RedHanded - Episode 78 - Ariel Castro & The Horror at 2207 Seymour Avenue

Episode Date: January 17, 2019

Between 2002 and 2004 Ariel Castro abducted three young women and chained them up in his basement at 2207 Seymour Avenue. Over the course of the next decade he systematically broke them down, tortured them, raped them, brutalised them - until finally, and miraculously they escaped. This week we cover the case of Ariel Castro and the three remarkable women who survived an unbelievable ordeal; Michelle Knight, Amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus.   See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Red Handed early and ad-free. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Get ready for Las Vegas-style action at BetMGM, the king of online casinos. Enjoy casino games at your fingertips with the same Vegas strip excitement MGM is famous for when you play classics like MGM Grand Millions or popular games like Blackjack, Baccarat and Roulette. With our ever-growing library of digital slot games, a large selection of online table games and signature BetMGM service, there's no better way to bring the excitement and ambiance of Las Vegas home to you than with BetMGM Casino. Download the BetMGM Casino app today.

BetMGM and GameSense remind you to play responsibly. BetMGM.com for terms and conditions. 19 plus to wager. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have any questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact ConnexOntario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor. Free of charge.

BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made. A seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hannah. I'm Saruti. And welcome to Red Handed. On the 6th of May, 2013, Aurora Matti was sitting on her front porch on Seymour Avenue in Cleveland, Ohio. There was nothing unusual about that day until 5.45pm when Aurora, looking across the street to 2207 Seymour Avenue,

the house opposite, saw an arm poking out from behind a storm door. 2207 was quite a big house. It had two floors, four bedrooms, one bathroom, a basement and a backyard, but only one person lived there. As Aurora looked closer, she realised the arm was waving and she started to hear the person who the arm was attached to shouting for help. Aurora's neighbours, Charles Ramsey and Angelo Cordero, also heard the cries. They thought this had to be some sort of domestic violence situation or possibly a robbery gone wrong. They approached the door and kicked a hole in it so the woman on the other side could climb through. This woman had a small child with her. Both of them made it out through the door.

She told Charles Ramsey that they needed to call 911. Her name was Amanda Berry, and she'd been missing for 10 years. In interviews with the press later that day, Charles Ramsey uttered the immortal words that made him an internet legend. I knew something was wrong when a little pretty white girl ran into a black man's arms. Something is wrong here. Dead giveaway. Dead giveaway. Charles, thank you very much.

Dead giveaway. You know he's written a book called Dead Giveaway. And the full title is Dead Giveaway, The Rescue, Hamburgers, White Folks and Instant Celebrity. What you saw on TV doesn't even begin to tell the story. There's a big controversy between him and Angelo of who actually broke down the door. Because he says that Angelo just saw the arm waving and then ran off and and now that Charles Ramsay's really famous Angelo's come out being like no it was me I know there's a lot of people as well the neighbors being like oh he didn't do anything

blah blah blah but it is um the book actually I obviously haven't read the book but I watched uh I read an interview with him about it it was like called five years on from the rescue or whatever and I was like what has this guy written The Rescue or whatever. And I was like, what is this guy written a book about? But actually his life after this case happened is really interesting because as the name suggests with Instant Celebrity, he became so, so, so famous because of what happened and that interview. And, you know, he just became like this viral meme sensation. And it seems like it kind of ruined his life, that Instant Celebrity-dom. Oh, really? So I know he like went

into work a couple of days later and was like do I still have my job and they were like yeah yeah don't worry about it. No it's really interesting they were saying like he couldn't hold down a job because people kept wanting to talk to him. I don't know how much of that is true but there was also a reason because I was like why has it got hamburgers in the title because he like plugs McDonald's in that very first interview that they do with him. So McDonald's were like, we'll give you free hamburgers for a year. But he says in this interview that he gave those out to all the homeless people he knew. So McDonald's realised what was happening and stopped giving him any more vouchers. I have never done a case where

McDonald's crops up so much. It like it comes up about four times. It's like I'm so hungover. This is such a stomach churning case. It's like I'm so hungover. This is such a stomach churning case. It's like I'm doing everything I can to put off talking about how gross and horrible the story is. But don't worry. Unlike I did last night in my Uber, if I need to vomit, I will get out from under the duvet fort to do it. Yeah, quite the night. So how did Amanda Berry end up behind a padlock storm door 10 years after she disappeared? And to answer this question, we have to, as always, start at the beginning. But the thing is, this story doesn't start with Amanda Berry.

It doesn't even start 10 years before. The story starts with a young woman called Michelle Knight. Michelle had it tough growing up. Her family were poverty stricken. And for large parts of her childhood, her family even lived out of a car. Michelle was born on the 13th of April 1981. She had two younger twin brothers called Eddie and Freddie and Michelle, as the oldest kid, took care of them all a lot of the time. Michelle and her siblings weren't able to shower or even brush their teeth every day.

