RedHanded - Bonus - December Patreon Round-Up: Best of 2021

Episode Date: December 10, 2021

To celebrate the end of another amazing year on Patreon and our whopping 16% off Patreon annual membership FLASH SALE (details below), we're bringing you some of our highlights from this years Patreon bonus content! We have clips from our bonus episode on Flat Earth "Theory", an In the News segment about a very lifelike manikin, and of course some EmyptyHanded caller woes from Under the Duvet.  So tuck in, and think about becoming a Patron of the show at patreon.com/redhanded FLASH SALE: Until midnight tonight GMT, you can get 16% off your RedHanded Patreon subscription - when you sign up for an ANNUAL subscription at ANY tier.  The discount is AUTOMATICALLY applied at checkout - so no need for any codes!  16% off is the equivalent of two months of free exclusive bonus content, ad-free mainfeed episodes and access to the full back catalogue of existing Patreon content!  This offer is only available until this Friday (Dec 10th) at midnight GMT ⏱️. That means if you have a parent, partner or poodle who wants some extra RedHanded goodness for Christmas, you have three days to get your hands on this juicy discount! (Or, just buy it for yourself as a discount-self-love-treat for the holidays.) So just go to patreon.com/redhanded now and sign up for a years’ worth of RedHanded patreonship - and get 12 months for the price of just 10….or forever hold in your buy-less remorse! - Love H&S x Become a patron: Patreon Order a copy of the book here (US & Canada): Order on Wellesley Books Order on Amazon.com Order a copy of the book here (UK, Ireland, Europe, NZ, Aus): Order on Amazon.co.uk Order on Foyles Follow us on social media: Instagram Twitter Visit our website: Website Contact us: ContactSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Before we get into the final Red Handed Patreon wrap-up of the year, I wanted to tell you something very exciting. If you have been well and truly seduced by these little wrap-ups and you want to head on over to patreon.com slash redhanded and check out what is going on over there, then this is the day to do it. Because right now we are offering 16% off an annual red-handed Patreon subscription at any tier. Today is the last day you can get in on the action of this flash sale. It's going to end at midnight GMT tonight. So if that sounds like something you might want for yourself or perhaps as a gift to a lovely spooky bitch in your life, then just head

on over to patreon.com slash red handed now for all of the information. 16% off any tier level means two months of free red handed Patreon ship. So that's 12 months for the price of just 10. And that means you will get all sorts of bonus, exclusive Patreon-only content. You'll also get every single episode of Red Handed ad-free. And it also means you'll get immediate access to the full back catalogue of Patreon content that is already up there.

So it's going to get you through 2022 a lot easier. So have a listen to this month's monthly wrap-up. And if you want to get your hands on that 16% off, head on over to patreon.com slash red-handed right now, before the end of the day. The belief in a flat earth is often called the ultimate conspiracy. Not just because it's the conspiracy with the biggest scope, which many people argue that it is,

but also because it's this conspiracy that encompasses and generates the most conspiracies within itself. During the last decade, flat Earth believers have seen a steady rise in publicity. Flat earthers, as they're often known, have become low-hanging fruit for stand-up comics and chat show hosts alike. And podcasters now. And podcasters, because we just cannot help ourselves. Oh, you've been on Dr. Phil? Open your guts for me. The largest and most prolific group of believers are the infamous Flat Earth Society, which has an official Twitter account boasting over 94,000 followers. That's more than we've got.

Oh, you can buy a fucking mile and some. Wow, that's 80,000 more followers than we've got. Is it more like a, I don't know if it's like a jokes follow, like when you follow Donald Trump just to like see. Possibly, but then I also feel like there's just enough people in the world and on Twitter to think this is the case. Yes, you know what? If anything, while researching this, I have been struck by just how many people.

Truly. Really. Not even just sort of tamper with the idea. Not just have a little like metaphysical play around with the idea of flat earth. No, like people who lay down their lives for the earth is flat. Oh, absolutely. I've even come across, I would say, at least two guys on Hinge in the past six months who have said that they believe, not like I've spoken come across, I would say, at least two guys on Hinge in the past six months who have said that they believe, not like I've spoken to them, they just have it as one of their prompts and they say that they believe the earth is flat.

No. I think I actually screenshotted one. I will send it to you if I did. And I will post it on the Patreon with that person's face and name blurred out. Wish the earth was flat so I could fucking fall off the edge. I thought you were going to say so I could push you off the edge I thought you're gonna say so I could push you off the edge you push you drop kick you into the universe oh my god it's and also you know I think it's just one of those ways of thinking that you can't sort of just like play about a bit with you

can't just be like one foot into it like Like you could be like, I kind of believe in Sasquatch or Bigfoot or whatever. And maybe I don't, I don't know. Maybe he does exist because it's plausible. But this is like either you think the earth is a sphere or you think the earth is flat and there's no in between. There's no inbetween. No, there really, really truly is not. The Flat Earth Movement is held together, unsurprisingly, by a collective belief that the Earth is a flat plane, normally shown as a large round disc. A lot of people have it as a coffee table.

I think that's your, like, initiation gift into the movement. Yes, yes. The majority of Flat Earth believers, although not all of them, like everything, they're subsects, they also think that the Earth is covered by a large dome, so I wouldn't be able to dropkick Taruti into the universe. She would just bounce off the dome right back at me. No, I wouldn't.

