Real Kyper & Bourne - Multiple Thoughts with Elliotte Friedman

Episode Date: October 18, 2023

Sportsnet's Elliotte Friedman joins Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne to discuss the future of Nick Robertson cracking the main roster or another NHL team, if the Ottawa Senators are in a similar situation with the Leafs and their young players with Shane Pinto, the NHL supporting causes through their uniforms, the Chicago Blackhawks holding back Connor Bedard from media availabilities, the possibility of promoting the league more and who will sign first; William Nylander or Elias Lindholm. Then, Kyper, Bourne and Sam McKee (25:56) discuss Vancouver Canucks' head coach Rick Tocchet calling out his team through three games, what makes a great hockey coach, and ESPN's list of the top 100 NHLers. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right let's welcome everybody into our national hour on the real kipper and born show it's nick kiprios justin born sammy mckee and elliot friedman we are live on sportsnet sportsnet 960 in calgary sportsnet 650 in vancouver and as always this hour of real kipper and born brought to you by bet 365 you know elliot we've only asked you like a dozen times in the last two years to come on our show and nothing that's not true national tv and i can hear you scratching the door on the other side but thanks i don't know this is an accurate representation of how it's gone it may not door on the other side. But thanks. I don't know if this is an accurate representation of how it's gone.

It may not be accurate, but it's funny. It is. And that's all that matters. How are you? Good. How are you doing? Good. Good.

Okay. Where do you want to start? Because we've got so much to get into. We're going to talk Rick Talkett, obviously, maybe a little later on in the show. But as always, fresh out of the oven 32 thoughts did you have a chance to read i did i did you know we find one or two we just there's 32 okay you gotta call it you gotta call it what berkey calls it 32 turds oh gosh we you know we just finished uh the leafs portion of the show but i will just wrap it up the one

tidbit in there that did uh kind of catch my eye a little bit as we struggle here to put together the best third line for the toronto maple leafs and what makes sense was just the really good start that one of their prospects nick robertson has gotten off to in the american hockey league five points in two games and not a lot of depth scoring here in toronto is there some frustration with the player and his inability to crack the NHL club right now? Well, you know, I think that, I don't think this is going to continue much longer if he doesn't get a look in the NHL.

I think that, and I think the Maple Leafs know that. You know, I think they know that the guy would want, I mean, he arrived in the bubble, right? Like this is four years. If you're not going anywhere in four years in organization you're going to want to go somewhere else so i think what has happened here is that they sent him down but they told him look we're only carrying a minimum 12 guys people always get hurt people always struggle um if you put up if you do well down there, there's going to be an opportunity for you.

And I think he bought that. He started it with the right attitude. But you guys know, the longer that goes before that chance happens, the more he's going to think, I need to get a fresh start elsewhere. Yeah. As we know, through the pandemic, a flat salary cap, trades are so hard. We saw one the other day.

Did you break the... Friedman? No, I didn't. I did not. You should have an incentive. He didn't call you? It's not Friedman breaking the family chat? People think that we're related.

We're actually not related. I should clarify that. We knew that when we first saw you on skates that's right i had i had people in vancouver dming me yesterday like is this a relative no no it's not how tough is it out there and how tough is on you as an insider to constantly look for for news that isn't there when it comes to trades well nick, Nick, you've, you've done that job as well as anybody has, like, you know what it's like, you know, I mean, you're like, you know, Justin read the piece that there wasn't a lot of trade rumor stuff.

Cause there just really isn't a lot there right now. I think the thing is right now, as you said, the cap is tight. At the beginning of the year, everybody's saying, okay, I just want to see what my team looks like. I mean, you don't get too many situations like Conor Garland where an agent is given permission to talk to other teams like two days before the season.

It's very, very unusual. So it's tight right now. There's not – and the thing about Robertson is, you know, like if it gets to a situation where the Leafs think about moving him, they're going to say, like, this is a talented young guy. They're not just going to give him away. Right. So, you know, we'll see how that works out over the next few weeks.

Is there a similar situation in Ottawa? They got a free-up cap for Shane Pinto. Yeah. But they're not necessarily ready to give up on anybody or just for the sake of making a trade here. No. ready to give up on anybody or just for the sake of making a trade here. No, and I think one of the real problems with that one, Nick, is that in those situations, it's not only, teams are kind of saying, not only will we, if you want us to take the player you want us to move,

whether it's Joseph or somebody else, what are you going to give us to do it? Like Philadelphia said, we want a certain prospect. It's been reported a lot, Boucher. And, you know, they didn't want to do that. First rounder? Could they get a first or second rounder? Joseph's a good player. And Joseph's off to a good start.

But an expensive one. But the other thing, Nick, I think there were teams that were saying, we want a prospect and a high pick. And Otto was like, we're not doing that. Seems crazy to me. And that's, I guess, the salary cap, really just handcuffing teams. Because he's a useful guy. Teams would love to have, obviously. If it's okay, we just kind of skip around the league.