So when they could, it was a big deal. Given this, Michelle was mercilessly bullied at school for her out-of-date clothes and for smelling bad. But as if the bullying and the neglect wasn't bad enough, it wasn't even the worst of it. Michelle was sexually abused for years by a man she only refers to as a male family member. We know that it wasn't her father, so maybe an uncle? My bet's uncle. Yeah. And this man, whoever he was, raped her and threatened her life for years. Michelle was completely trapped. Until one day when she was 15, Michelle slipped two sleeping pills into the man's drink, waited for him to pass out,

and escaped through the bathroom window of the house she was living in at the time. Michelle had broken out, but she was 15 and had absolutely nowhere to go. But she thought anything would be better than staying where she was. So with very limited options, Michelle started to live in a bin under an overpass. And as far as I can tell, this was one of those round metal bins like you see on TV, or presumably the ones that are common in the States. But fucking hell, they don't look big. Like, how do you... She's very short. She's four foot seven. Oh, yeah, no. Yeah, I did know that. Michelle even stole a baseball bat from a nearby back garden to defend herself,

because I assume living under an overpass in a bin isn't the most wholesome place to spend your childhood. And during this time under the overpass, Michelle heard about a church that served a meal every weekday. So she started to go there just to get fed. Then she came across a man who called himself Sniper, who told Michelle that she could come and live with him, have access to money, a bed and a shower, if she became his drug runner. Michelle, tired of living in a bin, accepted the offer. I think I probably would too. Yeah, I mean, you'll go on to see, but Michelle's entire life is just a story of

sheer desperation. She just goes from one shit situation into another shit situation into another one. I know there are three girls in this story, but my heart is completely broken for Michelle. Sniper lived with another man called Roderick, who Michelle became instantly close to. And we should say here that apart from asking Michelle to move reasonable amounts of illegal drugs around, nothing untoward happened to Michelle at the hands of Sniper or Roderick. She liked them. She had a roof over her head and it was a million times better than the overpass bin. And even though Michelle wasn't a very good drug runner, Sniper and Roderick seemed to look out for her. Until their house was raided by the police.

Roderick and Michelle made it out, but Sniper was not so lucky. With their safe haven gone, both Michelle and Roderick ended up back under the overpass, living in bins. Within five days of returning to the overpass, though, Michelle was recognised by a neighbour of her father's. Michelle's dad went down to the overpass and took Michelle back to his house, and it was here that the abusive male relative showed up and whispered in Michelle's ear, you really thought you could get away from me? Now back with her family, Michelle had to go back to school. Things at school didn't get better for her from how they had been before. And Michelle even says in later interviews that when she was forced to go back to school at this point, she was assaulted. We don't know what that means, but we can assume that the bullying was very,

very physical and very intense. When she was 17, Michelle started dating a boy and fell pregnant and dropped out of school. According to Michelle, after she found out she was pregnant, she discovered that her boyfriend was also seeing someone else. When forced to choose between the two young women, the father of Michelle's baby dumped her. Michelle's baby was born on the 24th of October 1999. She called her son Joey. By the time Michelle was 21, Joey had been taken into custody by the Children's Authority because Michelle's mum's boyfriend Carlos had got drunk and broken Joey's leg. Joey was adopted by a caring family and Michelle was left with her abuser. Michelle moved out of that house as quickly as she could.

She moved in with her cousin Lisa who was about 10 years older than her. Lisa told Michelle not to worry, they were going to get her away from her abuser, they were going to get her sorted out, and above all, they were going to get Joey back. Lisa introduced Michelle to one of her friends called Emily Castro. They hung out a little bit, but not loads. I think it's if they saw each other in the supermarket, they would probably say hi, but not much more than that, I think. During this time, if Michelle wanted any contact with her son, she needed to show up to multiple scheduled visitations. And these are all over the place. They're not in the same place every time. On the 22nd of August, 2002, Michelle had to get to one of these meetings.

But she was in trouble. She didn't know where the building was. She didn't have a car and nobody she came across seemed to know where this building was either. Michelle knew that she could not miss this meeting and she was getting desperate. So she went into a dollar store to ask for directions. In the queue behind her was Emily Castro's dad, Ariel Castro. Michelle sort of knew him. Ariel asked Michelle if she knew where the bank was. She did, so she told him where he could find it. And then, Ariel offered to return the favour, and help Michelle find the building she was looking for. Michelle got in Ariel Castro's car on the corner of Lorraine Avenue and 106th Street in Cleveland, and Michelle Knight disappeared. Michelle's family, perhaps unsurprisingly, just thought that Michelle was out and about visiting people. According to her grandma, Deborah, when they called the police,

they were told that nothing could be done until Michelle had been gone for 48 hours. You hear this all the time. I know. That kind of, they have to be missing for 24 hours, for 48 hours. Is that still a thing? I don't know. I really want to look into it quite significantly because it seems so strange when those hours are so important. Maybe now it's that's not the rule if they're children or if they're young. Maybe. I think possibly the logic behind it is that probably quite a large percentage of people who are reported missing show up within that time frame, I think. And police can't be wild goose chasing all the time, but even still. It seems bizarre. So when Michelle didn't show up within that time frame,

a missing persons report was filed. It detailed that Michelle was wearing blue shorts and a white t-shirt, had mental abnormalities and was often confused by her surroundings. Is that the case with Michelle? I don't know. That's just word for word what her missing persons report says. The report also detailed that Michelle stood, as we said, at only four foot seven and had the unimaginative nickname Shorty. But nothing happened. Michelle's family stapled a few flyers to telegraph poles, but that didn't seem to do much to help. And after 15 months of nothing, Michelle was removed from the missing persons list. Why, when you've been missing for 15 months, is your name being removed from the missing persons list. Why, when you've been missing for 15 months,

is your name being removed from the missing persons list? That's so strange. Everything to do with Michelle's part of this story is so bizarre. Because of course, Michelle hadn't just vanished into thin air. Her friend's dad, Ariel Castro, had driven her to his house, 2207 Seymour Avenue, and chained her up in the basement. He would keep her there for the next 11 years of her life. On the 21st of April 2003, it was the day before Amanda Berry's 17th birthday, and she had just finished up her shift a little bit early at Burger King. Oh, so not McDonald's. Not McDonald's. No, I've forgotten about that. On 110th Street and Lorraine Avenue,

just four blocks away from where michelle knight had gone missing the year before it's literally the same road it's a long road admittedly but it is still the same one amanda was either getting picked up after work by her sister beth or her boyfriend dj i've read differing accounts but as she'd finished early she needed to call them and let them know that she no longer needed a lift at that time. As Amanda walked out of Burger King, she saw a maroon van. Inside the van was a man she didn't recognise, but a girl that she did. She recognised Angela Castro, who she'd gone to middle school with.