They also believe that the Earth's oceans are held in by a large ice wall, like in Game of Thrones, and that the sun and the moon are suspended overhead like a giant baby mobile over a baby cradle cot, whatever you want to call it. The what, why, when, and how of all of these statements are hotly debated within the flat earth arena. I think if you're attracted to flat earth theory, like do you remember my old boss who was like such a stick in the mud and then one day he decided to tell me that he didn't believe in evolution? Do you remember him? Yes, I remember.

Like the charity boss? Yeah, I remember remember who took great pride in being a person of color and right wing and wouldn't wouldn't shut up about it oh yeah they love that I would not even remotely be surprised if he was a flat earther and I think if you're a contrarian person you're going to be attracted to the flat earth and then you're also going to be attracted to like causing trouble within the movement because you can't just you can't just shut the fuck up very true that's what i um my feeling from the documentaries that i've watched the whole movement is a fairly fractured collection of subsections so there's the flat earth society and there's also rival breakaway groups who spend as much time creating conspiracies about each other as they do trying to prove that the Earth is flat.

I love that. Yeah, honestly, it's just like... Of course they do. I want to be king of the playground. Of course they do. I mean, it's just like... I want to be king of the weirdos. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's just like you said with religion. We're like, oh, we all start, we all kind of believe the same thing at the start

and then we're going to believe mildly different things, and then we're just going to make up a lot of conspiracies and spread a lot of hate about the other group so that we can be the king. But how did we get into this king fight in the first place? Well, there's a widely held belief that people in medieval times slash Game of Thrones times believed that the Earth was flat. Well, dear listener, we're here to tell you that that is nonsense. The Earth has been widely assumed to be spherical for over 2,000 years. In fact, during the time of classical Greece, a bloke

named Aristophanes, Hannah's classic scorer, successfully used two shadows and some tricky trigonometry to work out the radius of the Earth to within 10% of what we know it to be today. So this guy, without telescopes, without satellites, without any of the techno wizardry we have today, was able to just use shadows to estimate what the diameter of the Earth was, correct to within 10%, which when you're talking over thousands of miles, hundreds of thousands of miles, millions of miles, is pretty fucking good going. So well done. It is pretty good going. Well done, Aristophanes. What a G. So the real reason that people believe our medieval mates thought that the Earth was flat seems to have been mainly because of a rumour created by the writer of The Legend of Sleepy Hollow,

Mr Washington Irving, in the early to mid-1800s. What an odd thing for the guy who wrote Sleepy Hollow to have done. Like, why not? I think he just loves a story. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I always think, though, like when someone is a fiction writer and then they come to the global stage being like, oh, no, this thing is definitely real. Everyone should just be a little bit wary of that, I think.

That's very true. Very good point. So Irving famously spun a tale and seems to have presented it as if it were fact about how Christopher Columbus had been told by church scholars that sailing to America, or as he had actually intended to do to sail to India, was pointless because he would simply fall off the edge of the world. This is bollocks. Not the fact that he would have fallen off the earth, but the fact that church scholars told him this.

And historical records specifically show how they actually believed the opposite. And the very idea that anyone thought Christopher Columbus could find his way to India by sailing west and not east, a rather rogue move at the time, shows that there was at least a concept of the earth being a sphere. However, this tall tale of the silly and controlling church scholars just didn't die. In fact, it was promoted even further by two pioneers of the American education system.

And this is when part one of a new segment called Conspiracies Within a Conspiracy comes into play. On the 7th of October 1868, America's now prestigious Cornell University opened its doors for the very first time. However, Cornell's grand opening was clouded by a shadow of criticism and debate. Eight years previously, Bishop Samuel Wilberforce and biologist Thomas Huxley went toe-to-toe in a now infamous argument over Charles Darwin's On the Origin of Species. The argument happened after a scientist central to this story, called John William Draper, presented a paper to the British Science Association in support of Darwin's theory of evolution. Bishop Wilberforce was objectively against the theory,

and Thomas Huxley, one of Darwin's mates, now known as Darwin's bulldog, threw everything into debating against the giftedly charismatic bishop. This argument, now known as the Oxford Evolution Debate, became a symbol of a deepening rift between the church and science. As a direct result of this rift, Cornell University was founded as a secular, i.e. non-religious, university. Shortly after its founding, Cornell also became the first university to educate both men and women together. So, go Cornell, it seems, very much. But the absence of God at Cornell painted a large crucifix-shaped target on its back. What Cornell University and the larger scientific community needed to escape this target was an angle. An angle to shake off the church's

clutches and ultimately take away their power to meddle with education and politics. And that's just the church all over, isn't it? Obviously. Even things like, and I know this is like not specifically related, but it just shows you the level to which we have forgotten the points at which the church started interfering with people's lives. For example, up until medieval times, at least in this country, and I assume most other places, weddings had nothing to do with church or religion. People just got married because it was like something we would tend to do as humans anyway. And then it was in the Middle Ages that the church was like,

all of these people are doing something that is so fundamentally important to their lives and we don't have a say in it. So then they decided to bring marriage into godliness, into the church. And it became something that the church could then have power over because what's more powerful than telling people who they can marry, how they can get married and whether they're being morally right or wrong. So even all of the stuff now that we see with the church needing to, the Pope needing to say that they are okay with same-sex marriages, it was none of their fucking business to begin with in the first place, if you look back to medieval times.

