Real Kyper & Bourne - Texas Showdown Between Stars & Leafs

Episode Date: December 6, 2022

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee discuss the timeframe for a potential contract extension for Sheldon Keefe and Kyle Dubas, building a consistent fourth line for the Maple Leafs, and the need for Nick Robertson to create opportunities for himself on the ice. Afterward, former NHLer and Hockey Night in Canada's Craig Simpson (40:16) shares his observations on the Leafs' success in November, how comfortable the team is playing in closely contested games, constructing a successful bottom six, and the re-emergence of physical hits on the ice compared to when he played in the league. Finally, Dallas Stars TV analyst for Bally Sports Daryl Reagh (1:05:50) weighs in on the change in philosophy head coach Peter DeBoer has brought to the team, and previews a match-up between the Leafs and Dallas Stars. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Bourne on Sportsnet 590 The Van. Nine games on tap tonight, including Sammy's Toronto Maple Leafs against the Dallas Stars. I'm Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Derek Brandale, Frank the Tank, and as I just mentioned, Sammy McKee. Sammy, ready to go tonight? Excited for the match, you and JD, after the game? Yeah, we're doing Leafs talk tonight. A little later because it's an 8.30 puck drop.

It's Central time, right? And a couple of consecutive streaks going at it tonight. Hey, I got a question before we get into that. All right. I actually have two questions. One more for Kipper because I know Borny won't remember this. Coming in hot. There was a big discussion last night in the parking lot after hockey about there being a two-on-two tournament with NHLers

that was aired on Hockey Night in Canada, and it was like an outdoor thing. And there was two guys that swears it happened and everybody else was not believing that it happened. Do you remember this? In the early 2000s. I do not. Okay.

Outdoor two-on-two Hockey Night in Canada tournament. But I've been hitting the head over my lifetime and I can't remember what I had for breakfast. That's not true, Kipper. That's so not true. You have this weird thing where you'll be able to pull stuff out. Yeah, you're right. I left in right-handed shots.

So, yes. So I thought maybe that you would have some recollection of that, because I did it. And there's two guys that I trust very much. So we need comments from our listeners on that. Like a showdown? Yeah. Like intermission stuff?

Yes, it was part of Hockey Night in Canada, and apparently it was like an outdoor scene sort of thing, and it was two-on-two with NHL players. Here's the thing. If I'm not mistaken, you're 33. Your friends are, therefore, about the same age. You're talking about 2000. We're talking about you guys were 10 years old.

We're going on the memories of a bunch of 10-year-olds here. Okay, I agree agree i was calling them crazy but i thought kipper might remember yeah no i got nothing for you okay and my second thing this is not hockey related at all can't sammy just coming out the gate you need to introduce the show this isn't off the rails friday no this is just something that popped into my mind because there was another world cup penalties today and there was spain lost to morocco it's a massive upset and i saw this tweet yesterday and i was very interested to get both your takes on it if you were randomly dropped into a pro sporting event with your entire country's hopes and dreams on the line which are the most would you like to attempt which are the

following would you like to attempt a free throw a penalty kick a 25 yard field goal or a six foot putt so sammy asked me this yesterday and my answer was that i wouldn't want to attempt the things that were like careful and fine a free throw no way because too much precision involved even though i can shoot a basketball all right six foot putt in front of all those people for the country too herky jerky i need something i can just pound it so i don't care i thought the penalty kick but then there's still another person involved the field goal is just kick it through the uprights as hard as you can and i i don't claim that i can kick it great but i like the idea of just getting a pound it straight and it's simple i like the penalty kick you Yeah. A field goal or a putt.

It's just you. Yeah. It's nice to see someone dejected after you've had success. That's the most sinister answer I've ever heard. I would like someone to hurt when I feel my glory. Winning. Is about defeating someone? Yes. Wow.

It is. I actually like that take a lot it's it doesn't mean as much if if the pain on the other side doesn't mean as much yeah that's the beauty of sport there's the other aspect though that we are golfers and like my chances of making a six foot putt are at least 50 i would think 40 i'm going putt 100 i have never kicked a field goal in my life so maybe i should just try to roll the six footer in i don't know i like someone trying to stop me i love it the the hole isn't doing that and the goal posts aren't doing that in your football game the only thing is such a uniquely competitive take on it and uh yeah my no one stopped me from the six foot putt is my hands and your knees knocking so i we got a text that apparently somebody says that it was a coca-cola

commercial that was the two-on-two thing that was involved with hockey night there you go now that's from will and oshawa so i'm gonna try to dig that up but okay okay there you go we can get into hockey now those are just two things that are on my mind all right we got we got toronto and dallas and speaking of um competitiveness i want to start our show off on kippers clippers with how keith approaches a game going into competitors of the Dallas Stars and how Pete DeBoer goes into this with competitors of the Toronto Maple Leafs. Compare and contrast, if you will. And where their wheels turn on selecting their comments publicly.

So let's go to Sheldon Keefe because it's fairly consistent on what we hear when he talks about his opponent. Have a listen and pay attention to just the detail on commenting on his opposition. Let's have a listen. Just a really good team in a lot of areas. 5-on-5, power play, penalty kill, goal tending. Obviously have, you know, top scorer in the league and top line in the league.

So, yeah, good team in all facets and deep as well. Good mix of size and speed, youth and experience. They got a little bit of everything there. Okay. I think I heard about seven different things about Dallas. PK experience, speed, power play.

They got it all picked up. Yeah, really thorough. Very thorough. Complimentary. Let's go to Pete DeBoer right now, as he talks about the Toronto Maple Leafs. Let's listen for the detail out of Peter DeBoer right now, as he talks about the Toronto Maple Leafs, let's listen for the detail out of Peter DeBoer.

You know what? Again, I don't know. They're in the other conference. I don't spend a lot of time on them. They haven't given up a lot lately, so my focus has been kind of the last three to five games on them. They look like they're playing fairly tight. They're getting good goaltending.

You know, I think I'm not the guy to speak on that you'd have to ask i give them i'm not the guy to ask goaltending i don't know what it i think i caught a highlight out of the corner of my eye and i saw somebody make a save i don't care basically he's saying don't ask me about the toronto maple leafs i don't care about them yeah i will say this is consistent with what i know about sheldon as a coach and that he i told you guys before he sells every opponent to the opposition like they're the greatest in the world i mean stats video you you know, being the video guy for him, looking at their systems and every facet of the game days before, DeBoer's like, ah, I don't know, man. I'm worried about the Dallas Stars.

Is that just like because that old bulletin board kind of material don't give them anything to, or, you know, can Sheldon Keefe go back to his players and say, hey, listen, this know, can, can Sheldon keep, go back to his players and say, Hey, listen, this guy doesn't, he shows us no respect here. Yes. I think he can. I thought Sammy was showing us that or playing that for us when we got to work today. Cause he was saying like, you know, look at Sheldon.

It's too much. It's ridiculous. I don't know if that was a point at all, but my actual takeaway was like, DeBoer should be a little embarrassed. No. Shouldn't you care a little bit or know something more here's my thought because i i think that it's one guy he didn't say he by the way he didn't say f toronto no i think it's a guy that's been coaching for 100 years versus a guy that's been coaching for three years in the nhl it's a guy that like feels yes maybe that he's semi guy that feels maybe that he still needs to...

I'm too old now to kiss their ass. Or Sheldon on the other hand says, I'm just starting out and I'm going to go the respect route. Yeah, see, I don't think it's I'm too old to kiss their ass. It's like, I don't think all that stuff matters. I feel like Sheldon Keefe is like a new coach in the league and he's trying to use every source of information he has. And DeBoer's like, at the end of the day,

it doesn't matter if our guys don't play well. I just think it's different styles. Can I tell you something? When I first got a job on radio with Sportsnet, I started working with Merrick and Stewie. It was like our first show. Parking Central at noon you did, right? You took my job i think

i don't think that they were like who will do it for one 18th of the salary but when i got here and this is not meant as shade at all to those guys who are awesome but i couldn't believe that we didn't do more pre-show analysis of the game like watch the game pick it apart dissect it you know what are we gonna but because really i learned after doing this for years that's not the good stuff and it's tough to share that you have to do sort of higher level stuff on the radio we do both though we do i think we do a really good job and that's just me patting us on the back but to the point about deborah i don't think he's been around long enough to know

you don't need to do all the, you know, pumping up the other team and looking through everything, a bit of data. Your team has to play well. And so maybe he's just been around long enough to know to focus on the bigger things than to pick through all the little nits. You are definitely onto something.

Yeah. Because that's the feeling i got out of john cooper on a early december game against the toronto maples right that he at he's he's basically saying i've been around long enough uh i'm not beating these guys down late november early december on attention to details and just it's a long year go out there and play and all we got to do is just get in the playoffs like the attention to detail between now probably peter deborah tonight or even John Cooper compared to a guy like Sheldon, who's now, as Sammy said, just a couple of years in is night and day. Yeah.

And when you get into the DeBoers and even the Bruce Cassidy's, like they're good coaches. For sure. Who have that shelf life that's been around for like tens of years now where the guys know that they're a good coach, but I'm just tired of your crap. Yeah. And they get fired.

And they're not fired because they're lousy. They turn into lousy coaches. It's because they just need a different voice now a different tune and they're not they're not wasting those moments in november and december and admittedly i've had this concern i had this concern when i worked for sheldon where i was like some days i was like can we just not watch the video for a night? Like, not because it was my job. I had to regardless. But like, do we have to go through,

do the guys need to hear the same thing again? You know, do you need to go pick through the other teams, every detail? Like, sometimes you just got to say, we're going to take care of our own stuff, play our systems, go play well. I don't know that every game you can prime your team up the way that Sheldon does. It's getting redundant.