And thinking nothing of it, Amanda kept walking. Before she knew it, the maroon van had pulled up next to her. The man driving asked Amanda if she needed a ride. Having recognised Angela Castro just moments before, Amanda gratefully accepted. But once in the maroon van, Amanda realised that Angela was no longer in it. And the man driving the van was, of course, Ariel Castro, father of Angela and Emily Castro. This guy has five kids, by the way. I'm just putting that in now. And Ariel Castro asked Amanda whether she would like to see Angela.

Amanda said yes. So Ariel Castro drove her to his house. Once at the house, Castro took Amanda upstairs and showed her a woman asleep. That woman turned out to be Michelle Knight, now 22 and still captive. Castro took Amanda Berry into another room where he asked her to pull down her pants. After that, Castro led Amanda into the basement where he asked her to pull down her pants. After that, Castro led Amanda into the basement where he taped her wrists and ankles together, put a helmet on her head and told her if she didn't make a sound, he would take her home. He has motorbikes, so I think it's like

a full face motorbike helmet, not like a bike helmet, like a cycling helmet. It's really like Colleen Stan, isn't it? And the box that he puts on her head. That total sensory deprivation lets just completely, completely isolate you as much as I possibly can. And imagine lying there with no trousers on, chained up in the basement of this gross old man's house, and he puts a helmet over your head. And it's your friend's dad. It's not just a stranger. That's the thing that really pisses me off about it, is, like, they trust him. He's not a total unknown to them, thing that really pisses me off about it is like they trust

him he's not a total unknown to them and that's the sickest thing about it he then chained amanda to a pole and left her there in the dark with only a small black and white tv for company amanda was left in the basement for several days enough time for her family to raise the alarm they called the police and filed a missing persons report and unlike Michelle Knight's family, the Berries fought hard to keep Amanda's disappearance in the news. They posted flyers everywhere and did everything they could to keep Amanda's face on the TV and in the public consciousness. Amanda watched their police appeals on the TV from the basement of 2207 and on the fourth day of her abduction, Amanda was moved upstairs to one of the bedrooms and chained to a radiator. A few days later,

Castro asked Amanda if she wanted anything from the shop to keep her occupied. You know, keep her occupied during her captivity with him. What fucking hero. Amanda asked him for a notebook that she could write in. And over the next 10 years, Amanda chronicled everything that happened to her, including the number of times a day that Ariel Castro raped her. She wanted a record, and she wanted him to be held accountable. And her first entry in this diary that she starts to keep is just so, like, heartbreakingly naive. She writes, You never know what you got till it's gone. I just can't wait to go home. I'm 17 now, but don't have a life. He told me I'm young and will go home before summer.

Another two months! Tragic, isn't it? It's tragic because she really thinks that he's going to set her free. You're right to compare it to Colleen Stan. And what we saw with that one was after a certain amount of time, you have to start believing what they're saying because they control absolutely everything, including when you can see light and when you're eating. So if he's telling you repeatedly, you're going to go home, and you're only 17, you're going to believe him.

And you also have to have that hope, because if you don't have any feeling that you might be able to go home, whether you might be able to escape or whether he might set you free, then you may as well just lay down and die. You have to have that feeling that there is a way out of this somehow. But as we know, he doesn't set her free. And on the seventh day of her imprisonment, Amanda's family received a late night phone call from Castro using Amanda's mobile phone. And this is really fucking sick. He says to Amanda's family,

I've got Mandy. She wants to be with me. Of course, the Berry family called the police. But in 2003, call tracing technology was in its infancy. The FBI spent about a week in the area the call had come from, hoping that the phone would be used again. But Castro never called. He really is like a by-the-book psychopath, like sexual psychopath, isn't he? The idea of taking these women, chaining them up, and then going so far as to call the families and tell them that they want to be with me. Wow. What he loves, this is so evident as we move through it, he absolutely loves knowing that people are looking for them. He loves it. Do you think that's why

he treats Michelle the worst? Because no one's looking for her. That's a great point. I'd never thought of that. Because as we go through the story, you will see that Michelle, well, of course, Amanda, Gina, the other girl he goes on to abduct, and Michelle are all treated horrifically. What happens to them is just unbelievable. But they all agree, as we see later, that Michelle had it the worst. Do you think he hated her because she was less valuable, because people weren't looking for her? Maybe. That's a really good point. Amanda's mother, Luana, got so desperate for news of her daughter that in 2004 she went on TV to speak to celebrity psychic Sylvia Brown, who told her, quote, she's not alive, honey. Your daughter isn't the kind who wouldn't call. How fucking dare you? Sylvia Brown, you are a dick. I got so angry when I read

that. Who are you to call that kind of shot? No one, Sylvia Brown. Get are a dick. I got so angry when I read that. Who are you to call that kind of shot? No one, Sylvia Brown. Get off the television. Honey, your daughter's not the kind who wouldn't call. What the fuck do you know about her daughter? Shut your mouth. And to make things even worse, Luana Berry died of pancreatitis in 2006,

seven years before Amanda would make her escape. So Luana died thinking her daughter was dead and she had no idea that she was just moments away, chained up in a house on Seymour Avenue. For Amanda Berry, during her captivity, everything came at a price. If she wanted a shower, it would have to be with Castro or no shower at all. He repeatedly raped her, sometimes as many as five times a day, all the while telling her that he just needed to find another girl and then she could go home.

