Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Time for a Coaching Change?

Episode Date: December 19, 2025

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look back on the Toronto Maple Leafs' 4-0 loss to the Washington Capitals. They react to Craig Berube's post-game comments on the team's passion and discuss the power play going 0-for-5. Then, they debate whether Berube will or should be fired and whether Peter DeBoer could turn the team around as his replacement. Later, Nick, Justin and Sam hit the Leafs Line to answer your calls and questions.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Come on in and settle down for the next two hours. The real Kipprin-Born show. We are live on Sportsnet 360, Sportsnet 590. The fan in Toronto and streaming always on Sportsnet. Plus can always catch us at your convenience over your holiday shopping, baby. Just download us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube. Nick Kiprio's. Justin Boren, Sammy McKee, Jake the Snake Shilts, and Derek Brandeo in our Leaf Hour edition.

Of course, we go off the rails Friday, Doug McLean at the top of the hour as well. And we got a leaf line, Sammy, where we get to hear. Do we ever? Other people describe what's going on with the Toronto Maple Leafs. Let me ask you, what's that. I was just going to say before we get into. Yeah. I love Justin Bourne, a very Christmassy fellow,

especially with that shirt on today. Looking incredibly Christmassy. But today is sort of like the quote-unquote, you know, last day before Christmas here at Sports I find out of the fan. And my man Borny brought in conservatively 2,000 timbits. 2,000 timbits. And what he didn't realize is that no one is here.

No one got to work for that. It is an absolute ghost town. You didn't park near us either. They're on the other side of the room. than people usually are. You're two separate boxes of them. I've honestly had, like, conservatively, ten timbits. Like, I'm running on sugar here.

It's got to be a Thursday next year. That was what I'm going to miss on my part. So, Mr. Christmas is giving us all, you know, where I'm just sugared up. So, let's go. And thanks to all of you out there. Merry Christmas for this. God, you look good. It's bright.

It looks really good. I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. Jacob Chicken scored twice last night. in a Washington Capitol shutout over the Toronto Maple Leafs

we got the next hour to sort a few things out but before we get started you know Sammy I got to tell you man no we're good watching Lee's talk again no no no no just listen I love that you are

through and through the biggest leaf fan I'm a little shaken up this morning because for the first time you had a little trouble hanging up the Toronto Maple Leaf jersey Oh yeah, I consider not doing it. Yeah. It kind of breaks my heart a little bit.

There's a suggestion to hang it inside out. No, no. That would be like hanging the flag upside down or something. No, no, no. Going full World Series 902 here. That jersey's royalty, man, and it will always be royalty. Uh-huh.

And it's not, the jersey i know it's not the jersey like maybe the only thing missing may be from the jersey is maybe a disclaimer that says that you know this the people underneath this jersey don't necessarily reflect our standards or you know uh that tradition that we've come to expect yeah symbols change meaning over time maybe maybe royalties how it feels right this is the black jersey like they're the one that's, you know, the most probably Gen Z jersey possible. So maybe it does reflect the players

in the, in that wear it. So? We know that we're flooded with our regional games coming up. So many. So many. So many. What great timing. Well, it might be. No. No. Well, we needed

we needed a little bit more ho-ho ho last night from them. But you know what? We are there for the people when it's at its roughest to tell them the truth. They're going to get a real broadcast over the month of December here. We're telling it like it is. I know the next hour will be heavy on Craig Bruby.

Is he becoming more truthful now a little bit, even through the media? Because we're getting a sense of real frustration and maybe more honesty in terms of how he now looks at his hockey club. Is that what we're getting? Well, I think when you tried. the coaching through the media thing for so often, like after the Blackhawks game and you say it was a character win, it was a gritty win and you try to put that stuff

and it just doesn't work? What's the point? What's the point and gassing the guys up if the car won't go? We're going to get into tons of Ruby stuff like you said, but so he did his post game press conference last night, which has been all over the internet, all over everywhere. Like the first real Canada event post game from a Leaf's coach in a really long time.

Like I, you know, there's been. There's been, you know, soft and purposeless was a big one with Keefe, but that he immediately walked that back. So there was that. But then this morning, oftentimes leaves coaches after they go a little, they go a little bananas in the post game. Usually they come back with a more, like a different tone. I listen to him after they practice today in Washington.

