Real Kyper & Bourne - The Goalie Hour & Devils Hire Keefe

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne are joined by Rangers' analyst Steve Valiquette (2:54) to break down the Panthers' 3-0 win over the Rangers in Game 1 of the ECF last night and how the Panthers' effective gameplan led to a clean score sheet for Bobrovsky. Then, he shares his thoughts on Oettinger's up-and-down play, what the Oilers can do as a team to help Stuart Skinner and the embracing of analytics around the league. Later, former NHL goalie Dwayne Roloson (31:42) - who played for both Edmonton and Dallas - reminisces on his Finals run in 2006 and shares his thoughts on the state of the Oilers' goaltending heading into Game 1. To close, the guys review the Canucks' locker close-out availability.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right here we go quickest hour in hockey history coming up nick caprio's justin bourne minus sime mckee who's on location we're not sure where he is but he'll be back yeah we're told we're giving him a break daniella franceschi disco dan is producing the show today we're thankful for that you know how we know he's producing how's that he got the bible we could do a 10-hour show we got the best lineup ever like we just we're not even gonna say anything for an hour we're just gonna hold it up and you guys can read it and it'll be very entertaining 15 clips yeah we got lots of content we got a ton but in the meantime we're happy to say that we're glad you're aboard wherever you're watching and listening.

Sportsnet 590, The Fan. Sportsnet 650 in Vancouver. Sportsnet 916, Calgary. Sportsnet Plus. And remember, if you can't catch us live, just download us, especially with this fast one-hour edition of the Real Kipper and Born. And, of course, this hour of Real Kipper and Born. And, of course, this hour of Real Kipper and Born brought to you by

Bet365. Here we go. Yeah. How are you? I'm good. I'm good. I feel underdressed compared to you. I love that jacket. Oh, yeah. Coral, salmon-y. But our producer, Ryan Fabbro, called me, like, Sam from

Goodfellas. It was a Robert De Niro character in the casino. Of course, we've got our massive grand opening at Mercedes-Benz Queensway tonight. Nice. And it's going to be like one of those where some of the best cars in the world are going to show up. So I told you the other day they flew in this one car.

I'm not even sure I should say this, day they flew in this one car. I'm not even sure I should say this, but they flew in this one car from Germany. And I told you it was worth about $90 million, and I was wrong. It was, I don't know how they pronounce it, the Eugen Host Coupe 1955 original that sold, I think, a year ago to a private collector for $144 million.

What does that even mean? Like, when you said that yesterday, honest to God, I thought you made a mistake and it wasn't worth correcting you. I was like, okay, wait, cars aren't worth $90 million. So I just kind of... It's the most expensive car in the world. And I also know that you're in the market for a car. Yes, I am.

And I'm just telling you right now, I know people over there. I could put a good word in for you. What do you think a lease would be on the $144 million Mercedes? I don't know. Think I could afford it? Interest rates are... We're interest rates right now.

Yeah, not great. Can you imagine the monthly payment on that? That would be tough. But yes, I am. That sounds awesome. I hope you have a great time. All right, and listen, if you're up to it, not great. Can you imagine the monthly payment on that? That would be tough. But yes, I am. That sounds awesome. I hope you have a great time. All right, and listen, if you're up to it, drop by. All right, I've heard it's going to be a good time.

All right. Live music. So jam-packed. Steve Allocat's going to join us in a few minutes. Yes. Former NHL goalie, TV analyst. And look, apparently he's been ready since like 6 o'clock in the morning. His last hit on our show, he just waited for the next one.

He's just stayed on his own. Valley, are you chomping at the bit? Is that the proper way to say it? Well, I told Barney I'm coming on with a Tommy gun today. And by the way, I thought maybe you were going to introduce me as former conference semifinalist for a time. Back up to a tender Steve Balliquette. Like really, it's a big deal to get to a conference final. semi-finalist Steve like really

like it's a big deal to get to a conference final it really is it feels big until you get knocked out am I right well you wake up in the morning after you win the second round and there's four teams left you know the feeling like that's a big deal

until it ends and everybody forgets yes yes well hopefully that might not be the case Like, that's a big deal. Until it ends and everybody forgets. Yes. Yes. Well, hopefully that might not be the case the next three games for the New York Rangers. But little Debbie Downer last night at Madison Square Garden for what was anticipated as the two best teams in the East for you? I thought Florida played it to perfection. They had the back check so strong that I thought everybody looked like Barkov. They had 18 Barkovs skating around out there

on the Russian gas. When I watched the first period again this morning, you know what I realized, guys? Paul Maurice understood what the Rangers are are and they're challenged as a four checking team they are they're just not as big and if you don't want them to play through the neutral zone and play possession through the neutral zone back check the living crap out of them and if they're not willing to dump the puck then you will own them in the middle ice and that's exactly what happened the Rangers had a difficult time own them in the middle ice. And that's exactly what happened.

