Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 438 | Turns Out Joe Biden Isn't Much of a Moderate | Guest: Dave Rubin

Episode Date: June 15, 2021

Today we're excited to welcome fellow BlazeTV host Dave Rubin back to the show. We'll talk about the disappointments of President Joe Biden that no one saw coming, except for everyone on the Right. The Democrats are obsessed with the Marxist idea of "equity," and it's making it harder for liberty-minded folks to just live their lives in peace. As more and more disaffected liberals join the Right because of this, how will conservatives be affected? --- Today's Sponsors: Annie's Kit Clubs give you a monthly craft retreat, hassle free, with their Creative Woman Club. No searching for supplies or hunting for new projects. Visit AnniesKitClubs.com/ALLIE & save 50% on your first kit! Fundrise provides access to diversified portfolios of private real estate to ALL investors with their industry-leading, easy-to-use platform. Go to Fundrise.com/RELATABLE & see for yourself how 150,000 investors have built a better portfolio with private real estate. Good Ranchers meat is 100% American! All of their product is individually wrapped, vacuum sealed, and ready to grill (which helps to eliminate waste!) & it's delivered right to your door. Go to GoodRanchers.com/ALLIE to get $20 off & free express shipping! --- Buy Allie's book, You're Not Enough (& That's Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love: https://alliebethstuckey.com/book Relatable merchandise: https://shop.blazemedia.com/collections/allie-stuckey

Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Today I am talking to a good friend of the show, Dave Rubin. I've had him on twice before. Always an interesting conversation and lots of insight to glean from him. So I'm so excited for you to listen to us chat about the craziness of the, the wokeness of the Biden administration and what we can expect probably out of the next few years looking back over the craziness of COVID restrictions and what we can expect probably out of the next few years looking back over the craziness of COVID restrictions and what. what it's all meant and how we've really changed as a country for better and for worse. Without further ado, here is Dave Rubin. Dave, thanks so much for joining me yet again. I am excited to be with you. If for no other reason than just the incredible lighting that exists here. That's what everyone says.

I'm very particular and they did a good job. Everyone looks good in this lighting. I told you, we had to rejigger our entire operation after I was on your show last time. I was like, guys, that's the way I want to look. I know. Well, I want it to feel like it's outdoors. And as you can see, you know, we've got the natural light coming in right there. That's not real? No, it is real. We are on my large piece of land. Yes. Okay, so tell us, tell us what's going on. Tell us your assessment of the world in this Biden administration, not the outcome that we wanted. We're recording this in January. This will come out later. So we're still kind of shell-shocked a little bit.

Yeah. Lots of executive orders, lots of wokenness. People told us he was the modern. he was the normal guy. Well, I think you and I, yeah, I think you and I were amongst the short list of people that were telling people that he's going to be the vessel that brings in the wokeism, right? Yeah. That there was a lot of people, my last few remaining good liberal friends who will still talk to me, you know, they kept saying, oh, don't worry.

They didn't go with the crazy stuff. They didn't go with Bernie. They didn't go with Elizabeth Warren. They went with the old moderate, old Joe. He was the VP. He's been in government forever. He won't usher. in all this craziness.

And I think what's become very obvious in just a couple weeks of this with all the executive actions and all the messaging about, you know, it's just nonstop about race, sex, gender, climate. And then the magic word equity instead of equality, which is the most dangerous word we have in America right now. I think what's surprising people is how quickly they're going after all of it. Like there's nothing in the woke bag that they haven't just grabbed for, right? now. Like if there's a bag of woke tricks, man, they're pulling them all out right now. They're juggling

all of them. They're showing them to all of us. There's no shame involved right now. Like, they're just going for all of it. And I would say the unfortunate part is that I don't think that the Joe Biden that was in public life for, you know, four decades, almost five decades. I don't think this is the Joe Biden that we have now, you know, or that Joe Biden is not this Joe Biden. In that I do think he was a more moderate Democrat. I think he believed in the inherent goodness of America. And at 78 years old, I just don't think he knows what he believes anymore. I think they push him out there to sign these things.

He often seems confused and not sure what he's signing. He can't find where he's putting his pen, et cetera, et cetera. And it's like, so at that level, at a human level, it's actually sort of sad what they're doing to him. And by the way, it'll all break one day. It'll all, the story will break that they've known something is not right here. But at the sort of macro level of what's happening. to society, it's not good, Allie. It ain't good. That's why I'm glad to be out on a pastor with you.

