RedHanded - Episode 139 - Ecclesiastes 12: The Strange Death of Charles “Chuck“ Morgan

Episode Date: March 19, 2020

When Chuck Morgan was found dead in the desert - shot in the head, wearing a bulletproof vest and with a $2 note hidden on his body covered in mysterious bible code - it was unbelievably ruled a suicide. And it was just the beginning of a series of bizarre and unexplained deaths that seem to go all the way to the top... Tin foil hats on everyone. Sources: https://unsolvedmysteries.fandom.com/wiki/Doug_Johnston https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/97jx5a/arizona_man_claims_to_be_secret_agent_and_found/ https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/unconvering-unsolved-mysteries/uncovering-unsolved-mysteries/e/52037285?autoplay=true https://unsolvedmysteries.fandom.com/wiki/Charles_Morgan https://unsolved.com/gallery/chuck-morgan/ https://medium.com/true-crime-by-cat-leigh/man-goes-missing-twice-his-body-is-then-found-in-the-desert-bd959260e5b https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/4m3sq3/the_unbelievably_bizarre_case_of_charles_chuck/ https://larouchepub.com/eiw/public/2002/eirv29n35-20020913/eirv29n35-20020913_069-arizonas_mob_gambled_on_sen_john.pdf https://www.cochise.az.gov/sites/default/files/treasurer/WillcoxMurder.pdf https://www.creepyhollows.com/faq/index.php?solution_id=2577 https://thoughtcatalog.com/holly-riordan/2017/05/25-people-on-the-one-unsolved-mystery-they-wish-they-had-more-answers-about/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lu5izP_kvX0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0s78GB_0xpk https://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/archive/index.php/t-279150.htm   See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Red Handed early and ad-free. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made. A seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Saruti.

I'm Hannah. And welcome to Red Handed. So I wanted to start this particular episode with a wardrobe requirement of one tinfoil hat per listener. But actually, after researching it for like the last week, I don't really know if that's necessary. I don't know if we can call this a tinfoil hat because I feel like there's barely a cover-up I feel like people just got fucking murdered left right and center and they were just like yeah uh prove it prove it was a cover-up but it so obviously is I saw this tweet so I can't claim this but um tinfoil is

actually no longer made out of tin it's made out of aluminium which is a conductor so it's actually just going to make it worse amazing it actually does say aluminium foil on the packet doesn't it or yeah it's not stopping anything it's literally conducting all of those waves straight into your brain so they've done it on purpose also what is it that the americans call it uh aluminum aluminum aluminum. Aluminum, that's it. So that's it, guys. Unless you can get yourself an actual bit of tin foil. Oregano. This is a way more fun podcast.

It's oregano. It's aluminium and it's oregano. Right. Now, there you go. The end. See you next week. Exactly. We've just started something wholly unnecessary on social media.

The number of people who are fascinated that we didn't know what a HEB curbside is, I don't know. Mate, that kicked off. Was that your takeaway from the episode about institutional homophobia? I mean, I'll take it. Fine. Right now, given the current situation, I would fucking kill for some HEBE-B curbside. I went to the supermarket, absolutely nothing. I did an online order. Tesco, the earliest they said they would deliver to me is the 25th of March. Yesterday was the 15th. Ten days.

My friends have had to cancel their wedding, so I'm not going to South Africa. Oh my God, I didn't want to ask. Yeah, they literally, South Africa has closed its borders. Especially to high risk countries like the UK. We're being so chilled about it. I don't know what's going on. Well, my friend texts me. She listens to the show.

Hi, Shay. She texts me. She's based in Boston. She was like, what's the coronavirus vibe in the UK? Because I'm not, public schools have shut until the 24th of April. And I just sent her that meme of Lord Farquaad from Sheck that's like, some of you will die, but it's a sacrifice I am willing to make. And I was like, it's like that, but it's Boris Johnson. Oh my God. When he came to the podium, I just said,

some people are going to lose loved ones before their time. What do you want me to do about it, though? Just get in the coffin. Just get in the burial pits, guys. Just jump in. Oh, my God. You know what? We'll save this for under the duvet chat. We've got to get back on track.

Sorry, yeah. It's a very complex case that we've got to cover today. What I will request everyone pay attention, there are a lot of names. There's a lot of names that sound kind of the same. We'll do our very best to sort of differentiate between those, but keep up. And a lot of people who are kind of the same we'll do our very best uh to sort of differentiate between those but keep up and a lot of people who are kind of the same i had to have a separate document where i wrote down all of their

names and who they were and how they were connected done our best to distill it for you into what will be an hour-long episode so pay attention i would also say a good accompaniment to today's show would be our episode on danny casolaro it's episode number 59 and we did it like a million years ago. 59? Fuck! We're on like, what, 159 or something now? Like 100 episodes ago. 138 or something. Crazy. So, a while ago. But Danny Casolaro is the guy that we talked about in that episode.

He makes a very important appearance in our tangled web of lies, murder and more lies today. And since we've already covered his death, we won't be rehashing it too much again. Our story today starts in the 70s in Tucson, Arizona. Not Tuscan, as I thought it was said. Because it's spelt like it should be said, Tuscan. So I kept spelling it like Tucson because I'd heard it. And it kept telling me with a red wiggly angry line that I was wrong. How dare you correct my incorrect fucking spelling.

How dare you. How rude. Pick one. It's either spelt this way or it's said that way. Pick one. You can't have both. It's either what I say it is or it's not. Exactly. Fuck you, Google Docs. So in the 70s, Tucson was a hotbed of organized crime, drugs and guns. And before anyone comes for us over this, we did try and get a flavor for the

time by reading posts on citydata.com, where people have started a thread where they talk about growing up in the 60s 70s and 80s in the area and basically the vibe is this yes the criminal stats are one thing but it was also a lovely place to grow up but i also feel like everyone says that about everywhere exactly i didn't go looking for that information i was basically trying to find out what tucson in the 70s was because it's all very organized crimey, very mobby. I just wanted to see some pictures of it. I wanted to get a feel for the vibe. And I came across this website, city-data.com.

And it's just people being really annoyed because they grew up there and they're like, it was actually a really nice place to live. And I'm like, I don't know, maybe. Maybe, maybe. But there was also a lot of organised crime. People are always just going to defend where they're from, you know. Well, I'm fine and I'm from fucking crime land. It's Monday morning, guys. So having not visited Tucson or the 70s, we can't speak of what the actual vibe was.

But apparently you could go out at night and find a cool live band playing every single night apparently that was the vibe every night of the week in citydata.com people were just like yuck there may have been mobsters running around but you could go out every single night and see a cool live band so what more do you want to not get murdered i mean there's not much more i want There's not much more than going to see some fucking live. I haven't seen live music in so long. My God. Tucson in the 70s would have been maybe your jam.

I don't know what the music was. Apparently, this time there was something called the Tucson Sound. And we don't know what that means. But it seems like it was just the soundtrack to the mob running wild in the area absolutely running riot in Tucson too I really want it to be like just just a lot of auto harps that's what I'm imagining but I don't know maybe if somebody knows what the Tucson sound is uh someone let us know because apparently it was birthed in this particular era but don't know what it is.

