Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 1011 | Colton Underwood’s “Daddyhood” Glorifies Motherlessness & Baby-Buying

Starting point is 00:00:00 Colton Underwood, a former bachelor, is welcoming a child with his partner via surrogacy. And my, oh my, the details of this journey that he has revealed are insane. We've got all of this and more on today's episode of Relatable. Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Thursday. I hope everyone is having a wonderful week so far. Okay, we've got the most controversial things to talk about today. before we get into it, just a few announcements for you guys.

Starting point is 00:00:40 The Share the Arrow's event coming up on September 28th, the response has been absolutely amazing. This is an event for Christian women. We are coming together and we are going to be so edified and encouraged and empowered by some of the best and wisest and boldest Christian women teachers in the world. we've got Rosaria Butterfield, we've got Elisa Childers, we've got Abby Halberstadt, we've got music by Grammy Award winning artist Francesca Battistelli. This is going to be a time for you, not only to sit under amazing teaching and encouragement, but also to meet like-minded

Starting point is 00:01:21 Christian women. So often we feel like we're alone, like we're the only ones navigating the storm of this culture war, especially depending on where you live. You can feel like you have no community at all. And when we feel like we're alone, we are tempted to feel like we are wrong, to feel like we are insane, to feel like it's just not worth pushing back against the darkness in our own lives, in our communities, with our families, but we're not alone. And so this event is going to be a beautiful and refreshing reminder of that. You are going to be with thousands of Christian women who have the same values, the same concerns, the same hopes and dreams. And an aim of pursuing Jesus as you do, and you do not want to miss this.

Starting point is 00:02:09 We've gotten lots of questions about whether it's going to be available for live stream, whether we are going to be going to different cities in the future. And we just don't know the answers to those things yet. I'm not trying to hold out on you, but this is our first event. This is the first event that I've ever done. So we are still figuring out what works and what's going to work. We didn't even know what the response would be. We have already far surpassed the goal that I wanted to reach ultimately in the number of ticket sales and the number of attendees.

Starting point is 00:02:40 We reached that in like the first 48 hours. And so now that we see, wow, this is something that is so wanted and so needed, we are figuring out ways to accommodate this desire that you guys have to come together. But all that to say, this is the best guarantee that you have of attending this event is. attending in person and also attending this inaugural event in Dallas because we just don't know what the future holds and what our technical capabilities are. So if you go to share the arrows.com, you can see all of the ticket options there. We would absolutely love to have you. Yes, you can come by yourself. That is totally fine. There are going to be a lot of individuals there by themselves. I promise you, like this is when I say that the relatable audience is the best

Starting point is 00:03:31 audience in the world. I am not exaggerating. Every sponsor that I have, every guest that I have, every person that has interacted with a relatable audience always comes to me and says, you've got the best audience. You've got the most generous audience, the most charitable, the most gracious, the kindest, most hospitable audience. I know that's true because every time we post a link to donate items to a pregnancy center, for example, you guys show up and you are so incredibly charitable with the time, the resources that you give to those in need. And so all that to say, if you come to this event by yourself, you are going to find fast friends. You are going to find people who will welcome you, who will link arms with you, who will share arrows with you.

Starting point is 00:04:19 And so that's what this event is about. But also bring your family, bring your sisters, bring your friends, bring your mom, bring all the related gals, potential related gals in your life, bring your women's ministry at your church, bring your fellow PTA members, bring your mom friends at your kids' school, bring everyone that you can, bring your BSF group, Bible study, all that good stuff, because it's going to be amazing. And I really don't want anyone to miss out on this, especially in light of election season. Every month we get closer to the election, we are going to feel like a my gosh, I just need to get with my people and make sure that I'm grounded and that like we're all on the same page, right? So that's what this is going to be, getting all on the same page,

Starting point is 00:05:10 a call to arms, and just a reminder of what is important and just ensuring that we are solidified in what is good and right and true. So share the arrows.com. I cannot wait to see you guys there. I, of course, will be speaking to. I didn't mention that. And there are also options on the website for meet and greet and breakfast and dinner and all of that. And so if you want to meet me, that's the best way to do that. Sign up for one of those options. Share the arrows.com. All right, just a couple other quick things before we get into all of this. Voddy Baccom. He is amazing. He was actually supposed to, we were supposed to record an interview today. I've had him on the show several times. You guys love him so much independent from this show.

Starting point is 00:05:55 But as a guest on the show and then also just who he is as an evangelist. as a teacher of the word as an author. But unfortunately, his flight got delayed. But we are going to be at the same event this weekend. It is a, we're having a live conversation in Texas. You can go to, I think it's vodibokum.org, but we're going to put the link in the description. It's on June 1st. Our live conversation will be at 630.

