Real Kyper & Bourne - The Auston Equation

Episode Date: June 16, 2023

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne react to reports of Auston Matthews' negotiations with the Leafs, how captaincy plays into the extension discussion and the rumours of Sheldon Keefe staying with the tea...m. Next up, former general manager, coach and NHL President Doug Maclean joins the show to give his take on Brad Treliving potentially re-signing Matthews, the Senators' plans for Alex DeBrincat and who he thinks would be a good assistant coach for the Leafs. Finally, the guys wrap up the show with their thoughts on Jarome Iginla being named as Special Advisor for the Calgary Flames.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Transcript
Discussion (0)
Starting point is 00:00:00 This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. I was just going to ask you right before we were going to air. Is it off the rails Friday? I can't tell. That's how you know it's really off the rails. When you don't know it's Friday. It's the Jays with their afternoon games. Throwing us a curveball. Like Jose Barrios, just throwing one down in the zone.
Starting point is 00:00:27 Okay. Is it in his contract to have a really good year every other year? It's the stagger deal. That's okay. Listen, he'll take it. I'll take the bounce back after last season. He's Justin Bourne. I'm Nick Kiprios.
Starting point is 00:00:40 We got Derek Brandeo, Jen Rolnick, as usual, and Tristan. Let's have it. Mark Ajani. Yeah. Filling in for Sammy McKee, who's on assignment in where? Where's Cabot? Oh, Cabot. Has he sent us any pictures?
Starting point is 00:00:58 Yeah, he sent us one of like an 80-foot, 9-foot breaking punt by the ocean. I hate him. Well, if Sammy's out, we'll get Doug McClain in on his regularly scheduled Friday hit on the Real Kipper and Bourne show, which means that he hasn't listened since his last time he's been on. No, he probably hasn't paid any hockey attention, but we'll get his info, get his input.
Starting point is 00:01:21 Oh, and I'm sure he's got a handful. So let's start with the insiders first. And we've got a great one here at Sportsnet, Elliot Friedman, via 32 Thoughts, saying that the Leafs are pushing for an eight-year deal on Austin Matthews. We love Elliot, but is that not stating the obvious? Well, that is stating the obvious what would why would the Leafs not want an eight-year deal for sure but the fact that he may you know we actually have
Starting point is 00:01:51 the clip why don't we listen to that let's listen let's do that first you know Bradtree Living did go to Arizona last week and he met with Austin Matthews I have been convinced he's signing now I'm even more convinced he's signing like i don't know how much they talk contract but the one thing i remember is when was the last time that brad tree living had dinner with someone uh was it huberto yes it was jonathan huberto in montreal so three days after he signed the extension with calgary, the eight-year $84 million extension. It's already been longer than three days since Tree Living met with Matthews, so we're not going to beat that, but I still am convinced that Austin Matthews is going to sign in Toronto.
Starting point is 00:02:39 I think Matthews, especially the people around him, they look at there's been two more big contracts in his future. I think the Maple Leafs are going to try to get a max term deal out of this. I don't know what the likelihood is, but I think they're going to try. What did Elliot ask
Starting point is 00:02:57 Jeff? When was the last time Brad Tree had dinner with somebody? He's been alone since. I gotta think he's had dinner with somebody else between that signing. point is he's a closer he's a closer abc um i'm surprised does that make you feel a little better if you're a leaf fan yeah that uh elliot's really convinced that he's gonna sign yes it does make me feel better because you know elliot knows stuff um i am surprised though and i did want to talk about that a little bit today um just because we had talked about potential next contracts for matthews and what they would look like it looked
Starting point is 00:03:35 to a lot of us that had set up the five-year deal to take him to ufa as young as possible you would then want him to you think if he's trying to earn all the money he could like a three to five-year deal then he's still 29 when he signs his next deal and you can give him another eight year deal at that point eight years now takes him to 33 years old or something like that not sure teams want to do eight years at that point but boy for the Leafs you love the idea of it I don't see an eight-year deal at all. And technically, they are negotiating still in a pandemic cap world, which means it's flat next year. And would Austin and his representative, Judd,
Starting point is 00:04:17 be in a position to really forecast that this is where the cap's going to be definitively, therefore, I want this number now. And I'm not sure he can get that number, the number that you foresee in the next five to six years, meaning that don't touch the eight or the seven-year deal. If I'm Brad Tree Living and I'm talking to Matthews, I say, you know, you present him with, if you do an eight-year deal,
Starting point is 00:04:51 you know, you look like these other guys who care about their team. You want to stay. The city loves you. If we give you 14 or 13, it's an $8 million difference over eight years. It's not a huge swing in where you're going to be in your life,
Starting point is 00:05:04 but the fans will love you if you do 13. It's an $8 million difference over eight years. It's not a huge swing in where you're going to be in your life. But the fans will love you if you do 13. Would you do eight times 13 somewhere in that neighborhood? I can't see him touching 13 for eight years. No. No. You want 14? I would think he, or 15. 14 or 15 would be a number on eight years for me if I'm Judd.