I just think it's classic, obviously, isn't it? They don't want you to have knowledge because if you have it yourself, you don't need them. Of course. And that's why it's the tree of knowledge. Exactly. And God keeps you away from it. Precisely. I even watched a documentary recently that if I can find, I'll post it below.

It was about witches and it was about how these healing women had been part of communities for generations because people didn't have officially trained doctors, especially in like rural parts of the country. So these women were such an integral part to the communities and the villages and the towns that they lived in because they were the healers. And when the church spotted this, they were like, why the fuck those women have all that power? We should have it. We want it. Their witches burn them. And this is this is the typical thing. I saw such a funny meme and it was on Dobby Club Instagram. And if you it was on Dobby Club Instagram. And if you don't follow Dobby Club Instagram, you are wasting your life. And it was when Mark makes friends with Jeff the racist.

Not Jeff, whatever his name. Daryl the racist. And he's like, the church when Jesus does magic. And it's like, I fucking love you. I think you're great. And then it's the same church when a woman does magic. That is the behavior of a grade a witch and i'm like of course it's exactly it like what so jesus was just allowed to like

fucking turn water into wine and like pull loaves of bread and fish out of nowhere but if a woman did it she's a witch yeah and the witch fuck fuck you anyway, back to this. So yeah, they're trying to keep the church out of education and politics. So the tall tale of Columbus, an icon of America, having almost never found the land of the free because of the silly church and their backward ideas, fitted perfectly with this narrative. So here we have a little bit of mudslinging. So they are using this story of Columbus, having been told by, you know, silly old church scholars not to go because the earth is flat as propaganda, anti-church propaganda.

And as much as, you know, I'm not here to print the myth, bash anti-church propaganda, I'm like, whatever. But we do have to say that it just really wasn't true in this case. Yes, not true. But who cares? Two men in particular, named Andrew Dickinson White, co-founder of Cornell, and John William Draper, who we met earlier presenting his pro-Darwin paper, took this story and ran with it. Both published papers, books and lectures, all including the story of how the church had almost stopped Columbus from ever finding America because they thought the earth was flat.

They were so successful that Cornell has remained secular even to this day. And the tale of silly church scholars was taught as a fact right up until the mid-20th century. That is a successful smear campaign. I will give them that. Yes, it is, it is. And, you know, the fact that that has stuck around so long when the church has literally covered up

paedophilic child abuse and that hasn't done that much to hamper their reputation in the eyes of many in this world. Well, you know, we'll take what we can get. I'm Jake Warren. And in our first season of Finding, I set out on a very personal quest to find the woman who saved my

mum's life. You can listen to Finding Natasha right now exclusively on Wondery Plus. In season two, I found myself caught up in a new journey to help someone I've never even met. But a couple of years ago, I came across a social media post by a person named Loti. It read in part, Three years ago today that I attempted to jump off this bridge, but this wasn't my time to go. A gentleman named Andy saved my life. I still haven't found him. This is a story that I came across purely by chance, but it instantly moved me and it's taken me to a place where I've had to consider some deeper issues around mental health. This is season two of Finding, and this time, if all goes to plan,

we'll be finding Andy. You can listen to Finding Andy and Finding Natasha exclusively and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery Show American Scandal. We bring to light some of the biggest controversies in U.S. history. Presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our latest series, NASA embarks on an ambitious program to reinvent space exploration with the launch of its first reusable vehicle, the Space Shuttle. And in 1985, they announced they're sending teacher Krista McAuliffe into space aboard the Space Shuttle Challenger, along with six other astronauts. But less than two minutes after liftoff, the Challenger explodes.

And in the tragedy's aftermath, investigators uncover a series of preventable failures by NASA and its contractors that led to the disaster. Follow American Scandal on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Experience all episodes ad-free and be the first to binge the newest season only on Wondery Plus. You can join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial today. Harvard is the oldest and richest university in America. But when a social media-fueled fight over Harvard and its new president broke out last fall, that was no protection.

Claudine Gay is now gone. We've exposed the DEI regime and there's much more to come. This is The Harvard Plan, a special series from the Boston Globe and WNYC's On The Media. To listen, subscribe to On The Media wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, let's do an empty handed experience um that's what it's called um so this is from donna donna says hi hannah and suti i'm a long-term listener long-term long-time listener and absolutely love the empty-handed segments i've attached my own experience and tried to trim it down as much as possible while making sure I didn't leave anything important out. It took a few days for me to think about whether I wanted to share it or not but ultimately after hearing how honest Ruti was about her experience

it made me realize that we should all be more open about what happens to us so there's less shame involved. I also want to say that I had your book on pre-order months before it came out. I'm so thank you. I'm so happy for you guys. It's absolutely stellar. Congratulations, Donna. Thank you, Donna. Let's have a listen, shall we? Okay.

Oh God, I feel like it's going to be really bad because she was like scared to tell us. Okay, everybody, no shame, no judgment. Hey ladies, I'm Donna and I'm calling you from Dallas, Texas. I had an experience that I would definitely love some thoughts on. So I met this guy online, and initially we chatted for a few days, but he didn't have any pictures, which should have been a red flag. Yes, Donna. I know.

