Real Kyper & Bourne - Willy and Auston's Extension Tension

Episode Date: June 26, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne, and Sam McKee open the show with reports of the Leafs’ putting a full-court press on William Nylander for an extension, if Auston Matthews has an impact on Nylander to resign, and if there's pressure on Matthews to take a pay cut to help the team. Next up, Aarif Deen from Mile High Sports joins the show to break down the Avalanche's trade for Ryan Johansen, how he'll fare as a Gabriel Landeskog fill-in and what the Avs still have on their offseason docket. Later, some rumours around the league including Pierre-Luc Dubois' potential landing spots and Erik Karlsson requesting a trade. Finally, the guys wrap up the show reacting to breaking news of Taylor Hall being traded to the Chicago Blackhawks. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. All right. We're back. Felt like an eternity. Yes. But we're all back. And what a week we've got going here. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Derek Brandeo pushing all the right buttons.

Jen Rolnick and yours truly, Sammy McKee. And what will be I don't know if it's eventful, but we know we've got talking points. Yeah, we do, right? A ton. You know what's great? Tell me. Vacation. Not working.

Holy. We have an easy job, but you know what's easier? Not working. What a vacation. Those three days. Played a little golf, didn't you, Sam? I did. Pleasant. Don't mention golf. YouTube gets mad.

Couldn't come from, what do they call, Sammy? Gen Z? I don't know. L? I have no idea. No, I'm definitely not Gen Z, but thank you for thinking that. I'm a millennial. Oh, you are?

Oh, yeah. Okay, that's where the trouble started, I think. Vacation first, and then work. Hey, Sammy? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You fell right into that one, my friend work. Hey, Sammy. Yeah, yeah. You fell right into that one, my friend. You did too. I'm going to make you work your butt off in the next hour.

How's that? Oh, yeah. I'm just grinding. We have got a ton to get into. We're going to start with the Toronto Maple Leafs and Michael Nylander. You got a clip out of Frank Cervelli who went on the morning show today. Willie Nylander. What did I say?

You said Michael. I said Michael? You did. See, that's what happens when you take so much time off. You go to his dad, who was a teammate of mine. Yeah. Well, listen, it's a default position for you. I'm sure you've said that a zillion times.

If he leaves, if he's traded, will you call him back Michael again? Will Michael play for minimum? If he gets moved and he strictly is about highest paid wins, that is an all Michael Nylander move. You know, tough to be mad at that sometimes. I always have a little bit of respect for the guys who are like, I just got paid, man. Got all the money I could.

Also on top, Pierre-Luc de bois and la the curveball here because i included said it it was just destined for the montreal canadians but things change as they say and i'm going to tell you why as we progress to that storyline eric carlson's making some news wanting a trade to a contender jordan Stahl signs a four-year deal with Carolina. Sean Dursey, Sammy's boy, on the move. Yeah. Do you have a Dursey-Shirsey? No, I don't have that.

No, Dursey's Jersey. I would love that. I would see Jersey-Shirsey. Five times fast right now. I would own one if someone gave one to me. Tough balance, eh, for the kid? Yeah. Go play in mullet and lose yeah that one's just a debbie downer well that's a weird one too though because you think was a second round pick that's it is that what they traded him for like i think

so yeah like a really was is he due to get paid a bunch this summer maybe he's yeah but i just i thought that was a weird one for uh la maybe to Maybe to get some money for Mr. Dubois. Elliott Friedman reporting that Aiden Hill is close to an extension in Vegas that should get done at $4.9 million. Curious that it's apparently two years. Like Aiden Hill doesn't want to lock up some security? Really want to bet on himself? No, I think it's the other way around.

He would love to lock in more years at 4.9 it's vegas that won't go past two years really yes and he's still down for that i guess 10 million bucks and a chance to re-up in a higher cap situation not so bad all right um who's joining us out of uh a reef dean at a colorado dean for an actual completed trade which maybe in 2014 would have been a little bit more exciting, but still pretty crazy to see them taking a chance in Ryan Johansson. So a couple minutes on that.

Yeah, and Ryan Johansson, of course, acquired by the Colorado Avalanche. There's a guy that came out of the blue to end up there. Yeah. $8 million left on two years. Colorado gets it for half. So we'll talk to Mr. Dean about about that and then um nhl awards tonight yeah does anybody care no no yeah i mean i voted i should say i vote in them and i do think they're

retroactively interesting but watching them is not typically a scintillating very important must watch event on sports we're gonna watch it we're gonna watch it watch the whole thing you know what strikes me is that when when you're in the heat of the playoffs, and correct me if I'm wrong, but did the announcements come out somewhere in the first round? Yes. I think it kind of gets lost in the first round. And I use Mitch Marner as an example here.

Selke finalist. Like that's a bigist like that's a big deal it's a big deal for sure he nobody said anything no one talked about it no one gave him any credit i'd be honest just lost completely forgot that that happened lost well and you know what it is kip for me it's not that when it comes out it's that they do it in dribs and drabs they're like and this monday we'll announce the norris finalists and they'll announce it. And then it's next Tuesday we announce the Selke finalists. And so you inevitably miss some of it, right? There's no big unveiling of the finalists at once.