They sit and practice there. Not a different tone. No. Like a different tone of the fact that he sounded a lot different than he has in years, but much like last night. Is our first Kippers Clipper from Bruy from last night or today? It's from last night. Okay. Let's get

his overview of what he saw last night. You know, we had power play to opportunity. Power play was not good. It's got to be a lot better. And to me, they play with more passion than we did tonight. I mean, that's what it boils down to. It looked to me like they had

way more urgency in their game. more passion in their game that's the difference how do you explain that considering where you are at the standard pass those guys not me is it disappointing for you guys was that our Luke Fox

yeah Luke is he Luke gets it I don't know about a lot of guys down there but he he gets it he felt an exposed nerve and went a little more on that but it's just a it is a natural follow-up

it's a great follow-up And to be able to think, like, I see people on the end of being like, oh, they never asked. I was like, for him to stand there and hear that answer and be ready to respond with that in that little moment is really great work. So as a journalist, do you even need to hear from Craig Bruby after that? Or are you just going right back into the dressing room and going, your coach just asked me to ask you where the passion was tonight?

I just do they go they go coach first then players I don't know but did did did anybody get that thrown maybe they were on the bus already maybe it was over I don't know did they did they shower last night did they need to shower last night oh I love it oh there we go that's a junior coach line to me yeah I don't know is that not a follow up is that not a follow-up question yeah coach just asked me to ask you where the passion was because he didn't know and he didn't want answer the question. He wanted you to ask, answer the question. So can I ask you just before we get into anything else? Do you like what Barubei said? Yes and no. Yes and no. I like it because I come on here all the time and say, just tell us the truth. We're not dumb. You know, we know it didn't

go good, whatever. And so I like that he came out and said, yeah, brutal, no passion, no urgency. I like that. What I don't like is that there's no next step where it's like, What we need to do is, because I wrote about this today, where we're left is him going, I don't know. I got no solution. Yeah. Yeah, I, I, J.B. just nailed it. I think from a, from an honesty perspective to at least having your fans go, thank you, because

we see what you see, but it draws a line. in the sand and i'm not sure that's a good thing either that that is a comment probably that should be shared with brad tree living or someone within the organization that if someone's asking you if your general manager's asking you where the passion was i think that's an internal circle small circle answer i just i'm not sure if it it benefits to you your point of where's the build now if if i'm a player now and obviously i've got my own issues going on with my game i don't know what that does when they listen to that the one thing we have said for a long time is that we've been surprised at the lack of accountability and how rare it's been for someone

to say these sorts of things and this feels like the magnifying glass and the sunbeam aimed at the players here that like okay it's it's on you now and and ruby's basically said you know he's shining that light so bright it burns but it's uh it's gonna get to be interesting to see if they respond or fold not that i can fold harder than you did last night but i you know since they've really sucked 2015 2016 i can't remember you know i've watched a million games so this could be anecdotal but i can't remember a game where they've generated as little as as what happened last night. Like they, what do they have, 22 shots?

It could have been two shots. What was the high danger? Like, what, I just, it felt like they weren't in the middle of the, I, I don't, watching that game, if you're a general manager of a team, would be one that would be a turning point in terms of what you're thinking about your team for me, where it's like, you know, they had that miracle come back against the Chicago backhugs and you're thinking of going into that third period. But watching that last night, like that didn't even look like a professional outfit,

boys it was really bad maybe they're really sick I know those people sick hope so that third period was gross gross oh for five on the power play let's get Craig brewby's thoughts clip two Derek well the power play's actually been getting better but tonight it was it got awful in my opinion I thought the other unit did some good things

you know they had a couple opportunities and just just you know the misfire didn't go in a couple chance had some good chances, but our top unit didn't execute, didn't win any battles when they needed to. Just couldn't make place. J.B., you in our intermission, talked about what you liked out of the second unit a lot more than in the first unit.

Also did the last battles. There was a sense, too, that Barubi liked it also and was using them more, and there was a couple of subtle messages, including not start. a power play at two minutes when it was over a minute of a rest with a soft timeout. They easily could have gone back out there, but he sent a message only,

I think it was on an offside, 20 seconds later, he puts the big boys out, and I'm like, it's like being a little pregnant here. You're either in or you're out on the message sending and it drove me crazy. 20 seconds later, you put the big boys on, like, oh boy, boy, you really felt that one, eh? I showed you, you're not starting for 20 seconds.

It does feel like, that bothered me. Coaches are unable to keep the finger on those guys. When they want to show them, how many times would like Willie Nealander, even with Shelton Keefe, bad game, bad game, bad game, down to go in the third period. He plays 11 minutes of the third period or something. Doesn't matter, we just need them out there. You know, we haven't seen a coach really be able to stay on that top group.

But on the power play, couldn't make passes, didn't win any loose pucks. Like the other unit moved it around a bit Still wasn't awesome But yeah, it was, it's I think Dysfunctional I think

They're dead last now This the thing is that We're all like Oh my God The second unit Like it's so much It's not No

But like they just look In comparison They look so much better than they have Like I just like It's hard to fathom I mean we've been beating a dead horse In this thing all year But the horses still lying at her feet

I got What is it? A horse away. Bring a new horse. Yeah. Oh, that was maybe two on point to metaphor. Sammy, do we have the captain commenting on the power play? Yeah, we do. Derek, clip two from Matthews, please.

