Real Kyper & Bourne - The Hot Seat + First Quarter Awards

Episode Date: December 6, 2023

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne are joined in studio by Jamal Mayers who is covering Penguins/Lightning tonight. He shares his thoughts on the status of Tampa's championship window, the Sens bringing back Jacques Martin as a coaching advisor and Kane set to make his Red Wings debut. Then, a discussion about hip surgeries and why the outlook for Patrick Kane is more positive than that of players like Ed Jovanovski. Finally, Sam McKee rejoins the guys as they make their award picks at the quarter-mark of the season.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

all right well welcome everybody into the real kipper and born show we are live and in color on sports net sports at 650 in vancouver and sports at 960 in calgary this hour of real kipper and born brought to you by bet 365 as promised before the commercial break said we're gonna bring in a huge star. Jamal Mayers joins us. He's getting ready tonight. It's Wednesday night hockey on Rogers, Pittsburgh, and Tampa. We also have the Edmonton Oilers getting right back in it with their quest to get back into the race.

Jammer, how are you, pal? Thanks for joining us. Doing well. Thanks for having me. All right. In terms of where you want to start uh you want to help us tee up your game a little bit tonight seven o'clock start yeah obviously it's uh pittsburgh and tampa two teams that are kind of similar this year we're underachieving perhaps um tampa having a little bit of excuse with vasilevsky being out but now that he's got back you know can they kind of find a way to get their get their groove back i feel like they've

taken an exhale and uh that'll last a little while and they've had to find a way um to play tampa bay hockey but i'm not quite sure they're built the same to be able to do that anymore. So having done one of their games and talking to Koop, I think I could kind of sense that feeling from him as well. Are they really that team that they were to contend for a cup? We were talking about the Leafs. Sheldon almost feels desperate. He's yelling at the team today on the ice. Their record's decent.

Tampa kind of feels like the same thing where Cooper, you see him getting mad at the team on the bench a lot more. Earlier this year on our show, he said he doesn't have to yell at them very often because they know. But it's almost like you feel it slipping through your fingers a little bit because they've spent a lot of assets to be good. So there is some worry, you think, with Cooper that maybe this team is not quite where they've been in the past.

It's cyclical, right? You typically go from being a bad team. Once you develop your younger players and become a good team, you generally have younger players contributing significantly on entry-level deals. And eventually, they need to get paid. And so when they get paid, you can't keep your team together. So there's a finite amount of time for the window of winning,

and you're hopeful that you develop and can replenish quickly enough and find players. But it's not easy. They tried to do it, and they've kind of made some misses in regard to their bottom six. And filling those holes, it makes you realize how important some of those guys have been. John Cooper, one of the most tenured coaches in the National Hockey hockey league it's quite remarkable the run that he's had uh in today's era where sometimes

it's hard to hold these kids attention yeah squirrel squirrel i think you need that in the room do you do you believe that there is a shelf life for a lot of coaches here i mean you played almost a thousand games was there a coach that you just knew was on borrowed time? I think typically my experience is coaches that are so demanding and mentally draining have a limited shelf life. The coaches that are able to, like, pull on your – that can lean on the room and that can pull on your individual competitiveness and trust the leadership group to kind of manage some of the standards

that a team creates will be able to do it for longer periods of time. And I think Coop's in that same breath. He's created a standard. He's let the players now manage that standard and maintain it. He has to go in and remind them what their standard is but i think the key for for coaches to have that sustainability is make it become the player's standard not yours if it's your standard and they never meet it you're never going to be able to keep it you know it's crazy as i wrote a little bit about this and

how teams can't keep their best players listen to to the names they've lost over the years here. Ryan McDonough, Yanni Gord, Andre Palat, Alex Killorn, Carter Verhage, Matthew Joseph, Blake Coleman, Barkley Goodrow, David Savard, Luke Shen, Tyler Johnson. Those are all guys that were on their cup teams. Like, you know, to continue to have success, eventually you do feel like that drop off is coming, which brings me to the Penguins, who they're playing tonight. Crosby having a good year. Malkin pretty good. Like a lot of their players are doing really well they're seventh in the division

still you know what's going on why is that team scuffling despite the fact that their best players have been pretty good another example where they're perhaps too reliant on their top on their top six and their top five or seven players. And you need to have everybody. I mean, it just doesn't work. You need younger guys contributing. I don't know what's happening in NHL, but for me, there's a lot of guys that just take up space. The bottom six, it's like, what are they?

They don't check. They don't produce offensively. They just skate around a million miles an hour and don't do anything. What do you think Sam does for our show? You need to fill bodies at some point. I'm not, like, you know, we had a role. It was an energy guy, kill penalties. Like, you dial into that role and you take pride in that role.

I feel like a lot of these guys have, they feel like they should be on the first line. They feel like they should be on the second line. They're like, they never quite, and all those, like six of those guys that you mentioned, really good players, but relished their role as a third, fourth line guy on a winning team. Right. I don't know if that makes sense.

