Real Kyper & Bourne - Vally's View: Goalie Trade Market & 'Growing the Game'

Episode Date: February 25, 2025

Nick Kypreos and fill-in host Gord Stellick welcome in MSG Network analyst Steve Valiquette (3:35) to share his impressions from 4 Nations, how the tournament helps hockey viewership in the US and how Jordan Binnington's play for Team Canada impacts his trade stock. Then, they get into whether the Oilers try to upgrade in goal ahead of the deadline, the Ducks acquiring Ville Husso from the Red Wings and Kevin Lankinen's big extension in Vancouver. Later, Nick and Gord regroup with Sam McKee to discuss Matthew Tkachuk's Fallon appearance and the idea of 'growing the game' in the US.The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

the show. Welcome in to the national edition of the real kipper and born show. We are live on sports at 6 50 in Vancouver and sports that 9 60 in Calgary. This hour of real kipper and born brought to you by bet 365 Nick Kiprios Sammy McKee and in for the vacationing Justin Born let's welcome in Gord Stehlik Gordo how are

you pal? Kipy I'm great well-deserved vacation for Justin I take it and I hope you get one soon as well I mean not that you need one I just mean you know post trade deadline and I think that you know grinding it out. I'm all right for now I'm good and we've got a trade deadline right around the corner here which always keeps everybody on high alert here. I imagine that you think that this one with a rising salary cap will have a different feel than we've seen in past years.

Already has, right? I mean, you start with Miko Ratnan, that trade, nature's going the other way. You've got a real trade between Calgary and Philadelphia, not a trade deadline deal, that was a real trade. Vancouver, which, because of the situation, making some trades, so I don't know if they'll all happen on the 11th hour day, but I hope this kind of wild west

mentality continues. Kipper, can I ask you, did you, because you were one of the big insiders, you were breaking stuff, I remember specifically, you broke the Taylor Hall, Sue Band thing, or maybe that wasn't you, I forget the one, the big one you broke. That was-

Stamco's, you know, Stamco's a member. PK for Shay Weber. Yes, that's the one that you broke. That one was the famous trio coming within, I don't know, nine minutes of each other. Yeah. Do you miss it? Oh, no. Do you miss being a big insider?

I watch Elliot on his phone and buried in his smartphone 24-7 and I'm like, I don't miss it. You don't get the, you know what? I just pick my spots now. Yeah. That's all. And also, with all due respect to Elliot and everybody else in all seriousness the insiders because you're right. It's exhausting You do not get the same scoops like they did And Elliot would get them too, but like you got I mean, it's really changed. Yeah, like it's really changed like organizations

There's very few surprises anymore compared to the old days. And if you wanna keep your job in an organization, you better be very careful about that as well. So it's really been buttoned down. Sammy, are we getting music? I don't know, I don't know. I like it. I can't hear anything and I was just hearing music.

What are, oh, okay. Somebody in an elevator or something? I think we've got now music, warmed up music for our Tuesday guest and Steve Valakett. Maybe that's what's going to happen in the. No, no, Derek Brandeo is waving me off like three, two fastball. What's going on? Don't look at me. You're the producer.

Yeah, I'm sitting across from you. I don't know what's going on up there. So Steve Valakett in a band today or something? Is it his band that's coming on? We will find out shortly. The guy can do anything. He can. And a guy that also, as much as we talk about

the clear sight analytics and he does a terrific job bringing us numbers that we believe sometimes are relevant to the game. Right. Sometimes not so much, but he also has his ear to the ground when it comes to that inside stuff. So maybe we'll get a little bit of that. All right.

Let's welcome him in Steve Alescette for his Tuesday hit. How are you, pal? Well rested. I don't think he's here. Oh, there he is. Oh, you okay? Oh, no, I couldn't hear anything. All right. You can hear us now. How are you? Yeah, I'm good. I'm good. How are you guys doing? Good. Are you recovered a little bit from a tournament that we weren't sure what we were getting to? Holy moly. Yeah. You know what? Kepper? I loved it, man. I was, I was in Utah skiing snowbird with my family. We had half the mountain watching this game. Like everybody got into

it all over the world. And I know that you can talk about, does this change anything for anybody in the future? Does it change anything for the game? I'm certain that it did over here in the U.S. and especially and specifically in places that you wouldn't expect. Like my wife said to me, and she made the most sense of this to me, she said, don't forget in this country you guys are the last dog to the bull. You have to make an impression when you have the opportunity. I thought everybody did the most with the platform they had, Kipper. Sounds like a beautiful Hallmark greeting card. You're the last dog to the bull.

Whatever. So when Jordan Bennington was anointed as the guy by John Cooper, did you believe he would be the guy or do you think maybe he would hedge his bets somewhere along the way? And what did you think about that particular pick and boy what a run he had. You know what Gordo if we go back and roll the tape from the other shows. I was trying to defend it as much as I could. Well not saying that there were better options out there. So I

was certainly somebody that was on the fence. And I forgot one very key thing that he is very good, whether it's real, or imagined to lift himself up and put pressure on himself to fight back at the naysayers. He's done that his entire career. I was around him a little bit when he was younger, where a goalie coach that I work with Andy Kyoto, we were working together on some Bennington tape was when he was in the HL actually and to see his growth from 10 years ago to playing in the East Coast League, the American Hockey

League playing in Providence in the same year that he beats the Bruins in game 7. He's always had that that element of being able to get pissed off and play better and it's not for everybody that piece and I know that It worked for me and I was trying to relate to it as I was watching him in overtime because I felt like I learned that piece about myself when I was playing in the OHL and Our generation had to figure out a lot ourselves without the help of a sports psychologist had to figure out a lot ourselves without the help of a sports psychologist without the help of mentoring that the players get now with player development

and one thing I remembered from my time with the Erie Otters we were playing in a seven game series that went the distance against the London Knights and there was a player from London this guy's name was Mike Mazuka and he was he was a nut job he was probably their leading Pym guy he was always looking to fight somebody and at the red line when I was stretching he was a nut job. He was probably their leading PIM guy. He was always looking to fight somebody. And at the red line, when I was stretching, he'd come by me, he's calling me fat. He's chirping me. He's in my ear. And I, and I remember saying to myself, you know, just keep saying it, keep saying it. You're helping me here. You know, you're fueling my fire. And in that series, we came back from down three, nothing to pushing it to seven. We ended up losing two, one in game seven. But I took that lesson with me into the pros. I feel like Jordan Bennington knew

that whether it was real or imagined around him, that he was able to create an environment where he felt like it was him against the world. And it brings out the best in him. I think that's why he's always trying to pick a fight on the ice. He's trying to get himself fired up when he's not. And we know that a long NHL career, it's very difficult to manufacture that energy sometimes. But you can't take away from him the fact that he knows how to play under pressure better than any goalie in the NHL right now. And there is some statistical evidence that actually shows this as well, which I think is very neat. And

I'm going to walk you through it because unless you play goal, you may or may not know that there's a big difference to the way you feel when you make a breakaway save when the score is tied to two in the third period. It's a completely different element mindset wise to make a save at 2-2 versus making that same breakaway save when your team is up by three in the third period or even down by three where the pressure is off. So sure enough, what goalie in the NHL last year had the best save percentage when the

score was tied? It was Jordan Bennington. And he also was a plus 15, which means in expected goals terms that he saved his team last year when the score was tied 15 more goals Than he should have which was also best in the NHL So there was some evidence there for that and I like to try and identify like what is clutch? Yeah I mean what is money goaltending? Yeah? And that's how you do it kipper you have to look at who's making a 2 on one save when it's 1, 1, and the 3rd who's doing that regard see those 3.

So I go ahead, no just because it regardless of how crappy the last goal that went in on him. Right well which I think again gets him even more pissed off, you know, and you know, I go to I got myself into trouble with a jack Hughes comment earlier in the year, because I said that he was trying to embarrass him. Well, what I think I was doing really was trying to manufacture a reason why I wanted to see the ranger bench lift up and have something to fight for. And, and again, it

goes back to that whether it's real or not, you're trying to fire yourself up for Christ's sake. And when I see him play that way, like that was, that was really for me guys, the big difference between he and Hellebuck in that game. A Hellebuck's first goal against the McKinnon scores. He gave that goal up seven times on 18 shots last year in the first round, the same thing. And do you think that McKinnon didn't know that that's who beat them out in the first round last year. But Hellebuck sinks into his net. And he backs up when that pressure comes to the net, where Bennington is fighting on his

toes and getting to the top of the crease. He threw technique to me out the window and play with passion and emotion. And, you know, it was one of the first times I never gamble guys, I don't like it. But I put a lot of money on Canada because I believed in the Canadian way in one way but also Their top guys were just gonna dig in a little bit harder and I believe that like through my core and I was texting Sammy Through the game we were going nuts and he's smoking darts and we were laughing our asses off Guilty M's not listening. Valley's is was his performance enough and not that there be a huge goalie market out

there but was his performance good enough where maybe a few teams might want to knock on Doug Armstrong's door and say, you know, he's only got two years left and you guys are going through this rebuild. Gladly take them off your hands. Well, I was prepared for this question. I thought you were gonna ask me this. So before you say that this is not possible, don't forget that we do have cars

that are actually driving themselves now and they've actually had some cars recently on if you saw in the news, they're flying. Yes, cars. So this is, I believe this is possible. If you put Jordan Bennington in the Edmonton oiler net right now, and we've talked a lot this year about how the Edmonton goalies aren't great off the rush Edmonton's been giving up a quite a bit off the rush lately, they're actually down to 15th in the NHL as far as rush chances against East to West chances

In their own zone, which is also something that Stuart Skinner is having difficulty with they are 24th Meaning they're giving up East to West in their own zone D zone coverage. They're giving up odd man's They're not playing well enough defensively to not have a very good goalie that it has a very good save percentage to not have a very good goalie, that it has a very good save percentage, clutch and off the rush. Put Jordan Bennington into the Edmonton net this year, all right, because we have this tool, analytically, where I can actually put a goalie

and know what his strengths are, and all of the chances faced by those Edmonton goalies, Skinner and Pickard this year, Bennington would have stopped 17 more goals if he was in Edmonton's net than Edmonton goalies Skinner and Pickard this year. Bennington would have stopped 17 more goals. If he was in Edmonton's net, then Edmonton's goalies have up until this point in the season. Okay, but that's not really cool for you. Yeah, then what you do is you watch the video which comes with all of these shots. Just watch it. Benner can play off the rush.

