RedHanded - Episode 189 - Castration, Cults and Cauterisation: The Ant Hill Kids

Episode Date: March 18, 2021

As the secret project deadline hangs ominously over us, we have dug up an absolute stonker from the Patreon vaults to keep you all going!  In the early 1980s, in a small hamlet in Central Ontario, there was a cult leader with a messiah complex so big he thought he could operate as a surgeon on the living and use his genitals to bring back the dead. Roch Thériault held a vice-like grip over his loyal followers, so tight that they would abandon their children to his surgical madness, and so firm they would abandon their partners for his harem. He called them The Ant Hill Kids, and with him, life was a living hell. Brand new MERCH out now: redhandedshop.com  Check out our Patreon: patreon.com/redhanded   See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Red Handed early and ad-free. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made. A seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. What's happening, lads?

A bit of a different spin on it this week. The Secret Project deadline looms ominously and we didn't want to give you a shitty episode this week because we've been so, so busy with The Secret Project. So what we thought it would be better to do is go through our bonus episode archives and give you one of those for a while this one is actually one of my favorites do you all remember when we recorded under duvets well this is from the duvet times saru is actually recording it in a hotel in Texas, which feels like a million years ago,

but wasn't that long ago at all. So here you are. Here is our upcycled Patreon bonus episode for this week. And we are going to be back next week with an absolutely bumper, bumper episode for you.

And everything will go back to normal so please enjoy the anthill kids I'm Hannah. I'm Saruti. And welcome to our second monthly bonus episode for all of you very generous Patreons. We love you, so we're giving you some more stuff that you like and pay for. our second monthly bonus episode for all of you very generous Patreons. We love you, so we're giving you some more stuff that you like and pay for, I suppose, is the basis of this.

That's the general agreement that we've got. You give us some money and we give you some content. Good. It's nice and simple and that's how we like it. And yeah, I think you're going to really fucking love today's episode because we know why you're all here and it's fucking horrible today speaking of horrible today if I sound a little bit weird it isn't because we have regressed massively in the audio world it is because I'm in a hotel room in Austin for work and I'm recording under a massive fucking duvet and just to prove how much we love you, I've turned the air conditioning off. So there you go.

Yeah, I imagine Texas in May isn't the most like temperate of temperatures. I'm in my own little personal hell here. So we've got a cult for you, which is an absolute stonker. And it's one of those ones that I've sort of always known about, but didn't have an actual clue

of what was actually happening with it. I just vaguely knew that someone somewhere in Canada was running a cult where people smashed their own legs with sledgehammers. But it's actually turns out quite a bit worse than that. And I'm amazed that there isn't more coverage on it. But I think that is partly because this story all happens in French speaking areas of Canada. So maybe there isn't much stuff on it in English. And I also read that there was some sort of like press embargo on it, like that no one was allowed to write about it until like a set number of years. But I don't know what those specific years are. So I don't know whether that has anything to do with that or not. Don't quote me on it.

But it was an interesting thing I read. Regardless, it's a fucking fascinating case. And I'm blown away there isn't more coverage of it also quick disclaimer we have another canada coming up on the general release on thursday this week if you're listening on the day of release and we didn't plan that that's just uh sometimes it just happens by accident and like every cult we've ever seen in this episode we have a very intelligent leader who thinks they are smarter than everyone else from a religious background that they think they know better than. Our man today is Rock Theriot. He was born in 1947 and grew up in a town called Thetford Mines, which was an asbestos mining town just over 142 miles northeast of Montreal.

Asbestos mining town, that sounds fucking horrible. Sounds pretty grim, doesn't it? And we assume that they're no longer mining asbestos there anymore. You would hope. One would hope. Yeah, I mean, I don't think anyone wants it anymore. Do they? No, no, no. But we used to have, when I worked at the theatre,

we used to have asbestos surveys all the time. I think you're allowed to keep it in the building as long as you wall it up. Yeah. And I think extracting it from the walls is actually really expensive because I think building in the 60s, 70s, everything was just fucking full of asbestos. Yeah, because it's so fire resistant. It's great, but it just also... Gives you cancer.

