Real Kyper & Bourne - Prospects and Picks Evaluations with Jason Bukala

Episode Date: January 29, 2026

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne are joined by Pro Hockey Group and Sportsnet's Jason Bukala (0:45) in-studio to share his thoughts as a former NHL scouting director on what would the vibe be like if he was working in the Maple Leafs' front office, the Edmonton Oilers targeting Bobby McMann ahead of the trade deadline, the current prospect market including Isaac Howard, retool versus rebuild scenarios surrounding William Nylander and Auston Matthews. Then, Buks shares his current prospect rankings for the 2026 NHL Draft, discusses whether Nazem Kadri's value remains high on the trade market, and what could be included in a potential Artemi Panarin deal. Then, Nick, Justin and Sam McKee touch on Linus Ullmark on the verge of returning with him backing up James Reimer against the Colorado Avalanche, the conflicting departments between the sport science staff and coaching staff on an NHL club, Ondřej Palát's strong debut with the New York Islanders, and Barry Trotz speaking on Ryan O'Reilly's future with the Nashville Predators. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Here we go. We are a national on the real Kipper Endborn show. Sportsnet, Sammy, be quiet over there. This reading Sammy's first note, Leafs suck, now what?

Oh, boy. It's for the first question for books. 650 in Vancouver, 960 and Calgary streaming always on Sportsnet Plus, Spotify, Apple podcast, and YouTube where we always appreciate a thumbs up. And if you get a chance,

subscribe to Sportsnet on YouTube. glad you're along for the ride this hour of Real Kippenborn brought to you by Bet365 let's welcome in in studio Jason Bukla Pro Hockey Group Sportsnet

does a great job for us always love having you on always learn something new That's quite an intro You guys have hey I don't know how Kipper does all that I don't know either I'm like the most unprofessional person

You can ever find No but you guys like all those hands handles. I mean, geez, YouTube, Spotify, yada, yada. Listen, we know it's a national show. We know we have a one hour on Leaf Edition, but I'm evolving. The Leafs have kind of turned into a bit of a national story right now with, I think, you know, how far they are from a playoff spot and the thought that Leafs missing the playoffs would have been almost pretty close to, like, the Oilers missing the playoffs this year. It's just no one had it in their year. equation in September, October, and now it's a real strong, realistic thought now.

So let's start there, books, in terms of just your experience as a scout before or feeling like where the Leafs are feeling right now. Take us into their management office from Brad Tree Living to the scouts to assistant general managers and what they're feeling right now, looking at. at the daunting hill to climb to get back into a playoff spot. Yeah. So in both my stops in the National Oculee, Nashville and then Florida, two completely different scenarios in terms of stability

because David Poil was in Nashville forever, right? And he was stabilizing force there. We went through some things, Kipper back then, that ownership-wise, but the trajectory of the franchise was really strong. We had a really good team for a lot of years. And we started to bring in some free agents as well as develop some high-end talent in-house suitor, Weber, you know, you can, David Legwine, you know, you go down the list of different. We kind of climbed the mountain and then didn't have the funds, the infrastructure.

We had like a, when the cap came in, we had our own internal cap, even though the cap was only $40 million back then, if you can believe it. But we had our own internal one. And that was frustrating because you could only build so far through the draft he wanted to add. right? Because now you felt like, you know, in Toronto specifically, you've gone through that core four build or the core build. And you want to add to that in the right pieces to get you over the top if you can. And we were never quite able to do that.

When I went to Florida, it was a significant rebuild and we climbed. And then we went through an ownership change. And then we added through free agency and we were getting really close to being good. We missed playoffs. We had 99 points one year missed playoffs, which is. Really? Yeah, astounding, right? Bobby Boogner was the head coach.

Did a hell of a job. But anyways, we were really close, and we added to our core group. And the young guys were starting to get there, the Barkovs, you know, the Ekblads. Then, you know, on my way out the door there, one thing I'm really proud of for our staff that was there was that we left the cupboards stocked. I mean, stock. They traded the Florida Panthers that won two Stanley Cups, but they traded out nine of our draft picks that were NHL roster players for them. Just look around the league. You know, it doesn't take very long to.

connect all the dots. So they were able to trade out infrastructure to bring in extra layers, if you will. And they still had a full cupboard of draftics to work with as well to do whatever they wanted to do. I can take you behind the curtain and I can tell you for certain that every day stinks. It sucks. And I'm telling you, it's the worst feeling in the world right now for the Toronto Maple East of Vancouver, Kinexner.

They're mailing it in. I get it. But it's still, it's really tough. It's very difficult. and where the Leafs have gone astray here, in my estimation, you have to hit on draft picks in the middle to the late portions of the draft. It's one thing to say that you don't have draft capital. That's a fact.

They haven't had high-end draft capital. But if you look at the really good teams in the league, and I'll even take a look at what we did in Florida. McKenzie Weager was the fourth last pick in the draft. You know, the Josh Browns of the world, they became assets that you can move other places to either pick up bodies or pick up other infrastructure. the leaves don't have that.

And four out of the last 39 guys, four, I was doing some math at my hotel today. Out of their last 39 draftics, they have four full-time NHL players. That's bonkers. And that's tough. That's tough. There can't be a worst team out there for that percentage.

I'd have to go through the entirety of the league. Now, you know, I will say this, and I want to give everybody a break here. You've got different general managers that come and go, maybe a little bit of a different philosophy or trajectory. But here's the thing. When you get into the middle of the draft, you have to be looking for, would you guys agree that they lack that intestinal fortitude?