I think that might be the way to kind of get the word out better. Okay. Let's kick it off with Willie, we Willie Nylander and Frank Cervelli on the morning show. I think he's been pretty aggressively pursuing a new deal for William Nylander in the last number of days. Okay. I,

I'd hesitate to even speculate in terms of progress or what that might look like. But I do think the full court press has been on to try and get an answer. Okay. Full court press is on to get an answer. Trying to sign Willie Kipper. Yeah.

I don't know if it's going to happen without Willie and his agent, Lewis Gross, at least having a good indication on number 34. I really believe 34 will dictate where it goes with Willie Nylander. In terms of Willie's going to want him here before he resigns here? No. More importantly, what's that guy's number?

Oh. Right? And I'll take you back to when Kyle had those famous words of, we can and we will sign everybody. They could and they did. Yes, they did. And they did and they got buried. Oh, yeah. It did not work. So at the time, the market had said that maybe the Leafs had overpaid a little bit at 6.9.

Do you remember the, was there a swing back then? Was it 50-50? Was it 60-40, 70-30 that the Leafs overpaid Willie Nylander at 6.9? Do you remember that far back, Sonny? I liked it day one but i know there are people i mean from a leaf fan perspective when it was signed i think a lot of people thought it was a pretty big overpay yeah i do remember i agree with that i remember the conversation being around it being like that maybe is a little bit too rich for the blood so he hadn't had one of his

breakout willie years when they had signed that contract he was a good promising young player but he wasn't willie nylander of today when he signed the deal obviously so yeah i think there of his breakout Willie years when they had signed that contract. He was a good, promising young player, but he wasn't Willie Nylander of today when he signed the deal, obviously. So, yeah, I think there was some conversation about him being overpaid. Was that a five- or six-year deal? I can't even remember. It was six.

Five? It was six. Was it six? Yeah, I'll check right now. Sure. Yeah. So where do you think, JB, in the course of six years,

it went from maybe a little overpaying to, oh man, this is a steal right now. Yeah, I'm not sure when that happened, but I would say with the cap staying flat and his numbers continuing to go up and up and up, I think, yeah, I mean, you look at this last year, 40 goals. I think over the past few seasons, he's a top 20 scorer in the league.

You know, he's putting up numbers like an elite, elite player. He signed a six-year, $45 million contract on December 1st, 2018, fellas. Which is crazy that that was that long ago. The point I want to make, too, is he went first. Right? And yes, there was that sense of urgency that he sat out and if i'm not mistaken the deal went probably up until maybe a day or two on the cutoff date 11th hour man 11th hour december 1st yeah i remember right on the station when we had updates that you had like a sounder being like, the next hour

of the Willie Neal. It was like down to the wire. They almost didn't get it done because like a jammed fax or something. Within like minutes. Yeah. So, he gets done at the 11th hour and he comes up with a number of 6.9 and people are like now

wondering where everyone is going to be situated after that. And the ones that were screaming that that's too high were the ones that would kind of try to do the math on Matthews and Marner. I think the feeling back then when they signed 6.9, the thought was that those guys weren't going to blow it out of the water. That there would be a situation where perhaps Mitch Marner could sign for 7, 7.5. Even the rant in the number of 9, 9.5. Yeah. When Austin went 11-6 and Marner went 10-9,

that one pissed the Nylander camp beyond belief because of the gap. Really? Yeah. I guess it's hard, not hard to understand. My point is that may be coming into play here. Like, I'm not giving you eight and a half to watch you guys blow your brains out on 34. I'm not taking the hit so you can get to 13 and a half or 14 for 34.

You know what, though, Kip? Then go. Go away then. Listen, it may be true. And that's, hey, is that not what's going on really in Calgary right now? Go away then. Listen, it may be true. And that's, hey, is that not what's going on really in Calgary right now? You've got all these veteran players. Yeah.

And, you know, not to turn tables on our conversation here, but that's realistic here. Right. That Willie may go, listen, if if you're gonna make me eat a contract so you can just play pay 34 more i may not go down that path this mentality is is what has killed this team is this well he's making this so i want that and he's got this and like you know watch your own bobber just like is this enough for what you do for your job? That makes you happy? And I know. In theory, I'm with you. Listen, it's not impossible to live your life that way.

It doesn't have to be looking at the other guy's plate and saying, give me a bit of his pie. He's got too much. But, you know, I'm sure Colorado's Gabriel Landeskog was, they were questioning how much is enough for you on your last contract, and guess what? He had a career-ending injury. And you think he's happy that he signed as much as he could for the length that he could?

That's always the risk for these guys. Of course. And everyone, I understand the idea that everyone should try to get as much as they can. It only applies to me where you don't have to get as much as you can when you're already paid and you're the guys making the most in a really tight salary cap market. You know,

it's different to me when we talk about Matthews and Marner and I guess Nylander and, you know, Tavares, whatever it's different to me talking with those guys and the middle class guy, go get yours, go play for a bottom feeding team like mckeough go to vancouver and make five schmill a year great but i do think that there's pressure on matthews fair pressure to take less money to help the team and say we're not this time we're not about squeezing every penny out

of the team i uh i've always had this theory where I would put three superstars in a room and say, we've got $24 million or we've got $30 million. How do you guys think it should go? You guys decide and you let me know. I mean, I love that idea. That's borderline Babs

in the list here. We've got to be careful with that kind of thing in Toronto. It's true though. I'd like to see them get along then. 10-10-10. Done. What's that? 30. That's easy. 10-10-10. No way.

They had an opportunity to do that and Lou Lamarillo once upon a time gave Matthews camp and Marner's camp the thought that we're going to treat you like Chicago treated Taves and Kane. And they were both attending a 10.5 and they were equal, same agent.

Nobody's whining and complaining. One got more than the other, but yeah, it's hard for them to, to realize that or get them to agree with it. Right. So we've heard absolutely nothing on the Matthews front in terms of a contract. If it's, you know, Freed said that there's potential it's going to get done here,

but we haven't heard any, like, friction or whatever. And now you hear that from Frank about Nylander coming out. If I'm a Leaf fan hearing that, it makes me somewhat happy because if Triliving is full court press on Nylander now, he must have some cost certainty on the other guy. He probably knows that Austin's signing. I will say that it's June 26th, and we haven't heard a peep from anyone on anything.

I think he's signing. He may have to come clean with the Nylander camp to say this is what he's signing for. That's interesting. That makes sense. makes it makes me feel a lot better if he's at if he's at 12 maybe i'll take nine or nine and a half i'm okay with being he ain't at two and a half yeah who no uh austin's not at 12 13 and a half yeah he's at he's at 11 6 now right so is he getting a million and a half raise or $2 million raise?

I hope it's the first one. I hope it's a million and a half for our sake because a show who wants the Leafs to have money to spend. Is Willie asking for a $2 million raise? I think it's a million and a half. And he says, okay, Austin's making $13.1. Which takes you to $8.5, $9 if it's a lateral uh raise for both of them you know there's some fair cases to be made about contracts i think marchese was saying on their show they had mentioned like the forsberg contract and comparables dated oh no no no certainly dated

but at the time he signed it the percentage of the cap yeah you know would take willie to at the same percentage of this cap yada yada but we are also talking guys that uh we assume that the leafs want signed anywhere between five million and eight million on a cap that we know is just on the cusp of going up can i tell you if i'm signing the willie deal i don't want to do big term i don't i want him i want his contract up i want him to be thinking about his next contract i don't think he's a guy who's gonna do great if you give him eight years and it doesn't matter what he does between now and age 36 he's a guy i want to go shorter with interesting like a four or five year with him yeah sure i'd consider less i'd consider three or four so that makes sense for austin matthews as well

does it not? Well, no, because my point about Willie is motivation. And I don't think Willie's a guy or Austin's is likely to just sleep through seasons. I don't know. He's slept through the playoffs. Come on now with this. Come on. Matthews? I'm not going to retrofit his playoffs as being bad all of a sudden.

It's not bad, but he just hasn't shown up. He scored five goals in the first half. How many in elimination games? I feel like he's played pretty well. How many in elimination games? One. No. Sorry again. Well, in three, in game six he scored. So more?

He scored in game six when they won, which is an elimination game, right? He scored the goal. I don't know. Yeah. One? Yeah, it was 1-1 and he scored the goal. I don won, which is an elimination game, right? He scored the goal. I don't know. Yeah. One? Yeah, it was 1-1, and he scored the goal.

I don't know. I thought he was pretty good in the playoffs. Okay. All right. Listen. He didn't sleep through the playoffs. Just not dominating. Just not dominating. That's all.

Definitely not. Definitely wasn't the same type of year. I'll give you good or very good, but highest paid in the league, good? No, 100% not. Okay. All right. Anyways.

All right. Let's move on but he's gonna be the highest paid guy yeah he is but the only question is is by how much because a guy who won the stanley cup in colorado only was allowed to go up a hundred thousand dollars of connor mcdavid i gotta tell you something right now so tell tell me with a straight face how Austin jumps up to two or three million. I feel more comfortable with someone other than Dubas negotiating the contract because he got beat pretty cleanly on all the other ones. Yeah, all you got is to look at history, and it didn't go well for him.

No. You think Brad Treeliving is the guy to play a little hardball with these guys? See, I think he has a big advantage that he didn't have the first time and that these guys have been paid. They have seen the salary cap crush their team and what they've had to do. You know, no draft picks because everyone has to retain salary for them to get players. And they've seen the reputation, how it takes a hit when you're overpaid. I think Tree Living is coming into a much softer approach with those guys than Dubas would have been.

Do you not think? Is that why Shane Doan's also there to do some talking? Yeah. Talking up the let's win together. Let's not worry about the money. Let's have the legacy. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if that's why Don's here.

That wouldn't affect me one bit if I were Matthews. I'd be like, yeah, I like that guy. Anyway, back to my contracts. What's the point of having him? He's an up-and-coming guy, isn't he? He's a hockey man. He's a hockey man. Yeah, he likes hockey.

He's a hockey player. Play hockey. Didn't win a ton, but. Do you want to talk about Tenenbaum quickly before we get to Arif? Just your thoughts about hearing about the news that his shares may be moving real soon. It's a lot of cake, boys.

