Real Kyper & Bourne - Rielly Returns! Desert Auditions

Episode Date: December 29, 2022

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne start by discussing the Leafs matching up with the Coyotes before they are joined by Leafs Radio Network Colour Analyst Jim Ralph (20:36) for an in-depth preview, the  Leafs' poor record vs Arizona all-time and if this game could possibly be a showcase for rumoured trade target Jakob Chychrun. Later, GM of Canada's Men's National Team for the Spengler Cup and former Arizona Coyote Shane Doan joins the show (44:40) to break down Canada's tough elimination in the Quarterfinals. Shane also shares his thoughts on the Coyotes' season, playing in Mullet Arena, and how keeping players like Jakob Chychrun would be beneficial for the long term of the club. Finally, the boys are joined by Former Leafs GM and Leafs Nation Pre + Post Game Host Gord Stellick (1:07:12) who makes the argument that the Leafs do not need to make a big trade.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. The holiday edition on The Real Kipper and Born Show. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne. In for the multi-talented Sammy McKee. Tristan Markajani. Nailed the pronunciation. Nailed it. I had it, like, I had him spell it out.

How to say it? And every last syllable. That's great. All good here. Multi-talented for Sammy in this case is drinking Funky Monkeys, daiquiris, tequilas. And if you're not Sammy on a beach or on, what, the 15th hole, you are listening somewhere on our Sportsnet Now,

Sportsnet 590, The Fan, iTunes, Spotify. We're glad you're aboard as the Toronto Maple Leafs get set to take on the Arizona Coyotes. Their first visit to the mullet. The mullet arena. The mullet arena. What an honor. Are we going to see some of those wigs tonight?

Oh, yeah. Luke Fox in the building. I saw his front row seats. There's leather front row seats for media, I guess. I don't know. I got to think with the Leafs down there, it's going to be a rambunctious sold out. Yeah, I read it's $190 is the cheapest ticket, U.S.

Predominantly, we should get that $50, $50, if not more, for the Leaf. There's got to be Leaf fans down there tonight and heavy. Yeah. Well, when I lived in Arizona for three years and I had a friend who lived in Calgary and he would fly to the games in Arizona and watch with me because it was cheaper than going to Flames games.

He could hop on a flight then, come down, get an amazing ticket on the glass for 150 bucks. And yeah, he had a good experience in arizona so yes people are flying down they're there lots of leafs fans tonight a lot of leaf fans and uh i guess uh a feeling like this one should be one of those where a guy like austin matthews goes home he's already had some good success against arizona three goals four points and maybe those aren't great numbers how many games five tristan how many games has he played career against arizona because i'm gonna throw something out to you jb this is in arizona

those stats five games he's played five games. So that's just in Arizona. Yeah. Okay. You got to imagine, Matthews has got some buddies there, girlfriend or two. When did they fly in? That's the important. Was it legal? So I had heard that it was, I think, the majority of the push came from the players to get in there early,

which is kind of strange because the players have this rule where they don't want that. So it was negotiated on behalf of the players, I'm sure, this thing in the CBA, that don't travel. Right. We want to spend more time with our families. And here, whether the plane was at 9 or 10 p.m., whatever, if I'm on it or if we're there, it's not, let's go, let's go. And the players apparently pushed hard to get in there as early as possible

to prepare themselves, which in itself is the right message, is it not? It is. That's what you want to hear from the players. But it also stems from the Leafs and from other teams, presumably, pushing the legal limit of that negotiation to the limit, right? Saying, okay, we can't leave until the 27th. Well, we're leaving at midnight. At that point, you've already said to the players

that they have to travel on the 26th, because call it the 27th, it's still the 26th. You know what I mean? Like, the Leafs have to travel on the 26th because call it the 27th it's still the 26th you know what i mean like they the leafs have basically decided for the guys that they have to travel the day before the game so if you're if you have to be there and you have to fly why am i getting in at two in the morning let's just go so you know i put some blame on the leafs i understand why the league is finding them trying to protect the players rights a little bit for the future but yeah i'm with you i get what the players' rights a little bit for the future. But, yeah, I'm with you. I get what the players are saying. Let's just go.

And as we discussed yesterday when we found out the news that they were being fined $100,000, there is still that one kind of thought that said, hey, just the price of doing business. I do wonder. Here's what I think happened. I think they thought if we get caught we can afford it but we probably won't get caught i bet lots of teams do it is that possible that it's like a common thing

that teams do it and they said ah you know we're not going to get singled out they got singled out so and yeah to their point whatever always looking for ways to use their financial might because the salary cap doesn't allow them to. So, hey, they got the win in OT. Maybe it was the difference maker. It was an extra little bit of sleep roll, Willie Nylander. Okay, so they play in a minor league facility against an organization that is doing everything in their,

I guess, power to stay relevant, look relevant. The Coyotes? Yes. This is them being relevant in a college rink? I'm saying the organization. Yeah. I'm just saying.

I know, I know. To play every night in the National Hockey League and look like you're uh a professional nhl team right is been challenging over the many years but they just it's not even the building for me it's that they just so actively don't want to win but teams have tanked before okay it's the combination of tanking and the arena. Which leads me to my next question to you. Okay. All right. The Leafs' career record of playing a team from the desert.

I've got it at 105 games since being in the desert. What is the career record of the Toronto Maple Leafs versus Phoenix slash Arizona Coyotes? Well, I know that the Coyotes, sorry, the Leafs were not very good for some of these years. And you wouldn't be asking me if the Leafs were like 80 and 25 and 25 so i'm gonna say they're pretty close to 50 50 here how about how about they're 55 and what'd you say 55 and 50 all right i do uh drum roll please uh no drum roll we're on the holiday edition here. There's no drum rolls. Barely me and you right now. 39-55, 8-3.

Shnikes. 8-OT, 3 in a shootout, but 39-55 against a team that we've seen in the playoffs like once in... Yeah, the team's been around 20 years and tried to tank six times. What is going on here? 39 wins and 105 tries. 39 wins. Against the Coyotes. Way to go, Leafs.

Okay, we got to fix that. They need to go on a little run here. So what do you think it is? They get down to the desert, get a little sunshine in the winter, and they prioritize playing at Weeco Paw and Greyhawk down there? I got a snippet of your New York Islanders owning the Rangers up until I think our last game of the regular season in 94. Yeah.

But there's just some teams that you just from from era to era too it's not like you know it's just 20 guys that have issues here it stretches out over a long period of time guys in guys out and yet you still can't find a way to beat certain teams. You know who would know best about this? Shane Doan. Shane Doan, who, by the way, is going to join you and me. Well, you know what? We thought we had Brett Holley yesterday. We're on a bit of a roll here, but Shane Doan's Canada team had lost today in the Spangler Cup.

Okay. So they went 0 for 3. Oh. So I'm not sure if we can, we're going to try to track him down and we'll see if we can if we would find him are you gonna leave me alone again and it's just me trying to fill air without shane doan yeah so we will uh we'll try to track down shane doan and see if he wants to join us and uh you know if he does great if he doesn't we we understand i think of course you know who will join us for sure jim ralph ralphie of course leaf radio network color analyst and a very good friend of the show and also we will track down much like shane dill and brett hall gourd stellick

who's most often reliable but we don't know if there's a visit to Pioneer Village or the dog pound. I don't know. As we're talking about this, it occurs to me that the true elite friends of the show, like Jim Ralph and Gord Stelic, we need Sportsnet to give us a gift budget so we can buy them something for joining us so often and

they need like a special class we have put plaques up in here the gourd stellic studio or something jim ralph room they deserve some love i like it wonderful like a green room yeah this is but named after their wonderfulness stellar uh it's electricity green room that's right okay we talked earlier about what kind of feel the Mullet Arena will have with the Toronto Maple Leafs in there tonight. Let's get Sheldon Keefe's thoughts on what he thinks will present tonight. It's different, but I think it's going to be, it's a little more intimate, of course,

and should make for a little more intensity to the whole thing. It'll be interesting to see how many Leaf fans are here tonight and what that might do for the atmosphere. But I think, as I've said, since we've come back from the break here, there's a general excitement and great spirit about our group. You can tell that even just a short break has rejuvenated them, but also, as you can hear right now, they just like being around each other.

So getting back together is great, and then you come here, you know, in Arizona, and of course it's Austin's hometown, and there's some excitement for him, and then as a result, our team around that too. So all that is presence, of course, but pucks is going to drop and you got to compete. That's really what it comes down to.

I'm excited about that. Yes. Let's see if he can save 25 grand for the Leaf organization tonight after the game. I know. Did you, I mean, you obviously did see it, but he was hot, huh? Like I went back and watched that. I've seen worse though. We've all seen worse.

For sure. like i went back and watched that i've seen worse though you we've all seen worse for sure so do you think that's like a related to everyone's watching the leafs all the time all eyes on leafs i think it does make it uh more challenging for the organization for sure yeah and let's not forget can't sneak one by there is a there's two offices of the national hockey league one is of course uh gary Bettman's home in New York City. And then the other one's above their roof at the Scotiabank Arena. Do they hate Toronto, do you think? Like, there's an arrogance, there's a lot of attention around it, there's all that with Toronto.

No, no, no, no. It's like, hate's a strong word. Okay. But it's on the spectrum of dislike, maybe? No, no, no, no. It's like, hate's a strong word. Okay. But it's on the spectrum of dislike, maybe? No, I do believe they try to be as fair as possible. Yeah. I do believe they don't want Toronto to get away with anything.

