction of playing even junior hockey. You're playing in the KHL. You've had to go up against 29-year-old guys or guys who are tough and guys who will intimidate you. And I just said a couple of those shifts where he did things, the opposite of what I was saying about Robertson. He's not going out and saying, I got to score a goal. He went out there and said, I better hit two or three guys on this shift.

I better make sure I get this puck deep and get in and try to turn the puck over. I got to make a play in my own zone and then get up the ice and get in the porch. Those are simple sounding things, but they're so incredibly important to build that framework of your game and the trust with your coach. And, you know, I just mentioned it there saying, if I'm Craig Berube, I go, I got some time for this kid now,

because in a situation where he's playing, what was that? His third game in the national hockey league and go, he's, he's identified that. And he, you can tell that he's going, I know what this coach wants me to do and how I got to play.

And I got a lot of time for that. And I think, I think Craig Ruby will as well. And he's heavy simmer. He's a heavy player. We see him finishing checks even at the end of a period that really had no bearing on any play because he's got a habit of doing that.

He's having fun out there. Never would have thought I'd say this, but they've missed Max Pacioretty's physical presence of whatever we saw in those first dozen games out of Max Pacioretty's physical presence of whatever we saw in those first dozen games out of Max Pacioretty. And there's something there that at least is more reassuring to know that at least he can do that every night instead of hoping and praying that someone puts a puck in the net.

So also what you were saying too is, you know, you look at the changes that Craig's tried to make with this team. And I think the one thing that has been successful and part of it due to some good defensive pairings, good structure in their own zone, you know, they've gone from what the 22nd team for goals against last year to tied for second going into last night. So there's an improvement and there's a noticeable effort in the way that they can defend.

They box out in front of their net a lot better than I can remember watching a Leaf team do. There's not a lot of trapping your own zone fire sales. But I do think the pain of that has been their offense isn't nearly as fluid and craig keeps talking about and i listen to your clip and i love justin going every time they don't score you might as well just replay that clip right we didn't get to that it's the same story but you know by now what two months in you know exactly what you're going to hear from craig maruby don't you yeah yeah like it's going to be the same thing every day.

When something falters, it's the same messaging. So I do think that the offensive part of it has slipped a little bit because guys are trying to be aggressive and trying to do what you're saying, Grebenko, to get in on the forecheck, make a big hit, make sure that you're checking hard there, but they don't quite yet have the combination of that and then get it and be as free-flowing and creative

as they have been in the past. Last thought from you, Simmer, if we could. Appreciate your time. What do you think the Panthers are compared to last year? I think they're a team that's missing the element on the back end. As much as Montour was, what, 23 and a half minutes of big minutes, it's hard to replace that on a Stanley Cup championship team. Even talking to some of the people around the team,

Ekman Larson became a big effort last year, too. He played just under 19 a game, but again, you've seen what he's done even in this lineup of stopping a play defensively getting you going the other way so those are two guys that I think as you guys know it's hard to replace them it'll take a little bit time Kulikov's a player who's playing almost four minutes more than he did last year so 10 guys like that grow into the same roles as those guys had in a successful time? I think the energy thing to me, Chris Cuthbert and I were talking last night

and just said that's the hard part to recreate when you've been Stanley Cup champs and now you're into the third year. You know, they lost in the final. They were motivated last year. They had a really good regular season and run. Now you're trying to climb the mountain again even a guy like Ryan Lombard who's not a huge player but it's the emotional part I think they've missed the emotion of their game and Paul Maurice said that much but I still think

they're a good team I still think they've got the ability to be really competitive and I mean off the top of my head I don't know what their cap situation is here but I think they're a team that still thinks they can win and so it's for Paul Maurice to do what he did the last couple of days and push some buttons and say let's just find a way to stay even keeled and get ourselves through this season and I think we've got the experience and at the end of the day I mentioned like Bobrovsky had his best year as a Florida Panther in the regular season last year and in the playoffs. It hasn't quite materialized yet. If he can get himself back to that, then maybe they got another chance to go out.

Simmer, have a great call in Tampa. Looking forward to it. Thanks for doing this, pal. All right, guys. Take care. Thanks, Simmer. Enjoy Thanksgiving there. Greg Simpson.

You bet. Yeah. I mean, I'm watching Boquist last night. Jesper, go on that breakaway. Like, pretty fast guy. Penalty shot. You want to call it a penalty shot? Oh, absolutely.

No, the infraction was too far away from the net. Yeah. I thought it was a penalty shot. he got him i thought they were gonna he did get a clean chance he got a clean shot and uh it was a big save yeah so maybe that's a right yeah you get the chance and it is a penalty i just i think the league needs to call more penalty shots like if a guy is in the clear and there's an infraction, refs are really timid about calling a penalty shot. Yeah.

I think they've, like, in, I don't know, I remember in the 70s and 80s, man, you had to, like, shoot somebody. Oh, yeah, I know. And I think that's the way it should be. I, like, I think... You don't want to see more penalty shots? I hate today's thing.

Yeah, I don't. No. We need to shoot out. It's fine. Like, I think you have to be two steps away, and a guy's got to come in and trip you. I hate when it's like one step. No, but if you're one step on the guy,

and you have a clean, like you don't have body, you've lost body position. If you have to take a penalty, to me, that's you're taking away that chance. How about this? Okay, this is a radical thought. Okay. Can we save this?

Send the defender. No, no, no. I got an answer. Some guy chasing you on the breakaway? You're going to have to wait national now. We're hearing the music now.

I got to open it up. Tell me quickly. No, I don't have time. Okay. You know how slow I am. Don't answer that. Don't you dare answer that. Leave it alone.

Our thanks to Craig Simpson and our Leaf Edition Hour. We go national next. Jason Brough, co-host of Halford and Brough in Vancouver, will join us. We'll get some thoughts on what the heck's going on with Vancouver as they lose a main cog on that blue line. We'll discuss that more when we return nationally. Don't go away.

Real Kipper and Born.