I had to research too many other things to find out and dig a little bit deeper into that particular rabbit hole. There are other things to be concerned with this week than what the fuck Tucson Sound is. The main documentary that we're going to be referencing in today's episode is a classic Unsolved Mysteries episode from January 1991. And in that episode, they explain all of the reasons for this mob activity in Tucson at the time. Apparently, it was because of the warm climate. Good for growing drugs, I suppose. Potentially. Maybe that's it. Maybe you're right.

Maybe it's just about growing drugs. I was like, why? Why does the warm climate matter? And then I thought, is it like a slightly racist thing? Because they were like, oh, all these mobsters were Italian or Mexican, two countries that were kind of warm. So either it's that or it's because of the actual growing drugs, or it's just because mobsters like a temperate climate. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, wait, if you're gonna pick somewhere to temperate climate i don't know i don't know yeah wait if you're gonna pick somewhere to do crime you don't want to be cold you don't want

to be cold but i feel like it's a weird it's a weird reason for a documentary to be citing without giving more information they just say yeah it was the warm climate and And I was like, in context to what? I don't know. This documentary also says that there was so much crime because of a thing that they called, this is a quote, a confused and corrupt criminal justice system. Specifically for Tucson? How's it done?

Specifically for Arizona and specifically for Tucson. So they're basically saying... Right, right, right, right. Yeah, that there was a lot of sort of weirdness going on in the legal systems and the sort of justice system in Tucson. And specifically in Arizona as well at the time, there was a unique state law that meant that one could buy up land through numbered blind trust accounts. So in this documentary, can we call Unsolved

Mysteries a documentary? We can, can't we? That's what it is. Yeah. TV show? Yeah. I mean, I suppose it's as much a documentary as like Dateline. Yeah. Okay. So the TV show, Unsolved Mysteries. The dramatization of events. I also really enjoy the 1991 one that we're discussing had the OG Robert Stack doing it. He is quite a scary man when you just watch him in like 2020. He looks like a well out of place, I would say. In what way? I don't know. He's just, he's so different to like the way true crime documentaries or the way like I would assume that same kind of TV show would be made now. No shade on him. I think he's great.'s fantastic the TV show is excellent I also realized that we were two years old when that documentary came out I was one you're older than me yeah yeah you were a year I was two when this came out so you know it wasn't made with us in

mind I'll take that into account yeah that's true all my fucking life I was at a party on Saturday night and there was this girl outside and she was like, I just feel like everyone here is really young. And I was like, how old are you? And she was like, 24. And I was like, please leave. Get out. Get out. What is happening? I hate you. People are too young these days. I don't like it. But also, again, with unsolved mysteries, they don't go into much context about what it means to be able to buy blind trust accounts and the impact that that was having. They just sort of say, there was a unique state law that meant you could do this. And I was like, but what does

that actually mean? So I did some digging. So basically, when you buy through blind trust accounts, it disguises the assets and importantly, the source of the income that was put into that blind trust, so where the money is coming from. So, of course, it's perfect for money laundering. That sounds like that shouldn't be allowed. It's very, the thing is it has specific purposes. So, for example, say you become prime minister and then you would have to put all of your assets into a blind trust. So basically, it would mean that you couldn't then change policy or government policy or redirect government funds into something that would personally benefit you. Because if you put it into a blind trust,

what it means is that you as the beneficiary now technically have no idea what's in your trust, as in what specific assets are there. So the trustees are responsible for appropriately managing your assets and your money. So basically, it would mean if you own loads of land in a specific area or shares in a specific company, you can't influence public policy to make those areas go through the roof, monetarily speaking, so that you can personally benefit. Because this sort of tells the world, oh, I don't know where my money is. So if I'm making decisions, it's not to personally enrich myself. Okay, I won't lie. I did not understand that.

So pretend you are Donald Trump and you own shares in Apple or something. Okay. Can I be Forrest Gump instead? You can be Forrest Gump instead. Absolutely. And then you can't then decide on influencing or pushing through policy or laws or legislation that would dramatically improve Apple's profitability for whatever reason. Like say you cut all of like taxes or something because they make all of their stuff in China and you make that really, really easy to do and you make it super cheap because then you would personally benefit and you would know that

you would and that's why you made those decisions. So that's why they exist to stop politicians being able to do that kind of thing. But bullshit, they definitely know what's in those blind trust accounts. It's all the nonsense. In this case, so assuming that a blind trust is a situation in which a beneficiary isn't allowed to or supposed to know about the holdings of the trust and the trustees have full discretion on how these are managed. So for example if you are a mob boss and the beneficiary of blind trust you are not supposed to know what the assets are within your trust or how they're being managed. So this gives you legal distance and plausible deniability if illegal activities are ever detected. Also, apparently, in some places

there is not even a requirement for registration of a blind trust because they are seen as private arrangements and their very existence is not a matter of public record. So essentially this could be as well included in this unique state law in Arizona at the time that Unsolved Mysteries never expands on. Possibly they never expand on it because no one gives a shit and people are skipping violently over my explanation of what a blind trust is. But if you're still there, I will continue to explain. So essentially, you could create what is known as a slush fund, which is illegal in most places. And this is where the source of the funds are secret and can't be traced back to who the donors

were. So basically, if you can successfully get your dirty money into a trust fund, it can never be traced back to you. And now, bam, you buy something with it, it's clean. Money laundering. So obviously, this makes these kind of blind trusts perfect for those who are looking to money. And if you are still there, that is just a trailer teaser for a podcast that I'll continually talk about but never ever start called Not In This Economy With Saruti Bala. We will see. Maybe one day. Maybe we'll all get trapped in our houses

so long because of Corona I will have enough time to start a second podcast. I mean quite possibly and we've been talking for ages about how people just fucking love shit to fall asleep to. So maybe it's just you explaining incredibly boring economic concepts. Well, if you're still there, come back. Come back to me because it's going to get more interesting now.

So basically, the thing that you need to know is organized crime groups were, of course, naturally abusing this opportunity. And they were buying up land and using it to anonymously launder money and then using that land to run illegal smuggling operations. So bottom line, needless to say, the guns and drugs trade was booming. You will figure out why we've talked so extensively about this because there is a reason. We'll come back to it though. For now, what you need to know is that according to reports at the time, Joseph Bonanno, aka Joe Bananas, a New York mob boss, apparently ran the area. Joe Bananas, which was apparently a name that he absolutely fucking hated,

so I'm going to continue to call him that, and over 500 other such racketeers set up shop in Tucson in the 70s. And of course, the gangland killings went through the roof. But so did the killings of anyone else who happened to get in their way i think gangster names are one of my favorite things like where they're just like oh fat tony they're great this one wasn't like an official one for that he chose because he absolutely hated it of course i don't think any of them are official i don't think anyone's like oh you know what i really just want to be fucking Lizard Eyes Jones.