Anything extra. I think what the challenge challenge is to be honest with you is that uh uh something two two equal incidents one in florida or arizona tonight outside of playing against the leafs it just doesn't draw a ton of attention right and then anything that involves with the leafs is magnified times a thousand and that in itself then you then then it's the be very careful about the message that you're being sent because one will not be as scrutinized as the other yeah and that changes that that's that's that's the challenge you can't let it go unpunished when it's the Leafs because you know more people noticed it right and the first thing that comes back to them would be okay it's the Leafs yeah which is again unfair if you ask me yeah do they really care at the end of the day they're paid to do a job you know and they're going to get paid the same no matter whether the Leafs are successful or not or anybody else.

Now, could there be other factors that come in to say it would be a good thing if the Leafs won a Stanley Cup? Right? Right. It would undeniably be a good thing for the NHL and hockey. For sure. Historic franchise. Longest drought. Is it not now? In the NHL?

Yeah. I mean, outside of the teams who've never won them. Yeah, that's right. Original six teams. St. Louis got it done. Right? Yes. I agree with that.

Everybody's had some sort of modern type of Stanley Cup in the original six, except one we remember in black and white. Right, for sure. Hey, do you think MLSC would be mad at Dubas for that fine? Do you think they'd be like, you know, hey. No. No? No.

Like that's what a waste, $100,000, man. No. No? Just the price of doing business. Someone just e-transfers it like if it's a fantasy football league or something yeah 100k what i will tell what i will say to you most often when we hear of a coach being fined and we could look at an incident and i didn't think again it was crazy about you know he's He was pretty mad, though.

He was mad. And he came, he went pretty hard at the officials. But that's not what the $25,000 is for. It is probably what was behind that moment that we don't hear about or know about. And there could have been a file on him that didn't make, you know, make it out to the public from previous incidents. Yeah.

And usually when you see someone get fined, either a coach, it's an accumulation. It's I've, we've had enough of this. Yeah. Hey bud. And Tortorella is like the king at that.

Yeah. Where, how many times, you know there's no press releases for most warnings or a phone call or uh you know somebody said something to somebody for the we're sick of your act we got you got to calm down a little bit you know our officials are getting tired of it i was just surprised that keith could muster up that much anger and energy in game 36 of the season you know like i understand he's just a competitive guy you know not uh right to take it lightly well run do you want to just you know and just one other thing is like

it's still sheldon it's not daryl sutter like think about Daryl and just his comment. Remember two weeks ago in the Toronto media? Yes. Remember that one? Yes, I do. What did he insinuate? He, that Toronto gets the calls. He's like, I'm not saying it, but you know,

I just know when I used to play in Toronto, you know, I'm not saying it, but it's like Daryl, you're saying it. You're getting the calls because you're Toronto. Right. Is that, is that a findable? Is that, you know why it should be findable? Cause it's stupid.

It's stupid. The Leafs. But it's Daryl. It ain't Sheldon. I know the Leafs are like the least pen. They're sorry. One of the most penalized teams are on the wrong side of the penalty differential for years now.

So that's why I say it's stupid. You know, did you want to hear from Marner on Mullet Arena and Matthews returning? Absolutely. Let her rip. Yeah, it was cool. It was great to be in here yesterday skating and kind of see that vibe, what it's going to be like. So I'm sure this burn will be rocking.

It's always rocking when 34 comes back to this town, and it's always a fun game. But we've got to take this very seriously. This team's been rolling over there, and they've won some games against some very good opponents. So they've taken a lot of points from us the last couple years and this year in general. So we've got to make sure we come back to get those.

Well, he should know. Mitch and the boys lost to them earlier in the season. They've beaten Boston, if i'm not mistaken most recently colorado boston colorado the leafs yeah they've been good they're scrappy this team this arizona team i mean god forbid they get conor bedard i want them to win just so bedard doesn't end up there and i don't have to turn on the college bowl to watch conor bedard play hockey for the next few years. Hey, just a question.

When are we going to discuss your nine-bowl Maple Leafs predictions article? What part of the show is that happening? We're going to probably do that. Back end? Yeah, back end. Back end. JB speaks of a column I write every week for the Toronto Star. Check it out.

I've got it on Real Kipper on my Twitter feed. And basically what I'm touching on is closing out 2022 and a few bold predictions on the Toronto Maple Leafs and a few around the league. So we'll get into that a little later on in the show. How's that? You flopped them on the table a little bit if I may say. I did.

I did say bold. And you know it will come back the rest of my life you know i'm where i'll miss everyone can stuff it on that i you know i still i tweeted this out there and someone's like yeah once kipper thought that they should trade neilander for richie and montour shut up okay but you know what they failed to mention? It was like seven years ago. Yeah, and like some developmental paths changed a little bit. And not to mention, do this for, how long are you doing it?

22 years or something? At least. Yeah, do this for 22 years and fill two hours a day and make some predictions. You're going to have a couple that don't hit. It's all good. I've got a few per day. There's a few lazy ones out there. I'm okay with them reaching out every once in a while.

I'm not claiming you or I get it right all the time. It's just obnoxious. It was a fun piece on where we think this thing's headed, and we'll get into it a little later on in the show. We also got Jim Ralph. He's going to tee up the game tonight in Arizona. Morgan Riley's back. Morgan Riley's back. You want to get Sheldon's thoughts. Morgan Riley's back.

Morgan Riley's back. You want to get Sheldon's thoughts on Morgan Riley coming back? Squeeze it in. Yeah, it's a quick one. Oh, Tristan is on the phone. Sammy. Sammy. Yeah, that's a quick clip is it better for Morgan missing 15 games and coming back on a game like this in a non-NHL environment or would you rather

come in and go up against Colorado yeah no it's AHL and a half, you know, in terms of field, midseason, Arizona, it's a little bit different, so yeah, here we'll have Sheldon Keefe on the on Riley coming back. No message, really, other than

you know, I'll just be excited to go out and play. He's a veteran player, he's played a long time, he doesn't need to be excited to go out and play. He's a veteran player. He's played a long time. He doesn't need to be spoken to too much. All right, we got Ralphie. Jimmy Ralph, are you there? I'm here, Kip. I would have bet you weren't

with the last couple of days that JB and I have had. My guess is that you wouldn't have been there. This is like a bonus right now. What a treat. By the way, whenever I came back from injury, it was always in a non-NHL atmosphere. It's my career as well.

You don't need an NHL facility to call your world-class game tonight, do you? I'm going to plead the fifth. I got a chance to play in a few barns, just like the Mullet Arena when San Jose first came in. I think it was the Cow Palace.

Ralphie, you remember that one? Tampa Bay, I think played in, I don't know, an amusement park or something. We all played in Junior too. I don't know. It was actually kind of really strange, but once the puck drops,

hey, a game's a game, right? Yeah. The only thing you wonder, and it's hard telling from watching highlights on TV, if the lighting is NHL standard. It looks a little dark and some shadows. That could be one thing that you would look at from a goaltender standpoint where it might be a little more of a challenge. Because you know, even back in junior, you'd have certain ranks you'd play in that were just dark, you know.

And so that might be the big thing. You know, most places have pretty well lit for the TV lights. You just wonder what the lighting is like there for, you know, what's supposed to be a college team. So much like the goaltending situation where the Leafs not only weathered early injuries to their netminders, they've really weathered this one with no Morgan

Riley. But I think it's caught up to them a little bit, and maybe a few good chances by St. Louis has really made you feel like yeah, this is a good time to get Morgan Riley. That's enough. Yeah, 12-2-1 is pretty good feel like, yeah, this is a good time to get Morgan Raleigh. That's enough.

Yeah, 12-2-1 is pretty good without him, though, isn't it? You're going a pretty good roll there. And it's, yeah, I think they've been able to plug and play, you know, a lot of guys. And I hate using the old cliche, the system, but it seems like everybody they brought in is just, you know, meshed in well with the system. And i would say even with the goals against lately samson off is um we've seen a dip in his play the last two or three games you know the game in washington

he had an off night um gave up a couple of you know five hole along the ice goals against philly and then there were uh there were some moments i thought in the St. Louis game that he looked like those soccer goalies in the World Cup final on the penalty kicks. You know, I don't know if he's guessing right on this one. You know, they were able to survive it. So I put that down to, you know, being able to overcome, you know, goaltenders have been so good for them. I think it was just a matter of, you know, the offense bailing their goalie out. Ralphie, you've, you know, played a long career and you've been covering the game for a long time

and you're well aware that there are some ebbs and flows in the season. You know, you start the season, everyone comes out guns a-blazing but making mistakes. Where are we on the NHL calendar in terms of pace and energy coming out of Christmas break? What kind of hockey do you expect for the next little bit? You would think that it would tighten up, Barney, that, you know, the high scoring games you saw in the, you know, pre-Christmas time. But I'm not so sure.

You know, even watching the St. Louis-Toronto game that, you know, I think it's the highest goals per game, I think, since the early 90s that the NHL is at right now. So I think, I mean, my suggestion is to make the goalie equipment bigger. Thanks, Ralph. We appreciate your input. It does come full circle, doesn't it? But it's, yeah, I just have a feeling that it's, we're sort of embarking on the high-scoring 80s, 90s, 2.0.

Because it seems that every night there's, you know, I think guys are so skilled now. You know, even the so-called average players are giving an odd man rush. Chances are it's going to be in the back of the net. So we were just talking about uh for whatever reason man the leafs their overall record against arizona or phoenix has been like short of atrocious you know we're talking 39 55 8 and 3 39 and 55 like how do you explain that on a team that we haven't seen too often in the playoffs the last decade? Yeah, I mean, the games they've had. I think the game last year, it was closest.

Van Elk was great at goal again. I think Matthews tied it early in the third, and Arizona scored on a backdoor tap-in. I think Keefe was a little critical and Peter Morazic on that. But it just seems that even the game they had at home against Arizona early in the season, they just seemed to come out flat. Now, the good news is I think since the start of the 16-17 season, the only team they had a worse winning percentage against was St. Louis.

