Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Hour: Treliving on the Edge

Episode Date: January 26, 2026

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee look back on the Toronto Maple Leafs' pair of losses over the weekend to the Vegas Golden Knights and Colorado Avalanche. They start with Friday's game and the different intensity Toronto and Vegas had in Mitch Marner's return. Then, they discuss the Leafs' lack of leadership, William Nylander flipping the bird to the broadcast, whether Brad Treliving is a lame duck, and why the Leafs must be sellers at the deadline. Later, Nick, Justin and Sam discuss Fraser Minten's emergence in Boston, the decision to start Anthony Stolarz, and Craig Berube distancing himself from that decision.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Digging out of a mess. Both for the city of Toronto and the Maple Leafs. From this past weekend, Nick Caprio's Justin Barnes, Sammy Wiki, Jake the Snake Shultz, Derek Brandeo, and Zhajaa, Ethan Gabor. This is our Leaf Hour edition. We are live on Sportsnet 360,

Sportsnet 590, the fan in Toronto, shovels and all. Streaming always on SportsNet Plus. And if you miss our show, also available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, where the chats are nonstop. We talked about a homestand.

We needed for the Leafs to go on a good run to get the city back on board. So far it hasn't happened. I don't know if an hour is going to be enough. I don't want to do this.

This particular stretch for the Toronto Maple Leafs. I'm not sure if an hour is going to be enough, but let's give it a try on our Leaf Hour edition. Overall thoughts on the team, particular individuals.

J.B., you go first, my friend. You know, going into this stretch, I think a lot of the previous road trip there, there's the four games where we were like, okay, they need to get X amount of points, right? They got five of eight, I think, of those points. Because we saw this coming.

We saw a couple of games coming that were going to be very challenging. And, you know, all you could hope was much like the first two times or the first time they saw Vegas and the first time they saw Colorado, they brought it and they overachieved and they surprised us. I would say that they did the opposite of that in those two games. And they completely did not bring it underachieved and peed down their leg. Sammy, Vegas or Colorado, bigger disappointment. Kipper, I don't really know. But you don't give me that. I got an hour to burn here.

I'd be lying to you if I told you that I didn't prepare something to get my thoughts out. I don't know if I want to do this now or whatever. No, no, take the hour off. But I, listen. No, no, no, Kip, let me stop you. He's written a psychopath's manifesto. He has written notes today. Like I took my Leafs Talk book that you'll see here.

You're looking on YouTube. It's the same one I had in grade nine, by the way. Yeah. And I, yeah, I wrote some things. Buddy, do I just sit back and get a coffee? Yeah. You want to start small picture or low picture? Let's get Kip's take first.

And then we're going to get to your manifesto. We lead you to weigh in before Sam just goes for 20 minutes. I'm not going to go 20 minutes. I have nowhere he's going. And I'm probably going to weigh in after the first sentence. So. Okay. Here's, we'll start with Friday night in the manifesto, okay?

Okay. So the Toronto Maple Leafs fans gave in and cheered for Marner that you didn't show up for, on or off the ice. Just another game, they said, while the night stars treated it like it was a game seven of the Stanley Cup final. A Stanley Cup, which their stars have actually won. 34 doesn't address the media the whole day and refers to the embarrassment the next day as fun. But it wasn't at practice. It was at an ath-the-ice workout because practice was canceled.

So that's my first sentence of my first paragraph of my manifesto. Do you want in on that? What was fun for the captain Friday night? Do you have the quote? Do we get it? I don't know. We do have it. Let's listen to Austin talk about getting his lunch money stolen from him and stuffed in a locker.

It's the top clip there. I just put it in there. What was it like last thing? than just playing that atmosphere? Yeah, it was fun. Obviously, you kind of knew going into it it was going to be pretty loud and all that stuff.

So it's always fun to play in environments like that. Have you got some cheers along with booze with that video tribute? Yeah, I mean, I think that's kind of what you expected. You know, it was nice that, you know, there was some cheers for him during the video tribute and all that stuff. I think it was kind of done the right way

and you know that there's going to be the booze when he's on the ice and has the pocket all that stuff like that. I think it's pretty expected. You've kind of seen it with other guys who have been in similar situations and stuff like that. So I thought it was a good atmosphere.

It was fun. I just don't know how you go from. I've had enough of the MARTAQ questions. And if you're going to play that angle or that card or that attitude, then see it through. I don't know how you go from. I've had enough of it to it was fun.

It was a good atmosphere. It was fun. I don't know where you get fun. Yeah, I don't either. I'm not sure about that. You know, like, I didn't think he played terribly this weekend or anything, but it's this sort of stuff that was frustrating. That was...

