Real Kyper & Bourne - Vally's View: Goalie Swap in the West

Episode Date: December 10, 2024

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne welcome back Steve Valiquette (2:30) to chat about the New York Rangers' struggles, why Alexandar Georgiev will benefit from playing behind the San Jose Sharks roster, expectations from Thatcher Demko making his season debut, why John Gibson is easy to read and much more. Then, Nick, Justin and Sam McKee touch on Patrik Laine's first few games as a Montreal Canadien, Anaheim Ducks' throwback sweaters, and notes from the NHL Board of Governors meeting.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

we go national on the real kipper and born show we are live on sports at 650 in vancouver sports at 960 in calgary this hour of real Real Kipper and Bourne is brought to you by Bet365. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee. In a couple of minutes, we'll welcome in Steve Valliquette, analyst for the New York Rangers on MSG, CEO of ClearSight Analytics. Just moments ago, before we came on air, we had Ken Danico on our program on the last hour.

I mentioned a fight that I had with Ken Danico on our program on the last hour. I mentioned a fight that I had with Ken Danico. And I don't know. Somebody found it upstairs, played it, and I just watched it. And? And I got my head pummeled. Was it like having Vietnam flashbacks? I'm watching it going. Number one, I'm getting a headache watching it.

And number two is like, how did I not soak my head in a bucket? I don't know how. Moments after that. Hey, listen. You hung in there with a big, tough man who played 1,230 games and scored three goals or something. So he knew what he was doing. He didn't score a goal for three seasons. He knew what he was doing at that department.

Last year of his career, though, he scored two. Lit it up. And you can tell through his filmy and gross that film was, I had better hair. Far better. He wasn't even close. That's probably why he fought you in the first place.

I'm mad about your lid. You're not follicly challenged now. None of us are. Getting there. I'm in a battle for my life. Are you? You're fighting for your life? I'm dying. Hanging in, bud. It's not long. I'm almost 42.

I know. I think you're fine. Yeah, you're fine. I actually, you know, I made a deal with the Lord above and said, get me to 40. But then now I'm married and I have a job. It's like, all right. I don't care what color it is, as long as she keeps growing. That's all that matters.

That's all that matters. Good time to have Steve Allocat on. Oh, why? What's happening? Rangers. Oh, yeah. Rangers. Rangers talk.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, boy. Rangers lost 2-1 to the Chicago Blackhawks. Now, the Leafs play New Jersey. Do you think there's a chance that Jack Hughes goes in on a one-handed breakaway? I hope so. And I hope he scores.

All right. Let's welcome him in. Steve Allocat. Always on a Tuesday night. Oh, the Yankee hat. What does that mean? What does that mean? We lost Soto this week, so I'm trying to just change it up.

Is it helping? No, no. Nothing's working, boys. Does the attention of Soto going to the Mets help Ranger fans the last week? You know, it doesn't because you know how it is here in New York. There's a small fraction of Ranger fans compared to New York Mets and Yankee fans, but they're intense. And I see them as I walk from Grand Central to MSG,

and people are losing their minds, Kipper. I can't hide it. So fascinating to know, you know, what's going to stop this Ranger slide valley? Like, you know they i don't think it's goaltending that's hurting them it certainly didn't look like it last night so what's gonna change great question i i sent you guys a tweet about an hour ago and it was really off of hearing chris verstig talk to you guys about star players giving up a little bit on the offensive side

of the puck. I thought that conversation was great. And because it came from him and he played and won Stanley Cups with star players, it just carried a lot of weight with me. So I went back and I started looking at how these guys performed as stars in their cup winning seasons. And I went over the last 10 years and when Chicago won, Kane had 64 points. Taze led the team with 66 points. Clearly those guys gave up something on the offensive side of the puck to win. Crosby, 85 points and 89 points in the two cup seasons that he's had his two most recent cups

Ovechkin he had 49 goals the year they won but that's the 10th highest goal total of his career clearly gave something up to be able to win and you keep going through Ryan O'Reilly he was the leading scorer for St. Louis with only 77 points the year they won skipping by the two Tampa Bay years because Sammy said they don't qualify and then go to Rantanen to Colorado and Eichel and Reinhardt I think it's a fascinating conversation because I think the hardest thing for coaches to do is to get their star players to check the right way. And when they do, it's most oftentimes what Versteeg was saying. Giving up a little bit.

Ending a shift. One more rush sooner. Line changes with speed. All the small things that these guys need to do to do a little less offensively, the graphic I sent you guys, it's the highest event team I've ever seen. I mean, hockey. It's ridiculous. They have this amazing offense.

They don't have the highest conversion rate, but they get glorious chances up and down the ice. And you can see it on our screen here, the right side of the panel. I've never seen defense that bad guys. Crazy. What a, what a board. Thank you to Jake, the snake for getting this up there. Yeah. Well done.

I didn't know we can do this every time. I'm going to start building graphics now. You know, upgraded the budget over here. I've never seen it this bad. I've been working for MSG for 10 years. I've never seen the team play this poorly defensively. Valley, I get that coaches want this now on a 200-foot game, but where are we as the game over the last 15, 20 years

when people were screaming for more offense and rules were changed to open up the game and all these kids were told, go, go, score. And now what do you do? Is the horse out of the barn here? Can you actually pull some of them back? You know what? It's so easy to do to me.

It's so easy to do. Borny, you're going to like this one because it goes back to the Islanders. It was during the Doug Wade era. They went really offensive. Barry Trotz came in and reeled that team in. Do you remember how that 17-18 team, they gave up the most goals in the NHL that year? They gave up 293.

They were the worst team defensively. But the next year, they only gave up 191 goals and finished in first. How do you go from being the worst to first defensively in a single season? You do it by stick detail. And they gave up East-West passes the year that they were last. 144 chances versus one year later where they only allowed 92. Wow. Yeah.

It's a difference of like 22 goals. And that's just for stick detail, back pressure, takeaway time and space. You look at the two goals that Shusterkin allows last night. Once again, it's Chicago, yeah, but time and space. If I give you a backdoor pass and you can handle it, corral it, and shoot it, you know, Bertuzzi's goal, he had three Mississippis on it. And it was a low east to west play. There's always got to be coverage there.

But I know you can do it because I've seen teams do it in the past. And I think the best example is that 17-18 to 18-19 season from the Islanders. That's fascinating because that does imply some coaching concerns. And, you know, the seat has to be getting reasonably hot there as they panic a little bit. Good to turn the page. Oh, what's that? I'm just buying. Yeah, buying from the...

I do have one thing to add to this because I remember being on the bus with Mark Stahl. And it was the year after Carolina won the Stanley Cup and I said to Stahls, you know, I said, what's going on with Eric? You know, are they going to miss the playoffs? And he said, what happened with Carolina the year after they won the Stanley Cup and they missed the playoffs that very next year, Eric said to Mark at the beginning of the year, Cam Ward was standing on his head. We weren't really playing well for him. Then we started to score.

He wasn't giving us saves. It was just a mismatch of timing. But that's how you miss the playoffs. If you don't have your goalie in sync with the rest of the team concept at the same time, you can have a season from hell. And every sport, every year, somebody has a season from hell that you don't anticipate. Last year, it was the New Jersey Devils. Right now, the Rangers are going through it, as you could say, Nashville Predators.

Do you want to move off the Rangers or ask them about Trouba? Go ahead. Just whatever comment you got on Trouba going to Anaheim, and he had his debut against Montreal last night, and I thought he played well. Yeah, look, I think that it was doomed from the start. You guys know what it's like in the locker room. As soon as you feel like there's been a sense of betrayal,

you're never going to be there as a player. You can do everything. You can work with a sports psychologist. It's so hard to get over. When did the hockey world first feel like a business? The first day I was traded. And I'm no longer wearing the crest that I was first drafted by, and that hurts.

And I can imagine when Trouba was told that we'd like to move on from you in the summer, that captaincy certainly wasn't as near and dear to him as it was when it was first put on his chest. Just the way it is. You know, another thing that we know that you're well in tune to is Gorgiev in Colorado and things not going great for him there. He ends up getting traded. What's your assessment of his season, a guy that the Rangers once thought was a pretty darn good goalie?

You know, I thought this was really fascinating because looking into this today, I have a page within our app where I can see what a goalie faces, and I use the term environment, just the overall array of difficulty of shots faced and sometimes you can have two goalies in the same team where one guy just happens to get the bad run of cards and the other guy gets the easier starts it's been debated in the locker room for years now this to me is interesting San Jose they've allowed the most scoring chances overall this year in the NHL with 924.

It's 50 more than the next worst team, Pittsburgh. San Jose has also allowed 525 low danger shots. Those are the easy ones, which is 76 more than the next closest team, Detroit. But Blackwood's environment when he was there in San Jose, it's the best in the league because he has the highest volume of low danger, which lowers his overall per shot value. So if you get a lot of easy ones and then you face a hard one versus starting a game, Colorado starts really slow and they usually give up two or three great A's in their first five or six. That's a tough place to play. I wonder how this is going to go for Blackwood, who, by every sense I get from listening and reading on Colorado,

they're heavily influenced in analytics, and they use it often, I think maybe even too much as far as bringing it into the locker room. What I've seen is that a goalie, and you guys know this one doesn't always perform well when they're not getting volume. It's not for everybody. You know, it's like back in the day, we saw Cujo have a difficult time in Detroit. And sometimes it happens where you might think you're getting something, but he's not the best fit for you.

But Blackwood is athletic. He's a freak in the gym. He just hasn't proven yet that he can play in one of those winning environments. And this is going to be a different pressure cooker for him. But I also think for Georgiev going to be a different pressure cooker for him but i also think for georgia of going to san jose he's more of a rhythm goalie that's going to benefit from getting a lot of action and then facing the high danger in fact both teams over the last 10 games have faced the same high danger chances 65 so the san jose goalies have faced 65 high danger chances over the last 10 games, as have Colorado. Same number.

But when you juice it up with the extra low danger, it becomes an easier place to play in San Jose, if you can imagine that. Hey, Valley. So we saw Scott Wedgwood get traded there, and then Blackwood get traded there. And we've seen goalies get traded mid season, but have we ever seen two that closely together? Like to me, that's like trading a line or trading a defensive pair. Like you've traded your goalies, both of them.

You, you bailed on them in, in 29 games and then just went, redo, mulligan. Well, in a lot of ways, I would say there's been a lot of mismanagement in Colorado going back to two years ago. I believe Georgie have had the most wins in the NHL over the last two years coming into this year. But it's also been multiple starts and three and fours. And I think that especially last year at the end of the year, they ran him pretty thin.

I think it's a lot. It's the first time it's happened this early in the season. I do know that I read that it's the first time in the NHL, in the history of the NHL, that the two goalies took from starting night to this point in the season have been replaced, which I think is fascinating. Something we most likely don't see again, but it looks to me point in the season have been replaced, which I think is fascinating. Something we most likely don't see again.

But it looks to me like in Colorado, they are blaming the goalies for their bad start. And you know what? To be fair, Georgiev did have a very poor first five, seven games, and he has recovered since. He won six games in a row, but then maybe the damage was already done.

You know how that goes. So tonight, it looks like Thatcher Demko is going to get back in for the Vancouver Canucks. What are you expecting from him? Well, it's fascinating because he's backed up the last two games. And that's a strange one for me. Backing up, coming back from injury, and possibly having to go in cold. I really wonder about that.

And the fact that he's getting in there i expect the most from him top five all day every day goalie in the nhl i'm gonna be watching that game closely i know what he can bring technically i know what he brings mentally and i know what he brings physically um he's look he's one of the best goalies in the league and if he can stay healthy you know what does that do for team usa in the event that hellebuck isn't uh at his best which sometimes the pressure cooker gets to him i don't know what uh kind of stretch you've ever had between games but give us your best thoughts on what it would be like for him to go in there for the first minute, five minutes, ten minutes? What are you looking for? What do you want?

You want to be busy early? You want to slowly get into it? Like, what would be going through his mind? You want shots. You know what, Kipper? The best that you ever feel is typically the first game into training camp after a great summer of getting your structure. And knowing Thatcher Demko and how he trains

and how he is diligent on the ice, I think structurally and his fundamentals, his game plan technically is going to be strong because he has that foundation and he can rely on it. And I'd imagine he comes out and has a great game. It's going to get a little more challenging two weeks from now because you lose that buzz. And I think, Borny, I've heard you talk about how, you know,

when you're in the American League and somebody comes up from the East Coast League and they have a buzz for 12 games and then they settle back to who they are. I experienced that one a lot. Saw it a lot with guys coming up and down. There's going to be a buzz for him. I think the challenge of weeks two, three, and four for him are going to be

he's not going to really have the practice time to rely on his technique after he gets back into the thick of the season. That might be where there's more of a lull. I expect him to get off to a great start because of his pedigree just one more event yeah please just in terms of lankan and playing well and not pressing him into action how how important has that been well that saved their

season hasn't it uh like having that depth has really saved them they're in a position to maybe charge now if demko can stay healthy throughout uh he's the rock back there there aren't too many number ones right now there aren't too many true number ones and thatcher demko is a true number one and now he's got a support system too so look we talked about playing through some pain and playing through some discomfort. And possibly what I'm going to be watching closely for is how is he getting in and out of his posts? How are his connections? Because that's where the stress is on the knee.

It's getting down into the reverse. And I felt for a long time that he was overly reliant on it, which is really hard on the body. And the goalie coach there that's not there any longer, Ian Clark, I used to always wonder about how hard these reps were on his body. Because as I've told you guys, I've been in the net now and doing it. And it's a mistake. You know, it's a big time mistake for a young guy to spend too much time using that reverse because it's so hard on your body for the long term.

So looking around Canadaada um stewart skinner is a guy who was kind of under scrutiny in terms of can he be good enough that the oilers can win a stanley cup we know they got darn close the answer is very likely yes is it is he a guy that they wanted to roll that dice with again this season i think depended on his play last four games he's a 941 96464, 938, 935. He's playing very well. Five of his last six games actually have been very good. Do you believe that Stu Skinner is a guy who can be one of these?

Can he be good enough for them? Has to be, Borny, because I don't see where you're going right now around the league to get anybody better with a better option. All the wood goalies are gone. There's no one left. Yeah. Very good. Very good.

No, like, after the last, I'm looking at a list here that has the top 10 goalies over the last month. And Skinner's number nine. And Bennington is number seven. Montembeau is number four. Aiden Hill is number two. Gustafson is number seven. Montembeau is number four. Aiden Hill is number two. Gustafson is number one.

But, you know, I just riled off four out of the top ten. They're Canadian goalies. So the Canadian guys, I don't know if there's juice behind wanting to get in there. And I can only imagine what these guys are thinking, knowing the attention in Canada. Like, we're not getting a sniff of this here, guys. I haven't heard a sniff about the Four Nations anywhere around New York. Nobody's talking about it. Nothing.

So I can only imagine, though, that these guys being a goalie and knowing that there is a talking point about whether the goaltending is going to be good enough. I don't think it's just a coincidence that over the last month, four of the top 10 performing goalies in the NHL are Canadian. Valley, where are you on John Gibson since he's been back?

Because it just seems now with Blackwood out in Colorado, he's probably, if teams were looking for a goalie, I think they would go to Gibson next here. So there's Carolina question marks. And if Edmonton does falter a little bit between the pipes and it gets to a critical stage in the season would you ever

entertain gibson you know you know what i would do kipper i'd have a long conversation with him about making some adjustments and if he had a willingness to do that i'd work with him but i think for a long time he hasn't changed he has been the easiest pre-scout for the last five years he is so shot focused so locked in on the open shot that he's willing to in my opinion give up everything on the pass and as we've seen the game over the last five years with more and more east west i think there's more and more reason for exposure there i go back to the stanley cup final where washington beat vegas and they saw early on that mark andre flurry was pressing on the first shot. And in that series, they went 11 for 14 east to west.

That was the number I got from a really good source. And, you know, I saw that happen and I said to myself, this is where pre-scouting is really showing its weight in gold if you can do it the right way now, especially in the playoffs. And I don't think you can win with a goaltender that can't stop an east to west. Not if you're all the way in on a shot. And Gibson has the ability to do it, but I just haven't seen him adjust. I'd want to have a long conversation with him about talking to him about,

are you going to back up off the rush? Are you going to have some pace so you can flow and have some east to west movement in your game? Because locking on is not going to work if we're going to win. Last one for me, just a quick thought on Montembeau. What's his environment been like? He's a guy that maybe the surprise pick for the Canadian team, but I've liked him quite a bit.

Looked really good last night. Yeah, I agree. And he's been a funny one for me because it's always hard sometimes to strike a balance between how difficult this guy's environment is, and it's a night-to-night thing, especially when you're a young goalie and you get beat up for six or seven, and then you're back in because there's really not a big, wide-tasting safety net that I can rely on and not have to be able to carry this baggage all by myself.

And starting with last season, I did a bunch of research for a team on who had the highest save percentage on screens, and I spent quite a bit of summertime research-wise on him because he led the league in save percentage on screens last year, and I noticed just a lot of battle in his game the only thing i've ever questioned with him is his overall fitness because he just still looks like a guy that's a little doughy to me you know and i know that because i was that guy you know it took a while for me into my mid-20s late 20s really to get

myself in a top shape and then what i realized from that was I could go longer in practice. I could have a longer practice, which allowed me to have more quality reps and then just be a little bit better when games begin. And I think that he still has more ceiling that way, more growth that way, but he certainly has fight in the game. He certainly has that battle level in the game. So I think it's great news for Canada. but he certainly has fight in the game. He certainly has that battle level in the game. So I think it's great news for Canada.

I mean, you've got a pretty good battle here at the top of the standings going into this tournament. Just one more Valley for me, and that's in Calgary, where plenty of fight early out of the Calgary Flames, but I think winners of one out of the last seven here. How important it now is it to kind of, you got Wolf who looks like every bit a tremendous goalie up and comer, but how important is it to protect him a little bit in the next little while? Yeah, I would.

And you guys know how I feel about him. He's one of my favorites to watch right now. And it's really game to game. Just, just don't let him feel too much of the burden right now and it's really game to game just uh just don't let him feel too much of the burden right now because you can go outside of what you're capable of doing and be sometimes to your own detriment uh too responsible some goalies will place blame and some guys can hurt themselves by taking on too much and we've seen that over the years unravel some really good careers and I'm I sometimes just wonder can you just insulate and keep him safe

because I love the way that he plays because he plays deep for a smaller goalie but he advances when he has a clear read that it's going to be a one-on-one he doesn't sit back and that's that's not an easy adjustment I've talked to quite a few-on-one. He doesn't sit back. And that's not an easy adjustment. I've talked to quite a few goalies this year about making that adjustment, and it's not an easy one. And he's very comfortable doing it because he's so explosive laterally. We'll let you get back in line for your Mets season tickets. All right, boys. Although, is that hat corduroy?

It's actually kind of a nice hat. I hate to admit it. I like that. It's pretty slick. I usually wear this one in the late fall games. Yeah, is that hat corduroy? It's actually kind of a nice hat. I hate to admit it. I like that. It's pretty slick. I usually wear this one in the late fall games. Yeah, very classy. Valley, as always, man, fantastic stuff

on our program. We sure appreciate it, man. Thanks. See you, boys. Have a good one. Thanks, Valley. Appreciate it. Steve Allicat, CEO ClearSight Analytics, and of course, analyst for the New York Rangers on MSG. So many good things.

Great, yeah. He's from Tobacco. Why is he wearing a Yankee hat? Come on. He's an MSG guy. He lives there. Blue Jays. Come on.

Hey, Sammy, a no-brainer. I could live in New York City my whole life. I'm not going to put that damn hat on. I still got, I threw out the first pitch at Yankee Stadium. Did you? What? Cool. Did I ever tell you this story?

After you won the cup? After you won the cup? After we won the cup. Really? I'm like, been about like a week and a half after we won the cup. I'm like taking it easy. I'm finally sobering up. I got a call from Mess. What are you doing?

I said, I don't know. I'm going to get a haircut. He goes, oh, that's too bad because we're going to go throw out the first pitch at Yankee Stadium. You want to come? I'm like, I'm canceling my my haircut so like multiple of you through it the whole day yankee stadium and i'm like blown away because we had this mentality of game day where you just work yourself up and then to the point where like at six o'clock when the music shuts off you're like

zoned in beyond belief they They play 162 times. They're just smoking cigarettes. This is like 15 minutes before the first pitch, and they got like buffets coming out and shrimp, and it's like I want to be a ball player. Yeah. $760 million deals. Do you want me to bring my warm-up jacket in?

No. Your Yankees warm-up jacket? Oh, yeah. It's so I can burn it. The old starter one remember those wow my god i'm not gonna say that's not cool kipper's craft is getting hot but there's you know it's there's a big like dynamic with the sports fans in new york that it's excuse me it's yankees rangers giants are usually the three that's together and then it's and then everyone loves

the knicks and then it's islanders well like don't they all love the kn three that's together, and then everyone loves the Knicks, and then it's Islanders. Don't they all love the Knicks? Mets, Jets, Nets. But the Nets aren't even really a thing, are they? Yeah. Oh, yeah. I guess. I thought most people just liked the Knicks.

Mets, Nets, Jets, Islanders. Yeah, and Islanders. That's it. So it's not often you're going to find a Mets fan that's a Rangers fan or a Yankee fan that's an Islander fan. Yeah, you're either like a downtown Manhattan, sort of a New York fan. Love that stuff. Wish there was a bunch of teams that's an Islander fan. You're either like a downtown Manhattan sort of New York fan. Love that stuff.

Wish there was a bunch of teams here that had those dynamics. We sure could. See those Yankee fans outside Shea. What's the new stadium? City Field. And they're like ripping on it. It's a dump. They're just killing it. It's the opposite of a dump. It's a brand new stadium.

He's just showing this one angle. Not the stadium. The area around it. Oh, yeah. Total dump. I'm not talking about the brand new stadium. I'm talking about the Yankee fans are ripping on the neighborhood. When Juan Soto is flown

on Steve Cohen's helicopter from his palatial home, I'm sure he's going to be devastated about the area around the stadium. Descends the stairs made of clouds from his palatial home. I'm sure he's going to be devastated about the area around the stadium. Descends the stairs made of clouds from his palace in the heavens. Imagine, like, you get paid $765 million, you don't have to move. Yeah. What a, like, you don't even have to move. Not too shabby.

You stay in the same house you're living in or whatever. You're just going to get a bigger one now. Yeah. I wouldn't move. It's not worth $765 million to move. So while we were on the air, Jason Murdoch, who does stats with Sportsnet, sent me a couple things on Danico on the chat that we had. Oh.

The research. I got two things for you. Most games that he went without scoring a goal. Oh, my God, yes. 256. Almost three. Is that that? Three full seasons plus some of hockey?

That you're playing probably 15 nights. Like one of them has got to go off your ass. Well, 15 minutes. 15 minutes a night. I don't think he played more than that, wouldn't he? 15 minutes a night, 20 minutes a night. Probably top second pair, sometimes third pair. Let's see if I can find how many.

That's fine. The next question is most games with 40 goals or fewer. Second pair, sometimes third pair. Let's see if I can find how many goals I actually had. The next question is, most games with 40 goals or fewer. So who's played the very most? He's second. Only one person in history has played more games and scored less. Oh, so it was close. Who is it?

Actually, I love the answer. Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait. Give me an era. I will say, I'll tell you, he has been a recent head coach in the NHL. And the era was Danico's era. A defenseman? God, I don't even know the answer to that. It has to be a defenseman, please. I don't.

Yeah, I would assume so. It would have to be. I'm embarrassed. I don't know the answer. But I feel like he's a forward. Well, now I'm going to say Craig Ruby. He's not on the list. Luke Richardson. Oh, wow. Was he a defense? No Craig Ruby. He's not on the list. Luke Richardson.

Oh, wow. Was he D or forward? No, defense. He was. Defense. I mean, you have to be. You have to be. A very stay-at-home.

Stay at home and get out of bed. Stay at home. He's in his basement. Never left. Yeah, 14-17. Never went out the front door. He played with 35 goals. 35 goals. And then so the rest of

the list is craig ludwig sean o'donnell mark bergevin hal gill that's the six guys that's phenomenal stuff all of shame well they did other things just kidding way way better careers i wouldn't want to do that i ever had guys really ludwig my hat to all of them. Okay, Sammy. Game time? It's game time. Presented by Bet365. Visit the app, play this to odds, and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. It's for 19+. Ontario only. Please pay responsibly. Lots of

games tonight, boys. Was there 11 or 12 games tonight? Lots of them. The Colorado Avalanche are in Pittsburgh to take on the Penguins. Sid playing his future team. The Colorado Avalanche are in Pittsburgh to take on the Penguins. Sid playing his future team. The Colorado Avalanche are huge favorites in that game. I would imagine I haven't seen anything, but potentially the first start for Blackwood, I'm not sure.

I haven't seen anything for sure. One of the guys who hasn't played there much. One of the woods is going to play in that game. Pittsburgh has been playing a little bit above their skis recently. I think they're coming. I like the Colorado Avalanche tonight. I even like them by minus one and a half at plus 130. I think Colorado wins big tonight and they run them out of the gym. Yeah, I'm not opposed to Colorado being good,

but I do think Pittsburgh's going to be okay. They're going to have so much juice right now thinking that they've gone to another level now. 100%. That's kind of where I'm at with that. Blackwood, I think, has got a shot at being really good there. Yeah. I like the bet.

I'm looking at the Toronto Maple Leafs game for tonight, and I was trying to see, but I guess they don't have it up because they don't know if he's playing for sure or not. But I was trying to find the number on a Max Domi goal because I feel like he might score tonight. But that's unfortunately not up yet because I don't think they know if he's playing or not for sure. So how about I go to the other Max Pacioretty,

the other Max who scored in their first game that they played there. He's getting back in the lineup. He's playing with the top two guys. Give me a Max Pacioretty anytime goal tonight at plus 375. I have bet the Devils to win in regulation, which I think is about plus 110. I don't think that's an awful bet at all, sir. And a really good one later

on tonight on Sportsnet 1, the Tampa Bay Lightning in Edmonton to take on the Oilers. The Oilers are big favorites on their home ice, minus 155. A lot of value with the Lightning, plus 130, but the Oilers are starting to look like the Oilers again, so that's a tough one for me.

You know, I got a good one for you too. Boston and Winnipeg. That one. We had good hockey tonight. I'm intrigued on that one. Oh, you know, and Thatcher Demko returning. Oh, my God.

Some decent hockey games tonight. Anyways, that was Game Time presented by Bet365. Visit the app, play the odds, and find out why it's never ordinary at Bet365. I'm actually thrilled to watch hockey tonight. Okay, let's take a quick break and when we return, we'll get into some news and notes, including a very hot shooter with the Montreal Canadiens.

Oh yeah, and we wanted that. Remember him? I do. What a shot. We'll talk a little Patrick when we return to Real Kipper and Bourne. Hey, it's Matt Marchese. And I'm Mike Futa. We're discussing the top stories of the day across the NHL and the hockey world weekdays at noon. It's the Fan Hockey Show on Sportsnet 590,

The Fan, and wherever you get your podcasts. All right. Final block here. As a reminder, this hour of Real Kipper and Bourne brought to you by Bet365. A little different vibe watching last night out of the Bell Center. And it's...

What did you feel? Patrick Lainey. Yeah. One guy. And I'm so happy that he's found some early success shooting the puck in the net because it's what he does best. Yeah, and like for goal scorers, that's part of their self-worth.

As stupid as that sounds to say, people genuinely associate like, I need to be doing this to be valuable, and he's doing that. So for a guy who's had some mental struggles, love to see it. They got to get those Ducks jerseys out of the league. Okay, let's do it. I know you don't do jersey talk, but... It's really orange for me.

Really orange. That's exactly right. It's just too much orange. It's not a professional hockey sweater. It's a roller league jersey. We had orange every day for like six months, you know, in a presidential race. You've seen enough.

Needed a little breather from it. I just, them going in there wearing those jerseys against a Montreal Canadiens, it's like, aren't you embarrassed that you have to put those on? Sebastian Maniscalco playing for them? No, but like think about it. Like Trouba gets traded from the New York Rangers. Oh, that's a tough day when you see that sweater. One of the best sweaters of all time.

And it's like, I'll get traded to the Anaheim Ducks, and we're going into the Bell Center to play the Montreal Canadiens, and I got to pull over this, you know, not even ECHL-looking jersey. I got to ask Kip about this, because so when I played in the BCHL, I played junior hockey, we won the championship. We swept playoffs playoffs we were the vernon vipers we were like the pride of the league and i went to a university that finished oh and 28 the year before like didn't win a game and i remember seeing the jersey in the locker

room being like oh like you know it just doesn't mean as much it took a minute i got there with that team but you did the opposite you went from the Whalers to the Rangers. Yes. Was it different for you knowing what the jersey meant? Well, is it different when you go to the outhouse and then go to the penthouse? Yeah. You know, but it is when you pull it over your head, it's like this. No, I'm just teasing.

Okay, as far as the uniforms yeah are concerned we had a pretty darn good one there uh the year berkey came in hartford and i will say my jersey is but you're talking about when you put history original six all of it the anaheim ducks yes i know they've won a cup but yeah the montreal yeah the answer is well there's only six of those things that have that type of history, right? But there's nice jerseys in the league outside of the original six. We're looking at one behind us here. That's beautiful. There's lots of great jerseys.

When I first put on a Washington Capitol jersey, I thought it was one of the coolest moments of my life. It's a beautiful sweater. Not anymore, though. They butchered it, too. I like the white one. No. The throwback white one. This is what...

Not the apron string. Not to get too deep into sports fans. I can't envision their latest jersey right now. I like the throwback. It's a dumbed-down version, like a new...

Sorry, a future version of the really nice old ones they used to have. Like the clean white with the capitals across the chest? Google, Google Alonzo Bansky. Yeah, I know the one. It's gorgeous. Are there stars on it?

It's horrible. It's a gorgeous jersey. No, so this is where you get into trouble with these jersey reveals, is that the Ducks put out this, they're like, we're going to honor our old teams where we had this great logo, but we've got to put this modern spin on it. Like, no, you don't. It's like, just make it eggplant point make it purple it was really nice really nice look what the kings did this year they're like you know what we have the best jersey the black one and the white one from

the 90s we're going back to that so i'm passionate about jersey talk i just i can't believe they put those out there and it's so bad there just has to be more people that just say no just, I can't believe they put those out there. And it's so bad. There just has to be more people that just say no. Just say, we can't do that. I actually talked, I forget, with this summer, I interviewed Timu Solani.

I forget what reason, but I did. And I asked him about it. And he was like, yeah, it's a lot of orange. I was like, Timu Solani said,

do they know that's Timu? Well, Burke was, Brian Burke was part of the creation of the Jersey. And the original idea was to honor, I think it was West Point. It's a military-based thing, and it's Orange County, and then there's some gold. There's some colors in there that are military,

and then Orange County is the orange trim. And then they just... It's going to be a huge moneymaker for teams and the league, and just new. And even if they suck, Sammy, they're still going to bring in... And we're talking about them for five more minutes than we ever would have so right if it was nice yeah we wouldn't have talked about the game but good for line a shooting it in the net so the board of governors wrapped up today everybody's on their way back home from earth-shattering news like

um the cap may go up if they negotiate it. Florida Panthers outdoor game. What does that do for you? I don't know. Won't it melt? You know, it sounds like such a dumb thing to say, but it's like, won't it melt? I know they have Freon in the pipes, but like,

I mean, won't it melt? Not during the day. I don't know how they do it. It's got to be at night. They're going to have like a 1 a.m. game. Floodlights? Yeah, what't it melt? Not during the day. I don't know how they do it. It's got to be at night. They're going to have like a 1 a.m. game. Flood lights? Yeah, what was it? Any details? Did Elliot give us any details?

I just read Elliot's tweet to you. But what was the game that they had? We flew all the way down there for Elliot to give us no details. Hey, don't you spoil his fun. But where was the outdoor game that was in a cold location? Was it Lake Tahoe? Oh, yeah, the Lake Tahoe one. And then they had to like.

The sun. Who could have ever. Can't play the game. It is too sunny. The sun. Who could have ever counted the sun? But then the weird visual was they went back at like midnight. Remember they went back like really late.

It was pitch black. And then they had that great clip from it where McKinnon walked Petrangelo. Can't name a second thing from that game, but it was an unbelievable moment. Yeah. Where an NHL D-man sees Nathan McKinnon coming down and just goes, oh boy. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. He walks around.

You just know you're dead to rights. Yeah. I love that. Pretty good. So the Predators have lost seven of their last nine no no they've lost seven in a row and 11 of the last 13 that's it seven in a row what is what is barry trotz do with that lineup he some somebody's got to go i want to tell you what the coach said here's the quote and this is in quotation marks we could scratch every guy in our lineup but unfortunately we need players going at different times it for sure crosses your mind

but they have to earn it we could scratch every guy in our lineup how do you how do you start as a coach you need some tent poles to build on and you just feel like not a single guy is playing well. And then how do you go to the locker room after you just said, we can scratch every guy in our lineup? But they won't. Can't. They're not allowed to. Well, they're not scratching.

Stamkos? No. Marchessault? No. Forsberg? No. Okay. I don't know.

After that, does it really matter? Listen, I watched them play against... Who's their farm team? Milwaukee, isn't it? No. Milwaukee... Is Milwaukee... Maybe they were the Tampa Bay.

Anyways, riveting radio. I wonder if Ryan O'Reilly would say, I'm willing to go somewhere and try to win again. Jeez, that's interesting. I mean, that's a pretty big name and a very playoff-proven guy. It's Stamkos. He just got there. He's not going anywhere.

Forsberg's committed. He's not going anywhere. Marches, though, I cannot see them. Three years, I think. I can't see Marches. Oh, this and just two more. 4.5. Yeah, but it's also also like can it be like three

yeah or three and a half i would fetch them an asset i mean i think the leafs want him back no i i don't think they would mind him but like he turned them down yeah you got to remember that he doesn't want to be here he turned an offer from them down so even if you're toronto with all due respect ryan o'reilly you got a great reputation we love you but you yeah you didn't want us and so why do we want you now well the coach of your team won a stanley cup with him winning a con smith Okay, so if we find out that he left because of Sheldon Keefe, that he didn't get along with him, he didn't like his philosophy. That would be wild.

And now he's got a new perspective on what the team's all about and it wasn't other factors in, then I could buy into that. Now, you have been paying some attention to rosters and potential guys to get moved this year. Am I wrong in saying that? No, you're not. But in a couple of days, I'll come out on sportsnet.ca with some names. And it's not just for me.

It's finding out some intriguing names that may not necessarily be traded by March. But it's not impossible. But it's not impossible. I heard some things. And keep your eye on this. And if things don't happen necessarily between now and the trade deadline, They could easily carry into the draft, to free agency. And there's some teams that are looking for

possibility of shaking things up. Ottawa Senators is an example. We've heard a lot of noise with Brady Kachuk and the New York Rangers. But whether you believe that's true or not, it doesn't change the fact that if if these guys don't see a significant improvement in their consistency they're going to rattle this thing but let me ask you this you know so much talk about who could go out and that's not how you

get better who would the rate who would the debt or sorry the ottawa senators who would the senators want or what what type of player are the senators lacking to get them to where they're trying to be they just can't get over this hump right now i don't know if you saw the quotes from and lauer today uh most recent ones outside of uh soft I dropped this in our group chat. He says, from a player standpoint, they're so young. And thank goodness, Ann Lauer said, if we had a core that was more mature and behaved that way, we'd be in trouble. So I think it's a process.

That was in the midst of, you know, a longer article. But it's like, you know, I don't know. That doesn't sound. It was a great defense of his team that he tried to make. But his point is we're still young and we're still learning they need to turn that page at some point well then stop having your entire fan base tell us they're better than the Leafs every year then well that's a you thing no that's the sense it's like oh who's stopping this top six everyone I do believe that there's some pressure for 90 points once ever you know to make the playoffs yeah they can't go another year can they i mean financially

if you buy a team you probably would like to have an extra four games at home gates or so but they are i believe there is a good they're a good team and i believe they're they're in many ways all very good hockey players but if they lack chemistry to your point earlier then your job chemistry is is to go out there and find of equal value or better and change the chemistry

Ryan O'Reilly is the type of guy you need centerman, veteran, proven good guy I don't know well Claude Giroux is the veteran in that room. But Claude didn't win anything in Philly. No, I know. And the Leafs did that for years.

They got great veterans who hadn't won anything. But the veterans who had one that they got, David Perron is having, you know, whatever. His year is not really great. No, he's got some issues off the ice. That's right. So, not going gonna put it on him no guy like amadio wins a stanley cup but he's it he happens to be on a good team he's a nice

he's making a lot of money though yeah but like he's not gonna step up in the room and be like come on boys like grabbing him by the collar type of guy i don't know maybe he should and then who else they got got another guy this year. How about your buddy Gregor? Yeah, I mean, he's a nice player. I like him. Stusla's gone, I think, as one of those leaders. He's as untouchable as there is,

along with Brady Kachuk. I like Drake Batherson. The one that is interesting to me is Josh Norosh norris yeah been watching some of his uh film lately he needs to play with good players to have success i feel like he's he's quietly putting together a pretty good year oh yeah no he's i think he's a good player 30 plus goals the way he's trending right now for sure i think he's a good player but i mean you're talking about chemistry changing the room, big moves. I don't think trading Josh Norris for a first-round pick or whatever helps.

No, no, no, no, no, no. That's not it. You need NHL players. We're talking about new bodies in. Yeah. Oh, Nick Cousins was the other guy that they brought in. You need to be contributing to the team in a big way to be able to grab guys.

I just don't think they're very good. Huh? I just don't think they're very good. That's fair, too. But everybody else. Against the Leafs are great. That's the game they get up for. They own the Leafs.

But outside of that, they're not very good. And everybody tells you every year they're good. And it's just the same mix of guys. And, like, they paid them all. Let me ask you a question. They're all like, these are our guys. We're paying them all. And then you can't.

One more question here. Detroit and Buffalo. What a question. They're all like, these are our guys. We're paying them all. And then you can't. Most of the guys they pay. One more question here. Detroit and Buffalo. What a game. 28. Yeah. What a game. If they merged, could they make the play? That's a great question.

Yeah. So 28 games they've each played. They've each won 11 games. They've each lost 13 games. And they have an OTL of four. Overtime. They suck. They're identical. It's such a good drop.

11, 13, and 4. Regulation wins. Right? Everything's the same. Why is it people are all over the Buffalo Sabres for completely sucking and then Detroit doesn't get that same. I think Iserman has the history of like people think he built the team that won a cup. Or, you know, had a huge hand in it.

And so he has this grace. And he's also Steve Iserman. Kevin Adams is not Steve Iserman. Agreed. That's the perfect explanation. Kind of like that Hall of Fame, right? I think it's part of it. So it's kind of like that Hall of Fame, right? I think it's part of it. Maybe it's also proximity to Toronto.

You get a little bit more respect from the media, maybe. I guess that's what I'm saying, Brooksy. And one of, you know, my best buddies in the world, Keegan. It's actually his birthday today. Happy birthday, Keegan. Oh, happy birthday. He's a diehard Red Wings fan, and he says that they're, he always talks to me about their prospects, great drafting,

and all that stuff. And that's what he did in Tampa. They drafted unbelievably well. All those guys came up and contributed. And it just hasn't happened yet for the Red Wings. And his free agent signings stink. They also lost every draft lottery, too. But they just haven't signed one good free agent.

No. Nothing. It was a fun show today. I don't know why, but it was sneaky. Sneaky fun today. Good energy. know why, but it was sneaky. Sneaky fun today. Good energy. Right? Good guests.

Good friends. 30 seconds to screw it up. Good friends. All right. Our thanks to Ken Danico in our Leaf Edition hour, and then Steve Allicat at the top of this hour. Plenty of games tonight. Pick yours.

Enjoy it. And we're back. Same time, same place. Real Kipper and Bourne Show.