Ep. #595: Nicole Perlroth, Laura Coates, Andrew Yang
00:00Welcome to an HBO podcast from the HBO Late Night series Real Time with Bill Maugh.Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you, people.Thank you so much for coming. My maskless friends. Thank you for coming and putting on a brave face. I know we're all processing what happened at the Oscars.and I just want to say to Will Smith, look, I got your back, bro.Stay strong.April fools, you're a dick.Oh, wow.You're on my side, for one.
01:19Yes, it's April.Look, I'm not here to humiliate Will Smith.He gets enough of that at home.But I will say this.Every single person.In America, this entire week, was talking about nothing but the sucker punch heard around the world.So the whole keep my wife's name out of your mouth thing didn't really work at.Can we at least say that?
01:54Right.And the Oscars?Wow.There was more action in that 10 seconds than the whole three hours of power of the dog.Who would have guessed at the movie that comes out of the Oscars with all the buzz was G.I.G.Jane. And, you know, also, I must say, comparing a woman to Demi Moore looking her hottest,is not exactly the worst insult I've ever heard in the world. I mean, alopecia. It's not leukemia.Okay? Allopoecia is when your hair falls out. Appalachia, when your teeth fall out.
02:39There are worse things. And also, I'm supposed to feel bad for Will Smith to thank you.pending the honor of the woman who was fucking August Alcena.I mean, I...How...Also,the other thing that is very a little fishy about this is that when Chris Rock told the joke,you cut to Will Smith, and he's laughing at the joke.Right?
03:04And then he sees that his wife is giving him the stink guy.I blame toxic femininity.I do.So, but now, of course, is a controversy.on top of the controversy because the Academysays that they asked Will afterthat to leave andhe refused and then got into
03:28a shoving match with Liza Minnelli.So, I don't knowwho's lying.But the Academy's getting very stern now.The Academy says from now on they may banWill Smith from ever coming back to the Oscars.My question, and what'sthe punishment?
03:53So, all right.Other things are going on in the world, but we don't care about that.Anyway, no, but there are two interesting moves in the media this week.Wow, did you see that?Jen Saki is leaving.She is the President Biden's press book.She's going to join MSNBC, part of their commitment to diversity.Well, now they have a redhead.
04:23So, and Fox News.Guess who's joining Fox News?Caitlin Jenner.Now they'll have two Tuckers.Okay, we've got a great show.We have Andrew Yang and one of the coats.But first up, she is the former lead cybersecurity reporter for the New York Times and Ultra.This is how they tell me the world ends.
04:44The cyber weapons arms race, Nicole Peril Roth.Bumper, Shaker, what are you?Shaker, good for you.Thank you.Wow, that's a very scary title you have there.But, you know, I've been concerned, as we all have about.cyber war. And I think peopletalk about it like, well, this is the coming
05:10war. But it really is the present war.Isn't it? It's kind of underway.I mean, hasn't Russia already gotten into ourelections? They've gotten into oil facilities,nuclear facilities.And we hit theirpower grid, didn't we, in 2015?So isn't the war happening?
05:28Yes. I mean, we've basically been in a digitalCold War since the Cold War ended.And look atwhat I've covered. I mean, I've covered hacksof the Ukraine power grid, hacks of our nuclear plants.They didn't get as far as the controls, but they're heading for them.And the question is, what is going to be the trigger for them to pull the access they alreadyhave?
05:51And that's why anyone who's paying attention to cybersecurity right now is watching what'shappening in Ukraine very closely.Because the more we tighten the screws on Putin with sanctions and the ban on oil and vodka,the more likely it is that this guy is going to do something, right?He's not the type to, like, sit back and chill about it.Well, why wouldn't you have already done it by now?So this is interesting.Some cybersecurity experts thought that he was going to go full gangster
06:21in the days leading up to the invasion.And he didn't turn the power off,but there were actually some pretty serious cyber attacks.Power off in Ukraine?In Ukraine.Not here.Not here.Can he do it here?
06:32He can.What?I mean, we had a...turn the power off in America?Well, the Department of Homeland Securityput out a screenshot a couple years agothat showed Russian hackers with their handson the controls of a U.S. power plant.
06:47They didn't pull the trigger.They didn't shut anything down,but we know they have the access.We've seen them have the capability.They got into all 50 states' elections.They didn't seem to screw with them,but they got in.What is that about?
07:01They just want us to know they can do it?We don't know why they didn't gofurther. I mean, we don't know if it was John Brennan calling up his counterpart and saying,don't do this, we'll respond. We don't know if this was sort of testing grounds for some futureinterference. We really don't know what the deal was with the election interference. But theworst case scenario, to me, at least for election interference, is an attack on the registrationrules where they mark people who are registered as unregistered or dead, and they show up to vote,and they say we have no evidence that you're registered,
07:36and that person walks off,and there's no trace of any interference at all.It's basically voter disenfranchisement in digital form.Right. No fingerprints on it.And what about banks?Aren't you worried about that,that they could get into our bank accounts?I mean, and where does, like, the future go with,
07:58I've heard people say we will have a totally digital currencysooner than you think.Doesn't that make that situation worth?So banks, I worry less about just because they've got in religion on cybersecurity for a very long time.I mean, if someone wiped out your bank account, everyone would freak out and move their money.So they've built up many intelligence agencies to track these threats.I worry more about pipelines.I worry about utilities.