But that's quite cool. Or, you know, like Johnny the Chin or something like that. Joe Bananas. Johnny the Chin. I like Jack the Hat. That's a good one. Mac the Knife. They're great. I mean, not really. I don't want to fall into this glamorization of organized crime. Fuck those guys. But also, that's why we'll call him Joe Bananas. So, for example, when we're talking about these gang-lined killings and people disappearing all over the place, an investigative journalist named Don Bolles

started digging around in a racetrack company owned by the very same Joe Bananas. And this was called M-Prize, which sounds like a really shitty management consultancy firm. Which come in and sack everyone. Consultium. Consultium slash consultius. Consultancy firm that's run out of Alan Johnson's come in and sack everyone. Consultio. Consultium slash consultius. Consultancy firm that's run out of Alan Johnson's bedroom in his dressing gown.

Girl, we haven't had a Pete Show quote for fucking ages. There you go, have it. So this investigative journalist is digging around in M Prize and then the mob blew him up. Literally. They planted a bomb in his car in 1976, and Don's last words were apparently, they finally got me. The Mafia. But our story today isn't about Don or Mr Bananas.

It starts with a much more simple character, a man called Charles Chuck Morgan. Chuck was an escrow lawyer, and he had done well for himself. I had to look up what escrow means, and I still don't think I know and if you google it if you just google the word the first thing that comes up is what is escrow exactly but that's the search term I think we can simplify it down to the fact of he's doing like real estate or property law or like land law land buying hence why we went into so much detail talking about the fact that the mafia were buying up land through these numbered blind trust accounts. This was Chuck's whole bag.

Okay, so Chuck absolutely understands what a blind trust is, even if I don't. And he'd done really well for himself. There was a real estate boom in the area during that time and Chuck ran his own business. He was very successful. He was married and he had four daughters. Life seemed pretty good. And then in 1977, Chuck became a witness in a state land fraud case against a mob boss. He gave his sworn affidavit and was set to testify. He was even offered protection due to the nature of the case. But for some reason, Chuck turned this down. And I guess he tried to carry on

with his life as normal. But everything was about to get very un-normal. On the 22nd of March 1977, Chuck drove his daughters to school. And then, that very same day, Chuck Morgan disappeared. His wife Ruth was frantic. This was completely out of character. But three days after the vanishing, Ruth was woken up at 2am. There was a sound at the back door and the dog was barking. Someone was out there. A scared Ruth opened the door and to her utter amazement, there was her husband. And Chuck, when he was stood at the back door, was in a weird way.

He was missing a shoe, he had a plastic zip tie tying his wrist together, and a plastic handcuff around one ankle. He was hysterical, but silent. He kept motioning to his throat, indicating that he couldn't speak. So Ruth fetched him a notepad and pen. Chuck wrote down that a hallucinogenic drug had been painted on his throat, and that if he swallowed the drug it would drive him mad or kill him ruth was of course baffled painted on hallucinogenics seems the only thing i can think is like lsd because i guess do they paint it onto tabs and then put it onto people's like because you can't they soak it so like so it could be a liquid form that could be painted onto somebody, I guess. Yeah, that's true. I can't remember.

Oh, yeah. One of my friends who went to uni in Manchester, she had this weird guy who was at a party that I was at, and he was just a bit off. Like, I couldn't describe. And I spoke to Liza, and I was like, Liza, what's wrong with him? And she was like, he used to manufacture LSD in his bedroom and it comes in like a bottle and he spilt it on his hand and he's never been the same.

Yeah. So that's that. You're fucked. Just cut that hand off. Cut it right off before it's too late. It's too late. Well, it's just in him now. He's just like that.

So yeah, Chuck, it is weird. And a lot of people do sort of question, not question this, but point this out on Reddit, on the internet, et cetera. When I was trying to dig up like background into this story people like how could it be painted but i guess you could like you know back in the olden days when they used people used to have like a cough or a sore throat and they'd have like those weird swabs where they would dip in like i don't know fucking tcp or whatever and then just like wipe someone's throat with it maybe like that you have made that up no I saw a thing about it this is as like legit explanations of unsolved mysteries episode they used to do things like

sort of like chimney sweep your throat to clear it out because they thought that was helping it wasn't helping fine what like you've got some ghosts in your blood you should do cocaine about it exactly I was also thinking in this uh Ruth just goes and gets a notepad and pen i wouldn't know where a notepad or a pen was in my house if somebody turned up and they were like i can't speak help me well you would if you were fucking patsy ramsey wouldn't you oh shots fired anyway chuck wrote down on this pen and paper that Ruth had to move his car immediately because if they saw it, they would know that he had come home. So he's managed to drive himself.

Yeah, so it's like he's escaped, driven himself home, and then he's like, I can't speak, blah, blah, blah, move the fucking car, they're going to see it. So he thinks that somebody is pursuing him after he's escaped home. Chuck also firmly told Ruth that she was not under any circumstances to call the police or even a doctor. When Ruth begged him to tell her why, Chuck simply wrote down, they will kill us all. He went on to explain to his horrified wife that he was in fact a secret agent for the government and had been for almost three years.

He also informed Ruth that his government ID had been stolen by the government and had been for almost three years. He also informed Ruth that his government ID had been stolen by the people who had abducted him, so he can't prove it even to his wife. Hmm, convenient. Over the next week, Ruth nursed a frantic Chuck back to health. He would only allow her to feed him water through an eyedropper. So specific. I know. But he eventually recovered and he started to speak again. Whatever had happened to Chuck during those three days that he'd been missing had pushed him into a deeply paranoid state of mind. He started to wear a bulletproof vest whenever he left the house and he started to insist that no one else was allowed to drive his daughters to or from school. And it appears that Chuck was right to be paranoid, because two

months after his first disappearance, he once again vanished. According to Ruth, the last time anyone saw him was the morning of the day that he went missing again. He had gone to his parents' house and told his dad that if anything ever happened to him, that it would be murder, and that he would be leaving a letter behind which would explain in detail why he'd been killed and who was responsible. But to this day, that letter has never been found. Nine days after Chuck's second disappearance, Ruth was at home when she received a call.

The caller was a woman, and she said, quote, Ruthie, Chuck is all right. Ecclesiastes 12, 1 through 8. When Ruth asked who she was, the woman simply called herself Green Eyes. Two days later, Chuck's body was found. It was laying in the desert 40 miles outside of Tucson. The body was found on the ground next to Chuck's car. He had been shot at close range, just once, to the back of the head. The weapon that had been used was also found at the scene and it was Chuck's own gun, a Magnum 357. It was lying next to him but it had no prints on it

whatsoever. In the car, police found a piece of paper with directions on it to the spot where his body lay and it was in Chuck's handwriting. In the back seat of the car, police found a piece of paper with directions on it to the spot where his body lay, and it was in Chuck's handwriting. In the back seat of the car, they found a tooth wrapped up in a handkerchief. There was also a pair of sunglasses found in the car that apparently weren't Chuck's. In the Unsolved Mysteries episode, and a lot of other places where this case has been discussed, it's said that it was a pair of sunglasses that definitely did not belong to Chuck. I don't really see how anyone can know that for sure.

It's a pair of sunglasses. You don't need a license for them. Exactly. And they always say it in such a like conspiratorial way. They're like, and there was also a pair of sunglasses that definitely weren't Chuck. There are fucking weirder things going on at this crime scene. Why are we focusing on these sunglasses that may or may not have been his? The lone tooth that I hate the most.

What? Can't do eyes, can't do teeth. Wrapped in a fucking handkerchief. For the tooth fairy. I want to know whether it was clean or whether it had blood on it or whether it had been knocked out or just kept. I don't know. Honestly, there's just not that much information on this case out there. Like we did our very best in terms of digging into it,

but so much stuff is just not really referenced in more detail than there was a tooth wrapped in a handkerchief in the back of the car. Like, okay, cool. And? And even though Chuck's family seemed to agree that the sunglasses definitely weren't his, he was missing for days when he was found. And he'd been driving around in the desert where you probably do need sunglasses.

And you can buy them. Like, it's not like you need to go to like... I'm not buying that they definitely weren't his. I don't think it's relevant particularly. No. And also, Chuck was well prepared after all. When his body was found, he was still wearing his bulletproof vest and he had a knife in his belt. We're not just going to sweep over all these things.

We're just going to give you a rundown of everything that was at the crime scene. We will come back to sort of dissecting these in more detail. Don't worry. And if you think that was weird, it's about to get a bit weirder. Listen to this. In Chuck's pants, not in his trousers, in his actual pants was a two dollar note on the front of the note were written seven names starting with the letters a to g and they're all spanish names surnames even so they're esevedo pejorano cajero tuerte encinas fuente and gradillas and above the list of names on the $2 bill was written the word Ecclesiastes and the number 12.

And just beneath this, on the note's serial number, were two arrows pointing as if to connect two numbers that appear in the note's serial number. No prizes for guessing which two numbers. 1 and eight. So that basically is telling us Ecclesiastes 12, one to eight. The same chapter and verses that Green Eyes had quoted to Ruth on the phone. Now, flip the note over. On the other side, there was more. Now, I don't think I've ever actually handled or like seen a two dollar note

but apparently on the back is an illustration of the signers of the Declaration of Independence and these figures on the back of this note had been numbered one to seven and also over the top of this a simple map had been drawn. The map is of roads between Tucson and the Mexican border. The lines of the map go out to a place called Robles Junction and then go down to a town called Saseby. Despite it being very rough, the lines formed a fair and real visualization of the area. According to an investigative journalist, Don Devereaux, who is now going to feature heavily in the rest of this episode, so remember him, there is a ranch down in the area indicated on the map.

And there is a landing strip down there. According to Don, this landing strip is rife with smuggling operations for narcotics. What a fucking cool name. Don Devereaux. Oh, he's just so cool. He a fucking cool name. Don Devereaux. Oh, he's just so cool. He's honestly so cool. He's in the Unsolved Mysteries episode

that we will tell you which season and episode and stuff at the end so you guys can go watch it. He's just so cool. He's an old man even then, but he's kind of sexy just because he's like, I'm Don Devereaux, investigative journalist. What? Sexy in like a Ted Danson way? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And we will be opening the Don Devereaux fan club next week. So despite everything we have just said, despite the sunglasses and the list of names and the weird $2 note, all of that sort of thing, Chuck's death was ruled as a suicide. Literally in what universe is this a suicide he's wearing a bulletproof vest who shoots themselves in the head wearing a bulletproof vest that seems outrageous i just do not understand this man had been so scared for his life apparently he had been walking around wearing a bulletproof vest for weeks and then he's found shot in the head and then i was suicide suicide got it nailed it and also how does one shoot oneself in the head without gloves on and then leave no fingerprints

on the gun so you're shooting yourself in the head and then just wiping the gun clean just in case while you bleed to death from a probably instantaneous headshot wound, you just like have a little wipe down of that gun because you don't want to give away that you shot yourself. It doesn't make any fucking sense. The gun that they found at the scene, yes, it was Chuck's, but it had no fucking fingerprints on it. How? How? And also when they tested Chuck's body,

they found gunshot residue on his left hand. But Chuck was right-handed. Why would he shoot himself with his non-dominant hand? That doesn't make sense either. And then we've got the fucking weird tooth wrapped up in the handkerchief on the back seat of the car. Why is it there in the first place? And also, by the way, it was definitely Chuck's.

They tested it. And then we've got this $2 note. And also, Ruth makes a really good point in the documentary. She says that if Chuck had killed himself, he would have left her and the girls a note but there was no note found at the scene or anywhere for that matter I do think though I mean I don't know I'm not married to a secret agent but he's clearly not telling you everything babes is he do you know what I mean like I don't know no I mean it's hard because obviously he's not telling her everything but you know clearly he was like obsessed with their safety he was

driving his daughters to and from school he was very concerned with all that but again kind of like the sunglasses you could take it or leave it the the fingerprints the gunshot residue on his non-dominant hand the tooth in the back of the car who is like i'm going to drive myself out to the desert to shoot myself in the head but this tooth fell out i better wrap it in a handkerchief and leave it in the back seat of my car like what and then all the stuff on the note why i don't know it's very weird and also why did he have instructions telling him how to get to where he was going to kill himself you don't draw yourself a map or write yourself a set of instructions to go somewhere to end it, surely. That seems like someone else has dictated that to you.

Yeah, you're meeting someone. Exactly. Because otherwise, if you were going to kill yourself, you'd just drive yourself out into the desert, wouldn't you? You wouldn't leave a treasure trail. Exactly. Why would you need to leave directions to the place that you were going to be found? And it's still beyond you. Harvard is the oldest and richest university in America.

But when a social media-fueled fight over Harvard and its new president broke out last fall, that was no protection. Claudian Gay is now gone. We've exposed the DEI regime, and there's much more to come. This is The Harvard Plan, a special series from the Boston Globe and WNYC's On the Media. To listen, subscribe to On the Media wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery Show American Scandal. We bring to light some of the biggest controversies in U.S. history. Presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our latest series, NASA embarks on an ambitious program to reinvent space exploration with the launch of its first reusable vehicle, the Space Shuttle. And in 1985,

they announced they're sending teacher Krista McAuliffe into space aboard the Space Shuttle Challenger, along with six other astronauts. But less than two minutes after liftoff, the Challenger explodes. And in the tragedy's aftermath, investigators uncover a series of preventable failures by NASA and its contractors that led to the disaster. Follow American Scandal on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Experience all episodes ad-free and be the first to binge the newest season only on Wondery Plus. You can join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial today. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made.

A seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. When TV producer Roy Radin was found dead in a canyon near L.A. in 1983, there were many questions surrounding his death. The last person seen with him was Lainey Jacobs, a seductive cocaine dealer who desperately wanted to be part of the Hollywood elite. Together, they were trying to break into the movie industry. But things took a dark turn when a million dollars worth of cocaine and cash went missing. From Wondery comes a new season of the hit show Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder.

Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of The Cotton Club Murder early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of The Cotton Club Murder early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. So despite the official theory that was released of this being a suicide, there were officers at the Sheriff's Department who felt that Chuck's death was a gangland hit.