We get in there and we make, you know, a couple good plays, and then, you know, it's like the next play isn't the right play or it's not executed the right way, or it's just one and done, 515 and on the power play as well. So, you know, things are feel like or felt like they're moving in the right direction, obviously, on a night night. You know, when you have that kind of effort in all areas of the game and, you know, you get playing on the road. It's obviously, you know, not a good feeling, but I don't think it's personnel or it's any of that stuff. It's simply just execution.

I doesn't think it's personnel? That's the one that stood out for me. Not me. It's not Willie. It's just. It's not us. It's not us. It's not personnel.

It's not us. Yeah. It is you. Yeah, it kind of is you. It is. But I think to your point, is this maybe the player pointing at the coach, them saying it's not people. It's just not holding yourself for each other accountable.

It's going back to our earlier conversation where I didn't like 50 minutes of Chicago and everybody wanted to focus on. and just, you know, let's get the energy up and get your hand on your ear there, Austin, and let's focus on, you know, the seven minutes, the 10 minutes, the three minutes, and not the issues that we have going on. And he's still, last night, it's not personnel, won't own it.

I feel like sometimes these guys are just kind of saying words they know that people say. Like, I don't know how much thoughts going into. It's not personnel. I don't know that you know what I mean like I've said it a million times the reason I don't cut this is because he's trying to say things as fast as possible to get through it as fast as possible to stop doing as fast as possible that's he doesn't which is not good no I'm not saying that that gives him a pass but I'm just saying that like he's not taking this as an opportunity to say something inspirational to the fans and players through the media he's just not going to do he's just trying to rush through it you know watching that last night in the first I thought the top line was doing an over they've been a one three one forever so like i thought they tried to change some structure which didn't work they you know the domi was coming up and out of the zone like they're trying things but this is what i mean like that article i wrote today is a lot about how they're just like i don't know

there's a lot i don't know i got no answers i think you went home and you wrote and you wrote and you wrote i don't even know if you slept last night there's a lot of words i apologize no don't apologize you had a lot to say this morning i just like what can't I cut from this and I did cut stuff but yeah there's still a lot of people there. Please go read Justin Borer's article on Sportsnet.ca because

I mean he does talk about a lot of things but the one that stuck out the most for me in your article is if Craig Bruby can't find the answers then look for someone else who can. You know if you handed me the key

today. This is what's hard about the team and said, you're the coach. What's the first thing you do? I don't even know where to start. Like, my point in saying that is like, there's not like five or ten pieces that are going good right now that you would build around and when everything, when there's

no structure, you know, at some point it's like, okay, well, you have to have some answer somewhere or all someone will. I'm not calling for Craig Buruby to get fired. That's not my intent when I wrote that article. I just laid out a whole bunch of truth. But it is leaning towards that if you can't get them going

then go find someone else they can. Well, I guess it's like I lay out what I believe to be a bunch of truths about where are they at and if you disagree with anything, go ahead and tell me which parts but it's like power play's bad, best players are bad, people seem frustrated, coaches don't have answers. I do I get it. I've been around professional sports

long enough to know that when you're seeing this over a long, per long period of time, something has to give. Usually it is a firing. It's a trade. It's someone getting set down to the minors. It's someone getting waived.

Is someone to say, go home. And we'll call you when we need to trade you. Whatever it is, something usually generally follows. And I'm not that far off to thinking that they do need to do something. But where you and I differ is I'm just tired of it's the coach. And especially with this particular. group where I look at you know who's the longest guy

Morgan Riley you fire Craig Bruby he's on to his sixth coach six and Austin Matthews now in 10 years four coaches

maybe it's not the coach and like where do you go J.B where do you go if you want to sit there and say okay, go find someone else that can and it's Peter DeBoer Do you really think right now

this is the time to do that and will it truly make a difference because I get the sense now that if you move off of Craig Bruby all we're going to be looking at is a Peter Horchuk coming in and buying time

until you find your Mike Babcock. I think part of, well, I think they think he is Mike Babcock. He would cost money and he'd be the biggest name out there. I think that's the idea. But part of the frustration I think that Craig Barubi probably has is it's a little bit like if I said to you, okay, I need you to build a fireplace out of only chocolate. And it's like, how do I do that? Like he's like looking at his pieces and he's like, I can't do that.