Like there's not that wave of character that's coming through the organization. You know those guys that will give their teeth to win a game? Generally speaking, you find those guys in the middle of the draft. Why? Because they're underdogs already. So if you're ticking off your boxes properly, if they can play fast enough, they can think fast in us and they're relentless competitors in that area of the draft, they'll have a chance, right?

to have a chance. In the Kyle Dubus era that was coming through here, what did they draft in the middle of the draft? Small skill, right? Small skill. You might get those guys hit once in a while, but I'm doing this off top of my head. It might have been the 2021 draft.

They actually had tons of draft capital. I think like nine picks or something like that. Was it nine, Sammy? Yeah, they got nothing out of it. Okay, so there's a strategy that goes astray, and you can look at what's going on today. I'm foaming at the month. I hope you guys don't mind.

You can go, they're going, you can throw a lot of stuff. snowballs today, but the reality is if you would have hit on three guys right there, those types of middle of the lineup guys with the grizzle and the character, you're not shopping for it. It makes your job a lot easier. So if you look, like, we've been talking about the Leafs and how, okay, you want to reload. So they're going to trade some guys and get some assets,

but you don't want to get picks who are good in three years. So you're kind of looking at prospects, what prospects are available. And the type of guy who you can get in a trade, I look at the Islanders picked up Cal Richie, You know, Kuznet Donov, I don't know how to say it, from Boston, got traded, and he's got some value in Boston. You know, what kind of guy are you getting if another team is, I actually, I'll be honest, I'm thinking of Isaac Howard when I say this from Edmonton.

What kind of guys can you get? Is it even possible to get a really good young prospect? Because teams usually know what they've gotten these guys after they've had them in the system for a year or two. Well, let me back it up there. When you put me in the spot like that, what are you trading out to get that? Like, what do you think has value to return in Isaac Howard or? We said, what if you sent, like, Bobby McMahon into a third or something to Edmonton or Howard? Okay, so Bobby McMahon, so if I'm sitting in a war room right now, the fits for Bobby McMahon, big guy skates downhill pretty fast, fast, we would agree with that.

You might not expect them. If he can provide your secondary offense on a good team, you're probably happy, right? So you start ticking off. Okay, well, Colorado, could they fit them? Yeah, they could actually fit them, salary-wise. then you start going through the problem with some of these organizations Colorado is one they don't have a lot to give back to you it's going to be very difficult but he he he would be the cheapest amongst anybody out there

that could give you one three one three one three so completely affordable even if you yes you'll get rid of a body just to fit that in for sure so to go with what you're saying there I think you get a mid a mid range prospect call it in my mind without name a name, someone who's been a late second round pick or something like that. And then you probably, if you eat some of that money to give them more flexibility to make a half a million. You move up again. So the fourth becomes a third in a scenario like that because you eat some cash and it gives

them some flexibility. It's going to be very, very difficult. And I don't think with some of these teams in the league, Toronto included, and I think actually Toronto might be the poster trial. People don't want to hear it. But I don't know that there's a life preserver out there. necessarily. You know, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know that there's that that exists. I think that some of these teams are looking at and they're saying, geez, I don't know if I really

want to do that with them. You know, it's, it's because there's that strategy that goes on behind closed doors, guys. It's a loving when they're, it's a kumbaya when they're at a meeting, but they're competitive as all can be. And they don't want to provide for someone to retool and be really good next year if it's going to cost me long term on my roster as well. So there's a lot to unpack there. So we had this conversation, earlier in the show, books in terms of what we perceive as blowing something up and not

and doing something softer, as Sammy likes to call it a soft sell, which, like I want to puke when I hear that, but that's another story for another day. We had said for the Leafs, only a pure blow-up would have to be one of Matthews, Neelander, or Nyes.

after that and we included calwin too because he's really their only blue chip prospect i think in the in the organization right now a plus a plus or plus a he's a he's an a he's an a okay so um after that it's you're you're much closer to retooling are you not oh absolutely nise is untouchable for me um i think he's got i think he has what i'm looking for to be honest with you I think if he was not surrounded by this leadership group and as he continues to evolve as a person, I think he's a guy that you can, he ticks off a lot of boxes for me.

Yeah. So that's not where I'm going. Okay, so let me go another way then for you. Okay, we just watched Vancouver Canucks do it with Quinn Hughes. Is there anything out there that could be deemed a positive move if you thought about shopping, Matthews, or Nylander? Well, you lose on the front end to win on the back end with that type of scenario. You know, there's not a Z. Bouillon who's going to come in and when you move a Matthews out,

you're not going to get a one in return. Like Zee, Boolean has already proven before he got a puck in the face. He can play north to 20 minutes if pressed right now, right? But you're not going to get a guy who's going to put the puck in the net 30 times right now, like out of the box. So it makes it really difficult. And, but here's my, here's my strategy, because I thought about it a lot after I started throwing bricks at my TV watching William Neander flip the bird. Some people say that that's no big deal, okay? To me, it is a big deal, okay?

Because here we are, the three of us, we work here, we're employees, right? If we're having a bad day and you turn to the camera and you, you know, Sammy and you flip on the bird, like, what happens? We get fired. Something happens. It's not good, right? And you got at 1.30 in the afternoon game. I know you guys have probably digested this. I don't want to regurgitate it, but here I am.