The Rangers had a difficult time that way with the style that they played. It was really difficult for the Rangers because they were unwilling to adjust during the game to get in on the four check and play a game that ultimately they were forced into, even though it wasn't the one they wanted to play. So it was funny. I heard Paul Maurice use the comment that there's such a thing as offensive chemistry, but he believes some of the guys in his team have defensive chemistry. They just kind of work as sort of a unit, and that protects the goaltender.

Sergey Bobrovsky's had an interesting tenure in Florida, but the last couple years, we've been reminded why this guy won Vezna's. What are your thoughts on where he's at right now? You know, 9-0-9 with nine wins and 12 starts. All right, so in hockey, you'll hear a lot of clean reads for goalies help them be successful. What is a clean read?

Do you know what the challenge for me going to the KHL was after being in the NHL? I couldn't read off my teammates. I had no idea where these guys were. I'm looking up ice, and I see what I believe is a teammate tracking back to cut the ice in half so that the puck carrier that was approaching me, I understand.

It's almost like me saying this. A lot of goalies will tell you that reading the play is based on my teammates' positioning, not on what they're doing. And if I'm reading that my defenseman's going to come back and cut the ice in half for me that means i can challenge because the puck carrier is a shoot only option not a deke because my guy's coming back in the khl i get scored on one of my first goals where i i step out i'm challenging this breakaway that i believe is a half ice breakaway my teammate completely disappears a half-ice breakaway,

my teammate completely disappears and the forward goes across the ice and scores on me on a deke. I watch the video the next day and I'm like, what happened to that guy? He just stopped skating at the blue line and now I'm forced to try and make up for a save that I can't correct depth-wise because I didn't

read it that way off of him. Bobrovsky is getting such clean reads off of the Florida players that his depth is completely accurate on every single sequence. It's cheating, right? It is cheating when you can read that well and then go to the post to post, which we saw a magnificent save to end the second period but you are you are almost moving before that puck even comes across and there's no net all right so right kipper if i was explaining goaltending to somebody for the first time watching hockey i'd say okay what's

the goalie's job it's to stop the puck but you need a few elements uh to be able to do that consistently. You need angle. You need depth. You need squareness. You need mobility. And you need tracking. And if you're missing one or two of those, that's why goals are scored. If you're providing as a team concept those five things to your goaltender, he's going to be successful. That's why goalies like Bobrovsky can go on these heaters when everything structurally around them is so sound.

How about how Florida has changed since 2022, guys? They were the number one team off the rush in 2022 when they won the President's Trophy, scoring 20 more goals than the next place team in the NHL. What are they now? Guys, they were 32nd off the rush this year. They've completely shut down the rush game. They don't play rush. They don't get rush chances.

They went from number one to number 32 in two years. That's incredible. This is the most incredible thing I've seen. And by the way, do you know what it reminds me of? St. Louis Blues in 2019 when they won. I talked to their coaching staff after the win. They said we'd be on a three-on-two in the postseason and just get it deep. Because we didn't like our efficiency at converting on odd mans and off the rush.

And we're really good in OZP. So let's just play against them in their zone. That's what Florida's doing. They're going to play against the Rangers. They've got the best OZP. So let's just play against them in their zone. That's what Florida's doing. They're going to play against the Rangers. They've got the best OZP in the league. They are Carolina Hurricanes, except 10 times tougher. That's what they are. Yeah.

And analytics are better guys. Like, legit. They're better. And we always talk about Carolina as being an analytics darling. No, you're right. Florida, I think, expected goals for and against. They're one of the top teams in the world. And even just basic goals, they gave up the fewest all season.

So they're the best defensive team in the NHL. The other three teams that are left are better offensively than defensively. Do you still believe in the age-old adage that defense wins championships? Do you guys remember when I came on the show and i said the last five stanley cup winners were the five best at minimizing high danger chances off the rush over the last five years per 60 all the math and all that jazz now there are two teams in the final four that are in the top five and that is edmonton that's edmonton and it is the Florida Panthers. So, and I would want one of those two teams to win so I could be right again.

So my rooting interest sometimes goes there. But in the case, and wild, also wild. Carolina, they were 31st in breakaways against during the regular season. And Florida, 32nd. They give up a lot of breakaways. We've talked about this with the Leafs too. 123 breakaways is what Florida gave up in the regular season. That's 32nd in the league. Last night, the Rangers have two breakaways.

Schneider smokes the post. Cooley, he just sort of dumps it into Bobrovsky. So I'm talking to Razor, Andrew Raycroft, before the round, and we're old teammates in Sudbury. And I go, Razor, what'd you see? And he goes, man, you're going to get breakaways. You're going to get breakaways, but you've got to stretch them out. So I went back and watched, and he said 10 breakaways, and this was just what he had thought.