Massively increases the risk of you getting cancer. So yeah, that's fun. Theriot was smart he was even described by a psychiatrist as quote a renaissance man with a bright inquisitive and sensitive disposition intelligence wise he was head and shoulders above his peers and he knew it theriot's home life he claimed was not good his parents were incredibly strict and they were super Catholic. The family were part of a group called the White Berets, which is a Canadian

evangelical wing of the Roman Catholic Church who put on white berets and walked around knocking on people's doors trying to convert them to Catholicism, which is really surprising because it's generally not really the Catholic Church's vibe. No, not much door knocking, really.

No, but maybe things are different in Canada. We don't know. If you know anything about the White Berets, let us know. Have they ever knocked on your door? I'd like to know. Now, the White Berets think that the Catholic Church, get this, is too liberal. Yeah.

So make of that whatever you will. I think that tells you exactly the kind of vibe we're dealing with. Yes. Now, the white beret evangelical door knocking wasn't the only thing that was a bit off about the Theriot family. According to Leon Vachon, I don't know, you have got French, Juchesse. How do you think I say that? Vachon.

Vachon. Leon Vachon, who used to live next door to the Theriot family when Rock Theriot was just a kid. Apparently, Daddy Theriot would play a game with Rock and his two other sons called Bone. I mean, that's just the worst thing I've ever heard. Yep. And it's just as ominous as it sounds. Basically, they'd all sit at the kitchen table with really heavy boots on and kick each other in the shins until one of them gave up. I think this is going to blow your mind. I hope you really, you don't already know about this. There is a tradition in some parts of the UK of shin kicking competitions. And one of Johnny Vegas's uncle is a champion shin kicker.

And what it is, is like men wear heavy boots that are steel capped on the outside and some of them have spikes on wow and then they just kick each other in the shins until one of them says sufficient that's what it means he's had enough and then that's it and the other person wins and that still goes on there's championships it's like an official sport wow we are a strange nation yeah i don't know what to say to that i assume there's quite a lot of beer involved in that or no is Is it an official thing? I don't know whether it's like darts where like it used to be okay to drink beer and now it's not. Like I don't know. Because it's a real sport. There was a sketch show I think in

like the late 80s or early 90s where they made a joke out of darts players just drinking beer all the time and then since then they made it illegal to drink during the sport because they thought people were taking the piss out of them. Oh, you knew they were so sensitive about these things. I know, I know. Right, where were we? Shin kicking. So this very violent game made Theriot quite a violent man and he carried on being a violent man for the rest of his days.

But he got a little bit more internal organy as he got older. Theriot was very very successful with the ladies. Not a great looking guy if you can look up a picture of him but I think if you're into the Jesus vibe then maybe but I am not so I don't I just don't get it I think even for you his beard is a bit too much. So people who knew him growing up said that he was very charismatic and he could charm the pants off absolutely anyone. And in 1967, at 21, he married 17-year-old Francine Grenier and they had two kids together. Unsurprisingly, Rock was totally unable to work for anyone else because he thought he was better than literally everyone. So Rock started

selling wood carvings to support his family. So then a few years after this, Rock actually developed stomach ulcers and a series of operations led him to develop dumping syndrome. The symptoms of which include a feeling of fullness even after just a small amount, abdominal cramping or pain, nausea or vomiting, severe diarrhea, sweating, flushing or lightheadedness and a rapid heartbeat. This syndrome caused Rock a lot of pain and to deal with this pain, he started to drink very, very heavily and soon enough, that heavy drinking turned into a full-on alcohol addiction. Despite all of this going on with his health life, he had time to have an affair with a lady called Giselle, and he and Francine divorced in 1976. By the mid-70s,

Rock had had enough of the Catholics and moved on to the Seventh-day Adventists. Now, the Seventh-day Adventists observe the Sabbath on Saturdays, and they can't work on the Sabbath. They also don't smoke, they don't eat meat and crucially they don't drink. Spoilers, Rock Theriot doesn't last long with the Seventh-day Adventists. But he did start wearing a monk's habit which I thought was very unusual. That's the sign that if you're not a monk and you start walking around in monk's clothes maybe something is not all right up top. That's the sign. I think that's a fairly clear marker and this happens around the mid 70s and this is where we see him get more erratic he started to tell his friends that he was having visions of the world ending he also told a fair

few people that he had the power to heal sick people and talk to animals he tells this story about how he goes into the wilderness and then this like mummy bear like treated him like a baby and like through that he like became like fucking monk Dr. Doolittle. I don't know. Like it's madness. Oh my god. And he also claimed that he could castrate cattle and pigs without any blood being spilt. He really does sound like he's got like messiah syndrome. Messiah complex. Oh that's exactly what's wrong with him. I mean, I also, I've been reading and I've been looking into castration for this episode. I believe that you can castrate a pig or a sheep by putting an elastic band around its balls when it's little. And then they just sort of drop off like an umbilical cord. Like I think it's possible.