So maybe this is the turnaround road trip for them to come out. And, you know, it'd be nice to see them, you know, get out with a 4-5-1 win and dominate, start to finish. But I think Arizona, it almost looks like they're going to use this mullet arena like Fenway Park. You know, it's a little different than all the other stadiums and they might find themselves being pretty comfortable in it yeah I think they were a six and three record at home so far this season they've had some success there you know you mentioned the

lighting is going to be a little bit different I anticipate a lot of Leafs fans like you know you've been to many games of this arena is Is it typically a place where they get, you know, sort of 50%? What is the fan attendance like in Arizona generally? Yeah, I mean, it's kind of hit and miss. I think, you know, anytime you're around the holidays, you'll get better attendance. But I think just reading something that was sent out, the ticket prices have more than doubled, you know,

for obvious reasons. But it looks like it's packed every night. So, yeah, I mean, sometimes you do games in there where they'll announce 12,000 and you're thinking, I don't think so. I didn't sit up there and count, but those are the five. Ralphie, with the addition of Morgan Riley, it looks like the Leafs will be able to kind of stabilize their blue line finally.

And yet, on the other side, we see a guy like Jacob Chikrin who's got to be at the top of the list for top two, top three kind of defensemen available. Where are you on this blue line and how advanced have they gotten since that horrific road trip in California for Dubas to start thinking about what kind of pieces he wants between now and the trade deadline

and could perhaps a game like tonight be a bit of a showcase for Jacob Chikrin? Yeah, I'm not sure, Kip. I mean, on one side, you look at it, you say they're with the second-best goals against in the league, even though their goal scoring's down.

So it's probably... I would say if a trade is made, it's for more character than it is an upgrade, a huge upgrade in skill. And Chikrin does bring that bit of a chip on his shoulder, can play a little more physical,

and still has the offensive side. So that's what you love about him. So you might, if you want to make comparisons to, say, Lilligren or Rasmus Sandin, you're saying, well, offensively, he might not handle the puck quite as well, but there could be

a meaner streak. Now, saying that, he's almost a point-of-game guy since coming back. So I think it might have more to do with, I don't want to say an upgrade in character, because that's demeaning to the guys that they have that have done so well, but that other element, and I think that's why they made the Dryden Hunt trade. How do you feel? Yeah, yeah. That makes sense. Sorry. Go ahead.

Oh, no. That was pretty much done. I was just scrambling. Stepping all over you. Sorry. I was going to just ask generally about this Coyotes team and how you feel about rebuilds and what the right way to do it is. You know, I personally, just to give you my take,

I don't know that you can tear it all the way down to the studs and then quickly turn things around i feel like the young guys need some quality players around them to learn from to put you in hockey games that matter you know i saw someone saying that the the canadian should trade joel edmondson i was like what then what you know they got five rookies back there right now how do do you feel about the Coyotes and what they're doing in terms of trying to get things turned around for, I don't know, 2027? Yeah, well,

I tell you, when, you know, Chicago is doing the same thing, and you say, well, let's get rid of DeBranco and Kirby Dock. And you're going, okay. Don't you need someone? You know, so that was the one that caught me off guard. Although I remember the Rangers, remember they sent the letter out to season ticket holders?

Oh, yeah. And this is a rebuild that all of a sudden you go and get Panarin as a free agent and you're right back, you know. Yeah. So they probably did it quicker than anybody. But you're right, they had that. They still had a core there of veteran guys. So, yeah, I'm big on that, that, you know, you have to have some pieces there to build around.

And, you know, teams have gone different ways of doing it, but when you see teams go 10, 12 years, that means one theory after another hasn't been working for you. We're talking to Jim Ralph, the voice of the Toronto Maple Leafs. Ralphie, you had mentioned Dryden Hunt. We expect him to be in the lineup tonight don't we uh JB yep uh for for Anderson uh is is this the missing piece here to take the the fourth line to another level is this just another uh version of Aston Reese here? Where are you on the bottom six, particularly the fourth line? Well, I'll tell you the third line I think has been fantastic.

Lately, Yang Ball, who else we got on there? Camp. And David Gant. Yep. I think they've been outstanding, both ends of the ice. So, yeah, I mean, I think you want guys that play a little heavier, a little tougher, and even if they're not going to score, you know, Holmberg, I think, has really been a nice fit

getting on the fourth line. But, you know, we'll see what kind of chemistry they have. You know, if they can dump and chase and bang around and kind of be the setup guys for when the big boys come over the boards after that. But, yeah, I mean, I think with all due respect to Dennis Melligan, even though he was playing with Neidlander, pardon me, Tavares and Marner before he got traded,

we saw him in the fourth line and you're kind of going, I don't know if that works. You know, once you get into the postseason, you need a little more size and a little more physicality. And at least Dryden Hunt's going to get an opportunity to prove he's the guy for it. What are your thoughts on Matt Murray not getting the start coming off a four-day break?

I was surprised. And then I was starting to think, is there some concern about the groin that you want to give him more practice time to use him into it? Like I said, with Samsonov, you sort of started to see some cracks in the game, in his game. And now he's played three out of the last four, which is a little odd because Murray was so good against Tampa

when he got his last start. Yeah, I think, was it Luke Fox who suggested that maybe Samsonov had maybe said something about wanting more games? Was that our problem? Yeah, yeah. Ralphie, we just didn't tell the coaches we wanted to play more? Oh, no, no.

I mentioned it quite often. They just didn't listen to us. Oh, yeah. And then I think one team I just left in the middle of the year and it was two months before they found out that i wasn't there so yeah that wasn't exactly a surefire measure to get more ice time okay all kidding aside though if he can turn around and say he wants more games and he gets it um good on him you know do you foresee this back half of the season coming up as a split

or do you think Matt Murray would say, hold on for a second, I haven't shown enough that I should get three out of four starts here? Well, I mean, let's face it. In your mind, Murray's got to be the guy going in. And my concern is going to be

that if you want to split them, you know, pretty much even down the middle for the rest of the season, that's great. Then how's the guy going to hold up when you're going to play every second night in the playoffs? You know, I still think you've got to sort of acclimate your body to playing a lot over a period of time. And, you know, all of a sudden then, you know,

game four of the playoff series where you're playing every second night, the guy's hurt because he's, you know, not quite in that groove. So I would like to see probably, you know, a two-to-one split in favor of Matt Murray and, you know, get him sharp, but get his body ready for hopefully what's going to be a long grind through the playoffs. You know, playing Arizona tonight, I can't help but think of their purpose in the season

as obviously a high pick. Did you happen to watch any of the world juniors in terms of seeing Conor Bedard seven points last night? Yeah, he's pretty good. Got a future, huh? Yeah. You know, like, should, I mean, how desperately should teams be trying to get to the bottom?

I know I mentioned, like, you want to be competitive, but boy, he seems like a franchise changer. Yeah, I think you put him in the McDavid-Matthews area. I mean, you know, you've seen guys that come up and the pressure, like Lafreniere in New York, I think it's still going to turn out to be a good NHLer. But I think it's such a rarity to have a guy that can come out and make a difference right away, whether he can do what McDavid did or even Matthews was a 40-goal score in his first year. It's going to be difficult. But, yeah, he looks like one of those rare gems.

But, I mean, it's one thing to finish near the bottom and then you need the the hand of the hockey gods to help you out in the draft lottery too ralphie we always appreciate your time i know we're closing out 2022 always awesome your contributions to the show uh i'm sure you have big New Year's Eve plans, right? You're going to head down to the square? Party. No, I got a game that night. I'm not going to get there until after the second period.

Hey, pal. We wish you all the best in 2023. Same to you, Kipper. You too, Bordy. Thanks, Ralph. You too, bud. It's Jimmy Ralph. Always fun. You doing New Year's Eve things? I'm not

a New Year's Eve guy. No, me either. Not at all. But of course, I played for the Rangers, so you had to kind of check out Times Square once in your life. Did you? Yeah. And it's just one big vomit pool. Awful. You know, I told you I lived in Arizona three years. I just never went to the Grand Canyon. I was never one of those guys that close. still didn't do it so good for you for going once uh

you just touched on connor uh bedard and we've got a few minutes before we go to break and you just get the sense that yes he will be impactful yes like right away is there a butt coming no well the butt is is we've seen the last little while, first overall picks, there's no guarantees, and some may take a little bit of time to come to surface, like a Jack Hughes. And then there's others that are struggling, and Lafreniere is one of them who's a healthy scratch.

First pick overall. Can't find just a sweet spot in the lineup for the New York Rangers. You know, this sort of thing becomes defining for a coach. You know, for Gerard Gallant right now, it's like, I know the Rangers are kind of middling right now right now but losing and not saying he's lost but losing a number one overall draft pick or at least frustrating him or at least struggling to get the most out of him you know whether it's fair or not that does come back to the coach in the end does it not like the organization can't be happy that lafrenier is falling to where he is no no 100 and like gerard gallant is putting his you know what on a on a chopping block here if in fact

this thing doesn't turn around for it in in any way shape or form um it's not even like it's shane wright and it's seven games into his career we're year three could be great he could come back and uh and it could spark something for him i don't think he's been horrible like he's he's managed to pick up some points even when he doesn't get points i think i like him a lot do you think it's at the point where they would trade him or they fire the coach first i think the rangers and i think their fan base probably the last little while have been waiting for maybe some shoe to drop. And they've got Kakko as an option.