And the way she records the rapes in her notebooks, she'll literally write a number at the top of the page with an X next to it, as in like four times, five times. That's really similar to how Sabine Dardenne did in the Marc Dutroux case. Oh, yeah. Where she had the book and she wrote an X for every time he raped her and two Xs if it was particularly, not that any kind of rape isn't bad, of course, but if it was particularly violent. It's a way of recording it without actually having to write about being raped, I think. And Castro got his wish because he did indeed get another girl.

On the 2nd of April 2004, just under a year after he'd snatched Amanda, Gina De Jesus was walking home from school with another one of Castro's daughters, Arlene. Gina was just 14 years old. The two girls stopped on the corner of Lorraine Avenue and West 105th Street to use a payphone. Arlene called her mum and asked if she could go to Gina's house. Arlene's mum said no, so the girls went their separate ways. Gina had no bus money, so she started to walk home. But soon a maroon van pulled up. She recognised the guy at the wheel immediately. It was Arlene's dad, Ariel Castro. He asked Gina if she'd seen Arlene. Gina replied, sure, she's just round the corner, and agreed to help Castro

find her. Oh my god, this is the thing. Tell your kids, if an adult asks you for help say no because no adult needs your help no adult needs your help to look for anything to find anything these girls know him they trust him and they go blindly with him because of course they didn't go to find arlene they went straight to 2207 seymour avenue gina knew something wasn't right when castro asked her to move some equipment and started to trim his nose hairs. It's so weird. Gina says she was like, so we were in the house and he starts like playing with his eyebrows and his ears. And it's just so weird.

It's such weird behavior. Like I have no explanation for why he does that. None. And then Ariel Castro started to touch her. When Gina asked him what he was doing, his whole demeanor changed. He said to Gina, you're going to go home now, but you can't go through the same door you came in. And just as he had done with Michelle and Amanda, he took Gina down to the basement. And after a struggle, Ariel Castro chained her up and left her down there.

She screamed for help, but nobody heard her. That is such an incredibly sinister thing to say you're going home now but you can't go through the same door you came in this is your new home now well apparently he himself never used the front door all of his neighbors would all say like he would just come in and out through the back because i took it to mean he was like you're going home now but not through the same door because you're going through this basement door because that's your new home now oh yeah maybe maybe a double a double meaning you're very insightful when you're this hungover maybe you should do it more often maybe i am feeling i'm

feeling quite like um i was gonna say the third eye is open is that what it is maybe maybe you need to drink alcohol 10 hours before and then your third eye will open up. Maybe it's just the intense feeling of hunger I have. I haven't eaten anything all day. I've just been in bed eating fruit pastel ice lollies. Oh, they're a good hangover cure though. Do you know what's even better than that? Get a Capri Sun, freeze it. That's the dream. Delicious. I've got two more fruit pastels left for the evening after the record. Then I need to build up the courage to have a shower. That'll sort you out. Hopefully.

Good old mammalian diving reflex. So, get this. The Ontario Liberals elected Bonnie Crombie as their new leader. Bonnie who? I just sent you her profile. Check out her place in the Hamptons. Huh. Fancy. She's a big carbon tax supporter, yeah? Oh, yeah. Check out her record as mayor. Oh, get out of here. She even increased taxes in this economy. Yeah. Higher taxes, carbon taxes. She sounds expensive.

Bonnie Crombie and the Ontario Liberals. They just don't get it. That'll cost you. A message from the Ontario PC Party. They say Hollywood is where dreams are made. A seductive city where many flock to get rich, be adored, and capture America's heart. But when the spotlight turns off, fame, fortune, and lives can disappear in an instant. When TV producer Roy Radin was found dead in a canyon near L.A. in 1983, there were many questions surrounding his death. The last person seen with him was Laney Jacobs, a seductive cocaine dealer who desperately wanted to be part of the Hollywood

elite. Together, they were trying to break into the movie industry. But things took a dark turn when a million dollars worth of cocaine and cash went missing. From Wondery comes a new season of the hit show Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder. Follow Hollywood and Crime, The Cotton Club Murder on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of The Cotton Club Murder early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. I'm Jake Warren, and in our first season of Finding, I set out on a very personal quest to find the woman who saved my mom's life. You can listen to Finding Natasha right now, exclusively on Wondery Plus. In season two, I found myself caught up in a new journey

to help someone I've never even met. But a couple of years ago, I came across a social media post by a person named Loti. It read in part, three years ago today that I attempted to jump off this bridge but this wasn't my time to go. A gentleman named Andy saved my life. I still haven't found him. This is a story that I came across purely by chance but it instantly moved me and it's taken me to a place where I've had to consider some deeper issues around mental health. This is season two of Finding, and this time, if all goes to plan, we'll be finding Andy. You can listen to Finding Andy and Finding Natasha exclusively and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. But the DeHazys family knew something was wrong as soon

as Gina didn't return from school on time. They followed the Berry family's example and kept Gina's name in the press as much as possible. They held multiple candlelit vigils for Gina and held fundraisers to keep up the search. And they did these often. These weren't one-offs. The sickest thing is Castro had grown up with Gina's mum, Nancy Ruiz.

