Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 194 | A Failing Impeachment Strategy | Guest: Andrew Klavan

Episode Date: December 6, 2019

Andrew Klavan, author, screenwriter, and host of “The Andrew Klavan Show” at the Daily Wire, joins me to discuss his thoughts on the 2020 election, impeachment hearings, and how to deal with those relatives on the other side of the aisle who just won’t listen. Today's Sponsor: Exhausted. Every. Single. Day? Bolster Sleep is my favorite brand for my mattress and pillows. Bolster Sleep has high quality, hybrid mattresses and bedding along with cooling technology for the ultimate nights sleep. For 15% off your entire purchase, use code ALLIE at: https://bolstersleep.com/#

Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day Show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Hey, guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Friday. Today we were talking to my friend Andrew Claven from the Daily Wire. I'm so excited for you to hear of this conversation. He's brilliant. He gives us so much insight about the election and about the impeachment hearings, the craziness that's going on there. Also, he's going to give us. some advice for how we talk to, relate to our relatives and friends who do not agree with us. Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political.

They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort. We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave. even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where

we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Okay, without further ado, here is Andrew Clayton. Andrew, thanks so much for joining me. It's great to see you. Okay, so I think everyone listening probably knows exactly who you are and many, I am guessing, listen to your podcast, but just in case there are one or two people out there who don't know.

Will you tell everyone who you are and what you do? Well, I'm a screenwriter and a novelist and a commentator, and I'm now at the Daily Wire doing the Andrew Claven Show. And is it every day? Is it an everyday show that people can catch it? It's Monday through Thursday, yeah. It's four days a week. And then there's a long Clavenless weekend, which most people don't survive.

So I lose my audience. Oh, completely. You have to start back over. And you have to start back over. And that's why you're on this podcast to make sure that you can have a new audience on Monday. Okay, perfect. Well, I want to ask you about some of the craziness that's going on in the impeachment saga right now. It's very hard for me to keep up with it.

It was the same thing with the whole Russian thing. I felt like there was something new every week and none of it mattered. And I just kind of wanted to see how it all hashed out. That turned out to be a really good strategy for me. The same thing happening in the impeachment stuff, and I would say most of my audience feels the same way. We don't know what's going on because we're not sure what's relevant and what's not. Can you kind of give us just a little concise update or recap on what is currently going on in this impeachment drama? Well, the House Intelligence Committee, the fakingly named House Intelligence Committee, went through this big show.

It was basically a show. I mean, look, this story is a nonsense to begin. The minute this thing arose, I thought, man, they've been trying to impeach this guy literally since before he got elected, before he took office. Molly Hemingway overheard Jerry Nadler, the head of the House Judiciary Committee, saying we are going to try and impeach this guy on this Russian thing. Yeah. And so we know they've been after forever. So the Russian thing didn't work. None of the other.

The obstruction of justice didn't work. So now they're on this Ukraine phone call where Trump and some of his other operatives were basically badgering the president of Ukraine saying, we want an investigation into corruption that might include Joe Biden's son Hunter, who had this kind of job that he knew nothing about and he was making a bundle while Biden was vice president. So they have the investigation in the House Intelligence Committee. Then yesterday they issued a report saying, oh, the crimes that were committed, the horrifying crimes that were committed because nobody believes them. So they have to keep telling us there were these crimes.

And now it's in the House Judiciary Committee where they have had basically left law professors lecturing us about how horrible and horrifying these crimes are. And so nothing really happened. I mean, there was no, you know, Trump wanted an investigation into corruption in Ukraine that might have included the Bidens. None of that took place. He was said to have held up aid. He always holds up aid. He hates giving foreign aid, but the aid was eventually released. So nothing is, literally nothing was done. And I don't know how they're going to sell this, but now they're on this impeachment train and I'm not sure they can get off. All the experts keep saying they won't get off. I wonder if Nancy Pelosi is just going to say, you know what, this is making

us look terrible because it really is. Well, that's what I was going to ask you. What's your prediction for how this ends up? Every day, you go on Twitter, you got one side who says, oh, this is it. This is the end. Trump is done. You've got the other side. Of course, our side who would say, no, there's absolutely nothing to this. Are we just going to go back and forth until he's reelected or someone else is elected? Yes. I mean, if they, if they, impeach, which they may, because they've got themselves back into this corner, it will go to the Senate. Not one Republican has deserted Trump. So you can imagine Mitt Romney maybe being pompous enough to have some vote. But nobody, you have to be convicted by two-thirds of the Senate.

