Real Kyper & Bourne - Vally's View: Goalie Swaps Before Christmas

Episode Date: December 16, 2025

Nick Kypreos and Justin Bourne get MSG analyst and CEO of Clear Sight Analytics Steve Valiquette's thoughts (4:34) on the goalie swap between the Edmonton Oilers and Pittsburgh Penguins, whether either Tristan Jarry or Stuart Skinner can perform better with their new teams and why it was the right time to trade goaltenders. Then, Vally shares why he sees a lack of confidence in Jacob Fowler, goalies being able to avoid letting pucks past their helmets, and the connection between the Minnesota Wild scouts and the Vancouver Canucks following the organisation's acquisition of Quinn Hughes. Then, on Grill the Panel, Valiquette asks which NHL team's environment is the best to play for as a goaltender. Then, Nick, Justin and Sam McKee discuss Jarmo Kekäläinen's first press conference as the Buffalo Sabres' newest general manager and Seth Jones' elbow to Brandon Hagel.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

There we go. It's the national hour on the Real Kipper and Bourne show. The Kippreel is Justin Bourne. Sammy McKee. We are live on Sportsnet, Sportsnet, 650 in Vancouver, 960 in Calgary. And streaming always on Sportsnet Plus, always available on Spotify, Apple Podcast, and YouTube. This hour of Real Kippenborn brought to you by. by Bet365.

And a few minutes, we'll welcome in, as always, on a Tuesday. Steve Aliquette, analyst with the New York Rangers on MSG. And if I'm reading this correctly, Sammy. Yes. CEO, ClearSight Analytics, and director of goaltending for Real Kipper and Borg. That was right? Was that the name? Brilliant.

Was that the name you said? That was the name. Right, but I screwed up Ben Pope's title, but I got that right. when did we add director of gold tending for real kipper and bourne show right now we made that decision on air we've talked about that three straight weeks but i know but you've never put it in the lineup before that is how it becomes official i did it today so on fridays what do we give doug mclean like director of like smart assness well i mean sure but i mean he director of crustiness i mean former general manager coach like i mean that's pretty good too

No, he needs a show title. Yeah, he needs direct. I'll come up with something. It's the director. Yeah. I'll come up with something. Director title's nice. Or VP's good.

God, Valley's just going to be so thrilled. He's going to be horned out. So thrilled. You know what's awesome? Tristan Jari and Stu Skinner are playing. Big night tonight. Okay. It's awesome.

I don't think I've, like, I'm a little older than you. It was a lot older than you. Like, when was the last time we saw two goalies flipped and then play each other, like, within, I don't know, three days? I'm sure it's happened. I don't know. It's hard. It would be rather hard. I know my dad tells a story about, I want to say it was John Tinelli.

Tinelli, someone got, they went to a game and they told the two guys to switch dressing rooms. It was Doug Waite and Essatikinen, if I'm not mistaken. That may have, yeah, maybe it's happened multiple times. I know in this case, the Islander guy didn't do it. It happened with the least, but not goalies. No, and yeah, playing that night. You're right. You're right.

It's very uncommon. Very rare. I think Skinner made some comment about just ripping the Band-Aid off. Like, you're on a new team now. You're going to play the old team. First game. It's never going to get harder than this. Just go play them.

Because he's had, I guess, travel visas-ish. I'm not going to pretend to know anything about this, but he couldn't play. Work permits, whatever. It feels like McDavid's going to get, like, 11 on them. Or zero. One of the other. Maybe 11's high.

Two? I think you can pitch a shout-out. Yeah. Well, one of two things is happening. It's going great or awful. Do they, like, he was loved there, right? He was a really, like, beloved teammate. Well, teammate-wise, they loved them.

Yeah. Loved him. I actually think fans loved the man. Yeah. Didn't love the result. I rather hate somebody who can help me win. Yeah, I see your point. Particularly when you're this close to a cup.

If I'm on, like, Chicago and we're not winning the cup, I'll take a good guy. But, like, you can only have, like, one of those guys. You can't have. Like, it doesn't work if you got, like, four of them. No. So, no, it's going to be really cool to watch those. and it's a lot of pressure on Jari too where just seeing Stan Montembo

to the rocket de laval for a stint deconditionment Like you made a comment about Jari Saturday night with a couple of those like rebounds and Easton Cowan's gold didn't look very pretty

It was awful Right two mile an hour shot he kicked right onto Cowan's stick You guys are looking for an excuse to crap on on Jari. No.

That's what you're doing. Looking for an excuse. Leifes biased, the two of you. You want the Oilers to, you want to make fun of the Oilers. We wanted Biddington to the Oilers. That's what kept on. That's what you wanted.

You wanted Bennington. You didn't get your way. Now you're going to be hard on Jari. I've been hard on Jari for a long time. He could strike lightning. I don't like the chances, but I'm not saying it's impossible. Yeah.

I mean, I agree that it's risky. You know, I mean, gosh, Skinner, the number. were never good, but you did see him play in some big games. Jari hasn't been there. Seven series wins for two Skinner. Okay. Let's go to our

director of goaltending for Real Kipper and Born Show, and then there's some other part about CEO or something that's really not that important, but they've now labeled you the director of goaltending for our show here. How do you feel

about that? I only have five jobs right now. I've got room for six. Awesome. Okay, so we're just picking up on, first of all, the rarity of two goalies getting swapped and then playing so quickly against one another. But your overall thoughts of the trade and, you know, whether or not Jari, quite frankly, is big enough or good enough to take Edmonton to that next level, which would we all agree would be a Stanley Cup. we don't know because he hasn't done it before and the only predictor of future success is past performance and we haven't seen it since he was with the edmonton oil kings and the w hl but with the goalie swap tool had jari taken all of the shots that he faced from last season as well as this season and the quality that he performs in those 39 different shot types and plug and play in edmonton's net he would have stopped 15 more goals goals than both Skinner and Pickard combined. But the caveat there is only five would come off of Skinner's ledger. Ten would be on Pickers ledger.

So if you want to say him versus Skinner, it's a plus five. Does that move the needle for you? I don't know. But Edmonton is known for giving up a lot of breakaways and the goalie is not performing well on breakaways. Jari is a very strong breakaway goalie. The same goes for rebounds. However, Jari and that net is going to face more broken plays, more screens,

where he underperforms Skinner's level on those two shot categories. It'll be a different look. The goals will look a little different, but you're getting close to the same result. But the change itself, in this case, was needed for both Skinner and Jari. That's my feel. So before I ask you my goalie question, is your office across the street from Madison Square Garden? Yeah, this is the boardroom. at MSG networks.

You're in the off. Okay. Yeah, this is the boardroom. This is where I have my pregame meetings with producer, director, et cetera, and then we go across the street. But we have five different studio locations, including on the bridge at the garden, ice level at the garden. Across here, we have multiple places that we do shooting. So, yeah, we've got five different studios to shoot from.

That is extremely cool. Okay, back to goaltending. Well, yeah, you're a TV stud now. I love this stuff. This is so cool. You're, you're, that's the best way to be. Are you going to stay on the trade still? Yes.

Okay, go. Yeah, yeah. Go on. Very excited. Okay. Who, which goalie then, knowing that you're talking about your trades or your goalie swap tool. Do you like the odds of one of them becoming something different than they've always been?

Is there any chance that Skinner is all the sudden, we look back at this trade and go, God, they traded Skinner? Like, could that happen here? You know, I take a deep breath because I don't. see it. Okay. I just don't. You know, when, and I want to root for both teams and to have success. I've worked closely with both teams a long time. And I think that, you know, I'm hoping for the best for both of these scenarios. And I, you know, Borny, what I see is just movement based. And technique alone doesn't stop the puck. We know that. There's a level of compete that's

necessary, the environment plays a role. But from what I've seen from both guys, they're just not moving at the level, at the level, at the level of the top guys. And in the way the game's being played right now, if it's not point shots with heavy traffic, it's east to west. And I think the further we get down the road here for players being able to adapt the way they have over the last 10 years to the play styles that have been working at scoring goals, the skill level that keeps raising, that bar is not really being met from those two goalies.

You're watching and listening to Steve Aliquette, of course, CEO, ClearSight Analytics, but more importantly, our director of goaltending for Real Kipper and Bourne show. So, Valley, we heard from the Abrampton Oilers and Stan Bowman, and the sense that he gave us, was that it was just time we needed something different we needed a change and I'm just wondering

what did you think of the timing this is before Christmas there's not a lot out there the sake of making a change just for making a change and then picking the guy that you think is most available right now would you have waited would you prefer to see what happened in the new year who came more available of course I threw up Bennington to Edmonton, there wasn't a sense that he was ready to go now, but who knows after the Olympics? Would you have waited longer than mid-December for Edmonton to make their big move? I got traded myself, Kipper, before Christmas in the OHL, and it really helped. I was able to play five games for the Eriottors before Christmas break, settled in

understood expectations, understood teammates and their responsibilities and strength players and how the P.K. worked. And I was able to have a break at Christmas to digest it just to get off the moving train. And we have never seen a goalie get traded at the deadline, get into that team that is most likely a contender if they're getting into that type of the situation and perform at a high level and steal a playoff series. Haven't seen it. So I think this is the time rather than wait and see what else becomes available the timing is before christmas i've always believed in that you've got to get in there and get acclimated so i do like the timing all right that's fair yeah i love that um vali i want to get your sense of how how lucky is it possible to get

really lucky when you're not a great goaltender for what stretch of time and i'm asking that because i think a lot of people i've read uh talk about dennis hildeby and i've talked to you about them and other people. There's not a ton of people who are like, this guy is a premier athlete or reader of the player. You know, the reviews are not unbelievable. But 11 games, he's a 923 save percentage this year trying to make heads and tails of is he going to come back to earth or is maybe he better than people think? So, you know what, Corny, it's not just the shots faced. It's the sequences face per game, which is typically 70. And if you look at shot, but don't reach the net. That's what I would look at. And you have to remind yourself

that because of the way you guys played the game, you're probably more attracted to watching your position than the full scope of the game. I know I am. I mean, Borny, I watch the game through a straw for the most part. And I'm just really, I'm looking at the goalie and then I'm seeing everything around it. And oftentimes I have to, especially when I'm covering a Ranger game, go back and watch it again, see what everyone else's role was in that play and where they were missed assignments, et cetera. With the goaltender, Borny, you can see when somebody's not confident before a goal scored if they're going up and down before the puck even reaches the net.

It's always a bad look where the puck is shot from the point. It hits a shin pad five or six feet away from the goalie, and the goalie's gone up and down twice. Or you're like, hey, this guy is not fighting for sight lines. He has no confidence to hold his feet. A compliment that a goalie coach will give you after a strong performance would be, you know what you were on your feet all night tonight when the puck didn't come to the net you were on your feet all night tonight you look quiet and patient you barely moved NHL goalies the top guys

they moved less and they move less distance and it has a look and it's posture and competence with feet under you and for Hill to be I watch all the shots on goal orney and there are a lot where behind traffic as an example he gets really small and sits in his crouch and for a few of his starts when you talk about luck it doesn't show up in broken plays it shows up in area of net missed the shot just hits him but he's sitting in his crouch and here i am watching the video saying boy oh boy that thing's an inch higher it's in the net i can see it you know you can see it if i showed it to you i know that not everybody is trained to watch goalies but the goalie guys know a young goaltender that uh comes to

into the league with a lot higher billing than Hilda B is Montreal Canadiens, Jacob Fowler. You saw him Saturday night at MSG. Your thoughts. Yeah, I was, to what I just said there, it's an extension of that conversation just didn't look confident. Confident goal-tending is, it has an attitude that looks like I want the puck. And you can see the posture is always forward because it's as if the net is in front of you guys. all of us goalies that mature around 25 to 27, it's almost like we all have that light bulb moment where we finally realize the net's in front of us. And as soon as you forget about protecting the big object behind you, you stop tracking your body back towards protecting it and are really

forceful at hovering down and over your pads and making your saves in front of you, at the imaginary net in front of you. And, you know, I played for Pete Peters. I was with the Oilers, and he was a really good goalie coach to give you that three-dimensional view of the net. He would attach dog leashes to the crossbar and bring it right down to the puck, and then you'd hop in the net guys in your butterfly, and you'd say to yourself, oh, my God, I only have to move two inches to make a blocker save here. That's my crossbar. My crossbar for my glove save is six inches, and that's the maximum distance a goalie should move their gloves to make a save if you're playing the net in front of you. And that's the idea. Everything

is in front of you. I had this conversation with Ken Dryden. And, you know, one thing Ken said to me, guys, was I didn't want to be a stand-up goalie. I had to out of protection. So if you take those dog leash lines and you take it to the face off dot the way Pete Peters did, the reason why Ken Dryden came out far and stood up was because the crossbar was at his belly button. And he said to me, the modern goalie has been able to back up in the crease because they have better padding in the upper body and a better helmet so you can back up and now be a little more vulnerable around your shoulders and neck area because that crossbar is in an area now that you have to go and reach and attack it and because the game has moved so east to west you have

to play a little deeper in your crease now to be available on your edges I actually want to ask you about that players shoot off goalie's helmets from tough angles now shoot for the head shoot up around the ears. Is that, do we feel like that's disrespectful? Does it bother goaltending? Goaltenders, can you goaltend that? Like, what are your feelings about players doing that? My thoughts are, Borny, that the trapezoid should be the zone where the goalie gets into

a reverse VH. But he should not be sitting in that as a setup before a player enters that trapezoid. If you take the trapezoid from below the goal line and just extend it up into the zone, imagine that that would be where a goalie should transition into the. that reverse VH down on one knee and if you go before it you deserve to get hit in the head because oh yeah giving the target to everybody and you know what furthermore you want to hear a good story at a gentleman's club in Moscow that's a good way to start in the story yeah run into dominic cash it okay and I thanked him because I read an article in the hockey news when he was

at the Buffalo Sabres that he said a good NHL goalie should never just get hit in the head think about that he said and he was telling me if you're just going to get hit in the head that means you're just staring at it and you blindly just take it in the head like you didn't see it coming a good NHL goalie should catch it a good NHL goalie should have the timing that they come down with the puck the only time a goalie should ever get upset at a teammate for hitting them in the head is if it's four feet over the net but if you go down early into a butterfly and get hit in the head on your way down you're not a real NHL goalie you're not a real NHL goalie you're not. So I think that what, you know, and what Hashick said to me was, I used to tell guys, if I

was ever getting puck shy, pile of pucks in the high slot, just shoot at my face. Just shoot at my face and I'm going to watch it with my eyes open the entire way. And one of the exercises I use with the goalies that flinch, and this is a common problem, especially through high school and junior, is I tell them to grab a piece of wood, grab some nails and a hammer and keep their eyes open as they make contact on the head of the nail and just and not flinch their eyes at all. Or

sponge puck's from the slot, you don't have to use hash-it style with the vulcanized rubber, the real puck, but use a sponge puck. When I was with the Oilers, that's the way Mack T. used to help everybody get confident in blocking shots. Just use sponge pox just to get the proper technique so you could take away the long side of the net.

Really cool. Valley, I know when you're not on Tuesdays with us, do listen a lot and I know that you caught Dan Boyle talking power plays and it was a good conversation. Anyone that

missed it, you can always download it on Spotify or YouTube Apple and just in terms of our Leaf Edition hour, the struggling Toronto Maple Leaf power play and what they can do and they still got world class talent on it, but you

have some thoughts on what a goaltender see. on the fundamentals of what makes a power play go. Yeah, you know, I think that one thing I can help people with is just how do you make a goalie feel uncomfortable? I'm an expert at that. Now, when I listen to your show when I'm away from New York and I'm typically on a chairlift in Vermont,

that's where I get the most out of feeling like I'm in the locker room, okay? When I was listening to that conversation, here's what I liked. Now, Dan Boyle, he was here, what a stud defense, and saw the game in a spectacular way. And the play that he was referring to was the low play, below the goal line, specifically on a five on three or a five on four, this works really well where the first play of the game is receive it and throw it at the goalie's feet. Now, it's really good for two reasons, because everybody knows it's coming so you can get. at chaos, you might get a broken play at netfront. But the best reason and why it helps later on in the game and it helps you at five on five is the goalie will not be able to cheat on your pass and get ahead because goalies are always trying to locate the receiving

player in the slot and then cheat on the pass and get ahead of it so they can get ice and get aggressive. But now you have to honor the low play because you know this is a team that will potentially throw it at your feet and make you look bad. So you always have that on your mind and you can't jump the pass. So that's a great way to start any power play because especially when you have a team that's really struggling to be on the same page. The first one is everybody's connected and this was Tortorella's thing and it always made sense to me as a goalie.

And then from there, you can freelance and play your style and let you guys be creative. But everything, you know, I talked to Adam Mote's over the years or Scott Gomez, who was close with Adam Oates, really into the power play stuff. They always tell me that the most important aspect of the power play is knowing where your outs are. And that's knowing where all your players are. And, you know, one thing that I've really worked on over the years, guys, is I've tried to figure out where most goals are scored from off of passes because you typically need a pass to move the goalie, get them down on their

knees before shooting specifically on a power play. Where the Toronto Maple Leafs haven't done a great job is they haven't created enough high danger scoring chances. They take too many five on five shots. Now, if you were to stand on the face off dot, just to the left of the goalie, you where the puck gets dropped and you skate towards the net and stop with your stick at the bottom of the circle don't go any further that is the biggest opening to the mouth of the net with the most vertical angle which requires the goalie to move the most that's the honeyhole of hockey so if you have a player there on the power play and there's a play in the right corner you should be able to blind that puck there or if you're at net you can blind the backhand

there you can blind it off the top circle so there are reasons in focal areas where teams could position themselves better to be a better threat to score for sure. Yeah, that's good insights. I wanted to also get you your take on, like one of the complaints I've seen watching the Leafs all the time is that they're bad to dump in the puck in. They dump it to the goalies too much. So how much do you talk with goalies about puck play and getting out of the net and their role in instigating a forecheck?

Is it more or less than it used to be in years past that you have goalies coming out? So I work on it every day when I'm training goalies every session. I'm on the ice, actually, a lot right now with everybody back from college and prep school on break. We have four calls. All number one is play it. That means there's a forecheck on you. And the key for any team when they're working with their goaltender is they have to start yelling it at the top of the circle, scream it. It's only two words.

Play it, play it. The goaltender makes up their mind. And I like them to stay strong side on the forehand, put it on the glass, get it away from traffic. that's the safest way to get out of your zone. The second call is leave it. And the goalie must leave it on the goal line, not above the goal line because it can't be a threat to enter their own net. When the puck is left on the goal line just outside the trapezoid,

the receiving defenseman can go up ice or he can wheel the net. The next play is reverse. A reverse is on the backhand. Now, this is important. Any puck that's dumped in on the goalie, whether it's coming on strong side or weak side on their backhand side, the goalie's on his backhand on both plays. he's blind to his right corner, and that's always the reverse side. It doesn't matter what side it gets dumped on. If you call the goalie by name, then fan out and get a complete pass on the tape. And those are the four calls. In that, it's simple language. Everybody understands it and you don't get messed up. When I see a goalie that handles the puck really well, if I'm playing against that goaltender, I don't let them touch it. What I do is I hammer it from center ice on the ice because if it's left or right of the goal, he will be putting

in the corner and then we can get a jump on on the forecheck or low blocker low blocker is a great shot too because it's always in play valley got your thoughts on the big jari trade uh with skinner i'd be remiss to not ask you about quinn hughes in minnesota and whether or not this gets them closer into conversations with dallas and colorado for for the western conference so this is a i'm fascinated with scouting i was around these guys for a couple years when i was working for the Islanders, and they have a different language. It's fascinating. I love listening to Jason Buchla when he comes on your show.

You just hear it in their voice. They have a passion for it. These guys do everything for our game, and the best staffs have the most success and really give you the flexibility to make trades. When I was looking at, there's a guy by the name of Kevin Gilmore, and he was on the Jason Greger show not too long ago, guys, you could pick it up on YouTube. I know you've had Jason on your show. He's a terrific guy that I've been on his show before.

And Kevin Gilmore did a study on all of the best drafting GMs over the last 20 years. And Yarmal Kekalainen is 22 and a half percent success rate of players playing 300 games in the drafts that he held. That was the highest over the time that he was a GM in Columbus. The average is 12%. So I can see why Buffalo makes that move, too, just to pivot to Buffalo for a second. Why don't they just keep him as a scout then? Well, I think that he's in charge of, you know, when he was GM, Dem Kipper in Columbus, he was in charge of the scouting staff and, you know, helped have the

proper structure to be able to pull the best players. I think that's going to help them. But, you know, how about Buffalo? You know, they're already at 14 years. Now, let's call it another five. That's the tough part to swallow. But different conversation. What's fascinating about this Minnesota, Vancouver trade is the scouts that were involved

there, Jed Brackett, Judd Brackett and Dan Palango, they drafted all of these players in the Vancouver drafts. Listen to this. Bo Horvatt, Retanin, Jared McCann, Besser, Eliza Patterson, Quinn Hughes, Hod Colson. If not for an injury, only Uleve would have been a first rounder that's stuck as well. So that's eight first round picks. And the players, guys, they're hitting at a success rate in the first round at 88%. Like in New York here, guys, we've had nine first rounders since I think it was the 17 or 18 draft. We only have two playing for the Rangers right now, Lafran Schneider. Like, I've seen how hard it is to hit on first rounders. And later round picks, they had 10 other players, which would include like Demco

and Ben Hutton and Forsling. Like they've done a really good job. The ironic thing is, is that in 2020, there was an article that was in ESPN today written about this. In 2020, Ben and fired these two guys. And they went to Minnesota. And all they've done is draft over the last five, six years the same way in Minnesota. And all the guys they traded for Vancouver in this huge deal came from Minnesota out of the drafts from these two guys, Judd Brackett and Dan Plango, and what irony. What a circle. The guy, what a circle. You know, I'm reading about this and learning about this.

And I'm like, oh, my God, this is a story in itself. So really neat article that I read here on this today. The next five years after Judd Brackett and Dan Plango were fired, it says in this article, they were only able to select one player that just played 50 games in the NHL, and that's Elias and Peders and the defenseman. So it's amazing, the irony, but they would, you know, it's funny, too, because you hear like some of these circles of where people had success, L.A. in the early 2000s, their staff goes to Tampa Bay. Tampa Bay drafts a ton of great guys. Dallas, same thing.

A lot of these circles of scouts that are lesser known in the mainstream, but should be, you know, front runners for, you know, I would say even plucking them off of where they are for more money. Like, scouts got to get paid more. You know, that's how trades are going to get made. They can make her break you. I love that. I love all the scouts listening right now. Being like, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, totally agree. Because they should. Well, you know, guys, what did it take for coaches to start getting paid at the value? You know what? You know what the Valley? Moneyball vilified scouts. Moneyball made them look like a bunch of meatballs who didn't know anything about anything. And that wasn't fair.

No, it's a bunch of BS. You know, these guys do everything for the game. And they allow you to have flexibility to make trades or not. That's why Ben, Vancouver was making this trade with Minnesota. That's the only reason why. And you like it for many. I mean, Quinn Hughes, control half a game.

Oh, yeah. Like, you know, again, okay, so analytics do play a role for me. It helps me get to the video quicker, really. Yeah, I'm really a video watcher. And, Boney, I know you are too. Yeah, it just leads you, gives you the flags to know what to look at. Correct. And, you know, just give me a shortcut.

So I'm, of course, watching a bunch of Quinn Hughes video after the deal gets done. And look, man, this guy, 121 times this year. set his teammates up for scoring chances. That's most among all defensemen, right? And they have a pretty weak, odd man rush, Minnesota. That's going to get them up ice and give them advantage that way. You can't win a Stanley Cup without, you know, a few different layers to your offense. Minnesota is doing a great job.

But to get in there and, you know how it is, to get seating the right way, you need an, you need a overhead attack. Okay, I know we're going to get to grill marks here pretty soon, but one more for me, One more for me, and that is culture and healthy scratches. The 2024 first round pick for Chicago is not playing tonight because he went to the rink late yesterday. I think there's Zabandajad also with a veteran here. Just your thoughts on culture and what's going on in New York with Zabandajad.

So what happened was there were five players that live in New York City that have to get to the training center, which is 45 minutes away. Four of them were on time for the meetings. Sabanajad was not. So as we know, and I hear you guys complaining about Toronto, it's the same here in New York, right? It's tough to get around. So four guys make it on time. Zab Anad does not. He sits out last night, and I see both sides of it.

Okay. But here's one thing I've seen a bit of a pattern on here. over the last few years. Chris Kreider last year was a healthy scratch, and it was made public. Jacob Truba, there was a leaked text message among the GMs last year, and he was on the trade list,

and I got leaked, and he was let go. And Schisturkin, his contract got leaked, and now we have Zabanajad. And my first thought is, is this first step to try to get this guy to town? You know, how can you not think that way? Right. Because there's sort of a pattern here.

Now, by the same token, maybe, and this is what we don't know, we're just speculating, maybe Zabanajad has a history of being late, and they're just fed up and they're like, you know what, I know I can't shame or blame a millionaire, but I can take away their ice time or I can healthy scratch them, and that's the way I'm going to get them. And maybe get a voice out to the rest of the team that if I can scratch an assistant captain for being late, that's our team cultural. That's our standard. So I can see from that perspective as well.

Of course, I don't know the answer, but there is a pattern there. you know, you'd be silly not to see it. I bet you were never late. I was never late. And then Mike. You can, if you're a backup and you're late, you might as well just not show up. They're an hour early.

There are no mistakes for fourth liners and backups. I'd rather be dead than be late for a practice, okay? Rather be dead. We used to go. Our bus would leave from, so we were in Alaska in college. And so we'd fly out on Sunday mornings at like 7 a.m. So the bus would leave at the airport like four.

She'd come home from the bar. and not want to miss the bus. You just go on the bus. They'd leave it unlocked. You just fall asleep on the bus post bar to make sure three hours early for a bus departure. Those college kids, so smart. I've been in a lot over the summer.

I know how the sun doesn't go down there and it's very dark in the winter. It can't be easy to wake up. Absolutely. All right. Boys, drill marks, drill the panel. By the way, Morton's is out. Oh, they're out, eh?

They're out. Open door for Ruth's, Chris. Working on my next deal. All right. Guys, here's the leaderboard right now. We've got, Borny, you had a big week last week. You're at 19 points. Keper, you dropped a second.

You're 18 points. McKee's at 17 points. I haven't heard McKee. Is he here today? Hey, buddy. All right. You're in the mix. Today we're going to talk goaltending, okay?

And we're going to talk about the goalie environment, where you play matters. Sometimes you can play for a team. And, you know, the reason why I like this stat is because when I was playing, you could always debate is my. My partner getting the hard games and I'm getting the easy games or vice versa. It's always a narrative around the team. And sometimes, like this year in New York, you wouldn't believe how much better the team is defending in front of Shistercun than they are in front of Jonathan Quick. Like, it's not even close.

If you looked at them on a leaderboard, you'd think they're on two different teams. That's how much harder the environment's been for Jonathan Quick. Happened sometimes. Now, we're going to talk about the best environment in the NHL. where's the easiest place to play is it Thompson, Washington, Sorokan Islanders, Walsdad, Minnesota.

Walstead. I got my pick. I'm going. I'm going to wait a minute. I'm going to have to back something up here because I made a little error, but I'm going to fix it. This is based on the best safe percentage differential,

which means it's the difference between the quality faced and saved. So Walsstead, Syroken, Thompson. They play in a certain environment. It doesn't matter how difficult it is, but how much better is their safe percentage based on the quality they're based. I'm going to change mine. I'm going to go

Sorokin. I'm sticking Walshdad and many. I'm going to go Seroquen, too. Okay. It's Walsstad and good call there. Sam. Sam. His environment is 903, but he's saved 931. Wow. So that's a plus.

Yeah, he's got the best differential there. All right. Now, the best environment is, again, based on the ease of who you're playing behind. And the best environment is one of these three guys. It's DeSmith and Dallas. Again, Walshead in Minnesota or Wedgwood in Colorado. I'm going to take Wedgwood in Colorado. What are the other two?

I like to Smith. I like to Smith. I'll go. I'm going mini again. Wallstead. Okay. It's DeSmith. McKee's on fire rate.

Oh, no, oh, no. I'm like 0 for six. Let's go, man, slump. This is a three-pointer. So, McKee, you're right back to the mix now. You're actually in the lead now. Okay. The worst environment.

What goalie has had the worst array of shots face this year? Goose of Wall. Markstrom, Anderson and Carolina, or Sorokin? I'm going to say, I'm going to say my boy, Anderson. Uh, I'll take Markstrom. I'll take Markstrom, too. Anderson. Sam McKee, everyone.

It's a wild one. They have given up the most rush chances this year, Carolina has. They've given up the most breakaways. They've really changed the way they play guys. They are gone and see you later. They leave the goalies for everything. That's based off the one game they play against police where they keep it so much.

I got grill marks on my ass right now. Valley, not bad for guys. who thinks they should replace goalies with a board. Oh, you know what? I'm still sensitive to that comment. I don't know. I almost fell off the chairlift when I heard that. Valley, bringing it big time, buddy.

Yep, we're going to see a good one here. We've got Vancouver across the street right now, and I'm going to tighten my tie and get to work. Just quickly. We've got to let him go. No, no, just one second. Like New Jersey missing out on Quinn Hughes, and if that wasn't bad enough, they lose to Vancouver.

Well, you know what? I actually looked something up before we came on. Give me two seconds here. How about this? He's going to be late for his game. It's okay. Listen to this. Listen to this.

The devil's drafted Holtz ahead of Rossi, Salyab ahead of Zee, Booiam, and Nemich ahead of Ogren. And those were the players that made that deal. So think about that. Minnesota, those guys that they drafted, in some cases they moved up in the draft to select them, which takes a lot of onions. And on top of that,

they were players that New Jersey could have had and they could have completed the deal. Wow. Tell you what, this may speed up Vancouver a little bit in the next few years. It's a good trade. I'm telling you, we had that booium in here at the beginning of the year. That guy is a stud.

He could skate, eh? He can get up and down the ice. you can play the game it won't be that much of a drop off off of hues in a few years yeah that's great to hear for vancouver fans valley awesome stuff great directing okay buddy enjoy the week we'll catch up to you soon that is steve aliquette CEO of real kipper and born wow i just got i don't know what he is i just got smoking hot there yeah he's going to jump the whole leader board uh it's game time is that by bet three six five visit the athlete of odds and see Why, it's ever ordinary, bet 365, must be 19 plus,

Ontario only, please play responsibly. So 10 games on the ice tonight, but for our national audience, I'm just going to focus right in on the Leaf, so love that. A lot of Maple Leafs hosting the Chicago Blackhawks in what both Kipper and I called in the first hour, a must win, can't lose game.

I called the free points. Okay. The leaders got called, who's squeaky over there? Leaders got called out by Craig Barubei after last game with a bad effort against the Edmonton Oilers. give me tonight a parlay of Austin Matthews to score a goal

and William Nealander to score a goal both of them anytime goal including overtime at plus 500 for a goal from both of those guys tonight that's good value I think both those guys are going to show up they have to or else you know the least are going to lose a can't lose game

and that would be bad so a Austin Matthews to score a goal and William Neander to score anytime goal parley at plus 500 and what another thing that I want to to bring up quickly. Fowler starting again tonight for the Habs. We heard Valley talking about how he thought he looked a little bit nervous.

He is starting at home against the Philadelphia Flyers. They are favorites in that game. Minus 125. Flyers holding a playoff spot right now. Sneaky good this year. Don't hate them as a plus 105 underdog. I think it would be the kid's home debut, right? Because I think he's played both of his games on the road.

That I don't know. I think that's right. Anyways, I'm just going to say it's right. That was game time, presented by Bet365. Visit the Afflead Assize and CY. It's ever ordinary Bet 365 and 17 plus. And Terry only, please play responsibly. Okay, let's take a quick break.

And when we return, the Buffalo Sabres, address the media for the first time since making major changes. We'll get into all that next when we return to Real Kipper and Bourne. Hey, it's Blake Murphy. And I'm Matt Bonner. Join us weekday mornings at 11 as we break down all things Toronto Raptors. It's the Raptor show on SportsNet. 590 the fan and wherever you get your podcasts

as a reminder as a reminder this hour of real Kipprin-Born brought to you by Bet 365. That Kipuris, Justin Boren, Sammy McKee, Yarmow Kekalainen. Now the big cheese here. So that was a pretty good stat that Valley gave us, that his

draft picks are like at 22% when everyone else is the one thing that stood out to me that helps you there and not to take away from that stat is just that the Columbus mostly wasn't very good right a lot easier for a guy to collect

200 games for a team one round in the bubble is what they've I mean he made playoffs five times yeah there wasn't a bubble when they beat Columbus I mean when they beat Tampa it wasn't the bubble no lost a bubble they lost to no they beat Toronto yeah that doesn't count as a playoff series win that was a play in

I'm reaching, I get. Man, the Leafs came back from 3-0-0 down with like four minutes left in that game. Matthew scored an overtime. Anything earth-shattering that you picked up, like, at the end of the day, you could have predicted this thing

the moment Yarmo joined. Yeah, and I hate that. You know, like, if you don't believe in your GM and you want to hire someone you think is better, just do it. I know. You know, oh, you bring in the, He's got the scythe and the grim reaper hood

was standing beside you. Who are you going to trade? Kevin Adams must have been told that Yarmo's going to come in. I wouldn't think he hired him on his own. Nope. You don't necessarily want to go out and hire your replacement. How's that handshake? Like, hey, welcome.

You know, let me show you where everything is. Yeah, I don't know. He didn't give his coach any good vibes. We have a couple clips. play the first one. This is on Lindy Ruff, Derek. Clip one. Well, Lindy's resume speaks for himself itself.

He's been a great coach in the league for a long time. I've really enjoyed my interaction with him day to day. He works. He's tail off every day. He's early. He's watching tape. He's analyzing. He's talking to the players.

He's got a good line of communication with him. And he's looking for ways to get better. So, you know, I've really enjoyed my time so far with Lindy. What does that mean? There's no changes in the coaching staff? We're going to evaluate everything moving forward, whether it's the scouting staff, management, coaches. Everybody is under evaluation at this point.

But there are a lot of good people here that are great at their jobs. There's just... Just I'm the only one that's not being evaluated. Yeah, everyone's under evaluation but me. There's no way I can look at the Sabres roster and be like, a different coach would have them. them succeeding like no no say what you want about lindy payton crab's top line noa ocelain second line like you don't watch the game very well there's there's not enough here i just i see when you don't

when you come out and kind of sugarcoat the whole thing all your he's a sitting duck we know that right well i maybe at the end of the year when you when you've got when you've got a split in the room and this isn't per se a Lindy thing. This is just in general that you've got you may have five or six guys that hate them, Lindy. Yeah. And then you're pretty much like six,

six and six or seven, seven and seven, right? Love them, hate them, and then everybody in the middle. But when you got six or seven guys in there that really can't wait for you to get fired that that's sending a message to those five or six guys that comment or that the lack of that like something will happen well you know we're reassessing them right it's like you got five or six guys going like boys let's just you know i mean lindy's done here we'll just continue

to do our own thing you know i i i i've seen it i've heard it i've listened to guys i do I can't wait for this guy to get fired. I do believe that you got to just... It didn't help him. That's all I'm saying is it didn't help Lindy. Yeah. Hearing that from Yarmo. Nope, that's fair.

Seth Jones? Good on. Yeah, I'm good. Yeah, I'm good. Seth Jones, yeah. I tweeted some of my take on this. Kip, you and I haven't given each other our takes yet. Yeah.

That is an elbow to the chops, man. I thought it was at least worth a hearing. if not a suspension. It's fully extended elbow. It wasn't the meat of the contact. It got him. It hit him. It's an elbow to the head that knocked out of the game.

But it's also an elbow to the chest and the shoulder too. And his head didn't, it wasn't a pick. It wasn't his head snapping back. No. But so it's not blindside, but it's just so clearly an elbow to me. Yeah.

Did he not even a two minute elbow penalty? And Hagle left the game and didn't return. So there is injury. So let me go down the checklist here. I'm okay. I'm okay with a non-suspension. Let me go to the checklist. Yeah.

Targeted towards the head. No. No, zero. Zero. I'm not giving you that. Target is chest, shoulder, elbow. History between the two teams. Okay.

I'll give you that. The not Seth Jones history, is there? I mean, they've been going after this guy for four straight games. Every time they play against each other, they're trying to kill him. Good. Fun. To watch. I'm just saying

it's preferential treatment. It's just how do you not get a fine for that? I don't see how you really believe. That's going to make you feel better. A fine? Anything to acknowledge that the fact that one of the star players in the league,

a guy who's going to represent Canada at the Olympics, who has had history with that team, gets elbowed in the face, knocked out of a game, and they just, that's fine. Bobby McMahon does that, he's gone three games. So let's work this back.

No question. Let's work this back. So then your implication is that George Peros doesn't want to suspend Seth Jones because he likes Florida. And he wants him to beat your Toronto Maple Leafs. So your logic is Peros is a giant Panthers fan. I just think that it's...

It's just dumb logic. I just think that there's something to the fact that like there's multiple things that have happened where they just don't even, they look the other way. Like, how is that a look the other way situation? But you're a kept sitting in here, and he doesn't think it's a suspension. Well, of course not, because he's Mr. League. Mr. League, League, League, Leigh, Leigh, like, oh, it's perfect hit.

Lead to this elbow, kicks out his knee just what we want the league. His head didn't snap back, not one bit. Because he's not a big faker. He's not a big cry baby. Like, so if he goes, like you, like you. If he goes fly in the back and lies on the ice and it's a penalty, he elbowed him in the chin. There's prior history.

He kicks out his knee. It's a dirty play. So I'll give you a two minute elbow, if it would shut you up. Give him a hearing. How does he not get a fine? I do feel like he's worried about getting beat by Hagel and like extending to get a piece.

Thank you. Thank you. That's not justification. How about renting in now? Oh, my renting. It's a dirty player, man. Moving past the league stuff here. They give the Panthers preferential treatment.

There's no denying it. Ranting it. There's no denying it. Anyway. Corey Perry, do you watch it a little of that? I did watch it. Miko Ranton and, eh? Oh, just this guy couldn't get more unlucky with these whoopsies, eh?

But yeah, I love him. Yeah. I love him. Oh, I think he caught Scott Mayfield's skates on that one, didn't he on the way in? I think that's what happened. He kept to skate on the way into that Opsie, you know. Third one and six weeks where he's hurt someone. You get a hearing?

Probably not. Doesn't play with the Leafs. He's fine. Oh, my God. He's out of the league if he plays a league. Just play. I got a suggestion. Just play deeper in your net goalies.

He's a decrease. Randman's a criminal. No, no, no. Just play on. All good. Sam Bennett did that. The Stollars in the playoffs. Randon's new Bennett.

Change the whole playoffs. All good. He's new Bennett. Good battle in front of the net. Whoever shot it off Kemper, that's ice cold. Someone banked it off him while he's... Hopefully he's fine. Yeah.

Shake it off. Hey, Rantanin officially, let's get this guy in reputation watch. That's three in like six weeks. He's going into MVP territory right now, that rant him in. He's going to be Patrick Colletta while he's winning MVP. And he turned down the Leafs, Sammy. Kipper said, somebody texting it and says, Kipper needs to join Prison Paul's team.

Paul Maris. Yeah. Mr. Panther. So what do you think you should have got? A game? Yes, or a fine. An acknowledgement that you're not allowed to do that to a star player. But it's okay

because he plays the Panthers. We had a guy attempt to hit. Here's what will happen. Shouldn't we pat him on the back these days? Here's what we'll have. And here's what's the worst part of this going to happen. I don't know when they play next.

But Tampa guy, they'll send out a guy. He'll do something dirty. And that guy will get suspended. Just like happening in the preseason. I just can't. Oh, I don't want to watch that. Why the Leaf likes Florida.

People are like Gregory Campbell's there. What are you fucking? I think the league makes decisions based on that. Everyone's got ties to someone. All right. All right. once again solve nothing on our show

yeah we solve something especially that hit preferential tree our thanks for sure to Chicago's Ben Koppu talked Blackhawks of course

Ben who? Then what did I say Koppu Nope Pope and Valley Thanks everyone Have a great night everybody Thank you.