Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 1222 | Zachary Levi on Leaving LA, Childhood Trauma & Church Problems

Episode Date: July 25, 2025

Today, actor Zachary Levi shares his faith journey as well as his big vision for a new media community outside Austin, Texas. We discuss his upbringing, his quest for authentic faith, and his critique of seeker-sensitive churches. We also dive into his transformative experience as a new father, the impact of Hollywood’s broken system, and his passion for building an intentional city grounded in connection and freedom. Plus, we debate love, mercy, and justice, unpacking how they shape a biblical worldview. Share the Arrows 2025 is on October 11 in Dallas, Texas! Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠sharethearrows.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for tickets now! Sponsored by: ⁠Carly Jean Los Angeles⁠: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.carlyjeanlosangeles.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Good Ranchers⁠: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.goodranchers.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠EveryLife⁠: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.everylife.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Buy Allie's new book, "Toxic Empathy: How Progressives Exploit Christian Compassion": ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://a.co/d/4COtBxy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ --- Timecodes: (01:18) Upbringing (07:00) Church culture (16:40) Words-based faith (33:50) What does true justice look like? (43:00) Fatherhood (47:00) Breakthrough with Zac’s mom & brokeness of Hollywood --- Today's Sponsors: Pre-Born — Will you help rescue babies' lives? Donate by calling #250 & say keyword 'BABY' or go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://⁠Preborn.com/ALLIE. Field of Greens — Use code ALLIE at ⁠FieldofGreens.com⁠ for 20% off your first order of superfood supplement for better health and energy! Good Ranchers — Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠GoodRanchers.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and subscribe to any of their boxes (but preferably the Allie Beth Stuckey Box) to get free Waygu burgers, hot dogs, bacon, or chicken wings in every box for life. Plus, you’ll get $40 off when you use code ALLIE at checkout. Paleovalley — When you choose Paleovalley, you’re not just snacking—you’re making a statement. Get 15% off your first order at paleovalley.com, code ALLIE. --- Buy Allie's book, You're Not Enough (& That's Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://alliebethstuckey.com/book⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Relatable merchandise – use promo code 'ALLIE10' for a discount: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://shop.blazemedia.com/collections/allie-stuckey

Zachary Levi is an actor who came out in support of Donald Trump before the last election. And because of that, he suffered a lot of consequences. Today, he's here not to talk as much about politics, but to talk about his faith journey. We will have a good discussion and even a little bit of the debate about some of the things. We believe about the Bible and love and mercy and justice and empathy and logic. Really interesting conversation. Also, he will be talking about. coming a dad for the first time just a couple months ago and his new endeavor to create a city

outside of Austin, Texas so much in this discussion today. This episode is brought to by our friends at Olive. Olive, Olive is helping make America healthy again by showing you the ingredients that are really in your food. I love the Olive app. Use it all the time. Download the Olive app at the app store today. Zachary, thanks so much for taking the time to join me in person. This is so fun. Thanks for having me. And in such an iconic, cool spot. I know. I don't usually record my podcast in the Reagan Center.

And so this is a special treat. Yeah. It's fun. Okay. I want to start from the beginning. I want to hear about your background, your upbringing, and how you became who you are. Big question. Big question.

Okay. Well, I mean, I was, well, I was born in Lake Charles, Louisiana, randomly. My dad just happened to be working there when I popped out. Really? Okay, I didn't know that. And we have family in Lake Charles. Yeah, yeah. But I was two months old when we moved away. So I literally don't know anything about Lake Charles, really. Yeah. Sorry to everybody in Lake Charles. I know some people really like to claim me. And by the way, I'm happy to be claimed by Lake Charles. Happy to. I really have a lot of love for Louisiana.

I've spent a lot of time in New Orleans, specifically. My sister got married there. All kinds of fun stuff. But Ventura, California, which is just 30 minutes south of where we are right now, that was really Grand Central for me. in mine. My mom grew up there. We lived there most of my life, childhood and even young adult life. And, you know, my parents were both, my mom grew up Catholic. My dad grew up somewhere in the Protestant world. I'm actually not a Methodist. I don't know, I don't know, Presbyterian something. And then they found each other in a church in L.A. in the 70s during the kind of hippie Jesus movement. and met and married and had me and my two sisters. I'm the middle boy between two girls,

which was its own adventure. Fun, yeah. And then mom and dad divorced when I was around six years old or something like that. And we grew up with my mom. My dad was more of the kind of, I don't know, liturgic Christian in that like, you know, very, very by the book and all. a lot of ways, still spiritual.

Yeah. But would, you know, go to church on Sundays and go to church on Wednesdays and sing in the worship band and taught Sunday school. And, but we didn't grow up in that. We grew up with my mom who was a, she was far more the like deeply spiritual, kind of like speaking in tongues. Oh, really? As a Catholic.

Well, no, no, she grew up Catholic. She wasn't when she was an adult. No, no, no. Like a lot of Catholics, she. it was very overbearing. It was, you know, she rebelled again. And I don't, I think part of that was also rebelling against her mother who was a very abusive person in her life, unfortunately, and wielded Catholicism in a way to do that.

And unfortunately, a lot of people do that. Catholic and otherwise, they'll wield religion in a way to punish and shame. Right. And Catholicism definitely comes with a lot of that. And so my mom rebelled against that. And that's where she kind of got, you know, know, kind of into the hippie Jesus movement and was then, you know, then, I guess, of the Protestant non-denominational sense after that. Yeah. But we never went to church. My mom, my mom and

dad went to a church in L.A. that eventually became a cult as a lot of churches in the 70s and all that kind of stuff got a little. It was a weird time. It was a weird time. And, but my mom and dad saw the writing on the wall kind of happening and they were like, we got to get out of here. But my mom, I think partly because of the abusive power of her own mother and things that she saw growing up, she just had a, she had a problem with authority and abusive authority. And so, I don't know. I think that was part of it, her not wanting to yield to more pastors who would abuse that power and many, many have, unfortunately. And so, yeah, she was also kind of lazy sometimes. So we just, we didn't, we didn't really grow up going to church. Yeah.