They've got Lafreniere as an option to move. And Hedl's decent too. Yeah, but they like him. It sounds like they like Hedl a lot more than finding a regular spot for Lafreniere. Wow. And like, you know, he doesn't get much power play time, and these kids need their looks on the power play. And there's Kreider there, and there's Panarin there,

and he just can't find a spot there, and they don't like him on the right side. He doesn't look comfortable on the right side. There was some success there with the kid line during the playoffs. Just trying to make sense. With Kako and Hedl. So the first power play unit is Kreider, Trocek, Panarin, Zibanejad, Fox. So to get on there, you got to basically say,

all right, we're going to put trocek on the bench not going to be crider who scored 50 times last year not going to be panera not going to be zibanejad not going to be fox yeah so you got to be better than i don't know i don't know what the analytical numbers are but it just seems to me that the star players now much more even in my era have no problem sucking up the whole two minutes if they need it. Oh, yeah. On the second unit, not even on that. Even the stars, teams that I've been involved with,

the stars had a sense that you're going to get a minute, a minute and 20. 75 seconds, yeah. Minute and 20 at the most. But if you're not having success get the off the ice well and if the puck goes back to your own end and it's been a minute you don't get another chance to reload and go again you know because by the time you set up you're at a minute and a half and or a minute and 10 whatever but i don't know it's just it's not even uh you don't even blink

an eye now to to to see guys out there absorbing the full two minutes or even going 220 that's because the breakout is now just go back and drop it for the one guy who can skate everyone else just wait pull up a lawn chair at the blue line you go get it get it mitch okay we're gonna take a quick break here and uh we'll see if we can hunt down shane doan after the break all right all right it's justinne. It's Nick Kiprios. And you are listening to Real Kipper and Bourne. CJCL Toronto. This is Real Kipper and Bourne on Sportsnet 590 The Van.

Also on the show, Gord Stelik in our second hour as we try to hunt down Shane Doan. Shane Doan, of course, the general manager of Team Canada's men's national team for the Spangler Cup. Also former Arizona Coyote. We'll ask him about the Coyote situation. Mullet Arena. His son plays for Arizona ASU.

That's so cool. I know. I see the videos. Right. It's awesome. It is absolutely awesome. And they had dropped Team Canada, of course, dropping a 3-1 decision to Swedish club Orbro. Yeah.

The lineup for that Spangler Cup team uh it's one of those like remember a guy type of thing it's like they just like see the names like oh yeah that guy still plays it's david deharney there's uh daniel winnick it's just like an interesting mix of people sounds like fun well joe thornton loved it i know that yeah i mean what an honor to get a part of michael hutchinson's over there let's go through the lineup let's let's play remember a guy here kevin conaten's over there who else we got riley nash cory emerton daniel winnick brandon perlini david day harney tyler ennis colton sevier some players here cody eakin brett connelly yeah so there's it's an interesting canadian team i am fascinated the team with all those talented players has gone

oh and three but i'm sure don't fill us in on that and uh goal goal scoring an issue yeah i think only one forward ended up scoring in those three games, and that's Conley. Really? Yes. Yeesh. Yeah, that's not going to get it done. Well, okay. We'll get Shane momentarily. Tristan's on that.

While you're doing that, let me tell you about the Samsonov thing. Yeah, okay. I got a message that said that we were talking about Samsonov asking for more games uh the the message i got from someone was that he hadn't asked for more games so much as he asked for the next game because he was bad in philly you know like you have that off game you're like look i just need let's get but i gotta get back to finding my game so he asked for the st louis game specifically uh shout out for that message from someone and that makes some sense to me all right tristan, you got a number to call?

Yeah, I sent it to you. All right. All right. Check your phone, pal. All right. Yeah, that's always a difficult thing. I mean, a limited number of players available. You got to put together a team at the last second.

Chemistry always the first thought yeah when you're playing teams that have been together for the season and really no idea how how it's going to come together no conley of course uh three goals i always liked him too i mean yeah i think he was a serviceable player it's always one of those things that uh people talk about is like a to-do list in your life like go over to switzerland after christmas watch the spangler cup enjoy davos do some skiing sounds like a wonderful trip i know uh andrew walker's over there right now uh you know former sportsnet employee he's uh soaking it and it seems like a pretty cool experience.

So something I'd like to do one day. All right, so it wasn't that Samsonov asked for more games. He just wanted to bounce back off of the tough start against the Philadelphia Flyers. Okay, as promised, Shane Dona joining us. Hey, Dona,'t show uh joining us hey donor really appreciate uh you uh joining us i know uh uh you're coming off a tough loss today so i know it's not the results you wanted but uh maybe your thoughts overall on the experience and uh and what really has transpired

with uh with your team canada the last few games yeah obviously that obviously that wasn't exactly what any of us had in mind. It's always when it goes over here, it's the most game. It's all one-wall games. Unfortunately, we're on the wrong side of the room. I think it's hard because it's really the reason you play is because you have a chance to win, which is incredible and so exciting. But in order for it to be incredible and so exciting, you have to give up that chance that you might lose.

And if you lose, it's no fun. Shane, how do you feel about the chemistry being a factor with other teams having been together and trying to bring your team together? What are some of the challenges that go into assembling a Team Canada for this sort of competition? Oh, yeah, that's a huge part of it it's it's much more difficult um and and at the same time this year was tough and we had uh three four of our the swiss players that would play defense for us or were injured so we had to bring over five players. And the players were more careful doing it. But you're adjusting to a sheet of advice that's 200 by 100 instead of 85.

That's the big difference. And it takes, you know, a day or two to figure that out. And people that are more comfortable, the game is a little bit more. It's funny. Everyone thinks that if we made the S bigger, we'd have more goal scoring and gave more room. But I actually think it works the exact opposite. The games are a little bit lower scoring because you just end up shooting from too far away.

So that's a big part of it as well. Brett Connolly led your team with three goals, but squeezing out goals from a forward, really a huge challenge here. Specialty teams five on five, what stood out with the lack of offense for you? You know, it's hard to put your finger on it. I think that's one of the things that made it difficult. We actually, I mean, you start going into analytics

and looking at all that stuff, and the three-team span doesn't really matter because we lost three games. But if you played those games over, you know, I played those same games eight and a half times, and all of a sudden, more than a percentage of balance is out to where it's supposed to be. It's hard. You sometimes end up being on the outside a little bit more than you want in the PGI surface.

And as you try to figure that out, you end up realizing that, you know, between the dots is always the same, and you have to find your way into the inside. It's just like golf on any surface that you have to be inside and get to the middle of the ice. Sometimes it's harder to do that when you're on a bigger surface and you have a little bit. You realize you beat somebody, and now you've got another seven, eight feet to go. And so you shoot too soon or you think you don't have time.

So you shoot before you need to. And you're, you know, eight, ten feet out makes a big difference for a goalie. We're talking to Shane Doan, general manager of Team Canada's men's national team for the Spengler Cup. You know, Shane, when we get guys, especially with your type of pedigree coming out of the National Hockey League, it's just a matter of what you want to do next and get a feel for it and let things settle down. Just maybe talk about your overall experience being the general manager of this hockey club and whether or not that really gets your juices flowing again.

We can't ever play again. We know that, but did it feel, did it feel like you had that, that vibe and that juice going again? Yeah. You know what? I've been,

I've got to do this with, with team Canada a few different times and I enjoy it every time. It's a lot of fun. And I get to do stuff with, with people that I I'm good friends with and that I get fun. I get to do stuff with people that I'm good friends with and that I get to do stuff with them. And you get to talk hockey and you get to

be around the guys and you get to understand the way the game's working and see the personalities of the new players. It's a lot of fun. There is nothing like playing. Playing is still the funnest thing to do and I love that. I still do it on Mondays and Thursday nights and have a blast doing it. But at the same time, being part of this was a lot of fun.

This tournament is unique in the fact that you get to bring families and guys brought over their parents, guys bring over their kids, and it's really kind of a family time at Christmas and over the holidays. It's unique, and it's in a special place, and it's a lot of fun. Unfortunately, the last time we were here, the last time I was here was for the 2019 one, and that was the last time that they had the tournament due to COVID. We won at that time, so that was probably a little bit more enjoyable today. The end of it was a little more enjoyable.

But this one's unique in its own way, probably a little bit more enjoyable today or the end of it was a little more enjoyable but um this one's unique in its own way and you get to be around friends and family over the holidays so you definitely enjoy it well shane the uh i'm not surprised to hear that you still play always had a great passion for it um looking at the arizona coyotes this year you know you're still involved there obviously involved in hockey development through it with that club how would you assess the initial year so far at Mullet Arena as they sort of are in their transition phase to uh what presumably will be a new facility in Tempe at some point yeah it's something that you know what it's a unique experience and um it kind of takes you back to a college or a junior hockey rink

where there's only 4,500, 4,600 people in the building, and it's special. It's something that you don't get to experience watching an NHL team do that. And when you do, it's definitely something that's different than what it is in the other buildings. So as much as it's temporary, we're going to be here for a couple years, three or four years, and we've got to make the most of it. I think the environment that the guys are playing in is exciting. And when people come into that building, it's different than any other one.

We're trying to take advantage of that. As a group, we've got a group of young guys that are growing, and hopefully they can continue to grow shane it it seems like uh you know arizona now has been a part of the nhl for such a long time but there has been this roller coaster of of stability and i'm just wondering now uh does it really feel different to you uh mulaterina is this is this truly one step back to take two forward here um or is there still you know the world of uncertainty well i think that um there's there's an element without a doubt that it's a step back to take a step forward and if we can get the building done obviously as i've got my kind of career on the whole fact

that it does work in Arizona. When we have a decent team and we're playing well, it does really work there. People can poke fun and make fun of the Coyotes for lots of reasons, but the fan base that has been there through everything has been incredible that they've been willing to stick it out because we've made it as difficult as possible at times through all different facets of the organization over the last, I guess, 20, 27 years.