But that's not what he means, I don't think. I think he means he can chop them off. Or who knows what he means. Yeah, I mean, he does do some rubber band balling later on, so maybe. Maybe. And he read medical textbooks cover to cover. Classic. He thinks he can just like become a doctor by reading medical textbooks.

Yeah, I think he's like, oh, doctors have fucked me up with my dumping syndrome. So I'm going to prove that I know better than literally every doctor. Yeah. And yeah, like Hannah said, he was just convinced that he knew better than any doctor because he'd been reading these medical textbooks. And in 1977 he got kicked out of the Seventh Day Adventists for drinking and he moved 27 miles away from his hometown to St. Marie de Bois where he opened a homeopathic clinic that ran seminars on how to stop smoking. Before long, he fell in with an organic food and alternative medicine collective, one of which was his old flame,

Giselle Lafrance, who he eventually married. He collected other followers as well, who all within months of meeting him, quit their jobs, turned over all their worldly possessions, and moved into Theriot's house. By 1978, there were four men, nine women, and four kids living in the Theriot abode. So Rock came up with a plan. All of them would move together to an even more remote area of the Gaspé Peninsula and live, you guessed it, on a commune. I'm always so amazed by like how empty people must be feeling to like meet someone and be like, yeah, this is it, whatever you want. Take my stuff, take my children, take my wife.

I'll come and live in your house and like clean your floors for the rest of my life because you are giving me this much. like I'm always completely blown away by it it was also around this time that Rock Theriot decided that he was God's agent on earth and he gave each one of his followers a biblical name classic and he kept his followers on their toes by telling him that the world was going to end literally any day now in a shower of hailstones as big as boulders and the only way he and his harem could avoid this was obviously for them to do everything that he told them to do. He convinced his followers that they would be saved from Armageddon if they moved out into the wilderness and reconnected

with nature. He warned them that the road to salvation would be paved with suffering. But that was the will of God. That sounds pretty familiar to quite a lot of churches i know to be honest i'm always baffled by the idea of like oh god's testing you that's why everything's shit and you hate your life anyway not for me to decide i think this guy like he sounds like a cross of have you watched the buddha field not yet no oh my god it's so good it's such a well-made documentary it's called holy hell if you haven't seen it's so good. It's such a well-made documentary. It's called Holy Hell, if you haven't seen it, it's on Netflix. So Michael, the guy who was the leader of the Buddha field, and I think he's a cross between him and Geoffrey Lundgren

from the Mormon cult episode that we did a while ago. Times on the commune were all right for a while. Everyone lived together and sold handmade crafty things and cakes to get by, and they also lived off the land. Theriot named his disciples the Ant Hill Kids because they were all so busy working together. Then things started to get properly culty when one by one all of the nine women who had come to the commune all became Theriot's wives and he kept them all almost constantly pregnant. He's a super sperma before this guy fucking just knocks out

kids left, right and centre. Over the 11 years that the Ant Hill kids lived together, things would get really horrendous and it all happens in a very classically culty way. Rock Theriot kept all of his followers chronically undernourished and sleep deprived this made it much easier to bend them to his every whim there's a documentary where they interview one of the ladies who lived there and she was like you know the idea was that we all just farmed the land and connected with nature and blah blah but like what that meant was that we were starving all the time it's classic cult behavior though isn't it like that's why in those cults they feed them like gruel. They totally cut out any sort of protein intake. That's it, yeah.

It completely depletes people's cognitive abilities. It makes you just like mush that somebody can manipulate. And also, Theriot walked around wearing red velour robes and a literal crown all around the place and he called himself the king of the Israelites. Of course he did. And due to their malnourished state, the anthill kids totally relied on Theriot's erratic leadership. He would force children to hit their own mothers in front of the whole group. No one was allowed to contact their families. And there are also quite a lot of orgies.