Oh, yeah, me too. Well, that's exactly why I moved out here, just in the middle of nowhere. So talk to me about the difference between equity and equality and why all of these executive orders and some of the proposals that we're seeing are really under this umbrella of maybe what sounds like to some people, fairness, equality, things that people say that they want. Tell me the difference. Tell me why it's dangerous. Well, I would say equity is the most dangerous word, as I said, that we have going around right now, in terms of what's flying around in our lexicon, what's in the zeitgeist? Well, we hear equity all the time. This is not a word that we heard that often a couple years ago, right?

You'd hear about equality. What does America do? America gives you equality of opportunity. We have laws that do not discriminate in the cases over 250 years where we had laws that did discriminate, slavery, women couldn't vote, etc. We got rid of those things. We have always expanded rights to people. And yet now we have this idea of equity, which is very different than equality says,

hey, if you're here and you're legal, have at it. And it's going to take some hard work. It's going to take some luck. You might be born rich. You might be born poor. All of those things. But humans can't create a system that would perfect all that. What they want to do is create a system that will perfect all that.

And that's deeply dangerous. And Kamala Harris, I know you know this. What was it, two days before the election, put out that cartoon video on Twitter. where she basically said, I'm a socialist. I mean, in essence, she said it's not where we all start. It's where we all end up. Right.

And we all end up in the same spot. Well, first off, that just makes no sense because I'm not vice president. She is. But if everyone ended up in the same spot, we'd all be vice president, right? Right. But putting aside the silliness of it, the idea that we all end up the same, that somehow being the same is the goal, as opposed to being an individual is the goal. And that there is some end of the game.

that we all agree is the place we should all be at. What in essence, what they're really saying, of course, is that the elites and the people with all the money and the power, they can do whatever they want, but they will somehow create a system for you peons so that you'll get, you'll all just get enough to be satiated so you don't kill all of them. That really is what they're setting us up.

So when people talk about equity, that we would end up in the same spot, it is anti-American. It's against the Constitution. It's against the Bill of Rights. against the American ethos. And yet it's being packaged to us. Like, if you're not for equity, you're not for tolerance.

You're not for healing. And all those other words that they don't mean either. It's also against human nature. Thomas Soul talks about this a lot. He talks about it in quest for cosmic justice. How the only way to ensure equal outcomes among all individuals and all groups is some kind of tyranny. It's some kind of social engineering.

You got to kill a lot of people. You got to kill a lot of people. You've got to continually punish people. who are intent on moving ahead, and you've got to reward people who are not intent on moving ahead to make sure that people continually stay in the same spot. So it's just another form of totalitarianism. It's just another form of communism, but a much more palatable term, I guess, to introduce people to that kind of idea. And that's what I worry about, the war on human nature, that people are different. If two people from the same family end up in two different

places in life with all the same opportunities and backgrounds, that of course, two random people from two different states will end up in different places in life. So I don't even, I guess I don't understand their plan to accomplish that kind of utopian or dystopian equality of outcome. Well, it's dystopian and it's now. I mean, we live in a dystopian future right now. That really is the truth. I mean, every dystopian movie, humans all dress the same. They walk in lines in the same way. They say the same thing, comrade, you know, or they don't have names, right? I'm FN2187 or whatever it is. Right.

But I think what it is fundamentally is a, it's a dim view of what humans are. That really is what it is. They just, it's a different view. And I would say it's a dim view in that, as you just said, so if you have two brothers or two siblings in a family that are brought up with the exact same resources, the exact same love from the parents, all those things, we know that 99.9% of the time, They're going to live different lives, do different things, not necessarily be as successfully as each other.

And in some cases, they may have very different values at the end. That's what life is. That's what freedom is, meaning one might make a lot of mistakes along the way. One might do it perfectly. One might have a really good run while the other one has a terrible run. And then all of the stuff that is the free human experience. Now, if you were to say, well, okay, they've been given the exact same stuff. at the start. So they have to finish at the same way. Or if you just took just take your childhood

friends. Okay, you got a whole bunch of friends. You all basically grew up in the same amount of thing. Should you all be forced to do the exact same thing? Some of you may want a lot of stuff. One of you may want a really big house in a boat and one of you may want to live in a cabin off the grid. Should we be forcing people to have the same amount of stuff? And I know it sounds sort of crazy like, oh, that that's not really what they want. The government's going to force it really. But it actually is. It. actually is when you whittle it down. Yeah.

And by the way, what you get at the end ain't that much. Yeah. And that's the problem with looking at outcome gaps as proof of discrimination against, again, this is another Thomas Soul subject that he talks about so much that disparities don't necessarily equal discrimination. That's something that Ibrax-Kindy talks about so much that you only have to look at outcomes,

not processes, not intent. He would say that something is a racist policy if it's creating. or if it allows for disparities and outcomes between two different groups. But think about that. That takes the human part out. Exactly. That takes hard work out. It takes what you care about. You, Ali, have a certain set of values and you care about a certain amount of things and put them in some sort of hierarchy to go ahead and succeed with your life. Well, if the system came in and said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, we have a better way for you to live your

life. Would that be a great way of you flourishing? I'm pretty sure it wouldn't. Yeah. But that's what he's saying. And again, that's why they have to, that's why socialism kills people. Because on the quest for the perfect system, you got to remove the imperfections. And guess what? That's us. And some people say, you know, I would say people on the left, especially right now, if we talk about tech censorship or the concerns that we have with totalitarianism, leftism, communism, all of those things coming down the pipeline, they say, look, you still got the First Amendment. You're still free to do what you want to do. You still live in a democracy. But I think what they don't understand is that, for example, the Chinese revolution, the communist revolution of

the 20th century, it was a cultural revolution. It started on that interpersonal level in some ways. Of course, it was also political and economic. But people having, you know, struggle sessions where they shame someone in public for having the wrong views, trying to do exactly what you're saying, change public opinion and get rid of the people that are standing in the way of communism or whatever. Does that sound a little bit like something that might be happening in America the last couple of years? And that's what I want to get your insight on. What do you say to the people who are like, oh, whatever, you're just kind of making too big of a deal out of this? We're just trying to make the world better for every different kind of person.

Well, I do believe that that is what they believe. Yeah. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I don't sit there thinking that most of these people are evil. I think that most of the people have good intentions and they're confused by bad ideas. I think there are some genuinely bad actors within that. I would say that AOC, for example, strikes me as a genuinely. bad actor. Not that she doesn't necessarily believe the stuff, although I'm not quite sure that she

really believes it, but her behavior within that and her desire to burn everything down and pretend that somehow if she just had enough power, if her crew had enough power that would all be perfect, I think that that makes her, I would say, a bad actor as a government official. But in essence, most of them, I don't think are bad people. I think they're just really confused. And it's our job as people that communicate ideas. It's our job to say, well, you know, there are some other ways. And that's why they want to cancel us so badly. That's why five years ago when I was talking about big tech censorship and everyone was like,

what are you talking about? Twitter's not going to get rid of anybody or I would talk about the college campus stuff. Or I'd go to college campuses and people would be protesting me, calling me a Nazi. And everyone would say to me, Dave, don't worry, it's on college campuses. The line always was, just wait until they get to the real world. Just wait until they get to the real world. And now we're seeing. Well, they're in the real world, and the real world folded like a paper bag, yeah.

Yeah, that's so true. Do you think the tactics that the right typically employ that basically the left wants the corporations to be ideologically aligned with them? They're totally fine with censorship of voices that they don't like. They want the social justice agenda pushed by big tech, pushed by these big corporations. Whereas conservatives, we don't want target in Amazon to necessarily be. conservative. We're not looking for them to stand up for the NRA or whatever. We just want them to be neutral. We want people to be treated fairly. Okay, is that like bringing, you know, a knife to a gunfight? Is our tactic of just being kind and refusing to cancel people, which is what I would like to do?

Right. And just wanting kind of neutrality and peace and being able to tolerate people of different viewpoints. I mean, are we just going to be crushed under the tyrants? Right. Well, it's the paradox of tolerance, right? And I think a lot of liberals suffer. from this and now conservatives are starting to suffer from it. So first off, when I say liberals, of course, I mean actual liberals, not lefties, meaning that if you so believe in the idea of tolerance and openness, that you will welcome in the very forces that will destroy you and what you've created, well, then thus you have the paradox of tolerance.

I would say the challenge for us is how do we deal with this? I think this is like, in many ways, this is where my head's at more than anything right now, is how do we people that just want to live. our lives, just want to have families, have jobs, have community, whatever it is. How do we go ahead and do that in the face of a system that is ever encroaching on us? So it's like, yes, what I prefer, that they just leave people on Twitter and say bad things. And by the way, if you break the laws of the United States, then the government will come for you. So it shouldn't be up to Twitter at that point, right? But if they're going to keep moving on us, so okay, now you

guys can't be on Twitter. You can't be on Facebook. You can't be on YouTube. By the way, you can't be on, you can't bank at Chase. Right. And, you know, you probably can't have an AT&T cell phone. I mean, this all sounds crazy, but we see the way the line is moving. So then at what point do we have to rethink our tactics? This is also where I would say that at some level, you get the limits of libertarianism, why I'm not, why I rarely say I'm purely a libertarian, because I do think you need the unfortunate muscle of government every now and again. Now, ironically, we have a pretty terrible, I would say, tyrannical government in office right now. So the idea that I would want to give it more power, which, as you know, I was warning people

against when everybody was saying, Trump's got to regulate, break up big tech, Trump's got to do it. Well, guys, if Trump lost, which he did, whether you wanted or not, well, congratulations, you were just going to hand over an awful lot of power of big tech combined with big government. And that, so you have to be careful what you wish for. And I think you have to make small steps instead of these giant leaps, which is what we see the left does with everything. They make giant leaps. We're going to fix, can you believe it they're going to fix the environment?

Because in 12 years, the earth is going to blow up. Right. AOC can do it. And crush COVID without crushing the economy, which is not actually what's happened. Incredible these people. And they're going to solve racism. I know he signed something that said no more racism. So I think we wrap that one up.

Can't talk about that anymore. Yeah. No more 25K speaking gigs for Robin DeAngelo. So racism is done. Yeah, sucks for her. Okay, I want to quickly talk to you about how we balance something that is typically seen as like a left-wing priority, which is LGBTQ rights and something that is typically only seen as a right-wing priority, which is religious liberty. Yeah. But I would say that you represent someone who cares obviously about both of those things.

Yeah. But, you know, someone who's coming from a traditional conservative perspective, I see something like the Equality Act or Biden's, you know, you know, gender inclusive executive order. Yeah. And I get really worried that, okay, the sexual revolution or whatever you want to call it is just going to completely trump our First Amendment right to religious liberty. How do we balance those two things in your view? Well, our founders did it properly. And we've done it actually pretty decently as a society for a long time.

Our founders said we had God-given rights and also said you should be free from being forced into any religion, obviously, and free from government coercion. That's a pretty good setup there. What's happening now is Douglas Murray, who you probably know, the British conservative author, he writes a lot about this. And one of the things he talks about is how the trans thing has so sort of grabbed onto the gay rights thing that it's really confused things, because there's a difference between sexuality and then having a biological and psychological issue. Now, my personal belief is that if somebody is born a man or born a woman and wishes to live, they, for whatever reason, they wish to live as the other person and they're an adult and they go ahead and they do the

transitioning, then they should be treated with the same exact respect and rights as everybody else. And by the way, if they give me respect, I'll give them respect. But nobody's just given respect just by the nature of their existence, which I think in many ways is what they want. I mean, I've gotten into it with trans advocates who, you know, will be calling me a Nazi and I'll be literally saying, well, I just want you to be treated equally. and I hope, I mean, there's a very famous video of me at University of New Hampshire going through this with this woman. I just want you to be treated fairly.

And in exchange, I'm a Nazi. I mean, it's sort of crazy. But I think what you're talking about with these. And that's also the difference between, you know, equity and equality. They're prioritizing equity. You're thinking about equality. And if you don't agree with their definition of equity, then of course you're a Nazi. Then of course you're a Nazi.

No matter how many times you tell them, hey, I just want you to be treated equally. I hope you're happy. I hope you're fulfilled. I hope you have all of the opportunities that America has given to anyone. But I would say in terms of the stuff that Biden is doing now, where we're going to have racial, you know, these ideas of racial equity, of gender equity, all these things. We talked about this last time I was here, but men and women want to do different things. Men care more about physical things. Women care more usually about relationships.

Like, this is just a reality. There's a reason that more women become nurses and more men become engineers. And that reason is not sexism. And not even just in America. It's also in these very progressive gender neutral places. Sweden. Sweden has the most amazing example of this, where they've had a completely egalitarian society for decades.

And then more women became nurses, more men became engineers. And then the social justice warriors said, this isn't good because of the outcome that you mentioned earlier, right? So then they go back in and they're literally now trying to force more women to become engineers and more men to become nurses. Once again, human nature doesn't fit the vision of the, anointed the vision of the elites. And so they're constantly trying to change human nature to fit their vision rather than change their vision to fit human nature. Absolutely. So to bring this to your

question about religious liberty, I want anyone that has a religious belief to be able to practice that belief however they see fit. The issue comes in when your religious beliefs potentially infringe on other people's ability to live equally. So I had long argued that gay marriage to me was a brainer from a, from a sort of secular legal perspective in that if two consenting adults wish to engage in a relationship the same way, regardless of whether they're gay or straight or whatever, then we have equality of opportunity in the United States and that was a just cause. Now, it's actually okay with me if some religious people don't believe that. I'm actually quite fine with that. And by the way, most religious people at this point, regardless of the denomination or religion,

They're not really screaming about it right now. They're not really screaming about it right now, which shows you that the conservative mind is somewhat flexible. It doesn't mean that they've all given up their beliefs. You know, like even we've talked about this many times, but if in your heart of heart, you felt that that gay marriage was a sin or something like that, would it impair our friendship at some level? I suppose it would, right?

Like I wouldn't be like, oh, David, you want to have Ali over all the time? Like, it just would, it would do something. But I understand that people think different things than me in America. And that is more important than that. So as long as you weren't doing something actively to come for my rights, that's what America is all about. Yeah. So I want to defend people's ability to live freely and have the religious thoughts that they have. And I also want to help people.

or no, not help people. I want to, I want to do everything possible to allow people to live equally under the law. Yeah. And you and I have had a very, you know, open and honest conversation of where I come from as a, as a biblical conservative. And you have talked to a lot of people who believe the same thing. And I do think conservatives have changed, not, maybe not on the values, like you said, but on the sense of, okay, maybe the government doesn't have a role to play in this.

And, you know, there's certainly a debate to be had about the Supreme Court. courts role and all of that. But I think the shift has also kind of gone to the transgender movement because there's something different there. I am compelled to deny biology in some cases, or I'm compelled to infringe upon what I think might be my daughter's right to be able to compete against people of her gender. Go to the bathroom with people of her gender. That presents a whole other issue. You being married doesn't infringe upon any of my rights or protection. or safety or anything. Actually, I think you could even make a more forceful argument,

which would be that by me being married, and then having the ability to have a family and have all of the things that you can have, that that actually strengthens America, that the family is the core. It doesn't mean that it's the exact family that maybe you wanted to see as the perfect family. And maybe a perfect family doesn't even exist.

But if you allow people to build something that is stronger than just whatever their whims of the day are, then you can really, you can actually strengthen society, which is why, you know, 10 years ago, when all the lefties all the time were saying, oh, the Republicans are attacking, or the people on the right would say,

the people on the left are attacking the family. And it sort of sounded crazy, but it's like, oh, it is kind of right. They've wanted to attack the family, because once you can break the family unit, that's the first building block. And then the rest of it's pretty shaky after that. And it was throughout the 20th century.

That was the first thing to separate the relationship between the parent and child. There's a lot we could talk. about with the structure of the family and all that stuff but yeah we have to wrap up this conversation um can you um can you just remind people where they can find you and anything you want to promote i'm only sending people to rubin report dot locals.com it's my little foray into trying to save emails and i get all my push notifications all the push notifications rubin report just published something so you see all my fancy stakes oh yeah all the fancy stakes well sometimes you post them on twitter too so i do sometimes tweet them but the the real stakes

yeah to get people to yeah to go behind the paywall. So repeat it again. Where is it? Rubenreport. Dot locals.com. Awesome. Well, thank you so much.

Yeah, it was great seeing it.