Starting point is 00:06:26 So link in the description of this episode for tickets. and so he and I will be talking about all of the important things. And also I just want to tell you about his book, it's not like being black, how sexual activists hijacked the civil rights movement. He addresses the dangerous alliance between gender ideology and the civil rights movement and shares why this is the latest threat to the church from social justice warriors. Yes, there is no greater messenger for this message than Voddy Bakum. That comes out on June 4th.

Starting point is 00:06:59 So make sure that you go out and pre-order that right now. Okay, last thing before we get into all of it, please, if you love this podcast, if it's meant anything to you, leave a review on Apple Podcasts, leave a five-star review. That would mean so much to us. It really helps out the show. All right, that's it. That's all the announcements. Let's get into this.

Starting point is 00:07:18 Let's get into this crazy story that you guys have been asking me to talk about for so long. And I've been avoiding talking about it because I don't really want to give this. this whole thing airtime, but we have to. It just combines so many things that we discuss so often on this show. And that is Colton Underwood of the Bachelor of Fame, starting a podcast called Daddyhood to chronicle his journey with his quote unquote husband who obtaining a child through excelling and surrogacy. And this is just another example.

Starting point is 00:07:59 of the glorification of commodifying children and commercializing women and their uteruses. And this is the person who also professes Christianity. And so here is just a little background about who he is before we get into some of the details of this, what I think is a very disturbing journey. And before we talk about why this all matters in so many different ways, Colton Underwood, as I said, he is a former Bachelor star. He is 32 years old and his spouse, Jordan Brown, is 38. They are expecting their first baby, a boy via surrogate in early October. Now, to rewind a little bit, you might remember Colton Underwood from The Bachelor. I do not watch The Bachelor. I watched a couple episodes of The Golden Bachelor, which I thought was interesting. But, I have not watched The Bachelor since I think Juan Pablo's season in maybe like 2011. He ruined it for me. He was a horrible Bachelor. Anyway, so I stopped watching it, which is good because it's pretty trashed television. Anyway, so he was on The Bachelor, though, a few years ago. And then in 2021, he kind of shocked the world when he said, yeah, I am now gay. Here is that one. I got closer to God this year. And I know even saying that now as a gay man, people can be like, how is that even possible? And it's like, I don't think unless you understand, I used to wake up in the morning and pray for him to take the gay away.

Starting point is 00:09:39 I used to pray for him to change me. And I can now wake up and pray to God and I can actually have faith. And I can go into church and be present. Yeah, you know, there's so much about that that just makes me sad. And obviously, I don't know his background that don't know his story. I don't know the true feelings and temptations that he has struggled with his whole life. But it saddens me that he feels, as many professing Christians, professing Christians feel that embracing sin and embracing our temptations is a form of liberation when the Bible actually says that it is a form of enslavement. And I think of 1st Corinthians 6-11, and actually if we back up a little bit before that, starting in waiting for it to load,

Starting point is 00:10:36 starting in verse 9, or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, will inherit the kingdom of God. and such were some of you and such were some of you but here's what changed here's the hope for every single one of us not just those who practiced or struggled with homosexuality but for every single sinner but you were washed you were sanctified you were justified in the name of the lord jesus christ and by the spirit of our god so the liberation actually comes in realizing that

Starting point is 00:11:23 being a slave to our flesh and our sinful sexual desires that that is part of the old self. But now we are new creations because of being made alive in Christ by grace through faith, as Ephesians 2 says that we can reject and we can leave and we can let go of and repent of our former way of life. Does that mean that we'll never sin again? Does that mean we'll never struggle. Does that mean we'll never have temptations again? No, of course, it doesn't mean those things, but it means that we are not walking in the way of our flesh. We are not walking in sin anymore. But the grace and the love of Christ motivates us to walk in a way that is holy. That is not just true of people who have homosexual desires. That is true of people who have all sinful desires,

Starting point is 00:12:13 which is all of us. We are all called by the power of the Holy Spirit to walk in repentance. that is what true freedom and liberation is, not just suppressing our conviction and pretending like you can wed Christianity with unrepentant sin, but repenting of that sin and walking with Christ taking up our cross and following him, Rosaria Butterfield, Christopher Yuan, Beckett Cook, all people whose testimonies of leaving homosexuality for the gospel and for Christ are so empowering and so beautiful. So if you don't want to take it from me, someone who is not in this same position, go read their books, listen to their testimony, see what Christ has done in their life specifically when it comes to the homosexual desire

Starting point is 00:13:01 and homosexual temptation. So that's a little bit of background on him. He's also had some legal issues with some very serious allegations of behavior, alleged behavior with his past girlfriends, some really disturbing stuff. We've actually already talked about that on this show so you can go research that for yourself. If you'd like to, that's not completely relevant to the conversation that we're having today about just how his confusion and deception about his identity is now having an impact on helpless children. And of course, that's always what happens when we normalize and celebrate and legalize sin. All right, this is, according to the first, to Today.com. This is the online news version of the Today Show. It says former Bachelor Colton