What a great drop. I expected you to be watching Portugal and not paying attention, Brandeo. And there are times when I do hear rumblings that they get tired of Sheldon's attention to detail. It is a lot. is meetings yeah the video uh the four or five a day on game day extra this extra that uh skills coach done practice into the office for a little one-on-one on the ice after it's a lot so as he gets older i i'm sure he's gonna pick his spots better and i do think that part of the reason it may still kind of work is they haven't broken through. Like no one in that room has really had the success to say this isn't going to work.

Like they have to push through and do more right now. They can't afford to take the foot off, but. The next contract will help them out a lot. Will help him out a lot. Shelton. Yes. Like being able to be like, i'm gonna be here for a while exactly yes not trying to prove myself every second correct yeah good point and that also has

to follow kyle getting a new contract right when's that happening so remember when i said that by it was like decision time by christmas on kyle if you're gonna extend him yeah that's not happening didn't happen trees up so that's not happening so he's going to finish the year with no contract i don't know i i can't tell you that i'm just saying it's not happening today or tomorrow and it's probably not happened before uh new year's and then where's the team where's the record what's it look like i just think it would be really hard um for kyle to march into that uh that office at mlsc and say okay boys uh you want to take another crack at me you don't think so deadlines what like march 3rd this year or something like that derrick just besides celebrating yet another beautiful Portugal goal, he brought up to me, remember when Ron Wilson tweeted on Christmas Day,

I got a nice little present in my stocking, like a contract extension? Maybe the same thing happens with Dubas. Christmas Day. There could be a change, for sure. But don't you think before March 3rd... I don't see it. I just don't see it i just don't see it i don't see a guy that uh they purposely left out of an extension going into this season who's had consecutive exits in the first round

getting a long-term deal because you had a wonderful november so don't you think, though, that he can go into the office? They're second in the Atlantic. They're doing great. And he can go in there and say, you guys are asking me to make some huge decisions here. I need another year term on my contract to know that I'm building towards the future or something. Yes, he can go and ask. He's allowed to ask. Absolutely. He's allowed to ask absolutely he's allowed to ask I actually kind of like the idea

you're under contract go work and we'll do a new one this summer I just don't see a change of philosophy if our show is doing really well you go in and ask for a new contract at any point just go in and say luck

sorry I won't flip it around and they're like uh you are you are uh yeah 20 years here uh no still means nothing to me um yeah i get the idea he and kyle's a big fan of if you have time use it with other guys contracts so here we are so you know it's interesting now because now we're going to see um who's who's the kid again getting called up here Semyon Durar-Gachintsev thank you very much and we're going to call him SDA SDA and he's going to make his debut which which we didn't really see this. I mean, Mulligan, we know how you felt about him before. I was right.

You had a change of heart on him. I was wrong on the change of heart. And now is he back out right now? Yeah, he is. Is he on the way out? Well, he's just back to, he's what I thought he was at the beginning. I had it right the first time, I think.

Here's. So, see, this is starting to bug me right now because I am a firm believer of, if you're going to try to believe in a fourth line in October, November, it would be nice if they had a way to just maintain that look throughout the whole year but are we now in a a juggling mode with sda and mulligan eventually coming in and wayne simmons sometimes once every 12 days 14 days 16 days is is this now the bottom six look now you know malgan has one point in his last 11 games like i understand your point about consistency and like letting them work through it a little bit but some point he's just not effective he's not contributing in any way so i get scratchy

him yarn crocs hurt if you look at the guys they were going to call up uh kyle clifford's hurt adam godette is hurt remember godette this summer was like an exciting signing for this team that he might be able to do something. Wow, he came in. I mean, there's a pedigree. There's Vancouver. He's had some success other places. Yeah.

And now he's not getting a sniff. No. And, you know, now he's hurt so they can't call him up. So this SDA thing seems to me like for next year, like after his entry level contract, can they find a, you know, a cheap spot for him,

right? They're always looking for a guy in the cheap. I think this is like a next year. Look, somebody has got to do it. He's playing well. See the other thing too is, and I mentioned this about,

um, can you turn some of these guys into some sort of asset? Is that what's going on right now? Does it help Kyle that he's pulling some of his draft choices up and giving them NHL experience to the point where can someone look at Hollowell after the last week and a half, two weeks? No, I'm serious. And just say, I see something there.

I think he can play. All of these guys, and SDA will be one of those guys where he should not embarrass himself. He shouldn't embarrass Kyle. He's going to come in, and maybe he even has some success and uh puck bounces off his ass or he scores a highlight goal and just all of a sudden it's like whoa and is it enough to to say that hey look look at my draft picks now they're they're they're coming along and you, you know,

maybe there's somebody that could be interested in somebody enough to throw him in in a deal. Is that what maybe is going on right now? You got to kind of prop up your own people a little bit and show some value out of it. And it can't hurt Kyle if some of these guys hit. For sure. And, oh, by the way, I need a new contract. Look know, I don't know. And it can't hurt Kyle. If some of these guys hit for sure. And Oh,

by the way, I need a new contract. Look, look how great my prospects are doing. 2018 draft may have been his first. And that draft for them is Sandin, Dersi, Derargen,

Chinsev, Hallowell, Kroll, Holmberg. Like all these guys haven't played a ton for the Leafs, but you know, Dubas can at least say, Hey boy, look at, you know,

six of my draft picks made NHL appearances. And what was it with Hunter? Like, none of them did for a stretch there, right? Like, it's probably something where he, you know, has a little bit of, not necessarily competitiveness in it, but there's no way that means nothing to him. I agree that you would want that reflected. But by the way, these guys have not made it i'm just

saying and it's his team and he has the ability to call them up and he has the ability to talk to the coach to put him in the lineup and he thinks they're good he drafted them obviously so yeah i don't know it's i i'd be lying if i said i didn't take some pride in the fact that there's so many ohl guys in the lineup too like he's he's really picked from the ohl you think everybody that's on that second unit there's sue saintault Ste. Marie, the Peets, everything. It's just, as an OHL guy, I do take a little bit of pride in that, so I love that part of it. Timmons playing tonight, his first game.

He is, yep. Was it Justin Hall who said that he saw him shoot a puck and it's harder than anything I've seen all season long, basically? He had a bomb in practice. Get him in. Ah, it's great. I mean, you got to get him in at some point. He's been around the team for five games. I don't actually understand why he had a bomb in practice get him in ah it's great i mean you got to get him in at some point he's been around the team for five games i don't actually understand why he hadn't been in yet i heard uh like arizona sat there and heard justin hall talk about his

shot and go oh my god we forgot to look at his slap shot what happens if it's great why did we trade him this is this the start of how things blow up in toronto timmons who would have known timmons had this bomb of a shot yeah and we let him go for next to nothing the only thing i will say on the sdas and mulligans and all the rest of them as they continue to kind of come in and experiment and maybe have a good week or not have a good week it really is going to come down to april on boys and can these guys and hollow well's another guy can they help me win that time of year and it's one thing to look at them and say can they play one week consecutively in mid-november or december but can they help me win a playoff round against a team like tampa bay yeah wouldn't it be nice

if a couple of these guys were i don't know just straight line guys bigger guys north south guys where i think holmberg's got the best chance. But that's why he has the best chance of playing in playoffs. They don't expect him to do anything but the right things. He doesn't have to create or produce or do the hard things of being a forward. And they need some cheap guys to fill in and do those things. You know, for a guy like SDA, he's of no use if he's not doing things to the puck and making plays.

All right, about uh 20 minutes we're gonna go to our uh number one analyst here at uh sportsnet hockey night in canada craig simpson's gonna join us help us tee up leafs and dallas in the second hour daryl ray dallas stars tv analyst uh for bally sports he's gonna come by by in the second hour and and dallas boys all of a sudden a team that you wouldn't look twice at last year and looking like one of those teams that could get to a conference final they seem to have some some good pieces and one of the best young ones and jason robertson uh we'll get uh we'll get our thoughts on Nick's brother a little later on. But let's talk a little consecutive streaks because Robertson has one of those.

Marner looking to become the fifth different player in just the last 25 years, guys. 25 years with a point streak of 20 games or more. That's not a lot of guys. That ain't many guys at all. 24-26 this season for Marner. So let's go on Sheldon Keefe on the point streaks. Very similar. We're talking about, obviously, he's not scoring at the same rate

as Robertson at this point. Nobody is. But just the consistency with this play, I think, again, because it's coming in all areas of the game, it just gives our group confidence, gives our group life. You know, as the season approaches Christmas here, and even though we've got a long ways to go, it's just something that kind that you can attach yourself to.