They knew each other very well. Castro attended the vigils for Gina. He hugged her mother. He handed out flyers. He joined search parties. He donated money to their fundraisers, knowing full well the whole time that Gina was chained up in his house, just three miles away from her childhood home. And this is even worse. The police dug a hole 40 feet away from 2207, searching for the remains of Amanda and Gina. And this is even worse. The police dug a hole 40 feet away from 2207, searching for the remains of Amanda and Gina. And Ariel Castro helped the police put up the crime scene tape. He fucking loves it. He can't get enough. It's just that typical, typical behaviour you see with offenders like this, inserting himself into that grief that the family's feeling and almost like

feeding off it. He's such a sadist in every sense, not just sexually, but the amount of obsessive pleasure he seems to get from the family's grief is really sick. But nobody remembered that Michelle had gone missing from Lorraine Avenue too. The erasure is absolutely undeniable. All of the coverage before the escape only mentioned Amanda and Gina. So who was this man that was capable of chaining up and raping a teenager in his house and then hugging their mother in the same day? Ariel Castro was born in 1960 in Puerto Rico and his childhood was turbulent. His parents divorced when his mother, Lillian, found out that his father had an entire second family. What a time in the 60s, right?

When you could have a whole second family. I know. God. With four kids as well. It wasn't just a couple. He had four kids with another woman. Jesus. What a boom they must have been in.

Because imagine having a second family now. Barely afford to probably have a kid and look after it. A second family? Not in this economy. Is that chapter seven of your economics business book? Not in this economy. No, you know what it is? It's your talk show where you're the host.

It's not in this economy. I love it. A second family, colon, not in this economy. Chapter six. So when Ariel was still a child, he relocated to the United States with his mother and his three siblings. They moved around a bit, but eventually settled in Cleveland, Ohio, where they had extended family.

When he was just nine years old, Ariel Castro was raped. This sexual abuse undoubtedly shaped Castro. And as he got older, violent sexual compulsions began to rise to the surface, initially manifesting in an addiction to masturbation. And this is so typical. You know, we see this time and time again, the idea of abuse at an early age, especially if that person already has that underlying psychopathic, sociopathic, maybe just lacking empathy kind of personality. This is the perfect storm really to go forward and create a sexual sadist as Ariel Castro becomes. It's when that sexual abuse that he suffers. And of course, not everyone who is abused goes down this road. It's the people that have those underlying issues that are then triggered and that sexual abuse gets fused with their own sexual development and turns into this kind of sadistic mentality. But the thing with Castro is that for years, his perversions went relatively unnoticed. He was a valued member of the community. He played bass in local bands and drove a school bus for a living. They have this interview with this guy who played in bands

with him and he's like, he was like the top three bass player in all of Cleveland. And I was like, wow, that is an accolade. Fucking get him a sash with that on. What do you want? The third best bass player in Cleveland. But also, doesn't this really remind you of BTK, Dennis Rader? Such a community man. I'm a father. I work at the church. I do all this. I drive the school bus.

Deep down sexual sadist. Don't trust anyone at all, ever. That's the eighth chapter of her book. But we do go on to see that he doesn't keep the whole good guy persona up for long. Because Castro's married life becomes peppered with violent domestic abuse. Because in 1980, Castro met a woman named Nilda Figueroa. In 1981, they had their first child together. And eventually, they got married and moved to 2207 Seymour Avenue in 1992.

And as I said, it was far from a happy marriage. Castro beat Nilda from the outset. and punches soon turned into broken bones. And everyone knew about the domestic abuse. Nilda would frequently run over the road to Aurora Matti's house to call the police. And that's Aurora Matti who's the one that first sees Amanda Berry's hand sticking out of the storm door. Aurora's sons, Javier and Daniel, knew Ariel Castro well, but they never got involved, despite everyone knowing. There's an interview with the pair of them, and they're just like, you just don't get in people's business when it's their marriage. But I think it's just that

mindset, that culture. I agree. You stay out of other people's business. It's not your place to get involved. I'm not saying it's right. Of course not. They're ignoring all of this, despite the fact that Castro chained Nilda up like a dog in the basement. He never even let her leave the house and use their children as pawns in his mind games. He would kidnap his own children in an attempt to just fuck with her. It's frequent kidnapping of his own children. God, it just gets worse and worse. When Nilda fell pregnant with their fifth child, Castro attempted to induce a miscarriage by kicking her down a flight of stairs. In 1993, Castro was arrested for domestic abuse but not indicted. Why?

I have no idea. Then in 1996, Nilda managed to escape her tyrant of a husband. She took her children to a woman's shelter. Court documents showed that she sustained a broken jaw, broken ribs, dislocated shoulders and a blood clot on the brain. This is the thing I don't understand. Like, why? Fine, don't get him for domestic violence.

Is that not aggravated assault? Is that not grievous bodily harm? Why does she need to give you a statement about what happened? Why can't you just arrest him? But they don't arrest him. But Nilda does get away. They divorced. And after that, Ariel kept to himself.