And Theriot claimed that he drew a lot of his inspiration from Alex Joseph who led a polygamous commune in Bigwater, which is in Utah. Rock Theriot visited that commune several times in the 80s. God knows how he was paying international airfare on dreamcatcher money. Like how has he done that several times even? From Canada to Utah is so far. I know, but then it was like, he made all those people that joined his cult give him all their money, and they just live on a shitty commune, so I'm guessing

he's got all that squirreled away for his effort. Now, things started to get really bad in 1981, when the Ant Hill kids took in a man called Guy Veer, who was extremely mentally unwell. So, get this. The Ontario Liberals elected Bonnie Crombie as their new leader. Bonnie who? I just sent you her profile. Check out her place in the Hamptons. Huh, fancy.

She's a big carbon tax supporter, yeah? Oh yeah. Check out her record as mayor. Oh, get out of here. She even increased taxes in this economy. Yeah, higher taxes, carbon taxes. She sounds expensive. Bonnie Crombie and the Ontario Liberals. They just don't get it. That'll cost you.

A message from the Ontario PC Party. You don't believe in ghosts? I get it. Lots of people don't. I didn't either, until I came face to face with them. Ever since that moment, hauntings, spirits, and the unexplained have consumed my entire life. I'm Nadine Bailey. I've been a ghost tour guide for the past 20 years. I've taken people along with me into the shadows, uncovering the macabre tales that linger in the darkness. And inside some of the most haunted houses,

hospitals, prisons, and more. Join me every week on my podcast, Haunted Canada, as we journey through terrifying and bone-chilling stories of the unexplained. Search for Haunted Canada on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts. I'm Jake Warren, and in our first season of Finding, I set out on a very personal quest to find the woman who saved my mum's life.

You can listen to Finding Natasha right now exclusively on Wondery Plus. In season two, I found myself caught up in a new journey to help someone I've never even met. But a couple of years ago, I came across a social media post by a person named Loti. It read in part, Three years ago today that I attempted to jump off this bridge, but this wasn't my time to go. A gentleman named Andy saved my life. I still haven't found him.

This is a story that I came across purely by chance, but it instantly moved me, and it's taken me to a place where I've had to consider some deeper issues around mental health. This is season two of Finding, and this time, if all goes to plan, we'll be finding Andy. You can listen to Finding Andy and Finding Natasha exclusively and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. He had actually wandered onto the commune after escaping from Quebec City Mental Hospital.

The day after he was welcomed into the cult, he beat a two-year-old boy called Samuel within an inch of his life, just because the little boy was crying. And Samuel was in a really bad way, and his mum noticed that he hadn't been passing any urine. So Rock Theriot reminded everyone that he was a healer and decided that he would operate upon and subsequently cure

this toddler who had been beaten by an adult man and that is just the most horrifying thing you hear step aside i will operate on him yeah so what happened next oh oh no definitely no eating guys sorry it's just gonna get really bad from here on out, so put the sandwich down. Like, seriously, seriously bad. Because what happened next was basically an un-anesthetized circumcision of Samuel, and it didn't heal him at all. Because Samuel died just a few days later. Theriot, of course, decided that this was all Veer's fault, and he tried him for the murder in his own kangaroo court.

Theriot ruled that Vere was not guilty of the murder of Samuel by reason of insanity but it didn't mean that Vere would go unpunished. Theriot decided that Vere would be castrated for his role in little Samuel's death and that is exactly what Theriot did. But chopping the balls off a mentally ill man would be the first thing that got him in trouble with the police. The Quebec police heard about the little boy's death and Theriot's followers tried to convince the police that the child had been trampled to death by a horse, but it didn't work. The police raided the commune and arrested seven of the anthill kids. They were all convicted of crimes related to Samuel's death and the castration of Veer.

Theriot pleaded guilty and served 18 months inside for criminal negligence. How he didn't get a mutilation charge, I have no idea. By June 1983, Theriot was out of prison and right back to his old cult charismatic leader ways. He moved his community to Burnt River, Ontario for an even more rural shot at total isolation. The child welfare authorities started to watch them even more closely. In January 1985, yet another child died on Theriot's watch. The coroner ruled this to be sudden infant death syndrome, but we don't actually know. In December of the same year, the commune was raided again by ten social workers and six police officers and all 14 children were taken from their mothers and placed in foster homes.