But she would constantly have friends over dinner parties, you know, drinking wine, speaking in tongues, praying over each other, talking about deep philosophical theological things. And so I was surrounded by that my whole life. And then in, I guess like junior high school, I started going to a youth group and then, you know, off and on, hot and cold with youth group through high school. And then after I graduated from high school, I came to the conclusion. I was like, well, I believe a lot of things. I think I believe a lot of things. But I know. know that I believe a lot of those things because my parents first believed them and instructed me in them. And I need to go and find answers for myself. I want to know if I believe these things because they are true and because I genuinely believe them or is it just because of the programming? And so I started to go to church by myself after I graduated high school or as I was kind of graduating High School and I found an incredible church actually pretty quickly in Ventura was called the bridge and it was like the early acts church. I mean it was just it was it was very community driven like everybody knew each other and we would spend time together and we would serve

together and I still to this day I mean you know I'm now living back in Ventura with my my partner and our newborn son. Yeah. I'm so grateful for all of that. But part of it is these friends that I made in this church are still like really wonderful brothers and sisters of mine. And I now get to spend some more time with them 23 years after having left Ventura. And so it was a powerful time and very formative. And I did, you know, and then that, and then I moved to L.A. And then I kicked around in L.A. for a long time going to lots of different churches and found people or, you know, parts of community and different ones. but ultimately wasn't very thrilled or satisfied with a lot of, I don't know, I think,

and I don't think it's just indicative of L.A. Although I think L.A. had some elements that were even more not, you know, my style. And by that, I mean, you know, I'm all about, I'm all about serving your constituents and, like, and, you know, giving people an amazing, powerful time when you gather as a church in a building, because the church is not the building, the church is the people in the building. And but when I would go to certain churches and it ended up being almost all of them, it was like you were going to the God show. Like a performance.

Huge. Yeah. Like the worship team going bonkers. And listen, and I'm not judging any one of their individual hearts. I know that plenty of those people were very earnestly worshiping God. But when you've got like jumbo-trons and full-blown light displays and smoke machines and a jib camera floating over the audience and doing, I'm like, what are we worshiping? What are we actually doing here?

Because I don't think this is about God anymore. This is about like, how can we impress? And also then, you know, how do we dress to impress? And I think, by the way, that's not, there's a lot of people that go to like, you know, Baptist churches. everything for many, many years. And it's like, got to put on your Sunday best for God. Yeah. You got, it doesn't matter what you were all week long, but if you don't put on your

Sunday best, you're going to be disappointing God. You're going to be, because you've got to somehow look apart in order to go and fellowship with other people. And I think that that is so antithetical to God, like entirely antithetical to God. In fact, Christ called the Pharisees out for saving the best places for the elite and for those who were dressed nicely and all that stuff. Yeah. In fact, I wore flip flops to a church.

I don't know if they're even around anymore. I think he was called In His Presence Church. And I ended up going and I was wearing flip-flops. And the woman, the usher, like, or the person, they were like, I was by myself. And they saw me wearing flip-flops. And they're like, yeah, we got a seat right in the front row. It's like, awesome. Great.

I go up to the front row and I'm worshiping and we're doing the whole deal. And my feet started getting a little warm. And so I just kicked my flaps off and I kind of like kicked them under my chair. And then I sat through the whole sermon and everything. It was all right. Whatever. afterwards I had an usher come up to me dressed in his Sunday best not an usher like one of the associate pastors or something and he's like hey um we believe in excellence around here do you believe in

excellence I was like yeah and he says well yeah we're not going to be able to have you sit up front wearing those flip-flops anymore and I was so taken about I was I didn't even know what to say at first I was like what what it's like it's a joke yeah it was crazy And so I was like, okay, and I left. And a friend of mine was actually outside. And I was like, hang on a second. I got to go address this. So I went back inside and I was waiting for this associate pastor to talk to me.

And I was waiting patiently. He was talking to somebody else. And while I was waiting, the head pastor, he sees me waiting. And he goes, hey, how are you doing? He goes to shake my hand. And I was like, hey, I was going to, I can talk to you. Your gentleman over here told me I can't wear flip flops in the front row or something like. And I just need to understand.

is that it doesn't feel very biblical to me that that would be something we're addressing. Didn't Jesus wear sandals? I mean, but and then he made the saying. He goes, well, we believe in excellence. You know, we really got to, you really want to put on your best, you know, before the Lord and stuff like that. And I was like, you've got to. And I started to quote the scripture to him. And as I did that, all these associate pastors started seeing that there was like this, you know, confrontation with the pastor.

And they come in to like protect him. And I was like, this is, I don't even know what world I'm in right now. but this is, and that's, you know, and that is just one of the myriad, you know, I think issues that I find in church, in the modern church. Quick pause from that conversation to remind you about Share the Arrows, y'all, it is only two and a half months away. So now is the time to buy your tickets to make your plans. Come on. And I probably shouldn't be telling you this, but if you use the first name of any of the speakers and 15, you get 15% off. So you'll go to ShareTheero's.com. You go to the Ticketmaster page right there. and you'll see unlock, press unlock and type in, for example, Ginger 15 or Elisa 15 or Sean of 15,

and then you'll see the 15% off discount. This is only for general admission, which is amazing. All the seats are so good, but also there are VIP tickets available. Encourage you to get those if you want to meet the speakers, take pictures with us, see the relatable set, eat dinner with us the night before, have reserved seating. That's all great too. Come by yourself. Come with friends. If you're coming by yourself, I'm working on creating a Facebook group for all of you who are coming together so that you can talk to each other beforehand and share the arrows this year is brought to you by our friends at every life so go to share the arrows.com get your tickets today before we get into the rest of our conversation i do want to

tell you about a new sponsor that i am so excited about y'all i had a call with them last week and i've been just obsessed with their products and i'm so excited and that is paleo valley paleo valley Paleo Valley creates these awesome food products that are so good and so good for you. I need a snack. Like mid-afternoon, I am getting super hungry. I feel like some kind of crash coming my way. And instead of just fueling myself with non-stop caffeine, I would rather fuel myself with protein, but I need something that's quick and easy.