Got a whole bunch of things. It's your show. I'm the guest here. Just tell me what you guys want. I was interested in kind of a nugget discussing Pride Tape. That's been a hot topic around the league. I've talked to some people who think that it's not impossible that, you know enough public pressure could get the league to bend back on pride tape what are your thoughts or what are you hearing about any potential for sort of players to represent a

cause that seems to mean a lot to a lot of people well i don't know how far along it is but i do know that one of the things has been discussed is have a night like the nfl does um i forgot what it's basically there's one cause for my cause my cleats or something like that so there's one week a year where you can put anything on your cleat you want as long as it's like a charitable non-profit organization and the thing that's really well done about the nfl does is is the players all post videos of themselves unboxing their cleats on social so people can see what they support. They've actually done a really nice job with it. And I do think, and I heard last week this took a big turn,

that there was a realization here that this has to, they can't go the whole year like this. Is there a sense, Elliot, between the NHLPA or the NHL head office that there are discussions on how can we find common ground? Yes, they have been talking about it and this is one of the things they're talking about. Do you have one night a year or two nights

a year where players can go out there in the warm-up and wear whatever they want, as long as it's a cause? Because, you know, Nick, I don't like the fact not only the pride tape, but I don't like the fact that hockey fights cancer jerseys won't be worn this year. It's ridiculous.

The Los Tiburones jerseys last week, San Jose couldn't wear those. And they were, I thought, a real nice part of fun in NHL. So why not have a night where everybody can wear what they want? And I am under the impression that has been discussed. I just don't know how far it is along. You know, the unboxing video is an interesting thing. Like, it promotes a lot of individuality for the players, which is the thing the league thrives on, right?

Having these people. Your piece led a lot on Conor Bedard. Yeah. And the amount of interviews and media he did leading up to it. He did none in Toronto. Yes. Which some people weren't happy about. Yes.

What are your thoughts on the league trying to create stars? Go ahead. I was just going to say, and especially you, because I heard you last week, we are in the entertainment business. I'm sorry, did you learn to sing and dance this summer that I missed? Well, if you've ever heard me sing or ever seen me dance, I was at Pitbull last night. My dancing was not very good.

My son loves Pitbull. We took him to it. My dancing is not very good, and neither is my singing. You know, look, the Toronto thing was weird. I'm not going to deny that. But I really find it hard to criticize Bedard after everything he did in the last week. You wouldn't criticize the Chicago Blackhawks, not him. Yeah, he did everything.

And our guys who are producing his games, they said he was incredible to deal with, like really good to deal with. The thing is, like, you know, I don't disagree it was a lot, but if you want to grow the game, this is what your fans are demanding now. So I think the answer is not as much dial him back as someone else or another team has to step up and say okay this guy's done a lot now i gotta do something or

now we gotta do something like you know one of the conversations i had this summer that really stood out to me was was an executive saying to me you know mls is coming for us. There's an F1 race in Vegas right now. People love Drive to Survive. Oh, yeah. Like, these sports are coming for us now. And not just us. They're coming to North America. The cult of personality among this next generation is very big,

and we have to embrace ours. I'm on the other side of just protecting this kid. And since the moment he went to rookie camp in Chicago, he's had this it must feel like he's already played 82 games and for that kid kid but i think the bigger picture it's important listen yeah but but dependent on an 18 year old now moving forward in that capacity is way too much i'm glad the chicago blackhawks backed off and yeah maybe maybe he should have spoke at some point after the game in Toronto. It should have been handpicked at that availability,

which would have meant back off something else, somewhere else. Trade off. Right? And trade it off. But moving forward, man, it's going to be tough for him in that market, that major market, to carry that much of a burden on his shoulders at such a young age.

I don't disagree with you. I think he did his job this week. My point is now I think it's incumbent on someone else or another team to say, okay, one of the star players to say, I'm going to be that guy next week. I'm going to do some things that are a little bit different. Like, he can't do it in hockey, but one of the things that really blew me away was I was watching a Sunday

night baseball game this week where this year, where I think it was Devers from the Red Sox is wearing a mic during the game and he's talking to the booth and he's like, Hey guys, wait, I got to catch this pop-up. And like, it's, I'm like, wait a sec. If they can do that, what can we do? That's more interesting. Nick Taylor did an interview walking down, was it 15, Sam? During the Open he won, the Canadian Open.

So the league just, we can't claim that our players. It's baseball and golf. It's not hockey. You're going to do an interview and I'm chasing you? I'm going to take your head off. Excuse me for a second. This guy wants to kill me. I'll be right back. But there's got to be something we can

think of. That's the thing. Can we move the line? Well, listen, I mean Nick Taylor's talking during the course of play between shots. Could you do it between shifts? No one's trying to kill Nick Taylor. No one's trying to kill you on the bench either. I don't actually think this is a good idea.

I'm just saying is there something we can do? There might be a coach that wants to kill you on the bench either i don't actually think this is a good idea i'm just saying is there is there something we can do there might be a coach that wants to kill you yeah that's a really good point that's what i wonder is there's something we can do that moves the line that's all i'm asking yeah just play hockey and be great yeah i would lally it's sometimes like the game is the game should be good enough. I don't argue with you. But that's just not where it is now coverage-wise, right? It's just not there. Like influencers and individuals are kind of what people follow now. Look at my son on YouTube chasing around these random,

I don't want to say what I think they are. Actually, I'm kind of curious now. Don't bring your home issues to work, okay? We are joined by Elliot Friedman, of course, of Hockey Night in Canada and 32 Thoughts. Okay, Elliot, who signs first, Nylander in Toronto or Lindholm in Calgary? That's a great question.

That is a great question. How about are they both soon or are they both late? Figure it out. Yeah, you know what? I'll say this. I think at this point in time that I believe more that Nylander will stay in Toronto over Lynn Holm in Calgary, if you were to ask me today, but that doesn't necessarily mean I think that it's going to happen anytime soon. Like, I think Nylander really wants to stay in Toronto,

but I don't think they're close. I think he's made that clear to everybody. I don't think that. I think Lindholm, the situation with Lindholm is, I think he's willing to stay in Calgary, providing they get to a number. And I think those two things are slightly different. You know, looking at some other Canadian teams here, we had a velarde injury in winnipeg last night does that open up some

movement potentially for whether it be garland or for ottawa um you know is there something that could happen there to kind of loosen up the market well don't forget uh velarde's coming back it's not like he's out for the year so four forever, yeah. So four to six weeks. You know, the one thing is, like, I kind of wonder, I really thought Nashville was going to be the team for Garland, but now I'm not convinced anymore. Winnipeg, I could see Winnipeg being a guy like Garland because he's got term. But again, I had someone tell me, like,

pump the brakes right now. They can't do it um i wonder about columbus for garland i i've wondered about washington for garland um i just think about winnipeg is he's coming back it's not like doc where he's out for the year and you can add someone and not have to worry about the cap and on the ottawa thing norris being back tonight everything's okay with josh norris he's just ready to go I think you find that strange yes I think what's going on there I think I got the sense that he just wasn't comfortable like physically yes yeah or mentally or actually you're right I should say that I would say meant more mentally than physically because I know there

was a conversation there about putting him on LTIR like about a week before the season, and it was just decided that that was not what was going to happen. He just had to get, sorry, mentally comfortable. I think that. Ever since Mike Babcock signed in Toronto, so much attention has been on coaches' contracts and extensions. I know you've broken many, including maybe Todd McClellan's latest extension. Yeah, one year. In LA.

One year. The big one coming up, which I find so interesting, is Rod Brindamore. And he's publicly stated already that, I think he was asked, and it was almost like one of those passive-aggressive comments where it'll sort itself, but I really want it done now kind of comment. Where do you think that stands? Because Rod Brindamore, to me, is a top coach.

Anybody would want him. Anybody would want him. And if he was willing to go anywhere, he could be the highest-paid coach like that. I agree. But what he's done is basically tell everybody i don't want to coach anywhere but carolina and now you've got a frugal owner who's already very tight when it comes to spending money hearing that i got a coach maybe the best one in the league right now who is not willing to go anywhere i can i can low ball them all i want

well do you have any reason to believe in brindamore's case that's changed that he would go anywhere i hope so okay i'm lying and saying yes i really hope so because i don't think it's a good thing well i look at it this way br Brendan Moore, one of the reasons that he wanted to stay in there is because one of his kids is a young player, really good player, right? Unless that's changed, I don't think that he's going anywhere. You know,

first of all, Dunn has spent money on the players. You're right. He's tighter behind the scenes. There's no question about it. I remember, Nick, there were some coaches who were upset at Brendan Moore the last time he signed because they're like you know it's it's less than your market value and the one thing i remember saying to one of them was you have to use the old david falk was michael jordan's agent he had a book called the bald truth

and they asked him about when you're in a situation like that and he would say that's your situation that's not my situation and that was his and that's what coaches have to do I just think unless Brenda Moore's mind has changed and he's willing to go somewhere else then that's probably the way it's yeah and I don't belittle anybody that has different reasons for signing including family and commitments and all of that. I get all of that. But there's a certain line where you end up really taking advantage of a situation. And I think it's important for Tom Dundon not to do that. Yeah.

Because there's a professional industry that's going on. And there's also people within that organization. And if Rod Brendamore takes a huge discount, then it's easy for Tom to go to anybody in that organization and go, hey, listen, if this guy's willing to work for Les, you can too. And I just think it sets a bad precedent for people around Rod Brendamore if he lowballs himself that much well technically i'm not supposed to talk about my own contract negotiations but i i do think of that i

i i do think of that yeah yeah with tom dundon uh one of the things going on carolina right now they don't have an american hockey league team right right what's good what's going on with that how is that working well it hasn't gone over very well. Like the NHL has made it very clear they're not happy about that. And, you know, like someone said to me they could not believe that Carolina got found places for everyone. Yeah. But the one issue I understand that was a problem was they sent some players to the ECHL.

Now, under the CBA, if you're on an entry-level contract, they can send players to the ECHL. Now, under the CBA, if you're on an entry-level contract, they can send you to the ECHL. So it's not like they're violating any rules, but I heard some agents and players were really upset. Right. And I heard the Players Association was putting pressure on, let's sort this out. I think they'll eventually get a team.

I don't think the league will allow this to happen again next year, but I think in the short term, they're trying to get some guys out of the CHL and into the A. So just earlier, we were talking about creating different buzzes for the NHL, growing the game. Last week, I think you had something on the NHL draft, maybe having a different look. Yes, they sent out a memo yesterday or today.

And basically, the draft that we've been accustomed to watching year after year could look substantially different in the future. They're talking about the NFL-NBA way, which is that the teams stay in their own offices or wherever they want to do the draft from, and only the prospects go to the location.

And Nick, personally, I don't like it. I love the draft for my own self. Well, you get everybody under one roof. And I'll tell you, I think there's a lot of people who really do like that. You get to see everybody. You can network. It does come across a little dry.

Well, I agree. They have to speed it up. They have to speed it up. I agree with you on that. But the only problem with doing it in your own location, Nick, is you remember the COVID year 2020, rounds two to seven were like nine hours. Like it was crazy. But I think they have to find a way to liven it up or speed it up a little bit.

Maybe not every team thanking the home city or congratulate the team that won the Stanley Cup. That should be illegal. When they hate the team that won anyway. But like I heard last weekend, I had people tell me it's definitely going to change. Then I heard today some people said it'd be the other, not as convincing. You know, one of the things that Gary Bettman, the commissioner of the National Hockey League, can do for certain owners is that's a nugget. That is a great point.

One I wish I would have written about today. Right? Yeah. What do you mean? Well, I wish I would have written about today. Right? Yeah. What do you mean? Well, listen, I'll give you the draft. Yeah. That means merchandise. That means buildings.

That means hotels. That means money in your city. Yeah. Now, you can still get the draft. You can still host it and make it a party. Like, the one thing is, like, one of the things I love watching every year is the NFL draft. ESPN had this old video of Jets fans freaking out at all their bad picks

at the draft. Like, you can make it a fan-friendly event. I just don't know, will people travel as much? I mean, maybe they will because the prospects will be there, but if the teams aren't there. Yeah. Any big surprises this early? I know Edmonton and Toronto have given up some goals,

but what strikes you? Vegas 4-0. Like, they look, you know how hard it is to repeat. Like, they're dialed in. I came this close and I went Dallas. I just, I wanted. You're picking Vegas? The other team, you know what?

I'm wondering about Seattle. Like, that was the team that led the league last year. Underwhelming start. Five on five goals. But they're not sneaking up on anybody now. Now everybody, exactly. Like, you know, hey, we got to be ready to, you know, I got to tell you too, the team,

just because of the way their year started and I have to say, I'm a little worried about Columbus. You know, the Babcock thing, you know, Kent Johnson gets scratched game one like like i can't like there's a lot on the line in that organization a lot on your most job probably i'm saying that a lot speaking of toronto and edmonton i think both fan bases can come to the conclusion they could use maybe another D or just have a few guys re-slotted, but they're not out there, are they, Elliot? But two teams have some decisions to be made

as far as their blue lines moving forward is Calgary and Carolina. Yeah. Which one strikes you as making their defense available? Where can the Leafs get their next player? Or Edmonton. I think Carolina. Or Vancouver. Vancouver's looking for someone to play with Quinn Hughes.

Yes, they were looking at Fabbro, I think, but now with Shanhurt, they can't do that. I think Carolina will keep their guys this year, unless they get a trade. Pesci's the big one. Yeah, I think they'll keep them. Unless a deal drops on their table that they think they can win, makes them even more likely to win the Stanley Cup,

I think they let Pesci play out the year. The only way I think he gets traded is if they think it makes them better. Calgary's interesting. I think they've taken a run at Tanev recently. I think they've taken a run at Hannafin recently. Vancouver you're talking about? No, Calgary. Keeping them.

Keeping them. Okay, all right. Taking a run. I don't know if they've taken as much of a run at Zannifin recently vancouver you're talking about calgary keeping them okay all right taking a run i don't know if they've taken as much of a run at zadorov but calgary is trying to see if they can keep a couple of these guys is there any sense at all that hannifin's got um i want to go back to the u.s thing he did last year he he absolutely told them last year he wanted to go back to the states but when he came back this year I think he left the door open a bit I don't know how easy it's going to be it's going to be a big deal

but I do think he told them that he would talk to them and I believe they have talked to him the other one is Edmonton when the Leafs were training Lafferty Edmonton liked lafferty yeah and they offered him there for day rna and at the time and that's a big guy yeah wait the oilers offered day no the leafs asked for day and and uh they couldn't get it done because they had injuries it was the time when they had their it was they were trying to get their roster. That's a guy.

Now, I'll tell you this. Woodcroft and Manson love De'Arne. He's a real project of theirs. But I know that's a guy that Toronto likes, and he's not making a ton of money. He just wants someone big to defend. He does that as a priority. But the thing is, if Edmonton's trying to win the Cup,

I don't know. They trade him. But that's a guy that the Leafs liked. And when they were talking to Edmonton about Lafferty, they asked for him. Nice to see the Oilers clean up a few issues. Campbell made some, at the beginning of the game, they weren't very good.

And Campbell was, but geez, like, if I was the Nashville Predators, the next time Oilers come to town, I would kidnap Dreisaitl and not let him in the building. He just owns another four points. He just destroys those guys. Every game he scores. Every game. Every game.

Should we get him out of here? What do you got on tap tonight? So this feature tonight is with Tim Stutzla, and Nick, it is one of the biggest. You know that Steve Buscemi meme, like, how do you do fellow kids? Yes, sir. This is a how do you do fellow kids with Elliot Friedman. Are you skateboarding with Stutzla?

It's not quite like that, but it's not far off. On a couch or listening to Pitbull with him? No, I don't want to give it away. Are you taking face-offs with him? No, I would never embarrass myself like that. Well, now we have to watch. We will be watching.

I'll tell you this. It is a piece about, we talked about players showing their personalities. This is a good one. But I'm 30 years older than the guy. There are times in the interview I really feel 30 years older. Bring us Jimmy Stu. Looking forward to it. Really appreciate you coming by.

My pleasure, guys. Thanks for having me. Elliot Friedman, Hockey Night in Canada. Take a quick break there, Sammy boy. All right, and then we're going to come back and discuss Rick Tockett using one of those bullets that Elliot talks about the coaches have maybe two or three times a year.

And was it too early for Rick Talker. Oh, it was great. All right. Don't give it away. Sorry. Come back. Come back on the Real Kipper and Bourne Show after these words. All right, welcome back to the Real Kipper and Bourne Show.

Still plenty of meat on the bone, including Rick Tockett tearing a strip off his team after a 2-0 loss in Philadelphia. Also in the discussions will include ESPN's top 100 current players that they voted on through, I don't know, 40, 50 people. Yeah. And it struck a nerve with some current players. So we'll get into that as well. But first, over to you, Sammy. It's game time presented by Bet365.

Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus, Ontario only. Please play responsibly. And here's what I, we haven't got into this yet, and I wanted to bring this up with you guys, that the regular season awards, and I wanted to quiz you guys on the favorites

for some of these awards. I think it's pretty obvious who the favorite for the Calder is. It's Conor. Conor Bernard, yeah. Who do you think the favorite for the coach of the year? The Jack Adams. Rod

Brindamore because they're a very good team and everyone loves them. No. Kipper, your guess? My guess would be This is riveting right now. Billy Electric. Who'd you say?

I forgot already. You said Brynden Moore? Yeah. I'll go... Borny, you get another guess. I'll go DeBoer in Dallas. Keefe. Nope.

Neither of those are correct. Is that an underdog? It's Lindy Ruff. Lindy Ruff is a favorite. It's six and a half to one. Surprising to you? Coming out benching Timo Meier. Guy who means business.

DeBoer is 14 to one, by the way. Sheldon Keefe down the list a little bit at 14 to one. Who do you think the favorite for the Vesna is? It's going to be Sorokin. Both of those men are the co-favorites both both at new york tri-state area both at six to one and the last thing i have for you is if you want to bet on the art ross trophy on bet 365 it's connor mcdavid is minus 200 or the field at plus 165 literally every other player in the league it's like back in the day with Tiger.

You're betting on an injury. When you'd bet. That's all you're doing. Yeah, that's it. There's just no chance anyone has any more points. And the last thing quickly, you know, we talked about the Calder. I don't know if you guys have watched

Logan Cooley at all this year. Yeah, he's good. Any value, any chance? Yes. Someone else? Logan Cooley? Yeah, Fantilli as well for me. He's 12-1.

If these guys stay healthy, there's a chance. I mean, not a great one from what I've seen so far. If he had talked to the media in Toronto, he maybe had a better chance. It did. Did you notice Bedard

on a four-on-four situation coming off, I think, a commercial break, never saw the ice? I did notice that. I brought it up to you in the box. In Toronto? Yeah, I said, is he not coming out here? See, again, I think that's a good sign. You just cannot give this guy the whole buffet.

Give him the buffet. No. So you were talking about how. Is that for me? Yeah yeah this is kind of related before you close it out connor mcdavid you're talking about how he's like peak tiger or whatever so connor mcdavid just became the fifth fastest player to get to 550 assists random amount whatever fifth fastest uh his games play total will be 572 gretzky did it in 386. Oh my God. Yeah.

Hundreds less games it took. And you guys are mentioning Just goofy. Quickly, you're mentioning with Riege about how bad the Drysaddle owns the Preds. Yeah.

Did you see the stat I put in here? No. Goals in the last 12 meetings. Leon Drysaddle has 22 and the entire Predators roster has 28. Oh. So that's how you own it.

You. All right. That was Game Time presented by Bet365. A lot of those are on the Power Play, by the way. Visit the app

for the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. All right.

Good job, Sammy. Thanks, buddy. I've kind of been teeing this up for the last little while because I can't ever recall. Listen, I've been in a few rooms where coaches have taken a strip or two off of me or my teammates,

but I can't ever recall being on any team that started out 2-0 against a Stanley Cup favorite. And then hearing what we heard from Rick Tonkin. Go lose one game and just get a public lash there's three separate clips and each of them are better than the next you drive the bus just um derrick just roll with with number one first of all if you could do that for us well i mean i i can't even pick one guy who played well other than Demko was unreal. He was great tonight, and the rest of the guys weren't. Okay.

That's a nice appetizer. Can we please, Derek, have the entree, the second clip, please? We just got some guys. They better pick it up. I mean, I saw a lot of, you know, I don't like to use the word soft, but I didn't see you guys competing at all. And that's alarming. But saying that, you know, you win two games.

You know, we said we didn't, let's not get too high. It's the same thing, you know, obviously it's a bad effort. Let's not get too low. But we got to, obviously, we got to go to the drawing board with some guys here. They got to pick it up. Boy, like, can't throw goose eggs again. Okay, before we go to the third one. Before we go to the creme brulee.

Yeah, before we go to the enchilada there, I don't know a more insulting word for a hockey player. I don't care what generation you came from. And soft. Yeah. Like, God, it's like that one. That one should sting every player. It's probably if you were to power rank the awful things you don't want your coach to call you, soft might be it.

Number one is how he played soft. That's the number one thing. He caught himself. He says, I don't want to use it, but I'm using it. Right? But that's how pissed he was. Close it out here.

Let's get the dessert here. We weren't smart everywhere. You know, times when we should shoot the puck, I got in front, we'd pass it. When it was time to pass it to the flanker, we shot it and it got blocked. It would just, you know, it's a good lesson for us. You know, it's a good lesson.

You know, who are we to think we're anybody? God, Rick. No, no, you know who he's, he stole that. Who stole that line? Who do you think you are? The bowler, Pete Weber you know who he's, he stole that. Who stole that line? Who do you think you are? The bowler, Pete Weber. Who do you think you are? I am.

Do you remember that one? Who do you think you are? I am. Who do you think you are? I am. Wow, Derek, what an on cue drop. That's exactly it. That's one of the best videos of all time.

If you want to go back and have a really fun watch, there's a half an hour lead up to what happens. It's a dramatic story. It's incredible. He's MFing a guy in the stands. He has to make a bunch of strikes in a row to win it. A strike to win it. A strike to win it.

Who do you think you are? I am. Elliot, before he left in our discussion, we talked about coaches and how many times can you go to a post-game comment like that? Is there twice a year, three times a year? Do you want to do it this early? Do you want to do it at Christmas? I'd probably say for some guys that may be true, but I would not think Rick Tockett would fall into that this season.

He gets 20 bullets. Oh, he could go to this all season long. He ain't going anywhere. Yeah. And just watching the clips of Rick, he's just looking the reporter straight in the eye and then just like, yep, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, and then eviscerates themiscerates them he's not trying to craft some political answer he's answering the questions and he's just like no secrets here soft soft you know to me you don't come out in game three and respond like that if you didn't have a

preconceived notion of your team you know like if you believe that you are a hard battle tested team john cooper doesn't come out and say that about the tampa bay lightning in game three talk it probably has held this thought and you know who i thought of listening to that bruce boudreaux i thought of boudreaux who's a nice guy and behind the scenes never do that would never do it but would think it and would say it to his staff and would address it internally. But, like, I think this is the reputation of that team. Talkett's just saying what everyone thinks. They got some superstars who sometimes don't necessarily show up

with the same amount of jam they need on a nightly basis, and I think he's addressing, if we don't, we're going to be the old Canucks. This is the Talk at Canucks. We don't want to be that. And the Rick Talkett I know is like, he's an attention to detail guy. So if he could see something along the wall that would go past everybody, and he'll call his players out on a battle along the wall that he would either have thought

that you didn't fight hard enough or you didn't approach it properly. But this is what he wants out of this team is that attention to detail. And they were very bad. Yeah, they weren't good. They were very bad. And I've undergone an evolution myself

in like what I believe a great coach is. You know, I used to think that there was all this sort of like system work you could do and tweaks and changes hockey it's so hard to make those changes in game because guys you know there's so many moving parts for a system to work that really all a coach can do is address these things the effort the positional play and the simple structure that you have there's only so much you can do. And so Tuckett is perfect because he hammers those things. Wow. And just to add to why I think Tuckett would get a lot more bullets

than most NHL coaches, just you don't even have to be old enough to remember he played. You just go google his name everything okay this guy was a fourth liner he was a third liner he was a second liner and he was a star scoring almost 50 goal seasons he's won cups yeah he's battled everybody in his history and gordie howe hattricks bought the biggest He bought the toughest of guys in the league. When he says something, and he's been able to look you in the eye and say, hey, I invented that.

Don't bring it to me. I invented that. Then you're not going to get away with anything with him, and it has to feel a little different than if it was somebody that didn't necessarily do it. It's just common sense. And then you got adam foot down the bench and there's another guy guys who can there's another guy that says

come on i know what it takes i know effort i know when you want something bad enough and you didn't want it on that shift and gonchar is there but i don't think he's there much more than maybe 25 30 percent of the time but there's another guy that I got a lot of time for. And also, I feel like if you let the leash go too far, it gets harder to pull it back in. And I think he feels like he's walking the dog. The dog started to get away in the leash a little bit. We're pulling that thing right back in. We're not going to start with bad habits, bad effort.

You know, Talkit is trying to make this team a playoffoff team which it can be if he gets the most out of them so you know maybe it's too early to use your bullets of some team but talk it the Canucks with their history I'm fine with it all right uh we also teed up this ESPN that uh some some players commented that in Pittsburgh, I guess the big snub was on Malkin. It kills me to give credit to lists and polls. I know. But this one is truly offensive. It's tremendously poor. Gino missed out on the top 100 in history.

Yes, which he is. And people call him Mr mr 101 around there like he's new zealand alone definitely going one-on-one with uh with old malcolm's gonna end well and now he's 101 on the current so the the list on espn was the the list of 100 players they expect to be the best players in 2022 23 so they expect the best seasons out of these guys this next season. 100 players, he's not on it. Now, that would be shocking enough.

Yeah. You know, a guy who's been a point-for-game season just last year, he was, you know, over 80 points, you know, at 6'4", and everything else. He is nasty and all that. He didn't get included in their 10 honorable mentions. Here are the honorable mentions alex tuck chris crider zegras terry noah dobson beau horvat carter verhege fantillion cooley you've

never played in the league adrian kempe noah dobson noah dobson ahead of evgeny malkin so penguins players are pissed they're not happy about the lack of respect. What is it about voting that we can't get Evgeny Malkin in there? I look at the actual list. Behind Toffoli? I look at the actual list and the first two names on the list are Thomas Hertel and Ryan O'Reilly.

Who do you want on your team this year? Patrick Lyon is on the list. Tavares, Caulfield, Robert Thomas. Yeah. Are you surprised that people care about this? They had to forget him. They must have forgotten him. They had to have forgotten him.

I do wonder why we get so obsessed and worked up on lists. I know. This is the content producer's dream. I would never have gone to this without this story. I know. But, Kipper, there's one thing to put together a controversial list, and then there's another one to just do something

bad. You know what else is crazy, though? Like, the lack of respect for the, you know, everyone loves the guy with the potential, but Sidney Crosby is 23rd on the list. Which, sure, Sid, maybe not a top 5, top 10 guy in the NHL. Next on the list, do you want Sebastian Ajo on in the NHL next on the list do you want Sebastian

Ajo on your team this playoff year or do you want Crosby yeah I want Crosby do you want Tim Stutzla who's ahead of him or do you want Crosby yeah you could tough one tough one see again the whole thing about lists and when you start having these conversations and let's go to just the simplest one, the greatest NHL player, you know, ever played. It's like, what do you base your decision on? And what do I base my decision on? Is it with 50 people? You think we'd find some sort of, no, there's 50 really dumb people sometimes.

There's a lot more than that. And they, they, oh, he's, he's the best skater. That makes him the best. This, that makes him the best. That it's like, more than that. And they, oh, he's the best skater. That makes him the best this. That makes him the best that. And it's like, no. No. It doesn't. So this is the top five.

Jason Robertson's 12th. This is the top five. Connor McDavid, number one, obviously. Cal McCarr, two. Nathan McKinnon, okay. Pretty good top three. And then they have Jack Hughes ahead of Austin Matthews. Oh, we just set Toronto on fire.

They have Jack Hughes ahead. Guys want a heart trophy. They have him ahead of Leon Dreisaitl. Oh, offensive. Again, if, but. How, this is offensive. Okay, if you just simply take away Austin, Austin's ability to shoot the puck in the net.

Where is the rest of his game? I don't know. He was seventh in Selke Trophy voting last year. He's like a top five face-off guy. Who would you rather have tomorrow? Jack Hughes and those things, Kip. Who would you rather have on your team tomorrow, Jack Hughes or Austin Matthews? Oh, my God.

No, no, no, no, no. I'm not. I'll take the 50, 60 goal score. Okay, thank you. Okay, I'll take the 50 goal score. But in two or three years, I don't know. We'll see. Jack's pretty good.

Oh, listen, that's not a knock on Jack Hughes. It's really not. You're very good for it. But it's enough to make you think about it. The subjectivity of it is... And we've given them what they wanted. I know. The one thing that kills me is that when people,

when you talk about players and you go, oh, he's a top five guy in the league, top ten guy in the league, and then you start writing it down and you're like, boy, there's a lot of good guys. There's a lot of good players. They have Marner 20th. Thoughts?

Yeah, for me, he should be a lot higher than that he's behind elias petterson caril kaprizov brady kachuk yeah barkov hellebuck box jason robertson he's behind yeah out of here sorry bad list anyway they put out a bad list sorry espn i uh like a lot of your stuff you don't care you clicked it don't like this top even top 10 lists like it's like a lot of your stuff. We don't care. You clicked it. Don't like this list. Even top 10 lists. It's like people pulling over for a car accident. They got to see the whole thing. I know. They're not dumb, those producers, on anything that counts down to one.