It's just not going to happen. I think they'd be crazy because once it's in the Senate and the Republicans can call witnesses they want to call, then they can call Biden and they can call Hunter Biden and they can call Adam Schiff and they're going to have to show up and testify. This whole thing has been programmed by Adam Schiff, has been run like a, like a television show. He does it in the basement of the Capitol building. He doesn't, he releases the information in leaks to the Democrat press like the New York Times. And then the New York Times reliably says, oh my gosh, it's a bombshell. And then we read it and think, eh, it's nothing. But once they're in the Senate, a lot of witnesses can be called. They may not want to have called. So will it go forward?

All the experts keep telling me, yes, it will, that they will impeach. Remember, impeachment is like an indictment. It's just a charge. The trial takes place in the Senate. Right. Then if it goes to the Senate, he will be tried. He will not be convicted, just like Clinton wasn't convicted. And then we'll go back and we'll see what effect it has on the 2020 election.

It is really hard for me to believe that it will have any positive effect on the Democrats, except in their most rabid base. I think this is, to me, this has been like watching the Wiley Coyote cartoons. where, you know, while he coyote gets the new Acme impeachment machine and keeps trying to drop it on Roadrunner Trump and keeps blowing himself up. And I just think that's going to continue. So Democrats have to know that the trial would not end up how they wanted to end up. So what's behind it? Is it just a PR campaign? They think that the longer they drag this out or if they actually file the articles of impeachment, they can use that as a talking point going into 2020.

Hey, this guy was impeached. You're really going to reelect him? You know, he's such a terrible president that we actually had to file articles of impeachment. Is it just to be able to spin a new narrative and put a new label on Trump going into the election? I think it's to service the left-wing base. I think that the base of the Democrat Party is lost in a narrative that is so ridiculous, but they are completely caught up in it. You see them on TV saying Donald Trump is Hitler. They actually say that. I mean, I'm not making that up. I'm not exaggerating. They say, Donald Trump is Hitler. You think about that for a minute. If Donald Trump was Hitler and you went on TV and called him Hitler, two guys would come in, pick you up under the arms, carry you away,

and you'd never be seen again. But in fact, you can go on TV and call Donald Trump Hitler with impunity because Donald Trump is not Hitler, right? And they keep using these overblown phrases, oh, he's destroying the Constitution, he's doing this. But when you say to them, well, how exactly? Give me an example. Give me if they just have verbiage. They just have words come out that have no meaning, no facts whatsoever. I think the base of the left got so excited, got so enraged, that they basically kept pushing their people, the atom shifts of the world and the Jerry Nadler's of the world,

kept pushing them saying, you have got to get this guy out of office before our country collapses and the stormtroopers show up at my house and carry me away and all those bad dreams that I have, those scary bad dreams that I have are going to come true. And I think they had to service that. And Nancy Pelosi, who was a smart politician, resisted and resisted and resisted.

And finally, they got this Ukraine story, and who told them that this was going to fly? I don't know. But from the very beginning, the first day it came out. And listen, I'm not like just Trumpy to the extreme. I won't follow Trump anywhere. I've criticized him. I'm not, you know, somebody who thinks that he's a gift from God or anything like that. But the minute I heard this, I just thought, you have got to be kidding me.

You have got to be kidding me. You lied about Russia. That blew up in your face. You lied about obstruction of justice. I blow up your face. And now we're supposed to take this stupid phone call seriously. And Trump has outsmarted them at every turn. He released the phone call. He released the transcript. So we know what he said. And no matter how many people who weren't there tell us it was evil, it wasn't, you know. So anyway, I think they were serving the, I think they were serving

the left wing base. I think that some of them are smart enough to have used it as a way to take our tax dollars and spend it on oppo research. So maybe they got something out of it like that. But again, if this blows up in their face as it must in the Senate, I can't see how that helps him. How many Democrats do you think actually believe that he has done something impeachable in this Ukraine story? I know there are people on the left who really believe that, but how many Democrats in Congress do you think, okay, you know what? We've really got something here. Or do you think they all know it's a charade? Well, I think most of them know it's a charade.