I don't always have time to like make a steak. And that's why I love the beef sticks from Pahlio Valley. these beef sticks are not only organic, they are grass-fed and finished. Sometimes you'll see a grass-fed beef. That could mean that that, you know, cow is eating GMO corn and just like a little bit of grass at the end of his life. That's not true of Paleo Valley. Every single meat product, grass-fed, grass-finished. It is so good. I've also been loving their protein bars. It's sweet. They taste really good, but the ingredients are amazing. And all, also high protein. My oldest has been also loving their bone broth protein. It's so good. You can make

chocolate milk. You can make all different kinds of baked good pancakes with it. Such a good way to get your protein. This is a family owned business. They care about every single product that they put out. And it is really so, so good. Go to paleovalley.com slash alley. Use code alley. You'll get 15% off your order. What an awesome deal. PaleoValley.com code. Allie. I have a couple of thoughts, so many thoughts about what you said. One of the things that I think is interesting is that you're talking about some of these churches that really make it about the show and really make it about the technology they

have, trying to impress the people walking in. And a lot of those churches are considered seeker-sensitive churches. They believe this is what we have to do to be sensitive to the secular world. This is what they want. We're going to give them as good of a show as, I don't know, whatever, select. or whatever artists can give them. And the interesting thing is that you're saying, as someone who was seeking, as someone who was trying to find a church, that was actually a turnoff. So I think there's like a good lesson there for churches to realize you don't have to have all of those

fancy things in order to attract people who are seeking. Would you agree with that? Yeah. Well, yes and no. I mean, I wasn't really seeking at that point. Like I was already very well. You were already there. I was well into my. Well, I was seeking a church, right? Well, I was seeking community. Yeah. that's what the church is. That's what we're called into, I believe. And I think that that's what a lot of churches are kind of missing the mark on, because you can't sustain real community if the only,

if the community is built on a whole bunch of pretenses and visuals and like, this is how we look the part. And then you only meet once a week. Like a lot of people go to church and they know the people they go to church with only at church, but they don't really know those people outside of church. No, that's not everybody. obviously there are some churches out there that are very community oriented. But I think that's where it has to start. Like who are we as human beings? Are we just shown up for each other? Like do you need

help? Can I help you? Like whatever that is. Hey, do you want to go and let's go bowling? Let's, hey, you know, in Ventura, we had this really great thing at the Bridge Church where, and I think to that stay, they do it where we would just go down to the avenue, one of the more impoverished parts of Ventura. And we just help clean up people's yards and take trash out and be like, hey, you need some help. Can we help you? Like the amount of people, I've been told recently, and it bums me out that, Frank, that this quote by St. Francis of Assisi is not actually an Assisi quote. But for the sake of the conversation, we'll just say it is.

It's still to me, like one of the most, maybe the most powerful quotes, I think, particularly as it pertains to those who believe in God and choose to represent God. but it's it's preach the gospel at all times and if necessary use words we don't do that I don't see a lot of that going on in the world I don't see a lot of that going on in the world of Christianity I see a lot of people talking I see a lot of people preaching I see a lot of people judging and shaming and doing all manner of things and and and a lot of you know frankly for a religion that's supposed to be so cornerstoneed on love and the love of God I don't, I personally find a lot of people either find Christianity or at least stay with Christianity,

not because of love, but it's because of fear. Because they're ultimately told, well, if you don't, if you don't do this, then you're going to burn in hell for the rest of eternity. And oh, that's such a, that's a bummer, you know. I have some thoughts. Do you mind if I kind of push back with my perspective? Go ahead. Really quick, just to finish the secret thing. I think it's folly to, um,

I think it's folly to think that we need to somehow design or engineer an experience that's seeker friendly. Yeah. Like being overly seeker friendly. I agree. I think what need to happen, what need happen is tearing down all of the stuff that we've built on top of the normal churchgoing experience so that it's just real and authentic. and it's from our actual earnest hearts of wanting to be conduits of God's love in this world.

And when you do that, seekers feel that. Like, it doesn't need to be God plus. We don't need to sell God. You just need to sell the truth. You just need to tell the truth. You don't need to sell the virtues of a relationship with God as much as you just need to talk about it authentically and share that. and I think that anybody who's genuinely seeking will feel that. So anyway, that's my, on the, on the secret bit of it.

But by all means, what were you going to say about the other stuff? I appreciate, I appreciate that. And I agree about the seekers-sensitive model. I think a lot of times it just leads to compromise and superficiality. And like you said, that's not really what people are looking for. You can get a light show anywhere. But as you said, it's hard to find that true community that is based on God's unconditional love. My thought about that quote, because I've heard that quote,

a lot that preach the gospel, use words if necessary. And while I understand it's sentiment and definitely Christians are called to action-based love. And we read in James that faith without works is dead. And we see the model in Christ that he fed the hungry and he helped the poor and he reached out to the truly vulnerable and marginalized. But also, like, Christianity is based on words. It is based on the call of Jesus in Matthew 28 to go out and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, preaching to them, telling them the gospel. And in fact, in John 1, we read, the name for Jesus' logos, the word made flash who dwelt among us,

who came and became light and darkness by telling us the gospel, and telling us what frees us from sin. And so Christianity is very different than, say, Judaism, or Islam who uses a certain method to try to bring people to the faith, and Judaism isn't evangelistic, Buddhism, which values silence is holiness. Christianity says, no, go out and preach the gospel, go out and tell people the truth. I'm not saying the actions don't matter because they do, but Christians, we necessarily have a public and a word-based faith. and that is one, I think, really important distinction about what Christians believe.

Yeah, maybe. I don't know. I don't know that personally. I don't think it's a word-based faith. I think it's a love-based faith. And I think that's where it has to start. Well, God is love. First John 4-8.

We know that. And the word is God. So that's John 1. And so to me, it would seem that it's both. Like if God is love and Christianity is based on God, is based on Christ, and he is love. And he shows us that how one way we can love other people is tell them the truth about what can free them from sin. To me, it seems that those are kind of inextricably intertwined.

Well, I mean, okay, and one could argue that nobody cares how much you know until they know how much you care. and if you're not leading first and foremost with that love, then all the words that you tell somebody are in one ear and out the other. And quite frankly, this is one of the problems I think with, there are so many people who have already rejected Christ because of Christianity, because of Christians. I think Gandhi has this great quote,

I love your Christ, but I cannot stand your Christians. There's something I'm paraphrasing. But what he's trying to say is that there are plenty of people that stand in the name of Christianity. Christianity, I mean, there are a lot of things that people have done historically, the Inquisition and all that kind of stuff. That wasn't love. That was a lot of punitive damage. That was a lot of shame and blame and death. And even now, there's a lot of people who carry themselves and profess to be Christians who I don't think are leading with love at all.

They lead with the shame. They lead with, oh, this person's not doing this right. And that person's not doing that right. And you know, this is what God says. It's like, well, yes, according to the Bible, according to the scripture, according to the document that you believe to be, the right document, that's what that says. But you're talking to a bunch of people that don't know that, don't believe that. So how do you, you can't just, I mean, honestly, I think this is a, this is a big folly within a lot of Christians and Christianity is when you just start quoting scripture to people that don't know it and don't believe in it because that doesn't resonate with them. What resonates with them is when you go and say, hey, how you, how can, forget anything I

believe. You don't have to believe anything I believe. But I'm going to show you that I believe it by my actions. I'm going to show you the power of what this did in my life without ever telling you these things. And that opens up someone's heart to want to receive the things that you believe, that you believe in this document. So I think it has to start that way. And, and, and, and, that allows the conversation to be a genuine one. Because when it doesn't happen that way, again, what I find is that a lot of people convert to Christianity, but it's, it comes at this because they're afraid. They're afraid that they're going to burn in hell. They're afraid of this eternal damnation. Well, there is one element of the fear of consequences

that does come with Christianity. And I don't think that's bad, but I agree with you. It should be motivated by love. Love. And I agree with so much of what you're saying that words, we both agree, that words without action and posturing without the life behind it, you mentioned the Pharisees, that Jesus called out the Pharisees, but not because they were wearing fancy clothing, not because they were praying, but because they were like whitewashed tombs. And so on the outside, they looked great, but they were decaying on the inside, not because they followed the law too closely or they preached the law too ardently, but because their hearts weren't in alignment with what they were saying.

So I think that we agree, I think that at least in Christianity, that the word that the evangelism, that saying what is right and what is wrong, is actually important. It doesn't mean that we have to, you know, preach scripture in every situation to someone who doesn't believe scripture. There might be a time and a place, although the word of God never returns void. But also, we do back that up. We do couple that with living a life of integrity and love and service and self-sacrifice and generosity. I would say, I would say most Christians actually do that really well. Yes, there are going to be sinners. There are going to be people who use religion for power and for leverage and for abuse. And I think that's especially egregious.

But in general, throughout history, I would say it's been a huge net positive what Christians have done for the world in Western civilization in comparison to paganism. I'm not thrown the baby out with the bathwater. I believe religion writ large, I mean, even outside of Christianity, other religions God used to help bring structure, to bring order, to bring civilization to what that which was uncivilized prior. So I'm totally in agreement with that. In Corinthians, and I won't even begin to butcher it, but in fact, you can pull it up. It's in 13 right around the verses that everyone loves to have at weddings, you know, love his patient, love is kind. Yeah, 13. But before

that, it's some, to me, some of the most powerful verses in the Bible. And the New Testament, which is you can have all of the knowledge and speak in all of the tongues and do all of those things, but have not love and you are nothing. You're missing the entire point. And then he finishes, Paul finishes, I'm pretty sure Paul wrote great. You're right. It finishes 13 with, but these three remain faith, hope, and love, but the greatest of these is love. like there are so many moments throughout specifically in the new testament where it's driven home over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again it's love usurps all of it love is more powerful than all of it so if you're not starting from

there if you're not starting from this place i don't know what the point of going and trying to preach is because you're preaching from that place that is kind of there is kind of not I don't know. So that's why I'm so passionate about that kind of stuff. Yeah. Next sponsor is Good Ranchers. I love Good Ranchers. We make it almost every night.

I love their beef. Their Wagyu beef is really good. All of their cuts of steak are amazing. Chief Related bro is definitely the griller in our family. And whenever he makes Good Rancher's steaks, I am so excited. Pair that with like some green beans, sweet potato. I mean, you just can't beat it.

I love their better than our game. chicken that's probably our kids favorite. They've got seed oil-free chicken nuggets. They've got bacon that we eat multiple times a week. This is another family Christian-owned America-loving company that you need to support because they are supporting American farms and ranches. Every single bit of their meat comes from only American farms and ranches. That is not true of the vast majority of meat you find in the grocery store. Go to good ranchers.com slash alley. When you use my code, Allie, you'll get an extra $40 off your order. That's good ranchers.com. slash alley code alley.

Don't you think it's important that we define love as God defines love? Like if God is love and he's the one that's telling us to love, because you might agree that the culture today kind of defines love however they want to. Like is love lust? Is love, I don't know, predation? Is it romantic infatuation or is it something else? And I think it's really important for us to distinguish what that is because if God is love, then it makes sense that he gets to define it, right?

Certainly. the best definition of love that I've ever heard, I think comes from Thomas Aquinas, who, if you follow it far enough back, it goes to like Aristotle or something like that. But to love is to will the good of the other. It's to will the good of the other. You want whatever person is across from you, on the other side of the world from you, you want their good. We, I think all too often, we categorize people into who is worthy of that love and who is

not worthy of that love. I think God calls us into that kind of love, which is why Christ says to love your enemies and pray for your persecutors. It's easy to love those who love you. That's not really what we're being called into. We're being called into something that requires us, I believe, to see every, single person, every enemy, every persecutor, every friend, family, everyone in between, people, terrorists, murderers, everything, to be able to see them as a beloved of God,

a beloved. And if you can truly see that, if you can see that once upon a time they were a child that had all these different possibilities in their life. But the route that they're on, which by the way, doesn't ever absolve anyone of the responsibility for the route that you're on or the decisions that you make or negate justice. But how we implement that justice must come from a place of some empathy where we recognize that that person is in fact a product of their environment. They were, well, did you have a choice in who your parents were? Well, I'm, hold on just, just quick. My only hmm is whether or not that should factor

into our like legal justice decisions. But that's, that was my only hmm. Well, well, Let's put the legal justice to the side for a second. I'm just asking, I'm asking, how does God see us? Does God see murderers or does he see someone that is his beloved? Or why are we singing in church when we're kids? Jesus loves the little children. Well, he certainly cares about that. All the children of the world.

Yes, but God obviously has consequences for sin. Yes, but both eternal and temporal. Even if, even if he loves us, which he does, because like you said, we're all made in the image of God. And I'm not even arguing that we shouldn't see, you know, the situation that someone is in and try to understand that. My only, like, aside, and maybe we'll get into this later is whether or not that should affect the legal justice that we implement. No, that's why I said it doesn't absolve anyone of their decision making. We're still responsible for the decisions we make.

That's part of how we learn. As part of how we grow, right? I'm with you on that. But that must be informed. however we decide to reprimand this person should be informed through the filter of God's love, of us loving, not looking at people like their monsters and villains and horrible. Yes, people commit heinous, vile, horrible acts. Those acts, I believe, are the darkness.

But I think that we, I personally believe that if we were to look at everyone through the lens that God looks at us through, we would see that child. that's what we need to practice more. We need to see the little five-year-old in everyone and go like, wow, you've done some crazy bad stuff. But I also recognize that what led you to doing those things isn't because you're sitting around this five-year-old twisting their little McAvelli and mustache and being like,

how can I go mess some stuff up in this world? They didn't choose the parenting that they got. They didn't choose the community that they got, the society they were born into, the religion that they were forced to go oftentimes to believe, even they the genetics the nature and the nurture they didn't choose any of that and i think it's folly for us to not consider that as we view people because i think god who knows all sees all of that and judges very fairly through all of that if god is in fact a just god and i believe that god is a

just god and knows everything then clearly god in his eternal love is looking at any one of these people that does heinous horrible things and still sees the beloved in that person. I have to believe. Yes. I think that God has immense compassion for people more than we can even understand because all the factors that you just listed, I mean, God not only knows those, but knows every single secret private moment of, you know, whatever it is, violence or oppression or injustice that that person has endured. And so I completely agree with you. And maybe we're not even having a conversation about legal justice at all. Maybe we're only talking about interpersonal relationships in which I would agree with you. But at the same time, something's got to give, especially when it comes to legal

justice. So, like, what do you think it looks like practically? Say you have someone, and I'm genuinely asking what you think. Like, if you've got someone who did have a really difficult upbringing and you're like, wow, they only knew violence. They were abused by their parents. They joined a gang when they were 12 because that's the only thing they knew. And now they're 21 and they just. you know, committed double homicide. Like, sadly, I still think the result needs to be maximum punishment for the lives that he took because ultimately those are the victims and those people were image bears of God too and their lives matter. It doesn't mean we don't have compassion for them. But when I start hearing, we have to think about their background. And I just see,

I just see that as kind of mitigating or inhibiting legal justice and the protection of victims and potential victims. Right. And this is where I think, and I thank you for wanting clarification on it, because I think this is where a lot of these conversations break down. I am by no means, listen, I think that God wants us to all act

in really deep empathy and really deep logic simultaneously. If you have too much empathy, it's toxic empathy, and you're like, well, they were abused, and it doesn't matter that they bombed and blew up all these people or the murder double homicide, like, you know, give them a break. It's like, hang on a second. You're not balancing the empathy that we should have with logic, which is you can't just do that. There are repercussions.

There are consequences to our actions. And when there are not consequences to our actions, then people who are still lost in darkness in their flesh and who want to take advantage of systems will go hog wild. I mean, look what happened in California. When all of a sudden they said, hey, if you steal less than $1,000 worth a product, then we just aren't going to go after you and we'll let you out of jail and all that stuff. It was wildfire and not the actual wildfires in California,

but a wildfire of crime spree. San Francisco to this day right now is still reeling from it. CVS is closing left, right, and center because they're like, we can't sustain this, right? So obviously there have to be guardrails. There have to be things. When we go and we sentence someone, let's say Maxim is life in prison.

Let's say. There's a way to go and sentence someone to life in prison where you stick them in a hole and you treat them like garbage and a monster for the rest of their life. Yeah. Or they can still be in a prison away from the general population, keeping other people safe, whatever it is. And you can minister to that person through love. And by the way, there are lots of organizations that do this.

They will go to prisons. Yeah. And they will intentionally go to these people that have been cast away. way by society and said, you're done with your gross, your evil, you're vile. You should have died. You're lucky you got life in prison. And they go to this person and say, I still see the child of God and you. Yeah. And I think that you are worthy of love. And they pray for them. And they love them. They love that kid inside back to life so that that that version of them gets to live. And here's the thing about justice. First of all, it's not ours. It's his.

right? And yes, we have to be used to bring order. I don't disagree with that. And I do think people need to be held accountable for their actions. But again, through the filter of that love, which doesn't negate consequences. It just means it's how we ultimately treat that person in the midst of that, hoping to will the good of that person, that they are not so far gone, that their soul can't experience that love right now on earth. And I believe with everything in me, that is what brings more healing and forgiveness and closure to that double homicide, those families that were affected by those people dying. Do they get some kind of closure because some earthly justice has been done and this person

was put in prison for the rest of their life? Maybe. Yeah. But do they get real closure, real, real healing in the same way that if that person who, let's say in court, and I've seen just, oh, just. horrible videos of people that are on trial for doing something heinous and they're just like laughing. Yeah. And the pain that that family must be feeling because that person feels no contrition whatsoever. And they don't get the, they don't get it. But when somebody can actually

down the road come to this family in true repentance and apologize for what they've done, that's, that's what we need more of. Because punishment on punishment on punishment. If we just, that's like, it's generational trauma. We just keep throwing down the line. That person, maybe they don't get life in prison. Maybe they get 40 years in prison. And then we just treated them like a junkyard dog.

So when they get out of prison, they're far more likely to go back to the same horrible life that they were already killing people in. That's not stopping the cycle. That's not helping the process. I don't think. Yes, there are consequences. But may we try to do them in a way where we're actually, wanting to will the good of that other and see the child of God in them, the beloved that they are,

and help them to get back to the light. Yeah, love is better than empathy. Empathy, I think, is neutral. It's neither good nor bad. It can lead you toward love or it can lead you towards cruelty. It really depends upon what you're submitting your empathy to, because empathy is so powerful. I was just talking to another guest about this, that Abigail Shrier wrote this amazing book. And I wrote a book called toxic empathy, but I talked to her about this first. And she cited this study by someone named Paul Bloom, who is a Yale psychologist. And he wrote actually a book called Against Empathy. And he's not really against all empathy, but he looked at this study that the more empathy is emphasized in schools, the meaner kids are to the out group. And I know

that's not what you're talking about. I just think that's interesting because when we We focus so much on how we feel or how someone else feels, whoever we think is against the person that we are feeling so strongly for. And I think this actually agrees with what you're saying. And I think this is actually a reason for the political divide in some ways. Whoever we see is against our chosen victim, the person that we're caring for, we can become cruel to them. We can become mean to them.

And we refuse to see their experience or where they're coming from. we only see the perspective of the person we perceive as a victim that we're taking care of. And I think that explains, at least a lot of progressives who I think are highly empathetic, a lot of why you see them feel so deeply for someone who is, say, an immigrant, but they cannot feel at all for someone who is like, yeah, well, I'm a legal immigrant and I'm against illegal immigration. No ability to see that perspective. Not saying the right doesn't have our own issues.

But in particular, that like deep feeling empathy that can blind you to objective reality. It's a very pervasive issue. Next sponsor is Field of Greens. So I love meat and potatoes. Like I could eat some form of that every single meal. It is very difficult for me to cook vegetables, not ability but desire to cook and eat vegetables. So I want to get the nutrients from the vegetables without actually having to cook and to taste them. And that's why I love field of greens. I mean, their greens powders are so good. They taste. amazing without a bunch of fake ingredients, all of the ingredients that they have in their powders are organic. And I was surprised to find out that a lot of these health food companies that have

these greens powders, that they don't actually use organic fruits and vegetables. So you're giving the pesticides and stuff that you don't want. You don't have to worry about that with field of greens. I'm about to get my blood work done. And so I'll let you all know how that goes. I think that after taking field of greens that I'm going to see some really positive results. And because my iron levels and all of the nutrients that you get from these vegetables, they really make a difference in how you feel and what's going on in your body. So go to field of greens.com. Use my code Alley.

You'll get 20% off and free shipping with my code fieldofgreens.com code Alley. Tell me about fatherhood. What has it been like since your son was born? Boy. It is just, like to say it's the best thing, that I've ever experienced in my I mean he's only just over two months old and I can already tell you and I think a lot of parents can um it's powerful from even before they're born but certainly once they're in the world like the profundity of what it means that a god gave us the ability to actually

create that life yeah that he imbues and that you are fully responsible for and two but that's so much the blessing that you are given. Like we don't grow and evolve and become better us, better uses because we weren't challenged. It's in those challenges. It's in those like, whoa, you know, this is massive. This is so big. But I've always known that deep down in my heart.

I think I came into this world. I think we all do. We were imprinted with so much in our psyche, in our soul, in our calling, in our purpose. And certainly an aspect of my calling and purpose in this life was to always be a father. I always knew it. People my whole life would tell me like, why don't you a dad? I'm like, it hasn't happened yet, all those things. But I will say, though, I'm very grateful that I didn't have a child and didn't become a father until this point in my life.

Because even eight years ago, I had a massive, massive mental brain. breakdown, like didn't want to live legitimately anymore. And thank God, I found the therapy that taught me to love myself for the first time in my life and heal so much of the unheeled trauma that I'm, that I still continue to, you know, like, like layers of an onion work through. But if I would have had a child before I had that breakthrough in my life, the amount of unknown trauma, unheeled trauma that I would have been spilling off onto them their whole lives just like my mom did and didn't mean to. Um, so yeah. So I've been, I've been preparing for it and been readying for it and wanting it my whole life. And so it's so dreamy. My son, Henson, Ezra, Levi Pew is acronym of help. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that. Um, and Ezra means help, helper. And, uh, he is just the grievous little nugget. I just love him so much. And Maggie, my partner is an incredible mom. And, and, you know, we're just, we're journeying through this. And every parent will tell you it is a roller coaster of all the emotions and everything. But it's been so already like the amount of, I don't know, just revelations that God has, has given me as soon as he was born. I was holding him minutes after he's born. I'm looking down to his little face and immediately transported to my parents looking down

on my little newborn face and with all the hope and all the promise and all the love and all of the things that I know that they wanted for me and wanted to do for me in my life. Regardless how however all that ended up going, that's where that started with so much love. So it gave me just even more. I mean, I tear up because it's just, it's cathartic. It's like, it's like letting go of so much fear and so much anger and so much unresolved trauma and unforgiveness and all of those things that weigh us down. That is darkness.

It weighs us down. And God wants us free of all of that stuff. It's all of its stuff. So having a child has been a hugely important modality of that type of therapy in my life. You know, just giving me more grace, more love for my parents. Yeah, you do have a lot of grace for your parents. I mean, I have wonderful parents. But you have a lot of understanding when you have your own kids.

And that's not to excuse. Like I know that you said that you were psychologically abused. No, no, no, no, no. It doesn't excuse it at all. I didn't want you to hear me saying that. But it just does give us a little bit more perspective and proper empathy for, you know, what our parents were thinking and feeling at the time and all the complicated layers of that. Yes.

Can you talk a little bit more about, you said, you had a breakthrough that had to do with your upbringing and your mom. Can you talk a little bit more about that? Yeah. I mean, I, because of my life up to, you know, 37, that was 37 when it all kind of came crashing down. but, you know, it was a long, it was a childhood full of lots of psychological, not physical abuse, thank God, but lots of just mental, emotional, psychological abuse from a mother who, like I said, was highly abused herself prior to that.

Yeah. And it doesn't absolve her of her actions, but it explains them and gives me more empathy for how that came to be. And also, therefore, allows me to forgive and let go because it wasn't personal. It literally wasn't. It was her trying to survive her own mental illness. that she was unaware that she had and was fighting with. And so that was, you know, a whole lifetime of that.

And being the only boy in my family, my parents divorced, and I'm the only boy between two girls and my mom and my aunts and my grandma and my cousin and family outings would be like go shopping at JC Pennings. I mean, it was like, you know, I'd go find the circular clothing rack and make a little fort and go hang out because I'm like, or beg my mom for another Nintendo game. But I knew very, very, very early on like four years old. I knew the calling on my life to go.

be an entertainer. And that's exactly where God brought me. And but then I ended up in a, just a very broken industry. You know, I could see the writing on the wall when I first jumped into it. I assumed it was probably going to be a pretty inhumane. Um, I assumed incorrectly, though, that the inhumanity was somehow like this price that everyone in the industry paid to be a part of this industry that like makes these great movies and TV shows. But the reality is that, certainly since I started working in the industry, um, that is a miracle to make great. things in Hollywood because most of, not all, but most of the ruling class of executives and producers and they don't, they might, they might say that they care about making a great movie,

but at the end of the day, they don't really care about making a great movie. They just care about making a movie and then using whatever marketing propaganda they can to get people to go buy tickets. That's it. So it's just about money. For most of the people in Hollywood, yeah, unfortunately. Do you think? that's gotten worse. Yes. Because me, just as a viewer, it seems like there's just not a whole lot of original storylines out there. Everything seems to be like a remake or a repeat. And it's kind of sad to me. Yeah. No, I mean, listen, I think it, I think that like I said earlier, the model's been

broken since the very beginning. Charlie Chaplin, Mary Pickford, Douglas Fairbanks, all those like Titans of the Silent Era, they started United Artists Studio because they saw it was all really broken. And you have a lot of people that are lost in power, money, hungry egos that aren't really the visionaries or creatives, but they are telling the creatives what to do. And oftentimes in doing that screwing up the creative process. And if they happen to not, or if let's say they might, you have a decent note here or whatever, but let's say they don't screw it up. That's a miracle. And then for it to succeed, it succeeded in spite of their meddling. And yet they still take the lion's share of the money and the win and everything else. And the artists and,

and, you know, they can get the scraps of the rest of that. That's been going on since the beginning. Yeah. There have been studio heads, visionary maverick leaders that were creatives throughout the years. There's no doubt about it. And they were responsible for finding and fostering great directors and producers and writers and actors and crew.

But unfortunately, that was few and far between. And now it's pretty much all gone because since the 80s, it's all just become way to come off. monetized and corporatized and run by lawyers and accountants. And it's like, what are the bottom lines, right? Once you go public and you have shareholders, the whole game just becomes, how do you please shareholders? And that's always better margins and better bottom lines. And if that's the thing that drives whatever you make, you're going to start making a thing that is worse and worse and worse and worse and worse. That's math, guys. That's literally what's happened to every

industry because you don't have industrialists that just hold the line and say, I don't care about if the shareholders want to sell their stock, then they can sell their stock. I'll let them sell it to people who understand that this is a long play and that their stock is going to value in a slower rate and become far better because we're making something that actually means something in the world, that actually has value in the world. I think Elon Musk has actually been a perfect example of doing that. Nobody was making anything great as far as electric cars. In fact, the car companies and oil companies we're all basically conspiring so that we wouldn't have electric cars. And by the way, there's a whole other conversation about if they're even greener for the

environment. But that's that's another conversation. The point is electric cars, nobody wanted to do anything about that. And Elon was like, I'm going to do that. And I'm going to make them awesome. And he made them so awesome by creating a company that actually values the awesomeness and the excellence of that and treating his employees as well. Shocker, that's boated well for the bottom line of those shareholders, right?

again, you can argue him recently being political wasn't great for these stocks. But I don't think that that's not going to rebound on some level because if you hold to the ethics of the integrity of make great things and take care of the people that are helping you make those great things, that's the company that you want to build. Okay. So tell me how you're about to do that or you're wanting to do that in Texas, right? Yes. Yes.

Sorry, just because we went off on a tangent and I just wanted to land the plane with you. Sure. So after the lifetime of whatever my childhood was and all that stuff, then I went into Hollywood and it was very broken. And there's lots and lots of trauma that comes from that too. And it was all these things that I hadn't resolved and I didn't know I didn't resolve until it all caught up with me. When I moved to Austin to eight years ago to go and buy land to build what I believe has been my calling the God has put on my life, my whole life, which was not just to go and be in the entertainment industry, but to be a leader of positive change. wherever God calls me, and he happened to call me there, and to fight for a better world for as many people as I possibly can

and use my platform to do that. And so when I got my first look behind the curtain and I saw how all the sausage was made in Hollywood 25 years ago, I was like, God, I don't know how to do this. This is so broken. He's like, aha. Yeah. Last sponsor is preborn.

You guys know how much preborn life matters to me, how near and dear pregnancy centers are to my heart. That's why we raise so much money and donate so many items to pregnancy centers. This audience has been so generous, but these pregnancy centers rely on preborn to be able to serve their clients, to serve these moms in need because preborn supplies pregnancy centers across the country with the tools that they need to serve these women. In particular, they offer these sonogram machines that can be very expensive but can be so crucial and getting a woman to make the decision that affirms the life and the dignity of her child.

Because when a woman sees that life inside her body, she knows it's not just a clump of cells. That is a living human being that she needs to protect. And if you donate $28 to pre-born, you are covering the cost of one ultrasound session. But whatever you can donate, maybe it's $2.80. Maybe it's $28,000. And you contribute to saving the lives of thousands of babies, whatever you can contribute, that will echo in eternity and can contribute to saving a life here on Earth. So go to preborn.com slash alley to donate today. That's preborn.com slash alley. I know that you just kind of explained the shareholder problem, but I don't want to gloss over. We were talking before the camera started running about that brokenness specifically.

What was it that you saw that you were like, yeah, nope, don't want to be a part of that, going to do something else? Well, again, so it's the value structure is entirely upside down. Yeah. They're not valuing the product and they're not valuing the people making the product. They're valuing the bottom line. So it's profit over people and not the other way around. You've got to value people over profit.

If you want, genuinely, if you want to make a company in any industry, that leaves a really, you know, ROI, not just of investment, like return of impact. Yeah. Like to actually have a great impact on this world. and hopefully, you know, if we're remembered at all in 10, 20, 100 years, whatever it is, that that's what you're remembered for because you didn't just take the money and run. You were like, no, I made a bunch of money. And also, I want to keep reinvesting it into this area, into these people, into this state, into this country, into this world.

I want to do that. So, but I saw that wasn't Hollywood right out of the gate. And then on top of that, you have lots of other issues, like part mixed up with all of that bad, you know, financial valuing and structuring. You have an entirely opaque back end, meaning you could have a deal that says you make, you know, X percent, 10 percent of the back end of the receipts of a movie or a TV show or whatever it is. The chances of you ever seeing that money are so slim because what a lot of creatives, what a lot of executives who might not be creative, what they're very creative at is a creative accounting. And they're constantly just claim poverty. And they're like, oh, no, we didn't really, well, there was so much money in P&A that we, you know, we'd barely made the money back.

and nobody made any money. I mean, everybody, since I was 18, 19 in the business, for 25 years, everybody complains about this, but nobody really did anything because it's just this, this, you know, it's its own system. It's very difficult to do anything outside of that entire ecosystem. Yeah. As well as, you know, when I started in the industry, I was very blessed that, you know, the first 10 years of my career, I got to work on two shows that shot in L.A.,

but I was watching all my friends and all these other people, constantly getting shipped out to all these other places living this like oil rig life like you know saying goodbye to their wife and kids and community and saying like see in a few months and the amount of marriages that suffered from that the amount of communities children's relationships with their parents like there's got to be a better way this we we shouldn't have to just chase incentives yeah because then you know like I'll go do a film and there's 300 people on that crew I want to be able to know all of them I want to be able to know their children like when I was doing TV I was able I knew my whole cast and my whole crew. We knew each other's families. That was a community and I wanted to do that forever.

But with films, you meet 300 people and it's like, see you never. After like two, three months, you're like, see you never. Maybe we'll get to work together again. That is not good for our soul. We were not built to not be in community. And community, in my opinion, is not who you necessarily live next to. There are plenty of us to live in neighborhoods that have no community because you don't know your neighbors. And therefore, by the way, you don't trust your neighbors. If you don't really know your neighbor, then that's why so many people want to helicopter their parents now, or a helicopter their kids nowadays. Because you don't really know your neighbors. So I was like, I don't know. Can little Billy go run it right as bike until the lights come on? That's what I did, right?

I don't know if I want Billy doing that because I don't know any of these people. Community is really more, in my opinion, who are you co-laboring with? Who are you co-working with? Who are you co-creating with this is how we were built for thousands of years of hunter gather ourselves we were bands predominantly of men off doing the hunting and women doing the nurturing and the gathering and we had community even went apart we had community and we could rely on each other and know each other and trust each other and knew each other's kids because we helped bring them up together in the world you know obviously cities are a little more complicated than groups of 150 people or whatever, you know, a tribe would be before it would normally break off.

But there's got to be a way to get back to the heart of that. And so that was one of the things that I felt God tapping me on the shoulder and being like, Zach, this is what you need, this is what you need to go and do. You're not just going to go create a better movie studio that values the artists and values the art and therefore values the audience. You're going to create a movie studio that's also a living community because our communities are broken. We all believe for far too long this non-reesome.

nonsense, American Western dream, which is if you have the right job and make the right amount of money and you have the right spouse and they have the right job and they make the right amount of money and you have the right house and the right neighborhood and you have the right cars and you have the right amount of kids and they go to the right schools and you go on the right vacations and all the other right things and you're going to be happy. Then you did it. Then you won. And so many of us have fallen victim to this lie and the propaganda that we're constantly hit with every day with more ads for, don't you want the new this and don't you need the new that and you don't need any of that stuff. You don't it. We could all live fall.

more minimalistic lives and live in a tighter community. The Amish, who people have mocked for so long, the Amish have been doing so much right for so long, because that's what we were called to, at least on the community aspect and working together. They can build Barnes. I mean, have you seen what they're doing in Western North Carolina? Those people are saints. They are stepping up when an entire government failed them.

Fortunately, Donald Trump has tried to fill some of that gap and he's been helping the people of Western North Carolina. But anyway, that's another tangent. So what God called me to do was, it's not just go fix the broken Hollywood system. It's like those are humans that make up that system. Fix as many things for their lives as you possibly can. So give them better schools for their kids,

get them, you know, that are actual education and not indoctrination. And by the way, as we're moving into this new world of AI, what are we teaching our kids? Like every parent out there, my kid's two and a half months. I got a ways before this happened.

but kids that are in school right now, make sure that you are, they're out of school where they're learning something that will be valuable once all of these AIs and robots that are, you know, motivated through AI. They're all going to start taking all of the jobs,

guys, all of the jobs. I don't mean to be a doomsday person about it, legitimately, but yeah. So anyway, so schools for their kids and further adult education for anybody who wants to keep learning new things,

new crafts, new trades, whatever. Okay, So this is beyond just an entertainment studio. You were thinking really big. I'm thinking, I mean, yeah, it's like an intentional city. I mean, we're starting with just the first phase. We're raising $40 million in equity.

If anybody out there wants to be a part of it, let me know. Go to wildwood, austin.com. We have all the information there. And some of this, and you have to go, and I promise I would keep you on schedule for your next obligation. I'm good. I'm good. But, and part of this was inspired by all of the stuff that happened with the vaccine mandates in Hollywood too, right? And just like your desire for freedom and autonomy. Was that a part of this at all?

I mean, I guess on some level, this all, truthfully, I just think that what we need across the world is we need to be able to live actually truly free lives to be able to have actual liberty and autonomy within your life. Like I'm more libertarian than anything else in that regard. Like I, if someone wants to go do something weird and wacky in their life, like, I'm not, go do that. So long as your liberty doesn't affect my liberty. So that's what I'm trying to build in the ethos of Wildwood. Like I welcome diverse opinions and thoughts so long as those people are being driven by both empathy and logic. So that if we have a difference of opinion, we can sit down and actually hash through and talk about it and we can learn from each other.

Yeah. So, you know, but yes, as far as like, I don't think anybody. should have been mandated to get the vaccine. Certainly, I can only speak for my industry. And there were lots and lots and lots of people that were mandated essentially said, you either get it or you don't work. And that's a mandate, you know. Yeah. So through fear, through coercion, that was forced on a lot of people. And I think that was egregious. And I think that that, quite frankly, is illegal. And technically is illegal, particularly when you break down all of the fact that what we were being, you know, coerced into taking. If you go look at the data now,

and you see it's ineffectuality that it didn't help anybody. It didn't keep you from getting sick and it didn't keep you from spreading it. So ultimately then, why were we shaming people for not joining in that? That was really tragic. That was really tragic. So I don't think that was right. But that aside, yes, I think people should have the autonomy to either, if another one floats around the world, God forbid, I would want people to have the freedom to say,

that's for me or that's not for me. I choose to believe this data or I choose not to. believe that data. We should be able to have that. And also, yeah, not be blacklisted because we say, hang on a second. I have some questions and I have some concerns. Questions and concerns, if brought politely and respectfully, should always be engaged with. What do you have to lose? Other than people who are building their argument on really, really thin ice and they know it deep down. They haven't really thought through everything. Those are the people that don't want to entertain any question or concern because they don't know to answer those questions or concerns.

and they certainly don't want to let this ice break because their whole identity goes down in the water with it. Okay, I think we have to end there. We got to end it. I know. Thanks, everybody. Thank you so much, Zachary, for taking the time to share your thoughts.

I really appreciate it. Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me.