Sam, I know you guys went in on pretty good. You're real bothered by it. I think that one of the things that jumped out to me, and part of my manifesto that I wrote down, is that oftentimes we've talked about Marner and Matthews and this whole core, and Kipper, to your... and you're not the only person that thinks this,

that Marner is the only guy that's ever, that's taken the most of the brunt, okay? And what I saw on that Friday night was Mitch Marner playing on a team with stars who were there to pick him up, where he's playing with guys that are Mark Stone. No, he had stars here too. Well, no, but here's what, he had Mark Stone,

these guys have won. Mark Stone, who was the best player on the ice. Now we're less in talent and more on character. Sure, fair enough. he was unbelievable Friday night treating that game you see the way he's celebrating goals the way that they treated that you see Keegan Coles are ripping down the sellout jersey on the way in you see Jack Eichel scoring a goal giving it to the fans marner never had like he was a big part of the failures here in the playoffs but it was never

he was never picked up by anybody so it was all this collective loss and they never had and they're just standing there watching it on Friday night I'm like that's what it looks when your teammates are character guys and winners and win for you and have big moments. Like you can go place. It doesn't all have to be on one guy. But all four of them can't be the same at the same time. And it just jumped out to me watching it. That was my biggest thing.

What are you been watching the last five or six years? Well, Marner's been on the team. And now you've discovered this? Well, Marner was on the team. He was brutal on Friday. He didn't have to talk. He wasn't, he didn't do anything. And he didn't have to do anything.

He wasn't brutal. He was brutal. He was brutal. He didn't do anything. Okay. It was zeroes across the board. Your team won. Your team won.

He played 20 minutes. He couldn't have been brutal. Stop it. I mean, just stop it, okay? You don't need three points. I'm on your side here, I know you are.

I know you are. But I think that type of attitude is just, it breeds to the fact that they didn't like Marner. Right? A lot of people didn't like Marner. I'm really proud of the rink Friday night. We disagree on that. Okay?

No, I'm, that's the right thing. to do. Okay, be classy about it and acknowledge what he did in the video and then boom, the rest of the game because he's not one of them anymore. I get it. It was perfect, Sam. Okay. But they did the right thing at the right time. I disagree. I mean, that wasn't what I was talking about at all. Like, I mean, I don't want to crap on the fans and I've already done it enough. I'm not here to do that. I'm just saying from a team perspective, it's not something that Marner ever had here. But there's other guys to pick them up. They haven't had it. Ever.

Well, yeah. Ever. But I never watched it on another team, Kip, is my point. That I watch it with these character guys. But you don't have to watch it on another team. You just have to know it's not there for them. And there's a Barubi quote here. And I don't know where it is.

So I'll just say that he talked about like lack of excitement, right? And how you got to cheer for one another. on the bench. Did you clip it? What game was that one from? Was that about the bench being quiet? Yes. Yeah, clip nine.

Thank you. What's the chatter on the bench like when you get down? Yeah, it depends on the game. You know, it depends on the time and the game like, you know, in different situations, you know, it changes, you know, throughout the year, you know. Right now it's quiet. Right now it's quiet and that's not going to help. You know, you got to, you got to cheer for your. your teammate, you got to have energy no matter what situation.

You talk about confidence. That's going to create confidence for your team too. Okay. Just stop at everything except you got to cheer for your teammates. Okay. Who says that about his team when that isn't an automatic. Win, lose, time of the game, clock, situations. don't care.

Not cheering for your teammate is non-negotiable. The moment I feel like you're not cheering for your teammate, you're not a teammate anymore. I want you off this team. That is absurd to sit there and say, I've got guys that don't cheer for each other. I watch Austin, I can't believe how many times he goes back to the bench

and pulls a frigging, iPad out to look at what happened. Can you just get on the bench, talk to teammates, and help one another out and stop worrying about what you didn't or did or didn't do on a particular play to score a goal? Can you see a big picture here burying your head in an iPad every time you come off the ice

speaks to the, I don't have time to cheer for anyone else on? You know, I don't know if this is. is a Austin conversation or not, because I do feel like that's just what guys do know. He watched Vegas cheer for, for Marner. And they picked him up. And no, he didn't have a great game. Okay. It wasn't a great game.

But to Sam's point, he had a great support group there going, this is important to us. This means something for us. You know, I'm torn on one particular aspect of that. And one is that Vegas is a better team than the Leafs. They got better players and the Leafs are without Willie and they win going away in that game. And so we tend to make losses personal and moral and about character when it's like that team won.

It's easy to look upbeat, whatever way. You can still look like you give a crap. I understand that. I understand that. When you lose and you're outplayed or you're out talented. I get it. But I do think that we tend to ascribe, oh, these guys look down, whatever.

And it's like, yeah, they're getting their asses handed to them. That tends to happen. The next facet of that, though, is that I think you know, when you go somewhere where you're supported, like you're talking about with Mitch, and Phil Kessel goes and wins a cop with Pittsburgh and Mitch, you know, is a part of a team where you're supported, it does bring up the idea and make you more aware of, you know,

Mitch, Austin, Willie, I don't even know if you want to include DeVaris and that. They have talent. They are Kessel. They are those sort of guys that are these elite skilled guys. But they haven't had that. They don't have that sort of captain-like guy. And that's why they're not sure.

Is it John? is at all, should it go to Morgan. They haven't had that. And captains in leadership are so important. And so the Leafs are at a point now where their coach has to also be their captain. And when your coach is your captain, you got no chance. Buddy, his face shouldn't be the only one that looks like that.