08:27I worry about water treatment facilities that don't even have an IT guy on staff.that is really where we are the most vulnerable.But they do attack individuals.I mean, I read in your book about zero days.Tell everybody what zero days means.So a zero day is, it's a hole in the software.It's basically a vulnerability in the software.Let's say it's your iPhone.
08:51There's a vulnerability in your iOS software.If I'm a hacker and I find that vulnerabilityand Apple doesn't know about it, that's called a zero day,if I can write a program to exploit that zero-dayto read your text messages or turn on your camerawithout you knowing about it or track your location,that's a zero-day exploit.And you can see why that zero-day exploit I just described
09:14would have immense value for an intelligence agency, right?So I can know putting an invisible ankle bracelet on you.So there's a whole market for governments, for zero-day exploits.The going rate in the U.S., I think,last time I checked, was $2.5 millionfor that zero-day exploit I just described.The Saudis will pay you $3.5 to $4 million if you want to sell it to the Saudis.But there's this whole market around our software vulnerabilities.
09:38And people don't realize that for years, governments have been purchasing these holes,not so they can get them patch, tell Apple about them, leave us more protected,but so that they can exploit them for counterintelligence or maybe to plant themselves in a certain system for a rainy day.And the reason I chose to call this outwas because I was sitting in my little perchat the New York Times, and I was seeingthat all of our adversaries getthat we have a really soft underbelly with cyber.
10:09And they can do a lot of damage here.And they don't have to go match usin terms of our military budgets and spending.They can do a lot of damage to the United States.And yet, even the United States was leavingthese zero days open for its own operations.And so the reason I wanted to call itwas to say, hey, cybersecurity is now national security.
10:29And we need to start patching these systemsand getting Americans to wake upto how vulnerable these critical systems are.Isn't one of the reason why we're not more alarmedis because it is not always reported?The people who get hacked don't want to report it.No?No?
10:45No?No.Like China was hacking our intellectual property left and right.Right.And no one wants to admitthat their intellectual property is now sittingat some Chinese state-owned enterprise, you know, institute in Beijing.So everyone was covering this up for a really long time.
11:01And actually, what changed was when the New York Times was hacked by China.And we wrote about it.And we said, listen, like, this is happening to every company in America.You know, every company in America, journalists are now basically ripe targetsfor advanced Chinese, Russian nation-state hackers.but we don't act like it.Okay, so what should we do?What is the government,
11:29what's the obvious thing the governmentshould be doing that it's not doing?I mean, I would guess when I read the stats,hire more people.I know the Department of Homeland Securityhas like 140,000 peopleand only about 2,500 are working on this.But I don't know, maybe more people
11:45would just be standing aroundlike I see places.Yeah.You know, I mean, they spend $10 billion on this,is that it sounds like, given that we just signed a pending on budget for $813 billion,sounds like a little bit.But I don't know.You don't have to buy equipment for this.
12:04So I don't know if this is too much, not enough, just the right amount.I don't know what we're doing and what we should be doing.That's what you're here to tell me.Right.So what people don't understand is that when it comes to cybersecurity,the government is not in charge of most of our critical systems.85% of America's critical infrastructure, water, dams, pipelines are all in private sector hands.And after Snowden, we had this whole debate, remember Snowden, that guy in Moscow,
12:34we had this whole debate about whether we want the NSA in domestic systems.And we all pretty much decided we didn't.So the government's not sitting in these systems in real time, defending them from advanced nation-state hackers.It's basically the private companies themselves that are forced to defend themselves from these threats.And any time there's been any effort to legislate that those companies meet some bare minimum standard of cybersecurity,lobbyists have come in and said, no, too difficult, too expensive, too much regulation,we're not going to put up with it.So the situation we're left with.
13:10So this is the Republican stopping it?You know, sadly, it was John McCain was actually the one who filibustered that last.attempt at a bill. Because they thinkit's too much government interference?It was just dirty word regulation.Right. That'swhat happens when it takesthree years to get solar hooked up
13:30in your house. Well...Regulationbecomes a dirty word. All right.But thank you for doing what you're doing, exposingit, because boy, this is a problem.All right, thank you. Let's meet our panel.He is the founder of the newpolitical third party forward, an author of
13:55Forward Notes on the Future of Ourdemocracy. Andrew Yang is backwith us. Thank you. Thank you.And she's a senior legal analystfor CNN, an author of the bestsellingbook, Just Pursuit of Black Prosecutor'sFight for Fairness, Laura Coates.How you doing?
14:12I'm good. How you doing?Hi, guys.Okay, soyou know what we're going to talk about?Because there are...It happens once in a while that there's likea national moment, right?Where the whole country is
14:27paying attention to something. It doesn't happen thatoften, very often a tragedy likeKennedy assassination or 9-11,but it could be the O.J.verdict or, well, we just hadanother one. Andit exposed, I thought,a lot of aspects of this society
14:45we have, which are not terriblypositive. Toxic masculinity.Victim cultureI could go into, and I might.Liberalhypocrisy, I think, wasthe big loser. I mean, what didyou think when Will Smith got a standing
15:01ovation from that crowd.I couldn't believe it.Could you? I mean, the idea that, I mean,first of all, I think Jim Carrey made the comments.Spinalist came to mind. It was one of thoseideas of how inertia was like, well, this is whatwe always do. We're supposed to standwhen somebody wins an award. So you
15:17do it this moment in time, and the amnesiawas instantaneous. And I just thought,first of all, why is he eventhere to be able to get the awardat the end of the evening?Number one.Because I remember, I remember,I remember as a prosecutor
15:31prosecuting quite a few assaultin batteries and they didn't stand by to gono, no, I've got the rest of my kid's soccer game.I got to stay for this. It didn't happen.So the fact that he was thereto be like, well, here's my award, was shockingin and of itself, let alone a standing ovation.Doesn't happen.
15:47I think a lot of it's just because it was Will Smith.If it had been anyone else, they're probablyushered out of there very quickly.I do feel like it's part of the jobof a world famous celebrity attendingan award show to absorb mild illness.insults directed at you and yours.It's, you know, I ran for office,
16:04and people said things around me I didn't like,and I didn't get up and smack anyone.Did you actually want to?Oh, you'll never know. No one will know. That's a point.Just like we shouldn't know if Will wanted to.No. I mean, it does look like those people,those are the very people who are always talking aboutmicroaggressions in the workplace and how you should be,
16:31you know, not have to face an uncomfortable moment,or, you know, people shouldn't touch you,unwontedly, suddenlythey were okay with this. It just seemedto show, to me, broken morals.Like, you really have no principles.When it's a star that you likein the service of some vague
16:48principle of intersexuality,or sectionality, likeyour wife shouldn't be insultedeven in a mild way,then it's like, well,too bad. That's what I like.It made me feel good, soI forget my principles.
17:04Now, a part of me isconcerned that that was the first moment. You realizedthere was no principles in Hollywood, though.No, that's not the first moment.I know it's not. I knowit's not. But I'm sorry to me, think, the thresholds high.I'm just saying it was a bad night for liberal hypocrisy.True. They look bad. Because
17:21here's the thing. The Oscars, whether theylike it or not, it's not fair.But they kind of area representation to a lot of America of theDemocratic Party. Andrew, youtalked about, I read your quote on the aira couple of times about when you wouldwhen you were running for president and you would start to talk to people,
17:39sometimes in a place where they didn't know much about you,and they seemed to like what you were saying,and then you would say you were a Democrat,and they'd be kind of like this.And it's like the toxic D.Why is the D so toxic?Because they look at the Oscars,and it represents sort of like pandering.
17:57It represents sort of like we're not connected to everyday people.You know, look at the, every year the winners.I mean, this year it was a disability.gay and race,which there should be movies made about these topics.They're important topics,but it looks like the Oscars only do those topics.Bill, I wouldn't get a sigh from people
18:16when I said I was a Democrat.I would get like a recoil.Like I'd just, you know, turn another color.And a lot of it is around the placesI was campaigning in Iowa or Ohio,they associate the Democratic Partywith this kind of insincere moralizingthat condescends to them.
18:35And I think when you describe what happened to the Oscars as exposing how some rules seem to apply more to some figures than others, I think that's part of the frustration, you know, from the folks that were reacting to me when I was on the trail.And what about what do we make of what's going on with violence and the word violence?Because it's a common word among the woke. They seem to have broadened the definition.You know, silence is violence and words can be violence.but then actual violence,not a big thing.You know, it's like,violence is not an answer
19:15except when I fucking feel like it,and then it's a great answer.I mean, you know,your assessment is probably violent to them right now,just the idea of trying to figure outhow to synthesize it all, and it's true.But, you know, it's the idea you're talking aboutconvenient compartmentalization.
19:32Right.The idea of saying, you know what,I have my preferences,I have my standards, but I really just want to do what I want to do in the end.And I'm going to figure out a way to work backwards from the answer that I wanted,and I'm going to make everything else make sense.And you see this in politics, you see this with issues around lobbying,especially we're talking about just now,
19:50it's the idea of thinking, well, why don't we start from the place,like we do, I don't know, in this country, the nation of laws,and then work forward where we have this standard,and then we have a, at times, a problematic, cookie-cutter approach.But the outcome is supposed to be, you are,treated in a way that the laws dictate. Now, that has always happened, you know, but the ideathat this happened on Sunday that they worked backwards. They want him in the audience to receivethis particular award. So let's work backwards to see how this can make sense. Now, imagine a so-called
20:22seat filler. The average person, every day, imagine Laura Coates in the seat. I would have beenwalked off like, I'm sorry, Ms. Coates, it's time for you to go home. Thank you. Your home's to Bel-Are.Okay? I don't live in Bel-Leyer, butThe idea of working backwards is what frustrates people in politics.The idea of, well, here's the result we'd like.So we're going to make everything contort ourselves in pretzels to make it make sense.It's probably like people were recoiling from you,why people think about the idea of,
20:50I need the word violent now to make sense for what I want it to.Somebody should grab that word seat filler and use it politically.Because we're just seat fillers in this country.The elitists do this and the seat filler do this.It's kind of true, you know, the country of feet fillers and stars.Those are the live studio on it.These are not seat fillers.No, these are seat stars.
21:26So can I ask about alopecia, because I must admit,when I first I saw the thing on TV,then I go to the vanity fair party, great party,and then I didn't hear about it until thenbut you don't know she had alopeciaand I had heard this word but it was vague in my mind what it wasso I went like oh well that's a very different thingand then I found out what it is and I'm like oh no it's not that different
21:50I mean if you are so lucky in life as to have that beyour medical problem just say thanks Godit's it's notit's not life-threatening you know it'sPart of, for most people, 80% of men, 50% of it.It's part of aging.Aging is, trust me, I know, it's the degradation of the flesh.It happens to all of us.
22:15And, you know, just put on a fucking wig like everybody else at the Oscars, if it bothers you so much.I mean, we all, as we age, you know, we look worse.And you do things to deal with it as best you can.You know, I got my hair did this week.That's my thing.I know, my hair, my hair would be white.I know, we're getting pretty personal here, Bill.I know, but my hair would be white, and it would look worse on TV,
22:45and people would think I'm older than I already am,which is already too fucking old for television.So, like, you know, I'll do what I have to do.Everybody else does.Timothy Shalameh wore a tuxedo with no shirt,because he can get away with it.But I wouldn't want to see Jonah Hill try it.We all got to deal with who we are, and am I wrong about this?
23:14I don't know.I woke up like this, so I don't really mean.And cornstarts help.But no, I agree with you.I mean, I agree with the sense of we all have to do the things we have to do to be where we are.However, I can imagine at one point in just thinking about being in Hollywood as she is,the idea of how much we look at women as they age, as opposed to Bill Maher.aging or Andrew Yang aging, there is a different standard for women, and black women in Hollywood
23:50in particular, about the idea of how we are expected, I'm saying we like I'm in Hollywood, we in D.C.,but you have to conform to certain aspects of it. And I think there's probably a part of her thathas been very, very empowered by being vocal about her alopecia and saying, look, I'm owning it,I'm shaving my head, I feel like I am going to take this by the horns. And there's probablythose quiet moments with her husband when he is seeing and hearing a more personal aspect of it.either way, the ideathat we could all assume that everyonewas aware of her condition at the time
24:21the statement was made, I think,is a bit of an arrogance. It's a condition.It's a condition like life is acondition. You know,yes, shit happensas you go down the path of life.And physically, it's not all goingto be roses.
24:42It just isn't. And,again, like, on the scale of what Ineed to worry about or feel sorry about,I can't get there.Well, this episode does remind me of our politics, Bill,where we have these personalized narratives and this morality play.Well, we all know we have many more serious problems to deal withthan whatever Will Smith did to Chris Rock on Sunday.
25:04Oh, what a political way to look at it, you know.Stop it.What I'm suggesting, though,all right.But what I'm suggesting, though, is that we treat politics the same way.We treat politics as entertainment in sport,and it's like, oh, this person did this to this person,and isn't this person then a terrible person?
25:19where the real problems around us are just getting worse and worseand you can feel the anger and frustration rising.Regardless of your political part.I know one of your big issues these daysis what's going on with men and boys in this country.Yes.It's so interesting.Just in this space last week,
25:35I was doing a thing at the end of the showabout Zelensky and how women in this countryis super hot for him.And I was saying, for all the talk about toxic masculinity,when a guy acts in a traditional,manly, badass way,seem to like it, and then right on cue,Will Smith slaps a guy,
25:56and 56% of womenwere on Team Will. This is the daymaybe that's changed, it's the day after the Oscars.So they liked it.They liked it.And I would say there was a display ofmanliness that night, but it was from Chris Rock.It's interesting, I told this story on TMG,
26:23but I'll tell it again on Tuesday, here on Friday.At the party, I was talking to someone,a very, very well respected.I think he's a great person,celebrity, a member of theAfrican American community, I wouldn't say who it was,but somebody in the crowd, it may have been me,said, what would have happened if Chris had hit him back?
26:43And without having to think,he said, he couldn't.He had the whole race on his shoulders.I thought that was kind of a brilliant assessmentand kind of real,and showed Chris Rockbecause, you know, there's a guy who can think on his feet.It's also a reason why I think what Will Smith did
27:06is all the more Hollywood and problematic,knowing Chris Rock couldn't do anything back.I mean, let's just play that moment back in our minds.Exactly.Right. You're going to walk up on stage.Right.You're going to not stand there and tell me what the problem is.You're going to really, you know, soccer punch me with an open hand.
27:22Then you're going to scuttle back to your seat.Look at your perch and then shout at me.I mean, if it was in the real world, I can't imagine this.this is how it actually would go down, but I thought his restraint, I got to tell you,I wasn't part of that 56% who saw manliness and what Will Smith did.I see sexiness in restraint and foresight and a husband realizing what are the consequencesof me taking this action on our entire family.That is sexy.
27:50And I'm very hot for that.But the idea of trying to come to my defense, and as you point out, he only did so.I mean, he laughed at first until he got that.wife look from that had the whole head go this way and he's, oh, this is my cue?Okay.I'll go up.And that's not masculine either.Well, right.
28:10And that really encapsulates cancel culture because that's what happens.People laugh and then they go, oh, wait, I'm supposed to be offended.And then they overreact, right?But are men in crisis?I mean, I know this is a big issue for you.When you look at the statistics, things like math, reading, admissions to college, women are all leaping forward ahead of men.In 2019, last year, I guess we have it.14% more women received bachelor degrees.
28:36There's this idea in America that if you don't go to college, you're doomed,and more and more men aren't and more and more women are.Yeah, that trend's only gotten worse, a bill.Men were only 40% of college students in this last year.And if you think about that, you could just say, hey, progress.But then you have to ask yourself, well, what will millions of men without college degrees do for a living?And a generation or two ago, you would have said, well, maybe they'll get a job in manufacturing.Though we've now blasted away millions of manufacturing jobs, and those men haven't found steady footing since.
29:08You're seeing them actually fall into internet rabbit holes and become alt-right extremists.And there's actually a study that shows a direct correlation between losing your job and becoming unemployed and then adopting extreme right-wing beliefs.So this is having profound impacts on our politics on individuals.and our society in a way that transcends this kind of individual situation.And the case I want to make is that...You're saying we're creating Trump voters.We 100% are.We 100% are.
29:42So you know I'm a data guy, and unemployed men volunteer less than employed men,even though they have more time on their hands.So what are they doing?They are playing video games, gambling, drinking more,abusing more drugs.And so you're seeing these social illsthat include domestic violence, child abuse,self-destruction,
30:02and that is manifesting in our politics, 100%.All right.So this is the,what we call,what we callaward season out here.We just had the Oscars.We're going to have the Grammys on Sunday.
30:18Okay.And I noticed from the Oscars,and a lot of the award shows recently,there's sort of a two-tier system,the ones who make the cut on TV,and then the awards they give to people who you weren't good enough to get on TV.And then they show a little clip of you, like Thursday ago,when you won your award in front of three people.
30:39It's very sad.I think they should.So the Grammys do it too.But they have too many categories.These are real Grammy categories this year.Best Recording package.They give an award to.Best Improvised Jazz Solo.
30:57Aren't they all?I mean, best liner notes, best immersive audio album.So we did this a couple of years ago.There are other categories, even more obscure.Would you like to hear some of these other categories?For example, best new song that makes boomers grumble, is that even music?Is a category?Best independent reggae CD handed to you against your will.
31:28Best spoken word album, not entirely about Obama, is actually a category.Best skunk singing can't touch this in an animated feature.Most self-righteous folk song that almost makes you want to vote for drum is an actual category.Most irrelevant singer-songwriter to pull music from Spotify to protest Joe Rogan as a category.Best duet with an old guy you assumed was dead.Producer of the year, non-rapist.Best country song that Strong.insinuates if you have a problem
32:32with America, you can relocateelsewhere. Best jazzalbum for driving stragglers out ofparties. And of course,best boxed or a speciallimited edition package of the same oldBeatles songs.Okay, so
32:55I have two lawyers here.Let's talk a little about the lawyer. Monday, theJudiciary Committee is going tovote, I think, on Judge Jackson,right? And I think that will, of course,go through the committee. But thenit goes to the full Senate, whereJosh Hawley and Ted Cruz will prove
33:16there are such things as racist babies.But I just want to talk a broaderthing about how lawyers in thiscountry now are coming under attackbecause they attacked, I rememberin the campaign, Kamala Harrisand Amy Klobuchar when they were runningagainst you in that race. Well, kind of
33:39attacked for doing their jobas prosecutors.You know, yes, it's a tough job. You got toput people away.And then Judge Jackson has attacked for defending people at Gitmo because she was a public defender.It wasn't even her choice.The government has signed this.We have this principal in this country.
33:57Everybody gets a lawyer.John Adams, the second president of the country, defended the British soldiers at the Boston Massacre.We gave the Nazis a hearing at Nuremberg.We used to understand this.I feel like now we're forgetting it.Your thoughts.Especially being a former federal prosecutor of black woman.I mean,
34:22people weren't throwing parties for mewhen I walked into the courtroom. I can tell you that.But I think there's this fundamental misconception.When I would stand up there and sayLaura Coates on behalf of the people in the United States,I knew that included the defendant.I knew that before trial I had to honorand during trial, honor and protect the rights of the defendant.
34:41Guess what? So did the judge?The Fourth Amendment, Fifth Amendment,the idea of the Sixth Amendment,all these principles are things that we knowwe're supposed to protect.So if you're telling me the defense counselwhose job during trial and beforeis to also honor and protect and defend those rights.
34:56Let me tell you, not just defense counselwho are maybe soft on crime,then it's prosecutors, it's judges,it's the entire current Supreme Courtwho said, we're not going to take up the caseinvolving Bill Cosby,who had a Supreme Court in Pennsylvania sayyou had to honor his rights.
35:11So I guess we're all soft on crimewhen we're pro-constitution.That's interesting.I think you can distinguishbetween a public defender who ideally should be doing everything in their power to defend someonefrom a prosecutor who does have some discretion. I mean, you can take issue with some of the choicesthey make. It's a very, very powerful position. But to your broader point, I couldn't agree morethat at this point, America is so polarized that you're just on a team. And if someone says,
35:41hey, this rule goes against your team, then people would be like, oh, no, no, I don't need that.I mean, you have 42% of both Democrats and Republicans who regard the other side as evil or corrupt.And so if you come and say, hey, defeating the bad guysmeans that you have to ignore this rule,a lot of people are very open to that.And not to make everything about Hollywood and the Oscars,but a Harvard professor named Ronald Sullivan,brilliant guy, joined Harvey Weinstein's defense team,
36:12and Harvard came after him.And again, yes, Harvey Weinstein, bad guy.Everybody gets a lawyer.It's in the Constitution.everyone gets a lawyer, being that lawyer,shouldn't mean you get rocks thrown at youand means that you're stepping up to do somethingthat we all would deserve if we were in that position.
36:30Well, Harvey Weinstein also kept his Oscar,so keep that in mind when they decide about Will Smith.Just saying.Right.That Oscar's for life.You cannot take it.Everything else is on the table,but you can't think of what you're talking about he's Oscar.
36:49Keep that fucking Oscar.That's some funny.But, okay, so let me go back,I mentioned the beginning of our republic.We used to have, and then John Adams Day,different newspapers for different parties.They actually had their own newspaper,like Thomas Jefferson had his newspaper.
37:08And I feel like...We're there now, aren't we?Aren't we?And here's what it brought it home to me this week.The New York Post, I remember reading about this a couple of years ago.New York Post came across.Now, how they came across,we need to get into because it is relevant.
37:23But Hunter Biden'scomputer, which he apparentlyleft at a computer repair store.I didn't even know they existed.And if anyone should notleave his computer with other people,it would beHunter Biden.
37:41Just for the personal stuff.But it also had stuffabout how, you know, this, come on,he's in there, do well, I'm sorry, HunterBiden, but you are. And, you know,you made a living being a,ne'er-do-well who was taking moneyjust because you were the vice president's son
37:58and you had influence.He got, I think, $4.8 millionfrom Chinese energy companiesto sit on the board and consult.Yeah, that was his passion in life.Energy exploration.Hooker explanation was his passion.Okay, so the New York Post got a hold
38:20of what was in the computer.And, you know, because the New York Postis a Republican.paper. And the New YorkTimes and the Washington Post are the Democratpaper. That's where we are again, kind of.And the Republican paper,Twitter, wouldn't
38:35cancel their account.Can't even report on this story.And now two years later, the New York Timesand the Washington Post have come around to say,okay, there was something there. Now,what I said at the beginning, how did itcame to them? It came to them through RudyGiuliani and Steve Bannon. So yes, of course,
38:51when Rudy Giuliani says, I've gotsome evidence, you take that with agiant thing of salt.Butnot two years.It didn't take two years.It looks likethe left-wing media just buried
39:07the story because it wasn't part of their narrativeand that's why people don't trust the media.If you look at the trustin media bill today, it actuallyfalls very sharply along party lines.69% of Democrats still believethat media will reportthe news objectively. That goes down to 15%
39:23for Republicans. ForIt's at 36%.So this is part of the erosion of institutional trust, where one side feels like the media is on their side.And it does seem like this Hunter Biden laptop story did get buried because of the timing.I mean, it was coming out during the height of the election in 2020, and it did not want that out in the mainstream.I think it could also be about the idea of, you know, one, the priorities that the media has about what stories to putforward. And sometimes it's tied to obviously what is in the national zeitgeist. Other timesit's according to what actually is there to report on. What is the new information that's going to
40:06better inform the population? And of course, here we are in a world, as you well know, where not onlydo we have different slants for different media they are suggesting, but also you've got peoplewho want these silos. They just want echo chambers. We used to say things like, don't preach,or preach it's to the choir. Now it's, well, why aren't you preaching to the choir? It's all I'm herefor us he preached to as a member of the choir.And so you've got to balance the idea this isa consumer-driven businessat times more than it can be
40:33an information-driven business, which of coursetells a lot about where we are associety. You don't used to be an antidote to thiswas local newspapers because theytended not to be very partisan.You can't really talk about high school sportsin an ideological way.But now the
40:50local news business has beendevastated. 2,000 papers out ofexistence, you have local news deserts in most of the country.If you wanted to restore some degreeof moderation and faith in democracy,you'd actually invest in local papers and bringthem back.So when you ran,
41:11your big issue really was guaranteed income, right?Wasn't that what you're most associated with?Yeah, people still stop me on the streets.They yang, where's my thousand bucks?And I tell them, it's coming.I'm still working on it. It's coming.Let me answer thethat question. Anybody here live in West Hollywood?
41:31Because here we have a...Oh, nobody from West Hollywood.Okay. West Hollywoodis here in L.A. It is, I think, a largelynot talking out of school here, gaycommunity. Okay, so they havea pilot program. A number of communitiesin this country are starting pilot programs
41:47based on this idea that you are theforemost proponent of, a guaranteed income.So West Hollywood, I was saying, they willprovide 25 randomlyselected people to get $1,000a month, over 18 months.See how it goes.Now, here are the qualifications.
42:02One, you have to reside in West Hollywood.You have to be 50 years older, older.I'm not sure why that is.Make $41,400 or less and be LGBT.Now, first, I don't know how they verify whether you're really gay.That would be my first question.But do we...What do we think?
42:30What do we think, panel, of having this a qualification to get money from the government?So I took a look at this. Sorry, I'm happy to do.I took a look at this. It's in tandem with a nonprofit. I have a feeling that there is a private donor who just said, look, I want to fund an intervention for this population.And then the local government said, sure, it's mostly going to be private money. It's a small pilot.So I get the sense there was an individual's wish because I don't think the government, the government, the government,would have devised this on its own.With that said, you know, I don't like the idea of taking something that everyone would want,like, for example, a thousand bucks a month, and separating it based upon some kind of characteristic
43:13that some people share and some people don't.When I moved to Los Angeles, that's where I moved, or it's where everybody moved at first, West Hollywood.And I can see why that if I, and I was poor.So I can see why this would have been like, how am I going to get this?Tell us more about what would have come next, Bill.All right, that's enough.You were great.Time for new rules, everybody.
43:38New rules.Okay, new rule, Harry Styles, needs to fire his stylist.I get it, the whole I'm challenging gender norms thing,but this look doesn't say my identity is fluid.It says, I'm a serial killer who wears his victim's clothes.New rule, Annie Rose, the English dog that has been voted this year'sCadbury Easter Bunny.Must be honest about the realities
44:19of show business. Sure, it's a rushwhen you take home the night's biggest prize,but then the cocaine wears offand then you're just a mopof fur on the floor and a pair ofbunny ears thinking, what am I supposed to dowith all this chocolate? I'm a fucking dog.New Rule, someone must tell me
44:49what's up with the new Maytag repairman.Is he human?Is he an android from the future?Did he time travel and killthe previous Maytag repairman?And if that's the direction they're going,they should hire Arnold Schwarzenegger as the Maytag repair man.Arnold has lived the role.
45:20We all remember the time he put a load in the dishwasher.New old Chad Kemple,who set a Guinness World Recordby completing a half marathon in two hours and 19 minuteswhile pushing his quintuplets in a baby stroller,was not complained to his wife about how hard that was.You'd think it's uncomfortable pushing five kids 13 miles?Try pushing them out of vagina.
46:08New rule, Colin Craig Brown,the man who thought he'd unearthed the world's largest potato,until DNA tests proved it was actually the underground stem of a gourdand not a potato at all.Has to look on the bright side.For one very brief shining moment in time,you thought you'd found a big potato.And finally, new rule, the Fox News editor,
46:41who each week highlight one thing I say about the Democratsthat fits their narrativeand then completely ignores all the shit I say about Republicans,might want to go ahead and turn the TV off right now.Because we are now only seven months awayfrom midterm elections that are poisedto make the Republicans much more powerful,so attention must be paid to where the Republican Party is right now.
47:12You'd think, with the left going a little loonyover the past few years,Republicans would have seen an opening to grab the sensible center.But no. Former Republican governor of Ohio,an anti-Trump or presidential candidate John Kasich,said of his party in 2019,sometimes you've got to let the fever break.And I think we have a fever, and it's going to break.
47:35But it didn't break.And it's not a fever. It's more like a tumor.And tumors don't go away.They get worse.Normal Republican crazy?where you just shoot gunsat things you don't like in your campaign ads?Even that shit doesn't even cut it anymore.
48:10The new cropare such a bunch of foaming at the mouthcrack and releases that Clarence Thomaswants to marry them. I look backat the Republican class of 2010because that year, I remember,has been held up as an exampleof Republican cuckiness gone wild.
48:35Remember Christine O'Donnell?Oh, she had been a frequent gueston my old show, a very sweet,sincere, Jesus freak conservative,who then ran for the Senate,at which time I played some highlightsfrom her appearances on politically incorrect,and the media seized on Christine's statement
48:54that she had dabbled in witchcraft,as if it was the craziest thing a Republican would ever say.Congressman Todd Aiken around the same timecaused a media firestorm when he said that in cases of legitimate rape,the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down.And Indiana Senate candidate Richard Murdoch concurred, saying even when a life began in rape,it was something God intended to happen.Both had to go away.
49:31But if a Republican congressman said the same thing today, would they have to?I doubt it since now what they said is literally the party's active legislative agenda in multiple states.And I used to think Rick Santorum was weird for wearing a sweater vest.in 2009, it was a big dealwhen Congressman Joe Wilson yelled out,you lie during Obama's State of the Union address.But this year, Marjorie Taylor Green and Lauren Bobartrepeatedly interrupted Biden at his state of the Union.
50:11Look at them.Excuse me, Karen.The president is talking.It's not a black kid you caught trying to use the pool.No, you can't.Can't have another skinny margarita,and if you don't sit down,this flight is never getting to Orlando.
50:43For all of you who get frustratedbecause Mansion and Cinema don't vote like true liberals,because they never were,or think Trump is as bad as it's going to get,remember the first rule of modern Republican politics.They always go lower,because this party has no bottom,unless you count Lindsey Graham.
51:18The kooky Republicans of the 2010-Everbalties,wouldn't even make the cut today for extremism.And the ones today aren't even as bad as the ones in the wings.Where do you see the incoming group of Facebook uncles,crazy Karens, and sub-mental shit posters coming up?Herschel Walker, Senate candidate in Georgia,who freely admits he has a dozen personalities,none of whom you'd want to stick next to do at a wedding,
51:46recently came out against evolution,saying science said man came from apes.If that's true, why are there still apes?Think about it.You first.And also think about this.If honey-nut Cheerios came from Jerios,why do we still have gerio?
52:23Alaska Senate candidateKelly Chabaca speaks in tongues,otherwise known as jabbering senselessly.This is her. Take a listen.pathetic, like the people of Alaskawould even vote for somedim-witted religious nun.Nevada State Treasurer candidate
53:04Michelle Fiore is called LadyTrump and has some interestingpolicy ideas like, quote,arming young, hot littlegirls on campus so they can killrapists.Maybe they can start a sorority,Delta Bostaca.
53:19On the topic of Syrian refugees,Michelle Fiori said, I'm about to flyto Paris and shoot him in the head myself.I'm okay with putting them down, blacking them out, and ending their miserable life.What was Bush's catchphrase, compassionate conservative?Former Missouri Republican governor and now Senate candidate Eric Gritens is a sociopath,whose ex-wife says he beat her and the kids,and who resigned the governorship after being charged with tying up a woman
54:01he was having an affair with in his basement,taking nude pictures of herand threatening to blackmail her if she told anyone.As governors do.And look at these two Neanderthals,almost coming to blows during a debate.And they're both Republicans.It was so over the top,
54:30the crowd filed out in disgust.I'm joking, of course,they couldn't have eaten it up more if it were deep fried.And my favorite,the Republican running against AOC,in the Bronx is Tina Forte,a self-described viralpolitical influencer, who's happy
54:52to sell you a T-shirt that says,I could shit a better president.That is, when she's notbusy campaigning on her wayto the gym.Give the balls to debate me. We can doan our fuck of paperbue, bitch.How do you like that? Motherfucker,
55:14fuck out of you.What are they serving at the Republican conventionthese days? Bath salts?If the GOP still had aplatform, which they don't, but if they did, it would be fuck you.You think the Republicans of 2010 were cooks?This crowd looks at those people like, please, they've never even masturbated on a subway.All right, that's our show. I'll be at the Mirro Theater in Indianapolis, June 5th,
55:53at the Soaring Eagle Casino in Mount Pleasant, Michigan, June 18th, and at the New Jersey.My home state performing arts in Newark, July 8th.I want to thank Andrew Yang, Laura Coates, and Nicole Perthron.No, well.You're on overtime now, and join us on, I mean, YouTube, and join us on overtime.I don't know what I'm saying.Catch all new episodes of Real Time with Bill Maher every Friday night at 10.Or watch them anytime on HBO On Demand.
56:23For more information, log on to HBO.com.
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