Real Kyper & Bourne - Winger Winger - Is Tavares the Answer?

Episode Date: January 3, 2023

Nick Kypreos, Justin Bourne and Sam McKee are back together and kick off 2023 by discussing Canada's overtime win over Slovakia in the quarterfinals of the World Juniors, Connor Bedard's imposing stretch and which NHL teams should consider tanking for him. Two-time Stanley Cup champion and Hockey Night in Canada broadcaster Craig Simpson joins the show (41:24) to catch up with the Leafs and discuss tonight's matchup against the St. Louis Blues, Matt Murray vs. Ilya Samsonov, concerns for John Tavares' offensive production and if he should be moved out to the wing. Later, Blues' general manager Doug Armstrong gives his take (1:06:44) on his team's season so far, how he approaches team-building and trades, and why his system is geared for success in the playoffs. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

This is Real Kipper and Born on Sportsnet 590 The Fan. That it is. Season 2, episode 58. But more importantly, number 1 in 2023. This is a big year for the Real Kipper and Born show. I'm counting on it. A huge year. And we are so glad you are all aboard sports at 590 the fan our youtube channel is back live and in color pod uh podcast on itunes and spotify plenty of choices plenty of choices. Plenty of choices. Consume where you prefer. We're available. Nick Kiprios, Justin Bourne, Derek Brandeo, Jen Rolnick, and our very own Off of Vacation.

We don't get vacations. No. But apparently Sammy McKee does. He's living a charmed life. So we're all buried up here. Yeah. And he's in shorts tweeting 60-foot putts. It wasn't 60-footers.

What was it? I don't know. Probably 30. Down the hill. A bit of a slider. So yeah, it was pretty good. Is that what your caddy told you? Yeah.

Did you have a caddy? Yeah, we had to at the course. We did a whole timeshare thing to get the course for cheap and stuff. No. Oh, yeah, we did. You had to sit through three hours of BS? It was like an hour and a half. It wasn't too bad. And how did you get out of there? You just eventually said no thanks?

I said no. No, they were not that pushy, to be honest. Do you even remotely fake that you're interested? Just out of... They're giving you a round of golf. The most you can do is fake it. By the end of it, I was like, guys, that's a pretty good deal. Don't you hear the commercials right now on how to get out of timeshares?

That's why we didn't do it. But no, it was good. It was a really good trip. Can't believe I'm sitting here again. The two weeks that we were kind of, was it two weeks we were off? I was off at least. It just kind of went by in a flash. That felt like a shot at us, the two weeks thing.

Was this a reminder? Of what? The bonus week that Sammy enjoyed. So jealous. Yeah, no, it was spectacular. I had a fall, boys. I had a fall. I fell down. Limpid like Tiger around whenever it was, Torrey Pines? Yeah. I wiped out in Mexico. Not even, it was like 8.30 in the morning.

Can't even blame tequila. Just crocks and wet steps, and I went down like a bag of potatoes boys it was bad my legs still not right you know who showed up with the injury mike fuda we had mike fuda on morphine that's that's a that's a team player right there so what time did you shut it down and when was the last tequila shot before you slipped well honestly question not even that like i was going to bed at 10 most nights. I'm more of a day guy at an all-inclusive.

I'm not going to go to the club at the all-inclusive. Shut her down around 10. That's good. Well, we're glad you're back because misery loves company here on the Real Kipler and Bourne Show. Absolutely. And we got a great couple hours here because there's so much to get into. Craig Simpson, former NHLer, two-time Stanley Cup champion.

He's teeing up tonight. Leafs and Blues will get his thoughts on a large schedule coming up for the Toronto Maple Leafs in January. The goaltending situation, Morgan Riley, all of that in the second hour. We'll also touch base with general manager of the St. Louis Blues, Doug armstrong he'll join us from halifax yeah good get today as he's uh and many general managers are soaking it all in on uh on what they can see out of a guy like connor bedard i think it's a little late for st louis to tank for connor i think so? But there's others that are certainly in the mix. But we'll get Doug Armstrong's thoughts on Bedard and the St. Louis Blues

as they tee up the Toronto Maple Leafs tonight. Like many Canadians out there, I was watching Connor and Slovakia battle it out to go down to a final scenario of a three-on-three hockey and watch a spectacular finish. But, you know, before we get into that, just life thrown right into our face last night from the moment that you think you're part of a great moment with Conor Bedard, you switch it over to the football game between the Buffalo Bills and Cincinnati Bengals,

and we see one of the worst events imaginable in pro sports. And, of course, it's not a hockey thing thing but it is certainly a reminder to all of us that whether it is a contact sport like football or hockey or even sometimes not such a contact sport that athletes out there put it all on the line every time they step out on a sheet of ice or a battlefield like professional football. Yeah, we do have a sense, I think, when you watch enough pro sports that you're watching people in a movie, you know, or that something is scripted or that it's, you know, not as dangerous as it is.

And, you know, in my own life, I've dealt with some injuries and I've seen people with concussion struggles. They get older. You know, my dad has a whole bunch of NHL friends and, you know, you see how people are affected by the game, but it is crazy to see it directly translated like the moment to the incident like that. You know, it has happened in the NHL before. What did we have for who was so Chris pronger took the shot in the chest yuri fisher um rich beverly rich beverly you know all directly affected by you know heart

stoppages essentially right yeah but you know and sammy i i know you were all over the the canada slovakia game and to to to just go from that euphoria, that great moment that we've been accustomed to seeing out of Canadian world juniors over the past 15, 20 years, just to go from that moment to the Hamlin moment during the football game is just like, wow. I don't think I've ever experienced anything like that. Well, I was completely locked in on the i hadn't even considered putting on the football game yet because it was the late third period of

the canada game into overtime at the canada game and then um i'm just kind of like i'm in a bunch of uh you know group chats with a bunch of different people and they're saying like they're giving this guy and the bill cpr and the feeling'm feeling like, CPR? What has happened? And then you see the horrifying, like, the clip got shown a little bit too much for my liking. I just, I saw the clip a lot. And the clip of the guy, you know, DeMar Hamlin, it's really, really hard to watch. And you just kind of fall down. It's horrible. But, yeah, like you said, it's just a real wake-up call.

Because you're so locked in like these guys just seem like superheroes they seem like they can take whatever hit they can and they can run whatever they want to do they're not going to get hurt or nothing serious is going to happen to them and then all of a sudden this guy's getting stretched or getting an ambulance onto the field it was horrible it's absolutely horrible situation yeah davar hamlin remains in critical condition last time i i checked uh yeah and uh update we'll just uh our thoughts and prayers are with him his family and uh the buffalo bills organization uh in saying that uh connor mcdave or connor bedard basically or basically the second coming of connor mcdavid uh does something that i don't think shocked a lot of people if you followed the progress of this guy's uh junior career out west it's a joke not

a lot of surprise on the actual move that solidified a quarterfinal match with the u.s uh tomorrow night so connor bedard now has 21 points in five games in the world junior tournament 21 points second best is uh logan cooley who has 11 so you got a 10 point lead nearly double the second highest point total and if you i don't know how much that game you watch kipper but the utter inevitability of that player in that game was unbelievable to watch every time he got the puck it felt like the ice was literally downhill like it was just a flood towards the net hard shots great chances like it was a game that slovakia had a chance at oh they have more of a chance yeah like there's a real chance canada was gonna lose that game go ahead sammy and i'll pipe in well i i was i could not have had more respect for the way the slovaks played that game they were

the more hanging around they were the more aggressive team they were they were harder on the puck they were mixing it up they were they were playing the more dirty style old canada style hockey than canada was canada would had the puck a lot more obviously they're a lot more skilled but they were mucking it up cross checks hits like really playing physical canada should have lost they're the rest oh yeah it was that oh no i didn't watch the whole game canada should have lost and canada would have lost if it didn't go to a skills competition if they would have remained five on five overtime five on five hockey i don't think slovakia loses that game really and yeah so this guy this bedard fella i mean just stole the hockey game. Well, I don't say stole it, but took it over.

Once you go to three-on-three and you have far and away the most skilled hockey player in the world at his age, three-on-three takes more room, more time, more touches. All of it. Like it's almost a given that this guy was going to end the game on a three-on-three. I mean, can we just say, are you allowed to be the guy who says that it was pretty poorly defended? Am I allowed to say that? Or are we still just doing the. Can I also be the guy to say that in a major junior hockey tournament, that going to three on three in a do or die game is one of the most atrocious decisions of all time.

Horrible. Let them play hockey. Why don't they just have overtime? Just 10, 10 or 20 minutes ofon-5 and a shootout. And I'm watching last night with my family, and my daughter's almost in tears watching Slovakia's response to losing. Oh, yeah, devastating.

Think how big winning is for Slovakia. I don't know who the player was that got a watch. Oh, my God. I mean, he's going to look at that picture, and it's going gonna be a horrific reminder his mascara is running just of of how we you know we should have won right yeah no it's that's a tough moment for something that could have defined a lot of their you know they're playing careers they're all gonna be nhlers you nailed it they played the role of Canada, and the Canadian team held on.

Like, some of the hits that I saw, this Slovakia team, who's the defenseman that lost his helmet and then lost his stick and wouldn't leave the ice? He was chasing the guy up the ice with no... What is going through his mind? That was Justin Holl throwing the puck down the ice. What a horrific... Do you not know the rules?

He started to go to the bench too. But what is he going to do? What is your plan when you get there? Other than take a penalty, what are you going to do? He's the Black Knight in Monty Python. Just come back here. I'll bite your knees off. So I think I just, I could feel it early in that game.

Like right from the start. I know you didn't watch the full game, Borny. Yeah, I got the last couple periods. The Slovaks are the first five shots of that game. They were really playing the body early in that game. They were hard on Canada. Canada got, I think they got the first one. They tied it up. You could just feel the whole way that the recipe was there.