Starting point is 00:14:05 Underwood has been pursuing Daddyhood, which happens to be the name of his podcast, for more than two years. And he and his husband's Jordan C. Brown announced on Instagram that they will be welcoming a baby boy in the fall. It's almost always a baby boy. Almost always a boy. I don't know. That's just strange. Our little boy is coming this fall. The X. NFL player captioned a photo carousel featuring an ultrasound image. He also posted a video to share his joy about the good news. And if you are not watching on YouTube, it's these men's hands holding this ultrasound image of this little baby in a womb. The question is, whose womb? And we'll get to that. Becoming a father, the today's show says, has always been a goal of mine.

Starting point is 00:14:53 Underwood said in a backstage interview when he visited today earlier this year. It's been something that I've always wanted to accomplish, and I never thought it was possible as a gay man. His path to parenthood wasn't an easy one. Underwood was told early on that his active sperm count was low, so he worked with doctors to determine a plan of action. He did change his lifestyle. His sperm count bounced back, he said. And so then they were able to find an egg seller. The reason, again, I don't say egg donor is because it's a lot of,

Starting point is 00:15:26 only called egg donor because of a technicality. It's not actually legal to sell human tissue in the United States. And so egg donors say that they are being paid for their time and their effort, not actually their eggs, but we all know the truth. They're not donating their eggs. They are selling their eggs. And so when people say, oh, surrogates egg donors, they're so altruistic. No, they're getting paid very often tens of thousands of dollars to sell part of their body very often to two men like this. Underwood told men's health, we want somebody deep and cool for the egg cellar. I believe in nature versus nurture. So give us the basics and we can show this kid love. What? That doesn't even make any sense. I'm not sure that you actually believe in nature because you are

Starting point is 00:16:17 denying that a child needs a mother. In the couple's first conversation with an egg donor, this is the language they used. They met virtually in Brown and Underwood. didn't use video or their real names. Underwood shared an elevator with his egg donor. He was heading to a routine physical and she was there for testing prior to her egg retrieval. He said this was a bonding thing. They also mentioned that it was kind of like using a dating app trying to find the right

Starting point is 00:16:47 egg donor and trying to find the right surrogate. So that's disturbing in and of itself. We've seen several stories of men like Shane. Dawson, that YouTube, for example, saying that they look through catalogs. You look through catalogs. You find the person who you think is prettiest and who has the best genetic makeup in your opinion and maybe who has an Ivy League degree and you say, yes, I want that to be the mother of my child. That's not the language they use. They use language like egg donor because it's less intimate and you're just denying the biological reality that this woman is a mother. So they literally

Starting point is 00:17:25 go through catalogs of women, not that different than prostitution, and they choose who is going to be the genetic mother, and they do a similar thing when they are picking the surrogate. They have spent $350,000 on their fertility team. So that's the surrogate, the egg seller, also the medical team that had to do all. of this. And so there's a lot that's involved. Of course, there's IVF that is involved in this process. Well, there's the egg retrieval first from the so-called egg donor. And then there's the IVF process where they are using the sperm from these two men and they are mixing it together with the eggs that were retrieved. They're creating embryos out of that genetic material. And then they are

Starting point is 00:18:21 implanting the embryo that is created, that is selected into a different woman, and that is the surrogate, and she has to take hormones herself to prepare her body for this foreign entity that is going into our uterus. It's very dangerous for the embryo, by the way. It can also be very dangerous health-wise for the surrogate because this is a very unnatural process, and it can be mismatched. The woman's body can reject this little embryo. but again, we're just saying, oh, whatever, as long as the parents want a child, that's all ethically fine.

Starting point is 00:18:57 And so this embryo is implanted. And if all goes well, quote unquote, this woman becomes pregnant and the baby grows. And we'll talk a little bit more about what happens from there. But first, I want to talk more about their specific process and what happened with the egg retrieval. So here's what Today.com says. And they actually use the wrong language. And so I'm going to correct them. This just goes to show how little the mainstream knows about the surrogacy process.

Starting point is 00:19:29 It says Underwood and Brown divided their sperm between the surrogates 22 eggs. It's not the surrogates eggs. That's illegal. That can't happen. It's the egg cellars, one woman. The surrogate is another woman. So it's not the surrogate's 22 eggs. Why do they have to be legally separate so that neither woman can claim?

