Real Kyper & Bourne - Leafs Need More From Morgan

Episode Date: January 16, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee kick it off by breaking down the Leafs loss to the Boston Bruins on Saturday, including Conor Timmins' critical blunder, where Morgan Rielly fits, if it's time to reunite Auston Matthews and Mitch Marner on the same line and the confidence level with Matt Murray as the number one. They are joined by former NHL executive and Sportsnet hockey analyst Mike Futa (41:11), who discusses the energy Wayne Simmonds brings to the team, the Leafs' need for a true number one defenceman and who they would need to trade to get one. Then, former Leaf and host of Chiclets Game Notes Colby Armstrong joins the show (1:06:10) to chat about the yo-yoing Penguins, flashiness vs. nastiness on the Leafs and the need for both, and why Seattle is the Cup contender no one is talking about. Kyper, Bourne and Sam close out with a break down of Canucks' president Jim Rutherford's press conference today.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. What a wild weekend. Yes, sir. In the sports world anyways. And I've never claimed to be this big NFL football guy. But man, oh man, did I like watching football on the weekend and of course that ties into a a real intense hockey game by the toronto maple leafs and the boston bruins but watching the bills hang on sammy and the bengals needing a 99 yard turnover so let's to solidify their win man that was a fun

weekend uh yeah and it was actually perfect because the leafs game on saturday night to solidify their win, man. That was a fun weekend. Yeah, and it was actually perfect because the Leafs game on Saturday night went up against Chargers and Jaguars. And during the game, the Chargers were just kicking the crap out of the... So I kind of was like, I don't need to flick back to that. That game's over.

Me and Bunk record Leafs talk after the Bruins. And I'm like, oh, well, I'll just, you know, I'll check. I was like, oh, it, I'll just, you know, I'll check. I was like, oh, it's 27-14 now. It's a little bit more of an interesting match. And then I got to watch that whole comeback. So it worked out perfectly on the Saturday night. Sammy hit a 14 parlay over the weekend, too. Nailed them all.

Wow. Yeah, I do every wildcard weekend, I do a four game, four gamer. Usually a pretty chalky one with a lot of favorites. A bit of a square parlay to be sure but hit it this week i had uh had the four guys right so it's great weekend what a difference the sun makes boys i know so as much as we get throughout the week of of games nhl games like can you get away with uh football on the weekend like i'm watching it's a one o'clock buffalo game and then it's like okay is it over can we go out now and and do something like i'm watching it's a one o'clock buffalo game and then it's like okay is it over

can we go out now and and do something and i'm like well there's a four o'clock game as i think sammy tweeted or send our group like looking forward to rotting on the couch for eight hours i was like oh are you my kids are three and my kids are six and two no no no chance no we're sledding we skated at glenwood park we went to his hockey practice he had a sleepover my wife around 12 30 on sunday she's like i gotta run some errands i'll probably be back around five or i'm like oh you're leaving you're leaving just please stay meanwhile i'm like in my underwear watching football for eight hours oh wait to 20 years yeah underwear will be optional it always is that's the start of the relationship at the end of the relationship well we're glad

we are glad everybody's aboard and uh we're gonna have a great week uh real kipper and born nick kiprios justin born derrick brandeo general nick sammy mckee all week long wherever you are watching or listening sportsnet 590 the fan youtube spotify itunes fun weekend turns into a fun week let's start with saturday night toronto maple leafs in the boston bruins i wrote an article about maybe a couple weeks ago when i when i started talking about the chances of catching the boston bruins yep not not uh impossible but not probable now would you say impossible yeah listen it's the nhl in 2023 uh 10 game win streaks 10 game losing streaks i don't see that for the boston bruins right but the one thing that i did mention also was where would the leafs focus would

be i i zeroed in on establishing a number one goaltender we're still not i think real close to to locking anything in uh and we'll get into matt murray's performance saturday night okay but the other one was that the importance of the next couple of games against the Boston Bruins, and I think one more against Tampa. I mentioned that I want to see what those brings, what those games can bring out of the Toronto Maple Leafs,

what we can learn from those games, the excitement, the intensity level. For me, Saturday night did not disappoint great game that was really fun really felt like that it had that vibe that you like you know the playoff vibe gave us everything we wanted yes with still a lot of time to go before the result of course so where do you want where do you want to start on on what you saw at a saturday night that uh i think that gave you and did it give you a good indication of of where the leafs are at yeah i think we should do big picture takeaway and if it changed anything for you for me watching that game um i felt good about the leafs you know like

i left the game feeling like okay that's you know they're they're in that realm of team but they ain't there and so i left immediately feeling like where is the ad got to be where where does it have to be does it need to be another left winger does it need to be a defenseman tj brody goes down all of a sudden it's morgan riley and connor timmons and you're looking through your fingers again like it's jake gardner andner and Cody CC and whoever I, I go back to needing a defenseman where the debate has been, where do they need to add for me? I left the game feeling like there needs to be an ad for sure.

I think the bones are there for the Leafs to beat the Boston Bruins in a playoff series. I think they need a renovation. They have, yeah, they got a good, you know, they got a great,

you know, two bed, two bath. It needs a little bit of, needs a little bit of upkeep. I like you. They They need a renovation. They have. Yeah, they got a good, you know, they got a great, you know, two bed, two bath. It needs a little bit of upkeep. They played them really well. I thought they were the better team in the third period. They had a really great pushback after the second period where they got caved in. I just, I don't think they can hold up against that team

over a seven-game series the way they're presently constituted. And I don't think that's to take away from the Leafs that much because they've lost five games all year. They're doing that to everyone. The Bruins are really good. Terrifyingly good. That's a third game and four nights for the Leafs, too. That's not nothing.

Your takeaway, Kipper. Yeah, I'm with you. The Leafs are close. Yeah. But there is something missing. And the one thing that kind of stood out after the game that is really consistent, and this even goes far beyond Sheldon Keefe and Kyle Dubas

and even Brendan Shanahan, that the Leafs can still find a way to shoot themselves in the foot. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that, to me, is a concern. That Timmons turnover to Pasternak is Alex Galchignok all over again for me. Like, just a young guy elevated in a spot he's not ready for. Too much, too soon.

That was a tough pill to swallow. There were some expletives in my living room when that happened. It's just not a play you can make. It's a fast game out there, I understand. But the blind spin around to your D partner who's 100 feet away from you. The risk-reward is a terrible, terrible relationship. Oh, damn it. What was I going to say?

I forget. Listen, we got almost two hours here. Yeah. That's never been a problem for you. I know. So why don't we go to Sheldon Keefe, get his overview of the game, and then we'll pick it up on Timmons. And while Sammy can think about Timmons first on Saturday night,

I'll go to Tavares and Nylander before I go to Timmons. Yeah. On my concerns saturday night but let's go to sheldon keith for the first kippers clipper of the week well two things i mean i think the big thing obviously is that we know we can play with any team in the league you can do it on the road you can do it you know three games and four nights and all those kind of things at the same time you know you three games and four nights and all those kind of things. At the same time, you know, you can't beat yourself when you're playing any team in the league for that matter. But a team of this caliber, you know, you can't give them freebies. And we did.

So there's certainly two big things to take away from yesterday. One, well, really, frankly, both very positive because, you know, you've got to learn positive because, you know, you got to learn these lessons, you know, sometimes the hard way. And, you know, you like to think our group has passed some of these things, but clearly not. But, you know, you got it smack right in your face tonight. Yeah, and that's what you're talking about, right?

It is. I just, as far as the urgency to change that narrative it's almost as if if we went back to 2013 and and counted the the number of times that a member of the toronto maple leafs have uttered those words that uh we we got to learn those lessons and yet here you are in year six of a of a build and you're still uttering those words when you're months away from starting your last chance to get out of a first round yeah is a little concerning for me yeah that's all you know i i wish you would have come down harder on a few people yeah i kind of go both ways on that you know like you're gonna make mistakes in a hockey game i don't expect them to say okay we used to make mistakes and now we're gonna play a perfect game against the boston

bruins there's gonna be mistakes but not big ones yeah not glaring yeah big ones that's all morgan riley to me has been a dog since he's come back from injury and i say that knowing and expecting that there's more to come on on the upside he's had coming back from injury he's been thrown all sorts of d partners right like all over the map but usually some of the the defensive errors the stuff you're talking about, come with an offensive upside where you're like, you live with this stuff because he does this going the other way. I'm not seeing anything on the offensive side of the puck for Riley. But defensively, I mean, turnovers, getting beat, like the one where he turns it over and then Timmons makes a bad read and he doesn't get back on his guy. That to me is a big concern because this is your top guy right this is your victor headman or your mcavoy or lindholm or your your top guy has got

to be your top guy and he's not a top guy right now you shouldn't be thinking about how you're going to figure out how to use your highest paid right how do we deploy this guy that we feel like now we have to protect but you have to give him TJ Brody now. I can't argue with anything I've heard. And I go to the first minute and a half where you're forcing Matt Murray to make that great save great save on marchand and if you go back and and you and you watch it you know um there's there's tavaris there's nylander they're heading up ice um there's just there's just no reason to give up that big of a glaring opportunity a minute and a half in. No.

So two things I want to bring up. One is the idea of starting David Camp's line. Like you have your whole team, you're in Boston, big game against the Bergeron-Marchand line, and you get hemmed in for the first minute. And then the other thing is just keith's quick trigger pulls on line changes in games sometimes like this is either of those catch your fancy is something you'd like to talk about first well even even tavaris's inability to win face-offs in

the offensive zone on power plays is really like you lose the draw. You're down to a minute and a half on a power play. It's been an ongoing thing. He's having troubles in the offensive zone. I go to camp on a face-off right now. You're a glutton for punishment. If this guy does not have it in the offensive zone for face-offs get him out it's unusual too because he's been pretty good for i think i i thought he struggled

saturday night i thought bergeron kind of fed him a little bit saturday night including his bergeron's goal where it's a you had the puck in the neutral zone and you lose the battle along the wall to him. And then he's able to get to the net because Morgan got caught flat footed as well. And Nylander's up on the ice thinking they were going the other way. Yeah. And maybe that brings us to the line change then where Matthews and Marner get reunited. But, you know, we talked about their success this season. A lot of it being patient in close games and sticking to the plan

and being okay with it being 2-2 or whatever the score is and just kind of trusting your team to find a way through. And I know that the line change, you know, Matthews and Marner go back together. They have success. Matthews scores the goal, a pretty good third period out of that line. I just hate the idea that the

second it's tough in a tough environment in a pressure situation it's immediately the first 41 game plan is out the window and we just got to put it back with Matthew Smarter together like you know to me let it breathe here let's see we want to see how the they match up against the Bruins immediately you're right back to the plan. You're a one line team. And yeah, I don't disagree with you at all. They're so quick to me.