I think that the problem that the left has, and this really is a problem, is they've been so successful in taking over our culture. They've been so successful in taking over the means of communication. They own Hollywood. They own the academy. They own the news media. The news media is just a left-wing, you know, talk fest, basically. So they keep having their stories, their narratives, play back to them. You know, they turn on the TV, and there's Chuck Todd telling them, oh, my God, this is explosive.

This is a devastating. This is terrible. And I think they start to think, oh, yeah, that's the real world. And it's not until they get home. And people show up and say, hey, why aren't you solving any problems? Why aren't you doing anything about the border? Why aren't you doing anything about drug prices, about infrastructure? It's only then that they start to think, oh, maybe the TV isn't reality. So maybe there are some people who believe their own press. You know, who knows what Maxine Waters believes. I can't tell even what she's saying from time to time. But I think guys like Adam Schiff are just pure McCarthyite liars. I think he's a guy who thinks that this is his ticket to the big time. It has been his ticket to the big time. And I think he spins this tail and hopes he can sell it. But at this point, he looks to me like Wiley Coyote just at that moment when he looks down and realizes he's run off the edge of the cliff. So whether any of them really believe it or not, how can I say? I think some of them have talked themselves into it, but most of them have got to know it's a bad deal. I think there are probably people like A.O.C.

see who said quite a while ago. It might have even been last year who said she was on a radio show and said, oh yeah, well, you know, he's done a ton of impeachable things. She didn't actually list, but yes, he's done a ton of impeachable things. So it's almost like they're kind of being honest. Like, look, we know this guy is impeachable because we don't like him because he's done XYZ that we can't really name. We just need to find the one thing that we can actually pin on him to make this strategy effective. I think it maybe it would be more effective for them to just come out and say that to be like, look, guys, we are looking for something. We're looking for it. We know that you don't like the guy. We're looking for it. But- Well, Ilhan Omar said that.

She said essentially that this is like impeaching, this is like arresting Al Capone for tax evasion, which is how they got Capone. They got him on tax evasion. And she's saying he's such an evil criminal, but the only thing we can get him on is this stupid Ukraine story. Even she is saying it's a stupid story. But the problem they have is when you get to the criminality of Donald Trump, all you really have is that he's rude. He doesn't, you know, he doesn't sound like other politicians. He says things, even I don't like it when he tweets crazy stuff, you know, most of his supporters. I mean, go out in the middle of the country and talk to people and they all say, he's doing a good job. I just wish you would shut up, you know. And the thing is, and I've heard people on TV say,

well, yes, he is doing wonderful things for black Americans, you know, their jobs are great. their wages are going up, but listen to how he talks. Yeah. And so they're just convinced that the way he talks is a crime in and of itself. Yes, definitely. Okay, I want to talk to you about the election, maybe get some of your analysis and your prediction. So Kamala Harris, she's out.

I want to ask first, did you see that coming? Because I'm not sure I did. Yeah, I did see it coming. I mean, I think she was another way in which the left has been fooled by their own media. When she announced, she's a dark-skinned woman, and they thought, wow, that's it. That's the thing we're trying to plug in. And so they said at CNN, they said, she's the number one candidate. And then you look at her and you think, well, wait a minute, you know, this is a woman who slept her way into politics, first of all. I mean, she's not a very reputable person. She was a hard, driving, ambitious prosecutor, which is not a good look for Democrats. Democrats at this point are so left wing, especially the people voting in the primaries, that they think criminals are the good guys. They think the criminals have been persecuted by evil America. So when she came on and said, well, I put over a thousand people in prison for marijuana

smoking, when she said, oh, I threatened parents, if their kids were truant, I threatened them with jail time. You know, she wanted to ban health, to private health insurance. Those aren't things that the left, even the left, is really all that excited about. So she came across as mean, she came across as nasty, she mistreated her staff, she had that horrible cackling laugh. She never got over 15% in the polls, which is pretty high. I mean, most of them are polling around 2 and 3%, but that's pretty high. But she was never that high. And her biggest moment was attacking Joe Biden for something that happened in the 1970s, which is a long time ago.