Yeah. Let me just keep the conversation going on head coaches, because we heard today a press conference, major press conference in Ottawa today, announcing Jacques Martin back with the Ottawa Senators as a senior advisor to coach DJ Smith for the Sens. What did you make of it? Well, I always take it from the players' perspective, and I think two things it does,

in my opinion, negatively. It gives the players an out so the players can say, obviously, I knew that system didn't work when we started doing it. And you kind of make the players listen less to the head coach. So what are you trying to accomplish? I feel like if you're going to do something like that, I'd rather the players didn't know.

I'm not saying he doesn't need it and teams don't support their staffs and have brilliant people behind the scenes. I'm with you 100%. My first thought was if you're going to have a major press conference, it better be to announce a new coach. To say that you're adding someone as a consultant or an advisor, to me. I get the fact that he's a big name. He is the winningest coach in franchise history.

Most games, I get all of that. But you're drawing more attention to your point to the players to say, oh, this is a big deal and he's a pretty big guy and he's a pretty powerful guy and he's going to come in and now kind of coach behind dj smith is that is that maybe uh somehow players can think that way well they haven't they've had trouble scoring goals we all know that but really it's about defending if you're bringing in him, right? So at the end of the day, there's only three ways to defend. Man on man, more of a zone, or a man and a half, they call it. So typically it's like if the puck's in my area, I'm on it.

But if I get beat, there's layers. So there's really only three ways to defend. How much is he really going to change? To me, defending is your willingness to do it. How committed are you to defending? It's not like he's going to come in and reinvent playing team defense, turning pucks over, allowing odd man rushes, not protecting the house, protecting your position, understanding time, score, situation.

Like, it's on the players at the end of the day. Yeah. Yeah, it's a really unique spot because the players are, you're right, it almost does, like, confuse the role a little bit. Who am I listening to here? So that seems to be the thing right now with a team, a league where every one or 20 teams are all pretty good. You see the Oilers make a coaching change,

and yeah, they're kind of doing a little bit better, but the Wilds make one, and they're doing a lot better. What happens to teams when you put a new guy back there? It's not like these guys that get hired have won 10 cups in the past. They just seem like new guys more than anything. So why is there a, and maybe you don't like the phrase, but dead cat bounce, as they call it when a new guy comes in? I feel like there's two things that could happen.

One is some guys who've been squeezing their sticks a little bit tight, too tight, kind of relaxed. That's mostly the higher-end skill players. For energy guys like myself, it's like, okay, is this guy for real? Is he really saying that if you play well, you're going to play more? So there's actually – I can chew up a few more minutes if he likes me. Yeah. So it's like, okay, a new person kind of can appeal to both sides, right?

So everybody feels like I've got to prove it to this new guy. This is my chance to earn more ice time. This is my time to relax and just play and have fun. So all those things happen at the same time, but you won't really know if it works. Elastic. It sounds funny. Like five games isn't really know if it's a if it works last it sounds funny like five games isn't really a benchmark it's like we'll see how they are halfway through the season like 25 games

in with him so um but good give credit to billy g who who was one of the best teammates i've ever played with who understood top line all the way through the lineup, how important every person was. And he has a great understanding and the pulse of his group. And he probably wanted to make that change four games prior, but wanted to make sure he can get the person he wanted and made the move. It's probably not easy to do it. I'm sure you create a relationship as a manager with your coaches

and you brought them in, you liked them. You want them to succeed. They had a high – this team was thinking about cup before the season started. So – but it's not easy to fire someone, so give them credit for that. Four unanswered goals by San Jose. I know this is a team that is near and dear to your heart, JB, but we'll let Jammer go first on the New York Islanders here.

And I get there's a legend running that team right now in Lou Lamorello, but at some point, are people going to be expecting changes there? You're right. Absolute legend, genius of the game, the mentality, the understanding, the building of, like, everybody understanding that you're pulling in the same way. Nobody ever did it like Lou. And there's so many managers and coaches that have been mentored by him.

So his legacy will live on in that regard. I don't know. I think that you have to let the players play. They look tight. They don't look like they're committed to playing the way that they want to play. It doesn't look like it's fun. And that can't be. I think the players have changed.

And in some respects, it sounds silly to say, like, listen. Change? Like they don't take their work home with them. They're less emotional on losses. Where do you point first on the change? They want more say. They want to be involved in decisions in how you're playing. Give me an example. For 20 minutes or 10 minutes, a voice text has all been recorded.

She's going to be like, thank you very much. No, I think that our expectations as adults and coaches have changed. I don't think they've changed in that respect, kids. I think they still want structure, but now they want to participate in that. At the end of my career, I remember having a PK meeting, and one of the young guys says, well, why would we do that? And I was like, because he said so. What do you mean?

Look at this guy. Are you crazy? It's like our kids. Yeah, right. But they want to participate in why. And I think that as difficult as I saw that transitioning happen near the end of my career, I started to see it. Now I'm a parent and they want to participate in that.

So not saying they haven't evolved and done that part, but I think you got to be careful with this generation of where you're choosing to control them. Because I think it starts to chip away from their joy of what they're trying to do. So that to me is the challenge. Like, how do you marry those two things about the structure and all those things that he wants in there? Some of it have to, you have to back off a little bit to, I don't know, I feel like they were just not having fun. But that's, you know, it's really a fundamental question because imagine telling your strictest coach in the NHL that you weren't finding any joy in your role. Be like, the joy just isn't there for me, coach.