The guy when he scores the other night, it's a huge goal for us. The guys are really excited for it. I think lots of that kind of stuff can get your team going, but certainly when you have a player like Mitch, that makes a difference in so many areas of the game and is having a run right here now that he's finding a way under the sheet every night uh you know just another great thing for your team to have you want me to jump right into peter deborah's uh comments on robertson's streak and kind of compare them again i do enjoy the

contrast please yeah i mean you know i i don't spend a lot of time on that. I was talking to Jason this morning just about, and he's a hockey nut. He knows everything. So I thought I might catch him with who had the longest streak in history, just to put it in perspective for himself, the difference between Gretzky at 51 or 2 and where these guys are. My point was, boy, this is really impressive what both you guys have done, and it feels like you've scored every night for a long time, and Gretzky's record is still 30-some-odd games down the road. It's an incredible number when you think about it,

and considering what these guys are doing right now so but he knew he knew all that he didn't uh i wasn't i wasn't enlightening him on uh on any of the statistics of the history of the game so devore is not paying attention to what the leafs are up to he's not paying attention to what his Leafs are up to. He's not paying attention to what his own guy's up to. So DeBoer... What would you say you do here? I'm almost waiting for him to pull a John Tortorella and say, you guys ask really dumb questions. It is funny, though, that he said that Robertson

is like this obsessive stat nerd type guy. There are some players who are like that, and his brother is a lot like that, who plays for the Leafs and scores slightly less. It was almost like he's complimenting them but he's not really complimenting totally yeah like uh yeah and then it's like gretzky at 51 what do you guys have like 12 13 like it's like yeah you shot 80 today great that guy just shot 64 but your 80s really good really impressed with your 80 yeah it's uh just goes back to the same thing of a guy that's been in the league forever and

seen a lot of stuff with pete deborough coach pete deborough coached a lot of great players probably seen some point streaks in his day and you know he doesn't really care we might as well stay with the theme and have keith talk about robertson's production because he now has 23 goals and leads the nhl in goals ahead of Connor McDavid. Yeah, it's interesting. I was just watching, prepping for it. You can see some of the reactions of their players and their bench and things when he scores

at that rate. At times, it can get a little comical because it's a real hard league to score in, but then it seems for players like that on the runs like that, that it seems like it's not a very hard league to score in. So, yeah, I think it brings a lot to your team for sure, and you always feel like you're

in every game. I mean, they were down big the other night, or the other afternoon, I guess, and it doesn't faze them. So, I think, you know, they've got a lot of confidence in themselves as a team, as they should. They've been playing a lot of really good hockey. And like I said, they're doing it in all facets. It's not just relying on one player.

They're executing in all areas of the game really well. So, yeah, it does bring a lot for sure to your team when you have a guy like that. But I think all of that is just part of the story with this team. 23 goals, 41 points in just 25 games, and this is a guy that held out and missed training camp. So funny, too, because everyone who holds out, it seems like they have bad years and the pressure they can't handle it. This guy just shoots it in the hockey net.

It's almost like it's just the the perfect scenario for this guy and it seemed like forever that this was uh jamie benz and tyler sagan's team and clearly based on cap friendly it is yes but it's not oh and that's where robertson comes in and he's like the new this is my team yeah in many ways it's his team now he's just maybe just too young and naive to realize it right now didn't the owner clash you, boy, we could really use some more out of Ben and Zagan. Didn't he like throw him under the bus? The owner has called those guys out in the past. It's crazy, though.

Like, you look at, it's only Drysaddle and McDavid ahead of Robertson. And those guys, their time on ice per game played is 23 minutes and 22 and a half minutes. Robertson plays 17. Sorry, 17, 45. Is that what it is? Yeah. Yep. So he's under 18 minutes he's and he's putting up

these numbers mcdavid has 23 power play points robertson 14 so at even strength he's leading the league this is taken over from calgary's uh number one line last season in the nhl yeah that was uh good row lindholm good yes that's right so now we speak of robertson rupee hints and pavelski as the top line right now in the nhl so let's ask sheldon keith how how he sees that line and the challenges tonight well i think it's an interesting the line has got a great grade balance of so many different things and you see it all come together i mean hints is among the fastest skaters in the nhL and then you got Pavelski and Robertson both that are not as beautiful on the wings but are incredibly smart players that are in the right

spots around the net they score in so many different ways Pavelski is as good as anybody there is at tipping pucks and finding rebalances and such and Robertson can score from anywhere on the rink and at the same time knows where to be at the right times, and then when you kind of take those guys away, all of a sudden hits can come flying out of nowhere. So the line itself has got a lot of great elements and they obviously have tremendous chemistry,

but I think for Pavelski, I think it's just intelligence and commitment to his craft and all those kind of things to be able to continue to do it at such a high level. Keefe is unbelievable. Sorry, where are you going? No, I was just... Go ahead.

I was just going to say, he just knows it. He's like, yeah, Hintz is a Pisces and his mother's left-handed. He just knows everything about these guys detail-wise. Obviously, puts in a lot of time and effort to their opponents. I just... You look at Rube Hintz with the speed and the power and then you got pavelski who's got the net front presence yeah and then you got robertson who finds areas to shoot the puck it's just it just seems like a perfect yeah fit right now and i like the idea of different speeds on a line like i know some people want

people to be able to skate together but like pavelski and robertson are very different than hints and that's something the least really used with mckeough last year right that he'd be in the top six and all of a sudden playing with tavaras and then the different speeds used to throw people off i feel like and so it's tough to defend when you got to back off because one guy's fast but the other guys are east west guys a lot of talent on that team should we go to brother nick who will be in the lineup which will be fun again yeah for fans to watch uh the brothers uh go at it again if i'm nick i'm not taking any more pre-game pitchers like it's you've been in the league you played each other.

It's fringe whether you're going to the American Hockey League or not right now. What do you think about that? And he got asked, like I listened to all the pregame audio today. He got asked every question was comparing him to his brother. Yeah. And he's like not helping. It's got to drive you insane. Yeah.

Because there's no way. He's your older brother. You're competitive as hell. You're in the NHL. All you care about is about is being better being good and you're getting asked about your literal brother who is way better than the world's best player so how do you how do you play like your brother what's wrong in nicer words it's gonna drive you insane so it's so funny you mentioned that like uh the picture time because my first game i played against mario lemieux obviously i'm on the fourth line and there's a matchup but you know there'd be times

i would actually extend my shift hoping that mario would jump on and someone would take a picture on the ice at the same time yes for a picture really yes that's pretty awesome hoping to hang a frame i don't think i ever saw a picture of me and Mario on the ice at the same time, but that's how you think. You know what? I will say there was a time when Austin Matthews was at development camp

and I would hold the rope behind him for like, you know, and I was like, hope we get some shots of me teaching Austin Matthews how to hockey. All right, let's go. You did that, eh? Yeah, we got to do some work on that. That's cool.

Sammy, do we have a clip of brother Nick talking about Jason and what he could maybe still learn from his brother? Yes, it's funny. Let's hear it. I think his poise is really good and the way he shoots the puck. And I think we both have good shots. And I think one thing I could take away from him is just his confidence with the puck and shooting it. So I think that's one thing I'd look at is, you know, he's shooting a lot. He's shooting, finding ways to get shots and finding and shooting it so i think that's one thing i look at is you know he's shooting a lot he's shooting finding ways

to get shots in there find a way to score so that's one thing i can look at you guys heard me freak out about this before the show i can't believe he said shooting he said shooting six times in a 13 second clip shoot shoot shoot shoot everything is a hammer to a nail and all he wants to do is shoot he wants he sees someone who scores he thinks they're a shooter he stays out for practice he works in the shooting but he has been built this way shooting right it's all he wants but that's that's his bread and butter he knows that's what's going to ultimately uh keep me in the nhl the only question is is when it's when you're not shooting yeah what are you doing you get like two shoots per game know, there's 15 minutes of ice time or whatever you would like to have.

What do you do the rest of the time? Hey, listen. That's what needs work, not the shooting. There aren't many guys that would – when it's all said and done, you look back and you're like okay there's some guys that are legit i i don't felt they got a a fair shake i didn't get a good opportunity like this guy's playing with tavaris and marner like yeah it doesn't get any better nick than that no maybe you could quibble over some power play time or something but

this is a good opportunity you should find poise and confidence when you get the puck in the offensive zone and you will with marner and tavars you will and you also know that you can trust your guys if you give it to them you'll get it back mitch marner will give it back he wants to give it back i put a stat in the lineup today that is incredibly relevant to this conversation from sport logic uh that marner's completed more passes into the slot than any player in the nhl this year 110 completed passes into the slot so get to the slot and so if you go see what this stat is, you go to the slot,

Marner passes it really well. That area. Yeah. There, there are some nights that Marner should have like four or five points. Yeah. If some of these guys could just finish. Get to the spots.

That's, you know, and forget who it was. It was, oh, it's sweet oats on yesterday. And he was talking about how it's not just that Brett Hall shoots it or Austin Matthew shoots it so well.

They know when to get open. Like, they're content in coverage being covered until they can see a play developing where they need to create that separation. That's something they do exceptionally well, and that's a huge skill in being a scorer is finding the time to get the separation, to get to the area

to do the shooting and the leafs get jake ottinger tonight they saw wedgewood last time they played the stars when they beat him in ot so they get the uh the number one tonight with ottinger which is a much different test than wedgewood i would say last few games i, I'm thinking, starting to see signs of missing Morgan. Starting to see signs of a no shutdown guy like Muzzin, Physical, and Brody. And tonight, you're going to see Giordano, Hull, Sandin, Lilligren, Victor Mete, and Timmons. Like, what is this going to look like playing against a

pretty heavy team and arguably the best line in hockey i will say i was on my uh you know thinking about bets today and at some point this leaves decor is going to cost them and when you have people playing above their true talent level or above their where they should be in the lineup eventually above their weight class right eventually you find out you're reminded why they aren't consistently where you have them slotted and i keep waiting for that to happen it is a concern against a big team you know what jamie ben did austin matthews last time they played with a couple of shots to the old kidneys. Yeah, apparently Brody's pretty close, so that would be a massive boost so you don't have to play.

I doubt Connor Timmons would probably stick around when he comes back, right? I don't know, like Mete? Yeah. Yeah. I'm not sure, but I agree that one of these games, one of these games, surely to God, it's going to catch up to them. I would say Murray had his first shaky one in a while. What's the over on tonight?

I could see a couple of pucks going in the net tonight. Yeah, I've got leafy concerns tonight, I'll be honest. I liked the Dallas team. Two teams that have really stood out for me so far uh to start the season dallas and new jersey against the leafs they both both those clubs showed me something dallas is what are they are they first in their division first in their division uh 14 6 and 5 tied for second in the west tied for second in the west plus 26 goal differential and they're oh and five in overtime so they could be five you know a few points better at least between the leafs and the

stars by the way the stars are the only team the leafs have beaten overtime you remember nick robertson's put them away early in the year oh 11 overtime games one win between these two talented teams so you're calling for overtime oh i'm, I'm calling for overtime. Oh, overtime would be excellent tonight. They're just turning it over to each other just over and over. That would be consecutive points, man. Keep them coming. Yeah, it's true. That would be almost like a win getting a point tonight for them. They really do.

In Dallas with this decor, I think they're in tough for sure. Okay. All right, let's take a quick break here. Craig Simpson after the break, two-time Stanleyley cup champion he's calling the game tonight dallas and the leafs simmers up next after the break you're watching and listening to real kipper and born this is real kipper and born on sportsnet 590, The Van. Toronto Maple Leafs set to take on the Dallas Stars tonight. Sammy is our friend Simmer.

Looks like he's having a chit-chat with them. I'm on Hockey Central tonight with Ken Reed and Mike Fuda nice kenny reed it's gonna be fun ken reed's good good dude yeah really good dude did a round table with him uh last week at a truckers convention i think kenny would have been perfect for that oh yeah without a doubt okay let's welcome in Craig Simpson, who gets to call the game tonight. Simmer, how are you, pal? I'm doing great, guys. How are you? So the Leafs face the Dallas Stars, who are the highest scoring team in the league right now,

with the likes of Mete, Timmons, Hall. I mean, if by chance that the Leafs keep Dallas to three goals or less, should we just give Sheldon the Jack Adams for Coach of the Year award after the game? Well, I think we were on, I can't remember how many weeks ago when this all started with the injury problems on the back end. And, you know, back then we said every coach will, you've heard it a million times, both of you, I'm sure, is you can't focus on who's not in your lineup.

You've got to focus on who's there and really try to put something together that makes up for the guys that you're missing. And I think you watch this team over the course of what the 11 games straight they've been able to get a point in. It's been a collective defense. It really has been impressive in the way that the forwards have been committed to coming back deep, to protecting the slot, to giving their defensemen a quick out.

And I just think that it's really forced this team and galvanized the team on how they have to play defensively to have success. And, you know, when you look at what happens in the most important time of the year, and that's playoff time, is there's games that you've got to play that way. And you've got to be comfortable playing a 2-1 or a 3-2 game.

John Cooper said last weekend, you know, the one thing he notices about the Leafs is typically they were happy to play in those 5-4 or 6-5 games now they look comfortable playing in a 2-1 or a 3-2 and finding a way to win that way you know obviously the last game got away from them uh and and tampa was able to take advantage of their power play and come back but they still you know played a confident game not a cheating offensive game and tried to keep it tight and that's really been the secret to the success that they've had during this time without the guys on the back end that they've been missing you know one of their challenges over the past few years when they have got to playoffs is they haven't had that bottom six success.

You know, however you determine success, whether it's scoring or it's physical play, they just kind of haven't got anything there. And it feels like they're searching for something tonight. They get SDA in the lineup. You know, do you think that they've learned anything about the direction they want to go or the personnel they want to have in that part in the lineup. Do you think that they've learned anything about the direction they want to go or the personnel they want to have in that part of the lineup this time around?

I think they're getting there, and I think you still see Sheldon tweaking and changing and trying to look for maybe some continuity there. Who's going to be your solid third line that you can trust in any matchup is your fourth line a line that you can honestly play at a critical time and i think he's getting there i think he's still continually tweaking and uh deragon chinta will get you know another opportunity it looks like malgan seems to be the guy that falls out when another opportunity is in. I think it's going to be really important, and I've said it, Chris and I were talking about it a bit today, that Kerfoot is such a guy that moves up and down in the lineup

and often gets back into that top six role to maybe try to settle things down. But I think defensively, the top two lines have been great, so there hasn't been any need to sort of solidify defensively. I think you need, realistically, Kerfoot to be an anchor in one of those bottom six roles. And if you can find that and slot in, whether it's Robertson gets a chance to play a little bit longer

and see if he can play in a top six role or rotate around up there, I think that's where it does allow you to not be worried about a matchup to have a little bit more consistency in that bottom six role and you were saying whatever that means having a good bottom six i i think the biggest problem in the past not just that they would maybe get scored on more than you can afford your bottom two lines to get. But in the past, they've been the momentum killers. Like you have a couple of good lines with your top guys, and it doesn't continue through.

Or there are times in games where you need that third and fourth line to be the motivator, to have a good shift where they pin a top line in their own zone. Now you get a change on the fly. You get some guys tired. I think that's probably been the biggest improvement in the bottom six is they have at times been the one that generates the chance or draws a penalty, which now your power play goes and can score a goal on. That's something when you get to playoff time, you can't have that momentum swing go the

other way. Every time the bottom six gets out, you have to startoff time. You can't have that momentum swing go the other way every time the bottom six gets out. You have to start building it your way. And I think they've been better at that, especially through this, you know, 11-game stretch. You're coming fresh off of the Tampa Bay game where you watched a fourth line of Maroon, Perry, and Belmar. And, man, you just think just think okay end of your careers you're running out of gas and i thought they were very effective is there still a sense that no matter how much you shuffle

the fdas or the mulligans in and out that that that that type of style of mauling a little bit on a four check and ugly cycles is still the way to go, Simmer? Well, you look at the combination there, though. I do think, you know, if you're not going to score, you can change momentum with some good physical play. Get in and get a hit. Get in and turn, you know, a defenseman, pace him to the boards. Now you spend 25, 30 seconds in the offensive zone cycling down low.

You know, Maroon can do that. Belmar can do that. Terry's got great hands, can make plays in those little tight areas. So you need that combination of that. But I think, you know, that is where you yeah that line specifically think last year they scored 39 goals and you know some people might say oh that's not a whole lot well if if you're you know if your bottom three forwards each have 13 goals you know

look at what that does to your lineup that's an important goal at a critical time that might change a game. And so I think that is what you kind of hope you can find and get. I don't think the Leafs are there on a consistent basis yet, but I do think that's a bit of the improvement. Now, they don't have necessarily the beef that you're talking about on that line, but if that line can be hard checking and and not irresponsible defensively and get in and do that offensive zone time which is really when the Leafs are playing well it's puck possession in the offensive zone so if your fourth line guys can continue that on

that's where you finally got something and it can really end up where maybe the top line comes out keeps the pressure going the next line comes out and keeps the pressure going. The next line comes out and say, Neil, Andrew gets a goal. You know, that's, that's really what you have to have to have that success come playoff time. So I just want a quick momentary detour off the Leafs to ask about something you mentioned there, the, you know, the beef, the guys, the physical stuff, there's been some huge hits in the NHL lately, and you were a part of the NHL during a much more physical era,

but you've also watched and called games all the way through what are your thoughts now on the sudden sort of re-emergence of just random one-off explosion hits where do you stand on their value and i guess how we got here yeah you know it seems like you go through little phases or stages where nothing's happened, the game's wide open, and it's all offense. And then you do find yourself, like we've had, where all of a sudden it's like, whoa, where did that one come from? And, you know, some incredible hits that, you know, for the most part, not necessarily dirty. It's just lining guys up in invulnerable spots and so I think it's still because of the speed of the game it's still an element it becomes a lot more difficult I find in the transition game

that you have and the the skill level of some of the guys that it's not easy for a defenseman to line a guy up anymore like look at how many guys can handle the puck in tight areas and make little deceptive cuts and moves that make you look silly. So I think defensemen typically during this stage of how fast the game is are less apt to be having that one opportunity where a guy really does have his head down or he's bobbling with the puck, where you get to stand up and really make that kind of aggressive play. But let's face it, over the course of an 82-game times 32 teams, you're going to have stretches where you've had the ones that we've seen.

And for the most part, I think you've got to be cognizant on the ice that this is still a physical game. You can't be going through the neutral zone and in those tight areas without your sensors going and being aware that you might get hit. So it's a good reminder, I would say to the players now, that so often we talk about the great individual skills and the speed of the game and being able to transition and have odd man rushes and things like that that do happen.

But it's still that middle of the ice area you you have to have your head up and be wary that there's an opportunity where you're going to get you know blown up in a situation like that and this has just been a stretch where what there's been two three in the last uh two or three days so i don't think I've watched personally a team that gives me a bigger feel of being big and heavy than the Dallas Stars. So is this the test for the Leafs and Kyle and what he's built to say that high-end skill can beat big and heavy? And, you know, I know it's just one game, and a seven-game series is a different beast, but will this go a long way tonight to assure fans that, you know, the Leafs have been on to something all these years with the high-end skill? Yeah, it's an important test, and you're right.

When you get into a series and potentially play a team, you know, seven times in 12 days, it becomes very different because the individual matchups become the storyline there who's who's owning who who's you know got a defenseman looking over his shoulder every time because he's been nailed 10 times a game by the same guy so that that's what's great about playoff matchups in that regard but this is one that you know i've always said, you play with the makeup of your team and play to its strengths. So if you're not going to get into an out-hit game with the Dallas Stars here, so what you have to really be cognizant of and execute to a high level

is having good, quick support puck movement. You know, I've seen, like a guy like Sandin is a good example. He's been run over a number of times going back to get a puck, and he gets up, he gets playing, but he's made the play and taken the hit. And if you're going to be an undersized defenseman, that's got to be your skill set to not have that fear of going, but get back a little bit quicker. And as I said, right now, defensively, the forwards are back in a better position

where they're not hanging their defensemen out. And that's how all of a sudden you slow down that big physical opponent that you're playing against. Two quick puck movements, transition into the neutral zone, and you're backing them off because now you've got a potential for a three-on-two going the other way. And it's not an easy game to play. You know that you're not a bigger team and probably not a tougher team, but play to your strengths. And it'll be a good test tonight. Can you move the puck quicker

than they can move their legs? And that's how you counteract the team that wants to come in and dumping it soft into a corner and start, you know, riding the defense every single time. If you can make three or four of those plays when they're trying to be aggressive and create odd man rushes that that backs off that game that Dallas wants

to play if you execute it well Simmer what's your take now that we're sort of a quarter of the way through the season on uh Austin Matthews coming off a heart trophy season you know not it's not like he's been bad at all right he's got 12 goals but he's tied with guys and scoring like martin natchez and you know brock nelson jeff skinner what are your thoughts on what's going on here with just a little bit less of an offensive output than expected for him yeah i thought earlier on it was unusual that i i thought he missed a lot of shots that you're not used to seeing him miss and i and i don't mean like not score i, miss the net and just be off a little bit. So I thought more so earlier on it didn't look like his rhythm was there,

his shot wasn't nearly as dangerous. I think it's improved a lot. What I've really been impressed with, though, is just his demeanor. Like, this is the start of a season like no other. You know, he's always had great expectations and had a great start to his career. But you're coming in as the reigning, you know, Hart Trophy winner. And that's just a completely different element.

You know you get game planned. You know I've seen it all since the start of the season. Toronto's still been, you know, I think their third or fourth in puck possession in the offensive zone. And that's really something they do really well. But as we've seen, five on five, they haven't been able to execute it and haven't been nearly as productive. I can definitely see teams not running out, not running and getting into a cycle. They're playing more of a zone in the middle, taking away those cross-scene passes

where Matthews might get a high slot, easy, quick release, and it's in the back of the net. Those have been taken away more. And that's just the respect you have coming in as the Hart Trophy winner and the Rocket Richard winner. And even as a team, I think teams have really strategically played the Leafs and their offensive zone possession time game a little differently and not run nearly as much and really just clogged the middle of the ice

and it's forced a bit of an adjustment. I think collectively the Leafs have gotten better at it and been maybe a little bit more patient with it and not turning it over as much in those areas. But the thing that I've liked from Austin is his attitude. You know, I think he's proven and really wanted to show to his teammates and maybe the league that I'm going to be a complete player.

And I think he's battled hard defensively. He's turned pucks over down low in his own zone and gotten all the way up and joined the rush. Hasn't necessarily scored as much, but I don't think there's been a drop-off in his game that way. And you have to feel as streaky shooters and scorers go that, you know, you hope if you're a Leaf fan that he gets back into that rhythm. And, you know, he's had two three-game goal-scoring streaks,

which probably if you asked him 26 games in, that's probably not enough, right? But you hope that one of those streets comes together and the game opens up a little bit for him. But I think collectively, both offensively and defensively, he's been playing at a high level, and you've got to expect that. I don't expect a 60-goal season from him, but you never know. I mean, he's got that ability.

You can go on a pretty good run. No question. Tonight's hockey game will feature the Robertson brothers and Nick not having the success of his brother Jason. But, you know, looking back at your years over hockey, whether it was Simmer as a teammate or as a coach behind a bench or as a broadcaster, is there any player that Nick's situation could remind you of

that you know that there's someone kind of close? Scoring, obviously, is the strength, but it's not quite there. And these guys have to find a way to buy themselves time until it does happen. Yeah, you know what? That's a hard question off the top. But from a coaching perspective, you know, probably for me starting in Edmonton with Alex Hemsky. And I can tell you how many times I sat with Hammer

and showed him some video. And here's a kid who it just didn't start the way he hoped. A little different than Robertson, but, you know, still high hopes, high draft, and not getting the ice time he wanted, not always in the lineup, not, you know, getting the trust maybe of the coach and I think the good example or learning for me was listening to what his view of what was

actually happening and how different it was from what the coaches were thinking and you know sometimes it's a young guy thinking oh the coach was mad at me or he's not giving me a chance or you know and then you sit with him and say what are the three things we talked to you about going into this game and so we'd label him off you know protect the pocket get in aggressively get skating get your legs moving and i sat with him one game i always remember and i had his first five shifts to the game and you know didn't really say anything just press the play button and showed him. And his face just looked, and I said,

Hammer, like, that's our messaging to you. Those are your first five opportunities to show the coach that you're ready. And he did the exact opposite. Like, he turned it over lazily three times, didn't get in. And his face was just, I go, Mac doesn't hate you.

Like, Mac actually wants you to have success. Mac wants you to flourish. We're trying to teach you how to get there. We said those three things to just narrow it down for you, to go in without expectations of scoring, and that was what you did. So five shifts in, he's going, oh, Hammer's out of it today, right? And now you can go on. So I think that's probably the biggest lesson from a coaching perspective five shifts in he's going a hammer's out of it today right and now you can go on so i think

that's probably the biggest lesson from a coaching perspective you learn that the player's mindset is so focused in on them and maybe what is not happening for them as opposed to saying all i got to do is do those few things and good things will come of it because your habits become good and i think there's a little bit of that with robertson and i think that he's starting to get it and i didn't mind his game last game but those are the tough lessons that you have to plow through as a young player and keep your confidence and gain it and grow and try to find a way to stay in the lineup every night 845 games for hemski and i think uh worked think worked out okay. 43 playoff games, including a run to the Stanley Cup final.

I think Robertson, Nick would gladly welcome that. You'd like that? Well, yeah, but you know, it's so tough for a young guy who his whole life has been evaluated by numbers, right? Like he, 55 goals. And like, so how do you, I just, I recognize it's such a challenge for a guy like him where his standards are not what Pontus Holmberg standards are.

Right. He can't go out there and just be above a takeaway. The, you know, the other teams break out and then call it a day, a game at the end of the day. So it's like, I don't know. I, you know, and I don't even have a question to your sandwich is how do you coach a guy

who is so focused on one thing? Like shooting the puck. His comments today were shooting the puck. Right, which is the only thing he does. No, but it's going in with the mindset of, you know, first and foremost, effort is everything. Like if you're going in thinking of scoring, that's not the mode that's going to get you there.

It's got to be. You've got to be the hardest worker on that line every shift. And maybe that's a tough task to ask, but at least put that as your standard. And when you're doing that, good things are going to come of it because you're moving and you're getting in and you're closing gaps and maybe you've turned the puck over. It's all those little things. I'll use my own experience. You know, you've turned the puck over. It's all those little things. I'll use my own experience.

You know, you've scored your whole life. My first year in NHL, I had 11 goals and 28 points as the second overall pick. That was hard to swallow. And you get a lot of questions of your own confidence in your mind. Well, that next year coming in, the focus wasn't about how to score. It was I got to be stronger. I got. It was, I got to be stronger. I got to be faster. I got to be harder.

I got all the little things that you got to own your own missteps and own the things you didn't do well. And then just find a way to get traction to that. And going into a game thinking I got to get two tonight is not the way. Going in and saying, I'm a good player. I'm going to own the puck tonight. Every time I have it, I'm going to make a play i i'm gonna own the puck tonight every time i have it i'm gonna make a play how many times does the puck die with me today and if you get through a

game and it's only like one or two times then you're going good players want to play with you because the play doesn't die with you so it's it's changing your mindset to start tackling those things and build the confidence out of that and And, you know, my second year was a complete different from my first year. My third year was a complete different from the second. And that's what you hope for a young kid, that he survives the difficult times, but learns and grows from it and gets better because of it. Simmer, fantastic stuff, man. Really, for someone that's off the top of your head,

that was an incredible uh uh story on uh hemski i really appreciate it and it nailed it uh just it is difficult for these kids today to come in and and not deal with instant success and how do you manage it uh terrific stuff thanks for doing this simmer have a great call tonight. All right. Take care, guys. Thanks so much. It's hard. Yeah. And if you are one of a fixed mindset, and that's what you're talking about, right, where you're just fixed on,

I've got no other way to measure my own success. It comes on a spreadsheet. You can see right right here he's doing better than me because he has three and i have one and i have one yeah therefore he's he's better than me and it's like as craig said no no that's not the case yeah yeah it is it's super hard and i will say you know i don't know if this is an era or an age thing but you know doing the video for the marlies i had ipads for the players come up and watch their shifts and you know who came up and watched their shifts everyone who played well everyone wants to watch themselves when it's going well you know two goal game yeah let me watch my shifts from tonight but no one wants to sit there and look at what it looks like

when it's bad oh my god you like all You, like, all the videos of, like, when you play a horse crap game and they go, like, we're going to be an hour late for practice and you've got to go through the whole game with the coach. In our day, sometimes they just put the tape in and you'd be like, we're going to watch all 60. Oh, my God. And then I'd cringe when my shifts would be on.

I'm like, oh, please get it over with. And they stop it. Borny. Oh, my gosh. It's painful. What the what the hell was that yeah what were you thinking here what'd you see playing left wing for us or right wing for them which one is it like well i just i thought that i could never mind you know like as you messed up and any excuse you have doesn't fly it's's miserable. So I get that people don't want to come in and look at themselves struggling, but that's part of finding your way to better days.

Not Sammy. Sammy wants to see every shift in his beer league. I know Kipper's listening to our worst shows at night just trying to find ways to get better. Grinding your way through. I'd like to watch some shifts from last night's Zig Zags. 7-1 dominant performance. Dominant Zig zigzag wins.

Didn't the other team forfeit again? No, no. No. We beat a good young team last night. What'd you get for numbers? Yeah, 1-1. 1-1 tonight? On the third line?