Starting point is 00:19:48 motherhood so that neither woman can say that they are bonded to this child. Even the law recognizes that there is this strong, fierce biological bond between the mom and a child, and that could cause all kinds of problems when that child is then taken away. And so the surrogate has no genetic claim to this child. The egg seller doesn't care because she doesn't even know who. who these people are. She didn't feel that child grow in her womb. And so it just makes it easier for everyone except for the baby, who will never know his biological mom and also is immediately ripped away from the only body, the only woman, the only home he has ever known

Starting point is 00:20:38 immediately at birth. Again, treating a child much worse than we treat puppies and kittens in the United States who legally we have to keep with their mother. for six to 12 weeks after birth. But for human babies, we say no, you don't get that skin-to-skin bonding with the heartbeat, the warmth, the smell, the feel of the woman that you know. You don't get the milk that you instinctively are longing for. You don't get that experience right after birth that regulates their temperature, that regulates the baby's heart rate, that regulates the breathing, that emotional.

Starting point is 00:21:17 that emotional physiological attachment that is so necessary for the health and the safety of babies at birth, no, surrogate baby, you don't get that because your two gay dads wanted to have a child in this way. So this baby gets robbed of all of those things that we are told, those of us who are biological moms, we are told that that skin to skin, that that bonding is so important after birth. and the entire medical team will bend over backwards to make sure that that baby is placed on the mom's chest immediately after the C-section or immediately after the biological or the vaginal birth because everyone knows how important that is. Babies of surrogates get denied that. They get denied that purposely. And again, how is this different than babies who are put up for adoption who also don't get that after birth? One, that is still trauma. That is still separation.

Starting point is 00:22:10 But surrogacy creates a broken situation from the game. go from the point of conception. It purposely creates a broken situation. Adoption redeems a broken situation. So the life is already created with adoption. Then adoption tries to redeem that broken situation. And then surrogacy creates the broken situation from the point of conception. You are creating a life to purposely rob that child in this kind of homosexual case of a mother or a father in different ways if you're talking about sperm donation. I also want to focus on this. Underwood and Brown divided their sperm between the ag cellars, 22 eggs. 22 eggs. They divided their sperm. There's a little confusion here. Again, I think this just goes to

Starting point is 00:22:57 show that this author at the Today Show doesn't really know how to explain this. They ended up fertilizing three embryos. Fertilizing three embryos. Again, that's not quite the right language. So it sounds like they fertilized the 22 eggs, but perhaps they only ended up. with three embryos. Again, this is a very dangerous, risky process for the little lives that are being created. So there's three embryos. They transferred the one embryo that doctors deemed, quote, unquote, healthiest. And they even put it in quotes because we don't know exactly what that means. Did one of them have a chromosomal disorder? Did they have Down syndrome? What happened to the other embryos? Were they discarded? Were they allowed to thaw? Will they be just frozen indefinitely?

Starting point is 00:23:43 we don't know what means healthiest. And I have a hard time believing that they didn't also purposely choose a boy. And so this is very common among anyone who uses IVF, not just two men, is that the gender that's wanted for the first child is very often, but not always, but very often selected. And so the other two or the other five or the other 12, they get discarded. They get indefinitely frozen. in so many ethical issues with IVF that even Christians so often are just not even willing to look at. But this is, of course, what happens when we sacrifice the well-being of little image bearers of God for the wants and the whims of adults. That's what happens here. Because if we

Starting point is 00:24:31 believe, as we say we do, as pro-lifers, that life starts a conception, that a person is a person, no matter how small, that embryos are made in the image of God, then indefinitely freezing them or thawing them or eugenically selecting them based on their gender or based on their ability or disability is not a way to treat that little embryo that's made in the image of God. And so the whole process from the very beginning is extremely corrupt. Is it good to want a child? Yes. If you used IVF, do I know that you love your children who are made in the image of God? Absolutely 100%. But that does not mean that we should be thoughtless about this entire process, especially when we are talking about this situation in which two men are purposely robbing a little boy of the love

Starting point is 00:25:17 of a mother, which every child needs, especially in those early years throughout your life, but especially in those early years, simply because why? Because of their wants. Putting your wants above the well-being and needs of a child is really one of the most wicked things that you can do, right? And yet this is being glorified as quote-unquote daddyhood. I'm sorry, but this is selfish. It is.

Starting point is 00:25:42 All of us who are moms, we remember that moment when we met our child, Earthside, for the first time. And this is true whether you're an adoptive mom or whether you are a birth mom, a biological mom. But because I haven't adopted any children yet, the only experience I have is when I birthed my children and they placed that baby on my chest. and it is the most natural and simultaneously surreal moment of your life. And I've told this story before, but I mean, there are millions and millions of stories like this. There are millions of videos like this, some of which we've played on this show before, when you see the moment that a baby gets to meet his or her mom. But with my first, I had a C-section and she had some breathing problems.