His face is so bad. It's a real. Can he have one player have a face that looks like that? Always looks like that. Mike McCabe looks like you get shot with a tommy guy. You might need a second guy because you got one all the time. Okay. All right, fair enough. But it is a limited amount.

Carry on manifesto. All right. In the midst of getting skated off the ice in the middle of the worst snowstorm in the city's history with a surprisingly big crowd, one of your stars who's sitting in the press box decides to flip off the camera, starting a national dialogue, on how immature beliefs are. So that's the next point of the...

Okay. In the... So we're on a group chat. And I didn't even respond to your... I don't know what you... Did he just do that? I don't know. You sent something, right?

I sent it... I saw it live and text you guys. I'm like, he just flipped the bird to the broadcast. I'm watching it. And it's like... Watching... In all honesty, I'm watching Chris Tannave have an ice cream cone that reminded me of the one I always got when I was like eight years old off the guy on the cycle.

It's a sluggo sugar cone with a chocolate hard chocolate. And I'm like, they looked really good. I mean, that's a classic Shoresy too. I don't know. These sticks are unbelievable. But after every game, the drum sticks, they all go all these sticks are unbelievable. Oh, the sluggo. But they have those in the press box.

I mean, not to bury my sports media brethren, but it's a knife fight to get to. the freezer in time to get to get to. And that's all, that's all I was thinking until I'm like, did that just happen? Yeah. Did he really do that? I couldn't believe it. So there's,

I think there's two directions to go with this, and I already have a feeling which way you'll go. And I'm on both side. Me too. I hate to say it, but me too. The one side of it is like, I just cannot fathom caring about this. Like I can't, there's two articles about it on the athletic.

I can't fathom caring about it. However, there's the other part of me that's like, it is indicative of a thing that like Lou Lamarillo, you would never, it wouldn't happen on his team. It would have stopped at the tank top and the feet up and we'd never have got to the point where a guy flips it right of the camera. So I'm like, I don't care. I actually don't care.

But it does, doesn't say nothing. I don't care. I want to not care. I know. I desperately want to sit here and be with my leave thing. Why do not want to care? I see everybody making such a huge deal of it and articles and think pieces and all this stuff.

On national broadcast, you got Biz making much more offensive jokes than anything than a little bird. And there's like talking about the league going to like get involved. Biz is not helping a Leaf fan trying to win a Stanley Cup. Biz is going after clicks. I get that. That's his job. Attract attention.

Anywhere from a serious conversation on hockey, to send his hair on fire. Right. Okay, it doesn't matter to biz. Get the eyeballs. That's not Willie's job. So don't even think about linking the two. No, but see, this is the thing is that you can't claim to be offended by it.

He's not offended by it. He doesn't hurt anyone. It's like, okay, whatever. But it says something. The only afternoon game of the year set to kids. And your star player is telling them, to go themselves. Where do you...

Did you break the pearls off your neck when you clutch them? Where? Where? Where does that... Where do you want that in your organization? This is the thing, is that I'm aware of what you're saying.

Yeah. And you're not wrong. No, you're not wrong. It's like, I want to just be like, ugh, whatever. But it's not nothing. Do you know the damage you do to, uh, whatever? Do you understand that...

I don't. But the attitude of... it. Do you understand what the attitude of, it doesn't matter? Your GM, your GM doesn't get to do this. I do. The GM doesn't get to go, ah, we don't care. That's why there's a statement out. That's why

he had to come out this morning. For Sam, who lives and dies until the Leafs win the Stanley Cup. Dies. It links. Okay? It's not separate. It's it's, it shows what is going on in that dressing room

or the attitude or the I get to do whatever I want. I get to put on any clothes I want. I can come into the rink half naked. Who's going to challenge me? Who's going to test me? I can flip the bird to 20,000 fans and tens of millions on the internet.

Right? I get to do whatever I want. And it's like, no, you don't. You can, but you don't get to win. You don't get to be a champion. You don't get to make the playoffs. Yeah. They're linked.

And I mean, if you want to impute all that on to that situation, I get it. And I do think that it does hint at an environment there where it's like, we've done the he's willy thing. But there used to be some like he's willy butt. But this feels like the last run of Willie things has been like, you know, 10, then he comes back and he gets two points and two shifts and everyone loves them. And I, back. The press box confidence.

this year from Willie. I mean, he's got no tarp on up there. He's flipping the bird. Somebody sent me a picture of him with his feet up up there one time. It's like, I put my feet up every day at work, so I can't say anything. But, I mean, just, it's, I,

Kipper, you're, you are unfortunately very right about this. I agree. What do you mean, unfortunately? Because, why is it unfortunate? Because I've flipped a bird off to a guy who cut me off on the road the other day. Like, people flip the bird off.