A retired sheriff who was still close to the team told Unsolved Mysteries he knew of several men who were convinced that this was a mob hit and they actually all left the department soon after this incident. Some left law enforcement altogether and two of them left the entirety of the United States. I mean, suspect. Suspect. Suspect, man.

Suspect. And this man, this sheriff, this retired sheriff when he's talking to unsolved mysteries doesn't strike me as the kind of man who is uh into a load of drama it seems like he's a quite straight up and down kind of guy and he's like yeah i knew of several officers who got the fuck out after this happened he says it could have been a coincidence but it seems like a weird coincidence and you know those names that were written on the note those seven Spanish surnames some people on the internet think potentially they were the names of the officers

who left but they left after so how would Chuck have known unless they left because they were caught up in this and he already knew they were caught up in it and then when this all happened and their names are on there they left but then surely that would have been super easy to trace back you'd be like hey you have the same surname as on this note and you're leaving like I don't know it seems really like how was that connection missed if it was the fact I don't know well I don't think anyone wants you to be making connections you know like I don't I think I think this goes all the way to the fucking top yeah and it's just they've just got rid of him. And then they're just like, oh, just nothing to see here. Don't worry about it.

Especially not you, Unsolved Mysteries. Stay away. If you are thinking, like, maybe these men who fled were overreacting, probably not, because two days after Chuck's body was found, an anonymous woman called the Pima City Police Department. And guess who it was? It was old Green Eyes herself. She told the police that Chuck and her had been meeting up for months before his death and that the day that he died,

he had come to meet her in a motel room. She said that during that meeting, Chuck had showed her a briefcase filled with money. She said that she thought there might have been around $60,000 inside. Chuck had apparently told Green Eyes that the money was to buy his way out of a mob hit that had been put out on him. And after recounting all this to the police, Green Eyes hung up. So if Green Eyes was right and Chuck did indeed have a briefcase full of money that day, it was gone by the time that his body was found. So is it possible that Chuck did indeed have a mob hit put out on him and he had found a way in which he thought he could pay the hitman off and save

himself? So had he like figured it all out, figured out who the hitman was, got in touch with this hitman and the hitman tells him here some instructions, come meet me here in the desert with $60,000. So Chuck had got all this money together, gone out to the desert with his briefcase full of money and his bulletproof vest to try and pay for his life. But if he had, and Green Eyes is correct that she had seen him that day with all that money, it clearly hadn't worked. Whoever it was that Chuck had gone to meet seems to have double-crossed him taken the money and shot him anyway and i think depending on the kind of scruples of a mob hitman is uh probably a mistake because this guy or gal don't know this hitman person can just take this cash and cash in on his death again

because he'd still be able to collect the money from the person who had originally ordered the hit on Chuck because he's dead. Ah, double bubble. Double bubble. So Don Devereaux, our mate, describes Chuck as naive. And unfortunately, I think I have to agree. And it also explains quite a bit about how Chuck got himself into this situation in the first place. But we'll come back to that in a bit. Three weeks after Chuck's death, two random men turned up at his family home. They told Ruth that they were FBI agents. They flashed their

IDs and entered the house. They didn't have a warrant and they never told her what they were looking for. But Ruth was so flustered that she didn't stop them as they searched the house from top to bottom. Ruth also didn't get their names as they tore her house apart. After this incident, investigative journalist Don Devereaux started to take a real interest in Chuck's case. He called the FBI and through the Freedom of Information Act, he requested the details on Chuck. But the FBI just said that they'd never even heard of Charles slash Chuck Morgan, even though Don knew that they had opened an investigation on Chuck when he was murdered, and that they had even interviewed his attorney. But now the FBI were just pretending like they had no clue who he even was. So if we assume that these two men were FBI agents, what were they looking for? According to Don Devereaux, the numbers and words on the $2 note

they found on Chuck's body looked like a code or a cipher, the kind that needs an accompanying document to crack. So were the FBI looking for such a document? Was it the letter that Chuck had mentioned leaving behind to his father, which was never found? Or maybe the FBI did find it and they took it with them that day. Or maybe they were just completely random people. Or maybe they weren't even FBI.

Maybe they were mob. I don't know. We'll never know. Maybe they weren't even humans. Men in black. It's happening. So Don also wonders if maybe Chuck had been working for the government. So in that case, was the $2 bill with all the codes and the ciphers written on it

an attempt to pass information on to the FBI? Or perhaps, was Chuck into organized crime? I think he was just poking around where people did not want him to be poking. And then they were just like, you've got a bit too complicated for us now, Chuck. Exactly, exactly. Exit through the gift shop. And we will sort of talk about how he was specifically linked but these are the sort of two pathways it can be either he's working for the fbi or he's working for the mob maybe both i think also though

if you do think about the mob involvement in this with the two dollar note and all the weird codes and the shit on it is that how the mob operate like Like, I can see the FBI or the CIA doing shit like that, but the mob, I don't know. Yeah, it just seems a bit more likely they just give you a pair of concrete shoes and throw you off a bridge. Like, I don't know. Why do they need codes?

Are they into that? Yeah, I don't know. But I think it's a combination of, like, obviously organised crime, but I think they're working with the authorities. So, like, it could be both both I think the other question is who the hell is green eyes mob FBI completely unrelated just Chuck's mate but she seems to cool under all of this pressure she's just like calling the police she's just calling his wife I don't know again questions hold your

questions for the moment so Don Devereaux had been investigating organized crime activity in Tucson long before Chuck's death. This was his whole bag. Remember, he's an investigative journalist. He was really into looking into what the mob were up to. And I think he potentially thought that this was his chance to crack it all wide open because he knew that Chuck had been murdered. So he took the story to the popular TV show Unsolved Mysteries. So Don is the reason that Unsolved Mysteries

even ever get their hands on the Chuck Morgan case. And when Don took it to them, he's a respected journalist, so they ran with it. And like I said, if you do want to watch this episode on the Chuck Morgan case, Unsolved Mysteries in its entirety is actually now on Amazon Prime. And if you want to watch the right episode, it is season three, episode nine. It's incredibly difficult to actually figure out which episode a specific Unsolved Mysteries episode is related to in terms of which case,

because they don't actually tell you in the episode descriptions what that episode is going to discuss, which is very frustrating. And IMDb lists it as the wrong episode. So there you go. It's because they don't want you poking your nose in. That's why. It's all a cover up. So yeah, it took me absolutely fucking ages to figure it out. So save yourself a lot of headache and just go watch season three, episode nine.

After the show aired, things really kicked off and Unsolved Mysteries was inundated with hundreds of tip off calls. Don Devereaux started following up on each one. He discovered that Chuck had been doing escrow work for at least one mob family and that they may have started dragging him deeper and deeper into their world. Because Don soon realised that Chuck had been heavily involved in money laundering and that between 1973 and 1977, he had done up to a billion dollars worth of escrow work

involving purchases of gold and platinum bullion. Billion. That's a billion dollars. With a B. They specifically even say that in The Unsolved Mystery. That's billion with a B. That's how much fucking escrow work he had done. It is like, I can't even get my head around that kind of money. No, it's completely unconceivable.