Starting point is 00:26:51 She needed to get her oxygen levels up. And I had to beg laying there on the operating table as they are stitching me back up. And they're about to wheel me back up. And they're going to take her into the NICU. I said, please, can you just put her on my chest? Can I please just hold her before you do that? And so they said, okay, while we wheel you up, it clearly wasn't too much of an emergent situation, but it just wasn't quite where they wanted it.

Starting point is 00:27:16 While we wheel you up, we'll let you hold her for just a couple minutes. And so they placed her on my chest. Of course, she immediately stops crying. And then when we get up to the postpartum room, they take her and they put her on the little bed that measures her oxygen levels. And they said, oh, never mind. The guy had just come in there wheeling in the bassinet that he was going to put her in, to wheel her into the NICU. And he turned right back around and left because her oxygen levels then were perfect. What did she need in that moment?

Starting point is 00:27:48 she needed her mom. She needed me. She needed the only heartbeat, the only feeling, the only smell, the only bond, the only home, the only human she had ever known. That's what all babies need at birth, whether their oxygen levels are off or not. And that's not to say that there never is a need for medical intervention. Of course, there is. But babies need their moms.

Starting point is 00:28:15 There is so much there emotionally, spiritually, physically, physically that is necessary in that bond. And again, this kind of situation of baby buying and the renting of wounds in order to create a child is purposely taking away that necessary bond. And we're just hoping that everything is fine. We're just hoping because the child doesn't have any power. He can't articulate his needs. He can't verbalize what he wants, what he craves, what he instinctively longs for in that moment, that everything is. is going to be fine. And he maybe throughout his life will have a hard time understanding that. He might never be able to articulate why something has always felt like it's missing.

Starting point is 00:29:00 And there may be a sense of guilt there because I'm sure he will love both of the men who raise him. I'm sure they're nice people. And he might not ever be able to say, yeah, it would have been awesome to know where else I come from. It would have been awesome to know where I got my nose, where I got my, you know, affinity for math or whatever it is. It would have been great to know that. It would have been great to have the love and the bond of a mother as a baby. He may never be able to say that. And because of that, we just assume that everything's fine.

Starting point is 00:29:35 And these are, again, the same people that say to trust the science. I'm not talking about Colton Underwood. I don't know if he's ever said that. But these are the same kinds of people, progressives, who say, oh, we got to trust the science. Well, the science tells us that in order for anybody on Earth to exist, we need male and female. Every single person on Earth has a mom and a dad.

Starting point is 00:29:58 Science tells us that. So you're telling me that in this case, this existential case of creating human life that the science tells us nothing about what human beings need, not just to exist but to thrive. Well, that seems like a very anti-science position. But that is, of course, because technology can tell us what we can do. It can't tell us what we should do. Science can't answer moral questions for us. And when we are our own gods, when we reject the authority of God, when we worship the

Starting point is 00:30:33 God of self, we will bend even science and biological truth to fit what we want. Of course, we see that with gender ideology. And we see that with the so-called marriage between, two men or two women. It's the same math, as we've said many times. Love is love and trans women are women. It's the same kind of circular logic. You're not defining any of those things. So they become whatever you want them to be. We lose sight of reality. We lose side of biological truth because the marriage and the parenting of two men or two women is denying the differences between male and female just as much as gender ideology is. You're saying that men and women

Starting point is 00:31:12 are interchangeable. You're saying there's no important difference between male and female mom and dad in the same way that a gender ideologue would say that a man can become a woman because the two are interchangeable. So that's why I'm just not down with the form of conservatism that's like, yeah, trans women are women is too far. That doesn't make any sense. But love is love. LGB without the T. It's all the same math. It's all the same math. It's all denying the important distinctions between men and women. And they both end up harming children. In this case, of course, it is, again, Rob being a child of his mother or father. And as we talked about, we'll link this description in the episode because my mom said, oh my gosh, that was actually the most disturbing

Starting point is 00:31:56 episode that you've ever done. And I was like, really? We've done a lot of disturbing episodes. But it's so important. It was the episode where we talked about. I think it was the Mother's Day episode. It was the episode where we talked about how there is so much information online, so much evidence online of nannies, whether they're on Reddit or different kinds of chat rooms and even gay couples that are writing articles about this, where the child, if they are raised by two moms, if the child, if they're raised by two dads, at some point in their young life, they are coming forward and saying, well, who's my mom or who's my dad or I want a mom or I want a dad? And the Washington Post had the audacity on Mother's Day to publish this op-ed by this gay man who said,

Starting point is 00:32:44 oh, our toddler child calls one of us mommy because she said she wants a mom. And we think that it's probably a result of the bigotry of our society, but we're just going to go with it at the time. Or we're going to go with it for the time being. And that is, of course, because children need a mom and a dad. They know that they need a mom and a dad. And I do mourn over celebrity couples normalizing and glorifying forced fatherlessness and forced motherlessness. Colton goes on to say, I guess, on a podcast, he says family building isn't always black and white. And he's talking about the surrogacy process.