So much to himself, he would hardly ever let people in the house. Even when his mum came round, he would keep her on the front porch or in the yard. One of the only people to enter the now infamous house and be allowed to leave was Ricky Sanchez. He's just a local Cleveland guy, and Castro wanted to buy a bass guitar from him, so Ricky was invited into the house. While he was there, Ricky could hear noises coming from upstairs that made him nervous, but Castro reassured him that they were just his dogs moving around. Ricky left in a hurry and never returned. For her first two weeks of captivity, Gina was Castro's favorite. He raped her for the first time on the 7th of May 2004. In later interviews,

Gina recalled feeling nervous about what would happen when she wasn't the new girl anymore. The abuse that Michelle, Amanda and Gina suffered in that house, as we said, is totally unimaginable. It wasn't just the sexual abuse. Castro pitted them against each other, changing his favorite all the time, giving one more food than the other two. And he even made them play Russian roulette while he watched. And obviously, as we said, Castro was such a sadist, like this kind of humiliation would have absolutely just been like foreplay for him. The rape and the control and the chaining them up and the captivity isn't even enough. He needs to go that stage further. Pitting them against each other is a really smart thing to do by Castro, because if they bond too much with each other, that's not a good thing. He needs them to be bonded to him and not to each other is a really smart thing to do by Castro because if they bond too much with each other, that's not a good thing. He needs them to be bonded to him and not to each other. So by pitting them

against each other, he builds these walls between the girls to keep them separated even without having to keep them in separate rooms. And after a while, Castro didn't even keep any of the girls in the basement. His mind games and fuckery had worked so well. He moved them to the bedrooms upstairs, where he would keep them chained to the walls with buckets for toilets, and he savagely beat them if they even thought about stepping out of line. If he left the house for any amount of time, he would duct tape their mouths so that Michelle, Amanda and Gina couldn't scream. And over the years, Castro fed his three prisoners a diet of mainly McDonald's, although they really rarely ate anyway. And this bit is so sick and just shows the sadistic pleasure he gets out of this. He

made them celebrate the anniversaries of their abductions with cake. And in the years that they were held captive, the three women were only allowed into the yard twice wearing disguises. Just think about what that would do to you, just being inside for 10 years. Even when you're in prison, you're allowed to go outside. Absolutely. And how many times have we talked about the massive impact that solitary confinement and confinement like that has on prisoners? Fucking hell.

And in 2004, Castro even forced Amanda and Gina to watch an episode of America's Most Wanted that featured their disappearances, complete with tearful pleas from their families. He even gave Gina a flyer from their search. She kept it. She kept it till the day she was reunited with her mum. I guess you need that strength to know that someone's looking for you. Castro would even test his captives often. He would leave doors unlocked and wait behind them. If any of the women tried to escape, he would beat them within an inch of their lives. So eventually they stopped trying.

He took so many precautions. Things like this, that kind of behavior, that fear conditioning that he does is so important. It's like, don't even fucking think about it. You never know when I'm going to be there. But despite all of these cruel games, all three women agreed that Michelle got it the worst. She fell pregnant five times during her 11 years in 2207. Each time, Castro would induce a miscarriage by beating her. Michelle puts this down to her total refusal to break. In her own words, if you've already been through torture, you can't break twice. Then, on the 22nd of April 2006, on her 20th birthday,

Amanda Berry, terrified, realised that she was pregnant. But she did not get the same treatment as Michelle. Amanda carried her baby to term and on Christmas Day she went into labour. Not wanting Amanda to make a mess of the bed, Castro provided her with a paddling pool to sit in. He instructed Michelle to deliver the baby and told her that if the baby died, he would kill her. Michelle did as she was told, but when she delivered the little girl, it was clear that she wasn't breathing. Michelle managed to bring the baby around with CPR, but it was a close call. Amanda named her baby girl Jocelyn, which means happy or cheerful, and that's exactly how Jocelyn turned out. The start of a new life gave all three women

hope and reinforced their survival instincts. And also just gave them something to do, I think. I really like this part of the story. They made her a kindergarten and pretended to walk her to school and made sure she looked both ways before crossing the road. And then Amanda would sort of say, okay, have a good day and then be her teacher. Jocelyn was a ray of hope amongst a decade of torture, sex slavery and imprisonment. Castro also loved Jocelyn and as a result, she was allowed a lot more freedom than her mother and her fellow captives. Castro even showed one of his daughters, Angela, a picture of little Jocelyn. He insisted that it was his girlfriend's child from a previous relationship, even though Angela pointed out that the kid in the picture looked exactly like her sister, Emily. Jocelyn

went to church with her father, called him daddy, and was allowed to roam freely around the house. And it turned out Jocelyn's free roaming would be Ariel Castro's undoing. Now we're back where we started, the 6th of May 2013. Jocelyn was now six years old and was pottering around the house when she told Gina and Amanda, I don't see daddy. Now Castro normally chained Michelle, Amanda and Gina up when he left the house, but that day he hadn't. So Amanda went downstairs to investigate and Jocelyn was right. Castro was nowhere to be seen and neither was his car. Amanda noticed that the front door wasn't locked either. There was only a padlock on the storm door.