And to earn that amount of money in four years. Well, this is the thing. He would have been taking a cut of it or however they were paying him. But the money that was passing through these mob families, the work that he was doing for them was up to a billion dollars worth of gold and platinum, like that much money laundering. So fuck me, that's outrageous. And all of that billion dollars was squeaky clean thanks to chuck's work through

banks in la and atlanta both he and whoever he was working with had made a shit ton of money according to ruth chuck had once told her that there was money laundering going on in tucson but he wasn't involved that seems like a funny thing to bring up at the dinner table bit weird but he had also rather suspicious suspiciously, we thought, said that the less that Ruth and the kids knew about this money laundering that he definitely wasn't involved with, the better for them. And I don't think that Chuck was some sort of criminal mastermind. I think he wanted to make money.

I think he got involved with the wrong people and he got in over his head and he's definitely not the first person to do that. And it's attractive. Do you know what it makes me think of it's like when I used to work at the theater and we would do like charity collections one of my jobs was to count all of that money and I would like sit there and be like I could just steal 300 pounds and nobody would know there is literally no way no one would know it would just be my own guilt eating me alive no no but this is the thing it's so it's so human isn't it it's uh are you doing the right thing when no one would know. It would just be my own guilt eating me alive. No, no, but this is the thing. It's so human, isn't it?

It's, are you doing the right thing when no one's watching? That's the question. Yes, exactly. Yeah, and I think, you know, all of these mobsters are going to be telling him that it's all going to be fine and they've been fine for years. They've never been in prison. They've, you know, they're just running the same old game

they always have been and it's going to be fine. So I can understand why he sort of got in over his head and I don't think he realized until it was too late what he got himself into because a big chunk of the billions of dollars of work he had done had come from Southeast Asia. And Don Devereux also found that there were links with Chuck's work to the CIA, high power government officials, the Department of Defense, and the Vietnamese government. So all this money coming in from Vietnam, Southeast Asia, it's pretty fishy when you consider that this was all going on between 1973 and 1977,

and the Vietnam War only ended in 1975. So this is most definitely highly illegal. The United States is at war with vietnam at the time and there's loads of fucking gold bullion coming in from there it's dodgy so dodgy and when don is sort of unraveling all this it started to dawn on him that whatever chuck was up to and whatever the mob were doing this was more than just your run-of-the-mill mob work and if you're wondering how was don able to figure all this out? Well, it was because he was able to track down basically everything that had been happening

because Chuck was keeping duplicate records of all of the deals that he had been involved with. Which I'm guessing for the mob is a big fat fucking no. Don't do that. I just sort of feel like he doesn't really understand the like concept or like the point of what he's doing like if you're keeping if you're literally making your own paper trail i don't stop it yeah maybe you could argue that chuck was just a stickler for admin but i think it's he doesn't realize how dangerous what he's doing is or he thinks that

his duplicate records were some sort of an insurance policy. Yeah probably. Whatever it was again it shows a very high level of naivety and Don Devereaux suspects that potentially someone found out about these duplicate records that Chuck was keeping and that could have been the reason that he was killed. But Don was maybe also being a little bit naive himself thinking that he could just go digging around in all of this and go unnoticed. So Don does a great interview with a podcast that is out there called Unsolved Mysteries Uncovered, which is just as meta as it sounds. And I don't know, go check out this episode.

I can't remember which one it is, but I'll link it below so you guys can check it out. And in that episode, Don talks about the landing strip that was in Chuck's map that he had drawn on that $2 note. Don started going down there and staking the place out. And apparently he was run off this airstrip twice, once by a car and once by a helicopter. He says that as his investigation ramped up, he started to feel like he was being stalked. Don, being an investigative journalist, had sources all over the place, and one of his sources was in Israeli intelligence. He told Don, in no uncertain terms, to quit doing the investigation. According to Mr Mossad, whatever was going on, Don wouldn't be able to make a difference anyway,

and that he would just end up getting himself killed. Three months after the Unsolved Mysteries segment aired, someone did die, but it wasn't Don. At 11pm on the 14th of May, a 35-year-old man named Doug Johnson left for a night shift at his job working for a computer graphics company. An hour later, he was found dead, parked in his company car park. He had been shot once behind his left ear. Nothing was missing from his car, his wallet and all of his valuables were still

there, and it was deemed a suicide. And maybe you're wondering what has poor Doug Johnson's suicide got to do with this case? Well, let's take a closer look with our tinfoil aluminium hats on. Firstly, Doug Johnson bears a striking resemblance to none other than our very own Don Devereaux. He also drove the same car, a Toyota station wagon, and he lived in a similar house. And in fact, Don's house was exactly opposite the car park in which Doug was found dead.

Don's house number was actually only separated from Doug's work address by a single digit. Don's was a three and Doug's office was an eight and he'd often accidentally receive company post. And maybe it was just a coincidence but then consider that Doug was right-handed and the bullet wound was on his left side. Who would shoot themselves like that? Also, no gunpowder residue was found on his hands. And as if that wasn't enough, no gun was found at the scene. It was also discovered that the shot was fired from a gun that was held at least 12 inches from Doug's head.

And then everyone just decided it was a suicide. That is madness. And like a three and an eight, like that can so easily be, like you can so easily get that wrong. Like if you're not writing neatly. Don Devereaux is on borrowed time. Mate, honestly, shooting yourself,

because he is right-handed, with his right hand through his left side and also being able to lift your hand away when you're going to shoot yourself in the opposite side of the head, 12 inches away from your ear. It just seems impossible. It's impossible. It's impossible. Just to clarify with this,

they never actually 100% have said this is a suicide, but they suggested that it was a suicide. And it's unresolved. Basically, his death is a big question mark. But, like, are you serious? Basically, his death is a big question mark. But, like, are you serious? Even to suggest this is a suicide and not to have launched a full-on homicide investigation is baffling.

It's absolutely baffling. But as far as Don Devereaux was concerned, despite whatever the officials were saying, this was an assassination. And to him, it bore all the hallmarks of an agency kill, not a mob hit. And no one who knew Doug either could believe that he had killed himself. His wife Denise was adamant. Doug was the happiest man in the world, according to her. He had just finished school and started a new job. And they had a 10-year-old daughter together. They were happy. They didn't

have any problems. According to her, this is murder. According to Don, this is murder. So after Doug was killed, Don got another call from a journalist at the San Francisco Chronicle who had links to the CIA. And this journalist told Don that the hit for him was still out. So if we assume that this was a hit and the person had made a mistake and killed Doug

rather than Don, they've realized their mistake. So this person is telling him, you better still watch out. And at this point, Don did decide to back off. He says in this interview and in this podcast that he just realized there's nothing I can do. I have a wife. I have kids. I need to watch myself. I need to stop whatever it is I'm doing. But six months later, after Doug died, Don got dragged back in. Because this was when another investigative journalist named Danny Casolaro got in touch with Don. Danny said that he had some information on the murder of Chuck Morgan and that he wanted to share it with Don. So like we said, go back and listen to our episode on Danny Casolaro we go into it in huge amounts of detail

there but to very quickly summarize basically Danny Casolaro had spent a year building a story that he had called the octopus and it involved him digging into some seriously shady characters. So the octopus is a theory that Danny was working on that stretched to the tops of the most powerful institutions and individuals in the world. It linked these people to crimes and scandals like the Inslaw case, Iran Contra and the October surprise. Like I said we go into a bit more detail in our episode on Danny so go check that out. What you need to know here is that Danny whilst working on these incredibly high-profile stories and connections, was claiming to have come across something connected to Chuck Morgan's death.

So this is a man who had been totally consumed by these incredibly high-profile scandals and cases. If Chuck's death was really nothing more than just a normal suicide or a normal mob hit that had taken place in Tucson, Arizona, why would it even have come onto Danny's radar? He had enough on his plate. Honestly, I used to think that being an investigative journalist sounds like a really, really cool job, but now it just sounds really scary. It sounds absolutely terrifying. No, thank you. We'll just do this non-investigative podcast forever.

Well, that's the thing. I think one of the things i like about doing the show is that we do a new one every week so if everyone hates an episode they've just got a week to get over it and then everyone's forgotten if we did an investigative long form podcast and spent six months on it and they put and we put it out and everyone fucking hates it i would literally jump out the window like i don't think i'd be able to cope no or if we spent six months on investigative podcast and then someone killed us because of it. Yeah. Yeah. All that. All that. I couldn't cope with that. Equal. Equitable. So Don and Danny agreed to meet. But before they could, Danny was found dead in a hotel room in Martinsburg, West Virginia, seemingly having killed himself. All the briefcases full of papers that Danny had with him

from his year-long investigation were all mysteriously nowhere to be found. But despite the bizarre circumstances of this incident, Danny Casolaro's death was also, of course, ruled as a suicide. He even told his brother before he left that if anything happens to me, it wasn't an accident or suicide. Who makes an appointment with another investigative journalist, bothers to call them up, does all this?

And this was way back in the past-o times. He didn't just have a laptop with all his information in. He literally had fucking briefcase filing cabinets full of papers that he carried around with him everywhere. Who makes this decision to go meet up with this person, goes to the hotel room? He met up with somebody the day before, had the papers from that, and then he just decides to fucking kill himself and get rid of the briefcases full of papers.

Like, fuck. And unlike Doug Johnson, Danny Casolaro's was officially ruled a suicide. Bullshit. So what we've got then is three men, dead, all seemingly murdered, but all ruled or at least suggested to be suicides. Ruth Morgan died in 2006, never knowing what really happened to Chuck. But his daughters are still working the case and are trying to get it some attention. According to them, they think their father had some potentially damaging information on high power politicians. And that was what got

him killed and like maybe and this is not me saying i think chuck got what he had coming or like deserved it in any way i think he was just a normal guy who got wrapped up in something that he wasn't ready for he was playing a dangerous game with dangerous people and i don't think he knew the rules the minute he stepped out of line, I think they had him taken out and they might have been the government or mobsters or both. We'll never really know what happened to Chuck. Even the stuff that he told Ruth

after his first disappearance, we only have his word for it. Like we said earlier, he said that his government ID had been stolen, that he was a secret agent, but the FBI said they'd never heard of him. They're obviously lying because they were investigating his death at one point and spoke to his attorney, but we have no proof for anything that Chuck says.

And so I think it's very possible that Chuck was doing money laundering work for the mob and that potentially the FBI spotted him in this whole sort of organized crime world and saw him as a weak link. So perhaps they approached him and convinced him to work for them, maybe in order to avoid prosecution. The mob then realized what Chuck's up to by passing information on to the FBI and they kill him. And after it happens, maybe the FBI just walk away as if they knew nothing. And the only reason they turned up at his house, if we assume that those two people who turned up to search Chuck's house were FBI agents, was because they were looking for a document to crack this code or cipher that

he had left them, potentially. And maybe some of you are like, well, would the FBI just walk away and leave it? Wouldn't they sort of like have protected their man a bit more? He was a valuable asset, potentially. Well, I don't know. If you haven haven't yet I would definitely recommend a podcast called My Aryan Princess and it's a really interesting podcast about the real story of a woman who falls in with a gang of white supremacists she is essentially in an abusive relationship with the leader I don't think she's like necessarily ideologically aligned with what they think she just sort of falls in and she's trapped with this man. And she sees them torture and kill people. It's talked about very graphically in this podcast. And then the FBI come knocking and they ask her to help them get the gang. And this lady agrees.

They know just what they have to say to her. The agent who works her, it is really hard not to feel like he manipulates her into helping them. And I know that bringing this gang down is of course a good thing, of course I get that, but it really made me think about the way in which these cases are handled by agencies like the FBI. In My Aryan Princess it really feels like the FBI's greater goal is to just bring this gang down. She's collateral damage. If she can help them, great. If not, whatever. If she gets caught, like, whoops, there's nothing we can really do. And it's really obvious because at the start when they're sort of grooming her, quote unquote, they're all sweet and caring and they can't help her enough. They're always available if she needs them. And this woman is terrified. She knows what this gang is capable

of and she knows what will happen to her if they realize what she's up to and after the fbi get what they want from her they drop her they disappear and she's completely on her own and i wouldn't be surprised at all if that's what happened to chuck no me either so if you go onto reddit and try to dig up some theories on this case like we said there's not that much information out there. We've done our very best to compile everything that made even the smallest iota of sense. And if you go onto Reddit or something,

you'll see people talking about the fact that this could have actually been a suicide, that Chuck could have actually killed himself. We're including this because I don't want to be accused of not looking at this from all angles. But, like like if Chuck staged the whole thing because he knew that he was either going to get caught by the FBI or he was going to get killed by the mob but this way he got to kill himself go out set up a whole stage and

look more interesting to his family that's the theory that people are sort of putting out there on reddit and stuff but like is that how people think? Especially terrified, desperate people? I don't know. Maybe? And when it comes to the whole Ecclesiastes thing, we read and re-read the verses that were referenced. And lots of the people on the internet sit around and ponder the deeper meanings of these lines and how they're related to Chuck. And we even went as far to read up on bible-studies.org to have a look at what those verses refer to. But I actually don't think there's any link between the actual lines and the death of Chuck Morgan in the way people think. Given that Green Eyes called Ruth and cited the chapter and the

verses, but they didn't mean anything to her, suggests to me that it wasn't a personal meaning. Would the mob or the CIA be bothering to mess around with weird Bible-related hits? Probably not. Like people on the internet read the verses and they're like, oh, it's talking about a man in a high place, like a silver cord severing. And they're like, this is what it means. The mob or the CIA killed Chuck. They're not like weird fucking Bible serial killers. Like, I don't think they give a shit about the link of the actual phrases in that verse to chuck yeah i mean they're a government agency they're not fucking dan brown exactly exactly and i think people want this case to be that but it's just not maybe the whole thing is just a

fucking red herring like maybe it's just it's so they've made it so confusing that nobody has any idea what's going on the only thing anyone can sort of kind of come to a conclusion to is this is probably a hit. And organized crime goes all the way to the top of levels of politics, which we all knew anyway. Exactly. So like we said, the Bible verses, I think it's much more likely to be a code or a cipher. And another document is needed to crack it. And perhaps this document was hidden in a Bible at Chuck's house. and Green Eyes had called Ruth in the hope that the first thing she would have done was go and open their family Bible to that page. So maybe it's fitted into the page

Ecclesiastes 12 verses 1 to 8. So by telling her that, the first thing you would do is you would think, go check your Bible. And then there would have been this letter or this document. Ruth never says if she does that or not, but that's the thing that kind of makes the most sense because she's not immediately like, oh my God, yeah, that's Chuck's favourite verse. Now I know that you're telling me the truth, that he's okay or something, you know? Also, it's quite an assumption that she definitely had a Bible in her house.

I don't know. I don't know how many, I suppose in the 70s, I mean, it's likely. It's likely she would have had one. Yeah, 70s in America, most likely. So maybe then those two FBI agents who turned up at the house that day were looking for the Bible because they'd figured this all out. But realistically, we will never, ever, ever know.

And of course, we have the remaining question that I'm sure you're all desperate for the answer for. Well, tough shit, because I don't have it, I'm afraid. But the question is, who was Green Eyes? And why was Doug meeting up with her when he was missing? Again, we'll just never know. But I do wonder why she was helping him or how she was involved. No idea.

Absolutely no idea. It's so similar to Danny Casolaro in that it just, it's kind of like the man who knew too much isn't it and if you would like to go on a little nostalgia binge and check out the related unsolved mysteries episodes we have dug them up for all of you lucky bastards so season three episode nine is on chuck morgan season four episode 25 is on Doug Johnson and season 5 episode 21 is on Danny Casolaro so if you're isolating just go and watch all of Unsolved Mysteries I dare you exactly and you can do so because as we said it's on Amazon Prime go check it out I don't know if that's in the US as well I'm sure you guys will find a way to watch all these they're out there it's a really weird one the thing I would like to end on saying this with is that as of right now don devereaux is still alive i think he's like in his 80s or something

now he must be he's an old man but he survived probably because he backed off when the cia told him to yeah and also because he never got a chance to meet up with danny casolaro who knows what could have happened if he had had that chance to meet him. But apparently Danny killed himself before then. Definitely not. He was fucking murdered. But anyway, also if you are self-isolating, yeah, just take care of yourselves. It's fucking weird times.

Come listen to Under the Duvet. Maybe we can cheer you up a bit. It's a bit of extra content to keep you going because yeah, if this kicks off in the UK as well, it's going to be really fucking boring and weird and sad and scary. So, yeah. Yeah, I went to Sainsbury's on Saturday afternoon. Absolute fucking carnage.

I couldn't believe it. There was just nothing. Nothing. People, stop it. With that, yes, other things you can do is if you would like some more extra sort of bonus content, you can always come over, become a patron of of red handed at patreon.com slash red handed here are some wonderful people who have done so that we are about to talk about other than that you can also

come join us on all the social medias at red handed the pod for some other ways to kill some time i guess if you are interested in extra content we had a really extra extraiting extraiting piece that went out on monday this week which was do you guys remember the episode we did on jenny haynes the lady with 2000 personalities in that episode you will remember that we referred several times to a lady called encina who had done an interview with med circle on youtube well and tina heard our episode which was absolutely terrifying to find out about but she said that we had done a good job and that she would like to sit down and have a conversation with us. So on Monday, if you're a $10 and up patron, you will have noticed we dropped an interview with Encina where we talk about all things DID and crimey.

So go check that out. Other than that, there are so many of you to thank. So here we go. Thank you so much. Molly Woodstrom. Kat. What the crime brie hunter ellis roberts uh jenna lockman nelms jem horton kendall kareen kareen yeah kachor kareen kachor rebecca e jackson jesse radison j Janae Fundersberg,

Holly Dumper. Holly, you tweeted at us and you were like, I can't wait for Red Handed to say my name because I hope they find my surname as funny as I should. It's pretty funny. It's pretty good. It's a great name, Holly. Brandon Heavy,

Anastasia, Sally Halderson, Amelia Rittenour, Jack Remington, Lauren Walls, Laura Hancock, Sweetheart, Hoda Mamoud, Thank you. Nina Rowley, Emily Kalina, Laura Mills, Anne Slavin-Lamvik, Bryony Rule, Jasmine Martins, Jaco Loughlin, Olivia Allender, Sonia Singh, Karis Merriman, Amy Smith, and then I think Hannah's going to have to do... Gillian, I was just quietly sitting here hoping that you would just do all of them. Gillian Logan, Caitlin Gerringer, Jen Kay, Jewelry...

Nope, not even can't, sorry. Olivia Ashley-Rose Spencer, Meg Stein, Erin W, Megan Ramberger, Brittany Odom, Cassie Lee, Piaget... Paige? Oh, maybe. Kazor Dawson Franka Joanna Alan Alison Fisher Renee Dembowski Ailish Harris Oh

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Jessica Hawius. Jackie. Just Kate Fisher. What did I say? You've lost it. Katie. Oh, sorry, Kate. Jackie McF Kate Fisher. What did I say? You've lost it. Katie. Oh, sorry, Kate. Jackie McFarlane, Tessa, Jessica Terry, Lauren Heather, Michael Sun, Annette Blackwell, Kat,

Fran Haygarth, Claire Kelly, Francis Eldrick Doe, Josie Cannon, Becky Economono. I am ashamed. Thank you guys so much. It honestly means the absolute world to us. So thanks for your love and money. We appreciate it. And we'll see you next week when we're doing something else. And if not, we will, I mean, no, you will listen to us next week.

But also you can come on right over now to patreon.com and have a listen to Under the Duvet. Goodbye. Bye. You don't believe in ghosts? I get it. Lots of people don't. I didn't either, until I came face to face with them. Ever since that moment, hauntings, spirits, and the unexplained have consumed my entire life. I'm Nadine Bailey. I've been a ghost tour guide for the past 20 years. I've taken people along with me into the shadows, uncovering the macabre tales that linger in the darkness. And inside some of the most haunted houses, hospitals, prisons, and more. Join me every week on my podcast, Haunted Canada, as we journey through terrifying and bone-chilling stories of the unexplained.

Search for Haunted Canada on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts. I'm Jake Warren, and in our first season of Finding, I set out on a very personal quest to find the woman who saved my mum's life. You can listen to Finding Natasha right now exclusively on Wondery Plus. In season two, I found myself caught up in a new journey to help someone I've never even met. But a couple of years ago, I came across a social media post by a person named Loti. It read in part, Three years ago today that I attempted to jump off this bridge, but this wasn't my time to go. A gentleman named Andy saved my life. I still haven't found him.

This is a story that I came across purely by chance, but it instantly moved me and it's taken me to a place where I've had to consider some deeper issues around mental health. This is season two of Finding, and this time,

if all goes to plan, we'll be finding Andy. You can listen to Finding Andy and Finding Natasha exclusively and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.