We decided to meet, and of course I want to see what this guy looks like. So I ask him to send me one, and then he admits that he's concerned because he's from Pakistan and doesn't know if I'll still want to meet him. My response was, of course, and what's the problem? So we go on the first date. We hit it off. He seemed smart and charming. Then the love bombing began. I was wonderful.

I was the best thing that ever happened. But then he started to be very controlling, not physically, but emotionally. It was very insidious. He would make comments about other women, about how their hair looked, their nails looked, how they were dressed. I developed a sort of checklist in my head about what was acceptable and what wasn't. He wanted me to dress in clothing that was very sexy with high heels. It was almost like he literally wanted a life-size Barbie. I met his brother one time, and afterwards he told me that I shouldn't have worn the dress and heels because it left a bad impression. What the fuck?

He never invited me to any get-togethers with people from Pakistan because, he said, they wouldn't understand why he was dating and that it was something he had to work out with his family first because they had always expected him to have an arranged marriage. I know, I know. I know. This goes on for a few months until he says his sister is moving to the U.S. because she got a scholarship and is going to live with him while she goes to college. No, no. We talk about our future. That's a wife, yeah.

He says not to worry because his mother will understand after he has a heart-to-heart with her. So before the family arrives, we go through his entire house and get rid of any evidence that I ever existed. We continue to see each other privately until one night he leaves his cell phone on the kitchen counter. When he gets up the next morning, his mother has gone through his phone, packed everyone's bags, and then says that if he continues to see me, she's taking his sister back to Pakistan and that he will have ruined everyone's life. So at that point, he breaks it off. I did meet up with him several months later to talk about what had happened.

And during that conversation, he said he was engaged. And when I asked who his family had chosen for him, all he would say was that she was very tribal. He just seemed to have this loathing for anything that represented where he was from. The part of this that's different than a lot of stories I've heard from other women is the cultural aspect. He had moved to Texas and had gone to A&M, which is a big football college that's in a more rural

part of the state. Throughout our entire time together, he constantly referenced how it had been difficult for him and how he had never been given a chance because everybody was prejudiced. I can see that having happened here so it wasn't hard for me to believe him. Once we were together he even said something like he'd reached the pinnacle by dating me as if I were some sort of trophy. Afterwards I wondered if he used that against me in some way to make me drop my guard even more. Because I'm not someone who would ever be culturally exclusionary. So the questions are, was he in denial?

Or did he know all along what he would have to do? And he was just fucking around with whoever he could get away with. Did he ever even talk to his mother? Was that just a way for him to dispose of me without ever having to take any responsibility? If I knew he was going to have an arranged marriage, why involve me or any other woman in his life? I don't know anyone else that this has happened to, so how common is this sort of situation my takeaways from the whole ordeal were to never ever allow someone to have that much influence over how i feel about myself and it pushed me to go on and be even more successful i finished a master's degree in

psychology i started my own business and i'm married to a very adult man who is absolutely wonderful I'll just end by saying that there are good people out there so if you do think that being in a relationship is something that you definitely want your life don't know okay i mean first of all you're out the other side fuck this guy yeah fuck so well done for it sounds like you're fucking crushing it so keep doing that um with the regards to the the actual the the case that she's case that Donna's talked to us about. The case. I think... For the love detective.

I think it's a very, very, it's a very common one. I think it's a very common one, actually. I think that this person, everything you're saying about them wanting to control the way that you dress, all of this, it's like an idealized version of what he wants in his mind. And he is pushing that onto you, presumably because he can't convince when he was back in Pakistan, a girl that he would have known there

to dress in high heels and sexy clothes. Like that's not acceptable. It's like this idea that he has in his head. I'll go to the West. I'll be able to get this from this person. And that's what I want. Speaking as somebody who's part of the Indian community that's definitely there's gonna be a lot of stuff there about like him his mum having expectations of who he's gonna marry just in a sense of even if his mum was just

like you can pick but she's gotta be like this then there's the next level of like oh no but I'm gonna pick because it's even more like this, which I'm not at all surprised by. I think he definitely seems to have an element of like not liking where he's from. Presumably it was very restrictive where he'd grown up and he's trying to break free of that, which, you know, there's no shade in that. Like if that's how you feel, then you should be able to pursue an individualistic style like we have in the West, if that's what you want. But if you're gonna do that, I would say it's not fair to drag other people into that until you're sure how much you can commit to that.

And you've gotta be able to follow through and fucking stand up to your mom. And this is the thing, and I might not be easy for everybody, but then it's a cost benefit analysis. It's a weighing up of like, how much am I willing to go against my family to have this life that I really clearly want um versus if I'm not going to be able to and maybe that's a realization you realize along the way and you

know with relationships it's like we've said it's really shit when bad stuff happens but it's kind of the the risk that we take as adults getting into relationships that stuff might not work out. And I don't think that he was like, let me just try and fuck about with this. And I don't know him. Let me just try and fuck about with this girl for as long as I can get away with it. And then I'll marry who my mom says.

I think that might've been it. But I think probably what happened is like, yeah, I'm here. I can do what I want. And I will break free of the shackles of my cultural upbringing. And then his mom's like, you fucking what? Yeah, that's what I would say as well. I mean, obviously I have less cultural context.