You're Sam McKee. Which. This guy is supposed to be a leader of the Toronto, Maple Leafs. Nobody cares that you flip a bird. I am agreeing with you and I don't want to agree with you, but I am. That's where I'm at. Then stop linking you and Willie together. Start there. So what do you want to have happen here, Kip? Spend him. Kick him off the tour. Yeah. You want to trade him? Buddy, listen. Get him out of here. Do you think you're going to win with

that guy? You know what? Do you think he's going to lead you to a Stanley Cup? There is only so much talent in this league. He is one of the ten best. or whatever you think, 20 best. Pick your number. And I think there are certain times where you go, we got to put up with Randy Moss's antics because he can make those plays. Or we got to do.

Willie is not, listen to me. You don't need it. Willie is not out at clubs getting in gun fights or whatever else. You know, this is all silliness that you can work on a maturity level. If you start running these guys out of town, you're going to be watching dumpings for days

with guys with awesome character. Is this where we're at now? Is this where we're at? Yeah, you make exceptions in pro sports for certain talent. Toronto Maple Leafs. Toronto Maple Leafs. What does that mean? It means it ain't Columbus.

It ain't Tampa Bay. It's the Toronto Maple Leafs. They would kill to be Tampa Bay. We're going to keep a guy because he's not getting in gunfights. No, I'm saying, no, it's because he is elite talent who's not breaking the law. And he knows it. And he knows it. And he shoves it in your face. And he shoves it in every fan's face that I can do.

stuff that nobody else cuss. Because Justin Borden tells me that it's above everything else. I win because I can do anything I want on the ice and look good. How about some internal standards? Why does it have to be everything goes? Could they find him, suspend them? Could they handle it internally without having to trade him to Columbus to fix it? Now we're having a different conversation now.

Now it's off Willie and it's on the adults in the room. Should be. Yeah. We just solved it. We did it. We finally did it. Okay. And I am 100% with you.

Where is everybody? Where is he when he's up in the press box? The Hilroy's coming out from Sam again. Hey, just keep letting him do whatever he wants. I don't know. I don't have an answer there. Yes, Sam. It's funny.

You should bring that up. Now the leaves sit five points out of a playoff spot, five points back of the last wild card spot. Trillivings seems like there's some lame duck conversations. here and no one has any idea what the plan is. They've been more rumored for trading for Nazim Kadri than doing the right thing and soft selling at the deadline. Where is Tree?

He hasn't spoken since the 25 game mark. It's the plan. He said soft selling again. I know. I know. I said just to piss him off. I think it's getting close to talk time. Don't you?

Like the sell time? No. like come out and like we're talking oh yeah like i mean what's his uh shovel day i'll talk to and things were going badly like it's you know who else did one reason is it tom fischarald tom fitzgerald in new jersey it's it's Toronto and i think it's getting close to i mean we had a conversation like they were talking about stolars and he said i that's not on that's yeah ruby said is about starting stolars and that came he said that's not my decision i don't know i Okay.

So I just, I feel like, we got a lot of, doing directions. Yeah, we got a lot of different directions. Take a path. Okay.

Let's go with this perception of a soft cell. And I get you and J.D. and whoever else uses that term. Mm-hmm. But let's just dig down underneath it. That, that's just a surface comment to throw out. let's go underneath here for a second.

Who, in your estimation, gets to make that decision? I mean, well, that's up to the general manager, assuming he has the approval from above to make those moves. I have no idea who makes it decision. You got to answer it, buddy, because you just can't throw it out there without understanding where it's coming from and what are the implications of making that decision and who ultimately is standing at the end.

Are you following me? Just win. Okay. So let's break it down now. Okay. So basically since Brendan Shanahan's left, the hockey department really has come down to Brad Tree Living and Craig Bruby, right? And Keith Pelley, of course, is the CEO and all of this.

And there's no questions asked that at the beginning of the season, he had 100% confidence in Brad Tree Living. He, I don't know the exact quote, but it's like, this is Brad's team. Where is that today? Where is if they're going to sell, who gets the ultimate saying? You threw up Brad Tree Living, right, is the decision maker.

I mean, presumably. Presumably, okay? I would hope. I mean, but it. What, what, what, what, what, what, What benefit does it have for Brad Tree Living to start selling off pieces and weakening his team this year? Because they're hooped either way. I mean, okay, go ahead.

They're hooped either way. In my opinion. Okay. So if they're hooped either way, why do I want him now to make those decisions if I don't have confidence in him and he's hooped either way and I got to get rid of him this summer? So what are you, like, I mean, basically saying for Tree, the only incentive is to try to get better. The only incentive is to try to get better and get back in this thing. The only thing is a seven or eight game winning streak to get them back in. There's no benefit to the future of the Toronto Maple Leafs for Brad Tree Living to start getting rid of Lotton.

He needs Lotton in that room. That room has got some issues. What is that? What is it? What is going on? Okay. What is cool? He's got, that room's got some issues.

You think Brad Tree Living wants to move Scott Lotton right now? He needs him more than ever. Yeah, you know, but for needs it for what? We can get back in this thing, Sam. So I think the only alternative I can think of to what you're talking about, Kip, is let's say he believes, Tree believes in his heart of heart, they got to sell. He doesn't think they're good. Yeah.

He's only had a couple years with Keith Pelly. Can he sit him down and say, I want to make the mature long-term, decision for our franchise. I'm worried about the long-term health of this team. You know, here's what I want to do and why. Can I sell you on a sell? So Brad sells Keith Pelly, the CEO on that. And now let's not forget Keith Pelly.

He's got a board. He's got an owner. He's got checks and balances. So imagine now Keith Pelly going to the board now and saying, I know we said we were all in and we were going to be competitive this year and we're going to make the necessary trades but we got a new plan now.

We got a brand new plan and we want Brad and Craig to and Craig to move forward this summer. You know what stinks about all this? How is that going to go over, Sam? If it's the right thing for the franchise it should be sellable to smart people. You're talking to me like I'm on the board

or like I'm telling you what they should do. What I think they should do. I know, I know. But I'm telling you, if it doesn't happen, I want to give you an understanding on why it doesn't happen. But to me, none of this gives credit to these people as thoughtful people that it's like, hey, here's the best thing for us in the big picture. I know this year we're going to miss out on $10 million or whatever the revenues are going to be.

I know that's a lot of money. But if we miss the playoffs the next 10 years, five years, it's going to be worse. You think there's a chance of Brad Tree Living survives missing the playoffs? this here and then he gets to fix all of this. Do you think that's the case? So that's the bigger question and I don't know the answer. I think he's a. I think the answer's no.

I don't see a world where that happens. Well, in that case, then yeah, it's a tough sell. So it's a tough sell. Here's right. Here's one of the options that scares me that I can see happening, doing nothing. keep what you got try to make a push see if we can get in with this group

some health after the Olympics you know can this group here claw their way in and then who knows maybe our goaltending maybe nize is better maybe maybe maybe and nothing

you get nothing for your assets you make a push you finish with 95 points and cross fingers but maybe Keith gets to fire somebody for it though right like I know I put faith

this guy but I've made a move now and let me hire a new guy. Yeah. And I think that's, if they missed the playoffs, that's probably what we'll see. Yeah, Kip, listen, I think you're probably right. It's impossible to think otherwise

based on the quick fall here from... I don't see Brad Tree Living now pushing a narrative of this is what's best for the team even though it could cost me my job. You know what bothers me the most in all this? But then, like, I've said it before, but you can understand

as a lifelong fan who's going to be here long after Radd's living is. Yeah, you want the right thing done. That's, I mean, that is poison to leave fans' ears. That's the last thing they want to hear that. Somebody's making a irrational decision to try to save their job with a team with zero assets. But at least, you know what bothers me most? It's been going on for decades.

Yeah. And it's, and guess what? Guess how many cups they've won in the last decades? So, oh, here, they never want anything. People want to compare it to Boston. Do you think Don Sweeney last years making those moves, including Carlo, if he didn't get, if he didn't get reassurance that I can still drive this. I have no idea how to answer that question.

The answer is yes. That's the answer. Yes, he got reassurance that he was not going to be fired for it. And we'll put you in on a relaunch, a retool. Now, if Brad can get that today or tomorrow, then we're having a different conference. You know, and I can see a world where this team comes back and they get more, their goalies are both from the start of the year. And Willie's healthier and Nyes is healthier. And they add some, you know, you can see a world where they do a Boston.

It's not so bad next year. Here's what I want to say the thing that bothers me most about it is let's say he thinks he has to be a buyer. Do it today. You know, it's this close. The margins are this thin. I'm not sure Keith Pelley will allow him to be a buyer because that would put him. and bigger jeopardy. So then, yeah, to Sam's point,

he can't sell, he can't buy, he can't. No, no, I think we'll probably see them kind of cruise in. That sounds atrocious. Just tires getting kicked right into pieces. Yeah, I think the most likely scenario, and listen, I had them

absolutely dead set against selling anything, but I didn't picture losing all the games here at home on this stretch. I know with the right answer, answer is. Don't get me wrong. What is the right answer? The right answer is to sell. Hard. Okay? Not solved? I just don't think it's doable at this point for Brad, tree living especially. So, but you hate to have someone making decisions. It's not allowed to make decisions. That's not good.

It happens all the time. Yeah, well, great. It does. It shouldn't ever. So does bad stuff all over the world happens all the time. It doesn't mean it makes it good. I just. I like that. It's true. I frequent bad stuff. I don't know I've been watching the news recently. You're 100% right. You won't get an argument out of me. I'm just saying that it's... For example.

We have people that, you know, often look at their self-interest. For example here. Of course. Human nature. Like, I mean, one of the big names that would be rumored at the trade deadline would be Bobby McMahon, right? And you've batted around the idea

that they're possibly going to extend them. And for example, if they go past the deadline this year, they don't do anything. And they're just like, oh, we're going to cruise into the, into the off season. And, you know, Bobby ends up signing somewhere else

or the least sign him for however much it's going to cost. He's been a part of it. He's been a focal point of this thing. He's played on the top line. Like, he's part of why they, like, he's been one of their better players.

I just, if you're going to let him walk or you're going to sign, I just don't understand, sign him now if you think he's that good or just trade. Could you get a first for him? Maybe. Maybe. Like, he's a baby a big getter.

I know Lotton at times has struggled as late as Friday night with his nine and a half minutes. By the way, he didn't struggle. He was fantastic. Two assists this year. But his stock, they have a better chance of recouping what they paid for him a lot more today than they did three weeks ago or a month ago. He is moving. See, this is what I would do. I would go to Scott Lotton and say at the trade deadline.

Do you want a contract or do you want to go? No, no. I'm moving you. I'm going to get something back. And I will open my arms up to you July 1st and you can come back. No chance. No chance. He's not coming back.

Never happens. Then I'll stick with the conditional second rounder then. How about that? You just said yourself though they need a guy like that in that room. No, Tree does. Not me as a fan watching. No, but the Leaf's culture, and I know people grimace when you try to be the culture team,

but he feels like one of the true guys who has some power to affect it. I just look... And still play well. I just, you know, I go to cap wages and I look at what their assets are in terms of picks or whatever. And I look at McMahon.

I look at Stetcher. I look at All Brickman-Larson. I look at... Assets. I look at Lawton. Assets. You could convince me, I mean, Machelli, if somebody, like, there's five guys right there. Robert, like, I would be going, looking to just bring in a whole new group of guys.

It's pretty bonkers that we, that Marner left. They did the Machelli Joshua thing. I'm not even going to include one there because they just kind of took it. They can get and he's a next player. He's okay. But, and just went, yeah, that'll do. Machil, Joshua, no, Mariner. It's like, I thought, you know, we talked about, okay, but they're still going to go get a top line guy.

I know. They didn't because they couldn't. Well, then don't go get the other guy. What do you have now, then? Now you're like worse than Winnipeg, you're in the bottom. You're no different. Joshua hasn't played all year.

But Chelly missed a whole month. He gets, you know, he's fine. But there was, it wasn't much more than like a win against Colorado that you were like, yeah, this team could get in the playoffs and they could do some damage. I still feel like they can get in the playoffs. I still feel like they can. Yeah, I'm way past that now.

Oh, no, I'm still there. They can still get in the playoffs. Wow. How many games left until the break? 30. Five until the break. When five in a row. Before the deadline after that.

I believe I said on this very show that, and you called me a coward, but people were clamoring for me to say they were back, say when they were back. And I said, if they're in a playoffs pot after that Colorado game, I'll say they're back. And we watched what happened on this homestand, and it went in the pooper. It was. They had a healthy Willie for a minute. That helped. They did.

They did. But, yeah. Okay. take a quick break here. Oh my God, yeah. Sammy. I got a couple more manifest. I don't know if that was fun or not.

I didn't enjoy that. You did it? Kipper, you loved it. No. I did not. I would say that was a good hard lap, boys. Yeah, good hard lap. Okay, we're going to towel off here.

Sweating. More real Kippering born after the break. Get smarter when you listen to Hockey Talk, the Hockey PEOCast with Dmitri Filipovich. Subscribe and download. the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to the program. The Real Kippron-Born show, Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, and Manifesto Sammy.

Would you like another point from it or no? I honestly, I need a break. We need to lighten on. Okay, this one will do it. All right. So now you're five points back of Boston for the final playoff spot. Doesn't sound light. Who you traded your second best prospect to plus a first round pick.

That top prospect now has 13 goals. which is one more than Matthew Nyes, you pay $7 million a year. Can I add to that? Yeah. Minton and Ed. Steve's? No. No.

The deal, though. Yeah, Minton and a 11th pick overall? Well. I don't know what it's at right now today. Yeah. But it's a very good chance. It's a top 10 pick. Unless they start a winning.

Right. It isn't traditionally. trading for someone at the deadline where they end up with the 27th, 28th, 29th pick, 25th pick. This is now in a territory where it's going to really sting if they miss the playoffs. Just miss the playoffs. I would say it's very disappointing watching Minton be already effective. Plus 15.

Offensively. Plus 15 on the year of this. I thought he would defend well and be smart and be in the right spots. There's lots of those guys in the league. But if he's going to be... But if he's going to score 25 goals and do that, that's really annoying. On the weekend, goal and an assist, tied the game late. Fancy Lawton.

The backhand driving hard to the net. Okay. Stollars played guys. Yes. That was a massive decision that we have yet to address. Have we ever really been like, I told you so on this program? Well, I did. Lots, yeah.

Here's another one then. I loved it. I said I liked it, so I'm an idiot. I'm the idiot. I'll eat it. But you guys are right. I just, it's just the percentages. That's all.

I like playing percentages. And being off that long and then coming in and watching rebounds, it's like a hot potato to goalies that haven't felt it in game situations. And I think it was the second goal. That's the goal. That's our goal you're thinking of. Yeah, the second goal where it's like, but since they signed you or traded for you,

I forget out of Florida, you never had a rebound like that. Right. Ever. Not like that. Kicked it into like the slot. Yeah. For no reason.

No, I mean, listen, you forgive a guy for being rusty, but it's not, he's a player. Of course he wants to go in. My one concern is like, there's the vibe and I said it, and I've heard other people now say it, like maybe he just didn't want to go play in the American League anymore. Maybe he didn't want to be in those games or something,

but I hope that's not sure. And I'm, and I shouldn't assume it is true. But I hope that's not true because that's not your call as a player. If the coach and the organization. Who's call? Well, the team, the Toronto Maple Leaf should say, well, that's what you're doing. You need conditioning. Jeff Barubis, do we have a Kipper's clip on that?

We have Stolars. We have Stolars. And we have Barubi on Stollars. Well, let's play, uh, the, let's play clip one from Stolars, Derek, on coming back to this specific games. Uh, yeah, I think, uh, we kind of had a plan, um, you know, around this time. and, you know, a few days ago, I started to feel really good. And obviously, having the opportunity to go down with the Marley's and get those full practices, you know, kind of a little longer than our practices are.

So just being able to go down there and work and get some reps, I think I felt really good after that. So I thought it was time to get activated and come back. But just why that came? That's the question. I don't know. I mean, you'll never, ever get, you can't replicate game situation. on top of the pressure of a game you've got to win. I mean, it's...

There's just a lot of at stake that now. It's crazy to think that you're going to go down to the Marley's, get a couple of shooting coaches on you, who probably like muffins beyond belief. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. No, I'm serious. No, but it is guys like me who do that shooting typically. I'm sorry.

You don't have an NHL shot, okay? I'm sorry, but you know what I'm saying. I do. And now you're going to be ready for Eichel, Stone, Anderson, Marner, you're ready, now you're ready for that. I mean, I don't get it. Didn't wall play Marley's games last year? You can't get a couple of game situations at that level?

That's all you can do. There's nowhere else for you to go. It just also, though, Kip, this Vegas game had stakes. People were paying attention, looking forward to it. It was a hotly contested ticket, you know, not contested, but sought after ticket. You know, I wonder if there's any thought about, sometimes when you have like a top prospect pitcher in your system

and you bring them up a little bit too early and you quote unquote, like you just don't want to waste any bullets in the minors because of the rampant Tommy John injuries out there that the Leafs look at it and they're like, well, he's going to get hurt. Let it be hurt on the Leafs. Like let him not go down there and get banged up. Let him get hurt there. So it doesn't cost me anything up here.

I don't know. Maybe they think that he was ready to go and they didn't want to waste any more time. I don't know. It's obviously played into their thinking. Why don't we listen to Barubi clip for? This is just post game. Post game on solar.

On Friday, yeah. Well, he was fine. I mean, you know, he probably wants a third one back. It was a tough rebound. But I don't think there's much he could have done any of the goals. I thought he got looked more comfortable and better as the game went along. And that's normal. Been out a long time.

Do you have the clip of him saying it would, Wasn't my call? No. No, I think that was in a conversation. Was it in a conversation? Yeah, with someone. It wasn't on camera. Okay, but that's on record, isn't it?

But I don't, I think it was, I'm not sure if it was about starting them or, hold on, let me just double check in there. You know. Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, I do. I heard the same thing. It's out there. And I heard it. But I, I don't want to, I don't want to bury, uh, chief on it.

If he didn't say it is exactly as I took it. Lance Hornby tweeted it. Yeah. said, by the way, Barubi was asked today why Rusty, like he stole ours didn't get a game or two enduring his condition, he's a stint with the Marley's, and he replied, that's not my call. So it's been reported. Okay, hold on for a second.

Hold on. Whose call was it? Did anybody follow up with that? To Barubi? Presumably, we assume it's the GM. Okay. So Brad made the decision. But it sounded.

Now, you said, you earlier in the program, you mentioned maybe Stolars. Having input. He would have had input on this. So that happens, right? Now, you don't find it odd that Craig Bruby publicly turns around and says, not my call. Now we assume it's either his general manager or if you have issues with it,

go see the general manager, go see Stolars. Maybe they made the call. Yeah. And I think if you're brewing, you didn't make the call. Yeah. Whether you agree with it or not, you say, well, it's just talk to someone else about it. That's not my thing.

You think that happens a lot with coaches that they turn around and they say it's not my call? Like, not when they're overly thrilled with the call, probably. That's not a good thing either. If he's not thrilled with a call and you pointed at your general manager, I don't know if that's a good thing either. You know what's worse in all this for me is that Wool went in the next game and he was disappointing. And so now there's a, what do you do now? Now with your goal-tending situation, I don't know who's going to start tomorrow night.

Going back to Stollars and say, find your way, kid. That's a good question. You know, you're playing the Buffalo Sabres in a game that's massive in the standards. Biggest game of the year by far. Yeah. Go, you go back to Stolley? Yeah. He's on your roster.

I know. I mean, he's on Hill to be. Well, he's been playing. Problem is he's been playing. That is completely double-downing on. It's not. It's not double-downing because they had a full practice. Stollars.

he played in the game. Like, if you're going to activate them and put them on your roster, if the other goalie doesn't play well, you've got to start the other goal, and you're going to start them. It hasn't played well all year. Stolars hasn't played well all year. Wall has played. Wall has saved you games.

Sure. Wall right now is the way better goalie and is the one that will give you the best chance to beat the Buffalo Sabers. Now, you want to save face, go to Stolars again. Okay, I agree with you. That's go bigger, go home. That's rolling the day. dice. But if you think Stollardustol Stardustle's stinks, then don't, why isn't Hill to be the other guy?

Starday Stollars feels like the blackjack theory that you keep doubling your bet till you win your money back. You lose, you double your bet, lose, double your bet. Yeah. The only part about it is whoever's making the decision is making millions of dollars. Right. We're not. Yeah. So we don't get to make it. I bet you stole our starts. You know, it's really tough when you talk about you when you're critical of goaltending in spots where they're clean looks. Like Brock Nelson shoots that first one in the net on a one-on-one. Like, it's a high danger shot.

Drury, Drury shirts that shoots that one in. It's a high danger shot. But at some point, I want one of those. And Lowe was actually good after that. On goal-tending the last few years. He was partially. But, yeah, like, the game's buried against the best team in the league. When it's 2-0-0-0. It was pretty much cooked.

It's over. It's over. You're back-to-back. You're tired. You're playing or whatever it was. Low-glove. Low-glove, clean look. They love low-glove. Everybody loves low-glove. It's the new hotness. Everybody shoots low glove. Last point here.

You're now six points back of the Pittsburgh Penguins, whose general manager, we all said sucks, and is now perfectly managing a rebuild while competing and keeping my favorite hockey player, Sidney Crosby, happy. And he's also having multiple pieces written about him how he's an awesome general manager.

And we all said he stunk. So I'm really happy to. But he did stink, Sammy. It wasn't that he didn't, he never stunk. He was bad back then. Let's give him some credit for maybe learning the trade and getting better and learning from his mistakes. And Pittsburgh's a better team right now, today, for it.

I'm not sure where it's going to be in a year or two, but I give him full credit here. Me too. For learning how to be a general manager, and it may take 10 years. This managing things generally seems like a fairly, Hard thing to do. Yeah.

And I think all we can do, I look at the Edmonton Oilers, and you got all these great pieces, and it's like, fill in at the edges, and you can win a cup. And they haven't. They have failed at doing that. I thought the Leafs did a pretty good job over the years with bringing in, whether it's O'Reilly and Achari and Lafferty's

and all these kind of guys that kind of cacha and kind of kept it close. But they didn't get the guys they needed to put them over the top. No argument from me on that. Here, you're not even getting the guys. is it keep you close. The fill in that the fringes have been more or less failures. And that's got you where you're at.

You know, it's, you're... I mean, he made the best trade of the year, Kyle Davis. What's on? Skinner. Skinner's on the fire right now. You know what his numbers are? He's got a 906 now. He's 231. But I think in his last, like, 938, 947, 912.

Did he send the tweet? Someone was like, he's a, if the Oilers need a goaltender, this guy, Stu Skinner could be. Perfect. He's like a 907. He's 2080s. He's been a big game experience. Is it the rookie Kindle?

Oh, Ben Kindle. Kindle. Justin Brazo. Brazo, they have those. Those are good pickups. Yeah. Those are solid pickups. Brzo's really good.

So that's just another add to the misery. It's been a miserable day. Miserable snowstorm yesterday. Leafs brutal. Just spring training still a month away. This was an all-time bad Leafs weekend. This is my nightmare. It really was.

Willie. you know, not being there. It was bad, but it was just the heart, the effort, the lack of, like, passion. I don't know. They're just, that Vegas game, should there have been some greater pushback Kip, fighting, physicality, jawing?

There was no contention in the game. Yeah, really disappointing. I don't know how you can be the same team that beat Colorado a week and a half ago. Yeah. Right? I guess no, I guess no, Willie hurts that bad,

but he was really good in that. game for them in Colorado. But yeah, I don't know. But they were good after Willie left too. Yeah, they're okay. No, no, I'm talking about the fight, the pushback, all of it. It shouldn't be Willie disappears and we get that on the weekend. Craig Brewy is a clip here on why the standard has slipped.

And I'd love to know the answer to that. Clip to. Don't have much time left, but go ahead. Yeah, we have time for it. I don't have that answer for you. I wish I did. It shouldn't. I mean, we've been a real good home team here for a long time.

this year, you know, and, you know, I remember the last road trip we went on and came back home. We were a little bit the same way. Kind of like in and out in the game's not quite detailed, not playing with the urgency that is needed and the simplicity that's needed. You know, that's something definitely I talked to the team about after the game. We got to fix it. A lot of people talking about his injury and, you know the internet, man. They're going to search now for whether or not it happened in the gym or not. No, no, Craig Brube.

Oh, yeah. 100% it was an accident in the gym. I think that pull down. There's no weight on it. That guy's as honest as they can be. There's no way he would make a story up. Not that, not Craig Brewby. I just want to know what in the gym happened.

It could be anything. It could be anything. I was to get someone running on a treadmill with a contraption. No, it's one of those bands that snap back. Oh, no way. Thank you.