Starting point is 00:05:25 You know what kills me about these sort of contracts? I see people saying like, you know, what about McKinnon did 12.7? Or what about Kachuk going into this past year did 9.5? That Kachuk deal immediately looks like the Marchand and McKinnon deals that looked so bad for so long. If Austin would do that, he'd be such a hero overnight in this city. And what is the value of that? Honestly, what is the value, like in terms of future earnings, your reputation, your ability to win?
Starting point is 00:05:54 Yeah, which this year, his reputation took a step back. I think so. No question. Just as a player. As a player. He wasn't one of the 10 best players in the NHL this year. As a guy. Just simply for me, as a guy that you can watch.
Starting point is 00:06:11 This is just, forget analytics. Forget about goals and assists. Let's go with optic analytics. There's your new term from the Real Kipper and Bourne Show. Perfect. Optic analytics. And I'm evolving. Thank you.
Starting point is 00:06:27 Nice drop. Nice drop, Monty. He didn't pass that one for me. Yeah. When I look around and I see other players and McKinnon last year or Eichel this year, the optic analytics says that guy's all in. All in. All in!
Starting point is 00:06:47 There's a lot of his wrist hurt. There's a lot of questions. Stop it with the wrist hurt. That makes me nauseous when I hear his wrist. Because he was playing the way he was, people asked those questions. The way he was playing led us to those questions. So even if it was
Starting point is 00:07:04 or it wasn't't you can say there was a definitive noticeable difference matthew kachuk playing with a broken sternum oh i was like that's intense like austin that's too much by the way you shouldn't do that don't try that at home folks don't but that's where austin just has everything going for him, but that's the one thing that's missing is when we watch you this season, you don't look all in. Well, the year before, when he won the Hart Trophy,
Starting point is 00:07:32 I felt like there were times when he looked like Giannis Antetokounmpo. Antetokounmpo? How'd I do? That was better. The Greek freak. The Greek freak. Going through the neutral zone,
Starting point is 00:07:42 just like slicing powerful big through the middle, looking like, prime adrian peterson yes that wasn't there this year carrying players on his back and still getting to the net and driving and finishing yes he so that wasn't there for him still i think he has earned you know earned the type of money he's going to get here whether it is 14 or 13 or whatever. He's going to make a loud statement about his priorities with what he does. And so if I'm his agent, it might be worth saying, shelf some of the money, commit long-term, show the people you want to be here.
Starting point is 00:08:16 I bet you if you do eight years, you're the captain in a hot second. Maybe it's whenever Tavares is gone. I don't know. Whenever that is. That could be part of it too couple years yeah a couple years right now could be sooner never know I'm here all day for two years do not think that
Starting point is 00:08:33 him resigning and upping five five years or plus that they don't go yeah insta captain you've been on this for a year and a half i have like just give it to them you want to sell the number 34 toronto maple leaf sweater with the c on the chest at some point here i would think that that would be uh a carrot to dangle do you think he
Starting point is 00:09:00 really wants it or do i know the organization i got a better forget him forget him for a second okay is he a captain okay answer that question before a does he want it or not yeah is he i didn't see captain material last season i don't feel equipped i don't know what goes on in that room how much he speaks up didn't see it didn't see it didn't see a guy that that definitively plays every night and says this is my team yeah jump aboard because we're going for a ride yeah didn't see it you know but there comes a point where if a guy is close he gets the sea you know what i mean where you'd rather it's a statement to the guy if you say we're going to have no captain is a statement let's say devars leaves in two years and they're like we're not sure if you're a guy a real captain we're not going to have one they signed a statement to me like i'll go back to john
Starting point is 00:09:55 signing yeah you know what the statement was to me that you signed john tav, at the time, you made him the second highest paid player in the league. You took away a franchise player who was a captain for the New York Islanders, and you don't put a C on him right away. He didn't get it until, what, a year later? Like, why? To me, he's never been in the room. It's not his team to come in and leave. There's some guys you can just, well, I know Mark Messier did it, but I get the fact that there's no Stanley Cup.
Starting point is 00:10:30 Literally name an award after his ability to lead teams. I know. But there are just some guys you know are just the leader. Yeah. Whether Matthews is or not, he's the face of this team, and they go as he goes. If he's bad, they're not going to win. If he's good, they can win. Fans perceive he's the face of this team. And they go as he goes. If he's bad, they're not going to win. If he's good, they can win.
Starting point is 00:10:47 Fans perceive him as the face of the franchise. Okay. Let's answer your question then. Do you believe that he wants it? I believe that he wants it from a perception standpoint. And I do think he's ready to handle the media. I think he's their best media guy. He does a good job managing the stress and the ups and downs of things.
Starting point is 00:11:07 Better than Morgan Riley. That's a good point. That's a good point. Morgan's really good. Really good. Okay. And he should be Morgan. Morgan.
Starting point is 00:11:17 He's got, you know, he took a discount. Can we say that even, even the fact that we're having this conversation on Morgan or Austin says that John Tavares isn't the guy? Yeah. I feel bad because I'm a Tavares fan and I root for him and I think he's a good dude. But yeah, I don't see him as the face of this team at this point.