And I'm not saying it's the same. But in Korea, I witnessed a very similar thing um with and kind of like the trophy thing is what i would oh yeah so for a korean for korean women yeah having a white boyfriend oh god is like the pinnacle absolutely i can imagine for this guy like absolutely having a white girlfriend would have been like obviously this isn't speaking generalizations for people in this country but like if he came from pakistan and he's got this idea in his head I can absolutely see that that would and that's why also the dressing you up and that kind of thing yeah I mean it's a cultural like and because of just like colorism racism etc like it in most

countries being as pale as possible is like the height of beauty right so like he's suddenly moved to a country where everyone's white so not everyone but like majority majority yeah and that would be like a a big deal and be like oh I'm suddenly surrounded by women who I've been taught my entire life are the most attractive a woman can get um and similarly in Korea I didn't have um many Korean male friends but like I knew Korean women and it was it was the pinnacle but you do not marry you do not marry yeah um you do what your mom said so I think that is um what I um experienced in Korea was obviously culturally different for lots of reasons but it is a uh something I saw quite a lot oh yeah and I can see it would be a similar case here and I've

actually seen the same thing from the other side so when I was at university I was really good friends with this girl she was white uh basically the entire time we were at university she was dating um this guy who was uh he was mixed race his dad was irish his mom was from sierra leone uh but i would say i guess he presented more as black and uh she dated him the entire time absolutely lovely guy very successful he was older than us he already had a job like he was like a total catch um her parents massive fucking racists in the sense of like we're fine with people of color but not so much not in my house not in my house not in my family not in my daughter and not in and not um not in my grandkids you know in the sense of like her mum she would tell

me that her mum's issue main issue with it was the idea that the grandkids wouldn't look like them and I was like what the fuck is happening this is unbelievable and obviously I tell my parents my mum was like you should fucking date him and I'm like mum that's not how it works because my mum my parents met him loads of times because he was at the house all the time and they really liked him because he was a great guy. So anyway, she dates him for like three, four years and she knows that this is a problem. She hid him from her family the entire time. Whenever they were coming over,

he wasn't allowed to be there. They knew that there was like a guy that had been on the scene for a while, but she basically convinced him that it was over. Her mum broke a table once in our house because of an argument about this i left the house because i was like this fucking oh my god yeah um and then uh yeah i was like what the fuck and obviously i'm like i'm not going to judge you based on your parents because you can't help the fact that they think this kind of crazy shit but i really think you should stand up to them because if you really

love him then you have to stand up to them because if you really love him then you have to stand up to them and be like you have to get over it and i said even if they don't speak to you for a few years after you have kids they're not gonna abandon you forever what world is this and maybe that's me speaking from a very privileged position where i know my parents would never put me in that position my parents are like fucking marry literally anybody anyone i do not care um so i understand that that's coming from a quite a privileged position to say that and i obviously don't understand what it must be like to be threatened by your parents with being disowned but at the same time you've been with this person for years you say that you love them

like it's kind of time to make a decision right because you're wasting his time yeah yeah if you're not gonna see this through and but at the same time i understand like you know you take a risk when you get into a relationship so eventually uh her parents threatened her with um writing her out of the will so she broke up with him he was devastated the number of nights i went out with him like to talk to him about it all of this and he was just like can't you talk to her and i'm like talk to her about what i stopped being friends with her after that and maybe people think that is um not a nice thing that i did but i lived with her for that entire time and I saw the fucking like the shit show that this was and how much

our parents felt strongly about this and how much she didn't stand up to them because she didn't want to be written out the will and presumably she didn't want to be disowned by them whatever and I sat up with both of them listen to them cry about this talk about this breakup get back together breakup get back together and then eventually she broke up with him for no other reason than her family wouldn't accept him and all the time that i knew them in my opinion he never put a foot wrong he was the best and um yeah so like it's complicated it is complicated and i'm not here to just say like oh everyone should just bite fucking whatever. But I'm also like,

if you know your family are like that, don't fucking get in these situations because you're just going to hurt other people. Unless you are so sure that you can stand up to them. And maybe that's over simplistic, but that's kind of how I feel about it because I've seen it firsthand and seen the level of trauma that it caused.

And fuck her parents, man. They were fucking dickheads. They were such dick such dickheads and like she'd say all this stuff and i'd just be like so they're gonna come to the house like i'm just i'm not gonna be here then when they're here and they're like no no no they don't feel that way about you and i'm like yeah because i'm not trying to marry you and have like mixed race babies like it's so weird it was so weird it's so weird. It was so weird. It was so weird. But anyway, whatever. She's with like a white guy now. We don't speak. Presumably her parents are fine with that.

Well, I hope whatever his name was ended up okay. Yeah. I actually don't speak to him for no other reason than like, you know. Yeah. I mean, yeah. Long time ago. Yeah. So Donna, there are lots of potential reasons.

Yes. None of them are to do with you no I think that's the main thing it'll always come back to it's like um none of them are to do with you it's to do with that person the way that he feels about whatever's going on with him his inability to stand up to his mother um and his family and his family presumably um and speaking as somebody who comes from an Asian background yeah there would be a lot of like the shame um again very i it was so i say i come from this background so i can understand it because i've seen it happen to other people in my extended family luckily it would never my parents would never be like that and i feel very i feel grateful every single day that they're not like that uh they're just like marry somebody how about him a b minus would be fine they're literally like

it doesn't matter him what about him he's he's he's there i shut the fuck up um so yeah i'm so sorry that that happened to you donna it sounds awful it sounds like it went on for far too long um not because of you um or because these things are easy but i'm so glad to that happened to you, Donna. It sounds awful. It sounds like it went on for far too long, not because of you or because these things are easy, but I'm so glad to hear that you're happy and thank you for the reassurance. Yeah, you're crushing it, Donna. Continue. Continue to be a boss bitch.