Some of the children gave detailed accounts to their new foster parents of the sexual abuse that Theriot would force them to take part in. Theriot had nine wives by this stage and they popped out nine more of his children between 86 and 88. All of them were taken by child services just days after their births. With the children gone, things got even more depraved at Ant Hill Kid HQ. This is all from Gabrielle who we meet a bit later. She gives quite a detailed account in interviews and she also wrote a book about it. Theriot would take two of his wives to bed at once and hold competitions to see which one would have the most orgasms. He also held gladiator matches between his followers. He would draw a square in the dirt on the ground and make them fight each other naked. They would gain a point

for landing a punch and lose one for stepping outside of the square. These battles would go on for three minutes. Then the winner would have to fight someone else. And these tournaments could go on for hours. Claude Ouellette was one of the original four men who moved onto the commune back in the 70s. Theriot nicked his wife, Gabrielle Lalavie, very early on. But Claude remained an anthill kid. But he was told by the king of the Israelites that he had to be a celibate member of the group.

Not only am I going to nick your wife, you can't have a new one. It's just everything about this is just total control, total ego. Like, it's just so cliche. He's such a cliche of a cult leader. Now, obviously, Theria was the Abraham of the group, and all the other men just had to deal with it. Later on, Theriot would make sure Ouellette would never threaten his manhood by placing a rubber band over his testicles.

Claude's scrotum swelled to the size of an orange. Eventually, one of Claude's testicles got infected. So Theriot, drunk off his tits, naturally, decided that he would cure Claude of his bull trouble. So, he does this. And then he's like, I'll fix you. Yep. Like,

the hero complex in this is unbelievable. Now, Theriot made an incision in Claude's scrotum and pulled out one of his testicles. Then he cauterized the incision with a piece of hot iron. I don't have testicles, but even I am like folding in on myself as I read that. And amazingly, Claude lived to tell the tale. Theriot's next patient, though, would not be so lucky. On the 28th of September, 1988, Theriot had been drinking all day and giving his devoted followers all kinds of grief.

But in the afternoon, he calmed down and asked if anyone needed any medical treatment. And honestly, this is... This is the worst bit, for for me of this whole case. Yeah, it's pretty bad. But I'm just amazed at the willingness. Yeah. He's fucking drunk off his tits. And then he's like, does anyone need any medical treatments?

Because I'm feeling in the mood for an operation. Yeah, that's literally it. It's like such a game to him. He's just like a kid that's like, oh, let me have a go at this. Let me put my hands in here and see what happens. Nothing good happens. Because 32-year-old Solange Bolliard told her master that she was having some stomach trouble. So in one of the commune's log cabins, Theriot tied her up to a wooden table. He punched Solange in the stomach

and shoved a plastic tube up her anus. He then attempted to give her an enema using molasses and olive oil. Oh my God. Am I wrong? But isn't molasses quite sticky? Like, surely the point of an enema is to get everything out of there. Like, I don't know if that's going to do the trick. Molasses is like, is treacle. Yeah. So next, he opened up her abdomen with a kitchen knife

and ripped off a piece of her intestines with his bare hands. Then Gabrielle Lalavie was ordered to take a needle and thread and sew up her fellow wife. Just a day later, Solange died in total agony as her digestive acid poured into her abdominal cavity. She was just 32. The anthill kids buried her body on their land, but quickly they were ordered to dig her up again,

so that Theriot could take one of her ribs to wear in a pouch around his neck. And so, also, that he could saw the top of her skull off and ejaculate onto her brain. Yeah, he literally is like, oh, this will bring her back to life. I just need to, like, wank on her brain. Yeah. I'm the ultimate life giver, me and my penis. I can kill this woman, bury her, then chop off the top of her head and ejaculate onto her brain and she'll come back to life. And I honestly think that's just about the worst sentence I've had to say in a very long time. I think it's worse than scrap metal sex toys, personally. The only thing that comes close to being as bad or like competes for that top space is the Ripper crew of Chicago bits.

Yeah, that's true. Now, Theria also took her uterus and then Solange's body was cremated. And the police had no idea that this had happened. The Ant Hill kids were so isolated by the stage that literally no one else did either. Almost a year later, in July 1989, it was Gabrielle Lalavie's turn on the operating table. She had a toothache, so Theriot pulled eight of her teeth out. And then to cure a stiffness in one of Gabrielle's fingers, Theriot cut off her right arm with a meat cleaver. Days later, Gabrielle's wound was cauterized by other members of the cult. I can't get my head around that, like, they all watched him kill Solange. Yeah. And then watched him dig her up, saw the top of her head off and fucking cum on her brain.