I guess it's almost 27 years. So it's something that we're working at going in the right direction and we're getting in the right direction. And once we do, you look at a team like Tampa Bay, and obviously everyone uses that as an example of what they've done. You look at Dallas and what they're doing, and obviously L.A. has had some success. And I think that we can be in that same category, if not even in that category.

It's such an incredible place for Canadians to come visit. People from the northern states come down and have relocated. The city's growing faster than any other city in North America and it's an incredible place to live and I think that if we get everything kind of being compared apples to apples that Arizona will have a chance to be as good a place as any to play hockey and I'm excited about the future. That's great. So what's the roadmap for building the club, you know,

in terms of trying to get back to, you know, you want to win a Stanley Cup. Obviously that's you. You mentioned winning and that being the priority. You know, I don't know that that's the intent while you're in Mullet Arena. What sort of do you see as the plan for the Coyotes to get where they're trying to go? Well, I think it's a little bit like every team that's probably in the bottom half of the league, that you have to figure out a way to get your base built up and draft well and build up a stable of young guys.

You look at a team like Colorado right now, it seems like it's, well, obviously we all want to be Colorado. Well, they had Eric Johnson as a first-round pick. Then they had our first overall. Well, St. Louis picked him first overall. But then they had Landis Gog was a second overall pick. Matt Duchesne was a third overall pick. Then they had another dip, and they had Nathan McKinnon come in,

and that whole group with Nathan McKinnon and Rantanen and that group. And then they had another dip when they got Kael McCarr and the other defensemen, whatever they got from Ottawa. And now you start to see that it's been a span of a long time. So it's not easy to do. And everyone hopes that they can figure it out as quickly as possible. But if you want to win Stanley Cups and you want to be a true contender, I think you have to have elite players.

And sometimes that's not fun to get. And when you want to, you know, have a, a feeling of community with your players, you don't necessarily fire sale them every year. And I know Jacob chicken's names out there, but Shane,

you know, part of the reason why there's still hockey in Arizona is because of players like you who probably could have got traded a thousand times. But you said, no, I want to be here. And, you know, at some point they're going to have to hold on to their players. Yeah, and I agree with that 100 percent. Obviously, it's the situation with Chick has been well documented with everything that's kind of gone on in the past year and a half with him. You look at Clayton Keller and Lawson Kraus and Christian Fisher,

and those are guys that have been around for five, six, seven years, eight years that are starting to be guys that are big parts of our team. And that's where we do have to keep our players. And you look at the teams that have continuity for a while, that's when they start to really mesh. You go through what, well, you look at Tampa as a great example. You look at what Tampa did where they have so many of their guys drafted in their system, brazed in their system,

and when they failed early, they had the patience to stick with them, and now everyone looks like geniuses. And I think Julian there has done an absolutely incredible job. He's got to be recommended for when Stevie left, that instant to come in and say, okay, I'm going to put my stamp on it. But he kind of just came in and added a couple things, did a couple tweaks, but really kind of left the foundation and left the continuity in there. And it paid dividends.

And I think that's sometimes harder to do because it's human instinct. You want to come in and show you the, you know, make big changes and do things dramatically. And sometimes that's not what's needed. And sometimes it's patience truly can be a virtue. Hey, Shane, can't thank you enough for coming on i know it's a tough loss today and not the results you wanted you could have easily bailed on on coming on our show today you didn't because you you're you're as much of a stand-up guy today than you were your whole career and uh uh want to wish you the very best in 2023. Thanks for doing this. Well, thanks, Kip. I appreciate it.

And yeah, there was a moment that I thought about it. Because this isn't exactly what I, you know. Yes, yes, we understand. And it's so frustrating. But thanks, guys, for having me on. And enjoy listening to your show. Well, looking forward to many more years with you running hockey clubs, if that's what you choose.

Thanks again, Shane Doan. Thanks, Chris. And no question that I think in what I've experienced the last 25 years in broadcasting, seven, eight out of 10 guys would have not done this. 100%. That's a tough loss today and uh it's it's team canada yeah we don't accept you know losing or not qualifying for quarterfinals semifinals finals you know it's just we know

what the culture is like for hockey canada and he's at the start of building a managerial career and probably takes that particularly hard but it's you, you know, three games, it's one goal losses. It's, you know, it's tough. So good on him for showing up. He has his whole career. Yep.

And he is one of the best. Like they don't get much better than Shane. Don't. All right. As we talked about earlier in the show, I wrote an article for the Toronto star today. My weekly article came out. It talks about the Toronto Maple Leafs, of course,

our focus on our show and my column every week. And this one really tapped into what do we think JB going into 2023, wrapping up 2022, what can we take out of 2022? Yep. And what can we look forward to in 2023? So I had my Twitter feed talk about their thoughts or what are their bold predictions. And for the most part, I'll start it off with you that this will be the year that the Leafs escape

the first round. Believers, believers all around and believer in Nick Kiprio said this is the year they find a way through is it is as definitive for you or are you you're you're 60 40 30 20 90 10 here's the thing now we really put our neck on the line I mean hockey is hockey and the best team in the league can go up against an arizona coyotes or you know last night vegas anaheim or whatever and the the favored team has like a 60 chance so yeah i think the least will get through here's one thing we

know kip they're like almost certain to play Tampa Bay in the first round. The Detroit Red Wings are in fourth in the division and not catching them. Florida is way back of both teams. Boston is way up on both teams. They're almost certainly going to play Tampa. So, yeah, like I think they're going to get out of the first round. I'm waiting for Boston to lose and have a bad two weeks. And that's all it may take for this to be a different conversation.

But assuming it's Tampa Bay, I do think, I do think that they'll beat Tampa this time. I know I sound like a fool. I do, though. But it's like 52% chance for me. And I acknowledge that in my article today, that they were close. They let them off the hook. They let them off the hook.

I agree. i still see john taveras scoring in my mind and just what is the biggest difference for you um thinking that this is the year that they can get over tampa bay so you mentioned in your article that the team defense is significantly better yes you know and that is an element of it for me like they they're second in the nhl you noted two point what did you write here 2.46 goals against per game the bruins the only team better in the whole nhl but that's not it for me what it is is their star players the whole thing is built around their star players which really is the the plan for the last five, six years.

Right. It is. Their star players have to be superstars, and they have to drag their team through. But if you look at the history of the NHL, almost without exception, and I say almost because there are some, but almost without exception, the best players in the world get theirs. They do. And whether it's Wayne Gretzky or Mario Lemieux or Alex Ovechkin or Sidney Crosby or go down

the list until you get to Eric Lindros. And then even beyond that, maybe it's Marcel Dion. But they get theirs. This team is going, these players are going to be on teams that go on runs. They're too good. And I just think that there's going to be a year that they have an elevated performance where the Tampa Bay Lightning go, we can't run Nick Purbix out against Mitch Marner and survive. This is the year. Right?

I did in my article today, I did say that I could see a conference final. I don't see enough depth to withstand four rounds out of their lineup. Right, because they're going to ask so much of those guys. And I don't know, like, is it Tampa Bay crossover into the Metro for the second round and then maybe face boston in the third is it boston in the second round but i said that they they could find themselves in a conference file i just don't know whether or not after six failed first round that they don't need another lesson somewhere between the second and the third round yeah or a stanley cup final loss to take them to another level can you go from six disappointing rounds to four great rounds to win a stanley cup well or is there a gap year

somewhere right and then that's of course an option you know, a lot of it comes down to luck. Like, can their star players all be healthy throughout the whole run? But then I look at the Toronto Raptors. And to get there, some things have to break your way. And whether that's missed shots or whether it's Kawhi's ball getting the bounce and whether it's Klay Thompson tearing an ACL and Durant missing games at the right time, you know, you need things to go your way. So all you can do is put yourself in the group of teams

who have a chance, and the Leafs are going to be in that group of teams. And then they just need the hockey gods to not smite them for the 6,000th time. So we've covered two of them in my article today, which was team defense and sharing the spotlight you know where i went after that finding so deadline deal sort of thing finding someone who is you didn't mention labushkin but i thought he was an undervalued asset last year

and they found him is kyle now going to be in a situation where he can get bold by the trade deadline or is this where kyle goes to his strengths which is not bold it's actually the crumbs it's not it's not the the main ent. Delicious crumbs and poor entrees. Can he find a few more crumbs here to round out the team that he thinks can go deep in the playoffs? No, like a Gavrikov. Gavrikov's stock is way too high now because everyone's talking about him as the only guy who's physical. He's Ben Sherrod. He's this year's Ben Sherrod. He's a first in a prospect, which has been a...

Can I just say something? It might be off topic here, but that Ben Sherratt deal... Not good. It could set back Florida for 10 years. You're giving up a lottery pot. If they're a lottery ball, it's... If that's it... I love that we've got them in a lottery now.

And Berard is a Montreal Canadian because you gave him up for Ben Chirot. Yeah. That's an organization game changer for the next 10 years. If you get that bad bounce, if the ball comes up Florida and they have to hand roll it to Montreal, if the owner immediately says, I just cannot keep you employed to the GM. How is that not a fireable offense? You know, it's one of those things where you're like, I love you as a person, but I can't look at you every day

knowing that you probably cost me tens of millions of dollars by not having a superstar. For Ben Sherrod! I know, Ben Sherrod is one of those guys whose stock went way up because he did a thing against Toronto. Okay, so that's what Kyle wants to avoid. Yes, avoid the Sherratt trade. So does he need bold or can he get away with finding a couple of more diamonds in the rough?