Starting point is 00:33:26 So knowing that there's a percentage of loss and knowing that there's a percentage of complications, that can happen. it is scary. Is it scary for you or is it scary for the baby that could die as a result of that? What he's talking about is that in egg selling and surrogacy situations, the rate of complications, the rate of loss, they're much higher. They're much higher in these cases than they are in just natural pregnancies because, again, this is a body carrying a baby that is not biologically theirs. And so you're looking at complications and losses that these children are suffering from. And he says kind of flippantly, that's scary. Is it that scary?

Starting point is 00:34:12 Because you are saying, well, it's worth the sacrifice of this child's health in order to obtain this child. You know that the rates of complications and the health problems that the baby can suffer from, that they're much higher in these surrogacy pregnancies, and yet you're, saying, let's go forth with it because I want a baby. Doesn't matter if this child has to spend a month in the NICU again because we purposely created a situation that is riskier for them. Because you just want a child that is extremely self-centered. It's extremely self-centered. On a new episode of The Most Dramatic Podcast ever with Chris Harrison, the former bachelor host, Underwood shared that he and his partner do not know whose sperm was used to conceive the baby.

Starting point is 00:34:56 We told our doctor to put the healthiest embryo in, and then for the next one, switch the genetics. This is so dystopian, so brave new world. I have a good chance we're going to be able to tell, but we sort of did that to protect ourselves. I didn't want people coming up on the streets and being like, who's is it? And we like look at each other. Like it's our kid and our baby. But it's not. It's not.

Starting point is 00:35:21 It's actually not. it is going to be genetically one of yours. And so that's the thing. It's like you make a choice to enter into a fruitless relationship. Like you know that sex between two men, sex between two men and two women cannot produce fruit. And you want to try to somehow skirt that reality by buying the genetic material from one woman, renting the womb of another woman and saying it's our baby. well that's just not how it works you made your choices you decided that that kind of relationship that cannot produce natural children is more important to you than having natural children and the consequences of that is that it can't be both of your children uh the couple has said that whoever is not the biological father of this child would go through the process again for their second child and of course this is all just very sad um now this child of course is is made in God's image. And I hope that this child has a wonderful life and that they know

Starting point is 00:36:32 that they are created by God, loved by God. I pray that they, that this child would know Christ. We had Ross Johnston here on this, on this couch. And it was one of the most popular episodes that we did. He was raised by two women who, who used a sperm donor to create him. And he became a Christian when he was a teenager and he got to know his true father. But he talks about the effects of father loss that he had to go through. And I'm sure ramifications that he is still dealing with to this day. And yet the Lord has used him, has used his testimony to bring others to himself. And I'm so thankful for that.

Starting point is 00:37:18 So I hope that for the children of these two people, of these two, who unfortunately will never know, never know their mother. I saw this commentary on a medical study that was published in PubMed in 2007, or you can see it in PubMed in the National Library of Medicine. And it's titled Cell Migration from Baby to Mother. and Nargis Kisselbash, I think that's how you pronounce her name. This is her commentary on that study that found that there are cells that migrate from the baby and the womb to the mother and then back to the baby. And just listen to the incredible effect and relationship of the baby and the mom.

Starting point is 00:38:26 During pregnancy, some baby cells migrate into the mother's bloodstream and then return to the child. It's called mother fetal microchimerism. For 41 weeks, the cells mix and circulate back and forth, and after the baby is born, many of these cells remain in the mother's body, leaving a permanent imprint in the tissues, bones, brain, and skin of the baby to the mother, and they often remain there for decades. Every other child a mother has will leave a similar imprint on her body. Even if a pregnancy doesn't end, or if you have an abortion, these cells,

Starting point is 00:39:01 still migrate into the bloodstream. Research has shown that if a mother's heart is injured, fetal cells will rush to the injury site and transform into different types of cells that specialize in repairing the heart. The child helps the mother repair while the mother builds the child. This is often the reason why some diseases

Starting point is 00:39:21 fade away during pregnancy. It's amazing how the mother's body protects the baby at all costs, and the baby protects and rebuilds the mother in return so they can safely develop and survive. Let's think about pregnancy cravings for a moment. What did the mother need that the child made her wish? The studies also showed the presence of fetal cells in her mother's brain 18 years after birth.

Starting point is 00:39:46 How wonderful is this? How incredible is God's design? How necessary are moms that imprint on our bodies because of the children. we have carried. Think about the implications when we are talking about abortion. The rejection, not only of your child's body, but of your own body, because you have already had this kind of symbiotic healing relationship with them. And yet even as your child's cells have tried to heal you, you then kill that child. How dark and demonic is that? and how awful and evil then is surrogacy.