Sounds like you don't even need any help. No. You're fine. Everything sounds fine. Married, run your own business. Next up, I've got something that is kind of crimey and mannequin themed. Love it. Do you remember in my old house, I had those disembodied mannequin legs in my room? How could I forget? When I left, everyone was like, are you

taking the legs? I was like, no, I'm not taking the legs. During lockdown, I stuffed a pillow inside a red handed t-shirt and drew a face on a piece of cardboard so I could pretend I had a friend in my room. That was on day three of lockdown and it only got worse from there. Just completely lost my mind. Right, okay, back to bringing the news to you. We're Canada, and around 10 o'clock on Friday the 23rd of July, firefighters and police responded to reports of a brush fire, which I don't know if that's different to a bush fire or not, behind a factory on Cabana Street in Sherbrooke in Quebec.

So we're in French-speaking Canada. When the emergency services arrived, numerous witnesses told them that they'd seen somebody set fire to something behind the factory building. Firefighters put out the flames and discovered a particularly crispy mannequin. Together with the police, the fire department agreed to place the mannequin in a container at the police department's headquarters at around 10.45am. And then the mannequin came to life and killed everyone and their children. I'm kidding. It's not that good, unfortunately. So as it turns out, the container the police decided to put the mannequin in was a dumpster,

a big bin. And at 2.15 that day, a local resident phoned the police department and reported that his wife was missing. Investigating officers began by tracing the missing woman's cell phone signal and found that it led them to her car, which was parked oddly close to the scene of the fire earlier that day. Oh my God, you would just imagine the scene of them looking at each other like, Oh, what time is the bin collection? Fucking hell. No, is that where this is going? I feel like that's where this is going. Yes, you all know that where this is going? I feel like that's where this is going. Yes. You all know exactly where this is going. One of the officers cleverly suggested that the woman's car being so close to the factory might not be a coincidence. Give that man a promotion. He also pointed out the similarities between the description of the person's report and the

mannequin. If I go missing and someone's like, yeah, she just looks like a mannequin. She looks like a crispy burnt up mannequin. Have you seen anyone like that lately? And they're like, oh my God, that's a fucking dead ringer for that plastic mannequin we threw in the bin earlier. A few hours later, at about 6.30pm, the police decided to re-inspect the mannequin and removed it from the dumpster. After taking a closer look, which makes me think they weren't looking that closely when they first found it. I feel like plan A should be to take a really close look. Yes, yes, as a literal police officer investigating the site of a fire. Yes, yeah.

No surprises for us guys, but for those guys, big surprise, the burnt mannequin was not a mannequin at all. It was, in fact, the body of the missing lady. And the police chief, who's called Danny McConnell,

not a very French name at all, said that they were all very sorry and the family have now been notified, which is very good of them. And apparently, an anatomical pathologist spoke to a local news agency about the incident and said that because the human body would lose its water weight when it's burnt,

we can look a little bit like mannequins when we are burned. But mannequins are made out of plastic, so burnt mannequins wouldn't look like humans would be my argument. This is the thing. You're right. You're exactly right. That's that's the exact right point. And also, I just feel like the fire department, surely you've seen and this is horrible, but in your line of work, I assume it is slightly unavoidable. You've probably seen some burnt out bodies. How did you not know? That's just a burnt out body. Yeah, like Like that seems strange to me.

Yeah. And we don't really know what's going to happen because no more details have been released. But we do think that it's not going to be considered a criminal situation, maybe an accident or possibly a suicide, I would assume. Yeah, I think they're reporting

that she set fire to herself. Yeah, they seem to be reporting that she set fire to herself, but not confirmed. So yet again, what we have learned, it is never a mannequin and you would think as a police department that would be in your training,

but apparently not. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Welcome to Under the Duvet for the first time Under a Duvet. If you're wondering what on earth is going on, Hannah and I are sat in a premier room in Manchester. Because we're real married now. We are.

And this is where we live. And we have just woken up after doing the first show of our UK tour. It was great. Things went okay. Manchester's a great city. It was a great crowd. A couple of things that we can work on before um London on Tuesday but for a first show especially because like I mean I'm not going to ruin it if you're going to come

see but there's a lot of variables in the show that like you just can't rehearse um so especially considering that being a factor I think we did really well I think it was like the first time out and also I haven't been on tour for two years no and we had a great time and everybody seemed to so thank you to everyone who came um but yeah there's some stuff going on let's talk about it so obviously alec baldwin we've talked about alec baldwin you guys have seen about um this is falling apart one show i know i think it was the glue from that eyelash oh yeah yeah fake eyelashes i had on it. Because I never normally do it and my eyes are like what the fuck

did you do with your eyes? So Alec Baldwin. Okay let's talk about it because I actually didn't know what happened. I was like out on, I was like out on Friday getting my hair done and stuff like that. Then I walked past the Evening Standard music thing and it was just like his face again and again and again and again

and again and I didn't read the headline because it was folded up so you could only see his face and then a picture of a woman and i just thought maybe he's having an affair with this one yeah then i was like why is that front page news on the evening standard um and then on the way home i was called my friend and she was like oh did you see the news about alec baldwin he killed a woman i was like what the fuck and then i looked into it and it is worth talking about i think it's it's fucking mental it's absolutely crazy so basically film was called rust i don't know if you know that i looked it up today it's called rust and it was a west it's a low budget western it's like the worst of everything like i'm not really a Western fan, as you can probably tell.