So at Barubi's point, look at his roster, is like, I don't have the horses. You guys don't have it. No one can do the thing that you've asked me to do with these people here. So that's what you're talking about. But I look at this group and over the years, they really, you can't start over when you have Austin Matthews. You're not trading a guy at his all-time low who's been as good as he's been recently.

And maybe you disagree with that, but I don't think you're getting better by trading good players. There's a whole history of NHL teams trying to fix problems by getting rid of good players, Mitch Marner included. That didn't help. The, you know, the idea that you're, going to get rid of these guys. I think the only thing

you can do if your MLSC is there's an article today about ticket sales, support them as best you can, and hopefully fill in around them with guys like what was it, Ryan O'Reilly in the years that they had real chances to have success. Because I don't think Kipps stripping these guys is going to make them better.

No, no, but you know what will eventually get you better? Getting rid of them. I mean, what's that? What are you talking about? Are you on a trade Maybe. Maybe. Riley, Tavares, Matthews. Maybe, maybe, maybe. There's not enough good players in the league.

Where are you getting the next version of those guys? This is what you call a retool or rebuild. This is what happens. It's a cycle, J.B. And it just looks to me like it's starting to run its course. You can sit there and hope that Peter DeBore could come in here and Austin can light it up again. But do you really like those chances, J.B?

I just know that I don't like the chances, but I know it's a lot easier to do that and find out if that's the problem first before you do what you're talking about. Good players are going to get... But you've done that three other times with three other coaches. At varying points for various reasons. If I can jump in on that, like Ryan Nugent Hobgins has had nine coaches.

McDavid and Drysail have had five coaches. Like all these guys have had a ton of coaches. I don't want to bail them out either. But to Borny's point, I'm way more ready to have a rebuild conversation. that I probably should be. Like, don't get me wrong here. I'm ready to have it.

Like, I am, I'm teetering on that every day I watch this team. But I think before you go down that road in this off season, if you think this season is sort of worth seeing what you, like, maybe Matthews and Neander just aren't as good as we thought they were. And maybe that's, but like, try a different coach, maybe try something else. And then if you get to the end of the year and it still looks like this with whoever you bring in, then we can have that conversation. That's where I'm at on.

I guess I'm more on Borny's side. There's two other reasons why I think that makes sense right now. And you said, do you really believe that this, someone could come in and turn it around? I think about Barubi doing that in 2019, came in, they end of blues end up winning the cup.

There's talent here. You know, there's not no talent. There's not as much as you think. Well, maybe, but there's fair. There isn't. But they're better than this. I think, I don't think that's unreasonable to say. But the other thing is that the East is the worst,

I've ever seen it. And this is a year where you string together five wins in a dead cat bounce of a new coach and you're in playoffs and actually in a good seed. So if you take this simple step, one man in, let's see if a new message, new system, new structure, new lines, new voice works, fine. If you're still terrible, you've got your answer. And then it's a much harder equation from there. But it's so complex, guys.

So off the top of your list, coaches. Yeah. So would you move Baroubi out and put someone in on an interim? Or do you want to go hit the home run with Peter DeBore? Yeah. So it's got to be DeBore. I don't believe ever that the interim thing is good. You've quit on the season if you do interim.

So let's kind of just move this a little bit to Peter DeBore, who we believe is the number one guy out there. And I'm Pete DeBore. And I'm watching this from afar. Yeah. Okay. And you got 40 games to go. Is this what I want right now?

Do I want to come in in this environment and, like, and people now expect me to turn this around? Like 40 games is a lot of games still for Peter DeBore to come in now and not move the needle and not be a guy that can motivate Austin. or Willie to the point where does he really want to tie his can to that group right now? Totally a fair question. Okay? Or do I wait? Hire me in March and April when I know you guys are done and I don't get to be associated with this. I come in today. I'm associated into this losing for another half a season and that's not a good thing for me.

That's a quitter's attitude. You probably believe he can turn it around. He wants to try to have success. But you don't. that's hiding no it's not hiding it's a timing issue i need to be separated from this group i can't i can't win with this group that's what peter de bore has to answer well if he looks at that group and says i can't win with this group he'll never take the job right no you can take it you can take it uh in the summer you could take it with a group you don't think can win well no but but this is where

it gets complex for debor is that he comes in he doesn't move the needle And we assume the guy that hired him was Brad Tree Living. Brad's sticking around after this horrific season. You really think Brad's sticking around? Listen, if they turn it around, he is. If they don't, he's probably not. You're right. And Peter DeBore has now a new general manager.

Well, Peter DeBore is not, you know, a first-time coach. He's, you know, we coach 16-tlee people know, he's a known. It doesn't really work that way, though. No matter what, no matter how. many wins you've had in your career, whether you're the top rated, you like to know that you're hired by the same guy who's going to be there with you for the next few years.

You're creating a fantasy where Peter DeBore wouldn't want this head coaching job. I don't think he'd want it right now. Well, and that's fine. If that's the case, then you need to find another solution. If you believe that Craig Barrowie... Tell me who. If you believe that Craig Barubi is not the guy for the job,

you cannot proceed. You have to make a decision on something. That's just that's a conclusion. you've reached. It's like being in a relationship and you're like, I'm going to get a divorce, but like in a year. Like, how's that year going to go? You know? If you really believe that Craig Bruby isn't the guy, then the safest thing that Brad Tree Living can do is move Lalonde into his spot. No, I'm just telling you, that's, it's reality. He's a former NHL head coach. He's been there. That is safer. You tag him with interim. And he is the Peter

Horichuk for the rest of the season. Keep proving. That's, that's what they're going to do. That's more realistic for me than Peter DeBore to come in here and be the savior. Peter DeBore doesn't want that. He doesn't want it. I don't know about that. Oh, no way, listen, you can take the money and run.

They pay. Okay, if they pay, you got to overpay here. For me to come in, put my reputation on the line with this particular group, you better pay through the nose. And, you know, I heard my boy J.D. talking about this on his show today, too, and it's relevant to this conversation. But, like, you're talking about what, you know, this season has shown us about this group.

It's a bit bigger resume than just this season. Like, it's like, in terms of what this group's potential is, and it's like, oh, so you're going to fire Brume in midseason to get the dead cat bounce of these guys that have never been able to win a big game in their entire. Then they're worst in the first round. How's that going to go? It's like, you know what I mean?

It's just, it's that I can see Kipper's perspective where it's like, what are you, what's the bounce you're hoping for? You're right. And there's a, you know, I look at these guys too. And the only reason that I think this bounce is, is something worth pursuing is we've seen Willie Neelander this year be exceptional. And he's been a dog for a month. Nine days, nine games now without a goal.

Yeah, and looked bad for worse than that. Yeah. You know, like we. Tavares hasn't had a power play point in almost a quarter of the season. I think Nyes has a goal and two assists in the month of December. It's been like 10 games. Like Tavares, like these guys, we know these aren't this bad, these guys. So the hope, you're not going to win without them being great.

So maybe someone else has that. Now, do I believe that a coach is going to come in? They're all going to be great. And it's going to be awesome. No, but you can't not try. You know, I don't, I don't, the other alternative is if you truly don't believe, you don't want to fire the. coach then we sit here and go how are we rebuilding how are we retooling who are we trading but you got

to try yeah i know you got to try but there there is and this has happened many times in the course of history where you also can dig yourself in a deeper hole totally okay huge risk of that you can even do more damage to your organization no matter how much you think they're they're flawed already you can even make it worse rasmus and Anderson coming in hot, eight-year contract, and there's another first gone. You got to be careful here. You don't want to sink this. If you're looking at a retool or rebuild, maybe you can do it in three or four years,

but you make some bad mistakes from here on end. You could be looking at seven or ten years. Well, you've got to be so careful. This is a conversation that we had during the first sort of slide, the five-game losing streak where it was looking really grim there in November. and the question I asked both of you guys is how, how, you know, incentivized is this front office to save this season?

How desperate are they going to be to save this season? And that's a worry that bounces around in my mind. Are they? Very. Like, should they be? Well, I think that being the GM of the least is a great honor and embarrassing to do bad at. And I don't think you're just,

I think that they'll do a lot to try to turn around. But if you're Brad Trilliving and you position this to Trilliving or the board or whoever you're, like, where you're like, hey, my moves haven't gone well here, clearly. It's been a bad start this season. It's not looking great. Give me a chance to wipe this out. But like, let me retool this and we look to head to next season. But if Brubing. It would also buy you a couple years.

Well, if Trillivin thinks that like this is it, the leaf fans should be terrified. Listen, because it's like they have two assets. It's common. That's your point is very common for any general manager who's feeling the heat. but Brad Tree Living already has a reputation for a guy that's overcautious, makes a ton of calls, is at times hesitant to pull the trigger. He ain't turning around and now rifling off moves to save his ass.

No, and you're right. He's not that man. He's not that man. I assure you, I'm happy to hear you. He will not, he will not purposely. No, say to hell with everyone else. Exactly.

He will not, he will not. He will not. not throw anything up in the wall just to save his job he's too honorable of a man you can't get a next job either doing that doesn't work listen you know people are judging him now on calgary and toronto so to your point like he if he's not here next year he wants to stay in hockey i'm sure and and he wants his team to do well and find another chance somewhere and you're not going to do that if it gets even uglier from here on end. But if you, so to go back to the original thing,

if you're desperate to save this season and you don't feel like there's a lot of assets that you have and there's a lot of things that you can make a move on, there's one move that they always do in sports. And it's they fire the coach to try to get the bump and maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. But maybe they don't do that. They maybe just continue to play well.

Like, I hate, I'm on your side of the bailout situation. I don't want to necessarily be like, here you go, guys, here's somebody new. Like, I don't love the perception of that. Do I think Ruby's a terrible coach? No, I really don't. But I just think these guys are sick of them and the way he's talking last night.

He sounds like he's kind of sick of them. For sure. For sure, they're sitting around out of pines. That's what's going to be interesting from here on Ed. He drew a little bit of a line in the sand. I would like to see the Barubi who says, if I'm going down, I'm going down my way. Like, Austin's going to sit out.

game uh you know like i you know i'm going to talk about it in the media like i really see it we're going to do it my way for a bit here i i think that'd be a good thing for the team he i mean you got my support on that you got to press another button at this point do you got another button they went out for they went out for dinner for his 60 it's the coaches and the trainers it's like boy that would have a a gulpro like that uber that the ottawa senators had to be some conversations i'd like to hear at that dinner you might have got suspended for more than two games like that Philly broadcaster did. Yeah, no hot mics at that dinner.

God, that's a risk. Every day. Did you want it? So there's another quote, I mean, the concern that his message isn't getting through. There's stuff from today at practice. What do you like, Sam? You clipped it. I clipped a lot of stuff.

Yeah, tell me what you like. Let's go to today, clip five. He was asked this morning sort of, how do you feel a day later? Clip five, please. Digest. Pretty much, Sam, his last time. You know, I think come out in the first period, I think we're ready to go, and things are fine. We get a couple, we get power plays, killed some penalties.

You know, and we had a few looks on the PPP, but it just seemed like it unraveled after that for us. You know, they scored a couple goals in the first period. They're defendable, you know. It's not like they did anything. Spectacular. They're actually, in my opinion, they're pretty easy, defendable goals. But in saying that, we got 40 minutes to play.

And for me, like I talked about last night, you know, we got to do more, like, as a group and push, have more pushback than we had last night in that game. So were the players available today? Yeah. I think... Did anybody follow up? And I assume, you know,

and I'm not in the rink. I'm not a beat reporter. I assume that they send the players out first. Then the players go back or on the bus. And then Craig Bruby speaks. And then there's no opportunity to go back to the players. I don't know. I just...

I don't know. Somebody's got an answer to... What happened to it? I'm supposed to ask you. That's what you're coaching. asked me too. So the third goal is the one that puts him away where Jacob Chikrin.

I mean, nice shot, but what was happening on the last side of the ice there? Was that the one that was Bobby McMahon stopped? Yeah, yeah, Brian McMan stops. Thrun stops. Thrun just got caught flat-footed.

And McMahon doesn't... Statue of Liberty. That's the one on the change where McMahon just gives him the Matador wave into the zone. Go get him. Not fun to watch you. Go get them.

Yeah. Oh, that touched up. That actually is McKee level. I rarely look like an NHLer, but that was me. Like in basketball, you're like, maybe I'll get his eyes. I can't get it to the shot. Chikrin was toying with him last night. Chikrin looked like he was trying to make some Canada last night.

I would say that the two guys on their team that's trying to make Team Canada, Tom Wilson and Chickren, both made a extremely strong case. Yeah, they sure did. No, yeah, I feel bad for Hill to be. Yeah, who, by the way, was absolutely fine. Showing hard at there at least. Yeah.

We should break here. Yeah, we should probably break. Okay. As you've probably just witnessed or heard, we're out of ideas, but our leaf line will have plenty. I am so looking forward to hearing someone else besides the three of us talking Toronto Maple Leafs.

It's a similar tone, no, no, no, no. No. Yes. But it's real, all right? Everybody's calling. is real and we can't wait to get to them after the break more real kipper and born dive deep into toronto sports and the nfl the jd bunk is podcast subscribe and download the show on apple spotify

or wherever you get your podcasts welcome back to the program nick kiprios justin All right, Sammy, it's Friday. Before we get to the Leafs line, it's what you'd expect. Here's a question for you. Oh, uh-oh. I don't know. I, because it's the big roster freeze happens at 1159, okay? Yeah.

Leaves have a back-to-back this weekend where they're in national Saturday night, followed by in Dallas on Sunday. I mean, if they play like that, I mean, they'll lose to everything. They lose to the Marley's if they play like that. Like, does it apply to coaches? The freeze? The freeze? No, I don't think so.

No, you can get... But humanity again? Yeah, that's what are you asking? Can the coach get fired at Christmas Eve? If they lose both the games on the week... I'm telling you, if they lose both the games on the weekend by margin or something, can it happen? Or is it just not nice?

Sammy, professional sports, man, it can happen. And I'm not talking per se. Yeah. Okay. I don't know about the Leaf situation, but this stuff is real. Nobody cares. No owner cares about his, about Christmas if he thinks it's best for his, I don't know, $3 billion investment.

I'm going through the start dates of head coaches in the NHL, 32 coaches in the NHL. There is one coach who's been hired in the month of December out of the mall. And there is three others in November. So pretty uncommon this kind of year. the one coach is Todd McClun, who was hired on December 26th by Detroit. Detroit. Who got rid of? Oh.

Okay. Let's go to the least line. Oh, that was Loisand? Yeah. It certainly was. He had hired two years to the day. Let's go to, I forget all these. Let's go to Monty from Nova Scotia to start.

I love the show. I never miss it. However. So they say. Barubi is a very good coach. I say a one-trick pony. Holy Mackinah try something different. Easy to see they don't want to play his way. Not the right players for his style anyway. Kipper, what along with Carlo would it take to get Sherwood? And stop wrapping the puck around the boards, which is about 80% of the time when no leaf player is anywhere near the boards.

to recover it looking like a few lean years coming in at least I've seen him win one Lord Stanley this show is best on TV other than hockey itself take care and Merry Christmas We love you too buddy We love you too

You mentioned Sherwood I do love Sherwood Someone I think could give up a first rounder for him You know but that would have to be knowing for sure that you're going to sign them and the Leafs ain't doing that the Leafs have no first rounders in the next two years and it's another team's going to go I can do better than waiting for the 2028 Jimmy will be 90 by then I don't think that's accurate well in fact Daniel Dale just called fact check it will it will feel it will feel like he's

90 waiting for the 2028 first round pick Yeah, but I agree, kind of, you know, the style he wants to play, they don't play. And they desperately need a guy like that, too. I sure would? Oh, yeah, but three quarters of the league could, too. Just an engine guy. An engine guy. In somebody's face.

Aldrich Malars was dash four last night, but was the meanest. He was my favorite player. God, he cross-checked somebody. I know. Robertson and Cowan, I still like almost every game. They're skating hard. They're doing things. I mean, that's, how about that big dice move?

They're down to two going to the third. Get the 18-year-old to light up the two, the $40 million men. He put them with Nealander and Matthews. That's what I mean. I know, but then he put them out third. So he's trying to let the best guys in Washington go through. So we're trying to get our best two guys out there against their worst guys with our most engine-like player.

And they got hemmed in immediately a minute and a half and barely touch the hockey puck. And then they went and sat back down. Thanks for playing. Jesus, that was really. Thanks for participating. Let's go to Rocco from Hamilton. I see all online about the coaching change and maybe Brubay wasn't a good fit. And maybe that is true.

But I don't see anybody really talking about if reliving was a bad fit. I mean, he came over here and the guys who were under contract that, I don't Marner was walked. But when he did get here, Marner had what? two years left. Maybe he wasn't really the right GM to bring in, and then him bringing him Brube doesn't really make it Barube's fault. The team is a mess. They got spanked by Washington yesterday. And is this just still Shanahan fallout? I don't know. I feel like Brube is taking too much heat and

truly even's not taking enough. Anyways, thanks. The point he made... It's a good call. The point Rocco made there is one that I think will always I'll always look back on as the turning point of this era

is when Dubis got fired, it was right after... Was that the five game series to Florida? No, Florida in the second round. It's right when you could have Quinn used Mitch Marner.

And he was like mad. And remember the whole, like, there was word that they were going to maybe trademarker. And they had the ability to them because he didn't have a full no move at that point. And then Trillivin comes in. They had to hire him because of all the stuff that happened, we know Kippers, the maddest have ever seen Kipper

in the history of this show after Dubas left. Electric Radio. I still see the reel on YouTube sometimes. It pops up at him yelling. I watch it once in a month. It's very good. But Trillivin just got here. his key card barely worked

and he had a week to trade Mitch Martin totally and it's like he had there's just no way where he could come in and be like all right guys send your offers you got a week he did but he got tricked he was like look at these guys

they're amazing there was just that window two between MLSC and Brendan Chanahan too and the last year I'm not sure you know when Keith Pelly came in he kept Brendan Shanahan but I don't know at that point

how much autonomy he had and in all fairness the decision with that window of Mitch Marner being traded or not shouldn't have fallen on Bradtree living it should have been on Brendan Chanahan yeah that was an unfair

that's a great point you know here here's the hot potato and it's like It's on fire. And at the end of the day, at the end of the day, when we look back at Brendan's 10 years and to his fault, he was tremendously loyal with Kyle Dubis to 34, 16, 91, 88, and 88. 29. And, and, and Morgan. Good bets, though, like, you know, bet on the good guys.

Right. And they gave Morgan his seven and a half. And he gave him all. all no moves. When we look back, boys, the no moves were the kiss of death. All around the league, the no moves, they're brutal.

Yeah. Someone texts. I'll forget who was texting with last night, but Morgan Riley, and I was like, Wednesday is contracts. It's like, 20, I'm like, oh, 2030. He's done. Oh, I thought it was sooner than that.

I got to tell you, that one feels like it's going to happen at some point. They're going to have a chat in the off season. I really believe that Morgan, like, he's still got some good hockey left. He just needs a fresh change. Wouldn't he want to go at some point? This one is good.

Let's go to Daniel from Toronto. I've said it many times, but this year really is different. I've never felt like this before. I'm numb. I'm only 47, but I've had too many scars. I remember the first one in 1989. The Leafs needed a win versus the Blackhawks in the last game of the season just to make the playoffs. But in overtime, Todd Gil coughed up the puck in front of Allen Buster

and Troy Murray scored. I told my mom I jumped out the window if they lost that game, and she still reminds me. Can we get a wellness check? I didn't miss the game in 40 years. I listened to games on the radio, and they were not televised. I missed family events.

I got the school late when they're on the West Coast. I believed in worst teams in this year's team. And then 93 Destiny didn't happen. The curse, not even hiding itself. blatantly interfering. Legit goals, denied, phantom penalties. Untimely injuries. This season really is different.

I haven't had beers with my friends. For the first time of my life, I don't know when it's game paid. I'm sorry, I don't listen to you guys every day like I used to. I don't like this team. I'm sorry, guys. Sammy, is that your lost brother? Were you going to separate it?

Can we get an address? Is he okay? Sorry, brother, I feel so soon. Daniel, it's okay. Sammy can relate. Oh, yeah. It's only a game. Long lost brother. I was very, like, I woke up.

I haven't been that upset about the lease. I woke up today. I was like, boy, this is going to be a long day. Let's do, let's do Tim. Christmas break here. Let's do Tim and Hamilton. Yeah, here's my solution for the Leafs. And I think this is what has to be done.

Fire the whole staff. And I want to put Kipper, Borny in as the coaches, because they seem to know a lot. They're pretty good at telling everybody what to do. So put them behind the bench. Let's bring Doug McLean back from Leisure World, get them out of the old age home and put him in his general manager. And Sammy, you'll be in charge of sweaters and sticks. I don't know, Sammy's sweaters.

You mess that up quite a bit. Maybe we'll just make you stick boy. But anyways, you're a great team. You love the team. You love Toronto sports. you're the guys I want to see there it would be entertaining that's for sure wow nice tim

how do you think that would go or do you think we would do this team the rest of the way it would last five minutes it would be bad Kipper would just mouth off the media immediately he'd punch you I gotta tell you 100% worried about Mac more than Kip Max the main concern

I'm worried that we'd be going into the game we'd be like I moved Riley and Matthews and I'd be like what do you mean Doug for a condo Future's real estate deal John would be going on some other radio show in 10 years

be like that Luke Fox I don't know how much we know how much more time let's go I could even know Yeah sure let's go to Costas and Mr. Costa Hey boys love the show Quick take

Have you ever noticed or wondered How the Burke and for Living Era will be viewed the same as in, you know, Brian Burke saying we're going to play with traculence, and so living talking about playing with SNAT and DNA change. And in essence, so far, both of these errors have the leaves being a soft thing mentally and physically, and other things not really having a hard time playing against them. That hard game has not really been successful.

If the lips continue to play as they do and they either bow out or don't make the playoffs, What can this management team possibly tell us the fans after they were not able to change the DNA as they wanted to? Is there going to be more promises? I'm just not sure what your thoughts are on the two eras and how similarly the team has played and how the executives wanted to change the makeup of the team, but they did not succeed.

Do you think they're similar or you think it's too early to compare? I'll just make one statement on this and then I'll hand it off to you guys that Burke delivered what he promised. promised. That team had Fraser, McLaren, Colton, or he said they'd be truculent. He delivered truculence. Yeah, they were truck. Yasu Costa, this is in a nutshell. From 1967 to present, anyone that's played or managed the team, we've all failed. We're all losers.

No, I'm serious. So you can pick apart whatever you want. This had more, this had less. We didn't get the job done. I didn't as a player. They didn't as managers. enough to fail. So I'm even worse. What an hour of uplifting sports talk radio. We got to go. All right. Don't go away. It's only going to get uglier. Doug McLean joins us next as we go national.