And they're still like, actually, my teeth hurt a bit. I would keep my mouth firmly shut. I mean, I know it's sometimes quite hard to get a dentist appointment, but yeah. In rural Ontario. Jesus. But that was enough for Gabrielle. And she actually is kind of the hero of this story because she is the first one to be like, fuck this, I'm out. She left the car and hitchhiked all her way to Toronto, where she told her story to the police. And on the 6th of October 1989, the police finally caught up with Theriault after a six-week-long manhunt. Just four days later, he pled guilty to his attacks on Gabrielle Lavallee and was sentenced to 12 years. And that was later reduced to just 10 through the appeals process. But it wasn't over. While Theriault was serving his sentence for the

mutilation of Gabrielle, another anthill kid came forward and told the police all about what had happened to Solange the year before. On the 24th of October 1989, Theriot was charged with the murder of Solange Bolliard. He pled guilty and was sentenced to life in prison. He would be up for parole in the year 2000. And during his trial, even more gruesome details of the anthill life came to light. It seemed that almost no one who lived there was not maimed by their deranged leader. The cult leader had burned women with a welding torch, put vice-like grips on their nipples and cut off fingers with a wire cutter. Members were forced to break their own legs with sledgehammers

and children were nailed to trees. Gabrielle is still living in Canada and received compensation from the state on a monthly basis. She has written a book about her experience with the Ant Hill Kids, which translated to English is called The Sheep Alliance. I thought it was pretty clever. Yeah, me too. Some of the ex-cult members are trying to access their children again, but it doesn't look hopeful. That is not the case for some others. Francine Laflame remains loyal to her cult leader husband. Her and two other cult wives live together

and run a bakery together just over a mile from their commune. Francine is Theriot's only legal wife, so she was able to visit her husband in prison and even take part in conjugal visits. These visits have led to yet another baby that the state has taken away from her, but she doesn't seem to care. And she's given interviews about this as well. And she's like, I genuinely would rather be with him than with my children. It's like, even from inside prison, he maintains this absolute control and clearly over two others as well. I could understand possibly from a certain perspective that if you've done communal living for 11 years, it probably would be quite hard to go and live on your own.

Like that would be quite a hard adjustment. But I think that I think it's also because of his sort of coercive control, even from behind bars. And she also told the press that, quote, most of the time he was not drinking and performing his operations. He was a marvellous man who was full of passion, intelligence and originality. He loved to laugh and dance. Yeah, I'm going to say if even like 1% of your living situation involves drunk, un-anesthetised operations, it's not good enough. No, exactly. Like, please cut my limbs off and touch my insides with your bare fucking hands as long as you know how to waltz and maybe the Charleston. Like, I just, I don't, no, I'm sorry. It's not acceptable. So Theriot was being housed in a maximum security

institution and repeatedly placed in protective custody because of the death threats he received from other inmates. In 2011, this protective custody stopped working and Rock Theriault was shanked in the neck by his cellmate and convicted murderer Matthew MacDonald. After the attack, MacDonald calmly walked to the guard station and said, quote, that piece of shit is down on the range. Here's the knife. I've sliced him up. And then he's like, take me down. I'm already in here for life. Yeah, fuck it. Exactly it exactly exactly and Theriot is the kind of man that was probably trying in prison to recreate a mini cult so that he could feed his ego on the outside world he just had access to more people who he could profile better and pick here he's you know got limited supply so

maybe you know he just tries his games on the wrong person. And like I said, I'm not obviously like celebrating a man being stabbed to death in prison, but he picked the wrong guy. And McDonald's like, fuck you, shrinks him in the neck. I've had enough. Game over. So yeah, that is the story of the Anhill Kids and Rock Theriot. Thanks for listening, guys. We hope you haven't been too sick. And we hope you listened and didn't eat because that was pretty bad, I think. Yeah, I should have put that at the beginning, so I was... We'll stick it in the copy. Cool.

So, yeah, we'll be back for you guys, especially in particular, next month on the first Monday with a whole new extra bonus Patreon episode. And we'll see you on Wednesday for the normal one, which is also in Canada, and also pretty bad. So, yeah, aren't you lucky? All right. Bye, guys. Bye. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery Show American Scandal. We bring to life some of the biggest controversies in U.S. history. Presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud.

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