Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Leave BC Stunned & Sore

Episode Date: March 6, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee get started with the Leafs' loss against the Canucks over the weekend, Ryan O'Reilly's injury and how Toronto finds continuity without him, Tyler Myers' hit on John Tavares and the two shorthanded goals conceded on the same powerplay. They also get into the idea of team accountability, how to fix Morgan Rielly and Matt Murray impressing in his first game back from injury. They are joined by Leafs' radio colour analyst Jim Ralph, who stresses patience when evaluating the new additions, the troubles on the powerplay and if Sheldon Keefe should explore 'load management' down the stretch (41:38). Finally, Senators writer for The Athletic Ian Mendes discusses the Ottawa's recent hot streak, what Jakob Chychrun adds on and off the ice and Tim Stützle's ascension (1:06:49). The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. And so the week begins. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Dirk Brandeo, David Siss-Boomba, Sammy McKee. Glad everybody's aboard for the next two hours as we continue the roller coaster of your Toronto Maple Leafs. Doesn't it feel like the Ryan O'Reilly trade with St. Louis was like a million years ago? Yeah, we were saying that the other day there were 18 guys in the lineup. He'd been on the Leafs longer than five of them you know he did he'd only played eight games or seven at the time but yeah and it's it's just the feel of this roller coaster of emotion yeah for Leaf fans and or Sammy where he's our barometer.

You, you, you feel great. You love the trades. You love the depth. You love the feel that this could be more of a playoff team than we've seen in the last five or six years. And

then you go into Edmonton and yeah that's just horrible they've looked right they were horrible in edmonton then you come back and you have a playoff kind of look it wasn't a great win but it was a a workmanlike mentality winning calgary yeah it's a road win they won in seattle oh yeah after the trade deadline right calgary was next calgary was next the third period there was apparently the best they'd ever been and you're talking about now guys starting to get to know each other and starting to feel good again and then you go on saturday night in vancouver could that have gone worse and now you've the roller coasters again kind, kind of. Low end. Maybe just stuck.

Yeah. You know how sometimes they leave them halfway up the hill? They got a big ladder out right now. It's like it's not moving and you're looking down and you're like, hey, buddy, you with that big stick, can you push it forward and get us up the hill? No. Like. It's going to be a wait to get up the hill again and that's for the fun part

where we are today or is it even worse feeling knowing that ryan o'reilly according to sheldon keith now out with a broken finger going on ltir we assume that probably a surgery will come into play in the next little while maybe let's be swelling down yeah most often not you gotta put a pin in something like that wasn't uh wasn't a wrist shot from you know someone else on the team it was a one-timed austin matthews kaboom unfortunately so yes i can see that happening okay before we dive into what this means for the toronto maple leafs let's go to sheldon keeper our first kippers clipper of the week give us an update on r o r uh he has a broken finger he'll go on l, you know, in terms of the full diagnosis and timeline,

we'll have a better idea of that. He's seeing a specialist, I think, as we speak, back in Toronto right now. So we'll know more about it there. But obviously, I'm not sure exactly what the LTI timeline is, but he won't be eligible for that period of time. We'll get him back up and running as soon as we can. That sucks. Four to six weeks.

Yeah. Kipper, can I ask you before we get any further into the show? What's going on with those headphones, buddy? Yeah. Mine blew up. Mine blew up. Are those elastic bands on there? What's going on?

These are, no word of a lie, Like four bucks at Dollarama. I'm the dinosaur. I can't believe you paid that much. Well, I didn't. I think my daughter had them in her room and I'm like, they're not being used. Yoink. Yeah. They really look like they're $4, don't they?

You pay her tuition. You're justified in taking those. Oh, my God. Ryan O'Reilly thing, though, if I may. You know what really sucks is the inability to I'm starting to look like what's her name from Star Wars? Princess Leia?

Don't I look like Princess Leia? I needed this today, boys. I'm getting rid of them now. You're really making me feel like conscientious of being a big loser right now. Whatever, you're really making me feel like conscientious of uh being a big loser right now whatever they're fine um do you want the big bucket headphones we can go to those a break

let's just take it to break plow on what sucks is that we don't get to see ryan the different the lines what they could look like you know the the big excuse right now is continuity and a lack of continuity and no one's played together before and it's all very new and yada yada and now you don't get to be in the formation for any length of time you're going to be figuring out one another in the playoffs so i think it's a bit of a bummer from that aspect there are some upside like o'reilly can at least rest his old 32 year old man frame now and you know try to be ready to go but it just stinks for figuring out lines and stuff no yeah no i get all of that i i just think when i watched even before ryan o'reilly got hurt like the mixing and the matching and the overthinking of what you can do

it's like you try to put every possible combination together in like a week yeah and i'm like just would you relax take a deep breath sheldon please yeah you know my son's never really had pop before we took him to the movies the other day. He was like, what kind do you want to try? And he was like, mix them all. Put them all in a cup. You know? That's your first mistake right there. I believe that's called swamp water.

It is. But it's like you never get to figure out what one of them tastes like. Or you could have done it. It's the metaphor. Our way, my way, is I told all my kids when they were really young that they're allergic to pop. And if they drink it they could die and they i kept them off it till about 10 or 11 when they figured out yeah dad's lying charlie's six you know he's still still just had his debut pop experience not long ago but that's a nice one i may lean on that it's just i i just i didn didn't, I just wish you would have left it alone.

And, you know, I remember vividly telling you the game in Buffalo where they were so good, Ryan O'Reilly, Tavares, and Marner. And I'm like, they have a couple more games like that. How can you split them up? And then the very next night they're not together and we know why because they wanted to get 34 going yeah right yeah they were for sure 34 was not happy they weren't probably happy with him they're like okay we going to put Marner, the whisperer with Matthews, and we'll get him going now. And I don't know.

It's just overthinking, like I said. Yeah, and like reach that conclusion really quick. They played that great game in Buffalo, and it was like, okay, we know we can count on that. What else do we have where it had only been a couple of games? You know, so yeah, you can quibble with that. I really thought 11-7 the second time was just too much you know too much inconsistency the pairs were all scrambled maybe the idea was going into it we'll see if anyone has this crazy wild natural

chemistry and we'll say okay well maybe those guys can work together in the end you just didn't get to see any real looks and you tried all the flavors of pop all at once yeah it just it really feels like over tinkering constantly it's like me trying to set my fantasy football lineup on a sunday morning just tinkering with it at all times oh maybe this would look good here i think you need to have some continuity and now it's gonna be impossible to get it because ryan o'reilly's hurt until probably game one right so it's gonna be really hard we'd said the best center depth in the league or some people had called it that and now they're out tavarez out o'reilly matthews took one off the knee god that would have hurt lafferty's playing center holmberg's back up things took a serious turn all right let's uh before we dive into anything deeper let's go to sheldon keep on also as jb

just mentioned moments ago tavarisavares out of the lineup. John's just not feeling himself today. Not feeling great. Wanted to skate and see exactly where he's at, and he got through it and was feeling a little bit better than he had thought. But I think just more so for him, out of an abundance of caution, we'll leave him out of the lineup for tomorrow and get him ready for Saturday. Is there extra concern because of the hits he took last night?

Well, I think you're a little bit more mindful of it, but there's more. I mean, there's a lot more. I mean, there's a bug going around. We've been traveling a lot, and there's lots happening there. So we just, again, want to be sure. He got through the entire practice today and felt good, but I think more so on our side of it than his. We just say, you know, let's

just be cautious on this one, and as long as he continues to progress well, he'll be ready to go for Saturday. Didn't he skate today and finish the skate? Yeah, he was on the ice. Usually you don't if there's a bug going around.

Well, that's, you know, I tweeted something about concussion, possible concussion for Devaras. Wears we're all like trying not to say it but like come on and not feeling great yeah is that the new term he's not feeling himself today he went out there to test it you don't go test a cold you don't go test you know a bug yeah you don't test that you test how your brain feels when you had it rattled really, really hard twice in a row the night before. I actually think the second hit probably doesn't happen if the first hit isn't as bad as it is. He got rocked. Like, what is he thinking?

He's going to go now. I know it hits in the league. He's the same across the middle as he used to. He's going to now, like, go toe drag in the middle of the ice. Really? John, really? Yeah, that's what he does. Yeah.

Well, he's got to stop. That's kind of his game. Yeah, it's no good. He's been toe-dragging his whole career. No good. No good. He got absolutely blown up. Tyler Meyer's best hit of his career.

But yeah, so it's like there's no doubt that's what they're waiting on with him now, in my mind. John's a very good scorer, but that's when you need a room strong enough to go up to john tavarez and say and maybe it was ryan o'reilly maybe that was the guy that was finally going to go up to a few of these guys and just say hey john we don't need the toe drag in the middle of the ice come on on, your buddy gets creamed. You're going to say, I think he learned, he figured it out there.

Right? You're not going to go up to pile on after he gets drilled. No, no, no. Okay, then the pass through the seam that got picked off for the shorthanded goal. Maybe, you know, there are times when you just got to not take a chance in the middle of the ice. Yeah. Sam said something earlier today where it was like, you know,

not saying this is the case, but like, do you think there's any chance they just want to get Tavares to step back and take a night off? Like, you know, almost like load management. Cause he got, I mean, he was terrible, you know, and it could be related to the hit that he took early in the game, but that's as bad a game as I've seen Tavares play. So that could be part of it where it's just like he's not 100%.

He's 90%. We would healthy scratch him if we could because he was that bad. But let's just give him a day here. Reassess. You know, I would think that you're almost on to something. And then there's the complete opposite where you watch saturday night austin go down and he's hurting yeah isn't that the time where you go all right we're up on tampa bay quite comfortably they they suck right now they they can't get it going. Like, why not just leave Austin in the dressing room the rest of the game?

Why bring him out at 75%? He's not skating well. You can tell he's laboring. But we're going to bring him back out because we dressed 11? Really? I think so. And O'Reilly left too right like they were down they would have been down to 10 so what finish the game with seven i don't care yeah i don't care

why why why bring him out you know it's the the thing where you'd ask the player if they're hurt and he probably says he's fine like and I agree that optically he's not fine. He didn't look good to me at all. Who, Matthews? Matthews. Can you hear me? Yeah. Oh, you can.

Okay, cool. Yeah. I just, yeah, the Tavares one, looking back on it, if you have that so-called concussion spotter or whatever, probably should have spotted him after that hit. What do you say you do here? Yeah, that, like, are you not around not around like how does he not get looked at and i think them probably a big part of them not saying this is a concussion is that he stayed in that he stayed and he played

the whole game yep and they're probably a little bit you know you think about the leafs as this forward-thinking franchise that doesn't make these kind of mistakes and thinks that they're, you know, the cat's meow when it comes to doing this kind of stuff. And having their captain play the full game with a possible concussion is a horrible look, and now they're trying to walk back. I mean, I don't want to make assumptions, but from a 10,000-foot view, seems like a pretty easy parallel to draw. Yeah.

I agree. No, I think it's a good point. I really do. It's unfortunate. It is. Sammy, you're 100%. It's just these mixed messages are just, yeah, it really lends to like, guys, come on.

Too emotional here? Are you just too emotional on all of it just take a deep breath yeah yeah you know like this is you know it's such a good point because if you're proactive with this stuff and you say we just didn't want john to play the rest of the game just in case he's fine no one bats an eye you know we're gonna get home ice advantage right and if you said hey you know why would we risk austin he took one in the knee we're just he's fine but we're gonna give him the rest we gave him the rest of the day it's fine but you're right there's this constant pressing i also like the fact that it challenges the rest of your lineup well now they're gonna be challenged right but in that moment i liked it i liked it

yeah no i i get that and i do you know i i think they they had needed to be proactive because even now still you dial this back and they've had some bad things happen it's not a major crisis for the leafs you mentioned in the playoffs we know they're playing tampa bay you know they'll probably get home ice maybe they won't but whatever you know like they'll probably get home ice. Maybe they won't, but whatever. You know, like they're going to have Tavares. They're going to have O'Reilly. It's okay. You just would have liked to seen a little more precaution, I think, on the Leafs behalf.

But again, dressing 11 handcuffed them, and that decision now looks not great. Yeah, they're five points up on Tampa, and they've played the same amount of games. By the way, in the last 18 games in Vancouver, the Canucks are 16-2 against the Leafs. That's remarkable. And, like, the Leafs have been good for seven years now.

That's with two dynamos offensively in Marner and Matthews. And the Canucks have stunk. That's honestly that if you're a Canucks fan, that's all you got. It's like you're just hanging. Youucks fan, that's all you got. You're just, you're hanging. You affected the course of the Leafs season. And yeah, it's like they get to. They keep this up. They win their Super Bowl every year there.

They, every year, the biggest team in the league goes in there and they get to chant Leafs suck and they win and they're all fired up. Now they're doing that little organ and they say Leafs suck. It's like, here they go. Who are they playing? Canucks keep this up. They're going to get their 7 p.m. local start on Saturday night. I don't know. That might be a step too far. Sports that's going

7 p.m. Vancouver time next Saturday night against the Leafs. Listen, I've been to a 4 p.m. Leafs game there. It's awesome. Oh, man. You go before Saturday night. Allie and's awesome. Oh, man. They got to go out that night, Saturday night. Allie and I went out for dinner after. We went to a party, and then we went to a bar after that,

all after the Leafs game. Every Saturday night hockey game should start at 4 o'clock. It's a great time for hockey. What an awful call. Tavares did manage to get a power play goal. There's the good news. Great finish. The bad news is he gave it right back.

Two shorthanded goals. Never been done before in Vancouver Canuck history, I think, on one penalty. And we're a bit of a broken record. How long have we talked about this power play that statistically is a top power play, but like we've been mentioning for a very long time that this power play, you can't trust it. You don't know what you're going to get with it. And Saturday night, it buried them.

Did it did bury them. They got one goal on it, but they give up two shorties going the other way. Again, Tavara is just not making good decisions after that. And I do it's related but you know again that's assumption but yeah I don't know Kipper like well I don't know what to even suggest differently just watching it it's just baffling like it was a different look having Nylander on that flank like they you know were at least in some different spots Gustafsson's getting time with the second group presumably

if they fall apart in postseason they're going to him like he'll get in if they're not scoring through a few games if it gets down to going to him it's over i mean he's he's produced on the power play for years it's the thing he can do maybe you go to seven at that point and he's just a field goal kicker he comes out in the power play and runs power play shifts so in the three games since the deadline the leafs have scored two two and one right they scored two against edmonton two against calgary and one on saturday against vancouver i like where you're going did they address the wrong thing like this is this just a cold stretch and like you're confident that the scoring is going to get back here but it's it has been very hard for them to you know score i

know that i know demko was good on saturday night but they had a lot of chances still i i don't know i just they're creating nothing at five on five it feels except dry at the moment offensively i think it's a huge concern so the last five remember the other day i talked about high danger chances they've had lots of games in the 20s and whatever the last five games are 5 10 1 7 6 like they're consistently high teens usually and just not creating anything the last five games the upside is that they're not trying to win regular season games where it's wide open against bad teams the hope is that the type of trying to win regular season games where it's wide open against bad teams. The hope is that the type of chances they create

are still getting created in the playoffs when it's harder to get somewhere. But I think the offense looks tough right now. Yeah, there is some expectation, I think, with Lafferty to come in and chip in with the odd goal here. Yeah, yeah. Well, they're giving him a look. Second line center with Willie Nylander today.

Willie Nylander, Lafferty, and Yarncroft, I believe. Yes. I don't expect a lot of Harlem Globetrotters tic-tac-toe passing on that line. Yeah. I think it's too early right now, but I get what you're saying. It seems like an ongoing thing, secondary scoring. That's what we're talking about. Yeah, and they're not even going to get a ton of top-end scoring, are they?

I know Marner's had some good games, but we do have Keefe on the power play, which we were just talking about. I want to stick with that for a little while. Go ahead. Come out in the third period in the power play, scores you a huge goal, gets you going in the game, and then obviously lets you down the next time out. So you're torn on that one. You do want to see your power play come through in those moments,

and it did in the first one. And then now we have a chance to really take hold of the game, and we failed to execute on that. So in that case, their best players were better than ours there. You know, like I said, you're torn on it because they did score us a big goal. I don't know. You give up two shorties and be torn on your power play. That's pretty definitive for me.

You got asked post-game about potentially taking those guys off after you give up your first shorty yeah it was 15 seconds in and he bristled at it he's like no no no or whatever you know they just scored us a goal would you have ever considered stripping them off i think it's a really good question you know i have no problem with him saying you know it happens there are guys we went back with them but not a lot of message sending to the guys like we you know we were going to talk about john cooper i know benching his big guys i don't know kept you yeah uh it just seems that there's a whole philosophy i think that's driven from kyle and and then the trickle-down effect to Sheldon

is that you don't browbeat these guys. You don't embarrass them. You don't bench them for prolonged periods of time. And I don't know whether or not it'll eventually catch up to you. And, you know, is that the difference between between cooper and and sheldon is that cooper can go to stanley cup champions and proven character guys and still send like a really big message and you can't send a message to that power play that gave up a first shorthanded goal. I mean, I would have.

I wouldn't have put them back out there. I wouldn't have. Again, it's the Vancouver Canucks. I think a message would have been better than even squeaking out a 4-3 win in overtime or, you know, it just, the bigger effect would be that this is unacceptable than even finding a way to come back and win particularly a message to the new guys you have five or six new guys in your lineup like not a bad time to say hey you know we're all accountable here do we want

to listen to john cooper's quote now just to get a contrast for the way that keith has gone about it or do you want to say no it's good timing okay let's listen to cooper and get him on you know their team who yeah you know as coaches you got to put your team in the best position to win you know 99.9 of the time those guys give us the best chance to win when they're on the ice just felt in the third period they weren't giving us the best chance to win and you know this this team's been unbelievable for a decade. And you take the three finals. Well, there's a reason a lot of that's happened. We have a set of standards here that everybody adheres to.

And it's not pick and choose. It's everybody. And so it's how it was for today. And like I said, those guys are an extremely important part of our team. But, you know, for 20 minutes tonight, I thought the other guys could get it done. And you know what? They almost did.

That was after they lost to Buffalo on Friday night. And they benched Kucherov, Stamkos, and Point. He's so good. The whole period. He's so good that he can send that message, he can embarrass the crap out of them, and still have a big picture without totally burying them. He didn't bury them.

He actually paid them a compliment somehow, some way. You bench your star players, and you find a way to keep it real yeah he doesn't bury what they've done in the past he doesn't bury their character he actually empowers their character with his post-game comments but do you feel differently that the stars didn't respond like the next game they went out and got shelled against Carolina. I think, first of all, there's no guarantees on anything. What you want to do, regardless of the results, immediate results, is just make sure you're consistent with that message. And I think you can't go wrong.

Whether or not they responded or not, to me, is irrelevant. You're consistent with your your theories your beliefs your philosophies and that to me is is the number one thing yeah and he says you can't pick and choose even your star players future hall of famers you can't pick and choose i watch the leafs they look like a team that picks and chooses when they want to go, when they don't want to go, when they're feeling good, when they're not feeling good. I would say that the one way that they're consistent is almost nobody ever

is held accountable for poor play. Like you'd see Engvall once in a while get bumped down or pulled out. Outside of that, like almost never. And there is one instance going on right now where Michael Bunting has been dropped in the lineup. That's a rare case for me of them saying someone's not playing good enough, but Bunting's had to play kind of not great

for a pretty good stretch here. See, for me, again, to draw the comparison to, say, Cooper to Keefe is that okay it's it's still michael bunting so find a an equivalent to bunting like hagel in tampa if you benched hagel would it raise eyebrows no no so i watch morgan struggling guys morgan riley is a star player who is struggling you want to make a statement bench him yeah it's interesting he is like we we don't talk about him a ton in that way it's like he's just assumed to be the guy who's going to play 24 minutes regardless of his play.

You know, you got 9D now, you're right. There's certainly the opportunity to send some sort of message. So, let's follow it up with Sheldon Keefe and his comments on the play of Morgan Rallycat. I think I liked his game the other night.

He hasn't scored the game-winning goal, but it's his initiative to jump in the rush the way that he did in Calgary that is the difference that ends up helping us win that game. And I thought he had some good moments there. I think he's got more and he's got more to give and can play better like a lot of our guys can. Yeah. He's hesitant though, right?

He's like, ah. And it's almost as if you hear that and he's encouraging him to jump up on the rush i i think his decision making on jumping up on the rush is he's not been very good all season long it's just when it just seems when he zigs the play zags watch one of the shorthanded goals he he wants to create motion for the sake of creating motion not for the power play yeah yeah not not methodically and reading the tea leaves on what it could do or how it can open up he just wants to go for the sake of going and i i for whatever reason he's really lost his sense i think for for picking and, he's really lost his sense, I think,

for picking and choosing. He's forcing plays that aren't there. And I think they're going to have to find a way to get this guy going. There's no way that they're going anywhere without Morgan Riley playing like a guy that they wanted and envisioned when they signed him to a seven and a half million dollar contract for what seven years yeah yeah no i listen he's a huge part of it and even with the new d it's like it all kind of hinges on him being a guy who's able to handle a big chunk of minutes and i look back to the however long he was hurt the earlier in the year where they had

literally their best stretch of defensive hockey they've ever played in this era of leafs hockey you know now they i can't i can't yeah not remember that i wonder if they would consider what we're talking about here if you want to hold someone accountable what would it look like if they if riley doesn't play and they they're deadly defensively again you know you're probably scared of that give you something to think of for sure yeah not not been great for him so they got him they got him paired with lilligran today at practice right so mckay brody giordano hall gustafson and timmons out shen is uh he's having a baby so probably his wife is doing that part of it but he's around somewhere i would imagine that's probably in the lineup that would probably be his absence right

lilligren he can help riley don't you think a little bit no i don't know i just i'm surprised he's been i don't mean to be a cynic and i don't want to be negative about all this stuff but like i don't you don't, you know, like, he's fine. He's fine. He's fine. But, like, Riley seems to need someone to play defense for his pair. Because he doesn't really do it. It's frustrating.

How many messages have you gotten in the last two weeks about Riley to the wing? I have been getting that DM and that text and that message. Yeah, stop with that, whoever you are. Enough. It's a classic. This is, we've done this before. Yeah. Cabriolet.

We should play forward. Jake Gardner should play forward. Every time the Leafs have an offensive defenseman, they say he should play forward. It's a very popular take. No disrespect to anyone, but that's like a... Morgan has to just find his game so he can look like the Toronto Maple Leaf

number one defenseman. Yes, that's what they need. Go move him up to the wing and then tell me who the Leafs number one, two, or three defensemen are. Yeah, make your number one D-man your fourth line winger or whatever. You know?

Second line winger if you're crazy. I just, and again, I know you guys, like Jake McCabe, to to me i like him but i just don't know with the struggles of morgan riley if that was a big enough upgrade for for that blue line yeah i really like him as you know and and sam does too um but certainly that's within the context of expectations and what we expected from him not that he's suddenly going to be a guy like at home who is a you know a tentpole part of a franchise or whatever i do i mean nice to have someone who will go fight a giant like tyler myers uh in an instant like that but more

than that it's jumping up and playing and my job as a general manager is to find that guy and not give up a first round pick for him i mean kipper we kicked around a bajillion names if you could find that guy more power to you but we didn't have one in mind that was available that what are you talking about well outside of spending the after ryan o'reilly trade they're not gonna well go ahead no you could have you could have yeah you could have found a way to go get chicken too you just chose not to yeah the whole idea was to spend less yeah for mccabe and find a way to look after next year because he's got him at $2 million next year and not give up the assets. I think it's a salary cap thing,

right? Like they, the Arizona coyotes did not seem willing to eat any money or to take contracts back. He makes 4.6. They get McCabe for two. Like it's a matter of puzzle pieces, I think more than.

Yeah. But you had two months to figure out the puzzle pieces. If that was, yeah. Yeah, if you decide that's your priority for sure. The last little while. Well, but we sat here too, Kip, and said that there was holes everywhere. You know, we wanted a top six forward. You wanted, I don't know, it wasn't going to be an all-star team in the end.

And maybe they made the wrong gamble here. I just, I think back made the wrong gamble here. I just think back to a week ago today. Yeah. And the excitement after we made the McCabe-Lafferty trade, and they got all they got. It's just a lot of curse and crap, and Leaf fans deal with more than anything else.

Conversations going on in the past couple days. I also think if we're sitting in here after the Calgary game. I'm not usually this guy. Yeah. But. Listen, it's going to be a roller coaster from here on in because we know what it's like in this market. They lose. It's the end of the world.

They win. Plan the parade. There's no in between. I was getting texts after the first period against the Canucks about how this is what the Leafs fans have always wanted the Leafs to be. They had just rolled the flames. They looked great in the first against Canucks, I thought. And people are going, they can score.

They can hit now. They've got edge. They're fun to watch. And two periods later, and it's Meltdown City. So I'm not full panic on the Leafers here neither am i yeah i don't not even close they find a way to have an incredible effort tomorrow night against new jersey which no ryan o'reilly i mean we know they're overwhelmingly against it tomorrow night like they have no business winning tomorrow night if they somehow find a way to

muster a character effort without even needing to win the game but this team is fast new jersey yeah and i think they can win some people back coming off of uh that game saturday night but yeah they're gonna have to they're gonna have to they're they're going to have to man up here Tuesday and tomorrow night. For sure. I think a lot of where the sky is falling comes from is that a lot of these nations are sick of seeing the top guys not perform against bad teams. Like, this is another situation.

I put in the lineup here, but we're updating the worst stat in the world. Records versus the NHL's bottom six teams this season. Bruins, 10-1-0. Lightning, 10-0-2. Leafs, 5-5-2. It's just like when you constantly play down to your opponent when you're supposed to be a cup contending team, people get pissed off. And rightfully so. Yeah.

Like, Saturday night, you know, it doesn't really change my, you know, overall thoughts on if they can beat Tampa in the first round or whatever. Like, I have no idea. But it just sucks to watch them lose to a crappy team when you've made all these moves and it still looks the same.

That's what sucks. And I think it's fair for people to be feeling pissed off. Like, it's not the end of the world, like I said. But it's annoying that they always do this. Yeah. Despite the loss Saturday night, we got Matt Murray back in that. So I'll throw this out to both of you real quick here.

Give me a quick answer. Who's the goalie tomorrow night? Samsonov. I think it'll probably be Samsonov, but I wouldn't mind it being Murray. You? Not as easy and quick on a decision after I saw Matt Murray Saturday,

and I thought he was really good. I thought he gave him a chance. Didn't have too many opportunities on goals that I thought went in. They were like perfect shots, two-on-ones. Yeah, the one breakaway goal. I didn't love his whatever, but it's a breakaway goal, so I'm not going to blame him.

Who's the two-on-one where he got the toe on it? I know you didn't. Well, Lainan didn't finish. Well, Lainan didn't get the puck up, but even to put yourself in a position, I think, to have a leg over there yeah i listen he as long as he's healthy he's gonna keep himself in the mix i think here whoever plays best in the next six weeks will start game one okay it didn't feel like that a week ago

no samson off it didn't a hundred percent it felt like saturday night may have changed a little bit of a feel on goaltending a lot of it for me is just can he be available like because you know when they're both healthy they were both very good pushing each other sharing the load i don't even mean the next six weeks the last three weeks whoever's better's better. See, I was just going to say, I mean, there's a part of me that wants to throw Matt Murray right back in there tomorrow night. But then if you factor in his last start and Wall was in there and then they don't play again until Saturday. It's now in the really extended. It's an extended time frame.

We were worried about Samsonov's time. The amount of games he was playing though. Yeah, but you don't want him too far away from a next start. Right. So that might be the only reason they want to get Samsonov back in there. But I thought, again, if all things being equal and you just assume that Matt Murray's healthy, that was the type of effort that says, okay, this is why we got him.

To me, that was by far the biggest positive from that game on Saturday night is that he got through that game, made some great saves, like you said, but not even on the stretch, just like looks solid. Puck was hitting him like he was moving around well. fact and guys crashed it is that a little bit he had to really push off from both sides he looked like a healthy nhl goalie and he played pretty well they hung him out to dry those two shorties i'm not gonna kill him much for those ones but that to me is by far the biggest positive from saturday night yep no he looked good that's uh but here's the right direction i i don't trust it at all no in terms of health like i don't know how anyone could that's like that's the whole thing

with us talking about the trade deadline and talking about getting a goalie sure he looked great on saturday and i'm really excited that he did and it's really hopeful that he can keep going but this man gets hurt in morning skate well but a pulled groin or rolling over that high ankle sprained uh he had plenty of opportunity to do that saturday night feels like it's on a knife's edge on a couple of those stretches i know listen i'm excited and happy you seem time but there's been a track record here that's all i'm getting at the only thing is, shorthanded. You put Samsonov in there. He gets blown out tomorrow night.

I would worry about his psyche a little bit. Yeah, I just feel like you can't protect him, though. Like, you got to, if you can't handle it, then we need to know that you can't handle it. Like, go play the games. We're not, you're going to have to play in Tampa Bay. I thought that's, what what 63 games were for well so then why skip this one you know why say he's not able to play this one for his fragile psyche we don't know yet i'm you throw him into the fire so you do know i like my

i like murray again tomorrow night i'm on team murray for tomorrow night get him back yes get him back in there yeah see what happens all right we're gonna take a quick break Jim Ralph Toronto Maple Leaf radio color analyst and a good friend of the show he's gonna come back after the break tell us what life with Ryan O'Reilly will be like for the Toronto Maple Leafs we'll also get his thoughts on on Matt Murray and his effort Saturday night in the next hour Ian Mendez is to come back all of a sudden ottawa senators one of the hottest teams they're great i guess could it be possible that ottawa catches tampa bay don't say it don't say it hot chuck we'll ask i was about to leave i was about to leave to go to the washroom but But I came back. Why?

Honestly, this is going to sound crazy, but playing an ice-cold Tampa team versus a red-hot Sens team that's going to come in, I might rather take Tampa than that Sens team. Out of his mind. He's out of his mind. You held a piss to come back and say that. You know why? Because the Leafs have found new ways to disappoint their fans. Losing to an upstart Ottawa team in the first round

would be the worst thing in the world. I think you'd genuinely lose a lot of fans. Okay. Anyways. Take your headset off. I'll take a leak. We're going to come back. Plenty more Real Kipper and Bourne.

Right. Everything you need to know about the Blue Jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. Toronto Maple Leafs getting ready to get right back into it tomorrow night in New Jersey.

Waiting on Jim Ralph. to get right back into it tomorrow night in New Jersey. Waiting on Jim Ralph. He'll calm everybody down. Is that right? Yeah, for sure. He's the voice of reason. Soothing. Has anyone ever called you that before, Ralphie?

The voice of reason? Not in either marriage. I know that been quite the roller coaster a since the big trades for the toronto maple leaves everybody wants to believe they're better deeper tougher a couple of hiccups in edmonton and vancouver now uh how long is it going to take without Ryan O'Reilly now for the rest of the team to prove that they are deeper despite the broken finger for O'Reilly?

I think you've got to give it a couple of weeks. I mean, the Rangers lose two in a row with Patrick Kane in the lineup. I mean, right now, Dimitri Orlov and Shane Goss' pair look like the best pickups. And I don't know if we're going to be saying that, you know, for all these teams by the time you hit the playoffs.

So, you know, I think disappointing because, you know, the Vancouver game, you thought, I know Joe and I said just at the start of the broadcast that, you know, you hope the headlines aren't same old Leafs after the game in Vancouver. And I know that's the consensus, but I think, you know, when you make so many changes, to expect that everything to click and be rolling right away is probably a little bit unrealistic. And so, you know, we start kind of going around the Leafs roster and going, who's looking good, who's looking not as good.

They got Alex Kerfoot up with matthews and marner um bunting has been bumped down to the old holmberg and steve's line what are your thoughts and what's going on with those with the wing position yeah well i i think it sort of stays in with what shell and keep was saying you know when they made the deals that he wants to experiment and try all kinds of different combinations so that, you know, obviously with O'Reilly out of the lineup, you know, you're going to have to be a little more creative in trying to solidify things. Although Keith did say that he thought that, I think it was in the Vancouver game, that he thought Kerfoot was one of the better players

and that he had been better than Bunting of late. So I think it's not quite benching your top three forwards in the third period like Tampa did. But it probably sends a message that there are certain expectations if you play with certain players. Ralphie, when you look at the Toronto Maple Leafs and all that talent, you just assume that, okay, maybe it's not McDavid,

but certainly it should be one of those power plays that every team looks at and says boys we got to stay out of the box we got to take any dumb penalties they're going to bury us and some nights it looks that way and then some nights it looks like the power play is burying themselves. And that happened Saturday night. What do you make of it? Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, when you watch the highlights and you watch Boston and how they scored in the power play or Tampa when they're on, it's all these scene passes that get through.

And I like the Tavares goal in Vancouver Saturday. And you just don't see that many opportunities that are like that, where you've got either the little bump pass in the middle where Braden Point seems to score all his power play goals. But I think the one thing that has always hurt the power play is there hasn't been that big shot, the big one-timer. Whether it's Ovechkin, Kucherov, Stamkos, Pasternak, guys that make a living off that on the power play.

So to me, it just seems that if that threat's gone, then all teams do is take away the seam pass. And that's, to me, what the Leafs seem to have troubles with, is they, you know, struggle to get that guy in the perfect spot. And there's a lot of outward passing or outside passing to try to find it. But, you know, without that big blast, you might have to go back to,

whether it's Dion Phaneuf or Brian McCabe, that far back to when the Leafs had that weapon. Ralphie, what are your first impressions of the three new defensemen for the Leafs? You've got Jake McCabe, Luke Shen, and Eric Gustafson. McCabe and Shen, I think, have been really good. Gustafson, I don't think you've noticed as much. Obviously, I think because of the familiarity with Luke Shen,

you're watching him a little closer, but you like the fact that McCabe jumps in after the Myers hit on Tavares. Shen, I think you know exactly what you're getting and he's delivered. So I think they're going to get better as well, Borny. Now, Kipper, you ever get traded midseason? Beginning of the season to the Rangers at end of October, but not necessarily late. Okay, but what was it like for you to acclimate yourself and the new teammates and everything?

Because, I mean, I got sent down midseason, but I never got traded. So I know the disappointment that went with that. But I'm just wondering from your standpoint, how difficult is it moving to a new organization? Yeah, I think it takes some time for sure. And if you've been around long enough, there's always like two or three guys that you know,

either you've skated with in the summer or you kind of just lean on a little bit more than others. But come on, I got traded to a room that I've never met Mark Messier before or Kevin Lowe, future Hall of Famers, arguably one of the best teams in the history of hockey out of Edmonton. I mean, it was incredibly intimidating. So how long did it feel for you? And this isn't being smart.

It's more of a curiosity. Yeah, I mean, weeks. Definitely, you know, four weeks, six weeks. When you could really feel like you could be yourself around these guys. Yeah, that's probably what it's going to take for these guys as well. I mean, you know, McCabe comes in with Lafferty and they haven't even been to Toronto yet to see the practice facilities or where they're going to live.

I imagine it's going to be hotel life for the rest of the season. So I think even though everybody wants that instant karma and everything to connect, I think there's that human element that it's going to take a while before you're actual brothers and you're in the same mindset and have the same goals. Yeah, absolutely. That is an area you want to peak at the right time, they always say,

and this is not necessarily the time you want to peak in. Let's face it, Toronto and Tampa Bay both not peaking right now, but they did get Matt Murray back. What were your thoughts on his first return to the crease in six weeks? Well, I mean, unfortunately, I mean, they only gave up about 20, 22 shots, something like that. So the save percent doesn't look good. It dings the goals against the average up a bit.

But he ended up, you know, on his shots, faced way more odd man rushes than Denko did, I think, other than, what was it, the Nylander breakaway in the first period. Leaves didn't have a lot off the rush. And, you know, I thought he was solid. You know, I think, you know, Patterson's goal, you know, a little shoulder deke,

and then everything opened up down low, he just stuffed a five-hole. If you get another big save there, and that's, you know, asking a lot. After he stopped a two-on-one, the breakaway in the second period. But if you get another save, you probably get something out of the game. But first, first game back in a couple of months, I thought he looked okay. We're talking to Jim Ralph, Toronto Maple Leaf color analyst. Ralphie,

you've covered this team for a long time. You've seen Morgan Riley right from being drafted to where we are today. When he's at his best, what works for him? And when he struggles, what doesn't work for him?

I think it's the both. i think it's decision making you know you know you see you know he makes the right play jumping of the plane calgary and ends up setting up the winning goal by yarn crook and you know then you see some some poor decisions now i think if you go back to the the-goal season he had, I'm pretty sure Ron Hainsey was his defense partner for most of that season. And that's why, in my mind, if I remember that correctly, Luke Shen might be the better complement for him. And they have had time on the ice together, but I think you need a stay-at-home guy. And, you know, a lot of times, too,

the forwards have to be more aware of when Riley jumps up into the play. You know, there's got to be better communication there as well. But to me, it comes down to decision-making. You know, sometimes, you know, when he does the right thing at the right time, everybody says, boy, what a great defenseman he is. And, you know, when the decisions are bad and they end up in your net, you're saying, what is he doing jumping up into the play? You know, when you've got a one-goal lead or you're tied in the third period.

And I think that's, you know, the balance that he struggles with sometimes. So we've seen them try to get all the new D and once going 11 and seven, a couple of times in a row. Do you think that's a viable option for them in playoffs given they have 90? Oh, I hope not. I mean, I think, and I am coaching staff the same, you know, you want to, you want to get guys on regular shifts and you know,

I think it might've been more just to get all the defensemen, get some reps in and make some assessments. But I think Luke Shand himself, he was, I think, 10 minutes the first game against Calgary and then up a little bit, 12 minutes against Vancouver. You know, for guys that are used to 18 to 20 minutes of ice time a game, I think it can get difficult on them. But, you know, they come in and they've got three games and four nights right away.

So I guess you understand it to a certain extent. But I think I prefer the little more traditional approach of 12 and 6 once you hit the postseason. Would you give Mark Giordano a day off? No, let me rephrase that. Would you force himordano a day off? No, let me rephrase that. Would you force him to take a day off? Yeah, I think I would. I think he's been fantastic.

I just think that all the extra minutes he played early in the season with the injuries they had and everything else um you know i just think uh 38 year old body could you know use a little bit of downtime getting to the postseason so uh but you're right that that might be a tough conversation to tell him that you want to take him out of the lineup for his own good um that that that might be a rather fiery conversation to have what have you made of uh shon Keefe's ability to handle sort of the new lineup, the new guys, the way they've gone out introducing everyone, putting O'Reilly in the top line, 7-D and all that sort of stuff?

Well, it looked great in Buffalo. Sure did. Yeah. That's when you're going, I remember going in that game, I don't know, wouldn't you prefer him in your third line? And then he's got three in the first period, and you're going, yeah, no, that was the right call. But like you said, I mean, he said, and this was right from the trade

to get O'Reilly and Achari right off the bat, said we're going to do a lot of experimenting. So I never really looked at anything as being set in stone, but sort of a fun time to experiment and see what clicks and what doesn't. Ralphie, coming off that game Saturday night in Vancouver, is the wish list good for, would Sheldon be looking forward to the challenge of facing a New Jersey team, probably the fastest team in the league right now,

without the likes of O'Reilly or Tavares? Like, would you welcome that, or would you be almost nervous about an outcome coming off a tough loss in Vancouver? Well, I'm not going to pat myself on the back, but I said before the game in Edmonton, I said to Joe, I said, I can feel a blowout coming. You know, but just because of all the changes were made

and the excitement, I said, this is going to be like 7 o'clock on Christmas Day for the kids, you know, where everything's starting to wear off, all the newness, and you've got to readjust mentally. But you know what I would do on Tuesday is if Joe Wall's still with the team, I'd start Joe Wall. Interesting. I really liked him in the game in Calgary.

I know he didn't get a lot of shots, but he looked square. His rebound control was great. His positioning was good. And, you know, with the health of Murray, and if you have any question marks about Samsonov, I know he didn't go out and make a deal for a goaltender at the deadline,

but I'm thinking, is this possibly Felix Pogban? Or, you know, even go Jordan Biddington or whoever, but somebody that might be able to get hot at the right time and mesh nicely with that team. Just as an option, but I'd really like to see him play. I think so far he's had, what, Columbus, Montreal,

and now Calgary, so there's only three starts. I'd love to see him play against a team like New Jersey. You really think with 19 games to go, there's a chance that you can have all three guys feeling good enough to think that they can go in there and win? No, I'm thinking you just need one. And who is that? Who is that, Ralphie?

The right one. But like I said, I mean, it's, you know, they've only got one game this week. But, you know, you get to the point, you know, later on in the month where you're playing a lot of games. And, you know, you might be able to put it in that way. But I was just really impressed, you know, with the way he handled himself

and the boys in confidence. He got better every game. He lost to Columbus and then he's given up one goal in his last two starts. That's one of those things. Like I said, the Jordan Biddington story was so great. He wasn't expected to be the guy

when he gets called up in St. Louis and goes on a roll. But that's all you need is that one guy to catch fire for you. Let me ask you a question about a different team here. The Tampa Bay Lightning struggling. You know, you mentioned the sitting of the top guys, but I'm more interested in just kind of what's going on. I think they've got five straight losses, 27 goals against over that time.

Do you make anything of it should Leafs fans get all excited no I think uh no I if that's uh let's hope that uh the excitement isn't just about Tampa losing in March you know they uh I will say this I mean they're they're too good a team you know they've been that group has been to enough adversity. And, you know, they win a cup when Stamkos plays one playoff game. I mean, they face their share of adversity. So I think, you know, maybe you'd want to start game one tomorrow. But for the most part, I think they'll be fine. Although I

did then talk to my son about after the benching Saturday in Buffalo, I said the key is usually the next game. You know, how they respond. And four shots out goal in the first two periods made you kind of think, you know,

maybe there's problems a little deeper than what we're privy to. Yeah. Ralphie, really appreciate your time. Thanks for doing this, pal. Well, I got nothing to do, but thank you. Thanks, Ralphie. Getting ready for the big Jersey Leaf tilt tomorrow night.

Jim Ralph, radio color analyst for the Toronto Maple Leafs. Okay. He wants Leafs. Okay. He wants Wall in. Yeah. He does. Now, he was hurt a good portion of this season. Last season he was hurt a good portion. Last season he was? Yeah, I think he's been fine this year.

He's been fine this year. Yeah. But he's played 18 games total this season. That's not many. Nope. Not at all. It's seven for the Leafs and I think maybe 11 for the Marlies, if that math adds up. Why? I just think he has been up and down, backing up here at times, getting in sometimes.

See, I... Maybe there's some injury in there. And I haven't seen a lot of him, but I can tell you he's quieter than Samsonov for me. I like him too. I just feel you he's quieter than Samsonov for me. I like him too. I just feel like it's too late to be like, let's hope we hit a, you know, like hope the mystery box becomes Marty Broder. It just feels, I'm not saying he's not going to be something.

The mystery box. Well, that's it. That's why people are excited about it. And they're like, yeah, I'm worried about these two. Maybe this guy is. I definitely, to Ralphie's point, find another start or two for him. Just in case. What if he's great?

I guess that's good. Yeah, that's good. Then the leash becomes shorter for others. Yeah. Just in case. Murray, I don't know. something eating cereal in the morning i have had a lot of people so i have been i would say on this show i have been the biggest skeptic of the goaltending at least in murray's case um so i've got a lot of messages about wool and like his ahl numbers and how great he's been

for the leafs so far this year and my my hesitance is just i don't want to put this whole thing you've built on a guy who's never felt the pressure he's never played in the league aside from seven starts just too much for me it's a pressure cooker a lot for binning him too a few years ago that st. Louis is... I know. They were the worst team in the league and they got hot. I'm just throwing spaghetti on the wall here. It's not impossible.

It has happened to that point. The Leafs have two NHL goalies. Yeah. That's how I see it too. Probably better than the wall. But maybe. But maybe. better than wall but maybe but maybe um so could it be that that the guys in tampa are kind of taking it on the chin for a and doug mclean mentioned it last

friday that's a left ski has not been good and continue you've learned oh please every time i mention it you're like don't believe it we've all learned not to be an idiot here and underestimate him. But, and you know, the other one is Sterkin. Remember, lifetime goals against save percentage of like 935 khl nhl and then looks awfully human at 9 10 yeah it makes a big difference to what the rangers are when they just have average goaltending you know like they're loaded offensively but from from sports that stats um excellent twitter fall the most goals against per game among nhl teams currently in a playoff spot the kings are first at 3.34 oilers second at 3.31 penguins 3.19 kraken and then the tampa bay lightning with 3.808 i haven't getting buried i actually got in a

scrap with david amber about this uh earlier the week. Did he kick your ass? Because he's a genius muscle. You fought him? Jesus, how are you okay? Actually, you know, DA, if you're listening, I don't know who would win in a fight between us. I know DA can bench me several times, but. Wow, you're challenging DA to a fight?

One of those guys, Amber, where he looks really tough, but he's not. Whoa. DA taking it on the chin here. Whoa, i will not agree with that um um but hold on i just wanted to say the verbal spat that we had was that i mentioned the tampa bay d pair which we've talked about in the show yeah right now it's headman perbix okay bogosian and sergachev you know great and uh flurry and cole hayden flurry and ian cole you know, great, and Fleury and Cole. Hayden Fleury and Ian Cole. You know, I'm not saying they're going to beat Tampa or Tampa's bad. I'm saying if that was the Leafs D, you'd go, boys, I don't know about.

My lips are sealed, young man. And they have not replaced Brian McDonough, who's really good for them. Yeah, and they tried to get another D-man at the deadline by all accounts, and they just didn't have the assets. You know, I'm just saying we would be frustrated here in Toronto. Janot really did a number of old... Was it Riley? Was Stillman?

Was Stillman's first name? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Oh, Janot. You bring in Hagel for Palat, whoat who's by the way really good for them too palat was oh yeah and he's good for steady right now jersey yeah jersey will benefit now from here on and he's healthy he's back in the lineup palat is going to bring so much to that team i think down the stretch are pretty significant but they are McDonough are pretty significant. But they are significant.

Players for them. And if Vasilevsky wants to be not the best goalie in the world, that would be helpful for the Leafs. But, you know, the Leafs got to get it sorted out themselves. I'm just saying the other team is not perfect. Before we go to break, boys. Looks a little bit more balanced today, though. Does.

Before we go to break. Yes. Just got to get some contest stuff in here. Ooh, do it. What do you got, Sammy, for us? Are we eligible? This is the first time this year. Can I win tickets?

No. You can't. You cannot. You can probably just buy them, Kip. The Molson Canadian wants to give you and a friend the ultimate hockey fan experience through their Molson Canadian rivalry train contest. This includes a round-trip train fair

from Toronto to Ottawa to see your Leafs take on the Sens April 1st, their first round matchup against the Ottawa Senators. This will include food and beverage at the game as well as an overnight hotel accommodation. To enter, all you have to do is tune in to Real Kipper and Born every day this week and listen for the code word,

then text 590590. Today's code word is... Whale's vagina. Today's code word is then text 590-590. Today's code word is... Whale's vagina. Today's code word is Molson. Text Molson to 590-590 right now for your chance to win. We have another code word for tomorrow's episode, so be sure to tune in. And of course,

you must be 19 years older to enter. Awesome. Can I pick the code words this week? You cannot i'm gonna say no all right well we're gonna bring ian mendez after the break and he's gonna t up ottawa for those tickets love it all of a sudden ottawa senators on fuego on fuego yeah they uh what are they i mean they've won five in a row but it's been going on longer than that they're now three points out of a playoff spot i know there's some games that they shouldn't have traded philip goths to soon though that's a bad move by

ever since he's killing it brady kuchuk single-handedly uh killed detroit's season yes yeah he did they're talking a lot about ownership in ottawa but he could check on the owner of the detroit red winds he is uh yeah detroit just battered just got beat up by philly last night they're cooked brady did it how about uh tim stitzel oh my god what a player he's turned into. No, he's in the elite fun-to-watch group. It's like him and Makar and some of those guys that are just so fun to watch. Most talented centerman in Ontario, you think? How dare you?

Sammy, did he pass Austin? No. Good Lord, no. Okay, we'll ask Ian Mendez. Let's go to break. Come on. All right, all right. Go take another leak, Sammy.

Ian Mendez, after the break, you're listening and watching on YouTube, Real Kipper and Born. Covering the Raptors in depth like no one else. The Raptors show with Will Liu. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. Don't look now.

The Ottawa Senators won five games in a row and are just three points out of the last playoff spot in the NHL Eastern Conference. Let's welcome in Ian Mendez, who predicted this right from the start. Knew it was coming. Right? Him and Pierre Dorian, the general manager, knew they were going to play meaningful games this time of year. Ian, is that right? That's right. Just don't go back and read any of my articles or tweets from the last six months, and we'll go with your theory that I was always optimistic.

So before we get into early returns of Jacob Chikrin in the lineup, just the whole vibe in Ottawa it just seemed like from the moment that there was a a potential for new ownership right up until the trade deadline man I how far do you have to go back for this level of excitement in the nation's capital yeah like I mean look obviously opening night of this, there was a tremendous amount of excitement because it was Claude Giroux's first game, and there was, you know, Alex DeBrink that was coming to town, and they had Daniel Alfridson drop the puck.

And, like, there was definitely excitement, but, like, that was more rooted in, I guess, just excitement to turn the pages and not really necessarily rooted in anything you saw on the ice. What we've seen in the last few days is something entirely different, and I don't think we've seen it really since that incredible run to Game 7 of the Eastern Final in 2017, where fans are legitimately engaged in the on-ice product.

I'll tell you, I was there Saturday night, and it was very spontaneous. It was very organic. But they started chanting, we want playoffs. And, I mean, guys, if we're having this conversation last week, like last Monday, I don't even think this was on anyone's radar. I wouldn't have in my wildest dreams imagined seven days ago them doing this. But you know what? They beat Detroit in those two straight games.

Then they went to the Rangers and beat them. Then they beat Columbus and they added Jake Chikrin. And all of a sudden, like you said, Kipper, like they're three points out of a playoff spot. Like it feels like it's possible. And so there's just a tremendous amount of excitement in the marketplace. And, you know, fans have been waiting basically six years

for this type of optimism. Ian, how much of getting Chikrin was, you know fans have been waiting basically six years for this type of optimism ian how much of getting chikrin was you know i'm just listening to all the different stories from other teams the deadline it sounds like it fell apart with this team on you know with chikrin because of whatever reason and you go it feels like all these teams had a reason how much of chikrin uh going to ottawa was that he fell to, like they took advantage of some good fortune versus going out and pursuing getting someone high-end like that. Well, it's a great point, right? Because I think at the end of the day, and I'm sure the two of you have been speaking about Jake Checker and being available for weeks and months.

If you listen to virtually any station, read Elliot's 32 Thoughts, whatever, it has been Jacob Chikrin watch, and the feeling was, well, it's going to take two, maybe three first-round-style assets. So when Ottawa got him, and they gave up a first and essentially two second-round pick,

yes, I think the feeling is Jacob Chikrin fell into their lap, because if you go back and look at kind of what Arizona probably wanted, Pierre Dorian came out and spoke about this on trade deadline day. He's like, Ridley Gregg's a non starter for me. We're not moving Ridley

Gregg. And so I think Arizona was probably thinking, yeah, we can maybe get a first in Ridley Gregg and we'll do that. Pierre Dorian held firm on his price. And I think the other thing that really helped Pierre was this was a whole game of musical chairs, right? And once Boston got their guy

and Edmonton got their guy, and you start to go down the list of who is potentially in the running for Jacob Chikrin, Gavrikov ends up in LA, and all of a sudden it's a game of musical chairs and all the other seats are taken up. And there's Pierre Dorian standing there like, hey, I've still got a need for a defenseman i don't have to retain salary uh you or you don't have

to retain salary on chikrin i'm not going to send you send you a dead contract and i think the key to guys they traded nikita zaitsev to chicago about a week before that deal and i think that's important i almost think you have to fold that in on the return on Chikrin. It's Nikita Zaitsev and a second-round pick and a fourth-round pick that they had to staple to him to get rid of him to Chicago to kind of give themselves some flexibility cap-wise for next season to absorb Chikrin. We're talking to Ian Mendez, senior writer for The Athletic, based in Ottawa, covering the Senators.

There's no question asked when it comes to whose team this is in Ottawa. Is it after watching what Brady Kachuk did against Detroit? No. It's one thing.

Again, this goes back to last Monday. Seven days ago, we weren't sure. They had two big games against Detroit. How are these going to play out? And, you know, I thought, okay, if they can try and win both these games, ideally in regulation time, maybe they'll have a chance. It's not that they won those games. It's the manner in which they won those games

and the manner in which Brady Kachuk pulled this group along. And, you know, they've started using the hashtag in Ottawa, the fans have, that is, of who wants it. And the who wants it is paying kind of homage to Brady Kachuk at the end of, I think it was the second period of the first game. He was real upset with the Red Wings. He basically, this was like, you know, the old, the stuff you'd see in the 70s and 80s where, you know,

it's like Stan Jonathan and those little tough guys, the Bruins, they'd go to the other team's bench and they're like, who wants it? They kind of challenged the entire team's other bench. Brady Kachuk kind of went by the Detroit bench and was yelling, who wants it? You know, which one of you wants this? And it was like, it was really

eye-opening to see him kind of do that. And, you know, he responded. He also scored a goal in that, I believe in that. Anywayening to see him kind of do that and you know he responded he also scored a goal in that I believe in that anyway it was a kind of signature moment and I think it kind of gave you a window with the Brady the playoff Brady might be which is really not that much of a stretch of what regular season Brady is and it was just a sort of definitive moment that I think Ottawa realized that you know what we sweep these guys, we demoralize them, and in some ways, it kind of set the direction for what both teams did in and around the trade deadline, right? Ottawa adds Chikrin, and it kind of felt like Detroit really became a seller

after that two-game set. You know, I look at the roster, you know, I think they know going into the season it wasn't a cup season, there's still some holes up front, but you look at that back end now shabbat zoob sanderson hamannik uh chickren brandstrom or the pairs is listed on daily face off like that's that's pretty competitive around the league um i am what do you think the off season looks like for the sins here to kind of shore up this team and push them to the next level yeah you know what uh justin i think the only thing, the biggest question mark on this team in terms of the raw, well, I guess two questions.

One is, what do you do with Alex Debrinket? He's going into his option, kind of his option year, last year of his deal, RFA, you know, he's qualified. But the goaltending is, I think, the other big thing because, look, Jacob Chikrin now gives them what they believe, and I think a lot of us believe, is four legitimate high-end defensemen. Chikrin, Jake Sanderson, Artem Zub, Thomas Chabot. However they plug and play those guys,

those are going to be your top four guys. That's a legitimate top four with most teams in the league. So the question becomes what happens in goal. I think that's the last piece now. Is it Anton Forsberg? Is it Cam Talbot? Is it Anton Forsberg? Is it Cam Talbot? Is it Matt Sogard? Is it somebody else?

And really, that's going to be the last piece, and we might get the answer to that in the next six weeks. If Cam Talbot plays well enough and kind of pulls this team into the playoffs, I think a lot of fans would say, okay, yeah, run it back with Cam Talbot and Anton Forsberg next year. Matt Sogard might get some starts here down the stretch, make people a believer in him. So I think that's the last piece.

I don't know. I mean, they might need a little bit of depth here or there up front in the bottom six, but really most of the pieces of that puzzle have kind of snapped into place, save for maybe the goaltending. Ian, before we went to break, I asked our producer, Sammy McKee, who's the best centerman in Ontario, Austin or Tim Stutzel. You should have seen the look he gave me.

Come on now. Look, I look, the answer is Austin Matthews, right? It is because I look awesome. Matthew's coming off a heart trophy season. And I know he's had injuries and he's not producing at the same rate that

he did last year. And he had to to win one game tonight, yeah, he's probably going to take Austin Matthews. But the needle is pointing up on Timmy Stutzla. I think what's really exciting is you're seeing him produce what translates into

roughly a 40-goal, 90-point season. He's on his entry-level deal. And the new deal kicks in next year. That's what's exciting. I think we've seen the ceiling on Austin Matthews, and that's a high ceiling, right? Like, that's 60 goals.

That's Austin Matthews' ceiling. That's a pretty darn good ceiling. And he's probably going to be a perennial 50-goal score as long as he's healthy for the next five or six years. You know, I don't know the ceiling on Tim Stutzla, but I think we've seen that maybe the floor is 35 goals. And it's exciting. You don't know how high this guy can go.

And really, if you look at the way his career has played out early on, even from right down to where he's drafted, to his productivity, it's mirroring Leon Dreisaitl real closely. And boy, if he ever turned into a potential 50-goal guy, 100-point guy, boy, that would, I think, potentially be the ceiling for Tim Stutzler. And Ottawa would have hit a grand slam with him at number three in that 2020 draft. He is electric, and I imagine that is exciting to any potential owners. Can't have you on without asking the obligatory question,

where is that process at in terms of figuring out who owns the sets? Where's Ryan Reynolds? Where's Ryan Reynolds? Where's Ryan? We can't have this segment without Kipper complaining about you. Yeah, glad we got that in, Ian. He's been awfully quiet. Did he move on to buy the Yankees or anything?

No, nice of you, too. Hey, Ottawa, two small potatoes for him now? Big star? No, no. Listen, so today is the 6th of March, and really this is where the bidding is supposed to heat up. So anybody who's had access to that data room has had the chance to look at the financials.

Realistically, I think I wouldn't be shocked if by the end of the month we either had this thing narrowed down to one or two bidders or we know the identity of the winning bid. And really, I don't think this is going to take too long. But what I thought was fascinating to me is to hear Bill Daley very recently suggest that the sale price for this team

could fall close to a billion dollars. That's remarkable. When you think about where this team was viewed, I think the public perception of this franchise and whatnot, even just a couple of years ago, to the idea that there might be a mini bidding war here that pushes that sale price north of $900 into the close to $ one billion dollar range it's going to be fascinating to watch this unfold i just think that they've gone down the road of ryan reynolds so far like i said to you guys i think a couple weeks ago i don't know how you put the genie back in the bottle how you could have an ownership group that doesn't have ryan reynolds folded into it would seem like a letdown to a lot of people in this market in Ottawa.

You know that looking at the financials is a waste of time. You know that there's no money in Ottawa that could support $800 to $1 billion for a franchise in Ottawa. We know that, don't we? That you're paying a premium because there's only 32 of these, for a franchise in Ottawa. We know that, don't we? That you're paying a premium because there's only 32 of these and billionaires still want their toys? Yeah, listen, I think, look, I think where the sale price becomes interesting

is, you know, Pittsburgh sold for what, $900 million? Close to that, yeah. Yeah, about $900 million. Like, I think if you're the NHL, you're trying to get that price up around the Penguins, if not higher. Because, again, we're hearing the whispers again about expansion, right? And we're hearing about, oh, is it going to be Houston?

Is it going to be Atlanta? Is it going to be somewhere else? And I think if you're the NHL, you're trying your best to establish the floor price for what an expansion franchise is going to be. And I think they'd love the new expansion franchise to be a billion dollars, don't you? Like, when Seattle was 650, and I would suspect that the league is going to try and say, look, if Ottawa was sold for 900 or a billion, that's going to be the floor for a new owner to come in into a bigger market.

That's my feeling on this and why you might see that price inflated as much as possible. You sell Ottawa for $625 or $650, there's going to be new owners for an expansion franchise, I think probably pointing to that, saying, well, if a Canadian market's only making $650, maybe we shouldn't be closer to a billion dollars. That's just my feeling on the matter, that This is about trying to set the market for franchises value league-wide. It is flattering to think that somebody wants to spend a billion dollars to put a team

in Ottawa, but is there any worry about a trickle effect of a new stadium coming in and whether or not these owners want to recoup anything at all that maybe a box at 400 or 500,000 could sell in Toronto, but there's just no way that they're going to be able to sell that in Ottawa

or jacking up the tickets. Is there any worry at all about a trickle effect in a market like Ottawa where you can't write off, you know, the majority of the government can't write off tickets and boxes there? Is there any concern at all about that? Or no, not really. Not that I want to derail all the excitement. No, no.

And it's a valid question. It's a fair point. Look, Ottawa's had attendance issues, right? But I think Ottawa's attendance issues have been more reflective of just a poorly run organization like i like like for the most part when ottawa's played well and has been run well the fans show up and uh you saw that in the early 2000s you're seeing it again now they're getting 16 17 000 i think if they build a new arena guys there's going to be a lot fewer of the corporate seats because as you

mentioned kepper we don't have in ot, we don't have Bay Street, right? Like we don't have Bay Street. We don't have the big corporations setting up in Ottawa necessarily that we could have 75, 150 corporate suites and they're all filled up. I think you're going to see a smaller re-up, maybe in the 17,000 range, 16, 5, 17. But again, all of these companies or all these potential investors would have spent the last five weeks looking at these books closely. So the books that they've been looking at are basically the ledgers, the payroll, any sponsorship deal. They're going to

know. And these people are billionaires for a reason. They're not a billionaire because they made some silly investments. They're going to make a smart play here. And I think no one's going to overpay just to have a toy if that toy is going to then cost them hundreds of millions of dollars just to have and operate. I think there is the feeling that this can be a profitable entity if it's run correctly. But I don't think it's been run correctly, certainly for the better part of five years. So I think the hope is run it properly, have a downtown arena, and it should be, you know, I don't want to say licensed to print money. Maybe that's a little too strong, but it should be a profitable business

if it's run properly in Ottawa. Last one for me, just, you know, when an owner takes over a team, they look at, you know, what owner takes over a team they look at you know what assets and liabilities and all that stuff this jake jacob chikra deal got to be an asset for them hey what a start for him well a unbelievable start and and i'll tell you um i'm sure people saw the interview both in the pre-game with hockey night and then kyle bakoskis with him uh after the Just genuine, raw emotion. And it's rare. Again, in Ottawa, we've watched so many players over the years leave.

And it's never because they didn't like the city. And again, the things weren't run properly. When you see somebody say they got chills to put on an Ottawa Senators jersey, that means a lot to us in Ottawa. Because we don't have in this market, we're, we're, we're, the French has 30 years old, so they don't have the long runway of a century worth of tradition in history. So you don't often hear people say,

I grew up watching the senators or my dream was to play the senators. So we need somebody like Jake, Jacob Chikrin coming in and saying, yeah, this is, I came to games as a kid in the 07 Cup, and this is, you know, I've paid attention to this team. It means a lot, and there's just this immediate reciprocal love between player and fan base that I don't think I've seen in a long time, where immediately they love him, he loves them. It's a love-in with Jacob Chikrin, and it doesn't hurt that his first two games

he's played really well has two points, and this just couldn't have been a better fit, I think, on and off the ice for the Senators. Sammy, what are we giving tickets away? March 18th? April 1st. April 1st. Close. March 18th is the first Leafs-Ottawa game, I think. With this new look, this new feel.

This could truly feel like a battle of Ontario like like we have not had in a long long time looking forward to the stretch run for the ottawa senators ian thanks for doing this and uh don't be a stranger again you're welcome here anytime pal yeah you got it guys anytime you need me just uh don't don't hesitate to call we will ian mendez thanks so much i am i. I'm jacked for the Ottawa Senators. I really am. It's so much better when they're good, when they're interesting. You know, I'll pump the brakes on the team a little bit. Listen, they're good.

They're young. And to Ian's point, a lot of them are already locked up. It's not like you're going to put, they're not going to get painted into a corner in the next little while. Right. Like unfortunately the Leafs did when they overspent early and then put themselves in a predicament where they could not kind of keep the back end up. Yeah. And they're still paying for it right now.

This to me though what the sins are right now are exactly what you become when you're bad for a long time like the kings got to hear the devils have turned things around and taken a step beyond that um buffalo's kind of doing it now but then there's like that next tier of how do you do that how do you do tampa toronto boston like their blue line. But they're now into that group of teams that's gotten better. Their blue line is set right now. And a lot of talk around Jacob Chikrin was not necessarily of his play.

Although sometimes you can watch him and he's not going to let a check go in his own zone, but it was always about can he stay healthy first. And if he stays healthy, he will have a great impact. He's an influencer out on the ice. Oh, yeah, for sure. And it's not that i don't like mccabe i like him a lot yeah but i think realistically he is a four a five and a six

to me he's not a number one or a number two and i just think for the Leafs, unfortunately, they went and spent heavily on Ryan O'Reilly, and I just think my first priority would have probably to save my bullets, and I don't know what kind of vibe Sweeney and Kyle Dubas had on the potential of an Orlov to be available. But if you ask me,

Dubas needed to outbid Sweeney for Orlov. Orlov is a legit one or two on the Leafs. Legit. That's a, yeah, as you say,

that last bit you put on it was the crucial part on the Leafs. Andit. That's a, yeah, as you say, that last bit you put on it was the crucial part. And with Morgan struggling, a guy like Orlov could have come in and supported Morgan and Sheldon a lot more than McCabe has the ability to do it now.

For sure. Yeah. Yeah, there's, I mean, I don't think Does that make sense, Sammy? It makes sense. I don't think anyone in the league said mccabe's better than chicken or mccabe's a better fit for chicken or mccabe would help them more than chicken only anyone in hockey would have said yeah but i think the big thing here that we're talking about is the ottawa senators were the only team that was you know a contender quote unquote which they're not necessarily but they're the only team that

was willing to take the whole thing for cap reasons and that was a huge priority which all of us have talked about elliot pointed at the other point too though you gotta understand they chose not to fit it in yeah but i mean maybe because they i mean maybe their priorities are paying two of their biggest superstars this offseason they don't want to worry about having a 4.5 million dollar but yeah deal on the on the well then you're not all in and we've said that they were all in and the other point there though is that ottawa looks or sorry arizona looks at ottawa's pick and says okay well their first could be 12th overall you know the leafs is going to be 28th you know you're not dealing immediately you would have the preference to trade with ottawa kip i know your point and i agree but i see like d would have been a priority for this team i would be lying if I said that seeing what Chikrin went for, ultimately, it hurt.

Like, it hurt. Yeah. But the Leafs probably wouldn't have gotten that deal. Yeah. That's what I can't. Chikrin or Orlov. I can't. You could have picked one for him, Kimber.

Which would it be? I came in here the day after they made. Orlov. Yeah. I think Orlov just brings so much. And, God, first star in the NHL. And God, first star in the NHL. First star in the NHL. What was the tweet I sent you guys?

Nine points? Most points by a defenseman in his first five games with their new NHL team. Since some dude, well, Paul Coffey in 92-93 and New Zealand alone in 1917. It was actually a guy named Harry Cameron. But at that point, you know. Could be New Zealand alone in 1917 it was actually a guy named Harry Cameron but at that point you know um could be New Zealand alone um yeah like listen I came in here the day after the Orlov trade happened and said if they had done that trade to be closer than yeah the O'Reilly trade so I agree with you on that Orlov Hathaway was an awesome trade for Boston and I love that trade

but the Chikrin versus McCabe one to me i don't think is the same conversation i don't think the leafs get that trade with that price that ottawa did they had to move they had to move on obviously because they wanted them to eat money they didn't think they're going to be able to do it and they moved on but the orlov one to me is a much more valid conversation if you want to have that kind of conversation this This is my perspective. Yeah. You know, at that time, you don't have Boston's pick, do you? Did they have Boston? Sandin was made by then?

Either way. No, they got it back. No, they would have to do the 24-4 first. I just wanted to play out my conversation about the Leafs playing the Senators in the first round of the playoffs. You like that, eh? You want to revisit it as a serious take? Well, no, because everybody, like I saw, you guys were crazy.

You're like, you're crazy, you're nuts. Yeah, you are. No, listen. It's a long shot, Sammy. Of course. But for that to happen, think of how good Ottawa would have to be. Yeah, yeah, okay. And think of how horrible Tampa would have to be.

Were they eight points back? You're right. Ottawa would have to be yeah yeah okay and think of how horrible Tampa would have to be yeah eight points back you're right Ottawa would have to get what are they eight eight back we said of Tampa Bay uh nine nine eleven oh eleven they're eleven back of games at hand uh they have 62 they're at 63 so they have one game in hand okay so. So, yeah. So they would get screaming goddamn hard. Like 18 and 2. And then Tampa would go ice cold. So that is my point. Yes.

So I just wanted to make sure I got that. All right. I see that point. Thank you. And I respect it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Just one note on a potential sale that when you have billionaires, you just know if the Ottawa Senators do not make the playoffs, you can lose $20 to $30 million. You make the playoffs, you win a round, you win two rounds, you shrink that $30 million loss into hopefully a five million dollar profit maybe more if you get to a stanley cup final but this is where it's gone is that these billionaires now are going to look at the premium of the billion dollars comes into you're only one of 32 yeah yeah i you know i heard ian's point about that none of these guys

are good businessmen and they won't. The people who buy NHL teams or pro sports teams are no longer doing business. They're buying fun stuff, mostly. You know, not that they may lose 5 mil. They may lose 30 mil. It is non-impactful, but they are an NHL owner. They don't look at it and go yeah

i gotta make the the balance the sheet here i'm broke like i do see what your point that like this is a luxury asset to be like that's mine you know why do you have a second lamborghini because i can but there will be one bean counter that they hire yeah oh they're gonna that will absolutely make you pay that 25 for a very big beer yeah no and i see your point where yeah then they say okay uh we did all this and now you know who's gonna pay for it that's right i'm not the billionaire owner that's right yeah you're going to pay increased ticket prices because that guy's got a bonus that he wants to hit. His entire job hinges on the viability of the business side, whereas the owner cares less.

Now, did Ian mention that there's more talk about expansion? Yeah, we didn't mention that last week, but Butcher Grouse all but tweeted it's happening to Atlanta. That's got to be fake. That's crazy. There's no way. Come on. You might make the league if there's 30 more players.

The product is watered down as it is. Yeah, they got to expand to Canlin Arena, get the zigzags. All Pontus is going to get paid if they go another couple of teams. Just uncle on the number of teams. Well, you know what? I actually think it genuinely makes the product worse, not just from a watered-down aspect, but you can only follow so many

teams like when there's 20 teams as a fan you know who's on each roster and what's going on it gets so big it's like wait you know what i mean like college football to me it's like 600 football teams i don't know who's where it's just too much to keep track of for a fan when you're up to 34 teams how about they get rid of five for sure five teams gone imagine the league get rid of some teams i like there's too many like there's so many teams with guys it's like i love it in theory yeah i just yeah i i there's a lot of guys in the nhl right now that shouldn't should be in the minors 34 teams that sure open up a whole new level of talent you although the top guys would really get to feast a bit more mcdavid's

like expand make it 46 let's go just beating up on ahlers at that point he'll be the 20 million dollar man and everyone else is making $750. I looked at the standings this morning and I realized that the Bruins had been hot again. Oh my God, bud. They've won 10 hockey games in a row. The best team in the NHL by goal differential is the Bruins at plus 105. Next best is 57. Their goaltending does not take nights off.

You can't catch them on a bad night. No. They've lost twice at home. The season's over in six weeks. They've lost twice at home. They've lost eight times in regulation on this season. They've won 10 in a row. Again, up 50 goals on the next best goal 103 of a possible 124 is that possible yeah sure it is what they've been they it's gonna really hurt when they lose if anyone

decides not to give uh what's his name montgomery there the the Jack Adams. Like, you're overthinking it. Oh, yeah, he gets the Jack Adams. Like, yeah, but it's a regular season award. Yes. They're a perfect team. Like I've said before in the past. Allmark, no playoff experience. You got a couple of guys injured right up until. He's played two games.

He looked like he's really going to get rattled in the first or second round. He doesn't. How many playoff games do you think he's played? Do you know? Ten. I don't know. Ulmark? Yeah, I have no idea.

Kipper, do you know how many games he's played? With Buffalo before, so zero. How many could he have played? Zero? He has played two playoff games. Yeah, okay. One less than Ilya Samsonov. And probably two more than Jeremy Swayman, if I had to guess.

I don't even know. He's been with the Bruins. I don't know if he's actually gotten any action. Yeah, he has played two games. And he has let in eight goals in those two games. So we didn't get through all of our Leafs clips. Do we want to revisit some of the coach's stuff?

We didn't hear him on Kerfoot and Bunting. We didn't hear him on losing to bad teams. No, go to Kerfoot because I've liked old Kerfoot. I'm not. No, go to Kerfoot because... I've liked old Kerfoot. I'm not... Yeah, go to Kerfoot and then we'll talk. I'd say Kerfoot's been playing better than Bunce. That's really it.

I thought Kerfoot was outstanding, maybe his best game of the season the other night. So I'm trying to change that up a little bit. And, you know, I'm just trying to change that group a little bit there and, you know, just trying to change that group a little bit there and try to get a little bit more from them. Like Kerfoot, boys. Like him. He skates so well.

He has been inflicted with the worst disease known to man. Pass when you should shoot disease and shoot when you should pass disease. It's infected him he just he makes the wrong choice 85 of the times he skates great he sure does he skates great and he makes good just like good defensive plays nobody can get to the wrong spot faster than kerfoot yes it's like i really like him lately i thought he's been playing really well he should not be playing on the top line well no no no but again you know you want bunting's been dog meat he's been no good going to assistance last seven games he's not doing anything else like take a look at that

left side tomorrow night look at the left wing read the names again to me kerfrit yarn croc bunting aston reese it's not bad for what i don't hate it men's league i don't mind it come on i don't mind it i mean a good player to me he's a second line winger championship team kerfoot doesn't see the light of day on your top six and neither does yarn crock who is going to go through anybody well not everyone has to do everything neither of those guys are your tell me who is then on the left side who's going through people why does it have to be on the left side why can't it be guys going through people on the right side or in the middle or on d so tell me who then on your first,

your top six tomorrow night, who's going through anybody? Your top six is Lafferty. Matthews is a pretty strong fella. Okay, Lafferty. Okay. All right. Okay.

That. In conclusion. Yeah, it's an issue. The Leafs suck. It's an issue. The bad, what are we doing? No, no, it's Yeah, it's an issue. It's an issue. What are we doing? No, no, it's just, it's an issue. It's an issue for me. That's fine. I can, I can see that it is not a strength of the team.

Can Nyes come in last week? He is a left winger and he is, what is he? Six, three, two, 10 or something. Something. I am curious. I just, I just wish with all this new depth, they would have found a way to not ask Kerfoot or Yarncroft to be a top six.

And I get it. I get it. I get, I get there's guys hurt. Yeah. Tavares and O'Reilly are out. I get that. But that's the best of a bad bad situation it is going to be interesting

against new jersey who timo meyer scored in his first shift boy some guys who change teams sure fit in quick you know it's like yeah didn't see a ton of that straight away o'reilly had his great game i suppose but timo will come in in new jersey and give them that just that right uh ingredient of looking big yeah big guy great shot nice goal to just kick things off for them they're interesting they have a real chance to catch carolina they're they're two points back at carolina which could punt carolina into that two three game versus the rangers and all of a sudden you're New Jersey and you get Ottawa, Buffalo, the Islanders maybe, someone like that.

On the weekend, you watch Dallas. I watch Dallas big and heavy. Dallas stinks. They played hard on the weekend. I know that. And they've had looks the last few years in the playoffs.

One got them to a final yeah where they look big and heavy like the islanders they remind me of the islanders that both teams are like not great for me the regular by the way dallas is 34 and 16 they're very good but both teams you get in the playoffs they give teams a hard time they make you go through like best case for the leafs tells me fighting for their playoff lives if they play in the East. Yeah. But, hey, let's just, if you are the Leafs, who do you want to play Boston in round one? Because you're hoping to get by Tampa.

You want Boston to have a tough time. Your choices are Islanders. Who's going to take a piece of skin off of the Boston Bruins? Islanders is your choice. Islanders, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Ottawa, Florida, Washington could still do it florida and what washington you know what hurts the islanders correct me if i'm wrong but clutterbucks done is he done i hadn't uh i hadn't heard that if that's the case that does hurt and certainly a banger for them they're all hurt i mean i yeah martin sezikas are playing with Hudson fashion.

Matt Martin's been playing on the top line for them. They've been struggling, trying to keep it afloat. He suffered a upper body injury in Thursday's 3-2 loss to the Buffalo Sabres. Who's that? That's not from recently. All right. Who's that? Cal Clutterbuck, but disregard.

Not from recently. I was just looking it up, and I read an article from January 25th. So I was wrong by that. I think he's done. The Isles do have just a lot of heavy guys in terms of Matt Martin and Sezikis, and even like veteran guys, Lee, Parisi, Nelson. Like they're Horvat. They play hard, play strong.

Pierre Engvall, right to the top line on that team, playing with Horvat and Anders Lee. Sammy. For context on what the aisles are. Sammy dropped him off at Pearson and I think picked him up at LaGuardia. Yeah. I haven't even thought of him since he left.

Not for one second will say that the Leafs miss Engvall. I haven't missed him for one second. Do you think that bunting playing poorly means the Leafs get him cheaper? I'll tell you where they miss him Where? He actually physically looks big Yeah, he does He's a large animal

That's it And he could hit the net Lately Yeah, time Here and there He could hit the net lately. Yeah, time. Here and there. Here and there. Do you think a poor bunting down the stretch helps the Leaf get him resigned,

helps them keep him? Oh, listen, they got to get bunting going again. Bunting is heading towards airport drive material. Oh, come on. I just want to see him. He looks a little tired to me he looks like he's he can have a nap in the car in the way kind of right send him a black car he's been on a torrid pace for two years oh yeah for a guy that's never done it before just dying to get that paycheck so he can take a knee no not accusing him that, man, he has been working for his money. I like that they backed off on him a little bit. Sure.

Just to kind of get him recharged here down the stretch. Lay on that fourth line. All right. We'll pick up bunting talk tomorrow. All right. We've run out of time. Ian Mendez, thank you very much for making time for us today. Also, Jim Ralph.

We're back tomorrow.