So 1.30 in the afternoon, it's a kid's game. That's what it is. And you do that. I just think, I wouldn't want my 26-year-old to do that. So it speaks to the internal character of the team. It speaks to, I can only speak from my own experience. And I can tell you for fact that when I was in Florida with Barkoff, Eckblad, even when Hubert O was there, you know, to go to Florida,

or to Calgary, what a ballsy move by Bill Zito. Isn't that where we're kind of talking about here a little bit? Like the Matthew, to break the band up for the good of the franchise to take it to another level. When they traded Uyghur and Huberto out of there and Trochuk before that, all these guys lived on the same street in Los Angeles and Florida. They're all driving their golf carts around together. They're all tight as can be, okay?

When they broke the band up, it was for the good of the franchise. And is this team going to get any better in the next couple of years? And are we going to walk ourselves into a Quinn Hughes situation that Vancouver just had? I'll ask you guys that question. So if the answer is a yes or a maybe, then you have to explore all options. If only there were some comparables within the city. It's like the Blue Jays traded Teosker and Lordus Gariel

and all of a sudden they got hot. The Raptors traded to Marta Rosen and all of a sudden they got good. You know, it's not unprecedented. You're starting to come on my side a little bit? No, no, no. I'm just saying there's a case. There's definitely a case. Well, the case has to be for the trajectory.

Like you live this guys for 9, 10 years. Yeah. And the coverts are bare. Okay, take a look what they have. in the next two draft cycles. They have two picks in the top four rounds, I believe, in the next two draft cycles. Two good draft.

As we say to here today, I think that's going to change. So let's talk about the draft. Vancouver Canucks are bottoming out on purpose, and they're going to pick high, maybe very high. Would it make you nervous to pick first this year because it's so tight and you don't want to get it wrong? I don't think you're going to get it wrong in the top three picks. Like anything you do, you're going to be okay.

I know I don't mean to regurgitate it, But it brings me back to the McKinnon, Barkoff, Seth Jones. Drew and is, you know, Drew and is Drew in that draft cycle. But I think that you're going to get three really good players at the top of the draft tier. They're all going to be different. You're going to have two wingers, maybe a centerman slides in there. But, you know, Verhoff, big 6'4, 220-pound right-shot defenseman. Who, by the way, everybody's talking how great McKenna, he's been shot out of a cannon after World Juniors,

Verhoff's appointed game fells as a 17-year-old defense, 17-year-old defense. I did the comparison to the draft of Tavares and Hedman. Yeah. That's a good one. Where McKenna is Tavaris. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a really good one because Tavares exceptional status,

all the accolades in the Ontario Hockey League. Yeah, World Championships, all of it. All that kind of stuff. That's a really good one with Edmund, too. So there, one's won Stanley Cups and one's just been a great pro. Well, listen, I mean, early, no question. had been struggled in Tampa Bay. It was not a given those first three years.

And Tavares came in and, of course, played the role of the face of the franchise, but then it turned. The big boys do. Chara struggled early? Like, I just feel like that's a thing. Okay, but you guys not agree. It's harder.

You guys have played high level. You've played in the National Hockey League, high leverage games. Yeah. It's really difficult for a defenseman to come in and play 22, 23. We went through it with Eckbad as well. Except for Schaefer. You know, except for Schaefer.

There's always, Yeah, he's excluded from this conversation. But, you know, that's a great example. But so you've got Headman and Tavares in this comparison, and you don't have either McKenna or Verhoff as your top guy, do you? I have Stenberg as my top guy. That's okay. So who's he in this analogy?

So Stenberg is a winger that plays the game like Barkoff. He thinks the game like Barkoff, really calculating. So off the puck, his routes to kill a play or to find a puck that gets turned over. He has defensive ability? He's always. I thought that was illegal in young players. 29 points and 28 games in the SHL. It's phenomenal.

Scores game winners, three-on-three overtime over there. He's over the boards at his age. Veterans are sitting on the bench. It's something to watch. I'm going to give you a guy's a name, though. Caleb Mahaltrow from the Bramford Bulldogs. Not Mel. Did you say Mahaltrow?

Yeah. Manny's kid. This guy's a complete player. He is like a Nick Suzuki type player. And it's going to... Top five? I have four. You got him four.

Four. So if the Leafs spot, them out and keep their pick. They could get, their pick is top five protected. They could conceivably lose enough to get down there. If they lost enough and they were in the four, I'd run up to the stage to draft this kid.

Is that really would? Yeah, absolutely. He's going to be at the top of the table for them. So I just start connecting some of the dots because there's not a lot of the dots to connect right now. But you got Cowan, you got Mahaltra, and I guess you got whatever happens after that.

But yeah, that's a good start for sure. A great player. Okay. So what does Vancouver? Where does Vancouver go in all of this, in your opinion? It's going to be interesting, right? I hope that they don't start introducing a flag bias in their process. And what I mean by that is if it's Stenberg on their list,

they've drafted a lot of Swedes. Let's be honest. Look, Karamaki. God, they're in last right now by eight points. I'm sorry if you, I just didn't realize they're in last by eight points. Like they're going to pick first, you know, very likely. Well, are you going to snow play tonight to watch the game? It's, uh, yeah, I'm off of working.

the cracking game. There is still a lottery here. Yeah, well, you're right. I mean, there's the possibility they don't. Bingo bangle balls. But they'll be picking. But they'll go to three. Yeah.

So if they go from one to three, still a great player in there. I don't know that, I mean, you want one. You want all the flexibility in the world. And the phone will start ringing right away because there's going to be three or four really good players there. But they need sentiment. You know, you don't want to draft for need at the top of the table. You got to draft the best player. Okay.

Yeah. They need sentiment. I can't recall ever going. going into a trade deadline where teams were screaming for Centerman. And I mean, NASCadry's out there. We know that. My understanding is that the prices aren't still where Calgary would like them to be. And as a scouting staff, you've watched prices go up. But correct me if I'm wrong. I mean, they can go down

pretty quickly too as you get to the deadline at 3 p.m. Well, it used to be that you'd have to get in the queue in the old fax machine there, and you better have your ducks in order anymore. It's still the same in terms of the lineup. You better have it. You don't want that to go down to the wire there. Craig Conroy, that's not going to happen. Something will give there, for sure.

Calgary, they can't score goals, okay? And Naz's statistical analysis, like he was good last year, really good. Calgary just can't score now. And actually, they couldn't really score last year either. But he's going to help somebody out with that grizzle. And he's in fantastic shape. He still plays fast.

Yeah. What type of falloff is there? So, like, I'm thinking, let's see, there's a nightmare scenario out there where Canadian hockey loses. McDavid could leave in a few years. Matthews could leave. You know, we could lose a few stars. I'm looking at the bottom of the table.

Canucks, Calgary, Winnipeg, all in the bottom four. Rangers, Blackhawks, right there, too. A couple of big cities. How, where is a fall off in the draft? in terms of quality of player. Like after three, it sounds like one. Is there another tier of players? So speaking on the sentiment thing,

I think this is a conversation that has to be had. So you've got a couple of different things. Imagine you're the Calgary Flames, okay? And you're looking at if you monitor the way that they've made trades recently, they've actually stocked up on defensemen quite frequently in the last couple years. They got a lot of depth there. But again, they need a sentiment to come through the system. So depending on who their trade partner is and how much draft

capital they get in the first round. Imagine they're at eight, okay? And they want a centerman in the draft. Well, I've already mentioned Mulchre, the Tyne and Lawrence kid who's playing at Boston University right now, he's his next best centerman on my list. Vigo Bjork, who's playing in the SHL as well. He was awesome for Sweden at the World Juniors. He can play the middle.

He's a smaller guy, though. So he's even smaller than Lindholm. Okay, so it's just a different kind of a player. What I'm trying to tell you here is that if you trade a centerman out and you inherit draft capital and you're still targeting centermen in this draft class, There's going to be a drop off after the top six guys go. So it's going to change things. Then you're going to get into a run of Carson Carl's from Prince George.

Awesome defense. Great. He's got Ryan Suter type of attributes to his game. I really like this kid. And then I would say probably seven or eight you're starting to go. There's another tier. It's my line in the sand. Okay.

It's important to know. You're watching and listening to Jason Buchala, pro hockey group, Sportsnet, former NHL scouting director. Bookes, is this going to be the trade deadline year? We don't hear normally from like the Rangers, the Leafs, the big boys. And we go now start hearing about Utah and Seattle. And I mean, are we going to see some of these teams that have struggled for a few years, to your point about being stockpiled now and ready to, who's looking?

Utah. I think Utah is a team to keep an eye on. I think the owner, similar to the ownership that came in in Carolina, I think he wants to win sooner than later. He's got a lot of good things going on there, the renovation of the arena and the outdoor game next year. They seem very excited about that. I think that they're close enough to start to get aggressive.

Here's the thing with them. If people want to go, Puckpedia is a partner of ours here and shout out to heart of Puckpedia. He's a partner of mine as well. But if you want to go take a look at their infrastructure there, guys, there's only 50 contracts, right? And they've been drafting like 12, 14 guys a year. It seems forever.

Yeah. They can actually overpay for something to get them over the top now for a couple of different reasons. A, they have it. B, they still have tons of draft capital. And then C, they got cap space,

I guess. And then D, I mean, they're finally in a position to give that group something else, like another push, right? They have really strong underlying numbers right now. And I think they've been red hot, if I'm not mistaken.

Where are they here? Yeah, 8-1 and 1 their last 10. I can see them. So you're saying basically they have some prospects that could be available. They could, when we're all working together on trade deadline day, they could pull something out of their hat that we're all going to say that's an overpayment and then you're going to come look at me in the other room and I'm going to say it's not because they've got all this. Right.

And there comes a time that you can't fall in love with your own. Then that's what's happened. Let's be honest, guys. That's what's happened in Toronto, right? We fell in love with our own. We just kept on hoping and hoping and hoping and hoping until it starts to teeter on the brink of, uh-oh. And what are you left with?

Don't draft cap on. So Utah is the other one. So they can't fall in love with their own because they got too much to go around. They can overpay. So Artemi Panarin is available right now. If you're the Rangers, you know, you're looking at Utah could be a potential partner for them, but Panarin sounds like he wants to sign somewhere. Are you expecting this to be some prospects?

Well, you know, what do you think is a good return here for someone like Panarin? Well, it's going to go to one of those teams out there. You start looking at the Anaheim's, and I was listening to Frege today on the when I was driving in on Futa show and Markezi show. And it doesn't sound like Anaheim's necessary, but I'm keeping a close eye on San Jose. I don't think Utah is a Panarin fit. I think in all things being equal, Panarin would love to go to Florida, for example. Why?