And Keith does this, but we, we, we know, and we've talked about this, that when the chips are down, he will put Matthews and Marner together. Well,

and now it's inevitable. That's going to be the playoffs. You're going to see Matthews and Marner as a line in the playoffs. Because it's his safety net. It's his baby blanket. If I'm also feeling that that's a good thing for the Leafs, I'm watching Saturday night and I'm watching Tavares throw a pizza up the middle of the ice.

Out of a set breakout with a minute and a half left. And Nylander's already up the ice as well like go watch go watch what happens the moment tavaris turns the puck over in the neutral zone the reaction time to come back in your own zone yeah off of a off of a broken play it wasn't clean it wasn't like you turn the puck over you got caught flat-footed it's in the net there's a bobbled pass you could see there was a bobble pass and then they got run around yeah go look at the time that the puck got turned over and how long it took Nylander to get back and where he came back to was in no man's land that's why matt grisly ended up so wide open and was able to step in 10 feet into a slap shot you think neil and i came back too deep five guys on one side neil ander

came back and was in the middle of nowhere had nobody had no idea who to cover all he needed to do was stay on the side that he was on as a winger and and get to grizzly was he the guy in grizzly's lane or supposed to be in his lane go watch it yeah take a quick peek at it and and yes the answer is yes he's the only guy i thought that could come back and and cover that portion of the ice they didn't need five guys to overload one side and then have Grizzlik step in 20 feet into a slap shot. But that was, that again is guys thinking about the game-winning goal and not thinking about managing a clock or getting to a three-on-three or even a shootout.

Yeah. Who was it against this year very early in the season where Justin Hall made the pinch and they gave up a late goal instead of just getting into overtime? I believe it was the very first game of the season against the Montreal Canadiens where instead of getting it in deep, he fired it towards the net, hit the shin, goes the other way. And I think, was it Caulfield that scored the late goal?

Somebody scored a late goal against the Leafs in that game. Yeah. All right, let's jump into Sheldon Keefe on the Boston Bruins, a team, obviously, that he's got to find a way to beat. Well, they're a good team. They're going to come to close fast. There's not as much time on the ice out there than there is normally. You're forced to make decisions quicker and execute under pressure,

but that's the game. Listen, I thought we did a lot of good things in the game today. I thought, first of all, against a team that doesn't give up many leads, you tied the game in the game today. I thought we, first of all, you know, against a team that doesn't give up many leads, you tie the game in the third period. I thought we had some opportunities and some time spent in there. And, you know, you're right there to get points out of it. We didn't do it. But there's a lot of positive things to take out of the game today.

And there's some not so positive that, you know, we'll make sure it turned into be productive. All right. Boston closes fast. Yeah. I guess. And, you know, Sammy, you made a comment earlier on when we opened up that Timmons has got that tough pass and he's got Riley 100 feet away. I'm asking you, why is Riley 100 feet feet away i said the same thing sammy and

i watched it and i was like why isn't he where he's not in the middle of the ice you're flat-footed you're deep isn't uh in trouble he's turned his back to you okay he cannot make a pass here to you riley's close to the top of the far circles sitting there hoping that you're gonna get a hundred foot pass it's not it's's close to the top of the far circles there. Why are you sitting there hoping that you're going to get a 100-foot pass? It's completely fair. And the question I would love to ask Sheldon Keefe about these two gentlemen playing hockey together right now, how did he expect it to go?

Yeah. I don't know what, like I know you're kind of undermanned. I guess you have one guy out, so therefore this is what you're going to. But to me, it's, I don't, I think you got to find, I don't want to break up the other pairs. I understand all this stuff. But what was his thought process going into this pairing? I know.

Coach is going to keep his mouth shut. I bet you his answer to you would be that these are, you know, experimental times or times to figure it out. And they wanted to see how we would do. They didn't know. They didn't expect it to go well. They didn't expect to go poorly. And they wanted to see how we would do. They didn't know. They didn't expect it to go well. They didn't expect to go poorly. They just wanted to see what his ceiling is.

And this is past his ceiling. Going to throw your baby into the deep end. That's exactly this. But I'm okay with some of that in the regular season where you say, let's put this guy in a spot. You know, let's see what he can do. Okay. Put Holmberg as second line line center let's see if he can do it if he can't then we know he can't and i think we got an answer there is he

as long as you're putting people in positions to eventually succeed yeah i'm not sure he did there but you you want to play the odds of plucking a guy off of Arizona. Oh, yeah, they're looking to see... And then within four months, he is ready to challenge and help you win a Stanley Cup. Like... Listen, it's bad. It's bad.

It did not work, and it should never have happened. The idea was to leave the other two D pairs the same, right? They liked the other two pairs. Leave Sandin, Lilligran, Hall, and Geo. But if you're prioritizing keeping your second and third pair the same and sacrificing Morgan Riley, not good.

And middle of the ice, just poor decisions, middle of the ice. This happens with him. Tavares in the last minute just needed to bank it off the boards and let Nylander skate into it yeah and he tries to go up the middle of the ice and it's like John I did watch by the way Nylander is gone the swing thank you the swing is unbelievable I know you guys can't see it but Nylander's there

in the middle doesn't get it all the way back behind yeah I don't want a Nylander's there in the middle, doesn't get it, all the way back behind. Listen, I don't want – Nylander's had a great season. Yeah. By far the best of his career. You watch that and you're like, am I sure I want this guy on in the last minute of a game seven in the first round? You want him turning like a train to come back in your own zone to help out? It was like the Suez Canal, whatever that boat was that got stuck there. Do you? No, I don't want that.

I also think it's even as good a year as he's had, that question, you want him in the final minute of a third period, I don't necessarily think. But this is it. It's going to be risk-reward the same way that you got to play Braden Point or you got to play whoever your guys

are they have to play when the game matters and if it's overtime willie's going over the boards end of story absolutely but it's it's not all equal braden point's got a better reputation for being defensively responsible i'm just saying your best players have to play really right like they have to play. They're not going to go with Holmberg in OT because he doesn't do that. Like, so for Williots, can you get him to not do that? And if not, this is, you know,

you're living and dying with kind of how it goes. We spoke of the minute- save on uh brad marchand that really kind of set a tone at least for matt murray looking like he's ready for the challenge yeah but what'd you think the rest of what'd you think a couple of goals that everybody says. What's that famous line when nobody wants to, like, hammer a guy? He'd like them back. Yeah. How many times in life would you have said, I'd like that back? Oh, many, many, many.

What's a mulligan cost? Give me a few. All right, let's go to Sheldon Keefe on Matt Murray's Saturday night. Well, I thought, I mean, he pulls a couple out of the net, or off the goal line, I should say, that are tap-ins. We gave them some freebies early on, and he made some saves there for sure.

So you like his game. I think he probably wants goals three and four back, but there's a lot of stuff happening in front of him there that shouldn't even allow those shots to get done. You know, my one thought on the good saves that he made in the game, because he definitely made some really good saves, are that the idea isn't that you make good saves, then you get to trade them in for junkers later. You know, like you're supposed to make these saves,

and the good saves are supposed to be above and beyond. The Greer one goes through him. The Gryzlik one you can quibble with, but I don't know. Deep in his net. He's a little deep. Not a huge fan on the Pasternak one either. Not a huge fan. Like you say, it's a great offensive play.

Listen, I'll quibble with a couple of goals he let in, but that's legitimately one of the best goal scorers in the NHL, wide open, coming down, not looking, and firing his hardest shot like perfectly five hole not expecting it shoots it on the ice still i i would like to say but i'm not gonna i'm not gonna kill him for that no i'm not gonna kill him but i'm also gonna go he also had marshan on the other side and i i think he was cheating a little bit and you know how you know he was cheating watch the way he falls into the net.

Yeah, he's collapsing. Right? Yeah. He's starting to go that way. You don't fall into the net like that. There, for every reason that Sammy just said, you've got the most dangerous shooter right now in the league. One of them.

Focus on... Maybe worry about hitting. Just by the shot. At that moment, you two are the only one in the building. Yeah. He goes back door. You can look at your teammates. A hundred percent,

but you don't, you, you, you stand up and you don't fall into the net. Like you were anticipating anything else except him shooting the puck. But this, this is the exact same goal that Murray gave up to. Who was it?

Sammy. I asked you connect me against Philly. The on the ice offside rolls the wrist just shoots it on the ice five hole so can't you got bad hands letting in goals five hole all the time but if you hit him in the shoulders or around the chest he's pretty good like these are some concerning trends i have come to grips with the fact that matt murray is at least nhl average i think he's not going to win you a game or a series but i think if you play well enough he can give you enough saves i have

to me he's shown me enough good games where that's really you want a game on his own yeah but okay don't you think i think sheldon said that's the only one all year right don't you think going into the into a playoff series that the potential is there for this guy to absolutely stand on his head in a really important game well he's done it before that's what i mean like i i know he has some stinkers and he lets in some bad games but maybe it's just my stupid dumbo brain but i do believe in the fact that he has the pedigree to play good in a big game. If Matt Murray is more likely, and the chat group can comment on this, if Matt Murray is to influence the game in a major way in the playoffs,

is it more likely to be with an outstanding performance or a dog of a performance? I think both. You can go either way? I think both. I think based on his challenges the last few years, I don't think it's a 50-50. I think it's more up that he won't succeed.

But that's up to him to change that narrative that's been following him the last little while. And see, that sounds like negativity, but it's fair. It's fair based on his track record for three-plus years coming into this season. But I also think he's the best that they have right now. And I think that there's something to be said about the pressure of going into Boston under that environment as a Toronto Maple Leafs,

carrying all the baggage that comes with it. So you think between now and the next time they play Boston that you might want to give Samsonov one of those games? That's a great question. Do you think so? I would. I probably, I don't know. How far away are we from that start?

Let me look. I think it's close. It's two weeks from now. Yeah. Is it in Boston again or is it in Toronto? I don't know that answer. I'll look. They play on a Wednesday two weeks from now.

If you, if we're going in two weeks into February. February 1st, Leafs-Bruins in Toronto, 730 puck drop. Will there be enough time for Sheldon or Kyle or Brendan or whoever's making decisions here to sway the perception that Murray's your number one goalie, then the answer is no to Samsonov. But if we are as wide open still as we are now, and you're giving in to the we are a 1 and 1A,

and we'll go with whoever's hot at this time, then you have to give Samsonov that start. The only thing is, okay okay so let's say samson off shuts down the bees great game you know they get 35 shots he gives up one or two they win you're then gonna go well samson like does that answer your question well samson was the guy in playoffs then he won his game at least he has something to build on i don't know how uh uh the the last week and or the first week in April look like? Who's looking well?

Who's looking confident? Who's got some great numbers? Like, the answer is you've got to come in with some momentum. Somebody's got to come in with some momentum to start game one. Yeah, you may need to scrap the tandem thing by April. The one thing, though, Kipper, that lends the, you know, gives why you should play samsonov in the next game uh against boston is that you don't know who's going to be healthy between the two

guys and you want both of them to have had played in one of these big games sammy we got we got boston one more and we got tampa bay correct i think boston two two more yeah i think so i'm just so it's yeah you're right it was three yeah after christmas april 6th in boston but that's the last week of the season we assume that love for that game to matter we we assume that uh guys will probably be resting by then maybe we were saying what's the best case scenario for the bruins to play in round one and is it washington and just have tom wilson go run around and bang them up a little bit for seven games. And the next Tampa Bay Lightning game is the second last game of the season. That stinks.

Yeah, I agree. I mean, that game could mean home ice. Yeah. Right? Like these two teams are battling. It could mean home ice. Do you even want to win that game? You know what I mean?

Not the home ice part, but like if it doesn't matter. Like, I two teams are battling. It could mean home ice. Do you even want to win that game? You know what I mean? Not the home ice part, but, like, if it doesn't matter. Like, I don't know. I think I'd like home ice. Still plenty to chew on here. Mike Futa is going to join us in about 15 minutes. We'll get his thoughts on what we saw on the weekend against Boston. And then Colby Armstrong, former NHL-er, or sportsnet hockey analyst co-host of chicklets game notes i don't even know that what that is is that like a spin-off it's a podcast they mix

and match some of the guys and okay your refusal to know what people are on who come on our show is hilarious i'm sure it's really good. Mr. Colby. But before we get into all of that, I want to talk to you guys about the physicality that we saw Saturday night and what Wayne Simmons was able to provide early against Nick Foligno. And I, for one, absolutely loved it. What a tilt. Santa Rice at the Bully's logo. I was standing in my living room.

I was shadowboxing after that, baby. But what I don't like about the whole grand scheme of it is that it's not really what your team's all about. It's not what you're built about. And at the end of the day, Wayne Simmons is one of those players that he's just a part-timer for you right he's not an everyday guy you're not building anything with him you just hand pick your starts with him every two weeks and good on him like seriously there's some guys

that i would know who've made the money that he has say, you don't want me on the team anymore, full time, yet you're telling me... You want me to go fight? You want me to go fight now for you on a Saturday night. Yeah. No, I mean, full credit to him. What a show. And, you know, to be there for the team,

I think he has made headway with the way he's played in a couple of games to your point about, like, if you have to play dryden hunter wayne simmons i know simmons isn't quite as fast as he used to be and i know just if those are your choices like he does give you something right he has a role yeah it is it isn't but it's it's selective and i also get the thought that they've probably played this scenario in their heads a thousand times is that we've got to move off of him he's he's not quick he's slow to react sometimes and i think we go pull up the goal go look at it he's kind of caught in the middle can't quite reach a puck

that ends up a little chasing a little bit yeah and then it's in your net. Yeah. So they're caught between a rock and a hard place. They need someone like him that isn't him. We need you, but we don't need you. Right. We need someone like you. Exactly. And that, to me, is another thing that should be so glaring to them is that you've got a high emotion saturday night game against a huge rivalry

and this guy's bringing the jam for you but outside of that you want it to carry momentum you want to keep that passion that emotion and you look past wayne simmons and you go okay who else is on our team now? Like, they're done. They're one and done. Wayne Simmons goes out there and he battles Foligno, and they're one and done. Boston, on the other hand, can still go play a more physical game and engage their teams, their teammates emotionally,

and the Leafs don't have anything like that past Wayne Simmons. No, the Leafs, though, are also not going to be a different team by bringing in one other guy who has that like this is the team that they are to me and if you want to call that their flaw then that's their flaw but i don't think you can change the core makeup you know i saw uh sammy you tweeting with nick richard and a few other people about how the Bruins' main players, their active guys, are nasty at times. And Marchand's chirping at guys and they'll take it right to you.

The Leafs guys don't do that. And that's just who they are. And you can win doing that. You can. You can't say that. Well, sure you can. Not when it matters. They haven't proved that they can win when it matters.

This group has not. This group definitely has not. So tell me, why would't proved that they can win when it matters. This group definitely has not. So tell me, why would you say that they can win? Well, I mean, if you look through the history of the NHL, people have won Stanley Cups. Not every person is a nasty jerk. But there's enough of them.

Well, and that's it. You need a couple of them. I think you do. I absolutely do. But what's your point? That it's just not enough. You ask Wayne Simmons to go out there and fight some battles for you, and then it's like, well, we don't see him in two weeks.

He's going to go practice on his own. He doesn't even go to the Marlies. He won't go to the Marlies. So you can either stick William Nylander in a box and poke him with a stick until he's angry, or you can accept it's not happening. And you can ask for it from who you trade for a guy or two, but like the core of this team doesn't do that and they're not going to.

So how do you win with that group? How do you build around it? Just don't, maybe you just don't win. That's you may be staring that right in the face. Ish. Yeah. Ish. Ish. Ish. When? That's, you may be staring that right in the face. Eesh. Yeah, eesh. Eesh.

Eesh. Because we think they're close. Yeah. You need to go find somebody. And you need to spend on it. That's why the Goudreau's and the Coleman's, they're not cheap. And they play up your lineup, right? So that, to me, is something here that we're on,

that you need someone that can play up your lineup, that it's going to cost a lot, that plays with some of that. I think it's a... Does Bo Horvat have any of that? Saturday night was a really good reminder that, you know, there's going to be portions of an emotional series like a Boston, like a Tampa, maybe Advance. And you just need what Wayne Simmons can provide for, yeah,

but a younger one, a hungrier one you can't keep throwing these flyers on hunt and aston reese and this is how you end up you look back at cadre looking at the team go we don't have anyone i gotta go do it yeah that's that's what stood out for me as well saturday night well the the bottom six in general got caved in pretty bad by the bruins i felt like i know angvall scored that goal or whatever but like which ultimately if we're going to talk about goals that sucked like that one was really bad up for all mark that that doesn't go in but that's not a that's not a goal that goes in. I actually like that analysis. That's not a goal that goes in. He snapped it off the bar.

It's a great goal. It's a great goal. That's just not an NHL goal. So a little bit of breaking news from Leafs PR. Injury updates. Maple Leafs forward Nick Robertson had season-ending shoulder surgery and will be out for six months. And Matt Colowell underwent surgery for a fractured kneecap

and will be out a minimum of 12 weeks. Here goes a trade ship. Two. You know, what's interesting now is that, you know, there's a big issue in Vancouver with Tanner Pearson and his wrist. And we'll get into it later on in the show, but I find it so interesting that Nick Robertson, like now, like where was that?

What's going on the last month? Yeah, like how do you, I guess, I understand that surgery should be a last resort, but how long has he been out i don't know it's been at least a month probably six weeks or something yeah yeah i don't know it's just there's there's some some battles behind the scenes with players and and uh issues with their health and who gets to assess them and who you know second opinions and it's really ugly now with Pearson and Vancouver but we're gonna get into that right yeah we're gonna we'll talk about it a little later on in the show by the way just had a good point sent to me that of that

Simmons Foligno fight Foligno is supposed to be the one for the Leafs that's supposed they got the solution right wasn't that aren't we looking for him now? Essentially the guy they had? Speaking of health, he was never healthy when he came. No. Never healthy. He had back issues.

He lived... I think he missed games in the regular season. It was just... He is... He's never going to be a top six player again like he was in Columbus.us but wow full value for a guy like that now and what he brings the boston bruins yeah yeah you wonder if the least regret no he's they gotta he's gotta bring it i mean was he making 3.2 million bucks playing on the

fourth line he better be full of that well just he's healthy he looks to me like he's healthy and you know unfortunately we talked about this earlier that was there an opportunity for nick robertson to come back even at the american hockey league put the puck in the net they're having a good season right the marlies yeah very good could he kind of jump on that uh train a little bit and uh and show that he's a top scorer for the marlies at that level and create some interest? No. Now we're going to be talking in training camp next year and saying, boy, he looks good.

Preseason, he didn't look great. Did we get Sheldon Keefe on the physicality? Did we do that already? We haven't played that clip yet, no. Okay, let's just play that to round out what Wayne Simmons brought. I think it's just two teams, you know, recognizing, you know, that they're going to play a very competitive and hard-fought hockey game. And that's what I liked about our team today.

I don't think we backed down. I thought we were very physical, strong on the puck. I thought we hit back and initiated at times. Obviously, you get down to third period, we push back and tie the game. There's a lot of really good things that you know, that our team did here today in terms of their fight and their compete. And I thought Simmers set the tone in that regard. And then I saw Lilligren get pasted too.

And in the neutral zone, I don't know who hit him. Right in the numbers, Noshik. Was it Noshik? Yeah, right in the numbers, right in front of the ref, throwing the blind eye in boston the boston blind eyes i like to call it i guess you can throw your stick at marner he's about to shoot in the net no penalty he didn't like that hey sammy's all up in the group chat yeah i didn't like it either no first of all we didn't mean to yeah i'm sure you need a high stick people either like it's a penalty right whether you meant to or not no he he meant to throw a stick he just didn't mean to throw it right at marner right that's all so still a penalty shot

i don't yeah i don't i don't know how the rules interpreted is it is it throwing your stick or is it throwing your stick at the puck or the player i think he's just throwing your stick or is it throwing your stick at the puck or the player? I think it's just throwing your stick, period. You can't. I'm not 100% sure on that. It's not a penalty shot. It's a penalty, isn't it? Or is it a penalty shot? It's a penalty shot if you throw a stick.

Not in the last minute of a game? Well, we'll do some Googling here. Let me crack out the rule book here. Come on, Sammy. I've been retired for too long. I don't know the rule there. And I was particularly bent out of shape about the slash or whatever the hell they called on Marner in the third period.

When he's going up the boards, he robs Lindholm of the puck, he turns it back, it's a three-on-one, and after a hard-fought physical game, they call that. I just, listen, I'm not, you could, we could spend 40 minutes on the refs every game if we wanted to, if we really wanted to, so I just didn't like either of those in that game. Yeah.

I agree. That was pretty iffy. Yeah. Yeah. Did we do Sheldon yet? Yeah, we did. We got to do Matthews, Marner, and on the D pairings, but we also need to go to break.

Yeah, let's go to break. All right. What do you want to do? Let's ask the producer. Let's hit the break, gentlemen. We're hitting the break. Coming up on the other side of the break, Mike Futa.es is like raring to go no question i hope his ribs are feeling better i hope he's still all drugged up and ready to chat let's have let's go futes all right mike futa after the break

and then colby armstrong in the second hour plenty Plenty more on Real Kipper and Born. Our next guest has really turned into a fan favorite. Hey, Fuchs, you ever been described as a fan favorite before? My mom. That's it, eh? On a daily basis, but that's about the extent of it.

Well, we'll take it. We'll take it. My daughters, too, actually. My daughters. We're going to get into a ton here, including the big game Saturday night, but how are you feeling last time we checked? You had a flu because you started the car without your jacket on.

Remind us. I've come a long way. I'm a quick healer. The ribs are fine. The ribs, I'm still, every now and then I get a little bit of a reminder that there's a little one of those twinge, like the old game operation where if you touch the outside when you're trying to pull it over, it just zings you. But other than that, I'm feeling a lot better, Kipper. Okay, if we go back to Saturday night against Boston,

one of those games that you look at feuds and you say, we learned a lot more, or is it one of those keep it in check, it's just January and plenty of ways to go? First of all, I thought it was an awesome game um I mean as far as the uh you know again I'm going to get into the Wayne Simmons factor and and just the energy that he brought or I felt he brought to the team um and just in general I mean I just chose you know the Bruins where they're at um i i was just going over the stuff the teams that need to that the teams that have won in the past and the need to have that elite number one defenseman and i still think that's an area where the bruins bruins are ahead

of the leafs but that being said uh you know would that not be a hell of a playoff series and i think again it gets back to whatever happened whatever team wins the trade deadline i think is going to win the series if a team doesn't the team doesn't come up with a big injury but i was just going over the past cup winners and that's obviously what these guys are shooting for and every team had a stud in it this is a pro i think with some of the teams tipper and boring is these guys they're paying number two and number three defenseman number one defenseman money and it it screws up with your and it doesn't mean the kids aren't aren't great players or anything like that but you look at colorado macar tampa bay tampa bay headman headman st louis petrangelo

washington carlson when we were trading cups with you know Pittsburgh had Letang in his prime when we were trading cups with Chicago we had Dowdy they had Keith there was somebody that just was an absolute beast of a horse um so if you want to look at trends I just don't I look at Boston and I see McAvoy and the way that um his part who's the kid home are playing this year and I think that trumps what they taught. And it's not a knock on, they're not good players or anything, but I think that trumps the top of the, of the Maple Leafs defense,

defensive unit. And that's not enough. Cause I said, Mark Giordano is having an absolutely incredible year, age and salary aside. And, you know, Morgan Riley's come back in after missing some time.

Brody's out, but I just think there's a depth and a diversity amongst the Boston defense, and I'm still not there yet with that defense core. I thought Murray was good, very good at times, but I'm not there yet that he's the goalie that's going to overcome the amount of chances that are going to be given up in a playoff series. So if you're in that Maple Leafs front office, are you prioritizing that, finding someone on the back end or a top end guy over a guy who can contribute as a forward in the top six? And I think they got away from that because, again, they played such a – that period of the month there was in November where they were missing some key defense,

and they played that style that everybody was raving about, and they were doing it without Muzzin in the lineup and without Riley in the lineup and the guys that were missing. And it seems like as those guys got back, things started to get a little bit loosey-goosey again. And I think it just sums up. But I think that Morgan, the more he plays, he's going to be able to play that style.

But I just think they're missing something back there. And good on Timmons for stepping in. I know, Borny, you and I were joking about that cross-ice pass. But he's actually been pretty good for them. But I just think to get to where they want to go and knowing as much as people piss and moan about it, it's going to go through Tampa or Boston in the first round. And I think they're going to need another.

I wouldn't go out there and say stud because they just don't have the room. They don't have the cap space. I don't believe they will, even with the Muzzin situation, to get the guy unless they get exceptionally creative and are willing to prioritize the top prospect. But I still think that back end is a priority because I do believe there's enough depth scoring chipping

in up front on top of the studs that have had great seasons that are going to be able to put the puck in the playoffs and keeping it out of their net is going to be a priority. I did catch myself a few times thinking if there was a healthy Jake Muzzin Saturday night,

how that would have maybe looked a lot different for the Toronto Maple Leafs. So saying that, they do have his $5.6 million to play with here. And a guy like Jacob Chikrin comes in at $4.6 million. It's not hard to know that you can fit the math in quite easily here. So is he not – would he not be the best of a situation where you have to win now? Well, and you've got him for term, right? I think he's got three years left at that number.

Yes, including this year. Yeah, and it gives you some time in the offseason and get creative about what you have to move in and out. And God bless if Muzz was ever in a Kucherov-like situation and was allowed to come in for playoffs, that would be to heaven's end. But I just don't know if he's going to be ready to go in the amount of time that it would take,

just from what I've heard about the injuries, to come back. And I agree, Kipper. That's one of those things that just leaves a scratch on your head because that's exactly the type of game that he excels in with his heaviness and his leadership. But it doesn't appear he's going to be there. I mean, Chikrin, it'll be all new for him. And I like the player a lot.

I mean, he's a left-shot D, but it's going to be his first rodeo. There's a lot different between playing in front of 5,000 college fans and coming into Toronto for a playoff run. But that being said, that's the type of player I think that could excel, and he's not a rental, which I think is key too because you're going to have him for a few years. But I just look at the group, and I don't even know, you guys would probably know from the lines and stuff today,

I was busy exhausting myself through the Vancouver press conference. But but you look at that night and i mean again i'm not being up but if i'm looking at that paul just even i think it's a key spot down the stretch here and again it's not a i know everybody my relationship with wayne simmons but what he brought the other night i think is critical in a game of that amount of intensity and i mean and i know that's a guy that sits out two, three weeks and then gets thrown in and still will fight for his teammates. And I think teams like guys like Foligno and Frederick on that team, they bring that element that make Boston a tough team to play against.

And I don't know whether he's back in. I know everybody, I mean, I made a comment on Twitter and somebody was like they don't need that none of the teams have toughness and it raised that whole and you know simmons isn't i never said he's the 2015 version but to play a game like that they obviously seldom likes to shorten the bench i just don't think a guy like i don't think anybody on boston the NOSAC is scared of Hunt, right? And they keep reshowing that fight where NOSAC probably saw on TV

that that's what you're supposed to do. Gets in his first NHL fight and Hunt fills him in and everybody's like, Ooh, Hunt's a killer. Well, there's not, I don't think Hunt puts any fear in the Boston Bruins. And that being said, he skates well and gets around the ice. But I just think that roster spot means a lot more and even to his teammates down the stretch here and maybe keeping some guys healthy

as having Simmons as a lineup. You know, looking at the way the Leafs went about that game where it wasn't quite working for him for a bit and they went back to Matthews with Marner, how do you feel about the way this team should roll themselves out? Should they be more spread out, separating those two guys, or do you like loading it up with the big guys? I'd like to see them load up with the big guys

as they get down the stretch here. I think it's been good for them. You keep looking at the standings they still have put because they went on such a great November. Even with the injuries, they put that separation between them and the rest of the pack. Like, it's not something that it would take a monumental collapse to, you know, come back to the pack as far as the, you know, as far as a playoff spot.

So they have some time to move some stuff around and see the lines. But there's something about those two guys together and the big games and stuff that's pretty magical for me. And I think, you know, the chemistry that Nylander and Tavares have had in the past, either way, it'd be a good look. But I just like those two guys playing together in the big games. You see the Boston Bruins even going into a mini slump from here on in. I think as we speak, I think they've pretty much filled in the flyers again.

I just find it just unbelievable. They made them look like this. Just absolutely filled them in would be the right word. Would be the right word. And that's what I mean. Dabrowski's having a career. He's not playing right now either. So, I mean, there's a guy in their top six that they're only going to get better as well. And again,

it looks like, I think you mentioned temporary. Is this goalie going to be able to maintain it? Well, I mean, it was only the Philadelphia Flyers today, but he looked like he had a little bit of his swagger back as well. Do you see this Boston Bruins team actually going out there? And you mentioned the trade deadline, and maybe it's coming down to that, but is there a chance that they could mess with this chemistry?

You've been there before as an executive. Is there the thought that bringing in someone is as easy as it could sound that Beau Horvat would be great and a guy that can certainly go on past Bergeron or Krejci. Is there a chance that executives sit around and go, well, I messed with a good thing? I think, well, it depends what's moving out, what kind of piece is moving out, because obviously you don't want any part of that chemistry that you have in your dressing room having to give up.

I alluded in our situation, we needed a sniper, and we went out and got Marion Gabrick, who wasn't, you know, Gabby was great for our team because he just came in and he was sure. But I think the addition that the Bruins make, I don't think it's so much of an offensive weapon. Like if they could ever, and I don't know how the hell they do it, but I keep hearing Jonathan Taze's name attached to them as well.

If they can add somebody that's got that, you know, like a Foligno, like Nick Foligno, there's just seamless chemistry. Like to that throwback type leader um that would be like another seamless the way this team seems to get along and look after each other and care about each other uh so that type of player i'm sure horvath would be the same probably a lot more i would assume it'd be more assets for you know with the agent stuff like that but no i i think i think b Boston is going to be creative. I think Toronto's got that added cap space. I mean, obviously, you hate to see someone get injured down the stretch.

They could provide that extra blanket or that extra cash that someone like Muzzin's providing right now. But there's still time to play out before that happens. I just find it amazing, Nolan, when you look at certain teams and what they're paying defensemen and how many true number one defensemen there are anymore in the National Hockey League. And you look at the salaries associated. Like, I did not know Darnell Nurse was making 925 for a lot of years.

And that's tough. That's a tough contract. And he's a very good player. But I wouldn't, you know, he's not Hedman. You know, he's not one of those guys that's just an absolute pure number one. And that's a lot of money to be tied up in it. And I mean, you're talking about adding Carlson, who's at 11.5 for like, I think, four or five more years.

Obviously, there's going to have to be a lot of salary retained, but he's been pretty sleepy for a few years, which maybe it was just his surroundings. And obviously, he's been phenomenal this year and is going to kickstart any team. But there's a lot of cabbage left on that ticket. And you'd certainly want to make sure it's a good fit for him. Futes, you know, we haven't really dug in on the Vancouver press conference,

but you said that you were paying attention to it for those people who didn't see. You know, there's a Tanner Pearson injury that that's in dispute but there's also a coaching situation that's in dispute and a horvath contract and there's just it's a mess i don't know from where i sit feuts what have you thought of what's going on with the vancouver canucks like i've seen i've been more excited about dental surgery than some of the stuff that i saw today it was the most pointless. Like, I don't know.

I just don't know the point. I know. I think the gist of it was for Jim to come out and take some bullets and say, hey, you know, we've done it. But I couldn't. It started off. It was about Tanner Pearson. And then they basically said there's been nothing handled.

They haven't done anything wrong. He's talked with everybody on their side. Nothing's been nothing handled. They haven't done anything wrong. He's talked with everybody on their side. Nothing's been handled wrong. And then it switches over to there's comments like, if he ever plays again, coming off a broken hand four to six weeks. And I just didn't see the – if I'm Tanner Pearson sitting at home watching that, I'm just shaking my head because it wasn't – it started off with, hey, this is just about about him being healthy and then it just veered and uh and then it started

into okay doctors you can leave and uh and uh let's talk hockey and it's like we're gonna just there's nothing wrong with this core and then by the end of it is we probably gonna be trading this core and I mean you don't have to like all you have to do is have the internet. Like, I know you can tag Jim Benning with old Ekman, Larson, and Myers. And I think that Garland's contract is a previous group. But, I mean, all this, and he just kept going on about not being able to have any cap space. And Besser, 6'5", JT Miller, eight times eight or whatever it was.

McKay of 5 million. He's the seven, eight, five. And then he's got, cause man, who's probably been the most productive score. Who he says that they're opening up negotiations.

I don't know where they're going to get the money to pay the guy. It's actually scoring goals, but they've created their own. Like it's one thing to kind of say, Hey, the cap space thing. And he took some accountability. He said he wasn't happy with his own, the job he'd done either. But it just seems so, you go into a press conference with two questions

and you come out with 12 questions. Like, it just seems to be all over the map. Well, you're really comfortable on our show, aren't you? Now you know the person that was my fan favorite. I lost my mom. I guarantee you I lost my mom with that one. Oh, boy, you're in trouble now. You gained a lot of other fans, I can tell you that.

You know, what's interesting now is more and more we're hearing players now uh challenging you know team doctors and and what kind of advice that they've gotten over the years and i just i i know in my era feuts you team says you need this you need this uh certainly that's not the case in vancouver here in toronto they announced nick robertson's uh needing a season-ending surgery that one plays out a little different to me i'm the firm believer that you don't have surgery unless you absolutely have to sounds to me like they tried to rehab nick's situation uh didn't work so this is the last resort but unfortunately for Kyle he does lose

say what you will of where the value sits on Nick Robertson today it's still a chip that you've lost in the poker game or you've certainly diminished the chip and I had mentioned before that it was going to be hard anyways to value

him and you always value your own prospects better than anybody else. And you've got to find a dance partner. But the mere fact that he wasn't finding success and they were having trouble getting him in their own lineup to showcase him, very much like what's going on in Calgary, it makes it hard for a general manager to create that kind of buzz around a player that's out of the lineup healthy. then now that he's injured even more difficult. So that's a tough one. So again, it gets back to

who's valued in your group and moving forward as far as what other people think of your prospects. And again, knowing very well that the Arizona born, tell me his name, the guy that I forget, who's my Minnesota top leaf prospect? Oh, Nyes, Matthew Nyes? Arizona born. So, I mean, you tell me if you're talking about Chikrin,

that you're going to just try and pretend that he's not from there? Yeah, I had heard that's the ask out of Toronto. Is nice. Yes. Okay, take him. That's probably the start, right? You know what I mean? I don't think that's even something you'd think about as a straight-up trade

as much as we love the prospect because you've got one. Again, that's what kind of bothered me i said last year with with carolina was that when you've got a team that's poured into it you want to and i mean colorado did it last year tampa does it every year kyle does it every year is when you're close you got you want to reward that group and you unfortunately some teams are hamstrung by cap issues and they can't do, but you want to reward that group in the dressing room. And for all the people, I went over the teams, and this guy was just giving it to me,

but the best teams don't have toughness. That's so primitive and throwback. And I went, yeah, McDermott was in Colorado, and I just went over the list of guys that do it for the teams that are really, really good. And then I looked at Carolina was the only team that really lacked that. And when we had our meetings, the only player that Roddy Brindamore banged his table about he wanted was Nick Deloria.

And it didn't happen, but still, that tells you the focus when a coach who's that experienced looks at his team and says, what element do we need? And obviously, there's a team that's really deep on the back end i mean i don't know what version of freddie anderson is coming back but you look at the moves they made and like slaving us like he for me is a true number one you've got passion you've got burns you've got depth you've got size up front you can score you've've got speed. And the first thing Roddy wanted was toughness and character to keep his guys protected.

And that wasn't saying he was going to be the first guy out of the gate in the power play, but that's the mindset that goes into. And then again, you don't reward them at the trade deadline, and you don't make a move. And unfortunately, after that, whether if or not it had anything to do with us losing last year was we got our goalies got hurt banged up but you know it would have been nice to reward them down the stretch with a with a big move one more for me feuts and this kind of goes

back full circle for us we had the earlier conversation about wayne simmons and i played with enough guys that uh that would have similar type of stature as Wayne Simmons and Leafs deciding to make him a part-time player. And some of them would just say, I'm not going out there and fighting for you every two weeks and go find somebody else. He doesn't do that. He's full value on his character.

And I'm just wondering now if this continues and Wayne Simmons looks at what he was able to do saturday night and it's reminded that i still have value and i shouldn't be a guy that you just come to me every two weeks would i would i welcome maybe a thought of maybe going to carolina or edmonton they need still a presence in toughness. You think he could revisit not ending as a Toronto Maple Leaf? Well, I tried to, and I'll cross my friendship boundary here because I've tried to convince him of that, and it tells me how much this kid wants to be a Toronto Maple Leaf

and it was his dream to win here, is he doesn't want to be moved. And it's not, I mean, obviously his family's got young children now and stuff, but he wants to win as a charlotte maple leaf and it speaks more volumes about because i know like i know for example last year we had a chance to acquire kyle clifford at the deadline right and cliffy was like no if i'm staying in toronto i want to retire your family that's fine that's these decisions you have to respect but in simmer's, to be able to play a game like that, and again, I'm not talking about to play a role in a game like that. I'm not talking this was like something earth-shattering.

Look at Austin Matthews, Mitch Marner. In a game of that intensity, he played the role to an absolute T. He goes with Foligno, who's another character guy. They're buddies, and you know, they give the really respect tap at the end, but he would do that for any teammate. He's just, that's just, that's the way Wayne Simmons is bred, but it's just got to kill him. Like,

I don't even know. That's why you guys see the morning and skate and stuff tomorrow. Like, to have a game like that, and if he's a healthy scratch tomorrow, that's a tough one for, I would assume, that'd be tough for him to swallow after how he went about for his teammates. But that being said, if he gets plucked in the lineup against Borny's Islanders the following Monday,

and somebody wants to go, he'd be right there for his teammates. And that's Wayne Simmons in a nutshell. That's the same character Mark Giordano has. And that's why, amongst all the other BS around, I'd love to see those kinds of Toronto based kids get a chance to hoist the Stanley cup in their hometown. But geez, you got to that kind of,

that kind of family and stuff and that kind of stuff, that kind of team and selflessness needs to be rewarded. He could have easily taken, you know how hard Foligno punches Kipper. He could have taken one and it's all over. And I think he knows it's his last dance. I was happy that they put him in in Philly. Cause I, you know, I thought if they healthy scratch him in Philly, his last,

basically his last tour where he played his best hockey, that's like a real kick in the stones and they didn't, they played them, but that was a great gesture. And then, then you know they put him back in and and i thought he was really good against boston and he did the stuff that wayne simmons needs to do in his nine or eight or nine minutes he plays a night and correct me if i'm wrong but it's easier for a guy like clifford to turn around and say no thank you and i've won a Stanley Cup. Two. Yeah, two. And Wayne Simmons still would love to know what that would feel like. 100%. You're at 100%.

And chose to take Les again like Geo, and I'm not saying in a difference. Geo would have been making a huge go. But Simmer, knowing where he's at in his career, he's accepted it. He's accepted the role. But to still go out, I mean, there are guys at that end of their warrior career, they're like, do I really need to keep doing this? And he doesn't bat an eye at it. And I tell you, when he talks about his teammates and the guy, like,

his boys, I mean, I saw them, the way his teammates feel about him at his thousands game party afterwards. These guys absolutely adore him, and it translates to the kind of teammate he is on the ice. Absolutely. Hey, Futes, really appreciate your time as always, how candid you are, the occasional F-bomb. If you can roll that back and take out that one.

We'll bleep it out, no big deal. And we'll clean it up for the podcast thanks gentlemen thanks borgie thanks futes appreciate you bud all right that's mike fuda with his last show of the season apparently no we're just kidding you can drop f-bombs now no problem at all no unless it's our show not us not us okay let's take a quick break. We'll see if Colby can clean this language up. I don't know.

He's a spitting chicklet, so I'm sure he's a follow-up. All filters off today. All bets are off, and it's not even Friday. All right, more real Kipper and Bourne after these words. All right. Our next guest needs no introduction. Hi. That's all you get?

Was that it? That's it. You need none. I just told everybody you need no introduction. Mr. Colby. Yeah, usually there it is. There it is. Yeah, usually I get that stuff. And now, star of Chicklets game notes. Okay,

what does that mean? What is that? Yeah, check the game notes, bud. That's how you figure it out, you know? Remember those, Kipper? Yeah, if I went, like, in all honesty, I don't mean to be crude here but i'd grab the game notes before every game and then i go in the dumps and then i have a dump with them exactly and it's like a last resort

it's a lot like you're cramming i can't find anything else to read in the dressing room i'm about to go to the bathroom you grab the game notes yeah you peruse the game notes you study up a little bit of everything in there for you on every single guy what's going on depths of the team inside and out when you came out of there you were better for it okay but you're giving the good

stuff like the game notes were like boring you know what that stems off of the story where I got my face welded, my eyes welded closed by Gavin Morgan in the American Hockey League.

And actually, it's Alexander Dagg when I was looking at my face in the mirror at the end of the game with my eyes half closed. He threw Gavin Morgan's game note page,

flipped open to it and goes, hey kid, check the game notes. So that's where it kind of came from. He said 600 pims a year in the LNAH or whatever. I like it. So that's where it comes from. All right.

That's great. That's awesome. Think the Leafs checked Boston's game notes Saturday night? Well, yeah. I mean, what do you say? I like to see the Simmons going at it, right? I like that tilt right there. And Foligno, I loved it.

Two old school dudes. I thought it was a good game. I thought it was a tight game. I thought the way that it should be. And if you're going to play Boston, that's how you're going to play them. Well, certainly the game notes show that these guys are champions. They've done it before. They find ways to win.

Anything that you got out of Saturday night that said the Leafs are close or close enough for a January game like this? Well, I think, yeah, I think you've got to find ways to win close games. I mean, that's the battle, right? That's the fight. All year long, you're playing measuring stick games and you're going to find ways to win close games. I mean, that's the battle, right? That's the fight. All year long, you're playing measuring stick games,

and you're going to find ways to win it. What do you take from it? What can you, you know, we've seen this group trying to do this for, you know, several years now, this core group, right? So are they going to be able to get over the hump? Are they going to be able to do it? I know there's lots of obvious chatter around the league with the Leafs and their skill and what they have and their

ability to possibly do it this year. So, yeah, I think it was one of those measuring stick games. And I guess when it comes down to it, that is the biggest question. Can you win those kinds of games? I look at Boston and go, yeah, not just because of the record, but the way they're built. I can see them doing whatever it takes in those situations to get the job done, so are the leafs going to be able to go to that level that's the question you know a team that you cover closely colbs and the pittsburgh penguins uh had a couple measuring stick games this past weekend they get the winnipeg jets who've been good the carolina hurricanes have been real good and fell short in a couple of games where do you have the penguins in their quest for the playoffs and beyond?

I don't know right now, and I know they're not trying to make excuses, but no Letang, no Petrie, no Jari, no Archibald, no Poehling on their fourth line, which has, believe it or not, been a great identity line for them when those guys have been in and found to leave their mark on the team. It's been tough without those guys with new faces in on the back end. Pedersen was out the last few games as well, who's had a kind of resurgent year for them. I think they're in tough right now.

I think they're in a battle. There's no question with the strength of the Metro that it's, you know, they've got to start collecting points. And I know they went on a hot run. The funniest thing about them guys is they're either really good and lighting the world on fire, or they can't win a game and they're bad. They're like a yo-yo at the bottom or at the top, nothing in between. So for them, I think, you know, leading into this trade deadline

here in the next little while, right, you've got to get healthy. You've got to see what you actually are. And if you can claw yourself into position to for the gm or the team to go okay we're going to be all right or what what do they got to do what do they need to add how are they going to do this to i guess keep this playoff streak alive but i think they're good enough also at the same time it's weird i think they're good enough that if they you know get in the playoffs you know i think they i think they have experience and they're good enough to understand how to manage and win a series and who knows what can happen once you get there hey colby it's not

like brian burke and ron hexall just got there they've had they've had a little bit of time here but yet it still for me doesn't feel like a brian burke type of team no are they are they they're not big enough or heavy enough are they or like what like, what's taking Berkey so long to get that trunculence going? Yeah, like, they played Winnipeg the other day, right? And, like, you've seen Winnipeg. Winnipeg, like, they have Cole Perfetti, who's, like, a smaller player, and Sam Gagne, who's on their fourth line, veteran guy. The rest of the guys, I swear, are like 6'2 and nothing else but.

So they're a monster team, and they kind of push the Penguins around. They threw them around, even against Carolina the other night, threw them around, pushed them around. So I don't think it's anywhere near what I would expect with, you know, a guy like, you know, Berkey in there and even Hexie, right? Like, you know, with what these guys would like their teams to probably look like or resemble. So I would, I have to think that they're going to have to look at getting,

you know, some kind of player in there that provides that. You know, Jason Zucker is kind of the lone horse on the team that's providing this. You know, he's over 100 plus hits this year, plus, you know, 20 some points, 26 points, I think he has. And he's been really consistent and strong and wins battles, and he's just got – he's that guy, right? They don't have enough of guys that are that guy.

You know, Archibald plays a reckless game when he's healthy in the lineup. We know that. But, you know, he's not going to produce like, you know, like a Zucker can. Can they find someone and some guys, whether it's on the backend or, you know, up front, especially up front. I just think they're lacking that up front, that, that kind of battle tested personality in their lineup, you know? And I, I,

I would have to think in watching that that's something that they're going to have to look at, at addressing for sure. We've talked about that on this show a little bit, like the idea of having to have that sort of energy, toughness, nastiness, whatever. Like, can you out-skill it today? Could the Leafs core guys just be so good that they don't have to have it? Or is it still hockey's hockey and at the end of the day you need some element there? Well, in my opinion, I feel hockey's hockey.

Like, you have to have players that can provide that or do that. And I think that just has to be built in, right? Like, if you're skilled, great. But do you compete battle in a will yourself? Like, you know, Marchand, for example. Skilled, can go between his legs and do all the fancy stuff that we see on Instagram all over the place. But at the end of the day, he's going to win puck battles.

He's going to get in tough situations and hard ice. He's going to go to hard areas. He's a competitive guy. That's just who he is. I feel like those guys are so hard to find. Why is that? I don't know. What's going on?

But I think you have to have a mix of that throughout your lineup. And if you don't, how do you convince guys to get out of the comfort zone and be someone like that? Can you find and mold and make players be those kinds of guys like can you have your player development right like you don't have that personality type you'd play like that oh colby would yeah i know but was that come naturally to you or do you make yourself do that yeah you know what i i kind of like just being a jerk on the ice it was like fun it was fun it was fun to like stir it up and then run away and hide behind other people that were bigger than me exist i have one of those but every once in a while yeah you didn't hide though yeah i knew i

had to show up like i knew i had to like answer the bell like that was part of it. You know, I knew I had to, but I think it's important though. But like I didn't, for me personally as a player, like I was first round pick, I thought I was going to be the skill guy top six, you know, when you come in and, you know, you're in the minors and you're kind of starting to figure out pro hockey. And once I, once I figured out how to be that guy, and I think it takes some guys a little while,

but do they push people that way? Like I had a trainer and I had some coaches telling me like, Hey, army, we need more of that guy. And I think it takes some guys a little while, but do they push people that way? Like I had a trainer and I had some coaches telling me like, Hey army, we need more of that there. That's a better game when I did that, you know? And I was like, Oh,

okay. So this is the ticket. Okay. I got to do this all the time. I'd rather score goals, you know? Yeah, I know.

And now, and now, now doing this, right. I, I always tell it to everyone like, Oh yeah, I saw you on day jardin commercials.

I see you doing this. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I saw you on Day Jardin commercials. I see you doing this. I'm like, yeah, I know. I wish I would have scored more goals. Wouldn't have to be selling these commercials. Yeah, exactly. Wow, wow. You look great in the commercials. I realize, like, hey, I got to play reckless.

I got to be that guy. Can you do that? Can you do that to prospects? Can you do that to guys in development? Can you push guys into these certain spots? And can you become that to see that hole or that void with your skill as like an enhancement right it's just an enhancement it's like you know my wife she goes out she looks nice but then she puts on her bag and the bag looks really nice right so it's like can you can you bring that bag out with you as far as you know

we're referring to these players and their nastiness i like followed the metaphor for a bit there and then at the end I got lost. Accessories. Very important. Stay with me, Borny. Sorry, buddy. Colby, are we talking about the Kraken enough here or maybe we should be talking a little bit more?

What they have done on the road is off the charts. They don't lose. They don't lose. They score goals through the depth of their lineup everybody's included their goaltenders are playing well they're deep they're fairly physical like they're feisty too a little bit to it like to the perfect degree right like you have to have that we're just talking about they've got that through their lineups and from their key guys right like that's been years i mean that guy's in your face that guy's on pox that guy wins battles he's he's so good and then you go down their entire lineup they got a bunch

of guys like that so um yeah i don't know what happened to him last year and i was even going what's ron francis doing i mean what an underwhelming like expansion draft and what happened here but man this year they've come out they've got saves uh and they've they found their legs with you know what they are in their depth and i, they've got saves, and they've found their legs with, you know, what they are and their depth. And I think they've got a confident group that believes that they're, you know, no one talks about them. It's like what Vegas had, I think, the misfit thing, you know. They've got it going on right now for sure.

Yeah, they've got it going on. They've got, you know, some good stories. They've got good production. And I'm telling you, when they're coming in now, like would go oh yeah okay the kraken because of last year they ain't saying that anymore this team is for real this team is pretty rock solid and uh i'm excited to see what they can do down the stretch here i'm excited to see what what they could turn into because i think they're going to be in a playoff series the way they're built i think they'll be a really tough out really tough yeah and one thing you know they have going for him is having a great goaltender here in toronto there's

like a bit of a quibbling between zamuri is it samsonov do you think you can win a cup as a tandem or do you think you got to have a clear-cut guy oh that's a good question it depends on what your team looks like i guess but i i like having the. I like having the one guy that's, you know, the guy that's going to get you there. And, you know, that's why, like, I look at Vegas, too, as an example in the West, right? Like, they got a team that, you know, they're in talks about being a contender for sure.

But, like, you know, Logan Thompson's a rookie goaltender. He's done really, really well. But do you put, like, the hopes of this team's expectations on that come playoff time? And Aiden Hill, is that the tandem? Is that they've been done really well, but do you put the hopes of this team's expectations on that come playoff time? And Aiden Hill, is that the tandem? They've been done really well. I'm not saying they haven't done well, or is John Gibson a guy that may be out there?

I don't know. I don't know what's going to happen, but I think you have to look at that if you're Vegas. Everybody just needs a Darcy Kemper. Just stop the pucks that you're supposed to stop and we're never going to pay you anyway. So, I mean, it seems to be that's where the goaltending model is going. Yeah, and I mean, it's crazy because I hate talking about the cap,

but when you talk about the cap and how you're going to build your team, where you allocate your money and what you believe in and what you think is important. And, you know, you look at Florida, you know, they got 10 million bucks tied up in a goalie Montreal with Carrie price. And we've seen, you know, tandems and in Vegas where they had Leonard and flurry and they were high price goaltending tandems. It's like, what are you going to do with that? So I can see how teams would be, you know, looking at, you know,

building their lineup the way they want with, you know, I call it like bargain shopping for goaltenders, I guess, and just finding a guy that's good enough. And I think there's lots of good enough goalies out there, you know. I think you can find some of those guys if it fits your team and, you know, what your makeup is and how well you play defensively. I think it could work. Well, we're lucky to have analysts that are just good enough.

And thanks for joining us on the show today. Thanks Colby. Appreciate your time, buddy. Thanks boys. Congrats on all your show success. Yes. Chiplets game notes. Yep. Check it out. For great reading.

Episode three. Absolutely. Yep. yep thanks boys you're the best colby armstrong everybody are you a hockey game on over there i do just checking in on seattle because they're playing uh currently currently oh they're they're at home i guess it is a they won seven day in the u.s they set an nhl record seven swept a seven game roadept a seven-game road trip. A seven-game road trip. Yeah. And not like a bunch of pushovers either.

They beat Calgary and Edmonton and Toronto. Boston. Boston. That was a road trip. I bet against them today. What's going on in the game, by the way? Goose eggs. Tampa caving them in 11-4 but

martin jones if they get 9 out of 14 that would be successful they go and get every point wow what a run and it's martin jones by the way that's kind of yeah running with it a little bit and i don't see martin jones being the guy when it's when the chips are down no yeah that's that's the part to me when we can talk about how incredible he was the first star of the week uh martin jones with unbelievable numbers and listen they're a pretty good team like i think their metrics are pretty kind but when you're getting that good a goaltending it can make you look like a world be right hold on for a second though i mean okay uh where are their numbers who jones overall i know really good like what's the save percentage it's high let me let's get out pull it up here for you pull it up um i'm just

getting the stats for the uh you know sport logic has a great graph and it's fairly common i think some of these places expected goals for per 60 and expected goals against per 60 like seattle is among the cluster of okay teams you know there's a percentage sammy i'm pulling it up right now under 900 yeah it's 895 yeah it's not off the charts but in the in the run when they were unbelievable this week okay he was three oh and oh with a 167 933 that there's a good reason they set an nhl record their goalies red hot but there's even a better reason why they're uh 26 12 and 4 so you're saying you think this team's legit i'm saying that it's not because merton jones is

standing on his head and spinning i'm saying because they're a good team. What's the other goalie's number? They're scoring. They're a well-balanced team. And they're a well-balanced team. They really are. Philip Grubauer? Is that the other goalie? Yes.

I'm looking it up right now. If you're Calgary and Edmonton, you're like, come on, Seattle. 885? Grubauer. Grubauer. He's an 885, yeah. They're not. Come on.

That says a lot about their lineup it does plus 28 goal differential on the season they are rolling rolling rolling speaking of the pacific division oh boy across the border from seattle the vancouver canucks in disarray yeah they need a veteran hockey man to come in and calm things down. Someone like a Jim. It's not good. I I'm with feuds. We had Mike feud on before the break. And I don't understand that press conference.

That major press conference plan going into it. I wonder where is the upside on it? What was accomplished here? What would you say? I think there was a desire to calm all of the negativity around the franchise. And I thought Fuda made a good point about saying that, put himself out there to take some bullets for the team. He got riddled.

Where's the GM? Just no reason like you could you could cover off a lot of things including you know there's there's no it's not like you had a major coaching change it's not like, you know, you've concluded anything anywhere. So why? Yeah. Well, you know, maybe give him some credit that people had a lot of questions for a franchise that's not doing so hot.

And he just wanted to go in. Well, the answer is that there aren't answers in some cases then you don't have a present you don't you don't just do it to appease people without having legitimate answers for them well what if the legitimate answer is i want to i want my i want to highlight the fact that my owner's not helping us out here you know call me crazy here but the whole bruce boudreaux thing has to be rutherford has been begging to put in his own coach. And Aquilini won't let him move on from Bruce Boudreaux. Or they're not ready to, right?

Want to spend the money. The way they're treating Bruce Boudreaux is a disgrace. It's unfair to Bruce Boudreaux, who has a long, distinguished career in the NHL. It's not like he's some rookie a long distinguished career in the nhl it's not like he's some rookie gm or rookie coach in the league it's a guy that's had a ton of success and respected guy well liked it's asked about him today rutherford said bruce is our coach right now would you like to hear the audio of him talking about that yes yeah, we all are. And, you know, there's lots of speculation out there. Bruce is our coach now, okay?

When we get off to a slow start this year, we, as a hockey staff, we watch the coaching staff closer. There's been times where we've had real good runs and the team's played pretty well, and there's been times where we haven't and and why is that and and and when i say this i'm not pointing this at bruce you know bruce is a friend i really like bruce and he's done good work here but this is what we review all the time and try to make a decision so all i can say is that bruce is our coach right now you don't need a major

press conference we can see that because behind the bench last game thank you bruce is our coach now thanks okay thanks jimmy again no upside whatsoever nobody learned anything new today you you there's nothing to have gained nothing but we did learn things new like when he said i don't know if he was joking when he said i thought we were tanking or whatever but he said they're moving towards a rebuild which they should have a retool yeah he said they prefer the term retool you know is that what the message you're right though if that was the message you wanted to deliver they didn't come out and clearly deliver that message. It was sort of in passing. You know what I didn't like about it today, too,

is that it's really the day that everybody's talking about a very popular player in Gino Ogic losing his battle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you went right up against that. Something like this could have been done days from now. It's interesting. A week down the road. Yeah.

Nothing earth shattering. Like one of the most popular players. One of the kindest guys. A lot of love for Gino Ochoa. In your franchise's history. Oh, yeah. Like he was right up there, man, with Pavel Burry in the 90s. They should.

Beloved. Maybe they'll do it posthumously or something, but they should have put him in the ring of honor and just let him be a part, let him be celebrated for this. Didn't understand that at all. No. But to Sammy's point, Kipper, like he's the president. Does the GM exist?

No. Where's the GM? He even said, Rutherford said, you know, I'm disappointed disappointed my ability to carve out cap space your ability the president and the gm the guy doing that i i know their whole management team's a joke it's not this year it's been a bad show like it's it's jimmy's team everybody else is just there for what reason just to fill out a business card i don't know listen it has been a mess from top to bottom you can't it's tough

to conclude it's a show out there it's done a good job uh you know what uh we talked about this earlier about uh this tanner pearson situation that has gotten very, very ugly. So what do you know about that? So what's going on? A lot of it's been reported already. He had wrist surgery, needed another one today. We'll need more in the future. And certainly right now, next season is not a given

that he will make a full recovery. And from what I hear, very much his career is in jeopardy with an infection. Really? Wow. It's like a surgeon made a mistake of some variety. Listen, don't know. Don't know, but that's why the PA is involved. Elliot reported that the PA, and this has happened on a couple occasions

when guys are looking at serious issues that maybe could cause you to believe that your career could be in jeopardy. So that's a standard. But certainly when we're looking at a guy that uh is he is he 30 yet he might have just turned 30 a legitimate what 20 25 goal scorer yeah another year on his deal i believe at uh over four million dollars so at, if he were to be done, pay him like a settlement type of thing? Whose insurance? I don't know.

I would believe that he would. There's a standard in the NHL, but it wouldn't be anything near to a personal insurance policy on you. Like there is PA insurance for a career or any, but the older you get, the less it is for obvious reasons. Yeah. But I don't think it would cover the potential for Pearson to look at his future earnings and say,

well, you know, I'm a legitimate 25-goal scorer here and I maybe could do it, I can do it for another five or six years, that should be worth $5 million for another six or seven years. He might be walking away from a future of $30, $35 million. In which case, lawsuits begin. Presumably. For sure. Which really, I found it interesting that Quinn Hughes would pipe up on this.

He said... I got the ball rolling on the presser, I bet. On Friday, he said that I feel bad for him. It wasn't handled properly. And you know, it's not a really good situation he's got there. And hopefully, he's going to be all right. That's what he said after the Vancouver's 5-4 loss to the tampa bay lightning according to the province's johnson that's huge for a guy like that to step up and say i i don't like what i've seen so far that that just didn't

that doesn't happen very often yeah that someone would again challenge the team and that's what's going on and from a few people that i've talked to that are close in on that situation the players feel like they don't think that they're properly assessed in vancouver really yes yeah wow that's an issue that's a big deal that's a big deal and i think that if you can read between the lines, maybe that's what Quinn's insinuating. Now, they did make major changes to their staff, Vancouver. Recently? Yes, recently.

Yeah. And they've got that sports science guy. And, again, I do believe that the players are questioning yeah a lot of people to me that doesn't matter if the doctor is doing a good job or not which may he may very well have got everything bang on and bad things happen but the second the team doesn't or the players don't trust that person unfortunately it's just you need a new person you know there's a bajillion well i shouldn't say that but there's plenty of good doctors out person you know there's a bajillion well i shouldn't say that but there's plenty of good doctors out there no reason to have a guy that makes people go i'm good thanks this is a just a s show yes do we want to play any of these other clips from rutherford

from the presser anything about horvat interest you yeah let's let's hear what he had to say we've we i believe have taken our best shot and the contract that we have on the table for bow right now i think is a fair contract for what he's done up until this year but it's certainly under market value for what he's done this year so we're you know we're in a pickle here okay he he's done this year. So we're, you know, we're in a pickle here, okay? He's had a career year, a career run, and he's looking for his money. He deserves it. I don't blame him.

But even with what we have on the table for him now, without any changes, which we know, whether it's through buyouts or something, there will be changes for next year, we're well over the cap on the projection. whether it's through buyouts or something, there will be changes for next year. We're well over the cap on the projection. That's bleak, man. That's how things work usually.

When you have a superstar who's having a great year, you get to pay him on what he was before the great year. That's how it's always worked. That is a very funny. It's a fair contract for what he's done always for what he's done prior you're right to what he's doing you're right until they don't think he's a superstar what are you saying yeah they don't think he's a superstar i don't think he's a star no guess who thinks he is for sure they don't want to get paid like and even if he doesn't think he is guess who has earned the right to get paid like one the guy who's playing like one bingo and that's that's in a nutshell they don't think he's the player elite yeah

they don't think he's a good passer too they don't think it's seven million or eight million or whatever he's going to cost nine million that they're going to get this year on repeat if they could get this year on repeat they'd probably pay the money for it but they don't believe that they'll get this again and they just picked jt miller when it was all said and done over him that's what they did i think he said something like that contract isn't going to affect what the canucks do down the road or something like that he said the cap's going up to 90 95 million which is some sort of comment to make about a contract that already looks like it's stifling them. But it is going to affect him in the next five months.

Immediately. Six months. It affects what they can do. Well, if that's what he's saying about the contract, then you have to trade him next week. You have to get the, don't you? He's coming out to the media. He's saying what he just said there. Yeah.

He says we're not going to get him. They're not going to get him, but we're offering him. He's not staying. We have no cap space. How are you not trying to maximize the value? Like, the earlier you trade him, you get a longer stretch with him. Wouldn't he be more valuable now than at the deadline? And he could get settled wherever he is.

He might get hurt playing every night. Yeah, but there's no market for him right now. None? No. Well, I don't know. You can go to Boston and say, let's do a deal, but you need the pressure from other teams to come into play right now, and it's still too early. Why don't we talk about him for the Leafs?

Cap space, right? Teams need to build cap space. The later you go to the trade deadline, the more you have to play with. Yep. And teams aren't ready to compete for Bo Horvat just yet. Yeah. I mean, do you think he'd be a fit with Toronto?

Yeah. Center? I didn't early, but I do now. Yeah. And I just think I didn't like Tavares against Bergeron. Yeah. I didn't early, but I do now. Yeah. And I just think I didn't like Tavares against Bergeron. Yeah. I didn't. Who would?

But the idea is you hope Bergeron has to play against Matthews, and that line can beat the Marchand line. You know, I've heard people say. Oh, my disadvantage doesn't guarantee you that, though. That's your last change. Well, they did want to match up against, was it Marner and Tavares it looked like, out of the gate?

But, like, if you want to beat the best to be the best and go through whatever, go through Mordor to get where you're going, Matthews and Marner are going to play together, and they have to beat Bergeron, Marchand, and Pasternak. They do. Great. They got to beat that line.

Spectacular. Not impossible. they're very good just a quick note that david pasternak three more points today gives him 12 points in his last six games his contract 11 goals in his last 12 games by the way i'm sorry 11 goals in his last 10 games on fire unbelievable what a player all right do you want to do on the if he wants if he wants to reset the market he's he might have to leave there pasternak yeah yeah i don't how many places it can pay though who knows cap space anywhere it's got a history of stupid cap of of getting guys on pretty good discounts. I don't think he's going to buck the trend.

You don't think he's going to buck the trend? Probably not. I mean, if he takes McDavid's number, that's a discount for Boston. McDavid's number? 13? 12 and a half. 12 and a half. I don't think he's going to get 12 and a half from Boston.

Panarin's making 11.6. Pasternak's significantly better. I think that if Boston wants to keep him, they're going to have to do what Colorado did with McKinnon and just go up 100 grand over the highest paid winger, which is Panarin. 11.7 or something. Yeah. And do you think they're willing to do that kipper

i don't know that's a great question because they just got mcavoy on a long term did they not for six years when's felino done that money's gonna they also after the game like literally they he must have signed it as he skated off the ice they They gave Zach a new deal. Yeah, that's a big one. Hey, Zach, a four years times 4.75? It was legitimately I was still stewing after them losing, and then I saw Frank Cervelli tweeted out that they had signed him to that. That surprises me. Bunting likes to hear that. Oh, my God.

Does he ever, Kippy? I don't know. Oh, that number. Yeah. Yeah. Just what are his numbers numbers he's got five goals is that right yeah bunting's really excited now 25 25 points in 42 games so far this season for pavel zaka 25 and 42 yeah 204 points in 428 career games what do you have last year 50 he had 36 and 70 dash 21 with the devils

yeah oh yeah now you tell me now tell me how bunting is gonna get less than him no it's that's a that is truly a that's the mckeough contract that's what you just got i think that's almost exactly the mcke of contract. Yeah. That makes agent bunting extremely happy. Man, so like even Rutherford saying the cap's going to go up to 90, 95, it's like, okay, in five years, like, you know, these deals still register next season. It's going to hurt. It's going to take a while still.

Even if they bump up the cap three million next year yeah like it's for some teams it may make a difference here and there but i don't know it all depends on who's re-upping and how much they want to take off of that as much as they can if i know humans well if you're austin right j, you have one more year, Adam. Hopefully then there's the cap, Joe. He's 11. What is he, 11-6? 11-6.

Yeah. He'll look at whatever the Pasternak number is and be like, I'm better than that guy. So. He was good too Saturday. Yeah. But he needed a big goal in the third. That was beyond cheeky, that little chip.

I thought the home run he hit from the defensive zone to the offensive zone was more impressive than the goal. You loved it, eh? Why? Because it was a flutter puck that had no momentum on it. Oh, he got a lot on it. And he just shortened up and he hit it all the way to the offensive zone, which led to a great four check by Marner.

Yeah. And then he dangled Bergeron, Lindholm, and the Vezina front runner, Allmark. But you like the baseball swing. I've seen guys do that a million times. I'm not sure I've ever seen somebody hit a home run from their offensive zone to the defensive zone. You just mentioned it too.

The four check where Marner gets in there and picks uh lynn holmes pocket great support by bunting too to be right there and then puts it on and i love the iso cam they had on matthews it was a great shot because he hits the home run and he's kind of he's hanging back a little bit and the second he sees marner win the puck battle head down as hard as he can possibly escape, picks up the puck in the slot, and cheeky little tuck there for Mr. Matthews. It was nice to see him play well in a big game

because I thought he was probably the best forward. And he is scoring more goals in tight. Yeah. Absolutely. But he's scoring less goals from far. Why? Well, he's got a nagging injury or something. He's got a nagging injury. Back injury or something.

I only say back because Matthews did have some comment about how it's something they need to manage for him. Which, ooh. To me, this is not me with any knowledge or anything. No. We got nothing. Wrist. Still wrist? Has to be.

You got Tanner Pearson's doc or what he's not he's not he doesn't have the same zip it's like it's watching a power pitcher take something off his fastball he's the one thing that really stands out to me is i can't remember a one-timer that he's kaboomed you know like where he's opened up on a power play and just hammered one. I feel like a lot of near misses. A lot less smooth handling the puck. Anyways, Cowboys Buccaneers tonight, Kippy. Next rewards, would you like Tom?

Love Tom. I don't know. It's a tough year for Tom with the divorce and all. I'm telling you something right now. No, hey, listen, that's part of it. Tom has never lost the Cowboys in his career. Cowboys choke all the time. Talk about pushing all your chips in. Tom got divorced from

a supermodel. You gotta play my app tonight. Yes, tonight I will. Next rewards. Next rewards. Whichever owns it. Alright. Okay. Our thanks to Mike Fuda. Yes. Colby Armstrong from Chicklets Gamelets game notes see i got that right which you pooped all over no i did literally i just don't know it i don't know it as well as the real you took it to the poop or the game notes thank you oh i did i did i did all right this

game's going to the our show's going to the crapper we're back tomorrow real kipper and born