You know, they're pretty darn good right now, aren't they? Like, I don't think they need to go acquire Patrick Kane. Not to mention, a lot comes with getting a guy like Patrick Kane or Jonathanane you have to mention a lot comes with getting a guy like patrick kane or jonathan taves or like a lot comes with that like nick felino's doing one-on-one sit-downs with christine simpson you know when he's here it's like i i don't see pat kane i don't see bo horvat i don't see ryan o'reilly you don't i, eh? I don't. I could be wrong. Yeah. But I get the sense. You see Ned Schneebly who's on the. I get the sense that, you know,

who are you knocking off that power play for Pat Kane? Just tell me who. Right. Where. Is Tavares going to sit? What's, yeah. Where do you find scoring on a guy who doesn't need to be on power play one? And if you do put them on, you do get a guy who't need to be on power play one and if you do put them on

you do get a guy who is used to be on power play one how do you make it work with your stars and make them accept less all right you know what we're going to take a quick break and uh we're going to pick up this conversation uh with gourd stellick i think he'd be fascinating uh to listen to you mentioned matthew can eyes in. And we'll get his thoughts and his bold predictions in 2023. It's Gord Stelik after the break. You're listening to Real Kipper and Born.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. You know, JB, we cannot close out 2022 without our next guest. And we've hunted him down. And now we're going to sing him our rehearsed Auld Lang Syne, Kipper and I, acapella. Ready, Gord? Okay, I'm ready.

Wait, we decided we need one more day to practice. Gord, thanks for pausing when Harry met Sally to be on our show. No problem. No, I'm over. Revenge of the Nerds 2 is coming up next. I only got a couple of minutes. How are you enjoying this break, Gord? You know what?

My family is in Mexico. So I'm enjoying the break. I'm taking it easy. Just played some doubles tennis and avenged defeat yesterday. Chris Tehan, myself, we took down Mark Jasvac and Ward Meek to defeat. 6-3, 6-3, Kipper. So all pumped. Do you think next year, if you're a good boy and not on the naughty list,

they'll let you go to Mexico? Oh, it's okay. Don't worry about it. It's fine. It's fine. I have work to do and stuff, and it's fine. It's all good. Okay.

We want to pick up a conversation we started before the break. I wrote an article for the Toronto Star. I made some bold predictions for 2023. We do not want to go any further until we hear from you on whether or not the Leafs in 2023 get out of the first round. Kippy, Justin, check out sportsnet.ca, the predictions, and I predicted the Leafs win the Stanley Cup back in September. There's no logic to it, no science to it, no analytical breakdown to it.

I just felt it's time. So that's a gut feeling, and I really liked, I found the last month or whatever period of time encouraging in that prediction so the answer is yes and you have based this all along on four particular forwards uh the fact that uh the blue line was good enough for you that that Murray and Samsonov would be the answer in that where did it stem well keep in mind I did pick the Winnipeg Jets last year, okay? So my track record is not great, but there's no 1-900 El Gordo line that makes money.

But I felt the goaltending was a question mark. The goaltending, I think I've said before, I wasn't skeptical about it, but it was wait and see. I mean, that was the boldest move they made in the offseason, and certainly that's been more than satisfied, but I just, I just felt about, okay, time they get that. I mean, every, every series has been a bloody deciding game. And at least this time they didn't save their worst game for game seven, or in the case of Columbus game five. So, you know, in some ways the bounces have to go for you.

And in some ways I just thought about, for you um and in some ways i just thought about about the leadership group on the team and and yeah i mean like the defense i felt and i heard you guys talking before the break and i really felt that trade deadline they'd be looking to get a core four defenseman and trade deadline they may be uh may be in the goaltender sweepstakes like mark andre flurry was year, but there's no reason for the latter. And certainly, I mean, he got Morgan Riley returning, and man, they played their best hockey without him.

You got a kid like Rasmus Sandin, I know he's hurt the last couple of games, but upping his game, a guy like Giordano, the veteran side, playing his minutes, Justin Hall reclaiming his game, TJ Brody just being steady and, you know, Lilligren growing. And so just a lot of things. So, so a lot of positives have come into fruition, but what I made the prediction, there's no question that they weren't, they weren't as complete a team as the, the, like, like the last two teams when the Stanley cup, for example.

So Gordo, what do you want to see over the next stretch of hockey from this Toronto Maple Leafs team? It's kind of a weird stretch, right? We said fans said they wouldn't care until the playoffs, but boy, they're kind of teasing around, you know, what are they, third in the NHL in points percentage. What do you want to see to make you more confident that this is a team that can go deep in the playoffs? More of the last month, which is a no-brainer, but also just not these

valleys anymore. No more crises. Like, you know, they've never, except for the All-Canadian Division year, they've never had a regular season, you know, that was really not beget by some kind of crisis, some kind of losing streak. So I think, you know, that's one. I mean, hey, don't lose three games in a row. You know, put that as a reasonable goal for the rest of the way. And I just, I like, to me, they've, you know,

every year they were bringing in leaders before right they were bringing in patrick marlow they were bringing in joe thornton they're bringing in wayne simmons they're you know they're bringing in veterans and i kept thinking well why do why does toronto need to keep bringing in these veterans when they've got this young leadership group that you know most of them are wearing a's and i and i and and and justin to answer your question um i'd like that they had some adversity. I like that Team Canada lost that first game and the World Juniors. I like some adversity along the way when you're having a regular season and it's the playoffs that matter the most, like in the Leafs case.

It's something to be thrown your way during the regular season that you weren't expecting, and I like the way they responded to it. So I know people say, wake me up, game number 83. And there is an element of truth about it. But they've certainly, Justin, been intrigued and enjoyed the way this – I mean, this team has showed them something the last month in particular. Okay, so Chikrin's not auditioning for you tonight? No, don't need to make the big trade.

Don't need to make the big trade. No, no, don't need to. I mean, don't need to make the big trade no no don't need to i mean like like that got alleviated with this last month i mean when they had the d all gone i mean kyle could have been in a spot that you go oh and four and you're going man you know what the wheels are falling off and we could be right out of the playoffs before these guys start returning and at that point you know maybe had to make a bolder bigger move so given what i believe the asking price will be for chikorin then no no this is and you know i heard what you guys were talking about earlier and it is you i mean it is a unique year when you're talking about

horvat and kane and tapes and but i think the peter forsberg to nashville trade showed a lot because you were just saying like you know who does patrick kane take off the power play for example and i remember matt sundin kind of cited what Peter Forsberg's experience in Nashville, that it's not only that if you're a player of that caliber, it's like you start in a new office on Monday and you've got to dominate. Like, you know, you don't have any kind of onboarding week or get, no, no, we just don't want you to be part of the team. You're going to lead the team.

You're going to be the difference maker in a lot of people's eyes. And that's a lot to ask and a lot for someone to expect to themselves so looking at uh kyle dubas's situation and he's the guy making these decisions what are your thoughts on him being without an extension and what is likely to come at the end of this season or before why do we know he doesn't have a contract i don't understand everything anyway why do we know that's a great question why do we know like seriously they tell us nothing and now we know this and hey i it doesn't make a difference to the players whatsoever no um there used to be that kind of rule it was an informal rule and you see it's

been violated now that coaches got to put in for their own good that they had to have an extra year, and they never could be lame duck. Kyle could be timing this fabulously. If he just wins one, well, I think one playoff round would suffice. I'm not sure, but say if he wins two, he all of a sudden is like Mark Shapiro. He goes from a lame duck year to a 10-year contract. I had someone offer up the other day that they think Kyle may choose to go somewhere else on his own volition. I mean, this gives him, I have no idea about that or insight, but this gives him the

chance to do that. But I, hey, I wish he was locked up for eight years. I just don't think it makes any difference. I would think he would look like, like, I'm not saying don't make a trade. I'd love to get like a Nick Paul type or a defenseman Nick Paul type or something, you know, something like that, that in the playoffs is a bit of a difference maker. But I don't understand what him having a final year of a contract has anything to do with anything regarding the trade deadline. I mean, does Brendan think he's going to make trades solely based on that? And, you know, come on.

Is it as black and white as we think it is when it comes to Kyle's extension? Is there any scenario, Gord, for you that he loses in the first round and still gets an extension? You know, again, there's nothing about being fair or unfair. No way. You can't. You can't put this on. You already got the fans saying, I'll see you at game number 83.

You know, you can't subject them to that. And, again, it doesn't matter. Fairness doesn't come into play. How can you? How can you sell that again? And then you got Austin Matthews as a guy that could be he's next he's next summer's matthew kachuk and yet you haven't won a playoff round the whole time austin matthews has been here yeah no that's that's a situation you just you can't be in well the this toronto maple leafs team is obviously a

fascinating one the goaltending situation right now is not at risk of becoming jack campbell campbell-esque last season but you know do you think that this you know the couple of crazy hot starts do you think they they've got some goaltending to overcome over the next little bit as it sort of regresses back to what it was expected to be well you know justin i mean you make that's a really salient point in that you know know, great goaltending, you know, it's a run. It's magical. And everything else is great because it sets the tone. I mean, you had that Dallas game where the Leafs had no business winning it,

and they got a shutout on top of it, you know, that Dallas had dominated early on. And that's to your point that all of a sudden, if you start getting ordinary goaltending or substandard goaltending, are there leaks in other places? And that you don't find out until later on. I mean, you want your goaltender always to give you a chance to win. That's what you want.