Starting point is 00:40:34 You become a part of that child, that child becomes a part of you, and then you rip that child away, again, not even giving the baby an opportunity to bond with the mother that he or she has become a part of. I also read the other day, and as a mom of three, you think you kind of, like, you think you've learned everything about baby development and then you learned something new, that a child, the baby, until about nine months old,

Starting point is 00:40:59 sees the mother and feels that his or her mother is just a part of her body, a part of his or her body. They feel that they are basically still in the womb for the first few months of their life. And I actually see this. It is around nine months old that you watch your baby come to the realization that you've left the room, that they have been left with someone that is not you, whether it's like with a sibling or with a grandparent or with the dad and they all a sudden are turning around and looking for mom. It's like they have developed the awareness that, oh, she is a separate entity that is not a part of my body.

Starting point is 00:41:40 She's not in the room anymore. And I feel that loss. The incredible, the incredible bond that God has created between the mom and the child. And that is why historically fatherlessness has been a much bigger societal issue than motherlessness because it is simply rare for a mother to just be able to sever that bond. Are there bad mothers? Of course there are. Is there motherlessness?

Starting point is 00:42:06 Yes, but it is very rare. It's becoming more prominent, though, because we are purposely manufacturing these motherless children because of the whims of gay men. And that's what's going on here. It's not something to be glorified or celebrated or to be commercialized as a podcast. but it's something to be mourned and to pray about. All right, let's move into our next subject. And that is the, again, commercialization of embryos and the trampoline upon the rights of these young babies made in the image of God.

Starting point is 00:42:48 But in this story, it comes in a different way. And the headline is Aaron Andrews, the sports reporter that a lot of you guys know, she's very famous. She is partnering with Infamil, committing $50,000 to support women struggling with infertility. You're not alone. Now, I do not have anything against, obviously, supporting women who struggle with infertility. That is a heartbreaking condition. It's a heartbreaking road to walk. There are women I know who have suffered with infertility for decades.

Starting point is 00:43:25 There are women I know who, by the grace of God, their infertility, whatever was causing it, has been healed through natural methods and mechanisms. They did not have to rely on IVF. There are women I know who struggled with infertility. They were told IVF is their only option. They went through IVF. They're thankful for their children, but they regret the process that they went through. and so I've spoken to many women who have struggled with prolonged infertility. This is a heartbreaking road, and I commend Aaron Andrews for having a heart for this, absolutely.

Starting point is 00:43:57 But this is not the way to support women. So let me read the summary of this story. She is an NFL sideline reporter for Fox Sports, and she is entering into this partnership and initiative called the Mack Grant, and that is named after her son. that is committing $50,000 to BabyQuest. This is a nonprofit organization that provides financial assistance to people who are unable to afford things like IVF. So that's what she's doing.

Starting point is 00:44:29 She is offering money to couples to use in vitro fertilization. So a little background on her own fertility journey. She is married to Jarrett Stoll. He is a former NHL player in 2016. Her oncologist recommended that she and Stoll. should freeze, well, she should get her eggs retrieved and they should make embryos together and they should freeze those embryos because she was sadly diagnosed with cervical cancer. Andrews Underwent two surgeries.

Starting point is 00:45:02 She was declared cancer-free, but they decided to move ahead with IVF in the event that the cancer returned. and she did several rounds of IVF, nine rounds of IVF over nine years, which I'm sure was so hard on her body, so hard on her mentally and spiritually. But we can't forget the fact that we're also talking about the loss of life. We're talking about the loss of life in an inherently risky process. She said, we lost twins via surrogacy, and that was really hard. I really struggled mentally. I didn't handle it very well.

Starting point is 00:45:42 I kind of tried to push it aside and act like everything was okay. I'm sure that was absolutely awful. She said, I could not stop crying, she says, when she found out that an embryo transfer had resulted in implantation and she became pregnant and she eventually gave birth to that healthy baby and named him Mack. She said, Mac was our golden embryo. He was our last hope. So a lot of loss for her emotionally.

Starting point is 00:46:12 But again, a lot of physical loss of life of children, again, all in service to the wants of adults. Good wants. Good wants to want a child, but doesn't justify this approach to creating life. And so now she is partnering with a company that is making it easier for people to create lots of embryos, to eugenically select, quote unquote, healthy embryo. embryos to freeze embryos. We right now have over a million embryos on ice in the United States, which is just crazy. There are so many quandaries that this can put people in.

Starting point is 00:46:56 I've heard from many of you who are in one of these quandaries. You realize now that it was wrong to go through IVF and you have embryos left on ice. You have, say, two to five embryos that you created with your husband. And you can't have any more children physically because of health complications or whatever it is. Your body has just been through too much. And so you don't know what to do. You pay the freezer fee every month to keep these babies alive. You feel bad doing that.

Starting point is 00:47:29 You can't stand the idea of adopting out your children because you don't know who they're going to end up with. In many cases, there are some private adoption situations where you can select or you can be more involved in the process. and it's very direct, but you don't know what kind of life they're going to live if you allow an adoption agency to adopt out your children. So that can be very hard. And then some women are like, okay, but do I use a surrogate to try to carry my children, to birth them? And then you've got a whole other quandary there because you are renting the womb of another woman. And again, you're breaking the bond at birth. And so it creates such a cascade of ethical problems and that is why I just say to you, if you are considering IVF, don't do it.

Starting point is 00:48:17 Just don't. And I have a wonderful listener who I got to meet a few weeks ago who talked about how her and her husband decided against IVF after years of infertility in part because of information that she heard on the show, all glory to God for that. And they just welcomed a beautiful baby boy via adoption. And wow, that kid has just hit the jackpot because he has. now wonderful, caring, loving Christian parents who get to raise him, and that broken situation was redeemed. Not made perfect. The ideal situation is that we are all raised by our biological

Starting point is 00:48:53 mom and dad who love us. But the next best option is adoption, and she got to play a part in that, which is a beautiful earthly reflection of the gospel that we Gentiles were grafted in. We were adopted by a father. And adoption here on earth is a wonderful reflection of that spiritual eternal reality for the Christian, unlike IVF and the whole reproductive technology profit-driven industry. We've talked about the bioethics of IVF in the past, but just a reminder that IVF has an overall success rate of only 23% the ratio of cycles to live births. 23% success rate for IVF only refers to the number of IVF cycles and not to the number of embryos created in each cycle. There's no broad recommendations or laws that dictate the number of embryos created in an average IVF cycle,

Starting point is 00:49:49 nor are there any laws that require clinics to report how many they create. That is not true throughout the world. America's the Wild Wild West of reproductive technology in places like France and Canada, Canada, in Italy, in the UK, there are much tighter restrictions and regulations around surrogacy and ag retrieval and IVF. It would be much better for us to at least move in that direction. But unfortunately, America is the place for profit. And we very often put profit over ethics. And so I think this is an unfortunate partnership for Aaron Andrews. I understand why she wants to do it. But again, this is just the glorification of the commercialization of

Starting point is 00:50:36 human life. Technology, as we've often said, when it takes us from what is natural to what is possible, Christians have the obligation to ask, but is this moral? But is this biblical? We live in a very disordered society where we sacrifice the well-being of the weakest, of the voiceless and the powerless children for the wants of the most powerful. We saw that during COVID too. It's because children are always the unconsenting subjects of progressive social experiments. Reproductive technology is another example of that, and we just need to catch up. Christians, evangelicals, we got to catch up on this issue. These little baby lives matter.

Starting point is 00:51:17 They matter just as much as the babies in the womb who are being considered for abortion, how we treat the most vulnerable among us matters. And Christians have to be a champion of the most vulnerable as we have. since our inception. We can't turn a blind eye to this just because it is uncomfortable. And again, please don't interpret this as hate for anyone who has gone through these reproductive technologies. I just have learned too much about this. I mean, when you have talked to, for example, if we're talking about surrogacy, when you have talked to a woman who was forced contractually, legally by two men to have an abortion or to allow the child to be born.

Starting point is 00:52:02 born prematurely and to not get any medical help because these two quote unquote dads decided that they no longer wanted the baby. Their surrogate was carrying because that baby might have some kind of health complications. When you hear stories like that, that's not the only story that I've heard like that. It is really hard not to passionately preach against evil practices like that. There's so much more corruption than we even know and talk about on the show. That's why it matters. All right. That's really all we have time for today. We have so much more on my document, on my research document that I didn't get to. But as always, there is so much more to discuss than we actually have time to talk about on this show. We've got a lot of good episodes coming up

Starting point is 00:53:05 next week, some subjects that you guys have been asking me to dive into. that we just haven't had the chance to yet that we will get into next week. And I'm super excited about that. As always, if you've got some feedback, if you've got things that you want us to talk about, you guys are our executive producers. And so feel free to send me a DM on Instagram. And I try to check those. And you can leave a comment on YouTube as well.

Starting point is 00:53:33 If you haven't already subscribed to YouTube or YouTube channel, please do that. and please click the little bell underneath this video so you get notified every time we upload a video that would mean so much. Also, Related Bros, we are going to be announcing our Father's Day merch very soon. Relady gals, make sure that you are staying tuned for that. So you can buy that for the Relator Bro in your life for Father's Day. All right, guys, I will see you back here on Monday.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 1011 | Colton Underwood’s “Daddyhood” Glorifies Motherlessness & Baby-Buying

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