Like, I mean, it is different that anyone should care about that, which it is a job for a lot of these guys. So it is quite the evolution. I've seen it. You know, I worked with Sheldon Keith in the minors and there was a power play meeting where it was just, what do you guys see? What do you guys want to do?

You know, let's, you know, and not saying that you would let them, but really hearing them out. And that is sort of a different mentality of a coach than certainly I'm sure when you were playing. I think the Minnesota Wild is a perfect example of maybe getting more power back into a head coach. Minnesota lost seven in a row, took out Dean Everson, and now have won four in a row.

I think there's a lot of struggling teams out there that maybe a few owners might be going, hmm, if it worked for them, maybe it might work for me. Absolutely. What do you see out of Minnesota for four games that we didn't see prior? Just resilience.

It's not just the change. It's like my understanding is that Hines is a very demanding coach. And to me it goes back again to Billy G's awareness of what his group needed in that moment. Like he saw things he didn't like. I don't watch them every day enough to know, but he knows enough to know, this isn't the group that I expected,

this isn't the compete, and some of those things are fixable, right? So that's what a coach can do. A new coach can come in and say, this is the standard. If you don't meet the standard, you're not going to play. And then he's trying to build that standard for them to make it their own. Right?

So they're having success. So the early success also makes them buy in even more. Oh, this guy's ideas work. Yeah. So another guy who is going to be playing for a new head coach, hasn't played for him before, patrick kane former teammate of yours uh hip surgery coming back tomorrow he makes his debut as a detroit red wing what are your expectations do you think he's going to be able to come back and contribute in a meaningful way after you know a fairly invasive procedure yeah

after you know i've talked to him a few times, and honestly, I think that initially I was a little bit surprised that he went to Detroit. But now, knowing him and knowing his mentality, he thinks, in his mind, he's going to play six more years, five or six more years. Really? So for him, this isn't like I'm going to come back and I want to win a cup,

which I think a lot of us thought that he was going to do. He's thinking, where can I play in the top six, play with really good players, and show I still have it? Not only for the NHL and everybody else around, but for himself. He's playing on, for three years, playing on one leg. He's the fastest to ever come back from this this surgery i read an article that where he was skating after two months and he was stayed in i think he had it in new york he stayed in new york and was skating um getting the motion down and like kind of redefined i think

ed jovanovsky was one of the last hockey players to get this done. But the long-winded answer is he's going to be closer to the Patrick Kane of 30 years old than the last two years that we saw. He's going to be really good. Yeah, we had Jovo on last week. Dr. Jovo. Yeah, Dr. Jovo. If anyone wants to go back and find that podcast,

it's worth listening in terms of his knowledge on having hip surgery and what he went through and the chances for success for Pat Kane. But Detroit at 14-7-3 is starting to look like a good choice for Pat Kane. I don't, the only thing I see that derails something in the future for Pat Kane in Detroit is if he can't play anymore. I don't think he picked Detroit to either get traded again in March or leave next summer. I really believe that he picked Detroit because he sees something in the next three or four or five

years, whatever he envisions playing. I think he wants to stay in Detroit. That's a good point. Would you agree with that? I think that's a good point. I would say he wants to play the year out with Detroit. Yeah. So I think you're right.

I think that probably is part of the conversation he had with Stevie Wise. Regardless of how I do this, even if I play well, can you promise me that I'll stay here the whole year? I don't see him as a guy that just wants to bounce from team to team now. He doesn't want to do that. He doesn't want to. You know, sometimes you're like years later and you look at Rick talking, you're like, he played for the Boston Bruins.

I don't remember that. Well, I remember thinking that, you know, when Perry and Foligno signed their Blackhawk deals, that part of that would be eventually they would go to a cup contender and that might be part of the appeal of being in Chicago. So yeah, I guess it's different motivations for people. If Kane,

he's got three Stanley Cups, maybe less desperate to go chase one instead of finding a place he can play three years after this summer be a top UFA. No one loves the there's only lucky to play with a lot of really good players can only think of one other guy that loves the game as much as

patty cane does and that's joe thornton yeah like just love everything about it coming to the rink talking about hockey watching hockey just everything about it staying on the ice i'm like dude i can't start getting bag skated till you get off get off the ice go home enough i'd have to tell him come on and so he just loves the game the fact that he's close to 100 healthy health wise i mean anything can happen i think the difference between him and jovo too is pat is Patty Kane's 182 pounds. Jovo's way more physical, lumbering around. Like, he was a little older when he had the surgery. Kaner, I tried, when I played against Kaner, I told him I'm trying to run him over every time I could.

Couldn't hit him. Yeah, no one ever hits him. It's hard to hit him. He doesn't get hit. So it's about how he feels and how he moves. It's Jam how he feels and how he moves. Jamal Mayer is getting ready for Wednesday night hockey here on Sportsnet, Pittsburgh and Tampa starting 7 p.m. Eastern. Also on the network regionally is Carolina and Edmonton.

Did you buy into that whole American Thanksgiving that they're cooked turkey? Turkey? I didn't. My kids didn't want turkey. I love Thanksgiving, but I had to fly back early on Thursday of Thanksgiving. I like to do the cooking, so I'm like, I'm not cooking turkey. It takes too much work if you don't really want it, so I made a tenderloin. Where did you have Edmonton at American Thanksgiving?

Missing the playoffs or a team that, no, no, not so fast? I had them missing. But now maybe what was more clear, like I think that all gets thrown out the window because the West is a mess. And, I mean, some teams who make the playoffs this year are going to be 80, what, 87. Right. And so I think that's kind of not, it's an abnormal year for that.

But having covered a couple of their games, three of their games, I was really concerned. They weren't defending. It's an abnormal year for that. But having covered a couple of their games, three of their games, I was really concerned. They weren't defending. They weren't, like, I think we realized how important Dreisaitl and McDavid were. They've never struggled that mightily together at the same time. They have their holes, but I think they'll figure it out. Goaltending kind of exposed a lot of what was wrong with them.

Hopefully they've figured that part out with Skinner. But, you know, it's hard to doubt. I think they make the playoffs. I don't think – I thought they were a cup contender. I'm not sure of that. Okay, well, listen, we know you've got a meeting coming up, a big night ahead on the network. We really appreciate you coming by and stopping by.

Oh, this was fun. Thanks a lot for having me. Okay. Jamal Mayers, we're going to take a quick break here. And when we welcome back in, we'll bring Sammy in. And we're going to go over some quarter pool trophies. Calder, Hart, Norris, Vesna, Jack. I think we're going to, I think me and you,

we probably would, I'm and you would probably would. I'm thinking, thanks pal. I'm thinking maybe we're, we're going to hit maybe three out of the five. I think so. Yeah. I kind of went off the board a little bit.

Did you? Okay. I can't wait to hear it. Okay. Sammy McKee back after the break, you're watching and listening to real Kipper and born fresh views on everything in the National Football League. It's the Fan Checkdown with Matt Marchese and Donovan Bennett.

Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Nick Kipper, it's Justin Bourne. Let's welcome back in Sammy McKee. Hey, when we have a guest, like, where do you go? I just sit outside the door. Oh, you do? Yeah.

All right. I would go to the calf. Buddy, who is here, he stole my seat. His handler. What was the guy's name? Garrett. Garrett. The handler.

Well, he stole my seat, so I had to go out. Jamal's handler. He doesn't need one. You got game time for us? Oh, yeah, sure. Do you want to do it now? I'm just, sorry, I was just busy scrolling Twitter for updates. Yeah.

It's game time presented by Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. Bet365 must be 19 plus. On tarot only, please play responsibly. So I'll just do a quick one. Quick check-in. Okay. Same as yesterday.

Plus 150. Minus 175 for the Dodgers. Plus 150 for the Blue Jays. And the LA Angels have gone into third with plus 700. So... Yes. Would this be an opportunity for a mighty happiness hedge? To place $500.

I don't know. Silly number. But like a lot of money on the Dodgers. If you lose your money, you're happy. But then he goes to the Angels and you're like, oh, that was dumb. Okay. Excuse my gambling ignorance here. But like with so many people involved from the Blue Jays to the Dodgers to... Could somebody know for sure and just go to a buddy who knows a buddy who knows a buddy and say,

put down a lot of money and make money? Yeah, that would be called Josh Norris. No, no, no. Shane Pitt doesn't even know who I said. Josh Norris. The Norris family. Sorry, no. Shane Pitt doesn't even look for it. Josh Norris. But I'll say, the Norris family. Sorry, guys. Line one, the Norris family for Sammy McKee.

I got my marginal Ottawa Senators mixed up. Oh, boy. Okay, now, looking ahead. The World Juniors are coming around the corner, and I was looking at the odds. They have them on bet 365. And you know I love the World Juniors, and I want to talk about how Minton and Easton Cowan

both headed to the World Junior Selection Camp. Not to talk about how Minton and Easton Cowan both headed to the World Junior Selection Camp. Not on the team, but both headed to the camp, which is great. Canada is plus 300 to win the tournament. Plus 300? I mean, they're probably going to win or come close to winning, so you'll be in that bet. So I don't mind that. A little plus 300

bet on Canada to win the World Juniors. That's looking way ahead. Tonight, a couple games. The one you were talking about with Jammer, with the Lightning and Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh plus 110 in Tampa. I think it's a bit of a mid-off. Neither of these teams are very good, I wouldn't think.

And I like Pittsburgh a little bit more. So give me the Penguins at plus 110 in Tampa, fellas. Yeah, okay. I like that. By the way, you mentioned the World Juniors. Also a good time to watch Kip and me on TV all the time. The Leafs play on like the 27th, 29th, 30th, 2nd. We're all over it.

We'll be on camera. And Carolina is plus 100 in Edmonton tonight. There's going to be some goals in that game. I would imagine the total is pretty high. I wouldn't mind having Carolina with the over in that one. I don't know what's wrong with Carolina. They're 14-9. It looks good, but there's something not right there.

They're 32nd in save percentage. They're getting no saves. The one that blows me away a little bit, too, is Orlov at 7.5 million. Is he still winning the green jacket? There's some nights he's playing, what, 14, 15 minutes. Like, I'm shocked that this guy's not playing like a stud that he was. Crazy, right? We he was in Boston.

We saw him in Boston. They were calling him Bobby Orlov. I knew. Which is a great nickname. He was unbelievable there. It is baffling watching his performance there. All right. And last one, because there's some good games on tonight.

Very. Florida Panthers at home against the Dallas Stars. A Florida Panthers win with Sergei Bobrovsky. 30 plus saves. Plays plus 425. So I like that as a little same gamer. So there you go. That was game time. Presented by

Bet365. Visit the app for the latest odds and find out why it's never ordinary. Bet365 must be 19 plus. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. And for the record, with absolutely zero leaks coming out of Otani negotiations, there's no chance that a friend tells a friend tells a friend. No. Tells a friend.

But if any of our friends know anything. Call us. Yeah, we could use a call. I wouldn't let us know. I would love someone to tell me. I'd love to get that scoop. That'd be a good one. Because I think it's a fairly significant story here in Canada

that Jacques Martin is back with the Ottawa Senators, I want to get your thoughts too on it, Sammy. But just in terms of, I think, the heat perhaps that Michael Landlauer, the new owner of Ottawa, and Steve Stahels were feeling on an Ottawa fan base calling for DJ Smith, his job. Was this kind of built up to kind of appease some people and to help alleviate some of that talk and just calm the waters down well i liked your point and i

hadn't thought of it because i think if you're ann lauer you're going okay people aren't happy with the maybe the the coaching staff or whatever so we'll bring in someone who's established he's an ottawa guy he's an all-timer here what's the harm in having him on the staff but you read his role so he's the eye in the sky but he's gonna come down every intermission and go in the coach's office and talk about what he's seen this is not i uh i'll come in once a week every intermission he's coming down day to day yeah at age 71 and i'm not telling anybody that you know he should be put away to pasture or anything like that. But, you know, at age 71.

Running the president. It might not be everybody's first choice. It's not like you're, it's not like, hey, Jacques Martin's out there and where is he going to go? It's not like we've had that conversation the last little while. Yeah. No, it's going to be unique. And so I was, when i was at the marlies

jacques martin was a special advisor with the leafs and he would come around a little bit him and jacques caron would come come by and dj smith was an assistant coach there so they have a relationship that goes back to toronto those two so i don't know if there's some tie where dj's like i wonder if dj was approached and said would you have interested in this or said, hey, here's a guy we're putting in your hip pocket, what do you think? Like, I wonder if DJ would have had the authority to turn this down if he didn't want it. I don't think that was brought to him.

I'd be shocked to hear. I would like to decline that. Then you won't be here. I'm okay with it. I think he knows the temperature of the water out there and it just doesn't it doesn't line up i think this is one of those where they got to string some wins in a row and they got to get out that uh that perception that their bottom feeders in the uh eastern conference no matter what the record shows.

And I don't know. Is he there? If DJ does not dig this team out and get them truly in a position to make the playoffs. The hand of the reins? Does it go to Jacques Martin for the rest of the season? That's the logical choice here, is it not now? Boy. I don't know. So Martin was with the Penguins when they won the cup

as an assistant coach in 2016 and 17, I believe. I don't know where. Is that right? I don't know. I'm looking up right now. Yeah. So he was with the Leafs after that. So, yeah, it would be surprising to name him the head coach of an NHL team.

But there does seem to be this relationship with Ann Lauer, which he values, right? He's got Steyos as a guy. They obviously see him as someone they want around. So, yeah, maybe you're right, Kip. He was an assistant in 2021 with the Rangers as well. It was his last on the bench stop. Yeah. Yeah.

Been with some good teams. I just can't imagine that DJ Smith is really excited about this. Yeah, you're probably right. It's hard to be like, oh, I think he'd hate it. I mean, how could you not? You're like, you're bringing in a guy

that's literally watching me from above and coming down and addressing me. Not only a guy. An Ottawa Senator legend. Yeah. What did you say? He's got their all-time wins leader, their all-time coach. Playoff, playoff, everything.

All the records. So to me, it can't be a good sign. Interesting. Okay. That's interesting. For sure. You guys want to do a little quarter poll action here? Do you know people are going to get mad at you for saying quarter poll, Kip?

What is it? Quarter poll is actually the final quarter of the horse race. The first quarter is not. so at 82 games you're a regular eddie over here 61 games would be the quarter pole okay so scrap quarter mark and down the stretch is no good too right you got anything else for me just being pedantic to really set the tone for the show okay sorry about that i had to say it at the 22 and a half game mark how's that perfect you nailed it well that's quarter ish ish ish we just move on i regret saying it well kipper this was wasn't this your idea yes yeah okay well then let's do it who's's the MVP of the league so far? Who has been the best? Not who we think is going to win it.

Not a prediction. Not a whatever. The season ended right now. The Hart Trophy goes to... Kucherov. Nikita Kucherov. Yes. Samwise Gamgee.

Quinn Hughes. I hate that we have the same one. I also pick Quinn Hughes. Kuch. Tell me their cooch justification. I just think... He's leading the league in points. Yeah, and I don't know where this team would be without him.

The power play would be without him. Don't even know if they're going to be consistent enough to hold a spot or not in the playoffs, but he is their team yeah i can't argue with that it's it's definitely a worthwhile vote the quinn hughes one kale mccarr right there neck and neck for me i think you know kale mccarr is a breath more points per game but quinn hughes has just controlled hockey every minute of the season so if if we are doing this like in the vacuum that the season ends today,

I think a lot of what goes into these awards is the narratives and the stories and where teams are expected to be versus where they end up and who that team's best player is. And I think the Canucks have been maybe the biggest surprise in the league to this point. Sure. Scuffling a little bit now. But he's been their best player,

plays in all situations, has the puck the most at anybody in the league. It's a narrative-based one for me and a pandering one for our friends in Vancouver. It's pulled back a little bit, though. But also, how about this?

Are we sure Quinn Hughes is the best in his family this year? I would say he would be the MVP if he didn't get hurt, Jack Hughes. Jack Hughes is leading the NHL in points per game at 1.83. So, you know, there's a worthwhile vote there. Kel McCarr in the conversation. And also, I want to make a note as a voter for these. I am dying to give Nathan McKinnon a Hart Trophy.

He should have won it the year Taylor Hall got it. No question. He should have won it, I don't know, a year or two ago. I forget what year it was. He's had my vote both times. He just is a force to be reckoned with. A ton of points this year. He's having a great season, so keep an eye on McKinnon.

Just to look at the odds of our three picks, Quinn Hughes is 22-1, and Nikita Kudrow is 5-1 so Kipper's closer to being correct than we are according to the books so there you go way to go Kip you win the closest to the books award so if you go hard for Hughes you gotta go

Norris Norris and Quinn you okay on this one? flip a coin but does it have to be it just makes no literal sense if you say this guy's a better defenseman yeah I guess

that's why defenseman never wins the Norris I mean defenseman never wins the MVP is because they just get the Norris right yeah let me rephrase this and go off the board is that a horse racing term can I use off the board. Is that a horse racing term? Can I use off the board?

You're allowed to use that. You have my permission. Yeah. If you had one game seven, who would you want? Hughes or Makar? Makar. Oh. That was fast.

Yeah, I've thought about this. This is not. I'm going to say Makar. Yeah. I'm going to say Makar. Just a bigger body, right? Like he's. He's got that physical element.

He's won the cup. It was unbelievable for them when they won. No, but he's just... He's physically more dominant than Quinn. No question. That's it. And that's an element that cannot be overstated enough. Nope.

Worthwhile. Vezina Trophy. This has to be the hardest one. Vezina Trophy, this has to be the hardest one. Vezina Trophy. Do you have a... For me, I'd go Demko. And I know, again, it's not that pretty in the last week. It's a perfectly valid vote.

Minutes played, save percentage. Yeah. No, it's Demko all day long for me i think demko is he's second in like goal saved above expected he's right there he's he's absolutely it i i have aiden hill just because he's margin i don't think vegas has been that good i think they've got a lot of really good goaltending and his numbers are like incrementally better than demko in a couple of categories and i just said to myself if aiden hill were in canada would i picked him over demko and say yeah i would so i'm gonna give it the hill this is the one i struggle with the most because i looked at i just looked at what the top 10 the top 10 goalies in say percentage was the first place i

went to look and like you said aiden Hill's number one in save percentage of the 9-3-5. And then it's Jeremy Swayman, 9-3-2. Connor Ingram. He's been awesome. Cam Talbot. Charlie Lindgren. Semi-Invar Lomov.

And he's only played eight games. I understand that. Same with Lindgren. 13 games, Logan Thompson, 9-19. Olmark, 9-18. Tristan Jari, 9-18. And the last is Jonathan Quick at 918. So it's not Broderwa and Hasek is your

point. It's a bunch of guys. I really don't know what to kind of pick out of that. I guess if I was going to go with one from that list, the Boston guys are really good. I guess it's hard to pick, but Allmark won it last year, but maybe this is the year that Swayman wins it. He's got 13 starts. I don't

know. So maybe that's my pick. I'll go with Jeremy Swayman. How do you year that swayman wins it he's got 13 starts you know i i don't know so maybe that's my pick i'll go with jeremy swayman how do you like that i like it i also uh need to ask you what your shirt means what you're what your shirt means 1001 hockey what's that that's just the guys that play with on thursday morning i wasn't intended to wear it but it's hot no no no no but i had to take off my sweater gotcha oh yeah 1001 shout out the boys yeah yes but uh yeah so i'm going j Swayman. All right. What are we on to next? What are we like?

Jack Adams? Got a coach of the year for me, boys? Yeah, I do. Kipper? You go first. La Violette. That's good. Yeah.