Like there's two ways these junior games go, where Canada's just an undeniable force. Yeah, it's 9-1. And then these weird things start. the recipe was there like there's there's two ways these junior games go where canada is just an undeniable force it's nine one and then these weird things start they hit the pole how many times the canada hit the post four or five times two minutes left or something big saves by the goalie like all the recipes for a um for a upset were there and then the anti-recipe i guess you would say i don't know the takeout um old connor connor bedard just denies him but i i don't think i just love canadian hockey phenoms there's few things that get me more excited than when it's the next guy for canada because you know it's like every every

so well you know mcdavid and then crosby is he on that level with this guy we're talking about mcdavid crosby level excitement i don't know how you cannot think that this guy doesn't have a chance to be a generational type of guy. With everything that he's done, the numbers that he's produced, and the way he's produced them, how do you not consider him a generational type of player? I mean, that shot is the type of shot you need to score against nhl goaltenders i mean that was his first deep goal i think was the ot winner and you know the i made fun of the defending on the goal but the slovakian defender sells out on the shot because he'd shot everything you know so you got to give him some credit it's

what an ability to create and he's got that cross body where he brings it in close. That's the Matthews, right? And shoots it low blocker across the body. Was it Adam Gagnon? Is that Gagnon? How did he say his last name? He was so good, too. He stoned.

He stoned Bedard. Guy? Was that the? Guy? I don't know. Listen, I'm no linguist here. I'm not sure how to pronounce it. But the kid was sick. And he made a bunch of really great saves low blocker so yeah uh credit to him

so let me ask you this boys what's best for the league where this guy's where this guy goes what's best for the nhl in terms of who gets connor bedard if you look at the bottom of the standings i'll read up from the bottom chicago anaheim columbus san jose arizona montreal philly and then you're into like vancouver florida nashville st louis not a lot of good options there you know i i have a front runner for me philly the league is better with a competitive philadelphia flyers team as my friend anthony patrelli noted to me in a text and i totally agree with that the chicago blackhawks might be top of the list for the league but anahaheim, Columbus, San Jose, Arizona, not seeing them a whole ton being out west.

And I realize that's just us, but most of the hockey media is out east. Yeah, to me, it's an east coast team. What about Montreal? Montreal. They might get two kicks at it with the Florida pick. Do you believe that the glass is half full or half empty when it comes to strong markets getting stronger or the belief that if you're going to have 32 teams,

you need to spread it out. So in saying that, would we not look at right now out of 32 teams, the weakest link right now quickly. And I'm the weakest link. I say Arizona. Yeah, definitely. Oh, as a franchise yes sorry sorry no-brainer arizona i thought you meant the worst team that's my least favorite team in what has been jammed down our throats for the past 20 years yeah an important market well you sorry you think it's good for the league if bedard goes to play? Yeah, okay. I'm asking. Okay, and here is my answer.

No. I just, I don't, I can't imagine. It'd be so embarrassing for the NHL. So embarrassing to have this kid play in front of 4,800 people. Don't you think? More people go to his Pats games probably. It would make Arizona a lot more relevant. It sure would, yeah.

I mean, there is the argument that, okay, they get the Tempe Arena, this guy sticks out a couple of years and all of a sudden he's... I'm sure he doesn't want to go. No. Why would you, right? Right. It's not my job to fix Bettman's mess. Gary Bettman.

It's good to see you, Derek. Welcome back. Gary Bettman. How many times can we watch, you know, Boston and Pitt in an outdoor game while teams like no one cares about Arizona and Anaheim. I believe the teams who have division two NHL teams. Well, they're still, however long they've been around, no winter classic so far for Arizona, Columbus, I want to say San Jose, and Florida.

Yeah. Like, not even a crack at one. And next year, who gets it? Seattle. Which I'm sure when you buy an NHL team, they're like, don't worry. We're going to get you a winter classic here. You know, you pay your $6.50. We'll pay you some back with a winter classic the very next year.

Well, two years later. I'm looking at the standings. If you're Vancouver, it's time to get sucking back. You need to drill some holes in the bottom of the boat and sink. They're too good to suck. They are too good. To sink that low. They're too good.

And they're not good enough. But get bad. In a hurry. Well, tell Bo Horvat to stop scoring. Trade him. Right? Trade him. Like, get rid of, of like you're watching this this kid's from north vancouver grew up die hard canucks fan loves the canucks

wants to go to canucks this is mcdavid and the leafs all over again but to to kipper's point like if you go down the list of canucks players and i'm like stop me when they get to a bad player and you go petterson horvat kuzmenko miller h Miller, Hughes, Mikheyev, Besser, Garland, Ekman, Larson, Shen. Like, there's good hockey players on that team. Trade them. Trade them. And you committed over $8 million to JT Miller. Like, how do you turn around and tell everybody,

now we're tanking when you just gave this guy A+. It's just a really bad look. Have you ever gone to the mall and bought something, and by the time you get home, you're like, why would I buy this shirt? This is an awful shirt. Why did I think I liked that? I don't even like Ed Hardy. Yeah.

Like, how quick is Vancouver's buyer's remorse where they're like, he doesn't look good, he's minus 13. It's just a knee-jerk reaction because Bo Horvat didn't take your offer, your low-ball offer. That's why. Yeah, you had the money set aside to buy something. You're like, we're at the mall, we've got to buy something. So the horrifying thing here for Leaf fans is the chance of Montreal having two pretty

high kicks at a chance of Conor Bernard, right? Because they have their own pick, which is getting worse and worse by the, well, getting better and better by the day. They're getting worse and worse by the game. And Florida stinks. And they traded an unprotected 2023 first round pick for Ben Chiron at the deadline last year. You know, I think Kipper was the first to really declare that team bad bad but i i'm on board now that florida team's bad bad like not even not even like if oh they'll figure it out

if if that pick for florida ends up being bedard for montreal that is like a fireable offense yes somebody's going down in florida you don't get to you don't get to uh hang that no i can't imagine how much money that costs an owner not getting to keep connor bedard were it to happen that's just no person will be watching that that lottery ball closer than bill zito if that does happen that's florida's record here 16 and 18 they're at a six percent chance now for the top pick yeah they've got 16 wins in 38 games for the panthers who just won the president's trophy wild stuff okay one last thought sammy uh usa and Canada, I assume that's for the championship. Yeah, I think the other semi is Czech Republic, Sweden, or Czechia. Sweden, is that correct?

I think so, yeah. Yeah, listen, Czechia beat Canada 5-2 in the first game. They played them pretty well. They handled Sweden pretty good on New Year's Eve, but I think the consensus would be that the team who wins the semis there's nothing better than canada usa at any level of hockey to me that's the pinnacle yeah you can talk about russia and canada because of the the old school rivalry and it's kind of a tough one to talk about these days but usa versus canada at any level i will get fully behind and get extremely excited

for i hate losing to them the most by far so it's a lot at stake so yeah okay never mind yep i was just wondering about well fine i'll say it because i'm i'm gonna come off looking like an idiot here where's matthew nize why is matthew nize too old why is he not in the world juniors he too old i think he's too old yeah it's probably simple as that but yeah i should have known that answer it's 20 years old he is 20 years old yeah it's too old all right there you go good talk answered question all right okay in about 25 minutes we're gonna have craig simpson join us help us t.s up uh leafs and blues uh tonight we're going back to samsonov any surprise there some but i guess not really like you expect him to get back in they'll give

him a chance uh we've got in here his last seven game stats the previous so the last three games he's an 852 save percentage the the previous four he was a 979 save percentage so things have taken a sharp turn and it's time for time for him to bounce back and show that he's you know the the good samson off and not what he's been lately that's that was the worry though no yeah like this was always the worry that you were going into this he's like oh every other year he's ever played literally in the nhl he's had incredibly hot starts and fallen off a cliff but this year this year's it's different there are some of the pre-season concerns are surfacing and that is the goaltending has been not great lately john tavarez has five points in his last 15 games now despite playing alongside mitch marner all right before we get into maybe that just just to go back to the goaltending yeah

the scenario here it's a rather small sample size of three games yeah i think even not too worried about a couple of louis tonight uh thursday seattle seattle saturday i feel a lot more comfortable Thursday. Seattle. Seattle. Saturday. I feel a lot more comfortable going back to the concerned scale after these two games this week. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. I mean, it is quick, but I think because going into the year

that the expectations weren't overly high, when things do go a little bit south, it gets our attention a little bit quicker. But yep, give them a crack at it here before I jump all over. I got to think for the Leafs too that if a save percentage between the

two of them were somewhere between 9-10, 9-15, 9-18, they'd be okay with that. Oh God, if one of those guys can give them a 910 910 delighted and that would be a massive success you can win the cup with a 910 and they finished last year with well under 980 yeah i don't know what it was 898 or something i don't know they don't need 920 no they need 910 and actually the league save percentage is way down. So even, yeah, that would be wonderful.

That would be more than enough to win the cup. Right now, they're both 920 save percentage guys through 14 starts each, I believe. So good numbers for these guys, despite what was expected of them. All right. All right. Do you want to, how concerned are you with John Tavares?