Benner can play clutch. And they have the team in Edmonton that needs a little more goal tending than what they have right now because they're not defending as well as they were last season. And that would be my case. And on top of that, if I'm ST Louis and I've got a very good backup and Hofer that can certainly play and you've got a great development model, you go back to look at the last 10 years in ST Louis is net and David Alexander there has done a heck of a job. So they should be confident to they could rehabilitate another guy, a guy like Caden primo, perhaps, or a

Levi maybe Debon Levi guys that are in the minors that could still fill NHL roles at some point. But yeah, that that to me would be something I do. Yeah, sorry any questions I keep rambling on here. No, it's all excited about that Canadian win on Thursday Well, and and so getting a cyber Jordan Bittington out. No, I think he has a partial no trade. I'm not whatever just yeah partial but 20 teams. Yeah, so I but I who knows if he even wants to go to Edmondson who knows again Doug Armstrong maybe wants to retool and stick with the winner, but the next point to follow up though Steve just like Stuart Skinner

I I'm torn because it does as you say if Edmonton wants to get to the promised land and you want to leave no stone Unturned you should look at you know that that including the goaltending yet This guy took you to game seven of a Stanley Cup final as a kid, as a young player. Like he took you where Jordan Binnington took the St. Louis Blues, just didn't get that last game seven. So I'm like, I'm just curious about upgrading the guy, upgrading the goaltending,

but also maybe being unfairly critical of Skinner. A bit of a recency bias, maybe because I watched the game against Philadelphia Saturday Gordo. I don't know if you saw the game, but man, like he was moving with cement boots out there and I don't know if he's taken a step back. Edmonton is certainly giving up a lot more, but off the rush, Philadelphia is one of the best rush teams in the NHL. So certainly that was not a great matchup for the Edmonton Oilers Saturday coming out of the break, then playing fast, et cetera.

But if you look at the calls, I mean, he is shooting his head out towards the sideboards when the pass is coming to his right. You know, he was doing so. And I, I'm hearing you. I don't think that it was ever fair to Stuart Skinner and he's done a marvelous job being able to manage this because Jack Campbell don't forget is supposed to be the starter there and Stu supposed to be the backup learning apprenticing and he's done a terrific job but for where they're at right now with what's at stake with possibly not winning with Leon and Connor and Connor's contract coming

up and he wants to be a Maple leaf Sammy tells me I don't know You're watching and listening to Steve Valacat analyst for the New York Rangers on MSG CEO Clear-sight analytics and regular contributor here on the real kipper and boring show Okay, we're gonna stick with goaltending here and Vili who so on his way to the Ducks. Does that open up something for? Detroit and perhaps Gibson? Or could Bennington sneak into a conversation? It's a good one, Kipper, because the one thing Detroit should know about themselves is they're a top five defending team

when it comes to quality chances with time and space? They're very good at closing. And I think time and space to me, guys, it's one of those enhancers to any scoring chance. Connor McDavid's goal, a game winning goal on Thursday, would have qualified as a time and space scoring chance from the slot. Well, Detroit's very good at denying those. A guy like John Gibson, who is a first shot goalie, needs time and space taken away for him to excel because he over challenges.

Not a bad fit there. I think that Anaheim makes a move, and I think it's certainly gonna be Gibson because of Doe Stall and how good I think he is. and I think that when I look at time and space and I'm going to name some teams here because I think this is important the teams that are not in the playoffs currently today they're all bad at this and the teams that I think that we could agree are possibly contenders are very good at it so teams that are not good with time and space and giving up a lot of it. Nashville, this is from worst. Okay, Nashville, Pittsburgh, Anaheim, New York Rangers, Philadelphia, Buffalo, Columbus, all non playoff teams.

You don't want to be a team that gives up a lot of scoring chances, great days with time and space. It's pretty simple. Now, go to the teams that we would say are very good teams, contending teams, great defensive teams. The Los Angeles Kings are the best at not giving up scoring chances with time and space. So when you take a Darcy Kemper, like this is where I think we're going with trying to pair a goaltender with a system too. You take a Darcy Kemper. He's a cast away from last season Washington. They can't wait to get wait to get rid of him and Pierlou Dubois goes the other way.

They really swap contracts. They don't like at the time and when you have a defensive system like the LA Kings and they've been doing this for a few years now you can insulate a goalie that is a cast away from somebody else. You don't have to go out and get the top guy. And if you go back to October, November, Kemper was settling in, but he wasn't stealing games by any means.

I thought that LA was really covering up for him. But if you watch Kemper now, he is playing with so much confidence, it is out of this world. And because if you take a goaltender and you put sticks around a guy that's going to shoot, and you're taking away the fact that and I do this all the time when I'm training goalies, the shooter can't manipulate the puck and move to the right because my stick is there. That's what I do as a goalie coach, I just give a

little stick in the slot. Can't move it backwards because my body's there. So he can go towards the net or possibly to his left. But you're taking away two of the four options. And with Kemper this year, I think LA is taking away three of four shooting options every time he faces a shot so he can lock in on the shot and be more valuable. I felt this when I played for Nick Fatu. And if you guys are familiar with Nick, do you remember meeting him? Kipperipper when you're with the

Rangers Nick fatiu was like a little bit me my heroes best right. He's the best so I had a great I love talking hockey with Nick he coached me when I was in Hartford guys got so many shutouts Jason LeBarbara and I we had 30 shutouts over 2 years with Nicky system 30. Nicky system was it was straight lines hard stops in the D zone. Our weak side winger would always come to the middle of the ice and leave the defenseman at that time. Think about this is like oh 405

2003. This was a time where these things were a little bit of outside the box thinking, but he would call it his safety guy. He would have a dry erase board in the locker room, a line going through the middle of the ice, cutting the ice in half. And he said, I don't care what happens in our D zone. The puck doesn't cross there, whether it's a player carrying it or a pass. And that's where the genesis of a clear site analytics came from. I started with trying to get value as to what those chances of going across that line would actually result in

gold probability, but it came from Nikki and Nikki system guys. Connor doesn't get the puck without Brock Nelson on him Brock Nelson would have been on Connor McDavid and he would not have had time and space under Nick Fittu system. Because if Fox doesn't cut off the puck behind the net, then it would be quickly Matthews on him. And then Fox would come in behind with layers and then you'd have a safety guy just between Brock Nelson and Mitch Marner's pass. So this was just something we were talking about yesterday. And under Nicky system, guys,

I barely even worked out the summer before and I led the league in safe percentage because I bought a house. I had like zero money and I put all my money on this house and we're going into a lockout and I was renovating this house because I had to rent it out to the Bridgeport Sound Tigers. I'm playing it. Oh We dropped them Hartford areas freeze, yeah terrible I ever played that we got your back yeah you know you know what I was saying Nick Fetillo you had had a of your heads up when you're in the old blue seats of Madison Square Garden he would throw pucks in the pregame warm they had to tell him to stop remember Maple Leaf

Gardens he was throwing them up in the gray seats he was like a fan favorite oh so okay nuts a Gordo one quick one Do you know what he did in Long Island once what the the intermission puck the shot from center-ice? Yeah car He made the hole bigger cop the whole Somebody want a freaking car because Nikki Man of the people and I could use his help. So what I wanna ask, so, okay, Kevin Lankinen. So he goes from being in the summer,

marked down on aisle seven, anybody want this goaltender, and finally, you know, Vancouver takes him to a, was it five year, 4.5 million per season contract. So Kevin Lankinen, did he change the way Kevin Lankinen played goal, or did he simply seize an opportunity? They'd never had before Kipral back me up here before the season began I said that our data was showing that Lankin and was gonna have a big season and

We were wondering at the time how long it was gonna take for Vancouver to figure it out I think Vancouver actually dropped the ball here. They overpaid. They should have gotten this contract done three months ago. When you are evaluating what you have, aren't you supposed to be the first ones to know? And based on previous data, two years ago he was ranked 15th last season. And I'm talking about adjusted save percentage, which is Gordo, it's just taken out the the noise take away the dumps from the neutral zone, the one I don't really hit the net, I mean, adjusted safe percentage. So the true number, the truest number that you can really judge a goalie based on the difficulty

faced 15th, then he went to 12 last year. And he's in the top 10 for the first two months of the season. Guess what, guys, yeah, sign the deal, you would have saved yourselves two and a half million dollars a deal on that deal He signed for 875 this season Yeah, and he was he was pushing because last year in Nashville making to he was looking for two and a half In July doesn't get it. He I think it was late September. He signs with Vancouver something like September 22nd signs with Vancouver at 875

Vancouver should have been all over this like a fat kid on a smarty two months, three months ago. Price of poker kept going up on this guy. And then Demko is still that the health question is right back at you. Oh, and guess what you're going to get Kipper? You're going to have $13 million in goalies if Demko gets what he's worth after a great season next year that I'm sure he's going to have a great summer, be ready for next season and then he's going to be coming out of next year at 825 or 85 and now you've got two goalies and $13 million. To me, you could have had Lankanen if you had your head out of the sand a long time ago for a lot less I'd be remiss if I didn't bring up

Long time new york sportscaster iconic guy in al Troutwig who the three of us have all had our paths crossed with him mine certainly in our stanley cup year with him, mine certainly in our Stanley Cup year. Adam Graves pouring champagne all over him in our dressing room. But you know, your thoughts on Al and arguably, Vali, the most recognizable New York sportscaster we've ever seen. I hope that people know him from his work because he was so brilliant. Tour de France, the Boston Marathon, the Summer Olympic Games every year for the last 20 years, or at least four of them, or maybe even more, six of them. I don't want to mess it up. But the Winter Games,

this guy's in movies, Cool Runnings, if you remember him, and Cool Runnings, the Van Damme movie that was filmed in the hockey rink, Sudden Impact, that might have been called. He's in so much. And look, I got to work with him for five years. This man mentored me, showed me the ropes. We had little bits where people thought that we didn't like each other. We were always messing around, but he made it fun. And nobody could frame the opening of a game like out

trial like he was brilliant at it. And a storyteller like you wouldn't believe in, in watching him watch the Rangers kipper, he would kick like people out of the green room, your bad luck, get out. We're watching. We're watching one of the games that he's going out for for a dark break. And, um, he's out on seventh avenue. And he's saying to me, can you believe all these people aren't inside watching this game? What's everybody doing out here? Like it was the most important thing in the world to out trout wig that either the next Rangers would win again. And he had funny stories, guys. I don't know how much time we have. Can I tell a couple? Yeah, sure. Yeah. We got, we got a few minutes for sure. So meet, meet the parents. It's his swimming

pool that was the scene where Ben Stiller takes the spike and it breaks the, oh really brides nose. Okay. So this is the best part of the story though. So it was, it was about 50 grand. I think he's getting a week and they said it was going to take two weeks and they're over time and They're really parked all their trailers on his grass in Long Island, right as they always do pissed off at this point He's really pissed off and he finally says to one of the production assistants Can I at least meet De Niro because they keep telling him I can't meet De Niro because he's in character He's a method actor and he's in character. So anyways, I was like, I'll take my chances. So he walks up to his trailer, De Niro's coming through with her about to do the scene and he puts his hand out to shake De Niro's head and De Niro walks right by him.

So Al is incensed. Okay. So then what happens next is after the scene, one of the production assistants asks Al's wife if the available bathroom upstairs and Al's master could be used for Robert De Niro to shower and he's like, tell De Niro to stick. He wants some office property, right? So they are trying to negotiate that they want to lift out some room in the bathroom where Stiller is putting a Speedo on and Al kicks them out. He doesn't let them film the scene

They were gonna put like take some walls down just to get enough room to get the cameras in etc So al's really pissed off. He kicks them off. They never get to film the bathroom scene months go by he gets invited to the premiere The premiere of the movie so he goes to the movie with his wife and sure enough Ben Stiller is putting on his speedo in Al's bathroom. And now I was pissed off again, because he didn't give him permission. So he goes back to the production companies yelling at them. And they showed him that what they did do was they went into Al's bathroom, they took pictures of

everything right down to the kitchen sink detail is are the sink detail as well as the towels in there. And they recreated that entire bathroom, Al's bathroom inch by inch in the studio where they actually filmed the scene for the movie in the bathroom scene and Al was like him telling me this story and many others he was a may use it as much fun to be around this guy's anybody ever been around he should have got residuals off of the copyright of his bathroom. Yeah, yeah, I was saying to Kipper earlier that I got to meet him my brief time in New

York and I remember once Barry Watkins took the media out and Al happened to be doing that game, this was in Chicago. But what struck me was like Sam Rosen was still kind of starting, right? So now he's become that legend. Marv Albert was a wonderful guy to meet too, very, very friendly guy there, but Altra L, like he's not a hawk, he's a sports case, everything. Even back then he was a young guy, right? And she said, holy crap, this guy does everything.

And you just rhymed it off, like whether it's Olympics, Tour de France, all those kind of things. And he's forever too, Gordon. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah. So most of us are kind of slotted now into a particular sport by and large and he was one of those Incredible generalists that just did everything phenomenally In Goro, he started off as a ball boy for the New Jersey Nets. That's how we got into really doing it

Yeah, they liked his voice and somebody said why don't you try doing the radio because they didn't have somebody to work one day And he just fell into it He just loved sports Stories amazing gone too soon at age 68. Hey Valley great stuff is always man Rangers and the Islanders. I assume the Rangers still think they're they're very much in it just quickly We're gonna see an active New York Ranger hockey club at the deadline Well, I'll tell you what, I don't know if you guys caught any of the game against Buffalo or Pittsburgh Saturday, Sunday, but they couldn't have been any more listless. And tonight against the Islanders, this isn't a statement.

It's more like a question. If they can't show more, then how can anybody in good confidence move forward with this group? That's this is it tonight and I don't know what to expect but it better be a lot more than I saw Saturday Sunday effort wise or It's over. I got to be honest. I don't know if I could say that an MSG networks I'll be out of here, but you know, like I'm worried and concerned. Yeah crystal clear on your side just like your Your analytics site Clear site great stuff as always Valley. Thanks for doing this pal. Hey my pleasure fellas. Have a great one What do you think Rangers another team Boston Rangers like no one no

Yeah, saw this coming from two out of the six original six. Well, absolutely So, okay so one thing first of, is his ability to talk in layman's terms is huge because there's a lot of people that I think know their stuff, but I don't know because it's just, it becomes just white noise, right? And that's a real credit to Steve. Rangers Boston, that's why, hey, leave no stone unturned. I talked about that about hypothetically about the Edmonton goaltending.

Like you got to be in the playoffs if you're the Bruins or you're the New York Rangers. And you ain't there right now. And I don't know what's worse, that the Bruins have had the, from the word go, a bumpy ride. The Rangers had a great start. People forget they won the President's Trophy last year,

got off to a great start, and then as Brian Burke used that line, the 18-wheeler went off the road for them. And it seemed like they've been, seemed like they've been getting it back. But you can't be listless if you're serious to battle for a playoff spot you never thought you'd be in a battle for.

So I can see very much see both of them not making it. That's why Columbus, Detroit, Ottawa as well, have to look at, can we do a move or two to strengthen our position game time? Game time, baby. It's game time. Is it my bet? Three six five visit the app list odds of find out why is ever ordinary at bet three six five? That's my 19 plus on terror only please play responsibly So lots of games on the ice tonight, like you mentioned

Canadian teams Calgary's in Washington to take on the Capitals. The great chase continues tonight. 13 goals away now for Alex Ovechkin. Really feels like you got to keep an eye on every single one of these games. It's crazy the Calgary Flames are plus 165 underdogs in that game. Montreal hosting the Carolina Hurricanes. As you would imagine Carolina big favorites minus 220 on the money line the in in Boston the Toronto Maple Leafs are big big favorites tonight minus 160 on the

money line the Boston Bruins are plus 135 underdogs and the Oilers the other Canadian team in action tonight are in Tampa to take on the lightning minus 105 on the money line for the Edmonton Oilers and this is a very very rare for me to do this in game time but I'm looking to the NBA tonight and Luka Doncic and the LA Lakers are hosting the Dallas Mavericks the team that traded him away and I think he's really mad about it and he's a guy that has a chip on his shoulder give me Luka Doncic to score 50 plus points tonight plus 1600 he's gonna be out for blood tonight and I think he is gonna be out for blood tonight and I think he's gonna have a huge night so there you go those are my

that's my game time that was game time because of my bet 365 visit the app for the saws and find out why it's never ordinary at bet 365 with 19 plus on terror only please play responsibly nice job Sammy okay we'll take a quick break and when we return we'll get into some news and notes including Matthew Kachuk's appearance on the tonight Show. A lot of people talking about growth in the game. We'll get Gord Stehlich's thoughts on how much that helped move the needle. Plus Jess Morrissey motivated after missing the biggest game of his life. Plenty more when we return to Real Kipper and Born. The best Blue Jays show out there, period.

Blair and Barker, be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Nick Kiprio, Scord, Stella,elick Sammy McKee. Just before we signed off on yesterday's show, I got a note saying that Matthew Kachuk was in New York to go see some doctors and stuck around long enough to have an appearance on the Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon. Yeah. Did you catch it? I caught it, I caught it. I thought he did a good job.

Absolutely. It was very pro-America, of course, but. As you would expect. Yeah, as you would expect and rah, rah, rah, and greatest thing in the world is wearing the colors and yeah, so I think he did what he was supposed to do and that's Continue the excitement long after unfortunately for the US losing. Mm-hmm So I think what's interesting about that it just shows the success of the four nations face-off

I know Sammy's on you about it I screw up four nations thing all the time and I get yelled at because they want to call the four nations face-off and Because normally it's someone that wins a Stanley Cup or so So he's on based on the incredible vibe that happened last couple weeks and to your point You know how much do these things grow or not grow the game? I mean in the United States Well, they certainly can't hurt I there's a clip of remember that show to tell the truth And it would say with the real real Nick Caprios please stand up? There's a To Tell the Truth.

Three individuals in their Montreal Canadian gear, including skates, would the real Jean Beleval please stand up? Okay, that's how, so they didn't know anyway, and they get around, and there's real Jean Beleval, full equipment stands up. When you won the Stanley Cup, I watched Letterman. Letterman was taped in New York.

I remember Rudy Poschek was out there in the crowd once and the crowd started chanting his name. But I thought there'd be something about the Cup because the day before he called Matt Lauchran trying to get two tickets and it was set up with Matty and for game seven it was funny and Marv Albert came up with two tickets for somebody, whatever.

I heard later that person sold them or something. But anyway, and then the Cup, I thought, and then nothing. Then he talks to Biff Henderson and the cup was behind whatever. And now came Mike Richter, Brian Leach, Mark Messier with the Stanley Cup and couldn't have been more perfect in New York being on the David Letterman show. So I've always liked those kinds of visits

and hockey players, I'm biased, but they're just such a genuineness about it that I like when they show their personality and always come across well. There have been over the course of like 40 years, 40 plus years, like moments, US moments, of course we can go back to 80 with the US Gold Medal team, Miracle Ice, somewhat in the 90s with a US-led team

by the Billy Garrens and the Mike Richters and the Brian Leachs of the world over Eric Lindros and Brendan Shanahan in the 96. World Cup in 96. And then Sid's gold medal game 2010 and then this one. So my question to you is, is this still about growing the game in the US first before we grow the game as a true World Cup here? Because it's the sense to me is like we got to grow the game south of the border and we have Gretzky did that by by moving

markets that we wouldn't have thought twice about 40 years ago like Dallas and Florida mm-hmm you know a second team in California passed LA but it just seems like we're trying to grow the game in the US right now before we can look at a true World Cup. So yeah you mentioned growing the game internationally and I think part of it is we have a history in Canada with the Summit Series, the Canada Cup as it was was called before it was the World Cup. So aside from 1996, there hasn't been that US success. I really think the best thing next year

would be for USA to win the Olympics. And not being just like another miracle on ice. No, but can't- Sam just had puked in his mouth. I literally just got punched in the stomach by that comment. Look when their women's team won the goal. I'm just saying 2002, 2010,

look how jacked we were in Canada to finally have best on best hockey and get a couple of gold medals. It wasn't the same in 2014, it's more special when you're in North America. But anyway, like I just think, because miracle and ice, they keep going back to it. And I thought they used it really well

in and around the four nations faceoff as well, because there hadn't been best on best in eight and a half years. You can't milk it again next year right around the Olympic team, but I thought they did a good job. Yeah, it's just like I'm almost 60 and like there was a genuine excitement about Matthew Kachuk being on Jimmy Fallon last night. Yeah. And it's because it's hockey. But like Wayne Gretzky was on Letterman 30 years ago. He hosted Saturday Night Live.

He's hosting Saturday Night Live. And it just seems like, although we've grown markets in the US, we're still kind of at the same place. We were 40 or 50 years ago. If we get an NHL player on a late night US show. We're like, wow, this is really cool. Wow. We're in 2025, not 1976.

Why is it such a big deal now? But we are. So if they have international success, will the world juniors play better there? Because whatever it is that they don't they don't embrace the world juniors like we do in Canada, but do we have to get hockey close to baseball and and football in the States before but also should we really care in Canada? Like she said, well, whatever. whatever so hey it's just air sports still has a tremendous challenge to get respect south of the border and when we do get when we do get it it's like oh my god they noticed us well this was a home run this was a grand slam and the

timing of it the Super Bowl is done it was a terrible Super Bowl baseball's not started the NBA all-star game was terrible. So you know just yeah this is kind of a rarity you know like you're almost I'm almost 30 now and I can remember yeah just anyway. The other thing that bothers me a little bit now is that when Wayne was lighting it lighting it up in Edmonton it seems like South of the border they knew more about Wayne Gretzky back then than they know about Conor McDavid today Well, was it because he had that Janet Jones was his partner for a couple years before I don't I don't I don't know To me to me maybe even prior to Janet. Hmm. No, well, he was don't look at me. I wasn't I mean I mean, he was dating someone was a singer Vicki Moss who was I wasn't born with it. I mean, I mean... But he was dating someone who was a singer, Vicki Moss,

who was, I don't know, like, Alan Thicke was a buddy. I don't know. Do you think they've acknowledged Connor McDavid as a true superstar of the game of hockey? They know who he is now. Well, yeah, they know who he is now, but, you know... Why isn't he on Fallon? Well, but look at Kachuk's personality.

Look at the Kachuk brothers' personality. So part of it, and then you got Jack Hughes with a great person I'm taking American players right now, but just about you know certain ones that there's you know Just are more seem to be more suited for that kind of talk show environment. But yeah, I mean Yeah, I don't know what you know I don't follow talk shows as much as I did, you know Cuz what we're watching hockey all the time hockey wasn't available back then see you watch the talk shows as much as I did, because we're watching hockey all the time. Hockey wasn't available back then, so you watch the talk shows.

Because you only had Joe Lose. I hope the NHL can kind of ride a bit of a wave here and not just go back to, okay, like you got to strap a flag on a tournament or an Olympics for people to get excited. Yeah, yeah, so you want to, you hope it's organic growth. Yes. And I think this was certainly organic,

genuine international growth just by basis of a great job by the NHL and the NHL Players Association and especially the players. What time will the games be on if it's in Italy, right? So they're ahead, so the afternoon games probably here, I'm trying to think. I don't know, I heard they shut everything down in the afternoon and they take naps. No, I'm talking about the Walk as you remember in Sochi the games route like 6 a.m

Like there was really weird timings for like when the games gonna be on if you're having it, but what's is that? I was no I'm not relevant. Yeah. I know I tell you what's relevant So 1998 which you wouldn't remember, but that was the big one, the first time. And I was filling in on the fan morning show that week. I was normally on one to four. And you remember how late the game started? So that infamous game about where the shootout

and Wayne Gretzky wasn't picked, like everyone's watching it. And I was getting up early in the mornings and I remember the face-off and then I fell asleep and I woke up for the shootout. That's what it was, was like, so the next morning, I had to talk about it like I'd watched every second, because I'm up three hours later,

and that's part of like, you know, it's a little bit off-putting when they're at odd times. It's better when they're in their time zone. Did you guys catch John Tavares saying that he went to bed before overtime? Just lie. Lie and say you didn't't that's so brutal to me I couldn't believe you said that

You know he's an honest guy. Why it's I don't know. I kind of like it a little bit like it. Yes Hey, well, it's because I'll tell you what I think I'll tell you how I interpret it He's I'm not on the team pissed. He's not there. I'm not on that well He went to the world guys don't think I'm good enough to be on the team. I'm not on the team. Pistie's not there. I'm not on the team. Well, he went to the World Champions. You guys don't think I'm good enough to be on the team? I'm not watching. I went to the Worlds last year. Okay, you can be a bit of a sore loser. It's fine. Wait, Kipy, he went to the Worlds last year, which not a lot of veterans do, and he was captain of Team Canada in the Worlds last year, which so I think probably part of his motivation might have been, I can't speak for him, that it would enhance his chances of being picked.

And he's had a solid start to the year, so that, I like that. I like a little more pizzazz from him rather than straight talk. Hey. Regardless how you feel, it shows a little bit of personality. What's the little bit of personality?

Went to bed early? What a personality, oh my God. No, I hate, it's the old sign thought, the guy got snubbed. You snubbed me. You snubbed me. I just, you got two teammates of the team. He's head to head. No, it's K-Inverse USA. Watch the overtime. If he was on the team, they would have won a regulation. That's what he's saying. Everyone would have been in bed at that point. He's getting older. He needs his sleep. Can I ask you though, like, do you think, you know, USA and Canada and growing the game

and all this stuff in the States, it would help if they, and this is just me throwing shots, but it would help if they won once in a while, right? Not the best on that. That's what I'm talking about. So, okay, but 1996, that was a big win, but I gotta tell you, this is how it was received, okay? We're not, I'm tired, we got a minute, right? Oh yeah, that's time, yeah.

So anyway, I was doing the games on TV 11 with Paul Hendrick and I had some Leaf games. We happened to be doing a game in Anaheim early in the year. So Leafs, Anaheim Ducks, and Paul Hendrick and I are sitting alone in the lunch room there, and Tony Tavares, a guy named Tony Tavares was president of the Anaheim Ducks. So he's there, and he's like, you know,

he was pretty front and set, well, like a hands-on kind of guy. And he's telling us, he's pissed that his coach missed training camp to coach USA. His coach is Ron Wilson. They won, they won the World Cup like 10 days earlier. And he's conveying, Paul Hendrick and I are looking, I was in amazement. That was a great series. I mean, he's justying, Paul Hendrick and I are looking at it as an amazement. That was a great series.

I mean, he's just like Keith Kachuk fighting. But that was what the Anaheim president thought of his coach being absent to what turned out Coach Team USA in their last big, their biggest international win, their last big international win. Now, I think it's changed since then, but that's what you were looking at back then. Do you think the Olympic hockey will be as palatable

to the American audience as what we watched in the World Cup or the Four Nations with the NHL rules? Because I think the NHL rules and the NHL. I think fighting's completely gone to another level right now. First thing that Jimmy Fallon talked about was the nine seconds. Scraps.

Yeah. But you're not gonna get that in the Olympics, right? No. Like it's not gonna be the same, it'll be brilliant hockey. But you're gonna get it every other year. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Because it'll be NHL sanctioned in every other year, so.

And it's the best players. So it's not just the fourth liners that are going out there. It's like your day where everyone probably had two or three fights during the course of the year. And if by chance the NHL can replicate that type of intensity every two years, I'm not sure you need the Olympics. Yeah, I actually agree with that.

Okay, I'm not sure the players need it. Well, that's what's gonna play out down the road. You're right. What are we going to look back on? Is the show money is the eight nations cup, which is going to be eight nations or whatever they're called. Is it going to get dwarfed by the Olympics

when we look back or are we going to kind of start and say, you know what, rather than their rules and playing at three o'clock in the morning, this thing, and then every time you get, you get that kind of, you get that kind of fight, which is still part of the game. All I know is right now it's set up that these NHL players every other year get three weeks off for spring break.

Like I can't think of a better thing. Like where was that when I played? So you wanna be a third liner? Going down to Hawaii, Mexico, Right a banana hammock. Come on Like every every other year a little uncomfortable banana. Well, you know The okay well Yeah, but also you want to be on the team, right? You know one's probably very few people get a chance to be on multiple times whatever to represent their country, right?

You know, you're you're not gonna start with it's unlike the all-star game where certain players get tired every year They got to go again I think every second year everyone's gonna be fine to be on the team for as long as they can I mean John Tavares showing a little glimmer that he probably wasn't happy that he wasn't on the team this time What about if you're doing the eight nations face off, eight nations facing off, whatever you're doing, some of these teams are gonna be able to fill a roster with NHL guys.

So that'll be the question that lends to be like, you have to get players in the AHL, or the KHL guys, Swedish league guys, like you're not gonna have enough. Well, Finland was kind of close to that. For sure, that's what I mean. Finland was kind of like that,, you are, yeah you are. And then do they have a history of playing together? Yeah.

You don't play on club teams like you used to be. Like the Czech Republic team that won in 1998, a lot of them were playing outside the NHL, so there was a togetherness. Plus they had Dominik Hasek. 95 during the lockout, myself, Mike Hudson, and Brian Noonan went to Mexico during the lockout. How is that really fun? We're there the whole way went up on the parachute and I wrote a like a

Banana behind a tugboat. Okay, that's the banana. I'm talking about not it's all about the other banana Sammy what you think of the one that born he's wearing The other banana. I don't know what you're thinking. The one that Borny's wearing on the beach right now. Get your mind out of the gutter. Oh, no, Borny is not wearing that in Disney World. Great job today, by the way. Well, thank you. Great job.

You got Andy a little confused yet to ask, you know, what you meant by a question. Do you do that often, confuse your guests? Yeah, I like to do that to see if they're on their game. Keep them on their toes. That's it. Yes. Hey, that's the best thing to be unafraid if you don't understand the question, you

know, so good on him. Good on you for coming in here. We got you the rest of the week. That's correct. All right. Enjoy 12 games tonight. We'll focus on Toronto and Boston. We'll do it again on Leaf Edition, our four o'clock tomorrow Eastern.

Sounds good. Thanks, Cord. Sammy, thanks, pal. All good. Our thanks to Steve Alequette and Annie Brickley. Enjoy everybody.