You know, people, I don't think kind of because... They just don't have the space, do they? Well, no, they don't. They can't make it happen. But what I'm trying, where I'm going with here is the lifestyle. Because if you're going to sign that extra... Yeah, you're going to sign that extra extension. So what do you think is he's going to get four or five years?

Do you guys think? Yes, I do. Okay, five years? Five at 10. 34 years old right now. So it's going to be $50 million around there somehow, whatever the term is, right? So you got to live where you're going to go. I'm not so sure that I see Artenham going from New York City to Utah.

No. Like, I just don't see that. San Jose seems more realistic. Usually we see guys that we think that might get traded that will be pulled out a weekend before the trade deadline. This is like they pull him out now. I love this. He's got to go. No, I hate it.

It makes so much. Oh, you couldn't be more wrong. Stop it. What if you got hurt? You blow the chance to get a first and a prospect and all this. What have you tripped over the sidewalk, J.B., on your way to work? Maybe you shouldn't come to work. Like, honestly.

Honestly, like, I would piss me off if I was a player. Like, I want to play. I'm paid to play. I want to hit some targets. Like, how do they shut them down so early to me is, like. You know, Alexander Barkoff blow out his knee for a shift to practice? Yeah. Okay, a training camp.

So anything's possible. I'm old school here, you know, respectfully. I'm old school. If there's a Panarin fan who still exists in Rangerland, okay, and you want to go to MSG to get your last couple looks on this guy, as a fan, a diehard fan, I think we owe it to the fans for that. I don't like this. I don't like it either.

But I get the injury stuff and all this rest of it, but we can't, you know. How long is he going to be off? I'm going to trade for him. He's going to be off for what a month. And Artemmy... A month and a half. Listen, this guy's not exactly Arnold Schwarzenegger in terms of being in shape.

So he's going to be off for three weeks. The risk reward. He's going to Florida one way or another. He's in self-each in the Russian community right now. The risk reward of him playing. What is the reward for him playing? A couple of fans who liked him get to see him one more time. The risk is that you miss out while trying to rebuild

on a haul of assets, a first, a prospect. It's just the reward's not there for a real. for risking it. So kudos to the Rangers for being smart. Let me ask you about the goaltending market because we... You see what he did there. He had to slip in the eyes. I know he did. I know. He does it all the time. All the time. Walshsted's

a name that we're hearing out of Minnesota. I'm kind of surprised. Okay. No, I'm not surprised because you spend a lot on Quinn Hughes and you need assets. And it's a luxury now to have two really good goalies. And he needs, he needs another body. Either

a winger, a centerman, he needs something else besides Quinn Hughes. How about Ottawa? He's going to throw Walshead out there. Wouldn't that be ironic? Ottawa against Walshead? Back. Correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't this the Kevin Bacon thing?

Didn't he start at the auto? I'd have to look it up. I thought there was an Ottawa connection in that. Can you look at that? What are you going to do with the other guy? Which one? Gustafin? No, no.

You said to Ottawa? Oh, yeah. And what do you do with Allmark? I haven't really thought this through yet. Yeah, we just had a lot of cows. Hey, back to my original question. Like, what kind of market do you see out there? Let me throw something across the valley.

Just food for thought. Just bear with me for a sec. Did you watch the Denver Broncos in NFL playoffs? I did, yeah. Okay. What happened when the quarterback went down and had nothing behind them? Okay. Do you want James Reimer coming out of the weeds to play net for the Minnesota world?

No. Okay. And no disrespect to rhyme. He's been a great pro. You understand what I'm trying to say. Yes. Yeah, it's, there's risk reward in this type of a scenario. You're right because when you get a really good goalie and you want to stand the cup run,

guess what the other guy does? He watches and he stops bucks from the black aces during the day. You know, like that's what they do. So I understand. Lavrovsky of Asleski. Yeah. Olnors got three years after this. Just throwing it up there.

At 825. 825, yeah. Yikes. Yeah, that's a conversation for another day. There's going to be a huge market for the goaltender, Walsstead. Actually, let me backtrack on the other. Hildaby? Leaves have luxury there, too.

Luxury. Yeah. Well, that's an interesting. Servicable goalies. Well, how about this? I'll throw Vancouver in the mix. Do you think Demko is going to be, you know, Demko when he comes back?

Like, who knows they don't? Do you think they would want another goalie? Is that what you're saying? Or you think they would trade? Well, they got Lankin and signed. long term, and then it kind of is a maybe after that. Yeah. I think they wouldn't entertain all kinds of different things, for sure.

Like Lincoln was in August last year. He was on the heap. Remember that? He signed late in August. Had a great year and got his extension. And Valley said he was going to have a great year. Boom. That guy, by the way, I watch him when he's on here.

That's a hell of a guess. Yeah. He puts in the work. Any team on the outside looking in, I know we covered the Leafs, but any other team on the outside looking in that has tremendous pressure that you think that is under the gun? New Jersey Devils have tons of pressure. Ooh, good one.

I really do. They haven't written their season off yet? I would be very surprised if Fintz's written their season off. I'd be fascinated to be a bug on the wall in the meetings, but haven't we been talking about New Jersey last couple of years, guys, taking that next step? Yeah. You know what?

Here's a goal-tending again. You need people to stop the pill. Yeah. You need somebody to make it. It's funny, Markstrom and Olmark are very comparable. And both teams had a long-running problem. They tried to solve with a big name, and neither guy did it. It's tough.