Amanda felt sure that she could get through the storm door somehow, so she grabbed Jocelyn and decided to go for it. She pushed the door from the bottom as far as she could and stuck her arm through and started to shout for help. This is when she caught Aurora Matti's attention. Once out of 2207, Amanda stood on the pavement outside holding Jocelyn in her arms. Castro could return at any moment and she was petrified. Gina and Michelle were still in the house and they had no idea that Amanda had

escaped. Aurora Matti took Amanda and Jocelyn into her house until the police arrived. At 5.55pm, the police were on the scene and Amanda told them that there were two more women inside the house. The police broke down the door and brought out Michelle and Gina wrapped in blankets. They had been chained naked upstairs and after 11 years, they were finally free. Michelle, Gina, Amanda and Jocelyn were all transferred in an ambulance to the nearest hospital. At 6pm, a call went out to trace Ariel Castro. At 6.16, they tracked him down. He was with his two brothers in McDonald's, and that's where they were arrested, all three of them. In the meantime, hundreds of news crews descended on

Seymour Avenue. Normal TV programming was suspended and live coverage of the scene unfolding was beamed to Cleveland's screens. Once at the hospital, Michelle, Amanda, Gina and Jocelyn were greeted by Dr Gerald Maloney and nurse Betsy Martinez. Betsy had known Gina as a child and could not believe what she was seeing. Everyone had given up hope on seeing Gina alive ever again. And after almost ten years, I think most people would. In the interview Betsy Martinez gives in one of the documentaries we watched, she's bouncing with enthusiasm about how overjoyed she was to see Gina

and how Gina and Amanda wanted to be together all the time and how beautiful Jocelyn is. But she makes absolutely no mention of Michelle. It really feels like by the time Michelle showed up alive, everyone had forgotten that she existed in the first place. It's such a sad, sad part of this story. How much Michelle is just completely ignored throughout all of it. Even still, it's very much Amanda and Gina and Michelle.

Like they're separate. Totally. It's bizarre. I don't understand. Just because it's just because no one was looking for her, right? Like we just value. Yeah, it's just because Gina and Amanda had so much, for 10 years they had press coverage of where are Amanda and Gina.

So I think people just linked those names in their mind and they were like, oh, who's this other person? We don't know who this is. It's like Destiny's Child all over again. Poor Michelle. Amanda, Gina and Jocelyn were allowed to return home to their families fairly quickly after their admissions to hospital and they were greeted by cheering crowds, banners, balloons and street parties. But poor Michelle, again. She's left behind. They leave her behind. They go home

and you can understand, of course, Amanda and Gina have been fucking brutalised. You know, I'm not blaming them at all in any of this. If I was in that situation, I'd fucking want to go home. But Michelle's left again in hospital for days after. Because Ariel Castro had beaten her so severely that she slurred when she spoke. And she had to have her jaw reconstructed. Michelle Knight's mum does turn up at the hospital, but Michelle refused to see her. And Michelle has never reconnected with her family. She says that she's too hurt that they didn't look for her. And you would be. I'd be like, fuck off.

So when Michelle was discharged from the hospital, she went to Gina's house and stayed there until she got back on her feet. And two days after the escape, Ariel Castro was charged with four counts of kidnapping and three counts of rape. He did not enter a plea, and his bail was set at $8 million. In the run-up to his trial, prosecutors pushed for the death penalty. In Ohio, a fetus has personhood, which means that the willful causation of a miscarriage is tantamount to murder. When murder occurs in violent circumstances, it becomes aggravated murder and in the state of Ohio in 2013, the penalty for aggravated murder was death.

But the general consensus in Cleveland was that Ariel Castro needed to suffer for his crimes and that a quick death was an easy way out and it was too good for him. His brothers were quickly released without charge when the police discovered that like the rest of Seymour Avenue they had had absolutely no idea what had been going on in 2207. During the search of the house, police uncovered a suicide note that Castro had penned in 2004. He wrote that the sexual abuse he endured had turned him into a monster. Quote, I'm a sexual predator. I need help. He asked the person who finds the note to give all of his savings to his victims.

And it was their own fault they were chained in his house because they made the mistake of getting in a car with a total stranger. Which is not totally true, is it? Because in each abduction, one of Ariel Castro's daughters is present every single time. And that's why the girls trust him. And I do have to wonder, did Castro put his daughters up to it? I'm not saying that they're involved at all, but I'm just saying that I think he knew that his daughters were an important factor in the abductions. He couldn't do it without them. Oh, definitely. I think Ariel Castro, you know, he's not a genius,

but he's not stupid in any of this. Like, he's very methodical in how he carries out the abductions and how he keeps the women for that extended amount of time. And I think he knew full well. And I think he definitely used his daughters as bait to give him that credibility. Again, that whole rationalization of it being like, they made the mistake of getting into a car with a stranger. They deserve it.

It's that absolutely. I'm not a monster. They deserved it. So it's okay. Those allowances that he'll give himself. And also that suicide note. Bollocks. Absolute bollocks. Whatever. The trial was a quick one. In July,

Michelle Knight took to the stand and confronted her attacker. When Amanda Berry's lawyer asked her what she wanted, she asked for only two things, a headstone for her mum and a birth certificate for her daughter. On the 1st of August, Castro was sentenced to life in prison plus 1,000 years after he pled guilty to 937 counts of kidnapping and rape. But he would only serve about a month. On the 3rd of December 2013, Ariel Castro was found dead in his cell. And he had hanged himself. I think the only reason he's not charged with murder is that they couldn't prove that he forced Michelle to miscarry. They couldn't prove it. It was just her testimony and

it wasn't quite enough to get him for murder, I think. So where are the women now? Amanda now hosts a TV segment on missing persons in Northeast Ohio. Gina still lives in the Cleveland area where she works with victims advocate specialists to provide abuse victims with support as part of the Northeast Ohio Amber Alert Committee. Michelle Knight now goes by Lily Rose Lee. She's married and although the abuse she sustained makes it very unlikely that she will ever be able to carry children again, she remains hopeful. She also hopes that one day her son Joey will get back in touch with her. Lily Rose Lee has written two books about her experience before and after her 11 years locked inside 2207.