Yeah, I mean, the valuation of the Leafs is very high. Yeah. But I will say it's sad to see, see in any way the face of ownership minimized he is such a universally liked guy and he's such a present guy in the rafters dressing room when they win in the leafs room when they lose yeah i didn't get a sense this year of of larry's presence for the leafs i didn't this year either but i have seen him around i was with the marley's and he used to come around you know we'd see him and he was in our team picture. Like he was a part of things.

I think it's still debatable on where exactly his shares are going. Cause I, I keep hearing that Bell and Rogers have first right of refusal on his 25% or less than I think, you know, I don't know what kind of clauses were in his agreement when he first came on board with Bell & Rogers, but I would think that it's still negotiable. Like for other, for them to get in there.

Maybe if he holds on to some shares. I think he will. I would imagine the deal's less about money and more about, you know, voting shares. Because he, I think it was set up where he, you know, as a minority owner, he probably had more voice than any other minority owner in the National Hockey League. Bell and Rodgers both own 37.5%. That's 75%.

I believe he was 25%, right? And I think of that 25, he's selling two-fifths, 40% of it or something, which is 10%. I could be mistaken on that. And often, would he have played out the deciding vote on things if they were split between Rogers and Bell? I would guess. You know, you would know more about that than I would. I don't know. I'm just speculating here. I'm just, you know, you would know more about that than I would. I don't know. I'm just speculating here.

I'm just, you know, spitballing that. Because it was supposed to be the Ontario municipal employee pension. Which I don't know. Would Bell and Rogers say, no, we're going to take those shares? I don't know. They got the money for that? Who? Well, I don't.

Does Bell have the money for that? Check under your seat. There's money. There got the money for that? Who? Well, I don't. Does Bell have the money for that? Has Bell got money? Buddy, check under your seat. There's money. There's Rodgers money everywhere here. Because it sounds like it's a $400 million chunk, so it's 200 a side or something. Yeah, I can probably make that work.

Yeah, I think they can. Pay you a little less and they'll be fine. I don't know. Not coming out of my share. Do you think people care if it's just Bell and Rodgers owning the team? I think. Without a face? Can Rodgers take hold and take all that chunk themselves? Okay. i share do you think people care if it's just bell and rogers owning the team i think without a face rogers take hold and take all that themselves okay to me all right let's go there hold on make it ours okay let's go there do one of them decide this is that we're gonna run the

i'll take the blue and white and i will waive uh restrictions on a second team in Ontario. Holy smokes! The room exploded. Jeez! The studio is on fire. What? Are you just speculating? You heard something?

Like, what are you saying there? Answer the question. Don't worry about where my... You can't handle the truth. Where things come from. Say it again to me. I said, I'm sure both of them would be very intrigued to hold on to the iconic Toronto Maple Leafs,

but in the event that they don't and they pass it on to their partner, would you lift the right for me to have a second team in Southern Ontario? Wow. That is such an excellent question. I think it's the most underserved hockey market in the world. I think if you put a team in, I don't know, Markham, Vaughn, whatever,

and you just pick a community, you're fine. I think immediately that team is super popular like there are people if people have the chance to root for a toronto team that was in the leafs and it would be so good for hockey here because everybody who was a leaf fan interned would immediately be shamed it'd be awesome rivalry nwo all over the place oh my god i'd be making fun of the mark the markham waxers of the nhl i would be making fun of their fans all the time. That's my number one thing. The Players Association are not involved with franchise fees,

but they would be licking their chops on, say, coming to Toronto or Southern Ontario instead of going back to Mullet Arena. Like, that's hundreds of millions of dollars. Oh, you're talking soon-ish. Well, listen, by the time you build an arena, you're talking three or four years, five years. Yeah.

But I'm talking sooner than later if the decision could be made as easily as, I don't know year and a half two years hell of a lot more attractive than going back to atlanta for the fourth time what's a franchise fee worth here you know what i mean if it's you know six years ago in vegas it's 650 or 500 in seattle it's 650 a toronto franchise has got to be that That's a really good question. Is it one and a half? Two. Wouldn't you want to see where your price point is first? Remember when Vegas came in,

they had deposits down on season tickets that I think got capped at 16,000 with a price point and people were lining up. Don't you have to get a feel for that first? I don't think you need a feel. No? I think the second you put the Vaughn, I don't know. Vipers?

The Vaughn Vipers, sure. I don't think you're going to have to get a feel. You're selling that baby out immediately. You still have the corporate boxes, the corporate stuff, obviously within Toronto. That's immediately the no problem. The reason why it's never been seriously considered is because it doesn't come with the blessing of Gary Bettman

and the Toronto Maple Leafs to entertain a second team in Southern Ontario. But if the ownership group was to relinquish their their 37 percent or their their half their their stake for a chance to maybe have a second team in southern ontario that changes everything so you're saying one of those telecoms being like you can buy this pr piece and just give us the chance to have our own second team. We'll split. I hope we're the least.

Then you really, you know, at the end of the day, Gary has to listen to his ownership. And if they have a chance to add $2 billion in their pockets. Ding, ding, ding. Who here would like a bajillion dollars? All of you? All right. Everyone say aye.

32, aye. Aye. All right, that's enough on that. Enough Fantasy Island. I'm going to call Arif here. Give me a sec. All right, Arif Dean's going to join us. What did you think? Before we get to Arif, what did you think of Ryan Johansson

being picked up by Colorado? You know, I'm not a huge Johansson booster in the sense that he doesn't score, he's not physical. I think he can kind of go quiet at times. Is that another way for saying at times he's a dog? Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's exactly what it is. However, he's also a large, you know, whatever he is, six-foot-whatever centerman, right shot, who scores 70 points or whatever his number is recently like he's

if you're on the open market if ryan new hansen were out there yeah he wouldn't cost four million dollars right he'd cost six and a half or something all right let's ask a reef dean avalanche reporter for mile high sports and host of hockey mountain high reef how are you and thanks for joining us i'm doing great guys i feel like you guys have been a little busy with the toronto maple leaf the last couple months so nice to change it up a little bit well you know what is nice to change up a little bit uh discussion points and and some things that we don't expect and uh would ryan johansson fall into that uh now a member of colorado one like 100 this is this is such a Joe Sackick and Chris McFarland move

in the sense where myself and a couple of the other reporters, we joked over the last few weeks where we tried to pinpoint every possible scenario the Avalanche could go at 2C, and we galaxy-brained some crazy ideas, and nobody got to Ryan Johansson. Like this is so off the board, the $4 million retention, getting him for seemingly nothing, they just needed to send a contract out because they were at the 50 contract

limit is, is a very off the board move. But the more you dig into it, the more it starts to make sense. Yeah. I mean, where, how does this change the abs? Do you like the addition? I understand it's clever from a salary cap perspective. Does it give them a better chance to win? I think it does, honestly. I mean, the guy that I kind of had my eye on is the same guy that the Avalanche were interested in

before Toronto got ahead of the market at the deadline was Ryan O'Reilly. And when you look at someone like Ryan O'Reilly, and then you look at someone like Ryan Johansson, obviously there's an injury. He's lost a couple of steps, but Ryan Johansson's, you know, his strengths aren't his speed and the avalanche play a very high powered, high paced game, but he's super smart. He's got the high hockey IQ. He's got great hands and it's very similar to what you would have in Ryan O'Reilly. So I think when you combine the fact that he's going to be playing with high-end wingers in Colorado, I know Lambuskog is out, but when you have guys like Lekanen, Nachushkin and Mikko Rantanen kind of available to you, you don't

have to be as strong of a centerman because the avalanche have this unique combination of wingers where, you know, they have lines where the wingers can carry the line. So between his high hockey IQ, the wingers at his disposal and the size that he's going to bring to that team, I honestly think it's going to be a great fit. Obviously the big wild card here is his health and recovering from the injury that he sustained. But other than that, I think the ability for him to bounce back is very much a possibility in terms of his on-ice production.

We're talking to Arif Dean, avalanche reporter for Mile High Sports. Arif, when we talk about limited centermen available, and maybe that's why a guy like Ryan O'Reilly can still command a pretty good price because there's just not that many out there. Ryan Johansson is certainly a decent pickup, but the comparison to Ryan O'Reilly is almost like opposites. One guy super serious about his craft at times. Ryan Johansson has been a guy that hasn't shown up,

not maybe in the best condition at times, and has never really proven to be a bonafide $8 million center in the National Hockey League, and he's 30 years of age now. And I get that they're only paying half price for it, but is there time for him to prove anything still? Can Nathan McKinnon grab this guy by the collar and say, what have you been doing for 12 years, man? Look at the size of you.

Look at the way you can shoot the puck and play. Why haven't you dominated? Is there time for that still with this guy? I absolutely think so. I mean, there's something about having, obviously, a winning culture and a core group that you rely on and you can trust that, you know, there were, you know, murmurs out there that the avalanche

might go for pierre luke dubois and that's a player that's asked out of two cities now and and he's 24 years old and it feels a little uneasy at first and then you remember he's going to enter that room with those core players and obviously he is a little bit younger but it's the same idea where if you trust the core and you trust that you're bringing in a player that has talent you trust that you can put it all together and i think that's a big thing like look at the way that the tampa bay lightning have made or have built their roster the last few years you had someone like kevin shattenkirk who got bought out of his contract and took a minimum contract or a very low paying deal with them with the tampa bay Lightning went on to cash out with the Anaheim Ducks and it's funny because that's exactly what we're

hearing now with Oliver Ekman Larson is oh that makes sense in Tampa he'll go there for a year he'll make a little bit of money and then he'll cash out again next year so when you have a room like that and when you have a winning culture like the Lightning do you can do things like that and I think that's kind of what the Avalanche and Chris McFarlane and Joe Sackick are banking on. They're bringing in a guy who's 30 years old. Is he young? No, but he's also the same age. He's going to be 31 when the season starts. That's the same age Nazem Khadri was