Bookes, anything else we're missing? We covered a lot. They covered a lot. Yeah, I could hot stole it for a little bit longer, but I got to go to work, unfortunately, on the other side. Oh, yeah. We've got to set them free. Buddy, so appreciate you coming by.

Thanks for having you guys. That was great. Thanks, Boox. Appreciate it, bud. Jason Bucola, SportsNets, very own. Scout. All right, we'll take a quick break when we return. Sammy McKee will enlighten us the remaining of our show.

Sammy, can you sing, dance, top, nothing? Okay, we'll figure it out back after these words. Diving deep into Leaps, Rafters, J's, and NFL, the Jady Bunk is podcast. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. As a reminder of this hour, Real Kipperman, Brought to by Bet365.

Nick Caprials, Justin Boren. Sammy McKee. I love Jason so much. Yeah. I really feel kind of bad even being back here, just how much better it is with him. He's very good. Well, he's. No question.

It's all from your view. Your point of view. And his is through scouting and being in those rooms and being a part of something that's incredibly intense right now. for all teams and that is making these moves that could strengthen you or weaken you and wearing it

every day. You guys talked about it a little bit with books, but I wanted to bring it up here again. That Panarin thing yesterday we got to do game time here still too, but just before we get to that if you're the Rangers, you must be like, seriously bud? Like you're going to, like you won't go to a contender for a couple months here and then you can sign wherever the hell you want on July first. Like you're really going to do that and sap the valley. The reports out there of who's interested in Panarin are like comical.

14 teams, you know, every team is being listed. Yeah. So I think they still have a wide array of teams to offer him to. But if he's like, I'm going to sign with these three teams. I don't know. I just, that really hurts you if you're the Rangers. You're like, okay, great. Like I got to take way less on this on this because he's not willing to sign there.

You can't go live in. We've been talking for a long time. Utah for three months? We've been talking for a long time, how the pendulum swung. in the players favor. And I wrote an article today in Toronto start kind of talking a little bit about that. And they've been empowered from their dress codes to no move clauses to getting money, becoming multi-millionaires of the $40, 50, and $60 million before their 24 years of age.

Like, there's a whole new world out there. The way Panarin's thinking right now is I'm picking my spot. And there's not a damn thing you can do about it. Sucks. Sucks for the Rangers. Because they've made the right decision to sell. And they sent out their little, Chris Ferry sent out the letter 2.0. And then like your number one ass and it's like, yeah, but I'll only sign with Florida.

So. But he might sign with three teams, depending, you know? Like, we don't know what they're limited to exactly. But like where of the contenders would you picture, like Detroit? Would he sign a long term in Detroit? Saturday, Detroit. I give. I'm going to say it's kind of a common.

Marsha had a lot of credit here because he could have easily done the same thing and said, I'm not going anywhere to Boston unless I got a nice big, fat contract waiting for me. And he didn't. You know what he did? He went there. Loved it. And he proved,

I'm not just a third line winger coming in here. And he turned himself into the most important player on that team. You got a 14-year contract as a result. He signed until he's 608 years old. And he, as he should have. Yep. Right? Because he had, because he had the guts to go and bet on himself.

He's got guts, no doubt about it. That was King Kong. The size of King Kong. It's game time. Presented by Bet365, visit the Affleadus Odds and see why it's ever ordinary. a bed 365 must be 19 plus and terror only please play responsibly who wrote this lineup is this right 15 games on top tonight boys whoa lot of hockey it's almost a frozen frenzy remember the frozen frenzy is that did they do that anymore once once a year i think we do all 16 so who's not playing uh i don't think columbus is playing tonight i don't know who the other team is anyways uh i'm gonna quickly look at this one because you know me jersey matchup guy

Colorado and Montreal tonight facing off at the Bell Center and the Colorado Avalanche are wearing the throwback Quebec, Quebec Nordiques jerseys against the red Montreal Canadians. They should have to give the city of Quebec, and I am sincere in saying this, like a million dollars every time they do it. Just every time they want to wear that jersey in Montreal,

give Quebec City million. Like hockey programs in Quebec City. Here's a million dollars. You talk to Quebec City, million bucks. We're wearing it again. Well, maybe they could develop us a gold. drag your carcass around the city of Montreal tonight and cheer for it. You know what the...

I'd go wild. You know what, though? This is probably a crazy take and one that I'm not in it. If I was a former Nordicke's fan and the Colorado Amalanche are so good, you know what? I'd be like, yeah, screw it. I'd throw on the old baby blue and head down to the bell set in a root. Trader.

Well, honestly, though, they're doing it. They're rubbing in your... You might as well be there. Anyways, just the line for the game tonight, the Montreal Canadians, as you would imagine, a slight underdog, plus 105 in the money line. Colorado going in there after getting spanked by the Ottawa Senators, minus 125 on the money line for them. Looking down the list of games, going out to Toronto, Toronto and Seattle, minus 110,

both sides of the money line. Goodwin and Vegas, Dallas in Vegas to take on the Golden Knights. Dallas there, a slight underdog plus 100 in the money line. Vegas is a minus 120 favorite. That was game time presented by Bet365. Visit the Athletist odds. see why it's ever ordinary at bet 365 must be 19 plus and turn only please play responsibly all mark not ready to still start um i will give james rimer some love here because he is

he's can't ask for anything more out of a guy to go in there and like it was a good moment for him being colorado totally i don't get being ready to be a backup but not the goalie like you're either ready to play. Totally agree. In which case you can play or you're not ready to play, in which case if we need you, you're not ready to play. Just go back to our conversation just a few minutes ago. Like, it's all in the power now.