Starting point is 00:11:40 He's not the driver on a night-in basis. He's not someone you look to. And he can't carry a team do you remember when andrew ference was named the captain of the oilers and he was like healthy scratched at times yes it's hard right and i'm not seeing tavarez as andrew ference but not the point anytime you do that and you know a good friend of mine's chris king he was the captain of winnipeg it's hard for third or fourth liners uh to be that guy when he's not leading on the ice yeah in the final minute and not yeah and not even leading the guys when there's like three or four guys who like mitch marner and matthews and maybe willie next year who could be another 40 goal
Starting point is 00:12:18 guy like there are players who are more important to the team then it's hard to be the leader. Would a three-year deal or less bother you for Austin Matthews? So, bother me? A little bit in secret? Yes. You know, like that would be like, it's annoying that he feels like he's trying to ring the team every dollar he can out of it, right? Because that's what that feels like.
Starting point is 00:12:48 Let me see the cap go up. Let me put up put up some numbers then let me ask you for 16 you know like it feels a little like you know why don't you just commit to the team be here well that's the that's the word commit right it's a non-commitment it's a dipping the toe in the water not all in but like you know four and five years is a long time. And I think that's a commitment. Yes, I'm with you. You know, so I'm. Minimum. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:13:09 Four or five. Right. Three does feel. Tells me you're just waiting for maybe another building to show up in your home state. Yeah, right. Like Arizona's got a billion draft picks and they're trying to build an arena. Maybe it is different in three years. You know, that's four years of playing time for him who knows okay um we got doug mcclain in about uh
Starting point is 00:13:29 what nine ten minutes uh other talk out there if we're going to talk uh insiders i think darren drager put out a report that the leafs are shopping for assistant coaches which can mean only one thing that it's a foregone conclusion uh sheldon keeps coming back well yeah the the tweet itself says that um tree living and sheldon have met and that sheldon has input on who the assistant coach is so that input implies you're going to be here right so he said he said no extension for him but there's plenty of time to talk about that but yeah he's weighing in on who the assistant coach is which makes you think toronto maple leafs are going to be coached by sheldon keith next season which means and i know we've had this conversation but it has to come with an extension You cannot let that guy go in and face 20 faces, 22 faces every day.
Starting point is 00:14:27 Who think if we lose five in a row, he's gone. Exactly. Yeah. Can't do it. But, you know, the good question here is if you're Sheldon, would you even sign a one-year extension? That's a good point. Not a chance.
Starting point is 00:14:41 A one-year is just like walking to the execution line. I see you making an excellent point right now because i'm with you if i'm sheldon i'm like one year just fire me no no no no i had uh what a hundred and 115 115 111 beat the three-time defending uh eastern champs there's uh 16 other teams that didn't make the playoffs. Yeah. So. One year's offensive. That's right. Give me two or three. And I guess if you're the Leafs, you know, you're like, well, we're MLC.
Starting point is 00:15:14 We can afford it. But I don't think they like paying Mike Babcock a bajillion dollars to not coach. I don't think that's fun. So when you go through the business bottom line, you go this money. Can we not do that? Can we not pay ex-coaches? Listen, I kind of hung out with some billionaires the last little while. Rounding error stuff?
Starting point is 00:15:32 They don't like wasting money. No, they don't. Okay? You got to quit with the attitude. Even MLSE, deep pockets and all, they don't like wasting money. No. Rogers, Bell, they don't like wasting money no rogers bell they don't like wasting money it's insulting yeah to people in high positions that's that stock price man whatever
Starting point is 00:15:56 the case is jb uh they don't want to pay any more than they have to so this one's going to be interesting to see if if uh if sheldon takes the token one year contract and and goes to work yeah i bet you it's two a two-year extension right if you're him he wants to coach the trauma one year left so you're saying starting september he will have three more years out of the trauma maple Leafs. See, I think that's too much. That's too rich for me. Yeah. But again, it's a hard sell to tell a coach to take a one-year contract, isn't it? Because it's not a commitment.
Starting point is 00:16:36 Well, listen, we're right back to maybe a standoff. But if I'm Sheldon, I want to coach the Leafs. You know, he is from Ontario. He is a Maple Leafs guy. He wants this. And then you get two years to win. Maybe Kyle can give him some advice on betting on yourself. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:16:53 Oh, yeah. Should we squeeze that in? Just one more thing, though, on the assistant coaches. To me, who are they interviewing and who's it going to be? Is it going to be? They're like, Galant's your assistant coach. He's like, oh, God. For sure.
Starting point is 00:17:07 It's going to be someone with NHL experience. They're not going to go get another Carberry. They're not going to pull some kid who's never been in an NHL dressing room before. I think it's all one way or all the other. It's this exact thing you're talking about. It's a guy you've never heard of who makes Sheldon feel safe and sheldon doesn't need to be feeling safe he may he may need someone to say if you don't deliver the goods by november bud you're gone you know who the angel of death there is is mike yo is mike yo not taking over like 40 coaches jobs as an assistant
Starting point is 00:17:41 maybe that's a bit high i'm gonna give you a name maybe it's three i'm gonna give you a name all right kirk muller that would make me feel a lot of pressure calgary flames yeah all right tree living right has been a head coach in the league been a head coach in the league before former toronto maple leaf had success in my head i just went boy one day kirk muller's gonna be the coach of the leafs, isn't he? Interesting. Yeah. That would make some sense. And I would say one thing that might dissuade that idea is Sheldon Keefe having input because I am not selecting Kirk Muller to be my guy.
Starting point is 00:18:19 I've long been like, get the best guy available and win. But there you got to protect yourself a little bit. When Rick Talkett was out there, I think there was something between him and the Leafs. And I'm not sure that guy would have made Sheldon very comfortable. Yeah. But everyone's been too comfortable here. I was under the impression that maybe Talkett turned down the Leafs. As an assistant. As Sheldon's assistant.
Starting point is 00:18:44 Yeah. I can't confirm that, but that was some of the scuttlebutt. Wasn't that a Boudreaux thing once upon a time too? Someone else. Well. How do you turn it down? Listen, they don't want to be over,
Starting point is 00:18:57 you know, they don't want a big shadow over them. It's an awkward spot too as those guys. If you're clearly there to supersede the guy, things go wrong yeah kirk muller stanley cup champion montreal canadian toronto maple leaf yeah first pick overall you're in the room and he's like yeah you know what sheldon i don't like that power play sheldon scrapped that but this guy trying to you know subvert me here what did you ever win sheldon yeah that'd be awkward yeah kind of kind of awkward. Well, that will be interesting. It'll be interesting. Real interesting.
Starting point is 00:19:25 Okay. Speaking of Kyle Dubas. Yes. Can he just go away? No. What? Dubas stories forever. We're going to play Dubas stories all year.
Starting point is 00:19:34 We're on Penguin's Watch. All right. Do we have a Kyle Dubas soundbite from Brock University? Yeah, he was given an honorary doctorate at Brock and spoke and made some comments about his time with the Leafs. Okay, let's have a listen. Oftentimes when people are invited to give addresses like this, they have far more life experience and far more wisdom,
Starting point is 00:20:03 far more success that they can impart onto the graduates and their families. So though I felt honored, I felt a great deal of imposter syndrome as well. But on May 19th, I was fired from my job with the Toronto Maple Leafs. And it was at that point, after thinking for a couple of months after Dr. Rigg had called exactly what I wanted to say and what I could be helpful with I'd never been fired before that was my first time hopefully my last but I'll probably get to that same conversation again at some point that's life and the way that it goes as dr rigg just said embrace failure we've had a lot of failure in my time with the leafs and
Starting point is 00:20:49 sue saint marie and um i'm happy to share that with you at all times that's the way it goes you would have scored a few more points with me if you would have just said i got myself fired well i will say the only thing that stood out when I first heard that clip, which I feel bad even playing that clip. I really do. But go ahead. The first thing that stood out to me is like, did he really get fired?
Starting point is 00:21:14 Like how many people getting fired are offered like $20 million contracts? Do you really get fired when they offer you a contract to stay? And then you trip on your own shoelaces on the way to sign it my first thought was you can really get fired just shut up don't talk about it anymore move on how do you get a speech like that and not talk about no you don't have to just be bigger than that be to me it still lacks maturity on his part i Scram, Pete. Scram, got fired. You sound like a whiny little Caillou. He's imparting his wisdom.
Starting point is 00:21:49 Oh, Caillou. Sorry, just parent shutter down my spine. But... JB, give me one reason why he would give another dig in. It's not a dig. And just draw all that emotion up. Why can't you just say, great experience. I'm happy to move on. And just let it go. Everything's great.
Starting point is 00:22:08 He's imparting his wisdom, embracing failure, which, you know, he makes a joke of. And I get it. It just feels too big to ignore. And he had to make a comment about it. I just think, no, no, no. Be bigger than that. Just rise above it and move on it's gonna be crazy watching him and spezza and whoever the gm is who you presume is a leaf guy wait for
Starting point is 00:22:33 that schedule to come out oh my god i know and it's not even going to affect the on ice play you wouldn't think but it's i mean there's going to be some media. Going to be some media, that's for sure. Yeah, this is, they got to move Pitt in the Atlantic. So they'll get him three times next year, I presume. That's fun. But yeah, it's, you know, he is still a hot button issue for a lot of Leafs fans and a tough, it's like an X, a bad relationship people think about for a while. We are in a buyout period right now.
Starting point is 00:23:07 Lots of talk. Another insider, Chris Johnson, saying that Bunting, Kerfoot, and Hall are not expected to return. No real surprise there either. What they probably think should be similar salaries or even a pay raise going into their free agency it'll be interesting because it's not easy to get you know big right-handed d-men who can play justin hall is a free agent i wonder if he gets more than the two million per season he got here kerfoot the guy's
Starting point is 00:23:41 played 17 minutes a night and put up numbers Bonta I mean it's fascinating fascinating to see what these guys are in somewhere else the one question for me as we wait for Doug McClain to join us on off the rails Friday is really I know the focus is on Austin Matthews and as Elliot said you know whether it's an eight-year deal or not, is Ryan O'Reilly. For me, that one's real interesting. If they can bring him back, and that'll shape the fourth line as well. If they don't get Ryan O'Reilly, all of a sudden, David Camp becomes real important again to them. But if you get Ryan O''reilly then camp's gone and you bring in your 850
Starting point is 00:24:28 pontus yeah on your pontoon boat right does that make sense to you it does um we have doug with us if you want to throw to doug or no let's go to doug okay have you been paying attention this last little while in the nhl because we got a lot to talk about. Or you've just been sweeping the porch in Summerside. Drop of death. I heard the drop of the boop. We got booped. Oh, did we get booped?
Starting point is 00:24:55 We booped. And Sam's not here? Oh, man. Wow, Tristan. Welcome to the Sammy Club. He's got about, what, 15, 20 drops drops to go yeah okay i wonder what the year total was we should keep it we'll get back but to your uh to answer you where you were going with that i love david camp like big camp guy want him on my team he is the exact guy that you love at 1.5
Starting point is 00:25:20 1.9 2.1 but the sudden he's second he's worth three million dollars and he can't score can you have a three million dollar center who plays in your third line and gets you no points well again yeah where's ryan o'reilly and is he your third line centerman because third line centers on championship teams what do you think ryan o'reilly could get on the open market five yeah but the term is you know four years times five and a half probably all right let's go back to off the rails friday with doug mclean you've been where are you on the porch uh you're on the golf course pickleball is florida so we'll exclude that in Summerside. Doug?
Starting point is 00:26:08 Doug? Yeah? What's going on? Yeah. Really? Oh, I've been busy today. I've had a lot of yard work to do. Yeah, that's what I figured.
Starting point is 00:26:19 I said you were on the porch. Yeah, but I've been working. I had to dig out some stuff around our garage and just some different things you know so so uh we were speaking earlier we were you know go ahead i just realized vegas golden knights it just hit me watching the vegas golden knights win the stanley cup all the leafs have to do all you have to do to be in the cup final is do the same as they did with Stone, put Tavares on LTI all year, bring him back the last game of the season, and take him right through the playoffs. That's all they have to do.
Starting point is 00:26:56 That's what Tampa did. That's what Vegas did. Just go ahead, go to the $100 million cap number or $95 million and put him on LTI for the season. Let them get rested up, you know? Sure. But in the meantime, the hot-button topic here is Austin Matthews and, as Elliot Freeman reported,
Starting point is 00:27:18 that Tree Living had already gone down to Arizona and talked to him. And, by the way, did you ever envision in all your years of being an executive, and I exclude free agents in this, but you would have to go across North America to visit a player and beg him to sign again? I, you know, I never really thought that the first week is a dream job of being general manager of the Toronto Blakely. You would have to go and recruit like you're with the Pee Wee travel team.
Starting point is 00:27:59 You know, like you had to go over to Don Mills to recruit a kid to come and play over in Oakville. You know, like seriously. Anyway, you know what? That's where we've gotten here. I'll never forget it, guys. And I've told you this before. When the collective bargaining agreement was signed and I phoned Gary Bettman, I said, Gary, you're not serious. You didn't give players unrestricted free agency
Starting point is 00:28:25 in seven years. Please tell me that I didn't get that right. And he said to me right on the phone, he said, yeah, Doug, that's the way it is. I will protect you for seven years, and after that, you're on your own. Well, that's what he just told the Leafs.
Starting point is 00:28:41 They're on their own. And after that, they're on their own for seven years and after that they're on their own you know and Terry put that in the collective bargaining to get it done that's why he did it to get it done Doug what what are the conversations like where you try to convince a player they're not worth as much money as they want like I can imagine tree living saying to Matthews yeah yeah yeah you know we want you we want you we you, but I don't want to pay you that much. Like, how hard is it to sort of massage that carefully? You know, I don't think it's that complicated.
Starting point is 00:29:13 I think you just take the best players in the game, you know. I mean, does Matthews think he's a better player than Connor McDavid? Really, really deep down, does he think he's a better player than Connor McDavid? Really, really deep down, does he think he's a better player than Connor McDavid? Did Connor McDavid, I know it was a couple of years ago. Yeah, they're signed at different times, so wouldn't that be Matthews' rebuttal? Yeah. Yeah, that's fair, but it's still the highest paid player in the game. You know, it's still, who's the highest paid player in the game?
Starting point is 00:29:47 And yeah, we're going to have to massage it here to you know but can he not be the highest paid player in the game and still be okay for the Leafs does he have to go to 14 million or you know does he have to go right a million seven past Connor McDavid no you know I had to, I'll never forget doing Rick Nash's contract. I had to give $100 more than Kovacic got in Atlanta because Rick was the first overall pick the next year and they, you know, they wanted more money than the previous first overall pick. Did you say $100?
Starting point is 00:30:22 Did you pull it out of your pocket and give it to him? I didn't. You know me. I didn't have $100 on me. I promised it to Gord Kirk, you know, that I would give him $100 to get him over at Kovacic. But Gord was good enough to give me credit on it, you know. Max, some...
Starting point is 00:30:44 Anyway, some... So, what is the number that works for you? He's at 11-6. Mac, he's at 11-6. Nathan McKinnon is now the highest paid player, I believe, at 12.6. What is the number that works for you and it doesn't work for the Toronto Maple Leafs? What is the number that works for you and it doesn't work for the toronto maple leafs what is the number that does not work well i don't have them i don't have
Starting point is 00:31:13 them in conor mcdavid or nathan mckinnon's category i don't have them as in those two players category for me especially after what i watched this year. So you would be negotiating a contract lower than those two players if you were talking to him? I would be. A hundred percent. Wow. Because he's not as good a player as either one of them. He's not as good as either one of them.
Starting point is 00:31:38 For me, he's not. Really, this year was not a good year. I mean, yeah, he was great at times, but he was pretty average at lots of times, too. So I don't know what, you know, what's he want. Lots. I don't know. Speaking of that money, if you can get him around that category,
Starting point is 00:32:00 you know, those guys, it would free up some extra dollars to pay your coach, you know, that you wouldn't have to spend, I guess. What are your thoughts on the idea of Sheldon Keefe coming back? Drager reporting that Sheldon is working on picking the new assistant coach, which, you know, makes me think he's going to be around. Yeah, I'm surprised. I mean, not that Sheldon didn't do a reasonable job. You know, he's had good regular seasons.
Starting point is 00:32:29 He's had limited playoff success. We just watched Jerry Glanket fire to New York after back-to-back 100-point season, but he went to a conference final, and he lost in the first round this year. But he went to a conference final, and he lost to a team in the playoffs that finished ahead of him in the standings. I'm a little surprised he's back. I thought that Tree Living would want to make a statement, you know, that I'm bringing my own guy in.
Starting point is 00:32:55 That's what I would have thought. You know, it's time for – I'm the new general manager. It was an ideal opportunity to bring his own coach in. Obviously, he likes Sheldon enough and trust him enough I mean I think Sheldon's a pretty good coach but I didn't I haven't really been that inspired by his playoff coaching for sure so we're talking to Doug McClain I didn't think they deserved to beat Tampa in the first round but that's just you know I thought other than five minutes of two or three of those games,
Starting point is 00:33:25 they didn't deserve to win that series. But anyway, that's fine. I mean, he did win it, so I guess you have to give him credit for that. And, I mean, look, he's done a great job in the regular season. He's former NHL president, GM, and head coach Doug McClain. Mac, if you are now in a position where the Leafs are shopping for assistant coaches, and the report also had that Sheldon is a part of that, also had that Sheldon is a part of that.
Starting point is 00:33:46 If you're Sheldon, do you want an experienced NHL guy, maybe even had head coaching experience in the past, looking over your shoulder? I threw out Kirk Muller for the link between Brad Tree Living and Kurt last season in Calgary. Would a guy like that make Sheldon uncomfortable? You know what? I don't think he can be uncomfortable.
Starting point is 00:34:11 You've got to go with the attitude, I'm going to bring in the best person I can bring in that's going to help me and us win. And I would be going for the most experienced guy I can find. Like a name that i'm hearing that's out there that's up for some associate coaching jobs is travis green with nhl experience a bit of a player's type guy i i'm not saying he's the guy but that type of guy with at least that type of background to me would be not you know you don't want a guy that's looking for your job
Starting point is 00:34:42 obviously but that's you know that's part of it aren't that's looking for your job, obviously, but that's part of it. Aren't they all looking for your job eventually? Right. They are. They are. That's fine. But, I mean, Lindy Ruff, you know, he brought in the coach last year that was supposed to take his job 10 games into the season,
Starting point is 00:34:58 and Lindy had the best game of his, one of the best years of his coaching career, you know, other than in Buffalo when he went to the finals. So I think you can't be you can't look at it that way i think you got to look at i want the best guy that's going to help our team is going to help me in the dressing room uh i mean i listened to these geniuses they had on the bench last year you know you know how great they were with the power play and i'm thinking what am i missing here this guy is a genius power play guy and and what was i missing with the genius part of that then he gets a head job so i just think you got to have a guy that's going to help you with your role with the
Starting point is 00:35:37 players and you you've got to have a guy that can sit down and talk to some of these stars and tell them what it's really like when it really counts at playoff time that's what i think they really need yeah and sheldon should be looking for that type of guy a guy that's going to put their big boy pants on at the right time of year and help them get them there for sure strap their pants on i am curious to see if the guys in Ottawa are looking for work or what's going to happen there with that ownership group, with that GM, with that coaching staff. It feels like we've been waiting for that to kind of settle in a little bit. What are your thoughts on what's going on there in Ottawa?
Starting point is 00:36:19 Debrinket goes to arbitration today. It seems likely that he could get potentially traded um at some point here what are your thoughts on the the senator's situation well it's a tough situation because they've really got the the some really good people in place there from a player perspective to really take a big step they're one team i look at and Buffalo, that are going to contend for a playoff spot this year. They should. And I really, really like their makeup from Sanderson on the back end becoming a star to the kids they have up front, Kachuk and Stutzel.
Starting point is 00:36:59 I see them as some great pieces there to take a major step. And, you know, with the ownership in flux, and it's in flux until he's approved by the NHL, and, you know, I just read the other day there's a lot of paperwork to do to get that done. Yeah, there's a lot of paperwork to be done. There's a lot of negotiating to be done before this is done. You know, this is a time when when guys whether it's a big corporation being taken
Starting point is 00:37:31 over by another another corporation where some of the big negotiations take place and you try to shave dollars off the proposed 900 million price tag, whatever it really was, that's when you're really negotiating hard to say, oh, you guys were 31st in the league in revenue last year? Ouch. You guys were 31st in the league? I thought you were like 28th. So that'll be fun, and that's going to take time.
Starting point is 00:38:03 And then the board, you know, they've got to be approved, and the money to be at all in place it's i think there's a lot of work to be done before he can say who's in charge and who's not in charge so dorian to me i don't know how they do anything with dorian and dj smithville you know well into the season and you speak of experience with this because i'll never forget i don't't know where. I think I was on vacation or something. I don't know where I was, but up popped up you and a Tampa Bay Lightning logo in the background on a press conference. And I'm like, oh, my God, Doug McClain is now part owner
Starting point is 00:38:38 of the Tampa Bay Lightning. And it didn't happen. How in the world do you get the green light to do a major press conference and not end up with the team well it was pretty simple uh i was part of a group that had a contract uh in place to sign contract with the palace of auburn hills who were the owners of the tampa bay lightning we had a purchase agreement done and signed and it was a hard fast contract with the palace to buy tampa bay lightning and i'll never forget as long as i live we walked off the stage and my the main one of the main guys said
Starting point is 00:39:26 to me uh doug we just lost uh the group from toronto that we're going to put 20 million into the deal and i said oh great that's fun and then you know what we we we started uh that was in september october i believe it was and and we worked till December 1st trying to close the deal, trying to raise $20 million, $15, $20 million to close the deal. And it didn't happen. Oren Koulis was a partner of ours. And Oren was trying to work his own deal to try to get the team. And we ended up, we had to go and meet with Gary Bettman and Daly in New York
Starting point is 00:40:04 and the lawyers of our lawyers and Oren's lawyers, and Oren Koulis took us out of the deal and paid us to leave the deal, and he took it over, and the rest is history. He lost it after a couple of years, I think. We were paying $200 million for the team is what our deal was, $200 million for the team is what our deal was. 200 million for the Tampa Bay Lightning and I noticed that Vinnick bought it for 170 a couple of years later.
Starting point is 00:40:30 Did I not read a report that they're worth 1.4 billion? If you would have kept it and they're worth 1.4 You wouldn't be doing this show. Business partner said to me the other night, you know that doug if we would
Starting point is 00:40:46 have got the tampa bay deal done um you'd be worth 200 million right now and i said i said oh okay well anyway he's my jeff jeff sharon he's my partner and you know we do a lot of real estate stuff together. We have for years. Jeff's biggest thing with that Tampa Bay deal was he wanted the five and a half acres that was basically on the Tampa Bay waterfront as part of that deal. That was the driving force behind him trying to get that deal done. And Vinick has taken that land and just turned it into, he's partnered with Gates,
Starting point is 00:41:25 and they've turned it into just an unbelievable machine. So they knew what they were doing, too, because the real estate was really valuable. Wow. Well, we'll see how this thing plays out and how fast it takes Anlauer to kind of close because right now decisions need to be made. The brink gets the biggest one.
Starting point is 00:41:45 Yeah, and that's the big decision. I think they did the right thing by taking him there. Now it bides them some time to make a trade. So I think it was a smart move. They can't lose him for nothing with paying a first, second, and third-round pick for him at the draft last year. So they can turn it into a draft pick and a prospect or something. At least they get something for him.
Starting point is 00:42:07 So, you know, they're not getting him, that's for sure. He'll be gone. All right. We're on summer hours, man. It's not great leverage. Got to let you go. Guys, I really appreciate it. Hey, listen, just sit back on your dock and have a glass of wine
Starting point is 00:42:22 and just think about the $200 million you lost. Listen, we've talked to him from Portugal and Florida this year. He's doing okay. Oh, yeah. I just got sick to my stomach thinking about it again. All right. Change the subject. All right. That's Doug McClain.
Starting point is 00:42:39 Former NHL president, GM and head coach. Always a treat on a Friday. He is. Okay. We're going to take a quick break. and then you're back with your playoff picks u.s open you ready yes okay nick kiprios justin bourne we are real kiprin bourne if you get a chance give us a rating and review or a thumbs up on our youtube channel back after these words dive deep into toronto sports and the nfl the jd words. on Sportsnet 590 The Van. In for Zemi McKee on Playoff Picks. JB.
Starting point is 00:43:35 It's time for Playoff Picks, presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds. Watching the U.S. Open right now, and we're doing golf, because there's no hockey. We talked about next year's cup winner. I actually think this may be our last one of the year. So let's make it count. Appreciate Bet365 being on board for this.
Starting point is 00:43:49 All right. Look at the odds. Here you go, Kip. We got Xander Shoffley is the favorite right now at plus 300. He is tied for the lead with Wyndham Clark and Ricky Fowler. A couple guys a little bit farther back. Dustin Johnson, plus 2,000. Like the DJ is a former champion, a plus 2,000. So, like...
Starting point is 00:44:10 He's minus four. Four shots back. Would have started before the round? I actually have a... I'm watching, looking at the updated, like, currently right now. Oh, good for you. Yes, thank you. You're a smart batter.
Starting point is 00:44:20 You know what I mean? Do we know where the leaderboard is? Yeah, right here. We got Wyndham Clark at minus eight, Fowler minus eight, and Shoffley minus eight. But after that, it falls down to minus five. So, you know, if you think those three, that pack is going to get caught, you can get DeChambeau at plus 2,500. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:44:39 He looks thin to me, right? I actually saw. How much weight did he lose? A lot. I saw an interview he did with the No Laying Up guys who are wonderful, and they were like, you've trimmed up a little. He's like, I was fat. He goes, I was fat.
Starting point is 00:44:52 Oh, was he fat? He said, he goes, you can say that I was fat. He's like, there's your clip. I was fat. All right. You know where everybody's thinking about it. Well, he suddenly his ball speed's 6 million, and he's ripping at it. He did look awfully big, awfully fast. Now, Ricky Fow now ricky fowler ricky fowler plus 600 what do you think he tees off late remember it's in california yeah so
Starting point is 00:45:12 i'm watching it yesterday and my wife's like like when's the golf and i know it's amazing the west coast golf it's gonna get dark soon yeah yeah so it's it's dark here like i'm still watching golf she's like you've rewound it you're watching it over again and i'm like no it's live yeah oh i know it's such a treat turn it on at night like it's a live sporting event well it is but it's it's awesome fowler wonderful story guy who was outside the world top 100 for a while after being you know everyone's darling golfer you know now tied for the lead tnf's afternoon i'm rooting for him he's plus 600 yeah what do you think of the golf course did you get a good look at it on tv yeah greens looks like they're
Starting point is 00:45:55 going to be pretty treacherous by the end of the week yeah like they just tap the ball and it goes forever yeah but they they scored well like that was two records yeah two two scores of 62 which had only been one done once before in in pga history in a u.s open what did nick taylor end up even or plus one i actually didn't see i saw something canadians played well beyond him i don't know i wonder what it feels like for a golfer coming off a high is he that fast is he sober yet? Do you think? He's got some Olsens in his bag. It's not like, that might be an issue for, it's got to be a huge issue for the Canadian Open is that you can't get,
Starting point is 00:46:33 you can't go right into the U.S. Open. Is that a plus or a negative? It's a bad spot for the Canadian Open. And they, frankly, they deserve better. It's been a great tournament for years now. The guys like playing there. Nick Taylor is plus 200,000 right now. What is he, 1,000 over?
Starting point is 00:46:52 Anyway, his number's really long. So, yeah, just my pick then is I'm doing Victor Hovland plus 3,300. Okay. Wrap it up there. That has been Playoff Picks presented by Bet365. Visit the app. Yes. As we've turned this show into a golf hour.
Starting point is 00:47:06 Well, what do you want us to do? There is a couple minutes left here. Aginla? Yeah. Thoughts on Aginla? Because it sounds like it's that special advisor. I get to come and go when I want, advisor. How about the feel-good Calgary Flames?
Starting point is 00:47:21 I saw someone called Craig Conroy the ted lasso of the nhl everyone loves the guy now aginla who is like the exact same sort of thing they're just they went from daryl sutter to just rainbows and sunshine i don't know if that you don't we are that is that is a big swing that is he can't be too comfy you've seen it here in toronto where i think people would say that at times things were too comfortable yeah i think it's a fair point it it's good cop bad cop yeah yeah you need a little bit of that don't you the bad bad cop good cop either way you need you need a bad cop in there but it seems like between doan and Aginla and Keith Jones, there's that next generation now stepping into some really important jobs. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:48:13 But it's hard because, I don't know, what did Aginla make in his career? $80 million? $100? Oh, God. He made so much money. Like, money's not the motivator here here it's to win again but well he was again was waiting for his son i think to yeah so he'd stop coaching him again like career earnings 91 million and that was you know he retired in 04 or something no well sorry never mind uh 14 yeah
Starting point is 00:48:40 the the one thing when you're dealing with guys like that, and I'm not speaking of Jerome, I'm just saying in general is how much are they willing to work? Yeah. Good question. And that's related to the money. It's like, yeah, we'll give you this to be the guy. And it's like, yeah, but I've got lots of money. And my time is what's valuable to me now.
Starting point is 00:48:59 I don't want to go to the minors and talk to kids that 75% of them will never play in the NHL. Yeah. It's a waste of time for me. It is tough. It's like, give me a good NHL job or I'm not going to do it. And that happens. Jesper Bratt at eight years, 63 million in New Jersey.
Starting point is 00:49:18 Good number? Sure. Yeah. What do we care? For eight years, that'll be fine. I just threw that in. June and it's yes for Brad. You're like, sure.
Starting point is 00:49:27 All right. Get me out of here. My weekend has started. JB, happy Father's Day on Sunday. And you too. And all the fathers out there. Do they get us presents anymore? I don't know.
Starting point is 00:49:41 I just want to watch the golf for 10 minutes. All right. Enjoy it, everybody. Have a great, safe weekend. We are back Monday, Real Kipper and Bourne.

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