And that was Freddie's problem in the playoffs, Freddie Anderson, about just for whatever reason in the critical games, he couldn't deliver it. But I got to hope and believe that maybe it's hard to expect the goaltending to be as sensational as it's had been by and large but um but you you gotta hope it doesn't go and actually jack campbell played decent in the playoffs last year i mean i know he didn't play as well the second half as he did the first half but yeah if you start if you i don't care any any team that starts getting substandard goaltending they're in big big trouble but i remember never and there was an anti-miemi that starts getting substandard goaltending, they're in big, big trouble. But I remember there was an Antony Emmy that was getting over-scouted when the Hawks won a Stanley Cup.

All of a sudden, you know, you can get a little weird about that. But there's no question, excellent goaltending masks some of those things. Excellent goaltending may be the biggest reason that Kyle didn't have to make that trade four months ago for a blue-chip D and give up a hell of a lot. Yeah, but we're talking about predominantly three guys and we include shaw grin that have worked the first 30 plus games this is an all mark in boston who's ridiculous i don't know what his record is is like 21 and one the last a game i think yeah it's so and it's not jack it's not Jack like Jack was last year in the first half of the season. This is a team that has found a way to block most shots in these dangerous areas,

and their defense has been absolutely phenomenal. Should we be asking the question more towards, can the Leafs continue to defend like this or their goaltending be subpar? Maybe that's the bigger question. Can the Leafs continue to be the second-best defensive team in the league? Okay, so a couple of different things. So the one is there's no question.

Just if the goaltending does go south, that's a problem. But you're right. The goaltending, I still wouldn't be comfortable with Shulgren, but it's been two guys in Murray and Samsonoff that are both. It's not just one goaltender. But to your point, Kippy, yeah, it's like what Barry Trotz did the first year with the Islanders, being dead last in defense and then being first in team defense the next year with basically the same players.

And that's what I'm talking about, this leadership group. I really think with the injury absences, they bought into a brand of overall. I mean, the Boston Bruins are the best example. There's a certain style set by Bergeron and followed by everybody else for the last 15 years. And to me, I've seen more of that from the Leafs of late, that team defensive side about things, and whether it's blocking shots or making those plays.

There's no question, and to answer Justin's question, that's what I really hope continues, because that's an easier one to say than to say, okay, let's keep our goaltender being sensational and not being ordinary. Can the Bruins lose enough that the Leafs could actually claim the division and not have to play an awesome team in the first round? Yeah, yeah, they can. And that's no disrespect. That's no disrespect to the Bruins.

I mean, there's still a lot to go. I mean, it's beyond absurd what they are doing. I mean, we know the last team to have that kind of great season, Tampa Bay, was upset in the first round by Columbus. So it doesn't always mean excellent players. But, yeah, I mean, something weird is going to happen. You know, I know people go, oh, man, we're playing the Lightning. The Leafs are playing the Lightning in the first round.

So, but, you know, you can't get – it's like the Ottawa Senators. The Leafs got in their head, what, four to five years when they were the better regular season team, and that team really should have won a Stanley Cup. And Boston was getting in the Leafs' head a little bit in the early playoffs. And now you can't let Tampa Bay get in your head. Like, okay, but Sam, bring it on. You know yeah you're on the verge of having it last year yeah you know game two if you kept control like you had in the first period then you could have been up to nothing

in a whole different series and we know game seven you really battle them right to the end so I'm not worried about that and I think mentally that's not that's not a good vibe I would I wouldn't think it permeates throughout the team. I would hope not. But I also think there's – I don't like things etched in stone right now. I'm going to believe there's some flexibility that could happen as far as playoff seedings. We're talking to Gord Stelik, former Leaf general manager

and Leafs Nation pre- and post-game show, getting ready for tonight against the Arizona Coyotes. Gord, off the top of the show, I read out their career stats versus Arizona or Phoenix, 39-55, 8-3. I know, I know. This is like, you know, I mean, last year was Vemelka. Remember how well he played? And there's just been, I remember Max, remember Max Domi scored,

I think, his first career goal, and his dad was there at ace what was then acc and they played the least early in the season and yeah it's been a it's been a bad bad place whether you call it phoenix or arizona this is this this for whatever reason and boy you were talking earlier about the lottery and i mean they're they're not even in bottom three teams right now you expected that like chicago i think has a 25 chance on conoror McDowd and that. But I give Arizona credit. They've been playing some kind of plucky hockey of late. But they've had the least number for a while.

You think some of those guys are just playing for trades, knowing that they're not going to be there? You have to find a different motivation when you're not on a team that's playing for the Stanley Cup, and they're in a unique situation in that rink is trying to find these sort of different things to play for, I would imagine. Yeah, you know, and that's why, you know, God rest his soul,

I just mentioned, like, working with the Leafs and watching Borya Salming play 80 regular season games every year. Now, back then, because there was only 21 teams, we made the playoffs a lot. Or not a lot, but, you know, more than now. But, you know, just, like, how did he go out and play a hall of famer in games that didn't matter? And he did, and he did, you know, each and every game compared to other times when they're, you know, the few times when there was a really good team around them. And yeah, that's, I think in Arizona's

case, I mean, these guys, they, they know probably Scott probably being as, as, as a scouted a team as anybody in the NHL right now because pretty well everyone is up for grabs and there's deals to be made. And certainly if the Leafs look at it, you get a chance to get a Michael Bunting. That was that end up being a great acquisition by the Leafs a couple of years ago. So I think you're right about that, that guys can play to get greener pastures somewhere else. And one thing they get is ice time in Arizona right now. Big plans.

New Year's Eve, Gord. I think there's a Team Canada game, right? Yeah, well, actually, we have the Leafs game against Colorado. Leafs, Colorado, yeah. And then where? I think there's like a Happy days telephone thing on Tele2. So I'm going to... Yeah, you know, Kippy and Justin, when you're in the hockey business,

and I'm not with the team anymore, of course, but I mean, a lot of New Year's Eve is funny. You're traveling, you're doing this, you're trying to get home, and all these kinds of things. So I'm going to probably connect with a couple of friends after the game. But yeah, I'm just hoping know a healthy year ahead for everybody with what we've had uh uh three years of or whatever number of years of not not being normal and uh i'm hoping we have a great one ahead ahead of for all of us and certainly our listeners included very well

said i'll let you get back to when Harry met Sally in the wagon wheel coffee table or whatever the hell they talk about in that movie. Yeah, I just got to get my beta tape out of it. It's stuck here. Do you have a knife? Hey, guys, you got a knife? Okay, I'll get it soon. Okay, see you guys.

Gordon Selleck, host of Leaf pre- and post-shows. Okay, I mean, I love Gord, but yeah don't necessarily agree with him that uh that they don't have to do something here and i'm talking about like trying to think about ways to win a stanley cup not get out of the first round i I thought you were a crumbs guy, Dubas and the crumbs. No, I'm asking you whether or not he needed to, would he go big or be a guy that nibbles around finding the next Lubushkin or giving up a third rounder for Luke Shen? The whole thing with Dubas in the past has been

he hasn't wanted to do it for guys who don't have term, right? He's done very few pure rentals and the ones he has have not panned out so if you're gonna do a rental you kind of got to do it now and say we're going after we're going after the division we're going after the bruins i just yeah i i don't know kipper like I feel like they can do okay going for the crumbs. It's just, is there a long track record of guys coming in, like big name players, and positively, like, ingratiating themselves into the team, having success, going on a cup run?

I can't think of a ton of guys. I'm sure there are examples, but it seems uncommon he needs a trade just like colorado's for a leckanen do you remember that trade there's a good example right there yeah but you know what he's below that level that trade yeah and he's the guy well i mean I mean, he did it for Placanich, right? That was kind of the one time. But yeah, you're right. He needs a guy who's not a power play one guy, who kills penalty, can score from the third line. Boy, Nazem Khadri would be nice.

Lekanen was a guy that Colorado traded for, who was not a rental. They got to... Or was a rental and was re-signed. Yes. But if I'm not mistaken... No, you're right. He had another year and he signed during this year.

He had another year and then they put him on a long-term. So he was guaranteed two cracks. So that's the non-rental trade. Yeah. And I'm just looking it up exactly they gave up uh baron who's a first rounder colorado's first round defenseman yeah watched him last night for montreal first game of the year where's his upside i don't know honestly it's impossible i didn't i think it's still good is it yes okay yeah and I think he was a highly touted prospect and a world junior guy.

I believe he's doing well in the AHL as a defenseman. Is he not up in Montreal now? He is now, but I'm saying he has good point totals in the American League before they brought him up. But he's got a bright future. And I think there's tremendous upside there. And he was a guy that had high pedigree as a prospect. I don't know where his upside's going to be. Can he become a top four Montreal Canadian?

Right. And I think the projection is that he can. So that's what Kyle's going gonna have to give up moving forward to go get a guy that isn't necessarily just a rental for 30 games right you know i don't know that they have that exact guy right yeah it's just yeah first you had to pinpoint the guy, and you got to find out if they want what you have. Like, it's tough to do more than crumbs, but. I also mentioned in my article Matthew Nyes. So what about that as a more than crumb addition?

I said he stays. Stays. With the Toronto Maple Leafs. Right, doesn't get traded. Doesn't get traded. I don't know whether or not he is right now he's of course being discussed by other teams right i just don't know and i haven't got a sense on whether or not kyle's got him off uh the trade list or would he be

willing to go that far my sense is he stays you know it's interesting thinking about him like we've put him in so many trade talks just only because the leafs don't have much in the way of assets to move that to think of him just coming in and seeing if he could help is really tantalizing you know as a guy you know you're talking about someone below the top six who doesn't have to be on pp, who can play with energy and finish checks and, you know, maybe shoot the odd one in the net. How many goals would you need for Matthew Nyes to be happy with his output over four rounds?