They've got the hammer. He's making 8.25. The Ottawa senators are at their mercy with this guy. They have no other choice, but just to, what do you need? What do you want? What can we give you? What can we? Okay, tell us when you're ready.

I mean, it's like, it's unbelievable. But that's it. He's going to let us know. When he's ready to play, he will let us know. That's what you're down to. But Borny's right. Then why are you on the bench if you're not ready? Yeah.

I mean, it's not like James Reimer. How old is Reimer? But if you... You could easily... If you answer the question, if you answer the question, there's a chance that you think that you might upset him. Mm-hmm.

Are we ready to talk about the Leafs article today about the, you know, there's an article today in the athletic written about some Leif's player performance staff, strengthening, all that sort of stuff and that they've lost a couple of positions. And that's why they got more injuries. They had the former performance coach, Jeremy Bettel, give some quotes. Yeah. And Brad Tree Living is wild about it. Yeah.

He went on our rival. Yeah, you went on TSN to discuss that. With the writer. Yeah, it was Jonas was on the show. But it is interesting because in it, there's a line from battle where he says something like, you know, Babcock never disputed when we told him a guy was available, unavailable. It is interesting that behind the scenes. I'm not sure I totally believe that. Well, whatever.

I mean, but I'm just saying there's a lot of conversations behind the scenes. But my, Babcock, the hockey coach? Is that after he went through your phone? Yeah. Hey, now. Oh, wow. But I'm just saying, there's a lot of conversations behind the scenes. Yeah.

Between people, is he ready, isn't he ready? We remember the documentary very well. The Toronto Maple Leafs, they're going, it's Freddie Anderson on the ice as he gets up. So many of them scared now are these guys. It is a fascinating world of availability. Because there's another line in that article, which points out, and this is battle against,

saying he had to tell their sports science department, we are not a sports science team. We're a hockey team. You could protect guys from ever getting hurt by never playing. But we're trying to get them in the game, which is an interesting aspect of what everyone is doing. How do you get guys ready? They are no different than analytics.

It's there. It's a tool. But they're not the decision makers, okay? They're not. I think in some teams they've been given that authority. Well, you are if you got... the opposite of King Kong, you know, balls. How long you took deciding if you're going to say it or not.

Good choice, though. Yeah, it's a tool. Yeah. Go talk to them and just use it. But come on, use your better judgment at the end of the day, a coach, a player, and the information that you get. But to sit there and tell me that every injury was like putting this predictive, because you lost these two guys,

I don't completely buy it. No. Okay? I mean, you know. Tree said that they basically up there. I'll tell you something.

Maybe playing every other night for three months. I would have liked them around for like Willie Neelander who has a groin, pull comes out, goes back in, does he come back too soon? Like there's some science behind maybe bringing them back a game too early or two games too early that you would have like to maybe have more information on. I'm not discounting that.

Yeah. But at the end of the day, there's a general manager, there's a coach, you guys are in charge. Yeah. Yeah. Not these guys. Yeah. Well, I mean, and then the player has their input too, and they lie to the coaches and GMs, depending if they want to play and not. And it's a whole, it's a whole circus.

Is he available? Is he not available? How about, uh, how about your boy, Pilat? Pilat. I like him. I like him. I like him. I like it, Palant.

That's got to feel good. You're a general manager. Right in the bumper on the power play first. Just like for Darsh. Yeah. Where there's probably some people that are like, really? And then like, are the islanders just warming up a little bit here? Other win, I guess so.

I think the additions they just made kind of show where their intentions are. And Sammy, didn't you say that there was a Darsh quote? Yeah, he went on with Frank Serevelli on his, frankly speaking, right? He does it with Bucci Gras. And Darsh went on there. And they asked him about being. aggressive at the deadline and then i think he said yeah i worked with julian breeswell you know i'm not exactly afraid to get rid of first round picks and then and then if i'm if i'm that guy if i'm

raddra living and i hear that after i'm you know i'm calling it and be like hey you ever see this bobby mcman play hockey you got to see you got to see bobby mcmall oh my god yeah you got a first depart with he can fly or that can skate all right what else you got for sammy oh um this this this one and Zaja spent a lot of time on. I looked over at him. He looked like he was doing brain surgery, so we better play it.

But Barry Trots was on, I forget which radio station he was on, with Willie Donich, the guy that does a play-by-play for the predators. And he was talking about potentially trading Ryan O'Reilly. Who, by the way, is unbelievable this year. 18 goals, 51 points as a defense is done. So if we could play that clip there, Derek,

the Trots clip on potential Ryan O'Reilly trade. Is it safe to assume that Ryan O'Reilly will not be traded before the deadline? No, I think everything has to be on the table. As I said, I have not had any conversations with Ryan on any of his situation. If there's a, I have to listen to all offers. If there's an offer that blows my, you know, blows my mind a bit, then I have to listen.

But at the same time, you know, we're not in the playoffs. And that's the bottom line. So as I said earlier in the year, nothing's off the table, and it shouldn't be. We'll be fair and understanding, but we'll also be understanding that we're trying to, you know, build something here and build it for a new core, build it for the future, and get it running back to the standard that we're a threat every year. And it's going to take some time, patience, all that. But nothing's off the table on any way. buddy. They got to have the best roster of a bad game.