I'm legitimately angry that we're doing this. I had to because of Malkin, but this is like I got sucked into the very thing I hate. I try to avoid doing it. I love lists. I love lists. A try to avoid doing it. I love lists. I love lists. A lot of people love lists. I love lists. There's nothing I love more than sports.

I put out like that top 100 plays every time around the end of the year. Just to disagree. You're almost hoping that you're going to be disappointed so you can argue with somebody. And every fan base has their guy right there. Yeah. All right. Injuries.

Yeah. Luke Shen out four to six weeks. Velarde and Winnipeg out four to six weeks. Kirby Dock lost for the year. Like, what is going on here? Sucks. Yeah, it's never fun when your team's, you need everyone like Montreal.

Too bad about Shen. Connor, we got to talk about Connor McDavid's goal last night. Yeah, who overskated that puck? 45 on the Predators. It's a defenseman, right-handed shot, carrier, maybe. He's 50th in the NHL ranking, according to ESPN. What a gift. Imagine you make one terrible mistake

and it's McDavid that picks it up. Come on. To be able to be on the ice like that and to be falling and to keep your wherewithal to pirouette up, stick, post, and in is absurd. be falling and to keep your wherewithal to pirouette up stick posting in you know the first

you know the first thing i thought about is all the drills i did when i was seven years old where they'd line you up on the goal line they blow the whistle and they'd say skate really fast to the blue line no drop on your knees oh yeah and then spin and get up and the whole time you know in my minor hockey league career i'm like this will never happen it's like everything in math class this will never happen i'll never need this and there's conor mcdavid doing my my seven-year-old uh drill yeah he uh that was pretty special. They scored four goals that single period against Nashville. That was the most predictable result of all time.

It was, and I bet it, and I got paid. Good, good. I told people to bet Connor McDavid for a goal in the first period yesterday. Nailed that too, yeah. And we knew that was coming, right? Absolutely. The most predictable game. The Oilers are a good hockey team, and they were due.

They were hungry. One other note in our news and notes we have is Kale McCarr, was the fewest defenseman, fewest games by a defenseman to 250 career points passing Bobby Orr. Bobby Orr needed 247 games to get 250 points. Kale McCarr, 241. He conceivably could catch, you know, I think actually in Elliot's article today,

he talked about McCarr and the all-time points record for D. I think it's Ray Bork at 1600 or something. And Coffey's got to be second. Yeah, I think he's right around there. So, you know, the point is that this guy, very early trajectory, but, you know, maybe David Amber, who had the Ovechkin watch since Ovechkin was in the womb,

can put Makar on all-time points leading defenseman watch because he's tracking that way. Here's the list. It's Ray Bork one, Coffee two, Al McInnes, Bill Housley, and Larry Murphy who round out your top five. Crazy Larry Murphy. 1,200 points in 1,615 games. Wasn't good enough for toronto boot him out of town boot him out of town

dennis poppin also uh got to 250 points in 251 games so he was another guy that was in the mix and there's a a perfect example of just how important it is speaking of Edmonton and Toronto, to slot your D in the proper place because Larry Murphy went there and just behind Lidstrom and a few other heavy hitters there, he was just a perfect guy to win Stanley Cups in Detroit. Yeah. And he couldn't do anything right in Toronto. The best argument for player slotting

has got to be Phil Kessel going to Pittsburgh. It's the perfect spot. They're like like go be the guy in the third line that they can't yeah defend because we they're covering malkin and crosby benino and who was haggling haggling yeah yeah like fast line they're like phil you're gonna play the third worst line on the other team shoot at the net for us he's like oh you know and macar's numbers are really good. They're the best. But compared to the years where Bobby Orr, I think, had 120 plus and Paul Coffey had some big numbers, I think, in the 125, 130. Those numbers aren't there.

No, I don't know if you can do that. Those numbers, I think, came a little later in their careers. Bobby Orr in his fifth season in 70-71 had 139 points in 78 games. Okay, and what? 37 goals in 100. What's the best McCarver's had? 80, 85? Of course, asking you 10 questions.

No, I got it here. The most he's had is 86 in 21-22. That's so many points. Plus 48 that year, playing 25 minutes a night. And he got 100 this year, staying healthy. And also defending, unlike Carlson. He's so good. He's my favorite guy to watch in the league.

It's the lateral movement that blows me away. I know, him walking the blue line. Lightning. Just like Klingberg. Just like Klingy, my guy. There you go. And just like that, real Kippenborn done. Our thanks to Gord Stelic in the first hour.

And, of course, our Elliot Friedman from Hockey Night in Canada. Just two games on tap, but a big one tonight on the network. Enjoy it, Ottawa. And help me out here, boys. I've had six concussions. Washington Capitals. Ovi versus Josh Norris. enjoy it Ottawa and help me out here boys Washington OV versus Josh Norris enjoy it everybody we're back tomorrow on Real Kipper and Born