Six million budget on this film. Yeah, which is tiny. It's tiny. And Alec Baldwin also produced it. Yeah. So it's his money. Yeah. So maybe it's like a bit of a vanity project. I'm not really sure.

Passion project? I'm not sure. But that's what they were doing. And apparently, this is interesting, is that the camera crew had actually walked off the set on strike in the days leading up to the incident where he killed helena hutchins he was about 42 i think and she was the director of photography because they'd walked off because apparently there'd been misfirings leading up to when he actually ended up killing this person three misfirings And this is a unionized crew. So they walked off and they were like,

we're not working here. We don't feel safe. And then they just got non-union workers in to carry on shooting this film. Yeah, which again, Alec Baldwin, he's the producer of Ross. So that will have been his call. So even though I do think it was an accidental shooting,

he is absolutely responsible for that woman's death um and i just don't knowing what i know about alec baldwin and also that his wife pretends to be spanish um i don't believe for a second that he handled the walking off of the unionized crew in a considered way he would have just been like mean, obviously this is complete conjecture. I don't know the man, but like from an educated guess, I think he would have been like, I don't give a fuck. Get the non-union workers we're shooting. Yeah. Yeah. You don't want to be wasting money when you've got a $6 million budget.

So this was the thing actually that I found out today, which is interesting because when you and I were talking about it on the van down, we were like, Oh, it must've been like a blank and maybe he was too close to her and it misfired. And he ended up killing Helena that way. He also shot another man.

Um, his name actually was the director of the director. He has survived. He was like released from hospital the next day, but Helena, obviously not. Um, but that's not what happened.

It wasn't blanks. It was a live's not what happened. It wasn't blanks. It was a live round. Because what happened, and I found this out today, is that apparently, this is unbelievable, members of the film crew working on the set where the cinematographer was shot dead by Alec Baldwin have been reported to use that prop gun for live target practice for recreational purposes when they weren't filming. So the people who were working on this film set were taking these prop guns and filling them with live ammunition, because they're like filming out in the desert,

filming out in the middle of nowhere, using it for recreational purposes for live target practice, like shooting cans and shit like this. And then they have forgotten to empty this gun of the live rounds that they put in to piss about with and then alec baldwin has picked this prop gun up thinking that it's empty and then practiced firing it and he's killed a person what the fuck jesus christ maybe this is what happens when you have a six million budget, is that you've got no one there to do any sort of fucking safety check.

I mean, maybe. God, it's just awful. It's just awful. It really, really is so horrendous. But yeah, because I was really curious. I was like, how could this have happened? How is this possible? But apparently that's the reason.

It's because these people were fucking using a shotgun for live practice. Just because they were bored. It's mad. So yeah, i think that's it basically it's like it's just a horrendous accident but it's he's still responsible it's still criminal negligence he apparently could be um he could be convicted of involuntary manslaughter is what the time said this morning i mean i'm not surprised but he won't no because he's rich and famous yeah he won't be but um no i i would be uh i mean i know it's not going to happen because it's hollywood but um he should be getting a manslaughter conviction yeah for sure yeah he won't but it's it's someone should be if it was a normal person they would be going to prison for that yeah and it's really really tragic because helena was seems to have been really successful when she was

doing why the fuck she was working on this film i have no idea um it's just really imagine she's going to work and she's getting shot to death by alec paul what the fuck so yeah that happened they also found brian laundry's body yes they certainly did so I think we all knew kind of from when we talked about the Gabby Petito Brian Laundrie case um a few weeks ago whenever we were doing that that most likely Brian Laundrie was probably hiding out in Florida that's what all of the signs seem to be pointing towards and um they actually have found Brian Laundrie's remains last week uh on a nature reserve in Florida. I cannot pronounce this nature reserve.

Let me give it a try. Maya Cachahatchee, I'm sorry, Maya Cachahatchee Creek Environmental Park. They found him there on Wednesday. But the problem is, basically, in Florida, it's like, I think it's rainy season now. And so everything is completely waterlogged. So his body has been laying in like waterlogged for God knows how long, because I don't think they've even given us like a time of death or definitely not a cause of death. But I also I was watching this thing this morning with this forensic anthropologist who was saying that when these bodies get discovered in waterlogged areas during rainy season in Florida they've often been moved around by the water so there's no guarantee that where

his body was found was even where he died like so much evidence could have been washed away they also do seem to say that his body seems to have been and I've said chewed on but uh they didn't say that but they said you know touched by but I would say chewed on by alligators and wild pigs wild pigs apparently so okay I can see they're vicious though because even a regular pig will like I just didn't know there were any wild pigs in Florida me either but apparently not but and also the fact that these alligators and wild pigs were they dining on this man like why didn't the alligators just attack the wild pig i don't know maybe it's some sort of animal farm situation yeah they're like it's like a hierarchy of who gets what so yeah basically they found his body um and it's not clear how he died he's gone off to