Good pick. I think they've been a good team, and I know they're scuffling a little bit here. It's a tough time for us voters at this point in the season. I think La Violette, just the way they've looked in the games that i've watched versus how they've looked in years past he just looked like they're playing a little bit different more lockdown brand of hockey so give me laviolette thought about mcclellan too i got john tortorella philadelphia flyers are seventh in the east and i think a lot of people had them as a bottom two or

three team this year they they got what's the word that he said? They got heart. I think he said they have. They got a lot of heart there in Philly, and I think that starts with the coach's mentality. I'm going off the board on this one. Winnipeg Jets, Scott Arneal and Rick Bolas. That is way off the board.

No Rick talking, by the way. Wow. Yeah. Tell me. I had Winnipeg just dead and buried this year. We did. So much. We've been mean to them over the years.

So much adversity with the contracts and the players wanting out and nobody wants to sign there. And all I'm watching is the other night these guys go tic-tac-toe nick eelers and yeah the rest of them just they they look like they're a fun team to watch and they look like they enjoy being with each other and you know how can you not credit that coaching staff and i know rick bonus has been gone for quite a while now he's returned, but you know, scarred our Neil has been this guy that nobody really talks about, but they're doing something really well there.

All right. And I just think, I think the record shows it at what? 14, eight and two. Yep. Good stuff. All right.

And the last one is, I'm just looking at the, the, the books I am trying to find that pick. He's just scrolling down. So John Tortorella is 25 to 1. And I don't think they have it posted here because it's been a two-guy situation. No bonus.

Yeah. Wow. That's how you know you're going to get paid to do that one. It's there. It's there. 20 to 1. 20 to 1. 20 to 1. All right.

And anyone not have Conor Bedard for Calder? No. I'd like to sit here and get greasy with it, but there's just no way. Yeah. Luke Hughes has been pretty great. Yeah. He really has. Brock Faber in Minnesota has been very good.

I'm going to do an article tomorrow for the Toronto Star and just talk about, just in general, bench management, line changes, length of shifts. You know, he's one of the top guys in the league for length of shifts. Who's that? Conor Bedard. Oh, yeah.

You came in after his debut. Fourth game of the year, so it's that early? His shifts are two. Just killed. Right, two. And you're right. It's just out of control. I remember you and I did sort the,

he was third longest average shift length. Yes. Over a minute average shift length. Average over a minute. Which means most, lots, half the time. A rookie! Okay.

So I don't have as much of a problem with that as you two do. It's ridiculous. For sure. Not that he's a rookie to me. Just that that's way too much. No, blah, blah. And a rookie. Okay.

So he's supposed to come off the ice for, you know, I don't know. Flurb Turgis in there, fourth liner. Mackenzie Entwistle? Like, I don't know. If I'm sitting on that bench, I'm Conor Bedard, trying to win a hockey game, and I look over at the bench with my nobody squad, I might stay out there an extra 10 seconds. It's not his job to figure

out, worry about who else is out there. Sammy, you go in a room and you portray that I'm playing with a nobody squad and we'll see how long you last in that room. I don't have to do that. That's why I'm sitting here. I know I talk a lot, but I can't hand the ball to these guys. 10-0-1 t-shirt.

That's what you do. I just, I don't know. I don't think it's that big a deal like you guys do. Yeah. I don't care that he's a rookie. Isn't that on the coach to tell him? Be like, hey, man. Shorten him up.

But he's trying to win. He's their best player. Trying to sell tickets, I guess, and T-shirts. I don't want to undercut your article tomorrow, but, you know, the couple of guys at the top of the list had a coach that people didn't think was doing a very good job for a while. Three out of four, Minnesota Wild. That's right.

And he ain't there anymore. Nope. So tighten it up, coach. What was number one? Was it? Kirill the Thrill in Minnesota. 105 average shift. 105 average.

Should be like 37 or like 43. 41, 43 if you're busting your ass. I was going to say between 41 and 47 was going to be what I would say is like a good one. 30 is too short, man. You're not doing anything. If you want to kind of connect the dots with Minnesota again, so Kirill the Thrill, number one, with the longest average shifts. Yeah.

Second was Zuccarello. Little Zuck, yeah. Sliding in third, Conor Bedard. And then we're back to Minnesota with Goldie. Yeah, Boldie. Boldie. Yeah. Goldie Boldie.

Yeah. You know, at some point, you got to get the Oscars hook off the stage. We need you to catch your breath or you're not going hard enough out there. Yeah. All right, where else do you guys want to go? Concerned, we didn't really talk about this

out of the Board of Governors, but Gary Bettman concerned about an ice rink not being built in time. We mentioned it yesterday, but this is just vintage. You think? But this is not a new complaint. This has been on the radar. But he's just, he's gearing it up. For what?

To not send him. 100%. Well, no kidding there, Sherlock Holmes. There's no rink. Oh, there'll be a rink. He'll be fine. Oh, really? He's laying the groundwork to pull the shoe.

So this is... No, I don't buy that for a second. He doesn't want to shut down the league. He never wants to shut down the league. If they haven't started on building a rink... No, I... It's an issue. Yeah, they don't get done.

There's the Olympics. they're dependable over there they'll get her figured out like no money at the problem like luigi and super mario are gonna build this thing up in what uh two months it would take long they'll be fine they'll get it done outdoor rink who needs a roof yeah i just i just know that he's not really upset about this news let's just say that he doesn't want to He doesn't want to stop the league, Kev. What do you think the Coyotes need to build the rink now? It's going to be at least five years. I don't know.

An exorcism. A few Hail Marys. They need help. Borny, want to talk about your Islanders? No. Islanders have... I have it here. What's that?

The stat I had for you there? Yeah, I can pull it up. Are we just to conclude, JB, that Lou Lamorello's never getting fired there either? I don't know what's going on there. I know sometimes people are frustrated. You think they would? I think they would.

The Islanders have trailed for 10 minutes per game this season, which is the second fewest in the entire NHL. 10-0-2 to be exact. So they're barely chasing the game. So easy to play when you're tied or out front. They've led for almost 25 minutes per game,

seventh most in the NHL. And they just blow leads, man. They blow leads all the time. 10 third period leads they've blown. They're up 4-1 against the Sharks in Blewett. Do we have their captain, Lee, on his comments on blowing the lead? We do have that. I'd love to play it.

Okay. Yeah, I don't got any words for you on that. It's just bad. It's really bad. We're going to use that on loop. It's bad. It's bad. It's really bad. It's bad. It's really bad. We're going to use that on loop. It's bad. It's bad. It's really bad.

It's bad. It's really bad. Okay, that is... Can we have... Okay, Derek, can we have Brad May and then Lee back-to-back? Oh, it's not good. No, he's... Well, it's not good.

It's bad. It's really bad. Yeah, that sounds like their season. It's not good, too. It's bad. It's really bad. Yeah, that sounds like their season. It's not good, too. It's bad. It's crazy, though. You mentioned the Islanders. I wanted to flag this because it's coming up.

The Leafs have two opponents before they go to Islanders. They have the Sens tour night, and then they have the Preds on Saturday. John Tavares is four points away from 1,000 for his career. So potentially what happens in the next two games, he could be heading into Long Island with a chance to get to 1,000 points in an arena where he is absolutely beloved. And he will be

fetid. They will the applause, the ovations. He may get it before then, though. Nothing tastes more delicious than schadenfreude. No, he won't get it. No, he's streaky, though. I'm telling you right now. And he's due.

He's getting his 1,000th on Monday. What's he got? A couple of goals in, what, 14? Two goals in his last 14, I think, yeah. We go through this every year with him. Yeah. Literally every year. And it's just like I don't even think about it really.

He'll have nine points in three games. It'll happen quick. But I'm curious, you know. No way. No way. Eventually. Vince Carter got some applause in Toronto. nine points it'll happen quick so but i i'm curious you know no way no way eventually vince carter got some applause in toronto and it was despicable well maybe this will be despicable too but maybe some people aren't as cold-hearted as you and they let people back this is wrong sports fans should be pissed how it played out to in their minds was unacceptable and that's in their minds and they can think whatever they want to think they're a passionate fan base i stand with the people of

long island and how they feel about john devaris i really do i get it he's not buying your participation no man it's a sport it's sports you're supposed to have hate you're supposed to i'm not a coach i just think that if someone gives you nine years of service and i get it you know your best player and good in of service and is, you know, your best player and good in the community. I get it, buddy. You know, exercises are right within it. Listen.

I get it. I was in the Gillies household talking to Clark about it at the time. What'd he say? He didn't like it. Yeah. He was on Long Islander's side. And so for me, I got to listen to that and understand that they're frustrated. I get it.

Eventually, it's going to. Tavares didn't rip the city apart. He didn't tell him he was going to stop dunking. No, he did not do that. He played hard, at least. Yeah. So I think eventually Long Island may welcome him, but it is a tough nut to crack if they're not happy with you there.

I can tell you that. Okay. Last year, I know this was mentioned also, but the NHL going to Vegas to the Sphere. Yes, to the giant emoji. Yeah. Okay. This is the last time that they're going to do a traditional draft

to save money. So they go and spend all of it at the Sphere. What am I missing here? Spending money to save money. Kipper, hear anything about how much it cost them? Yeah, a ton. Okay. Seven figures?

Yes, obviously. Oh, yeah. Multiple seven figures? Yes. To me, it makes it a spectacle. It makes it something you watch. It makes it something good for the league rather than, so... Rather than Iserman's kitchen. They're in danger that it could be too good.

Yes, and then they would have to do neat things for the fans. They'd have to go back. I'm sure everyone's going to be so, you know, happy to be like, well, we'll never do that again. Yeah. When it's like all the writers get to go to Vegas and everybody's in Vegas. Here's Zoom video of Jarmo Kekulainen's cabin. Ever catch that second day when

they're halfway through the second day and general managers and their tables want to get up and leave and catch flights and get the heck out? Maybe just do one day then. I don't know. No. Two days. That's got to be double day. You're there anyway. Maybe everybody will stay the extra day.

Wow, what a show. Yes. Jam-packed today. Our thanks to Brad Tree Living, Gord Stelic, Jamal Mayers, as he gets ready for Wednesday Night Hockey on the network. 25 hours and 5 minutes till the Leafs play. Have a great night, everybody. We're back tomorrow.