Five? Three? I don't see it that way. I don't go five, three goals. I say. How many hits? 10, 12, 14 minutes, six. I six i see minutes yeah i don't see sure right yeah that that makes sense and i assume that if he's if he's playing 12 or 14 minutes he got him

in a top six scenario yeah but we don't want him in that scenario here they don't want him maybe they do i don't know yeah i don't know either. Yeah. But I can tell you. I just watched him shoot one in the net on my Twitter feed. I can say that it's not too often that you have a highly touted prospect come out of college, which this will be the case because it doesn't happen in junior. Right. So it's a college scenario. Where a potential for a guy to walk in. And see such a wide open space. Oh yeah.

There's a gaping. Gap. Gap. On the left side. Come on in kiddies. 6'3". 2'10". All we have to really see.

As a lock. is bunting. That's it. I know. And Pierre Engvall. The great Cali Yarncroft. Engvall could be a top legitimate top nine. He could be a healthy scratch. You don't know.

So true. You don't know by then. But that's his whole range is third line fourth line out so assuming that he doesn't trade for an established left winger like it's wide open i don't think for nize to sign after his run in minnesota and step in and say hey kid here's 10 or 12 minutes let's see what you can do here's what i see so i'm with you i think they want this guy to come in and see what he can do it's a no acquisition cost guy who can improve your team in theory um at least give them the chance to do it so i think there's that i also

think that if they're going to do anything that trade you know trading futures they see if they can trade something like a 2025 first you know something where they can still pick dubas doesn't have this contract they can try to get an asset at the cost of someone else down the road like it feels to me like they are going to want their picks over the next couple years they're going to want to see what their guys can develop into you know it's it's tough to see the move in their 2023 first even for a guy who can help them next year they haven't don't have enough top guys in the systems in the system it has to be in play jb the 2023 pick yes it has to be in play i guess there's you know you are price for everything

you think you're close. I also think his contract status is relevant and the contract status of the core is relevant. Like it's now. It has to be now. And you're able to mortgage some of the future to be the best now you can be. You look what Tampa Bay has done. You know, we joke every year about their ability

to find guys and the right guys who come in. Nick Paul comes in. He's the right guy. And Brandon Hagel now looks like he's the right guy for them. Their ability to find the right guy. So, yeah, it's in play if you can find the right guy. Brandon Hagel is two firsts. The Lightning are in a suck in like five years.

I know. Like the way that Chicago has sucks now after their run. Takes some time for the pain to come but it comes well we spoke of florida uh earlier on the show like think about florida going from a top team in the regular season last year a top team the top team first uh 120 points yeah scary that they went from the top team to the point where you don't even envision asking montreal for a lottery protected you it's not even a thought in your mind when you trade your first rounder for ben charot that you will ever need to protect that pick no because you're going to be in playoffs at worst so you go from the top team during the regular season to quite possibly missing the playoffs this year

and i don't think they have a first rounder in the next three years is that right i happen to be on the page to check that no first next year no first year after no first year after also no second and 24 okay good luck so they have building in terms of first and second rounders over the next three years they have two second rounders okay well if you're at least families they're not a huge threat down the road you're hoping your team owner does not pay attention right don't check cap friendly.com slash team slash panther think about that rebuild if they miss the playoffs i just you know i don't know if your thoughts on the offseason moves they made have changed at all, but my thoughts have changed. And what a disrespect for Mackenzie Wieger, the whole thing.

Wieger's good. He's a good hockey player. And they were just like, throw him in. That killed them. Wieger killed them. They got no D. No D. You know how scary it is?

You can't ask Matthew Kachuk to do any more. He's been wonderful for them. They're getting everything they thought they could have got. And they stink. And he is squeezing everything out of his game. And it still doesn't matter. They're playing Mark Stahl, Josh Mahura, Matt Kirstead, Gustav Forsling. I know they got Eckblad and Montours playing above his expectations as well, but man.

You know, I love Gord Stelic, but the other thing that he said that I do not agree on is when he said the comparable of a Boston season to Tampa Bay's when they lost in the first round to Columbus. Mm-hmm. Like that Boston could roll in and get surprised by a team? when they lost in the first round to Columbus. Like that Boston could roll in and get surprised by a team? Yes. And I'm not saying it can't happen, but it's not comparable to a team that was still learning how to win.

Man, you've got one of the greatest modern-day players in history on 200 feet and knowing how to win and patrice bergeron that to me is a difference maker on why i don't expect boston to fall off the face of the earth uh in the playoffs and they are a balanced team they're gettable though kip they're gettable where right now i don't know i mean i look at that boston bruins team and i don't think you know what an unstoppable force i i'm trying to think like everything has gone right so far you know they've gotten a lot out of pavel zaka and jake debrusk and nick felino's been good like are we sure those guys are going to continue to be good that's an excellent question but they are balanced right now

and i'm telling you right now the biggest game changer is that hampus lholm trade. That is the biggest game changer, no doubt. And how, and it's just completely given them a different look beyond having the weight of the world on a young player like Charlie McAvoy's shoulders. And how they got away with, can you pull up that trade again that boston made yeah there was a first rounder involved but outside of that how you were able to get this player at his age yeah 27 i got it and then put him on a contract for 6.5 million dollars is one of the bigger trade deadline steals in the last 10 years for me. Anaheim receives a 2022 first, second round picks in 2023 and 2024. Urho Vakkanainen and John Moore.

So a first in two seconds. A couple of prospects. And he re- five yeah and it's a big pay but he's obviously big pay yeah it's nothing darnell also darnell retained 50 on that trade so they got him cheap last year yeah yeah and then they're getting them cheap now at six and a half right when i think of darnell nurse making 9.25 for sure and then this guy would rather have at the same dollar amount probably lindholm i don't know tough call right and that that to me and and there wasn't even that much action on him that's that's what i found out yeah there wasn't a ton of teams but you know what this is this is the east sleeping on the west that's why there was not much action on lindholm is because

general managers go to bed at 11 o'clock don't watch them enough don't know them enough at least in the east yeah they didn't watch enough he's they slept through lindholm being available last year and boston did not someone good out west and boston did not right um you know what i was thinking about good and then just all mark like i don't know he's 21 and one or something ridiculous having a great year like i don't know i mean it's not gonna continue that's another place where it's like i don't know. I mean, it's not going to continue. That's another place where it's like, I don't think he can continue to be this good. Maybe he can. We'll see.

You don't like to build anything on one player being awesome and it being your goalie, I don't think. But yeah, sure. Nice to have that goaltending. So when you were talking about all this and the way that the Leafs are going, I was thinking about that Tampa Bay comparable they lose to Columbus earlier in the show Shane Doan talked about Phoenix and how some teams have stayed with it and been patient and that's hard and sometimes that's the right thing

to do and Tampa stayed with it after that loss right kept the core together by and large I can't you know we talked about the Leafs doing it i can't help but see that comparable where you stay with it you're patient everyone says blow it up blow it up and you keep banging that battering ram against the door until it gets through yeah and you can be rewarded for that well listen kyle's already being rewarded because willie has taken that group to the next level and if you had traded him when everyone asked you to trade him two years ago, one year ago, you probably don't get the value if he's a 90-point guy now. Well, you got to pay him now. Yeah.

Wow, those are issues down the road, and we'll get into that. We got one more show tomorrow before we break again for for new years and we will continue this uh this conversation on on what we see towards 2023 and i'll i'll sit on uh your thoughts on on willie austin short term long term where we see that playing out yeah you're mentioned in your piece the willie neilander thing is interesting that let's say he doesn't sign and you go into the season contracts are tight but for the most part willie neilander and again that's a hell of a goal in overtime yeah i'll be at the skills competition but yeah to be able to steal the puck off of a tarasenko and go in there with that finish i mean that's that's the that's the world kyle envisioned when he was quoted what five six years ago we can and we will sign all these players great quote but i don't think he meant to say

it in a way that put him in a position where if you if he didn't it sure would have looked bad right like you can't say we can and we will and then not do it so kind of well he's it in a way that put him in a position where if you if he didn't it sure would have looked bad right like you can't say we can and we will and then not do it so kind of well he also followed it up with uh he's not trading willie kneelander yeah that was abundantly clear he didn't sign him to trade him and he's he's they love him he's in our plans yeah we see him as a game breaker and now it's really coming to fruition with what should be a career year for willie nylander and the toronto maple leafs so tonight they play arizona here's my question to you is there anything they can do positively that can change your opinion of this team because to me if they go out and they're dogs against arizona maybe you can draw some

conclusions maybe you can pull something out of it. Like if they go out there and just mop Arizona 4-1 tonight, do you feel, can you learn anything? Yeah. This time of year, can you learn anything, period? I think you just build chips. If you're a poker player, this is what you're doing. You're just stocking chips.

Be pros. Just be pros and add another chip to your pile. Isn't that a great one? You're a professional athlete. You're supposed to be the better team. Go be a pro. Go do your job. And if you do lose to a vermelka,

a vermelka is standing on your head. What's his name? Let's just keep trying. Vegmelka, I think. Veggie. Veggie man. Let the veggie man stand on his head yeah and and anybody can accept that uh a goaltender could can can win a game on his own it's like you and i you know

we're pros we come in here in december 29th and we do our job just show up and perform and we had great pros on our show today shout out jimmy ralph shane doan from switzerland and of course our very own gourd stelic tricity stelic and of course jb you're the you're you're the you're the pro here today as always all right who's back there tristan thanks man great work today didn't screw anything up that's the whole standard of great. That's our bar. You don't screw up. It's a great day on the Real Kipper and Boren show. And all of you

for sticking around and sticking around all year. We got one more tomorrow. We want you on board for that one as well as we wrap up 2022 and continue our bold predictions going into 2023. Thanks for listening and we're back tomorrow.