when he had his breakout year with the Azim 22. Not that Ryan Johansson is going to put up 87 points and score big goals in the playoffs by any means, but it's not by, you know, it's, it's by no means a 36, 37 year old that you're bringing in to play a depth role. It's someone that, you know, has the skill, has the talent, obviously the attitude and that part of his game is a little bit different than Ryan O'Reilly's, like you said, but if

you trust the guys you have in the room and you trust that this guy has the skill to do it, you put it all together and you're kind of banking on that. Last one for me, just, you know, what are the Avs prospects of getting back to being legit cup contenders this offseason? Just looking at their lineup, some questions. I guess Nachushkin is fine and going to be back, it looks like. You know, what are their odds, you think, going into next year? Is that right, Ken? Yeah, no, no, for sure. And then just to add to JB's question, the thought of Nikushkin coming back

and, you know, is it done and over with here? Is there a lingering effect of this guy coming back? So to talk about Nikushkin first, is it going to be a lingering thing? Is it done and over? It's very much a question that i think the avalanche are going to keep behind closed doors uh because that's the way they've been doing it since the beginning it's been very hard to get any information if natushkin is there at training camp and if he's still a top six forward which i suspect he will be because that's what you

know we've heard at this point has been confirmed uh i would assume that between now and training camp, he has had meetings. He has had Stern talking from Joe Sackett, from Chris McFarland, from Jared Bednar, and from the leadership course. You know, Gabe Landis-Gaugh is not playing, but that's still a voice that people respect. Nathan McKinnon, Mikko Rantan, and Kiel Makar. You know, someone like Andrew Cagliano comes back. That's been a very big voice in the room the last couple years. I think that if anything is going to linger from it, they're going to put it to bed before training camp, and they're not going to let that be an issue.

In terms of what he has going on and what caused that very, very mysterious event that happened in Seattle, I can't say if that's going to be something that's going to linger with him. But I think four or five months is going to be plenty of time hopefully for him and for the team to kind of rally around this and find your way through it and not have it linger because that's the last thing this team needs like already not having Gabriel Andeskog already having dealt with losing Nazem Kadri you need Val Nachushkin and you need him healthy and that's not something you really had last season. He was playing hurt seemingly since the Stanley Cup final.

So that's very much something you have to put to bed. So for that part of the question, I very much think that they're going to work through that between now and training camp. Arif, thanks so much for shedding some light in Colorado for us. Really appreciate it, pal. Absolutely, Nick. Thank you guys for having me on again.

Thanks, man. Reporter with the Colorado Avalanche. And just to note, Nikushkin, six more years at 6.125. But like, are you worried about that? Yeah, for sure.

To me, that gong show, that whole episode, was a gong show. Does it whole episode well he had like gong show does it not seem like he had like a i don't know i'm not weighing in on the thing but this is the playoffs but it seemed okay but it's just like one thing in his career he had like a blow up here unless it's a consistent trend with him or a lifestyle or whatever i don't know i don't know either i i will say the type of thing of thing he's rumored to have been involved in does not seem like something you stumble

into once, which is partying, you know, during the playoffs. I get the rolling the dice on Ryan Johansson to get a guy that's skilled with that

much potential for $4 million. Yeah. Is, I guess, a decent. Her foot made 3.5. Johansson at 4? Okay. That's backhand sauce in the league. Is he going to be like Jack Eichel,

where the room's so strong with Kael McCarr and Nathan McKinnon and Rantanen and Landis Cogh when he's around the room. Is that going to overcome just this guy that's sometimes going, eh, maybe tomorrow I'll be better? I got to tell you, his reputation has really been outsized. He's not known for his defensive work, right? We so i assumed that he over his career had had some large offensive numbers his highest output for points in a season is 64 that's his career best point output he's scored over 20 goals um three times he had 12 goals 55 games like 28 points. Last year, 28 points. Dash 13. Yeah.

Wow. I mean, you know, all of a sudden, it's like 4 million. I don't know. Boy, even 4 million seems. I could see that working out for them, though. It's going to. If he gets 50 points at 4 million, that's not easy to find. Kipper, before we go to break, I got to go back to this two-team thing.

I know you're talking about money and all this stuff, but how the hell does one decide we get the Leafs? Two competing things are like, you know, we are the one who gets the most profitable team. That's us, pal. Everything's negotiable. I know, Kippy, but like. Everything's negotiable. Okay.

And you have a chance to be in Southern Ontario and control everything. They're both, they can both put the games on their network. I understand the legacy of the Leafs. The chance to make money may be greater with a new franchise for a while, with all the excitement and buzz and all that. I bet you they're immediately a top 10 to top five most valuable team yes the question is yes if if let's say rogers holds on to the leafs how badly do you want to own it yourself that's the question enough to overpay me and allow me to do this within, I don't know, 100 kilometers.

Maybe it's the Kitchener area. Maybe it's further down 401 West. London. Maybe. I mean, don't know. Oh, my God, there's not a team I would hate more in the league than that London team. That ain't happening.

I'll tell you that right now. But there's Markham. There's Downsview. There's Pickering. There's Newmarket. Newmarket market vaughn right so vaughn's really close though i don't know that's a subway right away yeah just well what's the problem with close i mean uh the but the nicks and nets are doing okay you know the mets and yanks i have no no doubt that the situation with Larry Tannenbaum will open up these type of discussions in the future.

So, you know, they're monumental decisions here. So Larry, you think, was kind of like the traditionalist in terms of those things, like being like, no, there can't be another team here, that kind of thing? Like you think there'd be other people more open to it? I don't believe there's anybody under the mlsc umbrella that would want to share anything with anybody right yes come on a new pie of money we've got the whole market why do i want to give it up right yeah well i'll tell you why three billion four

billion five billion yeah yeah for sure interesting that's just a really interesting conversation that i wanted to circle back on okay can i expect more questions in about 10 minutes from you no well we're good it just feels really insignificant now to be like and what did you think of the derzy deal you know i do think the pierre-luc du bois conversation okay what about jordan stall signing four years how old is he 35 2.9 AAV, which is a fantastic number for a guy that plays 18 and a half minutes as their most important 200-foot player. But it's almost like the old back-diving deals where you didn't think they intended to play them out.

His last year is 750. Oh, no, it's a three-year deal masked as a four-year deal. 100% it is. Yeah. I love that contract for the Canes. I did too. It's a great, like, I mean, 2.9. Stahl a four-year deal. 100% it is. Yeah. I love that contract for the Canes. I did too. It's a great, like, I mean, 2.9. I was like, I want to play three more years.

They're like, four it is and we'll knock down the AAV. 2.9 is hard to complain about. Now you got to get Nylander to do what Stahl did and Matthews to do what Stahl did. Right? Yeah. Yeah, right. Where else do you want to go? Pierre-Luc Dubois.

Let's get a quick conversation there. I, for one, had been all over the Montreal destination for this guy. Yeah. And he's still in a perfect world. Wouldn't mind going there at all. But it really makes no sense for Montreal to be aggressive on this to get him. In terms of their timeline? Yes, 100%, JB. for Montreal to be aggressive on this, to get them in terms of their timeline. Yes.

100% JB. Their timeline doesn't, doesn't lend towards giving this guy an eight year deal. No, it does. In the ballpark of eight, eight and a half million dollars. It doesn't does, you know,

cause he's 24. And so the cap's going to go way up. You're buying his prime. And I, you know, I think your young guy's got to play with some players. I don't think you could be terrible. Oh, they're going to be terrible.

They're going to be real bad. For how long? I don't know. If you start getting PLD and guys interested again, maybe not as long. I don't think you, no, I don't think you can be that long. Right now it looks like it, unless you sign guys like PLD. I just feel like for for dubois he's been he's asked out of two places as araf mentioned at 24 years old and you know tortorella

no he he was he's not asked out of winnipeg well he's clearly stated he's demanding but that's my choice yeah okay yeah it's his choice they're his choice. But Tortorella didn't used to yell at him on the bench because he was a great, motivated night-to-night guy. I feel like if he goes to L.A., you could have another pouty baby stretch where he's not in Montreal. He wants to get to Montreal. So to me, it's like get to Montreal

and do what you got to do to be there, PLD. If that's where you want to be, take less money. Or go to LA and win now and try to win now. Montreal seems more important to him. No, see, I question that. If that's more important to you to go be a rock star and have everybody kiss your butt and not have a chance to win, I'm questioning that. Yes.

Same for me as Gaudreau going to Columbus. But he's not. He's not. He's picking LA. And this would certainly change that appearance, right? That he, you know, and obviously Los Angeles is a place people like to live. Man, yeah. I think it'd be all right.

Yeah. Like, they're a good team. They add him. Yeah. Like, that's a big addition for them. Well, I don't love LA as much as other people but with dubois it really changes my perspective on them because kopitar's getting older dowdy's getting older like you bringing a guy like him i want them to pay him too because the other you know what that means the other issue

is less money for austin matthews oh right right right right right what do you say i'd like to affect the likelihood of matthews going there if they pay a lot of money to Dubois. That's a very good point. Thank you. How is this about the Leafs? We have found a way to make it about the Leafs because that's the fear. It's not Arizona for Matthews leaving. Maybe it's the Vaughn Vipers.

Which for me personally, the fact that they've gone down the road so close to Pierre-Luc Dubois. They don't think Matthews is coming. They don't think he's coming. The whole show, we've unintentionally been like, the Matthews ain't leaving show. I do believe that that lends towards Matthews signing some type of deal in the next week.

We should break. All right, let's go to break. I'm not leaving. We've had some good conversations for a measly Monday. Listen, we're good at what we do. All right, let's see if we're good to's go to break. I'm not leaving. We've had some good conversations for a measly Monday. Listen, we're good at what we do. All right, let's see if we're good to throw it to break. Real Kipper and Bourne back after these words. Dive deep into Toronto sports and the NFL.

The JD Bunkers podcast. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Van. Gonna love this time of year. Elliot Friedman just put out a text saying Taylor Hall will be going to Chicago. Huh? Yeah, that one, I had heard Taylor Hall's name last week.

Why can't they do Tavares? Clearly Boston creating dollars and cents probably to keep Orlov. Keep Orlov or even add if in the event that Patrice Bergeron is not coming back and Krejci is not coming back. All of a sudden you don't get that. Other name Bertuzzi too. Bertuzzi they want back. Yeah. Big time.

And he's a UFA and he just made what four or five and a half or something. So he's going to need probably more. So slide the Taylor Hall money over to Bertuzzi. You would think. Yeah. What did Bertuzzi have last year was not great. Numbers wise year before he was 62 points in 68 games, Bertuzzi, you would think. Yeah, what did Bertuzzi have? Last year was not great numbers-wise.

The year before, he was 62 points in 68 games, 30 goals to go with the pesty stuff. Like in Boston, they're going to love that. Net front guy who had 10 points in playoffs in seven games, seven or five goals. Wow. Would Taylor Hall be excited about playing with Bedard? Or, Jay, here's something.

You're not going to get close to a Stanley Cup for another three or four years. So what happened there for Chicago? What did they get back with? Like, do they want to get better? Are they trying to win games, maybe? I would think at this point, you do not want to tank anymore.

You don't want to surround Bedard with any negativity. This is about building and moving forward so maybe hall can come in and and maybe mentor him a little bit i mean that's part of the equation i think if you're chicago and davidson i was starting to say that about pld and montreal like i am not a guy who thinks bottom out for years and then turn it around it's so hard you saw buffalo like bottom out for years and then turn it up and then and then turn it up oh it's really hard it's really hard to get going the other way and i support teams who try to win even detroit signing seven ufas last year and just starting to go the other way there's value in that to me and helping those guys try to

win games frege also sent out a text i think the other day about Aiden Hill and looking at a – did we do this already? 4.9? Yeah, we did. We mentioned that. Yeah, yeah. Okay, I've been hitting the head a few times over my career. Sorry about that. That's all right.

I think Borny has said this before, but with Taylor Hall in Chicago, you need hockey players on your hockey team. Yeah. And I think he's a – I'm sure that they'll have to be a pick or something like they're gonna be incentivized to take his six million bucks still right like that's a lot i think he makes four and a half no six uh i think i think yeah he's coming off of a bit of a discount to go to boston uh jb's right the cap it is six6 million. It is. Hey, that's the AAV. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Four years, $24 million contract.

He signed. Oh, okay. In 2021. In terms of money that's left. Left? Yeah, he's got 5.25 the last year. Okay, here's one I know we haven't discussed yet. Eric Carlson, he wants to trade to a contender.

What's he have left? Four years at 11? Double check for us. That changed tune, right? Like, wasn't there a while about would they approach him, would they not approach him? See, this is doable. But what's going to have to happen?

11-5 till 26-27. Four more years. Okay. What is going to have to happen, and this could happen as early as this week, if San Jose just understands they got to take a big bite out of that salary. Three and a half brings you to eight million.

Keep going. Four and a half brings you to seven. If Nashville did 50%, that's what I'm asking for. I'll take him for five and a half, six. What's that? 5.75? Or you start asking for 50 and you start taking it down to 45 and 40. Yeah, I mean.

You could move him. I just think if you're saying Jose. Would you pay seven and a half for him? Oh, man. Eric Carlson is seven and a half. Let's go. Let's go to eight. Do I have eight? Eight and a half.

Ah, yeah. You got eight. I'd pay for eight. Nine. No. Eight, five. Sure, you got eight. I'd pay for eight. Nine. Nope. Eight, five. Sure, let's talk.

Eight, two, five. Let's final offer. All right. Eight, two, five. You can do that, and I will give you a player for eight, two, five. He just had 101 points. See, that's 101. Yeah, I know. I get it.

I get it. 101. I don't know. We don't have much time, but maybe we can get into it. So are we talking Leafs here? Is that what we're doing? I don't know. Where do you want to go with the Leafs?

Carlson. Eric Carlson. Here's why I want to talk about that. The Leafs, everyone's going, they need scoring, they need scoring. I'm sitting here going, they need D-men. Again, we don't think Giordano or Hall are going to be there. Right now, it's Riley Brody. I don't think you can go.

Lilligren, McCabe, and Timmons. I think you can go close to $9 million for Eric Carlson on the Leafs. I don't think there's... Can you send him Willie and have him send back someone else's good? Yeah, there's possibilities there for sure. That is a blockbuster. I don't want a guy who's had surgeries and could blow a wheel at any time. Yeah.

Yeah. Before playing 82 games last year, he was 53, 56, 52, 50. Oh. And then 82. Oh, that's tough. Listen. That's tough. Still finding a bona fide shutdown guy.

And I appreciate McCabe. Didn't end up being Muzzin he's making two millisies they love him at two doesn't doesn't appear to be uh a legit top four guy no right great at four five and six don't mind him in the regular yeah is carlson what you need now to more offense and more go-to can't score i know he I know he can score. Yeah, he scores. I know. All right. All right.

Just like that. Our hour's up. Arif Dean, thank you very much for joining us from Mile High Sports, talking Ryan Johansson. We are back tomorrow, and we are back the rest of the week. Make sure you join us. Make sure you give us a rating and review. If you're on YouTube, give us a thumbs and review if you're on youtube give us a thumbs

up appreciate you always being on the real kipper and board show with us have a great night everybody