102.5, the game in national. Give the players credit for getting his phone to start ringing again. It wasn't ringing. Yeah, they were hot. October and November, it was like you're thinking you're stuck. And now he's not. Now he's in a position of strength and he's going to be smart enough to use it. And he talked about getting their next core.

That's a fascinating thing because their team, they got big names forzsburg stamp coast march or riley yossey shay like they got players but they're not winning a cup no so you you got to start looking at what's our next core and you know i think tough to strip it all the way down anywhere but seems like they know what they got to do for me if i'm a team that's interested in a center and i'm been like linked to nasm cadry i'm putting as much time and effort into calling on rile o'reilly as nasm cadry i think i think Ryan O'Reilly. I mean, he's won the consummite, obviously, so you can look back.

And that was a while ago. Prefer you get two playoff runs. You don't have to worry about the long contract. It's cheaper. He's just been a playoff performer. Like, I had that time that he was with the Leafs in those playoffs game, playoff games. Like, you wanted him on the ice in big moments.

He's responsible. He can shoot in the net. It's got the weirdest blade in the league. It's got a little hook on it. Yeah. I love Ryan O'Reilly. I, I think, Detroit.

Many. I see that. Detroit should do it. I can see many. Any I can see doing. Montreal. Montreal, eh? Montreal needs a center. I mean, yes, it's a fantastic fit in Montreal.

Yes. And you don't have to, and like you mentioned. It's going to be expensive. You don't have to worry about the longest, the longer part. Dallas. If I'm looking at a team, though, Montreal is a team. I'm like, yeah, that's, I'd like to trade with you. They've got picks.

They got a lot of prospects. Like, they are, they're. Nashville has a whack of picks, man. They got four, third. third rounders next year. Just as a random year. But they got, I mean, I don't know, 11, 12 picks in the upcoming draft. So we also have a clip here from, I guess we already talked about.

So maybe we won't play. Maybe the moment's past. But Sullivan talked about Panarin after the game last night. You guys were talking about how you hate him, or you were talking about how you hate him sitting out. I do feel that. This early. Just this early. Do you want to play the K?

I'm okay. I'm okay. Soon, aren't they going to train him? No, no, no. They're not. They're not. Should be like, do it in the next few days here. Do you want to play the clip or was that moment passed?

I'd like to hear. I like all your clips. Well, thanks, Jaja. Let's play the Solomon clip on Panarin, please. Well, obviously, you know, Bread's a terrific player and a great teammate. And, you know, he's good friends with a lot of the guys that are in that dress of him. So, you know, that has an impact on guys.

I thought our guys did a great job just as far as. controlling what they can and bringing the right intentions out there. But obviously he's, you know, he's one of the best Rangers of his generation. And, you know, he's not an easy guy to replace when, you know, when he's not in the lineup. But everybody understands it, and we're going to control what we can. And we're going to see what we can take from this one. We're going to try to put our best game in the ice tomorrow.

Sucks for Sullivan. I think he's a good coach, but he just kind of walked into a bit of a hornet. It's nest. He is the highest paid coach, him and Coop. In the league? Oh, yeah. Really? Oh, yeah.

What do you get five times three or something? North, North. North. So it's long-term. He's not in a real hurry to win the Stanley Cup in the first year, although it would have been nice for them to make the playoffs. I don't think he went there thinking he had the pressure of the world to win the Stanley Cup. So he's just settling in, man.

He ain't going anywhere and he's going to be part of this retool or rebuild or whatever they want to call it. They do have work to do. Like if you look at what their next core is, it's not pretty. No, and the majority of the guys they got to get rid of are 32, 33, 34. Long deals. And Aaron Zabandajat, J.T. Miller, Troche. Miller's not going anywhere. They're going to still try to do this thing around him.

Oh, you think so? Oh, yeah. Trot-check. Miller is 32. Trochak will go because he also is needing a new contract, I think. No. Next year. No, no, no.

After next year. Nope. Two years? Three years after this year. 5.6. Okay, so that's not bad. But, okay, so it's not necessarily the contract you got to worry about. It's the fact that his peak.

No, his peak, yeah, he's not going to get any stronger as he gets older. And his peak value right now is with that contract. Right. So that is the first rounder. or an A prospect. So boys, what's the plan for tonight? You're on at 10 o'clock. Are you guys going home first?

You're going to go have a nice bite to eat? I don't know how openly I've talked about this, but I'm working on a Daryl Sutter book. Oh. Daryl is a very fascinating, you know, coach slash, he's got these theories. I love working with Daryl. So I'm going to spend us some time on that tonight

and put some words on the paper. Give us a little. bit of yeah give us a little bit of insight of what we can expect the other day I asked him I said uh how how with seven brothers did none of you end up a goalie like you know certainly

someone went in net and he goes well you choke to death and I said what do you mean what are you talking about and he goes because of the rope I was like Darry what are you talking about he's like well you know you hung a rope from above the net in the barn and you put it around the goalie's neck because back then it was illegal to go down You're a stand-up goalie.

So if you played goal, they put it around your neck so you couldn't go down. So no one wanted to play net because you'd end up choking. That is way better than I expected. I am so happy I didn't grow up on a farm. I love it. Well, we'll look forward to that, J.B. Yes, sir. That's an email.

Our thanks to Jason Buchala Pro Sports Group and SportsNs has very own NHL Scout. How many games on top, we said? 15 boys. Justin and I will be part of one of them. Enjoy your night, everybody. Off the rails Friday with Doug McLean tomorrow.