He had a couple of assists on saturday night yeah i think one of them was a broken pass or to to bunting he tried to stuff it maybe short side he got a lucky bounce off a skate that went to bunting but clearly it's not the look that we had earlier in the season with JT. And is that, is that, is he just another player going over a stretch of an 82 game season where you're just going to have some lulls here, or is there a greater concern? You know how it is with like guys,

as they get older, anytime they slump, everyone goes, there it is. Here comes the end of season or end of career decline. So yeah, we're a little bit on notice about it, but the team is supposed to pick up around them do you want to start with keith playing the full a full team game would that be good relevant all right relevant

here let's do let's do that clip please the strength of our team and how we were able to have such a strong november and in december maybe not as strong, but a good December as well. It's just our team game has really carried us through. So I think sometimes there's a natural tendency to look to others, especially we've got some really good players, you know, both forward and defense. But when we really pulled together and relied upon our team game to carry us and then have individual performances push through uh within that that's

what's given us the greatest chance of success so that's what you want to have continue is everybody just comes in and does their job and plays within our structure and and the individual greatness you know comes through within that and that makes sense to me right like this is supposed to be a team thing and so yeah maybe tavarez can have a little bit of a down a slump here and then you know within that team structure find himself and get hot at the right time later fingers crossed and a worried face you there's is there is there a hope that even if john isn't as as strong as he was in the beginning of the season that willie marner and matthews can carry him through or Or does John need to be very good in the second hole

for the Leafs to have success? So I understand that the Leafs' plan has always been that these superstars are going to drag them through. And I think if you go around the league, lots of teams have a couple of good players. The best teams have three good players. leafs advantage is supposed to be you got four elite guys four guys making a lot of money superstars whatever if you bring it down to three if tavarez is okay you know tampa can match three three high-end guys right stamko stamko's kucherov and point they got three good forwards

lots of teams have three good forwards i think tavar is like the guy who makes a difference to me where you're like we got four guys who can do damage so yeah i think he needs to be good i think when he gets hurt against montreal and they lose that advantage it's a big deal for them i think i i mean it's not to you know end the conversation here but i care more about him playing well in april than i do right now like they're they're humming along they're playing well they just beat the crap out of the defending staley cup champions in their last game i as long as he can kind of figure it out and get himself going to what he was similar to the start of the year i would like that very much for april and right now he's got enough guys to carry him along do you like sorry go ahead kip you know go ahead

do you like that since marner tavarez and yarn crock have been aligned they've been the worst leafs line in terms of generating offense they generate the least there's been 10 lines put together in that time go back and see yarn cro. He's got 10 points in nine games. Yeah, but with who? Marner. No. Tavares. Yeah, no, no, no. Was it not with him?

Go back and look at it. I see more like line changes and points off of Keefe and Engvall. I don't think they've been generated off of the Tavares and Marner per se. Yeah, that's interesting. Actually, you know, I think about a couple of power play opportunities in there where you got points. Yeah. Yeah.

I don't think it's them. So that line. And just to clarify, that line has been the best defensive line. The Leafs have Marner Tavares and Yarncroft, the best since they've been together, but the worst offensively. So they play tough matchups.

They play in the D zone, but producing is a, a major issue there. So what's not helping John, play tough matchups. They play in the D zone, but producing is a, a major issue there. So what's not helping John or I think Mitch Marner now is, especially going in the back half when things get a little heavier and it gets tougher and teams button down is that they look over and they see, they don't see a presence on the left side. And now it's Jarnkrok who is not a top six left winger. No.

So if JT is going to snap out of this somewhere soon, is it going to be with Jarnkrok? You know, this is a problem, though, that we have to find ways to prop up jt right he's supposed to be a line driver at 11 million dollars a year and obviously he's playing with mitch marner and you know mitch has been wonderful this year it's just it's it's been a struggle lately tavarez has obviously slowed down significantly so hopefully he gets a little new year's energy a little little pop i'll tell you i'll tell you if if you are in uh the belief that you in this back half you're going to try

different things and have different looks i would think sheldon would have a couple of looks with tavaris on the left side you got to try it I think it would alleviate a ton of work for him. It's a problem, though. On some nights. I know you want Marner to play center. Is that what you would suggest there? So, yeah. I'm going to throw a twist at you.

Let's put in Holmberg in the middle for a couple of shifts. Yeah. And throw Tavares on the left side. I love that you love Holmberg. I do. I love it because I love Holmberg too. Oh, no. Listen, go back and listen to the sound bites of teammates talking about Holmberg.

Yeah. Big, strong guy. Smart guy. Marner had a three-minute answer. We just called him a stud 12 times. There you go. Just a stud minute answer. We just called him a stud 12. There you go. So a stud. Yeah.

I'm not saying that you're, you're, this is going to be your focus to start a best of seven against Tampa. Right. But get a couple of repetitions with this guy moving up in the lineup. Yeah. There, you know,

Keith had had some quotes in the past week about how, about them working Holmberg up in the lineup. And he said, you know, looking good in some situations, not as good in some others, but exposing him to see where his threshold is. Right.

Like what's the limit. You have to find out what's too far. Okay. You can't start in the D zone against, you know, Kucherov, Stamkos and point, you know,

like, okay, we got to find that limit though, for, for Holmberg and to his credit that we're even talking about him like this i mean i have a good year i would like to see him play with a a winger that could maybe shoot the puck in the net because it seems like he's getting zach astin reese and joey anderson and dryden hunt and it's tough because i do notice when i'm watching the games that he makes a lot of positive plays for his wingers in terms of putting the puck

in the right spot for his guys he looks confident with the puck now makes good defensive zone reads and gets the puck out to the wings and it's always he's giving it to zach aston reese who has one point in his last 30 games and tried and hunt who i say to sammy and you were there kipper i i like the leafs fourth line i understand between aston reese holmberg anderson and hunt i like that they have four guys that kind of go get the puck and work hard and play d and all that i know they're not big but like they in the regular season it's an effective fourth line i can see why there's concerns going into playoffs but i don't know i watched that fourth line i'm like you know if you add another guy and bump someone else down during the season all of a sudden you got yarn crock in the fourth

line or something you got a pretty good group i'd like to see a i'd like to see an upgrade in the bottom six yeah just one body there's one body yeah kind of changed that whole look just a little bigger a little heavier i just i think the last time Tampa Bay was in, I think we saw still sample sizes of Belmar, Maroon, and Corey Perry. Yeah. Big, heavy, along the walls. And just Leafs kind of missed that type of optic look. Yeah, they've been good.

I mean, that line has been good for years for them. them you know they don't play a ton in the playoffs but yeah i know what you mean the one thing that killed me today was i was looking at the uh um jonah siegel had his article today in monday morning leaf report and it was looking at last year their decor from playoffs and it was riley labushkin muzzin hall giordano brody or whatever it was yeah you know like it was Riley, Labushkin, Muzzin, Hall, Giordano, Brody, or whatever it was. Yeah. You know, like it was with Labushkin and Muzzin, that was a bigger, stronger group, you know?

Yeah, that gave them a feel back there. Like that was a, you know, a couple of meaty guys to go with your guys and move it and play. And so the plan right now. It's a leaner right now. Well, yeah. I mean, Sandin and Lilligran didn't really play much in the post season last year i think lilligran two games sandy not at all so now you're gonna have to be

your everyday guys they're obviously having great years they're obviously good players but it is just a different type of decor and i don't know if you love getting smaller to go play tampa in the first round i yeah i know most people would say that look how great they're doing and they're doing great i definitely like the options that they have outside of the lineup right now. I think, you know, Connor Timmons, outside of the point total, I don't think he's been as good as his point total shows. I think we can probably all agree on that. But he's had some moments where he's looked pretty good.

I think he's a good 7-8 kind of guy that if you have to bring him in for a playoff game here and there, and you'd kind of say the same about Jordy Ben. If you're looking at their group right now it looks pretty deep to me no it's deep it's are the six as good as the old six deep right it's to fill in for your six deep fifth and sixth guy they have eight capable nhl defensemen on their in their roster right now but to me it's are the six as good as when you had muzzin and labushkin and ariely and lillard sorry sandin and what version of muzzin are we talking about here the one that

played in playoffs last year who was very good yeah all right you know it's a it's a big ask it's so do you think they should trade for a defenseman well that's where we're going here because i just think there's like what do you are you taking out hall are you taking out is that who you want to take out is that your guy you want to take out lilligran sandin to me there's just if you're spending the asset your big asset your first round pick whatever your prospect you're going to do it absolutely has to be on a forward absolutely and i don't know the way kipper is rubbing his face he doesn't uh honestly it's pick your poison. Where can you get the best player?

I don't know, Kipper. Fully healthy, they still have no left winger. I think, you know, to Sam's point, and you've beat the drum too this year at times. They just. Yeah. Who, the best version of this Leafs roster, who's their second line left winger?

Truly. I just, if you ask me, which position is more important, it's the blue line. Yeah, come playoffs. Come playoffs. I believe you win Stanley Cups from the net on out, which means strong. And they've been one of the best defensive teams all year. They have been. Better than last year.

November and December. Better than last year. But you can't deny that that's an important thing it is november and december and it is different yeah terrific but they were whatever right listen i get it but we're talking about now we're talking about spending the asset to get better yeah and to me if you're letting dubas talk about evaluating this group and looking forward when he didn't make it, remember when he didn't make a trip, we're like, oh, my God, who's going to play? And he's like, we're going to see how these guys do.

And they all rose to the occasion. And then you're just going to, I don't know. Yeah. I think he, I do believe you have a better chance, I think, to have more of an impactful guy. If you're going to give up a first and a prospect, there's a very good chance you're going to get a 20-minute guy on the blue line. If you're going to give up a first up front,

like at the end of the day, what are you getting? What are you getting? I don't know. Yeah. Right? You're not going to get, I don't know. I don't know what kind of market's going to be for Bo Horvat. You know what?

Yeah. To say. Could it be a first? And Nick Robertson, if he comes back and he looks okay, is that going to be enough for Bo Horvat to rent him? You know what I feel like more and more is that like sandin and lilligran on d are going to be great but if you can avoid tampa if you can avoid boston if you can win the division i feel so much better yeah so much better about those guys playing that ship sailed i think

they're nine points back they with over half the year to go yeah the thing with that though is boston has to lose. They do and they're not going to forever. And they never lose. You know, I've watched them a few times. And it's 10, not 9. What's it, 10 points? Yeah. That's close. But they do have a run of games at home. This is my seg into

segue. How many? How many at home? They got 10 games in January at home and the ones that are on the road are puddle jumpers it's montreal it's ottawa it's detroit they're all around here they got a month that they could they go to boston too they could win some matches here that's exciting let's listen to keith talking about getting a stretch of games at home i'm just not getting comfortable i think that's the big thing we played really really well and had good results here uh it's you know the nature of our

schedule a lot of times we kind of bounce around, you know, between home and away. But, you know, it's pretty consistent. We'll scoot out for a short trip here or there. But it is a good opportunity for us to get some real traction here on home ice and just kind of get into that rhythm that you talk about. But, you know, you never want to get complacent or comfortable within that. You know, especially tonight we're playing against a team that plays really well on the road and all of that, and we're coming back off of a road trip and all these things.

So be excited to play at home, but understand that, you know, there's work required and purpose and all those kind of things that we bring to the road. You want to bring that back here at home. I think that's been a big part of our mentality. Blues blues team did they strike any fear into your heart where are they at no ryan o'reilly tonight no tarasenko two guys that contracts up you thought my trade get traded i think it's uh still undetermined on where Doug Armstrong, and he'll be joining us in the second hour, and we'll get into that,

just where his break point is on determining how good he thinks his team is and what that means for assets. But I think he still thinks that he should have a lineup that can compete in the West. And it's tough to disagree with that, right? I mean, right now they sit five points out of the second wildcard spot, but Colorado sits between them.

But still, Seattle is probably the team to back up a little bit. L.A. is, you know, it's possible they could. You know, St. Louis isn't done. They're in a tough spot. But, yeah yeah these injuries make some decisions a lot harder um and we have seen them move a a player like stassny to winnipeg knowing that uh he had a contract uh situation not much unlike uh ryan o'reilly yeah well the team was trying to win You could still think he can have a chance

to make noise in the West and still move a guy. For sure. But I like Ryan O'Reilly a lot. But... You could move Tavares to the wing

if he's in the middle. Would you play him as a... I wouldn't say that'd be the fastest group there. No. But intelligent... They can plot along together. Intelligent, smart...

Oh, they'd be good. They'd be good. Okay, we're going to take a quick break. We're going to bring back Craig Simpson. He is, of course, calling the game tonight. St. Louis and Toronto will get his thoughts on a depleted Blues lineup and what that means to the Toronto Maple Leafs. You're watching and listening to Real Kipper Inborn.

We're back after the break. This is Real Kipper Inborn on Sportsnet 590, The Van. Toronto Maple Leafs get ready to host the St. Louis Blues tonight. Let's bring in Craig Simpson, who will call the game tonight for Sportsnet. Simmer, how are you? Happy New Year. I'm doing well, thanks. Happy New Year to you.

Are you guys hanging in there? Oh, yeah. Yeah, we just, you know, top of the show, Simmer. You know, the euphoria of a Canadian win on an extraordinary goal by Connor McDavid to, you know, the... Bidart. What do we keep calling him, McDavid? Yeah, it's easy mistake. Yeah, easy.

To, of course, the tragic turn of events in the football game last night. Certainly is a reminder to all of us uh what uh all these athletes and in any sport really leave it out on the the field or the ice on any given night yeah and i think how much you take for granted just literally in your own life just the importance of your health but uh when you see the athletes performing at the level that they can and the physical feats that they do i think at times you forget the human element even about it so you know it's always a scary thing when a guy gets injured badly whether it's breaking a leg or you know a back injury whatever it may be but obviously just such a different perspective when

you're dealing with a heart and you're dealing with life and you're dealing with bringing him back to consciousness. And so it was a surreal, difficult task for the people doing the game too. I thought they handled it as well as they could have. And no question, just the way that the athletes themselves, forget about even if you're an opponent, obviously a teammate, you think so fondly of your teammate and the guys were so concerned.

But I think it said a lot about the opponent, the coaches, and just how everybody handled it. It was a tough night to watch and difficult, but a good reminder of the human element that is just the game, right? For sure. For sure. And, you know, the Maple Leafs resumed the things tonight, Simmer. I wanted to start 2023 off by getting a big pitcher thought from you.

Just on this season's team compared to the team they were last year. You know, we talked early in the show here about their decor going into playoffs had Labushkin and Muzzin in it. Different on the back end, some different forwards. Where do you think they stand compared to last season's team? Yeah, when you kind of look at the stat line, you know, it's not all that different from last year, the way it played out.

You know, a little trouble early on scoring goals and then a November push that continued on into December and I think you saw the same this year early on they couldn't really score five on five now all of a sudden you know they're back to I think plus 24 or so five on five and you know last year they were plus 28 at the end of the year. So I just think a lot of similarities, a little bit of a different makeup. I think they're really finally finding a makeup where you've got some consistency in the third line that looks like it's a line that can play against anybody that's starting to get a little bit of offensive chip in from the wings

with even Engvall and Kerfoot, you know, chipping in here and there. So I think they're a better team collectively, defensively, than they were last year. I'm not sure they're necessarily as, you know, explosive. I guess the numbers don't quite say from being the second highest you know scoring team last year to to you know trying to break the top 10 this year but that may come i i think collectively sheldon even said again today their team game is probably a little bit tighter and a little bit better than it was last year at this time. A good stretch here in January, Simmer, at home here.

A couple things that stand out to you that you'd like to see. Is there a chance that complacency might fall into place here somewhere in January when you see still Boston 10 points ahead in the standings? Yeah, you know, I don't know how you felt playing, Nick, but I always thought these are kind of difficult times. It's sort of January blues and blahs, and you come out of Christmas that can be exciting with family and, you know, exciting games.

It's just a different time. You get into that early to mid-January, early February, and then you get the all-star break. I think this always is a different time. You get into that early to mid-January, early February, and then you get the all-star break. I think this always is a tough time. I'm not sure if it's better to be at home or the road. You know, I think it depends an awful lot on how you're playing and how your confidence level of your team is. As you know, you get on a homestand, and maybe your game slips a little bit.

You know, that can be further damaging. I know you always say it's an advantage to be at home, but man, if your power play goes south, you know how tough it is with the fans when your power play's not going, or when all of a sudden maybe the goaltenders struggle a little bit. Being at home isn't all that safe haven.

So I think it is a critical time, and I really felt that New Year's Eve game was a very, very important one for them on the heels of losing again against Arizona. That seems to have their number. If nothing else, guys, with the homestand that you mentioned coming, I thought it was a really important game

for them to play a solid defensive effort against the Cup champss to have the lead going into the third and I think we talked about it during the game basically played you know about as much as a four-line game as you possibly can and everybody would have felt a big part of that win and you hope that that transfers here into game one as you start the start the new year do you think there's any sort of scenarios for them ahead where the goaltending plan isn't just to take turns with the two guys? Could one guy take the reins?

Could a guy play poorly enough to get traded? Are there scenarios where it's not just these two, your turn, my turn? Yeah, I can't really see the trade one, Justin, just because, man, look around. There's a few teams that probably do need some help and that might be needing to look to a goaltender. So you can never say never. But, no, I think that they've got to be, for the most part, pretty happy with the way the tandem, once they got healthy, has worked.

I thought Samsonov is kind of, you know, not just his numbers in the last couple of games, but just his style and some of the little mistakes or goals that have trickled through. So I wasn't totally shocked that Murray got another one. I wouldn't be totally shocked, you know, if he had got another one tonight. He's

had a couple of times where Murray's played three straight. So I think you might see one goalie get as much as maybe four in a row, but I can't see with all the games and, you know, the rhythm of how the games go that, you know, one guy is going to be six, seven, eight in a row. I do think it'll probably be a one-off for a few times and then two or three in a row. And then if one guy proves that maybe he's a little more on top, then I think that's when you've got to start making the decision

come playoff time, is this Murray's net or is this Samsonov's net? Because the last thing you want as a coach is come playoff time in those big swing games when maybe your goaltender played well, but you lost again, and you're facing elimination. The last thing a coach wants to have is, oh, God, who am I going to play tonight? You know, you just second-guess yourself all the time, I find, when you're in that scenario.

Honestly, I think that's where it's headed, Simmer. This is the way it feels to me right now, because I'm just watching the two teams that you need to focus on with the mentality of we're going nowhere unless we get by these two teams have bona fide right now, number one, no questions asked goaltenders in Allmark and Vasilevsky. And this is shaping up to game one in the playoffs

where I'm 65% sure that Matt Murray's the number one goalie until we see how this goes well you know that you just said it though that that's unless unless Murray or Samsonov just runs a table here where he's just spectacular and now you go okay this is my guy i think you're right and and the only thing i worry about that is your comment about the guy at the other end you know all mark i i would say okay this is his sort of first time that what is he 20 21 one and three or something like that it's like off the charts crazy yeah it's off the charts but that's that's also kind of uncharted you know water for him so you go maybe i'd like to take my chance on

that but it doesn't look like boston's falling off so you got vasilevsky again yeah like cooper's even if vasilevsky has a bit of a struggle he's not going into any game thinking about his goaltenders where you know okay you get down three games to one let's say and who's who's my goalie tonight you know that that is just such a gut-wrenching decision that you always feel you make the wrong choice so I do agree with you Nick it looks like it's headed that way and that's not a real easy situation to be in. But that's where you hope maybe one guy does sort of put himself above the other and you take that decision-making process right out of it. So in terms of the people in front of him, Morgan Riley has made his return to the Leafs lineup.

Your thoughts on how that's affected the look of the Leafs, D, and how he's fared so far? I think Morgan's been fine. He's only played like 20, just over 20, and just under 20 in the two games. Hasn't had to be, you know, a big horse or a big factor back there in terms of pushing the play. You had the five-man first first power play so maybe you missed a little bit of extra time that might have pushed you to 21 or 22 minutes but anytime you have a

knee injury and you're rehabbing you can never get totally up to speed so i think you always give a guy a grace period and you say okay you've got to be feeling better now got to be getting up to speed can you be an impactful guy you know he's can he shoot the puck a little bit more can he get involved in the offense can he push the play and I think that's what you want to see over the next little bit it sounds like if Sandin's coming back and Timmons goes out you know the one thing you say you've talked a lot Jason about the back end and the look. I think we talked months ago going into Dallas about how you have to play against different teams given the style that you have back there.

But now all of a sudden you've got a couple of little options and you've got a couple of decisions again and say, okay, Sandin deserves the ability to come back just because he was playing quite well and established himself when they needed it but man now you got a little competition back there that might push and say you know do we need to change on a on a certain matchup the the size of the look of the back end and those might be some interesting I thought Timmons has played pretty well he's not overly physical but he's he's not a guy that we've talked a lot about and

you know on the back end guys that means you're not making a whole lot of mistakes and you're getting exposed so i do think it'll be interesting come deadline time when they do already have a couple of different options back there of you know geez what else do we have to add and is it another defenseman or do you do you focus on the forwards? We're talking a two-time Stanley Cup champion, Craig Simpson, analyst with Hockey Night in Canada, and someone very familiar to playing on a number one power play. So I throw you this, Simmer.

Yep. When I see five forwards on a power play, I think what? Well, are we talking as a penalty killer or just as your situation? As a penalty killer, I'm thinking opportunity and I'm thinking pressure. You know, I think it's worthwhile going through the process for Keith, again, trying to see if something works, again, trying to see if you get some real chemistry. But I don't know.

I still think you get into, again, a playoff series where you've got Braden Point killing the penalty and Hedman back there. You're going, yeah, I've got to have one guy there that mine can flip to defense. And so I don't think it's going to happen in the end. I think it's good for situational because, you know, guys, there could be a game that you're down. You don't care about that. So I I'm, I'm totally good with the whole situation of, of letting it ride a little bit and letting it go.

But as we all know, when you're coaching in a playoff series, a lot of different decisions can be made at that time. I think to your point, you know, there's a lot of things that can happen in a game and you don't want to overreact to small samples of things and only getting a look at a few things going right or going wrong. You know, something we talked about a little bit before you were on was just john tavarez and you know speaking of sample sizes over the past 15 games i don't know if he looked like quite the same player he did in the first right you know 20 games or so uh overreacting to make too much of that

no not overreacting but i think i think being conscious and aware of first off every player right like you know that that's why the superstars are so rare that they rarely ever dip or ever have a you know a down in their play but anybody who's over the 32 33 number uh you know or has played a thousand games and you just know you're gonna have a little up and down you're gonna have a time where you don't maybe look as fresh maybe the schedule has been a little hard on you so i i don't think overreaction is necessarily the word but i think it's a reaction saying you know maybe we do have to back him off look at his ice time i have to look at my notes but i think he's under 17 for the last four straight yeah and that's to me yeah some nights he's played under 15 yeah backing him off and allowing him to maybe recharge a little bit

it might mean you're not as effective during those games or maybe selective to your effectiveness but i think that's a coach looking and saying, I can't be playing this guy 20 and 20 and 21 in a row right now. I've got to back him off and let him regroup a little bit. We also talked earlier in the show about the thought of maybe even alleviating some nights of maybe some hard labor. Let's face it, he doesn't skate like Willie. He doesn't skate like Mitch or Austin.

He needs to work hard when he skates. If maybe on an occasion in the back half, you throw him on left wing, is that doable? Or does that make the Leafs look bad that our $11 million centerman is now not good enough to be in the middle every night? Well, I guess your answer right there at the very end is a completely different discussion point,

right? That has nothing then to do with what do you think is best for the player. I don't really know John's mindset in terms of wing. I know I played center my entire life until my third year in the National Hockey League. And man, when I suddenly got to play wing, I was like, this is the easiest position in the world. Don't tell people. It was. And so there is a natural sense of even progression.

And I would consider myself like like John Tavares, he's probably a faster skater than I was. So, like, everything had to be aligned for me to be skating well and do that. Go to the wing, Nick, was like, oh, my gosh, this is a new life. And let my center drive the thing, and I can come and make plays and come late. So I think it's a valid question, but you're when you threw it to me with the contract stuff and you know, the perception stuff, I think that that's where your head coach has to say,

I just got to deal with my player and say, what's best for John and what's John comfortable with. I don't know guys. Has he played much wing? I can't think of, I mean, in a Team Canada thing, you'd go, yeah, you play anywhere, right? And you play in any situation. I think he did in 2010. Yeah, I think he did see wing action. But in those situations, Nick, there's no perception of what I make or do that. I'm playing for Canada.

I'm going to play wherever the hell I have to, right? Yeah. And so if you made a deal that brings somebody in that can maybe take some pressure for time in there at the middle, I'd be all for it. And honestly, I think he can still take his face off, which he's really good at. But then the responsibility and the play on the wing,

I just thought it was like the easiest thing going and maybe he maybe would take a little pressure off but that's that's a whole nother you know discussion point because of what you just said with the perception of being a leader and being a big money guy you know something that's also taken perception off and last one for me here sam i appreciate your time um was just taking some pressure off as having pontus holmberg this guy's a pretty good hockey player hey like i don't know going into the year they thought they had such a reliable guy and as a bottom six center exactly and i i think there's the classic example of giving the guy you know moving him a couple different times in the third line back down fourth line uh giving him an opportunity to probably play in some games early on that you know other guys maybe got pulled

out or put in the spot but being patient with a guy that you really felt had real potential and to me the telltale sign and you guys would know when your top guys are talking about you and saying good things about you and even on air in our broadcast about you and you're a fourth line center that says that you know there's a lot of things in your game that are strong and you know they all talk about man he's got a great stick and he's hard on the puck and he battles hard so I think that where in the last week and a half where Tavares, Matthews, Marner all talked about him in various ways. I go,

yeah, there's, there's a teammate now that those guys are trusting and saying, good for you. Like you, you've, you've found an issue, really fit in a very important role.

And I think Sheldon's at that spot too, where he trusts him an awful lot. And I think Sheldon's at that spot too, where he trusts him an awful lot. And I think that's, that's a line that can probably get a little bit of an input from someone else, or maybe a trade at the end too. But he now looks like a bona fide guy that you can probably trust and lean on in some key situations.

Simmer. We'll let you go and get ready for tonight's call on Sportsnet Ontario. Craig Simpson, always a pleasure. Thanks for joining us. Always enjoy your time here. You bet, guys. Take care. See ya.

Thanks, Simmer. Some great stuff there. Oh, yeah. I love the winger thing. Well, you know, as someone who played wing my whole life, I just hope people never find out how easy that position is. Go in your own zone. Stand somewhere near the top of the circle.

A horrific position. I don't think I skated like 500 feet backwards as a winger. Oh, I know. You just wait until you get to go the other way. Anyone who willingly chose to play center is insane. It's like goalie to me. It's like, oh, my God, who would do that? Yeah, so, sorry, you want to be a defenseman and a forward you want to start and finish every play no thanks i'm good at that catch

my breath here while you yeah yeah i'll hang out by the by the defenseman and kind of poke at a stick and make it look like i'm doing i'm in the lane coach you know uh you know we've spoke very highly of holmberg for quite a while here uh But the other thing too is, you know, Kempf to me, like another good player who I think has a little bit of upside as well to be moved around. Like even throwing... He scored 11 times last year, didn't he?

Even throwing Kempf up on a shift or two with Tavares and Marner, I wouldn't have a problem with... You know what, that's a really good point because he's long and Marner, I wouldn't have a problem with. You know what? That's a really good point because he's long and rangy and he can make little plays and you trust him. Like, yeah, you feel okay when he's out there.

It's a good point. Yeah, mixing more David Kampf. He's got 14 points this year in 37 games. He had 26 in 82. He's pretty much on pace for all you need out of him. 1.5 mil. Love it. Yeah, he's going to get Edmonton for now for the next 40

games and whatever you can squeeze and then you gotta say goodbye to him yeah then edmonton's gonna give him five times five someone may give him five times three oof i would like that to not be the maple leaves i love camp it's my favorite players but i don't know. Yeah. I'd give him five times three. No, no. So would I. I would. Yeah. He'd look good on a lot of teams competing. He'd be your third line center, you know, and try to get, yeah, your 10, 15 goals out of him, whatever, and have him take the toughest assignments,

D zone starts, win draws, PK. I just hope then Holmberg slides in, and at the very least is your third line centerman next year. Yeah. I mean, they're okay down the middle now, which is, you know, something you didn't expect maybe at pre-Holmberg era, but it's the wings now. The Holmberg era.

The pH. Was that pre-Holmberg or post-Holmberg? Change things. Holmberg be the Nick Paul in game seven. You know, they need someone. Max Talbot scores two Nick Paul in game seven. You know, they need someone. Max Talbot scores two for Pittsburgh in game seven to win one. Nick Paul gets the, you know, you need that guy down the lineup who just does something the right time.

Come on, Pontus. Just let the record show when it happens. We've been here all along. It's going to be Angvall. Just jam it right in my face. It could be Angvall. I've thought that several times. People are like, is he going to be thevall And just jam it right in my face Actually you know what it could be Angvall I've thought that several times People are like is he going to be the guy who scores that goal

You never know when you're going to get him He might show up and score you too Some nights he's just tantalizing You're like oh my god this guy When he's gone he's gone He's got every tool Well not every tool Sometimes he's missing the toolbox.

That's exactly what I was thinking. You can't quite put them all together in one area. They're all in a pile in different parts of the house. You've got to gather those. You've just got to find them when you need them. We've got to get to break. We're going to get to Doug Armstrong after. But I never really got your thoughts on the five forwards on the power play.

Yeah. got your thoughts on the five forwards on the power play yeah i just don't think it makes them that much better than if it's sandin or riley or someone who can actually skate backwards i don't think it makes them enough better that i want to see it who would you rather have on there out there bunting or sandin or riley yeah you know i don't know i guess sandin or riley is my answer riley probably imer nailed it. Again, about if I'm a penalty killer. Like, think if you're Brad Marchand and you got Mitch Marner on the point. You're taking a couple chances to poke one free

and getting... Yeah. Mitch Marner's one of the best defense players in the Leafs. I don't mind... I didn't mind bunting spot there on the power play, though. Yeah, you like him there?

But you got T tavaris there so oh yeah we're running into another awkward moment just yeah and there just doesn't seem to be anyone that can lock in between riley and sandin there's just that question it's just because of the contracts and morgan riley status it's Morgan Riley. No, it's because they haven't fared well consistently on that spot. Yeah, even with Sandin there. Sandin probably shoots the puck. In their mind, he probably gets pucks to the net better than Morgan. But Morgan's making...

Many millions. To do more than just not be on the power play. Right. So second unit looks pretty good these days. They're getting out there. Yeah. Okay. We got to get,

okay, we'll go to break. Doug Armstrong. We'll hunt down Doug in Halifax is all the big wigs are there for the world junior championship. That more after the break, you're watching and listening to real kipper and born this is real kipper and born on sportsnet 590 the van

okay let's get right into it because our next guest is a really busy guy. Yes. Out in Halifax. Let's welcome in General Manager of the St. Louis Blues, Doug Armstrong. Army, thanks for doing this. Happy New Year. And I take it you're with all the big wigs out in Halifax for the World Juniors. Yeah, well, happy New Year's, guys. And thanks for having me on. Yeah, we saw a great game last night.

Canada pulled it out there at OT. It was a ton of fun to be at as a fan and then to work it. But, yeah, it's been a great tournament. Looking forward to the next couple of days. So watching this phenom named Connor Bedard, not your team, of course, but would you think others would be watching it thinking, hey, maybe this is not a bad time to be not very good this year? Yeah, this might be a good year to have a bad year.

Is all of you guys watching this sit back like any other Canadian watching it going, wow? For sure. I did last night. It's the first time I've had an opportunity to see him play in person, and he didn't disappoint. I thought as the game progressed, they really played him physical. They went after him hard and tried to push him out of the game, and I think that just – I was impressed how it motivated him

to get more on the inside, more to try and want to take the game over. Some of just the things you pick up when you see him live, his release is probably the best I've seen at this level. And his ability just to change that direction or just the point where he's going to shoot the puck by six and eight inches where it just gets the goalies confused and he uses the whole net to score i was unbelievably impressed with him yeah he was uh it was quite the show last night so uh tonight your st louis blues take on the toronto maple leafs you guys head into 2023 here i'd love to get your your take

on the season so far for the blues compared to how you expected to be or things you know maybe i'm guessing a little bit behind where you expected to be what are your thoughts on the season so far for the Blues compared to how you expected to be? Are things, you know, maybe I'm guessing a little bit behind where you expected to be. What are your thoughts on the Blues season so far? Yeah, I thought the way that our season ended last year and quite honestly our play for a number of years, I thought we were going to be competitive. You know,

going into the year, I thought Colorado with the success they had last year, they lost some good players. They might take half a step back, and that would give everyone a little bit more opportunity in the West. And that may have happened. They've been hit with injuries also.

So the West, it looks like it's wide open. But our team specifically, we haven't played nearly to the standard that we thought we'd be able to play at uh we haven't played our defending has has been subpar pretty well all year long and uh we need to change that if we want to uh just basically get a foundation that we can start building off of uh doug does does looking at the Western Conference and seeing others be inconsistent change your thoughts on where this team goes and where you go towards a trade deadline? Do you see 92 points, 93 being the line to make the playoffs here? That's exactly the numbers that we talk about here.

92, 93 could probably get you in. It seems like we're all going to start feasting on each other as the season progresses. And, yeah, the West just doesn't seem to have the sashay this year that the East does. And that usually switches from year to year every couple of years. But no one's been able to really put something like Boston's done or into place out in the West. And so it's going to be competitive. And, you know, obviously it's such a long time to the deadline. It's nice to talk about it or have, you know,

I understand why people want to focus on it, but it's a long time until March and a lot of things have to happen. And you just look at the, you know, there's a lot of conversations around the NHL, except they don't seem to have with the 32 managers that make the trades. I hear a ton about it in the media, but I don't hear a ton about it from the guys I talk to. Just waiting for the phone to ring.

You do have a couple of injuries right now, which complicates things for you guys in trying to climb up the standings. Sounds like O'Reilly is going to be out, Tarasenko for a little bit. How does that change things for you as the team's GM heading into these months? Well, I think we need to focus now. We have to really play a strong team game, and that's always been our blueprint here. We've never been an organization that has been blessed with a Crosby

or a McDavid or Ovechkin. So what we try to do is be strength in numbers, and we're going to need that even more now. You know, we have Robert Thomas and Kyra seem to be two young players that we've counted on that are appointed game players now and seem to be turning up. We have a player like Shen that can slide right in and be that second-line center. So I think we have the people here to stabilize and to put some wins together. But as you guys know, it doesn't matter what people say. It's what we do, and we have to start tonight against a great Leafs team

that I give their coaching staff a ton of credit. They've been hit with a lot of injuries on the back end there, and they seem to find a way to play really good hockey. Obviously, they're a powerhouse in the league right now. Ryan O'Reilly, of course, is out with a broken foot. Four years ago, you traded Paul Stastny, and that must have been a tough decision because there's a fine line between the future and the present,

but you were still able to kind of stay competitive when you traded Stastny. Obviously, this is leading towards a tough decision with Ryan O'Reilly, but, I mean, there are ways to, I guess, improve the immediate future without selling the farm, correct? Yeah, I think that when I look at our franchise, with, you know, I don't want to overhype Thomas and Kairou,

but teams tank to get players of this caliber. And so I don't think we're ever going to be in a position to go to the bottom of the league for a number of years with these guys here. So what we're going to try and do is add to those guys, keep as many players as we can and keep pushing ahead and let these guys grow and get better. We have some other players that we're excited about seeing. We have Snow Guru just playing for the U.S. now.

Last year's pick looks like he has the chance to be a very good prospect. He's a very good prospect. He has the chance to be a very good player and neighbor. So we've got some young guys coming. But, yeah, tough decisions have to be made. And with the salary cap uh looks like to be relatively flat this year before it starts to take its jumps uh we have to be smart on what we do but we've had we're hoping to keep as many guys around here as we can and keep pushing ahead

and a lot of that's going to be dictated on how we play over the next eight weeks when you're at an event like the one you're at doug is is there a lot of conversations, you know, sort of planting seeds that can bear fruit as you get closer to the deadline? Actually, there's not, you know, managers, we're at a different hotel, so I just see them at the games. Yeah, we do that on the phone and talk more or less. It's not, it's things that, you know, we're, we talk quite a bit. I talk to the most managers, you know, at least once a month and sometimes more and you, you have a good feel of what's going on, but yeah, you,

you get a sense after a number of years being in the business who, who thinks it's their time and who wants to put, who has the assets that they might want to take a push. And you just try and try and understand that if I was to receive the call I'd like to see the logic that the person's saying so I like to have you know what I always say to our staff when they say well call them and ask this I said well I see that what's in it for us I'm not really sure what's in it right well you want to have a little little bit of logic in what you're making and uh the next eight weeks are going weeks are going to clearly define where teams are at also.

It really is, and more maybe show up to the party. I mean, for an example, we're watching Florida that ran away with the whole regular season last year, now struggling. They're going to have to make decisions here. But is there a sense from what you gather already that there's going to be a lot more supply out there with some bigger names than there will be with teams that can actually take them on

uh i think when there's a will there's a way you can you can third-party broker deals uh you know so let's say you take a player, you name the cap, you cut that in half if the team keeps half, and you bring somebody else and you cut that in another half. All of a sudden, if you do that math, a $10 million player becomes a $2.5 million player really quick. And so I think if you want to get creative, there's lots of ways to get things done.

And obviously players that have no trades, you know, have a lot of say in where they want to go and what they want to do. So I think it's a fluid situation right now. I think it's ever evolving. And you just have to be ready to act and react to what's happening. Given your guys' success, you know, in the very recent past here, do you feel like if you guys get in, you're just one of those teams that you just got to get in?

You're still dangerous once you get there? I think that's the NHL. I think you're dangerous once you get in. I think that the parity is here now, and I think it's here to stay under the system that we have. You run into a hot goaltender or you run into a team that gets some injuries

and you never know what can happen. And I look at last year where Colorado, they were a full-letter grade ahead of us, I thought, going in, but all of a sudden Bennington seemed to be getting on a roll and we seemed to have their attention, and then Bennington gets hurt and it changes the dynamics a little bit. But you never know what the other team is dealing with. They may look like the duck on top of the water, very

calm, but they're piling like hell underneath, so you just got to keep showing up every day and see if you can make them break. Hey, can you give your head coach, Craig Broomey, some crap for me because he neutered Bennington and I liked him better when he was challenging everybody out on the ice.

Well, it's like I can give him crap over the phone, but like you, you probably don't want to do it. No, no, no, no. He's still scary back there. He's a big man, isn't he? He's a big man and just throw a pair of skates on him and he becomes the toughest guy on the ice,

even at his age. You got that right. He seems to get a lot of respect when he walks in the room there's a little scowl on that face no question about that listen we know you got uh a few scouts i'm sure you want to look after tonight uh with maybe a nice dinner but uh really appreciate your time uh uh doug and uh all the best to you in 2023 well you've been around a long time kipper they don't really care what i think They just want me to take their credit card. Hey.

You take care, guys. Happy New Year. Throw it our way, too. Thanks. Doug Armstrong, general manager. Ah, man. That was awesome. I got to tell you that.

That was the highlight of working for the Marlies, was just getting to go out when the credit card came out and they take you to a nice steakhouse, Toronto Maple Leafs, you know? Were you around, you were working with the Calder Cup Championship? No, I was the two years prior to that, actually. Oh, okay. All right, so you missed out on that?

But I did cash in because Lou Lamorello's whole thing was that he wants everyone to be treated and throughout the system, like it's the NHL, you know, to make this system. So yeah, we got the NHL per diem, took us out to some nice meals. The money I heard they dropped for parties for a Calder Cup Championship was off the charts. you know to make the system so yeah we got the nhl per diem took us out to some nice meals i heard they dropped uh for parties for a calder cup championship oh yeah it was off the charts i'm not

shocked to hear that yeah i saw a couple seafood towers at a couple restaurants do you have a number that you'd care to share uh yeah but uh it's okay okay you don't need to. I'm just interested. Yeah. Oh, it's, yeah, they looked after their group for sure there. Not surprised. Which, you know, I got to go back to my 1988 Calder Cup championship in Hershey. Maybe not quite the same experience. Maybe here's a bag of Hershey kisses. On a fire truck.

Past the due date, but everyone gets it. Yeah, there were no seafood towers yeah for sure crab legs there you go um he you know doug armstrong always has such a firm grip on reality to me every time you know he comes on our show i feel like kind of an idiot sometimes for like some of the wild hypothesizing like he's aware they are. He knows they're too good to be bad. He knows it's challenging. They're trying to get to 92 or 93 points. And it's real interesting to hear say you don't throw $8 million to Cairo or Robert Thomas to sink to the bottom. It's not happening.

They're like, what are they, 25-year-old point-per-game scorers. So, you know, full circle to our conversation with Vancouver. J.T. Miller. You don't give him $8 million to turn around and go get Conor Bedard. That don't make no sense. It makes all the sense. How old is J.T. jt miller though older than 24 yeah he is let's just look at this up quick yeah he's 29 so he'll be next year younger than i thought he was yeah so do we have uh an explanation uh on jt miller sam, on why maybe he's not scoring lately?

He did offer an explanation. One, if you'd like to hear it. We would. I think it would be. It's quite compelling if you would like to hear it. Yes, 100%. JT Miller, below a point per game. Let's hear from JT.

I honestly thought the last month or so, I haven't played a lot of center. But the last couple of weeks, I've been playing really well at center. I'd like to say that my lack of production is a compliment to me not cheating the game and playing the right way. You know, I haven't been on for a lot against and, you know, played a lot of hard matchups in there and thought everything was coming along in the right direction. It's a little tricky when you're bouncing around on every line here,

like every, on a nightly basis. But, you know, I feel really comfortable there. You know, the first seven, eight games of the year were kind of a crapshoot there i didn't feel good about my game or like just comfortable and uh but you know since then i feel good there um you know i kind of like the strides that i'm making at a 200 foot basis i'm gonna make a prediction right now if jt miller doesn't score again the rest of the year he's gonna win the heart it's a compliment to his play that he's not getting points. Based on the fact that he's getting better and better not scoring. Yes.

Has to put him up there with McDavid. So two things stand out in that answer to me. One is, is it a veiled shot at teammates? If you're like, I'm not getting points unlike some people, but I'm doing the right things. And is it a veiled shot at the coach? If you're like, if you move me around all the time, it's like impossible to play that was there's three things from that clip how long was that clip derrick like 35 seconds yeah 35 seconds he lies blatantly

throws his coach under the bus throws his teammate under the bus and then has like a veiled thing where he's like oh i was a little bit out of sync for the first nine games of the season yeah boy his contract has not started he is one different dude that's a nice way of putting it kipper it is oh i hate that dude i mean the scene with the goaltender um and then you know later in that same play he's yelling at another teammate. The shots in the media. You know, right now Miller has 30 points in 36 games. He talks about being a 200-foot game, good positional play. Miller is last on the team in plus-minus. He's minus 13.

Like Pettersson's plus 11. Kuzmenko's plus 11. Like a lot of these guys have decent numbers. He's last on the team so i don't know if you can say you don't score getting points last three games that your d is kelly rudy uh uh did an iso on him on a couple of shifts where he he looked like the body language had quit on uh before the end of the shift or before the shift was already nailed it those two clips that he showed were horrible.

So then there's some people who are like, oh, you're trying to read body language. Well, you can learn something. He has been doing that his whole career. Sure. This is not a new development. It's not new. What's new is you

called out your goalie and everybody's just had enough of you right now. Right. Yeah. He is no different than he was in New York. No. And no different than I think. Yeah.

Tampa. But what's the difference now? They're money and they're losing. They're losing. And you embarrassed a young kid in net. And now, now there'll be more kelly rudy's now going to find those moments that you've always had your whole career but there wasn't a necessary it wasn't you don't you don't necessarily just bring that up on any player yeah but now you do jt miller

has put himself in a position where guys like kelly will call him out a lot more now but i know and i know you're right but like imagine david camp doing that you know would we sit here and talk about it like which we all we've all had moments on shifts oh sure that we that you could we could look like that yes not that often you hope right but i look like that every show but there are some nights that you go and we've had we not experienced that with willie nylander over the first six years of his career where you watch sometimes willie start the the glide for a line change at the far circle. Yeah, but with Willie, it's always seemed more like indifference than malice. You know, like he's always like, I don't know.

Maybe it works out. Maybe it doesn't. Yeah, aloof. Yeah, more like whatever. Whereas Miller's is more like F you, F you, you know. Yeah, you think I'm going to skate hard, punk? Yeah, right. Get out of the net.

That was nuts. That was nuts. You weren't here for that conversation, but that truly was. That was embarrassing. A little bit embarrassing. Particularly because the goal is in the coach. I don't think he even realizes what he does. That's an interesting thought.

I listened to his comments after saying, hey, I was just trying to, you know, let him know that I'm in control. I got the puck behind there and you're good to go. And I do believe he believes that that's interesting he doesn't think he's being a jerk when he's behaving that way he's just getting the message across when you've got the reputation of a jt miller now for being that guy in the room it's because you don't realize you are that guy in the room that's a problem that's a problem and that's a problem in itself

then you don't know how you come across to teammates or sometimes uh no fans media hands is he completely untradeable um i you know you could probably give them away the same way that was it? Max Pacioretty went for nothing because Vegas wanted cap space. And, you know, there are those deals now where you just give a player away. Basically, I would absolutely give him away if you're looking for no return. Yeah. The cap space, you know why? There's value there.

There's value there. And I don't know where it is, but it's not. 100 points last year? Definitely. It's low right now. The value is low. By giving him so many years. I don't think that you can convince someone just to take that contract right now.

I could be wrong. Listen, you had a chance to trade him. They couldn't trade him all summer. Okay? It was the one year left on the deal, right? Because his new contract doesn't kick in until next September. Right. They tried.

This is where people got to realize. They tried to trade him all summer. And they couldn't. And then they couldn't sign Beau Horvat for what they wanted to sign him for. And they did the switcheroo. And then they just gave him the 8 million. You know, what's fascinating is like he has no trade protection for the remainder of

this year. So I presume that means it all kicks in when his new deal starts. I'm not even sure he wanted to sign in vancouver but now he's got the money and he could say okay trade me now because he couldn't get the money anywhere else right and he took the money i can't be mad at him there i'd probably i hate it here but you need the contract then i'll worry about asking for a trade because when you have the protection you can still ask for a trade. But there was ample opportunities for other teams to trade for him, and they just didn't or they couldn't.

It felt like the Leafs were in on that. I remember Elliott reporting that during, I forget when, talking about it at some point, though, talking about Miller potentially being of interest here. He is a good player. He's a very good player whose probably attitude has held him back in his career but under the right circumstances with the right room i think he could be a valuable asset like playing with uh

well come on you guys sat in here a long a while ago and told me that Evander Kane was not an asset. I did not. I'll loan that. I said I wanted him on the lease, for the record. Okay, I remember one of you saying. Morty did. Certainly would have been me. I was definitely saying I wanted him on the lease.

He could. I mean, he's not as tough. Doesn't fight like Evander. But he's got that type of impact as a left winger. Like, come on. Imagine just money aside, put him with Tavares and Willie. He had 99 points last year. 32 and 67 for 99

his previous career high uh was 72 just hard to imagine uh the the thought process of of signing this guy to that, what was it, 56? Eight times seven? It's seven times eight. Seven years times eight million. Yeah. And then, like, leaving your captain, Bo Horvat, hung out to dry.

Like, I don't understand that. Bo's going to be the perfect playoff ad for someone, right? Go play center on on team that's already good colorado so boston no no he's not allowed they're not allowed to trade for guys they gotta replace uh krejci and probably bergeron next year the boston bruins have a have 62 of a possible 74 points this year gross i think they're going to start to lose some hockey games you heard it here first so what did we think of the winter classic now this one is their new year's day spectacle that didn't want to go up against the NFL. So they pushed it to January 2nd. Did you watch it?

I watched it. I watched the whole game, yeah. I watched it, yeah. It doesn't have the same effect, I think, from a national kind of basis. Nice sweaters. It's still, it is quite the spectacle. I mean, locally, it works still still i wonder if they focused a lot of the advertising locally because i don't feel like we hear about these outdoor games much till they

come up but there it did very well love the bruins coming in and the red socks old-timey gear oh it's cool a little cheesy agree it's Fenway. The Bobby Orr shooting the puck to the catcher for a little cheesy. Corny. She got it airborne. Yeah. And they all wore Pittsburgh Pirates jerseys and they didn't even play in it.

Is that? The Penguins wore Pirates jerseys to come in and they didn't even coordinate with the Red Sox. They both just did it unknowingly. Oh, really? Yes, they did it unknowingly. That's cool.

Really? Yes. Oh, I thought, yeah. You know, maybe I would have preferred the Red Sox gear were it not the, like, 1920s old-timey version. Just some Sox gear. And they're carrying the bat with the glove. That was a bit like Field of Dreams.

Come on. That was all right like Field of Dreams. Come on. That's all right. That's cool. By the way, I always rip the NHL for the music and the performance. You know, the Black Keys or the Boston Pops. Thought that worked. I thought the jerseys were cool. It's a cool setting.

Like, cool. Good game. Bruins win. The success. I'm having a couple more gripes than I thought I would. The jerseys for the Penguins were horrible. No. Horrible. I'm not a big P guy. I didn't like the logo. I jerseys for the Penguins were horrible. No. Horrible.

They're not a big P guy. I didn't like the logo. I don't like the P logo. They look like Purdue. I thought it was Purdue's hockey team. The college in the States from Indiana. It looked like Purdue. Maybe the league gave you more credit

for assuming you'd know what P stood for. I know what they said. And the helmet looked off with the jersey, and it was meshing with the Bruins' shoulders. It was not aesthetically pleasing to me. Bruins' jerseys were nice. Minus the meth bear logo. I like that logo. As they call it there in Boston.

I like that logo. And then the shadows bother me too. Yeah? Yeah. I just find it a little hard on it's only the back half of the game but it's not perfect. The lighting's not perfect.

It's like every game at Mullen Arena. It's hard. It's hard. It's just like you're not going to get everything great. The weather worked okay. It was five degrees or something. It's enough to pull it off. There's no question.

Yeah. Seattle-Vegas is an outdoor game. It's pretty sweet. I think that's awesome. There are cash cow teams, and all these new fans are going to be racing to spend money i don't know how many uh have now been played out it must be in the 30s or the 40s well the winter classic is the once a year but the heritage classic is really i went to that one i went to to the original one. Stadium series. They remember they did those weird ones. Yeah, sure. 30 outdoor games or whatever it's in.

Lake Tahoe, first place. Awesome. Has any been canceled? Or was one postponed to the next day because of weather? Yeah, no. Lake Tahoe. Was Tahoe postponed one day? They delayed and played later in the night.

They played it at midnight. Yeah. But it's quite remarkable that one hasn't been like. Just hurricane weather. Right? Or. The most weather was the first one in Buffalo in the snow globe game where Sidney Crosby scores the shootout to win it. Which, I mean, unbelievable marketing success.

The big house was a lot of weather. What a shovel that thing was by the time we finished putting it between Ryan Miller's legs. It wasn't exactly a pretty goal. I think he hit the puck into a little mini snowbank. Shot an igloo in. Wasn't it minus like 20 in Edmonton? The Edmonton one is the coldest one

on record, I think. That's the first one. That was the Heritage Classic in 2020. And I think they're doing that next year as well, are they not? Battle of Alberta. Like, what are the odds it's going to rain heavily in Seattle next year? That's what I was going to say. Like, does like does it rain every day yeah they'll be like 90 sunny days a year or something don't they they better pick right they'll be looking at the trends the farmer's almanac they'll figure it out dan craig superhero um i didn't plan to bring this up but i saw it today hold on i'm not done on the outdoor let me have have it. All right. Just the Boston Bruins here, guys.

Like, probably should have lost the outdoor game. Wasn't going well. And then same thing that we've seen all season long. They just hang in there, hang in there. And then Jake DeBrusque, the hero with two goals. Should have traded up. Are there any holes right now in the Boston Bruins? Age.

You know, can they continue to lean on Krejci, Bergeron, Marchand? You know, the most important players on the team are older. Are they more susceptible to wearing down then? Well, you look at John Tavares. Happens. Didn't Bergeron get two hips? Yeah, he's probably bionic. He's a cyborg.

That's the time that they should have been losing at the beginning of the year. Yep, in theory. And they never lost. That was their moment of getting out of the gate slow. And now they're too old and too this and too that. What a treat for the leafs they god forbid they happen to get by the you know three times stanley cup finalist uh tampa bay lightning who they're locked into playing the first round they get to play the boston bruins the second round what a great layout gary thanks you know that craig smith is starting to slow down felino

their fourth line is craig smith thomas nosik nick felino it's good fourth line it's better than leafs uh nick felino is just that's that's how you would have liked to resign nick felino yeah that version that version derrick forboard connor clinton is a third pair nick felino should have been established as a great bottom six guy when they traded for him unfortunately you know that's his place right now in this part of his career he is a perfect fit i love him in boston right now spending three million on a fourth line left winger you wouldn't love it that's a fair assessment from borneo. And he's very good. He is very good.

And the reason they can do that is because they have such great contracts to their stars. Yes. Bergeron and those guys make it. By joke. Take a look at the last few years, though. If you want those Nick Folinos or the Colmans or the Goudreaus, you got to pay a first rounder for those guys, you know? Well, I shouldn't say, it all depends on their contract situation too. If it's a rental or if they've got term,

that has a lot to do with whether or not it's a legit first rounder. I just looking at this Boston Bruins team, I feel like one of the most important players on their team, like right at the top is Hampus Lindholm. You know, like I feel like without of the most important players on their team like right at the top is Hampus Lindholm you know like I feel like without he changed he changed he gives them two pairs that are really good like McAvoy and Grizzly Grizzly because he gets help from McAvoy and then Lindholm and Carlo together is really good that's a great pair Carlo's a great I think great defensive defense and you credit the Boston Bruins for going to get Lind home because a lot of a lot of gm slept on that and i don't think that there was much of a of a situation where you know you had to outprice anybody to to get him or there was a

bidding war on him right nope they uh they did well in that one uh other thing i want to ask you about uh before we move on today is jacob verana so he goes to the player assistance program um you know spend some time there plays three games in the american league is available was put on waivers today for anyone to have them if they can he's got a half a year left on this year and then one more season he makes five million bucks a year 5.25 i think wonder if anyone would have any real interest in a guy like verana who can create and score i'm surprised detroit doesn't okay let's find teams for him right now okay and let's start with the one right here in toronto 5.25 no oh but can you get steve eisenman to eat two million of it great question that's a really good question i think

they would do that because it's only for this year and next you don't think they're in their cup window next year could they take a first like an ad not a first but like an asset, who would be first? I would think it would be a second, for sure, which is a very expensive thing to do. Like think about, just go back to Carolina, taking Marlo. His $6 million cost you first round or cost you Seth Jarvis just to take them off your hands so that's that's what you're dealing with and we just listened to doug armstrong talk about having

a third party in there right to broker deals that that crap's expensive brokering deals is expensive yeah because it's what's in it for me you can't get this guy without me so let's keep that in mind when you throw me a first or second rounder yeah like verana has had a couple seasons so he had 25 goals um in 2019 the year he had another year with about 25 goals or a pace to be higher than that um you know 50 points, 60 point guy. Where else? 26 years old, left shot, left winger. Jersey? Jersey's interesting.

Do they need more skilly guys, though? I feel like they need more grit. I don't feel like they need more Jacob Ranas. Although I know they have some. My boy Tyler Dell is there, and he's a number runner guy. I bet Rana has good numbers. For me, he's not big. I think he's 5'11", 6 feet.

Sounds right. 6'1", 190. Yeah. No, no, no, no, no. Need big. Need big. 6'2". 6'2", 6'3". It solves your problems

6-2, 6-3 It solves your problems Whose problems? Toronto Toronto You're immediately a better team with him in the left wing Yeah, I know you're better But now you run into the Matthew Nyes conundrum

Where you got Nyes and We must protect the spot for the chosen one There is He exists Better protect the spot Are you willing To trade an asset are you and then give nize the spot are you willing to gamble that this guy's gonna come in and play 12 14 minutes a night for anna no nice i'm not no chance that is on a team that has to win now

it's an insane decision to make. Big ask. Big ask. Roll the dice, baby. It doesn't cost anything. That's nice. I got to bring this up before I go. Go. Okay, go.

Jarmo Jagr has seven points in eight games, and Cechi is top tier. Playing for the team he owns. He can kick rocks. Love Jagr. Great. That's insane. I don't care it's there it's impressive they're in the they're in last place this team stinks uh clad no they're not very good but

he got a goal today or tonight or whatever uh set up by thomas placanitz who plays on the team as well does he really yeah he's wearing his turtleneck oh yeah is he wearing his goatee oh oh yeah he looks exactly the same leaf's legend thomas flicanitz that's pretty cool hey you own the team and you know just check in when you need uh i'm up next shift and no joke is he 50 50 no he's 50 yeah he's 50 years old and the goal is such a classic like he uses his ass gets the front of the net tips one in in backhand, top corner. Yeah. Unbelievable. Were you asking if he should play in the National League for him? No. No, okay.

No, no, no. I'm just saying. Okay, awesome. Because that's what I thought was the suggestion. All I remember is tonight we play Pittsburgh, and Brian Leach, who's one of the best defensemen in modern-day history, is like, this guy gives me nightmares. Just his ass comes out.

Once his ass comes out, he goes, I can't get the puck. No. And you're like getting backed in like Michael Jordan starting to lean on you. He posts you up. Oh, he will post up. He's the postiest NHL player I think who's ever played. So, yeah, it's just amazing to me that he's still playing in any league at a top level. You know what's impressive to me about it is you have to keep working out all the time.

Like, I know he's a workout fanatic. Ohatic oh yeah that's like a big thing with him oh you know he works out at 2 a.m whatever he did here but it's you know i the second i was done playing it's like 27 i was like oh no maybe he's playing because he just needs the money well that's for sure he's he's put a couple shards down on some over-under bats. No question. Wow. He hasn't heard attendance when he's in the lineup, I'm guessing.

Can we get somebody to do that 30 by 30? 30 for 30? Or a documentary on that guy's. That would be really fun to watch. All right.

Just like that. Two hours. Amen. Coming on. Craig Simpson. Our thanks to him. And general manager of the St. Louis Blues, Doug Armstrong. Shout out to the Blues and the GM.

They never hide, right? Nope. Awesome. They show up. And looking forward to the Blues and the GM. They never hide, right? Nope. Awesome. They show up. And looking forward to the game tonight. Sportsnet Ontario. Watch it and then tune in tomorrow. We'll be right here to break it all down.

Nick Kemprios, Justin Bourne, Sammy McKee. Have a great night, everybody. Stay safe.