Right away I texted him, yep, you're right, there was 10. There was 10 breakaways in the boston florida series for three goals seven saves for borowski where they just came in and shot and like dumped it on him they tried to open him up he never moved and then essentially it becomes a shot rather than a real deke the three goals they did score were stretching dekes where they really dragged bob out and bob's really wide on the breakaway stance. He comes out and challenges the shot and takes it away. And ultimately, what we want to accomplish as goalies is make it a one option, take away the shot, and force you to deke.

And that's what he does. But because he's so wide, he really extends and lays out so you can stretch him out if you go beyond his post. We're talking to Steveve valaket former nhl goaltender now doing a great job on uh msg covering the new york rangers also ceo of clear site analytics so valley if if we know bobroski did a great job of your checklist, including tracking. Where was Shusterkin last night on that first goal against Kachuk or even the clincher where he tried to, I think, bank it off the wall? Maybe the worst pool shot I ever saw in my life

that solidified the win for Carter Vestig. Okay, so the first one, the shot. As we've talked about, boys, you give up a low-danger goal, you lose, right? And in the postseason right now, it's 79% of the time. That was a low danger. We looked at this. It was really distracting, actually, because I'm covering the game, but I'm working with the guys on did it hit Fox's stick?

Was he screened and essentially it goes through the triangle between fox's leg and his stick no screen no screen and um where's my numbers on that you guys can imagine what my desk looks like right now it was uh a lot of shots this regular season i think in the postseason it was 110 clear-sighted shots faced. He had not been beaten a single goal. And then it was, here we go. It was during the regular season, Shusterkin had 39 shots from that exact location, no goals. So I wasn't surprised to see

that he had not been beaten there. He had been beaten there twice during the regular season on layered screens. At that distance, it was top of the circle. You guys saw where it came off the release. But back to my earlier point on the five elements to needing a save, he was off on his angle, guys. If you watch from the goalie's perspective, the fletch cam from behind,

you'll see that he was off a foot. And Kachuk Chuck give him credit. He did bring the release into his body the way Matthews does. And he was able to disguise it a little bit, but it was low danger all the way. Henrik and I were talking about it on the post game. Fans were chirping me saying that I'm putting Shusterkin under the bus. I'm not,

it's it's just the way it is guys. A bad goal days in the NHL. Valley, is that a good sign for the Rangers that, you know, we're going to get a better Shusterkin? And, like, I'm not pinning the loss on him because we did see. We're not pinning the loss on him. But he doesn't give that goal up. Then there's a chance that we can get a bounce

and find a way to win a game like that despite being outplayed look it wasn't that bad of an outcome for the rangers they had three high danger chances in the third period to push overall my my secret sauce guys for if i was running a team that i would want is seven or more high dangers in a game at the same time while taking 12 or fewer low danger and that's exactly what the rangers had this was a strong game this was not a bad game in a game at the same time while taking 12 or fewer low danger. And that's exactly what the Rangers had. This was a strong game. This was not a bad game for them.

However, at points, it was really quiet. In the second period, they came out and I had said that it was, yeah, Schneider's breakaway, Vincent Trocek had a two-on-one, and then they didn't get a shot for 16 minutes. So it was one of those where it came a little bit in clusters. So that's why a certain way. You can't miss those opportunities when they do come. Take you to the other series tonight that gets underway at 8.30 p.m. Edmonton starts off in Dallas.

Jake Ottinger is a guy who I think a lot of us thought is going to be one of the better goalies in the NHL for a while been a little bit hit and miss hot and cold this season you know what do you think of the goalie matchup in that series I'm sure you're going to tell us that Dallas has the edge but Ottinger yeah he can't have streaks of cold play yeah there's there's sometimes during a season where you know you lose your alignment and that could be um it could be the way that you're standing in the net like i said shusterkin was off by a foot almost on that goal last night and um right now when i look at the alignment meaning squareness guys is toe caps

knees hips shoulders hands uh almost like you're hugging the puck. That's what squareness really is. And his squareness looks off for me. And it turns his knees. Now, if we're explaining hockey to a youngster that wants to really learn how to read off the goalie, you have to look at the goalie's knees, right? Because we know that the goalie at some point during the shot is going to make it to the ice. But if you can make his knees collapse for a split second

that's when you know you have them and what i see with him is that he's collapsing his right side early and it's showing his next position to the shooter and now he's only allowed two low danger goals in the postseason and both have been on post play Kipper's favorite reverse VH. And those are the only two areas that he's really looked suspect to me is on post play and just staring him down one-on-one. And that's how you have to read off a goalie on breakaways to anything. One-on-one, a partial breakaway, a half ice breakaway, an open look. He can really give away his positioning early. That's, that's the one place I think I see him foggy.

I think that if the Rangers can miraculously beat Florida, because Florida's the favorite for me, they could win a Stanley Cup. I think the Cup this year comes out of the East. So as far as the Edmonton Oilers is concerned, a lot was made out of Knobloch changing

goaltenders later on in the series against Vancouver and yet there isn't the presence of a top goalie still in Edmonton. To your point earlier in terms of what's in front of

a goaltender to track, is it less important about if it's Skinner or Pickard and more about how the Oilers play in front of them that will matter? Kipper, you know what? That's the hard part because this starts at the beginning of the season. We build trust over the season.

And to give you a good example that I remember from my first year goalie coaching after retiring and really focusing on this stuff, Buffalo's playing against Boston. Boston has a two on one Ryan Miller's and net Ryan Miller comes out to challenge on the two on one. It's an easy tap in backdoor. He doesn't feel safe on the pass. 16 seconds later,

another two on one. This time Miller adjust back four feet. He's in his blue paint deep. They shoot over his shoulder and it goes in. Do you see how it influences the way the goalie approaches the next sequence? We want to make saves. We want to be responsible, but we have to read off of what the intentions are of our group. And if it changes all the time, there's no way you're ever going to find a straight line focused in a sense of structure or statistics that would represent a goalie's playing consistently well that's the

hard part about playing for edmonton and to be fair that's the hard part about the edmonton team with their goalie that oftentimes they don't trust on the open shot so they try and challenge that and then they give up the bigger pass across. That's the conundrum of a hockey season. And that starts in the first two weeks. And we know what their first month and a half looked like. They get it back on the rails, but it's still there. It's still there.

And I wonder if you can have that and still win a Stanley Cup. Valley, you know, here in Toronto, we followed the firing of sheldon keith closely he's just been rehired by the new jersey devils uh i don't remember exactly i think the devils had like 81 points this past season but a lot of that was due to goaltending they were 30th in save percentage all strengths two teams in the league worse than them do you see the potential for a rebound? Could the coach help whatever goaltenders are there?

Or do they have to go out and get someone like Markstrom or something to help them out? You know what, Borny, on the big scope of the goalie conversation in the NHL, you know where I'm at right now in 2024? Nobody should ever get goalied. It's organizational malpractice if you don't understand what your own guy is weak at so you can protect them. So you need to see what everybody else knows about them if you're not really into this information.

On top of that, you need to have the guy in your net that we've talked about in the past that can help you against your own weaknesses within your team. I just told you guys that Florida struggles at giving up breakaways because everybody leans in and they just attack. And they do, you can get behind them. Well, if you're going to be 32nd in the league in breakaways, you better have a good breakaway stopping goalie, which they do. He's a good breakaway stopping goalie, but there is also a way to score on him.

That doesn't mean that he stops everything. Why, when I watch the video, and again like you guys understand me now at this point if i'm watching video it's because it led me there with the numbers not the other way around and that's when i find out certain things but come on there's no way that the new jersey devils that i saw last year in the first round should ever miss the playoffs this season. That was organizational malpractice for them not to get that right this year. That, and you know, what's crazy to me, boys,

because we talk money too on the show, right? Why not? It's a hundred grand. It's a hundred grand to get the right information. Would you rather have that and miss all those playoff gates? I don't know, to me. Not good business valley you know so valley did did uh tom dundon the owner of the carolina hurricanes and and his staff learn a valuable lesson about being goalied listen man uh yeah yes yes uh did you see rod man. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Did you see Rod after the postseason presser? I mean,

the guy didn't want to throw Frederick Anderson on the bus, but yeah, Crider's first goal of his three to get them back in it. Hey, listen to be fair. They outplayed the Rangers in five of six games, you know, and he has a weakness of getting his left skate back to the post. Lafreniere scored the same way in game four.

Kreider scores the same way in game six, and it sends up what was one of the most miraculous, most improbable wins I've ever covered in the NHL. So, Valley, what does summer hold for Clearsight Analytics? What are you working on this summer? Well, I'm going to be calling Craig Brubé after I get off this call. Yeah?

All jokes aside, I do want to make comment to something you said earlier. Guess what? Brubé's not a bin guy, Borny. He's not a bin guy. Not a bin guy. Likes the numbers. In fact, he is an over-the-shoulders guy asking a million questions. Not a bin guy. Maybe a bin guy if it belongs in asking a million questions not a bin guy maybe a bin guy

if it belongs in the bin okay not a big that's encouraging i'm telling you uh not it's hard because as you guys know we're not in the room but i i know i've got insight into that so just to follow that up you know we've covered sheldon keep over the years here in toronto never really struck us as a huge analytic guy yet it was very clear in the press conference that he's going to work well in departments i think and i'm just wondering you know that's that's the devils right they're they're led by that sort of stuff. So, I mean, is he going to have to embrace that more? Well, look, I think the biggest challenge that analytics has is finding its way on the ice.

The biggest hurdle it has is it's got many different departments to go through. You've got to get the general manager to sign off on it. You've got to get the analytics guys to be hockey IQ enough to be able to take the right stuff to the coach. OK, because you're going to. And by the way, boys, everybody's doing audits on their stuff now. There are three or four companies out there, including mine, and there are audits being done. And when that audit gets done, the coaches understand that this is stuff we cannot use any longer, so just get it out of my face and you're wasting my time

because what it does oftentimes is put their back up and now they've got to prove that what you're saying isn't actually happening. And I'll show you the video. I spoke to one analyst on another NHL team recently, and he said, look, you've got to understand, I speak in numbers. That's how I speak. Our GM speaks in video, and then the rest of our staff speaks English and they're trying to communicate hockey their

way. We're all trying to get on the same page. The only way stuff ever works is if it finds a way on the ice. I'm telling you, I've been at this 10 years and it has the same challenges now as it did 10 years ago. Valley, I talked with one NHL team once upon a time. I was working on a job

that the job was going to be a go-between, a liaison between the analytics and the coaching staff so you could actually take the stuff from that department and speak hockey about it and tell them what's useful in this mess because it's really the coach is like, what can I do with this? It's too much. What do I need to know?

What is useful here? Hey, Borny, was that the one that you mentioned was a non-paid position? It may have been the same organization. Yeah, right. Hey, but you know what, Borny? This is really good. If you haven't read the book, MVP Machine, I read it three years ago. My son is a pitcher, okay?

He's not a hockey player. He's a pitcher. His coach had a minor league career and a pro career, much like mine, got into this stuff as a baseball guy, played for the LA Dodgers. Okay. He said in the LA Dodge, in the LA Dodgers system, we called them conduits. And it was the guy that went with something like this, right? He went up to manager and said, Hey, this is this, this is this, coach, player, this is why we want to keep you alive a little bit longer.

You got to be good at this. Like, for instance, here's a good one. This is one that I would help the Rangers with. How does Artemi Panarin go 0 for 13 on breakaways this year? Guys, 0 for 13, okay? That's wild. He's a 60% shooter in shootouts. Lifetime.

I can explain it to you okay in a shootout you've got a lot of time he crosses that royal road twice in the shootout he crosses it twice and if he doesn't cross it twice he'll quickly cross it and shoot low but he's a 60 success shooter with no back pressure but in a game he gets in tight too tight to the goalie and tries a deke there are three ways to score on a goalie and tries a deke there are three ways to score in a goalie if you're going to shoot before the hash marks you can shoot high but don't shoot low you have still room to climb and surprise with vertical angle if you get after the bottom hash mark and you want to shoot on the goaltender still

it's probably because you see him holding his gloves high and you can go under the hands there blocker or glove but if they're out challenging and you can you can read off their knees most goalies have one knee that will collapse early you have to attack the one that is still up because that does not have an edge if you go round so you can look off the knees and that's how you deke, but you must cross the middle of the ice. And if you carry the puck on a deke as if it was in line with the post, then you can have the goalie in a position where he doesn't know if you're going to shoot or deke because you're carrying it in a shot position, which would still represent both options.

You can work with somebody and help them score is my point on breakaways. If you have the information that says you don't do it in the regular season, but you do it in shootouts, you're a capable scorer. We know that you had 49 this year, but I'm telling you there's a way to be a conduit with this information for every single chance type. Look at Chris Kreider and his growth around his neck game. You know, he was in front of the net this year, guys,

17 times when his teammates scored most most in the NHL, right? And he's amazing at being able to understand when he's really too tight and the goalie's square on him that he can bump the puck off the pad and then take them to task on the second one. But there are many ways that you can use this information. If you have the right conduit to be able to go from info to player, and it's received well from player to player. If Borny or Kipper is bringing me something,

I'm listening because you guys played. Bally, we're listening to you, my friend. Bring it on the Real Kipper and Borny Show. This is fabulous stuff, and we're going to pass around a hat here, see if we can get you the hundred grand because it's worth it but it's worth it for us on this show it's worth it fabulous stuff i don't know if you can see on your monitor like we did but every once in a while there's a bubble of a thumbs up coming up by you coming from but i love it and i did see that actually i wasn't sure if that was sam you're getting approval from someone double thumbs

up here for the valley here hey always a pleasure having you on our show man we so appreciate watching you guys when i'm on thanks buddy all right when do i get to have the uh the button for the drop yeah some drops i don't know how that works either. Soon enough, my friend. Thanks for doing this. Anytime, fellas. Have a good one. Steve Vallecat. Thanks, Vallecat. MSG. Oh, my gosh.

He's so good. He is. And his son's a pitcher. These guys like to do the hardest job on the surface. Good for them. That's awesome. All right.

A little game time? Let's do it. It's game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app with the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary

at Bet365. Must be 19 plus Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Tonight, By bet 365, visit the app with the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at bet 365. Must be 19 plus Ontario only. Please play responsibly tonight. The Oilers are in Dallas. They are underdogs. Plus 110 on the money line. Minus 130 for Dallas. Kipper, any value? Would you bet Edmonton?

Get $1.10 for your dollar bet? Can they steal the first one one can they go in there and and have the feel that okay we're the underdogs uh we've traveled and we're dealing with a few different things time zone i don't know but there's just a feel like can you can you go in there and and surprise them with a a win? The one thing that's encouraging for them, I think, is how Vancouver just couldn't generate in the same way.

Like, they played really good team defense. That's, you know, for me, I'm not entirely sure. I think I'm leaning Dallas, but the one thing I am leaning, the over-under is set at six goals. I'm leaning under. Yeah. Just, this playoffs, it feels like teams are better coached than ever. No one can score.

You watched that game last night. There's no room for anyone. So layered. Yeah. Vancouver had no room. We saw the Leafs in their series. No room. It's got to go by like eight legs before it gets to a goalie.

Well, he's talking about Chris Kreider is the guy who's in front of the net more than anyone else when they score. Well, he gets a hat trick last series because he's there. Like, what has Connor got to produce to get them past Dallas that he didn't have to against Vancouver? I guess more. I guess more because it's going to be hard to crack that Dallas team. So I am leaning more, you know, more low goal totals in Dallas tonight.

So that is game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 plus Ontario only. Play responsibly. Okay, we're going to take a quick break. When we come back, we're going to track down Dwayne Rolison.

He played for both teams? Oh, he had a very good run in 2006. We'll talk about that and more, including some sound out of Vancouver as they wrap up with the media today. So plenty more on real Kipper and born. Don't go away. Breaking down the top stories in hockey and Elliot Friedman every day. The Jeff Merrick show subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Back with the real Kipper and Bourne Show. Nick Kipper, Justin Bourne, Disco Dan, Jake the Snake, and Dwayne Rolison. Yeah. Is he in the house? All house alright let's welcome him in Dwayne how are you pal

I'm doing great thanks how are you yeah we're good thanks for joining us man oh man time just absolutely flies the good news is you know I can see on your zoom and you still look like you can play and I look like I could just absolutely flies. The good news is, you know, I can see on your Zoom and you still look like you can play,

and I look like I could carry maybe pucks to the bench, maybe to the extent of it. But just talk to us a little bit about what you see out of the Oilers today, and if there's any comparisons at all to the run that you had in 2006. I know there wasn't the flash of a Connor McDavid, any comparisons at all to the run that you had in 2006? I know there wasn't the flash of a Connor McDavid and to a lesser extent, maybe Leon Dreisaitl, but what do you see?

Yeah, we didn't have, I don't want to say it because I don't want to hurt anybody's feelings that I've played with, but we didn't have those superstars. We didn't that I've played with. We didn't have those superstars. We didn't have Jai Settle. We didn't have McDavid. But we had four lines of remarkable players. It didn't matter who was getting tipped by Mac T to jump over the boards.

All five guys were ready to go and could be a game breaker. Where, you know, the Oilers now, I'm not saying taking anything away from the current team, but, you know, they rely a lot on Dry Subtle and McDavid to do a lot. And obviously Bouchard now, he's carrying a lot of load on the back end. So, you know, we had prongs to do that but i think up front we were deeper overall than what the current oilers are we just had steve valiquette on he talked a little bit about how for goaltenders reading off your d and knowing what your team is

doing makes the play so much easier that post, I think you had a 927 save percentage. Is it just get to a level where you're in a zone where you just really come to trust and know what the guys around you are going to do? Yeah, it is. It takes a little bit of work to get it all figured out, especially when I got traded there. You know, Mac T is a big believer in blocking shots.

The first few games, I was getting screened by Jason Smith and Pronger, Steve Stales, Matt Greens of the world. And finally, we had to come up with a rule. I came to the guys, I'm like, okay, here's what we're going to do. If anything goes under you, it's in the net, it's on you. I'm not dropping if you're going down.

If the puck goes east-west, you guys are going to take the short side away. I got the far side. If it's strong side, you can take the far side. So they're always in the middle. The defense are always in the middle to be able to deflect passes, but also give me an opportunity to read what the options are for the shooter. If they're taking it on a rush, if they're taking the far side of the net away, which is taking the passing lane away, I got all short side,

and that's easy for me to handle. We're talking to Dwayne Rolison, member of the Oilers' 2006 Stanley Cup final run. Dwayne, when you talk about, again, what you experienced that year in terms of managing your emotions and gaining confidence as you got to a Stanley Cup final, how would that relate to what Skinner is going through for the Edmonton Oilers? And I know he's a lot younger, less experienced than where you were at that point. But, you know, what could he be experiencing now,

knowing that he is the number one goalie based on the 59, 60 games that he played this year, but knowing that he's one start away from missing his next one? Yeah, you know, it's a tough situation and you know stewart i know fairly well and i reached out to him and give him a nice little congratulations and you know for him what he's feeling obviously is a lot of pressure and playing in edmonton it's a lot of pressure it's not toronto mind you but there's still a lot of pressure and and being the only canadian team in there's going to be a lot more pressure i have friends here that are already asking for tickets so how do i get tickets how can i fly out to edmonton to watch games you know so it's you know there is going to be a lot of pressure on him. But, you know, realistically, like I told him,

I told him before the coaching change and after the coaching change, you have one job to do, and that's give him a chance to win day in and day out. Focus on those things and forget about anything else. You know, once you leave the rink, get home, deal with family, have fun with your family, and leave hockey behind. And he's done a great job with it. You know, he's reached out a couple times throughout the year. And, you know, so he's in a good spot mentally.

Physically, he's in a good spot to advance and take this team forward. And, you know, he's obviously young, but at the same time, he's got people to lean on, you know, with myself, Grant Fuhrer, the people at Billy Ramford, all the guys that played there before. It's a pretty tight-knit alumni association, so current players can reach out to older players and ask questions. And, you know, so, you know, give him credit.

He did reach out a couple times this year, and, you know, and I've reached out just to, you know to wish him luck and let him keep going. That's really cool. It's great that you do that and that he would be willing to hear, get some opinion from some outside places. Wanted to get your thoughts on Calvin Pickard. I think he showed that if they do need to go away from Skinner,

that the Oilers aren't necessarily done. What did you make of his performance in the playoffs so far? I thought he was great. I thought he handled the situation extremely well. He came in and gave his guys a chance to win. For not playing, he didn't look too rusty. He's a veteran guy. He's been around a little bit.

It was great to see him have belief in his own game to come in and play and play as well as he did, especially in the pressure situation that he was in. It was a do-or-die win for him, actually. He went on and just played calm and efficient and let pucks come to him. He didn't chase the game at all. I was excited for him, and I was happy for him and also for the organization. Dwayne, outside of the Edmonton Oilers' goaltending situation,

if you were to take a look at goaltending in general from a 60,000-foot view here, the development, that reverse HRV. reverse vh vh like where is it going here uh for you in terms of uh how we're producing goaltenders these days well that i still i still teach and i teach a lot of young kids and that's one thing I will not teach. I do not teach it. I teach people how to get out of it. Realistically, the RVH or RHV or whatever you want to call it, I just call it the reverse.

It's designed for one play and one play specifically and that's below the goal line, pass out to the strong side, like a guy that's line pass out to the strong side like a guy that's below the top below the circle on the strong side so literally you just come off the post in your square dome we got guys using it when the guys are on the rush from the top of the circles it's like i tell my kids i'm like you want to score goals come down get to the dot and shoot at the center bar you're going to score every time uh i i hate it and it's funny the you guys guys that i teach every once in a while uh with freddie anderson who i had in anaheim you know text them i'm like nope there's another another bad goal by rb or RHV, you know what I mean? And the kids, they've been so...

Brainwashed. So much, yeah, brainwashed, and it's robotic, and it's crazy. And I hate it, and for what it's designed for, it works perfect. But realistically, it's 0.25 times a game when it's done part properly. That's when it's how many times it should be used in an average NHL hockey game. Yeah. You know,

so it's, it's overused and I hate it to, and it, you just validate a big way. Roley. I love, I love, I love you even more now.

Sorry. Sorry. I hate to validate Kipper. This one is right. Fair enough. He's great, but this one he is right. Fair enough. So, you know, I hate the thing, and it's something that I do not teach. Well, listen, we really appreciate your time and your insight.

Enjoy the conference final here. It'll be a good one, one way or another. We know that for sure with the players involved and we'd love to have you on again real soon. Roley, thanks for doing this. Yeah, no problem. As long as I'm alive, because both my players, my kids, one's a Dallas fan and the other one's an

Oiler fan, so there's no fights and I don't have to break it up. I'm okay. From that, I'll be able to come on anytime you guys do. You bet. Good luck to you. Thanks so much. That's Dwayne Rolson, NHL veteran.

Very memorable in that 2006 run, and then he got hurt. Crazy. But yeah, the guys just shoot it off the side of the goalie's head because they're already down now. It's entertaining. Yeah.

We have a ton of clips. Okay, where do you want to go? Where do you want to go first? I most want to make sure we get the Canucks ones in. Okay. Because they had their postseason press conferences today, and there was some interesting stuff. We got Patterson, we got Miller, we got Hughes.

All right, let's go to Petey first. Let's have him talk about his Canucks staff. Nope, sorry, this one's on. Being ready to get away. It will be nice to get a break from everything. It's been a very noisy season in terms of contracts and how f***ed I've been the last three months, like I said. So it'll be nice to just get a break from that,

but I'm just excited to get a little break here and then get back on the horse again train hard and uh come in best shape possible for next season all right when when i hear that you know and i've said this a lot about you know mitch miner as well anytime it you go into the you guys or the media or even even the part where he says he wants a break yeah man this is canada yeah like if you want it a break don't say go play in columbus or go play with carolina drink. Carolina. Yeah. But not here. You know what that reminded me of? Not in Vancouver, not in Toronto, not in Montreal, not in Edmonton, not in Winnipeg, not in Ottawa.

That reminded me of Patrick Laine and the way that Laine will just like abuse himself and then goes into these like funks where he's just despondent on the ice. Like, good, he does need to get away. But yeah, you're right. It's not doing him any favors. And, listen, he's young.

It's the whole experience of this was just not getting out of the second round. Like, it's going to be as you get older and more expectations and the contract obviously kicking in. Like, what you're feeling ain't going away. It also, when you say you guys have said I've been, you know, crap for the last three months, it also implies that you haven't been. It implies that they're making it up, that they're saying it when you have been.

So I didn't like that. It'd be nice to just get a break from that. Go have a break. That's great. JT Miller, JT Miller, you talked a little bit about not loving one of his blow-ups. Apparently some Canucks fans didn't like that. Yeah, this was over Saturday night when Dakota Joshua didn't get a puck in deep. And he's an emotional guy.

And listen, I've said this, like, on record for the whole year. I've really loved him in so many different ways. And a lot has to do with Rick Tockett and all of that. But I think he kind of sums up his situation best with this clip. Let's have a listen. Yeah, I really do believe it's a fine line. Like, you know, when you're winning, my emotion is accepted, and when you're losing, it is certainly not.

So I just think that's why I downplay it is, you know, I am who I am, and I just think that what comes to mind is the staff here has helped me embrace who I am instead of run from it, you know. It was good that I'm kind of wearing my heart on my sleeve and a little louder but help me you know channel it and it's not like hey don't be like this guy you know what I mean so I I don't know I don't look into it that much I'm just trying to do my job and uh if I do my job it gives our chance a better our team a better chance of winning and if everybody does that to a, I just think it makes everybody look better.

And for the record, he did his job the majority of the time. Yeah. But I'm still not a fan of even that clip. And I'm guilty of it when I go home, trust me, with my wife. I am who I am, right? But as she reminds me, there's no growth in that i love i love that that is verbatim like i know she has said those exact words yeah 100 yes there's just like you know it means that you're not moving that you're not it's good to be pushed to be a better version of yourself sometimes. And that's where sometimes, you know, I think he can still find a way to, I don't know,

sometimes you got to bite your lip or sometimes your instincts say, okay, I want to blow up or I want to give you a piece of my mind. And it's like, will this really help? And there's a reason why it doesn't look good when you lose is because there's a thought process that it's not good in general. Right. Like maybe they're linked together. Like it's great when you win,

but you're not acting the same way when you win as when you lose. No, that makes a lot of sense to me. Yeah, so Miller's Miller. We also have a good clip from Zdorov. Another one, Daniele on his contract. So let's get to the Zdorov clip. Nikita, I think your stock rose significantly in the playoffs. Just, I mean, you did everything for this team,

which maybe prices you out of being re-signed here. You talked about how much you loved it. How badly would you like to come back to vancouver why you think i pressed myself myself out of here is that his agent asking the question your contract may have gone how much you think i should be making yeah like you guys i don't know where you get those numbers from the trees yeah i don't know it's yeah you you gotta stop listening to Edmonton reporters who's reporting the contract negotiating. It's only between my agent and Patrick.

And obviously I'll love here. Hopefully we can work something out. I love him. I know. I love him. How much do you think I'm worth? That is a very funny lead for a reporter to ask there you know got a if you're all he's got a great disposition i think that's just kind of can certainly balance a room but you know what

kip when it when the team is losing and this is related to the miller one i think it comes off wrong because i think he can seem aloof or above it like in calgary i don't think they love you know what you're you're right you're you're yes a hundred percent for sure and he is who he is the general feeling is that vancouver they were winners this year and they achieved more than we ever thought and yet he he gets to look really good right now in a comfortable position which he earned yeah but you're right there were times in cal Calgary they thought it was him worrying about his contract in those earlier spots. I remember he came to Toronto and started kind of pushing his brand. It's not out of the question that he comes to Toronto again

and, you know, pushes his brand. Because I think they could use a guy like him. Not saying, just saying. What do you think he's worth? What did we... Six? Five and a quarter. Five and a quarter?

Yeah. Probably closer to five than six. That's a lot of money. He's big. He's young-ish. Yeah. Shoots it in the net. Yeah.

Mean. He's worth money. Should be a legitimate top four guy now. I now i would say calgary found himself on the the third pair a lot of times yep all right kip enjoy uh the mercedes thing tonight yeah great great job today no no sammy mckee we believe we'll get sammy back tomorrow and uh we'll hunt doug mclean for off the rails. Perfect. What do you got tonight? I think Dallas wins game one.

You do, right? I do. Low scoring affair. 3-2. Oh, another tough one to gather points. Okay, our thanks to Dwayne Rolison, terrific guest. And, of course, Steve Aliquette crunching the numbers. Useful or useless?

Very useful. We're back tomorrow. Have a great night, everybody. We'll be right back.