Oh, we only have two lines to camp. So you're on the second line. I'm on the top six. That's all that matters. Yes, the sixth. All right, we're going to take a quick break. Daryl Ray is going to come in and talk to us about his Dallas Stars team, the one that he covers,

and what Leaf fans can expect out of this new contending team in the West because they are back, and they are back with a vengeance. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Real Kipper Bourne after these words. We're right back at it. This is Real Kipper and Bourne on Sportsnet 590 The Van.

You're eating a carrot. I've been crushing just chocolates since Halloween. I can't do it anymore. You're eating a carrot? I've been crushing just chocolates, like, since Halloween. I can't do it anymore. The chocolate? Yeah. You've been passing me a chocolate over for, like, a month and a half now. I've got some deep shame over this. It's becoming a reliance.

How's our buddy Daryl Ray? Is he on? He is. That's probably the most unprofessional opening you've ever had in the history. How long have you been doing this, Daryl? I liked it. Razor, how long have you been doing this? I don't know, a quarter of a century.

And I'm the worst at introducing you ever. No, that was stellar. Good. Very good. Let me ask you about this Dallas Stars team that you're following here. You know, for a team that looked like it was something was coming to an end. And I only speak of just kind of the play of Jamie Benn and tyler sagan and it just seemed like maybe their best years were behind them and these big contracts and this is a team that has to find a way to get

rid of these contracts and rebuild and no no no lo and behold you come in this year and you're uh you know one of the better teams in the western. Did you see this coming? Not to the level that it has happened with Jamie especially. It's been fun, you know, following essentially the benissance of one big Ben. You know, because last month he looked, to me, he almost looked better than he did when he won the Art Ross. You know, he's skating really, really well. There's no question that the style that they're playing under Pete DeBoer has helped.

You know, as a winger, there's not a lot of just getting stuck, stopped. It's a very kinetic style. And I think that that's fed his game. And then, hey, you get a little longer in the tooth in the game and and you play with some very talented young guys and i i think it rejuvenates a little bit i think that's part of the secret with joe pavelski too you know you know joe's pushing 40 but he's playing with robertson andz, two guys that are not even into their prime yet. And with Ben, he's played exclusively with Wyatt Johnson and Ty Delandria for almost the entirety of the first 25 games.

And you can tell that he's enjoyed that. And it's given him a little bit of juice. And Tyler, look, Tyler's played better than it probably looks like. If you just look at the goal column, it looks sour, but he's done some good things too. He's on the second power play unit, not the number one, and that's affected some of his offense. But he's meshed pretty well with with mason marchman and giving them some

depth so yeah i mean there was some concern i know what you're talking about it even even i looking at it after last year is like are they going to be too yeasty and and too moldy all at once where they're trying to work young guys in with with guys that are maybe you know moving past their prime but it certainly hasn't looked that way. Yeah, it's funny. I played college hockey against Pavelski, and I've got kids in a bad back, and he's out there still scoring goals.

It's really incredible to watch. Here in Leafland, a relevant name is Mason Marchman, who you mentioned is getting some run with Seg in there. Has he lived up to the billing expectations? How has his season gone as a dallas star yeah yeah i mean immediately it did he scored three goals in the first two games they're like yes that's what we need we need somebody to come in here and now he hasn't scored at that same rate but uh he's you know he he's added another guy that that plays a style that has been maybe missing around here a little bit where, you know, he's rambunctious. Like I've heard before, and I can attest to it now, like you watch his shifts and he looks like one of those Carlotte blow-up bobbers.

You know, the arms are going all over the place. And he's involved and he's on the ice and he's up and he's smashing people and he's forcing turnovers and he can finish. So, you know, he's been a very welcome addition to this group. He actually

racked up a bunch of penalty minutes in a row the other night when he had the book thrown at him and he leads the team in penalty minutes. So a little, you know, another power forward on that left side. And if you look down the left-wing side of the Dallas Stars, I mean, it's murderer's row. You get Robertson, Ben, and Marchment. Bang, bang, bang.

And they've gotten the job done. And as far as the blue line goes, I see a big heavy blue line, you know, at times can just suffocate teams yet, you know, Miro Heskinen is one of those guys that you go, okay, this guy can also one day win the Norris.

Yeah, true. You know, he doesn't get maybe the accolades that he he deserves on the on the national front just because he he hasn't put up the the dazzling offensive numbers that some of the others have but I mean he's no shrinking violet in that category either i mean he went into last game uh he had 19 his 19 points were double any other stars defenseman so you know he's he's making it happen he's getting pushed to to be maybe a little more sparkle offensively but i mean he's as good as anybody in the league at

defending uh and does it with his feet to stick his head uh he's skating obviously he's one of the best skaters in the league but yeah i mean the whole group back there has played well you know the guy who's played great is yanni hockenpah you know a great big guy on on a real budget uh contract and he plays important minutes big part of their penalty kill he along with s lindell uh those are those two guys are the two heaviest on the squad, and they eat up a lot of those big penalty kill and defending minutes with them. But there's no question who the number one guy is,

and that's Miro. And if you're into just the little details of the position and you can respect and appreciate the subtleties of his game. He is easily one of the best defensemen in the league. There's a lot of guys on this team who you look at, and I don't think people appreciate how good they are. One of them that I'm curious about is Dennis Gurianov. I remember he scored 20 as a rookie in 60 games or something was super fast.

And it was kind of the offense hasn't been where it was that year. I see just one goal in 18 games or something super fast and you know it's kind of the offense hasn't been where it was that year i see just one goal in 18 games this year where is he at for this dallas stars team big guy too isn't he yeah yeah he is and he can skate like the wind i mean there there have been a couple of times like nobody can fly like mcdavid but there have been some times when you're like well it's in the at least in the wake you know of that and and yet it hasn't led to a ton of offense uh you know he he can get down on himself a little bit i think deborah and his staff are trying to shake him a little bit from maddening inconsistencies and just overall play i i thought he would really uh jet into this system where it's, you know,

it's go-go, like make no bones about it. The wingers blow the zone, like they take off, and they head north immediately. And that's kind of his game. But, you know, he spent some time on right wing with Sagan and Marchment, but just it hasn't clicked enough to stay there and make that a cemented line. So, yeah, it's a curiosity with him.

Like, there's so much there. He can shoot the puck through the end of the rink. He can fly. But as you mentioned, you know, the proof is what does he have to show? And there's only the one goal. I think he opened the scoring when we were in Arizona and they dusted them mightily. I think they scored four in the first period of that one

and never looked back. So he's got more to give. I'll say that. Darryl, the Leafs will face Jake Ottinger tonight. We all remember him best from his epic playoff run. That was as good as anything we've seen, at least, you know, if not in any playoff game, certainly in Dallas Stars history. Just watching the goaltending in general and expectations from guys

from anywhere to $7 to $10 million and watching their save percentage be under, what, 900 with some of them. Where is he handling the pressure of coming off of that incredible playoff series against Calgary and managing expectations? Well, first off, there was a time when 900 was pretty good, you know. Your time? Yeah, I think that's a good point. I think managing – look, in the first part of the season, he looked exactly like the guy he was against Calgary,

which was nothing short of stupendous. And looked like, no, there's not going to be any of that, okay, I've arrived, or maybe I've been petted all summer and come into this season and there's a little stumble bumble. And he got hurt in the game against the Rangers and missed a couple weeks. And since he's come back, he's been a little off in some games. In some games, he's looked like himself again. He got yanked last game against many, and it was performance-based. He just wasn't sharp, and he's going to get the start here again tonight.

But they all go through these little little vacillations it seems like at the position uh and and he's kind of gone through one a little bit here lately and uh you know jeff reese is the goalie coach here he does phenomenal work with with them and and he's got a great partner in wedgwood who's taken some of the load away so that he doesn't have to be in there night in and night out but this is one of those games where he's he's got to play better than maybe he has lately, which is weird to say because two games ago he had a shutout. So just part of the growth maybe of a young netminder who every time he's been challenged by something that I've watched, he's rose to that challenge, whether it was getting thrust in with a bunch of injuries

to veteran goaltenders last year or the playoffs, which is a completely different animal. He almost won the series by himself against Calgary. So he's facing another one of these, another mini crucibles, I guess, here in the opening half of the season. And he's got to get his act completely back together. Well,

I think remarkable. We've gone this long without talking about Jason Robertson. We got to Dennis Guriano first, but I think I'd like to get a bit more of your thoughts on, on how Robertson is doing what he's doing. Cause you know, Sheldon Keefe, you're talking about the Dallas stars,

lots of praise, but you say in Robertson, maybe not the most fleet of foot, but, and then he went on to, you know, with all the nice superlatives about his game. What do you see? How is he leading the NHL in scoring? How's he getting it done?

Yeah, Justin, it's a record for me to go this long without somebody asking me about Robo. Yes. Well, he's an absolute student of the game. Like, I was talking to him the other day, because it seems like after most shifts, if we go back with a shot of him on the bench, he's on the tablet, like, every single time.

And he just consumes massive amounts of video with the goal of being better all the time like all the time and you know so one thing I asked him I said well what what did you want to be better at this year and he said well one of my big goals was to not get my shots blocked so much and he went through all the stats and he had all the numbers from last year about the number of shots that he would have had if he was smarter shooter and this and that. And you watch him here in the opening 25 games, and he doesn't get blocked a lot. He's got a little more patience or maybe just moves the angle of the puck a little bit and gets the shot through first and foremost.

And if goalies don't see it, they don't stop it. He's very patient and accurate with that. And he plays with some really good players. Like Ropey Hance is one of the most underrated players, let alone centers in the league. And Pavelski's ageless and crafty. And they have unbelievable chemistry with one another. That being said, you know, he has what now?

An 11-point lead on the team and almost a dozen more goals than anybody else. So he's just had a very special start to the season. I keep waiting for a game where he's not a threat. Even in the games where he hasn't scored, he's felt like he's been a threat. And you have to go all the way back to when they played back-to-back at Ottawa and in boston and that's the last time he didn't have a point in a game and a lot of times his goals like

he can beat goaltenders in so many different ways most of it is with his wrist shot and it's really crafty and very accurate and uh he scores repeatedly The consistency has been unbelievable. What is it that Robertson's, when it comes to Pavelski, what is working for Pavelski that Robertson is taking such a great advantage of? You know, four years ago, Darrell, you know, when you see the breakup of the San Jose Sharks, we've watched Joe Thornton and Patrick Marleau go to different teams and kind of do the natural thing. And that's just fade off into the sunset. This guy's going the other way.

Yeah, there's no slowdown. He had three primary assists in that rally against the Wild to get a point just in the third period alone, and all three of them were nothing short of brilliant. And I think he's got a very calming effect, and he's such an intelligent player. And through osmosis, Robertson's absorbed some of that, and he had that anyway.

But they play an excellent small game. You know, when things get tight and they just need to make a series of passes that are like eight feet from one another with a little bit of movement, they do it. And Joe's been a terrific sort of relay guy. Ropey can skate with the best of them in the league. He can fly, he can gallop.

And so he kind of drives things for them. And a lot of timese can be the guy in neutral ice that just makes one little subtle crafty player at the blue line and it gets them in and and going and then from there with rope a speed backing defenders off and robertson skills and and uh and patience and a shot shot it just all seems to mesh together and and they're all a threat to score I mean last year Robertson scored 41 Hintz scored 37 and Joe scored 27 and they're doing sort of the same thing again this season a few others are joining them in the let's carry the Dallas Stars goal scoring which which is nice, and that's why they're second in the league in goals right now.

But that line still is the line that teams can't stop. I watch it night in and night out, and they cannot stop that threesome for a full 60 minutes. They just find a way to get something done. Last one from me, Ray. I just want to get your thoughts on what has changed with the coaching switch this season. You mentioned that the forwards blow the zone

a little more of a kinetic style. Is that an accurate assessment? Just a team that's less stopping and starting and more keeping it flowing? Yeah, and again, Pete's done great work and making sure that it's not a complete slam on what was here and that he wanted to build upon the defensive structure and acumen of this group. And for the most part, they've done that.

They're still top 10 in goals against. But they needed to get out of their own zone quicker uh and and build their offense you know open things up a little bit so they could score some more because they they were kind of stuck and you could see again in that series against calgary it was defend defend defend stop box every now and then counter punch a little bit and and it's more of a dictating, initiating style. There's very little D to D and, you know, work the width of the rink on your way up. It's more let's get going north and the very hot hockey vernacular and and get our offense going that way and by moving the puck out of their own zone so quick you can you can see when you watch it all the time like teams teams just get on their heels almost immediately and

then they get chasing back into their own zone and from that they're obviously they don't have to dump the puck in as much because there's room to roam people are backed off their space because of how fast they play now when they don't play like that and they revert a little bit, they get stuck in the mud like everybody else. And it, I think, ticks Pete DeBoer off a little bit. But old habits are tough to break. But I would say that that's probably the biggest change that I've seen here is that they just hit the whip a little quicker than they did in pass.

And with that, they're going to open themselves up to some chances against more than they did in previous years. Razor, we're past American Thanksgiving, and we're looking at the standings, and there's still some questions about New Jersey, Seattle, even Winnipeg. And it's like, okay, when's the bubble going to burst here? When are they going to come back to reality? Are we way past that for Dallas?

Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think so. You know, again, you haven't played everybody yet. Like, they played Boston. They were on a back-to-back. They played in Toronto. They lost in overtime in in Tampa

they haven't played New Jersey they haven't played Carolina they they play the Islanders here at home they played pretty much everybody in their own division now they haven't played Vegas they haven't played Seattle they haven't played Calgary you know, like, it's still a little bit early when you look at it that way, but when you're 25 games in and you can start to see what they're all about, this seems to be what they're going to be. I don't know that they can continue to score at the rate that they have, but they're probably going to try. And what they have that would scare, I think, most others around them is they have a supreme belief that even when they're down a couple of goals

and it doesn't matter how late it is, they believe that they've got a switch that they can flick and they can come back on you. And maybe they didn't have that in past. And there's a belief that they have it now. Looking forward to the game tonight. Have a great call, Razor. Enjoyed it. Work on your intros.

I will. I will. Yeah. In my next life. Thanks, Razor. We'll listen back to the tape. Daryl Ray calls a great game too for Dallas

I've always been a huge fan of his I love turning on a game where Razor's involved just that Daryl that Darren Pang kind of thing where they're just kind of born to just talk you know what it is when I first worked at the score

they told me about the concept of beerability he's a guy you want to go have a beer with right like that's a beer ability i used to write articles and i would rank the beer ability of nhl players gms coaches i used to drink a lot i'm about to read all about it i know but in all seriousness daryl uh sorry razor has has a high level of beer ability. All right. I like that term. I think I'm going to steal it, too.

I don't know if I did it for media. You have high beer ability, for sure. I can't confirm. Yeah. We have that as factual evidence. And some guys get nastier the more beer ability they get. Right. Yeah, it's not.

But you can usually tell sober can't you good laugh you have a sense of which guys you'd want to i think i get funnier yeah beer do you think that there's others that get meaner with beer that's very true yeah you got to pick your people but yes paying your high beer ability as well all right he yeah he kind of brings up a good point here that, you know, we do have 32 teams in the National Hockey League, and you can go long stretches without being, I'm not sure tested is the right word, but seeing depth. I think that's the right word.

Yeah, maybe you're right. Yeah. You know, like there's. I just don't want to disrespect, you know, the ability to win on any given night and just winning and scoring goals is tough. Right. Night to night.

But we got some bad teams. For sure. And, you know, we make fun of like in this league's crazy, like Arizona, who we thought was like the worst team on earth. Like, you know, they got seven wins, just like Chicago, more than Anaheim. So every team can win at any given night but the problem is there's so much parity like you don't see many teams you're like oh that team is head and shoulders above it's like boston you mentioned new jersey i don't know if they'll come back to

the pack a little bit i just i don't know that they're this good but yeah you can go a stretch of 10 games where you play a bunch of okay teams. And then you got like, we've already established the teams that are just going to like tank from here on in. Chicago. Chicago. Arizona. Like this is, this is like they're, they're full, full. Connor Bedard. Maybe somebody talked to the Montreal.

Maybe somebody talked to Montreal Canadians in somebody talked to Montreal Canadiens in the first Montreal last night how do you turning it around how do you like blown leads again blown leads

this is the first time we saw four four nothing after the first period and they lost yeah in fact they got up 6-5

with three minutes to go I did not watch the game from start to finish but good for you it was nor did I if if the three Stooges They got up 6-5 with three minutes to go. I did not watch the game from start to finish. Good for you. It was... Nor did I. If the Three Stooges ever made a hockey movie, I think it would kind of look like what we saw last night.

You and I both watched the highlight packages and both looked at each other about half through the highlights like, what happened? Guys are kicking pucks in their own net. They're falling. Goalies can't catch a puck. Spencer Martin's using one of those Velcro things to catch a ball instead of a glove. It just was ugly hockey from the looks of the highlights.

But we did see one hell of a hit. Luke Shen absolutely pasted Slavoski along the boards behind the net. Yes, the tweet from, I believe, the Spoked Z was that he control-alt-deleted him. Just good night. Erased the man from the play. And it was a penalty. Hold on. Did he get a penalty for that hit?

Interference. Interference for hitting the man with the puck? Yes. The puck had left his stick. You know, it was a millisecond since it left his stick. You used to get like three steamboats. I just hate that that was called a penalty. And then he gets the treat of having to fight Wi-Fi.

Yeah. And then he out-strengths him and just pushes him to the ground. See, the ref was kind of like your tweet on that hit. What, bad? Read your tweet. what did i tweet i'm gonna find it here you hate it i didn't want to i didn't want to sound like uh a neanderthal but i don't want to live in a world where this is a penalty okay why did you feel the need to to preface yeah to bring up that you're a neanderthal because sometimes i think like one and i don't want everyone to think i am one that's why see and that's why the referee called

the penalty because it's the same thing you're because he's as scared as you are for everybody coming all over you in terms of ripping you for being a guy that just likes hard checks. I'm okay with that. I'll take the heat. Do I have the edit button? You don't have to apologize for being a guy that likes hard hits. So this is a thing I'm consciously doing in my writing is trying to erase those hedges where I'm like, yeah. Like you're apologizing.

Hey, everybody. It's still in the game. No, just write the thing you can hit hard yeah and you could actually you know hurt a guy like that's there's just two full values possibility one is you separate the guy from the puck which is the point of the hit the other is that you make people hit but the other is that you make people hesitant to have the puck at all but there are people out there that don't want that second part to be that hitting anymore and it's like it's been around for a hundred years like you're going down a path now that's just you want to

change the rules of the game yeah no it's like you don't get to just go on your social media and say i don't like it you're in neanderthal and you know yeah i want hockey this way now like right it's like i'm sorry and you are what about the second part of the tweet uh bring luke home uh there's a lot of people that want to bring luke home he is the most talked about guy right now for jimmy rutherford how much better is luke shen than jordy ben better yes i agree how much better uh you can stay in the lineup okay that's better and those punches it's hard once upon a time luke shen was a top five pick overall it's very high okay yeah once upon a time he was on waivers and anyone could have him for free i know but that's i don't know 12 years later i i do not want to express skepticism how long has he been a great player and i would love to have him on the

leaves luke's a legitimate lu Luke is a legitimate 5'6". Yeah. You know who he is on the Colorado Avalanche? He's Jack Johnson. You don't trade for him and to try to win a Stanley Cup and ask Luke to play 18 to 20 minutes a night. Right. I think my theory on defense is that you don't have to have

the best decor in the world, but you can't have holes. You can't have a guy who's bad, you know, who are the other team can pick apart or there's going to be a breakdown. Shin can plug a hole. If you feel like on the Leafs bottom pair, whether it's Meta or Hollowell or Timmons or whoever it's going to be, Shin is a massive upgrade.

Massive, massive. So, so correct. You know, i don't want to see them give up a you know high pick or a prospect or something that's what i was just gonna ask since kipper is it's it's climbing there's a lot of people looking it's climbing supply and demand listen it's not are we talking uh i don't know if they think that they can get a second to a third for him now,

but it's not a fifth or a sixth. I bet they can. You look at what Dennis Savard fetched last year. It's not a first. David Savard. Yeah, but David Savard's more legit 20 minutes, 22 minutes. What other deadline guys do? There was value traded for... it could be uh it could be nick

robertson it could be a if you're i wonder if canucks fans would do that mid prospect you think they do nick robertson for luke shen right now of course you can sell them on the promise they you know like they're getting anything for a guy that's expiring they're supposed to be rebuilding like you're right you're right when do you want to win can i to win? How old is Luke Shen going to be when they're supposed to be good? How old is Luke right now? Good question. And what draft was he? Luke Shen age.

Luke Shen is 33? 33. 2008 draft. He's only 33? It's not 40. I think I'm going to change my tune on this a bit. I thought he was like 37 or something. I know it's only four i think i'm gonna change my tune on this a bit i thought he was like 37 or something so i know i know it's only four years big swing put himself into a third round pick

can jimmy think he can get a second round pick for a desperate team i think i think i mean what give me his draft give me the first five in his draft because once upon a time... I'll get it right here. There was a small window where you thought you were going to get possibly... The defensemen ahead of him were unbelievable. You got it? It's an awesome top five.

Yeah. It's Stamkos. Stamkos, Dowdy. Dowdy, Bogosian, Petrangelo, Luke Shen. Yeah. And then it just goes off a cliff. And then your boy our boy don't mention was dug in columbus at the time philatov was the sixth pick yeah i don't know

maybe he's um the fbi follow him maybe or was it another player he played 53 games colin wilson mikhail bodker josh bailey but you at when you're a top five, you're hoping to get a guy that can maybe look like Shea Weber than a guy that's plugging your fifth, sixth, or seventh spot on your lineup. That's the most pims from that draft. There were times even in Toronto that you saw flashes of a guy that can kind of do it all. And he did fight he did hit i think i remember one particular goal where he came down the off wing and scored a beautiful

goal luke shen yes oh yeah remember of course like photographic in my mind yeah yeah it was like oh i was like guys i don't know if it's a good sign if you said i remember the goal luke shen scored and you remember it. Like, that's not great. You should be like, there were so many. I don't know. How many games has he played in his career? 889.

Yeah, so there's some. 40 and 137 for 177. 724 PIMS. There's still some mileage. There's some, what do you call it on tires? Tread. Tread. I struggled for a second there. He's got some tread still on on tires? Tread. Tread. I struggled for a second there.

He's got some tread still on his tires. All right. Luke Shen coming to Toronto. You heard it here first. All right. What else do we got? Shane Wright. I was just looking at that goal that he scored.

Primary assist, Joey Crabb. Hey. Colorado College. Also an Alaska boy. There you go. So is it off the wing can you see it it's a gorgeous goal did he backhand no no he cut into the middle on his off wing yeah and then went across and bar down there you go and it's against the bruins what are we doing there you

watching luke shen porn during the show i love it okay what can we expect out of shane right versus uh slafkovsky tonight? Seattle, Montreal. Ooh, Wright, Slavkovsky. First off, do you believe that Shane Wright mean-mugged the Montreal front office, gave him the glare of death on the way up there? Yeah, and I really liked it. Me too. It's great.

It's great. You know, it's not decided. It's not decided that Shane Wright, they made a, you know, he has time here to prove them very wrong so do we get a final tally on his uh minor league success five games four goals four goals four goals a couple of sister do um so yeah great great showing in the american league after seven nhl games shane wright had one shot on on net and had the puck for a minute and a half, according to my staff. And he's in the lineup tonight. He's averaged all but, what, six minutes a game?

What's the over-under on six and a half minutes? I'm taking over. I'm taking over. I think, you know, you go to Coachella Valley, you handle the biscuit, you shoot some in the net. They give you a look against Montreal, who played last night against Vancouver and blew their brains out.

I think he's going to score tonight. Wow. And that pay. I don't know. Good question. And Seattle is one of those teams where you're, okay, is this, are they on borrowed time here are they 15 and 6 you know to sammy's point and i don't know if we did this on the show or not but

like there's not a great team not a lot of great teams in the west but they're getting good mileage they got uh burakovsky out of colorado yeah is he not leading them in scoring he's doing very well uh i can figure that out though but seattle is right now two teams in the pacific division have a positive goal differential that means all of la edmonton calgary vancouver san jose and Anaheim are even or worse in goal differential. So, yeah, way to go, Seattle. Like, they're doing good, but that division is not good. Nashville, St. Louis, Arizona, Chicago, all minus. Minnesota's barely over.

Like, the West is not that strong. And they got this two years ago, second uh round pick overall who's the kid there matt uh veneers veneers awesome awesome been really good leading calder trophy candidate you know guy uh he's somewhat exciting you know they they went all in on defense and goaltending last year and it wasn't a real thrill ride to watch them lose but lynf you they got bjork strand too right bet you it's expensive tickets in seattle tonight They went all in on defense and goaltending last year, and it wasn't a real thrill ride to watch them lose. But a little infuriating. They got Bjorkstrand, too, right? I bet you it's expensive tickets in Seattle tonight.

Habs coming to town? Oh, they are expensive as is. And I bet you they're going up and up tonight. Okay, what do we expect tonight in Dallas? Keep it close. Lower score game. Red Rover, Red Rover, we call you in line up five over it's matt murray tonight yes sir back to murdog can they i think this is a huge test for murray tonight can they keep them

three and under yeah that's the murray question so the stars are second or you said first in goals this year i think they're closing in on 100 okay so the most goals in the nhl this year the leafs are third in the nhl in goals against per game if i'm not mistaken so the best offense against a very very good defense i am curious to see how the leafs injured decor on a long run of games against a very good offense can hold up i think there's a chance that matt murray has to be very good tonight and test that groin post to post. This is the building that Austin Matthews broke Rick Vives record. Is that right?

Last year. I actually, while we were doing this show, went and placed a bet on Austin Matthews to score tonight. For the record, Twitter world, I didn't bring up Austin Matthews and question his play. JV did. Fair point. twitter world i didn't bring up austin matthews and question his play jb did uh fair fair point but matthews is gonna start shooting in the net at some point here yeah you've been saying that for three weeks now i know it's almost christmas pal lights are up

all right so you guys are right he's not gonna start scoring you heard it here kipper and sam said because he hasn't been scoring he's not going to start scoring. You heard it here. Kipper and Sam said because he hasn't been scoring, he's not going to start. Careful on that limb you're out there on, Barney, that he might start scoring. Well, you're the one who's doubting it. I don't know. Either you think it's happening or you don't.

I don't know. I think it's got to. The numbers are okay, but he's not standing out. Right. Particularly on the puck in net part of the standing out. I mentioned some of the guys that are scoring at his pace. It's not his usual company, to say the least. So yeah, betting

on it tonight. Matthews goal. It's plus 110. Actually, Robertson, his odds are shorter. So they think Robertson is more likely to score tonight than Austin Matthews, which if you're a betting person, probably not. All right, let's go get him nick i should have specified you got to put an initial on that one i don't even know if they offer a line on nick scoring sure they do all right well

this is you know we're in the east coast so what do we have an 8 30 eastern time yes you'll be okay with that you got a men's league game or anything like that? No, we got Leafs talk after the game tonight. Me and JD Bunkus breaking it down live on YouTube. And it'll go up on all the podcast stuff afterwards. And I just wanted to do a quick housekeeping. I had to give a shout out to the texter, Brock in Orangeville, who texted me the hockey tournament that I was talking about at the start of the show.

Oh, yeah. Yes. It was during the lockout. Yes was talking about at the start of the show. Oh, yeah. Yes. It was during the lockout. Yes. It was Labatt Blue Pickup Cup. Yeah. It was so lame. It was horrible.

It doesn't even count. And it was, it had, Kujo was involved. Alan McCauley was involved. Yes. Todd Warner. Todd Warner. Vinny LeCavalier. Vinny LeCavalier.

Here's the thing is like, you're during a lockout, you get hurt, you're missing millions. No one was going too hard out there. Nobody. So there you go. Just wanted to bring that up. Thanks very much, Brock and Orangeville. You saved my boy Roy on the hockey team. Did you guys know it's St. Nicholas Day today?

We did not know that. Is that different than Christmas? Yeah. Okay. Well, happy day, St. Name day. Happy name day. Happy name day to you.

December 6th. A little education there. Well, I'm always happy to learn. All right. Our thanks to learn. Alright, our thanks to Daryl Ray and Craig Simpson on a great show tonight. Enjoy the game. Enjoy

the battle of the consecutive streaks. We're back tomorrow.