the forensic anthropologist to be to try discover but they're saying it's basically only skeletal remains that are left at this point yeah so unless there was some sort of someone at the show last night said that he had to be identified by dental records like there was nothing else there seems like there's literally nothing and if that is the case unless there is like a a fracture or a very clear cause of death in his bones we're probably never gonna know how he really died which feels very unsatisfactory it does doesn't it i feel very annoyed that we won't know this is interesting this is where it gets interesting and i got this from the independence i feel like it's okay that we talk about this because i haven't seen it reported anywhere else but the independence definitely did this was as of six hours ago

before we started recording chris and roberta laundry are his parents because i was like okay they knew he was missing in florida they most likely suspected that he was on one of these islands or one of these nature reserves in Florida but how did they actually fucking find his body because like that nature reserve is ginormous yeah and I was curious about that okay this is what the independent says Chris and Roberta Laundrie led authorities to personal items belonging to their son, Brian, in said natural park, making the most significant update in the hunt for their fugitive son since his disappearance in mid-August. So they led him,

they led the police to his belongings. How did they know where they were? And then human remains were found in the area later that day. I knew the parents were in on it. The parents knew where he was because this is the thing that didn't make any sense. Everyone was just like, they found him. They found his body.

I was like, how? How is that possible? But the parents led authorities, according to the independent, to his personal items, to his stuff. And that's why maybe the body did move because they thought he was somewhere because they led it to his personal stuff and his body is found nearby the same day and prior to the discovery as we know as we talked about when we covered the brian laundry case and brian laundry and gabby petito case in the news they hadn't said a word they had been completely silent from when he went missing to now and then suddenly they're

just like oh this is where the remains are i thought that was quite strange yeah i think like what we've lost in the knowing what happened to him death wise i think we are going to learn a lot about his mum and dad yes unfortunately so um so yeah the only thing they've said now on top of this since his remains have been found which again makes it seem very much like they know he did it there doesn't seem to be any conversation from his family or anybody saying maybe he didn't do it they're just like yeah okay um because now they're saying that they won't be giving him a funeral they're just going to quietly cremate him oh wow they have said we won't be doing a funeral for brian his own parents um so it's all very confusing

i don't really know what's going on either i don't know how much we are gonna get i think the parents do know everything i think brian laundry okay he was 22 he lived at home with his girlfriend with his parents the fact that as soon as Gabby goes missing and he goes straight home and then his parents and him go camping for three days if you guys need like a bigger update on this go back and listen to the under the duvet where we talked about it and then in the news where we talked about it really in depth they go off camping for three days together and then they come back and then Brian Laundrie goes missing again I feel like he's the kind of guy I feel like he told them everything and then they cover up for

him and then he goes there I think possibly they didn't know he was dead well maybe they did maybe they hadn't heard from him and that's why they tell the police where his roommate where his personal belongings were if they know where his personal belongings were they know he's dead yeah and that means they knew who he was the whole time they didn't say yeah so which is quite a hard thing to do under police pressure oh my god yeah they held out they didn't say yeah for real like um which i'm not i'm not commencing um but it that must be a tough a tough thing to hold oh that's for that long because it was weeks yeah it really was it has it's been since mid-august it's now the end of october yo i didn't realize it was that long fucking

i was the 25th of october when we're recording this it's gonna be the 27th when you guys are listening to this that is crazy they held out for ages and again we don't know maybe he had just told them roughly where he was gonna be i don't know it's very hard to know but it's all very confusing um and we just aren't going to probably know anything though gabby petito's parents um have come out and said that they think brian laundry was too cowardly to have killed himself really so they think that he was they the thing is there's only really two there's only two likelihoods it's either he killed himself or he he succumbed to the elements or an animal attack. Yeah.

If there's alligators and things like that hanging out in this part of the country, I feel like they're the only two things that could have really happened. And if it's an animal attack, the bones will tell us. How was that? Did it do it for you? If you weren't convinced, if you're still on the fence, hopefully that did a little bit more convincing so again if you want to get your hands on that exclusive 16% off annual patreon red-handed subscription at any tier then head on over to patreon.com slash red-handed right

now to sign up and get two whole months for free have a lovely christmas and a happy new year and we'll see you in 2022. You don't believe in ghosts? I get it. Lots of people don't. I didn't either, until I came face to face with them. Ever since that moment, hauntings, spirits, and the unexplained have consumed my entire life. I'm Nadine Bailey. I've been a ghost tour guide for the past 20 years. I've taken people along with me into the shadows, uncovering the macabre tales that linger in the darkness. And inside some of the most haunted houses, hospitals, prisons, and more.

Join me every week on my podcast, Haunted Canada, as we journey through terrifying and bone-chilling stories of the unexplained. Search for Haunted Canada on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made, a seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. When TV producer Roy Radin was found dead in a canyon near L.A. in 1983, there were many questions surrounding his death. The last person seen

with him was Lainey Jacobs, a seductive cocaine dealer who desperately wanted to be part of the Hollywood elite. Together, they were trying to break into the movie industry. But things took a dark turn when a million dollars worth of cocaine and cash went missing. From Wondery comes a new season of the hit show Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder. Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder

on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of The Cotton Club Murder early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus.