Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 319 | Piper, Policies, Personality & Priorities

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey, this is Steve Day. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort.

Starting point is 00:00:19 We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us. Hey, guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Wednesday. I hope everyone is having a wonderful week so far and that you enjoyed last week's episodes. I was out of town and so we pre-recorded those episodes, did it a little bit differently, had an interview on Wednesday with John Cooper of.

Starting point is 00:01:06 skillet. I got amazing feedback from that interview and I knew that I would because he's so awesome and has such wonderful insight. So if you haven't listened to last Wednesday's episode with John Cooper of Skillet, I highly recommend you doing so. Then Friday I talked to Burgess Owens. He's running for Congress. Amazing person and so wise and patriotic. So go listen to Wednesday's last Friday's episode. And then Monday we talked about health care and the differences between the Republican perspective on health care and the Democratic and Joe Biden's perspective and plan on health care. We've covered now all of the topics, the big topics that we are going to cover before the election. Today we're going to kind of do a recap and a further analysis and a further justification from my perspective of voting for Donald Trump. I'm going to talk about that John Piper article that went around and my response to it and my take on this.

Starting point is 00:02:11 I'll also talk about Al Mueller's response to it or at least I don't even know if it was a direct response, but his perspective on voting and who he is voting for. So for the past nine Mondays, we have talked about a different subject that a different policy subject that pertains to this election. So we talked about abortion, we talked about religious liberty, we talked about immigration, we talked about justice, what justice actually is versus social justice, the government's role in implementing justice, foreign policy, the economy, education, health care, the environment, comparing and contrasting Trump versus Biden, Republicans versus Democrats. As I always say, you guys know I'm a conservative. So you all know where I stand and typically where I'm going to

Starting point is 00:03:08 land on these subjects. I don't hide that for some reason. You have people coming to this podcast thinking that I am somewhere in the middle that I'm agnostic on politics and I don't necessarily have a particular side that I'm coming from. No, I am very clear from the outset that I am a conservative, I have a conservative worldview. But again, as I've said many times, even from that perspective, it is never my desire to misconstrue something, to leave out a side of the story, to leave out a fact in order to get you to agree with me. My goal is always to represent things as factually as honestly as I possibly can. When I have an accidental inaccuracy, which I've had before, people have reached out to me and they've kindly said, not just, hey, you're wrong about this,

Starting point is 00:03:59 because that doesn't cut it. If you just say, oh, this show is full of inaccuracies and this is lies and falsehood and false rhetoric, well, that doesn't tell me anything. That just makes me think that you disagree with me. But if there's something that's factually wrong or you disagree with me on something, you think that I misrepresented something, then you need to come to me and reasonably, thoughtfully, lay out your case or point to the real fact that corrects my inaccuracy or give me an argument for your side. Now, if we just end up disagreeing on a particular subject, I'm not necessarily going to come on this podcast and correct it. But if you point out something where I am factually wrong, or I have grossly exaggerated something, or I've misconstrued something, then tell me. And if you are correct, I will correct it on air,

Starting point is 00:04:49 as I have done before. But what so often happens is that I'll get a message or I'll get a review was saying, this is wrong, this is not true, this is, this is not right framing, this is polarizing, whatever. Look, you got to be able to articulate why. You can't just tell me that you think that. You have to tell me why you think that. If you articulate thoughtfully, why, I am wrong about something. I will, typically, I don't get to all of my message, but messages on Instagram, but I very often will engage with you. But the kind of of sassy, sarcastic, well, this is wrong, and I'm not going to explain why. You can Google it. Come on. That just makes me think that you don't actually know. And if you do know, I want to know too.

Starting point is 00:05:36 And if you are correct that I said something wrong, I will happily and humbly correct it on air. Over the past few weeks, there's been a lot of pushback. There's been more praise and gratitude towards this show and especially its guests than ever over the past few months. It feels like we have been going full speed since the riots and the protests broke out in Minneapolis a few months ago. There's been so much to cover, so much subject matter to dig into. We've had so many wonderful guests bring us their insight and analysis. We've had John McArthur. We had Wayne Grudom. We had Albert Mueller, Voddy Bakum, Ted Cruz, Megan Kelly, Neil Shinvi, Monique, Dusson, lots and lots of commentators, authors, theologians, writers, over the past few weeks.

Starting point is 00:06:24 weeks to help us answer the really tough questions that are before us about the crazy things that are going on in the world. We have talked about critical race theory, the inherent contradictions and dangers of intersectionality, the murderous history of left-wing revolutions around the world, the ineffectiveness of socialism and communism, the importance of the Supreme Court. We've talked about police brutality. We've talked about social justice versus biblical justice, the state of American theology and how it influences what we think about politics and culture. We have covered a lot of ground, and I'm very thankful to all of you guys who have been following along. I'm so thankful to all of you who have sent me emails and messages telling me what

Starting point is 00:07:09 you've learned, especially from a particular guest or any specific episode. I'm also, I'm thankful for those of you who have thoughtfully, kindly reached out to me and told me that you happen to disagree on something, or you've pointed out something that is factually wrong, I am very thankful. Now, I've also gotten a lot of passionate pushback from people who refuse to tell me why they disagree or why I'm wrong. And in a way, it's understandable because we have been talking about a lot of subjects that solicit emotions. So when I say I've gotten emotional responses, I don't mean that in a way that's condescending. We have been talking about a lot of things that rightfully, that understandably solicit a lot of, a lot of emotion and a lot of passion.

Starting point is 00:07:56 And that's okay. That's okay. But it's not necessarily what creates constructive dialogue again. If we can't talk about why we disagree, what the facts are surrounding it. We've talked about in that vein, we've talked about the dangers of something called standpoint epistemology, which is that you determine what truth is based on your subjective standpoint. And people who are considered more oppressed and more marginalized have more access to universal truth than someone who is less oppressed and less marginalized. So we no longer operating on a

Starting point is 00:08:32 shared set of facts or on a shared sense of reality, but we are now arguing which standpoint is more valid in our pursuit of truth. And that is disastrous. any kind of constructive dialogue or any true pursuit of what is actually true. And so I don't see it to be productive at all to operate from that vantage point. We've talked about all of these things, all of these very deep, theological, philosophical, ideological, political, social issues. And you guys have taught me so much in your feedback. And the people who have been on this podcast have as well. Now, it's hard when I do receive accusations of deceit or when I hear mischaracterizations or when I receive demeaning comments or messages to not reciprocate with the same level of

Starting point is 00:09:34 sassiness. And I just, I say all of this because I know that so many of you relate to me, so many of you who have engaged with people across the aisle for the first time ever, receiving this kind of pushback and you are tempted to respond in kind with the same level of sarcasm and sassiness. And we have to be thankful for the times that the Lord bridles our tongue. And we have to work towards self-control with the power of the Holy Spirit. I fail at that sometimes in those kinds of heated exchanges. exchanges and I just pray for more self-control and for God to give me a spirit of gentleness

Starting point is 00:10:12 and to give me a spirit of grace that I so often fail to represent. And I hope that you all are praying that too because the fact of the matter is is that we still have to share this country after the election. We're going to have to coincide and coexist with the people that we disagreed with on November 2nd, on November 4th. We are still going to live next door to the neighbor that is on the opposing side of the aisle. And our goal is Christians will still be to love God with all of our hearts, mind, soul, and strength, and to love our neighbor as ourself, all of our neighbors. So let us do whatever we can to glorify God in every way and ask forgiveness when we don't,

Starting point is 00:10:55 which is daily, if not moment by moment, by the way. So I just want to say to anyone listening who already voted for Joe Biden, you're probably not listening to this podcast, but maybe you are, or who knows that you will vote for Joe Biden, and I'm not going to be able to persuade you otherwise. I'm glad that you're here. And as assured as I am, and as passionate as I am about the topics that we are going through today that we have gone through for the past several weeks, that doesn't change what I think about you. Yes, I believe that you are wrong in this particular arena, just like you think that I am wrong, but I also know and appreciate the fact that you are a person made in the image of God. I don't think you're stupid. I don't think that you're wicked. I'm not

Starting point is 00:11:40 doubting your sincerity. I'm certainly not doubting your salvation. That is, that's not my role. I simply think that you are incorrect. And I understand that there are some people that cannot separate the statement that I think you're wrong from the idea that someone hates you. But I think it's very important for us to be able to do that, not just as Americans who want to preserve our republic, but also as Christians, we have to be able to say, look, I disagree with you. And here's where I think that your views do not align with God's word. Here's where I think that you are factually incorrect, but I'm not doubting your sincerity. I'm not doubting even your intentions. And I am certainly not doubting your salvation. We simply disagree. I don't hate you, but I do

Starting point is 00:12:26 believe that you're wrong. I am not going to harbor resentment towards people who vote for Joe Biden. I'm not going to view them as my enemy. This is what theologian Charles Haddon Spurgeon said. I will not say do not attend to politics, but I do say do not let politics stain you. I believe that it is possible while still being assured and informed and even passionate about what's going on politically, that you can do all of those things without being stained by politics. I think it's necessary for Christians to be involved and to vote, to exercise that right for which so many people have fought and died in which millions around the world will never, ever get to exercise. Here's how Spurgeon also put it. We are now called upon to

Starting point is 00:13:16 exercise one of the privileges and duties which go with liberty. Let no man be neglect. in it. Every God-fearing man should give his vote with as much devotion as he prays. I happen to agree with that. Now, why? Not just because it's a right and it's a privilege, but because the people who represent us and the policies they push and present have a real effect on us. They have a real effect on our children, on their schools, on our churches, and especially on those who may be outside of our circles, the most vulnerable in society, the most marginalized in society, policies have a real effect on their everyday lives, on our everyday lives. Choosing politicians matters because policies matter because people matter. That is why I don't believe in a throwaway

Starting point is 00:14:07 vote in voting a third party, at least not in this election. Now, I totally respect people who take this position. I really do because I see the argument. I don't think that these people are just being lazy or being ignorant. I think that these are very thoughtful people who have thought through it and prayed about it. And I see the logic of the conclusion that they come to. But in my view, there's just too much on the line right now. The two visions for the country are too disparate, are too vastly different for me to risk the nation and future generations becoming victims of the kind of left-wing government. that has ravaged nations both culturally and economically throughout history.

Starting point is 00:14:54 So this is why I disagree with Pastor John Piper on his recent article. He's a theologian whom I greatly admire. I recommend him very often. I've learned so much from him. I love his podcast. Ask Pastor John in addition to his sermons and his in his mini writings and his website desiring God. All of these resources have enriched.

Starting point is 00:15:18 my faith so much. And even though I disagree with him on this article, I don't doubt at all. His love for God and his commitment to the scriptures and his dedication to the gospel. I just land in a different place than he does. And trust me, I understand that it is, it's a little bit strange to disagree with someone whom you know knows more about God in the Bible than you who you know is probably smarter than you, wiser than you. That's how I feel when I disagree with other people, with other men who have had a huge impact, a positive impact on my faith, like Tim Keller and Matt Chandler. Like, these are two men who have had a hugely positive influence on my faith, especially in high school

Starting point is 00:16:03 when I was really, my faith was becoming my own, was becoming real and relational. But I disagree with them. Dramatically, drastically on the issues of critical race theory and social justice, I simply think that they are gravely mistaken. It's possible for people to be very wise, very godly, and wrong. I've been wrong more times than I can count. But it's okay. We cannot say just because someone is smart or just because someone is godly,

Starting point is 00:16:35 that means that they can never be wrong. The only one that is infallible is God. And so we all have the capacity and propensity to be wrong. and there are people who are equally as smart and as godly who happen to disagree with John Piper and with others on politics and on this particular subject of who to vote for. And I will get to one of those very good responses by Albert Mueller at the end of this episode. So John Piper wrote last week an article titled policies, persons, and paths to ruin. The article didn't surprise me at all. A lot of you have read it. It seems like him. I agree with a lot of it. But

Starting point is 00:17:14 like I said, I just, I don't come to the same conclusion, and I'll explain why. First, I'll read you a little bit of what he writes in the article. He says, I remain baffled that so many Christians consider the sins of unrepentantant sexual immorality, unrepentantant boastfulness, unrepentant vulgarity, unrepentant factiousness, and the like to be only toxic for our nation, while policies that endorse baby killing, sex switching, freedom limiting, and socialistic overreach are viewed as deadly. My point so far is simply to raise the stakes of what is outwardly modeled in leadership so that Christians are given pause. It is not a small thing to treat lightly a pattern of public behaviors that lead to death.

Starting point is 00:17:56 There is a character connection between rulers and subjects. When the Bible describes a king by saying, He ascend and made Israel to send, 1st Kings 1416, it is not mean he twisted their arm. It means his influence shaped the people. That is the calling of a leader. The justifications for ranking the destructive effects of persons below the destructive effects of policies ring hollow. I find it bewildering that Christians can be so sure that greater damage will be done by bad judges, bad laws, and bad policies than is being done by the culture infecting spread of the gang green of sinful self-exaltation and boasting and strife-stering. I think Roe is an evil decision.

Starting point is 00:18:36 He's talking about Roe v. Wade. I think Planned Parenthood as a code name for baby killing and historically, at least, least ethnic cleansing. And I think it is baffling and presumptuous to assume that pro-abortion policies kill more people than a culture-saturating pro-self pride. Before I give my take on that, let me also read the editor's note at the end of his article that was added later. It says after this article was published, John Piper tweeted the article we post today explains why I won't be voting for Biden or Trump. That choice to write in is relatively unimportant, but the reasoning really matters. He then linked to his 1995 article on abortion as a stake in the ground. He hopes

Starting point is 00:19:14 never to move. So the reason he said this is because for some reason that I cannot possibly discern people who identify as Christians who are openly supportive of Joe Biden were sharing this article and praising John Piper, which is just crazy, not only because this is a guy that they never ever, ever agree with on any kind of theological or socialist. issue at all, but also because this article did not align with the views of someone who was openly voting for Joe Biden. John Piper is and was in this article explicitly against abortion, sex switching, baby killing. He is against pro-abortion candidates, planned parenthood and anything connected to abortion. His argument is that arrogance is just as deadly as abortion.

Starting point is 00:20:04 And while I agree that that is spiritually true, that is spiritually true that an unresue, that an repentant, arrogant person who does not place their faith in Christ whom God does not save is just as bound for hell is someone who advocates for abortion or someone who commits an abortion. That is obviously biblically true. I obviously agree that pride has an effect not just on a person's soul and a person's words, but also on the people who are around them and the people who are under their leadership. But when we're talking about the deadly effects, the tangible deadly effects that that character quality has on a nation, I cannot agree that it is as deadly and as dangerous as abortion.

Starting point is 00:20:51 It's, again, not that arrogance isn't dangerous or that we should commend it or ignore it, or that it doesn't have consequences, especially eternal consequences, it does. Proverbs 813 says, the fear of the Lord is the hatred of evil. So if you fear the Lord, you hate evil. pride and arrogance in the way of evil and perverted speech I hate. So God hates pride. He hates arrogance. That means he hates the way of many politicians on both sides of the aisle. Ego is rampant in Washington, D.C. and in the halls of power throughout the country, God hates deceit. He hates manipulation. He hates hotiness. These are things that I see, though, not just displayed in Trump, but in both Biden and Trump. And certainly also in Kamala Harris. So when Piper says that it is a prideful heart that leads to baby killing, that's what he says in the article, then to me that means that Biden and Kamala must also possess those prideful hearts since they advocate for baby killing. Just because Trump's pride is displayed on Twitter and Biden's is displayed more inconspicuously through influence peddling via his son internationally are calling a voter at a town hall fat and challenging him to a push-up contest,

Starting point is 00:22:07 are telling a factory worker that he's full of a cussword that we don't say on this podcast in a discussion about guns or insane poor kids or just as talented as white kids or in openly advocating for our federal tax dollars to fund abortion or claiming that if he had been in charge at the beginning of COVID, that things would be drastically different. That doesn't mean just because Biden's pride is displayed in those those ways that are seemingly more culturally palatable. or are more acceptable to our left-wing media, that doesn't mean that Biden is actually less prideful than Trump. And I'm not saying that that's the argument that Piper is making. But when I read Piper's article, that's what I think, that we have two candidates that have pride. We have two candidates that have arrogance.

Starting point is 00:22:57 Biden is smoother than Trump is in some ways, in some ways. He's more politically correct. I'll say that, just as Obama was. the divisive things that he says, like if you don't vote for me, you ain't black or that it's a good idea to direct funding away from the police. They're not made into major stories by the media the way that Trump's comments are, but that doesn't make him any less prideful. I just don't see evidence that Biden's sins just because they're different and less flashy are worse than Trump's sense. So Biden too is accused of sexual assault. Biden too has said things that people

Starting point is 00:23:33 have called racist, like all black people think the same way in an interview with Yahoo News a few weeks ago. He said in 2007 that Obama is the first clean, mainstream African-American man, according to CNN. Biden had to drop out of his first presidential race for plagiarizing a speech and for telling a lie that he later had to say was a lie that he was the first person in generations and his family to go to college. Under his vice presidency, you've got the Fast and Furious scandal, the IRS scandal, the Benghazi scandal, the fact that he was in charge of relations between the U.S. and China and the U.S. and Ukraine while his son Hunter Biden was making hundreds of thousands of dollars from them and allegedly making gains for the whole Biden family. Again, I'm not saying that Piper is saying that Biden is not sinful in this way, but he seems to draw a dichotomy between prideful Trump and pro-abortion Biden. And from what I see and from what I know about Biden is that in reality,

Starting point is 00:24:30 we've got two candidates that represent that kind of arrogance and that kind of divisiveness that Piper seems to be almost exclusively ascribing to Donald Trump. We've got two prideful, sinful candidates whose rhetoric does have an effect on society and help shape our culture. The things that both of them say do absolutely matter. But we only have one prideful and sinful candidate who also believes in federal. federally funded abortion and codifying Roe v. Wade in an assault on religious liberty via something like the Equality Act on capitulation to Iran and China and more government control over

Starting point is 00:25:12 health care and redirecting funding away from the police and fighting against school choice in charter schools and in raising taxes and who is running with the senator that the nonpartisan GovTrack ranks as the most liberal member of the Senate. She is the most liberal on abortion on health care on immigration. And then we have another prideful and sinful candidate who has protected the Hyde Amendment, has redirected funds away from Planned Parenthood via Title X reform, who has appointed three constitutionalist lifetime Supreme Court justices, including the pro-life constitutionalist and mother of seven, Amy Coney Barrett, who was just confirmed on Monday, and has appointed 284 federal judges, 242 of whom, of which have been convinced.

Starting point is 00:25:58 confirmed by the Senate, who delivered on tax cuts and whose deregulatory and economic efforts helped bring about a booming economy with record unemployment. This was, of course, pre-coronavirus lockdowns, who has helped broker three peace deals between Arab nations and Israel with hopefully more to come, who helped defeat ISIS, under whose leadership the life of Kayla Mueller was avenged, who ensured the return of Otto Warmbier to his family from North Korea, who has championed school choice, more than any other president whose administration has fought for religious liberty and for free speech who banned critical race theory funded by the taxpayer in federal agencies. Now, if you have questions about

Starting point is 00:26:40 any of those, if you want clarification, if you want the reasoning behind it, if you're thinking about rebuttals to those, before you consider those and before you send me an email, please go back and listen to every single episode I have done on all of those subjects, everything that I talked about, Biden fighting against and everything I talk about Trump fighting for, I have done an episode outlining all of the details of those and probably answering a lot of your questions and pushing back on a lot of the misinformation that the media has been peddling about some of those things. If you are wondering why, for example, I support school choice or if you're wondering about the details of the peace deals, I have answered all of those wonderful, great questions.

Starting point is 00:27:22 I will link those past episodes and some of the interviews I've done on the these subjects in the description of this episode so you can easily go listen to them. You can binge listen to all those episodes, put it on like one and a half times or two times. You can do that on Apple Podcasts. It'll go by it a lot more quickly. Now, I will say with all the things that Trump has accomplished that are really good, it's a real shame just to be honest that Trump really gets in his own way so much of the time. And what I mean by that is that he waste petty time on, or he waste time on Twitter being petty. He punches down at people.

Starting point is 00:28:02 He doesn't take criticism well. He can be a bully. He calls people names on Twitter before he was president. He was known for promiscuity. He was known for bragging on camera about grabbing women. He was known for his ego. He says ridiculous things regularly, especially at his rallies, especially when you have a media that is scrutinizing your every move and refusing to print anything remotely positive about your

Starting point is 00:28:28 accomplishments, this kind of bad behavior is very often going to overshadow any good that you do. Part of it is the media's fault for refusing to report on the good things that he's done and for even just outright lying and for holding different standards for what they report on when it's Trump versus what they report on when it's Biden. But part of that is also Trump's fault. Part of that is a lack of self-control. However, saying all of that, I believe that we can criticize the bad parts of Trump. We can condemn the bad parts of Trump and even recognize that the bad and very loud parts

Starting point is 00:29:06 of Trump's character have an effect on our culture, on the temperature of our country. But before we go too far with that, before we blame Trump's flaws or rhetoric on our division, we have to remember that this division, this tension that we have. was not created by Trump. I think a lot of people, especially on the left, think that the golden years of America were when Obama was president. There is absolutely no piece of data whatsoever that backs that up none. The division that we are feeling existed when Trump became president.

Starting point is 00:29:41 Has it gotten worse over the past few years? Yeah, for a variety of reasons. But really, we were just a powder keg about to explode back in 2017. Like, we were so divided. going to read you some statistics that actually proved that. According to Pew Research in 2011, the median Republican and the median Democrat both had views that were moderate toward the middle. There were a lot of us that had a lot of moderate middle-of-the-road views. Republicans and Democrats shared many views with a large number of Americans in the middle. I'll put this chart up on

Starting point is 00:30:16 YouTube if you are watching and I will make sure to include the links to these studies in in the description. By 2017, though, the political middle had significantly diminished with the right moving slightly to the right. So the median Republican moving slightly to the right and the median Democrat moving way over to the left with a higher number of Americans than ever on the far left than on the far right. From 2014 to 2017, the median Republican didn't move at all, while the median Democrat moved significantly over to the left. The left in this country has moved way left, especially in the eight years Obama was in office, while the views of Republicans have changed slightly, but not as drastically and in some cases have gotten more liberal.

Starting point is 00:31:04 In no cases that we are about to go through have Democrats become more conservative on any issue. They have moved to the left on everything that is not necessarily true of Republicans moving to the right on everything. According to another study by Pew, 82% of Democrats in 2017 believed our economy favors powerful interest compared to 71% in 2014. Only 17% of Republicans believed that in 2017 compared to 27% in 2014.

Starting point is 00:31:33 In 1994, 49% of Democrats said poor people have hard lives because the government doesn't do enough versus 28% of Republicans. In 2017, that number was 76% for Democrats and just 25% for Republicans. So from 1994 to 2017, there was a big shift in perspective on poverty and the government not doing enough among Democrats from 49% to 76% thinking that the government needs to do more, whereas it went from 28% of Republican thinking that in 1994 to just 25 in 2017. So not much of a change at all and a huge gap between what the left

Starting point is 00:32:15 and the right thinks about poverty and what the government should do about it in 2017. In 2010, 76% of Democrats had global warming as a real threat compared to 92% of Democrats that in 2017. Only 34% of Republicans said that in 2010. And then 52% in 2017. So actually became more liberal on that subject, but still a huge gap, a 40-point gap between what Democrats think about global warming and what Republicans think about global warming. In 2010, 57% of Democrats and 30% of Republicans believed America needed to do more to ensure equal rights for black people.

Starting point is 00:32:52 By 2017, that percentage among Democrats had skyrocketed to 81% and went up to only 36% among Republicans. So, 2010, 57% of Democrats believed that America needs to do more to ensure equal rights for black people. That number shot up after Obama had been president for both of his terms to, 81% by 2017, whereas it only went from 30% to 36% among Republicans. In 1994, only 32% of Democrats and 30% of Republicans believed immigrants strengthened our country. So about even a minority of Republicans and Democrats back in 1994 believed that. In 2010, 48% Dems, 29% Republicans by 2017, 84% of Democrats believed that a huge change, and 42% of Republicans believed it.

Starting point is 00:33:43 So again, Republicans, more Republicans shifted to a leftward position on that. And Democrats, a large number of Democrats moved to the left on that. Still a huge gap between Republicans and Democrats. Think about immigrants, specifically illegal immigration. Okay, guys, let me take a quick break from all of that to tell you guys about an awesome deal. That is being put on by Blaze Media. So this is the most important discount that they have ever done. And that is $30 off an annual subscription.

Starting point is 00:34:21 This is making Blaze TV available for the incredibly low price of $5.75 a month. That is crazy. And so when you subscribe to Blaze TV, you are not just getting more access to me because I know it's so wonderful to watch this podcast and to listen to this podcast, but you are getting access to exclusive content that is only available. available to subscribers and you're getting access to all of their kinds of people that work at Blaz Media. Not just me. You're getting access to Glenn Back, to Phil Robertson, to Lauren Chen, to Steve Days, all of these people who have excellent analysis and a lot of entertaining content.

Starting point is 00:35:00 And so you sign up for Blaze TV, $5.75 a month. That is an amazing, amazing deal. With big tech censorship, you just never know when someone is going to be to platforms. You never know when this podcast is going to be taken off YouTube or when you're not going to be able to get it on Apple podcast anymore, while being a subscriber to Blaze TV ensures that you are still able to get my content and other kinds of conservative content on a platform that's not going to be censored, that's not going to be taken down. And all you have to do to keep Blaze TV giving you this awesome content is to pay $5.75 cents a month. That is well worth it. See it as an investment, not just in your own life and in your own knowledge,

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Starting point is 00:36:05 Hey, this is Steve Dase. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God, humanity, and reality itself. On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality.

Starting point is 00:36:22 We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort. We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, You can watch this D-Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts. I hope you'll join us.

Starting point is 00:36:49 By 2017, both 81% of Republicans and Democrats held unfavorable views towards the people of the other party. So 2017, 81% of Republicans and 81% of Democrats held unfavorable views toward people of the other party. This is before this might have been right when Trump took off. office, but this was before Trump had had any kind of effect as president. So we were vastly, vastly divided in major ways by the time Trump took office. And some of the biggest shifts, especially on the left side, happened in the eight years that Barack Obama was president, especially when it

Starting point is 00:37:30 comes to race. Another Pew chart that shows this is one that says that in 2010, 28% of Democrats believe discrimination is the main reason black people can't get a ahead these days. So 28% 2010 Democrats said that. By 2017, that number had left to 64%. The chart goes all the way back to 1994. In 1994, only 39% of Democrats believed this. By 2010, 28%. So it went down from 1994 to 2010. But then by 2017, after Barack Obama had served both of his terms, that number shot up to 64% much higher than it was in 1994, much higher than it was in 2010. Only 26% of Republicans in 1994, 9% in 2010 and 14% in 2017 believe that discrimination is the main thing holding black people back.

Starting point is 00:38:28 So again, this is a huge gap between the left and the right that is mostly attributed to a seismic shift in the thinking of the Democratic Party specifically while Barack Obama was president. a shift that corresponds not to what is actually going on in the country. So no kind of quantifiable increase in discrimination was going on against black people at the time that Democrats shifted so much on this issue, but actually corresponds to newly popularized ideology and identity politics that became more pervasive during those years. Here's more evidence of this. According to a different study by Pew, 40% of Hillary Clinton voters in 2016 said,

Starting point is 00:39:09 they believe white people benefit a great deal from advantages that people of other races do not have versus only 4% of Trump 2016 voters. Now, four years later, 59% of Biden voters say they believe this versus only 5% of Trump 2020 voters. So again, we see a huge shift on the left side, not on the right side when it comes to race in things like white privilege. 57% of Clinton voters in 2016 said they believe that it's a lot harder to be a black person than a white person in this country versus only 11% of Trump voters, 74% of Biden voters now say this is true versus only 9% of Trump voters in 2020. So again, a huge shift in the perspective of race and racism on the left that hasn't necessarily corresponded to any real changes, any real increase in

Starting point is 00:40:01 discrimination, but in a shift in ideology that simply hasn't happened on the right side of the aisle. Biden voters are also more likely to believe that there are serious impediments to women's success in this country than Clinton voters were four years ago, whereas Trump voters today are less likely to believe this than they were four years ago. 69% of Clinton voters believed in 2016 that society is just as well off if people have priorities other than marriage and children versus 77% of Biden voters that believe that today. Trump voters went from 41% to 44%. That percentage is actually very high. But again, two totally disparate worldviews. Our views of society and our priorities and our values and reality is so vastly different. And the left has changed significantly over the past 10 to 14 years.

Starting point is 00:40:55 In 2009, when Obama took office, according to Gallup, 78% of Republicans were extremely proud to be an American, to be Americans, versus 45% of Democrats. By the time Obama left in 2017, 72% of Republicans were extremely proud. So that didn't shift too much. For Democrats in 2013, for Democrats, in 2013, they peaked at 56%, the majority of them being extremely proud to be an American, but that dwindled the last four years of Obama's presidency to 43%. So while their Obama was in office, their patriotism dwindled down. By 2019, that number had fallen to 22% among Democrats who say that they're extremely proud to be an American. But it remained 76% for Republicans. So again, while their own Obama was in office, Democrats became less proud of their country.

Starting point is 00:41:52 Republicans actually did two a little bit, but the majority, the vast majority, was still proud to be an American. That number changed very slightly. And the pride reported in 2019 among Republicans is the same as it was going as far back as 2006 and higher than it was in 2001 when this particular study starts. For Democrats, their patriotism fell 23% from 2009 to 2019 and is 32% less than what it was in 2001. Democrats have changed a lot. Leftism has changed a lot. It has marched leftward. They have moved further to the left on almost every subject. It is not true that the right has moved further to the right on every subject. All of these huge gaps and perspectives existed before Trump took office.

Starting point is 00:42:39 The left has continued to shift while Trump voters have stayed about the same on many issues. We disagree and have disagreed on very fundamental things. We do not see the world the same way at all. Democrats' views on race, on immigration, on patriotism, on abortion, on the Supreme Court, socialism, transgenderism, religious liberty, free speech have all shifted to the left drastically in the last five to ten years alone. You see this not just in polls, but you hear it in their speeches, you read it in their articles, in their tweets, and in their platforms. So when you hear the conservatives have become radical, no, no, no, no, no. The perception of conservatives has changed

Starting point is 00:43:21 drastically because the left has changed. The left has moved left. The Democratic Party has moved left. The shift has not occurred predominantly, or even comparatively at all, on the right. Our country changed a lot while Barack Obama was president. And if you're a liberal, maybe you think it changed for the better. That's understandable coming from your perspective. But chances are you didn't really even notice that it changed a whole lot and that we actually got a lot more divided, that tensions actually raised a lot. Remember, the riots in Ferguson, and all of that that started happening, the police officers that were shot dead in Dallas in July of 2016, that all happened while Obama was in office. We on the right noticed. We noticed

Starting point is 00:44:10 that shift. We noticed that change. We were talking about it, that the country isn't the same anymore, that we don't agree on the fundamentals anymore. We were talking about that when Barack Obama was in office. People in the middle and on the left largely did not notice. And the media has done such an effective job of making you think over the past four years, that the past four years have been terrible for the country. But while Barack Obama was president, everything was just normal. Everything was nice. Everything was smooth. Everything was good. That is a rewriting of history. I mean, that is some Orwellian kind of

Starting point is 00:44:48 an Orwellian kind of memory holing of the bad things that happened while Barack Obama was president and the division that was getting worse while Barack Obama was president in the name of defending him in the name of defending the Democratic Party. Trump did not do the dividing.

Starting point is 00:45:09 Now, I'm not saying that he has been the great healer or the great reconciler either. but he has mostly pointed out the fissures that already existed. He did not create them. I say all of this to say. If pride in politicians is the big driver of division and destruction in this country, then we had very prideful politicians, if not more prideful politicians before Donald Trump. And especially during the years, Biden was vice president. And I simply do not believe that Trump's arrogance can do near the amount of damage to our country than was already done before he took office. And I think the policies that are advocated by every other candidate are far more

Starting point is 00:45:50 damaging and far more dangerous. I think the rhetoric of identity politics, intersectionality, and critical race theory are far more divisive, far more destructive, far more dangerous, and damaging than Trump's rightfully condemned Twitter schooly bullying, which again, I think is bad, but I don't think has nearly the detrimental. effects, that the rhetoric of identity politics and divisiveness that we had under Barack Obama and that we have heard from, from politicians on both sides of the aisle. I don't think that his rhetoric is nearly as damaging or as far-reaching as that kind of rhetoric. Now, Al-Mohler, he wrote what I thought was an excellent article about all of this, defending why he is voting

Starting point is 00:46:40 for Donald Trump, despite the bad things that he has said. and despite some of the bad things that he has done. I want to read you the entire article. I won't do that because it's long, but I will link it. I really want you to go read it. I think it's really good. Maybe you're not going to agree with it, but it's very thoughtful. I've had Al Mueller on this podcast. He talked about voting for Trump and his reasoning behind that. You should definitely listen to that episode. But let me read you some of that article so you get the gist of it. Here's one thing that he said that I thought was a really good point. He says, if elected, Biden would be the oldest individual ever elected president of the United States. Both candidates are over age 70. That makes the vice presidency all the more important. I do not have to blink in deciding the prospect of the president Mike Pence versus a president, Kamala Harris.

Starting point is 00:47:27 Yeah. And that should be obvious for anyone who has even slightly conservative Christian worldview, considering that Kamala Harris is the most liberal member of the Senate. and who is not just moderately pro-choice, but rabidly pro-abortion as her record shows. Al-Muller goes on to say, if I am electing a neighbor, it would be Biden hands down. I am not voting for who will be my neighbor. I am voting for who will be president of the United States. He says, I see politics and culture as being temporal, but nonetheless with very real significance for human beings of the communities we build. He says, I believe that human dignity and human rights are grounded in the

Starting point is 00:48:10 the transcendent truths of God, who was the source of all being and truth. When I talk about a biblical worldview, that is what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about us having to agree on everything, but that is the foundation for a biblical worldview. He says, I cling to the gospel of Jesus Christ and the saving truths of redeeming grace, but I'm also thankful for the common grace, whereby all humanity formed in the image of God is accountable to universal truths embedded by the creator in his creation, including the goods of marriage and family, a community, an economy, a culture. I believe that denying these universal truths is destructive of civilization. That is what makes him a conservative. He says the Democratic Party is now so pro-abortion and yes, that is the right

Starting point is 00:48:50 term, that it has declared opposition to any restriction on abortion and demands taxpayer funding for abortion. This is accurate. Led by Democratic governors, states such as New York and Illinois have adopted new abortion legislation that effectively allows for abortion right up to the moment of birth. That is not a myth. it in full on this podcast, read the legislation word for word. Those who deny this reality are dishonest, Albert Mueller says. The Democratic Party is linked hand in hand with Planned Parenthood, which is not only the nation's largest abortion provider, but is also the engine for the culture of death, unmasked for having targeted unborn babies for the strategic removal of specific organs and tissues. Imagine voting for the party that is funded by that organization.

Starting point is 00:49:35 Biden, on the other hand, has already indicated. that he would immediately put the Obama administration. So now we're talking about religious liberty. I skipped some stuff. Biden has already indicated that he would immediately put the Obama administration contraception mandate back in place stripped of the religious liberty protections President Trump has established. Go listen to the religious liberty episode to know more about that.

Starting point is 00:49:57 The Democratic Party has also decried other forms of conscience protection and would deny religious liberty to Christian cake bakers, wedding photographers, and pharmacists. He's talking about the Equality Act. we've also done a podcast on the Equality Act. Christians in many medical fields will face the reduction or removal of conscience protections related to abortion. On issues such as the transgender revolution, which will reshape the entire society, Al Muller says Biden went so far in a recent town hall appearance that he said he would

Starting point is 00:50:26 support transgender demands all the way to supporting gender transition among eight and 10-year-old children. That is a direct quote. There should be zero discrimination, Biden said. Keep in mind that zero discrimination. in that context means enforce submission to transgender claimed throughout society. That means your Christian College, adoption agency, mission board, or school. The Democratic administration will steamroll these issues through the entire society and leave no arena untouched.

Starting point is 00:50:52 He says, I see some who claim to be conservative falsely ascribing a virtue to a Democratic candidate and failing to concede that a Biden election would lead to direct threats to conscience and religious liberty among American Christians. And I would add, all Americans. It's not just Christians that religious liberty protects. It's Muslims. It's Jews. It's atheists. It's agnostics. Religious liberty is for everyone. But from a Christian perspective, yes, we are looking at the liberty to be able to say and to believe and to practice the things that we want to say and believe in practice. He describes character in this way because a lot of people talk about President Trump's character. He says character is some strange combination of the personal, the principled, and the practical. Let me put it another way. I think this is such a good point that he makes.

Starting point is 00:51:41 I cannot accept the argument that a calm man who affirms the dismembering of babies in the womb has a superior character to a man who rants like Gingas Khan, but acts to preserve that life. He says, in my ideal world, I would vote for a candidate in whom the personal, the principal, and the practical earn my admiration. I do not live in that world. I live in this world, and I must act accordingly. So I completely align with that view. I disagree with the idea that policies don't have a greater and a deadlier effect, something like the direct killing of babies, like abortion, doesn't have a deadly or a fact than Trump's tweets. I'm not saying that Trump's tweets don't have any effect. I'm not saying his rhetoric doesn't matter at all. I'm not saying that he shouldn't

Starting point is 00:52:29 be held accountable for his words. But I cannot see the equivalence. of those two issues. And I just don't see that there is a case to be made that Biden's character, or Kamala Harris's character, is better than Donald Trump and Mike Pence's. I just don't see it. And so this dichotomy between that John Piper has articulated between the arrogant, boastful, divisive guy and the other guy who just happens to support pro-abortion policies, I don't think that is a correct assessment at all. I think, again, you've got two prideful, sinful candidates in different ways, and then you have one candidate that supports policies that are good for every single segment of society, especially the most vulnerable. I am more aligned with John Piper's

Starting point is 00:53:24 wisdom that he shared in 2004 than what he shared in 2020, even though I still very much respect John Piper and will continue to go to him. for wisdom. John Piper says, now if you are dissatisfied today in 2004, if you are dissatisfied today the way I am, why vote? The answer is that if you don't, you are guilty of the very oversimplification you condemn. There is no escape from responsibility by pointing out the imperfections of leaders. That is the only kind of leader there will ever be. Our calling in this world is not to wait for the arrival of the perfect, but to pick our way through the thicket of flaws. We would be arrogant to put ourselves above this fray and say a curse on both your

Starting point is 00:54:10 houses. I think this also applies to not voting for either candidate in this case. I do wonder, and I don't mean this in a like a sarcastic or rude way, but I honestly do wonder. If Biden becomes president, Democrats take over the Senate, they keep the house, and they're able to ran through all the things that they want to do. They packed the Supreme Court. They passed the Equality Act. They limit the First Amendment. They strip people, doctors, cake bakers of conscience protections and religious liberty. If parental rights are destroyed, if private and charter schools are regulated, if churches are regulated, not just in their speech, but also in their hiring processes, will John Piper speak out? Like, will he feel that he has the right to say,

Starting point is 00:55:01 these policies are bad, they're destructive for society, they are ungodly, they're against the family, they're against the church, they're against all the things that have made this country both good and great. They make not just this country more dangerous, but the world more dangerous. Will he feel like he has the right to do that when he decided that he didn't want to say in who actually won this election. I don't know. I don't know. He goes on to say in this 2004 article, the Lord Jesus does not give us the luxury of disengagement. He says, quote, render to Caesar, the things that are Caesar into God, the things that are gods. Caesar, even pagan Caesar, has his claim on our lives. Why? Because God Almighty, whom we serve above all men,

Starting point is 00:55:49 made human governments his way of running the world. Let every person be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God, Romans 131. In a democratic republic like ours, that means at least vote. God has commanded us, as aliens and exiles on the earth, seek the welfare of the city where I have sent you into exile and pray to the Lord on its behalf, for in its welfare, you will find your welfare, Jeremiah 297, This is now the third time that we have talked about that verse and that passage on this podcast. We are citizens of two kingdoms, John Piper says in 2004. The kingdom of God are ultimate allegiance and the kingdom of this world.

Starting point is 00:56:33 The ambiguities are many. The complexities are great. The possibility of political miscalculation is real, but Christ came into the world to save sinners. Therefore, we do not panic at the possibility of error. It is worse to run than to risk. Yes, and amen. So that is where I land in this 2020 election, which means that I am going to vote for the imperfect candidate whose policies that I believe strongly believe based on every piece of evidence

Starting point is 00:57:02 that I have are best for every demographic of this great nation, not hesitating to criticize when necessary and certainly not looking to him as my savior or my hope, which means that I still love you if you vote third party. And yes, people who vote for Joe Biden too. I strongly disagree with you, but of course, you are my neighbor. I happen to think that you are wrong here. I've been wrong very many times in

Starting point is 00:57:28 my life. And I do believe that if Joe Biden wins the election, that it is a grave mistake. It is a grave mistake to have voted for him. It is a grave mistake to have voted Democrat. Of course, I believe that. You, if you're on the other side, believe that it's a mistake to vote for Donald Trump

Starting point is 00:57:44 and a mistake to vote for Republicans. We disagree on this issue. But I see no issue at all with voting for Trump in this election. And I think that there's a lot of good reasoning and a lot of good policies that back that up. Thank you guys so much for listening. I will be back here on Friday. Hey, this is Steve Deast. If you're listening to Allie, you already understand that the biggest issues facing our country aren't just political. They're moral, spiritual, and rooted in what we believe is true about God. humanity and reality itself.

Starting point is 00:58:34 On the Steve Day show, we take the news of the day and tested against first principles, faith, truth, and objective reality. We don't just chase narratives and we don't offer false comfort. We ask the hard questions and follow the answers wherever they leave, even when it's unpopular. This is a show for people who want honesty over hype and clarity over chaos. If you're looking for commentary grounded in conviction and unwilling to lie to you about where we are or where we're headed, you can watch this Steve Day show right here on Blaze TV or listen wherever you get podcasts.

Starting point is 00:59:01 I hope you'll join us.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 319 | Piper, Policies, Personality & Priorities

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