And so she never really had the love of the people, even in California, where she's from, they didn't support her. So I did see it coming. I didn't think she was going to be. I thought when she first started, When she first came out, I was taken by that narrative too. When she first came out, I thought, oh, she's scary. She's smart. She's, you know, clever. But she turned out not to be that smart, not that clever and really unappealing as a human being.

And I think all those things sank her pretty quickly. Yeah, I predicted that she was going to be a top contender for sure because of what she said about the intersectional point of it. I mean, that is the cry of the left constantly is the importance of intersectionality, the importance of superficial, you know, skin-based diversity. And so I thought, well, surely this is the candidate that they're going to go for. If they think intersectionality is their power, then this is going to be who they put up against Trump. But as Corey Booker said this week, he said, look, we're going down to, we're going down this spiral really fast of having no diverse candidates whatsoever, having an all white democratic, democratic debate stage.

So I want to hear what you think about that. what do you think about the lack of racial diversity now that seems to be characterizing the democratic field? Does it show that Democrats really don't care about intersectionality and diversity as much as they say they do? Well, look, the big thing to remember about the left is because they own the media, because their spokespeople are making movies and teaching classes and giving this the news. You forget that most people on the left vote Democrat, because their parents voted Democrat. The same reason most people vote for whatever they vote for.

They were raised to think that Republicans are evil or whatever. When you talk to Democrats, and listen, I live in Hollywood. I live in the heart of darkness, right? Even here, when I talk to Democrats and you say, well, what about all this intersectionality stuff? And they say, oh, well, that's crap. You know, that's garbage. But that's not the point. The point is we have to have health care.

You know, they don't really care about these things that are being sold. It is a very, very small number of elite white people, mostly white people who are. who buy into this and the black students that they convince are oppressed and can't get ahead in the world. And so once you get rid of that, you know, little edge, the edges of that party, you're really voting for people who think the government should take care of things, who think the government should pay for things, who hear, yeah, well, college, people ought to go to college, so maybe the government ought to pay for that, who haven't really thought these things through all that much. And so, you know, did they love Barack Obama because he was a, what did Joe Biden call him a clean Negro or whatever he call?

I can't remember the horrible words he used to describe Barack Obama. But, you know, they may have loved that about Obama. But Obama was a good politician. He was a good speaker when he had a teleprompter in front of him. He was attractive. He was not money corrupt the way Hillary Clinton is. He was, you know, he may have been corrupt in otherwise, but he wasn't money corrupt. So they may like it when that virtue.

when they can show virtue by voting for Barack Obama. But they would have voted for Barack Obama had even white as well. And I think that that intersectional plug in the right color, plug in the right gender, I don't think that gets a lot of votes. And I think it's ridiculous when people reject somebody, as they were saying on MSNBC, in a couple of places were saying that they rejected Kamala Harris because she was a black woman. Just no way. No way.

That's not what happened. They rejected her because she was a lousy candidate. Do you think Democrats are overplaying their hand? in the intersectional gender racial stuff, all of the Democratic candidates putting their pronouns and their profiles. Elizabeth Warren has talked about racial reparations. I mean, they've all talked about very extreme things when it comes to abortion, whatever it is. Do you think that they are going to lose those voters who, like you said, are just like, you know what? I just want, you know, free health care and affordable college. You know, I think so. I think one of the, look,

the two polls came out saying that President Trump has 33 to 34 percent, support among black voters. Wow. That's true. And I predicted, by the way, I predicted that pretty early on. I thought that, you know, he's doing a great job for black Americans. Why shouldn't they support him? You know, if that is true, that really explains the left's panic to have immigrants flooding

into the country who they can con again, you know, I think that they overplay their hand and they make people's lives worse. I mean, this is the thing. I go and talk at colleges. And sometimes like a young black man will stand up and talk to me about microaggressions. And I'll say, like, are you kidding? Like, you know, I'm talking to you man to man. You're a man.

You're a young man, a powerful, strong guy. You could pick me up and throw me across them. And you're worried about microaggressions. Who taught you? Who taught you to be afraid of an aggression so small? Micro means it's so small you can't see it. Who taught you to be afraid? They make people's lives worse.

And the only thing that has to happen is for people to have the courage to say the emperor isn't wearing any clothes. And once that happens, I think everything falls apart. So, yeah, listen, I think that there are things that they can sell like they sold abortion, safe, legal, and rare. But now we find out, oh, yeah, not safe legal and rail. Shout your abortion. Abortion is a wonderful, wonderful thing. And then people who have had abortions are kind of like, I did that and it wasn't so wonderful. and I really still feel bad about it.

And once the truth starts to seep out, yeah, I think people do react to it. Listen, you know, Donald Trump, he's a great big character with great big flaws, right? He's a great big American character, like really, only America could have produced him. He's done a terrific job. He's done a really good job as president. I was so opposed to him coming in. I had to admit that I was wrong about him. I made video, one of my most popular videos, it got like 17 million hits, is attacking

Donald Trump during the primaries, the guy has done a terrific job. And I don't say that out of love for him. I say it because the economy is doing great. He is appointed terrific judges. He has restored the military. He is in fact building his wall. It's an amazing. He has done an amazingly good job. I have complaints. There are things he hasn't done, the debt and all those things that I think are really important. But he has done a great job fulfilling his promises. At some point, that kicks in. Reality has a voice and you can tell all the stories you want, you can tell all the narratives you want, you can own all the means of communication. And eventually people say, you know, it's kind of fun having food on my table. It's kind of fun having a job that I go to so my family respects me.

It's kind of fun being able to pay my mortgage. Maybe I'll elect this guy again and that'll keep happening. That wasn't happening under Obama. It is happening under Trump. I think that that narrative is going to counter the narrative of the left. Yes. Right. I've said this in regards to abortion. I think it's true in regards to how Trump has done. Our job on this side of the I.O. is really easy because all we have to do when we're arguing, you know, pro-life versus pro-choice is to say what an abortion is. We don't have to use euphemisms. We don't have to cover it up with this crazy philosophy about if life begins some point after conception. All we have to do is talk about fetal development and abortion. All we have to do is talk about reality. It's so much easier to tell the truth. It's the same thing

when it comes to Donald Trump and really any conservative issue. We don't. have to bend over backwards to try to manipulate all of these narratives to make it sound like America is this dangerous place when it's really not. We're in a wonderful time, a wonderful time of American history. So I think our job going into the election is really easy because all we have to do is point to reality, whereas Democrats are falling over themselves to come up with some other reason why you should feel miserable when you're really not. And I would say that that's just exhausting. You know, you're absolutely, I mean, somebody, I can't remember who said, tell the truth. it's easier to remember.

Yes. You know, this is a genuine theory on the left of leftist academics, that there is no truth, there's only narrative. And so that's a stupid theory, but it has been a dominant theory on the left for maybe 50 years. And so they think that they can sell a narrative and it will change the truth. But the thing about the economy, as I say, dinner on the table is, you know, you can't tell a narrative about dinner on the table, which is what they tried to do.

You know, Donald Trump, when he was running and he had those, remember those tremendous rallies that he still has where he'll fill up a stadium. And he said, you know, they tell you that the unemployment rate is 5%. If it were 5%, this stadium wouldn't be filled. And he was dead right. That is exactly right. You cannot fool people about dinner on the table. You can't fool people about jobs in the community.

You can't fool people about their communities falling apart. All those things, he has helped reverse. And that, you know, you got to celebrate that. And I hope that that's true. I do worry about young people. I do worry about people my age and younger who don't necessarily see those effects because they're in college. Maybe they don't have families yet.

And so really all they care about is that Donald Trump is supposedly this white supremacist bigot who is going to take their rate of abortion away or however they see the world. They believe that they're oppressed and they don't really see the benefits of Trump's presidency. I do worry about that. that generation kind of being fooled because the reality that you're talking about doesn't necessarily apply to them. Do you think that there's any hope for millennials and Generation Z? I always think there's hope for young people because they do learn the truth when they have a job and when they look at their paycheck and they see the money coming out. I worry right now with Donald

Trump, I worry for him and for the country. I worry about women. They look at him and they don't like him. And I can understand why they don't like them. They all know a guy like that and, you know, who's pawed them or abused them or use language they don't like. And they just look at that and think, uh-uh, you know, because a lot of people, you know, you and I pay attention to politics. A lot of people don't. And they just think like, no, that's that's not the guy I want in office. And I understand that. When it comes to young people, I think I'm very hopeful right at this minute. I know that they are liberalizing in certain ways. And I think that those ways are going to continue.

I don't think we're going to go back to a time when gay people could be arrested for being gay. And to be honest with the alley, I think that's a good thing. I think, you know, you can have whatever feelings you want and whatever religious beliefs you want. But I think people should be left alone to have their private lives. And I don't think the government certainly should have anything to do with that. I think that that kind of liberalization is going to continue. But let's face it, when you look at the economy, the economy works on certain principles. They keep telling you about Scandinavia.

Scandinavia tried socialism. It didn't work. They went back to free markets. They can be very socialist in the distribution of wealth, but government can't create wealth, right? Even the Soviet Union collapsed because government can't create wealth. So I have a lot of faith in young people. I think that certain things are going to come back because they have to come back. One of them is religion.

I think that the idea that there's no such thing as God, there's no such thing as truth, there's no such thing as narrative, it's all a narrative. Those things are going to come a cropper because they just don't hold together and things that don't make sense ultimately collapse. We've watched the collapse of Europe. We've watched the end of Europe and we've seen that happen and we're all afraid it's going to happen here and it might. But I also think that Europe was played out in many, many ways.

It was played out and we're not played out. We have, I think, hundreds of years of good times ahead of us. When I worry about America, what I worry about is the Republic. I don't worry about our power failing. I don't worry about our prosperity failing. I worry about our system of government coming under attack. And that's the story that we have to go out and tell. We have to say, you know, that's what I try to, when I talk to young people, what I say to them is, look, the founders didn't make this government by accident.

Here are the things they were thinking about. And if you can reconstruct that, you can sell it to them. You know, I see the dangers, Ali. I really do. I see that young people are being taught by these leftists who hate this country. They hate this country and they hate Western civilization and they're not very bright and they really are a lot less smart than they think. And I see that, but I think we can reclaim them, A, by reality and B, by starting to move

into the culture as the left did. Remember, the left didn't always own the culture. They took it over. We can take it back. I think you are absolutely right that the left hates Western civilization, hates America, and that we have a responsibility just to tell the truth what we were saying earlier and to move into the culture and not to isolate ourselves. I do think it's a little bit, it's hard, especially for people like me who are a new mom,

and I see the things that are happening in public schools, and I just kind of want to be a recluse. I want to pull my family out of reality and say, I don't want to deal with this craziness anymore. You're not going to touch my kids. You're not going to teach my kids that stuff. What do you think the balance is? You are also apparent. The temptation for us as Christians, as conservatives, is to kind of cut ourselves off from the world because we don't want to deal with the craziness. What do you think the solution is, though, because we need light to infiltrate darkness? Right. I don't think you cut yourself off from the world. I think you start to

build alternative institutions. We're not going to get Yale back. We're not going to get the New York Times back. I think we have to build those things for ourselves. It always bothers me that conservatives spend a lot of time complaining about Hollywood. but they don't make movies. They don't make TV shows. So, you know, why complain? You can't just complain. You got to create. You got to make things. So when you say withdraw from the world, because you're a mom, you know, homeschooling is a genuine alternative that doesn't just, that doesn't just school the kids, but it also creates another community because you have to homeschool in community. So that's an alternative. I see Hillsdale planting schools around the

country that teach what they call classical learning. I think that is a really hopeful sign. I think that We have to start writing books. I have my podcast, another kingdom that I'm doing because I know that I can't get that out through the publishing world, but the podcast is doing really well. It's reaching hundreds of thousands of people. We've got to tell stories like the left tell stories. So it's not a question of withdrawing. It's a question of building alternative structures because, like I said, I don't think we're

going to get Yale back, but I think we can build universities that are just as good. And more important than universities, I think it's K through 12. I think if a kid shows up at Yale understanding civics, I don't think he's going to be polluted by their stupid intersectionality because it makes everybody, everything so much worse. So I think I think that's the answer. It's not withdrawing. It is withdrawing from their institutions in order to build new institutions and new systems. Home schooling, listen, I taught at Hills. I got a fellowship to teach at Hillsdale for like two weeks this year.

and I called my wife from nowhere Michigan and she said, what's it like? And I said, it's like going sane. I said, going from Hollywood to Hillsdale is like suddenly you're talking to kids who are sane. They're open-minded. They're polite. They're nice. They're religious. But they're not like pinched and small-minded. They in fact were willing to talk about anything. They were willing to debate and discuss anything. And so I think if those new communities can be built, they will take over. they will actually replace the desiccated, dead institutions that the left is slaughtered from within. You know, I always compare the left to the alien in men in black who kills that guy and then lives inside the guy, and he still looks like he's a person, but actually there's an alien inside.

That's what Yale is now. That's what the New York Times is. It looks like the New York Times. New York Times used to be a great newspaper. Right. But it's really just leftism, this alien leftism inside the New York Times body. Right. Well, I think that's very positive.

and encouraging message. What about, this is the last thing for people who have family members who are on the left, who disagree with them and they're coming into the holidays, they're coming into Christmas time, and they know they're going to have to talk to their confrontational uncle about politics. What is the best way to handle that you, yourself, are in a family of people that disagree with you, some of them? How do you handle it in? How can other people handle it the same way you do?

Well, first of all, put the love first. You know, I love my family very much. And I try to stay into that, in that zone, even when we disagree ferociously. When we do get into confrontations, and listen, everybody fails at this. I fail at it. We don't always do it right. But the best advice I can give is don't talk about personalities. Don't talk about Obama. Don't talk about Trump. Don't say this happened, you know, he did this. Well, he did that. It's an, endless, endless battle. Why? Because all these guys are flawed instruments or principle. So talk about the principle. When they say, when they come after Trump, you know, you say, well, let's leave, let's leave Trump out of it. And I, you know, I won't talk about Obama.

I always tell people, I didn't like Obama. You don't like Trump. I get it. You know, I absolutely get it. But let's talk about what we're trying to achieve and why we believe in the things that we believe it. Like, why don't I believe in free health care, you know? And, you know, I lived in England so I can talk about how bad the health care was there. Right. And I can, but I can talk about the principle of freedom that when you work for, for money, that money belongs to you. And when the government takes it away, they're taking away the time that you put in

to make that money. So they're taking away peace of your life, you know, and I always tell students, the definition of slavery is you do the work, but someone else spends the money. That's also the definition of socialism. That's the same definition, socialism and slavery, have the exact same definition. So if you talk about principles, if you talk about what you're trying to achieve, what your goals are, you sometimes can find common ground. And, you know, I'm not an absolutist about anything. I want people to be free.

And I understand nobody, we can't be entirely free because we're not angels, right? If men were angels, we wouldn't need a government. We do need a government. So I'm perfectly willing to say, you know, like, okay, you know, we want some people coming in immigrants. We love our immigrants when they come in. But shouldn't we obey the law? I mean, shouldn't we obey the law? And people will always try to bring it back to personalities. Well, Donald Trump, he hates Mexicans and he said this and he said that. Just don't follow them there.

Stick to the principles. You can always find common ground when you talk about principles with fellow Americans. Oh, I think that's great advice. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time. Please tell everyone everywhere they can find you. Well, please come to Delhi Wire and listen to the podcast and listen to The Another Kingdom podcast. and you can find me on Twitter at Andrew Claven. It's K-L-A-V-A-N. There's no E-N-Claven. And you can find me at Andrew Claven.com

if you want to see my books and movies and things like that. Perfect. Well, thank you so much. Allie, it's so nice to see you. Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political.

They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and test it against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us.