And her main job at the moment is running the Lily's Ray of Hope Foundation that helps women and young girls who have experienced physical and emotional abuse through domestic violence, human trafficking, and child abuse. She also tells her story in talks all over the United States. She does not, however, keep in touch with Gina and Amanda, who released a book together in 2015. The three do seem quite divided. Gina puts this down to the mind games that Castro played with them in the house. But then it does seem odd that when she left the hospital, Michelle went to Gina's house and stayed there. So I don't know if that's the case. Obviously, what they've gone through is totally unimaginable. so we can't imagine how they would react to anything because we like it's it's so difficult to say but it just seems a bit strange

that now they don't speak amanda and gino have teamed up and michelle is you know still on her own but i mean who knows i mean it could be so many things there was such a big gap between when michelle is taken and then when the next two girls are taken. They're abducted just- Only about a year. Oh, between all three of them. Oh, right. So it's like, it's less than a year, I think, before. So Michelle's taken, then it's about a year, maybe a little bit less. I don't know. Do you think maybe the divide could be obviously because of what Castro did in the house? I do believe that would have had an impact on their ability to bond with each other. I guess it could also be because I thought maybe is that they're

seeing each other is a reminder of the worst time of their lives. But then if Amanda and Gina seem quite close and they've written this book together, why is Michelle outside of that? I suppose they're a bit closer in age, maybe, but not massively. Maybe there is the age divide. i also thought as we said all three of the women accept that michelle had it the worst in the house and i wonder if amanda and gina have some sort of like not survivors guilt because michelle isn't dead but a feeling of they had people looking for them they had a life to go back to she had it the worst in the house with castro

and maybe they find it difficult because of that I don't know I don't know what it is but Lily Rose has stated that she wishes Gina and Amanda well and says that they will reunite when the time is right poor Michelle I know poor all of them and fucking poor Jocelyn imagine spending the first six of years of your life in that situation and then growing up and then knowing that's who your father was that's what happened to you there's an interview in one of the documentaries with ariel castro's cousin and she this really doesn't sit well with me at all so uh her name's maria and she's ariel castro's cousin reasonably tight-knit family so she knew him really well she was like i really want jocelyn to understand that we're not

monsters and she's part of this family and she's's this, this, this. And I was like, this is not about you, Maria. Please calm down. And she gets so upset about it. Piss off. Just let her not be associated with you. Just leave her alone. It's not like Ariel Castro didn't have any other kids. You want to give that love, go give them to the other five kids that he has.

Leave Jocelyn the fuck alone. Yeah, that really didn't sit well with me at all. Wow, that's something. So yeah, that's the case of the Cleveland captives. Let us know what you think. As usual on all the social medias, you can find us at Red Handed The Pod on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter. And if you would like to go that stage further and help support the show, you can do so on Patreon. Here are some people who have done so this week.

Ellen Pearson. Person? I don't have done so this week. Ellen Pearson? Person? I don't know. I'm sorry, Ellen. Natalie Barrett, Della Gordon, Joanne Walters, M.

Do you think? Is it Judi Dench? Do we think? Could it possibly be? Natalie Barrett. Oh, I've done that. Jennifer Doyle, Lauren,

Mia Martinson, Devin, Lily Rance, Puck, Liam Wilson. Liam Wilson? That name is Ryan. on that jennifer doyle lauren mia martinson devon lily rance puck lee puck liam wilson liam wilson that name is ryan williamson and i just said liam wilson are you okay no i'm not he's tweeted us as well i'm sorry ryan liam wilson i was reading him along as you were saying them out loud and i was like what I need a break Jane Bowers uh Adriana Parker Bianca Belongus Belongus Smith Jessica Troy Deirdre McLeod Deirdre also sent

us a message being like this is how you say my name don't worry Deirdre I can say Deirdre McLeod Caitlin Weaver Joby Burger thank you so much guys they have so little faith in our ability to pronounce their names but yes you're all great we're only we're only having you are great we love you we'll see you next week we will bye guys bye he was hip-hop's biggest mogul the the man who redefined fame, fortune, and the music industry. The first male rapper to be honored on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, Sean Diddy Cone. Diddy built an empire and lived a life most people only dream about. Everybody know ain't no party like a Diddy party, so.

Yeah, that's what's up. But just as quickly as his empire rose, it came crashing down. Today I'm announcing the unsealing of a three-count indictment, charging Sean Combs with racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, interstate transportation for prostitution.

I was f***ed up. I hit rock bottom, but I made no excuses. I'm disgusted. I'm so sorry. Until you're wearing an orange jumpsuit, it's not real. Now it's real. From his meteoric rise to his shocking fall from grace, from law and crime, this is the rise and fall of Diddy. Listen to the rise and fall of Diddy exclusively with Wondery Plus. You don't believe in ghosts? I get it. Lots of people don't. I didn't either until I came face to face with them.

Ever since that moment, hauntings, spirits, and the unexplained have consumed my entire life. I'm Nadine Bailey. I've been a ghost tour guide for the past 20 years. I've taken people along with me into the shadows, uncovering the macabre tales that linger in the darkness, and inside some of the most haunted houses, hospitals, prisons, and more. Join me every week on my podcast, Haunted Canada,

as we journey through terrifying and bone-chilling stories of the unexplained. Search for Haunted Canada on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts.