Real Kyper & Bourne - Treliving Breaks the Silence

Episode Date: June 27, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne, and Sam McKee kick off the show by going live to Brad Treliving's press conference addressing his off-season thoughts, Sheldon Keefe staying with the Toronto Maple Leaf and the plan for the goalie room. Afterward, the guys give their takeaways on the possibility of Matt Murray resigning, Brad Treliving's draft restrictions and his lack of verbal commitment to Auston Matthews and William Nylander. Finally, the guys wrap up with their take on Pierre-Luc Dubois likely heading to the LA Kings, Alex Newhook getting traded to the Montreal Canadiens and rumours that the Leafs have prioritized signing UFAs David Kampf and Alex Kerfoot.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Bourne on Sportsnet 590 The Van. All right, welcome to Real Kipper and Bourne. Kipper is not in the room with me. I'm joined by Sammy McKee. Hey. Sam, how are you? I'm good. Good.

Good. But we do have Kip, despite him not being here. Kip is like, you know, he knows people. He's into things. I think he's a Joe Carter Skinski. Kip, are you with us? I am, pal. How are you?

I'm good. I'm good. How was the golf today? Oh, we got true living. Too late. Awesome. Awesome. We're going to throw to...

Yeah, we'll go to Tree. We'll check in with you after. We'll go to Tree right now. Really enjoyed it. You know, it was difficult and probably uncomfortable at times, but really excited and look forward to working with him. I think probably the next question will be relative to contract status. We'll deal with that at the appropriate time.

But Sheldon will continue on and they're excited for him to do so. When you're in the middle of talking to players about their futures and the organization and such, how much value is there having some stability and familiarity at that coaching position? How often do players want to know about that? I think Sheldon's got a really good relationship with his players. I think, as they say, they all think he's a good coach. I think there's a real strong bond. What I took away from it, there's lots of belief both ways. There's belief in the players with the coach, and there's belief from the coach and the players. And like I said, it was unique in the sense that Sheldon and I had, in this business, when you've been in it as long as I said, it was unique in the sense that Sheldon and I had, in this business,

when you've been in it as long as I have, usually you've come across people somewhere. We really haven't. So we needed to have that. We needed to build that connection. But certainly there was a great deal of respect from both the player side and from coach to player. What stood out to you about him in that time? You thought he was a good coach from afar, but what stood out in the process? Him as a person and from coach to player. What stood out to you about him in that time? You thought he was a good coach from afar, but what stood out in the process for him as a person and a coach? I think there's a real focus.

I think he's come into this market at a young age and as a young coach and hasn't been able to deal. That's not an easy job. I think he's got a bright mind. I think he's got, he's open to, you know, change. I think he's strong in his beliefs, but he also doesn't think he's got all the answers. And one of the things we talked about is,

I firmly believe we're all sometimes better in our second jobs. You see it with coaches. Maybe your second, I think there's a little bit of that, you know. You know, I've talked to you guys about my relationship with Kyle, and he's worked with Kyle a long time. But sometimes I think I can, you know, sometimes a little bit of new, a little bit of fresh can help, a little bit of change. So, yeah, I think there's a lot of things that I came away from there. And, like, we probably met for 17 hours over four or five days. Probably about the third day, he's like, maybe I don't want to stick around with this guy.

And so once I didn't chase him out of there, I thought, well, maybe I'll stick around. But I came out of there going, this is a real bright guy. Where do things stand with your open assistant job? We're in the process of evaluating everything else. I mean, like I said, Chris, it's not always perfect. When the manager comes in three weeks before the draft and there's a whole bunch of things to do, dealt with Sheldon, evaluating the staff now, how it all fits. We've got an open

position evaluating everything else so it's, it's, we're working on it. It's a long way to say we're working on it. Brad, Brad, have you extended Sheldon through this decision or has the contract remained? No, you just, your late arrival here, we just addressed it. We're, we'll deal with that. It's on the to-do list to look at. When you say 17 hours, is it you two just sitting across in chairs staring at each other? Or do you involve in what you do? It was just meeting.

It's a lot of it. Like, to me, there's three buckets to it. It's, you know, you've got to develop a relationship. So there's just, there's a getting to know you part. And then there's, you know, then you dig into a little bit philosophical and the team and the players and where he sees it going. And then obviously there's, you know, there's a strategical part. You start going through some video and how do you like such, you know,

where do you see, how do you play? You know, there might be a little change in how we play, but how does he see the game? And, you know, a little bit more of the bricks and mortars and defensive zone cover. All those types of things that you have to go through. So there's a step and stage that you have to grind through it. When are the restrictions lifted by Calgary? I appreciate Calgary.

Brendan's been dealing with that. I have not been dealing with anything draft-related. I will be, as we stand here today, I will be at the table once Calgary has made their selection. So I think Calgary selects 16. I'll be at the table shortly thereafter. How was the visit with Austin in Arizona? What did you come away with? I think Calgary selects 16. I'll be at the table shortly thereafter. How was the visit with Austin in Arizona? What did you come away with?

Less humid than Nashville. No, it was good. I had a good chance to visit with him, and that relationship and that dialogue continued, but certainly got down there and spent a few days with him. We all know the files that are open, so we continue to work away at it. But it was really good to spend some time with him. Were any assurances made to the Corps? I mean, so you can't, John has a total moment,

but were there any assurances made before July 1st about the Corps group remaining together? Oh, I don't think there's ever any assurances in this business. I said it before, we've got really good players. We've got two who've got a year left in their contract that we'd like to resign. We're engaged in that. You just keep working away at it. How confident are you that you're going to get Boston and Willie?

I'm always confident until proven otherwise. I'm positive by nature. Yeah, the dialogue's been good, and you keep working away at it. I know, listen, there's lots of interest in it. I get it. I tend to

not tend to, I will never have public discourse on contracts. But we're working away at it, and hopefully we get to a good conclusion. How about your first round pick? 28, we pick at a 28. You know what? As good teams do, and this team's been a good team for the last little bit, you move draft capital when

you're trying to win. So we've moved some draft capital over the last few years. It would have to make a lot of sense to move the pick. Now, you know, I don't think we're flush with bullets to move up. So you're probably, when you're handicapping it, picking or potentially moving down. If there's something that makes sense to move the pick, we would. But at some points, you've got to put some groceries back in the cupboards. And so I think there's a fairly good bet we're picking at 28. From the organization. I've read the fact that this week and next week are really fertile time period for trades and the cap gets used up for a lot of teams so you don't have forever to decide to act or not.

How do you balance that with wanting to extend a guy like Neylander but also knowing that there's probably a bit of urgency to it? Yeah, it's like anything else. And I would say this, and it's hard to remove, you know, the individual. I'll say this and everybody will tie it back to what I said, but it's not really that. You work the process, right? So, you know, in any scenario, you can't make a – if there's nothing out there to make your team better, then it doesn't make sense to make a trade, just to stand up and say, hurrah, I made a trade.

So our focus, you know, with that, when you talk about Willie, our focus is strictly to get him signed. You're always talking to people. I mean, that's the job. The job of the manager is to make sure you know, A, what's going on in the league, and B, is there avenues to make your team better, regardless of who it is. So priority, sign the player. Always have an ear open of is there opportunities to make your team better.

And sometimes the timing doesn't match up, but that's the process you can do. You can't do something, you can't manufacture it if it's not there either. How different of a GM are you after going through what you went through with Johnny, a similar situation, contract-wise? Well, I think we all learn from experiences, right? And Johnny's, I know, you know, there's things that you would never, you're not going to comment on. There's some stuff, you know, that happens in those situations

that lends themselves to, you know, to the end result. But at the end of the day, you learn from everything. You always, you know, every experience you have, any walk of life, any job, you think you're wiser. You know, you maybe avoid some potholes that you stepped in prior. So you're better for the experience. Are there any other restrictions you've faced with the draft? Like, have you been in draft meetings?

I haven't been in any draft meetings, no. Really, it's just been not involved in the draft until really today or up until today until we've gotten clarification on the table. What's the plan for Matt Murray? Excuse me? What's the plan for Matt Murray? Well, I mean, Matt Murray's a good goalie. I think we'd all agree he's probably the biggest challenge has been availability, right, in terms of injuries.

I look at it right now, we've got three good goaltenders, really good goaltenders. And, you know, you've got Joe, the young guy, who's, you know, he finished off well. I've learned sometimes just let those young guys sometimes to finish off well doesn't necessarily mean the start's going to be well, right? So let's just let them, you know, we got three good goalies. It's a position we've got good depth in.

Like anything else, we'd be open to looking at different things. But if at the end of the day we go to camp and we've got three good goalies, good for us is how I look at it. What surprised you most about this job? Surprised me most about the job? You know what? It's just been a lot. It's been a busy day.

It hasn't been – it's been pretty much Groundhog Day. It's up early. It's go to the office. It's been drinking out Groundhog Day. It's up early, it's go to the office, and like it's been drinking out of a fire hose right now. I think not so much just because of the market or the, it's the timing, right? The timing and the files we got to deal with. It's been cool.

I've got a, living in a place, I got a, you know, a fat bastard burrito down there that's pretty cool to eat. I thought that was pretty cool, so I have a, you know, a fat bastard burrito down there that's pretty cool to eat. And I thought that was pretty cool. So I have a couple of those and get up and get after it the next day. So it's been pretty cool. You might not pay for another one all year now. Yeah, there you go. From the organization's perspective, how important is it to get clarity on Matthews and Nylander like on July 3rd?

You know what, Chris? It's, I mean, it's always good the sooner the better, right? I mean, the idea is when you know where things are at, you can plan better, right? When you know if it's going to be raining tomorrow, you maybe, you know, pack a jacket. So having clarity always helps. Is it the be all, end all? No. You've got two sides that are going to play a piece in this puzzle. We certainly would like that.

We're certainly trying to work towards that if it happens or not. I'm also not, you know, July 1 the world doesn't stop. I feel very confident like I said to the earlier question, I'm confident we're going to get both players signed until proven otherwise, and hopefully it's still live. If it's not, then we'll keep working our way at it. What are you going to prioritize in the UFA market? Well, I mean, we've got a lot of UFAs.

To me, it's a little bit of let's see what happens the next couple days. I mean, we've got a lot of, I mean, it's a unique situation. We've got, we've got, we've talked about Austin and Willie and, and, and, you know, although they're not free agents this year, it goes into next year planning and all those sorts of things. So we've got, we've got some players who are UFAs this year. Let's see if where that goes to, what, what we can or can't get done, what players, you know, where, where we can fit it all in, and then

we'll probably have a better idea come July 1. Generally speaking, what do you make of the UFA class? I mean, it used to be there's a lot of big names this year. It seems like the big dates in the league are kind of not as big anymore. Trade deadline July 1st? Yeah, I mean, it's a function of everything. Again, we've been at a minimal growth cap. Everything's squeezed. Everything's tight. You see more players extending for a longer period of time.

There's less availability of players. I would just classify the market as there's some good players, but there's more, there's quantity. There's a lot of players. Again, you don't know, we've got,

we've got a number of UFAs. Are those players going to be signed between now and Wednesday? When is three days, three days from now, four days, Saturday? It could change, right? So we'll probably know better in the next couple of days, but there'll be good players out there. Have you had your first phone call yet with Greg Conroy as managers and gotten So we'll probably know better in the next couple days, but there'll be good players out there Oh, I've talked to Connie a lot yeah, he's a good man he's going through it like he's he's I

Always say there's a difference between the co-pilot chair and the pilot chair right Landing the players landing the plane is different than the guy cheering you on to do it. And so he's doing good, yeah. We've had some discussions, and he, like us, has lots on his to-do list. Is it a disadvantage for you at all because he knows your every thought about all of the players that he might be talking to you about, and he knows everything you're thinking about these guys? Well, I think he knows what I think of those players. We've had those discussions a lot.

But it's, you know, there's movement around the league, right? You know, I don't think it's too unique to this. You know, whether it be managers move or system managers move or coaches move, wherever you've been, you've got feelings on players but you know his his feelings my feelings or you know second base everybody's got their own feelings but he's got a lot of good players over there you added shane doan are you foreseeing any other additions to your staff you know what um yeah donors donors been a really good addition um and uh has dug right in. We, you know, in all honesty, what I've said with staffing is

with everything that's been prioritized till July 1, we'll deal with that after. So what I have learned in the short time that I've been here, we got a really, there's lots of really good people. And we've been utilizing everyone. We'll cross that bridge once we get through the next couple of weeks. Thanks. Okay.

Thanks, everyone. Appreciate it. Thanks. All right. That was Brad Treeliving discussing all things Toronto Maple Leafs. Kip, you still with us, pal? Oh, yeah. Were you able to hear Brad?

I consider that the longest Kipper's clipper. Kip, you still with us, pal? Oh, yeah. Were you able to hear, Brad? Oh, my. I consider that the longest Kipper's clipper. Sheldon would be jealous, don't you think? I do think so. We gave him a lot of time. We might as well just start with you. Yeah, okay. I can lead to that.

I mean, Sheldon is going to come back as the coach? But no extension, Kip? You know, I do believe that there will be an extension. Now, did I miss it? Did he mention anything about an extension? No, he didn't. He did, in that they're going to work on it. Yeah.

So my thoughts on that are like, you know, what would be the harm in them going a month into the season say you know just just make sure everything is smooth between the two of them it's working you know yeah but sheldon would not like that he wouldn't but what's he gonna do quit no he's not gonna quit but you don't want to start your relationship justin um with uh a little bit of animosity towards one another And you don't want to fall into that same feeling that you had with Kyle Dubas. I think it's crazy that you want to dip your toe after all these years with Sheldon Keefe. Either he's your coach with an extension or you get rid of him.

And he will get his extension in the summer. He will, eh? Yeah, I mean, I just feel like Sheldon has to have somewhat of a shorter shelf life now, having been through what he's been through with his team. You know, what kind of extension does that look like? You think a couple years? I think it would be rather difficult to give him another for two years. But I think a minimal one would be one year. And we know now with Kyle gone that there would probably be a shorter leash, even on Brendan Shanahan, guys, even with Kyle out now.

This time next year, I'm not sure what it would even look like for Brendan Shanahan, let alone Sheldon Keefe. So I don't think that it warrants, you know, a two- or three-year extension, but at a very minimum, you can certainly add one more year to his deal. Kiefer, what did you make of the tone he took when asked about Willie and Matthews? Did you get anything out of that? Well, no assurances in this business. business yeah that's who i wrote that phrase down too uh did you not listen to leaf nation applaud when you heard that yeah and that's that i mean we've

been waiting for someone to not give everyone absolute certainty that they're safe right it doesn't seems like a pretty pretty good way to approach things. I think, guys, what we're starting to feel now, and not that Brad's excluded from this, but there is a lot more rope for him because he's new. But I can tell you right now, a lot of GMs, a lot of gms a lot of executives a lot of presidents are feeling it from their ownership group to change things up to to find ways to either go deeper in the playoffs or make the playoffs there's a tremendous amount of pressure on these gms uh to to change up their team, their roster, their look, their feel. And when you're handicapped, like Brad Tree Living mentioned,

when you're caught into a flat cap era, that's rather difficult. But we continue to see moves that suggest that, you know, 50%, the owners are willing to pay 50% of some big contracts just to change things up. The latest Kevin Hayes going from Philadelphia to St. Louis. And Philly's willing to pay 50% of his contract just to get him the heck out, just to get a different feel, different look to that organization.

So I guess the no trade clause for John Tavares would kind of put a wrench into this, but you think they'd be willing to eat some of that to get rid of him? 100% Sammy. 100%. I guess it's just a matter then of you know having that conversation with Tavares but it doesn't feel like that's likely to happen at least not this year

well for a new guy coming in no I think it's an easier combo for him to have than for Dubas right? I don't know I wasn't here when you guys signed this just want to get your right is that what you're getting at Kip? yeah that's what I'm getting at I think all bets are off and if you're getting at yeah that's what i'm getting at i think all bets

are off and if you're gonna stick to there's no assurances in this business that includes no trade and no move clauses you know it's interesting you know of all the things that stood out one of them you know and talking about these big guys so first off i don't mean to skip past that point and actually maybe I should slow down here. What? Well, I mean, the idea that Tavares could be available in some way or made available or at least conversations could be had feels like a change in perspective here

from how we've previously talked about the core four and what they could and should do. You know, would you even want to retain $4 million dollars say yeah to pay him to not play here can you get a seven million dollar player that's better than john tavarez that buddy i i i'd pay 50 of john's two years you would hey 100 then you got five and a half to get a guy who's going to be more valuable than him? No. I'm getting five and a half cap space that I could turn into a lot of other things.

That's the way I look at it. Yeah. And I guess if you're retaining that much, Tavares becomes an asset in a trade, right? Like you're saying, we're giving you a point per game centerman, you know, at 6 million or whatever the number ends up being. You know, it's like... I think John would be very attracted to a lot of teams at 6 million or 7 million. Maybe you don't have to pay 50%.

Maybe it's 40%. Maybe it's 35%. Yeah, interesting. John john tavaris is still a tremendous centerman yeah uh but it just it doesn't work any longer here well yeah i mean that's that is facing the facts a little bit you know every time you talk about the core four and what you can you do different it always starts with well tavaris is here but and if he doesn't have to be that certainly changes the way they look but camper what do you think they like i said that it's an easier conversation for true living to have than the guy who signed him to that contract probably

but you know shan he's still around like how do you go about that conversation like the landing points the landing place is so important where he's gonna you know he's gonna be happy there like it's such a huge conversation to have with him like how do you go about that three boys here well first of all you you do it by showing the respect that you need to for a guy like john tavaris um and uh it's it's not gonna be an easy conversation for john to have um but one but one that suggests that, uh, you know, he, uh, he needs to start thinking about, uh, playing somewhere else. And, uh, it was not personal. It's not that we don't like you. It's not that we don't respect you. It's that your $11 million

hit doesn't work for us moving forward. let us work together and and come up with a solution that could make you and your family as happy as possible you know i think if you're another team and and you think that that's a possibility i think you start having some internal conversations like boys we can get you know we can get a pretty good hockey player here at a discounted rate i i suddenly think that becomes an asset for the Leafs, but again, you don't want to eat too much salary. An interesting one. You know, there was a lot of stuff in there

that we can kind of try to read into. One of them was he didn't seem too fussed about having contracts done by July 1st. Did he, Sammy? You seemed to pick up some tone that he wasn't in a rush about Matthews on the 1st? I picked up the tone that he wasn't in a rush about matthews on the first i picked up the tone that he wasn't in a rush because it wasn't gonna happen because yeah because maybe it's not gonna come to fruition

on july 1st that's the tone i kind of felt from what about you kev yeah listen uh i think he said at best that in a perfect world the sooner the better uh that way you can prepare but i don't think the july 1st uh no move clause kicking it in changes a lot moving forward and of course you're giving the guy a chance to uh to control for sure where he wants to go but if he's not resigning here i don't think it's in his best interest to play out the season here he's gonna want to be moved before um you know playing a song and dance that maybe i'll stay maybe i won't i i think i think leaf fans are too smart for that with all the history that we've seen in the last two, three, four years of these free agents pretending that they want to stay

when they really walk out the door, I don't think Austin Matthews will survive the months of January, February without signing a contract as a Toronto Maple Leaf. So whether his no move kicks in or not, February without signing a contract as a Toronto Maple Leafs. So whether his no move kicks in or not, this is in best interest to work out a trade with Brad Treeliff. And if in fact, you know, they both feel like a contract isn't going to get done.

Yes. Like it's kind of the same thing. Like you say the no, the no move clause, but if you're not signing long-term, then you obviously want to go somewhere else. So then therefore you should be able to be traded somewhere else. of the same thing like you say the no the no move clause but if you're not signing long term then you obviously want to go somewhere else so then therefore you should be able to be traded somewhere else right like the no move is kind of counterproductive at that point it is and you got to understand too that like it's not like you're you're turning around and you're going to shop austin matthews if you're brad tree live and you can't get a contract and you're going to shop Austin Matthews if you're Brad Treliv and you can't get a contract,

and you're going to shop him to 31 other teams, how many can turn around and sign Austin Matthews and make him the richest contract in NHL history, right? Not many teams. Well, the one that could have maybe is L.A., and they're on the cusp of signing Pierre-Luc Dubois. Yeah. So, like, let's revisit. I mean, again, how many teams are out there that could take on, that are contending?

Yeah, you know how I feel about this, though. Forget about any team. They'll make room for him. Yeah, but, JB, how hard is it to make room? How hard is it to bring a third team in? We're talking about a lot of work. We're talking about teams willing to change their lineup completely to welcome in Austin Matthews.

It's not going to be easy, is my point. And it's going to be maybe three, four, five teams that can do it. And is Austin willing to go to a team that isn't quite ready to compete or wants to grow into a program that could compete in three or four years? Or does he want to win now? That's another one, too. Pierre-Luc Dubois had that thrown in his lap. You want to go to Montreal and wait three or four years

to compete for a Stanley Cup, or you want to go to L.A. right now and try to win now? Yeah, I guess with the Matthews thing and talking about July 1st, the one thing that I am maybe naive to is like, you know or you don't know, right? Yeah, you do. Like, you know today, Kip, it's not like the number or term is going to be shocking. You can pick the term and essentially the number.

So you either stay if you want to. So if it's not July 1st, then it isn't happening to me. Is that too dramatic a stance? It's a terrifying one. Well, what, you know, you bring up an excellent point, JP. What changes before or after, really? Well, the only thing that changes is fans and the organization, certainly. But really, the fans, you're making a statement to the people who are a part of this team

that you want to be here signing the know, signing the day you can. Yeah. Otherwise it's just like, I don't know. I'll get to it next week. Really? It would be a weird thing for this to go into like September the way McKinnon was like,

yeah, well we'll get it done. Yeah. Well, McKinnon was too busy, you know, partying after winning the cup. that was a limiting factor.

You know, they actually won something. So maybe that's why he was too busy celebrating that to sign a contract. Last time I checked, Matthew's got a lot of time off. So anyways. I think there's going to be a level of frustration, though, if in fact that there isn't any movement on Nylander and Matthews in the next week or two for Leaf Nation.

You know this town as well as anybody, boys. We've lived it for two years now, two hours a day. They're going to get frustrated. You guys got any thoughts on tree living being allowed to be at the draft table after Calgary picks at 16? What is that? What a charade that is. I don't get it.

Can someone explain that to me? After a first-round round pick it's okay but this what the second round and the third round are less valuable than the first round what if he traded what if they trade down can he does he have to wait till when they trade too it's really weird like what's the difference can we just stop doing this can we stop doing this it's a little dog and pony show here like who's this appeasing calgary i guess that's why i just don't understand in a locker room in the building until 16 then he comes out and then it's like stone cold what's the the wrestler with the glass break it's stone cold he comes out my god tree it's straight the the other thing guys that i picked up uh out of that press conference is that we've got three really good goalies uh-huh three huh and also a lot of

guys young guys that start well don't or finish well don't necessarily start well yeah i did pick that up so last week i wrote uh in my article that uh that uh kyle dubas prior to leaving for pittsburgh wanted to uh sign matt murray to an extension what sorry yeah yeah i got word that he wanted to sign him to an extension. Are we doing jokes today? Arden? No, we're not. Matt Murray. The goalie. The goalie.

There's another Matt Murray who's a goalie. Is it that one in Dallas? No, no, no, no. This is our Matt Murray. Our Matt Murray. Your Matt Murray, bud, not mine. Don't you put that on me. No, they still saw value.

And listen, did you not pick up Brad Tree Living's vibe on Matt Murray? Yeah, he's value there. He's starting for the Leafs next year. That's what I heard. Yeah, but we also thought that about Mrazic last year. I also think if you're trying to up Matt Murray's trade value, you at least pretend you're going to use him. You think he's good enough to play in the league.

So there's that. Yeah. you at least pretend you're going to use him. You think he's good enough to play in the league. So there's that. Yeah. Well, listen, I think Kyle Dubas, based on, you know, Kyle wanting to bring him back to Toronto prior to leaving, is a sign that he would have tremendous interest in Matt Murray and Pittsburgh. If, in fact, the police want to move off of him. One of my complaints about Dubas over the years was like there is this ardent obsession with proving that he's right with some of this

stuff right this is like it will eventually come to pass that i will be vindicated and i would like to see that help the leafs here and have him take matt murray because they need help and net there in pittsburgh pedigree is you know it can really like matt murray was bad last year and his numbers he was a 301 uh goals against he was 903 but like he was at 920 after a couple starts like he was horrible for long stretches of the year right like there's just to me you guys have watched hockey long enough like do you believe that he can turn it around and be a league average goalie? Like, I don't get it.

I don't see it. Like, what general manager is going to convince himself, boys? Yeah, I know. I don't, like, pedigree is one thing. Like, they won the cup, but that was, what year is that, 2017? It's the year 2023, fellas. Like, it's a long time ago that he was good yeah no i'm with you bud so is this uh no longer a foregone conclusion that uh joseph wall and samsonov will be your

two starting goalies in uh yeah it definitely puts that into question you know what's really tough there is samsonov and Wohl, you're looking at a combined salary of what Samsonov going to get for something like that. You know, and Wohl, they're going to be combined five. Now you're looking at a $9 million duo. Yeah. I don't know.

That hurts you. So, again, if you're trying to trade Matt Murray, pretending that you think he's NHL level is the smart thing to do. So maybe he's galaxy braining this thing. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Outside of that, it's pretty clear that Brad's got a good rapport

with the Toronto media, though. Lots of jokes, lots of great – Fat bastard burritos. I'm telling you, that media group that he had in there, a terrific – they would make a terrific studio audience. They wouldn't even need the applause sign. You know, the best part, though, and I understand, because Sam made the same comments when it was going on,

so I understand that perspective, but it is nice that the GM of the Leafs isn't always acting like he's being interrogated yeah i agree you know like the it doesn't not every conversation it feels like you can have more conversations when each one isn't like from a few good men jack nicholson and tom cruise like just asking some questions yeah we're working away can i just say like anecdotally fellas how weird like because we've seen Brad Treliving as the general manager of the Leafs for his introductory press conference.

And we haven't heard from him or seen him, but like it just hit me today watching him up there, like how used to I was with Dubas being the general manager of the Leafs and then was kind of like, oh my God, yeah, Treliving, this is happening. He's there. He's the Leafs guy. Like such a huge change. It caught me off guard again today it's crazy well the other thing too is i don't think we saw or heard from

kyle dubas all but two times it was brutal last yeah yeah he went radio silent yeah he went real silent and then come last january february there were even some rumors and talk that Brendan and Kyle weren't as close as they were earlier in their professional relationship. And then some people wanted to suggest that that was just, you know, Brandon backing off to let Kyle grow more. And then of course we found out later that that wasn't the case. But I would believe that we're going to probably be hearing from Brad a lot more this year. He seems seems he's of course very personable he's likable and uh i think he you know he's a pretty transparent guy or as much as he can be and uh it just seems like we'll probably be hearing from the general manager of the toronto might believe so a lot more this year and that'll i think that'll buy him a ton of leeway with with the media in terms of just his ability like you

said kipper to just stand out there make some jokes talk about eating that fat bastard burrito and like you know being personable i mean that i think it goes a long way with building relationships with the media which means more favorable coverage like i really do you know if he signs austin matthews to a contract extension is nice to the media for the full year it's gonna be a pretty good time for him. Yeah. I just think it also, it doesn't, you know, when you never speak and suddenly you're on camera, the way Dubas had kind of done it, it puts such gravity on your words

and so much pressure on your words to say the right thing. So hopefully that makes things a little bit easier for tree living. Probably break. Okay. Why don't we break, Kip? And when we get back, we got lots of news around the NHL. Alex Newhook has been traded to the Canadians. You got Dubois going LA.

We're going to talk about that all after the break. We'll be around in five minutes here. Be right back. Unrivaled insight, analysis, and opinions on all things Blue Jays. Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple,

Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Jays Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is real Kipper and born on sports net five 90, the van. Welcome back to real Kipper and born with Sam McKee Kipper on location today. Uh, some big news around the NHL today.

We got a little cleanup to do at the end of the show here. Another 10 minutes. Talk about the big stuff. I guess the foremost one here is Dubois. Pierre-Luc Dubois, it's not official. Murat Eitz was tweeting about a rumor that looks like Dubois could go to LA. They could get back Velarde, Kupari, I believe, Ayafalo, some pretty good hockey players here

we're talking about to Winnipeg. Kipper, you got thoughts on the potential Dubois deal? Yeah, certainly if you're Winnipeg, this is the direction that you're pushing Pierre-Luc Dubois. Obviously, they got to come up with a contract. I'm hearing between $60 and $65 million for Pierre-Luc Dubois on an eight-year deal. Wow. Montreal, first of all, Montreal didn't or didn't want to go with assets back to Winnipeg. Again, for a team that's not in contention to win now,

there's no reason why you've got to give up key assets for a guy that is not ready to win with you now luke dubois so that's that's why winnipeg is focusing on la right now and i do wonder if montreal is less likely to be a trading partner now that they've traded for alex new hook um they traded a first and a second in this next year draft now that sounds like a ton it's the 31st overall overall pick from Florida and the 37th overall pick. So 31 and 37 for the signing rights to Newhook. You know, okay, Alex Newhook, a 22-year-old, 5'10 center, 30 points last year.

You like that for the Habs? Oh, perfect for Montreal who have a no past 5'11 rule. Everyone's got to be 5'10. got suzuki caulfield new hook i it's a weird one for me if i'm montreal like you guys stink why are you trading first round picks like i know he's a he's a player i guess alex new hook he had some pedigree like he was a world junior guy like he's you know but to me that's way way too early to be making a trade like that. I'm really shocked to see them trading any first-round picks. Noah?

Well, first of all, he's 22 years old. Yeah, and he's young. Which fits in with a lot of their top guys now. Obviously, Cole Caulfield being the big one in Suzuki. But I just, again, I got to get bigger. I just watched the Vegas Golden Knights win a Stanley Cup with big guys. I don't get wanting a top centerman at 5'10". I don't understand it.

You know, I've told you guys before like i i typically like to see teams try to win and try to go in the right direction so i like them trying to get good players i also like the idea of them not moving players off the roster right so they can just kind of they're a player better a legitimate nhl player better but yeah i look at buffalo and what's going on there with thompson and and Power and Cousins and Darlene. All those guys are 6'3 plus. A little bit better way to build your team than what Montreal's got going here. Yeah.

Just one more note on that trade with Colorado that it gives Colorado some draft capital to make now other deals. So I expect them to be very active here going into the weekend you do eh yeah i do i mean the more i've thought about the johansson thing the more i like it the more sense it makes um you know these deals with their attention we kind of glossed over the kevin hayes to st louis thing but like getting hayes for a couple years at 3.75 like these are big assets for only a sixth round pick you know you wonder if there isn't some way that the leafs can get involved in that i only say that because the ufa is out there not overly tempting

well again if we go back to bradeliving's comments, guys, what did he say? Quantity, not quality, out there with availability, which means it's weak. That's essentially what he's saying, that it's a weak free agent crop, which means that you have to get creative. But it takes a dance partner and a rich one, in this case the Philadelphia Flyers, to eat millions of dollars off of Kevin Hayes' contract. But this is the way teams are going now,

which makes for, I think, an exciting week. It's interesting, because the Flyers aren't trying to win right away, and Hayes has, what, two years left on that deal or something? I think it's longer. Is it longer? Yeah. So I guess that's it. They're trying to clear things for going forward, but this is new leadership there in Philly getting aggressive early. And you

have the support of your ownership group to eat that money, which is huge, guys. And last year, I think there was talk about Carlson, who won his Norris last night. And there was interest in Eric Carlson last year, but San Jose was not willing to eat a substantial amount off his contract. And that will have to change going into the weekend.

You know, talking about, you know, the lack of free agents out there, I think we should circle back on Carlson maybe for a second. I do want to talk about the report about, you know, Kampf and Kerfoot and whatever here in Toronto. But the Carlson thing, there's a couple tweets today that, you know, link Toronto among teams, whatever here in Toronto, but the Carlson thing, there's a couple of tweets today that, you know, link Toronto among teams, Seattle, Carolina,

and Toronto is teams that have looked into Eric Carlson. You mentioned it last season, a couple of times that you actually didn't think it was impossible. Where are you at now? You mentioned it more than a few times. Yeah. Like, like an amount of times that was like,

okay, what do you know? What do you know, pal? Absolutely doable. But again, it's going to take the San Jose Sharks to look at 35, 40% of his contract. It's unmovable without it.

Weren't the Sharks a finalist for John Tavares? Yeah, I don't know. Straight up swap? Listen, I think that was all just leverage, house of cards, bluff, whatever you want to call it. You're telling me a guy spends all of his career on the island and then decides to go to the West Coast in California? I mean, right so uh i think

there was interest but that was doug wilson as well guys who is no longer there um pushing for for for uh tavaris at the time and he was the guy that made the deal for eric carlson but you know in saying that uh there's not a there's not a team that wouldn't love Eric Carlson at $7 million. He's got four years remaining, I think. You could get a haul for him if you retained it to seven. Yeah, after his Norris Trophy last night and the ability to show that he can still play on a wonky foot at a high level,

that there would be interest to take on his four years, but at a much more reasonable number. How wonky of a foot are we talking here? Well, go look at the reports over the surgeries over the years. I mean, at times there was some thoughts that he'd never be the same player again. And despite performing with one of the worst teams in the league, there are times, and remember that game he played against the Leafs? I mean, they couldn't catch him.

So I think I said it yesterday, but until last year, the amount of games he had played was 53, 56, 52, 50, and then 82. So he's missed a lot of time. I just, I can't think of anything that would be more sad for his career than to come to the brightest light in terms of markets. Well, his career, inevitably, father time comes for us all. You know, if he goes into decline in any way god it's a tough place to be while you're in decline especially depending on the package

that you give up and you're measured against that it's been much of a defender to begin with and it's it's not kevin hayes with uh what did we say kevin hayes has left on his deal three years two years three yeah i mean even three is better than four. Four is a lot. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Four is a lot. Again, if you can chop that number in half,

if San Jose just eats 50% of it, there's a lot of teams that would love Eric Carlson at that number. Wow. Well, that's a fascinating idea. Certainly Power Play 1 would benefit from a elite elite elite power play player like carlson um and then the other rumor of the day just that they're circling back the leafs are circling back on kampf and kerfoot as potential of their own guys to to bring back before they can get to the market sammy you like

well i said to borny before the show kipper that i would sign david camp to a 1.6 per year lifetime contract to let him play 82 games i have no problem with that last year i think 1.6 1.5 was it 1.6 i think it was 1.6 yeah but alex kerfoot uh is a bridge too far. I cannot do another flex seal year. You're not getting caps without a raise, okay? That's not happening. Well, it's not like he lit it up. That's not the point. He plays too much.

The point is he's a free agent. He actually plays second line minutes. He played a prominent role for Toronto all season long, and there's value in it that is closer to $2.5 million than your $1.6 Sammy. Yeah, I know you're right. I know. I like camp. I'd be happy to have him back.

I really would be. When it comes to camp and Kerfoot, let's just circle right back to Brad Tree Living's comments earlier in the show. Quantity not quality. Yeah. Well, that's the show. Quantity, not quality. Yeah. Well, this is the thing.

As I said to Sam before he was like a petulant child and wouldn't even hear it, I said, there's a number where Alex Kerfoot is giving you surplus value and what you're paying him. There's a number. So what is the number? Well, the coach is returning, and the coach is going to play him in the top six regardless. Yeah, you have to put some...

Take away his toys. It's like money ball. You got to release the guy that he played too much. Anyways, we got to go. Would you give him... What do you think? No, no money. It doesn't matter.

You could give him $750K. I don't care. I want Sammy. I want Sammy. Gone. This is the only time that you make a change for the sake of making a change. Kerfoot is about making a change for the sake of it. Here's what I think.

I think you're both right. We got to go. Yeah, we do. All right. I'm back in studio tomorrow. I was at the Joe Carter charity event today. I'll tell you all about it tomorrow. Beautiful.

Sportsnet and Fan 590 do a terrific job sponsoring this event. It's fantastic. I'm going to get you guys in next year. Great stuff. Sounds great. We'll see you all tomorrow. Thanks a lot. ... ... ... ...

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